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From YouTube: Board of Equalization Hearing - August 25, 2020
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A
Say
august
25th
2020,
and
this
is
the
arlington
county
board
of
equalization
hearing
the
first
case
that
we're
going
to
discuss
is
rpc34020275
at
241,
south
18th
street.
It's
my
understanding
that
the
appellant
and
the
county
have
agreed
to
the
offer
from
the
county.
So
technically
mrs
borman
would
like
to
withdraw
the
case.
So
is
there
any
discussion
for
many
board
members?
A
Second,
second,
okay,
so
mary
julie
and
mr
matkin
is
the
second
all
in
favor.
A
That's
withdrawn.
Thank
you.
Miss
mormon.
Thank
you
board
have
a
good
day.
Okay!
Thank
you,
bye-bye.
Thank
you
board.
Okay,
second,
as
grant
steinhauser
is
logging
in
I'll
go
ahead
and
move
to
the
third
case
on
on
the
schedule,
which
is
actually
the
second
case.
Well,
here
is
rpc
three
one:
zero,
three,
four:
zero
zero.
Four
at
2651
shirlington
boulevard.
Again
that
case
has
been
asked
to
withdraw
and
the
county
has
no
opposition.
B
A
Opposed
okay,
that
is
withdrawn
and
the
fourth
case
on
the
schedule:
rpc
three
one:
zero:
three:
four:
zero:
three:
nine
on
shirlington
road,
same
situation,
they'd
like
to
withdraw
the
case.
If
there's
no
discussion
from
any
board
members,
then
I'll
move
to
accept
the
withdrawal.
Do
I
have
a
second.
B
A
A
Good
morning,
okay,
we
will
move
to
the
first
case
on
the
schedule,
which
is
rpc20003003
3804
wilson
boulevard,
mr
steinhauser,
you
can
start
with
your
eight
minutes
and
tell
us
about
the
property.
B
Mary,
this
is
barnes
I'm
going
to.
I
have
a
conflict
on
this
one,
so
I'm
not
going
to
participate.
C
Thank
you,
madam
chair,
my
colleague,
dylan
saraldo
who's,
also
on
the
line
right
now
we'll
be
presenting
this
one.
So
without
further
ado,
dylan
go
for
it.
D
All
right
thanks
grant
thanks
mary,
so
this
site
is
located
at
34,
3804,
wilson
boulevard
and
it
is
currently
a
staples
property.
This
2020
assessment
was
5.25
million
and
our
requested
assessment
is
3.399
million
and,
to
just
give
you
a
little
bit
of
background,
it's
kind
of
built
on
an
odd
parcel,
that's
kind
of
cornered
on
the
street,
and
so
the
ingress
and
egress
isn't
the
best.
D
The
site
is
a
retail
outlet
facility
and
it's
8
900
square
feet,
and
essentially
with
our
valuation,
where
we
disagreed
with
the
value
comes
down
to
the
market
rent
that
was
used.
We
looked
at
a
number
of
comparables
in
the
arlington
sub-market,
and
what
we
found
is
that
market
rents
were
closer
to
30.84
cents
per
square
foot
versus
the
county's
chosen
rate
of
forty
dollars
and
fifty
cents.
D
So
our
opinion
of
value
is
based
off
of
the
market,
rent
of
thirty
dollars
and
eighty
four
cents,
a
pass-through
income
of
sixty
thousand
dollars,
which
is
taken
from
the
2019
real
estate.
Taxes
paid
a
vacancy
and
collection
loss
of
5.4
percent
versus
the
county's
small,
three
percent
adjustment
and
again
our
5.4
vacancy
and
collection
loss.
D
That
is
a
market-based
assumption,
which
is
taken
from
the
virginia
square,
retail
submarket
per
co-stars
database,
and
so
that
is
the
current
vacancy
for
that
sub
market
according
to
costar
and
then
in
the
2020
commercial
guidebook.
D
They
have
just
a
blanket
13
operating
expense
deduction
for
properties
of
this
kind,
and
so
we
applied
that
13
deduction
versus
the
county's
12
and
that
brought
us
down
to
an
noi
of
275
hundred
and
eighty
dollars,
and
we
capitalized
that
as
seven
point
two
five
percent
cap
rate,
which
was
the
cap
rate
in
2019
and
2018,
but
the
cap
rate
for
2020
was
recently
changed
to
seven
percent.
So
we
capitalized
it
at
the
previous
cap
rate
of
7.25,
and
that
is
how
we
got
our
value
of
3.796
million.
D
And
then
we
took
a
discount
for
lease
up
and
the
rationale
behind
this
is
because
currently
staples
is
paying
a
below
market
lease.
They
are
paying
about
three
dollars
per
square
foot
to
occupy
that
space
and
they're
occupying
it.
On
a
month-to-month
basis,
and
so
for
this
reason,
if
a
new
owner
were
to
potentially
buy
this
property,
they
would
have
no
certainty
that
staples
would
stay
and
in
all
likelihood,
staples
would
go.
D
So
that's
essentially
our
our
analysis
on
this
grant.
Is
there
anything
that
you'd
like
to
add
for
this.
C
E
Thank
you,
okay.
So,
basically
I
took
a
look
at
the
the
rent
in
this
neighborhood
and
I
have
flagged
a
couple
of
rent
rental
rates
and
these
are
actually
taken
from
income
and
expense
statements
in
the
subject's
neighborhood
and
I'm
going
to
read
off
those
rents,
but
I'm
not
going
to
tell
you
the
the
names
of
the
owners,
so
the
lowest
one
that
I
have
is
39.90
a
square
foot.
I
have
another
one
at
42
and
30
cents,
another
at
54.
E
So
we
feel
that
our
original
the
original
assessment
we're
using
forty
dollars
and
fifty
cents-
that's
conservative,
especially
for
a
national
chain,
and-
and
these
are
like
I
said
these-
are
freestanding
buildings
rents
in
that
area.
E
I
want
to
remind
the
board
that
this
is
a
triple
net
lease
and
the
expenses
that
we
used
on
the
original.
The
original
valuation
is
12.
No,
it's
not
13,
which
is
in
the
guidelines.
However,
if
you
look
at
page
three,
which
is
the
summary
page
you'll
see
that
our
our
expenses
that
we're
using
is
still
higher
than
what
they
are
reporting,
it's
written
in
the
lease
agreement
that
the
tenant
is
responsible
for
the
real
estate
taxes
and
that's
why
it's
included
as
pass
through
other.
E
Oh,
I
wanna
make
note
that,
yes,
this
tenant
is
paying
a
ridiculously
low
price
per
square
foot.
In
fact,
it's
the
lowest
that
we
know
of
there
may
be
other
tenants
throughout
the
county
that
are
are
having
trouble
and
owners
are
giving
them
a
huge
break,
but
none
of
them
come
close
to
the
ridiculously
low
rent
that
this
tenant
is
getting,
and
this
is
a
management
decision.
E
There's
they're
trying
to
find
a
way
to
redevelop
this
lot
with
another
lot,
I'm
not
sure
where
it
stands
at
the
moment,
but,
like
I
said
this
is
part
of
a
management's
decision.
They
just
want
to
keep
our
impression
county's
impressions
that
they
just
want
to
keep
the
site
occupied
and
that's
why
they're
offering
the
low
rent
and
until
they
make
a
decision
as
to
what
they're
going
to
do
with
the
development
of
this
site.
E
F
Just
curious,
without
identifying
any
of
these
properties,
if
you
can
kind
of
run
through
for
the
county,
if
you
could
run
through
the
the
four
comparable
properties-
and
let
me
know
if
any
of
those
had
kitchens
or
any
kind
of
different
discrepancies
in
use
or
if
these
are
all
similar
use
and
then
kind
of
what
the
size
range
is
on
those.
E
E
F
G
Question
for
the
appellant.
I
went
through
a
second
time
just
now,
your
the
data
that
you
supplied
in
your
appeal
and
I
saw
in
virginia
square
and
I'm
sure
I
read
it
right,
but
I
want
you
to
comment.
You
had
said
that
you
would
look
at
retail
rates
in
virginia
square
or
at
least
nearby
a
little
over
thirty
dollars
a
square
foot,
but
yet
on
page
41
of
45
in
some
pre-published
document
it
says
it's
45
dollars
a
square
foot,
presumably
triple
net.
Could
you
squirt?
I
I
do
this
all
day.
G
Every
day
I
haven't
seen
a
retail
at
anywhere
in
the
roswell
boston
quarter
at
thirty
dollars,
or
so
a
square
foot
triple
net.
So
could
you
tell
me
what
I'm
missing
and
again
hook
up
the
pre-printed
data
from
what
your
you
said
in
your
eight
minutes.
D
Sure,
which
page
is
it
that
you
said
you
saw
the
higher
rate,
but
on
page
45.
G
Yeah
I
can,
I
can
tell
it's
orion
report,
rent
and
vacancy.
G
It
says
45
index
122,
whatever
that
might
mean
percent
growth,
half
a
percent
and
total
square
footage
of
over
22,
000
and,
and
it
says,
virginia
square
retail.
Now,
of
course,
there
certainly
is
difference
between
standalone
with
its
own
dedicated
parking
and
not,
but.
H
D
Yes,
good,
yes,
so
that's
more
of
an
aggregate
number,
but
what
I
would
like
to
draw
your
attention
to
is
to
page
20,
page
20,
page
19
and
page
19
is
the
information
that
we
took
it
from,
and
so
so
these
are
the
peer
properties
from
which
we
took
our
analysis
from
and
so
there's
six
of
them
one's
4444
west
broad
street.
Another
is
3000,
duke
street,
there's
our
staples
itself
market
commons,
clarendon,
delray,
north
3178,
mount
pleasant
street
northwest
and
then
bolston
quarter.
D
Those
are
the
properties
that
are
nearby
similar
retail
properties
and
that's
the
information
from
which
we
took
our
data.
So
I
would
say
any
difference
would
just
be
based
on
the
population
of
property
selected,
but
we
think
it's
important
to
keep
in
mind
that
again
this
site
is
paying
below
market
lease
at
three
dollars
per
square
foot.
So
if
any
figure
is
closer
to
that
number,
we
feel
that
the
current
30
and
84
cents
is
more
representative
of
what
genuine
market
rents
are
for
a
property
of
this
type.
A
Okay,
are
there
any
other
questions
from
board
members
go
ahead,
mr
hoffman.
F
F
Thing
question
on:
I
guess:
policy
for
the
county.
When
you
look
at
a
market
rent
in
a
building,
that's
actually
rent,
at
least
to
somebody
else,
that's
paying
an
actual
amount.
Do
you
make
any
deductions
below
the
line
for
the
leasing
expenses,
the
ti
or
anything
that
would
actually
take
to
get
a
another.
C
F
So
I'm
just
looking
at
the
valuation
and
let's
say
it's
a
40
market
rent
and
you
wanted
to
get
a
market
participant
in
that
building.
Wouldn't
you
have
to
pay
a
leasing,
commission
and
tenant
improvements
and
rent
abatement
and
concessions
in
order
to
achieve
that
market
rent
so
wouldn't
that
deduct
from
the
value
of
the
property
in
its
current
state.
E
E
Like
I
told
you,
the
range
was
39.90
all
the
way
up
to
65
and
so
we're
using
the
very
low
end
of
that
range
and
that
we
feel
that
that
right
there
is
what
accounts
for
your
lease
up,
whatever
you
need
to
do,
to
get
a
new
tenant
in
your
leasing
commissions,
but
we're
at
the
low
end
of
the
range
okay.
I
I'm
sorry
mary,
we've
said
throughout
the
year
that
on
general
commercial
right
now
I
mean
we
use
a
lower
rent
rate
to
account
for
any
need
to
get
a
new
tenant
in
there.
It's
a
lot
of
information
that
we
don't
get
on
gen,
reta,
general
commercial
properties
that
we
do
get
on
office
properties
such
as
ti
free
rent
and
everything
like
that.
So
what
we
do
is
we
use
the
lower
end
of
the
rent
range
or
we
even
discount
the
rent,
a
little
bit
more
if
we
deem
necessary.
I
F
A
E
Thank
you
as
just
a
reminder.
E
The
owner
is
getting
a
very,
very
low
rent
for
this
property
there,
and
I
wanted
to
remind
you
that
the
lease
is
on
a
month-to-month
lease,
so
the
tenant
can
leave
at
any
time
the
owner
can
have
them
leave
it's
it's
a
very
short-term
lease,
and
this
is
because
they're
looking
to
redevelop
this
property
and
we
feel
that
the
expenses
that
we
applied
are
are
above
what
they
were
reporting
and
we
used
a
low
rental
rate
for
this
neighborhood
and
for
this
size
also
for
the
type
of
tenant.
E
That's
in
there,
the
national
chain.
We
feel
that
the
2020
assessment
is
well
supported.
Thank
you
very
much.
D
Sure
so,
just
in
in
closing,
this
site
is
an
old
building
that
was
built
in
1965.
It
hasn't
been
renovated
since
1990,
so
it's
an
older
building.
It
is
not
one
of
the
towards
the
nicer
end
of
the
range
when
you
look
at
all
of
the
different
retail,
that's
in
this
neighborhood
in
the
virginia
square
submarket.
D
So
I
think
it's
defensible
and
logical
for
it
to
be
at
the
lower
end
of
the
range
automatically
just
given
its
condition,
but
we
think
that
the
market
rent
ought
to
be
lower
for
this
particular
property,
given
its
condition
and
also
taking
into
account
that
a
new
owner
would
have
to
essentially
release
an
entirely
vacant
building.
A
G
A
couple
of
things,
the
first
one
is
the
comparables
that
they
presented
in
their
report.
There
are
certainly
similar
properties
in
similar
uses,
but
they're
by
no
means,
in
most
cases,
similar
location
and
even
in
commercial
location
matters
a
lot.
This
is
a
lot
of
frontage
on
the
rv
corridor,
with
a
boatload
of
parking.
G
What
exactly
the
landlord
the
owner?
Of
course,
the
appellant
has
been
trying
to
redevelop,
has
come
out
several
times
and
they,
and
so
far
the
development
plans
haven't
meshed
well
with
the
immediate
neighborhood,
which
is
completely
residential
but
they're
trying
they're
going
at
it.
So
I
I
don't
find
the
30,
but
rather
the
40
square
foot
estimated
income,
all
things
being
equal
to
be
more
appropriate.
G
Second,
this
is
one
tenant
only
and
of
course
it's
iffy
how
long
they're
going
to
be
there,
but,
but
part
of
that
is
because
of
the
appellant's
decision
they
want
to
redevelop
and
to
just
give
the
guideline
vacancy
rate
is
completely
appropriate.
I
think,
and
and
not
an
inflated
one,
it's
one
tenant,
that's
it.
Lastly,
we
have
a
tradition
or
a
standard
or
a
guideline
that
we
don't
project.
G
What
might
happen
to
a
tenant
in
the
future
future
meeting,
starting
on
january,
2nd
2020
in
this
case,
and
though
it
looks
like
an
iffy
tentative
a
tenancy?
We
don't
know
that.
We
can't
know
that
and
we
don't
know
that
a
future
owner
is
going
to
automatically
lose
the
stables
it's
reasonable
to
assume.
But
we
don't
know
that
and
we
can't
account
for
it
so
taking
off
below
the
line.
Expenses
for
releasing
is
not
something
that
we
do,
and
this
comes
up
fairly
often.
G
F
Yeah,
you
know
I
did
some
math.
I
came
up
with
slightly
lower
than
than
what
we
had
reduced,
or
I
guess
confirmed
last
year
at
2019.
I'd
I'd
support
a
a
minor
reduction
this
year,
but
if
I
don't
hear
any
support
on
my
end,
I'm
not
going
to
even
bother
making
the
case.
F
It
on
yeah
yeah,
I
mean
I
took
the
county's
rent
kind
of
at
face
value,
the
forty
dollars
and
fifty
cents
with
the
seven
cap
I
deducted
a
ten
year:
leasing,
commission
and
fifteen
dollars,
a
square
foot
for
concessions,
and
I
came
up
with
4.8
million.
H
I
this
mark,
I
do
think,
that's
that's
somewhat
fair,
because,
while
it
is
at
the
lower
range,
the
rent,
the
county
used
it.
That
building
dictates
the
lower
range
before
any
leasing
commission
and
if
someone
would,
if,
if
the
tenant
did
move
and
they
decided
that
abandoned
because
they're
not
getting
their
price
for
this
property,
they'd
have
to
release
it
and
they'd
have
to
do
some
work
and
it's
it's
a
little
bit
of
an
awkward
location.
It's
a
tough.
F
Spot
yeah,
you
know
when
you
when
you're,
comparing
the
rent-
and
you
know
I
guess
I
appreciate
not
wanting
to
disclose
you-
know
private
rent
rates
and
things
in
that
neighborhood,
but
you've
got
a
much
different
dynamic.
F
If
you
go
a
couple
blocks
to
the
east
and
you're
kind
of
in
the
boston
office
market,
this
staples
is
across
the
street
from
essentially
a
nursing
home,
so
you're
not
going
to
get
that
kind
of
activity
for
a
traditional
retailer,
and
my
other
issue
that
I
have
with
this
building,
that's
going
to
be
tough
to
overcome
if
staples
ever
left
and
probably
why
the
owner
is
letting
them
continue
once
a
month
at
a
low
rate.
Is
it's
a
weird
size
right?
It's
it's
too
big!
F
It's
too
small
to
be
big
box,
and
it's
too
big
to
be.
You
know,
kind
of
a
restaurant
or
a
smaller
shop,
so
you're
you're
always
going
to
get
a
lower
rental
rate
when
you're,
when
you're
in
that
in
between
size
area.
C
A
A
J
J
Let
me
just
go
ahead
and
pitch
in
my
comment.
I
don't
think
well,
I
don't
think
I
would
support
any
reduction
from
this
year.
You
know
we've
heard
this
case
before
and
I
think
the
assessment
has
been
pretty
much
in
line
with
the
way
that
other
properties
have
been
accessed,
and
this
is
a
particular
property
that
the
management
decided
to
obviously
keep
it
at
such
a
ridiculous
range
for
now
and
any
reduction
I
think,
would
be
made
based
on
speculations
from
us.
J
Think
right
now,
I'm
okay
with
what
the
county
has
done.
They've
used
the
lower
rent,
the
lowest
rent
possible,
so
you
know,
and
based
on
the
vacancy
and
the
expenses
that
they
use,
I'm
okay
with
the
assessment.
The
way
it
is.
G
Would
I
I'll
just
extend
exactly
what
mary
said?
I
would
support
a
slight
deduction
to
last
year's
evaluation,
but
I
need
to
know
based
on
what
empirical
evidence,
what
number
you
think
is
shaky
enough
to
change
to
lower
that
0.5
percent
increase
that
the
department
has
suggested
for
this
year.
F
Yeah
I
had
a
different
approach,
just
looking
at
the
bottom
line,
but
you
know
if
you
wanted
to
take
a
look
at
the
rental
rate
for
8
900
to
9
9
000
square
foot
building.
I
don't
think
the
counties
presented
adequate
comps
right,
the
largest
building
there
was
6
800.
H
F
So
I
really
don't
think
they
made
a
case,
and
I
you
know
I
don't
know
which
one
had
the
kitchen
in
it,
but
that
that
should
have
been
thrown
out
that
shouldn't
even
be
presented
to
us.
You
know
to
put
a
kitchen
in
one
of
these
imagine
putting
a
kitchen
in
that
staples
building
how
much
it
would
cost
that
that
that
owner
to
try
to
get
through
all
the
regulatory
red
tape,
and
do
that.
F
F
Yeah
39
8
900
over
7
is
4
million
958
600.
F
F
H
A
H
F
All
right,
a
motion
to
reduce
the
assessment
to
the
2019
level
of
4
million
965,
even.
A
So
without
bar,
and
so
that
makes
it
five
to
one
so
the
assessment
has
been
reduced
to
four
million
nine
hundred.
Sixty-Five
thousand
and
that's
just
based
on
a
rough
number
of
the
run
somewhere
between
38
and
a
half
and
39,
and
a
quarter.
Okay.
A
Okay,
thank
you.
Okay.
Moving
to
the
final
case,
economic
unit,
3406716g
is
in
george
3600,
south
library,
mr
steinhauser,
you
can
start
with
your
eight
minutes
and
tell
us
about
the
property.
C
Yeah.
Thank
you,
madam
chair,
my
colleague,
sean
eskaw,
who
was
on
the
line
we'll
be
presenting
this
one.
A
K
All
right
well,
thank
you
board.
So
this
is
the
eclipse
on
center
park
retail
center,
it's
3600
south
glebe
road
3650
as
well,
located
across
from
the
dca
airport.
K
It's
the
current
assessment
is
31
903
600
for
comprised
of
six
parcels,
the
2019
assessment
for
what
it's
worth
was:
29
million
743
600.
K
Our
opinion
of
value
is
coming
in
at
24
million
for
the
six
parcels
and
it's
an
81
000,
roughly
square
foot
center,
that's
comprised
of
primarily
a
harris
cedar
grocery
center
and
then
the
remaining
30,
000
or
so
square
feet
is
just
some
retail
condos.
K
K
K
K
I'll
keep
talking
and
stop
me,
but
this
is
a
cbre
broker.
Opinion
of
value
market
analysis,
it's
as
of
july
2019.
Obviously
this
was
performed
for
the
owner
to
support
a
higher
value.
You
know
to
market
the
property
and
the
value
range
that
they're
coming
up
for
independently,
for
this
property
is
between
21.2
million
as
a
low
end
and
high
end
of
23.9
million,
and
again
this
was
as
of
july
2019.
K
K
This
is
an
email
from
the
owner
from
you
know,
early
2019
that
they're
they're,
trying
to
you
know,
we've
received
multiple
brokers,
opinions
of
value
and
conducted
auction
processes
where
the
max
bid
was
no
more
than
26.5
million.
So
basically
long
story,
short
they're
trying
to
sell
this
property
and
and
receiving
bid,
slash
market
opinions
between
the
range
of
23
and
26
million
again
compared
to
the
current
assessment
of
over
31
million,
and
they
said
their
acquisition
base.
Cap
rate
was
7.25
percent.
K
As
we
know,
cap
rates
typically
tend
to
to
rise
up,
for
instance,
in
discounted
cash
flow
analysis,
so
that
would
support
a
loaded
cap
rate
anywhere
between
eight
point,
five
to
nine
percent.
K
This
was
from
march
of
2018
and
they
actually
were,
you
know,
had
a
letter
of
a
letter
of
intent
signed
with
a
prospective
buyer
for
25
million
for
this
property
and
unfortunately
for
the
owner.
It
fell
through
the
buyer
backed
out-
and
you
know
here
we
are
a
couple
years
later
and
they're
still
trying
to
market
sell
the
property.
K
So
that's
just
a
brief
background.
Now
I'll
walk.
You,
through
our
income
analysis
kind
of
supporting
our
opinion
of
value
flipping
back
to
page
five.
K
So
I'll
kind
of
go,
you
know
side
by
side
with
you
know
our
the
very
right,
the
appellant
r
opinion
versus
the
updated
counties.
You
can
see,
there's
only
really
a
couple
variances
a
couple
differences,
our
paris
teeter
retail
rent
is
is
very
similar.
One
difference
is
we're
using
a
lower
retail
other
retail
rent
of
around
38.50
a
square
foot,
whereas
the
owner
is
using
41.25,
I'm
sorry
the
county
is
using
41.25
and
our
number
reflects
actual
historical
performance.
K
So
I'll
show
you
that
in
a
second.
Secondly,
our
vacancy
is
six
percent
versus
the
county's
three
percent,
and
this
six
percent
is
market
supported
and
it's
historical
supported.
There's
six
percent
actual
vacancy
of
the
subject.
The
three
percent
we
feel
is
very,
very
low
and
then,
lastly,
the
the
last
difference
is
we're
using
a
loaded,
nine
percent
cap
rate
as
I've
kind
of
alluded
to
numerous
times.
K
You
know
the
last
several
minutes
versus
the
counties,
loaded,
seven
percent-
where
really
the
county's
base
rate-
and
I
know
that
that
that's
the
number
they
use
in
their
guidelines,
but
it's
a
base
rate
of
around
five
and
a
half
percent,
and
it's
just
I've.
Looked
at
every
survey,
rerc
pwc
I've
looked
at
recent
sales.
I
don't
see
anything
supporting
this
type
of
property
for
that
low,
a
rate
combined
with
what
they're
actually
trying
to
you
know,
market
and
sell
the
property
for
so
quickly.
K
If
you
look
at
the
historical
performance,
you
can
see
that
the
noi
the
county
has
is
2.2
million
2.24,
which
is.
K
While
the
while
our
analyze
is
2.1,
so
it's
about
100,
a
little
140,
000
delta
and
the
I'll
just
read
off
the
last
four
years
of
historical
performance,
noi
2016
was
1.468
million,
2017
was
1.9
million,
2018
was
the
2.23
million,
so
I'm
assuming
that's
where
the
county
is
getting
their
number
from,
even
though
it's
higher
they're
using
2.24
million
versus
2.23
and
then
lastly,
in
2019
the
last
year
came
down
to
2.128
million.
K
K
You
know
that
not
only
would
they
do
it
yesterday,
they
would
do
it
with
you
know
a
huge
celebration
there's
just
no
way
they
can
get
that
number.
So
I'll
stop
for
questions
and
stuff.
E
Thank
you
once
again.
This
is
a
commercial
condominium
property.
It's
the
only
one
in
all
of
our
commercial
condominiums.
That
is
as
large
as
it
is,
and
so
therefore
we
use
the
guideline.
We
used
a
diff
different
cap
rate
than
what
was
used
for
the
commercial
condos,
which
was
6.25,
I
believe,
and
this
one
we're
using
seven
percent
because
of
its
large
size
at
the
81
000
square
feet.
E
The
market
analysis
that
the
realtors
we
looked
at
those
things
and
and
we
go
okay,
but
they're
still
they're,
not
an
executed
sale,
it's
not
an
actual
sale,
but
when
we
were
looking
at
other
properties,
we
go
okay
in
this
subject's
market.
We're
going
is
the
rent
that
we're
using
reasonable,
and
so
I
did
a
rent
analysis.
It's
on
page.
E
So
if
you
look
in
column,
f
line,
12
you'll
see
the
rental
rate
that
we
came
up
with
for
the
smaller
tenants
that
excludes
the
grocer.
That's
that's
in
there.
So
this
the
rental
rate
that
we
had
come
up
with
well
the
rental,
so
we
used
something
a
little
bit
lower
because
they
were
also
showing
5.8
roughly
for
vacancy
and
the
vacancy
that
we're
using
is
three
percent.
E
So
because
we
don't
do
below
the
line
adjustments,
we
lowered
the
rent
and
so
the
rent
that
we're
using
shown
on
page
gosh.
These
pages
are
not
numbered
four
or
fives
on
page
six
on
the
test,
so
we
we
tested
it
out
and
we're
looking
at
what
the
the
appellant
is
reporting,
and
so
we
used
a
lower
rent
for
the
smaller
tenants
and
we
used
the
same
rent
that
the
group
they
were
achieving
for
the
grocer.
E
E
Other
than
that,
that's
pretty
much
it
for
the
moment,
I'm
open
for
questions.
B
K
K
It
might
be
multi-family,
I
think
it's
malta.
I
think
it's
like
apartments.
B
Okay
for
the
county,
I
was
just
looking
back
at
your.
You
know
the
assessment
guideline
that
you
all
did,
which
is
tremendously
helpful,
but
I
do
have
one
question
with
a
condom
with
a
commercial
condominium
of
this
magnitude.
B
I
No,
we
treated
this
property
the
same
as
we
treated
mixed-use
apartment.
So
if
you
want
to
look
at
this
property
and
the
way
it
sits,
you
can
compare
it
to
penrose
square,
which
has
a
large
grocery
store,
the
giant
and
other
retail
stores.
We
use
a
seven
percent
cap
rate
on
that.
I
Well,
actually,
we
do
have
other
commercial
condominium
properties
if
you're
small,
you
know,
if
you
look
at
the
met
park,
area
properties
out
there,
such
as
the
metropolitan
that
is
broken
up
into
a
land
condominium,
so
all
the
general
commercial
properties,
all
these
one
land,
condo
and
one
set
of
rpc's,
and
then
the
apartments
above
is
set
on
another
land
condo
right,
but.
H
B
How?
Because
a
land
condo,
you
have
created,
you've
divided
the
land
here,
you've
divided
the
structure.
I
B
B
We
don't
like
the
insurance
we
have,
but
we're
stuck
with
it,
because
we
have
an
office
condo
and
we
have
a
hotel
condo
and
they
own
more
than
we
do,
and
so
we're
stuck
with
their
insurance.
And
those
are
the
kind
of
things
that
I
think
you're
not
giving
any
that
you're,
not
understanding
an
owner
has
to
deal
with,
and
it
seems
like.
Maybe
that's
why
these
lower
prices
are
coming
in
and
they're.
I
And
again
we
try
to
base
our
cap
rate
and
information
off
of
sales
that
occur
in
the
county
and
a
commercial
condo
of
this
size.
It
hasn't
sold.
So
no,
we
don't
just
arbitrarily
pick
a
different,
a
basis
point
to
add
to
it
off
of
that,
because
we
don't
have
the
evidence.
We
did
say
this
property
is
the
same
size
as
other
mixed
use,
retail
spaces
in
the
county
and
that's
something
we
can
peg
it
to.
And,
as
I
mentioned,
you
have
penrose
square,
which
is
similar
in
size.
I
You
have
the
with
the
metropolitan
land
condominium,
which
is
valued
based
off
of
general
commercial
on
the
retail
and
there's
a
few
other
properties.
I
think
what
pentagon
not
pentagon
road,
but
we
have
a
few
other
properties
that
are
large
in
size
as
far
as
retail
square
footage
that
receives
the
general
commercial
cap
rate
and
know
the
best
way
for
us
to
equalize
this
property
with
other
properties
in
the
county.
B
I'll
I'll
say
for
discussion.
F
K
Excellent
question:
yes,
I
can-
and
I
just
spoke
with
the
owner
about
this
yesterday-
and
I've
been
speaking
within
the
last
couple
weeks
in
2014
the
property.
The
sales
for
the
harris
teeter
was
over
20
million.
K
It
steadily
has
declined
since
2014
to
through
2019
in
2018
it
was
14.1
million
and
then
in
2019
at
you
know,
calendar
year
2019
it
was
13.3
million.
So
it's
a
35
decrease
from
2014
to
2019..
K
They
said
there
is
a
good
risk
that
the
the
harris
heater
will
continue
paying
rent
through
the
re
through
the
remainder
of
the
their
lease,
but
they
will
go
dark
so
that
in
itself
is
the
number
one
obstacle
for
why
this
property
is
over
assessed
and
why
it
can't
sell,
because
that
hair
seeder
is
struggling.
Mightily.
E
So
once
again,
we
were
looking
at
other
properties,
maybe
apartments
mixed
use
for
similar
size,
comparable
rent
at
this.
For
this
particular
property.
We
feel
that
the
seven
percent
cap
rate
is
justified.
E
We
used
a
higher
cap
rate
for
this
property
because,
if
it's
larger
size
than
we
do
for
the
other
commercial
condominiums,
I
also
wanted
to
make
a
quick
note.
I
found
two
other
properties.
They
are
not
commercial
condominiums,
but
they
range
in
size
from
56,
000
to
59,
000
square
feet
and
their
rental
rates
range
from
35
90
to
53.50
for
rent,
that's
on
the
the
retail
size.
Those
are
the
largest
ones
that
I
could
find.
E
We
feel
that
the
the
subject
looking
at
their
income
and
expense
information-
our
expenses
are
well
supported
and
that's
it.
K
Sure
so,
just
two
main
things
to
summarize
one
from
an
noi
standpoint,
you
know
counting
rents
expenses,
all
that
stuff
the
county
is
using
a
higher
noi
than
the
last
ever
ever.
2018
was
the
highest
year
performance
year
that
the
property
achieved
and
the
county's
number
is
higher
than
that.
Our
number
is
in
line
with
2019
performance,
around
2.1
million.
K
Secondly,
with
cap
rates,
I've
looked
as
well
in
addition
to
every
market
survey
I
can
find
were
there
and
irwin
said
this
perfectly
there.
There
have
been
no
market
sales
of
similar
properties
in
this
area
in
this
location
of
similar
property
types.
So
it's
not
fair
to
it's
not
appropriate.
To
use
this
to
say:
oh
we're
using
a
higher
cap
rate
of
seven
percent,
which
really
is
like
a
5.5
percent
base.
Cap
rate,
when,
when
everything
I've
seen
supports
a
higher
rate,
in
addition
to
the
owner,
trying
to
sell
the
property
unsuccessfully
for
years.
B
Thank
you,
madam
chairman,
I'll,
go
ahead
and
throw
out
my
thinking,
I'm
a
I
own
one,
six
of
my
office
building,
I'm
in
an
llc
and
you
take
the
value.
Let's
say
the
value
of
this
building
is
six
million.
My
my
interest
is
not
worth
one
million.
B
My
interest
has
what's
called
a
discount
because
I'm
a
member
of
a
llc,
so
my
interest
is
probably
worth
about
750
000
and
the
reason
is
because,
if
I
sell
my
interest,
whoever
buys
it
has
to
deal
with
my
other
partners-
and
you
have
the
same
situation
here
with
this
commercial
condominium-
and
I
I
hear
what
the
county's
doing
and
they
argue
eloquently
in
defense
of
their
position,
but
I
think
it's
just
wrong.
I
think
the
cap
rate
is
not
appropriate.
B
I
tried
to
find
a
comparable
one.
I'm
not
sure
there
necessarily
is
one.
The
county
talks
about
evidence
of
a
concluded,
sale
and,
and
sometimes
you
don't
have
a
concluded
sale
because
the
market
is
so
poor
that
you
just
don't
have
anything
comparable
and
I
think
the
applicant
has
presented
appropriate
evidence
in
when
we
don't
have
a
concluded
sale.
B
G
Nonetheless,
none
of
them
approach
this
this
level
and
and
and
to
me
this
is
a
cap
rate
issue,
because
all
the
various
numbers
are
all
quite
close,
percentage-wise
the
gross
potential
in
the
noi
and
the
egi,
and
all
that
kind
of
good
stuff.
It's,
as
I
said
it's
the
cap
rate,
but
given
sympathy
to
that
this
seems
to
be
relatively
higher
than
what
the
market
dictates
the
open
and
free
market.
I
would.
G
G
A
Evaluation
right
I'll
add
to
that
ken.
I
I
agree
with
what
you're
saying
I'm
I'm
not
swayed
by
the
appellant
argument.
You
know
that
the
county's
number
was
way
too
high.
Again,
if
you
look
at
historical
performance
of
the
property
in
columns
a
b
and
c,
the
actual
original
assessment
was
right
in
line
with
what
you
would
expect
it
to
be.
I
will
say:
I
think
that
the
county's
test
is
a
little
high.
A
When
you
look
at
that
number,
I'm
not
sure
they
did
themselves
a
favor
there,
but
I
find
column
g,
the
appellant
just
slightly
lower.
So
you
know
I
don't
know
I
mean
I
I'd
like
to
hear
what
other
folks
have
to
say.
F
All
right
I'll,
just
I'll
make
a
couple
comments.
Penrose
square,
I
believe,
is
a
grocery
anchored
multi-family
building
under
single
ownership.
F
I
believe
which
in
the
market
yields
one
of
the
best
cap
rates
available
right,
grocery
anchored
multi-family,
there's
a
lot
of
buyers
for
that
product
and
there's
a
lot
of
financers
for
that
product.
You
can
get
a
hud
loan
on
that
product,
so
there's
the
the
cap
rate
is
going
to
be
the
bottom
of
the
market
on
the
other
end
of
the
spectrum,
condominium,
retail,
building,
retail
condo
inside
of
a
residential
condo
structure,
which
probably
controls
the
majority
of
the
decisions
that
are
made
for
that
building
ken.
F
I
think
I
think
I
was
just
looking
through
the
land
records.
I
think
there
is
like
a
couple
hundred
individual
owners
in
that
building
of
condos,
so
they
have
to
deal
with
with
an
association
in
anything
that
they
do
now.
I
don't
know
who
has
majority
rights
or
decision
rights
or
how
that
works,
but
it's
a
nightmare
and
what
that
does?
Is
it
eliminates,
regency
or
or
you
know,
any
other
shopping
center
to
traditional
shopping
center
owners
from
even
wanting
to
take
a
look
at
that
property?
Edens
is
not
going
to
buy
it.
F
F
So,
for
that
I
mean
just
in
short,
I
would
and
when
you
add
in
the
whole
concept
of
there's
a
potential
that
this
is
a
dark
grocery
store
and
that
there's
leases
that
are
probably
hinging
on
whether
or
not
there's
a
grocery
store
there
in
some
of
the
smaller
inline
spaces,
I
would
support
a
cap
rate
increase
and
when
I,
when
I
use
eight
percent
to
take
that
that
into
account
instead
of
seven
on
the
appellant's
numbers,
I
came
up
with
a
number
pretty
close
to
where,
where
barnes
was
20,
26.3
million
more
or
less
so
I
just
don't
see
any
I'll
say
the
appellant.
F
This
is
probably
one
of
the
best
cases
we've
seen
as
far
as
they
looked
at
a
market
offers.
They
presented
market
offers,
they
presented
brokers,
opinions
of
value,
they
presented
data,
all
the
ine
reports.
They
even
gave
us
retailers,
income
sales-
I
mean
all
the
information
is
there.
They
made
a
good
case.
I
think
it's
a
much
better
case
than
what
the
county
has
at
32
million.
F
I
mean
if
it
was
just
up
to
me.
I'd
probably
support
the
appellant's
opinion
of
value,
but
knowing
that
we
need
to
get
a
consensus
here,
I'd
I'd
go
with
just
just
changing
the
cap
rate
for
this
particular
property.
J
Yes,
what
one
of
the
things
that
I
I'm
not
clear
on
what
mr
lawson
said
is
you
know
what
would
make
a
difference,
the
way
that
the
title
is
held
down?
I.
E
J
I
don't
see
it
but
on
the
overall
numbers
that
we're
looking
at
on
page
three,
just
like
we
do
with
any
other
property,
I
think
the
numbers
are
in
line
and
now
the
reconstruction
that
the
county
has
on
column
f.
The
only
thing
that
I
did
is
change
the
vacancy
from
three
percent
to
four
percent,
which
would
bring
it
to
114
000
161,
which
I
think
is
more
in
line
with
the
2019.
J
Now
I
understand
the
situation
that
this
is
not
necessarily
a
you
know
typical
condo
project
that
has
individual
owners
like
political
senses
or
not.
But
I
would
I
also
looked
at
the
possibility
of
increasing
the
eight
percent
cap
rate,
because
I
think
I
agree
you
know
most
of
the
times
we
we
say
we
don't
have
enough
evidence.
You
know
the
appellant
didn't
make
a
case.
J
We
didn't
they
provide
too
much,
and
I
think
in
this
case
they
do
have
more
than
just
the
offers,
and
I
wouldn't
base
my
any
decisions
based
on
just
offers.
You
know,
I
think
we
have.
I
agree
with
ken.
I
think
we
have
to
have
a
solid
sale
or
something
that
is
at
least
in
process
or
a
contract
just
to
persuade
a
little
bit
so.
I
J
Eight
percent,
if
I
use
like
eight
percent
cap
rate
with
the
change
to
four
percent
vacancy,
I
come
up
with
a
value
a
bit
a
little
bit
higher
than
what
they
you
know.
What
barnes
and
greg
are
suggesting
the
value
would
be:
27
million,
741
200.
G
Two
questions
first
jose,
thank
you,
oh
say
the
four
percent.
Where
does
where
does
that
come
from
the
guidelines?
Three?
Why
do
you
choose
four.
J
J
G
Just
okay
and
and
for
mr
for
greg,
you
talked
about
the
the
condominium
there's
hundreds
of
partners,
but
it
isn't
it
one
entity
that
owns
it
and.
F
Dark
pc
unmoved,
whatever
that
rpc
is,
you
can
just
see
it.
There's
there's
a
hundred
or
so
units
in
there
that
are
individual
owners
that
are
all
members
of
a
of
a
residential
association.
G
I
C
G
G
B
Thank
you,
madam
chairman.
I
wanted
to
kind
of
share
with
ken
the
reason
I
have
a
conflict
with
tom
calucci
is
that
my
father,
tom
calucci,
art,
walsh
and
preschool
brothers
bought
all
the
condom,
all
the
commercial
condominiums
in
hyde
park
and
for
about
10
years.
My
office
was
there
and
I
was
finally
driven
out
by
the
resident
by
the
residents
and
what
they
would
do
ken
is
they
would
say:
okay,
we
need
to
fix
the
plumbing,
so
we're
going
to
shut
off
the
water
all
day
on
tuesday.
B
That's
great
residents
are
at
work,
but
barnes
is
I'm
working
at
the
condo
and
we
need
to
clean
the
garage
or
we
need
to
turn
off
the
lights
and
so
once
you're
in
a
condominium
ownership
situation,
you
have
to
deal
with
other
owners
whose
interests
are
very
different
than
yours.
When
you
have
an
apartment.
Building,
that's
owned
by
ditmar
and
ditmar
owns
the
commercial
and
owns
a
residential.
B
They
control
everything
it
can
also
go
the
other
way.
I
was
involved
in
a
condominium
dispute
where
it
was
a
cigar
store,
and
so
people
would
smoke
cigars
in
the
commercial
units
and
with
the
smoke
flooding
throughout
the
condominium
building
and
it
drove
the
people
crazy,
and
so
I
just
I'm
not
trying
to
bore
everyone.
I'm
sharing
this
with
you
too,
to
to
help.
You
understand
why
you
have
to
value
this
use
this
condominium
commercial
in
a
condominium
with
residential
units
that
can
outvote
the
commercial
owners.
A
J
Yes,
I'll
go
ahead
and
move
that
we
make
a
reduction
in
the
assessment
for
2020
and
the
value
would
be
27
million,
741
200,
that's
based
on
increasing
the
expense.
I
mean
the
vacancy
to
4
and
the
cap
rate
to
8
from
column
f.
A
Okay-
and
the
second
was
mr
hoffman,
yes,
okay,
motion
in
a
second
all
in
favor,
aye.
J
A
A
We
will
not
have
an
appellant
on
that
we're
just
going
to
hear
from
the
county,
so
the
order
is
going
to
change
a
little
bit
tomorrow.
The
cases
are
going
to
be
heard
in
the
order.
If
you're
looking
at
your
agenda,
mr
chica
says
two
cases
case
number
two
and
case
number
five
are
going
to
be
heard
first,
because
he
has
an
appointment.
We'll
then
move
to
case
number
one
and
then
end
with
case
three
and
then
just
at
the
end
of
the
day,
we
will
vote
on
the
withdrawal
case.