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Description
White House press photographer Dennis Brack discusses his long career photographing presidents. Having created a museum’s worth of images for the Black Star agency, Brack has now written the book on his craft, “Presidential Picture Stories: Behind the Cameras at the White House.” Brack demonstrates how photographers have covered presidents since the days of Abraham Lincoln. Presidents can stay only eight years but veteran photojournalists like Dennis Brack have spent decades documenting First Family life and fresh history in the White House “fishbowl.” Dennis Brack is a former president of the White House News Photographers Association who averaged a picture per week in Time Magazine for 23 years. He’ll discuss the joys and ordeals of such high-profile, high-pressure work. Recorded at the Arlington Public Library on Nov. 24 2014.
A
Well,
good
evening,
our
special
guest
tonight
is
Dennis
Brock.
As
you
know,
since
you
turned
out
for
this
program,
he
is
a
very
distinguished
white
house
photo
journalist.
Who's
just
come
out
with
a
unique
book
presidential
picture
stories
behind
the
cameras
at
the
White
House
capturing
a
an
occupation
that
probably
hasn't
been
documented
in
this
kind
of
detail
before
people
like
Dennis
are
usually
the
people
who
document
the
people
in
the
White
House.
But
this
time
he's
documented.
A
The
people
behind
the
cameras
dennis
is
former
president
of
the
White
House
news,
photographers
Association
Association,
and
he
averaged
a
picture
per
week
in
Time
magazine
for
23
23
years,
not
sure
he's
taking
pictures
of
every
president
from
JFK
to
the
current
occupant
mr.
Obama,
and
basically
has
seen
more
history
than
most
people
have
read.
So,
let's
hear
more
about
it
from
Dennis
himself,
Dennis
Brock.
C
D
E
B
Men
and
women,
talented
photographers,
but
they
have
never
seen
a
dark
room.
They've
never
used
a
camera
with
film.
So
all
the
old
stories
that
we've
told
through
the
years
that
have
been
passed
down
from
photographers
presidents
and
things
about
what
film
we
use
in
things
that
we
used
have
been
lost
and
it's
a
great
deal
of
difference
between
the
photographer's
today
and
the
photographers
that
were
back
in
this
day.
B
If
you
look
these,
these
people
had
probably
12
frames
to
take
their
pictures
all
day,
long
12
clicks
of
the
shutter
and
these
these
shutters
were-
and
this
was
better
than
earlier-
and
these
shutters-
who
you
would
take
the
the
film
and
you'd
put
them
in,
and
you
take
the
slide
out
and
you
click,
and
so
it's
very
time
consuming.
We
had
to
have
split
second
timing,
so
this
was
a
problem.
B
So
I've
listened
to
these
stories
for
many
years
and
as
I
says,
I've
covered
presidents
for
since
Kennedy
and
and
so
these
stories
had
to
be
written
down
and
I
wrote
them
down
in
this
book,
and
so
I
have
enjoyed
doing
this,
and
so
I
will
tell
you
a
little
about
a
history.
Now
we've
got
150
years
of
history
to
cover.
B
So
if
we
could
have
questions
at
the
last,
that
would
be
great
and
there'll
be
time
for
that,
if
I'm
fast
and
so
the
other
thing
is
about
the
pictures
is
that
I
took
all
the
color
pictures.
The
black
and
white
were
photographers
who
went
before
me
and
thanks
now,
some
some
subjects
at
the
White
House
would
love
to
pose
for
pictures,
and
this
is
this
is
fala
FDR's
dog
and
he
was
very
good
others
not
so
much.
B
B
B
Former
congressman
Abe
Lincoln
was
walking
down
Broadway,
he
took
a
right
into
Brady,
studio,
went
and
Brady
came
down
and
straightened
up
his
collar
and
he
made
this
picture
and
you
got
to
remember
that
photography
was
brand
new
they've
never
had
anything
like
this,
and
so,
but
they
didn't
have
any
way
to
to
see
it
because
none
of
the
reproduction
processes
had
been
invented.
Yet
so
the
best
they
could
do
was
these
little
cards
now
carte
de
vistas
and
I'll
pass
these
around.
B
Photography
at
the
time
was
very
complicated.
It
was
the
wet
plate
process
and
I'm
going
to
tell
you
about
the
tools
that
we
used
just
to
give
you
some
idea
about
how
photography's
come
along.
First,
you
had
to
coat
this
plate
and
then
you
had
to
rush
course.
This
was
all
done
in
the
dark,
put
it
in
a
film
holder
and
then
you'd
rush,
and
you
take
the
picture.
This
is
Senator
Leahy.
B
Getting
his
paper
is
a
picture
taken
by
Rob
Gibson,
and
this
Rob
after
a
hundred
years
has
gotten
this
down
here
to
about
like
that.
But
when
they
first
did
this,
it
took
a
whole
big
wagon
of
equipment
and
things,
and
so
he
Matthew
Brady
moves
down
to
Washington
has
a
studio
still
there
today.
You
can
see
it
if
you
know
where
you
look
around
sixth
street
and
pennsylvania
avenue,
but
he
wants
to
cover
the
hostilities.
Now
they
called
him
the
hostilities
they
didn't
know.
B
C
D
B
At
all
says
that
here
he
takes
out
a
three
by
five
card,
just
a
little
little
smaller
than
that
picture
and
he
writes
pass
Brady
Abe
Lincoln,
that's
sort
of
the
first,
all
access
press
pass
and
so
that's
what
he
did
and
there
he
is-
and
of
course
he
did
and
then,
of
course
he
got
Alexander
Gardner
and
a
whole
bunch
of
other
photographers
to
a
document
to
Civil
War.
Now
I
mentioned
the
technology.
This
is
about
the
best.
B
D
B
D
B
The
newspapers
didn't
quite
use
them
very
much
took
until
Teddy
Roosevelt
that
they
started
using
this,
because
teddy
was
a
good
subject
and
the
film
got
a
little
better
than
the
static
pictures
that
were
taking.
Quite
frankly,
the
newspapers
were
very
happy
with
what
they
had.
They
had
drawings
that
were
sensational,
they
sold
newspapers,
they
didn't
care
about.
B
This
Teddy
Roosevelt
gets
to
the
White
House
and
we,
the
photographer's,
missed
the
best
pictures
during
that
administration
early
in
the
morning,
Teddy
Roosevelt
would
come
out
to
the
banks
of
the
Potomac,
take
off
all
his
clothes
dive
in
and
swim
over.
To
probably
what
was
wrote,
Roosevelt
Island
and
then
he
would
kind
of
rest
up
didn't
have
any
clothes
over
there,
but
that
didn't
make
any
difference
seat.
Then
he
swam
back
put
on
his
clothes
and
what
to
work
now.
B
One
thing
he
did
do
is
he
brought
this
fella
George
Harris
to
Washington.
He
was
in
San
Francisco.
He
says
George
Harris,
you
come
to
Washington,
set
up
you've,
seen
the
pitch
that
pictures
in
text,
books,
Harris
and
Ewing.
This
is
the
the
company
that
preserved
that
photographs.
For
the
first
half
of
the
last
century,
teddy
was
a
good
subject
and
George
Harris
was
a
pretty
darn
good
photographer
and
that's
one
of
his
pictures.
B
Here's
what
was
happening
about
after
that
world
war.
One
is
about
to
start
and
we
had
down
at
Fort,
Belvoir
and
Fort
Meade.
All
these
people
coming
to
fight
the
war
and
remember
the
the
halftone
made
these
things
so
photographers
were
welcome
to
Washington
and
they
the
bureau's
were
being
set
up
and
just
about
that
time.
B
Woodrow
Wilson
has
his
stroke
at
everybody,
wanted
pictures
of
Wilson.
Nobody
knew
his
condition
and
accept
the
first
lady
and
then
dr.
Grayson,
his
doctor,
and
the
closest
they
could
get
was
the
sheep
grazing
on
the
White
House
lawn,
and
this
was
actually
taken
by
George
Harrison,
this
picture,
so
they
call
in
George
Harris
and
they
say:
okay,
let's
have
a
controlled
situation
and
it
is
it's
the
first
White
House
handout
picture,
basically
he's
paralyzed
in
this
arm.
The
first
lady
is
holding
this
because
he
couldn't
possibly
do
it
and
that
didn't
work.
B
Everybody
realized
that
that
was
a
fake,
so
on
Sunday
afternoons
and
others
they
had
him
gone
out
in
these
car
rides
and
the
the
photographers
would
get
off
at
the
southeast
gate
and
photograph
him,
but
all
it
showed
was
that
President
Wilson
was
a
very
sick
man
and
finally,
this
is
the
end
of
his
administration,
a
little
bit
by
up
tools
here,
we've
gotten
a
little
bit
more
mobile.
These
things
were
these.
B
The
pictures
in
this
thing
were
eight
by
ten
the
size
of
a
window
frame
in
class,
but
they
were
better
than
what
we
had
Harding's
having
a
cabinet
meeting.
Neg
comes
whispers
in
his
ear.
He
says
cabinet
meeting
over,
that's
it.
He
goes
out
and
laddie
boy
his
airedale
had
just
been
given
to
him
and
he
had
just
arrived
now.
Hardy
was
an
old
newspaper
man.
B
He
knew
the
value
of
a
good
feature
picture
and
every
time
he
had
a
big
scandal,
he
would
invite
the
photographers
in
and
bring
out
laddie
boy
and
his
problems
were
solved
now.
Calvin
Coolidge
was
a
friend
as
the
photographers
and
one
time
one
of
one
of
the
reporters
asked
him.
What
do
you
do
for
exercise?
He
pointed
over
the
photographer's.
B
He
says
I
I
just
do
what
they
tell
me
to
do
and
that's
plenty
of
exercise
for
me,
but
he
was
in
what
he
really
liked
was
the
movies
he
saw
about
a
movie
every
night
at
the
White
House
one
of
the
things
he
liked.
The
best
was
the
newsreels
because
he
realized.
This
is
the
only
way
that
the
American
people
could
really
see
they
couldn't
hear
yet
because
sound
and
it
was
a
voiceover,
but
it
was
it
was
coming
along,
so
these
fellows
were
kings
about
this
time.
B
This
is
35
millimeter
film,
because
these
things
were
shown
in
the
movie
houses.
So
there
was
no
producer
down
here,
there's
nothing.
It
was
just
this
guy
doing
the
whole
thing
and
he
had
to
really
edit
what
he
did,
and
so
he
was
pretty
good.
Now
we
get
to
who
Hoover
in
the
photographer's
did
not
get
along.
He
was
one
one
of
the
things
I
did
was
interview
old
photographers
when,
when
a
no
photographer
saw
me
coming,
it
was
sort
of
like
the
Grim
Reaper
is
showing
up
at
your
door.
B
No
more
magazine
subscriptions
for
you,
and
one
of
them
was
Johnny
D
Joseph's,
who
remember
Hoover,
and
he
said
that
he
was
very
nervous.
He
was
always
worried
about
doing
something
wrong
and
thanks.
He
kept
the
photographer's
waiting
a
great
deal
and
it
was
down
and
out
war,
and
you
can't
really
blame
them,
because
it
was
photography
at
that.
Time
was
very
painful,
especially
when
they
use
flash
powder.
This
was
something
new
that
we
had.
B
This
is
what
the
photographer
would
hold
up.
He
would
put
his
camera
on
a
tripod.
Sometimes
they
could
hold
it
and
put
up
magnesium
in
this
thing
and
then
he
would
trigger
it
by
just
about
like
work
at
a
Zippo
lighter
and
do
that,
and
so
that
was
what
happened.
One
photographer
in
Denver
was
sent
out
to
photograph
a
new
hotel
ballroom
and
a
he'd
like
to
put
a
little
zip
in
in
that
so
put
a
little
gunpowder
in
with
the
magnesium
he
burnt
the
hotel
to
the
ground.
B
So
anyway,
one
thing
that
they
were
really
at
odds
on
was
fishing
and
everybody
was
trying
to
get
a
picture
of
the
Hoover
fishing
and
he
didn't
like
that.
At
all,
Johnny
said
that
the
real
problem
was
mrs.
Hoover
she
had
the
15
foot
rule
no
photographer
could
get
within
15
feet
of
her
husband
because
he
wore
these
horse.
Collars
Johnny
call
him.
He
had
a
couple
duck
double
chins,
and
so
she
thought
by
keeping
them
back.
That
would
do
it
that
didn't
work
anyway.
B
A
little
bit
about
tools
now
we're
getting
a
new
tool,
the
Speed
Graphic,
and
that
that
revolutionized
our
business
to
speak,
and
we
got
a
new
president
FDR.
Now
you
would
think
with
all
the
rules
to
FDR
and
the
photographers
would
not
get
along,
but
they
did
because
he
always
gave
them
something
to
make
a
picture
by.
Maybe
it's
just
the
janta
of
this
or
or
something,
but
he
he
was
really
kind
of
a
guy
that
we
would
help
the
photographers,
and
so
they
they
followed
his
rules.
B
Of
course,
one
of
them
is
photographing
him
in
a
wheelchair,
I
researched.
This
I
never
found
anyone
or
any
place,
except
one
John
Gunther
report,
which
was
wrong
about
any
of
the
photographer's.
The
professional
photographers
photographing
FDR
as
he
was
getting
in
or
out
of
the
car
or
anything
it
just
wasn't
done.
George
tames
said
that
never
came
into
their
mind
that
they
would
not
do
that.
These
were
terrifically
different
times
and
what
we
we
have
today,
but
one
thing
about
FDR
is
he
was
he?
B
Wouldn't
you
wouldn't
think
he
was
a
man
of
the
people,
but
in
a
way
he
kind
of
was
he
identified
with
people.
He
would
be
working
at
his
desk
and
remember
it
took
a
long
time
to
set
up
so
the
photographers
would
come
in
and
they
set
their
tripods
up
and
he'd
be.
Looking
at
the
newspaper
remember
that
horse
racing
was
big
back
then
we
had
Pimlico,
which
is
a
big
track,
and
he
look
up
and
he'd
say
who
do
you
like
in
the
fifth
boys?
B
B
You've
noticed
that
I've
said
boys
up
until
this
point,
because
all
photographers
were
meant
all
news
photographers
and
don't
don't
be
fooled
by
the
suits.
These
were
rough
guys
when,
when
a
city
editor
was
in
the
newsroom
and
he
saw
a
aggressive
copy
boy,
he'd
sent
him
over
to
the
darkroom
to
be
a
squeegee
boy
and
he'd
work.
His
way
up-
and
you
you
photographers,
were
not
somebody
you
take
to
dinner,
but
the
war
comes
just
like
Rosie.
B
This
is
actually
the
second
picture
of
the
swearing
in
the
photographers
were
out
of
position.
They
grumbled
and
they
said
well,
let's
do
it
again,
and
so
they
did
Harry
Truman
when
he
was
Senator
was
a
good
friend
of
the
vitara.
He
judged
our
contest
all
the
time
max
desk,
for
who
is
a
hundred
and
one
years
old
lives
out
at
leisure
world
pick
Harry
Truman
up,
he
was
their
chairman
of
our
picture.
Contest
committee
picked
him
up
in
his
office,
they're
walking
down
the
hall
Harry
stops.
This
is
max.
You
stay
right
here.
B
He
runs
back
to
his
office,
comes
back
with
a
brown
paper
bag,
and
then
they
go
into
the
probably
one
of
the
hearing
rooms
where
this
was
to
judge
him.
He
takes
it
out
and
there's
a
fifth
of
bourbon
and
he
says
now:
let's
start
the
judgment,
so
that's
that's
the
way
he
was
you've
always
heard
about
his
his
walks.
It's
early
morning
walks
and
they
must
have
been
a
lot
of
fun.
He'd
walk
out
of
the
Northeast
gate.
B
Take
a
right
and
he'd
walked
down
F
Street
to
about
ten
street
that
shop
owners
would
be
waving.
What
Washington
and
and
yell
and
they's
great
then
take
a
right
around
tenth
or
ninth
and
go
up
around
the
Washington
Monument
Harry
Truman
had
a
rule
about
the
photographers.
If
you
photograph
that
you
just
couldn't
take
one
picture
and
go
away
you
you
had
to
walk
the
whole
way
because
you
had
to
get
your
exercise.
These
were
his
boys
and
everybody.
D
D
B
Mince
words
he
hit,
let
Johnny
know
that
he
needed
to
lose
some
weight,
but
anyway,
Mary
was
a
good
friends
of
the
photography
he
had
his
own
Club
and
he
was
always
the
person
of
the
club
and
the
just
one
more
Club.
And
now
this
is
a
great
picture.
One
reason
is
George
tapes
who
I'll
talk
about
in
a
little
while
the.
B
B
Sitting
there
in
the
White
House
press
room,
one
Sunday,
I,
President
Truman
called
us
all
together,
us
being
the
White
House
news
photographers
and
I'm,
not
in
there,
but
a
lot
of
the
people.
I
work
with
are
at
work,
and
but
he
took
our
picture
hey.
We
also
had
a
contest.
Only
presidents
could
contend
that
this
category
of
our
contest
and
he
won
that
every
year,
but
I
better
go
and
I
now
I
can
the
photographers
were
pretty
good
friends.
B
D
B
Go
away
and
that
worked
got
an
equipment
update.
That
graphic
was
still
being
used,
but
we've
got
this
rolleiflex
now.
This
is
not
the
pretty
little
rolleiflex
that
everybody
has
this
thing.
The
first
thing
they
did
was
take
the
ground
glass
and
submit
that
and
put
this
sports
finder,
and
then
they
had
this
little
knob
there
and
which
would
put
six
foot
eight
foot,
and
it
was
a
great
news
making
machine.
B
D
D
B
And
smaller
cameras,
that
meant
we
could
take
candid
pictures
and
it
couldn't
have
happened
at
a
better
time
for
a
better
subject:
John
F
Kennedy
hated
corny
pictures.
A
hat
would
stay
on
his
head
about
a
second,
but
there'd
never
be
a
headdress
never,
but
so
he
started
using
these
first.
He
knew
he
was
a
great
subject,
but
second
he
picked
about
three
or
four
photographers,
so
we
could
trust
and
who
had
a
good
photographic
sense.
B
This
one
right
here,
Jacques
blow
now,
jacques
lowe,
you
saw
his
pictures
nantucket
everything
to
about
the
first
two
months
of
the
President
in
office.
Jacques
was
the
president
called
George
teams
in
George
teams
worked
for
the
New
York
Times
and
he
says
George.
Why
did
you
take
this
picture
of
me
with
glasses
on
and
why.
D
B
You
let
it
get
into
the
New
York
Times.
Well,
George
looks
at
it.
He
says,
I
didn't
take
that
picture.
Look
at
the
credit
was
jock
low.
He
immediately
called
Pierre
Salinger
in
and
said:
that's
it
I
cut
off
jacques
loeb.
Never
again
he's
out
of
here
and
so
no
more
exclusives
for
Chuck
George
was
the
big
benefit.
George
was
a
great
photographer,
probably
the
best
of
the
of
the
news
photographers.
So
what
they.
D
B
They
created
a
day
in
the
closet
and
where
you
would
sit
quietly
and
then
make
just
a
few
pictures
at
various
parts
of
the
day.
Now
this
is
very
hard
for
George
the
sitting
quietly
because
he
talked
all
the
time
and
had
the
greatest
jokes
and
everything
but
George-
and
this
is
something
all
photographers
know.
B
B
He
had
a
pile
of
papers
and
on
the
desk
in
the
kitchen,
and
he
says
I'm
I
want
to
throw
these
out,
but
I
want
you
to
look
at
him,
picks
up
this
little
piece
of
scrap
paper
and
it
said
LJ,
SD
and
George
goes.
My
god
runs
upstairs
to
his
sock.
Drawer
goes
in
the
back
of
the
drawer
and
there
is
an
envelope
with
the
negative.
It
was
lowliest
job
in
sock
drawer,
and
that's
that's
where
that
negative
was
all
the.
C
B
Anyway,
this
is
the
first
picture
of
the
LBJ
administration.
Cecil
Stoughton
he's
sweating
sweating
because
they're
26
people
in
this
thing
and
he's
using
a
lens
that
he
never
used.
He
just
got
the
day
before
and
but
he
made
some
good
pictures
and
there's
also
lots
of
stories
in
the
book
about
what
happened
after
he
made
these
pictures
now.
Lbj
would
treat
everyone
on
a
one-on-one
basis.
If
he'd
like
the
picture,
he
tell
you
if
he
didn't
like
it,
he
tell
you
and
he
didn't
like
this
picture
called
Charlie.
B
B
B
Do
he
wins,
but
he
saw
what
was
going
to
happen
he's
coming,
but
he
didn't
make
it
obj
just
pulls
back,
and
he
just
just
for
that
long
and
we
were
sure
Charlie
made
the
first
payment
I
followed,
but
we
were
sure
that
he
was
going
to
get
up
and
just
be
in
our
face,
but
he
didn't
I
asked
Jack
Valenti,
who
was
his
chief
staff
many
years
later?
What
what
happened-
and
it
says
that
he
wanted
people
to
know
he
didn't
have
cancer.
But
my
explanation
is:
that
was
just
ill
BJ.
B
It's
just
the
way
he
was
gotta
say
one
word
locomotives,
the
first
White
House
official
photographer,
perhaps
the
best
now
hixson
10
he's
looking
at
the
papers.
The
next
day.
Everything
is
terrific,
except
this
man
in
a
hunting
jacket
and
his
aide.
A
causes.
Eight
is
who
does
that
man
work
for
he
says
well,
mr.
president,
he
works
for
you,
he's
your
official
photographer
and
he
says
not
anymore
so
Cecil
Stoughton
is
it
was
an
Air
Force
photographer.
He
was
immediately
transferred
to
Germany,
but
Nixon
and
the
photographer's
got
along
very
well.
B
He
was
fine
one
thing
he
did,
he
see
change
our
pressroom
around.
This
is
where
we
were
she
used
to
be,
and
it
was
in
the
diplomatic
lobby,
and
so-
and
this
is
the
reason
for
this
nice
place.
Henry
Kissinger
wanted
a
new
office,
so
we
went
to
California
and
we
came
back
to
the
covered
up
White
House
swimming
pool,
which
is
underneath
here,
and
you
can
still
go
down
to.
If
you
know
a
technician,
there's
a
trap
door
right
there
that
you
can
go
down
and
see
FDR's
pool
still
preserved.
D
B
Is
photo
country
and
Larry
downing
and
the
AFP
photographer,
and
this
is
where
we
process
our
pictures
to
stories.
Nixon
one
is
the
prison.
The
China
trip,
the
other
and
and
they'd
had
the
best
photographers
horse,
boss,
John
Dominus,
Dirk,
Halstead,
walling,
mcnamee
and
time
didn't.
I
I
was
supposed
to
go,
but
time
didn't
get
a
space
because
life
kind
of
big-footed
us
here
and
that
was
it,
but
but
we
all
got
a
piece
of
Watergate
and
you'll
remember.
B
They
did,
they
came
down
and
we
were
at
the
end
of
a
roll
of
film
and
he
did
this
and
you
never
know
what's
coming
next,
we
didn't
know
if
he
was
going
to
do
it,
but
finally
he
did
the
double
whammy
and
we
were
just
saying
just
get
on
the
helicopter
was
the
bed.
Ford
was
a
friend
on
the
hill
and
if
you
wanted
something
he's.
D
B
Going
to
change,
he
was
a
terrific
thing.
One
of
the
reasons
he
was
a
good
friend
was
David
Hume
kennerley,
who
was
his
official
photographer
one
time
we
were-
and
this
is
the
best
day
that
I
I
ever
had
at
the
White
House,
which
is
the
Bicentennial,
and
so
we
started.
We
went
up
to
Valley
Forge
the
tall
ships
and
the
biggest
thing
was
going
to
happen
at
that
as
the
fireworks,
and
so
they
were
going
to
be
on
the
Truman
balcony,
and
so
we
went
up
there.
D
B
And
the
first
fireworks
came
and
they
were
way
over
to
the
side,
and
so
the
little
aide
says
well
just
didn't
work
out.
This
is
now
they're
going
to
work
out.
Ford
said
and
says:
get
these
guys
to
gin
and
tonic
and
we'll
be
over
here
and
just
call
us
when
we're
ready
well,
two
gin
and
tonics
later
we.
B
Didn't
have
a
pool,
you
can't
have
a
mansion
without
a
swimming
pool,
so
they
dug
one
out
in
the
backyard
and
everybody
wanted
a
picture
of
the
the
photographer
I
mean
the
photographer's
wanted
David
askins
just
bring
him
on
by
one
morning,
so
we
did
there's
George
James,
that's
a
younger
Dennis
broth
there,
but
anyway,
and
so
he
did
a
perfect
Drive
swam
a
couple
laps.
Then
he
got
out
now.
I
want
to
show
you
the
role.
This
is
his
terry
cloth,
robe,
probably
from
jenny's
lame
right
here
you
don't
see
any
seals.
B
B
Jerry
Ford
did
not
hold
this
against
us;
he
knew
we
were
just
doing
our
job.
One
group
that
really
wanted
him
to
be
elected
was
the
Secret
Service.
First
of
all,
they
were
his
kind
of
guy,
and
so,
but
they
don't
so
heard
about
Jimmy
Carter
and
the
agents
assigned
to
that
detail,
and
there
was
it
was
a
hard
hard
thing,
but
that
didn't
happen.
Jimmy
Carter
gets
elected
the
first
day.
D
B
Ever
got
up
on
the
second
floor
and
Jimmy
Carter
comes
in
and
he
looks
at
me.
He
knew
who
I
was
I
was
at
the
time
photographer
and
he
says
what
are
you
doing
here?
This
is
well
we're
doing
a
story
on
Rosalyn
and
ruslan
came
in
immediately.
It
says
Jimmy
they're,
just
doing
a
story
on
me
and
you
just
sit
down
in
that
chair
and
let's
hit
this
man
take
your
picture,
and
so
he
did
and
he
put
up
his
thing,
but
he
was
not
happy
anyway.
D
B
In
time,
ham,
Jordan
and
Jody
Powell
were
great
guys,
but
they
could
care
less
about
photography.
So
we
didn't
get
any
breaks
there.
Jimmy
Carter
had
two
modes,
one
was
the
big
smile
wave
mode
and
the
other
was
the
pensive
mode.
So
if
you
get
that
was,
that
was
what
you
got
with
him.
These
are
hard
times.
B
We
had
to
gas
crisis
the
ironic
crisis,
so
you
really
couldn't
blame
it,
but
along
comes
a
Pappy
plane.
Ronald
reagan
had
away
in
there
and
I've
talked
to
a
lot
of
people
or
just
talked
to
chris
wallace
about
this
the
other
day
that
the
candidate
sets
the
mood
of
the
plane
and
the
whole
thing.
This
was
easygoing.
The
Reagan
campaign
plane
was
terrific,
happy
and
the
press
corps
was
happy.
Even
the
Secret
Service.
A
lot
of
the
agents
still
remembered
that
as
a
very
good
time.
B
One
thing
he
had
was
a
great
advance
man,
Mike
Deaver
new
pictures.
He
knew
how
to
get
him
and
he
wanted
them.
He
wanted
a
great
picture
at
Normandy.
Every
president
goes
to
Normandy.
He
actually
took
a
a
photographer
on
the
pre
advance,
Larry
Rubenstein
of
UPI,
and
everybody
lays
a
wreath
at
the
grave
of
general
Roosevelt,
which
is
a
great
story.
Of
course.
You
all
know,
but
the
last
time
Jimmy
Carter
did
it.
B
We
had
a
fight
with
the
French
we
got
in
early
and
the
French
tried
to
roll
us
and
that
we
were
having
a
fight
over
the
grave
Americans.
One
I
think
the
general
would
have
been
pleased,
I'm
not
sure,
but
anyway
so
Larry
says
you
know.
Reese
lanes
are
just
nothing
well.
Could
you
have
him
walking
out
in
the
in
the
grave
and
they
they
said?
B
B
No,
that's
it
and
I
just
said
these
are
wooden
flower
parts,
I
cut
one
hole
and
it
looked
a
little
phony,
so
I
cut
six
holes
and
he
said
she
says:
okay,
since
you
you
sanded
six
hours
on
each
denison,
she'd
known
me
for
a
long
time
and
she
says:
I
want
him
there,
but
I
don't
want
any
flowers
in
and
so
that's
the
way.
There's
one
one
here:
one.
D
B
And
this
ran
fairly
large.
Ask
any
photographer.
Franco,
probably
tell
you
to
Frank
Johnson,
who
is
the
president.
They
like
the
best
and
that's
Bush,
41,
terrific
man
kind
of
goofy.
At
times
he
called
us
the
photo
dogs
and
which
was
funny
knew
everybody.
He
knew
everybody
Betty
and
something
about
anybody,
because
he
liked
people
one
on
one.
B
B
This
is
just
the
way
he
was
and,
of
course
there
was
a
the
big
story
of
the
first
Gulf
War.
Well,
our
technology.
Now
we
are
developing
the
negative
film
and
scanning
it.
This
is
on
a
campaign
train
actually
that
we
were
doing
this,
but
every
every
August
he
would
have
a
party
for
about
20
photographers
and
their
wives.
That's
my
wife
right
there,
and
this
is
I.
Just
come
off.
B
B
The
the
Clintons
were
big
on
the
official
things,
but
there
were
not
any
behind
the
scene
except
Diana
Walker
and
she
did
a
good
job,
but
we
got
to
tell
you
again
was
changing.
The
first
of
the
digital
cameras
came
in.
These
were
not
very
good.
They
had
the
pictures
were
sort
of
salmon
colored,
but
that
now
we
can
correct
those
images.
We.
B
D
B
B
This
one
right
here
charged
Charles
hominy
from
this
week.
He
called
chuckles
and
always
raised
a
rass
Charlie's
about
his
hair,
but
I
must
say
that
chuckles
gave
as
well
as
he
got
so
this
one,
incidentally,
is
that
Kevin
Lamarck
Reuters.
There
were
two
photographers
three
photographers
that
went
on
the
trip
to
China
when
Kevin
still
works
for
wetters
and
was
one
of
those
three
photographers.
This
is
Larry
downing,
also
of
Reuters
photographer,
who
was
one
of
Bush's
friends
and
favorites,
but
larry
has
been
a
favorite
everybody.
B
We
all
agree
that
bush
43
was
a
friend,
but
not
the
friend
that
his
father
was
which
we
all
loved.
Now
remember.
We
have
not
had
a
small
child
in
the
White
House
since
Amy
Carter,
and
we
all
remember
how
that
didn't
work
out
very
well.
As
far
as
Amy
remember,
that's
picture
for
going
to
school
and
it
was
was
not
so
we
knew
this
is
coming
up.
The
Obamas
were
ready
for
a
fight.
B
The
fight
didn't
happen
because
the
bureau
chiefs
all
got
together
and
we
made
a
rule
and
it
was
Mason,
basically
the
associated
press
in
david
ake,
who
did
it
say
we
will
not
photograph
the
children
unless
their
mother
or
father
or
in
the
frame,
and
this
rule
was
so
simple
that
it's
held
to
this
day.
There's
been
some
arguments
by
people
that
didn't
know,
but
basically
that's
what
it
is.
B
We've
had
a
little
trouble
and
it's
a
long
thing
about
the
group
and
you've
read
about
it
and
the
releases
of
the
pictures
which
the
news
photographers
don't
care
about
that
we,
if
they
want
to
put
them
on
flickr,
they
can
do
whatever
pete
souza,
terrific
photographer.
It
was
one
of
our
members
and
things.
That's.
B
The
access
that
we
we
want
and
actually
we're
getting
a
little
bit
more
cooperation
now,
but
it's
that
denial
of
the
access
that
we
we
care
about
and
thanks
we've
changed
it
a
little
bit.
These
guys
are
not
taking
a
nap
in
the
Rose
Garden
they're
there,
and
you
will
see
the
pictures
in
the
paper
these
low,
dramatic
angles.
These
were
taken
by
remote
cameras
that
will
be
around
behind
the
president
that
we
can
trigger
now
with
the
radio.
B
This
is
Scotty
Applewhite
Scotty
Applewhite
is
the
best
in
Washington
you'll,
see
in
a
Washington
Post
every
day,
j
scott
applewhite,
Associated
Press.
He
is
has
been
for
years
and
he's
on
the
hill
now,
but
he's
he's
everywhere.
He
he
is
one
good
photographer
I'm
just
about
through,
but
I
got
to
tell
you
about
vice
presidents,
just
a
little
bit.
This
is
Cactus
Jack
garner.
B
He
was
FDR's
first,
vice
president
and
I'm
told
that
you
would
go
into
his
office
and
you
take
a
picture
and
then
he'd
opened
his
drawer
and
a
fifth
of
bourbon
would
come
out
and
everybody
would
have
a
drink
and
that's
the
way
he
he
was
a
little
difference.
This
is
joe
biden.
He
was
head
of
the
Judiciary
Committee.
When
the
clarence
thomas
hearings,
there
would
be
a
lot
of
breaks
and
things
and
Joe
loved
to
talk
and
still
does,
and
so
he
would
come
over
and
talk
and
we.
D
B
To
know
him
pretty
well
and
still
do
he
has
this
one
story
about
me:
I
had
a
list
of
10
would
be
senators
before
he
was
scimitar
for
time
and
Kennedy.
You
might
have
participated
in
some.
One
of
these
would
I
just
had
to
get
these
guys
and
I
called
up.
I
got
a
voice
on
the
phone
and
I
thought
it
was
as
fresh,
secular,
asses.
I
just
need
about
a
half
hour
with
the
candidate
at
a
rally.
She
puts
your
hand.
This
is
him
now
I
found
out
from
him.
F
B
He's
told
this
story
many
times:
he
puts
her
hand
over
the
phone
and
says
Time
magazine
wants
to
photograph
us
at
a
rally.
This
was
his
wife
I'm,
not
and-
and
so
this
is
the
first
wife
that
he
had
who
died
in
the
car
wreck
and
he
said
jones
beach
at
eleven
o'clock.
Now,
there's
a
jones
beach,
just
above
doing
delaware
and
on
saturday,
so
I
show
up.
B
They
got
all
their
friends
and
they
made
these
signs
and
they
said
you
love
us,
but
you
don't
know
us
you're,
just
fans
and
so
we're
walking
down
the
beach
and
sure
enough.
Some
seagulls
come
along
splat
right
on
Biden's,
head
and
so
anyway,
he's
telling
this
this
he.
This
is
right
in
a
at
the
War
College,
where
Obama
is
going
to
just
make
some
fierce
statement
and
he's
walking
on
the
thing
and
here's
the
Secretary
of
Defense
laughing
Mikey
anyway.
This
is
this
is
what
happens
with
it.
B
Joe
Joe
the
one
thing
it
when
Joe
starts
a
story,
he's
going
to
finish
the
story,
and
so
anyway,
that's
the
way
I'm
through
and
I,
just
have
to
say
that
the
whole
thing
about
covering
the
whole
White
House
and
in
presidencies
you
just
don't
know,
what's
coming
next
and
it's
sort
of
like
turning
the
page
and
and
here
we
are
we're
going
to
start
another
whole
session
there.
So
there's
the
book
and
I
hope
you
enjoyed
the
talk
and
thank
you
and
I'm
here
for.
B
F
Thank
you
very
much.
What's
very,
very
interesting
and
informative
and
insightful
I
wondered
about
how
the
I
don't
know.
You
is
still
photographer
your
camera
photographer
interfaced
with
the
move.
First,
the
moving
picture
photographers,
who
would
start
taking
pictures
for
the
newsreels
in
movie,
theaters
yeah.
C
F
B
They,
the
little
history,
is
back
in
the
20s,
the
stills
in
the
mute
movie,
we're
all
the
same
company
national
picture
association
was
and
they
they
sold.
You
know
they
have
two
different
photographers,
but
they
they
were
all
one
company,
the
company,
then
the
newsreels,
which
was
MGM
and
the
big
movie
movie
houses,
came
in
with
the
35
millimeter
that
we
showed
and
then
and
that
was
completely
unionized,
and
that.
B
Everything
and
then
the
network's
came
up
same
Union,
and
then
they,
the
union
that
representative
and
it
was
a
very
tight
Union
you,
you
would
probably
have
to
be
a
son
to
get
a
slot
in
this,
and
so
but
then
television
came
along
and
and
they
were
doing
times,
the
studio
photographers
were
out
with
a
non
film
cameras
and
they
they
went
to
the
Union
and
said.
Would
you
want
to
retrain
these
in
Antony's?
B
B
B
E
You
Dennis
thanks
we're
former
colleagues
with
Time
magazine
I
want
to
say-
and
this
is
fascinating
about
about
your
coverage
or
the
presence,
but
I
wondered
if
you
had
any
anecdotes.
You
want
to
tell
about
other
other
types
of
coverage,
and
I
would
like
to
tell
a
little
wonder
about
that.
You.
It
reflects
very
well.
D
E
You
in
November
or
December
of
1965
I
had
my
first
traveling
assignment.
It
was
to
go
down
to
24
jackson
in
columbia,
south
carolina
and
we
were
doing
a
cover
story.
The
man
of
the
year
general
Johnson,
who
was
building
up
our
forces
for
the
mess
in
Vietnam
and
I,
was
trying
to
interview
the
draftees
around
there
and
every
time
I
would
pull
a
pulley
a
young
man
aside,
I
was
young,
then
myself
and
try
to
interview
him.
E
There
would
be
a
lieutenant
and
captain
a
couple
of
sergeants
would
gather
around
him,
and
so
he
was
intimidated
and
couldn't
talk
frankly
with
me,
so
you
and
I
conferred
and
you
you
would
pull
these
officers
aside
and
ask
him
to
pose
for
pictures
and
their
egos
got
the
best
on
and
they
they
would
get
over
there
and
so
I
would
give.
I
would
get
some
candid
candid
comments
from
these
draft
tears.
I
wonder
if
you
well.
B
You
just
reminded
me
of
exactly
what
happened
of
with
another
the
same
situation:
a
scottie
Applewhite
that
you
saw
there
and
I
were
the
first
photographers
in
this
DoD
pool
to
go
over
when
Bush
said.
Okay,
we're
going
to
send
the
82nd
over
there's
a
DoD
beeper
that
we
and
I
was
the
magazine
photographer
and
Scotty.
Was
the
wire
service
photographer
and
sure
enough
completely
controlled
by
just
guys
like
that
and
unwittingly.
B
Scotty
would
pick
a
fight
with
them
because
he
wanted
to
cover
something
over
here,
and
so
that
would
let
them
and
of
course
they
had
a
TV
crew
or
CNN
crew
part
of
the
the
thing,
so
they
just
didn't
have
enough
handlers
to
go
around,
and
so
I
was
free
to
just
walk
around
and
take
all
the
pictures.
I
want
it
because
I
had
these
two
diversions,
but
sometimes
you
have
to
do
that
matter.
That
was
it
anyway.
You.
B
B
Jason
Reed
is
a
photographer
for
Reuters.
Was
he
now
works
in
Australia,
but
he
was
a
white
house
and
he
was
covering
that
trip
of
to
Burma
were
Obama
that
first
one
and
he
just
put
that
GoPro
on
the
on
the
top
of
his
camera,
and
it's
terrific,
because
you
could
just
see
everything
was
going
on
as
they
were
back
pedaling
and
things,
and
then
you
would
see
the
stills
that
he
did
but
yeah
it's
coming.
That
there's
no
doubt
about
that.
But
then.
D
B
Exactly
why
we
would
Peter
and
I
were
talking
about
this
book
when
I
came
into
the
White
House
53
years
ago.
If
somebody
had
told
me
that
I
would
be
walking
in
there
which,
due
tomorrow
and
and
not
have
a
film
camera,
have
a
camera
with
no
film
I
would
said.
You're
crazy,
well,
I
hope
that
someday
whatever
use-
and
we
probably
be
some
sort
of
an
editor.
That's
not
even
a
photographer
50
years
from
now
will
maybe
pick
up
this
book.
It's
in
all
the
right
places
to
be
preserved,
and
so
who.
B
Hasn't
been
done
very
well.
No,
and
it
is,
there
are
two
different
animals,
because
the
video
needs
sound,
and
this
is
the
downfall
of
that
whole
thing.
It's
it's
something
that
you
really
have
to
pay
a
great
deal
of
attention
to
to
get
sound
and
some
it
that's
why
the
networks
have
two
people,
two
men,
crew.
That's
it
so
anyway,.
B
Well,
it
has
their
it's
been
since
the
internet.
We
we
used
to
make
a
lot
of
money
off
of
sales
of
pictures.
Now
we
make
nothing
but
because
there
was
no
way
to
do
it.
You
had
to
get
the
actual
pictures.
Now
you
don't
have
to
do
that
and
they've
driven
the
price
of
pictures
down
to
nothing
which
it's
just
technology
and
and
it's
the
evolving.
B
We
all
try
to
kind
of
police
that
and
we've
got
programs
that
a
pic
scout
that
will
go
and
find
your
your
and
that
you
try
to
collect
the
only
people
that
are
going
to
collect
our
and
they
do
is
get
e
because
they're
so
big
that
and
they're
only
going
to
collect
it
from
magazines
and
newspapers.
They're
going.
D
B
B
Well,
yeah,
it's
a
it's
a
problem
and,
and
that
fortunately,
for
me,
I
only
had
to
buy
one
picture
for
this
book
because
all
of
them
were
mine,
except
in
the
black
and
white
that
one
and
I
really
could
have
gotten
away
with
it.
Saying
because
this
the
profits
are
going
to
go
to
the
White
House
news
photographers,
but
I
bought
that
George
planes
pictured
the
loneliest
job.
All
the
rest
were
by
photo/agencies
like
Harrison
Ewing
they
gave
when
they
went
out
of
business.
B
B
Yeah
yeah,
that
was
fun
I
was
very
young.
That
was
my
first
assignment
for
her
black
star
and
I,
really
didn't
even
know
who
they
were,
but
that
was
told
to
go
to
union
station
and
and
did
and
went.
They
came
off
the
train.
The
beatles
had
just
done.
The
ad
Sullivan
shot
the
show
the
night
before
and
they
came
down
for
a
concert
at
what
we
had
is
a
an
ice
rink,
basically
and.
B
And
so
they
came
and
this
big
old
while
it
was
new
then,
but
it
is
big
Cadillac
and
so
I
followed
them
up
to,
and
then
they
had
a
press
conference
at
this
ice
rink
and
a
British
photographer
says:
do
you
have
a
car
and
I
said
yeah
I
says:
pull
it
right
up
next
to
the
the
Cadillac,
so
your
bumper
is
touching
so
I
did
and
he
got
in.
He
needed
a
ride
because
there's
not
enough
room
in
that
thing
and
what
nobody.
B
D
D
B
B
Say
I
course
finish:
high
school
and
finish
college
and
then
pay
attention
to
your
writing
and
go
into
the
video
portion
of
it,
because
every
still
photographer
is
a
video
photographer.
These
days,
you
yeah,
we
call
them
now.
We
were
just
we're.
No
longer
photographers
were
storytellers,
and
so
that's
that's
what
you
have
to
do
and
and
who
knows
what
you'll
have
to
be
doing
in
the
future,
but
you
really
turn
it
in
and
we've
always
done.
This
I
mean
look
at
these
these
guys
that
only
had
it.
B
We
are
editors,
editors
with
our
eyes,
and
so
we
have
to
boil
down
everything
into
that
one
instant.
That
is
the
best
that
tells
the
story,
whether
you're
doing
it
with
a
big
Speed,
Graphic
and
and
or
not.
It's
something
I
got
to
tell
you
one
story:
I
hope
I'm
not
taking
about
photographer,
who
missed
a
pitcher.
We
all
have
ones
that
were
missed
and-
and
this
is
the
one
at
Maurice
Johnson
coming
out
of
the
White
House-
they
hear
shots
over
at
Blair
House.
B
This
is
when
the
Puerto
Ricans
were
doing
the
thing,
and
so
he
they
run
West
executive.
Avenue,
which
is
closed,
pennsylvania
avenue
was
was
open,
a
regular
street
west
executive
was
too
and
he
he
runs
and
he
first
photographs
the
guard
who
had
been
shot
and
then,
as
he
remember,
those
big
cameras
taken,
and
it
takes
time
to
do
that.
He
hears
harry
truman,
he
looks
up
and
here's
Harry
Truman
in
his
under
ship
sure
leaving
out
the
window
like
this.
What's
going
on
out
there
and-
and
he
is.
D
E
We
both
covered
a
march
on
the
Pentagon
October,
the
21st
1967,
and
you
must
have
taken
hundreds
of
pictures
and
I
know.
There
was
one
out
at
that
out
there
with
the
the
protesters
facing
off
against
the
US
Marshals,
and
then
you
had
a
photo
the
night
before
Norman
Mailer,
drunk
as
a
snail
darter
ambassador
theater
right.
E
B
Epic
day
actually
I
mean
I
am
in
one
of
the
the
most
famous
picture
out
of
that
was
taken
by
Bernie
Boston
of
the
Washington
star
and
it's
of
the
the
protester
putting
the
flower
in
well.
If
you
look
into
I've
got
it
because
I'm
writing
back
I'm
in
the
middle
of
the
troops
and
it's
kind
of
a
funny
picture
of
me
and
Bernie:
isn't
he
he's
cropped
it
so?
But
I've
got
the
full
frame
of
me.
D
B
Was
a
very
famous
picture
but
I've
got
it
with
this
guy,
but
yeah
I've
looked
through
those
and
then
we
all
got
up
to
the
Pentagon
and
then
they
they
there
was
an
order
and
all
this
stuff
was
like
they
just
moved
forward
and
just
crushed
everybody
which
yeah
I.
You
know
you
didn't
know,
we
didn't
have
any
communications
at
that.
Time
knew
what
was
happening,
but
all
of
a
sudden
they
everything
was
peaceful
and
then
boom.
I.