Armagh City, Banbridge & Craigavon Borough Council, UK Performance and Audit Committee, 9 Dec 2021

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From YouTube: Performance and Audit Committee on Thursday the 9th of December 2021 at 6.30pm

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Armagh City, Banbridge and Craigavon Borough Council Performance and Audit Committee on Thursday the 9th of December 2021 at 6.30pm in the Council Chamber at Craigavon Civic and Conference Centre.

A

Okay, good evening, all uh this evening, folks, we have it's class here. That's here, yeah you're welcome, yeah, I'm so just going to get started whether gen data, one will have apologies. I have received new apologies and biannie from the floor members.

A

No okay, so it's at the end item two, which is declarations of interests, and uh is there any interest from the floor happy to take these? Let me proceed through the agenda folks, so I don't care.

A

Okay, the next item we're going to move into jane item 6, um which is the confidential report folks, so I need a second proposer and seconder before we go into committee.

A

Proposed by councillor greenfield secondary by councillor, savage thank you, members and listeners to the audio feed in accordance with schedule, six of the local government act. We will now move into the confidential session of the council, and this means that we'll be turning off the public audio fade of the meeting, and this will be returned when the meeting is restarted.

A

Can I say t officers, please turn off the audio.

A

A

Thank you. Okay members, we're gonna, move back to agenda item three um and we have two items for information item three point: one is performance, audit and assessment report and we have martina taking these three items.

B

Thank you, sir. Yes, item 3.1 is for information, it is from the audit office, it's their report on our 2021 um performance, audit and assessment and the details within the report.

B

But the good news is that um we have had a clean bill of health and there were no recommendations for improvement or proposals for improvement um in relation to that period, and normally we would have had this by november of last year and um colette may wish to speak to this if she's still here, but um we are then hoping that we'll have our audit for this year commencing shortly, I think in december, um and I suppose it's just with the impact of covet and everything else.

B

That's it's had an impact on on our audit uh or on their audit schedule, um but we continue to work with with colleagues in the audit office in relation to these matters. So thank you, chair.

A

Thank you, martina um folks, it's native information, there's any questions or comments. I'm do you want to come in, oh claire. I just think. Let's just oh she's there yeah yeah.

C

I'm sorry thank you chair. um Yes, I um reiterate what um tina has said, so um this was much scaled down audit this year, because um members will remember that the department for communities had um said that at the beginning of the pandemic, it wasn't necessary for council to reduce an improvement plan for 2021. So therefore, without an improvement plan, we were unable to audit that so it was much scaled down and made the decision not to have any proposals for improvement um in within this document.

C

um It was delayed, as martina has said, um but actually it was primarily because we were waiting for legislation to go to go through um by the department and and that did go through, but unfortunately it wasn't as wholesome as we all wished it to be so, and we were then required to complete this solid and it was completed by the end of november and, as martinez also said, we are about to start the next one and we have a deadline to complete that by the 20th of february, so that will um hopefully, if we get that done, that will bring us right up to date.

C

I'm back on schedule for all of the audits and again, which is, I think, it's a really good place to be. Thank you, chair.

A

Thank you class, any other comments. Folks, before we move on again martina, do you want to come in again or.

B

No, no that's great. No, it's grand yeah we've been continuing to work with the department and and the audit office um all along through this period, so yeah, it's it's all, hopefully, as colette says, we'll get back on an even keel very shortly. So thank you um I'll just move on then to item 3.2 chair. um So again as an information item. It's a mid-year performance report.

B

It's just a high-level summary of um progress on our business plans and the service committees, as you will be aware, got the detailed um business plan, progress reports back in november and also um that would contain also details of of progress with the medium-term recovery plan and then specifically also. This includes progress with our performance improvement plan for this year, including any statutory performance indicators and standards happy to take any questions. Sure it's really just a high level summary report. Thank you.

A

Yeah, thank you martina louise uh councilman kennedy. You have your hand up bye,.

D

Thank you. You know it's all right. um No, I just wanted to note on um and appendix four just um it had been um a proposal back in 2018 about um the implementation of the uh the autism friendly um plan and the training and everything, and I see that a lot of the um the performance indicators are set at amber, um and I just just wanted to highlight it that you know I just think we've. I would just like to put a wee bit more pressure on.

D

Maybe this isn't the right forum to do it, but I just wanted it noted and that I do think we should be making a wee bit more progress on this, because you know we we are leading the way with so many of our disability friendly initiatives, and um I think this is one that um we really should be pushing forward in, because- um and I know a lot of the time we use the covert as an excuse, but covert has really um created um really highlighted for people with um conditions such as autism.

D

You know how difficult life has been from this last few years, and and really, I think we should be pushing forward as a council to make sure that all of these indicators are green for them. Thank you.

A

Thank you, counselor mckenzie. Yes, I can carve those comments uh on those comments or do they noted martina? Do you want to follow up with those.

B

Yeah well just to say, I suppose that you know there will be or should be, a separate update in relation to that notice. Emotion back to the rel service committee that it was um you know taken to in the first place and then we'll continue to report on it in this end, but um I suppose just to give some consolation that it is amber and not read so obviously there's some some work happening and it's only up until september.

B

So there's still still some time left um and I don't know there are a number of initiatives happening in relation to that. Thank you.

E

Thanks chair, it's it's more by way of comment: it's just an appendix for really that that it's stark that the the four red uh category one or building, control and platinum. I think that the but we all know the issue is resourcing there and just more or less calm down like the megazord like. Hopefully, that will be addressed sooner rather than later. It has been going on for quite a while and went to staff there or doing excellent service they're very much overworked.

E

So I'd like to think that the not too distant future would have adequate resources in that department. That made the demand. That's out there thanks chair.

A

Thanks, christopher savage and yes, I was a member of the planning committee as well, and yes, those I would concur with those comments. Yeah the staff are working hard on the do. You have resource issues so um yeah fully concur and remember any other comments or questions.

A

Okay, martina thank you and we're going to move on to gen item 4.. 4.1 is an item for decision folks so, and we're going to have curl present in the revised internal auto plan. Carl.

F

Thank you, chair, regular revisions of this year's internal audit plan have been reported to the performance of an audit committee during the year.

F

It has been necessary to further amend the plan, and this report provides an update of audit activity plan for the remainder of this financial year and reflects changes to the original internal audit plan as a result of changing priorities and resources available.

F

The main changes to the plan include the inclusion of a peaceful or audit and from management request. This replaces a community centre audit. It includes the inclusion of five days for policy development, work, increase in investigation and consultancy work and the increase in the scope of certain audits.

F

Four follow-up audits have been deferred until the beginning of the 22-23 year to allow management further time to implement all recommendations.

F

These follow-ups will be prioritized as soon as possible, hopefully in early april, to allow for the amendments and to take into account the resources available to the end of the year. Two audits that are considered less a priority have been removed from the plan but will be considered for inclusion in the 20 to 23 draft audit plan.

F

Contingency days of 10 have now been allocated out, so it asked members to approve the revised internal order plan for 2122 attached at appendix one and happy to take any questions.

A

Thank you, carl um folks. We have the revised internal, auto plan and appendix one in your documents. It is an item for decision and we're happy to take questions and comments. Folks, tracy, and do you want to come in with the first question.

G

Thank you chair. I think it's great to note that the plan remains flexible, considering um the times that we're in and that's that's good to know for carol. I just wanted to find out about the four follow-up audits that aren't going to be done to april. If those aren't completed. Those are previous limited audit reports. Would that impact the annual opinion at your end, if they can't be done.

A

Thank you tracy. Charles, do you want to answer that question and follow up with us.

F

Yes, thank you church and thank you tracy. Yes, it would have an impact on our overall opinion um if recommendations um had not been progressed and by the time we do the follow-ups in april. We do allow for a cut-off period for um follow-up audits um to be completed for the previous year, and we take that into consideration and we also track all recommendations through the recommendation. Tracker and management responses and implementation of recommendations are monitored. That way. Also, we are hopeful that these insurances can be raised.

F

They are limited audits and we're hopeful that they can be raised in early april at the start of the next plan. Thank you thank.

G

A

Thanks carol thanks tracy and the next question folks, we have, sam with your hand, up.

H

The teacher sir, it's just a question about the amendments that have been made. There were 1.2. I was trying to link those in with 6.4, which was a previous paper. Look in terms of the progress report. It's just a big question, but the increase in the investigation and consultancy work is not in relation to those things we saw in 6.4 around those additional items that had been brought in during the year.

A

Thank you, sam charles. You want to come in again with those amendments.

F

Yes, um we have, we started with a budget for investigation work at the start of the year, not sure exactly what it was, but um it has been necessary to increase that during the year and the result resultant increase in this um revised order plan is as a result of the recent investigation work and one particular investigation did take up more time than we originally had planned for so yeah.

F

It is an ongoing um investigations to crop up from time to time and they are resource intensive, but um they are a result of the ongoing investigations. Yeah.

A

Okay, thank you sami, okay, about those comments. Yes, my teacher.

A

Thank you members. This is an item for decisions. We need a proposer, consumer chemistry.

D

Yes, um happy to.

A

I propose you need a second there. Folks.

E

A

Thank you alderman candidate, proposed by consciousness, mckenzie second, by alderman kennedy. Thank you. The next item is 4.2, which is needed for information and that's a six monthly assurance statement presented by kiarl.

F

Thank you chair.

F

In accordance with the council's assurance framework, heads of department and strategic directors complete and sign six monthly insurance statements as a result of completing their sharing statements, heads and directors are given assurance on the risk management, internal controls, responses to audit recommendations, any emerging issues and also the impact of covet 19 on their service delivery and practices.

F

The assurance statements are attached to appendix 2-5 for the period ended in september. Any governance issues noted by either directors or heads of department will be considered for inclusion in the annual governance statement.

F

Last members to note the six monthly sharing statements.

F

A

Thank you, carl. um Yes, folks, it's an idiom for information, happy to have comments or questions. We do have some of the directors here and on with us, counselor mckinstry.

D

And uh thanks for letting me ensure- and it's just a general comment um about the amount of information that's given and beside each of the the the headings um and it's just inconsistent and some department heads seem to furnish us with lots of information that helps to to get a better feel um for for the position that each department's at so um you know, I'm not a specialist in this area and and maybe I'm expecting something that just can't be there.

D

But I do find the commentary alongside each item and very useful, um and I'm just wondering, um could I be encouraged by you know that head the department to to populate the the grid a bit more for us yeah. Thank you.

A

Thank you, counselor ken street yeah. Those comments are julie, noted done and we can pass those on to the to the directors. Certainly hey tracy, you have your hand up. Do you want to come in.

G

Thank you chair just following on from louise's just the detail in the um strategic director's six monthly assurance statements and the community and growth. One, for example, identified no significant governance issues, yet the head of departments beneath that had concerns relating to planning and building control. I just thought it would be useful if they're not going to you know that those issues would be included in the strategic directors ones as well.

I

um Constructive.

I

Yes, um thank you tracy and the the points that you have made and are noted and will be taken on board for the next assured statement. I just want to make the members aware that the industry targets are reported back through to the planning and regulatory committee and for both departments.

I

So members are made aware of what the current performance issues actually are and both of the departments actually transferred in when the new community and growth directorate was set up in july.

I

So they haven't literally been with in the new directorate for six months so, but we will be taking that on board for the next um assurance statement.

G

Thank you. Thank you, chair.

A

Thank you both um councillor mackel. Do you want to come in? Thank.

J

You yes, and it was just a backup what comes from against you was saying in terms of the comments and the economic development report has no comments at all, and I mean covet had no impact at all in the department which I found hard to believe. Do you know what I mean so it seems to me it's just really been a tech box and no thought put into it at all. So just to have those comments started sure.

A

Thank you, counselor mackel. Yes, those comments are actually noted and will be passed on to the directors. Thank you and sam. Do you want to comment, leave your hand up.

H

Across each of the ones that we have there under item 4, which is internal control, because it can confirm it all accepted recommendations made by internal extra law that have been or are being implemented, as agreed this one in relation to this statement, which I think is it's very important statement- it's a kind of an accountability statement almost by by each of the directors to the chief executive.

H

When we look at uh 6.5.2 tonight, there are four priority: one recommendations which are still outstanding uh across the organization and I'm just wondering in future uh statements should those priority one recommendations that are h done and should they be brought in with a bit of an explanation here I know that dates have been agreed. Future dates have been a great past, the original ones uh and those are accepted.

H

But I think, in terms of this kind of value statement, is there scope to be able to bring in those outstanding priority one recommendation and then I'll just highlight them, so they need to stay up. Thank you.

A

Thank you, sam um charles. Do you want to come and answer those pretty ones yep, charles.

F

Yes, thank you sam. I think yes you're right. It is something that maybe we could improve on in in terms of long overdue recommendations or maybe dropping off issuance statements um and they're more focused on current audits or completed audits. Recent audits. So yes, this um will be um highlighted to the relevant directors and heads and, um I think, completed going forward.

A

Thank you, carl sammy, happy with those questions or comments. Sorry, yes, thank you. Chair.

A

Thank you remember. This is an item for information only so you have enough to move on folks.

A

Okay. Next item is again item for information and it's 4.3 um and we have qrl present in this item.

F

Regular updates are provided to the committee on the national fraud initiative work.

F

This paper provides members with an update on the completed nfa exercise which commenced in october, 2020 and involved data being extracted from council's financial systems and submitted to the auto commission for analysis on completion of this matches are reported back to council potential matches are reported back and for investigation, and these were carried out by nominated staff within finance, payroll and audit overseeing and all matches now have been investigated and placed in four members that there are no incidents of fraud um in the in the matches that have been reported.

F

um The action plan for the latest senate I exercise is complete and included in appendix 6 for members information.

F

The next nfa exercise is due to commence in october 2022 and will be reported back to members and due course, then, later next year,.

A

Thank you carl again. This is an item for information. Folks, any comments on this item.

A

Okay, folks and we'll move on to item 4.4- and this is really only an item for newton- um it's the dates for the performance and audit committee for the year 2022. hobby. Just to note those dates, folks, okay, okay, well moving on to the gen item, five, which is the correspondence and we have 5.1, which is northern ireland, audit office, ground fraud, risk gate and again claudia do you want to come in and if you may want to comment on it, yeah.

C

Okay, thank you and thank you very much for putting this on the um the agenda tonight. uh We issued this document in october and it's actually a series of um fraud dressed um guides that we have issued in the last year. So we had one on procurement and another one on general fraud, risks and and the reason why we have it um have reduced.

C

It is obviously um the there's a heightened fraud risk as a result of the pandemic and um grant fraud in particular, and I'm sure members might have heard um some commentary from the cnag this week around and the 10k or the small business grant and scheme as well, and some of the issues that have come forward from it.

C

But um it's recognized that grant schemes during the pandemic were implemented at pace and, in some cases, were quite unique and also were, in some cases also administered by officers who maybe had not previously been involved in grants games. So um it's just really. I suppose it's quite just a useful document for organizations to look at if they are designing grant schemes going forward to be aware of the types of risks and how those could be mitigated. So hopefully, um council will help find that helpful. Thank you, chair.

A

Thank you cloud and I certainly found it helpful, I'm just putting a new member on council just from this year from january, and um I had some particular interest in the case studies that were included. So um no thank you yeah any comments on this item. Folks, it's all happy just to note it yeah, okay and the next item and agenda is item seven, which is any other relevant business.

A

I haven't been notified any other business folks. Is there any from the floor?

A

Oh okay! Well, on that note folks, um thank you. Thank you for everyone for the members for their attendance evening. I want to thank the officers as well for their tenants and preparing all the documents for the meetings, and I I want to wish she's all a happy christmas. So I don't see us all before then so. Happy christmas and good night, everyone merry christmas.