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From YouTube: Affordable Housing Advisory Committee – March 6, 2023
Description
Regular meeting of the City of Asheville Affordable Housing Advisory Committee.
Access the agenda and other meeting materials at the City of Asheville website: https://www.ashevillenc.gov/department/city-clerk/boards-and-commissions/affordable-housing-advisory-committee/
Participate before and during the meeting on our public engagement hub: https://publicinput.com/G6244
A
Good
morning,
everybody
and
welcome
to
the
Monday
March
6
2023
meeting
of
the
Asheville
affordable
housing
advisory
committee.
Welcome
everybody.
We
call
them
a
meeting
to
order
we'll
do
a
roll
call
vote
for
everybody.
That's
here.
C
A
And
we
also
have
joining
us
from
City
staff,
Sasha
and
Kevin.
Thank
you.
A
First
item
is
we
have
approval
of
our
minutes
from
last
meetings.
Everyone
had.
A
A
A
Okay!
Next
up,
we
have
a
discussion
of
our
bylaws
last
meeting.
We
discussed
some
ways
to
revise
it
to
allow
for
co-chairs
I,
believe
we
have
in
front
of
us
the
actually
we'll
print
it.
We
can
print
that
off,
but
we
have
do.
A
K
K
I
did
put
a
cover
sheet
on
here.
Basically,
I'll
just
give
you
a
quick
summary,
so
we
drafted
Janice
Ashley
from
legal
and
I
drafted
these
bylaws.
You
have
two
options.
We
drafted
it
like
you
can
in
both
cases
you
have
the
option
for
co-chair
co-chairs.
The
question
is:
do
you
want
to
also
have
a
vice
chair,
Janice
said
from
her
experience
with
the
historic
Resources
Commission
that
it's
helpful
to
have
a
vice
chair
who
can
step
in
if
the
two
co-chairs
can't
make
it
now?
K
K
K
A
H
A
C
A
D
Weren't
we
going
to
get
some
guidance
at
this
meeting
interest
and
sort
of
the
Optics
of
having
developer
interests.
K
You
did
and
I
think
our
City
attorney
was
going
to
attend,
can
make
it
today
or
she's
yeah.
She
couldn't
make
it
here
in
time
for
that
discussion,
but
I
think
I've
heard
her
say
this
many
times
so
just
for
boards
and
commissions,
the
general
guidance
for
conflict
of
interest
is,
if
you
have
a
financial
or
potential
financial
interest
in
something
I
think
conf.
You
know
the
appearance
of
conflict
of
interest.
It
is
good
to
be
aware
of
that
and
you.
C
H
K
D
H
D
A
C
A
I
have
purposely
not
ever
submitted
anything
to
Housing
Trust
Fund,
because
that
way
there
was
never
any
conflict
we'll
be
discussing
Housing
Trust,
one
of
the
leaves,
and
now
that
I
do
have
two
submitted
housing
profile.
Applications
I,
probably
would
not
feel
comfortable
being
in
a
conversation
about
by
housing
transport
applications
where
things
had
affect
it.
So
I.
D
A
C
So,
are
you
talking
about
not
just
being
like
being
someone
who
would
be
like
a
civil
engineer
or
a
general
contractor
or
I
mean
there's
so
many
things
that.
C
H
D
And
trust
fund
policy
and
and
created
a
for.
D
I
think
you
know
someone
in
the
community
who
was
looking
for
a
reason
to
disparage
the
work
of
this
committee
could
say:
well,
look
at
that.
He
was
just
you
know,
buttered
his
unread,
so
that
to
me
is
the
place
where
you
know
I
feel
like
we
just
need
to
I
need
some
guidance
again,
not
so
much
about
the
actual
conflict
of
interest.
You.
H
D
B
So
another
organization
I
served
on
a
board.
When
you
joined,
you
were
required
to
list
out
what
your
potential
conflicts
of
interest
could
be
perceived
by
others
outside.
So
you
would
say
in
advance,
I'm
a
civil
engineer.
My
firm
does
work
with
people
who
develop
properties
both
affordable
and
not
affordable
properties.
Therefore,
that's
a
potential
conflict.
So
when
you
and
then
in
specific
discussions,
all
you
have
to
do.
Is
it
if
you
identify
that
remind
people
of
that,
then
that
people
can
take
your
opinion
within
the
context
of
any
potential
conflicts.
B
You
might
have
I
think
where
you
run
out
of
issues,
if
you
don't
disclose
it
right.
So
if
we
said
I'm
going
to
vote
on
a
project
and
then
we
could
keep
it
on
Chris,
he
said,
but
we're
voting
on
a
micro
housing
project.
We
should
endorse
it
at
my
firm
is
planning
to
do
work
for
them
and
that's
you
should
probably
disclose
that
up
front
during
the
discussion
and
then,
as
a
committee
we
can
say
you
should
recuse
yourself
or
not.
B
I
think
that's
that's
the
way
you
said
to
put
it
all
on
the
table
and
it's
the
same
thing
for
non-profits.
You
know
if
you're
a
supporter
of
Homeward,
Bound
or
Haywood
Street
congregation
and
something
like
that
comes
up
for
a
discussion.
You
should
also
disclose
that
hey
I'm,
a
big
supporter
of
that
organization,
because
it's
well
it'll
work
for
them.
I
am
trying
to
further
that
organization's
objectives.
D
Yeah
and
Brian
I'm
sorry
I'm
just
going
to
keep
beating
this,
but
the
like
I
I,
think
that
makes
a
ton
of
sense
for
when
we're
in
this
room
and
I
also
know
that
the
chair
or
co-chair
for
vice
chairs
are
sometimes
doing
the
work
of
this
committee
and
setting
the
agenda
of
what
we're
going
to
talk
about
and
those
kinds
of
things
in
a
in
a
way
that
there
is
no
opportunity
for
public
disclosure.
B
K
I
did
get
a
message
from
Janice
and
I
guess
this
is
just
to
the
meeting
piece,
not
what
you
just
said.
You
know
she
said
you
know
for
appearance
of
conflict.
You
just
disclose
it
and
if
the
rest
of
the
committee
feels
it's
a
conflict,
then
they
can
vote
to
recuse,
it's
less
of
a
concern
for
an
advisory
committee
where
you're
not
making
final
decisions.
A
A
J
A
Gonna
because
our
Charter
is
calling
out
for
people
there's
always
we
are
we're
playing
in
the
field,
so
yeah
we're
going
to
understand
it.
But
I
do
you
know
I
do
and
from
our
when
we
made
the
recommendation,
we
did
request
for
legal
to
come,
so
we
can
ask
the
questions
rather
than
have
to
discuss
as
amongst
ourselves.
So
if
people
are
more
comfortable
waiting
until
next
month
and
making
sure
we
can
get
a
surprise
or
someone
here.
A
D
F
I,
don't
know
I
mean
yeah
to
your
point
like
we
are
on
this
committee,
because
we
work
in
the
community
doing
this
work
and
our
work
doesn't
end
when
we
walk
out
of
this
room
and
we're
not
such
a
big
enough
Community
to
where,
like
we
can
choose
people
who
aren't
going
to
be
involved
in
some
of
this.
You
know
the
boots
on
the
ground.
Part
of
the
work
so
I
think
there
may
be
times
when
it
gets
a
little
close,
but
it
kind.
F
A
D
D
I,
don't
know
who
we
select
for
a
leadership
role,
isn't
going
to
affect
our
ability
to
represent
the
Public's
interest
in
affordable
housing,
which
is
what
our
you
know.
Our
main
goal
is
right
so
like
that
who
are
going
to
perceive
this
group
as
having
you
know.
L
A
M
You
good
morning,
good
morning,
I'm
Michelle,
Moore
I'm,
the
co-director
of
the
housing
Choice
voucher
program
with
the
Asheville
housing
authority
and
I
was
asked
to
come
speak
and
give
you
a
little
more
information.
I
understand
you
get
a
monthly
report
on
our
voucher
accounts
and
they're
made
be
some
questions.
Do
I
need
to
address
this
yeah,
okay
or.
M
Okay
feel
comfortable,
perfect,
so
I
understand
that
the
data
that
we
provide
may
still
leave
you
with
some
unanswered
questions
and
there's
conversation
around
whether
or
not
that
actual
report
is
the
best
tool
to
paint
a
picture
of
our
vouchers
and
how
we're
meeting
the
need
in
terms
of
affordable
housing.
I've
got
a
list
of
questions
forwarded
from
you.
Sasha
should
I
just
maybe
go
over
those
our
answers.
Okay,
so.
M
C
M
That
sure
I
printed
it
on
Friday,
so
the
January
reporting
that
you
should
have
is
going
to
look
different
than
the
previous
ones,
because
the
the
graphs
at
the
bottom-
those
are
those
are
missing.
So
when
you
month
to
month,
the
graphs
down
below
will
start
to
populate,
but
so
the
January
every
year.
That
report
is
going
to
look
a
little
blank,
but
in
terms
of
the
Housing
Authority's
total
voucher
count,
we
have
3414
total
vouchers.
M
We
have
1525
project-based
vouchers.
We
no
longer
operate,
which
I'm
sure
everyone
here
is
aware,
but
we
know
longer
operate
under
public
housing.
So
our
project-based
vouchers
are
those
units
that
were
converted
from
public
housing
to
what
is
called
rad
units.
But
those
are
the
project-based
voucher
units
and
again
that
count
is
15.25..
Does.
M
Those
are
separate,
those
are
different
project-based
vouchers,
but
the
1525
is
strictly
those
rag
units
that
the
Housing
Authority
owns
and
manages
like
diver
view.
Please
give
you
right
and
then
we
have
tenant-based
vouchers
now,
tenant-based
vouchers
those
are
assigned
to
the
tenant
and
those
are
the
vouchers
that
folks
use
out
in
the
private
rental
market
and
they
rent
a
unit
on
the
private
Market
if
they
move
that
voucher
goes
with
them
because
again,
that's
a
tenant-based,
voucher,
I've
broken
out.
My
number
I'm
sorry.
M
So
there's
there's
a
project-based
voucher
listing
there
for
Lifehouse,
the
one
that
says:
LH,
that's
life
house,
that's
a
project-based
development
on
Peachtree
out
in
South
Asheville.
They
have
20
units
there
and
those
are
project-based
vouchers
tied
to
those
units.
Then
the
Vash
vouchers.
These
are
special
purpose
vouchers
tied
to
the
the
Vash,
the
VA,
supportive
housing
vouchers,
341.
M
The
Ned
vouchers
75,
those
are
non-elderly:
disabled,
mainstream,
37,
emergency
housing,
47
emergency
housing
vouchers
are
newer
for
us.
We
worked
with
the
consume
of
care,
Emily
ball,
their
partnering
agencies,
abccm
Homeward,
Bound,
helpmate
I'm,
forgetting
someone
helped
made
a
lot
of
home
that
might
be
who
I
missed
home
are
bound
and
abccm.
So
each
of
those
agencies
had
a
commitment
of
a
different
number
of
vouchers,
and
those
agencies
refer
folks
to
us
with
those
emergency
housing
vouchers
in
the
initial
award
was
for
47
of
those,
and
then
we
have
1369
other
tenant-based
vouchers.
M
A
M
An
active
award
on
those,
let
me
see
if
I
brought
information
on
that
I'm.
So
sorry,
those
are
for
disabled
families,
who
are
entering
like
it
more
leaving
dependent
living
and
and
going
out
into
the
private
market
for
Independent
Living,
and
we
don't
have
like
a
new
A
continuing
award
on
those.
M
So
if
you
look
over
a
word
that
says
available
and
for
the
main
screen,
for
example,
there
are
four
available
so
of
that
for
37
or
of
that
initial
award
that
we
have
we've
had.
Four
of
those
folks
have
left
the
program,
and
so
we
have
four
that
we
could
lease
up
so
that
available
column
corresponds,
of
course,
to
the
different
voucher
types.
M
This
it's
it
looks
like
it's
the
same
I'm,
not
sure
why
the
highlighting
is
there.
That's
the
data
that
I
actually
update
monthly.
The
highlighting
and
I
may
have
sent
that
in
with
the
highlighting
on
there,
but
it
is.
This
is
actually
December's
I'm.
So
sorry,
so
the
one
I'm
looking
at
I
bought
November,
December
and
January,
because
the
question
was
posed
if
this
was
the
use,
a
useful
tool
for
you
guys
and
in
all
honesty.
In
my
opinion,
it's
not
it's
a
lot
of
numbers.
M
Obviously
those
numbers
are
important,
but
I
don't
feel
like.
It
really
tells
this
story
as
well
as
it
could
so
we're,
certainly
at
the
Housing
Authority,
we're
certainly
open
to
providing
the
numbers
in
a
different
way
or
the
information
in
a
different
way.
The
housing
authorities
work
closely
with
Kate
pet
in
developing
some
reports
for
Thrive
and
for
a
recent
broad
committee
that
a
collaborative
that
we're
we're
partnering
on
and
again
we're
open
to
presenting
the
data
in
whatever
way
would
be
most
useful.
I.
H
B
M
There
was
a
question
about
tenant,
Mobility,
so
tune
up.
Mobility
vouchers
are
tenant-based
vouchers
that
are
issued
to
folks
in
the
rad
or
the
project-based
voucher
units
that
we
own
and
manage
so
folks
who
live
in
our
developments,
who
want
the
tenant-based
voucher
after
they've
lived
in
housing
for
a
year.
They
can
apply
for
the
tenant-based
voucher,
but
that
it's
called
tenant
Mobility.
So
it's
folks
who
are
moving
out
of
housing
or
project-based
housing,
our
project-based
housing
and
out
into
the
private
rental
market.
Those
tenant-based
vouchers
are
called
tenant,
Mobility
vouchers,
so.
M
Are
part
of
the
other
where
it
says
tenant
based
at
the
very
bottom,
where
it
says
other
yeah
they're
long
they're
lumped
in
there
correct?
Yes,
yes,
and
we
could
certainly
bring
that
out
if
that's
another,
smaller
specific
population
that
we
want
to
report
on,
that
would
help
you
guys
we're
certainly.
M
J
Of
how
many
of
those
are
being
returned,
how
many
of
those
tenants
are
not
able
to
actually
find
housing
using
those
type
of
vouchers?
It's
I
think
the
biggest
concerned.
M
It's
around
50
I
mean
it's
not
right,
so
there
are
a
lot
of
factors
involved
with
that,
though,
so
for
our
tenant
Mobility
folks.
M
M
But
it's
not
necessarily
a
representation
of
dire
need.
A
lot
of
folks.
We
see
a
lot
of
folks
who
have
requested
the
tenant,
Mobility
voucher,
their
voucher
expires,
and
they
immediately
reapply,
and
this
can
this
cycle
can
go
on
they'll
get
the
voucher,
look
not
find
exactly
what
they're
looking
for
and
that
voucher
will
expire
and
they'll
just
apply
again.
So
again,
it's
hard
to
look
at
that
number
and.
G
Michelle
I
used
to
work
for
help
me
and
I
did
actually
help
to
assist
eight
of
the
crimes
with
the
ehb
voucher,
so
I'm
a
little
aware
of
that.
But
I
don't
think
that
most
of
the
clients
are
not
not
finding
things
that
they
want.
They're,
not
finding
things
that
they're
eligible
for
so
I
think.
We
need
to
be
very
clear
about
that
that
most
people
who
are
limited
project
makes
housing
want
to
get.
G
But
they're
not
able
to
find
housing
that
will
accept
their.
J
M
J
N
M
A
Housing
Authority
development,
but
I
need
a
voucher
and
I.
What
how
do
I
like?
What
is
the
application
sure
says
it
is
like
income
levels
so.
M
We
take
applications.
Our
wait
list
is
not
closed.
It's
open,
so
someone
who
doesn't
have
a
voucher
and
is
not
in
assisted
housing
can
apply.
Our
wait
list
is,
unfortunately
longer
than
five
years
for
someone
who
does
not
come
in
with
a
referral.
M
We
don't
know
what
your
eligibility,
it's
just,
a
screening
on
income.
We
just
do
a
pre-application
based
on
what's
reported
on
the
application
and
then
after
they
come
up
on
the
wait
list,
we
verify
things
like
income
and
then,
if
they're
going
into
project-based
housing,
we
would
do
the
other
screenings.
But
in
terms
of
the
private
voucher
right.
M
M
So
when
they
apply
it's
what
we
call
a
pre-application
and
because
our
wait
list
is
so
long,
we
do
know
verification
at
that
time.
So
they're
just
reporting
on
the
application.
So
it's
a
pre-eligibility
essentially
and
then,
when
they
come
up
off
the
wait
list,
we
verify
and
we
have
a
hierarchy.
We
have
a
eiv,
Enterprise
income,
verification
system
that
we
use
and
if
we
can't
pull
income
there,
we
move
on
to
pay,
stubs
and
so
on
and
so
forth.
But
we'll
do
verify
it
once
they
come
off
the
wait
list
and.
A
M
K
Bulb
kind
of
well
not
really,
but
when
we
often
get
this
report
and
we
look
at
like
assigned
who's
looking
and
we
see
104
households
on
this
month
right
next
month,
it
might
say
85
and
the
following
month.
It
might
say
you
know
something
else
right.
M
I
K
M
So
I
believe
14.
Yes,
so
14.99.
If
you
look
below
the
highlighted
section,
it
says:
wait
list
14.99!
That's
on
this
report
monthly
and
that's
how
many
people
are
on
the
wait
list.
C
O
H
M
And
our
voucher
to
remember
rate,
you
know
how
how
many
people
can
we
pull
off
the
wait
list
at
a
given
time?
How
many
folks
are
going
off
the
program
and
releasing
vouchers
it's,
unfortunately,
a
slow
process
like
salsa
sausage,
referred
to
the
104
available.
Those
are
folks
who
have
vouchers
who
are
out
there
looking
now
and
again,
that
number
will
fluctuate
month
to
month,
depending
on
how
many
folks
we
were
able
to
either
pull
from
the
wait
list
that
month
or
this
number
carries
over
so
when
a
voucher
is
issued.
M
M
M
A
A
Talk
about
so,
let's
just
say
like,
and
there
are
more
vouchers
or
vouchers
available
from
those
are
on
the
waitlist
like,
let's
just
say,
let's
say
if
I
opened
up
an
apartment,
building
and
I've
got
a
thousand
units
and
I'm
going
to
offer
them
all
the
voucher
housing.
Did
the
vouchers
automatically
become
available
for
those
people.
M
Not
necessarily
so
our
tenant
Mobility
folks,
they
do
have
a
defined
preference.
So
if,
if
you're
living
in
our
project-based
housing
and
you've
applied
for
that
tenant,
Mobility
voucher,
you
get
a
preference
for
the
private
Market
voucher
over
folks
who
are
on
the
wait
list
who
have
no
voucher
because
there's
an
initiative
to
move
folks
out
of
high
poverty
areas
into
higher
opportunity
areas.
M
We
get
every
year,
yes,
yes,
and
the
number
of
our
vouchers
really
doesn't
change.
In
all
honesty.
Year
to
year
we
received
eight
new
vouchers
and
we
don't
even
always
receive
new
vouchers
year
to
year
our
special
purpose
vouchers.
You
know
we
will
either
get
continued
funding
and
it
increases
for
those,
but
those
are
very
small
amounts
and
again
not
helpful
for
the
folks
who
are
on
the
waitlist
again.
It's
those
referring.
M
Not
everybody
applies
for
both
so
and
not
everybody's
open
to
go
into
project-based
voucher
housing.
First,
it's
the
quickest
way,
I
mean
if
it's
honestly
in
terms
of
just
general
information,
if
you're
an
applicant
or
if
you
need
housing,
the
quickest
way
to
get
our
tenant-based
voucher
is
to
accept
a
unit
apply,
of
course,
and
accept
a
unit
in
our
project-based
voucher
stay
there
a
year
apply
for
the
tenant,
Mobility
voucher
and
within
months
you
will
get
your
so
you
know
a
year
and
a
half,
maybe
compared
to
five
to
ten
years.
M
They
do
but
they're
just
so
many
people
who
either
are
not
open
to
that
or
we
filled
a
ton
of
calls.
Just
like
the
scenario
you
mentioned.
I'm
a
landlord
I
have
a
tenant,
and
she
you
know
her
husband,
just
passed
away
or
lost
a
job
like
it's
heartbreaking,
but
there's
just
not
a
process.
There.
There's
there's
no
quick
way
to
assist
those
individuals.
J
So
sorry.
G
M
You
know
we
have
fought
to
increase
our
payment
standards,
which
I
can
certainly
speak
to
that
and
just
as
soon
as
we
get
that
approved
the
market
explodes
again
like
when
we
got
our
most
recent
payment
standards,
increased
I
was
so
related,
but
then
you
look
at
a
mile
and
it's
just
a
constant
struggle,
but
but
to
answer
that
it's
still
very
tough.
G
M
Well,
we're
probably
getting
five
back,
but
it's
again
it
varies
because
some
of
those
are
the
tenant
Mobility
who
again,
they
may
not
have
that
urgency
or
they're,
like
you
said,
there's
so
many
factors
in
there
to
why
we're
those
are
going.
M
Yeah,
so
yes,
yes,
folks,
are
fighting
the
stigma
that
exists,
but
yeah
the
amount
of
rents
that
property
owners
can
get
in
command
is
just
it's
hard
to
stay
in
line
with
that
with
the
voucher
payment
standards.
M
Here
the
homeownership
is
in
the
other,
okay,
and
we
have
76
I,
believe
it's
it's
in
that
ballpark
who
are
in
homes
that
they've
purchased
and
are
receiving
monthly
subsidy
with
and
again,
we
can
absolutely
report
on
that
monthly,
but
those
those
are
the
tenant-based
vouchers.
So
if
someone's
in
Project
based
housing
we
would
have
to,
they
would
have
to
move
to
the
tenant-based
voucher.
But
there's
a
process-
and
we
absolutely
work
with
folks-
is.
J
Any
of
this
data
set
like
segregated
by
race
and
like,
and
the
reason
why
I'm
asking
it
is
because,
as
we
think
about,
the
ones
that
are
coming
back
are
finding
it
harder
to
get
vouchers
is
enter
that
data.
That.
M
Our
data
is
not,
but
we
could
do
that.
I
worked
again
with
Kate,
with
thrive
in
our
landlord-tenant
partnership
recently
to
start
a
report
that
looks
at
the
different
demographics
yeah
and
she
just
showed
me
and
it's
visually
again.
It
tells
a
better
story
than
just
looking
at
these
numbers,
so
it
would
be
absolutely
happy
and
open
to
who.
C
Is
representing
who
can
go
to
HUD
and
say,
wake
up
and
and
give
us
more
who?
What
organization
or
do
we
have?
Some
type
of
you
know
somebody
in
the
general
assembly
that
is
doing
that.
F
M
Yes,
because
again
like
we
so
HUD
sets
the
payment
standard
for
each
jurisdiction
based
on
the
fair
market
rent
and
we
applied
for
a
waiver
to
go
120
above
the
fair
market
rent,
and
so
we
were
approved,
and
then
we
had
to
pitch
that
to
the
board
and
we
got
board
approval
of
course.
So
it's
all
very
exciting,
but
we're
still
we're
still
in
this
place,
where
the
market
keeps
going
up
and
we're
still,
the
voucher
payment
standard
is
still
behind
the
market.
M
So
it's
certainly
worth
the
conversation,
if
there's
other
gap,
funding
or
things
that
that
we
could
look
at
but
to
Tara's
Point.
Yes,
it's
a
constant
struggle
with
having
Property
Owners
landlords
who
will
work
with
the
program
and
whether
it's
build
more
housing
or
turn
their
existing
housing
into
to
units
that
they're.
You
know
willing
to
to
accept
the
voucher
payment.
J
I
K
The
voucher
payment
standards
to
Michelle's
Point
are
actually
higher
than
like,
say
a
rent
for
an
80
Ami
household.
If
you
had
a
voucher,
your
rent
is
actually
higher
than
what
that
is.
You
know,
I'm
saying
like
the
vouchers
are
super
valuable
and
the
payment
standards
that
hacka
has
argued
for
are
actually
higher
than
what
the
city
says
is
Affordable.
Does
that
make
sense
like
the
market?
It's.
I
J
How
is
being
defined
as
affordable,
yes,
is
really
unaffordable,
giving
what
we're
like
our
Market
here,
that's
like
the
reality,
and
so
the
definition
don't
match.
What's
really
affordable
right
here,
which
still
hinders
that
fluctuation
to
be
able
to
be
the
vouchers
to
be
valuable
to
a
homeowner
who
wants
to
rent
their
property
to
someone
who's
asked
about
you,
because
they
can
get
much
more
way
more
Market,
yeah
well,.
M
M
J
K
I
was
just
gonna,
say,
I
think
this
is
why
the
the
discussions
that
you
hear
have
here
or
hcd
or
Council
about
our
projects,
are
we
mandating
the
accept
vouchers.
Are
we
asking
them
to
set
aside
units
for
vouchers?
That's
partly
why
this
is
so
important
right.
So
we're
taking
these
projects
through
and
saying
certain
number.
You
have
to
accept
them,
but
that's
not
the
same
as
you.
You
must
right.
M
Fast-
and
my
answer
was
yes:
yes,
yes
more-
require
make
that
requirement,
because
the
more
tax
credit
unions
we
can
build
or
create
the
more
tenant-based
vouchers.
The
more
of
those
folks
we
can
house.
K
B
M
M
M
I,
don't
want
to
get
us
too
deep
into
the
weeds
without
the
information
in
front
of
us,
but
we
also
thought
to
increase
our
utility
allowances
because
utilities
have
increased,
but
that's
a
double-edged
sword.
So
we,
the
rate
we
got
the
utility
allowances
increased.
So
that's
an
average
that
we
calculate
to
anticipate
their
utility
project,
their
utility
fees,
their
utility
expenses,
so
that
we
add
to
that
rent
to
see
if
they're,
at
or
below
the
payment
standards.
M
So
we
we
got
that
increased
that
helps
the
tenant
in
terms
of
their
tenant
rent
portion,
but
getting
in
the
door
with
the
landlord
it.
It
comes
off
the
rent
amount,
if
that
makes
sense,
so
the
payment
standard,
in
other
words,
if
you're
23.38
and
the
utility
allowance
used
to
be
200.
But
now
we've
increased
it
to
250..
M
G
Course,
180
days,
yeah
that
they
would
just
want
to
do
portability.
Are
you
seeing
that
most
of
the
clients
or
residents
are
trying
to
support
their?
We.
M
Don't
have
a
lot
of
portability
and
portability
is
just
the
head
option
to
port
or
transfer
a
voucher
to
another
jurisdiction,
and
we
speak
to
that
during
the
voucher
orientation.
Voucher
issuance,
but
we
don't
see
it
a
ton.
It's
it's
definitely.
C
Do
you
all
do
any
type
of
maybe
Kate
does,
but
looking
at
how
their
system
works,
what
their
numbers
are
compared
to,
because
Asheville
is
an
anomaly
when.
H
H
C
M
A
Of
the
things
we
talk
about
so
much
is
unit
mix
and
what
is
the
demands
of
like
of
the
90?
Let's
say
of
the
91
of
the
104
that
are,
people
have
vouchers
that
need
need
housing
or
or
in
Project,
based
housing
that
are
looking
how?
What
is
the?
What
is
the
one
bedroom
mix?
What
is
the
family
unit
mix
just
so?
We
know
because
we're
trying
to
design
policy
to
meet
the
needs,
and
we
don't
we.
M
So
I
did
have
our
admissions
coordinator.
She
she
was
actually
our
staff
person
Gary
who
issues
our
vouchers.
I
asked
her
to
pull
some
data
that
might
help.
This
was
from
January
of
2022
through
January
of
2023..
M
We
had
in
terms
of
expired.
Was
that
your
question,
or
was
at
least
up.
M
Now
she
does
have
a
column
here
searching
and
that
would
be
similar
to
the
104
number
on
the
current
report
and
her
searching
number
is
89,
so
I
can
go
over
that
it
would
there's
just
a
shortage
there,
but
for
that
year
on
a
screenshot
there
were
31
one
bedroom,
voucher
holders,
searching
32
bedrooms,
23
bedrooms,
six,
four
bedrooms
and
two
fives.
F
H
L
A
So
what
would
happen
if
so,
let's
just
say,
let's
just
say,
someone
opened
up
a
building
next
week
and
it
had
50
units
that
they're
willing
to
put
for
one
bedroom
vouchers
and.
A
Is
you
said,
there's
21
what
happens
like
what
happens
if
they're,
starting
so
basically
you're,
saying
there's
like
12
there's
about
20,
something
that
are
unused
vouchers
for
one
bedrooms
and
then
the
restaurant
awaiting
list
that
we
don't
know
when
they
would
get
their
vouchers?
What
happens
like
if.
M
A
It
exceeds
what
there
already
are.
There
are
vouchers
for
one
bedroom
that
are
unused,
that
there's
people
on
the
waiting
list,
so
that
would
that
would
accelerate
that
waiting
list
to
then
be
issued
vouchers
so
that
so
it's
so
vouchers
can
be
that's
kind
of
where
I'm
confused
in
the
week
so
vouchers,
if
someone's
on
a
waiting
list.
If
then
those
other
vouchers
get
used,
then
it
opens
up.
It
opens
up
more
to
be
issued.
I
said:
okay,
I.
J
Got
a
question:
okay,
when
I
think
about
one
of
your
own
and
I:
guess
it's
just
kind
of
how
my
expense
was
when
I
was.
You
know
the
one
bedroom
so
like
say:
I'm,
a
single
parent
and
I'm
applying
for
a
one-bedroom
and
I
have
a
daughter
and
so
would
I
be
qualified
for
a.
J
M
In
that
scenario,
we
would
issue
a
two-bedroom
voucher,
I
mean
they
could
certainly
choose
a
one
bedroom
if
they
had
difficulty
finding
it
to
the
issue.
There
is
that
when
they,
if
they
find
a
unit,
that's
smaller
than
the
voucher,
it
also
reduces
the
payment
standard
down
to
that
voucher
down
to
that
unit
size.
M
So
there's
that
yeah.
G
G
G
M
M
E
M
C
L
They
understand
you
know
what
what
our
utility
rights
are
and
so
yeah
in
terms
of
talking
to
them.
D
I
was
just
gonna
say:
we've
talked
a
lot
about
them,
some
of
the
barriers
and
they're-
certainly
real,
but
I
just
keep
looking
at
this
there's
about
3
000
folks
who
have
affordable
housing,
very
low
income
folks
who
have
affordable
housing
through
this
program.
That's
is
by
far
in
a
way,
I
think
the
largest
number
of
low-income
housed
folks
are
housed
through
this
system
of
anything.
You
know
in
a
minute
we're
going
to
spend
you
know
an
hour
or
more
talking
about
a
policy.
You
know
with
Louise
that'll
get
us.
D
That
create
you
know
incremental
additional
units,
but
you
know,
and
the
fact
that
you
know
we've
for
five
years.
Four
years,
I
don't
know
a
long
time,
and
this
is
the
first
presentation
we've
really
gotten
at
this
level
of
depth
around
the
single
biggest
before
the
program
in
our
community
like
this
is
really
important
stuff
and
the
things
that
we
can
do
to
make
this
program
work
better
affect
more
families
than
anything
else.
We'll
talk
about.
M
M
A
But
that's
what
I
mean
see
what
I
understand,
because
the
funding
amount
would
check
like
so,
let's
just
say:
if,
like
a
thousand
more
units
opened
up,
that
meant
a
thousand
more
vouchers
committed
issues,
so
the
funding
exists
for
that
because
then
it's
not
so
the
funding
exists.
If,
if,
if
the
ones
that
are
wait
list,
if
the
ones
that
are
currently
available
get
filled,
then
that
means
the
waitlists
become
active
vouchers.
That
funding
is
needed
for
so.
K
M
That
those
units
are
still
there,
so,
if
someone's,
if
someone's
into
review,
for
example-
and
they
their
tenant,
Mobility
voucher
becomes
available
and
they
find
a
unit
on
the
private
market
and
they
vacate
their
dealer
view
unit.
We've
got
folks
on
the
wait
list
primed
and
ready
that
we
will
move
into
adding
supplies
absolutely
opens
up
exactly
yes,.
M
C
E
H
A
L
N
It's
almost
easier
to
see
some
of
these
big
questions
and
what
I've
learned
from
Michelle
and
through
Michelle,
maybe
from
Tara,
is
that
we
can't
advocate
for
more
until
we
show
that
we
constantly
really
exhaust
all
the
ones
that
we
have,
and
so,
when
I've
looked
at
other
communities
that
have
successfully
raised
their
numbers,
they
have
to
continually
push
this
number
what's
challenging.
Is
that
our
local
Housing
Authority
only
releases
them?
They
can't
overextend
right,
so
they
have
been
given
a
certain
allotment
and
they
can't
over
extend
that
number.
N
Even
though
we
need
many,
many
more
so
they're
only
kind
of
coming
close
to
that
number
so
that
they
don't
overextend,
which
makes
it
hard
to
make
the
argument
that
we
need
many
more.
Does
that
make
sense.
So
right
now,
if
we
have
a
hundred
vouchers,
open
they're
watching
these
numbers
very
closely,
because
they
have
a
budget
that
is
based
on
that
allocation,
they
can't
over
award
that,
and
so
somehow
we
do
need
a
Lobby
group
and
at
the
same
time
we
do
have
to
help
them
place.
N
All
of
these
folks
Barry
asked
a
question
earlier.
If
we
had
a
hundred
new
units,
what
would
that
do
to
it?
If
we
had
a
hundred
new
one
bedroom
units
and
I
think
what
Michelle
was
saying,
she'll
come
back
over
here
was
that
they
could
pull
down
for
that
specific
size
into
the
list,
but
I
don't
know
Michelle.
M
M
We
can't
select
the
unit
on
the
tenant-based
voucher
issuance,
but
we
would
have
to
unless
internally
we
you
know
revamped
our
preferences
and
all
of
those
policies
that
go
to
the
board
and
but
that's
how
right
now
it
stands.
We
would
have
to
look
at
how
far
back
would
we
have
to
go
and
how
many
people
would
we
have
to
pull.
We
would,
if
we
had
to
pull
you
know,
300
or
400,
then
we
may
not
have
staff
capacity
to
pull
that
many,
certainly
not
in
a
month.
A
J
A
A
There's
a
they're
saying
we
will,
we
will
accept
46.,
are
there
actually
and
but
we're
saying,
there's
30
something
there's
actually
only
30
something
vouchers
and
some
of
them
aren't
going
to
want
are
going
to.
Even
though
they've
got
one
bedroom,
they
might
not
want
a
studio
because
Rogers,
don't
necessarily
so
we're
trying
to
like.
A
M
And
I
think
that's
just
one
way
for
me
that
this
particular
tool.
This
particular
report
is
not
that
useful
in
terms
of
the
community
work
that
needs
to
be
done
and
I
know,
Kate
hears
this
for
me
all
the
time
that
you
know
we're.
M
Certainly
at
capacity
in
terms
of
the
you
know
the
work
and
what
additionally
can
we
be
doing,
but
it
in
my
opinion,
it
really
would
take
breaking
this
information
out
so
that
we
can
help
the
community
tell
a
better
story
and
then
make
the
changes
where
they
need
to
be
made.
But
I
did
want
to
mention
that
Kate
brought
up
a
valid
point
about
the
percentage.
M
M
You
know
again,
HUD
gives
us
a
certain
amount
of
funding,
so
there's
just
this
constant
Balancing
Act
and
get
as
close
as
you
can,
but
you
can
also
see
if
you
look
at
the
other
specific
vouchers
like
we
are
103.9
percent,
at
least
up
on
our
tenant-based
vouchers,
but
anyway
that
fluctuates
month
to
month.
So
it's
not
like
we're
in
a
danger
zone
or
anything.
But
again
it
does
speak
to
that
that
kind
of
touch
and
go
hitting
that
Mark
as
close
as
we
can
when.
J
M
So
it
would
be
someone
with
a
one
bedroom
voucher,
but
our
payment
standard
is
going
to
be
lower
for
the
studio
unit.
So
our
one
bedroom
payment
standard,
for
example,
is
1557.
So
someone
with
that
one
bedroom
voucher
can
go
out
and
find
a
one
bedroom
unit
where
their
rent
and
utilities
don't
go
over
that
amount,
but
it
drops
down
to
13.97
for
a
studio
or
efficiency
so
that
same
one
bedroom,
voucher
amount
reduces
because
the
the
unit
size-
yes.
Yes,
yes,
yes,
so.
I
M
Might
still
be
acceptable
in
terms
of
size,
you
know
for
the
individual
or
you
know
if
it
was
a
family,
you
know
one
person
and
a
child,
for
example.
They
may
accept
that,
but
it
does.
The
impact
is
that
our
payment
standard
is
reduced.
Okay,.
H
A
A
So
it's
a
separate
non-profit
that
receives
Federal
funding
and
that's
what
and
so,
let's
say
and
like
other
markets
have
like
a
dish
like
I
have
different
cdc's
and
other
kind
of
things.
So
what
what
qualifies
creating
a
new
project
like
a
development?
That's
considered
project-based
like
what.
If
what.
O
A
B
Just
have
to
you
have
to
have
the
building,
and
then
you
have
to
apply
to
the
Housing
Authority
for
the
vouchers
for
the
units,
so
the
short
Michigan
project
that
we
did
with
Homeward
Bound.
We
bought
you
bought
a
apartment,
complex
modified
the
units
and
then
applied
for
project-based
vouchers
through
the
Housing
Authority.
M
B
M
A
Mobility
options
once
they've
been
in
a
project
base
so
and,
and
it
can't,
and
if
some
and
it
sounds
like
it
can
be
even
a
percentage,
it
doesn't
like
if
three,
for
example,
let's
say
319,
if
it's
not,
if
only
let's
just
use
example,
20
20
units
or
vouchers
it
can
apply
instead
of
it.
Just
getting
applying
for
other
funding
and
saying
that
we'll
receive
like
they'll
accept
housing
choice,
they
can
apply
to
be
a
project
to
accept
Project
based.
M
Yes,
they
could
commit
either
project
and
include
in
in
their
application
funding
all
of
that
to
have
project-based
units
a
certain
number
Project
based
units,
or
they
could
commit
to
reserve
in
a
certain
number
or
percentage
for
tenant-based
vouchers,
and
that
really
is
just
a
conversation
or
a
decision
on
the
developer.
A
M
And
from
my
understanding
that
I
don't
know
enough
on
the
development
in
but
I
think
on
the
lender
side,
you
know
it's
going
to
look
differently
if
there's
a
project-based
voucher
commitment
versus
tenant-based
voucher,
but.
B
K
M
M
D
A
Were
both
at
a
meeting
there
was
a
meeting
last
week
about
a
group
at
New,
York
City,
that's
Consultants,
basically
consolidating
see
you
know,
Community,
Development
corporations
and
and
and
then
making
it
easier
for
there
to
be
basically
more
more
smaller
housing
authorities.
That's
kind
of
the
I
mean
because
we
were
talking
about
one
of
the
issues
we
have
in
our
community.
Here
is
basically
it's:
it's
the
the
it's
the
housing
authority
and
then
kind
of
out
housing.
This,
but
they're,
not
really
the
CDC
I
think
it
was
Eagle,
Street,
Eagle
Market.
H
A
The
only
other
one,
so
it
kind
of
like
the
effective
yeah
that
was.
G
So
my
concern
is
always
even
with
the
current
properties
that
we
have
in
Asheville,
but
even
with
the
ones
that's
being
built.
Who
is
making
sure
that
these
places
are?
You
know
they
say
that
they
have
20
units
that
there
is
actually
20
of
those
20
units
are
actually
people
who
are
using
these
vouchers
or
considered,
or
you
know,
maybe
low
income
or
whatever,
because.
G
By
working
in
the
community
is
that
a
lot
of
these
properties
say
that
then
whatever
but
I'm,
not
seeing
our
people
in
those
Pro
in
those
units,
so
I
just
wanted
to
know.
Who
is
the
Watchdog?
Who
is
making
sure
that
these
projects
are
actually
key
than
they
were
once
they
get
the
money,
get
developed
and
put
things
out,
but.
G
Too
is
if
we
do
vary,
if
you
said
100
units,
one
bedroom
units
or
two
bedrooms,
I
could
fill
the
mean
Kate
and
francina
week.
We
got
this
even
Toronto.
We
we
don't
feel
those
units,
no
problem.
We
will
have
a
big,
fair
and
say:
Section,
8
approves
and
I
bet
you
we're.
Gonna
have
no
problem
filling
those
units,
it's
just
that
we
don't
have
enough
space
or
you
know,
people
who
are
taking
these.
G
Then
that's
the
problem.
I
I,
you
know
how
I've
met
various
is
because
I've.
G
M
G
M
M
We
could
generate
that
information.
You
know,
for
these
types
of
conversations,
absolutely
I
mean
they're.
B
Because
that's
what
always
been
one
of
my
concerns
is
what
you
were
just
getting
to.
Is
we
keep
doing
this
right?
It's
Housing,
Trust,
Fund
or
you
know,
land
use
incentive
grants
to
create
units
on
how.
B
M
This
sure
right,
I
think
and
certainly
a
shorter
list
like
if
I
had
a
short
list.
You
know
I
could
spend
time.
Looking
at
you
know
five
properties
or
even
ten
and
finding
out
how
many
voucher
holders
are
leased
today,
for
example,
but
an
extensive
reporting
on
all
of
our
landlords.
We
might
have
to
do
something
with
our
developer.
Our
software
developer
to.
M
H
A
Have
this
data
and
we
asked
for
it
and
we
kind
of
asked
for
her.
You
know
we
kind
of
tweaked
with
her
kind
of
what
the
needs
are,
but
I
think
what
we
probably
need
to
do
is
have
an
agenda
item
for
cook,
because
this
is
so
bad,
so
helpful
and
that
you
know
I
think
maybe
we
need
to
do
as
a
future
agenda.
Just
have
I
kind
of
us
all
put
together.
Questions
like
these
are
the
things
we
don't
like
to
see
other
reports
and
that
way.
A
We
have
the
guiding
The
Guiding
data,
because
we
ask
these
same
questions
a
lot,
but
it
really
helps
to
you
know
really
helps
to
understand
the
broad
view
but
understand
the
details
right.
B
A
See
these
numbers
and
to
understand
what
the
difference
between
104
and
the
14.99
that's
a
that's
a
huge
difference.
J
I
just
want
to
make
sure
I'm
clear
about
one
thing
you
said,
and
you
said
like:
the
waiting
list
is
based
off
of
when
people
apply
when
people
put
their
name
on
the
waiting
list,
so
just
hypothetical
because
of
China
process,
and
that
various
example
of
if
we
had
a
hundred
units
of
one
bedrooms
with
that,
take
100..
If
you
had
a
just
stay
kisses,
for
instance,
if
you
have
100
unions
and
you
and
we
have,
we
have
them
available.
J
M
M
Correct
because
our
Branch
our
applicants
to
our
project-based
voucher
units,
we
look
at
bedroom
size
for
those,
because
we
know
we
own
and
manage
our
project-based
voucher
units
and
we
know
what
our
vacancy
rates
are
by
bedroom
size,
but
in
terms
of
our
tenant-based
voucher,
applicants
we're
not
pulling
a
report
on
on
those
and
we're
not
prioritizing
by
bedroom
size.
So
if
there
were
a
hundred
one
bedroom
units-
and
we
pulled
a
hundred
people
off
the
wait
list,
we
would
not
capture
101
folks
who
would
be
issued
a
one-bedroom
voucher.
M
H
E
N
Michelle
recently
created
a
report
for
us,
it
was
based
on
December's
data,
so
it's
not
on
this
104
but
of
the
75
households
at
that
time,
that
had
vouchers
and
were
looking
about
less
than
half
of
them
were
the
just
single
occupants
so
to
Paul's
Point,
not
only
when
you
look
at
the
data
that
she
just
provided
today.
Not
only
is
there
is
a
one
bedroom,
less
than
half
of
the
total
units
needed,
but
it's
far
less
than
half
of
the
people,
so
I
just
think.
J
M
Well
and
not
to
go
back
and
forth,
but
I
think
two
part
of
the
community
conversation
should
be
trying
to
eventually
look
ahead,
and
you
know
so
in
terms
of
folks,
like
Aging
in
place
and
folks
who
are
here,
who
are
one
bedrooms
like
a
there,
may
not
be
a
indicative
need,
for
you
know
one
bedrooms
over.
You
know
larger
families
or
as
big
of
a
need,
but
I
think
getting
ahead
of
that,
as
folks
are
staying
and
aging
in
place
like
I
mean.
M
Obviously
we
have
to
prioritize
right
now,
but
eventually
getting
to
a
place
where
we're
looking
at
Trends
with
our
population
and
getting
ahead
of
all
the
problems
with
housing.
L
I
M
L
Is
definitely
a
need,
but
that
we
serve
and
will
continue
to
serve
and
as
they
age
in
place
things
of
that
nature.
That's
what
we
see
as
our
need.
A
D
Margie's
question
earlier
about
advocacy,
fully
funding
the
housing
Choice
voucher
program
is
a
one
of
the
main
advocacy
planks
for
the
national,
low-income
housing
Coalition.
So,
if
you're
looking
for
somebody
to
get
on
board
with
to
try
to
boost
the
funding
of
this
they're,
the
they're,
the
folks
nationally,
who
are
doing
that
work.
A
A
H
K
A
Of
this
conversation
like
what
we
just
had
I
almost
like
this
conversation
was
had,
and
then
it's
in
light
of,
like
so
Council
Council
had
Retreat.
Last
week
there
was
some
discussion
of
an
idea
in
Council
to
discuss
the
possibility
of
redo,
of
putting
a
pause
on
Luigi
and
looking
at
designing,
like
a
benefits
table
so
with
so.
A
Share
that
with
like
the
as
the
lens
of
what
we're
looking
through
this,
how
much
time
we
want
to
spend
on
this,
because
I
also
think
this
value,
because
the.
H
A
J
A
H
K
I
Yeah
and
that's
how
you
were
framing
it,
you
know
there's
an
application
but
you're,
trying
to
think
of
it
more
as
a
broad
policy
and
I
you
make
it
akin
to
spot
zoning.
That's
this
is
policy,
it
is
general,
and
so
it
would
never
be
that
level
because
of
a
zoning
decision,
which
is
a
final
decision
or
recommendation
that's
going
to
go
to
council.
If,
for
anybody
doesn't
know
spotsonia
sort
of
picking
this
one
deciding
this
one
property
is
going
to
be
a
different
zoning
than
all
the
other
zoning
around
it,
and
it's
like.
I
A
H
D
I
mean
especially
since
we're
looking
at
this
out
I
mean
so
we're
doing
a
review
of
Luigi
policy
in
general.
This
piece
of
it
we're
being
asked
to
make
a
decision
on
or
make
a
recommendation
on
outside
of
the
timeline
for
that
larger
review.
It
does
look
like
you
know,
we're
trying
to
give
guidance
on
one
specific
component
policy
before
we
give
guidance
on
policy
in
order
for
hcd
to
make
a
ruling
on.
K
Us,
yes,
that's
true
and
I
think
that
when
Luigi,
if
it
continues
to
exist
when
it
gets
over,
if
it
gets
overhauled
or
re-looked
at
this,
could
also
still
be
included.
If
people
aren't
happy,
you
know
what
I
mean
it's
not
necessarily
a
permanent.
J
Because
of
this
application,
now
we're
one
piece
of
the
total
project
that
we
already
have
a
timeline
for
it.
It
is
that
perception
and
it
can
be
perceived
that
way,
even
though
we
know
we're
looking
at
this
in
the
whole,
the
way
public
perceptionists
go.
Look
at
this
life.
Oh
so
this
application
came
to
them.
Not
they
wanted
to
make
it.
So
when
I
my
application,
come
it's
go.
You
see
what
I'm
saying.
H
J
I
K
Almost
finished
the
Luigi
thing:
first:
okay,
let's
not
jump
around
too
much.
Let
me
guess
what
I
would
say
about
that
is
that
we've
been
struggling
for
this
for
a
while
this
application's
kind
of
been
on
the
books
for
six
months
because
of
committee
schedules
and
budget
process.
He
he
couldn't
go
forward
back
in
November
December,
so
that
was
no
fault
of
the
Developers.
K
But
I
have
wanted
some
guidance
and
some
help
looking
at
this,
and
so
that's
what
I'm
looking
to
you
all
for
and
council
did
direct
it
and
so
I
know
it
makes
you
uncomfortable.
But
it's
where
we
are
so
what
I
would
propose
and
I
think
you're
right.
You
know
our
brains
are
a
little
full
if
there
was
a
subset
of
this
committee,
that'd
be
willing
to
meet
and
I've
done
a
lot
of
thinking
about
this
and
some
writing
of
things.
K
You
could
recommend
that
micro
units,
under
a
certain
square
footage,
have
another
rent
line
right.
So
we've
got
a
one:
bedroom,
rent
efficiency,
rent
Maybe
I've
looked
months
ago,
I
scoured
HUD
for
micro
units.
It
doesn't
really
exist,
they
haven't
caught
up
to
that.
So
it's
inefficiency.
It
meets
the
definition
of
inefficiency.
We've
gone
through
the
voucher
requirements,
we've
gone
through
everything
that
it
does
meet.
K
Standards
like
it
does
qualify.
So
should
it
be
a
lower
rent
than
an
efficiency,
because
it's
so
small
I
don't
know:
should
it
get
a
percentage
less
of
taxes
back,
maybe,
and
and
also
we
could
look
at
and
I
talked.
We
talked
a
little
bit
about
this
before
the
meeting
and
it
may
not
be
good
science.
So
we
could
look
at
some
existing
micro
unit
projects
like
in
other
cities
and
look
at
I
did
look
at
the
Nashville
ones
and
the
rents
were
pretty
low.
The
rents
were
fitting
our
80
efficiency,
standard
and
I.
K
Don't
know
I,
don't
think
they
have
any
affordability
subsidy
because
that's
been
the
concern
like.
Are
we
subsidizing
something
where
they
could
charge
those
rents
anyway?
Right
so
I
think
that's
the
main
question
for
this
policy
like
how
do
we
make
sure
that
micro
unit
rents
are
truly
affordable
and
that
it's
a
correct
use
of
City
dollars?
That's
the
question
right
and
there's
a
bunch
of
ways
to
slice
and
dice
this
right.
K
So
I
talked
to
the
tax
assessor
for
other
things,
but
when
I
was
talking
to
him,
I
just
went
ahead
and
asked
I
was
like
how
would
this
be
assessed?
He
said:
well,
it
actually
might
be
assessed
higher.
It
might
have
actually
a
per
higher
per
unit
per
square
foot
rent
right
so
because
you
have
so
many
rents
or
you
have
231
units
on
a
half
an
acre
of
100..
K
So
you
are
going
to
have
this
income
stream
they're
looking
at
income
when
they
assess
so
the
assessed
interaction
might
be
pretty
high
compared
to
a
standard
Suburban
apartment
conference,
so
it
gets
complicated.
The
math
gets
very
complicated
and
I
would
love
a
group
of
people
to
maybe
meet
once
in
a
couple
weeks.
K
A
Just
feels
like
there's
I
mean
one
of
the
one
of
the
main
things
we're
talking
about.
Putting
on
a
workplace
is
looking
at
the
weed
standards
and
like
here
we're
being
asked
to
talk
about
one
specific
thing,
and
the
reason
why
we're
being
asked
to
talk
about
one
specific
thing
is
because
of
a
pending
application
when
I,
when
I
think
it
seems
like
that,
that's
where
it
feels
uncomfortable.
A
I
totally
agree,
especially
hearing
like
like
to
what
the
information
we
just
heard
now
I
think
is
one
of
the
biggest
things
of
how
we
should
try
to
be
adjust
like
that.
We,
as
a
committee
policy
committee,
can
take
into
our
mind,
is
like
how
we
look
at
adjusting
what
we're
asking
from
Luigi,
for
you
know,
or
or
whatever
policies
based
on
how
we
provide
more
voucher
or
Project
based
or
however,
we
want
to
refer
to
it,
but
yeah.
B
A
B
B
Clear-Cut
right
and
I
just
think
we're
kind
of
we
need
to
just
you
know,
go
ahead
and
deal
with
the
uncomfortableness
of
it
and
make
sure
we
comment
now
because
it's
kind
of
now
or
forever
hold
your
peace
and.
K
This
is
what
we
need.
We
need
units
for
with
vouchers,
accepting
all
20
of
the
units.
He'll
accept
vouchers,
that's
what
we
need,
so
it
was
really
interesting
and
he
made
a
very
strong
argument
in
terms
of
sustainability
and
density.
It's
location,
it's
right
near
the
transit
center
I
mean
there's
so
many
great
things
about
it.
The.
K
A
D
So
it
to
me
it
sounds
like
from
one
I've
heard,
there's
kind
of
two
questions
around
this.
One
is:
what's
the
marketability
right,
there
was
I
mean
I
mean
I've,
heard
Margie
articulate
you
know
we
have
a
different
population
than
Nashville
or
Seattle,
or
some
of
the
other
places
that
have
had
success
with
micro
units
and
so
one
thought
might
be.
You
know,
as
we
look
at
Luigi
and
if
you
look
at
this
particular
application,
is
it's
not
uncommon
to
require
a
developer
to
do
a
market
study?
D
You
know
in
an
application
process
and
that's
something
that
we
haven't.
We
don't
do
you
know
that
would
answer
the
question.
Is
there
you
know
looking
at
both.
D
Per
unit,
does
it
make
sense,
to
you
know,
give
a
200
and
something
square
foot
unit
the
same
level
of
subsidy
per
unit
as
we
would
have
800
square
foot,
Apartments
I.
J
C
C
A
G
A
H
A
We
don't
get,
you
know,
it's
always
been
told
us,
we
don't
reviews
individual
applications
right
and
we
don't
discuss
it.
We
don't
have
the
applicant
here
to
discuss
this,
but
essentially
we're
talking
about
a
policy
that
is
kind
of
revolving
around
a
specific
application
and
it's
kind
of
passed
us
back
from
aucd
like
well.
We
don't
feel,
basically,
they
didn't
feel
comfortable
voting
on
it.
So
they
asked
us
to
discuss
a
policy
I'm
like
now,
you're
you're,
basically
kind
of
asking
us
to
talk
about
a
specific
application.
G
J
J
Adventure
college
students
like
when
I
read
a
micro
I'm
like
these
college
students
who
got
UNCA.
We
got
the
colleges
around
here,
the
cop,
their
students
to
come
in
and
that's
what
registers
to
me
when
I
think
of
micro
unit,
because
I
don't
like
when
I
think
family
I
don't
see
that
being
like
efficient.
K
H
C
Maybe
if
we
put
the
cart
for
the
horse,
the
horses
will
come
because
if
we
build
something
like
this
and
we
have
it
available,
maybe
it
will
attract
more
the
younger
upwardly
mobile
or
the
younger
career
oriented
person.
That's
trying
to
to
work
at
a
bank
say-
and
you
know,
they've
got
some
money-
they're,
not
they're,
not
in
the
affordable
category,
but
they
are
don't
have
a
lot
of
money,
and
so
maybe
they
would.
This
would
work
for
them.
K
C
A
Kind
of
a
I
mean
it's
a
roommate
alternative.
There's
tons
tons
of
this
I
mean
tons
of
the
employees
downtown
the
service
industry's
hospitality.
They
can
only
afford
to
live
here
if
they're
living
in
apartments
or
rentals
with
three
to
four
roommates.
So
this
is
basically
an
alternative.
The
rent's
private
thing,
but.
A
A
Should
our
next
step
be
an
ad
hoc
committee
issue
should
the
do
we
have
consensus
about
that,
because
here
we
keep
talking
about,
we
need
more
housing
of
all
sides,
every
size,
big
units,
little
units,
and
here
we're
saying:
well,
maybe
we
don't
want
to
make
this
affordable
and
kind
of
as
counter
to
this
like
we
need,
we
need
everything.
We
need
everybody
to
think
Innovative.
So
maybe.
H
O
A
H
E
I
Do
advise
a
lot
of
boards,
sometimes
you're,
going
to
be
uncomfortable.
Well,
I
advise
historic,
Resources
Commission,
a
lot
of
those
people.
You're
picked
you're
picked
for
these
roles
because
you
have
some
connection
or
involvement
in
affordable
housing,
you're
likely
going
to
know
people
out
there,
but
I
say
to
somebody
on
HRC
just
because
the
neighbor
across
the
street
is
putting
you
know
it
has
a
proposal,
that's
not
a
reason
for
them
to
recuse
themselves.
Now.
I
Say
I'm
the
neighbor
across
the
street
I
just
want
everybody
to
know
that
and
ask
the
board.
Do
you
think
that's
a
conflict,
but
basically
then
it
you
just
have
just
as
much
duty
to
vote
as
you
do.
You
know
to
recuse
yourself
when
there's
an
actual
conflict
of
interest,
because
you
don't
want
to
just
I'm
not
comfortable
about
this,
so
I'm
going
to
not
vote.
That's
that's
not
a
role
of
committee
either
so,
but
only
one
I
hear
here
really
it
would
Chris
says,
and
you
know
there's
some
other
things.
K
N
J
But
see
I
guess
my
computer,
like
I,
understand
that
we
need
to
share
thoughts,
but
I'm,
like
I,
want
to
really
understand
it,
because
it's
a
new
thing
here.
So
it's
not
something
that
if
you're
not
a
developer
or
know
about
these
things,
these
units
and
other
places,
it's
not
something
that
I'm
gonna
be
familiar
with.
D
In
the
next
week
can
I
start
with
a
question
on
that
so
I'm
looking
back
the
way
this
is
worded
on
the
agenda
and
it
says
Luigi
policy
and
micro
units
policy
recommendation
for
micro
units
in
general
to
hcd.
So
are
we
just
to
make
sure
are?
We
is
the
question:
how
should
micro
units
be
weighted
within
the.
F
I
think
if
we
just
Define
what
a
micro
unit
is
all
kind
of
weigh
in
on
what
how
that
feels
right,
like
yeah
I,
agree,
definitely
because
it's
a
New
Concept
to
me
too,
or
it
was
like
a
month
ago
or
two
months
ago,
when
I
first
heard
of
it
so
yeah.
B
G
A
Let's
say
I'd
say
what
I
mean
we
have
10
minutes.
We
have
a
couple
other
things
and
I
think
this
is
I
mean
this
I
think
plays
into
this.
You
know
a
couple
of
these
other
bigger
questions.
We've
had
and
I
think
we
need
to.
We
basically
I
think
we
need
for
maybe,
if
we're
going
to
come
back
on
the
next
agenda,
then
we
need
a
little
bit
more
background
in
this
one.
So
it
sounds
like
we
will
need
we'll
want
to
know
exactly
kind
of
look
at
the.
A
B
C
K
B
A
Students
invited
everything
kind
of
in
writing.
Did
anyone?
Did
everyone
read
through
10
of
the
updates
that
were
provided?
Anyone
have
any
questions
anything
specific.
Do
you
want
to
point
out
Sasha.
K
H
M
K
You
any
tomes,
but
I
did
I,
did
put
in
here
just
to
point
out
some
links
to
City
council's
Retreat.
If
you
wanted
to
watch
that,
we
do
have
a
missing
middle
update
here
that
you
can
read
through
they
haven't
started
meeting
yet
Scott
Adams
is
your
rep
and
Emily's
the
alternate
for
that?
K
We
did
have
Housing
Trust
Fund
deadline
passed.
We
had
six
applications,
it
totals
5.7
million
and
272
units
in
those
applications.
We're
working
super
closely
with
the
county
for
the
applications
where
people
ask
for
money
from
both,
because
we've
had
this
situation,
where
the
county,
where
we
just
don't
know
what
the
county
is
going
to
do
and
then
they
look
to
us
to
fund
the
rest
or
you
know,
different
awkward
situations.
So
we're
trying
to
take
some
of
the
awkwardness
out
and
we
have
three
overlapping
tax
credit
applications.
K
K
Representative
yeah,
so
the
list
here
is
historic:
Resources,
Commission,
aias,
Architects,
AARP
I
think
we
all
know
who
that
is
Kayla.
It's
an
Aquila
Alum.
So
Kayla
is
the
city
of
Asheville
leadership,
Youth,
Academy,
I
think
that's
right
and
they're
really
awesome
students
that
that
we
have
a
program
for,
and
so
it's
actually
somebody
who's
an
Alum
of
that
program.
So
it's
kind
of
getting
at
a
younger
person's
perspective,
lnc,
Legacy,
neighborhood,
Coalition
and
that's
Burton,
Street
Emma,
South
Side
I,
think
is
joining
East
End
Valley
Street
Shiloh.
K
Thank
you
ahac,
you
all
say,
see
sustainability
advisory
committee
on
energy
in
the
environment,
which
is
another
City,
Board
Planning
and
Zoning
commission
can
Coalition
of
Asheville
neighborhoods,
which
is
a
private
non-profit
and
then
Knack
is
a
city
council
aboard
city
council
appointed
commission
neighborhood
advisory
committee.
K
So
the
neighborhoods
do
have
three
kind
of
seats
here,
but
for
this
thing
to
actually
be
successful,
I
think
the
neighborhoods
have
to
be
really
involved.
Otherwise
it
won't
happen
in
the
chamber
and
Mountain.
True,
any
other
questions
and
Ada
is
having
an
event.
I
see.
Well,
it's
not
for
a
while,
yet
but
they're
bringing
up
to
coast
and
they're,
giving
a
presentation
to
the
community.
So
it's
not
a
city
sponsored
event,
but
it's
kind
of
almost
like
a
kickoff
presentation
in
a
way
to
educate
folks
about
what
missing
metal
is.
K
Build
and
connect
is
there
what
else
I
will
say
and
there's
some
cdbg
and
home
thing
updates
here
that
process?
That's
what
Nikki
had
to
leave
to
go
to
the
to
a
meeting
and
here's
the
I
put
some
links
here
to
the
city
council,
Retreat
items:
I
am
working
on
an
RFP
for
this
affordable
housing
plan,
I
still
I
didn't
I
was
hoping
to
have
it
for
you
today
and
I've
got
four
folks
who
generously
volunteered
to
look
at
it,
so
I
still
need
to
get
them
a
draft.
K
C
K
H
A
I
H
A
H
A
B
A
There
is
the
difference
between
the
legal
part
and
the
Optics
part,
trying
to
make
sure
that
the
chair
in
particular
can
lead
that
way
and
I.
You
know:
I
use
this
example
for
years,
like
being
the
chair
I've,
never
to
make
sure
that
I
kept
clear
of
this
I've,
never
applied
for
city
funding
and
and
I
purposely
have
not
done
that,
because
I
thought
well,
I
don't
want
any
Optics
of
it.
So.
D
Yeah
and
my
I
mean
my
specific
question
around
the
leadership
roles
and
we'll
just
we'll
just
keep
using
the
same
example,
because
it's
so
professional
when
it's
mine,
let's
say
Chris,
was
the
chair
and
you
know
it
wasn't
a
matter
of
accusing
himself
in
a
vote
in
this
situation.
B
D
K
D
I
It
because
it's
even
once
removed
I
would
say
from
a
clear
conflict
of
interest.
It's
I
think
that
that
would
come
up
in
the
context
of
the
overall
committee
calling
the
chair
or
the
the
co-chair
and
saying
we're
not
following
we
have
a.
We
have
a
mission.
We
are
supposed
to
look
at
policy.
We're
supposed
to
look
at
this
I,
don't
even
know
how
often
you
make
recommendations
on
Direct
funding
decisions.
I
I
didn't
think
you
did
so
if
you,
if
this
body
starts
to
feel
like
the
chair,
is
not
going
in
the
right
direction
and
I've
seen
some
commissions
where
the
members
are
not
happy
with
the
What
the
how
the
chair
is
running
it,
then
you
will
know
it
and
I
think
that
I,
don't
everybody
seems
to
be
pretty
strong,
have
strong
opinions
and
be
willing
to
participate.
So
I
don't
know
that
you'd
have
a
situation.
I
H
I
I,
don't
I,
don't
know
how
I
don't
I
wouldn't
want
that
kind
of
thinking
to
hamstring
you
from
going
ahead
and
making
a
decision.
I
know
why
you
want
to
go
down
the
root
of
the
co-chair,
because
it
sounds
like
you're
when
I
went
to
your
one
meeting
I'm
like
I,
think
you're
the
most
active
chairs
I
ever
heard
of,
but
that,
if
that's,
what
you've
defined
as
your
role
and
the
expectations
of
this
committee,
that's
great
so
I
was
really
just
going
to
try
to
focus
on
I.
I
Believe
your
rules
of
procedure
have
what
is
a
conflict
of
interest
under
the
statutes.
I
can
read
it
again,
but
Sasha
did
a
good
job
of
saying
it
and
then,
when
it's
an
appearance
of
a
conflict,
I
think
I
heard
somebody
here.
Let
me
just
just
read
the
actual
conflict,
and
this
is
from
160d
109.
This
is
for
planning
commissions
or
governing
bodies.
I
Making
recommendations
on
planning
related
matters,
so
members
of
appointed
board
shall
not
vote
on
any
advisory
matter
where
the
outcome
of
the
matter
being
considered
is
reasonably
likely
to
have
a
direct,
substantial
and
readily
identifiable
Financial
impact.
On
the
member,
and
then
it
goes
on
if
you're
doing
a
zoning
decision,
you
also
can't
be
a
person
who
the
member
has
a
close,
familial
business
or
other
associational
relationship
which,
having
to
be
over
somebody
I,
don't
think
would
fall
into
that.
I
J
I
You
work
for
a
non-profit,
but
it's
if
it
was
say
it
was
Andy's
project
and
again
I,
don't
know
how
often
you're
advising
on
particular
projects
and
I
and
now
I
kind
of
understand
why
this
became
a
concern.
But
I
was,
if
it
got
on
the
agenda.
I
would
hope
the
rest
of
the
body
would
say
why
do
you
keep
putting
their
own
projects
on
the
agenda,
but
even
if
they
did,
you
wouldn't
be
able
to
vote
on
it,
because
you're
involved
in
that
particular
project
and
somebody
could
say
or
even
Chris
is
the
engineer.
J
I
think
I
think
what
the
concern
was.
Royal
perception
was
mainly
because,
like
we
have
some
great
Developers
and
so
and
they
might
want
if
they
were
to
become
co-chairs
or
chair-
and
we
are
voting
on
policy
because
I,
don't
I,
know
we've
seen
project
list,
but
we
haven't
like
seen
like
actual
projects
and
voted
on
projects,
and
so
but
we
do
vote
on
the
policies.
H
K
J
J
I
I
think
that's
just
the
struggle
of
being
on
the
commission
and
when
it
starts
to
feel
that
fuzzy
kind
of
like
this
might
be
perceived
as
I,
don't
think
it's
a
real
conflict.
You
can
always
any
commission
member
can
contact
Sasha
and
say:
can
you
run
this
by
legal
or
and
usually
the
way
it's
handled?
And
somebody
here
said
it
is
that
somebody's
like
I'm
not
comfortable
with
this
but
I'm
just
going
to
go
ahead
and
I'm
going
to
say
I
used
to
work
for
this
company.
I
That's
now
proposing
Michael
units
and
I
and
and
but
I
feel
I
could
still
make
a
fair
and
partial
decision.
In
fact,
I
think
I
I
know
something
about
micro
unit
development.
Now
that
could
help
this
Commission
and
then,
if
somebody
onto
the
commission,
they
re
so
your
your
divulging
that
you're
disclosing
that,
then
the
commission
can
always
say.
I
No,
that
is
a
conflict
and
you
vote
and
say
sorry.
We
think
you
should
recuse
yourself
or
that's
when
you
get
the
person
in
the
public
hearing.
So
you
have
saying
what
you
know:
don't
do
that
so
I
think
some
of
what
you're
concerned
is
what
I'm
hearing
is
further
on
down
the
line.
Is
somebody
learns
something
from
being
on
this
commission,
which
is
a
public
commission
that
somehow
later
on,
they
were
able
to
benefit
from,
but
that's
a
policy
decision.
I
The
other
thing
you
know
I
advise
the
riverfront
Redevelopment
commission
and
there
are
questions
around
conflict.
Those
members
are
picked
because
they
own
property
in
that
group,
Arts
District,
and
so
anybody
could
say
when
they
were
talking
about
doing
form-based.
Only
somebody
could
say
well,
you're
just
voting
that
way
because
you
own
it
down
there
and
you
want
it
zoned
that
way,
but
it's
like,
but
you're,
also
on
the
body,
because
you
had
that
interest
and
you
have
that
sort
of.
I
Maybe
somebody
might
view
it
as
Insider
something,
but
you
have
that
they
were
picked
so
that
they
had
some
knowledge
about
that,
just
like
you're
all
picked,
because
you
have
knowledge
about
affordable
housing.
So,
if
that
helps
you
at
all,
I
do
I
have
so
I've
been
here
12
years
and
I
advise
planning
zoning
commission
every
month,
I'm
there
historic,
Resources
Commission
every
month,
that's
quasi-judicial!
It's
a
higher
conflict
of
interest
standard,
even
higher.
I
You
know
other
just
other
commissions
from
time
to
time.
If
you
have
conflict
of
interest
and
most
times
when
somebody
calls
and
says
it's
not
an
actual
but
I'm
not
comfortable
with
it,
I'll
say
I
would
just
divulge
that
I
would
just
disclose
it
and
see
what
the
rest
of
your
body
says.
Because,
again
with
that
in
mind,
you
have
a
duty
to
vote
on
things
that
might
be
uncomfortable
too.
K
Just
to
reiterate
like
so,
but
you
are
again
that
your
advisory
so
you're,
never
the
final
stop
for
any
of
these
policy
decisions.
It's
really
council's
policy,
I
mean,
and
so
that's
one
thing
and
I
think
the
second
thing
Andy
I,
don't
know
if
you
you
just
may
have
a
discomfort
because
you're
an
executive
director
of
a
non-profit
that
does
receive
city
funding
and
I
and
I,
don't
know
if
that's
it
or
not
and
I
guess
that
would
be
a
question
to
you.
Is
that
that's
not
raised
any
red
flags.
I
You
know,
there's
going
to
be
policy,
give
up
and
it
you
know.
Hcd
is
often
heard
from
habitat,
MHO
and
Homeward
Bound
with
input
on
what
you're
experiencing
out
there.
We
need
down
payment
assistance.
You
know
you
do
different
policies
that
can
only
come
from
the
people
that
are
doing
the
work
so
but
I
think
it's
coming
down
to
that
final
vote.
I,
you
know
sometimes
even
having
a
discussion
really
if
it's
policy
not
a
particular
project
it
it
would
be.
I
Okay
to
you
know
in
some
cases
for
Chris
to
say,
I
used
to
work.
I
worked
on
a
micro
housing
project
and
these
are
the
in
the
past.
It's
the
difficulties
in
these
particular
projects,
because
it's
got
to
be
high
rise
right,
so
more
expensive
in
some
ways,
even
though
they're
littler
units
so
does
that.
A
H
A
H
A
J
A
Recommendation
would
be
good
because
we
can't
vote
because,
maybe
for
why
don't
each
task
force
nominate
who
they
think
would
be
like
from
build
like
a
dominate?
This
would
be
who
we
think
for
the
build
the
you
connect,
get
together,
recommend
and
then
we
vote.
We
can
you
know.
In
other
words,
then
we
can
vote
on
like
these
are.
These
are
who
we've
collectively
kind
of
company,
because
that
way,
you're
representing
the
different
kind
of
two
different
interests
that
we
of
a
committee
has
already
kind
of
identified.
H
G
A
How
do
we
know
who
these
people
are
to
get
to
the
you
know
to
try
to
bring
them
together
and
now,
we've
created
we've
said
we're
going
to
do
co-chairs
so
that
allows
that
it
allows
the
chair
collectively
to
have
a
balanced
Viewpoint,
and
so
maybe
we
look,
you
know,
look
at
in
denominations
like
oh,
who
might
come
out
of
this
like
that,
could
come
from
you
know
you
guys
get
together
and
say:
hey
we
think
this
or
this
should
be
and
then
we'll
get
together.
We
think
yeah.
K
A
I
J
E
I
always
thought
if
somebody
did
have
to
accuse
them
chair
that
you've
got
because
I
have
some
bodies.
I
have
Vice
chair
chair
second
or
third
last
year.
You
know
so
yeah.
It's
up
to
you,
I
guess
how
you're
going
to
structure
that?
But
if
you
leave
it
as
an
option,
can
you
rule
the
procedure,
but
then
each
time
you
have
to
decide
what
you've
been
voting
them.
So
I
didn't
know
to
nominate
okay.