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From YouTube: Planning and Zoning Commission – January 4, 2023
Description
Regular meeting of the City of Asheville Planning & Zoning Commission.
Access the agenda and other meeting materials at the City of Asheville website: https://www.ashevillenc.gov/department/city-clerk/boards-and-commissions/planning-and-zoning-commission/
Participate before and during the meeting on our public engagement hub: https://publicinput.com/G0704
B
C
You
everyone,
sorry
for
the
slight
delay
there,
but
welcome
to
the
first
PMZ
meeting
of
2023
Wednesday
January
4th.
We
will
begin
this
evening's
meeting
with
roll
call,
Mr
Okla,
Cheney,
chair.
C
Abbreviated
schedule
this
evening
we
will
be
having
a
presentation
and
then
we're
also
at
the
end
of
the
or
towards
the
end
of
the
meeting.
We're
going
to
be
doing
some
kind
of
commission
work,
discussion
about
annual
report
and
future
Retreat
first
thing
on
the
agenda,
though,
is
the
approval
of
the
minutes
from
the
December
7th
2022
meeting.
Is
there
any
discussion
about
those
minutes,
any
comments
or
anything.
C
You
second,
okay,
we
have
a
motion
in
the
second,
all
those
in
favor
say:
aye
aye
any
opposed
passes.
C
So
the
next
item
on
our
agenda
is,
we
were
have
a
presentation
from
Buncombe
County
Planning
staff
on
the
Buncombe
County
cup
plan.
The
2043
comp
plan
project
that
is
ongoing,
I
see
Nathan
Pennington
is
in
the
audience
and
I'm
guessing
that
is
Jillian
Phillips.
So,
if
you'd
like
to
come
up.
H
Okay
got
you
good
evening,
chair
and
Commissioners
and
members
of
the
public
we
are
thrilled
to
be
here
today
we
took
a
little
bit
of
a
different
approach,
more
of
a
regional
approach,
with
this
particular
comprehensive
plan.
We're
going
to
divide
this
in
half
and
I'm
going
to
appear
and
do
the
the
latter
slides
and
talk
a
little
bit
about
regionalism
and
intersections
of
where
both
Asheville
and
the
county
can
work
together
and
with
that
being
said,
I'm
going
to
let
Jillian
take
off
and
do
the
first
part
of
the
presentation.
J
So
good
evening,
everybody,
my
name,
is
Jillian
Phillips
I'm,
the
long
range
planning
division
manager
for
the
county,
and
we
have
been
working
on
the
County's
first,
what
we're
calling
wholesome,
comprehensive
plan?
The
county
has
had
land
use
plans,
we've
had
sustainable
sustainability
plans,
but
this
is
really.
Our
first
covers
a
wide
variety
of
issues,
comprehensive
plan.
J
It
was
created
by
the
county
in
partnership
with
the
community
as
a
guide
for
addressing
future
challenges
and
opportunities.
It's
a
broad
long-range
planning
tool.
It
looks
at
the
relationship
between
land
use,
environment,
infrastructure
and
community
services
and
amenities,
and
it
outlines
policy,
guidance
and
specific
actions
to
work
towards
our
goals.
J
So,
just
for
you,
guys
and
I
know
you
all
know,
because
you're
on
the
Asheville
Planning
Commission,
a
comprehensive
plan
is
a
is
part
of
a
continuous
cycle
of
planning
activities
undertaken
by
a
local
government.
This
creates
our
long-range
Vision,
upon
which
short-term
priorities
in
planning
and
budgeting
can
be
drawn
for
drawn
from,
and
it
will
be
evaluated
periodically
to
determine
whether
updates
are
needed.
J
So,
just
to
give
you
an
idea
of
the
process
we
started,
we
started
in
Fall
2021,
we
got
a
little
coven
made
it
a
little
longer
process
than
we
wanted
it,
but
we've
been
through.
We
are
through
the
third
phase.
We
launched
the
project,
we
established
the
vision
and
goals
and
now
we're
on
coming
out
of
phase
three
into
phase
four:
the
adoption
of
the
plans.
J
So,
just
a
little
note
about
public
engagement,
we
we've
had
about
2
900
responses
to
our
activities.
We've
had
three
sets
of
activities
we're
on
that
third
Activity
Set
we've
had
about
a
hundred
and
thirty
thousand
individual
comments
regarding
the
stuff
we've
put
out,
and
we
have
tried
really
really
hard
to
make
sure
that
the
communities
that
are
not
usually
heard
in
Buncombe
County
and
aren't
involved
in
this
process
have
been
involved.
We've
tried
to
reach
our
rural
community
so
like
Sandy
mosh
Fairview
out
in
barnardsville,
we've
tried
to
specifically
do
Outreach
to
them.
J
So
and
any
of
that
input
we
received
from
kids,
we
put
it,
we
put
it
feedback
into
the
overall
input
for
the
project,
so
one
of
the
really
fun
kids
projects
we
did
is
throughout
this
whole
process.
We've
done
a
kids
postcard
project
and
we
asked
kids
what
they
want.
Buncombe
County
to
be
like
in
the
future,
and
we
got
some
really
great
answers
and
we
got
some
really
smart
answers.
So
you
can
see.
J
Elliott
wants
more
small
ponds
and
places
for
rain
water
to
go,
and
you
can
see
on
the
other
end,
I
think
it
was.
Juliet
really
wants
dragons
and
alien
spaceships,
so
a
range
of
stuff,
but
some
really
good
input
from
the
kids.
The
kids
are
paying
attention,
they're
intelligent
and
they
they
provide
us
with
lots
of
great
input.
I
will
say
from
a
Parks
and
Rec
perspective.
All
the
kids
wanted
swimming
pool
steps.
Every
kid
wanted
a
swimming
pool
so
how
we
sort
of
formatted
this
plan
is.
J
J
So,
plan
component
we
have
Vision
themes,
that's
the
highest
level
of
the
plan
framework.
It's
into
it's
intended
to
spread
Express,
ideal
aspirations
for
what
the
county
is
going
to
look
like
in
20
years
goals
or
desired
outcomes
related
to
the
planning
topics.
Policies
are
statements
of
commitment
and
direction
towards
achieving
the
plan.
Goals
and
actions
are
a
specific
implementation
tests.
J
So
there
are
lots
of
gold
policies
and
actions.
I
sent
you
guys
are
very
large,
100
200
Page
document,
but
I
just
wanted
to
sort
of
point
one
out
to
you
as
sort
of
how
it
crosses
over
into
that
regionalism
and
working
with
other
jurisdictions.
So
you
see
our
growth,
equity
and
conservation
goal.
One
of
the
policies
within
that
growth,
Equity
is
and
conservation
goal,
is
to
promote
multiple
jurisdictional
planning,
collaboration
and
information
sharing
and
then
a
specific
action
is
coordinate.
Information
sharing
and
Joint
decision
making
with
neighboring
jurisdictions.
J
So
just
a
few
things
to
sort
of
I
wanted
to
point
out
to
you
guys
as
a
Planning
Commission.
The
first
thing
is,
you
have
in
within
the
city
of
Asheville
your
legacy.
Neighborhood
groups.
We
really
wanted
to
look
at
Equity.
We
really
wanted
to
make
sure
we
were
addressing
Equity
throughout
the
plan.
What
we
found
is
it's
more
because
we
are
geographically
more
spread
out.
Our
population
is
more
spread
out.
J
We
equity
in
the
county.
Look
Equity
concern
areas
in
the
county,
look
different,
so
this
is
our
community
index
map
and
it
takes
the
data
that
the
CDC
tracks,
which
is
presence
of
high
poverty
areas,
medium
household
income,
households
that
are
food,
insecure,
so
on
and
so
forth,
and
it
creates
an
index,
and
it
shows
you
where,
in
the
county,
those
areas
where
our
vulnerable
populations
are
so
you
can
see
if
any
of
you
are
familiar
with
Sandy
mush
out
in
that
corner
of
the
county.
J
J
So
as
part
when
we're
talking
about
land
use
decisions
and
using
the
comp
plan
as
a
tool
for
land
use
decisions,
we
decided
to
take
a
really
broad
approach
and
part
of
the
plan
is
that
we've
created
an
equity
analysis
tool.
It's
based
on
work,
our
equity
and
inclusion
work
group
in
the
county
did,
but
it
is
a
call
to
the
planning
department
and
the
Board
of
Commissioners
in
the
planning
board
to
look
at
Equity
when
we're
making
land
use
decisions
So
within
the
plan.
J
There
are
these
series
of
questions,
and
now
you
will
see
in
our
staff
reports.
If
the
plan
gets
gets
adopted,
you
will
see
a
specific
equity
Equity
section
where
we're
looking
at
that
community
community
map
and
then
we're
looking
at
the
equity
analysis
tool
and
where
we're
talking
about
Equity
within
any
sort
of
document.
That's
talking
about
land
use,
so
that
might
be
a
text
Amendment,
but
that
also,
where
you'd
see
it
most
often
would
be
Board
of
adjustment
and
our
map
amendments.
Okay,.
J
So
this
is,
you,
guys,
probably
have
had
a
future
land
use
map
for
a
really
long
time
the
county
has
not.
This
is
our
first
sort
of
future
land
use
plan
map.
I
wanted
to
put
this
up
on
the
board,
for
you
and
sort
of
show
you
how
the
different
categories
work
and
how
they
look
different.
So
we
have,
if
you
want
to
think
of
it
as
intensity
of
use.
J
Then
we
have
our
conservation
land
uses,
and
so
those
are
areas
that
either
we
want
to
try
to
maintain
the
rural
character
of
those
areas
or
we
really
want
to
focus
on
conservation
within
those
areas.
So
those
are
the
green
areas
and
I
will
say
to
you
guys
a
lot
of
what
how
growth,
how
we
thought
about
growth
when
we
were
coming
up
with
this
map
is,
if
you
get
out
into
the
county
you
we
don't
have
a
left
flat
land.
J
We
do
not
have
sewer
or
water
service
so
that
really
constrains
where
growth
can
go.
So
those
areas
that
are
growth,
oriented
land
uses.
Those
are
the
areas
that
are
outside
our
steep
slopes,
have
access
to
Water
and
Sewer,
or
on
major
transportation
corridors.
H
So
this
map,
particularly,
is
one
I
like
to
show
folks,
because,
particularly
for
the
folks
that
continue
to
move
here,
it's
very
shocking.
You
know,
I
tell
the
story
about
the
guy
in
barnardsville.
H
That
called
me
up,
and
he
said:
hey
just
wanted
to
let
you
know
I
just
moved
here
from
New
York,
and
when
are
you
going
to
turn
my
sewer
on
who
do
I
call
this
happens
every
day
it
is
the
most
common
call
we
get
is
Where's
my
water
Where's,
my
sewer,
some
people
even
buy
homes
and
don't
even
know
they're
on
a
well.
We've
got
a
lot
of
folks
that
live
in
areas
of
the
county
that
are
sort
of
saddled
with
this
private
infrastructure,
meaning
well
in
septic
systems.
H
I've
got
another
heat
map.
I
can
show
you
out
in
the
Candler
area
that
shows
complaints
that
we've
received
due
to
failing
septic
systems.
So
this
will
really
burned
this
map
into
your
head,
because
these
are
just
properties
that
are
within
proximity
to
Water
and
Sewer.
We
have
some
people
that
are
on
water,
no
super.
Some
people
are
on
sewer,
no
water,
some
people
that
are
fortunate
enough
to
have
both
one
thing
I
like
to
tell
is:
did
you
all
know
that
Ridgecrest
is
an
actual
Municipal
Water
provider?
H
H
A
lot
of
people
don't
know
that.
So.
Needless
to
say,
infrastructure
in
this
county
is
very
complicated
and
layered,
and
it
is
the
basis
of
everything
that
you're
getting
ready
to
see.
So
what
else
we
got
going
on
here?
Oh,
we
got
a
lot
going
on.
So
this
is
a
constraints
map
and,
as
you
can
see,
we've
got
the
Blue
Ridge
Parkway,
which
we're
fortunate
enough
to
have,
and
we've
got
National
Forest,
and
we
have
very
good,
steep
soap
and
protected
Ridge
ordinance.
It
doesn't
really
matter
what
side
of
the
aisle
you're
on.
H
We
all
think
that
we
can
get
behind
protecting
our
steep
slopes
and
protected
ridges.
They
are
what
defines
us
and
in
order
to
do
that,
and
if
you
look
specifically
at
those
blue
areas
floodplain,
so
it's
very
delicate
balance
and
why
it's
so
important
to
have
that
feature.
Land
use
map
like
the
city
has
as
well,
because
it
helps
manage
expectations.
H
So
if
we
want
to
preserve
lands,
we
have
to
Define
where
we
want
to
develop
plants.
So
it's
it's
very
important
for
us
to
have
gone
in
this
direction
to
to
to
have
that
map
so
that
we
can
manage
the
expectations
of
all
the
other
thing.
I
really
wanted
to
talk
to
you
all
about
are
and
and
we've
we
talked
about
for
years.
H
What
are
the
different
ways
in
which
the
city
and
and
the
county
can
work
together?
Not
just
the
city,
not
not
just
the
county,
but
given
the
fact
that
we
are
popular
and
often
say
that
you
know
we
don't
have
a
popularity
problem.
We
have
a
popularity
problem,
it's
not
a
conversation
that
needs
to
be
had
with
just
Todd
about
hey.
What
are
you
going
to
do
in
Asheville
or
NATO?
What
are
you
going
to
do
in
Buncombe
County?
H
It's
a
conversation
where
we
all
have
to
come
together
on
topics
where
we
can
talk
about
things
like
Silo
deconstruction.
You
know
for
years
we
heard
well,
the
county
doesn't
build
roads,
that's
ncdot
or
we
don't
do
sewer,
that's
MSD,
but
it's
actually
an
organism
and
it's
actually
to
the
level
of
of
making
sure
that
that
our
energy
providers
are
are
involved.
H
H
This
brings
about
an
important
conversation
about
urban
and
rural
levels
of
service.
That
term
exactions
up
there
talks
about
things
that
the
county
may
not
have
been
doing
in
the
past
that
we
need
to
get
into
the
business
of
doing
in
the
future.
It's
no
surprise
that
two
municipalities
in
the
county
lost
their
etjs
in
2013
and
2014,
Asheville
and
Weaverville.
H
Those
came
into
the
county,
for
they
have
different
characteristics
than
the
rest
of
the
county.
They're
more
urban
you've
got
areas
where
people
are
like
hey.
Why
do
I
have
a
sidewalk
here
and
not
next
door,
only
to
find
another
piece
of
sidewalk
next
door
to
that?
Well,
that's
because
Asheville
had
standards
in
their
etj
and
they
rightly
enforced
them
when
they
have
that
etj
intact,
the
County's
never
been
in
the
sidewalk
building
business.
A
lot
of
counties
are
not
we're
considering
that
in
the
future.
H
Obviously
you
want
to
provide
more
urban
safety
amenities
in
those
areas
that
are
urbanizing.
One
area
in
particular
and
I
know
a
lot
of
you
I'm
going
to
call
out
Jeffrey
here
is
our
work
you're,
seeing
Swannanoa
and
other
areas
on
Transportation
corridors
urbanizing.
So
we
want
to
make
sure
we
do
that
right.
So,
for
instance,
I
want
to
call
out
East,
Haven
and
I
want
to
call
out
another
development
that
took
advantage
of
one
of
our
density.
Bonus
programs
I
was
told
we're
not
getting
sidewalk
out
of
here.
H
Stop
even
asking
about
it,
but
I'm
pleased
to
announce
that,
with
the
work
of
groups
like
MHO
coordination
within
a
DOT,
Dogwood
Health,
Trust
And,
even
Ingles,
they
built
a
sidewalk
from
the
English
store
and
we
have
sidewalk
connection
with
a
crosswalk
across
U.S
70,
that's
intact
and
it
works
and
it
functions
and
people
are
now
getting
safely
to
the
grocery
store.
Other
exactions
to
consider
that
are
Ultra
important
in
our
area
are
things
like
the
Fanta
Flora
State
trail,
which
is
a
state
designated
Trail.
There's
just
no
money
to
build
it.
H
We
need
to
be
very
careful
about
making
sure
we
have
the
land
Acquisitions
in
place
to
make
that
happen,
so
we
can
go
from
Asheville
all
the
way
into
like
James,
eventually,
one
day
we'll
get
there,
infrastructure
resilience
and
capacity
I
put
that
in
there
just
because
we
are
actively
having
conversations
about
what
the
future
holds
for
areas
of
the
county.
That
can
be
Seward
with
gravity,
and
we
have
done
some
presentations
to
the
Commissioners
so
far
and
throughout
the
community
about
what
that
could
look
like
and
transportation.
H
Some
people
don't
know
that
the
county
operates
the
mountain
Mobility
system,
and
we
do
that
in
tandem
with
the
with
the
city
of
Asheville.
We
also
do
it
in
tandem
with
some
of
the
surrounding
counties
as
well,
and
we
all
know
too
that
we
have
an
affordable
housing
issue
and
that
is
creating
push-pull
effects,
so
people
having
to
live
outside
of
Buncombe
that
work
within
bunkum
every
day
and
finally,
concurrency
management,
one
of
the
things
that,
while
the
general
assembly
and
the
statutes
don't
specifically
provide
for
it
in
this
state.
What
does
that
mean?
H
The
joke?
Is
it's
the
big
fancy
word?
Well,
no,
it's
very
important
because
it
means
that
making
sure
that
we
plan
for
enough
Public,
Safety
enough
EMS
bases
enough
Hospital
enough
school
for
every
area
of
the
county.
It
kind
of
gets
back
to
that
bigger
Equity
question.
Some
states
are
very
much
more
robust
in
their
concurrency
management,
but
I
I
feel
like
there's
enough
there
that
we
can
take
those
kind
of
things
into
consideration.
H
H
As
we
continue
to
urbanize.
We
will
probably
consider
what
what
amenities
and
what
levels
of
service
we
need
to
provide
in
those
areas
as
well.
We
do
not
foresee
any
sort
of
abatement
in
terms
of
growth.
I
mean
people
will
continue
to
move
here
and
ultimately,
at
the
end
of
the
day.
That
means
we
need
to
embrace
density,
better.
H
J
They
will
finish
this
month.
Our
public
input
opportunity
last
one
that
review
of
the
draft
public
plan
is
started
on
December
15th
it'll
run
through
February
13th,
we'll
have
a
joint
work
session,
with
planning
board
and
Board
of
Commissioners
in
April
2023,
and
then
we'll
have
both
the
planning
board
and
the
board
of
commissioner
hearings
for
adoption
in
May
2023,
and
at
this
point
we'll
just
ask
for,
if
you
guys
have
any
questions.
C
H
One
thing
I
was
going
to
mention
too
after
the
etj
of
Asheville
was
abolished,
there's
still
two
County
appointments,
Brinton
I
believe
you're,
one
of
them
for
the
county
and
the
former
atj,
and
who
is
my
other.
C
H
So,
just
even
though
the
etj
was
boss
to
John
assembly
was
very
specific
that
there's
still
two
so
I
just
wanted
to
kind
of
explain
the
background.
K
K
So
I
really
I
know
it's
been
a
lot
of
hours
on
County
staff
time,
but
the
quantity
of
opportunities
to
provide
input
is
has
been
really
amazing
for
your
process
and
and
looking
at
the
draft
Planet,
you
know,
I
think
the
theme
of
equity
being
woven
throughout
is
is
really
admirable
and
I
think
that
it's
a
reflection
of
the
county
listening
and
kind
of
reflecting
you
know
the
vision
for
the
future.
So
I
really
appreciate
kind
of
the
details
that
you
walked
through
and
the
framework
this
provides.
It's
really
exciting
document.
Thank
you.
F
Yeah,
thank
you.
Alfred
I
mean
there
was
a
lot
of
hard
work
and
I
know
I'm
about
to
see
the
world
and
soon
to
get
theirs.
It
can
be
frustrating,
but
I
mean
thank
y'all
for
I
guess,
moving
forward
in
the
right
direction.
C
Actually,
that
was
going
to
be
I'll
jump
off
of
what
commissioner
Hope
just
mentioned.
Is
there
and
I
realize
this?
Is
a
you
know,
I
I,
guess
I
shouldn't,
say
loaded
question
but
impossible
to
answer
at
this
moment
question,
but
have
there
been
at
least
the
inklings
that
MSD
needs
to
expand,
which
I
realize,
or
at
least
my
small
understanding?
Is
it
can't
really
expand,
but
like
could
there
be
Regional
sewer
plants
like?
Has
that
even
been?
Oh?
Yes,
maybe,
but
we
got
to
show
that
because
that's
just
way
too
down
radical.
H
No,
that's
a
fair
question,
it's
a
very
important
question
and
what
I
have
to
explain
to
a
lot
of
folks
that
move
here
is
the
French
Broad
River
moves
from
the
south
to
the
north,
so
when
I
say
Downstream
to
them,
it's
hard
for
them
to
understand
that
the
MSD
treatment
plan
resides
in
Woodfin
yeah
capacity,
wise
about
50
percent.
H
So
once
a
lot
of
those
went
offline,
the
trend
now,
of
course,
another
important
theme
of
the
comprehensive
plan
is
economic
diversification
and
we're
seeing
a
lot
more
specialized,
manufacturing
and
you're.
Seeing
that
with
you
know,
like
GE
and
Pratt
Whitney,
we
went
through
a
brewery
boom.
You
know
so
we're
starting
to
see
a
lot
of
transition.
There.
Msd
is
somewhat
hamstrung
in
their
ability.
They
have
a
very
similar
policy
to
what
the
water
providers
have
and
that
is
they
don't
speculatively
extend
lines
now.
H
What
that
could
look
like
in
the
future
is
a
combination
of
any
number
of
things
we
don't
know
exactly.
We
don't
have
all
the
fine
details
yet
on
the
federal
infrastructure
bill.
I
can
tell
you
that
that
there
are
are
three
sort
of
plans
that
make
the
most
sense
from
a
gravity
perspective.
One
is
Candler,
two
is
sort
of
North
Weaverville
Leicester,
Highway
area,
and
the
third
is
a
little
more
tricky
and
that's
going
to
be
down.
Charlotte
Highway
and,
interestingly
enough
MSD,
as
a
system
has
become
a
true
Regional
system.
H
Now
we've
picked
up
the
Cane
Creek
area
to
the
South
and
Henderson
and
I'm,
actually
one
of
the
county
Representatives
on
the
MSD
board.
So
in
terms
of
what
that
looks
like,
there
is
a
lot
of
work
and
very
important
work
in
that
specific
area,
because
if
you
build
it,
ultimately
they
will
come
in
terms
of
the
Smoky
Park
Corridor
that
is
basically
kind
of
the
last
Transportation
Corridor.
That's
unlocked.
I
will
tell
you
that
if
that
is
ever
built,
it
can
serve
all
the
way
to
Haywood
County
because
of
the
drainage
basin.
H
Beyond
that
there
could
be
things
like
special
assessments.
The
county
has
to
be
a
partner
on
that,
because
MSD
is
sort
of
hamstrung
in
their
specific
enabling
legislation
that
they
have
from
the
state
in
terms
of
water
water
lines
and
we're
not
even
going
to
get
into
the
history
of
all
the
water
history
in
Buncombe
County.
H
You
know,
of
course,
interesting
factoid
about
Weaverville
water.
They
pull
most
of
their
water
from
the
Ivy
and
that's
why
we
enforce
the
Watershed
up
in
up
in
the
north
east
quadrant,
so
lots
to
talk
about
in
that
round,
but
probably
not
enough
time.
H
One
of
probably
the
hardest
things
for
professional
planners
to
sort
of
encapsulate,
but
I
do
think
that
we
build
off
the
successes
of
some
of
our
density
programs
that
we
have
seen
you
basically
reward
density
for
very
good.
Smart
growth
and
key
is
stick
to
your
future.
Land
use
map,
stick
to
your
transportation
corridors
and
stick
to
your
areas
where
you
have
the
infrastructure
that
makes
sense.
Foreign.
C
Yeah,
there's
there's
certainly
a
lot
I
just
started
skimming
through
a
lot
of
this
information,
but
there's
a
lot
and
I
mean
I.
Think
one
of
the
things
that's
great
is
just
the
consistency
of
you
know
some
of
these
responses
to
questions
worded
slightly
different
differently.
That
are,
we
need
density.
We
don't
want
to
just
develop
everything.
It's
like
right.
Yes,
I
want
to
make
banners
and
put
them
up
that
say
that
differently,
because
you
know
you
know
it's
it's
also
hard
here
in
the
city.
C
G
C
B
C
L
C
H
C
All
right,
we
will
get
to
the
one
item
that
we
have
on
the
agenda:
legislative
public
hearing-wise,
and
that
is
a
zoning
map
Amendment.
It
is
a
request
to
amend
the
conditional
zoning
ordinance,
ordinance
number
4853
for
the
property
located
at
2,
64,
Inca,
Heritage,
Parkway,
to
make
site
plan
and
layout
changes.
The
property
is
is
identified
as
pin
9617430440
in
the
Buncombe
County
tax
record.
The
property
owner
is
Inca
partners
of
Asheville
LLC
and
the
planner
coordinating
review
is.
M
Thank
you
chair
good
evening.
Everyone
I'll
be
presenting
on
this
project
tonight,
which
is
an
amendment
to
an
existing
conditional
Zoning
for
this
property
at
264.,
anca
Commerce
Parkway
known
as
anchor
Commerce
Park.
M
M
M
And
the
site
plan
showing
the
proposed
layout
and
design
of
the
site,
which
includes
three
one-story,
light
industrial
buildings
at
total,
approximately
600
000
square
feet.
Other
improvements
include
off
street
parking,
totaling
463
spaces,
a
new
roadway
connection
via
the
cul-de-sac
off
of
the
existing
roadway
on
the
site.
All
right
are
adjacent
to
the
site.
Already,
a
new
storm
water,
Retention
Ponds,
the
kind
of
an
iconic
Inca,
historic,
brick,
Clock
Tower,
which
is
located
kind
of
the
middle
of
the
site,
will
be
preserved.
M
Another
number
of
elevations
provided
relatively
similar
designs
overall,
so
you'll
see
that
besides
the
two
kind
of
side
elevations,
there
are
kind
of
there's
a
front
in
the
back
to
each
of
these
buildings.
So
at
the
rear
elevation
of
each
building
is
the
loading
docks
and
then
on.
The
front
is
where
you
know:
pedestrian
entrances
are
located.
So
typically
the
buildings
have
that
lower
elevation
fronting
beyond
the
interior
of
the
block
kind
of
towards
each
other
and
then
at
the
rear
is,
is
kind
of
loading
access.
M
So
this
is
261
Inca
Heritage
Parkway,
the
north
building
264,
which
is
the
East
building
on
the
site
plan
and
274,
which
is
the
Western
building
on
the
cycling.
M
As
far
as
these
projects
alignment
with
the
city's
comprehensive
plan
living
Asheville,
the
project
is
consistent
with
the
future
land
use
map
designation
of
employment,
slash
anchor
institution
which
is
described
in
part
that
important
employment
clusters
that
are
often
substantial
anchors
for
the
water
Community.
M
As
far
as
the
review
prod
process
for
this
project,
it
was
reviewed
and
approved
with
conditions
at
the
July
11
2022
technical,
Review
Committee.
It's
not
located
any
design
overlay
areas,
so
that
was
really
the
only
step
before
coming
to
Planning
and
Zoning.
Commission
was
continued
a
few
times
at
the
applicant's
request
to
to
ladder
meetings
where
it
is
being
reviewed
tonight.
For
the
first
time
in
a
public
hearing,
there
are
a
couple
highlighted
conditions
that
are
in
the
exhibit
e
project
missions
document.
M
The
first
one
is
that
easements
are
to
be
dedicated
for
the
anca
Heritage
Greenway,
and
also
that
the
historic
Clock
Tower
shall
be
retained
and
preserved
on
site
with
amenity
and
seating
areas
and
a
historic
marker
speaking
to
the
historic
significance
of
the
site,
and
there
are
four
technical
modifications
to
address
some
of
some
of
the
zoning
parts
of
the
zoning
code
that
don't
align
with
the
project
through
the
conditional
zoning
process.
The
first
is
building
entrance
spacing
in
excess
of
the
minimum,
I'm.
M
Sorry,
I
guess
maximum
75
foot
distance
that
parking
lot
tree
Islands
will
maintain
a
minimum
width
of
nine
feet
instead
of
the
required
10
feet.
Width,
technical
aspects
of
the
lighting
plan
as
specified
by
the
project
team,
and
also
that
no
bike
lanes
are
being
proposed
into
into
the
developments.
M
B
Thank
you,
Mr
Palmquist,
any
questions
right
now
for
staff.
M
So
my
understanding
of
it
and-
and
this
is
the
lighting
provision-
that's
similar
to
what
the
previous
conditional
zoning
had,
if
not,
if
not
the
same,
is
that
essentially,
if
the
light
is
contained
within
the
site-
and
it
has
a
is
directed
and
doesn't
contribute
to
light
pollution
overall,
as
far
as
the
direction
of
the
lighting,
if
it's
down
down
lit,
that
would
comply
with
the
the
intent
of
the
Udo
and
that
our
UTI
doesn't
want
to
get
into
this
level
of
detail
necessarily
but
I
think
the
project
you
wanted
to
have
it
in
here.
M
O
Chair
members
of
the
commission,
nice
to
see
those
of
you
again
that
we're
here
with
you
before
time,
back
we've
updated
our
site
plan.
That
was,
you
can
just
state
your
name,
sorry
Brian,
Hall,
nice,
to
see
you.
We
updated
our
site
plan
that
you
guys
previously
approved
for
a
single
user.
We've
adopted
changed
that
site
plan
to
be
now
more
flexible
to
accommodate
multiple
users.
You
saw
the
different
buildings
that
are
planned
there.
Those
buildings
are
based
upon
an
economic
development
model
to
be
able
to
work
with
Clark
Duncan
who's.
O
Here,
I
think
you'll
hear
from
him
to
work
to
attract
employment,
employers,
job
creators
in
a
flexible
fashion.
Those
buildings
are
designed
to
even
be
subdividable,
so
we
can
accommodate
even
more
than
just
the
three
potential
buildings
those
buildings
could
be
smaller
spaces.
That's
why
they're
designed
like
they
are
with
employment
or
pedestrian
access
off
the
front
trucks
in
the
back,
where
you
could
subdivide
those
buildings
and
create
multiple
users
in
those
same
spaces
to
work
to
be
flexible,
try
to
accommodate
as
many
employers,
job
creators,
industrial
users
that
we
have
there
so
we're
here.
O
To
answer
any
questions,
we
appreciate
your
consideration:
we're
excited
about
the
project,
we're
excited
to
move
forward.
We've
been
working
on
the
Redevelopment
with
Mr
Lewis
is
here
for
a
long
time,
and
so
we're
ready
and
anxious
to
get
going
and
appreciate
your
consideration.
Glad
to
answer
any
questions.
C
Thank
you,
I
have,
were
you
gonna,
I
didn't
know
if
somebody
else
was
going
to
come
up
and
speak
or
not,
but
I
do
have
one
question
and
and
I'm
glad
you
addressed
what
who
the
tenants
may
be
sure.
C
Oh
we
hear
you're
directing
it
towards
I
was
curious
if
it
was
going
to
be
something
that
would
allow
say
small
scale
manufacturing
where
these
could
be
subdivided
because
I
know
that
is
a
big,
obviously
overall
trend,
but
especially
here
in
Asheville
I
happen
to
be
in
a
redeveloped
old
textile
mill
right
speaking
of
a
comment
from
earlier
in
Wood
fit
and
very
similar.
It's
all.
You
know,
businesses
that
need
say
500
to
2
000
square
feet
right,
ten
thousand
square
feet.
C
You
know
that's
kind
of
exactly
a
great
thing,
so
yeah
that
that
was
a
question
of
mine.
So
thank
you
for
answering
that
it
then
would
appear
that
each
one
of
these
could
be
maybe
as
small
as
10
000.
yeah.
O
Absolutely
I
mean
you
look
at
those
buildings
and
they're
long
rectangles,
but
if
you
start
to
slice
them
into
bite-sized
pieces
down
to
squares
or
even
rectangles,
that
would
be
opposite
of
the
way.
The
long
building
shaped
I
think
we
can
get
down
to
10
or
20
000
square
foot
users
and
so
a
user
from
that
small
up
to
a
50,
000
square
foot
user
or
even
100
000
square
foot
user.
O
C
Okay,
I'm
going
to
take
that
one
step
further
sorry.
So
there
was
a
note
in
and
let
me
just
pull
it
up,
because
I
want
to
make
sure
I
I
get
this.
C
E
conditions,
there
was
a
note.
It
was
number
19
that
the
applicant
will
make
good
faith
efforts
to
contract
with
small
and
minority
firms
and
when
women's
business
enterprises
and
so
just
kind
of
keying
off
of
of
the
question
I
just
asked
about.
You
know
how
small
what
what
are
the
you
know
thought
about
tenants
that
might
be
here.
C
O
C
C
And
I
know
we've
kind
of
done
that
some
before
with
some
mixed-use
projects,
but
you
know
there
may
be
differing
things
with
this
and
again.
Obviously
any
conditions
are
always
a.
You
know
the
applicant
has
such
a
degree.
Then
then
we
we
as
a
commission,
can
I'm
doing
and
so
I'm
kind
of
posing.
That
is
if
it's
something
you'd
be
interested
in
I
think
it
would
be
great
I
think
it's
something
that's
needed,
and
then
it's
really
a
conversation
that
you
all
can
continue
to
have
until
it's
true
to
council,
okay,
so
yeah.
C
E
Some
that
say,
we
will
commit
to
doing
a
certain
percentage
at
market
rate
or
a
small
at
lower
rates,
so
that
has
been
a
condition
but
I.
P
C
Yeah
I
mean
it's
not
necessarily
so
much
about
the
exact
end
user,
maybe
perhaps
but
yeah
as
far
as
eight
Market
segment
of
end
user,
whether
it's
Brewery
or
whatever
but
yeah.
Does
that
make
sense.
E
C
To
afford
full
Market
the
one
I'm
thinking
about
in
particular
was
the
project
over
on
Cox
avenue,
the
big
Cox
Hilliard
project,
where,
where
they
and
I
don't
remember
what
it
ended
up
turning
into,
but
how
it
exactly
got
worded
but
I
know
we
were
able
to
get
a
certain
percentage
of
of
this,
the
small
commercial
spaces
that
they
had
there
towards.
B
C
I
pose
that
is,
if
you
all,
are,
would
consider
that
I
would
love
to
see
that
hasher,
because
again
there
are
lots
of
smaller
businesses
right
trying
to
open
in
this
town
and
need
spaces.
Absolutely
just
to
you
know:
have
that
start
that
foot
in
absolutely
we're
open
to
the
idea.
Okay,
great.
Thank
you
sure.
C
G
G
G
Basically,
what
I've
gleaned
from
the
public
comment
was:
is
this
truly
going
to
be
a
urban
center
and
not
just
a
heavy
industrial
Light
industrial
site?
I?
Guess
that's
what
I'm
saying
that
they!
You
know
that
the
public
wanted
more
of
a
Community
Center
rather
than
a
light
industrial
center,
but
that's
not
necessarily
maybe
I'm
just
want
to
express
to
the
that's
the
public
comment
that
was
coming
yeah.
C
Thank
you
for
that,
commissioner
Faircloth.
There
were
two,
and
this
goes
back
to
the
you
know
that
we've
kind
of
had
this
rolling
on
our
agenda.
For
for
many
months,
there
were
two
letters
that
we
received
through
public
comment:
I
believe
they
were
back
in
October
and
both
of
them
were
in
a
similar
vein
of
you
know,
thinking
that,
wouldn't
this
in
a
in
a
larger
sense,
not
just
your
particular
the
particular
parcel
we're
talking
about
tonight,
but
the
in
that
entire.
C
What
I
will
say
the
old
income
plan
wouldn't
the
ultimate
goal
for
that
be
more
of
an
urban
centered
zoning,
and
does
this
necessarily
maybe
fit
with
that,
and
you
know
certainly
there's
the
you
know
if
you
want
to
call
it
the
elephant
in
the
room,
the
recent
hospital
award
to
Advent,
which
seems
to
maybe
be
somewhere
in
the
vicinity
of
this
and
I,
think
they're
certainly
valid
points.
C
Also,
you
know
and
and
I
know,
this
came
up
when
we
reviewed
this
for
the
previous
conditional
zoning,
it
is,
has
always
been
industrial.
It
is
still
a
great
place
to
have
Industrial,
which.
C
G
Q
Thank
you
to
the
members
of
the
commission
for
this
quick
opportunity
to
speak
and
support
of
the
proposed
amendment.
My
name
is
Clark
Duncan
and
I
serve
as
executive
director
for
the
economic
development
Coalition
for
Asheville
and
Buncombe
County.
That's
a
mouthful,
but
we
are
a
30-year
public-private,
Partnership
of
Asheville
city
council,
Buncombe,
County
Commission
and
the
Asheville
area
Chamber,
with
the
mission
of
growing
Economic
Opportunity
growing
wages
in
this
community,
diversifying
the
economy
and,
of
course,
growing.
The
tax
base
of
the
city
and
the
county.
Q
Our
board
and
our
staff
are
governed
by
a
policy
and
the
Strategic
plan,
with
five
key
tenants
and
I'm
not
going
to
bore
you
with
all
of
them,
but
we
support
and
grow
local
industry
because
of
the
impact
of
wages
in
that
sector.
We
recruit
complementary
businesses,
we
grow
the
next
generation
of
Asheville,
headquartered
businesses
to
the
programs
of
venture
Asheville.
We
also
grow
investments
in
our
Workforce.
Q
This
45
Acres,
you
are
correct
in
saying,
is
probably
the
the
best
opportunity
for
Industrial
Development
in
all
of
Western
North
Carolina
at
this
moment
in
terms
of
graded
topography,
robust
utility
service
access
to
Workforce
access
to
two
interstates
within
a
stone's
throw,
and
we
continue
to
work
our
staff
and
our
boards
very
closely
with
these
developers
and
attracting
an
employer
that
will
make
I
think
all
of
Buncombe
County
and
all
the
city
of
Asheville
proud
to
call
neighbors.
So
thank
you
for
this
opportunity.
I
encourage
your
support.
Thank
you.
G
C
I'll
go
ahead
and
make
yes.
N
I
moved
to
approve
the
conditional
zoning
Amendment
request
for
the
property
located
at
264
Inca
Heritage
Parkway,
so
commercial
expansion,
conditional
Zone,
exp
CZ
for
the
modification
of
the
site
plan
and
find
that
the
request
is
reasonable
is
in
the
public.
Interest
is
consistent
with
the
city's
comprehensive
plan
and
meets
the
development
needs
of
the
community
and
that
the
request
one
encourages
responsible
growth
by
directing
growth
in
designated
growth,
areas
that
provide
access
to
employment
opportunities.
Two
promotes
great
architecture
and
Urban
Design
to
enhance
Place
making
by
encouraging
the
preservation
of
the
historic
Inca.
N
C
That
concludes
essentially
the
public
comment
public
portion
of
our
meeting
tonight.
We
do
have
a
few
essentially
commission
and
staff
things
that
we're
going
to
take
care
of
now,
including
discussion
and
review
of
this
commission's
annual
report
to
council
and
then
we'll
also
be
discussing
some
ideas
around
Retreat
and
some
presentations,
and
things
like
that.
So
yesterday
and
actually
I
guess.
I
should
right
now
say
that
planning
staff
has
a
new
member
Clayton
I.
Don't
even
remember
your
last
name
now.
C
Clayton
Mitchell
just
started
in
November,
yes,
so
welcome.
I
know
you
met
at
least
a
few
of
us
upstairs
and
so
Clayton
and
will
and
Avery
and
I
met
yesterday,
just
kind
of
have
some
discussion,
one
around
the
annual
report
and
then
two
also
some
ideas
about
future
present,
mini
presentation,
topics,
Retreat
and,
and
that
kind
of
thing
so
I
think
the
first
one
to
discuss.
Probably
is
the
annual
report.
B
C
Unless
everybody
was
here
last
year
for
the
annual
report,
you
know
it's
it's
fairly,
you
know
basic
in
as
far
as
kind
of
a
description
of
you
know
what
PMZ
has
reviewed
kind
of
you
know,
policy
recommendations,
things
like
that.
You
know
the
one
thing
that
it
does
you
know
get
into
a
little
bit
is
what
would
be
this
commission's
goals
or
what
would
we
like
to
kind
of
bring
up
two
Council
as
Council.
C
C
M
C
No,
it
wasn't
yeah
but,
like
you
know
so
last
year,
last
year
is
what
we
had
on
the
annual
report
or
was
it
you
know
some
policy
recommendations
that
were
listed
on
last
year's
annual
report
were
Charlotte's.
You
know,
and
these
are
potential.
These
are
just
things
you
know
the
commission
was
thinking.
You
know
to
present
the
council
as
things
to
consider
and
perhaps
either
designate
staff
time
to-
or
perhaps
you
know,
budget
resources
to
where
Charlotte
Street,
Corridor
and
Zoning
study
Udo
update
with
a
different
mentioned,
reducing
barriers
to
infill.
C
Is
one
that
you
know
I
think
we
could
say
is
about
to
happen
with
the
missing
middle
housing
study
were
talking
about
that
yesterday,
that
is,
RFP
has
gone
out,
I've
heard
back
from
people,
and
it's
kind
of
in
that
interviewing
consultant
stage
right
now,
scheduled
to
actually
start
next
month.
I
believe.
P
C
You
know
perhaps
that
one
doesn't
necessarily
need
to
be
back
on
this
year's.
You
know
recommendation
and
then
also
in
the
other
policy
recommendation
we
had
last
year
was
incorporating
Equity
analysis
into
land
use
decisions
which
I
know
is
also
one
we
talked
about
during
the
retreat
too
and
I
know
that's
been.
C
You
know
we
talked
about
that
yesterday.
I
know.
There's
some
staff
is
working
on.
How
do
you
get
like
a
better
word,
an
equity
toolkit?
How
do
you
get
something
that
you
can
very
easily
take
and
either
have.
C
K
On
that
one
in
particular
the
giraffe
Buncombe
town
and
comp
plans,
Equity
analysis
tool
is
actually
a
fairly
simple,
straightforward
approach.
I
know
it
would
be
slightly
different
in
the
city,
given
our
history
and
Legacy
of
urban
renewal
and
redlining,
but
as
a
starting
point,
it
might
be
worth
just
looking
at
what
the
county
is
doing
or
planning
to
do.
K
One
thing
that
I
I
thought
was
particularly
interesting
about
how
they
framed
their
questions
is.
What's
the
consequence,
you
know
the
impact
in
an
equity
standpoint
of
this
project
not
being
approved,
and
that's
kind
of
a
helpful
way
to
look
at.
You
know
the
consequence
of
denying
a
Housing
Development
or
denying
a
particular
type
of
development
that
could
help
move
the
needle
on
equity
in
our
community.
So
it
might
be
worth
just
looking
at
the
simple,
interesting
questions
that
counties
come
up
with
yeah.
C
C
That
is
I,
think
what
video
and
Todd
may
know
or
remember
more
about
this,
but
I
think
that's
kind
of
what
he
based
that
analysis
when
he
did
the
urban
centers
on
and
again
just
I
mean
it's
great
for
something
that
big,
but
again,
maybe
four
and
I'm
just
going
to
use
the
angle
one
because
we
just
saw
it
like
how
do
you
get
a
list
of
questions
like
really
a
like
a
DS
game
checklist
right
in
a
sense,
I
mean
I,
don't
want
to
reduce
it.
So
that's
what
it
should
be
as
a
checklist.
C
But
how
do
you
say
here's
the
questions
you
need
to
ask
you
need
to
provide
three
cents
or
some
that
give
us
something
answers
this
right
question,
or
this
reason
and
I
think
you're.
You
know
what
is
the
outcome
if
it
doesn't,
what
is
the?
What
are
the
consequences
that
this
does
not
gonna
answer
the
Inca
one?
If
you
were
to
ask
that
we
don't
have
another
place
for
small
businesses
to
look
at
is
yeah.
Does
that
start
to
influence
our
decisions
council's
decisions
right
right?
That
kind
of
thing
so
yeah
yeah.
M
P
C
Know
one
of
their
original
sites
was
held
up
or
what
they
weren't
able
to
work
on
that
site
because
of
concerns
around.
C
Thank
you.
Thank
you,
Kelsey
yeah,
so.
P
K
I'd
like
to
lift
up
the
comprehensive
udl
rewrite
that
chair
Archibald
keeps
mentioning,
because
you
know
it
does
seem
that
we've
we
run
into
kind
of
consistent
barriers
in
the
UVO
that
you
know
always
seeking
exceptions
to
those
are
really
easy
fixes.
It
seems
like,
but
then
there's
some
deeper,
just
structural
challenges
and
we're
adding
a
lot
to
the
UCO,
but
not
revisiting
some
of
the
original.
K
You
know
1990s
tax
and
it
does
feel
like
it
may
be
time
to
bite
the
bullet
and
really
kind
of
look
holistically
and
make
sure
you
know.
Every
square
inch
of
the
Yu-Gi-Oh
is
kind
of
aligned
with
our
vision
and
the
comp
plan.
Yeah.
R
Yeah
I
think
that's
a
great
suggestion.
I
think
you
know,
in
the
absence
of
having
at
least
the
funding
budget,
for
that.
In
the
meantime,
our
our
strategy
has
been
especially
as
we've
gotten
more
fully
staffed.
We've
got
great
great
new
staff
like
clay
and
some
of
the
other
new
folks
you
you
have
yet
to
meet
still
in
the
department
that
just
recently
joined
us.
But
you
know
our
plan
in
the
department
is
really
to
in
the
meantime
to
try
to
tackle
some
of
these.
R
R
Maybe
more
minor
amendments
that
can
help
clean
up
the
code
in
certain
sections
of
the
Udo
make
sure
it's
very
consistent
with
State
statutes
and
other
regulations,
and
then
also
look
look
for
tax
amendments
that
have
a
high
impact
and
that
are
low
hanging
fruit
kind
of
like
the
manufactured
housing
tax
amendment
we
did
recently.
That
was
a
really
quick
Amendment.
R
P
F
C
I
think
there's
there's
definitely
some
super
low
hanging,
fruit
and
Clay
was
really
excited,
so
I'm
hoping
these
March
March,
but
I
mean
there
are
things
like
that
because
we
talked
about
it's
like
yeah.
It
would
be
great
to
do
I
think
just
what
you
said
Todd
to
do
a
big
one,
but
can
we
kind
of
start
to
until
we
get
that
until
Council
says?
Yes,
here's
the
check
go,
go,
find
a
consultant.
You
know
sure
yeah.
K
I
guess
to
to
maybe
push
back
a
little
bit
harder
sure.
You
know
that
the
reducing
barriers
to
infield
housing
is
a
obviously
an
admirable
goal
and
it's
going
to
be
a
really
great
study.
We
sitting
here
can
all
pretty
much
predict
what
it's
going
to
recommend,
and
so
that
was
eighty
thousand
dollars
committed
by
Council
in
the
budget.
K
That's
not
going
towards
a
comprehensive
video
update,
but
is
instead,
you
know
formalizing
and
codifying
recommendations
that
are
probably
common
sense
that
you
know
the
brain
power
of
our
staff
has
just
maybe
doesn't
have
the
examples
of
you
know
language
from
other
udos
and
other
municipalities
to
build
in.
So
there
is
value
in
the
consultant
I'm
not
trying
to
Discount
that
I'm
just
saying
you
know
that
that
is
money
that
was
budgeted
for
planning,
but
you
know,
then.
K
D
F
C
Had
a
discussion
a
couple
times
with
padillo
course
of
a
year
or
so
about
well
even
back
to
when,
when
he
was,
you
know
bringing
up
the
reducing
lot
sizes
and
all
that
that
was
three
four
years
ago
now,
but
one
of
the
comments
I
made
to
him
and
I
made
in
yesterday
when
we
met,
is
in
the
process
of
this
study
going
on.
Is
there
a
way
to
say,
okay
give
your
first
glance
at
this?
What
can
we
do?
C
Can
we
do
some
changes
while
this
study
is
going
on
because
I
agree,
I
think
you're
right?
That
was
one
of
the
questions
I
asked
at
all.
I
was
like:
aren't
we
going
to
get
what
we
already
know
like?
Can
we
somehow,
obviously
that
was
too
late
to
kind
of
change
the
RFP,
but
can
we
now
somehow
like
get
them
to
say
you
know
what
we
want
you
to
look
more
at
this?
C
What
we
asked
you
to
do,
and
not
that,
like
we
already
know
what
it's
going
to
say,
tell
us
what
we
need
to
do
and
and
even
I
think
it
may
have
been
I,
don't
know
how
we
got
to
it,
but
the
idea
of
perhaps
and
and
I'm
you
know,
also
couch.
This
and
I
realize
we
are
all
volunteers
here,
but
the
idea
of
perhaps
having
someone
from
this
commission
be
more
a
part
of
the
discussions,
the
reviews
that
kind
of
thing
with
the
consultants
and
staff
for
that
study.
C
In
other
words,
it's
not
that
this
study
goes
on
for
six
months
and
they
bring
us
a
report.
It's
someone
from
this
commission
if
someone's
willing
to
goes
to
whatever
meetings
are
happening,
if
they're
once
a
month
or
whatever,
but
it's
more
like
a
liaison,
it's
more
connected,
so
it
can
be
that
person.
He
says
well,
we've
already
seen
this
stuff
or
provide
some
feedback.
That
I
think
could
be
helpful
to
the
consultant
as
well.
Yeah,
perhaps
like
actually
hearing
it
from
this,
is
what
we're
seeing
what
we're
hearing
what
I'm?
C
Let's
just
say
it
with
you,
I'm
not
saying
it
would
be,
but
you
would
have
that
experience
even
to
bring
to
them
that
they
wouldn't
have
to
go
out
and
necessarily
try
to
find
them
right,
just
based
on
your
your
career,
so
that
that
was
a
thought.
Obviously,
it
takes
someone
from
here
to
the
United
States
right.
M
C
C
G
On
right
to
counter
that
a
little
bit
chair,
I
mean
shouldn't
these,
the
Consultants
should
be
doing
public
feedback
or
some
kind
of
open
public
meeting
and
correct
anyone
can
show
up
to
that
I
mean
correct.
Maybe
saying
someone
from
the
committee
should
be
at
those
public
meetings:
okay,
yeah!
Is
that
a
volunteer
system,
or
is
that
a
ball
and
told
system?
Well.
C
I
mean
I
was
thinking
that
it
was
more
than
just
going
to
like
a
public
meeting
more
like
the
the
let's.
P
M
Yeah
I
think
I
think
a
lot
of
habitable
function
might
still
be
kind
of
TVD
as
far
as
like
working
groups
or
who's
going
to
be
on.
You
know,
helping
with
drafting
the
draft
policy
and
that
kind
of
thing,
but
I
don't
see
why
I'm
a
member
of
bnz
couldn't
be
a
part
of
that
I
mean.
C
So
yeah,
so
that
was
a
thought
and
then
yeah
I
know
Will's
listed
a
couple
of
the
other
things
he's
just
holdovers,
yeah
yeah
that
we
kind
of
talked
about
yesterday
and
you
know
adding
to
the
list
of
you-
know,
recommendations
as
far
as
budgetary
impacts
and
then
also
too
I.
Think
like
the
very
top.
There
are
the
ones
as
far
as
like
policy
recommendations.
So
you
know
looking
at
the
of
the
pressure,
you
know
looking
more
specifically
at
growth
pressures
opportunities
for
you
know:
storm
water
management,
infrastructure,
stuff.
C
C
M
Does
business
with
the
last
year
reiterate
the
mission
and
it
kind
of
helps
to
identify
yeah
things
like
the
goals
and
potential
initiatives,
and
so
when
they,
when
they
maybe
see
a
request
for
funding
for
Udo
update
they'll,
say
oh
right.
We
keep
seeing
this
on
the
end
of
the
report
from
Planning
and
Zoning
commission
and
we
keep
hearing
from
directly
from
the
commission
that
it's
a
priority.
So
it
kind
of
helps
the
and
it's
really
from
the
commission
and
and
from
the
chair.
So
it's
kind
of.
M
M
Yeah
well
so
these
these
are
just
holdovers
from
last
year.
So
this
is.
This
is
a
copied
version
where
I've
only
updated
really
the
summary
information
about
projects
reviewed,
but
then
a
lot
of
this
I
have
not
edited
anything
in
this.
These
are
just
kind
of
starting
points,
so
kind
of
some
of
them
are
still
relevant.
Some
could
go
away,
new
ones
can
be
added.
M
You
know
a
staff
would
probably
review
them
against
the
department.
Work
plan
understand
how
it
fits
in,
and
you
know,
find
the
Synergy
between
what
what
Seth
resources
are
planning
they're
working
on
and
what
the
commission
sees
as
goals
for
the
future.
So
we
can.
You
know
this,
isn't
the
last
chance
I
think,
like
last
year,
I
think
Joe
sent
a
draft
around
everyone
to
get
comments
and
feedback
and
then
kind
of
more
offline
tied
it
together
to
finalize
it
before
submitting
it
to
the
clerk's
office.
A
B
N
B
C
C
Media
yeah,
unfortunately,
got
kicked
from
Council
again,
but
like
that
one's
been
done,
the
urban
Center's
resenting
initiative
is
done
council's
approved
it
that
one's
done
open
space
has
been
approved.
You
know
we
have
been
having.
We
did.
Have
the
commission
Retreat.
C
Had-
and
you
know
since
I've
been
on,
we
have
been
having
I,
wouldn't
you
know,
maybe
work
session
isn't
right,
but
we've
been
certainly
doing
some
more.
Like
the
comp
plan
presentation
we
have.
You
know
that
was
something
we
had
talked
about,
wanting
to
have
some
more
just
informal
reports
about.
What's
going
on
certain,
you
know
key
topics
if
you
want
so
I.
B
C
Know
quite
a
few
of
those
upcoming
goals,
I
think
we've.
We
said
we
wanted
to
do
these
and
I
think
we
did
get
the
we
didn't
get
all
of
them.
Obviously
the
budgetary
ones,
though
we
don't
have
the
control
right.
We
can't
say
Council,
gives
staff
like
that's
out
of
our
hands.
But
again,
if
we
just
keep
like
I
kind
of
feel
like
it's
just
I'm,
just
gonna
keep
beating
the
hammer
until
it
gets
done.
N
D
G
So
last
annual
report
I
made
a
stink
and
had
a
bunch
of
comments
about
storm
water
management
and
Medela
told
me
to
hang
out
that
there
was
a
new
plan
or
something
coming,
and
that
was
I
haven't
heard
or
seen
anything
about
that.
I
know
that's
not
necessarily
under
as
to
Kim's
Point
our
purview
since
we're
planning
we're
not
in
an
enforcement
board,
we're
a
planning
board
but
I
guess
where
I
was
coming
from.
You
know
we
have
all
these
larger
developments
coming
in,
especially
where
I'm
from
in
South
Asheville.
C
K
C
It
for
sure
the
storm
water
management
again
I
think
a
lot
of
these
as
far
as
they
are
literally
things
I.
Like
super
simple,
this
commission
sees
these
on
a
every
single
month,
not
saying
Council
doesn't
see
it
too,
but
we
see
it
every
single
month
with
every
single
development,
certain
things
that
are
proud
on
this
end.
This
is
our
way
to
say
directly
to
council.
Hey,
we
say
this
every
single
meeting.
Maybe
it
doesn't
get
written
down
every
single
meeting,
but
right
here
here
they
are
right.
G
G
A
C
Well
and
the
reason
thank
you
Brent
for
bringing
it
up,
I
I
knew
it
was
on
there
for
some
reason
and
I
knew
somebody
had
put
it
on
there.
But
yesterday
we
were
talking
and
I'll
swing
just
slightly
to
talking
about
things
like
mini
presentations
and
stuff,
like
that
I
mentioned.
To
will
that
I
think
it
would
be
great
and
I
had
this
before
the
water
debacle,
but
to
have
someone
from
MSD
from
the
water
department.
You
know
traffic
come
in
and
give
a
presentation
about.
C
You
know
overviews
kind
of
like
what
Nathan
mentioned
as
far
as
like
here's
the
MSD
map.
Here's
where
you
know
we
get
this
because
again,
you
know
whatever
what
are
the
key
complaints
from
people
without
development
infrastructure
and
traffic
and
I
think
just
education
and
understanding
and
then
Publix
here
they
could
hear
it
like.
So
maybe
that's
all
it
is.
N
N
M
If
some
some
limits
but
yeah
and
especially
over
a
certain
elevation,
so
anything
above
2
220
feet
in
elevation,
have
that's
more
of
like
a
higher
elevation.
Slash
steep
slope
ordinance
see
as
a
more
right
so
I'd
say
it's
more
about
looking
at
impacts
of
development
on
on
slopes
or
which
could
be
a
Udo
solution
as
well
to
Amendment
at
some
point
to
look
more
closely
at
that
or
so
yeah.
Maybe
try
to
identify
what
issues
about
development
other
need
further
study
or
could
be
addressed
through
other
mechanisms
too
yeah.
K
P
A
R
That
that
would
I
would
Envision.
That
would
be
like
a
text
Amendment
similar
to
what
we
did
for
hotels
and
it
might
be
helpful
for
us.
We
could
probably
share
with
you
all
like
what
our
what
our
work
snapshot
of
our
work
plan.
You
know
looks
like
and
I
know.
This
captures
a
lot
of
the
projects,
but
maybe
it's
not
all
all
inclusive
of
every
project
we're
working
on,
but
expanding
public
benefits
is,
is
on
our
work
plan,
something
we're
kicking
off
pack
Square
visioning
project.
R
Obviously
we
have
the
as
part
of
I-26
connector
project,
East,
Patton,
Avenue,
Corridor
study.
This
is
something
that
would
be
kind
of
a
joint
effort
with
the
French
Broad
NPO
to
kind
of
analyze
that
Gateway
opportunity
that
we
have
in
this
once-in-a-lifetime
kind
of
planning
opportunity
and
Redevelopment
along
Patton
Avenue,
leading
into
downtown
part
of
the
I-26
project.
We
mentioned
missing
middle
housing,
study,
open
space
text,
Amendment
check
off
South
slope,
Vision
plan.
We
hope
to
check
that
off
soon.
R
You
know
in
February
a
couple
of
other
projects
that
we
completed.
African-American
Heritage
resources
survey
and
you
got
you
all-
got
I-
think
an
update
from
Alex
Cole
recently
on
that
project,
the
Burton
Street
architectural
survey,
which
will
help
to
inform
a
pattern
book
in
the
future
for
that
neighborhood
I
think
Alex
presented
that
as
well,
and
we're
also
looking
to
expand
or
make
permanent
the
outdoor
dining
and
what
we
call
like
streeteries
program.
R
This
is
all
part
of
the
evl
share
space
initiative
that
we
that
we
did
during
the
pandemic,
where
we
have
all
the
outdoor,
dining
and
parklets
that
help
to
support.
You
know
businesses,
especially
in
downtown,
so
those
are
just
some
of
the
projects
on
our
work
plan
just
to
just
so
you're
all
aware
of
some
of
the
things
we
are
working
on,
if
there's
opportunities,
maybe
to
even
kind
of
get
you
all
involved
in
any
of
these
other
initiatives.
C
Yeah
two
two
things
and
and
I'll
do
a
little
and
I
kind
of
did
it
a
little
bit
yesterday
when
I
met
with
with
Will
and
clay
and
Avery
similar
to
what
what
you
did
a
minute.
C
Would
push
back
a
little
bit
on
the
like
on
the
I-26
thing,
you
know
the
East
Patton,
as
I
mentioned,
it's
like
That
was
supposed
to
be
started
in
1998,
I,
think,
probably
before
then
I
think
it's
definitely
worthy
of
thinking
about
on
a
long-range
scale
and
if
it's
more
than
x
amount
of
dollars.
C
Let's
put
that
towards
solving
some
UVO
problems
like
it's
important
and
it's
like
it
just
needs
to
be
a
because
my
understanding,
looking
through
the
stuff
that
has
come
from
the
I-26
committee
with
multimodal
is
that
dot
hasn't
even
committed
to
giving
the
land
up
yet.
So
it's
like
it's
great
to
think
about
it,
but
it's
obviously
going
to
take
so
long
to
even
get
to
the
having
them.
You
know
and
and
boy
there's
a
whole
lot
more
things
that
need
to
get
addressed
like
now.
C
And
then
the
other
one
I
mean
Jim,
certainly
in
any
any
of
the
rest
of
the
Commissioners
I
mean
you
know.
This
is
definitely
not
I'm,
certainly
have
been
part
of
you
know,
kind
of
in
the
last
couple
years
coming
up,
you
know,
with
with
previous.
F
C
Helping
to
to
put
in
input
well
and
every
year
actually
input
into
the
into
the
annual
report.
It's
certainly
not
my
reporter.
My
goals
I
mean
it's
definitely
needs
to
be
viewed
as
a
complete
commission
goal
and
if
there's
something
on
there
that
nobody
wants-
or
you
know
doesn't
want
to
get
behind-
that's
I'm
completely
fine.
You
know
with
that.
It's
kind
of
like
this
is
you
know.
Basically,
we
took
what
was
on
there
last
year
and
said:
well,
here's
some
kind
of
things
that
yeah
I
think
this
needs
to
stay
on
there.
C
Here's
something
else,
I'd
like
to
add:
let's
get
everybody
else's
input
and
and
what
I
had
mentioned
to
will
is
I
think
will
if
you
can
go
ahead
and
send
that
out
and
I
think
actually
sending
out
that
sure.
Yes,
that
work
plan
and
then
basically
I
think
you
know
via
email
over
the
next
week
and
a
half
or
so
we
can
just
kind
of
refine
what
this
list
is
and
then
we
can
actually
have
what
we
would
then
print
right
and
and
send
accounts.
So
this
this
is
not
the
final
list.
A
B
C
Upcoming
goals,
I
kind
of
look
at
those
as
like-
it's
not
even
just
certainly
I-
think
some
of
them
are
like
goals
for
the
commission
this
year,
but
maybe
it's
even
long
range.
Yes
yep
thinking
about.
Maybe
it's
a
long-range
goal
to
have
a
someone
from
the
city
on
the
County
Planning,
the
board
of
adjustment.
C
R
Their
there
are
supposed
to
be
annual
reports.
I
think
we've
done
one
so
far.
I
think
part
of
the
challenge
with
it
is
trying
to
figure
out
how
the
comprehensive
plan
dovetails
into
their
other
strategic
priorities
that
they're
working
on
like
the
reparations
or
reimagining
Public
Safety,
and
some
of
these
other
bigger,
bigger
initiatives
that
they're
working
on
I
know
that
one
of
the
things
we've
been
working
on
is
with
our.
R
Looking
at
a
dashboard
type
of
tool
that
that
can
be
beneficial
not
just
to
city
council
members,
but
but
also
to
the
community
and
other
departments
as
well
and
part
of
the
the
implementation
plan
for
living.
Asheville
just
entails
continual
kind
of
education
for
for
City
staff
as
well.
Obviously
we
have
some
vacancies
throughout
the
city
we
bring
in
new
staff.
We
want
to
make
sure
that
the
new
staff
is
familiar
with
living
Asheville
as
well
and
how
it
could
be
a
tool
and
a
resource
for
them.
R
So
there
are
several
ways
that
we're
trying
to
I
guess,
educate
folks
on
the
comp
plan,
but
we're
still
as
an
organization
just
trying
to
figure
out
the
best
way
to
kind
of
communicate
progress
made
toward
the
plan
or
whether
it's
gaps
and
and
maybe
where
we
want
to
re-prioritize
some
of
the
strategies
in
that
plan.
So
we
haven't
had
those
conversations
yet
but
definitely
open
to
you
know
any
ideas
around
that:
okay.
K
Yeah,
that's
great,
that's
kind
of
I
think
what,
when
I
think
about
our
goals,
some
of
what
may
play
into
it
is
you
know,
with
the
consistency,
statements
and
planning
staff
reviews
for
conditional
zonings.
Are
there
portions
of
the
comp
plan
that
are
just
kind
of
collecting
dust,
or
you
know
that
aren't
really
being
used
to
say:
hey,
we
are
approving
projects
that
are
consistent
with
a
comp.
A
K
R
And
I
mean
there's
also
another
aspect
of
the
comp
plan
that
we
really
intended
for
it
to
be
more
of
a
living
document
and
I
mean
already,
if
you
think
about
even
like
the
equity
sections
and
the
plan,
we've
learned
a
lot
more
since,
when
the
plan
was
adopted
in
2018
and.
P
R
Could
see
you
know
future
initiative
where
we
kind
of
do
a
scan
of
living
Asheville
and
see
where
there's
opportunities
to
make
some
some
updates,
particularly
I,
think
around
Equitable
growth
and
and
maybe
missing
middle
housing
study,
if
that,
if
that
changes
any
of
the
future
land
use
map
recommendations
there,
there
could
be
some
opportunities
to
amend
the
plan
for
that
project
as
well.
B
C
Guess,
maybe
if
so,
if
we
send
all
this
out-
and
maybe
if
everybody
just
emails
back
with
I,
don't
know
two
three
four
ten
whatever
you
want
to
write
down
like
goals
like
what?
Let's
do
it
as
like
recommendations,
policy
recommendations.
So
thinking
about
things
like
he
does
a
short
Charlotte,
Street
quarters
and
Zoning
study
make
sense,
or
is
there
some
other.
C
Makes
music
like
what?
What
are
the
things
that
you
would
want
to
see
from
a
policy?
You
know
standpoint
being
done,
which
more
than
likely
will
have
either
staff
or
monetary
budgetary
impacts?
And
then
what
are
some
goals
that
you
would
like
to
see?
This
commission
have
over
the
next
year
two
years,
everybody
else
here
that
me
is
going
to
be
here
for
five
four
more
at
least
years:
yeah
yeah.
C
H
E
E
It
into
something
and
say
this
is
maybe
organize
it
in
a
way
and
say
this
is
what
it's
looking
like
and
then
maybe
ask
for
one
another
at
it
and
then
maybe
in
the
future.
What
I'm
hearing
is
you
must
need
a
plan
to
do
the
this
annual
plan
and
I
know,
there's
not
a
lot
of
time,
but
maybe,
and
we
had
with
covid,
we
haven't
had
time
for
a
retreat.
Every
treat
is
a
time
when
you
talk
about
these
kinds
of
things,
I
mean.
E
You
you
know,
there's
a
lot
to
it.
We've
got
tons
of
text
amendments
that
get
at
the
medicine
middle
we've
had
adapt.
Adus
we've
had
things
with
on-street
Hospital
parking.
We've
had
looking
at
different
types
of
housing.
That
can
be
so
obviously
incrementally,
as
you
were
saying,
Jeffrey
we're
adding
them
in
there
and
the
urban
centers.
That's
what's
huge.
That
was
a
huge
change
that
was
the
biggest
zoning
change.
E
We've
ever
done,
so
there's
a
lot
of
things
that
are
being
done,
but
you
you
need
that
time
to
talk
about
So
when
you
say
What's
missing
from
the
UDF
and
no
it's
not
working
my
head's
going
specifically
what
what
I
or
what
you
were
saying.
What
are
we
not
getting
that
we
you
know?
Is
it
because
of
the
way
the
Udo
is
written
or
is
it
because
of
no?
You
know.
The
comprehensive
plan
is
just
not
enticing
people
enough.
E
We've
talked
about
incentives
before
are
we
missing
these,
but
these
are
the
kinds
of
things
that
you
really
need
to
retreat
to
just
sort
of
start:
brainstorming
and
maybe
a
facilitated
Retreat,
that's
sort
of
and
and
again
I've,
never
thought
about
this
before.
But
when
you
have
an
annual
plan,
it
would
be
nice
if
either
six
months
down
the
line
or
before
you're
getting
to
do
your
next
annual
plan.
You
do
talk
about
hey.
What
are
these
things
on
this
annual
plan?
How
have
we
addressed
or
are
we
working.
C
Itself
into
whatever
it
wants
to
be,
because
there
has
been
a
lot
of
commissioner
change
on
this
Commission
since
I've
been
here
in
the
last
year
and
a
half
it
like,
it
really
has
shifted
younger
different
demographics,
like
it
has
changed,
and
so
some
of
like
this
I
feel
like
it's
holdovers.
It's
like
the
way
it's
been
done
doesn't
mean
we
have
to
keep
doing
it.
That
way.
You
know
it
it's,
it
can
be
whatever
we
want
it
to
be.
That
makes
sense,
like
the
commission
is
obviously
it's
a
commission
of
the
city.
R
Commissioner
Archibald
General
trouble
what
you
were
mentioning
before
about
this
commission
I
mean
you
do
have
the
opportunity
to.
If
you
want
to.
B
R
Proactive
in
certain
you
know,
initiatives
for
the
city
and
like,
like
you
said
earlier,
we
we
tend
to
present
things
like
in
the
middle
or
draft
format
and
kind
of
get
get
a
reaction
from
this
commission.
But
if
there
is
interest
amongst
any
of
its
members,
there
are
certainly
with
like
opportunities
that
we're
working
on
our
work
plan,
such
as
the
missing
middle
housing
study
or
expanding
public
benefits
throughout
the
city
in
that
system,
for
example,
for
Commissioners
to
be,
you
know,
involved
from
from
day
one
and
being
more
kind
of
more
proactive.
E
E
You
know
so,
but
it
is
a
way
of
organizing
and
understanding
what
what
the
city
has
now
decided
and
distilled
into
a
work
plan
and
to
the
extent
that
you
can
either
look
at
the
work
plan
and
say:
oh
yes,
I
kind
of
see
where
that's
going
and
agreed
with
it.
Maybe
you
don't,
because
you
were
saying
some
things,
maybe
you
don't
think
should
be
so
prioritized,
instead
of
creating
a
whole
new,
completely
different
goals
that
are
not
even
on
the
work
plan,
but.
M
I'll
send
a
snapshot
of
the
kind
of
the
main
project
list
around
the
folks,
as
well
as
like
a
PDF
of
this.
This
kind
of
I
wouldn't
call
it
a
draft
report.
It's
just
a
hold
of
report
from
last
year
with
the
old
stuff
and
there's
still
I've
crossed
that
a
few
accomplishments
that
we've
already
completed
and
send
that
around
and
I'll
curate
responses,
and
they
may
work
with
you
Joe
to
finalize.
M
M
E
M
M
G
Could
I
make
a
a
request,
a
recommendation?
Maybe
it's
me,
but
other
people
might
agree
for
stuff
like
this,
when
it's
sent
out
if
there
could
be
a
requested
deadline
or
due
date.
Yes,
you
all
know
all
these
dates
way
better
than
us
who
don't
live
in
this
world.
Yes,
10
hours
a
day
at
the
work
day,
yep.
So
if
you
could
say
in
there
hey
responses
requested
by
yeah
yeah,
now
you'll
get
the
email
back
from
me
at
11
58
the
night
before.
B
B
C
P
C
M
Maybe
maybe
a
week
and
then
in
between
another
iteration
of
something
like
we've
heard
you.
This
is
how
we're
addressing
the
final
report
final
comments
in
the
next
few
days
or
something,
and
maybe
something
like
that.
So
we
can
be
another
another
iteration
that
can
be
done
through
staff
or
through
editing.
The
document
directly.
C
Yeah
I
wanted
to
jump
into
the
other
discussion
too,
and
Janice
kind
of
had
the
perfect
ability
to
segue,
which
is
the
retreat
idea
and
one
of
the
things
and
again
all
this
is
just
my
thoughts
I'm
putting
them
out
there.
I
am
one
of
seven
six
sitting
here.
C
I
keenly
get
the
volunteer
aspect
of
this,
and
my
other
commission
Retreats
are
great.
It's
hard
trying
to
find
that
time
when
seven
people
can
agree
on
a
time
for
half
a
day
or
whatever
I
I.
Think
the
presentations
like
with
the
comp
plan
that
we
had
Alex
Cole
come
last
month
to
talk
about.
You
know
the
Burton
Street
survey
and
those
things
we've
had
other
ones.
You
know
over
the
past
year
I
mentioned
that
I
thought.
You
know
great
idea
for
some
presentations
moving
forward.
C
C
You
know
we,
the
commission
has
cut,
is
kind
of
set
up
where,
in
whatever
the
that's,
not
the
mission
statement,
but
I
mean
it
is
in
there
that
we
can
have
whole
mid-month
meetings,
and
so
we
can
do
a
mid-month
meeting.
If
it's
about
topics
like
this,
we
don't
have
to
take
public
comment.
C
But
it's
you
know,
everybody
knows
it's
this
time
this
place
and
we
can
sit
here
and
have
a
discussion
about
whatever
we
need
to
have
and
that
maybe
that
is
easier
than
trying
to
find
again
an
agreed
upon
time
to
block
out
five
hours
to
do
it.
That's
just
a
thought:
I,
don't
know
what
everybody
else
thinks
about
that.
If
you'd
rather
go
and
Retreat
I
know
before
covet,
there
was
the
wild
chance
that
the
commission
might
go
to
Greenville,
but
that
got
squashed
really
yeah.
So
I
mean
again
it
can
be
anything
but.
G
G
C
And
you
know
I
mean
they
can
be.
Obviously
we
can
say:
okay,
we're
gonna
start
to
say
we're
going
to
start
it
at
4
30..
It
ends
at
6.
30.,
like
you
know,
we
pnz
meetings
are
intentionally
not
a
set
time
frame
because
we
never
know
how
long
they're
going
to
be
because
it
depends
upon
the
agenda
and
how
what
the
conversation
is.
But
these
we
could
say
it
is
this
and
everybody
would
know
it's
this.
Instead
of
oh
gosh,
we
got
16
things
on
the
agenda.
C
I
mean
if
that
sounds
like
a
great
idea,
then
again,
I
think
that's
yet
another
one.
We
should
you
know
at
least
again
do
a
similar
thing.
I,
don't
know
if
we
can,
if
it
makes
sense,
maybe
it
does
the
your
idea
of
the
Google
Doc
of
like
hey
everybody,
put
two
idea:
topics
I'm
bad
among
seven
people,
there's
going
to
be
some
overlap,
maybe
not,
but
then
we
can
just
kind
of
say:
okay,
here's
the
overlap,
ones
and
then
hey,
which
ones
do
we
want
to
do
first
and
what
month
like?
C
Do
we
just
say?
Okay,
it's
going
to
be
August
or
not
August
yeah.
Maybe
it's
April
and
August.
We
say
it:
okay,
those
are
the
two
mods
we're
gonna
do
mid
month.
Meeting
each
one
is
going,
that's
called
two
hours
and
we're
going
to
talk
about
the
first
one.
That's
gonna
be
these
two
topics,
the
second
ones.
These
two
do
that.
A
A
D
P
E
And
I
just
want
to
say,
if
you
haven't
been
to
a
retreat
and
I
know
it's
hard
to
find
the
time,
there's
a
benefit,
I
think
to
being
in
a
different
location,
to
not
sitting
like
this,
to
not
feeling
like
the
words
out
here
and
a
guy
advised
the
Civic
Center
commission
Retreats
that
historic,
Resources,
Commission
I
just
went
to
the
affordable
housing,
Advisory
Board
off-site
a
different,
a
different
location,
but
something
kind
of
related
to
plan.
I,
don't
know,
maybe
a
cool
location
that
maybe
some
place.
E
We've
approved
a
board
room
or
some
some
building
you've
approved
in
it.
It
helps
sometimes
to
see
something
tangible
that
you've
approved
but
anyway,
and
to
be
able
to
concentrate
yes
on
topics,
but
I
have
seen
some
Retreats
where,
just
as
you
are,
the
chair
is
sort
of
has
an
agenda
and
you're
all
talking
I've
seen
some
that
have
gotten
a
facilitator
and.
E
Says
what
are
your
goals?
You
know
sort
of
they're
doing
a
strategic
plan
for
that
commission.
Actually
you
know,
or
or
just
certain
topics,
but
this
sort
of
more
guided
and
then
everybody
can
kind
of
participate
and
that
those.
E
Successful
too
and
I
think
give
people
the
opportunity
or
Commissioners
the
opportunity
to
sort
of
relate
to
each
other
in
a
different
way
and
really
feel
I,
don't
know
historical
to
think
about
the
successes
that
you,
you
know
that
you've
achieved
sometimes
too
and
then
talk
about
other
topics.
So
that's
just
a
thought,
because
otherwise
it
might
just
feel
like
two
more
meetings:
they're
always
open
to
the
public.
I'm,
not
you
know
you're
going
to
have
you
know
people
can
always
observe
but
I
just
it's
there's
something
about
getting
out.
Sometimes.
C
We
do
what
I
was
thinking
about
a
retreat,
not
thinking
mid-month,
meeting
retreatish,
but
my
thought
was:
could
we
go
to
a
neighborhood,
Civic
Center
or
something
to
maybe
that
is
part
of
the
you
know,
I
think
back
to
boy.
It
wouldn't
have
been
nice
to
go
to
the
Burton
Street
Community
Center,
to
hear
about
those
ports
there
hear
what
the
community
fight
that
kind
of
thing.
B
C
L
P
M
D
C
I
printed
it
out
the
other
day,
the
jamboard
thing
where
we
had
all
the
different,
because
I
I
actually
printed
this
out
yesterday
when
we
met
thinking
about
you
know
all.
M
N
B
N
C
M
M
P
C
A
M
M
Yeah
see
I'll,
send
some
friends
tomorrow,
like
we
talked
about
and
social
feedback
and
we'll
kind
of
massage
it
moved
along
and
get
it
to
a
good
point
to
submit
it,
and
then
yeah
talk
more
about
how
we
want
to
handle
our
kind
of
off-meaning
meetings
and
figure
out
a
good
strategy
depending
on
what
people
think
will
be
effective
for
them
and
their
schedules
and
moving
the
business
forward.
So
I.
C
Mean
I
will
say
the
facilitator.
Having
you
know,
we've
had
that
for
multimodal
ones
before
I
think
it's
great
I,
just
don't
know
you
know.
Obviously
there's
either
staff
and
or
cost
implementations.
There's
probably
it
makes
sense,
probably
for
something:
that's
maybe
three
hours
or
more
I
don't
know.
Does
it
make
sense
for
two
hours
again
I'm
just
throwing
my
thoughts
of
it
out
there
I
think
it's
a
great
idea,
though,
for
sure
yeah.