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From YouTube: Backdrop Design Meeting - August 12th, 2021
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A
Okay,
we
are
on
air,
it
is
thursday
august
12th,
and
this
is
our
fortnightly
design
meeting
before
we
get
into
what's
going
on
in
the
agenda,
let's
go
around
and
do
some
quick
introductions.
A
I'll
start,
my
name
is
john
lampton,
I'm
joining
from
oakland
california,
where
it
is
reasonably
sunny
and
nice
out
today
I
was
just
looking
at
all
the
user
experience
issues
in
the
issue
queue
today
and
I
got
very
excited
about
string
changes
again,
so
I
apologize
in
advance
for
what
I
might
do
to
the
issue
queue
today.
C
Hi,
I'm
joseph
I'm
from
las
vegas
nevada.
I'm
a
packet
developer,
mostly
focusing
on
tools
to
make
life
easier
for
site
builders.
I
guess.
D
I'm
luke
mccormick
in
san
ramon,
california,
where
I
saw
bob
cat
this
morning
on
a
morning
walk.
I
I've
started
doing
a
little
development
work
this
week
where
I
started
something
and
then
joseph
finished
it,
but
we'll
probably
talk
about
that.
A
little
bit
later
in
the
episode
greg.
E
Am
greg,
I'm
joining
from
greece,
safe
distance
from
fire
is
going
on.
I
haven't
been
in
touch
with
the
community.
I've
been
in
the
hiatus
for,
like
a
month
and
a
half.
Now
I'm
trying
to
catch
up
with
all
the
the
activity
it's
gonna.
Take
me
a
while,
but
hopefully
I'll
start
timing,
all
the
zulip
channels
and
the
issue
queue
joining
just
to
see
where
we're
at.
A
I
did
want
to
mention
that,
right
before
we
started
the
video,
we
had
a
brief
discussion
about
issue
that
robert
brought
up
on
factor
of
cms.org,
that
the
messages
like
the
status
messages
are
appearing
sort
of
below
the
fold
when
you
create
a
new
account-
and
it's
not
very
helpful-
greg
mentioned
that
that
might
be
an
issue-
that's
happening
in
backdrop
core
also,
but
we
couldn't
find
an
issue
if
anyone
remembers
that
issue
and
wants
to
share
it
with
us.
That
would
be
great,
otherwise
we'll
make
a
new
one.
A
We're
also
going
to
fix
the
problem
on
backdrop,
cms
network
quickly,
because
that's
much
easier
than
getting
changes
in
the
core,
also
related
to
user
experience.
If
anyone
is
really
passionate
about
user
experience,
you
can
check
our
issue
queue.
If
you
look
for
anything
with
two
square
brackets
and
then
the
capital
letters
u
and
x
between
them.
That
indicates
that
the
issue
is
a
issue
that
affects
how
people
interface
with
the
software
and
those
improvements
can
usually
get
in
and
bug
fixed
releases,
even
though
the
issue
itself
might
not
be
classified
as
a
bug.
A
If
there's
an
improvement
user
experience,
we
authorize
those
to
go
into
bug
fix
releases
too.
So
I
know
we've
had
a
lot
of
issues.
These
are
experienced
issues
that
were
labeled
good
first
issue
and
have
been
getting
attention
from
open
source
day
and
other
people
who
are
new
contributors
to
backdrop,
and
I
love
that
we
can
get
turn
around
on
new
contributor
stuff
so
quickly.
So
I'm
very
excited
about
that.
A
If
anyone
has
any
other
user
experience,
experience
focused
issues
for
core
you
want
to
talk
about
today.
D
A
Yeah
I
mean
I
tend
to
do
that
sort
of
a
slippery
slope
of
like.
Oh
all,
these
things
are
related
and
maybe
you
can
get
them
all
into
one
issue,
but
maybe
they're
all
just
separate.
I
don't
know.
E
You
can
stop
the
issue
and
then
you
can
make
it
a
meta
issue
and
split
tickets.
Sorry
issues
off
of
that
like
make
it
sub
tasks
like
checkboxes
on
that
main
issue,
but
you
can
start
a
discussion
with
a
single
one
and
then
take
it
from
there.
A
A
We
definitely
need
to
be
different
issues,
because
we
want
to
make
some
progress
rather
than
waiting
for
everything
to
get
done
all
at
once,
and
sometimes
it's
hard
to
know
that
until
after
you've
had
that
conversation,
so
you
want
to
start
the
issue
and
be
like
these
are
the
problems
I'm
seeing
and
then
someone
else
might
be
like
oh
yeah,
we
can
do
these
two
together,
but
let's
make
this
third
one,
a
follow-up
that
that's
often
how
things
end
up
split
into
separate
issues.
D
We
were
talking
about
a
particular
usability
thing
where,
where,
when
you
synchronize
a
full
configuration,
it
would
just
pop
up
the
first
thing
that
was
wrong
and
even
though
you
knew
there
were
multiple
problems
like
if
you're,
if
there's
one
model
missing,
there's
probably
other
modules
but
it'll
just
give
you
the
first
one,
and
so
you
had
to
go
through
and
and
do
them
this
arduous
process
that
you
didn't
know
how
long
it
was
going
to
take-
and
that
was
that
was
the
big
problem
struck
to
me
is
when
you
saw
one
you
suspected
the
rugs,
but
you
didn't
know
how
big
it
was
and
for
for
me,
when
that
happens
to
me,
I
tend
to
give
up,
because
I
you
know,
I
don't
know
how
many
times
I'm
willing
to
roll
the
rock
up
the
hill
before
giving
up
on
it,
and-
and
so
I
just
like
yeah-
I
I
wonder
if
that
that
that
could
be
fixed.
D
So
I
like
dived
into
the
code
myself
and
looked
around
and
kind
of
figured
out
where
the
problem
was
causing
and
tried
to
try
to
figure
out
how
to
how
to
approach
the
problem
and
popped
up
a
message
on
zulip
after
I
gave
up
on
being
able
to,
you
know
fully
solve,
but
you
have
to
hit
a
wall
in
about
an
hour
joseph
comes
in
with
like
complete
code
solving
it.
D
So
I
just
couldn't
paste
what
he
wrote
into
the
spot
of
the
code
that
I'd
found
and
then
suddenly
suddenly
worked
the
way
I
I
wanted
to
to
work
wherever
it
actually
spit
out
all
the
messages
I
was
like.
Well,
that
was
great
and
there
and
then,
and
then
you
know
wanting
to
you
know
I
was
like
okay.
So
I
need
to
create
a
pull
request
for
this.
D
E
I
think
that
cowboy
coding
is
just
fine.
If
you
put
that
in
a
pull
request,
you
will
have
more
people
looking
at
the
code
and
making
suggestions,
so
I
think
that's
a
start
so
create
an
issue
put
all
that
in
a
pull
request.
If
you
don't
know
how
to
do
that,
we
can
help
you
out
and
then
you'll
start
getting
reviews
from
people
and
suggestions
and
we'll
fix
it
we'll
make
it
less
cowboys.
A
English
issue
is
number
5146
in
backdrop,
issues
queue,
it
does
look
like.
There
is
a
poor
request
that
is
failing
tests
and
it
looks
like
you're
already
working
on
it,
so
I
think
you're
on
the
right
track.
There.
A
I
also
got
really
excited
about
that
because
I
saw
some
okay.
Oh,
we
should
also
add
this
change
to
include
the
module
and
the
config
file,
so
we
can
tell
people
which
module
is
missing
and
I'm
like
I
I
remember
that
issue.
I
created
it
a
very
long
time
ago.
It's
a
1
000
issue
number,
which
is
like
revive
the
old
issues.
This
is
great,
so
that
is
one
eight
one
one.
If
anyone
wants
to
see
that-
and
these
are
definitely
separate
but
related
they'll-
both
improve
the
config
sync
experience.
E
D
I
think
I
I
think
I
followed
that
all
right,
so
is
it
a
keyword
fixes
or
is
it
just
any
link
to
the.
E
Just
the
link,
just
the
link,
won't
work,
the
link,
it
does
add
it
in
the
thread
of
messages,
but
the
you
know
how
there's
the
sidebar,
where
we
have
all
the
labels
for
the
issue,
the
milestones
etc.
So,
if
you
add
the
word
fixes,
there's
some
other
keywords
as
well,
but
fixes
is
the
one
that
I
know
of
and
then
space
and
then
a
full
link
to
the
issue.
Then
it
adds
it
as
a
metadata.
There.
E
E
And
I
can-
and
I
can
help
you
out
if
yeah
and
I
can
demonstrate
what
I
can't
share
my
screen
now
but
yeah
what
it
actually
does
after
you
do,
that.
E
You've
done
it,
we
got
a
request.
So
if
you
look
at
the
issue
now,
you
will
see
the
link
to
the
pull
request
on
the
sidebar
on
the
right.
Under
the
linked
pull
request,
section
say
it's
easier
for
for
the
rest
of
the
people
to
know
how
many
pull
requests
are
there.
You
know
if
there's
multiple
by
many
people,
which
ones
have
been
closed,
which
ones
have
been
merged.
Things
like
that.
D
F
E
A
All
right,
any
other
user
experience
issues
we
want
to
talk
about.
We
also
could
talk
about
design
focused
issues,
so
those
are
issues
where
we
feel
like
the
solution
to
the
problem
needs
input
from
somebody
who
understands
how
to
create
a
design
or
how
to
improve
the
design
of
a
page,
which
is
not
me.
A
I
feel
like
every
time
I
run
into
one
of
those
issues,
I'm
pretty
good
about
adding
the
design
label
on
it,
because
I
know
it's
out
of
my
scope,
but
I'm
sure
there
are
probably
a
lot
of
other
issues
in
the
queue
that
need
the
expertise
of
a
designer
that
don't
have
the
label
on
them,
which
makes
them
a
little
hard
to
find
just
because
it
comes
up
as
we're
working
on
other
stuff,
we're
like.
Oh,
we
should
consider
the
design
of
this
user
interface
or
whatever.
E
And
unfortunately,
we
don't
have
designer
experts
in
the
team
we're
all
amateurs
but
yeah.
If
anyone
joins
the
community,
they
will
be
able
to.
You
know,
filter
the
issues
by
that.
A
E
A
A
That
would
be
good.
I
would
also
love
it
if
we
brought
in
someone
who
not
only
cared
about
colors
and
fonts,
but
also
had
an
eye
for
like
what
could
be
an
accessibility
issue,
because
I
know
that,
like
we're
using
a
lot
of
grays
in
our
admin
theme
and
I've
been
doing
a
lot
of
government
work
lately
where
everything
has
to
be
made
accessible
and
there's
stuff
that
I
come
across.
I'm
like
I
never
would
have
thought
that
would
be
a
problem
and
they
look
like
backdrops
admin
theme
and
I'm
like.
A
I
don't
really
know
exactly
what
the
issues
are,
but
if
we
could
get
someone
to
come
in
and
be
like,
you
know
this
could
be
useful
for
basis.
It
could
be
useful
for
seven.
It
could
be
useful,
for
you
know
any
interface,
something
like
vertical
tabs.
That's
going
to
appear
everywhere,
stuff
like
that,
I
think
would
be
great
to
get
it.
C
On
that
is
the
layout
ui,
like
I've,
had
people
who
can't
tell
the
difference
between
the
gray.
That's
the
main
background
and
the
gray.
That's
the
region,
background.
C
And
so
they
they
were
actually
this
person.
She
was
dragging
around
blocks
and
she
commented
that
sometimes
the
blocks
get
really
skinny
and
she
doesn't
know
why
or
how
and
how
some
of
them
on
some
layouts
they
don't
do
that
and
on
some
layouts
they
do,
and
it
was
because
there
was
a
sidebar
region
in
that
layout.
A
I
think
on
somewhere
on
drupal,
I
don't
remember
if
it
was
panels
or
not,
there
was
something
where,
when
you
dragged
it,
it
would
put
a
little
dotted
line
around
the
outside
of
the
region.
So
it
wasn't
there
all
the
time,
but
as
soon
as
you
picked
up
a
block,
it
was
very
clear
where
you
could
put
it.
I
liked
that.
A
A
A
This
is
an
old
one.
It's
not
a
very
well
labeled
issue,
issue
number
one,
six,
three,
two
drop
it
in
zulu
also.
E
Yeah,
I
think
that
the
screenshot
is
all
there
that
it
doesn't
apply
anymore,
but
the
the
issue
is
still
present.
A
E
A
Okay,
then
I'll
maybe
do
a
rewrite
of
that
whole
issue.
E
E
A
A
E
I
think
there's
something
similar
when
you're
in
the
ui
that
you're
building
flexible
layouts
and
I
think
that
the
it
has
to
do
with
the
region
that
you
that
you're
dragging
or
the
regions
in
general
that
you
don't
immediately
know
that
they're
draggable,
they
don't
have
any
crosshair
thingies.
So
anyone
that
has
worked
with
them
knows
that
they're
draggable.
But
it's
not
immediately
apparent.
A
I
think
I
ran
into
that
too.
I
did
a
demo
for
somebody
yesterday
and
they're
like
oh,
you
can
drag
them
and
I
thought
that
like
of
course
you
can
drag
them,
but
it
didn't
occur
to
me.
There
wasn't
any
visual
cue
there,
but
that's
yeah
yeah.
C
Oh
yeah.
It
has
some
like
border
stuff.
C
E
E
C
If
you
mouse,
if
you
mount
it's
actually
inheriting
the
css
of
the
admin
theme,
so
if
you
so
the
the
header
region
is
actually
goes
all
the
way
across
the
screen,
and
it's
that
great,
that's
that
gray
color,
so
so
that
that
row
is
actually
inheriting
the
css
from
the
admin
theme
around
it.
It
shouldn't
happen.
E
C
E
Yeah,
I
think
I
think
that
we
should
bring
that
in
line
with
the
layout
builder,
so
that
it's
more
consistent
yeah.
So
the
region
should
have
dotted
lines
and
then
the.
But
we
need
to
keep
in
mind
that
what
we're
dragging
in
the
layout
builder
is
blocks,
whereas
in
the
other
instance
it's
just
regions
that
we're
dragging
around.
F
C
Yeah,
I
don't
know,
can
I
share
my
screen
for
a
minute
yeah.
I
want
to
show
something
else
on
this.
C
Okay,
so
here
we
have
regions
that
are
they
have
the
container
applied
to
them
and
if
I
configure
the
row
and
remove
the
container,
it
makes
it
wider.
But
it's
so
the
difference
here
between
this
thing,
which
does
not,
which
is
fixed
width-
and
this
thing
here,
which
is
full
screen
width-
is
very
tiny.
C
A
A
Let's
see
so
one
issue
that
is
on
our
agenda,
that's
been
here
for
a
while
is
how
to
safely
change
css
in
one.x,
and
I
think
we
have
an
idea
here,
which
was
to
add
supplemental
css
selectors.
I
don't
think
I
have
a
full
request
for
an
example.
Let
me
just
follow
the
bottom
here.
F
A
A
Yeah
still
need
to
re-read
it,
okay
and
then
I
feel
like.
A
Oh,
that
sparked
an
idea,
and
then
I
lost
it.
But
I
came
back.
I
wanted
to
throw
out
some
ideas
and
this
might
not
be
the
right
place
to
do
it,
but
just
because
I'm
thinking
about
it
right
now
about
what
backdrop
two
is
gonna
look
like
this
is
in
2025,
so
we
have
a
little
bit
time
to
decide.
But
I
was
thinking
like
there's
a
bunch
of
stuff
that
we've
run
into
recently,
where
we've
tried
to
make
changes
to
the
admin
theme
and
as
we're
looking
at
it,
we
go.
A
Oh,
we
should
really
improve
the
markup
here
and
the
admin
theme
is
the
safest
place
to
be
able
to
do
something
like
that.
Really,
because
the
number
of
people
that
are
providing
an
override
for
the
administrative
theme
is
much
fewer
than
the
number
of
people
who
are
providing
an
override
for
the
out
of
box
theme.
But
it
does
still
present
an
issue
or
if
somebody
has
written
a
bunch
of
css
against
the
markup,
that's
there
and
you
change
the
markup.
A
You
can
break
their
site,
so
we've
been
pushing
back
on
making
changes
to
markup
and
css
in
some
places,
because
we're
worried
about
the
effect
it'll
have
on
people
running
backdrop
sites,
and
I
don't
think
that
that's
something
we'll
ever
be
able
to
do
in
a
way
that's
going
to
be
backwards
compatible
in
terms
of
markup.
It's
just
I
mean.
Maybe
we'll
come
up
with
something
in
the
next
five
years,
but
I
haven't
thought
of
anything.
Yet
I
don't
know,
but
I
was
thinking
that
backdrop
major
versions.
A
If
we
continue
to
say
okay,
there's
a
bunch
of
stuff
that
we
can
add,
we
can
add
new
features.
We
can
add
new
apis.
We
can
add
a
whole
bunch
of
stuff
in
ways
that
is
backwards
compatible
backdrop
two
could
drop
the
stuff,
that's
marked
as
deprecated,
but
it
could
also
be
an
opportunity
for
us
to
make
those
markup
changes
that
we
want
to
make,
and
that
way
we
would.
It
would
be
saying.
A
So
I
don't
know
if
anyone
has
any
thoughts
on
that.
Yet.
C
B
C
C
A
Like
if
you
always
target
by
using
classes
instead
of
like
tags
or
something,
then
that
would
give
us
the
ability
to
change
the
tag
level
or
the
tag
entirely.
Right
like
that.
E
Joseph
when
you
said
ui
tool,
what
exactly
are
you
referring
to
like
the?
What
are
they
called
like
ui
kits
reusable
patterns,
or
what
did
you
refer
to
when
you
say
so.
C
C
D
D
Perhaps
there's
a
there
there's
a
fork
like
the
distinction
between
stable
and
classy
and
drupal
world,
where
there's
a
opinionated
structure
versus
a.
C
A
I
like
it,
though,
especially
now
that
we're
giving
people
ui
tools
to
do
things
like
change
tags
and
heading
levels.
It
makes
it
even
more
important
that
your
css
is
written
in
a
way
that
it's
not
so
brittle
that
using
the
interface
we
provide,
you
can
break
the
way
your
site
looks,
and
I
think
that
this
is
going
to
be
really
helpful.
A
Not
just
you
know
in
in
telling
us
as
core
developers
what
we
shouldn't
be
changing
from
factory
one
to
backdrop
two,
but
anyone
who's
building
a
theme
for
backdrop,
could
read
this
documentation
and
be
like.
Oh
because
there's
the
user
interface,
where
people
change
their
block
heading
level,
I
better
not
target
an
h2
or
h3.
If
I
want
to
make
it
a
specific
color
or
something
I
should
target
block
title
instead,
that's
a
that's
a
fantastic
example
joseph
really
made
it
sink
in
for
me.
I
don't
know
how
we
would
go
about
documenting.
A
All
of
that,
I
feel
like
it's
gonna,
be
really
hard
to
do
like
a
start
to
finish
complete
guide,
but
we
might,
you
know,
start
with
what
we
know
and
see.
A
You
know
if
some
documentation
is
better
than
none,
so
we
can
start
there
and,
as
we
run
into
problems,
we
can
document
them
and
we
could
even
like
write
tests
against
it.
I
guess.
D
This,
give
them
somebody
to
get
stuff
done,
while
not,
while
not
handcuffing
the
people
that
do
know
how
to
do
it
right,
but
as
long
as,
if
we
find
some
way
to
make
it
like
you're,
making
an
intentional
decision
like
you.
If
you
want
to
stay,
you
know
within
canon.
You
can
use
these
tools,
but
you
have
to
follow
these
rules.
D
If
you
want
to
break
them,
you
know
here's
what
you're
risking
and
I
mean
right-
I'm
not
sure
how
big
it
sounds
like
a
big
task
to
come
up
with
a
list
of
things,
but
but
maybe
maybe
some
of
them
can
be,
can
be
teased
out.
C
C
Like
so
one
example
would
be
a
like
a
university
site
where
they
have
500
sites
that
all
look
the
same.
C
You
know
in
a
multi-site
and
the
university,
it's
people
are
not
going
to
want
anyone
to
change
the
colors
of
their
theme,
so
they
might
turn
that
off,
but
so
basically
having
multiple
permission
levels
and
multiple
functionality,
levels
that
could
be
turned
on
and
off
independent
of
each
other,
so
give
people
the
ability
to
apply
like
a
call
to
action
style
to
a
block
on
their
site
without
being
able
to
change
the
color
of
that
in
the
case
of
the
university
site.
C
B
A
Yeah
interesting,
though
part
of
my
eagerness
to
talk
about
it
now
is
that
I
feel
like
if
we
could
make
a
decision
at
some
point
soon.
It
would
give
us
a
lot
more
flexibility
to
start
making
changes
to
things.
A
We
want
to
see
changed
so
like
oh,
I
can't
change
this
right
now,
but
do
I
know
if
I'll
ever
be
able
to
do
it,
but
if
we
know
it'll
come
in
factor
of
two,
we
could
have
a
two
branch
that
includes
like
markup
changes,
but
right
now
we're
sort
of
still
a
question
mark
is
what
what's
going
into
two
all
right.