►
From YouTube: The Baseline Show: with Daniel Norkin
Description
The weekly office hours for the Baseline Protocol open source community, Wednesdays at noon in the US-Eastern timezone. And don't miss the show on Saturdays at 6pm in the Indian (IST) timezone. Learn more at https://baseline-protocol.org.
Date: May 18, 2022
Guest Speakers: Daniel Norkin (Envision)
A
B
Hello,
everybody
welcome
to
our
may
18th
baseline,
show
where
we
have
daniel
norton
from
envision
blockchain
solutions.
A
very
familiar
face
in
the
community
he's
been
around
since
the
inception,
but
officially
on
our
show
as
a
guest
today.
So
we'll
be
talking
all
about
what
envision
is
up
to
the
original
days
of
baseline
with
vision
involved
and
all
other
topics
happening
in
the
space
right
now
so
first
I'll
hand
over
to
you
daniel,
to
give
an
intro
on
yourself
and
envision
for
those
of
us
who
are
unfamiliar.
C
A
C
So
much
so
now
and
pleasure
to
be
on
here,
you
know
kind
of,
like
I
commented
in
the
baseline
slack
chat.
You
know
long
time
listener.
First
time,
caller
you
know
been
involved
in
the
baseline
community.
You
know
from
I
won't
say
from
from
the
very
start,
because
there
were
people
that
had
you
know,
developed
the
thawed
and
put
the
time
and
energy
into
baseline
before
it
was
officially
open
source,
but
envision
was
part
of
the
open
source.
Launching,
if
you
will,
you
know
so
definitely
happy
to
happy
to.
C
You
know,
talk
about
the
past
present
and
future
for
those
that
don't
know
about
envision
blockchain.
We
are
a
application
development
organization
that
focuses
in
the
web3
space.
C
So
we
help
out
customers
on
all
the
different
levels
of
their
journey
in
web
3,
whether
it's
from
you
know,
ideation
all
the
way
through
design,
proof
of
concept
and
obviously
scale
deployment
so
happy
to
be
here
thanks.
Everyone.
B
C
Yes,
I
mean
you
know
as
as
a
as
a
system
integrator,
we
always
gravitated
to
the
idea
of
baseline,
because
you
know
our
our
entire
business
model
is
not
to
create
the
new
protocols.
It's
not
to
create.
You
know
our
our
own
ip,
but
rather
help
organizations
adopt
a
technology
that
exists
out
there
and
help
you
know
literally
integrate
systems
or
to
create
something
new
out
there.
C
You
know
so
so
when,
when
we,
when
we
first
joined
the
baseline
community,
we
were
doing
a
lot
of
education
around
it,
because
I
think
that
the
you
know
that
the
the
concept
of
what
baseline
stands
for
is
something
that's
extremely
relevant
right.
It's
like
people,
people
use
blockchain
or
think
about
blockchain
like
a
major
database
right,
and
we
all
know
that.
There's
issues
to
go
with
that.
C
So
the
fact
that
the
baseline
pattern
has
all
sorts
of
different
technologies
like
zero
knowledge,
proofs
and
smart
contracts
and
message
brokers
and
all
sorts
of
things
that
work
together
to
kind
of
add
that
level
of
privacy
and
kind
of
I
don't
know
like
like
a
level
of
maturity
to
this
emerging
technology
really
attracted
us.
C
So
from
education
we
were
also
involved
in
some
of
the
early
demos,
so
envisioned
blockchain
was
the
organization
that
put
together
the
demo
for
dynamics
365
back
in
the
day
us
as
a
microsoft
gold
partner,
so
that
was
kind
of
our
our
our
end
to
the
community.
We
worked
together
with
the
provide
folks
and
the
unibright
folks
and
consensus
as
well
to
go
ahead
and
put
put
together
some
of
the
some
of
the
early
early
demos.
C
We
also,
I
remember
that
I
I
was
I
was
the
it
was
the
kind
of
the
the
I
don't
know,
leader
or
presenter,
of
the
baseline
summit
education
track,
where
I
think
that
there's
a
youtube
video
of
me,
probably
talking
for
like
72
hours
straight,
so
you
know
heavy
heavy
on
the
education
side
in
the
early
days.
For
sure
I
know
that
envision
was
also.
C
You
know,
I
won't
say
that
we
played
a
heavy
hand
in
the
early
parts
of
the
standards
organizations,
but
I
know
that
you
know
we
were
there
for
the
early
conversations
as
well.
So
you
know
just
we
we
stopped.
You
know
we
stopped
paying
attention
to
it
after
the
first
maybe
month
or
two
months
of
the
standards
organization,
but
as
as
I
was
looking
around,
I
think
that
you
guys
actually
launched
with
that
standard
right.
B
D
Yeah
the
standard
one
yeah
it
is
well,
it
would
be
going
through
the
ratification
process
if
there
were
a
ratification
process
to
find
there
is
none.
Yet
the
pgb
is
working
on
it
to
to
to
do
that,
and
that
is
is
those
are.
Those
are.
You
know,
immensely
pleasurable
calls
to
be
a
part
of.
C
D
D
It's
like
is
a
is
an
is
an
is
an
is
an
interesting
thing.
I
just
just
a
little
tidbit,
which
is
really
really
interesting.
So
standards
bodies
have
have
adopted
accessibility
requirements,
which
is
a
really
good
thing.
So
it's
like
how
can
a
blind
person
read
or
or
consume
a
standard?
You
know
besides
being
read
to
him
the
or
them
actually
not
him
her
when
it's
when
it's
an
image.
D
So
how
do
you
do
that
so,
and
this
is
not
only
for
blind
person,
you
can
you
know
it's
like
it's
it's
it's
any.
You
know
it's
like.
Basically,
any
form.
How?
How
can
you
make
standards
standards,
work
more
accessible
for
people
with
just
disabilities
is
a
really
interesting
challenge,
the
the
so
all
the
centers
bodies
sdos
are
adopting
these
kind
of
like
accessibility
requirements
for
their
for
their
standards.
However,
they
assume
that
both
the
editors
of
the
standard
and
the
authors
are
experts
in
that.
D
In
that
area
I
mean
not
only
is
that
that
the
accessibility
requirements
are
not.
You
know
uniform
across
all
the
different
sdos.
There
is
also
no
support
for
editors
and
authors
to
actually
do
it
right
right,
which
means
it's
it's
like
you're.
It's
like
it's
like
it's
like
you're,
being
asked
to
to
to
to
write
braille
without,
or
you
know,
to
to
to
to
create
something
in
braille
when
you
have
no
idea
what
braille
is
or
or
or
how
it
works,
or
anything
like
that,
it's
probably.
D
D
Support
right
so
it's
mandated
by
by
sdos
so
standard
development
organizations,
but
there
is
no
institutional
support
for
that,
so
that
that's
a
fun
discussions.
We
we
we
have
right
now.
Yes,
benjamin
that
that
is
indeed
true.
That's
like
the
w3c
is
was
one
of
the
first
to
do
that
and
that's
going
to
be
adopted,
and
I
think
it's
really
important
right.
It's
really
important,
but
having
said
that,
it
is
without
the
right
support
right.
D
Your
you're
you're
out,
it's
like
it's
like
asking
asking
a
blind
man
or
one
person
to
identify
color
right.
It's
like
it's
like
there's,
no
there's
there's!
No!
There
is
no
foundational
knowledge
how
to
do
that.
The
right
way
right
and
therefore
by
editors
and
and
authors
like
do
you
know?
I
don't
so.
D
D
Exactly
so
so,
there's
there's
what
you
have
with
with
like
in
images
you,
you
see
that
with
with,
like
you
know,
in
the
different
different
editors,
there's
alt
text,
so
that
that
all
text
allows
you
to
describe
the
the
image.
But
how
do
you
do
that
for
a
blind
person?
It's
like
you
know
you
go
like
there's
a
circle.
D
You
know
it's
like
the
overall
diagram
is
called.
You
know
it's
like
is
called
like
a
bpi
architecture.
You
know
the
top
layer
is
represented
as
a
box.
D
You
know
with
three
smaller
box
labeled
x,
with
three
smaller
boxes
in
it,
labeled
xyz,
right
that
that's
the
type
of
stuff
that
you
need
right
and
then
the
the
point
is.
How
do
you
do
that
most
effectively
right?
What's
the
standard,
how
to
do
that?
How
do
you
do
that
in
such
a
way
that
it's
not
confusing
for,
for
you
know
disabled
people
right,
so
there
is
no.
C
C
D
Playing
playing
blind
chess
against
40
people
at
the
same
time,
the
the
the
great
grand
master
night
of,
did
it
and
actually
won
most
of
the
the
the
those
those
matches,
but
he
was
so
confused.
He
couldn't
do
anything
for
like
two
days
afterwards,
literally
it's
true
true,
true
story
anyway.
The
the
the
point
is
that
and
that's
a
that's
a
discussion
point.
D
It's
like
you
know,
sdos
need
to
provide
or
should
not
need
to
should
provide
resources
that
help
editors
and
authors
to
do
that,
right,
experts
that
that
can
do
this
effectively
and
efficiently
and
can
work
with
the
editors
and
and
authors
and
and
and
help
them
do
that
right
right
now,
it's
like
oh,
just
write
it
any
way.
You
want
it,
and
so
it's
it's!
It's
not
it's
not
very
helpful.
D
So
having
discussions
with
like
oasis
and
va-
and
you
know
around
that-
so
it's
it's-
I
I
I
find
that
that
is
actually
the
most
interesting
aspect
of
the
whole
process
discussions
because
otherwise
it's
it's
just
you
know
discussing
what
label
we
put
on
an
arrow
to
explain
how
the
process
works
so,
which
is
which
is
fascinating,
but
anyway,
I'm
I'm
like
I'm
like
rambling
on.
I
don't
want
to
derail
this.
D
This
is
about
daniel,
but
I
just
thought
I
would
share
that
because
it's
an
interesting
tidbit,
that
is,
that
shows
you
about
what
people
are,
what
people
are
concerned
about,
what
they're
discussing
and
what
they're?
Actually
what
actual
issues
are
and
relevant
ones.
C
That
was
the
question
right
because,
because
I
was
saying
that
you
know
I
had
just
left
off
basically
on
the
creation
of
the
standards
standards
group
right,
so
you
know
that's
kind
of
bringing
me
in
a
little
bit
as
to
what
some
of
the
some
of
the
thinking
is
going
on.
A
C
C
A
C
A
C
No,
it's
it's
it's!
It's
a
you
know,
thanks
for
asking
yeah
we're
we're
involved
in
a
lot
of
different
areas
within
the
web
3
space
right
now.
You
know
we
are
so
for,
for
example,
myself-
and
I
see
I
see
ben
over
here
on
this
call
as
well
ben
bukari,
so
so
we're
both
the
co-chairs
of
the
eea
tokenization
group-
and
you
know
we
have.
We
have
a
really
interesting
kind
of
agenda
scheduled
out
for
the
next
couple
months.
C
I
want
to
say
so,
for
example,
what
we're
doing
is
it's
it's
kind
of
like
education,
but
work
at
the
same
time,
so
over
the
next
couple
months
we're
putting
on
a
webinar
series
that
focus
around
kind
of,
for
you
can
loosely
say
like
I'm,
not
I'm
not
gonna,
I'm
not
gonna
coin
the
phrase
over
here,
but
but
I'm
kind
of
calling
this
kind
of
like
the
pillars
of
tokenization
in
a
way
where
the
first
webinar-
and
this
is
enough-
no
specific
order,
it's
not
on
purpose,
but
the
first
webinar
is
around
the
legal
regulatory
framework
of
tokens.
C
The
second
one
is
around
the
technical
framework
of
tokens.
The
third
one
is
around
token
economics.
C
Fourth,
one
is
around
an
ethical
framework
and
then
the
next
couple,
webinars
after
that,
are
going
to
be
kind
of
like
a
use
case,
study,
taking
a
look
at
these
four
different
pillars
and
how
they
apply
to
different
different
types
of
use.
Cases
out
there,
whether
it's
you
know,
environmental
cases,
real
estate
cases,
royalty
cases,
security,
so
on
and
so
forth.
So
you
know
excited
excited
about
that.
I
think
tokenization
is
super
hot.
That's
really!
All
that
we're
doing
right
now
is
a
lot
of
use
cases
within
tokenization.
C
You
know
a
lot
of
familiar
faces
here,
so
envision
is
also
working
together
with
the
tree
trunk
team
and
consensus
to
put
together
treetrunk.io
some
of
the
relevant
kind
of,
like,
I
won't
say
directly.
The
work
from
baseline
correlates
with
that,
but
I
think
that
the
work
with
the
zero
knowledge
proofs
and
the
development
of
the
circuits
is
is
some
interesting.
Some
interesting
points
right
there
that
a
couple
of
our
c
plus
plus
developers
are
helping
out
with
the
zero
knowledge
proof
circuits.
C
Of
course,
you
know
it's
always
great
to
have
the
the
design
there
from
dr
andreas
freund
and
some
of
some
of
the
work
over
there.
With
regards
to
the
circuits,
we
have
a
number
of
circuits
that
we're
creating
couple
of
them
are
finished.
We
still
have
a
lot
more
to
tackle
as
the
weeks
go
on
and
then
you
know
we're
also
doing
a
lot
of
work
in
the
sustainability
space,
so
so
we're
currently
building
an
open
source
platform.
C
So
this
is
a
tokenization
platform
that
mints
either
fungible
tokens
or
non-fungible
tokens
based
on
specific
policies
and
within
the
esg
space.
The
way
that
you
create
offsets
or
you
create
emissions,
either
a
ghg
policy
or
that's
on
the
emissions
side
or
creating
offsets.
Then
there's
other
types
of
policies
like
from
the
popular
ones
like
gold,
standard
and
vera.
C
A
E
Hey
everybody,
sorry
I
was
late,
I
didn't.
I
didn't
bring
the
music
so.
C
E
We
got
to
get
that
teed
up
somehow
on
on
some
kind
of
a
thing.
Do
you
guys
know
that
one?
The
one
time
baseline
protocol
ever
got
a
takedown
warning
from
from
youtube
from
youtube?
Was
we
were?
We
were
playing
the
the
the
magic
bus
song
a
lot
right,
and
you
know
it
was
just
short
segments
of
it
just
because
it
you
know
that
was
kind
of
our
catchphrase
in
the
beginning,
magic,
bus
and
and
it's
the
who's
song
right.
E
If
you
don't
know
the
magic
box
bus
song
by
the
who
and
and
one
day,
I
forgot
to
turn
off
the
kill,
the
the
stream
and
so
out
of
yeah.
So
basically,
we
serenaded
youtube
for
like
three
hours,
maybe
six
hours
with
the
full
length
version
of
the
who's
proprietary
song.
E
Well,
yeah,
as
we
as
they
should
have
so,
but
you
know,
because
you
know
it
was
it
was
I
you
know,
the
link
that
we
were
playing
was
was
appropriate,
which
is
like
you
know,
less
than
15
seconds
or
whatever
it
was.
But
yeah
six
hours
is
not
okay,
mm-hmm,
you
mean.
E
A
D
C
E
Tj
czymoleski
painted
that
or
drew
it
on
my
wall
the
day.
I
think
he
got
coped
and
it
was
the
day
before
the
walls
came
down,
and
I
don't
know
why
I
didn't
get
covered
that
day
and
I
think
he
came
out
with
cove,
but
he
said
that
he
was.
He
got
sick,
the
very
next
day
and
and
and
then
I
I
proceeded
to
color
it
in
tj,
jaleski
everybody,
a
great
great
designer.
A
And
I
believe
stickers
were
made
from
it:
correct,
yeah,
yes,
yeah!
Yes,
there
are
and
handed
out
in
amsterdam.
That's
right.
Bingo.
C
A
B
Daniel,
I
have
another
question
for
you.
We
talked
the
other
day
about
where
the
baseline
protocol
is
now
in
regards
to
the
standard
being
fully
written,
but
some
more
foundational
steps
being
done
in
the
community
with
that
road
map
that
I
shared
with
you
and
some
of
the
work
going
on
in
the
core
dives
and
outreach
team.
So
I
wanted
to
ask
your
thoughts
on
that.
I
think
you're
well
aware
on
how
slowly
standards
bodies
move.
C
Yeah
I
mean
you
know
like
we
were
talking
about.
You
know
what
andreas
was
saying
with
with
regards
to.
Accessibility
is
just
like
one
of
the
many
things
that
makes
standards
kind
of
slow
to
move.
It's
never
easy
in
an
open
source
community
to
be
able
to
come
up
with
a
standard
that
really
fits
everybody,
because
things
that
are
going
to
be
made
are
going
to
have
to
then
be
taken
by.
You
know
every
participating
party,
and
then
thereafter
you
know
so
it's
it's
like
it's
like.
C
Never
easy
and-
and
I
give
a
lot
of
credit
to
to
the
folks
that
are,
you
know,
still
banging
away
at
it
because
you
know,
like
you
know,
and
I
can't
I
can't
say
it
enough
that
it's
you
know
it's
a
it's
a
dirty
job,
but
someone
has
to
do
it
and
I
think
that
standards
in
general
are
important
because
you
know
it's
like
when
we're
talking
about
emerging
technology
or
just
any
technology.
C
It's
like
nobody
wants
to
be
the
one
from
adoption
perspective
to
just
kind
of
like
try
things
out.
There
are
some
right.
Those
are
those
are
kind
of
like
the
riskier
the
riskier
companies
in
the
world
that
have
maybe
a
higher
risk
tolerance,
but
when
something
has
gone
through
a
standard,
it
makes
it
a
little
bit
more
tolerable
or
a
little
bit
less
risk-averse
to
be
able
to
adopt
it.
Now,
with
that
said,
it's
like
not
all
standards
are
created.
C
Equally,
you
know
and
the
thing
that
we
were
talking
about
offline,
it's
like
well,
what
makes
one
standard
better
than
the
other
and
what
makes
the
standard
a
standard
and
why?
Why
are
we
going
to.
E
That's
what
the
open
source
play
normally
is
right.
Is
you
know,
I'm
gonna,
I'm
gonna
open
source,
something
a
lot
of
companies.
I
mean
my
old
companies
included.
You
know,
would
open
source,
partly
as
a
marketing
strategy
to
say,
and
especially
for
like
chinese
firms.
That
would
you
know
that
were
very
concerned
about
you
know
a
proprietary
buying,
proprietary
tech
from
say,
a
us
firm
you
open
source
it
and,
and
somehow
that
gives
it
a
stamp
of
safety.
Of
course,.
E
Can
compile
naughty
things
into
the
compile?
You
know
it
could
be
open
source,
but
the
runtime
might
be
dangerous
depending
on
who
compiled
it
and
what
they
put
in
it.
C
Right,
well,
companies
or
you
know
the
technology
leaders
at
organizations
want
to
be
able
to
audit
code
and
want
to
be
able
to
make
sure
that
everything
is
cope.
Aesthetic
and
you
know
that
there's
no
known
vulnerabilities
for
them
to
be
able
to
adopt
it.
In
fact,
I
remember
talking
to
an
organization
it
was
about
a
year
ago
where
they
were
going
through.
You
know
I'm
not
going
to
mention
any
names,
but
they
were
going
through
different.
C
You
know
web
3
protocols,
blockchain
protocols,
and
they
you
know
canceled
out
the
ones
that
weren't
open
sourced
you
know
just
just
for
that
fact
that
they
weren't
open
source.
So
you
know
it's
like
it's
it's
a
big
thing,
but
what
we're
talking
about
here
is
there's
a
difference
between
open
sourcing,
something
and
and
calling
something
a
standard,
because
anything
could
be
open
sourced,
but
not
everything
could
call
itself
well,
I
guess
anything
could
call
itself
a
standard,
but
not
everything
could
be
a
standard
that
stands.
C
You
know
that
kind
of
like
holds
true
to
a
standard,
and
I
think
that's
what
you
were
saying
earlier,
that
there's
like
standard
organizations
out
there
that
are,
you,
know,
kind
of
approved
right.
It's
like
a
bunch
of
people
can
get
together
and
say
that
this
is
a
standard,
but
I
think
that
you
know
it's
important
to
have
a
good
governing
body
behind
that
standard.
D
Daniel,
why
don't
you
tell
a
little
bit
about
like
the
work
that
you
guys
did
around
the
the
the
guardian
with
adoption
with
in
terms
of
like
standards
and
adopting
standards
and
and
and
and
moving
that
moving
that
forward,
because
that's
relevant
also
for
baseline,
because
it
it
it's
about
dids
and
vcs
and
and
and
so
forth,
which
is
which
is
you
know,
starting
to
to
to
really,
you
know,
be
adopted
more
broadly
across
various
various
various
various
projects.
C
Yeah,
no,
that's!
That's
a
that's
a
good
point,
so
I
kind
of
alluded
to
it.
A
little
bit
earlier
when
mark
was
asking
what
what?
What
kind
of
things
have
we
been
doing
so
what's
interesting
about
the
guardian
project
right,
it's
kind
of
like
the
problem
statement
right.
I
got
to
start
with
the
problem
statement
and
then
we'll
and
we'll
get
into
the
dids
and
vcs,
because
that's
that's
really
the
answer
to
the
problem
statement.
The
problem
statement
is
carbon.
Offsets
are
nothing
new
they've
been
around
for
a
very
long
time.
C
It's
just
that
when
they
get
when
when
when
an
offset
is
created
and
it
meets
a
specific
policy,
there's
you
know.
Congratulations.
You
got
your
offset.
It's
like
a
pdf,
that's
like
as
like
a
certificate.
C
So
when
there's
a
buyer
of
that
offset
when
someone
wants
to
go
and
spend
money
on
that
because
they
want
to
offset
their
emissions,
it's
very
difficult
to
be
able
to
rate
the
quality
of
that
offset.
You
can't
audit
it
or
anything
like
that.
So
part
of
part
of
what
the
guardian
does
is.
What
we
call
is
the
trust
chain.
C
Trust
chain
is
a
chain
of
just
like
andreas
said:
it's
did
verifiable
credentials
that
are
all
wrapped
up
in
a
verifiable
presentation
that
allow
you
to
see
every
single
thing
that
happens
along
the
entire
track
of
it,
and
I
think
that
the
whole
point
of
the
standards
part
is
when
we
were
looking
at.
What's
the
best
way
that
we
can
go
ahead,
and
you
know
show
this
sort
of
information,
we
want
to
make
sure
that
we
use
kind
of
like
a
universally
adopted
standard
that
that
that
had
credibility
behind
it.
C
So
obviously
the
w3c
is
like
the
first
place
to
go,
look
at
and
and
that's
where
we
adopted
the
w3c
standard
for
the
dids,
the
vcs
and
the
vps.
D
It
was
not
so
much
the
vcs
is
more
the
dids
right.
It's
a
word
with
the
the
the
the
did
standard
is
stuck
because
you
know
mozilla
and
google,
and
and
so
forth,
they're
they're
they're,
taking
offense
at
the
fact
that
the
the
that
blockchains
are
used
for
anchoring
those
those
those
dids
that
are
not
environmentally
friendly.
D
D
You
basically
can
fundamentally
disrupt
the
entire
certificate
authority
market,
which
is
shilling
here,
which
is
what
the
integrated
trust
network
is
going
to
do
when
it
launches
later
this
this
year,
which
is
going
to
be
a
federated
certificate
authority
formed
by
some
of
the
largest
organizations
on
this
planet
so
that
they
will,
they
will
go
in
and
and
the
itn
will
directly
compete
with,
with
the
likes
of
octa
and
google
and
facebook,
as
as
certificate
authorities,
yeah
using
dids,
nvc's
right,
using
dits
and
and
and
vcs,
and
the
appropriate
software
packages
wrapped
around
it.
E
E
I
don't
know
I
I
got
no
problem
with
that.
I
don't
know
what
the
new
generations
are
all
about.
It's
like
I'm,
like
hey,
I
like
my
free
email
and
I
like
my
the
fact
that
I've
got.
You
know
that
I
like
the
fact
that
I
get
ads
that
that
are
creepily
accurate,
because
that
means
I'm
not
they're
not
wasting.
My
time
with
ads
that
I
have
no
interest
in
advertising
is
actually
is
an
astoundingly
amazing.
E
You
know
commercial
invention
for
doing
a
lot
it.
You
know.
I
don't
know.
People
are
annoyed
by
them
today,
but
I
you
know
it
used
to
be
back
in
the
60s
and
70s.
It
was
like
a
form
of
entertainment.
I.
D
C
Right
the.
Why
is
like?
Well
well,
it's
like,
if,
if
google
shuts
you
off
because
of
your
use
of
something
else,
that
is
not
because
of
your
because
of
your
views
right,
because,
if
you're
purchasing
history
over
here,
because
if
you
purchased
something
that
that
that
one
organization
didn't
like
so
therefore
you
know,
but
it's
like
yeah.
E
E
Sure,
but
you
know,
on
the
other
hand,
do
we
re,
you
know
if
you're
fully
decentralized,
you
can't
shut
down
osama
bin
laden.
I
got
a
problem
with
that
too.
You
know
you
can't
have
it
both
ways
either
decent.
You
know
you
either
have
controls
or
you
don't
have
controls
and
no
controls
is
anarchy
and
I
don't
I've
I've.
I've
had
a
glimpse
of
lord
of
the
flies
and
I'm
not
interested.
E
I
just
think
that
we're
missing
it,
the
centralization,
is
in
a
world
where
laziness
is
your
only
lock-in
right,
you
know
facebook
can
be
myspaced
as
easily.
You
know
over
time
and
probably
will
be.
You
know
there
is
competition,
it
gets
hard
monopolies
occur
and
then
we
break
them
up
and
there's
there's
back
and
forth,
but
saying
I
don't
know.
I
always
thought
that
ann
rand
was
both
ghoulish
and
a
terrible
writer.
So
I'm
not
a
libertarian.
D
D
Exactly
because,
because
it's
it's
it's
twitter,
it's
a
private
company,
they
can
they
can.
They
can
kick
everybody
off
and
no
one
can
do
anything
about
it
right.
It's
it's
it's!
The
the
the
the
the
key
here
is
is
is
the
recourse
and
how
do
you
establish
recourse
in
in
a
world
where,
where
there's
decentralization
right
now,
everything
that
is
being
that
is
decentralized
right,
which
is
like
you
know,
look
at
the
us
right.
It's
it's
a
it's!
D
D
D
A
A
C
I
got
it,
I
got
it,
so
how
did
I
get
into
this
space?
I
don't
know
it's
a
long.
It's
a
long.
It's
it's
a
long
path.
It
was.
It
was
a
good
one
for
sure
we
opened
up
envision
in
2018,
and
you
know
I
co-founded
it
with
a
business
partner
named
jason
panzis,
and
before
that
we
were
doing
project
management
consulting.
I
had
help.
C
It
wasn't
necessarily
a
startup
but
helped
bring
this
company
up
for
about
seven
years
before
that
we're
doing
project
manage
consulting
within
the
microsoft
ecosystem,
we're
doing
a
lot
of
project
online
implementations,
project
server,
implementations
and
what
was
happening
within
that
space
is
all
of
the
software
developers
were
standing
up,
their
own
jira
environments
and
they
were
standing
up
their
own.
You
know
version
version,
one
environments
and
pivotal
trackers
and
all
their
other
project
management
tool
sets
out
there.
C
So
what
started
out
as
a
basic
implementation,
service
of
project
online
and
project
server
ended
up
going
into
integration
services
where
you
know
like
we
worked
pretty
much
with
the
fortune,
500
pmos
of
the
world,
and
they
were
asking
us
to
provide
integration
services
to
bring
in
all
the
time
tracking
from
you
know,
from
the
jiras
from
the
version
ones,
and
then
it
went
from
that
to
larger
systems
like
okay.
C
Now
we
have
an
sap
system
and
we
have
people
clocking
time
in
there
can
we
all
you
know,
can
can
we
bring
all
the
roles?
You
know
the
erp
management
and
workday,
and
everything
like
that
and
bring
that
into
the
pmo
so
that
we
can
do
proper
resource
management
and
whatnot.
So
that
kind
of
brought
me
into
the
world
of
system
integrator.
C
So
then,
you
know
I'll
give
I'll
give
the
credit
to
jason
panzis,
who,
who
was
in
the
I
guess,
speculation
side
of
of
the
blockchain
industry
and
when
we
started
taking
a
look
at
you
know,
for
example,
like
what
ethereum
was
doing
from
the
business
side.
We
said.
Look,
there's
there's,
definitely
a
need
to
be
able
to
do
system
integration
in
the
protocol
side.
So
again
you
know
it's
like
we
don't
build
ip
for
ourselves.
C
We
help
and
build
ip
for
other
organizations
in
the
space
so
like.
When
we
came
into
this
space
in
2018,
we
didn't
want
it
an
app
we
didn't
want
to
come.
You
know,
try
to
build
the
next.
The
next
blockchain,
the
next
ethereum
right,
then
the
next
baseline
protocol,
but
again
helping
companies
integrate
with
these
sort
of
protocols
and
then
build
applications
on
top
of
that.
So
that's
that's
what
we've
been
doing
for
the
past
five
years.
C
C
You
know,
I
think,
that
it's
really
important
to
be
able
to
get
the
common
person
to
be
able
to
interact
with
these
blockchain
systems,
which
again,
which
is
another
another
reason
why,
for
example,
in
the
baseline
protocol
in
the
early
days,
we
did
the
demo
with
d365,
because
you
know
it's
like
people
needed
to
be
able
to
see
how
they
were
already
using
systems
and
using
dynamics
365
as
your
front
end.
C
But
you
can,
then
you
know
leverage
the
blockchain
networks
like
like
ethereum
as
the
main
net,
by
integrating
with
the
baseline
protocol
to
be
able
to
keep
things.
You
know
safely
secured
and
be
able
to
work
with
your
trading
partners
and
business
partners
again
from
a
user
experience
perspective.
C
I
am
having
fun
learning
the
the
zkp
side
of
things.
I
always
find
that
that
that
side
of
the
world
really
really
really
interesting.
It's
you
know
it's
complicated
in
theory,
but
the
actual
code
is
pretty
pretty
short.
You
know
you're
talking,
like
you
know,
not
I'll
use,
john's
favorite
line,
it's
about
four
lines
of
code
to
be
able
to
get
this
thing
done.
You
know,
but
it's
it's
it's
like.
What
can
we
do?
That's
gonna
help
increase
the
adoption.
C
You
know
it's
kind
of
what
I
really
like
so
definitely
working
on
zero
knowledge
proofs,
not
for
me,
but
you
know
from
from
the
developer
side,
really
seeing
what
our
team
is
doing
is
really
it's
really
exciting.
E
C
Yeah
like
we,
we
spoke,
a
lot
spoke
a
little
bit
about
it
at
the
beginning.
You
know
kind
of
like
how
how
we
got
involved.
You
know
and
no.
E
C
I
mean,
I
think,
multi-party
automation
is
important
because
it's
very
it's
very
difficult
to
do
business
by
yourself.
You
know
so.
E
Most
of
what
organizations
automation
projects
are
you
seeing
like
what's
where's
the
sweet
spot
in
the
in
the
industry,
now
we're
talking
about
funding
an
idc,
I
think
is
survey.
You
know
of
businesses
not
on
blockchain,
not
uneven
baselining.
Just
on
how
much
are
you
spending
core?
You
know
running
orchestration
between
web
services
or
operations
between
you
and
other
companies
that
are
automated
and
not
just
email
and
phone
calls.
C
When
I
hear
multi-party,
it's
just
like
it,
just
instantly
goes
to
supply
chain
work.
C
You
know,
but
just
like
my
hesitation
is
there
it's
because
companies
that
are
involved
in
supply
chain,
it's
like
it's
like
clunky,
you
know
from
a
from
a
technology
perspective,
it's
clunky.
So
it's
like
it's
not
just
like
a
oh
here's.
The
solution
we're
just
going
to
go
ahead
and
put
this
in
and
your
life
is
your
life.
Is
that
much
better
it
takes.
It
takes
time
to
be
able
to.
E
Implement
it
they're,
not
the
most
aggressively
tech,
savvy
companies,
sometimes
yeah.
A
People
aren't,
but
a
lot
of
them
still
rely
on
yeah.
Sorry,
sorry,
I'm
good.
E
I
was
just
to
say:
people
aren't
dumb,
but
they're,
usually
busy
being
trying
to
be
smart
about
something
else,
and
in
the
case
of
some
of
those
companies,
the
people
are
trying
to
be
smart
about
their
golf
game.
C
It's
like
our
experience
with
supply
chain
companies-
it's
like
this
right,
so
so
we've
talked
to
small
startups
and
when
I
say
small
startups
in
supply
chain,
I'm
not
talking
about,
like
you
know
like
they
just
launched,
I'm
talking
about
like
a
company
like
less
than
50
employees
like,
like
maybe
30
employees,
40
employees,
something
like
that.
C
So,
for
example,
I'm
thinking
one
specifically
with
a
buddy
of
mine
who
just
got
a
vp
of
operations
position
you
know,
and
and
and
it's
like
in
supply
chain,
the
the
the
industry
I'm
talking
about
over
here
is
cannabis
right,
so
you've
got
to
be
vp
of
operation,
cannabis,
booming
industry,
of
course,
but
a
lot
of
these
companies
that
are
like
40
40.
You
know
employees
or
something
like
that.
They're
just
not
focused
on
tech,
innovation,
they're
focused
on
you
know
just
like
excel.
Does
it
I'm
going
to
use
excel?
C
Google
spreadsheets
works,
I'm
just
going
to
use
that
and
I'm
just
going
to
focus
on
making
sales
and
making
connections.
Making
business
partnerships
with
the
farms
and,
like
you
know,
upstream
downstream,
is
what
they're
really
focused
on.
But
it
comes
to
a
point:
it
comes
to
a
point
where
their
systems
do
need
to
be
upgraded,
because
you
know
we're
talking
about
serious
inefficiencies
that
happen
over
the
course
of
time,
from
managing
people
to
managing
product,
to
managing
invoices.
C
To
managing
you
know,
agreements
and
all
those
things
that
are
all
part
of
the
supply
chain
game.
So
I
mean
from
like
a
technology
perspective,
it's
full
of
rigor,
but
that's
the
opportunity.
I
think
that
that
that
multi-party
workflow
automation
is
really
ripe,
for
it's
always
been
the
case.
In
my
opinion,.
A
Yeah
when
it
comes
to
supply
chain,
I
had
a
co-worker.
We
sold
supply
chain
solutions.
She
used
to
say
that
our
biggest
competitor
is
pen
and
paper,
and
that's
that's
really
true.
When
it
comes
to
supply
chain
and
logistics,
a
lot
of
those
guys
really
that's
all
they
operate
on
pen
and
paper
and
maybe,
if
you're
lucky
excel.
C
Oh,
I'm
so
glad
you
asked
it's
actually
basically
a
year
to
this
date.
Almost
it
looks
good.
Thank
you.
E
E
B
Well,
thank
you
so
much
daniel.
I
hope
to
have
you
on
as
many
future
shows
that
you'd
like
to
join
us
on,
as
well
as
all
of
the
work
groups
happening
in
the
baseline
community
and
with
that,
I'm
also
going
to
use
the
rest
of
our
time
for
some
updates
from
kyle
and
team
from
provide
so
I'll
hand
over
to
you
kyle.
F
Thanks
thanks
a
lot
we
won't,
we
won't
take.
You
know
too
long,
get
just
a
few
updates
related
to
provide
and
how
things
are
coming
together.
F
There's
100
validators
that
will
kick
off
epoch
0
in
in
the
near
future,
and
the
the
network
essentially
is
going
to
use
a
lightweight
consensus
that
leverages
some
or
all
of
the
patterns
that
we
talk
about
in
the
ea
community
projects
or
yeah
in
the
l2
project.
Andreas
is,
is
helping
spearhead
that
as
well.
I
think
that
that's
it's
quite
interesting.
If
you
haven't
come
to
one
of
the
the
sessions
you
should,
you
should
come
to
one.
F
I
think
it's
gonna
happen,
not
the
next
one,
it's
not
next
wednesday,
but
the
following
wednesday
and
yeah.
So
the
the
white
paper
will
soon
be
updated
for
provide
network
that
outlines
that
consensus
as
well
as
how
the
prvg
and
prvd
tokens
interact
in
there
provide
was
was,
is
really
cool.
Provide
was
allowed
a
patent.
F
So
in
2020
we
filed
a
patent
called
system
and
method
for
autonomous
mapping
of
enterprise
identity
and
it
was
actually
allowed
by
the
uspto
and
it
just
describes
sort
of
a
way
to
automatically
resolve
counterparties
using
you
know,
sort
of
in
the
baseline
context
and
leveraging
you
know
a
handful
of
the
the
components
microservices
that
you
may
find
in
the
provide
stack
I
default
in
chain
baseline
privacy
in
the
baseline
service.
F
What
else
prvd
oasis
that
that
commercial,
focused
project
will
have
the
founding
pgb
for
that
will
be
finalized
on
june.
The
sixth
and
shuttle
will
launch
a
few
weeks
after
that,
so
I
think
we're
targeting
june
30th
for
for
that,
so
it's
all
finally,
coming
together
with
regards
to
prd
oasis
a
handful
of
some
really
notable
web.
F
Three
organizations
have
also
come
come
forward
for
that,
and
so
that's
that's
super
exciting
and
we,
I
think
we
do
still
have
a
few
surprises
that
are
sort
of
in
store
for
for
the
pr
video
oasis
release,
including
a
few.
F
What
I
would
consider
to
be
very
disruptive,
open
source
projects
that
that
are
going
to
be
released,
at
least
one,
in
particular,
with
regards
to
a
system,
a
certain
system
of
record
that
currently
has
no
open
source
coverage,
but
we
will
be
releasing
like
a
middleware
sort
of
a
connector
integration
for
the
system
of
records.
So
I'm
super
excited
to
do
that.
C
F
I'm
glad
to
catch
up,
sure,
oh
and
so
so
what
what
yeah
well
so
one
last
thing
the
patent
is
meant
to.
You
know
really
enrich
the
prvd
oasis.
You
know
portfolio,
it's
not
really
so
we're
not
looking
to
like
troll
or
troll
around
with
it.
It's
a
software
patent.
So
but
yeah
it's
it's
pretty
cool,
so
check
it
out.
D
F
Just
just.
D
A
just
a
quick,
quick
take
on
on
on
kyle
and
l2,
actually
where,
where
the
the
the
work
that
was
done
on
the
on
the
baseline
standard,
seems
to
be
informing
initial
work
on
on
on
l2
intra,
so
that
that's
a
that's
a
that's
a
nice
little
wing
towards
the
work
that
that
already
has
been
done
so
that
I
think
that's
that's.
D
It
just
shows
that
that
what
has
been
done
with
baseline
also
another
another
thing
that
came
up
in
the
in
the
l2
call-
and
this
is
going
to
be
a
new
work
item-
are
our
wallets
and
and
and
account
interfaces
so
integrating
integrating
identity
into
into
digital
asset,
wallets
and
and
also
edds,
a
keys
for
for
for
ck
roll
ups
or
zero
knowledge.
D
Proof
required
type
of
type
of
keys
is
is
was
also
very
high
on
the
agenda
and
we
have
two
baseline
grants
for
that
and
one
proposal
so
that
it's
it's
the
whole
concept
of
of
having
universal
identifiers
across
different
l2s
and
and
blockchains
aka
dids
is
is,
is
is
a
big
one.