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A
B
D
C
B
C
Heavenly
Father,
we
come
before
you
this
afternoon,
thanking
you
for
the
guidance
and
understanding
that
you
have
given
this
Board
of
Commissioners
Lord.
Are
we
asking
in
today
for
your
help
and
direction
to
carry
on
and
do
the
good
work
them
in
place
before
them,
but
your
divine
providence
help
them
to
benefit
every
citizen
in
this
community,
your
holy
name.
We
ask
this
amen.
A
B
Nobody
all
right
so
right
to
petitions
and
communications
number
was
and
she,
by
the
main
reasons
talking
applies.
This
would
be
the
recognition
of
Ivan
Curtis
on
her
retirement
from
the
Bay
Area
Community
Foundation,
that's
resolution
2017,
so
that's
258
and
I
would
have
the
clerk.
Please
read
this
a.
C
Priori
Board
of
Commissioners,
whereas
over
the
years
accounting,
has
enjoined
the
leadership
of
money.
Individuals
who
are
visionaries
with
a
love
of
community
and
commitment
to
the
growth
of
prosperity
of
all
be
County
aware,
as
one
of
these
leaders
is
Eileen
a
Curtis
president
and
CEO
of
the
big
Area
Community
Foundation,
where,
as
Eileen
a
Curtis
has
announced
her
retirement
from
the
Bay
Area
Community,
Foundation,
effective,
December,
2017,
and
whereas,
since
joining
the
foundation
in
2007
Eileen,
a
Curtis
has
overseen
a
35%
growth
in
assets
from
27
million
dollars
to
36
million
dollars.
C
During
her
tenure,
the
foundation
has
awarded
over
13
million
in
grants
to
nonprofit
organizations
and
scholarships
to
students
pursuing
post-secondary
education,
whereas
I
lead.
A
Kurtis
has
played
an
integral
role
in
the
development
of
the
bay
commitment,
first-generation
scholarship
and
the
Great
Lakes
Bay
College
and
Career
Resource
Center.
Whereas
working
closely
with
the
Bay
Area
Chamber
of
Commerce
Eileen,
E
Curtis
is
one
of
the
community
leaders
instrumental
and
implementing
the
bay
county
road
map
to
the
future
and
whereas
I
lead
a
Curtis
has
served
as
director
on
the
boards
of
the
Council
of
Michigan
foundations.
C
The
Michigan
College
access
network,
the
northeastern
Michigan
State
Planning
Council
in
Michigan,
chapter
of
the
Association
of
funding,
raising
professionals,
as
well
as
the
McClaren
Bay
region,
whereas
the
level
of
professionalism
and
the
dedication
displayed
by
Eileen
a
Curtis
during
her
career
is
exemplary
and
must
be
acknowledged.
Therefore,
be
it
resolved
that
the
bay
County
Board
of
Commissioners
and
the
Bay
County
Executive
do
hereby
recognize
the
efforts
and
contributions
to
the
bay
County
community
made
by
Eileen
a
Curtis
and
extend
best
wishes
for
a
long,
healthy
and
well-deserved
retirement.
G
I
do
have
just
a
comment,
you
know
being
fortunate
to
work
with
you
and
the
number
of
different
projects.
Bay
County
certainly
owes
you
a
huge
huge
amount
of
thanks
for
all
of
what
you've
done
and
getting
Bay
County
to
where
we
are
today.
I
really
appreciate
what
you've
done
and
you're
leaving
quite
a
big
spot
to
fill.
So
congratulations
on
your
next.
Whatever.
H
This
morning,
and
that
had
a
chance
to
personally
congratulate
you
on
your
distinguished
career
or
the
Bay
Area
Community
Foundation
them
on
behalf
of
myself
and
residents
of
Bay
County,
we
watched
you
know
how,
as
commissioner
Krieger
just
mentioned,
health
appreciated,
you
are
for
the
imprint
you've
had
not
only
in
Bay
County,
but
on
this
region
and
you're
really
you're
going
to
be
succeeded,
but
I
think
you're,
not
replaceable.
So
so
we
wish
you
the
very
best
you
and
Erica
near
as
you
step
down
from
the
intense
level
of
commitment
and
dedication.
H
You've
had
the
last
decade
leaving
the
foundation
I,
wish
you
the
very
best
and
the
next
chapter
of
your
life
you
and
Eric
both
and
just
saying
that,
on
behalf
of
people,
we
really
appreciate
the
all
of
the
entire
loss
effort
to
enhance
the
quality
of
life
of
Bay
County
that
you
have
accomplished.
I
have.
B
To
say
a
couple
words
eat.
Well,
you
know
I
mentioned
just
a
couple
years
ago
and
has
been
good
ever
since
you
know,
I
was
able
to
I'm
able
to
be
on
a
couple
of
the
committee's.
You
know.
The
scholarship
committee
in
the
grant
committee
and
I
had
never
had
an
idea
exactly
what
went
on
there
until
I
got
in
those
communities
and
it's
such
there's
such
great
people.
You
know-
and
it's
because
of
your
leadership.
You
know
you,
you
select
a
great
people
and
and
they're
all
good
to
be
around
and
I.
B
Don't
think
the
people
of
Bay
County
have
any
idea
how
much
money
that
goes
through
there
and
how
much
you,
how
much
you've
given
back
to
the
community
through
this
through
the
foundation
and
you're
like
like
mr.
Barcia,
said
you'll,
be
replaced.
You
know
what,
but
it's
gonna
be
tough
and
she'll.
Do
a
wonderful
job.
You're
succeeded,
you
know,
but
you
deserve
a
retirement
too.
B
You
know
you
you
weren't
going
well,
you
looked
awful
hard
to
get
to
where
you're
at
and
you
know,
and
and
Bay
counties
have
got
a
place
for
it
and
the
world's
a
better
place
for
it.
I
B
B
B
F
A
F
F
J
Now
we're
waiting
for
purchasing
to
prepare
the
documentation
to
in
order
to
receive
you
know,
proposals
from
from
candidate.
So
that
is
the
reason
for
the
extension
of
the
current
agreement
to
allow
for
sufficient
time
to
accomplish
that.
So
I
had
received
one
prior
to
anything
being
done,
but
you
know
until
the
time
that
it
goes
out
for
proposals.
We
probably
won't
receive
it
so
hopefully,
within
the
next
month,
they'll
start.
J
J
That's
that's
true
one
of
them.
One
of
our
recommendations
will
be
that
if
the
candidate
does
not
possess
the
certification
based
on
you
know
the
other
qualifications
that
we
would
like
to
see
that
they
obtain
it
within
a
certain
period
of
time,
and
we
have
received
a
communication
from
the
state,
the
Michigan
Department
of
Veterans
Affairs,
and
they
offer
to
provide
that
training
for
us.
So
it
was
it's
out
there.
Thank.
G
G
J
Believe
that
it
there
they
will
be
doing
it
at
you
know
without
a
charge,
it's
just
it's
to
their
benefit,
to
provide
it
as
well.
Now
there
may
be
additional
classes
and
courses
that
are
offered.
You
know
off
site,
I
various
agencies
and
of
course
we
would
take
the
opportunity
to
participate
in
that
those
are
very
the
feet.
For
those
are
it's
very
minimal.
You.
A
F
A
B
F
F
D
D
B
D
F
D
B
L
K
B
F
A
B
N
E
G
Yeah,
just
in
reading
all
the
material
it
gets,
it
was
confusing
for
me
because
in
one
paragraph
it
makes
this
statement
and
then
down
ways.
You
read
another
piece
of
information:
it's
almost
like
it
contradicted
itself.
So
as
long
as
they've
got
good
answers
like
what
liabilities
the
county
would
have
in
pursuing
this
that'd,
be
my
big
concern.
So
thank
you
again.
H
I
just
thought
I'd
add
that
a
recent
example
of
a
redevelopment
effort
was
the
project
at
Maplewood
Manor
in
Bay,
City
they'll
explain
a
little
bit
about
the
amount
of
HUD
and
mr.
money
that
went
into
refurbishing
that
facility
affordable
housing
facility,
but
that's
what
our
goal
would
be
for
Senator
charms.
H
It
hasn't
really
been
updated
or
renovated,
since
it
opened
so
it
could
be
a
candidate
for
hopefully,
the
federal
and
state
funding
that
would
make
it
much
more
attractive
would
have
hopefully
a
long
waiting
list
for
people
to
get
in
to
become
residents
there,
but
but
it
is-
and
maybe
the
director
would
want
to
speak
to
some
of
the
deficiencies
that
would
be
corrected.
Should
we
secure
nine
or
ten
million
dollars
to
redevelop
it.
K
Mid
Michigan
Community,
Action
Agency
has
contracted.
You
know,
Garfield
matter
hear
me
at
the
end
also
up
and
where
they
have
similar
facilities.
You
know
senior
senior
living
facilities
that
they've
contracted
with
people
to
run,
and
they
had
done
well
with
both
local
projects.
So
far
so
I
mean
it's
a
little
bit
different
there.
There
are
different
type
of
agencies
than
we
are,
but
similar
types
of
a
sudden
that
they're
managing
for
all
see
if
that
worked
out
pretty
good.
Thank
you.
O
Sir
hi,
my
name
is
Brian
Gallagher
I'm,
with
MHT
housing.
We
are
a
non-profit,
affordable,
housing,
developer,
we've
been
in
business
since
1990
and
we
specialize
all
that
we
do
is
affordable
housing
and,
more
specifically,
we
specialize
in
the
low
income,
housing
tax
credit
industry
and
just
to
give
you
a
little
bit
of
background
on
what
that
involves.
O
That's
involved
title
work,
so
there's
a
number
of
exhibits
that
are
required
and
there
has
to
be
financial
statements
for
the
sponsor,
that's
submitting
the
application
and
also
the
general
contract.
That's
going
to
be
working
on
the
project
also.
So
what
we
do
is
we
put
these
tax
credit
applications
together
we
submit
them
to
the
Michigan
State
Housing
Development
Authority
tax
credits
are
award
to
projects
based
upon
how
they
score
out
and
there's
a
number
of
factors
that
go
into
how
they
score
out.
O
O
So
we
sell
these
long
term
housing,
tax
credits,
there
they're
able
to
be
used
by
companies
on
a
dollar-for-dollar
credit
basis
and
their
tax
liability,
and
so
if
we
get
a
million
dollar
tax
credit
reservation,
those
tax
credits
are
good
for
ten
years.
So,
in
a
sense
you
we
end
up
having
ten
million
dollars
of
low-income
housing.
Tax
credits.
O
So
if
we
get
a
million
dollar
reservation
and
tax
credits,
ten
million
dollars
of
credits,
we
sell
those
credits,
so
that
brings
in
9.2
million
dollars
of
what
we
call
tax
credit
equity
into
a
project,
and
we
use
that
nine
point:
two
million
dollars
in
combination
with
a
new
permanent
loan
to
acquire
the
physical
asset
and
also
do
a
full
renovation
and
the
asset.
So
we
make
sure-
and
we
have
enough
money
in
the
deal-
because
not
every
deal
pencils
out
to
where
it
works
appropriately.
O
So
we
make
sure
we
have
enough
money
in
the
deal
to
do
a
full
renovation
that
includes
full
exterior
everything
from
parking
lots
to
striping
to
landscaping,
roofs
on
the
interior,
mechanicals
kitchens
bass,
flooring
appliances,
you
name
it
everything's
completed
even
the
office-
is
fully
redone.
Where
the
staff
works,
new
furniture
and
fixtures
throughout
the
community
and
as
part
of
the
deal,
we
make
sure
we
put
a
sufficient
amount
of
reserves.
O
That's
set
aside
for
the
property
to
make
sure
that
it
has
plenty
reserves
to
start
out
with,
and
that's
going
to
continue
to
make
the
property
last
for
a
number
of
years.
Those
tax
credits
as
I
mentioned,
are
good
for
10
years
and
there's
a
15
year
compliance
period
that
is
involved
with
those
long
term
housing,
tax
credits
and
by
15
years.
O
Compliance
is
what
I
mean
is
that
we're
required
those
tax
credits
are
purchased
by
an
investor,
so
we're
required
for
15
years
to
make
sure
that
that
project
only
rents
to
low-income
housing,
individuals
and
that's
because
that's
basically
the
reason
that
we're
getting
those
tax
credits,
so
our
management
and
our
compliance
is
extremely
important.
So
if
we
have
a
tenant
that
moves
into
the
project
and
that's
over
income
that
doesn't
qualify
for
the
area
median
income
for
those
tax
credits,
then
what
happens?
O
Is
we
get
a
form
from
the
Michigan
State
Housing
Development,
Authority
that
they
send
to
us
and
they'd?
It
would
also
send
one
to
our
investor
in
the
IRS
that
says
this
project
hasn't
over
incompetant
and
they
give
you
a
certain
number
of
days
to
correct
that
file.
If
there
was
an
error
figure
out,
you
know
what's
going
on
or
why
there's
an
over
income
tenant
in
there,
and
we
have
never
had
that
happen
to
us
in
the
27
years.
O
We've
been
business
because
that's
how
we
have
our
new
move-ins,
double-checked
and
triple-checked
from
our
compliance
department.
But
what
happens
is
if
you
end
up
having
an
over
income
tenant,
you
lose
the
long-term
housing
tax
credits
on
that
unit.
So
what
happens?
Is
we
lose
the
units,
those
tax
credits
on
that
unit
for
the
ten
year
period,
and
then
our
investor,
who
paid
us
at
nine
point,
two
million
dollars
they'll
come
back
and
say:
alright,
we
paid
you
for
tax
credits
on
that
unit.
O
You
lost
the
tax
credits
so
now
you've
got
to
refund
that
back
to
us.
So
in
our
partnership
that
we're
proposing
with
Bay
County
is
that
MHT
would
be
the
full
guarantor
on
this
project
for
those
low-income
housing
tax
credits
for
those
15
years.
Mht
would
be
the
full
guarantor
on
that
project
for
any
operating
deficits
that
the
project
may
have
over
that
15
year
period
and
also
guaranteed
construction
completion
and
the
way
that
these
deals
are
done.
The
investors
require
to
have
a
guarantor.
They
were
lard.
O
They
require
the
guarantor
to
have
a
large
balance
sheet,
a
certain
amount
of
liquidity
for
each
individual
project.
They
require
the
general
contractor,
that's
chosen,
which
we
would
propose
to
have
a
contractor
local
in
this
area
to
do
all
the
work
and
be
able
to
utilize
workers
from
the
area
for
the
work.
That's
going
to
be
done
on
average,
with
the
projects
that
we
do.
We
normally
do
on
average,
anywhere
from
twenty
to
thirty-five
thousand
dollars
per
unit.
O
Some
of
them
go
in
excess
of
that,
and
so
it's
not
spending
thirty
five
thousand
on
the
interior
that
unit
you
know
that
obviously
encompasses
everything
within
the
project,
so
all
of
as
I
mentioned
the
roofs
and
the
appliances
and
the
exterior
and
whatnot.
So
our
we
submit
this
tax
credit
application.
We
go
out
and
get
the
investor
and
end
up
renovating
the
project.
So
the
the
great
thing
about
it
is:
is
the
residents
live
there?
O
They
all
that
they
notice
is
that
they
just
get
a
fully
renovated
unit
on
the
interior
and
the
exterior
of
the
unit.
So
it's
all
upside
for
the
residents
and
we
have
no
dislocation
of
residents
when
we
do
our
acquisition
and
rehabilitation,
which
is
what
this
project
would
be.
So
we
setup
hospitality
units
to
where
the
residents
are
able
to
go
to
so
we'll
ensure
that
their
kitchen
is
knocked
out.
If
they're
having
their
cabinets
replacing
their
kitchen,
then
we
pack
up
their
help
them
pack
up
their
belongings.
O
If
they
want,
you
help
them
pack
up
their
belongings.
We
move
them
out
of
there.
Contractor
comes
in
removes
the
cabinets
and
we
get
them
back
in
there
in
the
same
day.
So
they're
out,
you
know
further
remain
for
most
of
the
day
and
their
hospitality
unit
or
elsewhere
they're
able
to
come
right
back
into
their
unit
by
the
end
of
the
day,
and
they
have
new
cabinets
come
in
the
next
day
and
finish
the
you
know
any
plumbing
or
flooring.
O
That
needs
to
be
done
in
that
kitchen
and
we
do
handle
the
same
way
for
the
bathrooms
and
the
rest
of
the
unit.
So
the
tenants
are
not
displaced
at
all,
which
is
a
good
thing.
They
have
a
fully
renovated
unit
and
it's
you
know
it's
a
it's
a
great
benefit
to
every
project
that
we
do
and
the
best
part
about
it
is
as
I
mentioned.
These
are
good
for
ten
years
and
we
have
a
15
year
compliance
period.
So
all
of
the
assets
that
MHT
owns
and
this
one
would
be
a
partnership.
O
We
would
propose
49%
bay
county
to
be
51%
in
15
years.
What
we
do
if,
if
this
partnership
was
created
today
in
its
center
ridge
arms
LDH
a
in
15
years,
we
would
propose
to
submit
another
tax
credit
application
to
the
Michigan
State
Housing
Development
Authority,
and
it
would
be
under
Center
Ridge
arms
to
LVH
a
so
what
happens
is
if
we
got
I
know
I'm
getting
ahead
of
myself,
because
we
haven't
got
the
first
reservation,
but
this
is
how
we
work
with
all
of
our
projects.
O
O
So
all
of
our
projects
that
we
have
I
mean
a
big
model
that
we
have
of
MHT.
Is
we
don't
want
anybody
driving
into
any
of
our
communities
and
knowing
that
their
affordable
housing?
We
just
take
pride
in
keeping
our
properties
updated
their
fully
renovated
every
15
years.
We
have
plenty
in
reserves
to
keep
them
going
over
that
time,
and
we
want
anybody
that
comes
our
communities
to
look
like
it's
a
market
rate
community.
O
We
don't
want
it
to
look
like
people
come
in
and
say:
oh,
that
must
be
a
low-income
housing
project
and
all
of
our
projects
are
they've
all
been
renovated
within
a
15
year
period.
We
have
we're
proposing
this
project
alone,
has
a
half
million
dollars,
that's
going
into
reserves
and
that's
at
the
beginning
of
the
project,
so
there's
plenty
reserves
that
are
in
there
to
cover
the
project
and
part
of
the
reason
we
do.
O
That
is
you
know
we
want
to
make
sure
that
there's
not
going
to
be
operating
deficits
over
that
15
year
period
that
we
have
to
fund
and
there's
reserves
in
place
for
that,
but
if
those
reserves
are
ever
earned
through,
the
investor
requires
that
we're
on
the
hook
for
any
operating
deficits.
So
the
investors
come
in.
I
haven't
talked
a
whole
lot
about
them,
but
they're
everything
from
you
know:
John
Hancock
life
insurance
company
we've
had
Chevron
a
lot
of
our
investors
are
banks.
O
E
O
Does
100%
yes,
and
with
the
majority
of
our
projects,
we
put
a
HUD
insured
loan
on
them
and
as
part
of
that
application
process
with
the
HUD
insured
loan,
it
requires
that
we
have
actually
HUD
higher
cut
the
lender,
actually
picks
who
does
it,
but
there's
a
comprehensive
needs
assessment
that
has
done
a
full
physical
assessment
of
the
project
in
and
out
in
that
outside
third-party
comprehensive
needs.
Assessment
determines
what
work
needs
to
be
completed
on
this
property
to
make
sure
it's
going
to
last
for
the
next
20
years.
O
So
that's
kind
of
our
starting
point
like
we
know
exactly
what
we'd
like
to
do
in
kitchens
and
baths
and
things
that
are
gonna
last
that
have
been
successful
in
our
projects,
but
we're
not
even
able
to
decide
ourselves
and
if
the
boilers,
you
know
what
you
know,
what
boilers
need
to
be
replaced.
What
roof
needs
to
be
replaced
they
actually
the
comprehensive
needs
assessment
determines
that
and
what
the
lifespan
is
of
certain
things.
O
I
know
that
this
project,
for
instance,
recently
has
had
a
new
boiler
put
in
I,
know
I,
believe,
there's
a
couple
boilers.
So
if
we
come
into
a
project,
we
don't
want
to
throw
money
away.
If
we've
got
a
boiler,
that's
only
two
years
old
and
a
new
boiler,
so
we're
able
to
take
those
funds
and
apply
them
to
other
areas
of
the
community
and
some
of
them
just
send
up
being
upgrades,
and
but
it's
a
really
great
program.
O
I've
been
with
a
company
for
14
years
now
and
I
always
had
a
history
of
and
in
multifamily
housing
and
when
I
started
here
14
years
ago,
I
had
never
known
what
low-income
housing
tax
credits
are,
and
it's
a
national
program
it's
in
all
50
states.
So
it's
not
just
here
within
Michigan
a
little
tidbit
of
information
that
says
everybody's
been
aware
of
the
tax
reform.
That's
going
on!
That's
something
that
our
industry
has
been
pretty
insulated.
Even
when
there's
downturns
in
the
economy
back
in
2008
and
whatnot,
all
of
our
properties
survived.
O
We
had
you
know.
Obviously.
Unfortunately,
there
was
even
more
of
a
need
in
some
cases
for
affordable
housing,
but
with
the
tax
reform
that's
going
on
and
the
corporate
tax
rate,
which
is
currently
35%
and
projected
to
go
down
to
20%
22%.
None
of
us
know
exactly
what
it's
going
to
be.
What's
happened
is
that's
driven
the
pricing
down
and
our
low-income
housing
tax
credit,
so
it
sounds
crazy,
but
we've
had
projects
in
the
past
that
we've
sold
tax
credits
for
over
$1.
O
That's
how
competitive
it's
been
with
some
of
the
banks
that
need
their
CRA
needs.
So
we
say:
here's
a
dollar
tax
credits
and
they
pay
us
a
dollar
one
or
a
dollar.
Two.
Now,
with
the
tax
reform,
that's
going
on
now,
you
know
the
market
is
not
sure
exactly
where
everything's
going
to
pan
out.
So
a
lot
of
our
investors
have
been
pricing,
their
models
at
you
know
20
percent
or
22
percent
or
25
percent,
because
they
just
don't
know
where
it's
going
to
sit.
O
B
The
answer
I
just
said,
I
guess
question-
is
why
I
pick
about
it?
Yes,
I
forget,
so
you
talk
about
these
15-year
agreements,
so
you've
been
doing
this
X
number
of
years
already.
Have
you
had
any
that
you
haven't
renewed?
You
know
that
so
the
projects
that
you
did
they
you
said
they
were
done,
a
continuous
variety
or
are
they
pretty
much
automatic
automatic
renewals
so.
O
It's
so
there's
a
the
tax
credits
are,
and
that's
a
great
question
by
the
way,
so
the
tax
credits
are,
for
ten
years,
the
compliance
period
that
we
have
I'm,
the
tax
credits
that's
required,
and
it's
not
only
with
our
investor.
It's
through
the
Michigan
State
Housing
Development
Authority
in
the
low-income
housing
tax
credit
program
is
fifteen
years.
Basically,
what
that
fifteen
years
is
is
that
you
can't
lose
tax
credits
on
that
unit.
O
If
you
keep
it
compliant
for
15
years,
then
you're
home
free
and
you
can't
they
can't
go
back
and
have
any
what
they
call
recapture
of
tax
credits.
Well,
what
they
do
have
is
an
extended
use
agreement.
That's
issued
to
keep
this
property
affordable,
even
after
the
tax
credit
period
and
the
compliance
period
is
burned
off.
So,
even
so,
after
15
years
the
tax
credits
are
gone.
The
compliance
period
is
over.
We
still
have
an
extended
use
agreement
that
requires
us
to
keep
the
property
affordable.
O
Now,
if
you
want
to
be
only
two
things
that
can
extinguish
that
extended
use
agreement
is
in
one
case,
would
be
foreclosure
which
you
know
knock
on
wood.
That
has
never
happened
to
us
and
we
never
would
plan
on
that
happening
and
the
other.
The
other
way
to
do
that
is
you
actually
apply
with
Michigan
State,
Housing
Development
Authority
to
get
that
extended
use
agreement
released
and
it's
it's
it's
about
a
you
know,
18
to
24
month
process
and
what
happens
in
that
period?
Is
you
basically
apply
to
the
Michigan
State
Housing
Development
Authority?
O
They
actually
market
the
property
to
try
to
see
if
they
can
sell
the
property
to
somebody
who
can
make
it
work
and
you
know,
keep
it
affordable
and
if
they
don't
have
any
takers
over
that
period,
then
they
basically
come
back
and
then,
if
they
do
find
one
you
right
of
first
refusal
to
to
do
that.
You
know
yourself
or
as
another
entity
a
new
entity
if
they,
if
they
nobody
comes
along
and
purchases
that
or
has
an
interest
in
purchasing,
and
it
says
that
I
can
make
the
numbers
work
and
by
keeping
it
affordable.
O
O
O
This
this
program
started
in
1986
from
the
Tax
Reform
Act,
and
our
company
started
in
1990.
1991
is
when
we
bought
our
properties,
our
first
properties
and
we've
already.
We
had
those
for
15
years,
and
so
after
the
15
years,
we
applied
for
new
rounds
of
tax
credits
so
and
re
renovated
all
those
properties,
so
we're
kind
of
in
that
second
stage
of
all
of
our
properties.
O
Now
we're
we
don't
even
have
you
know,
we'd
like
to
go
out
and
find
new
properties,
but
we
also
have
all
of
our
properties
in-house
that
are
now
beyond
that
15
year
period
and
we're
getting
new
rounds
of
tax
credits
and
we've
got.
We've
got
three
three
applications
going
in
that
are
going
in
now
for
three
projects
that
we
have,
that
we
originally
bought
renovated,
got
tax
credits
and
now
we're
doing
a
second
round.
What
determines
you.
B
O
That's
like
that's
a
great
question
too,
so
as
part
of
this
competitive
application
process
with
Mishnah,
they
have
something
that
they
call
cost
containment
and
they
only
have
so
many
low-income
housing
tax
credits
that
they
can
issue.
So
they
only
want
their
low-income
housing
tax
credits.
They
do
it
on
the
scoring
basis.
They
only
want
their
low-income
housing,
tax
credits
to
be
utilized
and
the
best
properties,
and
they
want
the
best
bang
for
their
buck
for
this
federal
subsidy.
O
So
they
incorporated
a
few
years
back
this
item
of
cost
containment
and
it
basically,
you
can
get
if
you're
putting
too
much
cost
into
a
project
based
upon
the
number
of
units
and
the
square
footage.
You
can
actually
get
negative
points
and
we
calculate
this
when
we're
submitting
the
tax
credit
application.
So
we
know
exactly
where
we
sit,
so
we
can
actually
get
negative
points.
You
know
and
it's
just
a
simple
taking
the
total
development
costs
and
dividing
it.
O
You
know
by
the
by
the
project-
and
you
know
so
you
can
get
negative
points
or,
if
you're
very
efficient
or
if
you
have
a
project
that
doesn't
need
a
whole
lot
of
renovation,
then
you
can
actually
get
positive
points
because
you're
putting
you
know
less
costs
into
it,
and
you
know
the
other
cost
that
I
haven't
mentioned
that
go
into
it.
There's
so
there's
the
rehab
cost.
So
for
this
project
we
budgeted
$30,000
per
unit
of
hard
cost
going
in.
O
In
addition
to
that
was
builder
overhead
and
profit
that
goes
to
the
Builder
there's
third-party
reports.
I
mentioned
all
the
third-party
reports.
We
have
to
get
done
to
a
Mistah
that
actually
ends
up
getting
reimbursed
to
the
project.
Once
we
eventually
closed
so
there's
third-party
reports
in
there
there's
reserves
that
are
built
in
there.
There's
a
developer
fee,
that's
built
into
the
project
for
this
project.
O
It's
an
$850,000
developer
fee
of
space
upon
and
it's
a
simple
calculation
at
seven,
perhaps
Senate
at
seven
and
a
half
percent
of
the
acquisition
costs
and
seven
and
a
half
percent
of
the
reserves
that
you
set
aside
for
the
project
and
15
percent
of
all
the
other
costs
that
are
involved
in
the
project,
so
the
rehab
and
the
third-party
rewards.
So
there's
an
$850,000
developer
fee.
O
That's
calculated
in
here
trying
to
think
of
some
of
the
other
there's
so
many
other
there's
tax
credit
fees
that
you
have
to
pay
the
Michigan
State
Housing,
Development,
Authority,
there's
an
application
fee.
If
you
get
awarded,
you
got
to
pay
a
6%
fee
of
whatever
that
tax
credit
is
amount
to
Mishnah.
So
there's
a
all
of
the
costs
are
listed
in
here
that
we
have
there's
construction
and
Loan.
There's
loan
fees
to
the
lender.
O
So
all
of
those
costs
are
included
in
the
total
total
budget
for
the
project.
So
you
just
got
a
when
you
submit
everything
you
can't
put.
You
know
we
wouldn't
want
to
be
going
in
and
putting
in
high-end
Thermidor.
You
know
Viking
appliances
and
granite
countertops
and
you
know,
but
we
look
for
the
most
affordable
best
products,
because
we
want
things
that
are
going
to
last
for
15
to
20
years,
but
we
don't
want
to
put
unnecessary
costs
into
a
project
that
are
gonna,
hurt
us
on
that
cost.
Containment.
E
E
O
Know
it's
a
good
question
in
regards
to
how
do
we
know
what
goes
into
it,
so
we
start
out
with,
as
we
did
for
this
project,
we're
just
very
in
the
preliminary
stages.
So
we
haven't,
you
know,
ran
forward
with
any
third-party
reports.
If,
if
we
were
granted
approval,
we
would
immediately
start
ordering
those
third-party
reports.
What.
A
O
A
E
O
I
know
I
know
that
zach
is
here,
he's
been
a
big
help
with
us
and
he's
overseeing
and
managing
the
project
and
the
problem.
The
reason
the
Maplewood
Manor
is
a
project
that
we
have
partnered
with
the
Bay
City
Housing
Commission
on
Commission
on
and
it's
a
very
similar
instance.
Mr.
Barr
should
brought
that
up
and
so
with
public
housing.
O
So
if
this
project
here
was
to
go
and
get
a
new
loan
and
the
project
that
wouldn't
be
enough
to
renovate
the
full
asset,
so
you
know
the
third
party
reports
that
we
do.
You
know
like
I,
said
the
comprehensive
needs
assessment,
because
I
think
just
based
upon
the
the
age
of
the
building.
There's
a
number
of
things:
I
know
that,
for
instance,
the
parking
lot
was
just
done
out
there
and
it.
O
That's
something
that
could
be
fully
done
could
have
been
fully
done
with
the
tax
credit
proceeds,
but
it's
just
something
that
the
project
needed
just
from
our
history,
that
we've
seen
and
it's
a
great
question
and
until
a
comprehensive
needs
assessment
came
in,
we
wouldn't
know
exactly
what
fully
needs
to
be
done,
because
we
haven't
sent
any
of
our
construction
guys
through
the
whole
building
and
got
the
age
of
the
mechanicals
and
whatnot
from
the
drive
by
on
the
outside
I.
Think
the
project.
O
Does
you
know
it's
it's
being
well
maintained,
and
you
know
right
now
with
ours,
the
brick
we
wouldn't
be
doing
anything
to
the
brick
building
and
there's
a
lot
of
things.
Unfortunately,
with
roofs
and
different
things
like
that
that
you
can't
see
from
the
street,
but
with
ours
with
driving
guy
and
pulling
up
I
mean
it's
on
a
big
part
of
ours.
As
you
know,
asphalt
curbs
striping
signs,
landscaping,
awnings
on
the
exterior
gutters
new
windows.
Those
are
kind
of
the
exterior
items,
you're.
O
E
P
Entertaining
so
we
have
to
prepare
a
five-year,
what
we
need
kind
of
initiative
and
then
approve
us
for
a
cab.
That's
our
operator,
just
our
category
on,
for
instance,
right
now,
we're
at
80,000
they're,
giving
us
8601
dollars
per
year.
We
have
to
go
back,
I,
never
made
it
five
years
of
2019,
so
what
we
have
to
do
is
I
have
to
look
at
how.
P
It
will
come,
we
had
an
issue
is
just
the
wall
part
at
the
end
and
replace
the
hole.
Then
it
would
be
$300,000
and
so
HUD
doesn't
give
us
the
money.
For
that.
There's,
there's
small
grants
you
can
apply
for
thing
is
obviously
based
off
in
capacity
and
your
previous
capital
improvements
and
unfortunately,
seven
minutes
hasn't
gone
through
a
lot
of
capital
improvements.
The
last
ten
years
we've
had
elevators
put
in
the
parking
lot
just
recently
and
the
new
boiler
system,
but
they
look
at
what
we're
giving
you
this
one.
P
So
the
nice
thing
about
capital
to
is
that
we
have
a
reserve.
We
have
money
on
the
side,
we
can
take
our
cap
and
put
it
into
our
operating
love.
It
lose
what
we
had
in
our
bank
account.
So
to
speak,
the
pair
of
oils
they
keep
the
lights
on
so
speed,
so
cut
is
very
strict
as
far
as
giving
us
money
to
do
needs.
Improvements
makes
up
a
history.
So
what
I
recently
done
is
a
I
had.
P
Little
things
like
that:
an
ncage
of
the
building
over
time,
accidents
and
bangles
repair,
so
not
having
the
money
at
our
disposal.
That
makes
it
tough
for
us
to
make
this
building
improvements.
Nonetheless,
it's
you
know
require
that
we
require
building
code
requires.
So
just
yesterday
we
had
reactor
building
inspection.
This
was
my
first
and
specialty
yet
I
haven't
received
the
report,
yet
I'll
make
sure
everybody
sees
a
report
listing
what
they
vote.
For
me
there.
Okay,
we
did
attend.
Three.
Here
is
what
we
fixed
the
problems.
P
We
were
very
small
problems,
but
they
all
come
in
and
look
at
you
know
the
condition
of
the
group
is
under
snow,
so
they
look
at
the
sprinkler
system.
They
just
want
you
here.
It
is
a
sprinkler
system.
They
don't
look
at
the
electrical,
they
don't
forget
the
front
doors.
They
don't
look
at
the
inner
columns.
They
just
look
at
physical
issues
that
could
happen
that
fact
the
residents.
So
there
is
a
lot
of
the
building
that
could
be
done.
P
O
Was
a
con
that
is
because
I
mean
to
be
frank:
we
don't
we
don't
own.
You
know,
public
housing
is
owned
by
you,
know
government
authorities,
so
we
don't
own
any
public
housing.
So
I
wasn't
exactly
sure.
You
know
how
his
draw
is
for
his
capital
needs,
which
is
why
I
just
called
on
him
for
that,
but
some
benefits
too.
You
know.
So
this
is
what
happened.
O
This
is
why
the
Bay
City
Housing
Commission,
why
we
had
recent,
what
got
the
low-income
housing
tax
credits
on
their
project
and
got
an
investor
and
fully
renovated
that
project
we
did
about
a
six
million
dollar
I
believe
it
was
rehab
on
that
project
and
it
was
a
very
smooth
project.
We
had
a
great
working
relationship
with
the
Bay
City
Housing
Commission.
O
O
And
you
know
some
of
it
just
some
of
the
benefits
too,
for
this
project
I
mean
from
a
cash
perspective.
Is
this
project
would
be
sold
into
the
partnership
for
an
agreed
upon
appraised
value,
and
so
those
sale
proceeds
go
to
the
county
and
then
our
developer
fee
that
we're
proposing
in
this
deal
is
an
$850,000
developer
fee
and
five
hundred
and
fifty
thousand
dollars
of
that
is
a
cash
developer
fee
which
we
would
be
paid
within
the
first
18
months.
O
The
remaining
three
hundred
thousand
is
what
we
call
a
deferred
developer
fee
and
that's
paid
out
over
cash
flow
until
that
three
hundred
thousand
is
paid
off,
and
our
projection
for
this
project
right
now
is
that
it's
going
to
cash
flow
about
seventy
thousand
dollars
a
year.
So
our
investors
that
come
in
for
the
tax
credits-
they
don't
want
any
other
cash
flow.
They
don't
care
about
the
cash
flow
they're
in
it
for
tax
purposes.
O
So
if
they
get
cash
flow,
they
just
got
more
income
coming
to
them,
so
they're
in
it,
for
usually
their
CRA
needs,
the
low-income
housing
tax
credits
and
the
losses
for
their
tax
return.
From
the
depreciation,
so
they
say
take
all
the
cash
you
know
we
don't
we
don't
care
about
the
cash
they
actually
do.
O
O
You
know
for
any
guidance,
or
we
have
a
great
relationship
with
the
other
partners
that
we
have
in
other
deals
most
of
our
deals.
We
don't
have
partners
in.
We
do
have
a
handful
of
deals
that
we
have
partners
in,
and
it's
usually
been
great
partners
that
in
many
cases,
have
came
to
us
and
said
we
have
this
project.
Do
you
have
any
ideas
and
in
some
cases,
they've
already
heard
about
low-income
housing,
tax
credits
and
in
other
cases
they
haven't,
and
we
kind
of
you
know,
we've
run
the
numbers.
O
Peter
does
a
great
job
of
running
our
numbers
and
just
seeing
if
it
even
is
a
good
project
to
qualify,
because
some
projects,
just
don't
qualify
based
upon
where
their
rents
are
at
what
area
are
they're
in?
Maybe
if
they're
too
too
much
work
needs
to
be
put
into
them
and
we
can't
come
up
with
enough
construction
proceeds.
So
not
every
property
is
a
qualifier
if
it
has
a
horrible
walk
score,
and
we
just
think
you
know
it's,
it's
not
going
to
score
out.
It's
just
not
going
to
be
a
good
candidate.
O
Maplewood
Manor
was
a
great
candidate.
Center
in
charms
we
feel
is
also
a
great
candidate,
and
it's
just
you
know
when
you
think
about
it,
I
mean
it's
just
it's
really
an
amazing
subsidy
I
mean
obviously
it's
a
you
know.
Ultimately
it
comes
from
tax
revenue,
but
but
to
be
able
to
go
out
and
sell
these
long-term
housing
tax
credits
to
an
investor
and
have
that
money
come
in
to
use
100
percent
to
renovate
a
property.
O
O
N
I
N
O
If
I
could
just
clarify
two
quick
things
on
that
well,
one
of
them
is
just
to
add
to
what
you
said:
they'd
be
converted
to
a
project-based
section,
8
that
we
would
get
through
what's
called
a
rad
conversion
with
HUD
and
what
it
is,
is
it's
a
project-based
section,
8
contract.
So
if
that
section,
8
contract
is
attached
to
the
building.
O
So
if
I
a
resident
moves
out
of
the
building
they're,
not
taking
that
what
we
call
a
sticky
voucher
with
them,
that
section
8
stays
with
that
unit
it's
by
unit,
so
the
project
always
has
that
and
our
investors
they
don't
want
to
get
into
a
project
unless
we
have
a
project-based
section.
8
contract,
that's
available
for
that
15
year
period
and
we've
been
successful
in
our
projects
of
getting
20-year
contracts
and
with
the
rad
conversions
for
our
project.
So
we
end
up
getting
a
20-year
project
based
section
8
contract.
O
It
would
be
for
Center
Ridge
arms,
which
would
lock
in
that
project-based
subsidy
for
20
years
for
the
project.
And
then
you
brought
up
a
good
point
too,
as
I
one
thing:
I
left
off
on
the
Investor,
so
the
county
would
sell
this
entity
to
Center
Ridge
arms
LDH,
a
and
the
reason
it's
limited
dividend.
O
You
know
different
types
of
businesses
that
invest
in
low-income
housing,
tax
credits,
but
they
wouldn't
become
the
limited
partner
in
the
deal,
so
they
would
own
99.99%
of
the
partnership
and
the
general
partner
which
would
be
made
up
of
51%
bay.
County
49%
MHT
would
be
point
zero.
One
percent
and
the
reason
that
the
investor
or
limited
partner
is
99.99%
is
because
the
low
income
housing
tax
credits
have
to
flow
with
the
ownership
percentages.
So
you
know
being
nonprofits
as
we
are.
O
We
have
no
need
for
any
more
miles
in
tax
Semmy
plus
when
we're
selling
those
long-term
housing
tax
credits,
so
the
way
that
those
that
investor
gets
them
is
through
the
ownership.
So
at
the
end
of
the
year,
there's
a
partnership.
Tax
return
done,
there's
a
k1,
that's
issued
for
our
limited
partner.
There's
a
k1,
that's
issued
for
the
general
partner
and
that
limited
partner
k1
would
have
their
tax
credits.
They
would
get
nine
ninety-nine
point
nine.
O
O
O
Yeah
and
what
we
have
in
our
memorandum
of
understanding
is
that
the
right
of
first
refusal
would
stay
with
bay
county.
So
at
the
end
of
15
years,
if
a
county
had
said
I
mean
it
could
just
continue
on
that.
Nothing
has
to
happen
at
that
point,
but
at
the
end
of
the
15
years,
if
a
county
decided
that
hey
you've
been
a
great
partner,
you
guys
would
you
be
interested
in
putting
together
another
tax
code
application
that
we
could
do
that
or
Dade
County
could
say.
O
O
The
barriers
to
entry
for
this
industry
are
tough,
because
you
get
experience
points
for
the
low-income
housing
tax,
credit
project
that
you
did
in
the
past,
but
but
we've
gave
that
right
of
first
refusal
to
pay
countin,
so
it'd
be
totally
after
the
15
years.
What
Bay
County
wanted
to
do
or
selling
asset,
because,
even
though
there's
an
extended
use
agreement,
it
doesn't
mean
the
project
can't
be
sold
either.
I
didn't
clarify
that
earlier.
Somebody
else
could
buy
it.
O
O
That
is
correct.
We
would
not
propose
to
bring
in
any
of
our
staff.
We
have
our
own
property
management
company
in-house.
We
did
the
exact
same
thing
with
Maplewood
Manor,
none
of
the
staff
turned
over
there.
They
still
run
the
project,
they
have
the
exact
same
staff,
we're
just
there
to
assist
in
any
compliance.
They
need
audits
at
the
end
of
the
year.
You
know
we
work
with
the
audit
firms.
O
E
N
O
O
It's
not,
we
would
propose
to
a
lot
of
the
loan
that
would
be
on
this
project
would
be
the
HUD
loans
we
we
usually
go
to
HUD
for
our
loans
because
they
provide
the
best
terms.
Their
loans
are
thirty,
five
and
forty
year
terms,
and
also
35
and
40
year.
Amortizations.
They
have
a
couple
different
programs.
Their
rates
are
in
many
cases,
south
of
4%,
so
there
it
takes
a
lot
of
work
to
get
them.
E
O
A
O
We
have
a
HUD
audit
and
the
auditors,
which
is
most
of
our
projects,
there's
just
a
simple
surplus
cash
page,
that's
at
the
end
of
every
audit,
and
it
takes
what
your
operating
cash
is
and
your
security
deposit
cash
and
it
subtracts
out
your
security,
deposit
liability
and
any
current
payables
and
whatever
that
net
number
is,
is
surplus
cash
and
then
that's
distributed
that
as
I
mentioned,
that
small
asset
management
feed
a
limited
partner
and
then
59-49
and
that
money.
That's
your
good
again.
O
O
O
You
know
the
only
thing
I
left
off
and
I
apologize,
I
know
I've
probably
been
around.
You
know
back
and
forth
all
around,
but
I
know
that
just
trying
to
explain
as
much
the
program
as
possible,
but
the
developer
fee
is
you
know
they
allow
you
within
the
program
because
they
say
there's
not
going
to
be
a
developer
like
MHT,
that's
going
to
go
out
and
do
all
of
these
projects,
if
they're
not
able
to
make
any
money
to
continue
their
mission,
so
they
and
allow
this
developer.
O
Feed
calculation-
that's
in
there
and
the
only
piece
I
left
off
and
the
numbers
in
the
pro
forma
is
the
way
that
those
tax
credits
are
calculated.
Is
it's
based
upon
how
much
money
you
actually
put
into
the
project
so
the
more
the
more
money
you
pay
for
an
acquisition
and
the
more
money
you
put
into
a
rehab
the
more
basis
you
have
us--
literally
take
those
dollars
and
multiply
it
by
the
tax
credit
percentage,
and
that's
how
you
come
up
with
how
much
tax
credits
you
can
get
for
the
property.
O
So
you
know
the
first
thing
you
know
so
the
more
money
you
put
into
it,
the
more
tax
credits
you
get
out
of
it,
but
as
I
had
mentioned
earlier,
you
got
to
be.
You
know
you
got
to
be
cautious
and
how
much
money
you
put
into
it,
because
we
go
back
to
that
cost
containment
issue
and
we
don't
want
to
score
negative
points
because
we
want
to
make
sure
that's
competitive.
So
I
didn't
mention
that
earlier,
but
that's
actually
how
credits
themselves
are
calculated.
N
O
Is
no
risk
or
liability?
We
have
built
into
the
MOU
that
image
generally
with
our
tax
credit
applications.
We
submit
they're,
usually
about
this
thick
without
the
environmental
we
usually
just
rubberband
an
environmental
report
on
top
and
as
I
mentioned,
the
application
itself
is
probably
only
about
this
big,
but
it's
the
are.
We've
got
to
go
out
and
get
investors
proposals
even
before
we
submit
the
tax
cut
application,
because
Mishnah
won't
give
a
tax
credit
reservation.
Unless
you
have
everything
ready
to
go,
you've
got
to
have
a
lender.
That's
already
looked
at
the
project.
O
You've
got
to
have
an
investor.
That's
looked
at
the
project
made
sure
everything
pencils
out.
So
we
have
our
lender
letters
in
there.
Our
investor
letters,
their
pro
formas,
which
mission
also
requires
and
all
of
those
third-party
reports
that
I
had
mentioned,
and
we
generally
have
about
about
$40,000
in
tax
credit
application
that
we
submit
and
that
doesn't
include
any
labor
within
our
offices,
just
strictly
cost
that
we've
paid
out
and
unfortunately,
if
we
don't
get
a
tax
credit
application,
it's
only
done
twice
a
year
and
we
just
do
it
the
next
time
around.
O
So,
in
a
lot
of
cases,
we
have
to
pay
for
updates
a
certain
third-party
reports
or
get
updated
letters,
but
for
the
most
part
that
application
is
complete
and
we
may
tweak
it
a
little
bit
or
if,
if
something
changes
with
a
walk
score,
if
we're
able
to
find
out
where
we
can
get
a
little
more
points,
maybe
spend
less
one
Andrea.
We
do
everything
we
can
to
get
every
single
point
that
goes
into
that
tax
credit
application
without
sacrificing
the
project,
but
we
resubmit,
but
we've
been
extremely
lucky
with
our
applications
and
I.
O
Think
it's
just
due
to
the
fact
that
we
pick
projects
that
we
feel
are
going
to
do
really
well
in
the
application
process
and
part
of
it
is
there's
two
funding
rounds
a
year
and
you
just
don't
know
who's
going
to
submit
tax
credit
applications.
There's
a
lot
of
owners
out
there
that
submit
their.
You
know
that
will
submit
their
applications
and
you
just
don't
know
if
they're
going
to
submit
at
the
same
time
that
we
do
so.
O
You
don't
know
where
all
the
scores
are
going
to
come
in
after
you
submit
within
a
few
weeks
missed
at
issues.
You
know
like
a
six
page
report
and
it
lists
what
all
the
projects
came
in
and
what
their
scores
are
at.
So
you
have
some
idea,
but
it's
only
a
self
score,
so
the
Mishnah
scores
it
itself,
and
you
know
they
might
say.
Well
this,
this
property
scored
a
hundred.
But
after
we
went
up
through
the
whole
report,
it's
really
only
scoring
a
95.
So
you
just
don't
know
every
funding
round.
B
O
O
We've
had
the
city
Detroit,
which
has
came
out
with
new
sewer
and
water
fees.
That
have
you
know.
So,
if
there's
things
like
that,
but
it'd
have
to
be,
you
know,
there's
always
costs
that
can
happen
that
are
outside
of
our
control
and
if
that
happens,
and
if
we
burn
through
the
reserves
at
the
property
then-
and
the
project
needs
money,
then
MHT
is
a
guarantor.
So
we're
going
to
be
looked
at
to
have
to
fund
in
those
reserves.
The
only
other
downside
is,
if
you
you
get,
that
nasty
form
that
mister
sends
out.
O
If
you
have
over
income
residents
that
move
in
at
the
property,
but
we
are
so
strict
on
our
move.
Ins
and
we've
been
doing
this
for
so
long.
We
just
ensure
that's
one
thing
where,
even
though
the
county
would
continue
to
manage,
that's
one
place
that
we
would
want
to
help
insert
and
review
the
files
for
the
movements,
because
they're
just
so
critical
with
the
low-income
housing
tax
credit
projects.
But
outside
of
that
I
mean
that's
really
about
it.
To
be
honest
with
you,
there's
lots
of.
O
They're
they're
bringing
their
equity
to
the
table
so
they're
buying
them
so
they're
they're
buying
they're.
You
know
and
they're
getting
something
in
return
for
it,
obviously
they're
getting
their
low-income
housing,
tax
credits,
so
they're
buying
those
low-income
housing,
tax
credits,
so
they're
getting
met
and
we're
in
that.
In
return,
and
generally
recently,
they've
been
going
for
about
a
five
percent
return
and
their
money
is
what
so
they
have
their
own
financial
projection
models
that
they'll
send
to
us,
but
they'll
take
out
all
the
formulas
and
we
don't
see
what
their
returns
are.
O
O
We
just
have
this
bucket
of
sources,
and
the
bucket
of
sources
is
fifty
one
dollars
from
Bay
County
and
forty
nine
dollars
from
us,
because
we
have
to
make
$100
capital
contribution.
That's
the
only
money
you
guys
would
actually
be
out
at
the
get-go
it'd
be
fifty
one
dollars
and
then
the
equity
would
come
in
from
the
investor
and
then
the
permanent
loan
would
come
in.
F
O
O
Correct
yes,
yeah
in
the
you
know,
brought
up
a
good
point
on
the
vacancy
rate,
with
our
generally
the
projects
that
we
have
depending
upon
where
they're
at
we
normally
have
a
seven
percent
vacancy
factors,
what
the
investors
require
and
Mishnah,
but
with
a
project-based
Section
eight.
They
let
us
take
it
down
to
five
percent,
so,
as
Zach
mentioned
with
document
or
the
vacancy
levels,
much
lower
on
that.
So
we
end
up
having
we're
projected
to
have
cash
flow.
O
Seventy
thousand
at
the
project
with
a
five
percent
baby
seat,
but
what
we
generally
find
in
all
of
our
project-based
section,
8
priorities
is
our
cash
flow,
is
much
higher
than
what
our
projections
are,
which
is
great
for
the
general
partner.
But
our
investors
require
a
five
percent
vacancy
level.
They
just
don't
want
to
see
anything
lower
than
that,
but
in
reality
with
project-based
Section,
eight
there's
no
reason
you
shouldn't
always
be
full.
Really.
You
usually
always
have
a
waiting
list.
E
E
N
Is
that
because
the
application
process
is
so
very
complex
and
because
we
have
to
undergo
a
certain
number
of
surveys-
and
we
also
would
have
to
go
through
the
application
for
the
rad
conversion
if
we're
looking
at
doing
this
well
deadline?
Time
is
of
the
essence.
Just
in
order
to
get
the
application
process
started
again.
If
the
application
isn't
granted,
the
project
doesn't
go
forward
in
the
county.
Doesn't
pay
any
expense.
N
There
is
a
provision
in
the
animal
view
regarding
the
termination
of
the
MOU
that
would
have
to
be
associated
between
the
parties,
because
there
were
some
questions.
I,
don't
think
that
that's
going
to
be
an
issue
and
the
board
chair
would
not
sign
any
Memorandum
of
Understanding
to
get
this
application
process
started
until
outside
counsel
gave
him
the
approval
that
the
Memorandum
of
Understanding
was
an
appropriate
one.
G
M
In
this
recommendation,
sir,
the
border
being
has
to
approve
a
Memorandum
of
Understanding
to
approve
any
future
agreements
that
have
been
written
and
Memorandum
of
Understanding.
They
haven't
seen
in
recruit
a
bunch
of
adjustments
that
don't
exist
at
so
then
there
would
there
be
a
problem
with
putting
this
off
a
month
and
we
provide
provided
information.
O
A
O
Wouldn't
be
any
change
there,
I
mean
you
bring
up
a
good
point
in
regards
to
you
know
what
makes
us
one
a
little
more
complex
as
the
rad
conversion,
because
that
takes
some
time
to
do.
There's
a
couple
meetings.
There's
notifications
that
go
out
to
the
residents
there
needs
to
be
two
separate
meetings
with
all
the
residents
with
finding
questions
Q&A
sessions
with
the
residents
in
regards
to
that,
and
then
from
the
tax
credit
application
standpoint.
O
We
end
up
getting
lenders
on
board
and
investors
on
board
and
and
by
no
means,
please
don't
take
it
the
wrong
way,
because
by
no
means
am
I
trying
to
force
this
through
by
any
means,
but
we
would,
if
we
lost
another
month,
we
would
probably
have
to
push
it
off
to
the
October
funding
round
and
I.
Just
don't
think
we
probably
be
able
to
make
the
April
1st,
but
you.
O
N
B
Mrs.
Evans
witness
that
work
with
with
the
Commission
I
mean
it's
up
to
us
as
a
body
to
do
quite
possible
to
do
our
due
diligence
and
make
sure
to
make
sure
you
know.
I
have
trouble
spending
$50,
you
know
you
know
and
proponent
or
a
day,
and
you
know
that
were
asking
do
this.
It
makes
me
a
little
nervous
depression
trigger
so.
B
Any
more
discussion
on
that
sitting
on
all
those
motion
carries.
We
would
hope
that,
maybe
maybe
you
could
get
together.
You
know
the
information,
so
it
comes
back
to
the
board.
So
we
have
it.
We
could
have
a
by
the
weekend.
You
know
themselves
we
get
horrible
or
I
think
that
would
double
dollars.
The.
H
Like
to
thank
you,
Commission
for
agreeing
to
take
it
up,
possibly
a
week
and
just
say,
yeah
before
Brian
leaves,
if
I
think,
you've
had
a
real
successful
business
model
in
the
last
14
years.
Could
you
share
with
the
Commission
the
extent
of
your
involvement
in
affordable
housing
and
regular
housing
across
the
state?
How
many
projects
you've
been
involved
in
how
many
housing
units,
just
because
you
do
have
extensive
track
record
them
a
very
familiar
with
the
requirements
and
obviously
have
very
successful
projects?
2.2
yeah.
O
We
we
own
and
manage
about
8,000
projects
or
I'm,
not
8,000,
I'm,
sorry,
8,000
units,
as
I
had
mentioned,
we
started
back
in
1990,
we've
been
doing
deals
every
year
ever
since,
and
some
of
these
have
just
been
rescinded.
Our
own
deals.
We
also
partnered
on
a
deal
in
Wisconsin
and
again.
That
was
somebody.
C
O
Came
to
us
and
asked
if
we
would
partner
with
them
on
that
we
have.
We
also
took
over
a
non-profit
out
in
the
Seattle
area,
so
we
have
projects
also
out
that
way,
which
we've
got
a
Jen
there.
That
runs
our
Seattle
office
and
those
are
also
low-income
housing
properties,
but
predominantly
we
are
in
Michigan.
We've
got
assets
everywhere
from
Traverse
City
to
Grand,
Rapids
to
Detroit,
Milford,
Brighton
right
here,
obviously,
Bay
City
and
just
Lansing
building,
just
kind
of
scattered
all
over
the
state.
E
G
E
O
Yeah,
no,
they
they.
So
we
have
a
you
know.
We
have
our
obviously
a
partnership
agreement.
You
know
that
says:
they're
gonna
pay
us
these.
This
amount
for
the
tax
credits,
but
that's
all
all
that
they
get.
They
have
number
one.
They
have
the
guarantee
from
MHT
that
they're
going
to
get
these
tax
credits,
because
because
at
closing
they
won't
give
us
this
full
yeah.
O
They
won't
give
that
right
at
closing
what
they
do
is
they
put
in
twenty
percent
of
that
at
closing,
and
then
at
fifty
percent
it's
different
on
every
deal,
but
at
50
percent
they
might
say
we'll
give
you
another
million
and
a
half
dollars
at
fifty
percent
and
then
at
construction
completion.
They
might
say
we'll
give
you
another
million
and
a
half
dollars
and
then,
when
the
project's
complete,
something
else
I
did
mention,
which
is
a
good
point.
O
So
to
answer
your
question
when
they
pay
that
money
in
they're,
just
they're
paying
it
in
knowing
in
the
end
they're
gonna
get
this
form
from
Missha,
that's
gonna
be
filed
with
their
taxes.
So
that's
their
only
pay
back.
Is
the
tax
return
that
they
get
every
year?
That
shows
how
much
longer
it
also.