►
Description
Docket #0213 - Hearing regarding Boston Police Overtime
C
D
D
G
B
B
B
All
right,
I'm
calling
this
hearing
of
the
boston
city
council's
ways
and
means
committee
to
order
for
the
record.
My
name
is
kenzie
bach,
I'm
the
city
councilor
for
district
8
and
also
the
chair
of
the
council's
ways
and
means
committee.
This
public
hearing
is
being
recorded
and
live
streamed
at
boston.gov
city-council-tv.
B
B
You
know
we
really
are
trying
to
shift
these
resources
and
make
what
we
budgeted
for
effective.
So
we've
been
holding
these
quarterly
overtime
oversight,
hearings
to
focus
in
with
the
department
on
how
those
goals
are
being
achieved
and
where
they're
coming
up
short
and
what
we
can
do
to
remedy
that.
B
So
we
had
the
last
one
of
these
in
november
and
we'll
be
getting
an
update
from
the
department
and
asking
questions
and
all
today
the
joining
us
from
the
boston
police
department
today
is
superintendent,
marcus,
eddings
from
the
office
of
the
police.
Commissioner,
superintendent,
james
hassan,
the
from
the
chief
of
the
bureau
of
administration
technology
and
superintendent,
kevin
mcgoldrick,
chief
of
the
bureau
of
field
services
and
also
lisa
o'brien,
the
deputy
director
for
the
bureau
of
administration
and
technology
and
the
department's
chief
financial
officer.
B
So
I'm
grateful
to
all
of
them
for
joining
I'm
mindful.
I
know
the
department
has
a
time
limitation
today.
So
that
means
that
I
will
be
quite
strict
with
colleagues
just
about
time
windows
so
that
everyone
gets
to
ask
their
questions
I'll,
go
very
briefly
right
now
and
my
two
co-sponsors.
But
then
I
think
we'll
dispense
with
opening
statements,
so
we
can
jump
straight
to
the
department's
questions,
sorry,
the
department's
presentation
and
then
our
questions
so
counselor
campbell.
If
you'd,
like
a
few
words.
F
H
B
C
Today
I
have
I
asked
asked,
and
they
graciously
accepted
my
request:
superintendent
mcgoldrick,
who
is
the
chief
of
the
bureau
of
field
services
and
superintendent
eddings,
who
is
assigned
to
the
police
commissioner's
office,
but
is
responsible
for
court
and
the
detail
unit.
So
I
know
the
intense
interest
from
past
hearings
that
the
council
had
in
these
particular
topics.
So
I
that's
why
I
requested
their
for
them
to
participate.
C
So
you
know
in
that
those
overtures
were
caused
by
those
challenges
that
I
met.
I'm
glad
madam
chair
and
counselor
the
counselors
have
mentioned.
You
know
ways
on
how
we
can
obtain
these
goals
and-
and
that
is
to
you
know,
to
calling
a
term
alternative
policing.
We
need,
because
the
citizens
of
boston
have
come
to
rely
on
the
bpd
to
supply.
C
You
know
provide
them
with
the
services
that
they
expect
and
demand,
and
until
we
can
start
putting
them,
you
know
incorporating
other
agencies
to
pick
up
the
slack
or
the
demands
of
those
calls
that
they
write.
They
rightfully
should
be
going
to
because
over
the
years
is
like
a
snowball
effect.
Over
the
years
we
have
collected
a
lot
of
activities
that
we
should
not
be
participating
in
and
I
think
the
way
we're
gonna
we
need
it's
a
full.
C
You
know
it's
a
holistic,
we're
going
to
need
a
holistic
approach
to
achieving
this
goal,
so
all
departments
in
the
city
are
going
to
need
to
step
up
and
help
out,
but
with
that,
like
I
said,
I
want
to
welcome
and
thank
superintendent,
eddings
and
lisa
o'brien
who's,
a
very
loyal
person
to
work
with
and
and
with
that
we'll
we'll
start.
The
meeting.
B
B
B
B
B
B
C
C
B
C
C
So
you
know
also,
we
have
we've
had
numerous
retirements,
which
you
know
so
for
the
fiscal
year
21
we
had
102
from
july
to
february,
compared
to
last
year
fiscal
year,
20
we
had
126
for
the
entire
year,
so
we're
losing
people
left
and
right.
We
still
have
the
issues
of
people
that
are
out
on
injured
mis,
so
you
know
we're
vigorously
working
to
get
that
under
control
we've
recently
hired
another.
C
You
know
this
covet
really
put
us
back
on
our
heels,
because
you
know
everything
became
virtual.
The
officers
were
seeing
their
physicians,
virtually
the
they
were
seeing.
You
know
our
medical
staff
virtually
so
really
slowed
things
down
getting
people
back
to
work,
so
you
know
so
which,
but
now
that
we're
starting
to
emerge,
we
recently
hired
an
an
individual,
that's
gonna
to
we're
going
to
start
seeing
patients.
You
know
offices
again
make
sure
that
they're
receiving
their
the
treatment
that
they
need.
They're.
C
B
B
Which
sounds
awfully
like
getting
close
to,
and
I
think
you
said
it
was
just
moderately
down
so
for
folks.
Reference
at
home,
the
budget
for
the
prior
year
was
60
million
and
the
and
the
reduction
to
that
in
the
in
the
fy
21
budget
was
12
million
down
to
48,
but
the
actual
overtime
amount
in
in
fy
20
was
72
million.
B
C
C
B
Right
so
I
wondered
if
we
could
speak
to
specifically-
and
this
might
be
a
question
for
superintendent
mcgoldrick,
I'm
not
sure,
but
the
I
mean
when
we
had
you
guys.
In
november
it
looked
like
there
was
a
sort
of
almost
100
officers
worth
of
replacement
costs
kind
of
covered
by
this
additional
bubble
of
folks
on
long-term.
B
C
B
C
B
Right,
no,
I
hear
you,
but
I
think
obviously
it's
very
frustrating
for
the
council
to
be
here,
and
I
was
hoping
that
we
would
be
instituting
these
some
of
these
things
earlier
in
the
year
to
get
this.
This
really
unusual
bubble
in
the
number
of
folks
out
on
second
entry
leave
down
because
it
seems
to
be
really
heavily
driving
that
replacement
cost
I've.
I've
run
my
first
round.
Timeout
counselors
should
by
now
have
these
numbers
in
their
inbox.
B
F
Thank
you,
councillor
bach,
and
thank
you
again
to
the
department,
I
guess
taking
a
step
back,
so
I
didn't
get
the
numbers
and
haven't
had
adequate
time
to
review
them,
and
I
will,
of
course,
if
we
could
just
go
back,
and
maybe
this
is
a
question
for
you
chair.
What
was
the
original
commitment
from
the
administration?
B
B
F
B
B
That's
better,
okay!
Thank
you!
Okay!
So,
basically,
so
basically
the
headline
here
is:
we've
already
had
20
000
more
replacement
personnel
hours
in
the
partial
fy21
than
we
had
had
in
all
of
fy20,
which
means
that
we're
you
know
we're
we're
going
we're
going
over
budget
first
of
all
clearly
and
we're
due
and
it's
driven
most
heavily
by
these
replacement
personnel
hours.
I
think
that's
fair
to
say
I
think
that's
pretty
much
what
the
superintendent
just
said.
B
If
you
go
down
here,
you
can
see
that
the
so
thus
far
we've
had,
I
see
so
the
overall
budget.
This
is
the
overall
budget
was
a
was
a
total
of
727
000
hours
coming
out
at
48.8
million
dollars,
and
and
this
would
have
been
the
average
hours
per
week
so
about
14
000
hours
a
week
to
hit
that,
and
instead
we're
running
at
20
000
hours
a
week.
B
K
K
K
Million
because
we
were
depending
on
I
mean
like,
for
example,
at
one
point:
replacement
cost
like
early
by
the
end
of
the
summer
was
relatively
flat
compared
to
last
year
and
then
again
we
had.
As
everybody
knows,
we
had
the
uptick
in
the
coronavirus
beginning
in
september,
and
we
got
hit
again
by
that
which
drove
the
replacement
cost
up
plus
some
of
our
offices,
as
you
know,
going
out
injured,
and
we
can
speak
to
that
later
on
as
well.
D
K
I
also
want
to
mention
too,
that
the
72
million
that
we
ran
last
year-
4
million
of
that-
is
being
moved
off
to
the
covid
grant
into
femur,
and
I
also
like
to
point
out
that
part
of
that
72
million-
and
I
don't
have
the
number
in
front
of
me,
because
I
can't
pull
it
up
because
of
the
sharing
screen.
But
of
that
72
million.
There
was
a
significant
amount
of
money
spent
on
the
mass
cass
area,
along
with
the
protests
which
drove
us
to
that.
72
million.
B
B
K
If
you
carry
that
out
and
back
out
some
of
these
unforeseen
events
to
get
a
true
run
rate,
because
you
know
some
of
the
unusual
event
items
that
you'd
want
to
back
out
such
as
the
amount
that
we
spent
on
protests
and
the
amount
that
we
you
know
we're
hoping
as
far
as
we
don't,
you
know
any
demonstrations
going
forward.
But
if
you
back
out
what
our
run
rate
would
be
have
we
had
not
had
those
unforeseen
events
such
as
the
election
week?
K
K
Back
to
work,
I
mean
I
run
rate
a
year.
Weekly
run
rate
for
average
hours
is,
is
19
20
000
hours
a
week,
even
if
I
back
out
the
unforeseen
events,
it'll
come
down
slightly,
but
I
mean
I'm
not
I'm
saying
if
we
keep
running
at
that
run
rate.
That's
where
we'll
end
up
and
it's
it's
replacement.
Clock
cost
is
driving
driving
that
significantly.
B
B
Okay,
so
just
but
just
so
that
would
be
counselor
campbell
to
answer
your
question
that
it
sounds
like
on
the
department's
projections.
We
are
currently
running
15
million
above
budget,
so
the
so
the
budget
for
this
year,
let's
just
say,
was
48
million.
That
was
the
that
was
the
budget,
then
the
like,
where
we're
kind
of
landing
based
on
this
current
is
15
million
over
that
at
63,
and
then
I
just
want
to
take.
F
A
step
back
just
for
the
lay
person,
that's
watching
right.
That
is
like
what
so
they're
not
confused.
So
the
administration
commits
to
saving
12
million
dollars
right
in
overtime
in
order
to
realize
that
what
num?
What
is
the
number
that
we
would
have
to
save
in
order
to
realize
that
12
million,
because
we
you
know
it
did,
go
up
so
that's
my
second
question:
does
that
make
sense?
Counselor
bob?
No.
B
F
B
B
C
B
K
B
B
How
much
of
it
four
of
the
set
of
the
78
four
four
72
or
72
right?
So
so
our
actual
budgeted
money
spent
on
fy
20
without
the
federal
money
was
68
million
to
achieve
the
fy
21
budget.
Counselor
campbell
was
at
48
million,
which
was-
and
we
talked
about
this
before
right-
is
that
it's
it's
a
12
million
reduction
from
this
60
that
was
budgeted,
but
it's
it's
an
effective
20
million
120
million
reduction
because
of
how
much
over
budget
right
things
ran.
B
So,
however,
it
sounds
like
what
the
department's
telling
us
today
is
that
we're
on
track.
So
our
fy
21
on
track
is
63
million,
which
means
that
we
wouldn't
I
mean
which
means
that
we're
actually
over
the
worse.
It
would
have
a
saving
effect
of
five
million
off
of
actual
for
last
year,
but
it
wouldn't
have
us
saving
anything
out
over
after
budget.
It's
actually
over
budget,
even
for
fy20.
It
would
have
been
over
budget.
B
F
It's,
but
do
you
do
tr?
Do
you
get
what
I'm
trying
to
get
at
for
the
person
who
is
just
you
know,
high
level,
trying
to
understand
this,
not
as
in
the
weeds
in
terms
of
replacement
costs,
as
we
are,
so
we
commit
to
saving
12
million,
but
based
on
on
track
of
where
we're
going
right,
what
would
we
actually
have
to
save
to
realize
that.
B
At
this
point,
yes,
at
this
point,
the
department
would
have
to
stop
having
overtime
hours,
because
it's
it's
already
spent
43.6
million
dollars
right
so,
and
that
was
as
of
february
19.,
so
we've
probably
spent
there's.
No
there's
I
mean
what
I
hear
the
department
telling
us
today
is
that
if,
unless
it's
stopped
having
any
overtime
hours
today,
it
will
not
hit
the
budget
target
of
48
million.
F
F
Has
a
sense
of
so
the
average
person
watching
has
a
sense
of
what
we're
talking
about.
If
that
makes
sense,
then
my
my
last
question,
because
I
do
want
to
be
mindful
by
the
colleagues
I
thank
you,
counselor
bach,
for
going
through
these
numbers,
because
I
just
got
this
during
hearing,
so
I
hadn't
had
a
chance
to
review.
So
thank
you,
but
my
one
question.
This
has
come
up
in
previous
council
hearings
and
then
I
can
wait
to
the
next
round.
F
We
folks,
from
the
gang
unit
from
the
bike
unit
from
the
youth
violence
task
force,
strike
force
back
to
the
districts
as
a
way
to
help
us
cut
down
on
overtime
costs
and
to
provide
the
districts
with
the
coverage
they
need,
especially
the
busiest
ones
with
the
coverage
they
need
in
order
to
respond
to
the
number
of
calls
they're
getting.
Where
are
we
with
that?
F
C
F
C
F
And-
and
I
guess
then,
my
last
question
is
what
strategies,
if
any,
because
we've
talked
a
lot
about
different
ideas,
including
you
know,
assigning
back
to
the
districts.
The
gang
unit,
youth
violence
strike
force
bike
unit
to
provide
more
coverage.
We've
talked
through
various
ideas
that
haven't
actually
happened.
So
what
strategies
the
department
try
to
do
in
order
to
realize
anything
in
terms
of
the
overtime.
F
C
Counselor
I
mean
our
strategy
is
to
work
feverishly
in
getting
these
officers
that
are
out
injured
back.
That's,
that's
the.
I
think
that
would
obviously
save
the
necessary.
You
know
replacement
costs.
So
that's
that's
our
goal
and
with
like
I
said,
we've
hired
and
we've
done
multiple
things
to
try
to
realize
that
goal.
B
H
Thank
you,
madam
chair.
So
obviously
you
know,
I
think
one
cost
driver,
as
has
been
mentioned,
is
when
an
officer
is
out
because
particularly
he
or
she
may
have
been
expo,
either
tested
positive
for
covert
19
or
been
exposed.
We
recognize
the
fact
that
boston,
police
officers
can't
work
remotely
and
our
first
responders
and
at
risk.
So
obviously
that
has
been
a
factor
for
the
last
12
months,
but
I'm
curious
do
we
know
the
percentage
of
officers
that
have
received
at
least
one
dose
of
the
vaccines
as
of
today.
C
We
have
about
1800
employees
vaccinated
approximately
we're
waiting
for
the
second
round
and
we're
hoping
to
get
more,
but
you
know
a
lot
of
people.
Some
were
skeptical,
you
know
they
want
some
to
wait
and
see,
see
you
know
see
how
others
make
out.
So
I
think
they're
realizing
how
effective
it
is.
Counselors,
so
they're
are
more
people
want
to
get
it
so.
K
C
K
H
H
And
I
would
just
urge
you
and
any
any
city,
employees
or
any
citizens
of
the
world
who
expect
exp
express
concern
or
cynicism
about
taking
vaccinations.
I
hope
we
can
all
underscore
in
the
strongest
possible
terms
how
important
and
safe
it
is
and
how
crucial
it
is
that
we
take
it.
We
encourage
our
colleagues
to
take
this,
get
this
vaccination
as
well.
So
that's
neither
here
nor
there,
but
since
you
had
mentioned
some
concern
that
some
officers
might
have,
I
get
it
it's
just
it's
we
need
to.
H
We
need
to
do
this
and
these
are
safe
and
these
are
effective
and
these
will
save
lives.
Secondly,
on
one
I
again,
I
know
you'd
sent
this
information,
we're
just
cutting
it
now,
but
on
one
of
the
spreadsheets
I
think
lisa
you
had
sent
it
some
part.
One
section
three
details:
do
you
have
that
available?
H
It's
good,
so
it's
got
fiscal
years.
You
know
16
to
20
that
are
all
virtually
in
the
same
amount
and
then
for
21,
it's
3.1
million
75
of
what
the
total
is.
There
is
a
note
that
much
of
the
amount
is
not
yet
due
is
so
that's
that's
what
a
private
vendor
would
pay
us
and
we're
just
waiting
to
collect
yeah.
K
H
K
Boston,
water
and
soar
and
they
they
pay,
but
by
the
way
the
bills
go
out.
It's
they're
not
considered
like
due,
not
within
the
30
days.
So
that's
really
not
it's
not
an
unreimbursed
amount
is,
is
what
I'm
saying
is
that
amount
will
go
significantly
down
once
we
get
payment
from
the
utilities
and
they're
the
biggest
biggest
vendors.
You
see
them
out
digging
all
the
time
and
a
lot
of
times
it's
because
within
the
actual
company
itself
they
all
have.
Every
single
digging
is
a
project
for
them.
K
So
it
has
to
go
through
the
various
project
managers
for
approval,
but
they
do
pay
so
that
that
amount
will
go
significantly
down.
I
would
not
really
it's
it's
just
a
number
right
now
of
what
we
have
outstanding,
but
it's
not.
You
know
beyond
90
days
beyond
60
days
like
it's,
not
at
a
dunny
notice,
but
counselor
does.
C
H
Yeah,
I
totally
get
that
and,
as
I
mentioned
at
the
last
working
session,
I
will
reiterate
today.
Anyway,
we
can
be
helpful.
I
mean
it
would
seem
to
me
that
if
there
was
a
vendor
who
does
business
before
the
city
and
has
not
paid
their
fiduciary
or
fulfilled
their
fiduciary
obligation,
there
absolutely
should
be
some
recourse
with
the
city
of
boston
as
it
relates
to
permits,
as
it
relates
to
other
work.
So
I
do
think
that
is
an
important
conversation
to
have.
H
I
just
wanted
to
get
the
point,
that
of
those
3.1
million
dollars,
which
will
obviously
grow,
because
we
still
have
two
and
a
half
or
three
and
a
half
months
left
in
the
fiscal
year.
You
would,
I
would
assume
lisa
this
looking
if
passed
as
prologue,
that
all,
but
about
200
000
in
change
should
be
collected
by
the
end
of
the
fiscal
year.
L
K
Conversations
within
the
departments
that
issue
the
permits,
such
as
inspectional
services,
transportation
and
boston
water
resort
to
kind
of
flag
some
repetitive
vendors
that
refuse
to
pay.
Ideally,
if
all
systems
talk,
it
would
be
great
similar
to
when
you
go
to
the
registry.
If
you
have
a
pass-through
parking
ticket,
you
can't
renew
your
registration.
K
H
You
completely
lisa
sorry
to
cut
you
off,
but
my
time
is
limited
and
I
think
we
will
have
we
follow
up
from
that
when
the
next
ones,
when
it
relates
to
two
more
questions
when
it
relates
to
sporting
events,
obviously
they're
starting
more
with
a
significantly
reduced
audience
capacity
has.
How
is
is
that
then,
in
turn
affected-
and
I
understand
that
these
are
private
offenders,
but
do
is
the
allocation
of
resources.
You
can
measure
it
with
the
reduced,
reduced
audience
or
crowd
size.
C
D
H
Great
okay
and
then
finally,
has
there
been
any
discussion
you
talked
about
how
extended
tours
have
helped
I've
brought
up
on
several
times.
With
these
conversations,
looking
at
the
shift
change,
experiment,
which
would
indeed
has
been
proven
normally
successful
in
other
cities,
there
seems
to
be
a
lot
of
appetite
for
it.
Has
there
been
any
further
discussion
with
that
as
it
relate
to
rain
and
some
of
the
costs
as
it
relates
to
overtime.
B
G
Thank
you.
Thank
you.
Council
block.
I've
been
following
this
issue
very
closely
and
following
this
hearing
very
closely,
but
one
thing
we
we
haven't
mentioned
is
we
don't
have
enough
police
officers
on
the
streets
of
boston?
We
need
to
hire.
As
I've
said
for
the
last
three
years.
We
need
to
hire
several
hundred
more
police
officers
that
will
address
the
issue
of
of
forced
overtime,
that's
happening.
You
know
we're
going
into
the
budget
process
season
as
a
city
council
we're
going
to
effectively
advocate
for
an
additional.
You
know
several
hundred
more
police
officers.
G
I
hope
I
hope
we
do
as
the
superintendent
is
saying
that
you
know
we're
having
a
lot
of
police
retire
at
high
rates.
Well,
because
we're
having
police
officers
retire
at
high
rates.
That
means
we
have
to
make
up
the
difference
in
making
up
the
difference
means
hiring
full-time
police
officers
instead
of
asking
for
forced
overtime.
G
So
I
think,
as
a
city
council,
we
we
need
to
do
our
responsibility
too,
in
advocating
for
additional
police
officers
on
the
street.
This
pandemic
hit
us
all
hard.
It
hit
the
police
officers
very
hard,
their
families
very
hard.
They
got,
they
got
coveted
and
they
were
exposed
to
dangerous
situations
when
they
have
covert.
What
is
important
is
their
their
health,
their
family's
health.
G
So
I
think
we
need
to
work
differently.
We
need
to
work
smarter
and
more
effectively.
You
know
as
a
district
counselor,
I'm
I'm
on
my.
I
talk
to
my
police
captains
all
the
time.
I
want
more
police
presence.
In
my
in
my
district,
I
talked
to
captain
sweeney
and
captain
boyle
and
captain
fong,
who
just
retired
and
captain
triolo,
but
I'm
asking
for
for
more
police
presence
in
my
district,
and
I
know
probably
other
district
city
councillors
are
too.
G
G
So
what
I'm
saying
is,
I
hope
we
have
a
serious
discussion
next
month
about
hiring
many
several
hundred
more
police
officers
in
the
city
of
boston,
and
I
just
want
to
say
thank
you
to
my
colleagues.
Thank
you
to
the
police
officers,
the
superintendents
that
are
on,
and
thank
you
for
giving
me
the
time
I
don't
have
any
questions.
I
just
wanted
to
highlight
my
my
concerns
that
I
had
thank
you.
Thank
you,
madam
chair.
B
B
We
also
have,
as
you
just
heard,
counselor
ed
flynn
from
district
two
counselor
anissa
sabi
george
at
large
counselor,
julia
mejia
at
large
councilor
liz,
braden
district,
nine
councillor,
michael
flaherty
at
large
councilor,
michelle
wu
at
large
councilor
lydia
edwards
from
district
one
and
counselor
ricardo
arroyo
from
district
5
are
all
here.
So
I
just
wanted
to
read
that
into
the
record
before
before
we
go
all
right,
so
counselor
sabi
george.
I
Thank
you
very
much,
madam
chair,
and
I
do
want
to
actually
ask
the
question.
I
think
that
counselor
flynn
was
proposing
what
is
the
sweet
spot
for
the
additional
number
of
police
officers
we
need
to
hire
in
order
to
sort
of
find
that
right
nexus
between
not
having
and
running
large
overtime
budgets
and
making
sure
that
we,
you
know,
because
we
we
appreciate
and
understand
that
the
reason
we
don't
hire
our
new
police
officers
is
because
it's
a
cost
savings
piece.
I
M
Counselor,
so
you
know
it
is
kind
of
a
catch-22
for
the
police
department.
We
end
up,
obviously
being
criticized
when
we
spend
overtime
to
get
to
that
the
levels
that
we
feel
we
need
to
serve
the
the
residents
and
and
the
visitors
and
everyone
else
in
the
city
appropriately.
So
I
mean
for
a
little
bit
of
history
there's
you
know
it
was
a
city
ordinance
that
was
enacted
back
in
1980.
I
think
it's
still
on
the
books
that
that
sets
the
number
at
no
less
than
2
500..
M
It
was
a
federal
grant
that
that
required
us
upon
acceptance
of
the
grant
to
commit
to
2185
as
the
number
into
2016.
right
now.
Our
number
is
is
less
than
that.
It's
2067
with
the
academy
class
will
be
2160,
but
they'll
obviously
be
retirements
between
now
and
then
so
so
we'll
be
hovering
around
the
20
2100
mark,
relatively
speaking.
M
So
so
there's,
obviously
that
there's
some
room
to
to
say
that
if
we,
if
we
kept
back
to
even
just
the
20
2016
commitment
that
we
made
to
the
federal
government
as
a
condition
of
the
grant,
we'd
be
a
little
bit
light.
Obviously,
if
you
look
back
historically
in
1980,
when
the
2500
nimbu
was
set,
the
population
of
boston
was
about
563
thousand.
M
Now
it's
you
know:
695
000.,
the
the
911
calls,
if
even
if
you
just
look
back
to
2011,
was
418
plus
thousand
2019,
the
911
calls
was
681
000
plus,
so
you
know
the
population.
The
workload
I
think
all
indications
would
would
would
point
towards
a
higher
number.
Obviously,
there's
a
variety
of
methodologies
of
how
one
would
establish
what
the
right
number
is.
I
I
think
understanding
sort
of
that
analysis
would
help
lead
this
discussion.
I
think
in
a
better
way-
and
certainly
we
can
you
know-
there'll-
be
disagreement
and
dispute
about
what
that
right.
Number
is,
but
understanding
some
of
those
formulas,
and
that
analysis
would
be
very
helpful.
How
many
police
officers
right
now
are
out
injured
or
out,
for
various
reasons
is
that
number
about
300
is
that
is
that
accurate.
C
C
So
that's
one
thing
yet
we're
bringing
people
back
light
duty,
we're
increasing
medical
visits.
You
know
so
we're
doing
we're
doing
everything.
We
believe
me,
and
I
know
counselor
brock
said
that
they
would
like
more
progress,
but
this
covid
really
has
put
us
on,
like
medical
doctors
just
weren't
seeing
people,
it
was
all
virtual
and
it
really
really
slowed
things
down,
but
with
you
know,
we're
hoping
that
most
of
the
employees
have
been
vaccinated.
C
I
Great,
I
do
I
appreciate
that.
I
see
that
my
time
is
up
super.
I
think
it's
superintendent
mcgoldrick
I'd
love
to
at
some
point
offline.
Look
at
that
analysis
and
understand
how
we
can
get
to
at
least
creating
a
conversation
around
around
the
appropriate
sized
force
and
and
how
many
members
we
we
could
have,
depending
on
some
of
that
analysis,
I
do
have
madam
chair
questions
for
the
next
round,
so
I'll
wrap
it
up
here.
Thank
you.
B
Great,
thank
you
so
much
yeah
and
I'll
note
that
several
times
the
committee
has
asked
for
sort
of
more
explicit
formulas
on
how
we
get
to
those
minimum
force
numbers.
So
it
was
helpful.
Some
of
the
context
you
just
gave
superintendent,
but
I
also
think
it's
something
we're
going
to
need
to
continue
to
dig
into
next
up
is
counselor
mejia.
B
E
I'm
more
curious
around
I've
heard
from
a
lot
of
officers,
wives
in
particular,
who
are
really
concerned
about
the
mental
well-being
of
some
of
our
officers,
particularly
those
who
are
overworked,
and
I'm
just
curious.
How
is
the
department
responding
to
to
those
needs
in
terms
of
just
the
overwhelming
mental
impact
mental
health
impact
that
overtime
has
on
some
of
our
officers?
Can
you
talk
a
little
bit
about
that.
M
Sure
yeah-
and
that
is
a
concern
that
that's
recognized-
we
do
have
a
a
very
probably
one
of
the
best
peer
support
units.
So
resources
are
there
for
people
that
are
experienced
some
mental
health
challenges
as
a
result
of
where,
whether
it's
the
workload
or
perhaps
some
of
the
conditions
they
face
relative
to
the
anti-police
atmosphere
or
or
anything
else
or
some
critical
incidents
they
might
be
involved
in.
So
we
do
address
that.
But
I
recognize
that
certainly
the
more
people
are
forced
to
work.
M
The
more
people
miss
time
to
connect
with
their
families
and
friends
and
community,
because
they're
forced
to
work
extra
hours,
sometimes
without
any
real
notice.
That
does
have
an
impact
on
mental
health
and
and
unfortunately,
we
don't
have
a
great
plan
to
limit
those
hours
limit
those
ordering
situations.
We
did
shift
some
people
around
in
the
past
to
try
to
mitigate
that.
It
helped
somewhat
on
the
margins.
M
It
wasn't
a
dramatic
difference
in
the
amount
of
people
that
that
we
could
that
we
could
order,
because
there's
there's
so
much
work
to
be
done
and
there's
only
so
many
officers.
So
it
is
a
concern,
and
I
certainly
appreciate
you
recognizing
that
and
and
having
conversations
with
with
officer's
family,
about
that
we
continue
to
work
on
it.
We
continue
to
try
to
limit
the
amount
of
times
we
order
people,
but
but
I
do
recognize
going
forward.
You
know
for
the
foreseeable
future.
E
M
Well,
I
mean
I
don't
have
any
data
that
would
indicate
that
it's
resulted
in
a
diminished
performance.
You
know
our
our
stats
and
the
way
we've
conducted
ourselves
as
a
department,
I
think
is-
is
probably
a
model
for
others.
I
mean
we
really
have
avoided
these
sharp
increases
in
crime.
We
really
have
been
able
to
take
a
huge
number
of
guns
off
the
street
without
without
having
to
resort
to
to
force.
M
That
would
that
would
be
objectionable,
although,
but
you
know
the
public
or
even
the
suspect
or
the
police
officers
in
danger,
we've
been
able
to
transition
to
a
very
methodical,
careful
approach
and
that
all
takes
some.
You
know
some
careful
attention
to
detail
some
supervision
and
some
mental
alertness.
So
I
think
we're
I
think,
we're
doing
well
performance
wise.
Having
said
that,
it's
I'm
sure
mental
health
professionals
would
say
there's
no
way
it's
not
affecting.
You
know
people
at
some
level,
whether
it's
at
work
or
elsewhere,.
C
No
counselor
superintendent
hassan,
are
you
doing
no,
and
we
do
have
provisions
within
the
rules
that
limit
the
amount
of
hours
that
an
officer
can
work
on
a
daily
basis.
So
so
we
do
take
that
you
know
into
consideration
to
ensure
that
they
get
proper
rest
and
time
with
their
family
to
the
best
of
our
ability,
but
the
demand.
E
Thank
you
for
that,
and
my
last
question
is
kind
of
just
want
to
piggyback
a
little
bit
on
what
counselor
campbell
was
referring
to
and
that
it
would
just
be
helpful
to
get
a
better
understanding
in
terms
of
where
the
greatest
needs
are.
Can
you
just
help
me
understand
a
little
bit
more
about
like
how
are
we
allocating
support?
I'm
thinking
specifically
around
some
of
the
violence
in
certain
neighborhoods?
E
Are
there
ways
that
you
all
are
partnering
up
with
others
to
maybe
I
think
we
talked
a
little
about
deploying
mental
health
and
wellness
providers?
Are
you
looking
at
other
ways
to
help
support
some
of
these
communities
that
have
seen
a
higher
uptick
in
violence
and
looking
at
partnering
up
with
the
boston,
public,
health,
commission
and
other
city
agencies.
C
Absolutely
counselor
I'll
emulate
superintendent
mcgoldrick.
This
is
people
are
the
front
line
emissaries
with
the
with
those
types
of
issues,
but-
and
we
also
have
the
bureau
of
community
engagement,
but
you
know-
and
you
know,
we've
as
you
know-
we're
working
with
the
best
teams
and
where
we
work,
you
know
we
try
to
work
with
other
city
agencies,
state
agencies,
mental
health.
C
You
know,
community
groups,
you
know
non-profits,
we
believe
us.
We
are
doing
everything
possible
to
reduce
that
violence,
because
that's
you
know,
public
safety
is
really
our
main
concern
so
and
we'll
do
whatever
we
have
to
do
to
obtain
that
goal.
You
know
and
create
whatever
relationship
partnership.
M
So,
council,
we've
in
in
terms
of
specifics,
we've
nearly
doubled
the
number
of
officers
assigned
to
the
street
outreach
unit
and
we're
working
diligently
to
hire
more
best
clinicians.
So
we
can
give
a
a
public
health
approach
we're
working
closely
with
the
public
health.
On
that
we're
revising
our
the
way
we
handle
section
12
commitments,
so
that'll
be
more
effective
and
it'll
be
it'll,
be
a
more
coordinated
approach
and
the
intent
is
that
will
allow
us
an
opportunity
to
enhance
relationships
with
what
providers
outside
of
those
who
usually
deal
with.
M
So
I
think
that
will
be
effective.
Of
course,
the
trauma
teams
are
deployed
with
street
outreach
workers
whenever
there's
a
traumatic
event,
a
homicide
or
a
significant,
violent
event
and
a
community.
So
we
we
are
still
working
those
issues.
Obviously
it's
been
a
challenge
with
the
coven
situation,
but
we
do
try
to
maintain
our
relationships
with
the
community
service
officers
and
the
various
faith-based
organizations
and
community
groups.
M
Hopefully,
we
can
turn
the
corner
on
covert
soon
and
enhance
those
relationships
back
to
where
they
were
pre-covered,
but,
but
that
has
been
that
has
been
maintained
as
a
as
a
key
component
of
what
we've
been
doing
and
we've
been
expanding
it.
I
will
say
that
some
of
the
some
of
the
issues
regarding
the
police
being
extricated
from
things
that
people
don't
want
the
police
involved
in
the
mental
health
things
has
not
really
resulted
in
less
police
involvement.
That
has
just
resulted
in
and
maybe
some
greater
partnership.
M
So
you
know,
as
as
public
health
may
increase
their
capacity.
That
doesn't
decrease
our
capacity.
You
know,
for
example,
when
when
ems
is
dispatched
to
a
emotionally
disturbed
person,
call
they
almost
always
request
police
accompany
them
due
to
past
incidents
and
potential
for
violence.
So
you
know
that
there
is
talk
of
maybe
creating.
Some
cities
has
created
a
third
agency
that
would
dispatch
mental
health
professionals.
The
police
fully
support
that.
I
think
that
would
be
a
great
thing.
I
just
don't
see
any
results
in
terms
of
lessening
the
the
role
of
the
police.
M
E
B
D
J
B
I
have
been
told
that,
if
that
there
may
be
an
issue,
it
may
be
or
wait
now
like
that's
the
wrong
one.
Isn't
it
yes
stop
share
there?
It
may
be
a
little
bit
blurry
on
the
on
the
stream.
It's
apparently
showing
up
fine
on
the
recording
like
so
it'll.
Be!
No,
that's.
Is
that
still
the
wrong
one?
Do
you
guys
see
the
right
thing.
J
J
For
me
right
now,
if
you
could
just
go
down
so
there
you
go
perfect
perfect!
That's
exactly
perfect!
Thank
you.
So
much
so
couple
questions
off
of
these
numbers.
We're
43
over.
Is
it
safe
to
assume
because
we
haven't
had
court
trials
and
things
of
that
nature
that
court
ot
is
actually
significantly
down.
B
M
J
J
J
J
M
Yeah,
that's
that's,
probably
not
a
a
great
name
for
it.
It's
just
additional
additional
assigned
patrols
or
assigned
fixed
posts,
so
it
could
be.
I
mean
theoretically,
it
could
be
as
a
result
of
gang
violence,
but
it
could
be
a
result
of
any
violence.
It's
typically
typically
violence
related,
but
we
also
do
have
coverage
for
and
it
would
be
looped
into
that
probably
inaccurately
named
category.
M
You
know
we
will
start
to
see,
as
I'm
sure
maybe
some
of
you
have
already
received
complaints
from
your
constituents-
we're
starting
to
see
some
of
the
atvs
out
on
the
streets,
and
you
know
we
haven't
seen
too
many
of
the
the
low
rider.
You
know
people
racing
around
the
streets,
although
we
did
have
a
horrible
accident
in
east
boston,
the
other
night,
so
you
know,
as
the
weather
gets
nicer
covert,
is
not
going
to
be
resolved
completely
by
the
summer.
M
So
I
anticipate
we'll
we'll
see
people
congregating
on
atvs
and
with
different
cars
and
just
trying
to
enjoy
themselves.
However,
that
gets
to
be
a
problem
in
the
community
if
it
exceeds
the
capacity
for
the
different
areas
to
absorb
that
type
of
activity.
So
so
we
would
dedicate
resources
to
those
areas
a
lot
of
times
at
the
request
of
some
city
councillors
or
others
in
the
community,
and
that
that
would
be
categorized
as
a
gang
car
frequently.
Even
though
it's
it's
really
not
related
to
a
gang.
J
Appreciate
that
breakdown,
and
then
in
terms
of
I
don't
see,
and
it
would
be
helpful
to
know
we
keep
talking
about
forced
overtime,
how
what's
the
percentage
of
actual
forced
ot
within
the
ot
hours,
so
a
lot
of
that
is
actually
voluntary
over
time.
I
think
the
vast
majority
of
it
the
last
time
we
had
that
data
breakdown
at
the
last
hearing.
How
much
ot
is
actually
forced
is
actually
not
by
choices.
K
J
C
B
C
J
That's
that's
helpful,
thank
you
and
then
just
on
the
injuries
which
this
might
end
up
having
to
be
a
second
round,
because
I
want
to
be
mindful
of
time,
but
just
on
this
one
specific
thing
do
we
know
how
many
injured
officers
or
out
officers
are
actually
out
due
to
contracting
culvert
or
coped
protocols.
Do
we
know
what
the
percentage
actually
is
as
opposed
to
all
the
other
injuries?
How
much
of
it
is
actually
covered
or
yeah?
We
have
those
numbers
yeah.
What
what
percentage
is?
Do
we
have
those
numbers?
J
H
J
Yeah,
thank
you.
That
would
be
very
helpful
and
I'll
save
all
of
my
injury
stuff
for
the
the
next
round,
because
I
think
there's
you
talked
about
forced
retirement
and
things
like
that,
and
I
kind
of
want
to
explain
and
understand
what
that
is.
I
just
heard
the
alarm
go
off,
and
so
I
want
to
give
you
a
little
heads
up
of
what
my
next
round
will
be.
So
if
lisa
or
anybody
has
to
pull
out
these
things,
I
want
to
know
about
forced
overtime,
not
force
time
overtime,
forced
retirement.
J
What
that
process
looks
like,
and
I'm
also
going
to
be
asking
about
how
you
calculate
this.
We
still
we're
talking
about
increasing
staffing
without
even
knowing
how
you
calculate
hours,
how
you
calculate
how
many
people
have
to
be
at
a
protest
or
a
rally.
We
don't
have
any
of
those
formulas,
and
so
I
I'm
certainly
interested
in
how
you
calculate
all
those
those
issues
if
we're
going
to
be
talking
about
upping
or
or
lowering
police
numbers.
Thank
you,
madam
chair
I'll,
see
you
on
the
second
round.
Thank
you.
B
Great,
thank
you
yes
and
I'll
just
say.
Obviously
anything
we
don't
get
answered
today,
which
maybe
you'll
be
following
up
on
and
also
I'll
be
taking.
You
know
any
questions.
Counselors
have
since
folks
just
got
the
information
now
as
they
sort
of
look
over
it
in
the
days
to
come,
since
it's
some
pretty
striking
stuff,
all
right,
I'm
going
now
to
next
sorry,
I'm
looking
for
my
list,
counselor
braden
and
then
it'll
be
counselors,
flaherty,
wu
and
edwards
counselor
braden.
N
Madam
chair,
I
don't
want
to
steal
cancer
or
I
use
thunder,
but
I
I
had
a
question
about
how
many
officers
are
out
on
long-term
sick
leave.
I
know
it
mentioned
that
there
were
220
officers
out
on
sick
leave,
but
how
many
of
those
are
long-term,
sick
leave
and
again?
What
is
the
process
to
expedite
the
retirement
of
those
officers
so
that
we
could
hire
replacements
who
are
graduating
from
the
police
academy?.
C
You
know
arcane
rules
associated
with
that
notifying
them
via
a
certified
nail,
and
we
do
all
that
and
then
we
we
bring
it
to
the
retirement
board.
And
if
it's,
if
it's
not
exactly
right,
then
it
will
kick
back
and
we
have
to
restart
the
whole
process.
It's
very,
very
cumbersome,
but
we
have
right
now
20
two
people
that
we've
submitted
paperwork
since
the
first
year
that
we're
going
to
involuntarily
retire.
C
We
just
feel
that
they're
not
going
to
make
it
back.
You
know
and
and
when
we're
working
on
others
like,
I
said
we're
selected
two
and
a
half
years
and
above
and
like
so
that's
that's
the
process.
I
mean
it
really
is.
If
you
really
want
to
talk
about,
I
don't
want
to
tie
everyone
up.
It's
we
could
I'll
meet
you
and
talk
to
you
about
it
and
show
you
the
process
and
very
difficult.
K
That
I'd
also
like
to
point
out
too
that
once
it
does
get
to
the
retirement
board,
it's
also
another
lengthy
process
on
their
end
to
process
these.
So
once
the
package
goes
up
to
the
retirement
board,
this
is
it's
a
lengthy
process
that
they
have
to
follow
to
get
them
seen
by
a
third
piano,
a
third
doctor,
a
piano
made
up
of
three
doctors.
C
There's
actually
two
ways
to
go:
counselors
go
involuntary
accidental
or
involuntary
regular,
and
so
you
know
we've
learned
along
the
way
that
we
need
to
do
both
at
the
same
time,
because
if
you
were
denied
involuntary
accidental,
the
whole
process
starts
all
over
again.
So
it
takes
months
and
months.
N
C
C
C
You
know,
if
a
lot
of
them
those
types
of
individuals
they
actually
you
know,
enjoy
our
assistance
with
that.
You
know
they.
They
appreciate
our
assistance,
but
you
know
so
two
and
a
half
years,
we'll
start
looking
at
what
are
all
the
issues
around
this
person?
And
you
know
what
does
it
look
like
we'll
stop,
making
an
assessment
if
it
looks
like
they're,
probably
not
coming
back,
then
we'll
go
down
that
road.
N
Is
that
a
supervisory
rule
that
you,
you
know
their
superior
officer,
would
would
have
a
conversation
with
them
to
be
more
to
thinking
along
okay?
What
do
you
think?
Are
you
going
to
be
coming
back?
Is
it
time
to
start
thinking
about
applying
to
retire?
You
know
rather
to
be
more
proactive
in
that
process,
rather
than
just
waiting
for
it
to
trigger.
C
Yeah,
well,
they
yep
there's.
Well,
that's
what
the
whole
point
of
the
medical
staff
kind
of.
Has
that
and
you
know
that's
the
whole
point
with
this
cove.
It
really
set
us
back
and
I
don't
want
to
keep
blaming
it,
but
it's
the
truth.
So
we're
going
to
have
more
in-depth
conversations
with
officers
as
they
as
we're
able
to
and
start
discussing
their
cases
individually
with
them.
N
Yeah,
oh
okay,
you
know,
and
the
other
side
of
that
is
that
we
we're
really
you
know,
set
our
intention
to
diversify
our
force
and
bring
in
new
recruits
who
more
women
recruits
more
people
of
color
to
have
a
more
linguistically
broad
group
of
folks
in
in
the
force.
So
you
know
the
positive
side
of
that
is,
and
I
understand
completely
that
it's
a
very
emotional
decision
to
retire
from
a
force
that
you
you've
been
faithful.
N
O
D
B
O
That's
one
of
the
strengths
that
we
have
as
a
city,
our
community
policing
and
the
fact
that
we're
not
like
a
lot
of
the
other
cities
that
are
experiencing
tremendous
amount
of
violence
and
we're
blessed
to
have
the
training
and
the
experience
throughout
all
the
different
police
districts.
Are
we
perfect,
of
course
not?
O
But
can
we
always
make
strides
to
be
better
absolutely,
and
I
think
that
this
hearing
will
be
hopefully
part
of
that
a
couple
quick
questions,
getting
a
lot
of
feedback
from
from
from
constituents
and
families
living
in
and
around
the
mass
and
cass
area.
They
feel
that
one
of
the
best
tools
to
date
has
been
the
bpd
bike
patrols,
the
pedal
bikes
there.
So
I
understand
that
there's
there's
been
a
cut
as
part
of
that
effort
to
reduce
the
overtime
budget.
O
So
I
would
love
an
opportunity
to
see
if
we
can
get
that
restored,
particularly
now
as
the
warmer
weather
is
here,
and
they
play
a
critical
role
and
also
maybe
to
one
of
the
superintendents
if
they
could
maybe
shed
some
light
on
really
on
the
court.
Overtime
piece
started
a
lot
as
an
assistant
d.a
started
also
as
a
defense
attorney.
O
I
believe
it
requires
four
hours
and
in
situations
where
we're
seeing
just
repeated
defaults
that
occur
all
across
the
county
in
in
the
district
courts.
What
can
we
do
to
prevent
that
and
again
that's
another
factor
that
I
think
plays
a
role
into
overtime.
So
I'd
like
to
hear
from
your
perspective
as
to
what
can
be
done
and
what
what
partnerships
may
need
to
come
to
the
table
to
stave
that
off.
A
We
also
try
to
have
the
ada's
schedule
more
than
one
case.
If
they
know
it's
going
to
be
something,
that's
going
to
be
quick,
so
if
they
can
handle
more
than
one
case
on
a
particular
day,
they're
able
to
do
that,
but
as
far
as
whether
a
case
gets
canceled
not
cancelled,
but
a
default
is
is
going
to
be
issued
or
whether
the
defense
attorney
calls
in,
for
whatever
reason
it
says,
he's
not
going
to
be
able
to
make
it
that
day.
We
really
don't
have
any
control
over
that.
A
O
And
then,
and
then
just
an
answer
on
the
pedal
bikes
over
massive
gas
and
then
just
my
last
question
have
any
of
the
as
the
city-wide
council.
Obviously
there's
22
wards
and
255
precincts
has
any
one
neighborhood
or
police
district
seen
heavier
cuts
to
their
day-to-day
operations.
Due
to
the
effort
to
to
to
rein
in
some
of
the
overtime
costs,
I
want
to
make
sure
that
there's
no
part
of
the
city,
that's
left
unprotected
at
any
time.
M
Council,
no,
this
is
this
kevin
mcgovern.
This
there's
been
no
cuts
to
to
day-to-day
service.
We
do
keep
a
minimum
manning
staff
at
at
each
district,
which
is,
you
know,
probably
probably
adequate
for
for
day
to
day.
Obviously,
if
we
run
into
situations
where
there's
significant
issues
going
on,
we
we
might
have
to
draw
from
other
districts
in
in
the
form
of
an
emergency
deployment,
but
that
also
dovetails
pretty
well
with
the
with
the
bike
unit
and
some
of
these
city-wide
units.
M
B
P
P
Okay,
so
my
apologies,
sorry,
it's
what
happens
when
you
have
25
freaking,
zooms
and
trying
to
pay
attention.
So
I
I
wanted
my
questions
to
be
very
think
about
possible
solutions.
Can
you
hear
me
all
right
so
one
of
the
questions
I
had,
I
guess,
for
the
police
officers.
I
brought
this
up
several
times
and
I'm
bringing
it
up
again
with
some
of
the
overtime
hours
and
how
they
can
be
rededicated
to
other
members
on
the
police
force
or
within
your
within
your
control,
such
as
crossing
guards.
We
talked
about
this.
P
It
seems
to
be
dismissed
and
redismissed,
but
I'm
still
wondering
why,
when
it
comes
to
street
work
and
standing
by
potholes
or
standing
by
certain
traffic
issues,
why
we
aren't
using
other
members
of
the
force
that
may
be
cheaper
in
their
overtime.
I
may
actually
need
some
additional
hours.
So
that's
one
question
number
two.
I
I
think
the
special
events
has
been
thoroughly
vetted
by
council
arroyo.
P
So
it's
very
clear
what
was
a
protest
and
what
was
a
concert
or
what
was
something
else
I
mean
it
looks
like
because
we
didn't
weren't
allowed
to
have
concerts
and
gatherings
most
of
20
most
of
last
year
that
this
would
have
been
overwhelmingly
protest,
but
I
still
think
I'd
like
it
by
date
and
then.
Finally,
I
also
noticed
that
there
is
a
the
major
majority
of
the
you
broke
down
by
district,
which
I
appreciate
it.
P
P
M
What
the
contractor
that's
doing
the
work
would
pull
the
permit
and
that's
wrapped
up
into
their
contract.
So
so,
if
it's
a,
if
it's
a
you
know
a
road
that
the
state
is
paying
or
bridge
that
the
state
is
is
doing
it's,
I
suppose,
indirectly
paid
for
through
that
contract,
so
that
the
public
ways
it's
it's.
M
It
is
at
some
point
for
those
jobs,
public
money
versus
a
utility-
that's
improving
their
infrastructure.
That
would
be.
That
would
be
private
money
you
know
paid
for
by
the
utility
contractor.
So
so
it
depends
on
what
work
is
being
done
on
the
public
way,
whether
it's
you
know,
indirectly,
public
money
or
if
it's,
if
it's
private
money,
but
still
on
a
public
way.
So
so
I
guess
it
varies
by
job.
Whoever.
M
P
M
That's
accurate,
I
know
that's
been
studied
before,
with
with
flagmen
and
again
this
doesn't
relate
to
overtime,
but
just
from
what
I've
seen
explored
before
say
the
use
of
a
laborer
at
a
construction
site
as
a
flagger,
I
think,
would
get
the
prevailing
wage,
which
is
our
that
the
detail
rate
for
boston
police
office
is
much
lower
than
the
overtime
rate,
so
I
think
the
prevailing
wage
would
be
comparable,
maybe
more
so
it's
not!
I
I
don't
think
we
could
pay.
A
Those
numbers
then
broken
down.
This
is
superintendent
nettings.
I'm
I'm
going
to
echo
what
kevin
said.
The
the
prevailing
wage
war
in
massachusetts
will
require
that
a
minimum
amount
of
50.42
be
paid
for
any
any
person
working
as
a
flagman.
Our
wage
right
now
for
fulfilling
a
detail
is
46,
so
the
prevailing
wage
is
actually
higher
than
it
would
be.
For
a
police
officer
to
man
that
particular
detail.
P
B
Councillor
edwards,
it's
prevailing
wage
for
this
activity
and
because
of
the
way
it's
pegged
to
police,
it's
basically,
it
makes
it
so
that
you
can't
really
replace
police
on
details
without
with
civilians
without
it
being
a
comparable
wage.
It
happens
to
mean
that,
of
course,
if
they
were
civilian
flaggers
that
they
would
be
very
well
compensated
once,
but
that's
that
it's
not
prevailing
wage
people
watching
at
home
should
not
think
that
that's
the
state's
calculation
for
all
working.
A
A
That
also
doesn't
include
legacy
costs
such
as
pensions,
health
care
and
other
long-term
budget
costs.
So
you
know,
for
example,
we
don't
receive
paid
sick
time,
vacation
workers,
comp
liability,
all
that
stuff
is
ancillary
benefits
that
would
be
required
by
using
civilians
or
other
performing
performing
a
role,
a
full-time
job.
Okay,.
P
P
I
would
like
to
see
how
those
hours
are
broken
down
by
date
and
when
they're
used
to
shed
them
all
into
one,
I
think
is,
is
confusing
for
us
to
be
able
to
analyze
where
we
can
make
some
cuts,
and
I
also
think
what
I'd
like
to
hear
from
the
police
is
specifically
how
they're
going
to
be
find
better
financial
stewards
in
helping
to
reduce
that
amount
of
overtime
hours.
What
I'm?
P
What
I'm
hearing
is
that
they're
they're
necessary,
but
I'm
not
hearing
any
sense
of
we
need
to
be
restructuring
or
thinking
about
things
differently
and
how
we
we
approach
a
special
event
or
how
we
are
spending
on
these
special
events.
Do
you
know,
there's
there's
a
you
know
we
could
talk
about
the
approach
and
another
hearing,
but
I
do
think
that
there's
got
to
be
who's
your
financial
watchdog
and
looking
at
these
overtime
hours
at
all,
I'm
you
know
beyond
us
asking
these
questions.
Is
anyone
in
bpd
asking
these
questions.
M
Yes,
I
think
bpd
is
asking
the
questions,
but
you
know
when
this
cut
was
made.
You
know
the
intent
at
least
the
publicly
stated
intent
seemed
to
be
that
some
of
this
work
would
be
shifted
to
other
people,
public
health
or
what
have
you
and
that
really
hasn't,
seemed
to
happen?
And-
and
I
don't
you
know-
I
I
recognize
that's
a
difficult
thing
to
do,
but
if
we're
going
to
reduce
not
only
police
overtime
but
police
involvement
and
some
of
these
issues
is,
it
needs
to
be
a
whole
of
government
approach.
M
It
can't
be,
we
take
the
money
from
the
police
and
even
if
we
give
it
to
someone
else,
we
don't
have
a
corollary,
our
reduction
in
in
the
police
involvement
in
some
of
these
activities.
You
know
one
example
is
you
know:
we've
been
in
talks
with
the
transportation
department,
they'll
issue,
a
moving
permit
and
then
we'll
get
the
police
will
get
a
call
that
that
a
car
is
blocking
the
moving
access.
M
The
police
get
the
call
the
police
get
assigned
to
tag
and
tow
that
car
at
you
know
that
at
the
cost
of
an
hour
or
maybe
more
of
a
police
officer's
time,
when
perhaps
the
transportation
department
would
be
the
the
better
route
for
that
to
go.
That's
just
one
example
of
many
that
we've
discussed,
so
you
know
if
we're,
if
we're
going
to
cut
over
time
and
cut
cut
budgets
with
the
intent
of
shifting
the
work
elsewhere
that
that
second
piece
of
actually
shifting
that
work
elsewhere
needs
to
happen.
It
should
happen.
M
P
So
you
know
maybe
when
we
do
have
that
hearing,
you
can
come
with
additional
examples
of
where
the
comprehensive
structure
shift
can
happen,
we'll
top
that
first
one
at
the
top
of
the
list,
but
then
we'll
continue
to
go
down
because
I
completely
agree
with
you:
there
are
times
where
we
cannot
simply
ask
you
to
not
do
and
not
earn
and
then
not
provide
a
structural
response
that
will
do
and
will
learn.
So,
thank
you
so
much.
I
see
the
gavel.
I
see
the
eyes
eyebrows
raised,
counselor
bach.
I
will.
B
Oh,
thank
you.
No!
No.
I
said
the
first
time
my
timer
went
off.
I
was
muted,
so
I
you
got
some
extra
time
in
there
counselor
edwards,
okay,
I
I
I
think,
that's
around
through
all
the
counselors,
so
we're
gonna
go
back
up
to
the
top
and
I
think
I'm
gonna
use
my
time
just
to
run
through
a
few
of
the
things
in
these
numbers.
So
to
start
out.
I
just
want
to.
I
just
want
to
share
this
one
again:
are
you
guys
seeing
in
excel?
B
B
I'm
curious.
We've
talked
a
little
bit
about
that
and
the
just
replacement
costs
driving
that
you
know
it's
really
concerning,
and
I
I
guess
what
I
want
to
underscore
it's
concerning
from
a
few
fronts,
I
mean
one:
is
that
we're
just
not
going
to
achieve
any
of
the
savings
that
were
budgeted
for
this
year
in
the
police
overtime
budget
and
I
think,
that's
extraordinarily
disappointing
to
this
council.
B
I
mean
it's
just
like
it's
a
really
concerning
driver
from
a
fiscal
perspective,
and
you
know
we
don't
have
the
budget
office
here
today,
but,
like
I
mean
the
next
question
is
going
to
be,
where
that
15
million
in
overage
that
you
guys
are
projecting,
is
coming
from
in
terms
of
us
settling
our
bills
on
june
30th.
So
just
really
want
to
stress.
You
know
how
how
frustrating
it
is-
and
I
know
all
of
the
superintendent
hassan
all
the
things
that
you've
sort
of
entered
into
the
record
about
why
we
are
where
we
are.
B
But
it's
just
from
a
fiscal
oversight.
Perspective
remains
really
frustrating.
I
want
to
ask
about
these.
The
departments
that
are
we
might
think
of
as
more
administrative
that
have
these
overages,
so
the
office
of
the
police.
Commissioner,
bat
professional
development
what's
driving
those
ones
because
they
sort
of
understand
what's
driving
field
services,
I'm
same
with
professional
standards
as
well
as
a
smaller
overage,
but.
K
The
office
of
the
police,
commissioner,
what
what
what
possibly
will
be
driving
that
overage
is
that's
where
the
community
outreach
team
outreach
street
outreach
team
unit
resides
under
the
office
of
the
police.
Commissioner,
under
the
bureau
of
administration
and
technology,
the
key
driver
for
that
20
000
is
upstairs
our
911
operations
unit.
C
K
Look
quite
easy:
correct,
you're
right
super,
that's
under
the
bureau
of
administration
technology,
but
I
would
like
to
point
out
that
9-1-1,
you
know
that
there
is
overtime
up
there
because
they're
down
significantly
in
heads
and
it
and
takes
some
time
to
get
call
takers
and
dispatchers
on
board.
So
I
think
that
their
short
personnel,
which
is
driving
that
overtime,
upstairs
the
bureau
of
professional
development
council
counselor,
I
can
say,
is-
is
probably
coming
from
for
the
most
part
correct
me
if
I'm
wrong
superintendent
hassan,
but
it's
recruit,
investigations.
K
You
know
smooth
itself
out,
but
now
it's
going
to
continue
only
because
we're
putting
a
second
class
on
for
june,
so
the
whole
recruit
investigation
process
has
started
all
over
again
I
mean
bureau
failed
services,
it's
replacement
time
and
bureau
professional
standards.
I'd
have
to
get
back
to
you
on
on
that
slight
overage.
Well,.
C
B
All
right:
well,
I
guess
I
mean
just
a
couple
of
comments.
One
would
be
that
I
think
in
terms
of
the
impact
of
the
police
cadets
class
lisa,
I
would
just
say
I
mean
I
think
we
knew
that
there
were
going
to
be
two
classes
this
year
that
was
baked
into
the
fy21
budget.
So
that
feels
like
the
type
of
thing
that
we
would
ideally
have
budgeted
for,
to
the
extent
that
it
kind
of
right
creates
this
additional
investigative
burden
for
that,
but
yeah.
B
I
think
I
think
overall
the
I
guess
I
guess
my
question
is:
like:
is
the
department
taking
any
extraordinary
measures
to
to
cut
costs
in
this
remaining
fiscal
year
and
and
then
in
terms
of
thinking
about
the
following
year?
I
mean
so
far.
What
I've
heard
is
just
it's
trying
to
it's
trying
to
get.
You
know
the
involuntary
retirements
and
obviously,
if
you
did
what's
what's
the
number
in
that
two
and
a
half
year,
what
number
of
officers
is
in
that
bucket
superintendent.
B
Right,
I
guess
I
would
say
that
it
seems
like
it.
You
know,
to
the
extent
that
the
department
has
a
strategy
on
that,
it's
something
that
we
could
cost
out
in
terms
of
you
know,
these
are
the
this
is
the
number
of
months
that
we
would
expect
it
to
take
this
process
to
run
through.
This
is
the
percentage
of
folks
who
we
think.
C
B
Right,
but
I
guess
my
point
is,
is
what
I'm
not
hearing
from
the
department
today,
I'm
not
hearing
any
plan
to
sort
of
curb
the
rate
of
this
number
running
into
june
30th,
but
I'm
also
not
hearing
a
plan
that,
like
really
right-sizes
our
overtime
to
what
we've
been
budgeting
for
for
even
next
fiscal
year.
So
I
think
that's
what
I'm
pushing
you
on
well.
C
The
plan
is
to
get
people
back
to
work,
pursue
all
these
avenues,
try
to
engage
other
city
departments
with
the
alternative,
policing
response,
which
I
think
is
the
key,
but
you
know-
and
we
can't
be
the
lead
agency
on
that,
but
I
think
if
we
could
have
some
successes
in
those
because
we
don't
have
the
luxury,
to
put
you
know
clothes
for
the
weekend
here,
you
know
people
call.
We
have
to
respond
like
these
special
events.
C
C
B
Right
and
I
would
just
say
superintendent,
I
think
that
the
I
think
in
some
ways
you
know
the
frustration
on
the
council
side
is
actually.
I
think
that
many
of
us
in
july
said
you
know
for
these
savings
in
the
overtime
budget
to
be
real.
There
needs
to
be
a
kind
of
like
structural
plan
and
and
what
I
hear,
what
I
hear,
both
you
and
superintendent,
mccoldrick
and
others
saying
today
is
like
there
wasn't
a
structural
plan,
so
we
haven't
achieved
the
structural
savings
and
they
have
to
be.
M
I
would
say
relative
to
a
structural
plan.
I
think
there
are
certain
fixed
costs
that
that
shouldn't
necessarily
be
fixed
costs,
but
but
they
are
because
we're
doing
the
best
we
can
with
with
the
situation
that's
handed
to
us.
You
know
I'll,
take
madison
casa
as
an
example
over
two
million
dollars
within
staffing
that
obviously
that's
what
the
people
in
the
neighborhood
demand
and
obviously
very
vulnerable
population
requires
some
increased
scrutiny
in
in
terms
of
keeping
them
safe.
M
There
are
people
that
that
recognize
that
there
are
people
with
with
mental
health
and
addiction
issues
and
people
do
prey
on
them
in
that
area.
So,
unfortunately,
that
has
become
a
fixed
cost
on
overtime
which
maybe
it
shouldn't
be,
but
there's
no
real
way
to
extricate
ourselves
from
that
without
impacting
public
safety,
quite
negatively
the
protests
that
that's
the
same
issue
and-
and
there
are
other
there
are
other
concerns
as
well
kobe.
Naturally.
M
Hopefully
that
goes
away,
but
I
I
guess
the
point
overall
is
that
the
people
and
events
and
and
just
events
that
that
may
happen
due
to
chance
planned
events,
unplanned
events,
those
are
all
factors
we
don't.
We
don't
get
to
control
so
to
to
look
for
a
concrete
plan
on
how
we're
going
to
limit
overtime.
It's
not
really
something
that's
without
hispanic
control
of
the
police
department.
M
I
mean,
if,
if
we
could,
if
we
could
schedule
every
major
protest
in
the
same
weekend
and
have
sort
of
you
know,
sort
of
economies
of
scale,
for
you
know
all
of
our
offices
to
to
be
in
a
certain
place
and
structure,
protests
appropriately,
sure
that'd
be
great,
but
we
don't
have
that
capability.
We
we
go
where
the
police
services
are
needed,
so
there
are
things
that
that
we
can
do
to
save
costs,
but
a
lot
of
what
we're
doing
is
on
the
margins.
M
We
really
don't
have
the
capability
for
a
wholesale
reduction
on
on
what
is
frankly,
an
arbitrary
remember,
not
based
on
any
kind
of
predicted
events
or
any
kind
of
predicted
crime
trends.
You
know
that
that
number
wasn't
based
on
anything
like
that.
That
number
was
I'm
not
sure
what
it
was
based
on,
but
but
certainly
there'd
be
no
way
to
predict
those
issues.
So,
there's
no
way
to
tailor
a
concrete
overtime
reduction
strategy
to
that
number
because
those
things
are
not
within
the
control
of
the
police
department
or
most
other
cities.
M
I
suppose
and
taking
a
whole
of
government
approach.
We
could
take
take
the
approach
when
people
start
applying
for
permits
again
that
we
would
deny
permits.
We
would
limit
events.
We'd
do
certain
things
that
would
cut
down
on
police
overtime,
but
I
don't
think
that's
the
direction
we
want
to
go
as
a
city
I
mean.
Certainly
the
the
police
are
going
to
support
whatever
events,
we
need
to
support
that
that
rarely
is
our
choice,
usually
we're
reacting
to
conditions
that
are
established
elsewhere
in
city
government
or
outside
of
government.
M
So
I
I
think,
unfortunately,
some
of
these
numbers
are
numbers
that
defy
predictive
analysis
and
and
defy
real
cost-cutting
measures,
the
ones
that
we
do
control.
I
think
we're
we're
trying
to
control,
but
but
I
wish
it
was
a
better
way
to
to
kind
of
schedule
things
and
and
address
things
without
incurring
overtime,
but
that
I'm
not
sure
what
that
would
be.
B
B
It
doesn't
strike
me
that
it's
so
out
of
the
realm
of
us
being
able
to
know
that
it's
categorically
different
from
all
the
other,
hard-working
civilian
departments
that
do
really
important
work
for
the
city,
and
that,
yes,
cannot
always
predict
the
future.
I
mean
I
just
think
that
we've
got
it
yeah.
M
I
think
the
police
deal
primarily
with
the
variable
of
people
more
than
any
other
entity
in
in
the
city
government,
certainly
on
the
scale
that
we
deal
with
it.
So
I
think
that
variable
is
hard
to
predict.
I
think,
if
anyone
predicted
a
year
ago
what
the
police
would
be
dealing
with,
they
would
have
been
100
percent
wrong.
M
I
think
we
all
saw
what
happened
at
at
the
capital.
Protest
turned
into
a
riot
turned
into
something
much
worse,
which
made
the
whole
country
look
bad
on
the
world
stage.
That
is
not
a
position
that
I'm
inclined
to
put
the
police
department
in
because
of
a
budget
number.
If,
if
we're
told
to
do
so,
then
then
I
think
it
would
be
ill-advised.
B
M
I
I
certainly
hope
that,
like
public
schools
are
more
predictable
and
and
how
they
run
their
day-to-day
than
the
police
department,
I
know
there's
there's
many
excellent
educators
who
can
shape
their
environment
much
more
effectively
than
then.
The
police
department
can
shape
their
environment
in
the
city.
So
I
I
I'm
not
sure
I
I
think
that
that's
I
don't
think
that's
a
valid
comparison.
I
guess.
B
Thank
you,
superintendent.
I
think
I,
since
I'm
the
chair,
I'll
I'll,
restrain
myself
and
and
go
to
the
go
to
the
next
counselor.
I
just
want
to
put
a
couple
numbers
on
the
record
for
the
public
just
and
I
won't
pull
the
screens
up
for
short
time.
So
I
think-
and
I
just
want
to
confirm
them
with
you
all
so
you
guys
sent
us
overtime
hours
and
for
the
sort
of
overall
overtime
hours
worked
versus,
not
worked.
It's
almost
all
worked.
B
It's
like
99.4
percent
hours
worked
and
only
0.6
hours
not
worked,
but
then
on
court
over
time-
and
I
think
counselor
flaherty
raised
this,
but
I
just
want
to
underscore
it
on
and
now
I'm
looking
for
the
excel
on
court
over
time.
It's
like
two-thirds
of
the
court
overtime
hours
are
hours
not
worked
and
one-third
or
hours
worked.
I
think
that
that
ratio
has
been
going
up
in
the
wrong
direction
over
the
last
few
years.
A
B
F
F
F
Why
more
details
there?
I
know
lisa
you
were
talking
about.
You
gave
some
details
here,
but
anything
that
the
department
can
send
over
would
be
really
helpful.
And
then
I
just
have
two
other
questions.
One
was
just,
I
guess
three
one:
what
percentage
of
details
actually
account
for
overtime
in
the
department?
F
M
D
K
I
know
that
from
obm,
roughly
4
million
was
get
from
fiscal
year.
20
was
get
getting
moved
off
the
operating
budget
from
overtime
some
some
of
it
was
being
reimbursed
from
fema,
and
some
of
it
was
being
transferred
over
to
the
care
grant
and
I
believe
we
have
the
care
grant
through
1231
2020.
So
I'm
not
sure
how
much
obm
will
be
allowed
to
move
over
to
the
care
grant
for
fiscal
year.
21.
that
four
million
dollars
was
specific
to
fiscal
year.
20
counselor.
F
F
K
K
D
F
This
is
to
superintendent
mcgodrick's
point
without
still
leaning
on
our
police
departments,
while
we're
doing
that
shift
of
responsibility.
So
has
the
department
ever
done
a
survey
of
some
sort
of
employees
in
the
department
around
their
thoughts
and
ideas
on
how
we
might
realize
savings
in
terms
of
overtime
costs.
O
C
F
So
I
just-
and
I
offer
it
up
as
an
idea
I
do
think,
having
as
many
employees
in
the
current
department
officers
and
civilians,
be
able
to
weigh
in
on
on
this
budget
question
that
is
before
us
with
ideas
or
thoughts
on
how
we
might
actually
make
it.
So
it's
more
sustainable
and
how
we
reduce
over
time
would
be
really
helpful
to
all
of
us.
So
not
just
of
course,
folks
at
the
top
tier
levels,
our
captains,
but
others
as
well.
M
I
agree,
council,
I
think
that
would
be.
I
think
that
would
be
a
worthwhile
endeavor
and
I
think,
there's
obviously
some
great
ideas
at
all
ranks
in
the
department.
Certainly
I
mean
certainly
at
the
patrolman
level,
we
engage
with
the
union
leadership,
who
has
pretty
pretty
candid
dialogue
with
their
members
and
they
do
filter
up
some
some
information
to
us,
but
but
perhaps
a
broader
approach
and
a
more
formalized
approach
would
would
yield
some
results
that
perhaps
we
haven't
thought
of.
B
Thank
you
councillor
campbell
before
we
go
to
councillor
sabi
george,
I'm
just
going
to
let
larry
calderon
from
the
boston
police,
patrolman's
association
speak.
I
had
said
he
could
justify
by
noon
and
we
are
there
and
then
I'll
also
just
ask
counselors,
who
are
remaining
for
a
second
round
to
really
whittle
your
questions
down
just
efficiently
and
because
I
know
the
department's
also
got
time
constraints.
So
I'd
love
to
get
them
on
the
record.
But
you
know
we
may
have
to
follow
up
with
some
things
afterwards.
Mr
calderon.
L
Good
afternoon
now,
counselor
and
all
the
counselors
and
everybody
from
the
command
staff.
That's
here,
thank
you
very
much
councillor
bart
for
for
getting
me
in
I'll.
Try
to
answer
some
of
the
things
from
the
standpoint
of
the
members
that
I
represent,
as
well
as
the
department
who's
spot
on
in
everything
that
the
superintendents
have
been
saying.
I'll
start
with
the
details,
counselor
edwards,
why
don't
we
use
other
entities
for
potholes?
L
It's
that
type
of
lack
of
information
that
exists
out
there
and
I'd
really
be
happy
to
sit
down
with
any
counselor
or
the
council
as
a
whole
to
talk
about
big
details
in
the
city,
because
what
we
actually
provide
by
in
that
service
is
public
safety.
A
couple
of
quick
examples
that
I
can
point
to
is
a
an
officer
involved
in
a
brief
struggle
over
a
radio
call
for
a
person
with
a
gun
that
that
firearm
was
recovered
and
removed
from
the
streets
in
another
incident.
L
Not
only
did
the
two
officers
rush
over
and
pick
up
that
slab,
but
they
simultaneously
summoned
ems
from
their
department
radio
and
were
able
to
provide
first
aid
to
that
injured
person
in
another
incident
on
causeway
street,
a
shots,
shots
were
fired
and
a
call
came
out
with
the
card
description,
detail.
Officers
notified
units
that
were
dispatched,
the
car
was
stopped,
an
illegal
firearm
was
recovered
and
three
suspects
were
put
in
custody.
L
L
I'd
submit
to
you
that,
just
by
the
numbers,
the
super
provided,
they
have
doubled
the
population.
The
city
has
doubled
since
1980
it
has
doubled
our
calls
for
service,
but
yet
our
numbers
have
gone
down
for
sworn
personnel.
I
don't
understand
how
we
can
continue
to
do
more
with
less
we're
looking
to
cut
an
overtime
budget
as
respectful,
as
I
can
say
it.
I
think
we
need
to
stop
the
charade
of
hey.
We
can
cut
police
services
by
collecting
by
cutting
the
overtime
budget.
L
The
city
of
boston
had
a
3.61
billion
dollar
budget
for
fiscal
21..
Surely
we
can
budget
the
appropriate
amount
of
money
for
the
police
department.
If
we
historically
go
in
the
red
by
12
or
15
million
dollars
every
year,
then
why
isn't
the
city
council
or
the
mayor's
office
whomever
creates
the
budget
just
giving
us
adequate
funds
to
provide
those
police
services?
L
It's
silly
that
I
listen
to
counselor
flynn
sit
here
and
he's
begging
for
more
police
officers
in
his
neighborhood
and
I'll
go
on
the
record
by
saying
that
many
of
you
counselors
have
also
asked
for
that
same
service.
In
fact,
the
department
many
times
have
hired
multiple
units
of
overtime
to
provide
police
services
specifically
for
city
councillors
that
have
requested
them
in
their
neighborhoods.
L
L
We
can't
cut
the
police
budget
if
we're
not
giving
adequate
budget
to
begin
with
we're
not
going
to
stop
investigating
crimes,
homicides,
sexual
assaults,
crimes
against
children-
you
rather
what
some
people
might
call
basic
quality
of
life
issues,
the
bnes,
the
simple
assaults.
We
we
can't
stop
policing.
L
So
I
I
guess,
I'm
going
to
ask,
hire
4
or
500
more
police
officers
or
increase
the
budget
to
an
adequate
amount,
because
in
my
26
years
I
keep
hearing
the
same
complaint.
The
police
department
goes
over
budget
and
we're
continually
asked
to
do
more
with
less
and
it
just
can't
continue.
I
applaud
everybody
for
the
job
that
they're
doing.
I
know
some
of
you,
counselors
are
are
fairly
new.
L
Others
have
been
around
a
long
time,
but
I'm
sure
if
we
all
sat
at
the
table-
unions
command
staff,
elected
officials,
we
could
have
a
serious
conversation
about
how
to
do
better
for
the
citizens
of
boston.
So
I
I
want
to
thank
all
the
men
and
women
out
there
that
are
answering
the
calls
for
service
daily
they're
doing
a
tremendous
job.
Cobit
has
taken
its
toll
on
everyone
and
that's
all
police
officers,
the
rank
and
file.
I
represent
the
detectives,
the
federation,
the
command
staff,
as
well
as
your
sales
counselors
counselor
bach.
L
B
Thank
you,
mr
calderon,
and,
and
I
will
just
know
that
the
department
did
what
the
city
did
in
the
fy
17
budget.
True
up
the
police
overtime,
so
we
had
been
consistently
running
over
and
it
it
increased
the
overtime
number
by.
I
think
it
was
10
or
15
million
in
order
to
make
it
kind
of
real.
So
what
you
just
suggested,
this
was
back
in
17
and
then
the
department
promptly
ran
over
that
substantially.
I
I
I
I
I
D
I
And
I'm
not
sure
if
this
was
this
is
in
that
analysis
that
we,
I
know
we
have
in
our
inboxes.
I
haven't
looked
so
you
just
tell
me
if
it
is
or
if
it
isn't
do
we
know
what
over
time
is
attributed
to
officers
who
are
out
injured
versus
officers
over
time.
That's
filled
because
officers
may
be
at
court
or
there
might
be
some
sort
of
special
assignment.
I
I
think
in
the
fall
chair
box,
so
I
think
it
would
be
interesting
to
get
to
a
point
where
we're
not
just
simply
sharing
some
information,
but
getting
to
a
point
where
we're,
I
think,
making
some
decisions
in
a
different
way,
and
certainly
our
budget
process
coming
up
will
play
an
important
role
in
that.
But
thank
you,
madam
chair,
and
thank
you.
Everyone,
who's
joined
us
today
and
who
has
participated
in
the
hearing
and
for
the
information
that's
here
and
coming
soon.
Thank
you.
B
Thank
you,
counselor
sabi
george
and
yes,
counselors
o'malley
and
flynn
wave
their
second
round
questions.
So
that's
why
we
jump
to
you
and
I'll
just
say
for
folks
that
I
agree
with
counselor
sabi
george,
that
the
budget's
going
to
be
an
appropriate
place
to
talk
about
those
sort
of
decisions
and
next
steps,
and
that
I
would
expect
that
the
sort
of
next
quarter
version
of
this
overtime
hearing
is
just
going
to
be
rolled
in
with
and
co-noticed
with
our
budget
process,
because
it's
really,
it
really
is
about
sort
of
what
action
we're
taking.
B
E
B
J
C
C
No
so
again,
this
is
just
something
that's
been
implemented
due
to
the
you
know,
trying
to
meet
this
goal
of
overtime
reduction,
and
so
it's
two
and
a
half
years.
But
it's
not
just
a
number
counselor.
It's
a
review
of
all
their
records
from
their
medical
from
the
medical
profession
that
they're
seeing
it's
from
conversations.
It's
you
know
projected
possibilities
so
and
then
we
take
all
that
into
into
account
and
then
determine.
Maybe
the
best
course
of
action
here
would
be
to
move
forward
with
retirement
and.
J
So
I'm
assuming
that,
when
that's
happening
officers
that
are
going
through
this
process,
the
only
reason
they're
still
going
through
the
process
and
not
going
through
the
retirement
process
is
because
they're
saying
I
can
get
back
into
the
force
or
I
can
I
want
to
get
back
to
the
force
eventually
is
that
is
that
the
process
here
is
it
kind
of
a
push
where
the
force
is
saying.
We
don't
think
you
can
come
back,
but
we
don't
think
you're
medically
cleared
to
come
back
and
there's.
J
C
Lot
of
them
so
a
lot
of
them
do
it
on
their
own
because
some
of
them,
you
know
some
some
of
these
officers.
They
love
this
job
and
they
just
don't
want
to
face
reality
that
yeah,
it's
something
you
loved,
but
you
can
no
longer
do
it,
so
they
kind
of
resist,
but
but
so
we
do
assist
anybody
that
wants
to
move
out.
You
know
move
on
on
their
own,
so
but
some
just
can't
come
to
grips
with
you
know.
C
K
J
J
What
I'm
trying
to
figure
out
is
how
many
of
those
replacement
hours
are
due
to
injuries
other
than
being
sick
with
coven
or
being
out
with
covet
protocol.
So
so
I
wanted
to
kind
of
get
the
percentage
of,
because
we
keep
saying
colbit
drew
up,
drove
up
the
replacement
hours,
I'm
trying
to
actually
put
a
number
on
what
that
actually
is.
If
kovid
drove
up
replacement
hours,
because
people
were
sick
with
cold
people,
I
want
those
percentages.
C
K
So
we
do
have
that
information.
It's
just
that
we've
been
trying
to
tighten
up
where
we
sometimes
find
that
the
clerk
will
code
an
officer
out
sick
when
at
the
same
time
the
officer
really
has
reported
a
covet
exposure
and
that's
where
we're
trying
to
close
that
gap,
and
I
think,
we've
closed
it
pretty
well.
So
we
do
have
a
lot
of
those
numbers
and
those
numbers
are
pretty
solid
and
we
can
get
those
to
you.
J
Okay
and
then,
if
you
could
just
also
when
you
get
that
to
me,
let
us
know
when
you
figured
out
that
you
had
this
issue
with
when
you
tried
to
basically
clean
up
the
coding
right
so
that
we
know
when
we
have
sort
of
an
unreliable
timeline.
So
if
it
was
march
and
april,
but
you
figured
out
by
may,
let
us
know
when
you.
C
K
What
happens
to
where
it's
it's
actually
better
for
us,
but
an
officer
goes
back
to
work.
It
doesn't
inform
you
know
the
time
clerk
puts
him
back
to
work,
but
doesn't
inform
our
health
that
that
council
has
that
that
that
officer
has
returned
to
work.
We
have
since
have
protocols
in
place
where
there
has
to
be
communication
between
oc
health
to
basically
approve
that
return
to
work
and
that
the
information
is
disseminated
down
to
the
appropriate
time
clerk.
K
So
we
we've
done
a
tremendous
amount
of
work
to
make
sure
that
we've
had
controls
in
place
but
again
early
on.
It
was
a
learning
curve
for
all
of
us
and
I'm
sure
it
was
for
everybody
within
the
city
department,
because
you
know
the
expectation
was
unknown
at
that
time,
but
I
mean
we
we've
made
tremendous
strides
in
making
sure
that
controls
replace
controls
are
in
place
for
tracking
covered,
more
importantly,
tracking,
when
those
officers
returned
to
work
and
making
sure
that
ark
health
was
aware
of
those
officers
who
have
returned
to
work.
J
J
The
city
council
is
an
oversight
body
and
it's
incredibly
difficult
to
have
oversight
when
we
don't
have
data
when
we're
talking
about,
we
got
to
up
the
hours
and
we
got
to
up
highers
and
we
got
this
and
we
have
that.
But
I
don't
get
you
know
what
counselor
campbell
was
talking
about,
which
is
the
raw
data.
I
don't
have
how
you
calculate
how
many
people
have
to
be
on
the
on
this
on
the
streets
at
any.
Given
time.
I
don't
have
how
many
officers
we
have
calculated
for
each
protest
or
rally.
J
Last
I
checked
there
was
no
insurrection
in
the
city
of
boston,
so
the
fact
that
we
ran
up
numbers
for
an
entire
week
and
we
had
phone
calls
with
bpd,
where
there
was
no
intelligence,
that
there
was
an
actualized
threat
and
a
lot
of
this
was
just
you
know,
essentially
for
comfort.
You
know
when
we
have
that
and
I'm
looking
at
real
numbers
as
an
oversight
body,
that's
supposed
to
be
overseeing
the
city
budget,
it's
incredibly
difficult
to
have
any
of
these
conversations
without
that.
J
So,
since
the
next
one's
going
to
be
tied
into
the
actual
budget,
I
would
love
it
if
bpd
could
explain
how
they
do
their
staffing
hours,
because
unless
we
know
how
you
do
your
staffing
hours,
we
can't
delegate
actual
dollars
to
that
in
any
real
way.
That
would
make
any
sense.
So
that's
it!
Thank
you,
madam
chair.
Thank
you
for
bpd,
for
being
here
and
and
giving
us.
You
know
the
information
that
they're
giving
us
and
if
I
can
just
get
that
covered
stuff
after
this
I'll
be
great.
B
Great,
thank
you.
Thank
you.
Counselor
arroyo
and
counselor
edwards
has
waved
questions,
so
I
think
we're
coming
to
the
end
here.
I
and
I
don't
see
anybody
on
for
public
testimony
if,
if
you
are
email,
s-h-a-n-e,
dot,
p-a-c
at
boston.gov,
shane
pack
straight
away,
because
I'm
going
to
be
gabbling
us
out
in
a
minute
yeah.
B
And
I
think
I
you
know
I
just
want
to
emphasize
that
sort
of
where
we
find
ourselves
back
is
that
you
know
the
money
comes
comes
from
somewhere
right
and
so
it'll
be
pulled
out
of
reserves.
It's
it's
a
significant
overage,
it's
so
much
so
that
it's
like
you
know
it's
many
of
our
other
departments
combined
worth
of
money
when
we
talk
about
15
million
dollars.
B
This
fall
the
spring
conversation,
but
it's
definitely
dispiriting
to
know
that
we're
not
going
to
achieve
any
of
those
savings.
I
am
glad
to
hear
about
the
work
that
you're
doing
superintendent,
hassan
and
others
around
trying
to
really
tackle
this.
This
long-term
sick
and
injury
leave
problem.
I
just
I
can't
emphasize
enough
when
we're
talking
about
like
100
officers
worth
on
the
force.
I
mean.
That's,
that's
like
you
know.
B
Solving
that
problem
is
like
adding
100
police
officers
and-
and
you
know,
having
looked
at
the
historical
data
you
sent
us
it's
way
out
of
league
right
now
from
where
it's
been
before,
and
it
seems
like
that's
even
with
even
bracket
and
covid.
So
I
just
think
I
think
you
know
to
counselor
arroyo's
point.
The
hearings
probably
raised
more
questions
for
us
than
answers,
but
the
you
know
getting
getting
these
questions
on
the
table
and
this
conversation
on
the
table
is
an
important
part
of
the
council's
oversight
role.
B
So
I
am
grateful
to
all
of
you
and
to
the
department
for
the
work
that
you
do.
I
know
these
are
hard
conversations
and
you
know
I
think
it's
it's
just
a
hard
thing
for
us
as
a
council
that
every
department
has
has
a
reasons
and
rationale
and
important
work
that
they
do
and
yet
we're
sort
of
stewarding
the
overall
city
budget
and
trying
to
think
about
how
to
do
that
responsibly
in
the
interest
of
all
bostonians.