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Description
Mayor Walsh, elected officials, and those affected by the opioid epidemic gathered in the Old South Church for an intimate discussion about substance abuse and recovery. Sam Quinones author of "Dreamland", and Maureen Cavanagh author of "If you Love Me," joined Mayor Walsh in sharing their experiences with addiction.
A
Thank
you
for
coming
here
tonight.
It's
great
to
see
you
all
hello.
Everyone
welcome
to
the
Old
South
Church
for
the
national
and
personal
toll
of
the
opioid
epidemic,
a
discussion
event
with
author
Sam
quinones
and
Maureen
Cavanaugh,
hosted
by
Mayor
Martin
J
Walsh.
My
name
is
Brendan
little
I'm
the
policy
director
for
the
mayor's
officer
recovery
services
at
the
city
of
Boston.
Thanks
to.
B
A
A
Especially
through
holistic
approaches
like
wellness
and
Art,
September
is
national
recovery
month
and
tonight's
event
is
the
culmination
of
the
mayor's
recovery
month
book
club,
our
recovery
month
initiative
focused
on
increasing
awareness
of
substance
use,
while
also
promoting
literary
arts
in
the
community.
This
month-long,
citywide,
read
including
tonight's
event,
has
been
a
partnership
between
the
mayor's
office
of
recovery
services,
the
mayor's
office
of
Arts
and
Culture,
the
Boston
Public
Library
and
the
Ryze
foundation.
It's
the
first
time.
We've
ever
done
anything
like
this,
and
so
far
the
engagement
and
feedback
has
been
incredible.
A
In
the
earliest
days
of
my
recovery,
journey,
I
would
regularly
attend
a
12-step
fellowships
meeting
that
rented
a
room
in
this
very
Church
I
was
18
homeless
and
in
need
of
a
lot
of
support.
My
first
sponsor
and
recovery
used
to
attend
that
meeting.
In
case
you
don't
know
what
a
sponsor
is
that
someone
who,
with
a
longer
period
of
recovery,
would
help
somebody
with
the
earlier
period
of
recovery.
This
man
had
a
warm,
loving
energy.
He
was
hilarious
on
the
steps
of
this
church.
I
nervously
asked
him
to
be
my
sponsor.
A
He
smiled
and
responded.
I
was
waiting
for
you
to
ask
me
he
and
a
few
of
my
other
close
friends
that
I
now
consider
my
family
were
pivotal
in
my
early
recovery.
At
a
time
for
the
anxiety,
shame
and
instability.
These
men
taught
me
what
a
sober
life
as
possible,
but
even
though
this
man
was
able
to
help
plant
the
seeds
of
recovery
in
me,
he
eventually
relapsed
the
disease
of
addiction
took
hold
of
him.
His
disease
quickly
progressed.
He
became
increasingly
isolated
a
few
years
ago.
A
Will
be
as
follows:
Maureen
Cavanaugh
and
Sam
communists'
are
going
to
individually
speak
about
their
books
for
ten
minutes
each
and
then
we'll
be
joined
by
mayor
Marty
Walsh.
Who
will
lead
a
discussion
with
both
authors?
The
discussion
will
be
followed
by
an
audience
Q&A.
We
ask
that
you
hold
your
questions
for
the
authors
until
the
end
of
the
discussion.
A
D
Good
evening,
everyone
I
get
the
pleasure
of
introducing
our
our
first
author
of
tonight,
but
before
I.
Do
that
I'd
like
to
take
the
opportunity
to
think
Brendan
to
tell
your
story
I
think
oftentimes.
When
we
think
about
this
work,
we
sometimes
forget
how
important
it
is
to
tell
our
stories
to
hear
those
stories
and
to
lift
up
those
voices,
and
so
it's
not
always
easy,
and
it's
not
always
something
everyone
does.
But
for
me
to
you.
Thank
you
for
doing
that,
because
it
helps
us
in
this
journey.
I.
D
Have
to
push
her
now
introducing
our
first
author,
Maureen
Cavanaugh,
Maureen
who's,
a
local
author
and
advocate
from
Marblehead
that
lives
in
North
reading,
as
it
recently
is
here
tonight
and
like
so
many
others,
her
family
has
struggled
with
addiction
and
her
debut
memoir.
If
you
love
me,
which
is
going
to
discuss
tonight,
Maureen
tells
us
the
challenging
but
hopeful
story
of
her
daughter's
battle
with
heroin
use
after
crashing
head-on
into
the
stigma
that
still
surrounds
addiction.
D
Maureen
became
a
fierce
advocate
for
people
with
substance
use
disorders,
she's,
the
founder
and
president
of
the
nonprofit
Magnolia
new
beginnings,
which
provides
support
to
individuals
and
families
struggling
with
substance,
use,
marinas
a
beacon
of
resilience,
courage
and
love
in
the
face
of
an
epidemic
that
is
ravaging
our
communities.
She's
helped
countless
people
in
their
time
of
greatest
need.
E
E
E
When
my
daughter
first,
we
first
found
out
that
she
was
using
heroin
and
addicted
to
heroin
I.
You
know,
I
didn't
know
what
to
do.
I
was
like
every
other
parent.
Certainly
the
last
thing
on
my
mind
was
writing
a
book.
I
spent
a
lot
of
time,
googling
things
and
trying
to
figure
everything
out
of
my
own
and
researching
things
and
just
came
up
against
a
brick
wall
over
and
over
again
until
I
started
to
connect
with
other
people.
E
I'm
hoping
I
know
that
the
both
will
it's
about
our
struggle
and
our
journey
over
the
last
five
or
six
years,
but
I'm
sure
that
parents
will
read
this
and
not
feel
so
alone
and
I'm,
hoping
that
that's
part
of
what
happens
from
from
the
book
coming
out,
but
I'm
also
hoping
that
people
read
it.
That
think
that
it
can't
happen
to
them
and
and
start
to
get
a
good
idea
of
what
we
as
parents
go
through.
E
I'm
sure
that
there
must
be
people
here
and
I
know
that
there
are,
but
here
in
the
audience
tonight
that
have
walked
in
my
shoes
and
it's
a
tough.
It's
a
tough
walk,
but
I
hope
that
by
the
book
coming
out
and
beginning
to
put
a
face
on
this,
which
is
what
I
think
we
need
to
do.
I
think
that,
hopefully,
the
stigma
will
start
to
be
broken
down
a
little
bit
and
we
can
start
to
join
together
because
the
connection
was
the
most
important
thing.
For
me,
the
book
is
about
our
story.
E
E
I
have
a
lot
a
bit
of
a
call
which
made
it
all
that
much
more
difficult
to
find
help
because
I
very
quietly
tried
to
have
but
find
help
so
that
I
wouldn't
expose
her,
but
I
found
out
that
that
was
not
the
thing
to
do
so.
This
is
the
story
of
our
struggle
and
how
she
struggled
and
how
I
struggled
alongside
her
and
finally
come
to
learn.
Then
we
were
both
on
a
journey.
E
She
was
on
hers
and
I
was
on
mine
and
I
needed
to
take
care
of
myself
and
find
help
for
myself
in
the
in
the
middle
of
all
that
I
created
an
organization
called
Magnolia
new
beginnings
and
I
think
that
that
gives
the
support
to
people
that
wasn't
available
when
I
was
looking
for
it
and
I
hope
that
people
will
learn
about
that
too.
As
they
read
the
book,
I
promise
you.
E
A
Thank
you
so
much
Maureen
I
now
have
the
privilege
to
introduce
Samton
Jonas
simcha
Jonas
is
a
journalist
storyteller
an
author
of
three
acclaimed
books.
He
spent
a
decade
living
as
a
freelance
writer
in
Mexico
and
worked
as
a
reporter
for
the
LA
Times,
where
he
covered
immigration,
drug
trafficking
and
gangs.
A
His
most
recent
book,
which
we'll
be
discussing
tonight,
dreamland
the
true
tale
of
America's
Opia
opiate
epidemic
in
dreamland,
Sam
traces,
how
the
aggressive
prescribing
of
oxycontin
intersected
with
an
influx
of
black
tar
heroin
to
create
the
biggest
public
health
crisis
crisis
of
our
time.
Since
its
release,
dream
land
has
become
recognized
as
one
of
the
most
definitive
accounts
of
the
opioid
epidemic.
It
has
won
numerous
awards,
including
the
National
Book
Critics
Circle
Award
Sam
is
a
meticulous
journalist
and
a
master
storyteller.
A
He
has
helped
us
understand
the
opioid
epidemic
from
an
international
perspective,
while
never
losing
sight
of
the
human
stories
at
the
heart
of
the
crisis
and
just
a
personal
story.
The
City
of
Boston
recently
filed
litigation
against
opioid
manufacturers,
distributors
and
doctors,
who
are
misleading
practices,
caused
an
epidemic,
and
you
know
we
were
interviewing
law
firms
that
came
in
these
biggest
law.
Firms
from
all
over
the
country
came
in
to
speak
with
us
and
wanted
to
us
to
hire
them
to
be
their
lawyers.
For
this,
in
every
single
firm
I
was
in
every
single
interview.
A
F
F
Everybody
good
yeah.
Thank
you
to
rise.
Thank
you
to
the
office
thanks
to
the
mayor
for
for
doing
all
this
I'm
blown
away
constantly
one
of
the
book.
Why
I
wrote
the
book?
We
thought
my
wife
and
I
thought
that
nobody
did
book
would
just
fade
because
we
were
I
was
encountering.
Nobody
who
wanted
to
talk
talk
about
it.
You
know
obituaries
were
fabrications.
The
whole
country
was
silent,
I
called
it
dreamland
because
of
a
little
town
in
southern
Ohio,
called
Portsmouth
dreamland
Portsmouth
used
to
be
an
all-american
town.
F
F
It
was
a
place
where
everybody
kind
of
I
was
like
the
community
Plaza,
the
the
guy
who
owned
it
on
the
shoe
factory
and
he
kept
on
using
the
P.
He
was
like
a
different
kind
of
CEO
than
you
hear
about
today.
I
think,
most
the
time
he
invested
his
money
from
the
pool.
He
didn't
need
the
money
from
the
poi
this
shoe
factory,
so
he
doesn't.
Then
the
place
began
to
grow
and
grow
and
grow
and
got
bigger
and
bigger.
F
There
was
always
room
for
more
at
the
swimming
pool
and
then
name
of
the
swimming
pool
was
dreamland
dreamland
in
dreamland.
There
was
no
kind
of
class
differences
because
everybody
looked
the
same
in
swim
trunks
right
every
was
it
was
where
a
cycle
of
life
repeating,
if
you
had
it,
had
a
child
of
toddler.
He
swam
as
she
swam
in
the
in
the
in
the
shallow
end
by
high
school.
She
was
jumping
off
the
diving
board.
F
F
This
kind
of
thing
happened:
it's
what
held
the
town
together
in
the
1980,
the
pool
quo
of
the
steel
mill
closed
shoe
factories
began
to
close
Main,
Street,
emptied
out,
half
the
population
left
and
in
1993
they
closed
dreamland,
dug
it
up,
and
it's
now
a
strip
mall
with
an
O'reilly
Auto,
Parts
Store
as
the
anchor
tenant
and
the
reason
I
told
that
is
because
I
believe
this
does
not.
This
is
a
drug
story,
but
it
has
something
it's
about
something,
far
deeper
and
far
bigger
than
simply
drug
addiction,
drug
marketing,
drug
trafficking.
F
It's
about
who
we
have
become
as
Americans
what
we
have
become
as
a
country
and
I
believe.
A
big
part
of
that
is
that
we
have
become
extraordinarily
isolated
from
each
other.
Poverty
affluence
is
not
an
economic
story.
This
is
a
story
about
American,
American,
isolation
and
destruction
of
community,
which
is
why
I
chose
the
pool
as
the
central
and
a
metaphor
for
the
for
for
for
the
book
this
this
is
now
I.
Don't
think.
That's
any
coincidence,
therefore,
that
this
is
now
the
largest
and
deadliest
drug
scourge
we've
ever
had.
F
Why
is
it
ask
yourself?
Why
why
is
it?
That
is
the
case,
then.
Why
is
it
that
the
72,000
people
died
of
drove
over
more
than
more
than
all
the
people
who
died
in
the
Vietnam
War
died
in
this
thing
last
year
every
year?
We're
seeing
this
now
ask
yourself
why
that
is.
One
reason
is
because
it
was
really
if
this
is
the
first
drugs
drug
problem
we've
had
in
post-war
America.
That
did
not
start
with
the
drug
underworld
that
not
start
with
drug
mafias
with
peddlers
on
the
street.
F
It
began
with
doctors,
pharmaceutical
companies,
and
there
are
more
doctors
in
America
than
there
are
than
there
are
drug
traffickers.
But
why
did
it
start
with
doctors,
because,
as
Americans
we
demanded
to
be
to
have
our
pain,
ending?
We
were
so
spice
elated
from
each
other
addiction
as
a
disease
of
isolation,
we're
so
isolated
from
each
other,
where
we
were
feeling
like
we're,
everyone
was
in
a
bubble.
F
We
didn't
have
these
ways
of
communicating
and
and
increasingly
as
a
culture,
I
think
we
began
to
demand
an
end
to
pain,
easy
convenient,
and
so
it
spread
it
spread
all
across
this
country.
I'm,
a
barometer
of
that
I've
been
speaking
all
across
this
country
in
the
last
few
days,
that
was
in
South,
Dakota,
Kansas,
Missouri,
Syracuse,
New,
York,
Connecticut
and
now
and
now
here.
This
gives
you
an
idea,
I've
been
speaking,
arrows
Hawaii
Mississippi
all
over.
F
This
is
a
an
epidemic
that
has
touched,
unlike
any
other
in
this
country,
it's
deadlier
than
any
other,
but
it's
also
spread
throughout
almost
the
entire
country.
Very
few
places
in
this
area
are
in
this
country
are
untouched
by
this
epidemic,
which,
as
I
travel
around
I,
also
believe
that
this
epidemic
has
catastrophic,
as
it
is
family
like
Marines
and
thousands,
perhaps
millions
hundreds
of
thousands,
certainly
families
all
across
the
country,
development.
F
H
As
you
know,
this
was
everyone
here
in
the
city
of
Boston,
we
posted
a
citywide
remain
featured
folks.
What
was
our
prediction
of
every
city
eh,
our
city,
people,
while
topics
it's
great
to
be
able
to
extend
this?
It's
my
pleasure
to
moderate
our
conversation
tonight.
I
had
a
chance
to
meet
Sam
and
those
conferences.
H
H
E
E
E
E
F
F
E
F
F
Big
deal
bigger
deal
and
some
of
our
wealthiest
communities,
nice
off
suburbs,
that
people
have
done
best,
people
have
done
best
in
the
last
20
30
years,
it's
their
kids,
getting
addicted
and
and
from
drugs
used
to
numb
pain.
You
look
at
their
logical
what
what
pain,
but
in
our
suburbs,
we've
built
into
into
our
suburbs,
is
kind
of
isolation
where
everyone
kind
of
his
alone,
he
drive
through
the
streets
and
nobody's
outside
you
go.
Is
anybody
home?
You
know
I,
think
I.
F
Could
you
know
when,
when
the
internet
started,
I
had
this
great
beautiful
idea
that
we
are
about
to
enter
into
a
wonderful
Renaissance
of
intellectual
Bob?
We
had
access
to
all
kinds
of
things
we
never
had
access
to
before
and
now
we
find
15
20
years
into
it.
That
really
it
serves
to
just
turn
us
against
one
another
and
atomizers.
F
F
Meanwhile,
we
laugh
at
government,
we,
you
know
in
it
bumbling
and
dull
and
kind
of
in
the
way,
and
when
government
really
is
what
grows
from
us
in
our
system,
it's
it
grows
from
us
and
it's
where
we
come
together
as
a
community
to
solve
our
communal
crumbs
and
yet
we've
turned
our
back
on
and
it's
not
worth
funding
and
somehow
a
tyranny
to
pay
taxes.
That
kind
of
thing.
So
all
of
these
things
I
think
and
more
there's
other
mari.
H
Let
me
ask
you
this:
there's
mothers
and
family
members
and
loved
ones
of
people
struggling
with
addiction
tonight
in
Boston
all
over
the
country
all
over
the
world.
Quite
honestly,
what
advice
do
you
give
to
somebody
who
cares
deeply
about
their
loved
one?
Look:
that's
that's!
In
the
grips
of
this
addiction,
I.
E
You
need
to
find
out
everything
you
can
about
the
disease
and-
and
you
know
the
most
up-to-date
things
that
we
know,
because
still
people
are
will
argue
with
you
that
it's
not
a
disease.
The
Surgeon
General
says
it's.
A
disease
and
people
have
been
saying
it's
a
disease.
They
found
that
it's
a
disease
for
a
long
time,
so
people
need
to
understand
the
disease
model
of
addiction.
There's
plenty
of
places
to
look
for
that
for
information
on
that.
I
also
think
that
they
have
to
connect
to
each
other.
E
You
can't
fix
this
for
somebody.
You
have
to
understand
that
this
is
there
there's
to
fix
and
that
you
have
to
take
care
of
yourself,
which
is
something
that
took
me
a
long
time
to
realize
myself.
So
that's
not
the
easiest
thing,
because
as
parents
we,
you
know
and
loved
ones,
any
loved
one.
We
we
want
to
make
it
better
and
you
can't
you
can't
always
make
this
better.
But
you
have
to
take
care
of
yourself.
H
In
the
last
presidential
election,
Hillary
Clinton
I
think
it
might
have
been
the
first
person
to
talk
about
the
crisis
followed
by
Chris
Christie
and
Jeb
Bush
Donald
Trump
talked
about
it,
so
it's
out
on
the
forefront
a
little
more
now
what
elected
official
he
said
talking
about
it,
but
they
did.
They
realized
what
both
of
you
said
when
they,
when
they're
talking
to
a
crowd
of
people,
that
more
heads
are
nodding
when
you
bring
up
addiction.
H
F
Well,
it
kind
of
depends
on
what
level
of
government
they
are.
I.
Think
federal
elected
officials
need
to
understand
that
the
federal
government
has
a
huge
role
in
funding
new
research
and
I
think
that's
beginning
to
happen
through
the
NIH.
That's
very
important
and
also
facilitating
what's
happening
locally.
I.
Think
a
lot
of
places
are
figuring
out
how
to
deal
with
this
again
put
in
fits
and
starts
for
stumbling,
of
course,
but
I
think
a
lot
of
folks
are
moving
that
direction
and
I
think
the
federal
government's.
F
In
some
degree
the
state
government
really
needs
to
be
encouraging.
I've
always
thought
it'd
be
great
for
a
governor
or
president
to
go
to
some
of
these
areas
and
just
meet
with
a
county
group
and
say:
hey
put
your
arm
around
way
to
go.
Oh
man,
you
guys
are
starting
this
stuff
on
your
own
without
any
blueprint
without
any
pilot
project
enough
go
keep
till.
You
know
that
kind
of
thing
is
boosting
morale.
F
It's
so
hard
out
there
because
numbers
keep
going
up
and
you
don't
seem
to
be
making
the
progress
if
you
like
to
be
making
and
yet
you're
valiantly
battling
on
this
thing
and
and
so
I
think
there's
something
to
that
and
I'd
love
to
see.
If
your
politicians
give
some
hugs
I
went
when
my
book
came
out
a
month
later,
Hillary
Clinton's
campaign
advisor
for
health
care
called
me
and
I
think
she
was
stunned.
F
She
said
Hillary's
in
Iowa
and
New
Hampshire
and
she's,
seeing
all
these
people
come
out
of
nowhere
and
I'm
like
yeah,
duh
I,
know
I'm
not
done,
but
you
know
I
know
because
this
doesn't
fall.
You
didn't
know
who
was
there,
but
yet
because
this
stuff
doesn't
poll
yeah
I
can't
call
those
major
issue
facing
you
all
jobs,
not
that
my
daughter's
addicted
or
the
quarterback
of
the
football
team
just
died.
You
know,
and
so
I
told
her
look.
You
need
to
do
a
hug
tour.
F
You
need
to
have
hurt,
you
didn't
do
it,
but
it
was
mine.
This
was
my
life
political
consultancy,
five
minutes
of
political
consultancy.
I
said
you
need
to
go
to
four
or
five
states,
three
or
four
counties
in
each
state
that
really
hammered
by
this
and
hug
mothers,
hug
them
they're
not
going
to
vote
for
you.
Who
cares
that
doesn't
matter
you
got
to
be
this
is
this
is
a
huge
issue
in
year
and
nobody
sees
it.
I
saw
it,
but
nobody
saw
it
because
it
doesn't
flow.
F
Well,
so
I
believe
there
is
still
a
huge
role
for
that
in
among
politicians
as
an
encouraging.
Yet
new
new
laws,
fine,
those
things-
are
necessary
a
lot
of
times
but
gee.
There's
there
I
think
it.
You
miss
a
bit
when
you
don't
just
go
out
and
and
give
people
some
hugs
and
Tom
damnit
way
to
go.
You
were
ahead
of
the
curve
you're
doing
this
on
your
own.
I
just
want
to
be
there
and
let
you
know
that
America's
behind
you
well
I'm
behind
you
or
the
state
legislature
of
the
state
is
behind
you.
F
You
know
that
kind
of
thing
just
boost
morale,
because
it's
so
hard
and
people
are
working
so
hard
at
it
in
it,
in
its
in
its
discouraging
and
so
literally
when
I'm
on
the
road,
I'm
hugging
people
all
the
time
now,
moms,
mostly
dads,
sometimes,
and
that's
what
I
kind
of
have
what
I
deal
with
my
hug
guy.
You
know
I'll
just
just
keep
going
what.
E
Know
part
of
what
Magnolia
does
the
nonprofit
that
I
run
does
is
try
to
fill
the
gaps,
and
one
of
the
things
that
we
do
is
give
scholarships
for
sober
living
and
I.
Think
part.
A
big
part
of
the
problem
here
is
we're
treating
this
disease
like
like
an
acute
condition,
instead
of
something
that's
going
to
take
a
long
time
to
recover
from
so
we
have
people
out.
We
have.
We
have
people
that
have
been
on.
E
You
know
in
the
grips
of
this
for
years,
and
we
want
to
put
them
into
treatment
and
Boston
and
Massachusetts
in
general,
just
such
an
unbelievable
job
compared
to
so
many
other
states,
but
we
still
are
putting
people
in
treatment
for
28
days
at
best
and
then
out
they
go
and
they
don't
have
any
place
to
live
and
they
don't
have
jobs,
the
skills
or
the
ability
to
get
a
job.
What
are
they
been
doing
for
the
last
two
years,
or
maybe
they
have
a
criminal
record?
E
We
have
to
help
people
go
back
into
life
and
I
think
that
that's
that
I
mean
that's
one
of
the
most
important
things.
We're
also
not
training.
Our
first
responders
and
our
and
our
people
in
our
hospitals
enough
to
understand
that
that
not
everybody
you
know
and
but
there's
some
that
still
need
that
coaching
about
this.
This
is
a
person
and
they
may
have
come
into
this
emergency
room.
E
Like
my
daughter,
did
you
know
14
times,
but
that
14th
time
you
may
say
just
the
right
thing
and
point
them
in
the
direction,
instead
of
giving
them
a
list
of
numbers
to
call
and
they
that
may
be
the
last
time
they
ever
walk.
Her
and
I
also
I
mean
there's
so
many
things,
but
there's
also
a
large
population.
E
That's
been
marginalized
for
years,
and
that
did
not
get
to
help
25
years
ago,
when
that
when
there
was
a
other,
you
know
drug
crisis
and
we
have
to
include
them
in
the
in
the
in
the
solutions
and
helped
get
them
on
board,
because
the
numbers
are
rising.
It's
not
just
a
white
upper
class,
you
know
or
middle
class
effect,
any
that's,
not
it
just
as
being
affected.
Thank.
H
J
J
I'm
involved
in
the
judicial
system,
I
have
been
for
a
long
time.
I'm
currently
running
for
Suffolk
County,
District
Attorney
I
realize
the
value
of
a
treatment
over
incarceration.
It's
something
I've
been
advocating
for
a
very
long
time
when
we're
dealing
with
the
judicial
system
and
I
mean
as
to
all
three
of
you.
What
we're
dealing
with
the
judicial
system
I
would
appreciate
your
thoughts
and
regards
to
treatment
options
afforded
specifically
in
Massachusetts,
and
you
know,
perhaps
what
can
be
done.
It's
not
just
about
affording
the
treatment.
Like
you
said
about
the
28
days.
J
H
Let
me
just
jump
on
this.
First
I've
been
in
this
business
doing
this
stuff
for
21
years,
my
file
legislation
at
the
State
House,
rather
than
a
conservation
treatment
instead
of
incarceration
depending
on
on
the
crime
and
I,
think
that
I
think
America
has
learned
over
the
years
that
Prison
isn't
the
right
answer
for
lot
of
folks.
Yes,.
J
H
And
I
think
that
we
have
to
have
treatment
on
demand
and
we
have
to
work
with
our
insurance
companies
and
have
a
lot
more
opportunities.
The
28-day
as
Maureen
said,
isn't
working
and
we
have
to
have
more
continued
care.
They
actually
work
for
everyone
and
I
think
that
there's
a
place
in
society
for
district
attorneys
and
judges
and
police,
but
in
particular,
district
attorneys
and
judges
to
come
together
when
somebody
gets
arrested.
Understanding
identifying
that
yeah,
this
person
committed
a
crime,
but
there's
an
underlying
cause
for
that
and
I.
H
Don't
think
we
do
a
good
enough
job
of
that
here
in
America
and
certainly
Massachusetts
I
think
we
probably
do
better
in
Massachusetts
that
we
do
in
most
places
it
better
in
Boston
we
do
a
most
place
in
the
country,
but
I
definitely
think
that
there
has
to
be
that's
the
question.
I
guess
when
I
asked
early
about
elected
officials
to
truly
understand
not
just
say
it
I'm
in
a
microphone
and
not
just
say
it
in
a
debate,
but
actually
understand
it
and
believe
it
and
care
about
it.
That's
my
take
on
it.
You.
E
Know
I
have
a
board
member
right
now,
whose
daughter
is
in
Framingham
for
a
probation
violation
for
something
that
she
did
three
years
ago
and
she's
been
struggling
with
drugs
and
with
mental
health
issues.
So
they
had
to
put
her
on
a
mental
health
watch.
Her
mother
couldn't
come
and
see
her,
and
this
is
for
a
probation
violation.
E
E
We
have
got
to
address
this
and-
and
you
know,
and
look
at
those
things
first,
because
if
we
do
that,
we'll
reduce
the
recidivism,
we
won't
have
people
cycling
in
and
out,
and
also
the
death
rate
of
people
that
are
just
getting
out
of
prison,
another
thing
and
or
jail
and
then
without
the
drugs
in
their
system
and
then
going
back
and
using
it
dying.
So
thank.
H
F
Of
the
most
exciting
things
that's
happening
in
this
country
right
now,
with
regard
to
this
epidemic
is
how
jail
is
being
transformed.
Jail
is
more,
has
traditionally
been
a
place,
it's
either
predatory
or
tedious,
or
really
both
where
people
kind
of
vegetate.
It's
actually
the
place
where
you
know
as
the
typical
addict
on
the
street.
You
gotta
mow
Bane
the
dope
for
months
and
months
and
then
gets
to
jail.
Detox.
Is
it's
at
the
very
at
that
moment
that
the
additive
understands
the
destruction?
F
You
know
that
he's
rigged
on
his
life,
and
it's-
and
it's
at
that
moment
when,
when
we
put
them
into
a
situation,
that's
predatory
or
foring,
or
both
nothing
going
on
sitting
around
arguing
about
history
or
Discovery
Channel,
all
that
kind
of
nonsense
right.
Well,
if
you
go
to
certain
states
and
I,
don't
know
about
Massachusetts,
I'm,
sorry,
but
I
know
Kentucky
is
way
ahead.
Oklahoma
knows,
Kentucky
has
25
jails
that
in
which
they
have
transformed
pods
into
full
time
recovery
services.
F
The
same
time
you
would
get
on
a
SERP
on
the
outside
at
a
treatment
center
on
the
outside.
If
you
could
afford
it
and
if
there
were
a
bed,
none
of
which
is
true,
this
is
where
you
know
on
the
street
one
that
the
the
problem
is
when
an
addict
says
gee.
This
is
awful.
I
can't
I
got
to
change.
I
want
to
I'm
going
to
check
myself
in
it
gets
there
and
it's
financed
with
a
three-month
waiting
list.
Here.
It's
it's
treatment
on
demand.
F
Basically
in
details,
I
was
in
Louisville
jail
and
I
suggest
you
check
it
out
if
you're
in
the
Louisville
area.
You
know
addicts
really
are
addicted
image
really
working
with
each
other,
so
those
who've
been
at
it.
For
a
long
time,
I
interviewed
a
woman
before
the
interview
she
had
just
come
from
cleaning
the
vomit
off
of
a
woman,
who'd
just
arrived
detoxing,
they
are
nurturing
places
I,
don't
know
how
many
I
never
thought
I'd
ever
used.
The
word
nurture
an
American
jail
in
the
same
sentence,
but
that's
what's
happening
and
again
it's
happening.
F
These
are
very
conservative
areas.
These
are
jailers
who
are
not,
but
they
see
things
not
working,
and
so
they
begin
to
say.
Maybe
we
need
to
change
and
also
what
they
then
do
normally
jail
detail
severs
our
relationship
once
the
person
leaves
jail,
but
these
jails
have
recovery
services
afterwards,
so
vivitrol
sober
living
employment
service,
all
of
which
turning
jail
into
a
place
of
productivity
nurturing
because
it
is
not
a
panacea.
People
do
relapse,
but
it's
certainly
a
better
way
of
doing
jail
than
the
vegetative
state
that
most
jails.
F
The
best
you
can
say
is
that
it's
a
desert,
vegetative
state,
you
know
so
I
would
suggest
you
look
at
what's
happening
in
in
in
Kentucky
and
that's
a
to
me.
That's
a
if
we
turn
jail
into
a
light
into
an
asset
when
it
was
a
liability.
I
think
we
have
moved
forward
as
a
society
and
just
a
huge
stride
ahead.
K
Thank
you.
My
brother
overdosed
on
fentanyl
about
a
month
ago
and
I
will
say
mayor
Walsh
that
the
only
reason
he's
alive
is
that
the
first
responders
had
narcan.
So
thank
you
for
that.
But
this
is
a
question
for
you.
Why
are
you
and
if
it's
too
close
personal,
let
me
know
so
it's
my
brother
and
I
see
my
mother
suffering
and
going
through
the
same
thing
you
probably
did
is
what
did
I
do
wrong?
What
could
I
have
done
separate
done
differently,
but
I
see
mostly
in
her
now
is
anger
and
I.
K
E
I
think
probably
she's
just
protecting
herself
with
that
anger
and
I
see
people
do
that,
because
it's
so
much
easier
to
be
angry
and
terrified.
You
know,
and
that's
probably
where
that's
coming
from
I
I,
don't
you
know
everybody
handles
this
differently
and
that's
why
I
mean
I
would
imagine
that?
That's
probably
what
that
is
it's
probably
if
you
really,
if
she
really
done
told
you
the
truth,
she's,
probably
absolutely
terrified
of
losing
you
know
and
that's.
E
You
know
what
you
should.
You
should
encourage
her
to
reach
out
to
other
other
people
that
are
going
through
this
and
there's
plenty
of
places
and
I'd
be
more
than
happy
to
tell
you
where,
but
to
have
her
reach
out
to
other
people,
because
this
you
know
that's
the
stage
and
everybody's
angry
too
people
get
angry.
You
wind
up
having
all
your
jewelry,
stolen
and
and
your
whole
idea
of
what
your
child's
life,
your
personal
views,
of
what
your
child's
life
was
going
to
be,
and
it
disaffection
the
family
everybody.
L
E
Absolutely
I
mean
it's
a
phony
and
I
think
that
this
is
like.
We
need
more
and
I
know
that
you're
very
you're
working
hard
on
doing
this
more
recovery,
coaches,
more
peer-to-peer,
because
that's
somebody
who's
been
there
I
mean
it's
the
same
thing
with
the
parents,
that's
kind
of
what
we're
doing.
But
when
someone
is
struggling
or
someone's,
you
know
working
really
hard
on
trying
to
want
to
get
well
when
they
can
listen
to
somebody
else,
who's
been
through
it
and
even
though
it
was
hard
they
got
to
the
other
side
of
it.
E
M
Hi,
my
name
is
Gordon
Rocha
I'm,
a
journalism
student
at
Emerson
College,
but
that
aside,
I
am
a
child
of
a
parent
that
struggled
with
addiction
three
years
clean
now.
So
for
that.
But
this
is
a
question
for
mayor
Walsh,
I,
so
appreciate
the
recovery
month,
especially
since
my
situation
and
so
many
people
in
my
life
that
have
been
touched
by
addiction.
But
what
are
we
gonna
do
beyond
recovery
month?
What
what
are
the
plans
for
this,
but
especially
the
city
of
Boston,
to
continue
this
sense
of
community?
Thank.
H
You
for
that
you
know
September's
technically
recovery
month,
but
recovery
month
means
everyday.
It
really
is
time.
We
have
laid
down
a
lot
of
programming
in
the
city
with
the
office
recovery
services
with
our
programs
in
different
parts
of
the
city.
We
turned
our
3-1-1
line
into
a
recovery
hotline.
A
lot
of
people
don't
know
the
front
door
how
to
get
into
recovery.
There
they're
apparent
that
their
son
or
daughter
struggling
in
a
no
place
to
turn
and
they're
sheltering
that
never
experienced
before,
or
they
haven't
talked
about
it.
H
So
we're
constantly
working
this
every
single
day
and
I
think
it's
something
that
for
me
personally,
it's
a
day
day
at
a
times
program
I
mean
I'm
in
recovery
a
little
bit
every
day
and
understanding
the
addiction
and
the
disease
portion
of
this
in
the
stigma
portion
this
you
just
have
to
constantly
do
it
and
I
think
that
what
we
do
is
we
do
it
in
the
city,
but
we
also
share
it.
We
across
the
United
States
of
America.
H
We
talk
to
how
the
mayor's
about
it
and
let
them
know
when
I
first
got
elected
mayor,
we
didn't
have
the
mayor's
didn't,
have
anything
set
up
to
talk
about
the
epidemic
and
what
we
did
was.
We
saw
them
to
me
as
recovery
task
force
and
we
brought
some
of
the
ideas
of
what
we
did
here
in
Boston
and
we
brought
it
to
them
and
explained
them.
We
put
together
a
toolkit
Sam
talks
about
a
toolkit
cities
and
towns,
did
it
without
a
toolkit,
but
we
did
a
toolkit,
we
express
itself.
H
So
it's
a
constant
reminder.
We
also
engage
our
hospitals,
Mass
General
Hospital
and
the
Kraft
foundation
put
the
vans
on
the
street
and
they're
working
on
the
private
way.
Our
health
centers
are
engaged,
our
police
and
fire
do
follow
up
when
somebody
is
administer
naki
and
in
the
home.
A
few
days
later,
a
fire
department
goes
back
and
visits
that
house,
because
at
that
particular
moment
that
person
is
not
willing
to
go
into
treatment.
They
black
out
and
they
don't
know,
what's
happened.
H
So
what
constantly
working
this
every
single
day
and
I
think
my
advice
is
to
talk
about
it.
This
is
not
gonna.
This
wasn't
a.
This
was
not
created
by
elected
officials
in
government
per
se
indirectly
directly,
and
it's
not
going
to
be
solved
that
way,
either
there's
no
magic
piece
of
legislation
or
there's
no
elected
official,
that's
gonna
solve
it.
This
is
this
is
something
that's
gonna
be
solved
at
the
kitchen
table.
This
is
gonna
be
solved
in
people's
homes.
H
This
is
gonna
be
solved
by
having
conversations
being
supports
that
young
woman
that
came
up
before
you,
her
mother's
upset
and
angry.
You
know
my
advice
is
pray
and
try
and
get
her
to
to
learn
to
cope
meeting
or
an
al-anon
meeting
of
talking
to
somebody.
That's
gone
through
it
before
so
they
can
explain
it
because
I
first
natural
instinct
is
to
ignore
it
and
pray
it
goes
away.
This
is
like
cancer.
If
you
ignore
cancer
and
pray,
it
goes
away.
H
You're
gonna
die
and
if
you
have
somebody
in
your
family,
that's
struggling
or
you're
struggling,
you
ignore
it.
You're
gonna
die,
so
it
really
is
a
disease
and
it
really
is
about
getting
of
it.
So
that's
kind
of
an
enough
shelf.
You
know
this.
Is
we
celebrate
or
recognize
September's
recovery
month,
but
in
our
office
of
recovery
services
it
happened
every
single
day.
You
know
in
our
shelters
and
in
our
programs
and
not
detoxes
and
john
began
from
the
gavin
house.
Here's
here
you
know
he
does
it
every
single
day.
So
that's
what
we
do.
N
So
my
needs
Dominic
Esposito.
Thank
you
all
for
what
you're
doing,
with
the
open
epidemic
in
the
books
and
Maureen
and
Mayor
Walsh.
It's
just
incredible,
but
my
question
really
has
to
do
centers
around
accountability
in
Mayor
Walsh.
You
talked
a
little
bit
about
this,
but
you
know
how
can
we
truly
hold
companies,
especially
pharmaceutical
companies
like
Purdue
Pharma
accountable,
given
that
the
scale
of
the
profits
are
just
so
large
right,
you're
talking
about
a
company,
that's
benefited
to
the
tune
of
close
to
thirty
five
billion
dollars.
N
The
Sackler
family
alone
is
worth
fourteen
billion
dollars.
They
paid
a
lawsuit
in
2007.
What?
Why
should
we
think
that
it's
gonna
be
any
better
with
more
lawsuits
and
they're?
Not
gonna.
Just
continue
the
same
rhetoric
and
you
know
if
you
talk
to
you
know.
80%
of
maybe
this
is
I
mean
eighty
percent
of
heroin
addicts
will
admit
to
having
started
on
some
sort
of
synthetic
opioid
right,
so
they
were
really,
as
Sam
pointed
out
the
culprits
behind
this,
and
so
the
question
is
really:
you
know
how
do
we
hold
them
seriously
accountable?
H
Me
stop
that
I'm
gonna
turn
it
over
these
guys,
I
think
Purdue
Pharma
was
in
my
office
of
the
State
House,
when
I
was
probably
2002
and
I
basically
accused
them
of
murdering
people
as
a
state.
Rep
I
said
you're,
murdering
people,
because
people
taking
heroin
and
they
took
offense
to
that
and
they
left
my
office
and
it
wasn't
it's
alright
dreamland,
where
the
whole
story
came
about
from
me.
H
You
know
I'm
thinking,
I'm
educated
in
this
area,
I'm,
not
a
clinician,
a
lot
of
licensed
social
worker
I'm,
not
a
licensed
counselor
I,
don't
have
any
of
those
credentials,
but
I
think
I
know.
What's
going
on
so
I
read
dreamland
and
you
realize
the
whole
pictures
painted
their
feet
and
not
just
for
me,
but
all
of
America
to
read
and
a
lot
of
America's
ready.
H
That's
one
way
of
holding
accountable
the
second
and
Maureen's
book
and,
as
I
said,
other
people
have
written
books
like
Marvine
that
have
talked
about
the
journey
of
their
family
in
the
addiction
to
that
family.
That's
another
way
of
holding
all
these
place
accountable
and
having
dialogues
like
this,
so
the
lawsuit
to
me
isn't
about
the
65
million
dollars
that
we're
trying
to
bring
back
it's
not
about
that,
but
it's
about
holding
them
accountable
and,
as
cm
mentioned
earlier,
these
drugs
are
needed
in
the
box
they
needed
for
a
Bart.
F
Lawsuit
say:
look,
this
is
this,
this
epidemic
I
think
has
no
solution.
It
has
many
many
solutions,
plural,
all
of
them
small
and
that's
that
might
be
one
small
part
of
it.
I
do
believe
that
they
should
should
pain,
pills,
take
their
rightful
place,
part
of
pain,
pills,
taking
their
rightful
place
in
our
culture
as
necessary
as
they
are,
they
they
have
a
certain
place
in
it,
and
the
way
that
happens
is
when
companies
understand
in
ways
that
are
important
to
them,
not
important
to
us
but
important
to
them.
That
did
this.
F
This
is
how
the
society
views
them.
You
know,
and
and
and
and
and
usually
that's
a
fine,
that's
money
that
they
have
to
pay
that
they
can't
give
to
their
stockholders
and
so
on.
I
would
also
think
that
they
through
this,
we
come
to
a
deeper
understanding.
These
companies
have
created
magnificent
improvements
in
human
life
and
no
doubt
about
it
you
know,
but
we
always
have
to
keep
in
mind
that
companies
sell
pills.
They
don't
sell
wellness.
E
Think
that
is,
65
million
dollars
sounds
like
a
lot
of
money,
but
to
these
companies
it's
not
that
much
money,
you
know,
and
it
would
be,
but
I
think
what
you're
doing
is
drawing
attention
back
on
it
and
putting
the
eye
back
on
it,
and
and
people
are
watching
again
because
of
what
you've
done
and
what
other
people
are
doing
and
also
what
Dominick
did
so
I.
Don't
know
if
realized
he's
the
person
that
dropped
the
opioid
spilt
in
that
large
sculpture
in
front
of
Purdue,
Pharma
and.
E
F
I
Name's
Tom
I'm,
a
member
of
the
recovery
community,
I,
think
we're
all
under
the
agreement
that
we're
in
the
midst
of
the
crisis
here,
but
what
we
further
do
to
defuse
the
negative
stigma
associated
with
with
addiction.
It
seems
that
everybody
comes
to
the
agreement
that
we
need
to
address
the
issues
we
need
more
beds.
We
need
more
detoxes
and
then,
when
it
comes
to
the
point
where
somebody
realizes
the
detox
might
be
built
in
close
proximity
to
where
they
live,
the
story
changes
people
resist
it.
I
E
Need
to
talk
about
it
need
to
put
a
face
on
it.
We
need
you
can't
I
mean
I
educated
myself
enough
to
know
that
I
have
four
children
and
one
of
them
has
this
disease.
The
trigger
may
have
been
her
using
drugs
for
the
first
time,
but
or
it
could
have
been
alcohol
or
whatever
it
was,
but
she
has
a
disease
and
it's
got
to
be
treated
like
a
disease
and
I
absolutely
refused
to
to.
E
That's
when
the
steno
will
start
going
away,
I
mean
even
with
our
campaign
right.
We
have
the
no
stigma
campaign
and
we
start
to
put
basis
on
on
on
the
people
that
are
suffering
from
this
disease.
We
need
to
start
putting
faces
on
the
families
too.
They
have
to
be
not
afraid
to
stand
up
and
say
yes,
this
is
happening
in
my
family
and
I.
Don't
know
what
to
do
about
it
and
I
need
help
and
I
need
I
need
my
child
or
my
family
member
to
get
help
and
I
think
we'll
start
seeing
changes.
B
B
What
might
you
be
able
to
recommend
for
loved
ones
who,
unfortunately,
when
the
worst
has
happened
right
now
among
our
friends
and
our
family,
there's
been
a
desire
to
really
remember
the
light
that
he
was
in
our
lives
and
all
the
positive
impact
he
had,
but
for
me,
they're
still
deep
confusion
about
what
he
was
going
through
and
while
I
don't
want
to
constantly
stir
up
the
pain
that
we
were
experiencing.
I
do
want
to
better
understand
what
happened.
E
You
know
they
said
that
addiction
or
substance
use
disorder
is
a
disease
of
isolation
and
that's
what
people
do
is
they
isolate
when
within
the
disease
where
they
they
don't
reach
out
when
they
start
reaching
out?
That's
why
whether
you're
a
12-step
person
or
any
other
kind
of
meeting
those
meetings
have
such
power
because
they
bring
together
people
that
support
one
another
and
the
families
need
that
just
as
much.
H
There's
organizations
too
that
you
can
go
there's
a
lot
of
times:
parents
who
feel
that
or
family
members
I
should
have
done
more
as
it
might
fault
what
happened
how'd
it
go.
You
know
so
I
did
there's
organizations
and
people
out
there
that
that
actually
support
families
when
they
lose
loved
ones.
Yeah
yeah.
E
I'm
sorry,
this
grasp
there's
an
organization
on
an
online
organization
called
team
sharing
and
they
have
meetings
all
over
a
lot
of
meetings
in
Massachusetts,
but
so
does
and
so
does
grasp,
and
these
are
specific
meetings
meant
for
and
there's
an
online
presence
to
where
there's
there's
online
support
groups
where
the
people
are
they've,
all
lost
a
loved
one
and
they
understand
all
the
different
ups
and
downs
and
that
this
doesn't
go
away.
You
know
this
is
oh.
This
is
this
is
forever
you're
going
to
feel
some
level
of
this.
E
O
My
name
is
Nam
I'm,
a
master's
in
public
health
student
and
my
question
is
we
see
that
Congress
is
sort
of
about
to
put
together
some
sort
of
opioid
response
bill,
but
one
thing
that
is
missing
is
coverage
and
access
for
non-pharmaceutical
treatment
for
a
lot
of
the
issues
that
people
have.
How
do
we
fill
in
that
gap?
How
do
we
apply
more
pressure
to
get
that?
How
do
we
ensure
that
we
don't
go
through
this
cycle
over
again
I.
F
Think
that's
one
of
the
biggest
things
we
face
that
that
we
and
one
way
we
got
one
thing
that
began
to
happen
is
this
momentum
for
using
of
narcotic
painkillers
for
all
pain
and
all
human
beings
at
all
times,
at
huge
doses,
was
that
we
began
to
demand.
Doctors
cure
us
right,
but
increasingly,
when
that
began
to
happen
in
companies,
then
stopped
reimbursing
for
a
wide
variety
of
pain
strategies
that
did
not
involve
opioids
so
acupuncture
and
Taichi
and
diet
physical
therapy,
cognitive
behavioral
therapy.
You
know
these
two
prescribed
on
marital
counseling.
F
Marriage
is
pain
right,
so
they
print
prescribe
them
and
they
would
get
reimbursed
without
they're
very
cheap.
You
know
it's
long
term.
It
also
implement
requires
the
buying
end
of
the
patient,
but
increasingly,
as
this
went
along,
the
insurance
companies
cut
back
and
they
maybe
not
on
all
of
it,
a
little
bit
and
so
pretty
soon.
The
doctor
in
that
appointment,
room,
very
intimate
setting.
Just
the
doctor
really
had
only
one
tool,
and
that
was
the
pain
pill
and
what
we've
done
is
we
have
and
I
think
it's
very
important
to
do.
F
You
know
we
have
battled
mightily
to
cut
back
on
supply
of
these
pills,
information
wide
and
I
think
that's
very
thick,
but
at
the
same
time
we
have
not
really
given
people
who
are
up
on
very
high
doses,
chronic
pain,
patients,
other
options
and
the
doctor
is
all
alone.
The
doctor
is
like
well
you're
up
on
800
milligrams,
I,
don't
think
that's
safe
I'm
really
scared
about
that.
F
But
you
know
I,
don't
have
anything
else,
because
the
insurance
company
immerse
for
for
this
of
not
me
other
that
where,
when
we
have
seen
some
a
lot
of
model
is
in
place
like
the
VA
go
to
a
VA
pain
clinic
now,
they've
done
a
180
on
this.
They
were
first
adopter
strategies
and
I
went
to
the
one
in
Las
Vegas
and
in
Las
Vegas
they
have
acupuncture
Taichi.
F
They
have
all
these
things
now
of
a
wide
array,
treating
every
book
human
being
as
an
individual
saying
we're
going
to
you
know,
customize
the
strategy
that
involves
a
lot
of
these
things
for,
for
you
and
I,
believe
that
that
is
that
I
was
just
speaking
to
a
medical
society
in
Kansas.
That
was
one
of
my
big
message
as
I
was
saying:
I
would
suggest
you,
as
dr.
association,
really
think
hard
about
arming
your
people
with
more
strategies,
and
that
involves
lobbying
insurance
companies.
I
think
I.
F
Think
the
more
people
that
you
know
a
lot
of
different
parts
of
our
society
have
understood
their
role
in
this
and
have
stuffed
up
and
insurance
companies
have
not.
You
know,
and
the
other
thing
they
need
to
do
is
think
was
mentioned
earlier,
is
provide
a
lot
more
coverage
for
medically
assisted
treatment
for
addiction,
but
just
focusing
on
pain,
which
is
how
we
got
into
this
I.
F
P
Laurie
carpenter
I
have
a
somewhat
similar
question.
The
role
in
a
lot
of
the
strategies
for
opioid
treatment
is
m80,
which
saves
lives
is
crucial,
but
what
seems
to
be
left
out
of
it
is
the
long
term
the
community
building,
whether
that's
a
a
smart
recovery,
whatever
that
is
along
with
the
medical,
mental
health
services.
Those
are
the
things
that
seem
to
be
sort
of
brushed
under
the
rug,
particularly
by
insurance.
P
H
H
H
H
If
you
talk
to
a
lot
of
folks,
they
won't
a
lot
of
folks
won't
take
the
vivitrol
shot
because
they
know
that
they
want
the
suboxone
prescription
because
you
can
mess
with
that
and
I
get
worried
about.
When
I
was
a
state.
Rep
I
fought
the
mandate
on
halfway
houses
that
they
took.
People
in
assisted
medicine,
I
fought
it
because
there
was
an
abstinence
component
to
it.
H
Not
everyone's
gonna
get
get
clean
using
abstinence,
but
there
has
to
be
a
system
in
place
that
if
you're
gonna
do
medical
treatment,
if
you
need
to
be
on
that
dosage,
you
can
weed
the
person
off
that
dosage.
There
are
70
percent,
I
would
say,
probably
70%,
of
the
people
that
are
on
methadone
and
suboxone.
They
do
what
the
way
it's
supposed
to
happen
and
they
get
some
support,
but
that
30
percent
is
just
constantly
they're
just
out
there
and
they're
lost
and
I
do
think
that
we
have
to
do
more
regulation.
H
H
No,
they
need
to
be
at
the
table
at
the
same
table
because
the
program
can
work
if
they
do
it
correctly,
and
that's
something
I
think
that
we're
gonna
be
battling
with
for
the
next
bunchy
is
because
I
think
people
are
looking
for
what
honestly
looking
for
the
quick
fix,
quick
fix,
let's
give
suboxone,
let's
give
them
half
of
my
methadone
and
they'll
get
sober
and
they
at
least
they
won't
be
shooting
up,
but
they
won't
be
high,
but
they
won't
be.
That's
not
the
answer
in
my.
H
Let
me
just
say
before
webs
coming
up
here.
Thank
you.
Thank
you.
Both
this
is
a
great
conversation.
I
want
to
thank
everyone
for
coming
out
today
and
tonight.
You
know
these
are
conversations
that
we
have
to
have
more
of
and
talking
more
about,
but
I
appreciate
the
fact
that
both
of
you
took
the
time
did
the
research
live,
the
experience
of
your
books
that
that
have
actually
really
given
hope
to
people
both
of
your
books,
they've
given
hope
to
so
many.
You
have
no
idea
and
your
book
is.
H
It
turns
into
a
spirituality
piece
for
people
to
read
because,
as
they
read,
the
stories
there's
also
the
positive
side
and
in
both
books
there's
a
positive
side.
So
I
just
want
to
thank
you
both
for
being
with
us
today
and
here
in
Boston,
and
thank
you
for
for
sharing
your
expose
of
your
experiences,
even
though
the
books
is
different
than
the
same
exact
book,
and
thank
you
for
that.