Brigade Community, 26 Oct 2021

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From YouTube: Brigade Community Meeting - 2021-10-26

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A recording of the Brigade Community Meeting on 2021-10-26

A

Want to know how the office hours went.

B

Sorry, it was just audibly informing me that recording is in progress, so I didn't hear what you said. Karen.

A

Oh, I said I wanted to know like how the office hour, like virtual office hours thing that you did during kubecon, was.

B

Oh, I think I think it went pretty well I I we had over 30 attendees, if I recall correctly, which is well more than I had been expecting for office hours like I guess. If it had been like a proper like presentation, I would have expected probably well more than 30 but for office hours. I was really surprised at the number of attendees, um but it was also my first time doing office hours. So I don't know if maybe my expectations were just not calibrated correctly. Bridgette looks like she has information about this.

C

This is, this is wonderful. I'm excited to be here. I feel like this is kind of one of those shows where you do the cold open and so the cold open, let's tease office hours and we'll get into that, but welcome to the brigade community call for tuesday october 26 2021 uh on the agenda today, kent's going to, as we teased uh tell us some things about how kubecon went and we're going to also talk about uh the current project roadmap.

C

So without further ado and we'll hear from uh you know, community maintainers, so without further ado uh karen do you want to give us the rundown of what the office hours for um kubecon were exactly and then uh kent can tell us.

A

How they went yeah um so as part of coupon, there was a in person portion and then an online portion to the event. So, um as part of the online portion, kent hosted a virtual office hour um with him being the maintainer of the project and based on the numbers that I got officially from cncf, we had 75 unique attendees, so yeah, it is more than you think.

B

Yes, that more than doubles the number that I thought whoa, that's that's great, also um bridget! Thank you for giving us the official opening and uh setting context you can tell which one of us is a podcast host um so uh yeah in terms of how it went. um You know this was my first time doing office hours. So I perhaps didn't quite know what to expect, and I guess I went into it- prepared to answer questions, but not necessarily do like a presentation per se, um but the the questions weren't really coming.

B

You know rapidly or soon enough, um despite the number of attendees. So I think vaughn was a little bit of a ringer and asked a few. You know questions to kind of prime the pump and uh it led to some impromptu uh demos that that went. I think, okay, but they were completely off the cuff. um But again I don't know how these office hours things normally go. I didn't walk into it, prepared to do like a presentation or anything of the sort. So.

A

I think they're usually just super open-ended and yeah. It would be like if you were working a booth right, virtually yeah.

B

Did um so I mean, obviously I was not there in person. I was only only participated remotely, um probably for karen, since you were there um in person, did did. Did anybody approach you at all asking about brigade or anything like that.

A

um So I think I so um radu and matt butcher were there for brigade, so I think they probably got a couple of questions, but, to be honest, like traffic was so low at coupon, like so low, um you probably got more engagement online. I think that was like across the board for all of our projects like even with home. I think there was more engagement online than there was in person.

B

It's as if there's a pandemic going on or something.

B

Okay, um well still, I'm blown away by that number. I had no idea that it was that high, because I I was I was trying to you- know, keep an eye on like the chat and the number of attendees and and everything. But you know it was hard to do that and talk and present and answer questions and everything all at once. So I I didn't notice exactly how high that number crept. So that's that's awesome.

D

Yeah um quick comment: yeah, I thought the session went well. It was actually remarkably similar to the only other office hours I've done, which was kubecon euro earlier this year, and it was similar kind of just um overview of brigade v2 with ralph and butcher. They were both there um and just kind of casual conversation. Answering questions off the cuff demo.

D

um So again, probably as casual as like booth with duty usually is but yeah. I thought it went well.

B

All right, good good to know we didn't miss the mark by a ton, um all right cool, um so should we do some kind of like brief project update now, probably yeah. So so.

B

Vaughn knows all of this because he's right there in the trenches with me, um but uh yeah we are, I think, uh right on the cusp of cutting uh beta four, um so two zero, zero beta four um and uh the the focus of this milestone has really been um clearing any and all hurdles that will stop us from producing a release candidate and since your release, candidate can of course become your release. We're really clearing like the the the worst of the last remaining issues.

B

um So uh there will be some things that that will you know we'll do some more grooming and agree that some things can wait until after ga, um but you know anything that we suspect um you know is uh you know this is our last opportunity for breaking changes and things like that.

B

Even though, even though in the beta phase, we avoid those at all costs, um you know this is the last opportunity if we need it, it's it's like the turn back now um kind of thing so, um and I I think that's going really well, and I think that once we cut that there are minimal changes on top of that to turn the beta 4 into an rc and mostly it's going to involve um changing the supported api version from slash beta to just no trailing slash anything, um because, obviously you want your rc to speak, stable api, um so we we are just about there.

B

I think I think we're within a week of cutting rc1.

C

So this community call in two weeks from now you're going to be telling us all about rc1.

B

Yeah yeah, I mean we could be telling you about ga two weeks from now we're really close yeah we're we're we're really close right now, um so yeah and and one thing that I really want to call out right now as well. Is that we're starting to see an uptick in community contribution again, which is really nice, because v2 has been a very large pivot from v1, and you know uh I'll use that old.

B

Like you know, in these trying times thing like, you know, everybody's busy right now and it seems a lot of people were aware of what we were doing and were content to say, and I got other things to do. I'm just gonna sit back and let the maintainers execute the pivot and and that's fine.

B

But now we see people coming back, which is awesome and there's one guy in particular, who has started making some contributions, and I've been talking to him on the the kubernetes slack and something that was very very interesting to me was that he was interested in brigade but did not have prior experience with kubernetes and to me, that's awesome because we built v2 with intentions of making brigade useful to people who weren't kubernetes experts, um and so that was really awesome to see such a person actually come out of the woodwork um and uh so he's been making some uh contributions to the cli um he's working on his second pr right now and uh he wanted to try it against an actual um live api server.

B

So this contributor who's never used kubernetes before I pointed him in the direction of the quick start and he was able to get through all of it and test his cli changes against a live api server. So um I think you know not to to our own horn or anything. I think we're doing something right in terms of the documentation or at least in terms of the quick start, because somebody with no prior kubernetes experience was able to work through it, which is awesome. I think it's great. It's.

C

Fantastic, so no, if you have people who are checking out this meeting after the fact and they're thinking well, I might want to get started with a contribution. But where do I even get started? What would you recommend folks who want to get started contributing to brigade what should they look at.

B

So we've uh I want vaughn to answer this as well, but um you know my answer is that we've been tagging any issues that are real, like um you know, low hanging, fruit, easy kind of gentle introductions.

B

We've been tagging them as good first issue in a lovely shade of purple and I've been trying to uh advertise those as they pop up. So I I try to be a presence every day in the um our slack channel um and uh whenever one of those crops up, I try to advertise it so that people know um that it's there.

B

So uh anybody who who does uh view this after the fact and and wants to pitch in um go look at the the issue, queue and look for issues that are tagged as um good first issue and that's a great place to start and we're happy to provide um additional guidance. If you know, if you know, if you're going in cold, um you know we want to help you. So um you know reach out to us on slack and we'd love to chat.

D

Yeah, I don't know if I have, I think, that's a great first entry point. um The only other thing I was thinking about was you know our contributing guide on the main brigade for community repo, but I was just looking at that.

D

It's more that's more kind of like signing your commits and kind of parameters for contributing, so I think you know we might be well suited for more of, like uh I don't know, a separate dock, for you know, listing with links to the good first issues on issue queue, certainly that contributing doc, quick, start kind of like a dedicated page, for you know a road map of where to get started, contributing to brigade.

D

We don't have that yet I don't think.

B

Yeah, I think, that's, I think, that's a really good idea, because you're you're right, our contributing guide, is like super focused on on how to sign your commits, both from like the dco perspective and from the perspective of you, know, cryptographically signing them to assert your identity and so forth. um So yeah. I think I think we could do something more comprehensive on that front.

B

So one one um one nasty little thing that I see for c coming up um just before we go ga is um we need to so so all v2 work has been done up to this point in a v2 branch and we do need to figure out how to transplant that into the main branch or rename the main branch or do whatever we're going to do. But, very importantly, do it without disrupting anybody who is consuming or dependent on packages from v1 um and go is like it's scary.

B

um So I need to re-read very carefully all of the docs about what is considered the right way to do this, and I might enlist help from carolyn who I usually think of, as as my uh my go-to person, when I'm in over my head with go dependency stuff.

C

It's that's a fearsome and uh amazing. um You know recognition you, you can tame the go dependencies. Yeah we'll have to credit caroline for that.

B

Yeah- and I think and bridget you mentioned in the chat, I don't does the chat get recorded along with everything else.

A

I mean it gets saved, but I don't know if it gets published. Okay, um I think, when you record a a call, it's like a extra file so like.

B

uh Okay, so I.

C

Don't know where you would put.

A

B

Yeah, so so so for anyone who doesn't look at that file, bridgette mentioned in the chat just now that helm went through this a while ago. So um you know, maybe we can um talk to teammates or look at the history of that repo to just kind of see how they pulled that off. um So that's a thanks for calling that out that they've been through this already.

C

I mean go, godups are the way they are, but also if people are running their production services out of whatever happens, to be live in the main branch on github. They might experience sadness like things on github will change well, yeah.

B

That's, that's.

B

That's, that's absolutely true, but then I think the other variable in the equation here is the the method or or the method du jour of approaching go dependency management has changed so many times that that you know the rules that we play by now with go mod and so forth are not the same rules that have been enforced all along and they may not be the same.

B

They are likely not the same rules that anybody consuming packages from v1 may have been playing by, and I think that's a complication that I just want to make sure. I understand all facets of it before before we actually rename any branches or anything.

C

I think carolyn will definitely know plenty about that.

B

Yeah and they seem.

E

B

Yeah and some experimentation may be called for here too, a little. You know experimental repository to see how these things go.

B

um The only other thing that I might add is that that I don't I don't know if we should do this pre, ga or post, but we do have enough uh good stuff queued up in uh v1 and in the charts repositories as well, that we might consider doing a release of the perhaps a final release of the old stuff. um I say perhaps, but you know, of course, we'll we're going to work out.

B

Some kind of you know schedule for maintenance and sunset, and you know security issues and all of that but yeah we, we probably should consider what might be a final release of the old stuff.

C

Just make sure a new release is the last thing on github, because otherwise, if it's like new release and then final release of old stuff sitting, there hanging out being what looks like the newest thing on github, you know just like on the side of your repo people get confused by that.

B

Oh, so so are you suggesting that we that we do like the final like one for x or whatever before we cut 200.

E

I mean hopefully 200.

C

Will have plenty of releases following it, but yeah just you don't want the last thing that you've released to be an uh an older rev sitting there on your page for quite a while, because people get confused.

B

Okay, yeah, that's that's a good point. Okay, so and maybe that forces us to slow down and because you know the thing is like once once v2 is out there. um You know, hopefully things you know really take off once this is um stable and ga and more people start using it at which point I'm gonna lose a lot of my motivation to do anything with v1. So may so maybe it's maybe it is better that we get that stuff out of the way up front before we before we lose the motivation to do it.

C

I'm not in any way telling you to delay I'm just giving you a github logistical puzzle to consider.

B

Oh no, I I know what you're saying I think it's just a happy accident that it it forces us to do the right thing.

D

Yeah I'd say we can keep momentum for at least the rc. Can it because actually we've been in this predicament up until now, because all the v2 beta all the v2 releases have been like pre-release github, so um the main brigade repo has shown like the last v1 release as the last release up until now. But anyway I say we continue momentum for the first rc candidate, which would also be a pre-release.

D

Then that's the time to like yeah sort everything out with v1 before going ga, maybe the go depths, and you know the branch change all that.

B

D

B

All right so, but you know none of this really changes too much. I think I think we're still. You know on track to to cut that beta four very soon and the rc one not long thereafter,.

B

We'll just have to work out some of these logistics before we get from the rc1 to the you know, actual release, super cool.

B

Yeah, so we're in we're in good shape right now. um I guess one other thing we do have you know, obviously a lot of gateways or other. You know, shall we say peripherals like the metrics and the um noisy neighbor, which is a little bit of chaos, engineering, stuff, um and I think, unless, unless anybody has different ideas, um I don't think that those all have to go. Ga at the exact same time that brigade itself does.

B

I think I would like to give ourselves um the luxury of a little bit of time to clean up each one of those um and and make sure you know, every eye is dotted and every t is crossed um any thoughts on that vaughn.

D

That sounds fine to me. Yeah I mean those are on their own release. Cadence already.

A

Yeah, that sounds fine.

D

B

B

Yeah, so I don't, I don't really have anything else to to add. Does anybody else have any questions comments, concerns.

A

um I think I scheduled like a cloud native, live stream slot for brigade me too, that is supposed to be in november. um I will follow up with you, but there should be another opportunity for more content to come up soon.

B

Okay, oh yeah, and speaking of content. I know um I know karen and bridget. You know we were all working together this morning on figuring out the logistics behind getting brigade a youtube channel, and all of that so thank you for all the help with that and uh yeah once once the the technical work um you know is, you know, uh put on pause for a little bit um after ga. I can really start cranking out um some videos. I want to do like short, five minute.

B

You know very narrowly scoped, you know topic oriented videos um and do do a series of them. um So that's that's something I'll I'll start looking to do after we go ga very cool I'd like to do it beforehand, but you know we only have there's only so many hours.

C

I mean once once you go ga and then you're doing these cncf webinars and there's plenty of opportunities. Let's, let's get those bits on disk.

B

All right, so so, for anybody who watches this video, the youtube channel is coming. In fact, you might be watching this video on that youtube channel.

C

I think you have an email in your inbox with the info from cncf, so coming real soon now to you awesome.

A

And then the next, oh, I think.

C

Karen and I say the same thing.

A

Go ahead, karen uh that our next call will be on november 9th. Is that what you're gonna say? Okay, yeah um cool.

B

Yeah- and I think next time we'll I I I will be um more prepared for this next time- it was tough because I came back from vacation just like yesterday, so um yeah we should. We should do more next time in terms of advertising. This get some tweets out and and everything um more in advance. So.

B

All right, cool.

A

See ya. Thank you. Thanks.

E

A

D