►
Description
The JRAC meets the first Friday of February, April, June, August, October, and December at 12:30pm.
D
A
E
G
E
G
G
H
E
A
C
B
G
We
can
make
that
work
all
right,
so
we
have,
we
certainly
have
a
forum.
Thank
you
all
for
being
here
today.
First
item
on
the
agenda
is
a
consent
agenda.
You
should
have
received
the
today's
agenda
as
well
as
june
minutes
any
questions
or
comments
or
suggested
revisions
to
the
august
agenda
and
or
the
june
minutes.
E
D
A
G
Deborah
hi
mayor,
mannheimer,
hi,
jay,
hi
and
julie.
Yes,
all
right
passes.
We
mentioned
before
that
at
each
jrec.
We
want
to
leave
space
to
have
discussions
around
data
in
hopes
that
we
can.
I
think
we
do
a
pretty
good
job
on
making
data-driven
decisions
or
just
having
discussions
around
the
impact
of
our
trends
that
we're
seeing
and
so
today
dr
lee
craven
will
be
providing
an
update
on
our
justice
systems.
Data
he'll
be
talking
about
failure
to
fears
and
kill
population.
I
G
D
So
it's
good
to
be
back
with
you
all
this
month.
I
think
I
was
with
you
all
last
in
june,
and
we
talked
a
little
bit
about
jail
population
trends
and
touched
a
little
bit
on
this
specific
population
of
those
who
are
impacted
by
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
we've
since
done
a
little
bit
more
of
a
deeper
dive
into
this
population
presented
some
information
to
one
of
our
safety
and
justice
challenge.
D
Work
groups,
that's
focused
on
case
processing,
and
we
thought
it
might
be
an
interesting
conversation
to
bring
to
this
group
this
month.
So
I'm
going
to
walk
through
a
few
slides
here
that
we've
put
together
this
one.
If
you
were
in
attendance
at
the
last
draft
meeting,
might
look
familiar
to
you,
but
it
is
the
trend
over
time
of
the
average
daily
population
by
month
for
state
pre-trial
is
that
tall
tall
blue
bar?
D
There
is
a
segment
of
the
blue
bar,
that's
lighter
shade,
and
what
that
represents
is
people
who
are
in
custody
only
due
to
an
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
on
their
booking.
What
we
see
is
the
pandemic
impact
that
this
was
a
population
that
was
greatly
impacted
during
those
pandemic
months.
We
know
that
the
courts
were
operating
in
a
different
capacity,
people's
court
dates
were
getting
pushed
out,
and
so
that
was
really
and
now
and
what's
going
on,
y'all
saw,
I
didn't
touch
it.
D
All
right,
hopefully
it's
better,
I'm
gonna
stay
very
far
away
from
it.
So,
but
what
we've
done
is
we're
seeing
a
return
to
pretty
pandemic
levels
with
this
population
back
in
may,
actually,
the
average
daily
population
for
failure
to
appear
only
was
67,
so
67
people
in
custody
only
on
in
custody
on
average
and
per
day
in
may
were
only
had
an
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
on
their
booking
out
of
416,
pre-state
pre-trial
stokes,
and
so
that
was
about
16
of
that
state
pre-trial
population.
D
That
was
again
only
in
custody
on
that
booking.
Due
to
an
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
so
we're
going
to
take
a
little
bit
deeper
dive
into
this
population
understand
a
little
bit
more
about
them.
So,
looking
at
the
fiscal
year,
2022
data,
so
average
state
pre-trial
population
for
the
fiscal
year
was
30
357..
D
Almost
50
percent
of
those
folks
were
in
custody
for
an
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
along
with
possibly
some
other
reason.
So,
basically,
50
of
almost
50
of
your
state
pre-trial
population
was
being
impacted
by
an
order
for
arrest,
for
failure
to
appear
of
that.
357
about
14
were
only
in
on
a
failure
to
appear
order.
Student
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
translated
to
about
15.
Excuse
me,
49
people
a
day
when
you
look
at
entries
into
the
facility.
D
That
means
that
they
are
not
federal
court
thursday.
They
have
pending
issues
in
buncombe,
county
courthouse,
and
so
so.
The
for
the
fta
only
group
coming
into
the
facility
that
was
about
22
percent
of
bookings,
and
you
can
see
that
the
vast
majority
are
on
misdemeanor
offenses,
but
felony
2
is
a
high
number
when
we
break
it
down
by
a
type
of
offense.
D
Trying
to
understand
when
a
failure
to
appear
is
occurring
in
someone's
case
penancy
process,
and
so
if
we
look
back
at
when
the
original
charge
was
filed
in
court
on
this
individual,
we
see
that
the
bulk
of
fta
bookings
that
came
into
custody
last
fiscal
year
were
on
charges
that
were
initiated
in
2020
and
2021..
That
is
no
surprise
again
because
of
what
we
know
that
was
a
impact
of
the
pandemic.
D
You'll
see
that
there
are
some
folks
who
had
actually
orders
for
arrests
served
on
them
that
originate
to
charges
back
quite
a
long
time
ago.
So
in
1999
was
the
earliest
one
that
that
specific
instance
was.
Someone
had
received
the
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
on
a
charge
that
was
taken
out
in
2021,
but
there
was
an
open
order
for
arrest
from
1999
that
was
served
on
them
while
they
were
in
custody.
D
D
That
is
the
where
the
bulk
of
those
charges
are
classified
for
these
releases
and
they
stayed
on
average,
just
over
six
days
in
custody
in
general,
people
who
are
in
custody
for
felonies
typically
stay
longer
than
those
who
are
in
our
misdemeanors,
and
that
is
the
trend.
When
you
see
an
awareness
on
those
buildings.
D
32
and
then
for
those
who
are
in
custody
only
for
an
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
that
was
slightly
higher
at
35,
so
poverty
is
greatly
impacting
the
population
overall,
but
it
does
have
a
little
bit
larger
effect.
It
seems
on
those
folks
who
are
in
custody
for
order
for
arrests
for
failure
to
appear
only
the
demographics
of
this
population
average
age
just
under
35
years
of
age,
about
30
percent
were
women.
D
I
B
D
B
D
E
E
D
E
D
We
can
certainly
look
into
it.
Where
do
these
people,
where
are
they
physically
located
within
the
county?
So
this
is
looking
at
bookings
coming
into
the
facility
with
in
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
by
the
zip
code.
That's
tied
to
that
individual
in
the
database.
You
can
see
in
this
the
darker
blue.
That's
a
higher
percentage
of
the
bookings
that
are
coming
out
or
excuse
me
coming
into
custody
that
have
in
order
for
arrest
for
failure
to
appear
on
them.
D
So
I've
tried
to
create
a
failure
to
appear
booking
rate
for
each
zip
code
to
make
them
comparable
right,
because
the
population
sizes
are
not
comparable
across
the
code.
So
the
the
darker
blue
represents
those
areas
where
we
have
the
most
the
highest
percentage
of
fta
booking
rate.
So
then
taking
the
number
of
bookings
coming
in
with
the
order
for
arrest,
for
failure
to
appear
and
dividing
that
by
the
total
bookings
that
came
from
that
zip
code
to
create
that
rate.
E
E
D
They
had
in
their
report,
walked
away
with
a
number
of
policy
recommendations,
many
of
which
you
can
see
are
really
about
getting
people
information,
as
well
as
supportive
resources
to
help
them
address
the
barriers
that
they
have
when
showing
up
to
court.
There's
also
measuring
for
justice,
which
is
a
another
project
of
the
school
of
government.
That's
available.
It's
got
a
number
of
metrics
in
it
that
you
can
look
at
that.
D
They
have
put
out
in
court.
Appearance
is
one
of
those
metrics
that
they
look
at
so
just
some
resources
for
you
all.
If
you
want
to
see
what's
going
on
in
other
places
across
the
state,
it
is
looking
at
the
data
a
little
bit
differently,
because
it's
looking
at
it
through
the
lens
of
the
court
system
as
opposed
to
the
jail
which
we
did
today.
D
D
Their
key
finding
was
really
the
bail
amount
was
not
significantly
associated
with
failure
to
appear
or
re-arrest
during
the
pre-trial
period
and
I've
pulled
out
verbatim
a
specific
section
of
the
study
and
its
findings
and
emphasized
it
myself.
But,
ultimately
you
know
they
found
that
bail
does
not
incentivize
a
return
to
court,
because
many
of
the
reasons
that
people
fail
to
appear
in
court
are
related
to
finances.
D
They
can't
miss
work,
they
have
transportation
barriers,
they're
caring
for
family
and
children
and
they
have
no
alternative
means
of
a
caretaker
and
ultimately,
no
amount
of
assigned
bail
will
incentivize
people
out
of
those
barriers.
So
it's
really
about.
We
want
to
move
the
needle.
We
really
have
to
think
outside
of
the
system
and
getting
to
those
the
supports
and
resources
that
they
need.
So
to
that
end,
we
are
trying
to
work
on
this
issue
locally.
D
There's
a
couple
of
projects
right
now
that
are
ongoing
to
really
deepen
our
understanding
of
the
root
causes
of
failure
to
appear
for
folks
here
in
buncombe
county,
we
have
a
survey,
that's
active
right
now
with
our
community
engagement,
work
group
as
part
of
the
safety
and
justice
challenge.
We've
been
discussing,
looking
closer
and
understanding
more
about
folks
who
are
on
pre-trial
and
have
a
history
of
ftas,
we're
also
looking
at
promote,
better,
promoting
and
also
exploring
how
we
might
be
able
to
incorporate
court
notifications
and
sign
up
into
our
new
existing
processes.
D
D
J
J
J
D
D
J
D
That
is
one
of
the
recommendations
that
did
come
out
of
that
report
from
you
know
around
from
the
school
of
government,
just
around
reducing
the
number
of
or
changing
kind
of
how
the
court
operates
right,
making
it
more
user
friendly
so
like
they
recommend
hearing
scheduled
for
smaller
blocks
of
time,
so
people
aren't
staying
all
day
or
all
morning
right,
just
making
just
court
more
accessible.
Well,.
J
And
you
know,
there's
such
really
there's
some
good
data
out
there
about
like
text
notifications
for
bill
collection.
For
I
mean
it's,
you
get
the
response
rate
the
default
rate,
it's
just
incredible
what
it
differs
from,
especially
as
the
generations
keep
get
added
on
and
that's
kind
of
their
format
for.
D
Absolutely-
and
I
think
we
have
a
really
great
tool-
that's
out
there
now
that's
available
to
folks
if
they
do
have
pending
cases
in
the
system
here
locally,
that
they
can
go
on
and
sign
up
for
those
court.
Notifications
there's
also
been
a
lot
of
work.
Research
done
about
the
notifications
themselves
and
what's
the
important
information
to
provide
in
those
messages,
there's
been
research
done
on
actual
the
forms
that
people
get.
H
All
right,
mayor,
manchimer,
I
just
wanted
to
weigh
in
this-
is
meredith
presley
from
the
da's
office
as
far
as
the
failures
to
appear.
Of
course,
it
is
a
judicial
discretion
of
whether
to
issue
an
order
for
arrests
in
a
number
of
cases
like
the
lower
level
traffickers.
They
just
issue
the
process
rather
than
issue
an
order
for
arrest,
so
that
would
just
be
a
failure
to
appear,
and
I've
told
our
adas
to
try
to
consolidate
individuals.
Court
dates
as
much
as
they
can
so
that
they
don't
have.
H
G
Any
more
questions
I
mean
it's
certainly
a
concerted
effort,
I
think,
from
the
court
side
to
justice
services
from
support
side
and
90
years,
to
try
to
figure
out
how
we
can
produce
that
and
give
people
information
they
need
and
additional
resources
to
be
able
to.
So
this
is
important.
This
is
a
large
amount
of
our
jail
population
in
the
campaign
which
has
stick
with
great
impacts.
Oh.
A
Yeah
question
about
pre-trial
services:
that's
one
of
our
biggest
financial
investments
as
a
county
for
public
safety,
but
also
for
court
appearance.
So
do
we
have
information
about
this?
The
success
rates
comparing
the
general
detention
population
to
those
on
pre-trial?
Are
there
differences
in
their
ftas.
D
E
D
C
I
think
this
has
happened
in
the
past,
where
there
have
been
like
amnesty
days
where,
if
you
have
those
outstanding
warrants,
you
can
come
in
without
fear
of
being
arrested
and
try
to
resolve
as
many
of
your
charges
as
you
could
or
if
you
can't
you
at
least
get
a
reset
on
that.
Is
that
anything
that
is
currently
happening
or
being
processed.
H
I
C
On
my
side
on
the
like
cps
side,
there's
so
many
impacts
to
those
outstanding
orders
for
risk,
even
for
the
people
that
may
not
necessarily
be
hitting
your
jail
population,
because
we
are
not
able
to
get
parents
to
come
to
visits
and
or
come
to
their
civil
court
appearances
because
of
those
outstanding
warrants.
So
they're
I
mean
eventually,
they
may
wind
up
in
your
data,
your
jail
data,
but.
E
G
D
The
response
rate
was
was
pretty
low
and
I
think
what
they're
trying
to
do
now
is
go
back
and
look
at
what
additional
kind
of
connections
and
that
we
might
could
leverage
for
folks
who
contact
information
for
some
of
this
population
can
be
not
reliable
right,
and
so
how
can
we
better
engage
folks
in
that
process
and
I
think
natalie?
I
don't
know
if
you
have
any
insight
too,
because
energetic
services
is
looking
into
this
issue.
F
Yeah
we
were
trying
to
take
a
look
at
on
the
front
end
we're
you
know,
kind
of
laying
eyes
on
everybody,
who's
in
custody,
the
morning
of
court
and
so
there's
a
lot
of
kind
of
historical
data
that
we
have
an
opportunity
to
analyze.
And
so,
even
if
we
could
create
some
flags-
and
we
were
kind
of
hypothetically.
F
Individuals
had
x
amount
of
ftas
in
the
last
two
years.
This
is
the
first
one
we
might
want
to
touch
base
with
when
we
have
the
opportunity
to
to
see
if
their
logistical
hurdles
are
contributing
to
those
fdas
to
kind
of
increase,
the
quality
of
information
that
we're
getting
and
then
two
we're
trying
to
think
through,
and
I'm
not
part
of
that
team
specifically,
but
even
as
we're
collecting
data
ways
to
do
that
and
to
collect
high
quality
data
where
they
don't
feel
like
we're.
F
F
I
I
F
About
the
folks
we
work
with,
for
the
most
part,
we
have
kind
of
good
contact
information
for
them,
so
facilitating
that
conversation
we
were
kind
of
brainstorming
pre-trial
being
a
warm
hand-off
to
whoever
facilitates
the
survey,
but
that
we
have
a
connection
with
them
and
then
hopefully
can
empower
them
to
give
us
some
data.
That
can
be
helpful.
C
F
F
G
All
right
and
we'll
look
at
the
additional
data
points
that
you
all
want
us
to
review
and
analyze
and
bring
it
back
and
hopefully
bring
back
some
results
from
the
community
survey.
Sooner
than
later.
I'm
sure
justice
services
is
doing
this,
but
I
want
to
also
make
sure
that
we're
lifting
up
the
conversation
with
our
case
department
to
see
if
we
can
expand
our
reaches
as
much
as
possible.
F
I
was
just
going
to
show
really
quickly
and
we
had
a
scrivener's
error
that
we
addressed
within
the
bylaws,
but
we
just
wanted
to
let
everybody
see
the
adjustments
we
made.
They
were
quick
edits
that
did
not
change
any
of
the
content
of
bylaws.
So
just
as
a
side
by
side
you
can
see
there
to
the
left.
Is
the
old
bylaws
at
the
right?
Are
the
updated
bylaws?
So
we
had
we
had
two
section
ones
previously
and
then
the
other
edit
of
note
was
under
the
membership.
H
F
If
you
can
see
here
section
three,
you
see
the
two
chlorine,
that's
flagging
is
one
of
the
issues
section
three
is
side
by
side
there
section
three
membership
based
based
on
nomination
and
appointment.
We
have
one
bullet
point
there
related
to
the
community
response
and
then
the
second
bullet
point
the
community
at
large
that
just
needed
to
be
formatted
and
section
four
added
at
the
bottom.
We
just
had
section,
and
that
was
it,
but
those
were
just
the
tweets
that
we
made.
We
just
wanted
to
present
those.
G
E
G
Okay,
well,
the
bulk
of
our
meeting
goes
to
mr
ed
here.
I
think
it
was
the
last
j-wreck
meeting
and
came
and
gave
a
high-level
review
update
on
the
driving
classes,
restoration
program-
and
there
was
lots
of
interest
in
that.
So
we
talked
about
doing
one
or
two
things.
Maybe
we'll
do
both
is
bringing
it
back
to
provide
more
detail
and
do
a
deeper
dive
into.
G
I
I
I
K
All
right,
thank
you
again
for
having
me
again
ed,
treat
I'm
staff
attorney
episcopal
legal.
My
practice
includes
expunction
and
driver's
license
restoration
for
low-income
residents
of
buncombe.
I
think
I
think
it's
10
counties
now
some
of
the
counties
don't
don't
have
all
the
services.
That's
a
little
tough
to
keep
track
of
I'm
contracted
by
buncombe
county
to
do
expunction
support
through
the
justice
resource
center.
They
don't
fund
my
whole
position.
K
K
I
think
I
saw
a
study
from
before
2020
when
the
second
chance
act
passed,
that
it
was
a
single
digit.
Percentage
of
people
were
availing
themselves
of
their
eligible
expansions.
So
we're
not
even
scratching
the
surface
with
that,
and
I
really
don't
even
do
any
outreach
anymore.
I
have
more
cases
than
I
can
handle.
As
julia
can
tell
you
the
driver's
license
restoration,
I
don't
think
pisgah
did
at
all
before
I
started
in
january
of
2021.
K
I
had
never
done
it
before
either
so
it's
been
a
learning
experience.
As
far
as
I
know,
I'm
the
only
person
doing
this
work
for
free
in
west
north
carolina,
there's
a
little
bit
of
in
charlotte
and
the
triangle
further
east.
Some
kind
of
places
like
that,
as
you
can
imagine,
the
demand
is
enormous.
We're
almost
at
the
point
we're
not
taking
any
more
cases
which
is
terrible.
You
know,
because
this
is
as
you're
gonna
see.
This
is
highly
impactful
work,
sometimes
for
a
relatively
small
input.
J
K
Okay,
we'll
get
there.
Thank
you
so
as
the
dmv
is
going
to
tell
you,
the
most
important
thing
to
keep
in
mind
is
driving
is
a
privilege.
It's
not
a
right.
It's
very
rare
that
dmv
absolutely
bars
somebody
from
from
driving
for
life,
really
even
in
very
extreme
circumstances.
It's
just
practically
speaking,
it's
impossible
for
many
folks,
even
when
there
is
supposed
to
be
a
mechanism,
sometimes
there's
time-barred
suspensions,
but
typically
very
few
people
just
are
told
you
can
never
drive
again
for
the
rest
of
your
life.
K
Just
want
to
show
you
the
I
don't
know
why
it's
not
catching
up.
Okay,
just
a
little
lag
there.
So
this
is
the
statute
that
covers
that
creates
the
problem.
Basically,
basically,
if
you
fail
to
appear
in
court
or
fail
to
pay
a
fine
once
the
division
must
revoke
your
license,
so
it's
a
must
no
discretion
by
the
department
of
water
vehicles.
K
I
don't
know
if
they
would
use
their
discretion
if
they
had
any,
but
they
don't
takes
one
to
suspend
you
indefinitely
and
you
will
see
clients
who
have
a
suspension
that
is
10
15,
20
years
old
and
it's
a
matter
of
few
hundred
dollars
quite
honestly
and
not
necessarily
a
dwi
or
a
vehicular
manslaughter.
Anything
of
that
nature.
K
The
numbers
I
see
these
numbers
all
the
time
and
I
still
can't
believe
that
they're
real
and
I
think
about
it.
Every
time
I
get
in
a
car
again
we're
going
back
to
2018,
but
I
can't
imagine
it's
a
whole
lot
better
at
this
point.
That's
what
is
that
a
million
and
a
quarter,
people
with
active
driver's
license
expenses
in
north
carolina?
That's
just
for
failure
to
pays
and
fair
to
appears
so
there's
other
types
of
suspensions
too.
This
is
15
of
all
adult
drivers
in
the
state.
K
That
is,
I
don't
even
know
how
that's
possible,
how
we
can
function
with
that
many
suspended
driver's
licenses.
Reality
is
people
keep
driving,
they
do
what
they
need
to
do
and
they
make
it
worse
because
they
get
caught
again
and
again
and
it
gets
harder
to
rectify
every
time
you
fix
it.
The
process
is
in
and
of
itself
kind
of
productive
and
that
if
the
debt's
not
paid
within
a
year,
it's
probably
never
going
to
be
paid.
K
K
today,
it's
147,
so
it's
going
up,
260
well
well
beyond
inflation,
and
this
slide
breaks
down
all
kinds
of
other
exciting
fees.
It's
like
when
you
get
your
cell
phone
bill
and
there's
all
these
surcharges
and
service
fees,
the
fine
itself
might
be
minuscule,
the
fine
might
be
50
and
you
end
up
paying
300
in
fees
again
the
idea
that
the
people
in
the
system
are
going
to
pay
for
it
is
it's
very
prevalent
in
our
country.
Unfortunately,
that's
all
very
negative,
some
slight
good
news
that
we
got
in
january
this
year.
K
Judges
in
north
carolina
are
now
required
to
consider
the
defendant's
ability
to
pay
when
assessing
funds
and
fees
and
to
sort
of
give
them
the
opportunity
after
the
case
is
over
to
go
back
and
reconsider
those
those
fines
if
they've
been
unable
to
pay
them.
That's
great
there's
a
petition
form
that
you
can
get
online.
Anybody
can
google
it
it's
aoc
415
we're
we're
hoping
that
the
form
is
going
to
be
streamlined
and
made
more
accessible.
K
K
I've
had
volunteer,
attorneys,
call
neighboring
counties
and
ask:
how
do
we
file
one
of
these
motions
and
none
of
the
clerks
that
heard
the
form
like
literally
the
clerk
put
down
the
phone
asked
everyone
in
the
office?
How
do
we
do
this?
Nobody
knew
so
clearly
it's
not
not
a
easy
fix,
but
it's
a
start,
and
it
is
something
that
people
might
be
able
to
do
without
an
attorney
eventually
does.
K
K
For
that
they're
not
going
to
be
represented,
they
don't
know,
what's
going
to
happen,
if
they've
had
negative
encounters
with
with
the
court
system
the
best
understandable,
I
think
the
federal
jobs
report
just
came
out
and
it
was
really
great
right.
I
think
it
was
country
added
half
a
million
jobs
in
in
july,
something
like
that.
It
was
really
really
nice
numbers.
Buncombe
county
has,
if
not
the
lowest
unemployment
in
state.
I
think
we
have
among
the
lowest
right.
Are
we
back
there?
I
think
great
stuff.
K
K
A
lot
of
folks
are
not
eligible.
Who
should
be.
That
is
what
it
is.
I'd
like
to
think
that
in
asheville,
malcolm
county
today,
you
could
probably
get
a
job
with
a
criminal
record.
You're
not
going
to
be
ceo,
but
you
can
work
if
you
want
to,
but
you
can't
get
there.
You
can
have
a
lot
of
transportation,
a
lot
of
employers
screen
for
that
at
the
front
end
I
had
a
client
recently
came
to
me
with
an
offer
letter
from
an
employer.
K
K
It's
it's
hugely
impactful
touches
on
just
every
aspect
of
kind
of
quality
of
life,
social
determinants
of
health,
that
kind
of
stuff
nutrition,
education,
involvement
with
your
child's
education,
and
I
would
estimate
that
not
too
many
folks
in
the
belgium
county
jail
are
there
because
they
have
suspended
driver's
license
directly.
There
might
be
a
few
really
really
serial
offenders,
but
from
talking
to
one
of
the
staff
at
the
county
jail
and
at
state
prisons
around
the
region,
they.
K
Have
driver's
licenses
again,
that's
not
what
they're
here
for,
but
they
all
could
use
this,
and
I
don't
have
a
number
to
back
it
up,
but
there's
no
way
it's
not
going
to
prevent
recidivism
there's
just
it's
absolutely
no
way.
It's
simply
common
sense,
and
I
know
folks
tend
to
be
in
the
county
jail
for
for
shorter
terms.
But
to
me
the
idea
of
sending
somebody
home
from
from
swannanoa
or
craggy
or
whatever,
without
even
a
plan
to
get
a
driver's
license,
is
just
it's
ridiculous.
K
How
are
they
going
to
keep
a
job?
How
are
they
going
to
make
their
probation
ones?
How
they're
going
to
pay
those
probation
fees,
dmv
used
to
go
into
state
prisons
to
at
least
renew
licenses,
not
not
to
restore
suspensions
but
to
renew
license,
which
was
great,
I
think,
with
the
pandemic
they
had
to
stop.
I
mean,
even
then,
that
was
kind
of
a
limited
service
and
accessing
correctional
facilities.
Understand.
Of
course,
it's
complicated.
K
There
are
huge,
catastrophic
racial
experience
here,
people
of
color,
obviously
more
likely
to
be
subjected
to
traffic
stops.
They
do
worse,
no
stops
happen,
they
do
worse
than
they
get
to
court
statewide.
As
of
2018
non-white,
drivers
are
going
to
be
suspended.
I
think
four
times
more
likely
than
white
drivers
welcome.
Unfortunately,
it
was
a
little
bit
higher
five
times
more
likely.
Some
of
the
counties
around
us
are
much
worse.
Some
of
them
are
a
little
better,
but
obviously
there's
a
huge
disparity
here
and
beyond.
Even
those
individuals.
K
It's
just
really
important
to
keep
in
mind
the
ripple
effect
this
is
going
to
have
where
it
makes
everyone
less
safe
on
the
road
it's
much
more
expensive
to
get
insurance.
If
you
have
to
spend
driver's
license,
if
you
can
at
all
again,
15
of
the
state
might
be
driving
out
that
insurance,
that
is,
that
is
bonkers,
I'm
not
a
police
officer.
K
I
was
a
prosecutor
for
five
years.
I
worked
with
a
lot
of
police
officers.
My
understanding
is
that,
after
domestic
violence
cases,
traffic
stops
are
the
most
dangerous
thing
that
police
officers
do.
I
think
that's
counterintuitive,
you
wouldn't
think
so,
but
it's
a
dangerous
situation,
so
less
suspended
licenses
less
expired
tags.
All
those
good
things
less
car
stops
less
negative
interactions,
all
those
all
those
things
we
want
to
avoid
in
our
county.
K
Talking
about
what
we
might
do
about
this
horrible
problem
that
I
just
sold,
you
guys
on
the
bunker
county
district
attorney's
office
and
have
to
give
them
all
the
credit
in
the
world.
Meredith
and
todd
williams
have
have
completed
their
mass
relief
project.
That's
phenomenal!
That
helps
hundreds
of
people
in
in
one
motion
that
that
saves
so
much
time.
You
know
if
we
could
do
those
case
by
case
it
would
would
take
us
it'd.
Take
me
the
rest
of
my
life
and
I
think
that's
happened
in
14
other
jurisdictions
around
the
state.
K
It's
a
good
start,
but
he
had
a
ways
to
go.
I've
had
some
conversations
with
another
d.a
in
the
region
about
maybe
considering
that
in
his
district-
and
he
told
me
you
know
without
even
have
to
think
about
it.
So
politically,
let's
be
honest,
that's
not
going
to
be
sellable
in
a
lot
of
places.
It's
just
not.
E
K
Well,
it's
it's
not
that
simple
in
that
they're
going
to
qualify
it.
Obviously
it's
going
to
be
certain
offenses,
it's
going
to
be!
If
it's
more
than
you
know
a
certain
time
old,
you
know
the
ticket
you
could
you
could
just
go
off.
I
think
judge
hill
wanted
it
to
be
folks
who
did
not
have
felonies
on
their
records.
I
think
so.
H
K
So
there
you
go
so
you
can
you
can
you
can
make
that
as
broad
or
narrow?
As
you
want,
I
mean
we're
going
to
talk
about
how
important
that
is,
but
how
it's
also
not
the
silver
bullet
by
any
means,
it's
a
really
important
component
and
I
would
love
to
see
it
happen
in
henderson,
because
I
can
tell
you
almost
none
of
my
clients
have
suspensions
in
one
county:
it's
not
the
way
it
works.
K
K
It's
not
going
to
get
a
lot
of
folks
there,
and
that
said,
having
a
sympathetic
district
attorney's
office
is
absolutely
crucial,
makes
my
job
so
much
easier
and
they
make
me
look
like
heroes
all
the
time,
because
they
are
willing
to
work
on
individual
cases
beyond
the
mass
release,
and
that
is
so
crucial
having
just
a
designated
attorney
like
mayor
who's
available
to
have
those
conversations,
and
it
doesn't
mean
they're
going
to
give
away
the
store
every
time.
No,
it
doesn't,
but
just
but
there's
a
mechanism,
because
the
mass
relief
again
is
retroactive.
K
H
Chance
dot
com
fair
chance,
thanks
ed,
so
they
can
put
in
their
information
and
it'll
pop
up
and
tell
them
if
they
got
the
relief
or
not.
So
that
was
over
800
votes
between
the
80s
up
to
2018.
When
I
did
the
mass
motions
and
orders
I
am
working
on
a
lot
of,
I
have
a
whole
box
of
files
in
my
office,
going
back
to
like
1977
that
I'm
going
through
it
looks
like
those
are
a
lot
of
unpaid
fines
more
than
traffic
stuff.
K
It
yeah
it
needs
to
be
stressed
that
this
is
a
lot
of
work
for
the
da's
office
and
I'm
sure
meredith
has
plenty
of
other
things
to
do.
She
gets
emails
from
me
all
day,
every
day,
begging
for
help
with
my
sad
clients.
So
it's
easy
to
say:
we
want
the
day
to
do
things
like
this,
but
I'm
sure,
just
like
everybody
else.
They
have
staffing
concerns,
and
it's
you
know
it's
not
that
simple
other
things
that
are
being
done
around
the
state
and
to
some
in
some
cases
here.
K
Pisca
ran
a
virtual
restoration
clinic
this
spring.
This
is
a
model.
That's
used
around
the
state,
the
nc
pro
bono
resource
center,
piloted
this
probably
some
years
ago,
now,
basically
volunteer
attorneys,
get
matched
up
with
a
client.
The
volunteer
attorney
gets
a
little
bit.
Training
gets
the
client's
dmv
record
for
free,
which
is
crucial.
K
They
draft
an
advice
letter.
They
annotate
the
record
if
you've
ever
ordered
a
dmv
record,
it's
written
in
another
language,
and
it
doesn't
tell
you
how
to
get
your
license
back.
It
might
tell
you
that
it's
suspended,
but
you
know
the
average
person
is
certainly
not
going
to
figure
it
out
and
it's
I
look
at
them
every
day
and
still
come
across
records
that
I
can't
understand
quite
honestly,
so
the
volunteer
drafts
that
advice
letter.
Then
they
have
a
meeting
with
the
client.
K
Probably
virtually
at
this
point,
go
over
the
letter
with
them,
because
nobody
reads
anything
and
explain
to
the
client.
Here's
what
you
need
to
do
to
get
your
license
back,
that's
nice
and
it's
a
great
model
in
that
it
allows
you
to
serve
a
lot
of
people
relatively
quickly.
But
as
you
can
imagine,
you're
not
providing
you're
not
providing
a
whole
lot
of
you're,
not
providing
representation.
It's
not
really
like
in-depth
service.
K
It's
really
advice,
which
is
it's
a
great
first
step
and
even
just
giving
a
person
a
copy
of
the
record
is
more
than
they
had
probably
but
you're,
probably
not
directly
getting
that
many
people
their
licenses
back
with
that,
unfortunately,
also
very
time
consuming.
As
I
could
tell
you
for
me,
the
staff
attorney
to
run
that
program,
particularly
early
on
you're
training
volunteers
who
they
might
have
been.
You
know.
K
K
I
could
tell
a
lot
of
the
volunteers
went
away
from
it
really
amazed
at
just
the
scope
of
the
problem,
so
it
was,
it
was
worthwhile
for
us
and
it
helped
us
build
some
connections
with
some
of
the
local
bar
who
have
more
in-depth
knowledge.
Some
of
the
local
firms,
the
minic
firm
in
particular
jake
minnick,
has
been
tremendous.
K
He
makes
a
nice
living
doing
these
kind
of
cases
and
he's
going
to
take
on
some
from
my
clients
for
free
just
having
a
resource
like
that.
To
ask
questions
too.
It's
phenomenal
because
traffic
law
is
really
hard,
so
we
have.
The
mountain
mountain
volunteer
lawyer
program
takes
time
to
build
that
up
and
again,
you
know
the
expert
attorney
is
worth
his
weight
in
gold,
the
the
well
men,
the
well-intentioned
attorney,
who
has
no
experience.
K
It's
more
work
on
the
staff
attorney,
it's
a
diminishing
return
and
with
more
resources
yeah,
I
could
trade
more
people,
obviously
again.
Turning
back
to
the
aoc
415
motions,
they
need
to
be
more
accessible.
Folks
are
starting
to
find
these
and
merit,
and
I
have
talked
about
that.
She
gets
people
cold,
calling
her
asking.
I
want
to
file
this
motion.
How
do
I
do
that?
I
think
buncombe
county
does
a
pretty
good
job
of
making
that
accessible
to
folks,
but
there's
a
lot
of
moving
pieces.
K
You
have
to
serve
it
on
the
da's
office.
You
have
to
file
it.
It's
supposed
to
be
notarized
which
believe
it
or
not,
is
a
major
assembly
lock
for
a
lot
of
our
clients
and
in
a
lot
of
counties.
I'm
sure
they've,
never
gotten
one
of
these,
and
they
are
just
going
to
look
at
you
like
you're,
a
crazy
person.
You
try
to
file
it.
This
could
tie
in
with
other
things
like
the
court
navigator.
K
This
might
be
a
relatively
easy
lift
for
volunteers
through
a
clinic
or
through
kind
of
a
self-help
center.
You
really
don't
need
to
be
a
lawyer
to
do
that,
for
even
if
it's
you
know
it
might
not
get
you
that
far.
But
it's
easy
to
try
also
important
to
understand
limitations
that
form
so
your
license
gets
suspended.
You
have
court
costs,
fines
fees.
You
probably
owe
money
to
dmv
directly
as
well.
Those
are
not
negotiable.
Those
are
not
waivable.
K
K
One
of
the
things
that
I've
seen
around
north
carolina
that
impressed
me
most
of
all
and
that
I've
been
kicking
and
screaming
about
since
I
heard
about
it-
is
the
town
of
chapel
hill
has
a
criminal
justice.
Debt
really
funked.
I
think
it
was.
It
was
2020
after
after
all,
the
civil
unrest
around
george
floyd
and
everything
chapel
hill
decided
they
wanted
to
stop
as
they
put
criminalizing
poverty
and
they
figured
out
how
much
money
they
took
in
in
traffic
court
fees
every
year.
K
It
was
about
twenty
thousand
dollars
at
that
point,
and
so
they
have
a
line
item
in
their
budget
that
matches
that
amount.
It's
not
they're
not
actually
taking
that
money,
because
that
money
goes
into
a
state
central
fund,
but
they
basically
match
that
every
year
I
think,
is
the
plan-
and
it's
amazingly
enough
to
me,
administered
by
the
chapel
hill
police
department
crisis
unit,
which
is
actual
police
officers
and
social
workers.
K
So
you
might
get
a
phone
call.
If
you
apply
to
this
fund,
you
will
get.
You
might
get
a
phone
call
from
a
uniformed
police
officer
telling
you
guess
what
we're
gonna
give
you
500.
So
you
can
pay
that
ticket.
I
think
there's
a
lot
of
talk
about
reimagining,
police
and
those
kind
of
things,
and
it's
not
as
simple
as
a
little
thing
like
that.
But
I
think
that's
an
amazing
idea
and
a
tremendous
commitment
by
chatboy
to
really
put
their
money
where
their
mouth
is
again.
K
They
consider
a
lot
of
factors:
residency,
indigency,
the
nature
of
the
expense.
Have
you
explored
other
avenues
of
relief?
The
money
gets
paid
directly
to
the
court
or
the
dmv
applicant's,
not
given
any
money,
and
there
are
some
things
that
are
not
obvious
started
with
20
grands
in
that
one
county
and
neighboring
counties
kind
of
had
a
knock
on
effect
where
they
saw
it
and
they
wanted
to
be
involved
and
they've
since
contributed
funds
that
their
residents
can
use.
And
it
was
nice
to
see
that
kind
of
domino
effect
with
that
idea.
K
I
got
from
the
safety
justice
challenge
grant.
It's
been
amazing
and
I
can't
thank
the
folks
enough
who
who
helped
make
that
happen.
I
don't
want
to
do
driver's
license
restoration
work
anymore.
If
I
don't
have
that
kind
of
resource,
because
it's
just
it's
a
wall
that
you're
going
to
run
through
every
time.
K
Here's
what
you
need
to
do,
but
it's
going
to
cost
you
800
good
luck.
It's
a
lot
of
work
too.
To
administer
it,
as
everyone
can
imagine.
I
naively
did
not
know
that,
because
I've
never
done
anything
like
that,
a
lot
of
paperwork
kind
of
the
work
that
I'm
doing
and
that
you're
seeing
around
the
state.
It's
typically
referred
to
as
restoration
council.
K
I
would
compare
it
to
what
I
the
contract
that
I
have
with
the
county
now
to
do,
expunction,
except
it
could
or
could
be,
could
include
driver's
license
restoration.
It
will
be
either
or
that
kind
of
thing
orange
county
again
has
arrest
racing
council
position.
I
happen
to
know
that
attorney.
I
think
that
position
is
actually
currently
open,
but
shirts
going
to
be
filled.
She
has
expunctions
general
court.
Debt
relief
driver's
license
restoration.
K
Those
kind
of
services
she
works
in
the
courthouse
she
gets
referrals
from
within
the
courtroom,
people
walk
into
her
office
and
she
helps
them.
Durham
has
the
the
dear
program,
I
think,
that's
two
attorneys
and
a
paralegal
funded
by
durham.
I
think
there
are
legal
aid
attorneys
who
are
grant
funded.
I'm
not
mistaken.
K
I've
heard
lately
they
tend
to
do
more
expunction
than
driver's
license
work.
It
is
hard
to
kind
of
keep
the
two
from
kind
of
bleeding
into
each
other,
because
they
both
are
a
lot
of
work.
New
hanover
is
launching
a
similar
program.
Soon
also,
I
believe,
grant
funded
legal
aid
attorneys.
I
think
that's
going
to
be
two
attorneys
in
a
paralegal.
K
I
want
to
say
that's
launching
beginning
next
year
the
charlotte
center
for
legal
advocacy
has
driver's
license
and
and
x
function.
I
think
theirs
is
funded
specifically
to
work
with
a
specific
area
of
charlotte,
so
that
one's
a
little
different,
but
it's
great
to
have
those
that
network
of
folks
around
the
state,
because
we
get
clients
who
have
issues
all
over
the
state
and
to
have
a
local
connection
makes
all
difference
in
the
world
knowing
which
da
in
that
office
you
can
talk
to.
It
saves
you
to
manage
time.
K
One
of
the
things
that
I
found
particularly
helpful
is
partnering,
with
various
service
providers
around
the
region
and
building
a
relationship
with
them.
To
kind
of,
I
don't
need
anybody
to
find
any
clients.
I've
had
more
clients
that
I
can
take
already,
but
having
the
client
with
that
support
system
is
just
crucial
once
in
a
while.
K
I
get
a
client
who
I
don't
how
they
find
me,
but
you
know
they're
they're,
really
not
in
a
place
to
work
on
restoring
their
license,
and
you
know
it's
hard
for
me
to
make
that
determination,
because
they
need
help
clearly,
but
somebody
who's
not
going
to
follow
through
on
things
who's.
You
know
maybe
not
safely
house,
you
know
unreliable
cell
phone
service,
those
kind
of
things,
so
somebody
with
a
peer
support
network
in
place,
a
mentor
living
in
support
of
housing.
K
Those
to
me
are
the
clients
who
typically
do
the
best,
even
even
with
the
bad
licenses,
because
you
get
the
releases
where
you
can
share
information.
Obviously,
with
the
other
service
providers-
and
you
have
like
boots
on
the
ground,
we
we
have
a
partnership
with
the
united
way
of
rutherford
county.
That's
been
tremendous
where
some
once
or
twice,
we've
called
them
up
and
said:
hey
this
person
needs
a
ride
to
the
dmv.
K
K
You
could
eventually
have
those
kind
of
networks
send
clients
who
are
sort
of
pre-screened
and
even
we're
training
case
managers
to
understand
dmv
records
and
do
a
little
bit
of
the
work
themselves
before
they
get
to
the
attorney,
because
they
can
do
a
lot,
they
can
get
dmu
records,
they
can
kind
of
interpret
them
and
kind
of
you
know.
So
the
client
comes
to
me
in
a
better
in
a
better
place,
also
united
way.
K
Rutherford
and
operation
gateway
have
some
limited
financial
support
available
that
they
use
and
they
do
all
kinds
of
other
services.
You
know
it
can
be
general
re-entry
stuff,
workforce
developments,
substance,
abuse,
recovery,
those
kind
of
things,
there's
no
point
in
me
trying
to
figure
out
all
those
things.
If
somebody
else
can
do
it
better
right.
K
Other
ideas
that
I'm
seeing
around
the
state
that
I
think
are
worth
considering
the
court
navigator
program
we
have
here
in
buncombe,
I
haven't
had
time
to
get
with
court
navigator,
yeah
anybody
I
would
love
to
to
me.
It
seems
like
an
obvious,
fit
a
lot
of
these
tasks.
You
can
go
to
the
clerk's
office.
You
can
go
online
and
get
these
forms
fill
them
out
yourself.
K
The
average
person
is
not
doing
that-
let's
be
honest,
particularly
they've
had
negative
interactions
with
the
court
in
law
enforcement
applying
for
limited
driving
privileges,
the
415
motions,
those
kind
of
things
those
could
be
done
by
somebody.
You
know
without
a
law
degree
and
just
to
have
somebody
hold
your
hand
a
little
bit.
I
think
you'd
be
a
real
difference
maker
and
there's
never
gonna
be
enough
free
lawyers.
So
you
need
those
kind
of
resources,
legal
self-help
center.
K
K
There's
also
a
lot
of
fairly
sketchy
third-party
websites
that
will
sell
you.
What
reports
of
your
db
record
and
it's
not
accurate,
so
you
just
wasted
some
money
and
time
and
that's
things
to
tell
a
client
who,
just
you
know
that
was
real
hardship
to
pay
ten
dollars.
You
can
go
on
the
you
can
go
to
the
website
and
get
your
records.
10.75
they'll,
send
it
to
instantly
as
a
pdf.
K
K
There
is
a
there
is
a
mechanism
that
I've
never
been
able
to
figure
out
whereby
north
carolina
government
entities
can
can
have
access
to
to
dmv
records.
I
kind
of
tried
it
when
I
started
thinking.
Oh,
I
technically
worked
for
the
county,
but
I
didn't
get
more
dmv,
but
to
me
it
doesn't
make
sense
that
you
can
go
to
a
public
terminal
in
the
clerk's
office
in
bunker
county
in
every
county,
north
carolina
and-
and
you
can
get
your
criminal
record
for
free
most
people
don't
know
that.
But
it's
easy.
It's
free.
K
I
think
I
know
the
reason
why
it's,
because,
like
a
lot
of
these
things,
where
this
is
probably
generating
revenue
for
dmv,
let's
be
honest
for
them
to
sell
your
your
record
for
10
75
cents,
so
my
cases
get
delayed
for
months.
While
I
get
free
records,
it
is
what
it
is
all
these
ideas
that
I'm
talking
about,
whether
it's
you
know
more
attorney
time
or
non-legal.
K
K
K
E
K
I
said
I
really
even
don't
do
any
outreach
on
this
anymore,
because
I
can't
we
mentioned
the
idea
of
an
amnesty
day
earlier.
I
I
know
that
that
has
happened
in
the
past
and
with
other
jurisdictions.
I
think
the
pandemic
put
a
stop
to
a
lot
of
that,
but
I
would
love
to
see
that
kind
of
thing
start
over
again.
It's
work.
It
ties
up.
K
Resources
ties
up
judges,
it
ties
up
clerks
ties
up
prosecutors,
but
those
kind
of
things
I
think
can
be
can
be
really
helpful
and
I
think
it's
also
just
sort
of
a
nice
way
to
demonstrate
that
we
can
be
forgiving.
You
know
we
can
give
people
second
chances
for
not
wearing
a
seatbelt
things
of
that
nature.
K
I'm
actually
just
going
to
share
one
client
where
I
know
it
says
stories,
but
this
is
probably
my
favorite
client
of
all
times,
and
I've
talked
to
josh
about
him,
not
because
I
love
this
guy.
This
guy
man
of
color
north
carolina
native
he's
from
fayetteville,
was
in
the
army
for
a
couple
years.
When
he
got
out,
he
really
struggled
with
mental
health
and
substance
abuse.
K
A
long
time
went
to
prison
not
going
to
get
next
function.
Unfortunately,
I'm
not
quite
sure
I
ended
up
in
nashville,
but
he
ended
up
hooked
up
with
a
really
good
peer
support
network
he's
doing
really
well
living
in
supporting
housing.
I
think
he
manages
the
restaurant
downtown
just
got
his
peer
support
certification
and
this
guy
had
done
all
the
hard
work
by
the
time
he
came
to
me.
K
You
know
he'd
been
sober
a
long
time
and
he's
he's
a
rock
star,
he's
awesome,
but
he
didn't
have
a
driver's
license
and
he
hadn't
had
one.
I
would
say
a
decade
more.
I
didn't
know
why
couldn't
tell
me
why,
but
was
willing
to
help
himself
and
got
his
dmd
record,
figured
out
what
he
needed
to
do.
Once
again,
we
had
a
very
sympathetic
da's
office
on
this
one.
This
was
cumberland
county,
not
lunch,
but
cumberland
county's
office,
really
nice
people,
apparently
they
dismissed
after
I
reached
out.
K
They
dismissed
one
of
his
old
cases.
There
was
one
that
they
could
not
dismiss,
and
so
I
use
the
debt
relief
fund
to
help
him
pay
that
last
fine.
Then
he
had
a
restoration
fee
at
dmv.
Helped
him
pay
that,
but
a
little
more
that
he
had
to
pay
in
person
himself
that
I
lost.
If
we
could
not
pay
for
him
and
he
paid
that
for
himself
and
he
got
his
driver's
license.
I
think
two
weeks
ago-
and
you
know
it's-
he
has
a
job.
K
I
think
a
job
offer
pending
that
was
going
to
require
him
to
get
a
driver's
license
working
with
folks
like
himself
working
with
veterans
in
recovery.
They
don't
all
go
that
well.
This
one
actually
happened
fairly
quickly
and
came
together
pretty
nicely.
It
doesn't
always
work
the
way,
but
it's
great
when
you
get
one
like
that,.
K
So,
as
you
can
tell
that,
there's
not
going
to
be
any
one,
there's
not
going
to
be
any
one
solution
to
any
any
problem.
This
big
we're
not
just
talking
about
fixing
all
the
old
tickets
that
are
outstanding
in
buncombe
county,
we're
talking
about.
How
are
we
going
to
prevent
that
from
happening
again?
K
K
D
K
Know
that
sounds
crazy.
A
judge
is
the
king
of
castle.
No
judges
have
performance
quotas
like
everybody
else,
and
they
need
to
be.
They
need
to
have
the
time
to
do
this
stuff
that
it's
okay,
it's
not
just
a
gesture
because
it
is
gonna
take
time
if
you're
gonna
do
it
on
every
case.
It's
gonna,
it's
gonna,
slow
everything
down,
and
if
you
look
at
the
number
of
people
who
are
coming
into
court
with
public
defenders
by
their
nature,
they
don't
have
any
money,
so
the
whole
thing
on
some
level
sort
of.
K
K
You
know
they've
they've
been
sober
for,
however
long
that
sort
of
thing
where
they're,
probably
in
a
place,
that
they
can
deal
with
this-
that
they're
they're
ready
for
this,
because
this
is
going
to
be
the
last
step
for
a
lot
of
folks.
For
somebody,
who's
really
been
through
hard
times,
it's
also
it's
just.
It
can
be
tough
to
get
folks
to
engage
it
can
be,
and
we
all
know
that
how
much
harder
it
is
than
we
would
like
it
to
be
that
we
have
all
these
services.
K
K
K
K
Talking
about
specific
recommendations,
obviously
I'd
love
to
not
be
dealing
with
doing
this
I'd
love
to
have
the
resources.
Do
it
more
than
half
time
the
support
is,
is
crucial.
The
durham
attorneys
told
me
when
they
started.
They
just
had
the
two
attorneys.
They
were
very
excited.
They
then
spent
all
their
time
just
dealing
with
the
walk-ins,
so
the
administrative
support
is
crucial.
I
think
people
kind
of
tend
to
overlook
those
kind
of
boring
details,
but
it's
absolutely
a
paralegal
knows
this
stuff
could
do
a
huge
amount
of
the
work
again.
K
The
the
financial
aid
resources
are
are
so
important,
there's
so
much
that
my
clients
coming
with
that,
I
can't
do
anything
about
as
an
attorney
or
that
it's
not
worth
my
time
to
deal
with.
If
your
fine
is
200,
if
I
have
to
drive
three
hours
each
way
to
go
to
court
to
deal
with
that,
that's
not
worth
it.
K
You
know
working
with
the
other
da's
in
the
region
about
maybe
getting
them
to
gradually
buy
into
doing
more,
because
it
is
a
regional
problem,
and
I
I
know
what
we
do
here
in
bungalow
is
not
going
to
fly
in
a
lot
of
the
counties.
I
serve,
let's
be
honest,
but
there
does
tend
to
be
a
knock
on
effect
and
get
one
county
doing
this
and
more
kind
of
pay
attention
again.
J
I
think
I
shared
this
group,
you
know
I
was
part
of
this
bipartisan
group
that
looked
at
poverty
in
north
carolina
out
of
duke's
public
policy,
school,
packed,
republicans,
half
democrats-
and
this
was
one
of
the
topics
we
tackled
and
the
way
it
was
kind
of
sold.
I
think
to
appeal
across
the
political
spectrum.
Was
it's
also
a
major
economic
development
issue,
because
you
can't
function
as
a
strong
economy
when
you've
got?
We
have.
J
E
J
K
K
I
don't
have
as
much
time
to
pay
attention
as
stuff
as
I
would
like
to
and-
and
I
can
tell
you
that
these
statewide
organizations
and
nationalizations
they
want
a
presence
here
in
west
north
carolina
beyond
direct
services.
They
want
local
buy-in
and,
as
they've
told
me,
it's
very
hard
for
the
nc
pro
bono
resource
center
to
cold
call
district
attorneys
in
west
north
carolina.
They
don't
get
anywhere.
K
You
know
it's,
it's
not
a
conversation
now.
Clearly,
I'm
not
from
here
either.
I'm
not
fooling.
Anybody
with
this
accent,
but
you
know
with
with
the
networks
that
we
have
this
this
region
is,
is
is
missing
out.
A
lot
of
this
stuff
is
centered
in
the
triangle
quite
honestly,
and
they
need
local
connections
to
make
it
happen.
G
K
K
And
there
is
a
national
final
fee-
justice
movement-
I
think
I
want
to
say
maybe
a
dozen
or
so
states
have
started
to
to
limit
this
kind
of
stuff.
It's
a
great
start,
and
it
might
be
something
that
north
carolina
looks
to.
Eventually
I
mean
sooner
rather
than
later.
I
hope,
but
I
think
it
is
also
important
to
think
about
what
we
can
do
here,
because
even
within
those
frameworks,
you
know
you
need
to
ask
yourself
about
so
you're,
limiting
the
term
of
suspension.
That's
great.
K
So
it
needs
to
be
a
concerted
effort
and
I
would
love
to
be
more
involved
with
what
the
folks
and
rob
are
doing
and
they
would
love
for
me
to
be
more
involved
because
I'm
the
guy
they
know
out
here,
and
they
don't
have
a
voice
here,
which
is
important.
I
know
I
talk
for
a
long
time
and
I
talk
really
fast.
G
K
The
folks
who
do
this
kind
of
work
around
the
state
and
the
triangle,
those
kind
of
places,
would
love
to
make
themselves
available
to
talk
about
what
they're
doing
and
to
offer
their
expertise
and
their
guide
to
what
has
worked
and
what
hasn't
worked,
because
some
of
them
have
a
much
more
of
a
big
perspective
than
I
do,
but
they've
also
done
the
direct
services
work.
So
so
they
have
great
experience.
So
that's
something
to
consider
if
you
want
to
do
it
thanks
for
having
me,
everybody.
E
G
Mylan
patton
milan
is
actually
a
fellow
from
the
north.
Carolina
league
lead
for
north
carolina
program
through
americorps
and
through
the
unc
school
of
government,
and
milo
is
spending
a
year
service
here
in
the
county.
Manager's
office
mylon
has
lots
of
big
heavy
projects
that
he's
going
to
be
working
on.
So
I
don't
know
if
you
want
to
say
anything,
but
y'all
will
see
him
around
a
ton
over
the
next
year.