Carroll County, MD Carroll County Board of Zoning Appeals, 31 Aug 2022

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From YouTube: Board of Zoning Appeals Morning of August 31, 2022

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https://www.carrollcountymd.gov

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We're going to call the board of zoning appeals meeting to order and.

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This morning we have have case number 6406 and it is an appeal of the planning commission's.

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uh Denial of a site plan for s-20-0010.

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Mr dixon, is you want to introduce the file or the yeah? You go ahead and introduce the file before.

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Before you get started, uh please please make sure that your electronic devices are turned to.

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um Either silent or vibrate and make sure that if you're here you've signed in on the the sheet, the.

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Clipboard on the side, uh another thing another reminder: please leave by the same door that you.

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Came in and turn your badges in so at the end of the day, they're not trying to locate.

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You somewhere in the building, so with that, mr dixon, could you go ahead and introduce the file.

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All right case 6406 an appeal of the planning commission's denial of approval of the site plan.

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For s20010, the site is located at liberty, road eldersburg, maryland property zone.

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C2 commercial, medium intensity, district in election district 14 by.

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Style loss properties, llc in care of michael staplas, go to public local laws.

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And ordinances section 158.133 d2, a site visit is tentatively scheduled for wednesday august 17.

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2022 at approximately 9 55 a.m and to file this matter. We have the following documents:.

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A july 21st 2022 letter from roberta j, windham, esquire, county administrator.

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Oh, I got the wrong file.

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All right, I got the planning commission, but that's this one, okay in the file, this beginner, so we can.

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Strike everything that you said to this point. No, no, I I said the right thing at the beginning, but.

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When I opened the file, I had the wrong file. Okay, all right. We have the site minutes for this case.

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We have an email from bill mccormick, we circulated miss vance. We circulated our previously emailed.

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Letter among our community and asked if anyone would like to sign on in support of the letter.

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Below are 139 names and their associated street names. We purposely did not collect street number.

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Of people who signed in support of our letter, these are people who live in our.

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Community, this was not a change, org petition, so there's 139 names here.

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Next thing we have is a.

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Email from timothy pascarelli passarello tats, please find comments from the freedom.

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District citizens association concerning the appeal of a decision by the planning.

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And zoning commission regarding potential development of long reach, farm lot, 20.

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And this is a two-page letter for that. Let's see.

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Then there's an august 5th 2022 email from matt.

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Matt e or emac matt e, um my apologies. My objection is to case 6406.

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All right, there's august 5th, 2022 email from jessica, kavanagh.

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I live close to the proposed new development on liberty, road known as long reach, farms.

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I feel the proposed structure is not in keeping with the surrounding environment.

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And in particular the apartments I have seen the other building in eldersburg that looks.

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Like the one proposed and I've always thought it looks, aesthetically like a.

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Motel, in fact, for the first three years of living in the area, I thought it was a motel.

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The proposed structural plans have the same, look and feel as a motel, and I feel this will reduce my.

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Property value as motels carry a stigma and don't reflect upscale up market living. I would rather.

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The area be kept to reflect our country, small town, feel and to blend with the surrounding structures.

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There's an august 6 2022 email from kevin wade too many people want to stifle any economic.

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Growth and want to stop any build it building whatsoever. I hope that the denial is overturned.

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And more business and opportunities exist in our community there's an august 1st 2022.

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Notice of public hearing for this case in the paper there is an august 4, 2022 email from matt e.

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In reference to case 6402, I request the board of appeals, deny the developer's request. I, along with.

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My fellow residents are adamantly against this development request. Thank you for representing.

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Our community against developer overreach, matt e there's an august 4th 2022 email from.

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Derek soderstrom I'd like to express my concerns for this project. This lot is not.

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The place for this kind of development, this will negatively negatively affect.

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Property values of the surrounding homes, this area also is very dangerous entering and exiting.

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Out onto route 26, adding more to this span of 26 without the supporting infrastructure.

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Is going to make things even more dangerous and chaotic, not to mention the additional.

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Three four-story 55 and up apartments being built across the street currently.

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All right there's a letter that is stamped in august 4 2022 from bill.

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Mccormick repaids typewritten letter.

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um Hearing notice was posted july 25th 2022 by scott robinson zoning inspector.

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And then there's the appeal planning commission's denial of approval of site plan.

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There's a june 16 2022 letter from kelly shaffer miller to the board.

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There are some plans from clsi.

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The appeal letter.

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Basically says at the end that the planning commission's denial was arbitrary and capricious.

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And not based on any reasonable interpretation of the facts and information before it.

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Is may 23 2022 letter from linda d, eisenberg secretary to the planning commission.

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Carroll county planning and zoning commission at its meeting on tuesday.

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May 17 2022 voted to deny the above reference final site plan.

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So that you will have some record of the action taken by the commission on this particular item.

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I am including an excerpt of the unofficial minutes from the meeting.

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I would ask that the file be entered into evidence. Do we have a motion to enter the.

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Following evidence so moved, do we have a second? Second, uh all those in favor aye.

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All right, we will go ahead and enter the file into evidence.

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So this is the de novo hearing of an appeal, the planning commission's denial of approval of the.

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Site plan, so I'm assuming ms miller since you're you're, the representation for the.

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Appellant that you will go first, um mr bale, well, let me introduce myself first of all kelly shaffer.

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Miller, 73 east main street westminster maryland 21157. I am prepared to go first, but I also believe.

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That, mr allman is prepared to call miss mathias from from the county staff, and so, if he believes.

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That it would be more efficient to open with her testimony. I am not opposed to that. Okay, very good.

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That yes and it's james allman on behalf of the planning commission, as this is a de novo hearing.

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um I just thought it would be wise to sort of run this as if it was a planning commission.

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Meeting and um typically um and the planning commission is reviewing plans.

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The representative from the office of development review.

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Goes before the applicant developer, so I just thought that would be the correct process.

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To do today, okay, very good, and with that, though, I would like to make a brief opening statement.

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Before we begin testimony, if, if we're there, no objection and that's no objection, okay, we'll go.

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Ahead and go forward with that format, so, ms miller, thank you good morning. Members of the board.

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Briefly, I would like to enter any objection to the file to the extent.

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That there were letters from people who are not here and present today to speak.

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I would like to preserve preserve that for the record. My guess is that several of those names.

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That were attached on that letter are not here and available for cross-examination and therefore I do.

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Not think that this board should consider that in in weighing the evidence before it here today,.

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I would also, and perhaps I'll wait for miss matthias to start.

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Testifying but I would like the development review file to become a part of this record as well, so I.

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Would I would ask that the board consider that I'm not sure do you have that, or is that? Okay.

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We are here today on an appeal of a site plan, as you heard, mr dixon introduce the location.

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Of the property is on maryland route 26 near the intersection of clean mill road. I believe.

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The board conducted a site visit, this property is zoned for the use, it is zoned c2 and the.

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Use uh requested is for a um planned commercial center. Sorry, it's it's going undergoing a name.

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Change somewhat recently so I have to, I have to get used to it: a planned commercial center.

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The plan that will be presented before you here today as you'll, hear testimony to meets the.

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Definition of a planned commercial center and has gone through all of the relevant technical review.

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And received all agency approvals, as mr bale opened the hearing, this is a de novo proceeding.

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And so we will be presenting this to you for approval of the site plan as.

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If you sit in the shoes of the planning commission, that is your role here today, and so that is the.

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Presentation that you will hear from from the applicants or appellants in this case.

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The I you will hear testimony from my witnesses here today, mr stavis who's, the property owner.

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Mr ron, thompson who's representing the engineer, mr mark keely, who's representing the traffic.

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Group who prepared the traffic study for this project and then mr joe rudder who's, a planner.

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So you will, you will hear all the testimony presented to approve this site plan here today and.

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We ask you to keep an open mind and, uh and with that I will lead the way for miss matthias, okay,.

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So, do you want to call her as a witness or you're just going to have her make the presentation how.

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I was just going to have her make a presentation- okay, but but very.

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Good before we get started, uh because this is a little bit different from our normal procedures,.

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Anyone that's going to testify here today. I would ask that you stand and take the oath so.

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Jay you're not going to weigh in on this.

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Okay, very good: do you swear or firm, under the penalties of perjury, that the testimony you're.

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About to give is the truth, the whole truth and nothing, but the truth very good. You may be seated.

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Okay, mr allman, okay, um so um laura mathias, the director of development review.

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um Is going to uh present the uh uh staff report um to you regarding uh this property.

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Good morning, miss mathias good morning, laura mathias bureau, chief of development review.

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And I was the presenter on may 17th to the planning commission of this.

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Final report, so, as jim said, I am simply going to.

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Give you the report as if I am doing it all over again to the planning commission. So we do have.

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A slideshow that goes along with it to orient you and provide you images.

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Of the proposed plan all right, so this is a final site plan before you today.

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The county file number is s20010 and the file name is longreach farm lot. 20.. This.

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Is a planned commercial center? That is the title of the project, the location to orient you. We are.

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On the south side of maryland route, 26 just east of cleese mill, road.

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The owner and developer are still blast properties, llc and the engineer is vanmar.

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Associates which this ms schaefer miller indicated they are here today as well to answer questions.

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The zoning is c2 commercial, medium intensity. The property itself is 6.58 acres.

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This is in the freedom area, the priority funding area and in the growth area for freedom.

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And go to the next slide and zoom in so we are before you today with.

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Two actions that are required- one is approval of the plan pursuant to chapter 155.

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Development and subdivision of land and two approval of the site plan pursuant to chapter 156.

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Adequate public facilities and concurrency management as a residential site plan. This.

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Is subject to concurrency management as well, so there are two actions required.

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All right so you'll see the property right along 26.

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I'm trying to get my cursor to there we go. Thank you all right. It was created as lot 20 of the long.

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Range farms subdivision in 2017 and recorded on a record plot prior to that subdivision.

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The future lat 20 was rezoned from conservation to business, neighborhood residential bnr.

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And that had a unanimous approval of the rezoning request granted by the board of county commissioners on december 5th, 2013.

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In december of 2019, the county underwent a comprehensive rezoning for the commercial.

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And industrial zone properties at that point in time december 2019 the zoning was adjusted.

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To the current c2 designation, bnr is no longer a zoning district all right, so the adjacent property.

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To the west is zone c2 and is vacant. There are several businesses on c2 zone properties between.

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The subject: property and the intersection of old liberty, maryland route, 26 and cleese mill, road.

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So if I go back, you'll see the zoning all the red are the c2 zoning district that I'm referring to.

A

Laura, could you blow that up a little bit so that we can? I wish I could I'm not sure that I can.

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Oh, I guess you can that's about as far as it wants to go. That's okay! So here's.

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The subject property and then you'll, see across the street and adjoining to the west properties.

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Good, yes, thank you. Welcome.

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The property to the north, which is across liberty, road, is also zone, c2, which you just saw.

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And there is an approved site development plan for a retirement community on that property called 44.

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Liberty, road, it was approved by the planning and zoning commission on april 20th, 2021.

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Immediately to the south and east, could you point that out on the map with your cursor.

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Please, where that, yes, the property is here. Okay, and what did you say it was going to be.

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It's a retirement community.

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Okay, thanks: okay, the property to.

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Lost my cursor again, the property immediately to the south and east. These are actually adjoined.

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Right here so to the south and east of the subject, property, they are zoned conservation.

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This is lot 19a of long reach, farms part of that subdivision. The southern adjoining portion of lot.

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19A is extensively covered with environmental easements, and the eastern portion is undeveloped.

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The property itself is open. Land you'll see with a downward slope towards the south.

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East, the property just to note it does not have any frontage onto ronda road.

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Here: okay, that lot 19a lies between lot 20 and ronda road. The 2020 spring amendment cycle to the.

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Carroll, county water and sewer master plan added this subject: property to the existing service.

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Area for both water and sewer services, so right now it does have that designation of existing.

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Okay, some photos of the site.

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And one more, this is behind all the way back on ronda road. Looking all the way up to liberty, road.

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I apologize I'm not sure if I click this x, I might be able to get rid of this yay perfect. Okay,.

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So the plan proposed the concept site plan was subject to citizen involvement in august.

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Of 2020 at our technical review committee meeting there were 10 citizens who attended that meeting.

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And the concerns that were posed were regarding traffic, pedestrian traffic to century high school.

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Lighting on the site, pole and headlight, trespass onto adjoining properties, noise associated with.

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Dumpsters and storm water runoff from the site, as well as a general concern of property values.

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The planning commission saw the concept plan for informational purposes on september 21st 2021.

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As a concept plan, there is neither an approval or a denial, it is for informational purposes.

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Discussion at that meeting revolved around the proposed mix use on this site.

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The traffic, the site layout and sidewalk connectivity.

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Plan modifications between the concept plan when the planning commission first saw it and the final.

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Final phase included extension of the sidewalk all the way to the eastern property line.

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To that adjoining vacant property.

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And some reduced landscaping, plantings that were above and beyond the requirements and.

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Those plantings were proposed here and that was reduced at the final plant stage, so the owner of.

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The property proposes to develop it with a two building: two-story planned commercial center.

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The commercial space is on the ground floor and a total of 34 residential units.

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On the second floor, each at approximately 904 square feet, as indicated on the plan.

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Planned commercial centers are defined in chapter 158.

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Zoning code and are a principal permitted use in the c2 zoning district.

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Subject to regulations in chapter 155 0.094 the section is planned commercial centers.

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That section is included in the staff report and it was discussed at the concept review as well.

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So the two buildings of two stories are.

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39 foot two and three quarter inches in height, as indicated on the building elevation sheet.

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They are proposed on the site to be approximately 70 feet from the south property line.

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Each building is 15 600 square feet per floor and, as I said, 34 residential units at the second floor.

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In accordance with the code, the unit size shall be no less than 600 square feet. No.

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More than 1 000 square feet and each unit is stated to be approximately 904 square feet.

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Based on the trip generation numbers, a traffic study was required.

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The proposed site, access and all off-site intersections will operate at an adequate.

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Level of service, the study was reviewed by both the county and the state highway.

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Administration, we are, of course, on maryland, 26 state highway, road, no traffic mitigation.

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Measures are required as a result of the traffic impact study. However, there are.

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Coordinated improvements.

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Right in front of the development which are coordinated with the 44 liberty project across the.

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Street so state highway reviewed and has approved this. Those include a six foot wide bicycle lane.

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As part of the access improvements, a deceleration right turn lane into this property an acceleration.

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Lane as well and a dedicated left turn lane for maryland route 26 for westbound traffic.

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So those improvements will occur in conjunction with both projects happening right here.

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There is a single full movement entrance from maryland 26 proposed into the site.

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You enter into immediately into the parking lot one parking lot and the drive aisle does.

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Circumvent the site providing access to the rear of the building as well. So you.

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Can fully come all the way around the building? There is a dumpster provided at each building.

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In regards to parking requirements, chapter 155 for planned commercial centers does require.

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5.5 spaces for every 1, 000 square feet of floor area so based on the use, 172 parking.

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Spaces are required, 203 spaces are provided, which is 31 spaces more than what is required.

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Site amenities include, sidewalk, bicycle racks and a possible transit stop.

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You'll find sidewalk coming from building one heading north to route 26 and where there's a.

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Possible transit stop located and sidewalk all the way across the frontage to the eastern property.

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Line as well as connecting and wrapping down to the other building on this side, there's a.

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Photometric plan in the plan set, which says 25 foot high light poles with full cutoff fixtures.

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Lighting levels are zero at the western property line.

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At the southeast and western property lines, no signage is proposed for the project. At this time,.

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Connection to the public sewer system is a cure occurring on the century. High school property.

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Across the street, across liberty, road they do have. The developer has an agreement in place already.

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With the board of education and there will be an easement established, the waterline.

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Connection is proposed to connect at linton road. The bureau of utilities has approved this plan.

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Emergency services, fire and emergency services come in that the building must be sprinklered and.

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Fire hydrants are proposed on site. Additionally, the developers are required to place hydrants.

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At approximately 500 to 600 foot intervals along the water line, extension to linton road.

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The department of planning recommended the.

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A discussion with the department of public works regarding that transit. Stop.

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Building elevations are provided in the plan set as well. Materials noted are white, brick and sand.

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Colored ethis units are shown with balconies and the buildings are connected at the second floor.

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Stormwater management for the project will be achieved with microbiofitan retention facility.

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Bioswales and permeable pavers there is a storm drain, pipe system which will outfall.

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To the southern adjoining property, which has extensive environmental easements and is under.

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The same ownership as lot 20., so that lot 19a that we talked about at the beginning with the.

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Environmental easements, these stormwater facilities will be privately maintained.

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The proposal is exempt from floodplain code.

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Water resources grading have approved the plan. The required landscaping includes parking lot.

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Landscaping going back parking lot, landscaping, screening at liberty, road and screening at the.

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Dumpsters there is additional landscaping proposed parallel to the southern property line and along.

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Part of the western property line that is above and beyond requirements in the landscape manual.

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And forest conservation requirements were previously addressed when they came through.

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With the plan of subdivision, so all agencies have approved the plan and pursuant to chapter 155,.

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Staff recommends approval of the site development plan subject to seven conditions outlined in the.

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Staff report number one: the developer enters into a public works agreement with carroll county that.

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Guarantees: completion of the improvements number two that utility easements be granted.

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To the county commissioners of carroll county and recorded simultaneously with the public.

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Works agreement number three that the sewer easement on the century: high school property.

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Be granted to the county commissioners prior to or simultaneously with the public works.

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Agreement did a storm water management, easement and maintenance agreement be granted to the county.

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Commissioners of carroll county as an easement of access to the commissioners or authorized.

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Representatives by a deed to be recorded simultaneously with the public works agreement.

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Number: five: a landscape maintenance agreement be granted to the county.

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Commissioners of carroll county and recorded simultaneously with the public works agreement.

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Number: six: a public access easement over the extents of sidewalk that parallels route 26.

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Be granted to the county commissioners of carroll county and recorded simultaneously.

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With the public works agreement and number seven, of course, any changes to this plan will require.

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An amended site development plan to be approved by the carroll county planning and zoning commission.

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In regards to chapter 156, as I stated, this is subject to concurrency management for the as a.

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Residential site plan staff does recommend that the planning commission approve the final plan.

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As follows: number one police, schools, fire and emergency services, water and sewer services and.

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Roads are considered adequate number two that a building permit be issued for the site plan.

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Before it becomes void, which is within 18 months of the date of written approval, number three, the.

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Building permit reservations are for 25 units for fiscal year, 23 and 9 units for fiscal year. 24.

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As a reminder, they are limited to 25 building permits per fiscal year.

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Number four: the building permit reservations are allowed to roll over year after year.

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Until the sunset provision takes effect and the plan becomes void,.

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That concludes my report. If you have any questions for me,.

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I am happy to answer them board members questions.

A

Geez don't mind dealing with questions. How many residents will there be.

A

In the well at this location there are 34 units 34 units and how was the density determined.

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So the planned commercial center section of the code 155094.

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Under accessory uses, it indicates that the planning commission may allow residential uses.

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As an accessory used to a plain commercial center, and then it gives.

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Size, as stated in the report, must be between 600 square feet and a thousand square feet.

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And the area of the residential unit shall not exceed 50 percent of the total area of the.

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Structures within the planned commercial center- okay, that's that's about the extent of the correct.

A

Me if I'm wrong, the the old rules were that the density was determined by the bza and then it.

A

Went back to the planning commission would that be. This is true for assisted living facilities. Okay,.

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And this is, is this an age restricted? It is not. It is not. Okay,.

A

Does the final plan that was turned down by the planning commission.

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Reflect the changes that were recommended.

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At the conclusion of the the presentation of the concept plan.

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Is my recollection that at the concept plan review, there was discussion of many.

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Elements as I noted, but there was no distinct direction. Specifics given to the developer.

A

So the concept plan and the final plan were identical or were there changes made between the.

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Concept and the final plan, I've actually included the concept plan in the slideshow, so I'll skip to.

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That, if you focus right here on the eastern property line, as I stated in my report, there.

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Was landscaping that was reduced and the extents of the sidewalk the sidewalk was lengthened all.

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The way to the eastern property line, which was not shown at concept, so I'm going to so we have.

A

So we got more sidewalk and less landscaping, more sidewalk, less landscaping, landscaping.

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Not being required so here's the concept plan that was seen by the planning commission, okay,.

A

And the photogenic plan met all county standards because we heard in the.

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Introduction of the file about the fear of uh light intrusion on neighboring properties.

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The photometric plan did meet yes. What we are looking for at the property lines correct.

A

That's all the questions. I have mrs wait. If nobody else has anything that I wanted to ask.

A

Okay, go ahead, mr dixon, you might clear something up for us. Okay, um I was trying to take notes and.

B

You said chapter 156 staff recommends approval. Did you say that correct and you also said.

B

Let's see all agencies approved the plan and staff recommended it with seven conditions.

B

Correct say that now just so I'm clear, so the county agency and staff recommended this.

B

Approval to the planning commission correct now. I know this is a de novo hearing today, but.

B

Is there anything written down as to why the planning commission denied this.

F

That would be in the meeting minutes as well as in watching the video of the planning commission.

F

Meeting I I believe that jim or stacey may speak to that. Mr allman, will you address that well.

E

Yes, there are uh the minutes from the may meeting, in which the planning commission.

E

Denied uh the approval of this plan, however, just procedurally, this is a de novo hearing.

E

So we sort of act like that, never happened and that we are now in front of you who have stepped.

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Into the shoes of the planning commission to uh to review the plan just like they did in may, okay.

A

That answer your question: that was my big question: follow-up to that, is it your understanding.

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That the seven conditions were going to be met by the developer. Absolutely thank you.

A

That's four-minute, you good, mr simmons.

A

Okay, very good. Thank you. May I ask miss mathias just one quick question. Yes, thank you.

D

Miss mathias, if you recall, I know it's been some time since these plans were submitted.

D

But prior to the concept presentation, was there an additional building shown.

D

On this plan as well- yes, there was: is it your understanding that.

D

That is part of the reason that additional landscaping at that time had been provided.

D

To accommodate an additional building, if you don't, I understand it's been several years now so.

F

So the concept plan that the planning commission saw was already reduced to the two buildings, um so.

F

That I would have to go back even further to see what the plan looked like when there was a third.

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Building perpendicular to 26 on the eastern side of the property initially, but I am unaware of what.

F

The landscape big look like in conjunction with that understood. Thank you very much.

A

Okay, any other questions. Are you going to remain here for the rest of the hearing? I hope.

D

Is that a request? Thank you. Thanks, matthias you're welcome.

E

Mr allman, that's uh all I have mr chair. Okay, very good ms miller.

D

Thank you, mr chair. um I would like to first call mr ron thompson.

D

Wherever you're comfortable.

D

So, from a procedural standpoint, what I have done- and I've spoken with mr allman about this and he.

D

Does not have an objection, I believe is. I have prepared everything that I intend to.

D

Present to you in essentially one packet with um with page numbers on it, so I am going to.

D

Ask I'm that that be entered as applicants exhibit one, although I can ask at the conclusion of the.

D

Testimony if you prefer, but I will provide copies to everyone and then as we proceed throughout, we.

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Will reference uh the pages of that document? I have. I have no objection to that methodology.

D

Here's some copies for us too,.

D

D

Mr thompson, can you please introduce yourself stating your name spelling your last name and your.

D

Address please ronald ronald thompson: t-h-o-m-p s-o-n I live at 5-9-0-1. O'shanta drive mount airy.

H

Maryland mr thompson, where do you work presently, banmar associates a civil site, engineering company.

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In mount airy maryland, and can you briefly describe your educational and professional.

D

Background, I have a bachelor of science. Civil engineering in 1976 from iowa state university.

H

And a master of engineering, civil engineering 1978 from the pennsylvania state university.

D

How long have you worked in carroll county over 16 years? Are you familiar with carroll county and its.

D

Code, yes, have you testified before this board and or other bodies in the county as an expert.

H

Yes, in front of this board, as well as the mount airy board of zoning appeals and the howard county.

H

Zoning appeal commission, mr thompson, I'm showing you what has been marked as applicants exhibit.

D

1 page 7 of that document is that a copy of your current resume. It is.

D

I would like to offer mr thompson as an expert in the area of engineering and site design for.

D

Purposes of today's hearing, we will accept him as an expert witness in those fields. Thank you.

D

Mr thompson, you heard miss matthias, says well actually I'll ask you, were you present and did.

D

You hear all all of the testimony presented here today so far I did was miss matthias's.

D

Presentation of the location of the site, correct correct: were you hired to prepare the site plan.

D

For this property, yes, did you prepare what has been presented as s? Twenty zero zero one, zero.

I

Yes and approximately, when did you make the first submittal of that site plan.

H

July 2020, can you explain the request that was made at that point in time? Just briefly,.

H

The initial site plan contained three buildings consisting of commercial space with residential.

H

Apartments above the commercial space, this was reduced to two buildings because of the water.

H

Sewer allocation for the site and what is the zoning of the subject? Site? C2, commercial, medium.

H

Intensity district is it accurate that the intended use was a planned commercial center.

D

Correct planned commercial center with commercial space on the first floor.

H

Residential apartments on the second floor, so that has been the proposal since day. One of the.

D

Site plan is that accurate, correct? Is it to your understanding? Is a planned commercial center, a.

D

Principal permitted use in the c2 district, yes per section: 155 0.094, the carroll county code.

D

To your knowledge, did this site plan proceed through the ordinary county review process.

I

Yes, and can you just well, I get I mean mrs matthias already testified to this, but can you.

D

Explain what um arm of the county leads that submittal process development review.

H

Okay and I'm going to direct you to.

D

Page 8 of this packet is this that what well read to us the title of this page.

H

Site development plan review, transmittal, okay,.

D

Does this show what the agencies that the plans are distributed to during the site plan process.

D

Yes, to the best of your knowledge, were these plans distributed to all relevant agencies? Yes,.

D

I'm I'm switching to page nine of this packet. Mr thompson. Is this an overview of the review process.

D

For a site plan, yes- and you heard mrs matthias speak to this- but is it in fact accurate that.

D

There's both a concept level review by planning, commission and then a final review by planning.

D

Commission correct after the initial submission process begins with a technical review committee.

H

By the county, where all agencies provide their initial comments, those comments are responded.

H

To and including any adjustments to the site plan based upon county comments, there can be and were.

H

Numerous submissions, particularly for storm water management, until each agency provides approval a.

H

Concept: site plan following concept, site plan approval and after initial planning, commission.

H

Review additional submissions are made until all agencies have approved the site plan to allow.

H

The site plan to be presented to the planning commission for final site plan approval so is.

D

It accurate that this plan was presented before planning commission in the ordinary process. Yes,.

D

You saw mrs matthias, I think it's still up on the screen there. What was presented is that the.

D

Is that a depiction of the concept plan that was presented to planning commission.

J

Correct approximately, when was that presentation september 21 2021 between.

D

That plan and what was ultimately presented to planning commission for final approval.

D

Were the did the plan configuration change greatly? No at the time of presenting this concept.

D

Plan to the planning commission had the plan received all concept level agency approvals. Yes,.

D

After the concept review by planning commission, were there.

D

Additional submittals prior to reaching final approval through all agencies.

H

Yes, there were approximately 10 submissions addressing approximately 13 comment, letters.

H

From the board of utilities, county agencies and state highway administration.

D

At the time that the plan arrived to planning commission for a final requesting final site plan,.

D

Approval did the plan meet all of the final site plan requirements. Yes, I am turning you to page.

D

10 here of the packet, can you just briefly describe what that is page 10 of the plaque? uh The.

H

Packet is the site plan uh requirements checklist that we are required to include and follow in all.

H

Site plans, including what the title block looks like the required general notes for a site plan.

D

Approximately, when did this plan come before planning commission requesting final approval.

H

May 17 2022. and at that time did the plan have all agency approvals. Yes,.

D

Is it true that one of those approvals was sha state, I'm sorry state highway.

D

Administration, correct: I will refer you as sha. Yes,.

D

Through the review process, was it your outfit or another that prepared and and.

D

Went through the review process for the for a trafficked impact study, another traffic concepts.

D

Is it true that your agency, you yourself.

D

Communicated with sha regarding the site, access aspect of this development after state highway.

H

It approved the traffic study. We then prepared the state highway improvement plans working with sha.

D

I'm going to turn you to page 15 and I apologize as part of this packet anytime, that there was a.

D

Plan the page numbers appeared very small and in the upper right corner.

D

But I'm going to turn you to page 15 of this packet.

D

Mr thompson is this the plan that you just referenced? Yes, are these all.

D

Improvements that have been agreed to and negotiated with sha as part of the review process.

H

Correct state highway required traffic improvements to mitigate impacts to traffic.

H

On route 26, and to provide safe, ingress and egress from the site, and that was related to the access.

D

Of the site, and not to the results of the traffic to impact study, is that an accurate statement? Yes,.

K

H

The improvements followed the traffic impact study and then, as we move through the process,.

H

State highway modified a little of the striping to coordinate with the.

H

Site improvements of 44 liberty road, so that there was one.

H

Set of transportation improvements through that section of route, 26.

D

During miss mattias's testimony, you heard her speak to um the specific.

D

Improvements uh that are shown on this plan.

D

Do you recall that, yes, okay, were those accurately stated? Yes, okay, so those are all shown.

D

As part of this plan, that's included in exhibit one. Is that correct, correct.

D

I'm going to jump ahead here a little bit because miss matthias already answered some of these.

D

Questions but um in your expert opinion, does the most recently submitted site plan for this project.

D

Meet all relevant requirements. Yes, in your expert opinion, is there any justification.

D

Under the code to deny this site plan no throughout the site plan process, you.

D

Heard miss matias speak to community citizen involvement. Was that an accurate depiction? Yes,.

D

Those are my only questions of mr thompson at this time.

A

Board members questions of mr thompson's testimony.

A

Does anyone I did this backwards? Anyone from the public have any questions of mr thompson's.

A

Testimony go to the microphone. Please state your name address and occupation and spell for the.

A

Record your last name and and again you'll have the opportunity for your own testimony. These are.

A

Questions of his testimony to this point: okay, my name is bill. Mccormick.

L

Okay, get a little bit closer to microphone. My name is bill. Mccormick, mac, m-a-c-c-o-r-m-a-c-k.

L

I'm a cyber security engineer. My address is 5685 ronda road eldersburg maryland.

L

Okay, my first question is sorry. My first question is: how old are the traffic studies that are being referenced.

A

Can you speak up a little bit more? How old, how old are the traffic studies being referenced? I I don't.

D

Object to mr thompson stating this, but just so mr mccormick also understands I will be calling.

D

Mr keely, who actually prepared the traffic study, so it's.

D

He may be better suited to answer that question. If mr thompson has the answer.

D

I have no problem with him stating that the study is dated october 20 2020, but I believe.

H

The traffic engineer can provide all of the specifics.

H

In terms of presentation and questions on the traffic study.

L

In your experience, is it common to use traffic studies that are just this outdated.

H

This study is not outdated. This study was done at the beginning of this of the site plan process.

L

Did the study take into account the newly developed property directly across the street.

H

I will defer to the traffic engineer to answer the specifics of the traffic study.

L

And I actually have two questions for miss matthias.

L

Should I wait for to address those later or would you like me to ask those now.

L

Seeing as she already testified, I'd just like to make sure that let's go ahead and let's clean.

A

That up and and uh we'll let mrs matthias answer those questions. Ms mathias, could you.

A

See I knew it was a reason I didn't want you to leave the room. Thank you. I appreciate that.

L

When was the first preliminary site planned with three buildings.

L

Submitted to the county and accepted I would have to refer to the file. I don't.

F

Have that answer off the top of my head, but it is right here if you'd like me, to look.

A

I would like, could you do that? I mean.

D

D

I'm not sure if it would satisfy mr mccormick, but we do have the answer to that question.

D

If mr thompson could speak to that, mr thompson, can you our first submittal is july 2020.

A

July 2020 correct that may be his first submittal, but um I'm just making sure.

L

That there was not a submittal prior in the prior year, maybe in october.

F

The initial submittal was received july 2, 10 2020.

A

Just to be clear, that was the plan that had that showed the three buildings. And yes, there are three.

F

Buildings shown on this plan: okay, correct, okay, um so I'm fairly certain. I would need to go back and.

L

Verify that there was a plan submitted prior to the board of county commissioners. Voting on the.

L

Commercial, comprehensive resulting and that, when the very first plan for this property.

L

Was submitted, the zoning on this property was still bnr so that that's just how I would like.

L

To address that, so, if there's any way that that you guys can verify that that was actually the.

L

Very first submittal. I would appreciate that and those are all the questions I have for.

L

These two people. Thank you, okay, very good. Do you miss mathias? Do you want to address that.

F

Other than this property going through that plan of subdivision, which I mentioned.

F

I do not recall a prior site development plan which.

F

Was being processed through the bureau of development review? Okay,.

A

Okay, very, very good. Does anyone else have questions of.

A

Either ms matthias or mr thompson's testimony.

A

Okay, very good, I'm going to call your next witness. Yes can I can I ask that that development.

D

Sorry, can I ask that the development review file be included as one of the exhibits or as the record in this case.

A

Without without objection you don't you don't object, no objection. Okay, we will go ahead and.

A

Include that how would you like that labeled, we can exhibit too, I believe, makes sense. Sure, okay,.

A

We will accept that into evidence. Thank you.

D

I would call mr mark keeley.

D

Mr kearley keeley, can you please introduce yourself stating your name spelling your last.

D

Name and your address for the record yes good morning board, my name is mark keely k-e-e-l-e-y.

M

I work for traffic concepts incorporated. My address is 7525.

M

Connolly drive sweet b hanover maryland two one: zero, seven, six.

D

Mr keeley, can you please briefly describe your educational and professional background to the.

D

Board, yes, I have a bachelor's degree from salisbury university and master's degree.

M

In planning from towson university, I'm a former member of the american association of certified.

M

Planners and I'm a current member of the ide ite professional transportation certification program.

M

I've been writing developing traffic studies for 25 29 years in harford county queen.

M

Anne's county and for the last 17 years I've been a project manager for traffic concepts.

D

Do you have experience working in carroll county? Yes, I've um over my 17 years, I've done.

M

Many many traffic impact studies. The last time I appeared before the planning commission was for.

M

Freedom's grant project and I have several projects that are in the.

M

Process right now, are you familiar with the county and its code and requirements? Yes,.

D

Have you ever testified in front of this board or other bodies as an expert? Yes, I have, can you.

D

Briefly describe that, as I said the last time I presented my traffic study, was the freedoms grant.

M

Age, restricted development near raincliff road, mr keeley, I'm showing you page 36.

D

Of applicants or appellants, if you will exhibit one, is that a recent copy of your resume. It is yes.

D

I would like to offer mr keely as an expert in the area of traffic engineering, and we will accept.

A

Him as an expert witness in that area, thank you, mr keely. Can you uh briefly describe your involvement.

D

In this project, when you began that involvement and the review process that you went through, yes.

M

So I started the process with the county in august of 2020 august 25th 2020, I received the final.

M

Scoping agreement from the county for the traffic impact study that outlines that the study limits.

M

And then, in october 2020 I completed my traffic impact study and submitted it to the county.

M

And to the state highway administration go back for us and just explain the the point.

D

Of the scoping letter and what that then allows you to do so, the purpose of the scoping letter.

M

Identifies the intersections that we are to study, it identifies the time periods weekday saturday.

M

Weekdays: six to nine am 3 p.m, to 7 p.m, and 10 p.m, to 3 p.m. On saturday,.

M

It provides information about the background developments to be included in the study growth.

M

Rates to be included in the study and discusses trip generation, then the letter also discusses.

M

The standards that the study is to meet in terms of intersection levels of service- and that is a.

D

Letter that is generated by whom it's generated by um carroll county and then that is the basis.

D

For your preparation of a trafficked impact study is that accurate? Yes, okay, now this property fronts.

D

On maryland route, 26, which is a state highway- is that accurate? Yes, so, throughout this process,.

D

um Was sha also involved in the review of any trafficked impact study? Yes, they were, and I mean.

D

I guess it goes to background of all of this, but obviously the impetus for this is that the county.

D

Required a traffic impact study as part of its site plan review process. Is that accurate? Yes, okay,.

D

Now I am going to show you, mr allman. Has his nice copy what I've marked as appellants exhibit three.

D

Can you just tell us what this is please? This is a very lengthy copy, so I only make one of these.

M

Yes, this is this. Is the traffic study that I wrote with my colleagues at traffic concepts. It's dated.

M

October 2020., okay, and was this the trafficked impact study that was submitted and reviewed.

D

Through the county and the state during the site plan? Yes, okay, what was the outcome.

D

Of that review process, so the outcome of the study was the finding was that the key intersections.

M

Identified in the study um operated at levels of service d or better so did it or did it not.

D

Show that the intersections meet the county code and the county requirements. It did yes,.

D

Did as a result of the review of this traffic impact study, did you receive a.

D

Final approval, letters from the county and sha regarding the traffic study. Yes, I did.

D

Now you spoke to the fact that the trap that the scoping letter.

D

Lays out some of the background information that's to be included in that in the traffic.

D

Study, ultimately, can you just explain what background development means and.

D

What was taken into consideration as part of this trafficked impact study, sure background includes.

M

Two two different things: one is a growth rate. The growth rate was determined by.

M

State highway travel forecasting and the travel forecasting, division, determined a growth rate.

M

Of 1.3 percent along maryland, 26 and that was applied throughout the.

M

Project's growth build-out period. The other item that we include in background are developments.

M

That have received preliminary plan approval but are not completed yet or not fully built.

M

We included the 44 liberty, road background development, that's opposite of our.

M

Site that was an age-restricted development with 54 townhouse units.

D

So is this information that you also receive through the county and that.

D

The county provides you some information on development. That's in the pipeline that then.

D

Gets factored into this sort of study correct, so the county provides us. The pipeline developments.

M

To include in the study in your expert opinion, does this plan uh meet all traffic.

D

Requirements of the county and state yes, it does. Those are my only questions for mr keely.

A

Case anyone from the public have any questions of mr keeley's. Testimony.

L

You need me to state my name again and all that jazz, please uh bill mccormick, m-a-c-c-o-r-m-a-c-k.

L

5685 ronda road eldersburg maryland.

L

So I I already asked this, but I'd like to get your answer as well. How old are the traffic.

L

Studies that were used in this development, it's dated october 2020 october 2020.,.

L

Again, I would like to ask so I think two-year-old traffic studies are fairly old.

L

But is it common to use traffic studies that are that? Are this dated again the.

M

Traffic study is not dated. It was submitted with the the official development package.

M

At the time we made our initial submission to the state highway and to the county.

L

What are the factors that were adjusted to accommodate the covet-based lockdowns in one.

L

Of these traffic studies, so the traffic counts, the approved counts that we included in the study were.

M

2018. those counts were approved by the county and state highway administration.

M

A growth rate of 1.3 percent was applied to the 2018 counts.

M

For two year period to bring them to the 2020 baseline condition, uh the saturday counts were.

M

Counted in 2020 and the covid, the approved covid growth rate approved by the county and the state.

M

Was five percent, so five percent was added to the 2020 saturday volumes.

L

What information did you use to calculate that five percent that was determined.

M

By the state, highway travel forecasting division, so forecasting estimates. Yes, sir.

L

uh Why were true traffic studies used to address this development instead of one.

A

um I didn't hear that question: why were two traffic studies.

A

Okay, gotcha, I submitted one traffic again, I believe the only testimony that's been.

D

Presented is that there's one trafficked impact study, uh miss matius could answer this, uh but her.

L

In her letters to me and to the community, she stated that there were two traffic studies used.

L

And presented for this development presented to the county for this development.

L

One for daytime count, numbers and one for weekend count numbers.

M

So if I can answer my study as according to the scope of services, we study the weekday.

M

Am and pm peak hour conditions, and then we also study because it includes a commercial.

M

Component to the development we study the saturday peak hour, which, as I stated, was between 10.

M

And 3 p.m so somewhere and there's the peak saturday. So so it's one study with it's.

A

One study with two different time frames: yes, sir, as a result of it being a commercial um use. Yes,.

A

Okay, does that answer your question it does? It just creates a little bit of confusion as to why.

L

The public was told that two traffic studies were used. um That's all the questions I have thank you.

A

Board members, any questions of mr keeley's testimony.

A

Thank you. Thank you.

A

At this point, let's go ahead and take about a five minute break. Thank you.

A

We call the bza hearing back to order. Ms schaefer, you want to call.

A

Another witness yes, thank you. I would like to call mr joe rudder.

D

Mr rutter, can you please introduce yourself uh stating your name and address for the record.

N

Yes, joseph roger r-u-t-t-e-r, 3435 jennings chapel road woodbine before I start with his testimony.

D

It just occurs to me. I wanted to ensure that I asked that um appellants exhibit two. The tr.

D

Sorry three, the traffic impact study be entered. I don't know whether we did or not, but we will.

A

Accept that into evidence. Thank you, mr rutter. Where do you presently work? uh I have my own.

N

uh Limited liability corporation jwr llc and I'm the sole managing member. Can you please.

D

Describe your professional certifications, yes, unlike engineers planners, are not certified at.

N

The state level licensed at the state level, but there's the american planning association that.

N

Evaluates education, experience and a comprehensive exam, and if you can qualify.

N

Become american institute of certified planners and that's a nationally recognized certification.

N

It also requires ongoing training uh every year, coursework that has to be taken to maintain ac.

N

Aicp status and I've maintained that since 1978., you please summarize your professional experience.

D

In the industry, yes, I started a professional as a engineering technician at state highway.

N

Administration, highway design soon after that moved to howard county office of planning.

N

And zoning in 1966, where I served in numerous positions, I won't go through all the details, but.

N

um Eventually, deputy director for three years and then director for 12 years at that point, I retired.

N

Solicited to come to anne arundel county and served there as the planning and zoning office.

N

For four years and after that um retired again and went in the private sector of doing the.

N

Consulting work, uh hopefully on a part-time basis, are you familiar and have you worked.

D

In carroll county before um I I've worked on cases, I have not been before this board.

N

In carroll county, but I have a long history with the county. My first house.

N

It was 1969, I bought a house right on london bridge road at cherry tree, so it's just east of.

N

The subject property, I moved there and raised the family there and lived in carroll county and was.

N

Very active in carroll, county politics and school system in the in the 70s and 80s as part of my.

N

Appointment as deputy director, it was an appointed position in howard. I had to move to howard county.

N

So I moved to woodbine, where, from I was in the howard county side,.

N

But I could see the tank farm from my front yard, so I stayed as close as I possibly could.

N

And so I've been more recently, I've worked with a couple of properties that were.

N

Involved in the freedom area comprehensive plan advising them on what the land use issues would be.

N

In the process, and also worked with a client here in westminster, just outside just on the edge of.

N

Westminster off of 140., are you uh familiar with the carroll county code and the master.

D

Plan and the freedom area specifically plan. Yes, I'm familiar with both the development codes and.

N

I, as I said, work with some owners on the freedom plan. Have you ever testified as an expert before.

D

Yes, I've been accepted as an expert in howard, county anne arundel county, prince george's county.

N

Circuit court and administrative hearing officer for the state, mr rutter, I'm I'm showing you on.

D

Page 38 of appellants exhibit one. Is that a copy of your resume? Yes, it is. I would like to offer mr.

D

Rutter as an expert in the area of planning, land use and zoning, and we will accept him.

A

As an expert witness in those fields based upon his testimony and also what's uh the resumes that.

A

Were submitted, thank you, mr rutter. Is it accurate to state that you were hired by mr stavlos in.

D

Anticipation of this bzi hearing- yes, I was hired in early june, just after the planning commission.

N

Meeting okay, can you just describe what you did um uh what you looked at to begin your analysis.

N

Yes, I reviewed the site plan, the zoning subdivision code, the county master plans.

N

Particularly the freedom master plan and then the implementing comprehensive zoning.

N

That came after the freedom plan where they got rid of the bnr, changed it to c2. So, prior to your.

D

Involvement in this case, were you familiar with the carroll county master plan and or the freedom.

D

Community comprehensive plan, yes both and, as I said, I've worked with clients both in the freedom.

N

Area in the westminster area, which is outside of the town but needed to know what the master.

N

The county, cam master plan called for along that section of 140.. Okay in preparing for this case.

D

Did you have the opportunity to review uh planning, comment letters that were that were part of.

D

The development review and site plan file for this. Yes, okay, I am you're you're, looking at page 42.

D

Of appellants exhibit one, can you just briefly summarize this letter? Yes, I think um it.

N

Starts with the important part justin come to a conclu. It comes to a conclusion up front that I.

N

Totally agree with it says the above reference development proposal has been reviewed for.

N

Consistency with the policies and recommendations contained in the carroll county master plan.

N

The carroll county master plan for water and sewerage and other area plans which would in this.

N

Case be freedom and functional plans, water and sewer, applicable policies and recommendation and.

N

Sites that are related to land use, land, major streets, community facilities, agricultural.

N

And historic don't really apply and then leads to a conclusion that.

N

The site development plan complies with all of those requirements.

D

In your expert opinion, what is the relevant master plan for this property freedom.

D

You just said it briefly, but I'll draw your attention to it again in.

D

Your expert opinion: do you agree with this letter from the department of planning? Yes,.

D

Are you aware that the planning commission, as part of its role, is tasked with reviewing.

D

A plan's consistency with the master plan, yes and your expert opinion is this plan or this site plan.

D

I should be uh specific: is the site plan, that's before the board today, um consistent with the 2018.

D

Freedom, community comprehensive plan and, to the extent applicable the 2014 um county master plan.

N

uh Yes- and I think it's important to go back in some of the history um and briefly before.

D

You start that I just want to say that the freedom community, the 2018 freedom, community, comprehensive.

D

Plan and the 2014 county master plan. I would like to ask that to the extent mr rutter references.

D

Those that those be taken that the board takes judicial notice of those two master plans as their.

D

County documents. Thank you. Okay, if I can briefly go over the history of planning with.

N

This particular area, the corner of cleese mill road in 26, was first designated for commercial.

N

Industrial and then 1964 master plan, the 2000 master plan again designated this area as covered.

N

So and revisited earlier, land use decisions that, and I want to put into the record the.

N

2000 master plan, state 2000 master plan, stated recognizing the traditional challenges posed by.

N

Residential and commercial development and their respective demands on a variety of public services.

N

The 2000 edition of the carroll county master plan contained herein essentially reaffirms.

N

Support for the basic premises, concept and development patterns chartered in in the 1964 plan.

N

Carol's and then it goes over the date, municipalities and and the.

N

Master plans for the eldersburg I mean for well. They called it eldersburg.

N

And finksburg at the time or continued in 2000 and then in 2014 master plan.

N

Now it has an important statement of today, unlike in 1964, it is increasingly difficult.

N

To balance the community's desire to maintain and even increase the quality of life with.

N

The pressures of development and developments demand on natural resources, public services and.

N

Infrastructure reaffirming the visions set forth in the 1964 and the 2000 master.

N

Master plan updates the 2014 carroll county master plan targets, the county's designated growth areas.

N

To receive the majority of development and, as we said before, this is in designated growth area.

N

Subject: property zone is designated as tier two, which is in conformance to the.

N

States state sustainable, sustainable growth act, it's included in the premium comprehensive plan.

N

And we would note that the original freedom plan was adopted in 1977 uh and then updated in 2001.

N

And then the other update started in 2007 and took until 2018 11 years in process, so the opportunity.

N

For public involvement and discussions of these plans has been pretty consistent from 1964 to.

N

Today that this area up near the intersection is appropriate for growth and development,.

D

Mr rutter, I am drawing your attention to page three of exhibit 1 here. Can you just tell us.

D

What that shows and what the land use designation is for the subject property. Yes, the actually, the.

N

Staff put this drawing up on the board earlier and it shows a mix of commercial, industrial and.

N

Residential at the cleese mill, 26 intersection south of the subject, property is where it gets.

N

Into the conservation area, which is appropriate because it's draining down towards the.

N

Pioneering reservoir but other than the high school, the the rest of the uh the areas is.

N

Primarily industrial and commercial, and what what is this from? I just want you to clarify what is.

D

This map, from that's the one from the freedom community master plan, I want to say page 74.,.

N

Oh, no, no you're! Better than that. You can cite the page number of the freedom plan.

D

But this is from the freedom plan. It is from the freedom plan. Yes, okay, and what.

D

Future land use designation. Does this provide for the subject property, commercial, commercial, medium.

D

And it's your expert opinion that that land use designation is consistent.

D

And that this plan, the freedom plan, is consistent with the the site plan that is before this board.

D

Today, that's correct: the site plan is consistent with the freedom plan. Yes, I'm sorry, I may have.

D

Reversed that thank you for correcting me. Those are my only questions of mr rutter.

A

Okay, does anyone in the audience have any questions of mr rutter's testimony mr mccormick.

L

Bill mccormick, macco cyber security engineer, 5685 ronda road.

L

Eldersburg maryland, am I speaking loud enough? Yes, okay, um were you present at any of the.

L

Community outreach meetings for commercial, comprehensive rezoning in carroll county no.

L

In your opinion, when rezoning takes place.

L

Is there any kind of standard with regards to the types of density and the surrounding areas.

L

For example, is it is it standard to have concentric circles of density, say high intensity.

L

In the middle medium intensity and the second ring and then lower intensity in the outer ring.

D

I'm going to object to that, mr rutter's. Testimony was specific to the site plan.

D

And its conformance with any of the master plans, not about the history of the rezoning. In terms of.

D

Why this property got zoned the way it was. This property is zoned. We are here today requesting.

D

Site plan approval we're not revisiting the rezoning issue, he's been accepted as an expert.

A

Yes, but mr mccormick, the the relevance to the approver or disapproval of the site plan is what.

A

We're here today and just to let you know, I was on a planning commission that approved the 1997.

A

Or 2000 plan, so I'm very I'm very familiar with it. I could probably answer the question.

A

Better than he could, but I can't okay as chairman I understand so so I'm just saying I don't.

A

The relevance of that question uh to the to what we're what we're charged with here today, which is.

A

To to look at this site plan de novo, which was what we're doing.

A

I don't see the relevance of that okay. I appreciate that. Thank you.

A

Board members questions mr rutter's testimony.

A

Very good, thank you, ms miller. You're. Is this your final witness that is, I am concluded with.

D

Witnesses, but I do just want to procedurally make sure that applicants or appellants exhibit.

D

One is officially accepted and entered um as an exhibit, and then I believe that two.

D

Is the copy of the development review file and then three is the trafficked impact study.

D

I mean I was unclear if we ever entered one they're they're all in evidence. Okay,.

D

They're all in evidence, but are two and three okay. I just want to make sure the.

A

Two and three weren't you didn't, have those confused, but that was number two. Yes, okay,.

D

That concludes my testimony. Thank you very good.

A

Mr allman anything uh no, mr chairman, okay and and now at this point does anyone in the audience have.

A

Any testimony that they want to give and again testimony you don't have to ask you, don't have to.

A

Ask questions, although we do have enough expert witnesses here and staff, I think that we could.

A

Answer questions so please go to the microphone state, your name, your address occupation and.

A

Spell for the record your last name. All right name is robert weinreich w-e-I-n-r-e-I-c-h.

O

504 equus drive, psych seoul maryland and uh my occupation is retired.

O

uh I had a question first, uh this meeting has been described as de novo, I think, is the.

O

Word what does that mean? That means from the beginning? uh So so we're not looking at any.

A

We're looking at this as if we were acting in place of the planning commission.

O

Okay, uh I presented the same information at the earlier meeting and it was back in june.

O

I just wanted to reiterate my concerns about this particular location and what goes on.

O

This is a picture of the property, the commercial property immediately to the west of this proposed.

O

Thing get the name of this little development for years and years and years it was a derelict dirty.

O

Looking property but the sign blown out exposed, fluorescent light bulbs, some of.

O

Them flickering some of them out. They only had one consistent tenant there. That was a liquor store.

O

They had some temporary things, they had a baby consignment shop that came and went.

O

They had a nail salon that came and went and we would go into the liquor, store and.

O

We would complain about the appearance of this property and the guy there, who was the manager.

O

Said well, we've complained to the landlord, but we can't get him to do anything apparently he's not.

O

Making enough money off of this, because the property only had the one consistent tenant.

O

Finally, several years ago, maybe even four years ago, the liquor store moved out of here. They.

O

Moved catty corner across the intersection and then that other that was also a vacant property.

O

So now this property, whoever after they moved out whoever owned the property, whoever bought.

O

The property did a pretty nice job, giving the place a facelift and it looks pretty nice.

O

But it has been empty for at least the last four years, no occupants at all period.

O

This is the liberty square shopping center, which is caddy corner across that intersection.

O

On the intersection of please mill in liberty, road, it is half occupied of that and it's been that way.

O

For years, the campus that large campus just down the road on exchange drive, it's been there for.

O

A decade or more and it's still not completely leased out. This is a picture. Let me let me.

A

What what location was that? That's that campus, it's the large campus, it's called exchange drive.

A

um Is that the st john's property- yes, I don't know, might be okay, I'm getting head nods and.

A

A yes from up here, I just and I understand some of their tenants are moving out. I think.

O

uh The orthopedic people are moving out of there soon. This is the property down in.

O

Princess square shopping center, which is the same format as the ones being proposed here.

O

It appears to be two-thirds to three-quarters unoccupied and it's been there for quite a while.

O

Over one or two or three store fronts that are there, a couple of them have.

O

Their logos, stenciled on large pieces of white paper taped to the inside and.

O

Now, when I presented this information, a gentleman sitting here said: oh, that's, not correct.

O

They've got a hundred percent occupation with people waiting to get in there. All, I can say is if.

O

This property ends up looking like this people driving through my neighborhood, aren't going to.

O

Think, oh, that must be 100 rented they're going to be wondering what the heck is. All this empty.

O

Storefront stuff doing around this intersection, so I'm concerned that all these things don't have.

O

Tenants aren't making money and how long is it going to be before they look derelict and dirty.

O

And so I just don't see why what their expectations are. Is it's just one of these? Let's.

O

Build it and they will come kind of information things, but I'm concerned about what this place.

O

Is going to look like in a couple years when these people aren't making any money? Thank you.

A

Miss miller, would you like to respond, or do you have any of your? I have two follow-up questions.

D

For I believe mr weinrich, am I saying that craig mr weinreich justin in brief follow-up.

D

And I'm sorry that I have to face here to speak into the microphone. um But can you just briefly.

D

State any of the properties that you just spoke to do you own any of those properties? No, I do.

O

Not okay, so can you just describe to the board kind of your basis of knowledge for for saying.

D

Speaking to the vacancies, is that just observation have you spoken with someone.

O

Well, it's plain to see these properties are empty. I have the pictures of them here.

O

I've lived here since 1983, so I'm familiar with so it's fair to say that that's based on observation.

D

I'm sorry, I couldn't hear your question. It's is it fair to say that that is based on observation.

D

Yes, okay, thank you. Those are my only questions. How do you spell your last name, sir? W e, I n r e. I c h.

A

Got a mr dixon? Yes, okay, very good! Thank you.

A

um Mr mccormick.

L

Hi uh bill mccormick, m-a-c-c-o-r-m-a-c-k.

L

Cyber security engineer, 5685 rhonda road eldersburg, maryland.

L

uh So, just to um reference what I was talking about before there was a preliminary site plan.

L

Submitted and accepted to the county for this property received october 4th 2019.

L

That was prior to the rezoning that was prior to the board of county commissioners. Voting to rezone.

L

This property from bnr to c2, and that was from a pia request that I sent to the county back in 2019.

L

So, first, since this is a de novo hearing which I'll address in a second.

L

um I would like to pass out um the.

L

Letter that I wrote to the planning and zoning commission prior to the final site.

L

Plan meeting can I hand that to you guys, yes, you can.

A

Just one copy or mr dixon can go ahead and label that as evidence. Okay,.

A

Do you have more than one I do give enough for all of us or a couple a couple to share that would be.

I

Okay, go ahead and go ahead and give her one copy and we'll take four up here. Okay, thank you.

P

L

Sorry, I only brought five copies simon: that's, okay, a lot of resources! um So, as I stated.

L

My name is bill mccormick and I stated my address. I live on long reach, farms lot 18.

L

Which, if you've seen the map, is directly south east of the property in question. So, according.

L

To the appeal submitted to the county by the developer and his representative he's.

L

Appealing the ruling of the planning and zoning commission and their denial of the proposed plan.

L

um So, as far as this is a de novo hearing, um I realize this is a little bit late.

L

But I completely object to that. The original um letter to the bza stated that they were appealing.

L

Based on the idea that the planning and zoning commission made a mistake in their ruling that.

L

Is how I believe the bza should look at that only reference I saw to de novo in the code.

L

um It's in reference to granting of variants, so, according to 158.133 d8.

L

The bza may grant or deny a requested variance based on evidence before and after a de novo.

L

Hearing so I I assume that this is that de novo hearing. So what and what did you reference? I'm.

A

Sorry, I don't mean to interrupt you, I'm sorry yeah uh 158.133 d8. It should be d2. You may be correct.

L

Paragraph 8, subsection d.

L

The bca may grant or deny a requested variance based on evidence before.

L

And after a de novo hearing, given that this is that de novo hearing.

L

It only stands to reason that they're requesting a variance.

L

Which means that they're somewhat acknowledging that, as submitted their plan, does not meet code.

L

Or that the planning and zoning commission had the right afforded to them by the code to deny the.

L

Plan as submitted based on the letter of the code, I have some evidence given that you don't agree.

L

That this this should be denied outright. So the idea that this appeal should be heard de novo.

L

Like new on its marriotts on its merits, excuse me.

L

Kind of infuriates me because to date had things been decided on their merits, we would not be here.

L

The stack of misguided, misaligned and misdirected decisions that has taken place with regards to.

L

This property to date is quite large. uh Well, I would like to list every single one of them.

L

It's likely that this would be seen as an attack against the county employees.

L

The pending a zoning commission and those that represent us, and that is truly not my intent.

L

For that matter, I will do my best to keep my scope, narrow and focused on the question at hand. However,.

L

If you all have questions with regards to any of those questionable decisions in the past, I would.

L

Be more than happy to answer those so as stated the bza may grant or deny requests of variance.

L

Applying the same standards and criteria set forth in 158 133 g, which is effectively the section.

L

Of the code that deals with conditional uses, according to the code, the bza and I'm quoting here.

L

Shall study the specific property involved as well as the neighborhood, and consider all testimony and.

L

Data submitted so as a cyber security engineer, I kind of have experience, reading protocol standards.

L

In those standards there's there's language shall may should can all of those have specific meetings.

L

And I would like you to keep those meanings in mind. I understand that you all sometimes.

L

Have a difficult job, especially when it comes to dealing with the public, as well as the developers.

L

That you see regularly, but it's so important, that I hope that you all have considered all.

L

Testimony and data submitted, as there is no specific time limit applied to that requirement.

L

I would ask that you consider all testimony not only testimony that you hear today.

L

But also the testimony from past hearings, as well as the thoughts and concerns expressed by.

L

The planning and zoning commission during both the preliminary and final site plans that were.

L

Submitted by the developer, I would specifically ask that you note the numerous concerns raised.

L

By by the planning and zoning commission during the concept site review that were not addressed.

L

Or just outright ignored by the developer when they returned for the final site review.

L

I would also ask that you consider all data to include previous hearings.

L

Regarding the rezoning of this property, as well as changes to the county master plans,.

L

That were made to accommodate this developer, to the detriment.

L

Of residents who had much more pressing needs in the form of water and sewer upgrades and relief.

L

If you have reviewed previous data and hearings, it is likely that you've seen and heard me arguing.

L

About this for quite some time, and for that I I apologize, but this is really important to me.

L

However, there are also comments from other neighbors, as well as groups in our community.

L

Which are against this particular project.

L

There was an objection to the comments that were submitted.

L

To to the bza the written ones that were submitted via email, um I would like to note that nowhere.

L

In the code, does it state that those who submit comments need to be present for cross-examination.

L

As I've stated in the past, we're not against growth, it's expected, but in accordance with.

L

The vision for carroll county, the desire for smart, measured growth is paramount.

L

Prior to this hearing, we circulate circulated a letter in the community rebutting every single.

L

Argument in the developer's appeal, which is, I expect why this is now a de novo hearing.

L

We had close to 150, it was 139 signatures to be exact in agreement with our statements and against.

L

The project this was not some change.org position petition. This was a petition that we submitted.

L

Among our community to see if they would back us in what we submitted, so this wasn't some position.

L

That anybody on the internet could sign. This was people from our community.

L

Both the letter and the list of residents was emailed to the administrator, miss vance, who.

L

I would like to say has been extremely helpful in answering my questions.

L

And I hope that if you have not reviewed it, that you will take the time to read it.

L

Secondly, as noted, I hope that each of you have studied the surrounding neighborhood, specifically.

L

Those lots in areas that sit well below the proposed finish floor. Elevation of the project in.

L

Question I do know that a site visit was scheduled and I was present during the scheduled visit, but.

L

I do hope that each of you spent some time and did more than a cursory glance at the surrounding area.

L

There are a number of homes with small children, as well as a daycare within close proximity to the.

L

Proposed development, there is also a conservation and forest protection area that sits well below.

L

The proposed finished floor elevation of this project. There is more than one drainage concern.

L

Presented with the proposed project, even with the input from county sewer, water management.

L

To speak directly to the items listed in 158-133, the application shall not be approved where.

L

The bza finds the proposed use would adversely affect the public health safety security morals.

L

Or general welfare would result in dangerous trafficking conditions or would jeopardize.

L

The lives or property of people living in the neighborhood and there's that language again shall.

L

I I've listed in past letters to the pcc why this specific project should not be approved.

L

Based on any number of those items, the large number of empty commercial spaces will lead.

L

To blight, which will both increase crime and decrease property values for the surrounding area,.

L

The landscape design, as well as the site layout, leaves multiple areas open for possible nefarious.

L

Activity, increasing not only crime but leading to safety concerns for the surrounding community.

L

The traffic conditions on this stretch of road are already horrendous.

L

The frankenstein's monster traffic study does no justice to alleviating fears of not only traffic.

L

Becoming worse but far, more dangerous, the use of the word war in the previous quote signifies.

L

That the bza shall not approve a proposed use should only one of those conditions be met.

L

In three short sentences, we've demonstrated that a majority of those conditions are met.

L

Thus, the bca has the duty to deny the appeal on those grounds alone. However, 158-133 g continues.

L

By stating that the bza shall give consideration to shall the orderly growth of the community.

L

This project is in no way befitting the current surroundings, as in no is in no way orderly.

L

Traffic conditions and facilities previous evidence has noted the questionable traffic.

L

Studies and the fact that improvements to 26 from white rock to 97 are medium priority for.

L

The county, the effect of proposed, use upon the peaceful enjoyment of people in their homes.

L

This project will tower over at least one home appearing to be a four-story building. If.

L

Second-Story apartments are approved, the residents will be able to literally look right down.

L

Into the home and backyard of longreach farms lot 18. the conservation of property values. This.

L

Project has had and will continue to have, a large negative impact to surrounding property values.

L

The effective effect of odors dust gas smoke, fumes, vibrations, glare and noise upon the use of.

L

Surrounding property values, I'm not sure if you've all been to the princess shopping center. Recently.

L

But the stench in that in that parking lot is, is horrendous. Additionally, runoff from parking.

L

Lots and dumpster pads will run directly by the house and well on longreach farms. Lot 18.

L

As stated, not only do I not wish to attack the county planners, the county commissioners.

L

Or the pcc, I would like to draw the attention draw attention to the work they've done in the.

L

Past in the last four years, the current board of county commissioners has overhauled a huge chunk.

L

Of the current county code, with what I can only assume is a huge effort.

L

By support staff in the planning department, it's no secret that I disagree with a number of things.

L

That each of these groups of people have has done in their tenure.

L

I could point out numerix numerous examples, but again trying to limit to scope here.

L

The language set forth in 155.094 the code having to do with planned commercial centers.

L

Is quite clear and we can assume based on the hundreds or even possibly, thousands.

L

Of person, hours that went into developing those codes that the language is specific and deliberate.

L

The code having to do with planned commercial centers states that the pcc may approve a pcc.

L

Additionally, additionally, if a pcc is approved by the pzcc acronyms, the pcc may approve.

L

Second story: apartments: while each of these conditions has, while each of these.

L

Has conditions set forth upon them? The code is clear: both are at the discretion of the pzcc.

L

In 2013, this same developer planned to build the same type of project in the.

L

Princess shopping center, it's likely that you will hear on this very day.

L

That feelings don't matter, however, when residents found out about those plans, they were not happy.

L

They did not believe this type of project belong there. The developer's response back in 2013.

L

Was that no one showed up to any of the pcc or technical meetings? So he was unaware of.

L

The community displeasure as as such the project was completed, the developer by himself, drawing.

L

Attention to the lack of community pushback with that project has clearly shown that the feelings.

L

Of the community do matter and are relevant, the code agreed to and adopted by the board of county.

L

Commissioners gives read us redress to us county residents whereby we may share our feelings with.

L

The pcc, it allows the pcc to measure the desires of a developer against the needs of a community.

L

It allows the community to be equally and fairly represented and ensure that if the community's.

L

Feelings are based on fact and reason which I've demonstrated. The pcc may listen. The pcc.

L

Listened to the developer and the community at the final site plan hearing for this specific project.

L

And they unanimously decided to deny this project.

L

Which was their right afforded by the code as written.

L

If this is a de novo hearing and you are acting as a pcc here, this is also your right as well. The pcc.

L

May approve the project. The pcc may approve second story apartment buildings, it doesn't say, shall.

L

The bza should affirm the pcc's decision and deny this project as proposed. Thank you very.

L

Much, mr miller, do you have any follow-up questions I have. I just have one brief question, mr mccormick.

D

um You spoke about the letter that I believe mr dixon introduced at the beginning of the case with.

D

um The with names attached to it, yes, um you just said that that was circulated to the community.

D

Can you explain to the board how those name how you obtain those names certain we have certainly.

L

uh We have a mailing list that we've developed, based on going around to houses in our development.

L

And we also posted on two facebook news groups. We posted on the freedom district.

L

Citizens association, news group, as well as the sykesville online community news group.

D

So did you have the opportunity to speak individually with each of those people.

D

Or they just somehow submitted their name to you speak in person.

L

Yes, no thank you. Those are my only questions board members. Any questions of um his testimony.

Q

No, it wasn't for him. Okay, thank you. Thank you very much.

A

So at this point we can close testimony and have yeah. Mr chair, I do have a quick rebuttal.

D

Testimony, if you will okay, very good, I'm sorry I I didn't see. I didn't see that coming but go.

A

Ahead, you can call a rebuttal witness no problem. Thank you. I would like to call mr ron thompson.

D

And uh wait, let me ask first, was that that.

D

Letter was just entered as mccormick exhibit one. Mr dixon was that enter okay.

D

Mr thompson, can you please state your name, spelling your last name for the record again.

H

Ronald ronald thompson: t-h-o-m-p s-o-n mr thompson: you you had the very quick opportunity to review.

D

um Mccormick exhibit one which is that letter, but also to hear mr mccormick's testimony.

D

uh Specifically, can you uh well not, can you did you go through the customary and ordinary.

D

Stormwater management review process as part of this site plan. Yes, and it.

H

Was actually more detailed than we normally would for a particular site, and does that.

D

Review process account for runoff and any kind of a stormwater management concerns.

H

We're required to begins with soil testing, to see if what the infiltration rates of the soil are.

H

In order to come up with various techniques of treating storm water management, we are required.

H

To treat because this is a vacant site, not a redevelopment site required to treat the entire.

H

Storm water management requirements for the site that included permeable, pavement grass or micro.

H

Bioretention swales and a micro bioretention facility, in addition, because of the downstream.

H

Characteristics from the site, we were required to complete a very detailed analysis.

H

Of the remaining site, runoff, as it leaves the site and its impact to the area that drainage.

H

Actually runs through the property owned by the current owner developer of lot 18. Mr stavlis.

H

And it then runs through and fans out a sheet flow.

H

Through that force conservation area behind the site and as a result of these studies.

D

And review did you? Did the plan receive final stormwater management approval? Yes, it did. Is it.

D

Customary during a site plan review process for sha or the county to comment or request.

D

Land, if there is any kind of planned improvements or any sort of planned work along maryland route,.

D

26 both state highway and carroll county issued comments in regards to storm water management.

H

And we had to comply with each of the agencies, requirements for addressing stormwater management.

H

And runoff from the uh improvements and again did you receive final approvals from all relevant.

D

Agencies, yes, we did. Those are my only questions, mr thompson. Thank you. Any questions of his testimony.

A

L

Thank you bill mccormick, m-a-c-c-o-r-m-a-c-k.

L

Cyber cyber security engineer, 5685 ronda road eldersburg, maryland.

L

Should this project be approved, who would be responsible for drainage issues onto lot 18 if.

L

Any develop to the extent mr thompson can answer. I have no objection to him answering to the best.

D

Of his knowledge, but I believe to me that is a legal conclusion um that part of that question.

D

Needs to be answered through a legal analysis, but mr thompson has some some insight. You you.

A

Understand what her her angle is. I I'm more than happy to ask the county lawyer the same question.

E

I would agree with ms schaefer that that question calls for a legal conclusion.

A

If you rephrase the question, you might get the answer you you might get it, in other words,.

A

If you take out the legally, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but if you ask.

A

About the the water issues with, was it lot number 19.

A

18 18., if you would, if you would just ask him about that, he could probably address that.

A

Without the legal reference, um that's that's. My concern is any legal um redress that I have.

L

Should drainage issues develop on my property as a result of this development.

L

It sure it certainly should not be my responsibility.

E

I would suggest that he would seek outside counsel.

D

Not to summarize mr thompson's testimony for him, but it's been mr thompson's testimony.

D

That that will not be an issue, because this plan meets all of the stormwater.

D

Requirements as and has gone through quite a an intense and rigorous stormwater review.

D

Process, so I don't think mr thompson can speak to that because that has not been.

D

His testimony, I highly doubt every sewer water management project is 100, successful.

I

Yeah, okay, I asked my question. Thank you very much.

A

He couldn't give you a legal answer because he's not an attorney and.

A

You heard what the attorney said you would need outside count: legal counsel, okay, I I want you.

A

To sit down frustrated, I want you to understand the position that we're in here as a board. Okay,.

A

Thank you very good. Do we have any more witnesses? I do not. No thank you. Okay, presentation.

A

Of testimony and evidence is now closed and summations are in order, ms miller, would you would.

D

You like me to go. First, would you you can go first, okay! uh Mr mr chair members of the board, thank you.

D

um Briefly, I just want to address the de novo standard that I know we've spoken about.

D

The board's authority and powers is listed in 158 133 b, which is actually a complete reiteration of.

D

The maryland annotated code, section 4306, which states that this board sits in the role of the.

D

Planning, commission, so the minutes of the planning commission and some of planning commission's.

D

Comments might be a part of this record, but this board is tasked with reviewing this case afresh.

D

With new eyes, the application for an appeal requests an allegation of error, but that is.

D

Not the standard of review before this board, this board standard of review is de novo.

D

So I you know for what it's worth. I just wanted to provide those code citations to you, the.

D

Planned commercial center, which was formerly called the planned business center. So if.

D

Anybody's familiar with the old code: that's why I keep getting my letters and words mixed up the.

D

Planned commercial center is a defined use in in the zoning code. It is a principal permitted.

D

Use in the c2 district, it has specific provisions which I've included a copy of the code section. I.

D

Know you have probably numerous copies of it, but I've provided one in this packet to you.

D

On page six of this packet that outlines.

D

The specific requirements for a planned commercial center, a planned commercial center.

D

In essence, comprises three or more commercial uses, which is then what qualifies it as a.

D

Planned commercial center and then it must go through the additional requirements um under.

D

That section of the code, specifically that are not relevant to all other uses in the c2 district.

D

You have heard today testimony from three qualified expert witnesses that this site plan.

D

Meets all requirements that this went through the ordinary review process.

D

That it, in fact, two plus years of review before a final approvals, were obtained by all agencies.

D

This it's important to note that that review process is not just county agencies.

D

But in this case was very sha was a very involved agency as well, because of this.

D

Property's access onto maryland route 26- it is no small task to go through.

D

That exercise of resubmittals and addressing all comments and meeting all code requirements.

D

There's been a lot of talk of history here today, rezoning history- and I know that I'm.

D

Probably belaboring the point, but I will just say to you that that is not what is before this board.

D

I understand that there might be people who have an issue with the fact that this property was.

D

Rezoned, but that is not the issue here today. The issue here today is that this property is zoned.

D

C2 that a planned commercial center is a principal permitted use in the c2 district.

D

And that the site plan meets all of the code requirements, the the role of this board is not.

D

To evaluate the market and deny or approve a plan because of vacancies in the area or because of the.

D

Need for this type of use? That is not one of the criteria that this board is tasked with reviewing.

D

So I would, I would focus your attention on the the expert testimony that you heard here today.

D

From the engineer who submitted the site plan, the traffic engineer, who prepared and submitted.

D

The traffic study and our qualified planner and zoning expert, who spoke to the consistency with.

D

The master plan, which is one of the criteria that you sitting as planning commission effectively, is.

D

Tasked with analyzing so with that, I would ask that this board approve the site plan. That's.

D

Presented to you today, I would ask that you approve it in similar language to what.

D

Was included in the staff report to planning commission with those listed conditions, so I.

D

Believe that I included a copy of the staff report in my packet to you as well. So there is on page.

D

D

Ages, 31 and 34 include the conditions that mrs mathias read during her presentation as well.

D

So we would request your approval of the site plan. That's been presented to you today.

D

Subject to those same conditions that staff recommended favorably of.

D

During the presentation here today, thank you.

E

Mr allman, I have uh no closing mr chair. Okay, very good.

A

The hearing and record of this case is now closed and, in accordance with the open meetings act of maryland, the board will now consider the case.

A

We'll go from oldus.

A

We'll let our senior member go first, mr simmons, I hear you.

C

I see, or I heard compelling evidence and reasons to support this approval.

C

I'm not quite sure how to word what needs to be said, but at least that's my sense.

C

I'm interested in hearing other board members appraisal of this whole situation and I'll reserve.

C

My judgment until I hear that this ford mount so I heard and agree that in that area, there's far.

Q

Too many open spaces that could be rented, but aren't I understand that? That's not my job here.

Q

Today- and I have to say that it's unfortunate that it's not my job, because if I could deny it, I would.

Q

I don't think it's needed. I think there are tons of spaces that are underrented or not rented.

Q

At all, I do feel like the residential could be very helpful in that area. Apartments and things.

Q

Like that, I know that housing in general is down and is needed commercial space. There are tons of.

Q

Commercial space in that area that are not rented, but I don't see how I could legally as my job here.

Q

Deny it it seems like it is allowed in that area the steps have been taken. um It is a commercial.

Q

Lot so commercial businesses are allowed there, um so I would have to uh agree that it is allowed.

A

What's that, I think the site is appropriately zoned for planned commercial center.

G

I, the state plan, has all agency approvals, which is compelling, and the staff recommended approval.

G

Of the site plan, so I'm at a bit of a loss to understand why it wasn't approved, and I.

G

Am ready to vote for approval similar to the staff report, with the conditions mentioned.

G

Which I understand um we're not going to be an issue and the developer was willing to meet.

A

Mr snyder, uh I agree with ms uh ecker in that it seems you know it's really nice from from some.

P

Past experience we've had that that this actually moved through the process as it should. um You know.

P

It wasn't circumvented, it wasn't bypassed, it wasn't hop, something wasn't hopped over.

P

But it looked like it looks like the process was honored, it was, it was um fulfilled.

P

The expert testimony is very fulfilling and that, of course, with uh staff uh giving unilateral.

P

Agreement and recommendation for approval- um I agree, there's a lot of commercial down there.

P

But that is what the master plan called for. It's the growth area. um I will say.

P

You know, subject topic, I'm very knowledgeable of is residential uh um rentals. You know for.

P

Housing- and I will tell you, there's a tremendous shortage in sykesville, it really is those will.

P

Fill up very very quickly, so, with all that said, I would support approving the site plan. Okay,.

A

I have a confession. I was on the planning commission that that actually approved the.

A

Residential portion of long reach farms, it's also on the planning commission that um in the 1997 or.

A

19 2000 plan, whatever it was reaffirmed that that front area there should be commercial.

A

I thought it was kind of interesting that the way the plan was originally put.

A

Before the planning commission, uh with the residential like why why.

A

Is why is this out here, commercial, there's already commercial on that side of the road.

A

It's actually a wetland that a stream that separates the two. If I remember correctly,.

A

It is a principal permitted use, so it didn't come before us asking for a conditional use.

A

And I asked the question about the concept plan and the final plan because I'm very familiar.

A

With how it works at the planning commission, um the final plan was an accurate representation.

A

Of the concept plan, uh with the recommendations um that came out of that, so there was some.

A

Discussion but no hard recommendations that came out of the planning commission.

A

The traffic issues- the county in this case was extremely fortunate.

A

That there was a project across the road that was.

A

Going through the development process at approximately the same time so that.

A

The mitigation efforts could be coordinated with both of these projects coming online.

A

In the same time, period.

A

That's a plus because state, highway and county has an opportunity there to make.

A

Sure that the mitigation efforts uh you don't do, mitigation efforts on one side of.

A

The road that would be detrimental to mitigation efforts that would be needed on the other side.

A

Parking issues- that's one of the things the planning commission is, is.

A

Charged with looking at it's more than adequate, according to.

A

The code this plan meets all code requirements and met all agency requirements.

A

I don't see I don't understand why this is frankly why this is before us.

A

If all of those conditions are met.

A

I don't understand how it could have been turned down by the planning commission.

A

um Forestry concert where the the landscaping the.

A

Water resources, the project was actually limited. It went from three buildings down to two.

A

um The reason it went from three buildings down to two was the availability of water and sewer.

A

They complied with everything that they had uh to deal with. As far as the restrictions.

A

I I don't see why this this this project should not go forward with the seven conditions.

A

That were listed in the development review presentation.

A

And those seven just want to add those those seven um conditions listed. There were not.

A

They were standard conditions as a result of this project. These weren't special conditions.

A

uh That were um that were put in there because of the size or scope or scale of the project.

A

So with that um board members I'll entertain a motion, uh mr chair, just procedurally, um it would.

E

This is going; the way it seems to be going is that there would be two motions.

E

One to approve the plan pursuant to 155 chapter 155 and the recommendations for chapter 155.

E

Then a separate motion to approve for chapter uh pursuant to chapter 156 and the recommendations.

E

um For chapter 156 and thank you, it's been a while, since I've been on planning commission.

A

Are you confused? Are you ready? 55 is the first one 155 okay in in case 6406, I move that we.

G

Approve the site plan in accordance with chapter.

A

155, with the conditions listed, I thought that was the second, with the conditions listed.

A

Okay, do I have a second second dad? Okay, any discussion on the motion.

A

All those in favor say aye, hi hi. All opposed no motion carries okay, 156.. What's the second.

G

Piece of that I into 156 and we're approving under 166 we're making a mission to approve.

E

uh Just pursuant to chapter 156, which is the concurrency management chapter and uh all the.

E

Recommendations under uh 156., basically the same one with just just a different chapter. Yes, sir.

A

Because that is the concurrency management chapter, okay, in case number 6406, I move that we grant.

G

Approval in accordance with chapter 156 and all of the conditions, inclusive of the conditions, okay,.

A

We have a motion in a second second, any further discussion on the motion.

A

All those in favor, aye, aye, all opposed no motion carries.

A

Our world decision will become final upon a written decision which will be issued within.

A

30 days, unless otherwise extended by the board, the board's decision may be appealed by filing a.

A

Petition for judicial review of the clerk of the circuit court for carroll county in accordance.

A

With provisions of chapter 200 title vii of the maryland rules of procedure, the appeal must be.

A

Filed within 30 days of the date of the board's written decision, we are adjourned. Thank you.

A