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From YouTube: 06 Feb 2023 Regular Cave Creek Town Council meeting
Description
Associated documents: https://cavecreek.civicweb.net/filepro/documents/53341/
Public Announcements: 02:00
Town Manager's Report: 07:10
Consent Agenda: 10:55
Item 11:16 (Special Event Application: Bike Week)
Item 2: 15:24 (2nd Quarter Report Fire/EMS)
Item 3: 40:12 (Ordinance O2022-05 Amending Zoning Ordinance re: Site Plans)
Items 4 and 5 were tabled.
A
E
I'd
like
to
note
that
the
current
issue
of
the
center
R
news
has
two
articles
about
the
Cave
Creek
Museum
I
think
this
is
a
credit
to
the
changes
that
have
come
about
there
over
the
last
couple
of
years.
The
museum
went
through
some
difficult
times
and
they've
come
roaring
back
better
than
ever
so
they're
looking
for
volunteers
and
they're
honoring,
our
veterans
with
the
special
veterans
Garden
to
the
inauguration
of
which
everyone
is
invited.
The
other
thing
I
wish
to
notice
is
that
we
have
a
celebrity
among
us
tonight.
A
F
I
just
want
to
point
out
that
if
you
hadn't
been
paying
attention,
just
look
around
it's
great,
the
desert's
Greening
up
awfully
nice.
Unfortunately,
most
of
that
is
that
stink
net
stuff
that
dries
out
and
burns
and
we've
had
plenty
of
water
to
get
get
this
stuff
to
grow
tall
again.
So
don't
come
by
my
place.
I
hadn't
done
it
yet,
but
I'll
get
on
it.
Real,
quick.
A
I
have
a
couple
announcements.
First
of
all,
the
vice
mayor
and
I
have
been
meeting
with
and
talking
with
our
state
legislatures,
there's
a
particular
bill
that
would
just
take
the
the
heart
out
of
a
lot
of
our
revenue
and
that's
a
bill
that
would
exempt
or
prohibit
imposing
sales
tax
on
food
items,
and
we
get
about
a
million
and
a
half
dollars
a
year
out
of
our
13
million
dollar
general
fund
comes
from
that
tax
and
what
we've
told
the
legislatures
is.
A
The
second
thing
is:
there's
been
a
lot
of
concern
over
the
state
lands
contract
and
that
is
going
to
be
on
a
future
agenda
item,
both
the
facts
behind
it,
how
it
works
and
what's
in
it
so
stay
tuned.
For
that
and
another
issue,
that's
that's
very
hot!
Is
traffic
I
personally
get
more
complaints
about
traffic
than
everything
else
combined,
including
my
own
neighborhood,
so
that
is
also
on
our
list
of
items
to
be
tackled
here
shortly.
G
G
of
those
hundred
and
thirteen
thousand
sixty
nine
thousand
plus
were
from
poisoning
sixty
two
percent
deaths
from
Falls
28
000,
that's
25.
Those
two
categories
were
followed
by
choking
fires,
Suffocation
and
drowning.
Each
was
less
than
three
percent
2021.
There
were
twenty
eight
hundred
and
fifty
U.S
residential
fire
deaths.
Arizona
averages
about
49
a
year,
bathtub
drownings
in
the
U.S
per
year.
G
300,
plus,
you
can
save
a
lot
more
lives
if
you
mandated
all
chemicals
and
medications,
be
locked
up
in
a
safe
and
that
require
all
homes
to
be
single
story,
with
no
steps
or
slippery
tile
floors,
and
nobody
would
get
to
use
a
ladder
unless
it
was
surrounded
by
airbags,
I'm
asking
the
Town
Council
to
rescind
the
requirement
for
fire
sprinklers
in
residential
homes.
Personal
safety
should
just
be
that
it's
up
to
the
individual
and
personal,
not
the
government.
I
Good
evening
mayor
council
members,
we
are
have
planned
a
joint
meeting
between
the
Cape
Creek
Town
Council
and
our
local
business
owners.
We
are
in
the
process
of
getting
all
of
the
businesses
notified
of
the
session
that
is
scheduled
for
10
a.m.
On
Thursday
February
23rd
here
at
Town
Hall.
This
will
be
a
wonderful
opportunity
to
engage
with
our
business.
Community
inform
them
of
the
many
good
things
the
town
is
doing
as
well
as
our
challenges.
I
The
Cave,
Creek
Rodeo
day
is
as
fast
approaching,
and
the
parade
is
scheduled
for
Saturday,
March,
18th
and
all
Bulls.
All
night
event
has
been
added
this
year
for
the
first
time
Thursday
night,
March
23rd
and
the
full
Rodeo
is
Friday
March
24th
through
Sunday
March
26th,
and
we
have
scheduled
our
brush
drop-off
for
residents
of
Cave
Creek.
This
is
no
cost
to
our
residents
to
help
clean
up
their
properties
and
provide
defensible
space.
I
The
first
one
is
scheduled,
March
11th
and
the
second
is
March
8th
they're,
both
from
8
A.M
through
noon,
and
these
dates
are
coordinated
with
Maricopa
County.
They
also
provide
drop-off
dates
down
at
their
transfer
facilities,
so
there
are
other
opportunities
for
residents
to
drop
off
their
brush
and
debris
cleaned
up
from
their
property.
So
that's
all
I
have
tonight
would.
J
Have
a
question
of
Carrie
on
that
issue?
You
know
not
every
resident
has
a
truck
or
a
trailer
to
take
their
materials
to
this
site.
Is
there
ever
the
possibility
that
we
could
look
into
having
a
vehicle
drive
through
our
neighborhoods
to
collect
such
such
materials
to
make
it
more
convenient
for
those
of
us
who
don't
have
a
truck.
I
We
could
look
into
that
vice
mayor.
We
did
have
incidents
during
clean
up
after
the
fire
and
we
provided
dumpsters
for
those
to
for
residents
to
put
their
to
dispose
of
of
their
waste
whatever
whatever
it
was,
it
wasn't
confined
to
just
the
brush,
and
but
it
was
for
a
very
limited
time,
because
people
started
dumping
there.
So.
J
I,
remember
that,
and
that
was
very
useful
and
helpful,
and
that's
all
I'm
trying
to
suggest
here
too
because
again,
I
don't
have
a
truck
and
we
have
all
kinds
of
materials
on
our
property
and
so
I
don't
have
any
way
to
get
it
to
the
dump
site,
so
I'm
sure
I'm,
not
the
only
one
in
this
predicament.
So
if
we
could
look
into
the
cost,
it
may
be
cost
prohibitive,
but
I
think
it's
worth
considering
foreign.
E
A
K
Go
figure
before
you.
We
have
a
special
event:
application
for
bike
week.
This
year
bike
week,
Saturday
March,
25th
and
Sunday
April
2nd
as
part
of
bike
week.
We
are
requesting
or
I
should
say
the
Roadhouse
and
the
highway
are
requesting
road
closure
on
Cave,
Creek,
Road,
25,
26,
March
road
closures
would
then
come
off
of
the
roadway.
Then
road
closure
would
go
on
March
30th
through
April,
2nd.
It's
the
same
traffic
control
plan
we've
been
using
for
the
past
few
years.
K
J
K
K
A
L
A
K
F
J
F
My
best
and
the
second
I
just
want
to
say
that
historically,
this
this
event
starts
out
at
Westworld,
where
what
75,
000
people
show
up,
or
something
like
that
and
they've
made
Cave
Creek
part
of
their
part
of
their
experience
over
the
years.
It's
become
part
of
what
they
come
here
for
and
for
us
not
to
approve
this
you're
going
to
have
the
people
anyway,
you
think
you
got
pandemonium
now
you
certainly
have
it.
N
O
E
L
A
A
Q
Mayor
vice
mayor
council,
we're
here
tonight
to
give
you
the
quarterly
report.
This
is
actually
the
second
quarter
report
for
the
fiscal
year
starting
22-23
I
have
Chief
Ryan
Tobin
with
me
tonight
again
from
Days
Mountain,
Fire
Department.
If
there's
any
questions
that
I
can't
answer
or
any
comments
that
he'd
like
to
make
he's
welcome
to
do
so
so
we're
here
to
kind
of
give
you
an
update
on
what's
been
happening
with
the
fire
department,
the
report
we
can
go
Brian
does
this
work?
Are
you
going
to
do
it
for
me?
Q
Q
If
you
go
to
the
Highlight
below
that
up
for
those
630
calls,
we
had
1566
units
assigned
to
to
Cave
Creek
and
to
the
region
that
came
in
to
assist
with
those
calls
and
where
that
comes
up
is,
if
remember,
a
few
Council
meetings
ago,
I
gave
you
a
printout
of
what
what
it
takes
for
a
residential
structure
fire
and
what
it
takes
for
a
rescue.
So
more
than
one
unit
comes
for
those
things.
Q
So
for
the
those
630
calls
we
had
1566
units
come
and
then
for
the
year
our
Cave
Creek
unit,
assisted
in
the
region
on
48
additional
calls,
that's
to
Phoenix
and
discuss
Dale
and
other
areas
of
Daisy
Mountain.
We
were
called
in
to
back
that
up.
If
you
recall
a
few
months
ago,
we
might
have
talked
about
the
the
actual
firefighter
rescue
that
we
supported
for
Tatum
Ranch
on
the
working
house
far
when
they
had
collapsed
on
there.
Our
crews
were
second
due
or
they're
doing
there,
so
we
helped
with
all
that
below.
Q
That
is
the
training
hours.
We
tracked
very
closely
the
training
hours
for
our,
especially
for
our
new
firefighters,
we'll
talk
about
that.
A
little
bit
more
here
and
for
the
iso
grading
we
just
completed
the
insurance
service
organizations.
Varisk
did
a
complete
evaluation
of
the
service
for
Cave
Creek.
We
don't
have
those
reports
back
yet,
but
we're
expecting
those
to
be
the
same
or
better
than
what
they
were
previously.
We
have
saw
improvements
in
dispatch.
We
saw
improvements
in
training,
we
saw
improvements
and
resources
that
come
to
our
incidents.
Q
Q
Slides
that
we
put
up,
one
is
the
quarter
and
one
is
the
annual
incidence.
So
you
can
see
the
percentage
again
we're
running
at
about
70
percent
or
better
our
emerging
medical
costs
for
the
year.
I
think
our
structure
calls
are
our
fire
calls
were
about
12,
which
is
about
correct
structure,
calls
make
up
about
four
to
five
percent
of
those
calls.
So
our
most
common
call
type
of
incident
is
an
emergency
medical
call
and
that
runs
from
heart.
Attacks
to
Strokes
to
the
trail.
Q
Q
Go
to
our
quarterly
notes
and
we'll
spend
a
little
bit
of
time
on
this.
This
is
what's
been
occurring
here.
First
is
we've
did
submit
for
the
firehouse
Foundation
grant
for
the
assistance
on
the
equipment
to
help
us
with
Trail
rescues.
As
you
know,
we
had
several
pretty
significant
incidents.
During
this
past
summer,
we
were
approved
for
the
grant
we
submitted
in
October.
We
were
just
found
out
that
we
were
approved
for
that
Grant.
Q
Along
with
the
easy
Mountain
we
participated
in
the
National
Forest
Service
Cooperative
meetings,
where
we're
looking
at
the
fire
risk
where
they
talk
about
what
what's
going
to
happen
this
year,
what
the
projections
are
for
this
year,
we
are
invited
to
those
and
we
go
and
attend
those
and
helps
us
come
up
with
what
what
our
programs
need
to
be.
You
had
the
abraza
one-year
celebration
in
November
days:
Mountain
assisted
us,
the
town
with
doing
free,
CPR
training
for
our
regional
volunteers.
Q
We
worked
through
the
volunteer
network
in
Cave
Creek
and
at
least
taught
him
how
to
use
the
aeds
and
how
to
do
CPR.
It
was
a
very
the
people
that
attended
were
thrilled.
We
just
need
to
get
more
people
there.
We
ended
up
having
about
oh
gosh,
I,
want
to
say
Chief
a
few,
probably
about
20
to
25
people
in
the
three
classes
or
four
classes.
We
gave
it
all
in
one
day,
but
we
need
to
get
more
volunteers
there.
Q
So
at
least
our
volunteers
that
are
helping
with
the
the
Holland
Center
and
helping
with
the
museum
and
helping
with
the
visitor
centers
all
know
how
to
use
the
aeds
and
and
CPR
and
if
you've
been,
if
you're
any
sports
fan
at
all
I,
don't
know
if
any
of
you
are
or
not.
You
understand
that
that's
turning
into
a
much
bigger
deal
with
the
incident
that
happened
at
the
football
game,
with
the
one
player
that
went
down
and
because
of
instant,
constant
compression
and
CPR
on
that
young
gentleman
survived
that
that
football
game.
J
Q
A
Q
O
You
Jim
mayor
vice
mayor
members
of
the
council.
It
is
an
important
milestone
for
us
on
December
7th,
where
all
of
the
recruit
class,
that
we
hired
the
staff,
the
K2
Creek
Fire
Station
recall
on
the
fire
service,
their
final
evaluations.
This
is
their
last
hoop
that
they
have
to
jump
through
before
they
become
a
permanent
full-time
members
of
the
fire
department.
All
of
us
remember
our
final
evaluation
today
and
all
of
us
remember
getting
through
it,
because
it's
a
it's
a
lot
of
stress
but
I
am
pleased
to
tell.
O
Of
the
members
that
we
hire
for
the
just
to
provide
service
here
to
the
kind
of
Cave
Creek
all
pass
west
by
the
way
flying
colors
now,
the
significance
of
that
is,
if
you
remember,
we
hired
a
rural
metro
employees
that
some
had
worked
here
and
some
had
worked
in
Carefree
and
other
places
throughout
rural
Metro's
service
area.
We
put
them
through
what
was
called
The
Bridge
Academy.
O
Q
D
Q
It
is
there's
the
class
that's
them
showing
up
in
the
morning
for
their
final
test
down
at
the
Phoenix
fire
academy,
and
this
is
just
a
quick
snapshot
of
some
of
those
skills
and,
if
you'll
you'll
notice,
if
you
look
closely
all
of
those
almost
all
those
skills
are
timed.
This
is
a
high
pressure
event
for
them.
You
need
a
pass
reveal
and
they
they
did
terrific.
They
were
all
down
there
for
pretty
much
the
whole
day.
Q
O
Q
And
then
so
to
kind
of
wrap
up
again
the
two
things
we
we
did
complete
the
iso
grading.
That
information
is
in
we're
waiting
for
that
to
come
back
and
then
I
will
come
to
the
next
meeting
with
a
a
console
action
item
to
approve
the
grant
funding
from
Firehouse,
Foundation
Subs,
and
so
we'll
be
happy
to
take
any
questions
that
you
might
have
about.
What's
happened
this
last
quarter
or
where
we're
going.
Q
I'll
give
you
my
anecdotal
response
to,
that
is
that
it
happens
everywhere
and
it's
usually
not
always,
but
usually
a
result
of
driver
error,
and
so
that's
what
makes
the
system
so
so
good
is.
If
it
happens
further
west
on
Carefree
Highway
will
have
resources
from
there
if
it
happens.
For
the
reason
we
have
resources
from
Scottsdale.
Q
If
he
needs
help
us
it's
just
all
over
the
place
and
the
two
things
that
most
often
impact
it
well,
there's
three,
the
most
often
impacted
is
impairment
and
speed
and
not
paying
attention,
and
those
things
depend
on
the
specific
situation.
If
you
happen
to
hit
a
a
high
voltage
power
pole,
that's
not
going
to
move,
then
you're
going
to
lose
that
that
encounter.
So
the
biggest
thing
we
got
to
do
is
keep
people
from
hitting
each
other.
Now,
for
the
bike
week,
that's
coming
up
that
you
heard
about.
Q
We
did,
or
chief
got
a
grant
last
year
for
10
000
from
the
Arizona
Department
of
Highway
Safety,
and
we
will
once
again
put
out
these
signs
that
you
saw
last
year
for
the
first
time.
Saying:
beware,
motorcyclists
and
prepare
for
that,
and
we've
actually
got
a
lot
of
good
feedback
from
that
last
year.
From.
E
Q
Saying
this
made
me
not
think
just
about
motorcycles,
but
about
horses
and
what
about
other
things
that
I
should
be
careful
when
I'm
driving
so
we'll
put
those
signs
out
again
for
the
those
events
that
are
coming
up,
but
in
all
honesty
it's
the
message
just
keeps
coming
out
from
the
state
from
the
governor
and
everybody
that
pay
attention.
When
you
drive
and
don't
be
distracted,
that's
that's
the
biggest
issue
that
I
see.
Chief
I,
don't
know.
If
you
want
to
comment
on
that.
No.
E
O
Lot
more
cars
that
drive
on
a
daily
basis
you
get
more
actions
and
they're
just
by
sure
numbers,
but
I
would
say,
there's
nothing
that
you
can
draw
conclusion
to
similar
to
when
law
enforcement
is
here
and
you
have
lots
of
statistics
about
crime.
There's
not
that
there's
not
that
many
to
really
draw
a
conclusion
from.
E
You
know
we
I've
heard
about
reports
that
the
Carefree
Cave
Creek
intersection
is
one.
That's
particularly
dangerous,
we're
all
aware
of
the
Cave
Creek
and
Schoolhouse
Road.
The
changes
have
been
made
at
both
of
those
but
they're
places
that
drivers
really
need
to
be
careful.
Some
people
obey
the
laws
and
some
people
don't
and
they
both
pay.
The
price.
Q
E
P
Q
That
was
going
to
go
in
when
we
did
the
remodel,
but
we
could
actually
look
at
moving
that
up
a
little
bit
if
we,
if
you
wanted
me
to
do
that
mayor
and
vice
mayor,
we
can
get
the
sign
on
the
station,
but
that
was
as
the
remodel
has
taken
a
little
bit
longer
than
than
I
talked.
We
talked
a
little
bit
last
council
meeting
about
that,
but
as
far
as
a
signage
we
can
we
can
look
at
the
signage
and
moving
that
up.
If
you'd,
like.
A
Well,
I
have
a
couple
questions:
both
Fountain,
Hills
and
carefree
are
going
what
we
are
going
through.
What
we
did
a
year
and
a
half
ago,
they're
they're,
both
switching
over
considering
switching
over
from
rural
metro
to
something
else
and
Carefree
is
doing
one
thing
and
Fountain
Hills
doing
something
different.
D
Q
Night
time
manager
and
myself
are
going
to
go
and
answer
their
questions
about
how
our
process
went
and
how
we
did
some
of
the
things
that
we
did
why
we
did
some
of
the
things
we
did
and
where
we're
at
and
how
we
feel
about
the
transition
and
how
it's
worked
so
far.
So
we
will
go
and
give
that
information
to
them.
Carefree
has
a
little
bit
different
they're
similar,
but
they're
different.
Q
As
you
can
imagine,
Cave
Creek
was
able
to
put
through
the
whole
process
and
the
whole
project,
with
the
funding
that
you
had
available.
Carefree
did
not
have
that
funding
one
one
of
the
things
about
Carefree.
That's
interesting
is
the
discussion
is,
do
we
do
the
property
tax
or
not
the
property
tax
and
they
voted
to
take
it
out
to
the
count
to
the
citizens?
But
the
issue
is
that,
even
if
they
vote
it
down,
Carefree
still
doesn't
have
enough
money
to
pay
for
the
raw
Metro
contract.
Q
They're,
still
shy
of
money,
so
they're
either
way
that
they
go
they're
going
to
have
to
do
something,
whether
it's
the
property
tax
or
not,
and
that's
the
way
they
decided
to
address
this.
At
least
that's
my
understanding
and
chief
Tobin.
You've
talked
with
Carefree
a
little
bit
also,
and
let's
give
your
comments,
I,
don't
think
you're
on
Mr.
O
Mayor,
member
of
the
council,
just
so
you
know,
I've
participated
in
both
of
those
processes.
Early
on
Daisy
Mountain
was
invited
to
participate
in
the
Carefree
citizens.
Advisory
committee
to
myself,
Tom,
Shannon
and
other
members
of
the
automatic
Aid
System
were
active
participants
in
in
their
process,
where
their
committee
came
to
the
same
conclusion
that
they
should
pursue
creating
a
fire
department
that
meets
the
standards.
The
automatic
Aid
System.
That
was
the
citizens
advisory
committee.
O
As
you
said,
in
December,
their
Council
voted
six
to
zero,
to
put
the
property
tax
to
the
ballot
to
fund
such
an
Endeavor
and
to
to
they
put
also
pass
a
resolution
to
dedicate
the
funds
from
the
property
tax
to
fire
an
EMS
protection.
So
we
participated
with
Carefree
Fountain
Hills
went
a
different,
took
a
different
approach.
They
hired
a
professional
consultant
to
provide
a
report
to
the
mayor
and
Council.
There.
O
We
again
participated
with
that
professional
consultant,
as
did
other
members
of
the
automatic
Aid
System,
including
Scottsdale
and
others,
to
prepare
the
report
that
that
the
Fountain
Hills
Council
also
came
to
the
same
conclusion
and
they
voted
to
to
move
in
a
direction
away
from
rural
metro.
A
little
bit
different
I,
don't
know
whether
their
goal
right
away
is
automatic.
Aid
they're,
but
they're
definitely
took
a
position
to
transition
away
from
rural
metro
and
gave
them
a
notice
of
to
terminate
their
contract
at
a
certain
date.
A
O
Mr
Mayor,
none
that
nothing
that
I
have
watched
and
I
watched
their
Council
meetings.
Did
it
indicate
that
they
were
committed
to
the
automatic
Aid
System
they
did
commit
to
moving
away
from
the
rural
metro
corporation,
which
means
they
have
to
hire
their
own
firefighters.
They
have
to
get
a
different
dispatch
system,
a
different
communication
system
and
provide
different
training.
So
they're
headed
down
that
direction.
O
A
C
Q
Did
I'm
sorry
we
did
it
was
it's
a
very
long
and
drawn
out
process
and
they
look
at
a
lot
of
things.
The
the
grading
is
pretty
simple.
It's
your
fire
service
is
50
of
your
score.
It
says
100
Point
score
your
fire
service.
50
of
your
score.
Your
water
department
is
40
of
your
score.
10
is
dispatch,
and
now
you
get
additional
points
added
on.
Q
If
we
didn't
move
up
an
a
grade,
then
I'd
be
surprised,
but
it's
hard
to
tell
because
there's
a
thing
in
there.
They
call
Divergence,
which
nobody
has
any
clue,
how
those
numbers
come
out
and
it's
the
difference
between
your
water
system
and
your
fire
department
and
how
how
much
of
a
variance
there
is,
and
so
I'm
familiar
with
that
from
other
tradings
that
I've
done,
but
it's
a
I'm
not
on
the
iso
Christmas
card
list,
because
I
challenge
their
greetings.
Q
Once
you
get
below
a
five
there's,
not
that
much
of
a
change,
unfortunately,
there's
a
little
bit,
but
there
is
a
big
difference
between
a
five
and
a
let's
say,
a
nine
or
a
ten
there's
a
huge
difference.
So
those
folks
that
are
on
the
brink,
where
we
can
show
we
have
the
hot
water
and
the
water
tenders,
and
all
that
type
of
thing
we'll
have
a
big
difference.
If
that'll
go
through
last.
A
Q
We
still
need
to
set
up
a
joint
meeting
between
the
county
and
the
Tonto
Forest,
who
I've
heard
actually
has
some
funding
for
additional
Trail
markings
and
things
like
that,
so
that
we
make
it
a
consistent
product
throughout
the
preserves,
The
Preserve
and
the
county
park,
and
the
the
forest
and
I
haven't
done
that.
Yet
so
that's
on
my
that's
on
my
to-do
list.
I
will
give
you
an
update
as
soon
as
I
can
get
you.
One
I
need
to
get
that
that
meeting
scheduled
with
those
folks.
You.
D
Q
That
would
be
a
part
of
the
evaluation,
but
residential
sprinklers
currently
are
not
a
large
part
of
that.
What
that's
more
into
Community
risk
reduction?
Do
you
have
the
current
and
best
codes
and
the
ordinances
and
codes
that
the
town
has
is
some
of
the
best
in
the
country,
so
we'll
get
full
credit
for
that.
Thank.
A
R
R
Last
year,
the
planning
department
was
asked
by
the
Planning
Commission
to
investigate
the
the
process
and
procedure
by
which
site
plans
are
reviewed
and
also
asked
to
provide
a
recommendation
to
the
council
to
remove
the
Planning
Commission
from
the
oversight
of
a
site
plan
review
application.
Following
the
first
reading.
Based
on
the
comments
from
Council,
you
were
initially
given
two
options.
R
The
first
of
the
three
ordinance
chapters
that
are
part
of
this
discussion
would
item
seven
and
eight
would
remove
the
Planning
Commission,
as
they
recommended
and
Council
gave
first
reading
to
would
remove
that
from
from
future
considerations.
So
this
is
the
the
first
of
three
text.
Amendments
or
three
chapters,
rather,
that
council
is,
is
reviewing
tonight.
I've
also
asked
the
chairman
of
the
Planning
Commission,
who,
at
that
time,
was
the
vice
chairman
to
be
here
this
evening,
and
we
can
answer
any
questions
that
Council
can
have.
C
C
I.
Ask
that
we
consider
slowing
down
and
taking
a
close
look
at
how
to
reach
a
process
for
complete
review
and
refresh
of
our
ordinances
with
items
8220102
and
03.
We're
being
asked
to
remove
site
plans,
review,
I'm,
sorry
from
a
transparent
and
public
process
and
place
our
approval
on
the
consent
agenda.
C
I
have
great
respect
for
our
staff
and
the
work
they
do.
They
check
check
applications
against
our
bulk
regulations,
but
here's
the
problem.
Many
of
our
regulations
are
relics
of
Maricopa
County
when
Cave
Creek
was
a
wide
spot
behind
Black
Mountain,
our
town
has
changed
in
many
ways
since
1986
and
our
regulations
need
an
active
and
informed
review,
revisiting
revising
ordinances.
One
element
at
a
time,
as
is
suggested
tonight
when
there
are
only
a
few,
is
easy
but
Cave
Creek
has
grown
in
size
and
complexity
and
we
know
it
will
continue
to
grow.
C
Our
public
has
asked
for
ordinance
review
and
in
the
general
plan,
it's
on
page
30.
and
the
recent
strategic
plan
study
group.
They
both
proposed
the
same
action.
A
comprehensive
review
is
needed-
let's
not
rush
to
action
on
these,
but
rather,
let's
find
a
comprehensive
direction
that
will
serve
us
into
the
future
I'm
suggesting
that
we
not
approve
a
suggestion
for
Less
transparency,
but
rather
that
we
look
at
the
whole
ordinance
package.
That's
involved
our
changed
community
and
lead
in
the
direction
that
is
current
and
prudent.
C
A
M
J
K
M
Doesn't
change
the
analysis
of
whether
the
Planning
Commission
or
the
Town
Council
has
any
discretion
over
a
site
plan
that
is
in
compliance
with
whatever
our
codes
may
be,
whether
they're
changed
not
changed,
doesn't
matter
so
really.
What
this
is
about
is
a
situation
where
we
have
no
discretion.
Why
are
we
taking
up
our
time
with
this?
You
know
by
the
time
it
reaches
the
Planning
Commission,
the
Town
Council
staff
has
already
reviewed
it.
They
attest
to
the
Planning
Commission
and
to
counsel
that
it's
in
compliance.
M
J
R
Mayor
members
of
council,
no,
it
does
not
because,
as
as
I
stated
previously,
this
would
go
to
the
Town
Council.
Still,
you
were
given
options,
you
could
make
it
administrative
and
we
did
take
a
look
around
and
see
what
best
practices
are
in
other
communities
and
the
vast
majority
of
them
site
plans
where
the
uses
are
allowed.
They're,
not
asking
for
any
variance
from
from
the
regulations
of
the
ordinance
that
are
set
forth.
J
R
R
R
R
Is
the
ability
to
see
it
on
a
consent
agenda
and
if
Council
wishes
to
pull
it
from
the
consent
agenda
and
discuss
it,
it
can
be
done
at
that
time.
The
other
thing
with
it
being
on
a
consent
agenda.
We
would
still
advertise
it
as
we've
done
for
site
plans
of
all.
You
know
for
Planning,
Commission
and
Council,
so
there's
still
an
opportunity
to
inform
the
neighbors
of
of
development
on
a
commercial
property
around
them.
So
there
there
isn't
a
we're,
not
removing
transparency.
M
And
you
know
towards
the
transparency
issue,
because
this
we
we
talked
at
length
at
the
first
reading
of
this
and
one
of
the
issues
that's
problematic
with
the
transparency
is
the
mistaken
belief
by
the
public
that
they
may
have
a
say.
You
know
where
they
may
show
up,
say:
I,
don't
like
that
business
I,
don't
want
that
here.
M
You
know
they
think
that
they
can
actually
change
the
outcome
and
that
we're
letting
them
down
by
saying
yes,
when
that's
not
the
case
at
all,
we
would
be
sued,
we
cannot
say
no
to
a
property
owner
who
is
seeking
an
allowed
use
in
full
compliance
of
our
codes
and
ordinances.
We
simply
cannot
say
no
so
by
creating
an
environment
that
makes
it
look
like
we
can
say.
No,
it's
even
worse.
M
J
L
R
Mayor
vice
mayor,
commission,
member
Rose,
sorry
I'm
still
working
through
names
and
seats,
it's
been
attempted
in
the
past,
but
that's
really
not
germane
to
this
specific
request
and
which
is
the
text,
amendments
and
the
site
plan
process,
but
that's
something
that
can
be
discussed
at
a
later
date.
Let's.
L
Say
I
think
it
is
relevant
to
the
site
plan
process,
because
when
you
do
the
site
plan,
that's
where
you're
going
to
show
what
the
building
looks
like
so
I
I
think
it
is
pertinent
and
I
think
that's
kind
of
what
we're
all
getting
at.
Where
does
the
public
have
the
opportunity
to
say
you
know
it
doesn't
fit
with
the
character
of
the
Town?
It
doesn't
fit
with
our
style
guide.
It
doesn't
fit
forever
and
I'm
not
trying
to
put
you
on
the
spot.
L
R
L
H
S
H
You
have
a
difficult
one:
the
property
owner
needs
to
have
a
due
process
right
to
know
what
the
standards
are.
You
have
some
generic
guidelines
now
that
I
think
are
not
enforceable.
I
mean
they
just
they're
sort
of
there's
sort
of
a
sense
of
what
this
should
look
like
and
I,
don't
think
they
apply
to
commercial.
H
But
if
your
request
is
that
the
zone
and
is
to
revise
the
the
zoning
code
to
adopt
design
guidelines
we
would
have
to,
we
would
have
to
amend
the
code
and
you're
right.
This
would
be
the
time
to
enforce
that.
But
the
question
is:
if
you
make
it
too
rigid,
then
you
can't
say
no
it's
the
point
he
made.
H
H
Alternatively,
if
it's
so
generic,
she
will
say:
I,
don't
know
what
you
want.
Therefore,
it's
unenforceable.
So
the
problem
is,
we
could
do
design
guidelines.
You
have
very
generic
design
guidelines
now.
I
think
that's
intentional
to
let
to
sort
of
let
the
planning
back.
Then
the
commission
now
you
but
right
now
you
do
not
have
you
do
not
I,
don't
think
you
have
objective
discrete
guidelines.
H
If
you
wish
to
have
them,
we
can,
but
that
will
you'll
be
embarking
on
a
process
to
figure
out
what
those
are
and
how
you
wish
to
enforce
them
the
right,
but
the
right
would
be
at
Cyclone
you're
right.
That
would
be
subjective
and
I,
don't
even
know
if
the
commission
wants
to
get
involved
in
that.
You
know.
J
N
M
M
L
Understand
that
okay,
but
part
of
the
issue
that
I've
heard
from
several
folks
is
they
want
to
be
able
to
make
sure
that
they
can
object
when
something
comes
in
that
doesn't
absolutely
so
and
I
know
it's
not
you
I
know
it's
not
necessarily
the
staff,
that's
not
fair
to
you
either.
So
how
do
we
do
that?
And
that's
when
that's
why
I
was
suggesting
that
maybe
or
I
would
suggest
that?
L
M
If
I,
if
I,
could
make
one
more
comment
to
that,
you
know
what
we
specifically
were
wanting
to
do
is
retain
any
discretionary
items
for
which
the
public
could
object
to
and
have
a
voice
and
a
say
to
absolutely
retain
that
at
the
Planning
Commission
Council,
that's
where
the
residents
have
their
teeth,
that's
where
they
have
their
opportunity,
not
where
there's
something:
that's
an
application
that
meets
the
code.
That
does
a
it's
a
ministerial
act.
We're
talking
about
here,
not
something
that
is
I
want
a
voice.
No,
we
can't.
J
R
R
R
M
A
I
mean
everybody
loves
it,
and
the
bill
was
why
Warren
Peterson
from
Gilbert,
which
would
authorize
municipalities
to
delegate
by
ordinance,
City
staff
review
and
approve
site
plans,
developing
plans,
preliminary
plants,
vinyl
plats,
design,
review
plans
based
on
objective
standards
without
a
public
hearing,
so
I
mean
the
trend
is
exactly
the
opposite
of
is
is
towards
less
Council
and
commission
review
and
more
stand
for
you
and
it
was
unanimously
approved,
which
is
having
been
down
to
legislature
a
couple
times
recently.
That's
amazing
because
everything's
a
fight
down
there
so.
A
E
I'd
like
to
see
this
as
a
discussion
among
those
of
us
up
here
on
the
council
and
our
experts,
there
I
agree
that
the
approval
of
a
given
site
plan
is
Administrative.
If
they
are
following
the
codes,
we
really
don't
have
the
ability
to
say
no,
but
we
also
need
to
have
a
way
of
a
discussion
and
bring
in
the
desires
of
the
public
and
some
of
those
will
come
forward.
E
As
people
look
at
these
particular
site
plans,
they
can't
change
that
site
plan
because
they've
met
our
criteria,
but
there
it
seems
to
be
an
opportunity
for
the
community
to
speak
to
us
and
to
be
able
to
say.
Well,
you
know
this
particular
thing
just
doesn't
seem
right.
Why
don't
you
guys
have
an
ordinance
that
covers
this
and
and
I
I
and
I
do
want
to
open
this
up
as
a
council
discussion
and
I
I
appreciate
Mr
Beckner,
what
you'll
have.
M
To
say
yeah,
you
know
I
think
that's
why
we
gave
you
guys
the
options
right,
because
you
know
you
don't
have
to
go
ahead
and
say
no
strictly
administrative.
We
don't
want
to
see
it
at
the
Town
Council
level.
That's
when
the
first
reading
there
was
discussion
about
putting
on
the
consent
agenda
so
that
if
any
Resident
wanted
to
come
and
talk
about
it
or
voice
themselves,
they
would
have
the
the
form
and
ability
to
do
so
after
notice.
M
The
issue
for
you
for
myself
and
the
Planning
Commission
was
that
you
know
this.
We
were
put
in
this
awkward
position
of
we
can't
say
no,
the
applicant
shows
up.
We
say
yes
off,
it
goes
now.
So
the
way
this
was
structured
for,
for
you
guys
to
consider,
was
to
leave
that
door
open
for
exactly
what
you're
talking
about.
M
If
the
council
is
interested
in
hearing
from
potential
residents
with
regarding
their
opinions,
albeit
you
can't
say
no
without
consequences,
you
have
that
opportunity
with
I
believe
at
the
first
reading
was
for
to
put
it
on
a
consent
agenda
so
that
it
could
be
removed
from
the
consent
agenda.
If
a
resident
appeared
and
wanted
to
talk
about
it,
so
you
have.
E
M
Perhaps
I've
Mis
miscommunicated,
okay,
when
there
is
an
applicant
with
a
site
plan
right
and
they
present
that
site
plan
and
under
our
current
processes
they
can't
just
have
an
administrative
process.
That's
where
they
show
they're
in
compliance
site
plans
approved,
then
they
submit
for
a
building
permit
and
so
on.
Now
they
have
to
go.
You
know
meet
all
the
requirements,
get
the
staff
to
approve
that.
Then
it
goes
to
the
Planning
Commission
at
some
future
date.
The
planning
kit,
you
know
commission,
then
reviews
it.
We
run
in.
We
we've
run
into
issues.
M
A
E
A
F
R
Sure
the
conditions
of
approval
may
vary
by
the
anticipated
use,
as
far
as
you
know,
requiring
a
grease
Interceptor
for
a
restaurant,
for
example,
or
something
like
that.
That
may
not
be
a
standard
across
the
board,
but
you're
right,
I
believe
there.
There
are
12
generally
standard
conditions
that
would
apply
to.
R
Yeah
they're
in
the
for
the
most
part
they're
just
restatements,
of
various
ordinances,
design,
guidelines,
town
code
regarding
you
know,
Water
and
Wastewater
connections,
those
types
of
things
that
are
just
standard
across
and
then
we've
got
kind
of
a
bag
of
different
ones
like
I
guess,
use
the
grease
Interceptor
as
an
example
that
we'll
pull
from
for
a
specific
case,
but
they're
all
they're,
all
vetted
they're.
All
standard
which.
F
E
F
Of
the
things
I
recall
from
from
the
history
here
was
was
looking
at
a
site
plan
for
development
that
had
all
of
the
things
that
you're
discussing
and
then
it
went
Way
Beyond
and
it
precluded
the
developer
from
using
a
particular
public
road
to
access
our
project
and
the
developer
actually
agreed
with
that
stipulation.
Otherwise
it
never
would
have
passed,
but
had
he
not
agreed
with
that
Mr
Sims?
What
would
the
outcome
of
that
have
been?
Were
we
to
preclude
someone
from
utilizing
a
public
road
to
access
a
building
site?
H
Would
have
been
two
claims,
one
of
which
certainly
would
have
gotten
the
applicant
attorney's
fees.
Under
the
federal
statute,
you
would
have
violated
the
you
would
have
imposed
a
requirement.
It's
not
one
of
the
objective
criteria
in
the
site
plan.
Mr
brecht
is
right.
You
once
the
criteria
met,
you
cannot
change
the
criteria,
but
then
in
changing
the
criteria,
you've
denied
them
use
of
a
public
road,
so
you'd
be
sued
on
that
one
you'd
lose
on
both.
F
Yeah,
so
it's
one
of
those
things
where,
where
folks
emotions
actually
can
get
ahead
of
the
requirements,
which
is
pretty
scary,
because
this
this
town
has
a
history
way
back
when
of
of
being
in
Superior
Court,
quite
a
bit
and
learning
the
term
arbitrary
and
capricious
which
is
not
a
good
thing
to
achieve
in
a
in
a
a
lawsuit.
So
I
I
see
no
problem.
D
D
We've
grown
a
lot
in
the
last
30
years,
since
our
ordinance
was
assembled
put
together
cobbled
together,
we
fought
to
get
Cave
Creek
to
be
a
better
place
to
live.
We
shouldn't,
we
should
not
expose
our
current
residents
and
our
future
residents
to
the
current
box
style
risk
we
have
of
the
lowest
common
noun
denominator
of
building
like
we
did
for
the
Sprouts.
Building
that
whole
entire
complex
is
nothing
but
a
bunch
of
boxes
and
rectangles.
There's
no
design
implemented
there.
There's
no
shade
implemented
there.
Tractor
Supply,
it's
another
hideous.
D
Looking
development
along
with
AutoZone,
surprising,
myself,
I'm
going
to
tell
you
our
Walmart
has
nice
braking
along
the
it's
got
a
nice
break
along
the
elevation,
and
there
was
more
emphasis
on
design
review
when
that
was
permitted
than
what
I'm
telling
you
is
should
not
be
allowed
in
town.
The
only
way
to
get
to
where
we
need
to
go
is
to
implement
design
review.
It
is
going
to
be
a
site
plan
function.
D
It's
great
that
you
guys
are
embracing
having
a
conversation
I
think,
six
months
ago
we
wouldn't
have
had
this
much
conversation
and
I
enjoy
hearing
what
each
of
you
have
to
say
on
this
I'm,
very
hopeful
that
what
we
can
do
is
come
together
with
the
idea
that
hey
Sedona
has
design
review
Flagstaff.
Has
it
Scottsdale?
Has
it
Carefree?
Has
it
why
can't
Kate
Creek?
Have
it
because
we're
afraid
I,
don't
think?
That's
a
reasonable
answer
to
that
question.
D
I
think
what
we
should
reasonably
do
is
come
up
with
some
development
standards
that
we
can
check
the
box
that
those
standards
have
been
met
and
we
may
even
be
able
to
get
with
the
right
design
review,
which
could
be
a
function
of
the
Planning
Commission.
You
know
three
people
out
of
the
Planning
Commission
could
work
on
the
design
review
with
the
developer.
D
D
T
I'm
Carol
Perry
4944
East
Sawmill
Circle
in
Cave,
Creek,
Mr
Mayor
vice
mayor
council.
Thank
you
for
hearing
me
today.
I
am
going
to
talk
about
this,
but
I
just
want
to
say
one
thing,
because
you're
still
here
I
took
that
Holland
Center
CPR
class
smartest
thing
I
ever
did
everybody
should
take
that
class
and
you
did
such
a
fine
job.
I
was
nervous
about
CPR
because
it
had
been
over
15
years
and
you
made
it
so
easy
to
learn
and
feel
confident
in
I
feel
like
if
something
happened
and
I
was
there.
T
I
could
save
somebody.
Thank
you.
Okay,
great,
so
I
have
this
sense
that
all
this
conversation
is
putting
the
cart
before
the
horse,
we're
talking
about
things
once
they
have
a
site
plan
and
it
and
it
fits
what
the
ordinance
says
we
have
no
discussion.
I
would
like
us
to
reconsider
this
ordinance.
We
have
three
ordinance
lists
commercial
buffer,
which
you
may
or
may
not
change
tonight
to
intermediate
buffer
Town,
core
commercial
and
General
commercial.
T
If
you
look
at
those
three
categories
and
everything
that
can
happen
in
those
three
places
and
I,
have
it
right
here?
Only
14
things
can
happen
in
General
commercial
that
can't
happen
in
commercial
buffer
and
I
know,
there's
a
concern
that
we,
the
humans
living
in
houses
around
here,
think
the
buffer
word
means
protection
and
I've
learned
from
all
the
reading
that
it
doesn't
mean
protection.
I
would
like
you
to
consider
having
another
zoning
ordinance
between
commercial
intermediate,
commercial
and
residential
or
desert
rural.
We
do
need
protection.
T
Nobody
would
want
next
to
their
house,
I
mean
nobody,
and
from
I
mean
we
don't
want
to
have
our
backyard
back
up
to
Sprouts
and
if
I
understand,
right
and
I'm.
So
sorry
I
heard
about
the
food
tax
possibly
going
away
because
now
I
know
there
might
be
a
sense
of
oh.
We
really
need
to
find
those
cash
registers,
but
please
don't
put
them
right
up
against
our
houses,
we're
in
a
neighborhood
that's
over
50
years
old.
My
house
is
52
years
old.
T
At
least
the
walls
in
there
are
52
years
old,
it's
a
beautiful
neighborhood
and
just
for
the
record,
because
I
did
hear
this
the
other
night
we're
not
a
bunch
of
old
farts
living
in
Old
trailers.
We
have
some
really
nice
properties
and
we
have
some
really
young
people
and
older
people.
We
have
a
great
diverse
community
and
it
is
a
community.
T
J
L
S
Monroe
shumate
5495
East,
El,
sandora
Drive
vice
mayor
I,
appreciate
what
you
said
about
best
practices
and
when
you
ask
the
question
about
what
are
these
other
areas
in
the
local
area?
Doing
and
I
get
a
little
concerned
when
the
other
person
said
yes,
I
looked
at
that,
but
I
don't
really
care
about
that,
because
I'm
focused
on
this.
That's
not
necessarily
best
practice:
council,
member
Paul
and
I
I
I'm
gonna
I'll.
I
S
Back,
thank
you
suggested
that
there's
a
lot
of
stuff
that's
going
on
here
and
the
whole
thing
needs
to
be
taken.
A
look
at
and
I
highly
recommend
that
you,
as
Cave
Creek,
actually
consider
taking
a
look
at
that
and
pull
it
all
together,
because
getting
rid
of
something
is
going
to
leave
in
a
hole
potentially
that
something
else
is
going
to
come
in
and
cause
problems.
So
thank
you
for
asking
for
best
practices
and
Paul.
Thank
you
for
your
recommendation,
appreciate
it.
Thank
you.
A
If
there
are
any
more,
the
agenda
item
is
about
it's
the
process.
It's
not
about
the.
We
have
we're
confused,
in
my
view,
we're
confusing
all
the
underlying
problems
with
the
town
code.
With
this
one
tiny
little
administrative
thing
we
had
before
us
and
just
everybody's
information,
we
have
a
me
a
meeting.
Is
it
on
the
engine?
We
have
an
agenda
date
yet
for
the
foreign.
I
A
We're
already
Gathering
items
for
a
joint
Planning,
Commission
Town
council
meeting
to
go
over
the
big
picture
on
what
the
issues
are
in
the
town
code,
but
this
item
has
nothing
to
do
with
the
details
of
what
goes
where
commercial,
buffer
or
any
of
the
other
thing.
This
is
strictly
the
site
plan
process
over
which
we
have
no
control,
so
we're
it.
This
little
piece
is
not
the
problem.
The
other
stuff's
a
problem
but
I,
think
90.
95
percent
of
what
I've
heard
tonight
is
about
something
that's
not
on
the
agenda.
A
N
Good
evening
mayor
and
vice
mayor
and
council
members,
I
I
am
not
a
fan
of
extra
busy
work.
I
do
get
what
they're
saying
and
I'm
kind
of
for
it,
but
this
is
like
section
three,
four
and
five,
so
I'm
an
agenda
dummy
and
I'm
going
to
say
a
few
things
here.
That
I
only
have
this
one
page
that
I
will
speak
quickly
through
I,
have
attended
and
reviewed
different
planning
and
Council
meetings
with
regard
to
numerous
rezoning
applications,
since
we
moved
here
from
another
part
of
the
valley
in
2018.
N
I
agree
that
we
need
to
find
some
sort
of
a
solution
where
the
the
town
folk
don't
feel
like
we're
losing
some
sort
of
say
in
what
happens
and
oftentimes
it's
confusing,
because
the
site
plans
we
don't
get
to
really
see
things
until
it's
possibly
too
late.
The
commercial
buffer
zoning
category-
and
this
may
fall
more
into
section.
N
The
general
plan
mentions
the
word
density
24
times
in
the
document
and
all
of
them,
but
one
occurrency
low
density
is
what
we're
about
here
in
Cave
Creek,
there's
only
one
mention
of
medium
density
and
that
is
related
to
a
multi-residential
Zone,
and
that
mentions
eight
units
per
acre.
Curiously,
when
we
put
that
under
a
commercial
buffer,
we
don't
have
those
same
requirements
in
our
zoning
ordinance.
Why
isn't
there
anything
in
there
addressing
density
whatever
we
call
it?
The
commercial
buffer,
ordinance
or
commercial
light
or
commercial?
N
Whatever
can
be
written
such
that
some
areas
can
be
addressed
to
meet
the
daily
needs
of
the
immediate
residential
neighborhoods,
as
it's
explained
in
the
in
the
ordinance
right
now?
Why
do
we
allow
two-story
buildings
in
commercial
buffer?
It
seems
it
would
be
best
to
have
a
single
level.
All
of
our
largest
tax
generators
in
town
are
all
single
story.
N
Some
of
them
require
a
site
plan
review
and
some
don't
that's
what
makes
me
concerned.
It
seems
a
bit
arbitrary
and
I
would
like
to
be
able
to
understand
I'm
sure,
there's
some
reason
to
it,
but
all
of
those
seem
to
have
similar
water
demands
and
or
could
impact
the
neighbors
with
borders
and
Noise.
So
you
can
read
through
each
section
I'm
not
going
to
bore
you
with
all
of
those
worry
details,
but
I
am
one
hundred
thousand
percent
in
favor
of
what
councilman
elkema
said
and
several
of
the
rest
of
you.
N
A
C
Right
so,
first
of
all,
I'd
like
to
just
give
a
shout
out,
because
our
Planning
Commission
currently
is
composed
of
a
wide
range
of
skills
and
understanding.
It
is
a
really
great
group
of
folks
who
are
willing
to
take
volunteer
time
and
look
at
our
town.
I'm
I
have
no
quarrel
with
this
at
all.
Those
are
great
folks.
C
The
point
I'm
trying
to
make
here
is
that
we
have
issues
on
the
table
around
the
details
of
our
ordinance
and
all
I'm
asking
is
that
we
take
time
to
look
at
the
whole
picture
before
we
do
another
action
that
is
piecemeal
and
we
really
don't
know
what
the
implications
are.
We
just
are
kind
of
hoping
things
will
go
well,
so
I
appreciate
the
discussion
tonight.
I'd
like
us
to
hold
off.
A
This
is
this
is
not
about
the
zoning
ordinances
or
what
you
put
in
or
anything.
This
is
about
one
tiny,
little
administrative
piece.
Whatever
we
do
with
the
other
ordinances,
we're
still
going
to
have
the
the
right
whatever
those
audiences
are,
it
has
to
be
approved,
we're
not
going
to
have
any
administrative
discretion.
So
we've
had
all
these
people
here
for
all
this
time
on
something
that
really
isn't
on
the
agenda
and
some
people
looked
at
me
like.
Why
aren't
you
pulling
the
string
and
getting
back
to
the
subject
here?
A
Because
the
subject
is
the
site
plan,
administrative
procedure
and
I
I
I
respect
what
what
Paul
said.
I
I,
don't
think
this
impacts,
what
the
other
stuff
at
all
we
can
change
to,
whatever
we
want
to
so
I'm
going
to
evaluate
this
just
on
the
administrative
action,
knowing
that
we
have
a
lot
of
actions
still
in
the
works
to
address
the
the
code
that,
by
which
the
site
plans
are
prepared
and
everything
else
too.
F
Bunch
yeah
to
me
this
makes
makes
good
sense
and,
and
quite
frankly,
the
other
things
we're
talking
about
it's.
It's
not
like
we're
going
to
step
up
here
and
go.
Oh
gee
we're
going
to
have
a
moratorium,
Bill
hates
that
word
on
on
on
site
plans,
because
we
haven't
decided
what
we're
going
to.
Let
you
build
yet
we
replace
ourselves
in
severe
Jeopardy
by
doing
so
by
passing
this
until
the
other
stuff
gets
gets
ironed
out.
F
P
P
There
is
for
those
of
you
not
in
the
room
tonight.
There
is
absolutely
perceptible
stress
whether
there
may
not
be
four
votes
to
get
this
through
and
I
will
not
be
supporting
this.
This
is
a
tactical
device
that
will
help
a
certain
type
of
entree
into
the
community
of
yes,
property
owners
have
rights,
and
the
attorney
is
here
to
remind
us
of
that,
as
is
the
planning
department,
but
with
all
the
growth,
the
hybrid
growth
we
get.
P
Every
meeting
we
hear
about
the
semiconductor
plant
and
the
house
is
going
up
to
Black,
Canyon,
City
and
Anthem
and
so
forth.
Why
would
we
not
want
to
have
a
perimeter
defense
with
our
Planning
and
Zoning
Commission
in
our
planning
department?
Not
to
say
no,
but
to
do
what
is
inevitable
better
the
Chevron
gas
station,
a
gas
station
at
the
corner
of
Cave,
Creek,
Road
and
Carefree
Highway,
and
we
had
to
have
it
and
we
had
to
do
it,
but
the
way
it
was
designed
and
the
way
we
partnered
with
the
applicant.
P
That's
what
we
don't
do
as
well
anymore,
publicly
is
to
partner
with
the
applicant
and
I
know:
the
laws
have
changed
over
the
last
20
years.
They
may
change
again
this
session,
but
if
this
is
such
a
minor
administrative
change,
what
is
the
feeling
in
the
room
that
this
is
so
critically
important
that
it
goes
through?
What
am
I
missing
here?
This
is
like
the
vote
we
had
for
the
Planning
and
Zoning
commissioner,
because
I
didn't
find
out
until
afterwards
that
we
double
voted
on
one
of
the
appointments.
What
am
I
missing
tonight
now
I.
P
Do
thank
you
for
delaying
this
until
this
evening,
because
we
had
it
on
the
previous
meeting
and
I
appreciate
the
chance
to
do
some
homework
on
it.
But
this
is
not
Cave
Creek.
This
is
not
the
Cave
Creek
that
I
know
and
what
we
need
from
the
planning
department
and
we
need
from
the
attorney
is
no
more
at
Boogie
land,
no
more
they're
going
to
jump
on
you.
You
can't
do
this.
P
What
we
need
is
what
rights
are
invested
in
the
property
that
we
have
to
honor,
and
what
can
we
creatively
do
proactively
with
applicants
as
they
come
in
to
get
them
to
recognize
the
uniqueness
of
Cave
Creek
respect
the
residents
who
live
here
and
do
something
that
makes
sense
for
the
community?
Ultimately,
it's
in
their
best
interest
at
gas
station.
P
So
I
just
wish
people
would
be
more
circumspect
on
helping
us
save
what
we
have
left
and
do
better
with
the
development
that's
inevitable
and
they
have
the
right
to
do
it.
But
surely
we
can
do
something
that
proportionalizes
what
is
coming,
whether
it's
commercial
or
subdivision
or
whatever,
and
make
it
fit
into
this
last
little
refuge
in
North,
America
County,
Carefree
Highway
is
Bell.
Road
North
had
not
even
done
that.
Well,
so
the
last
10
years,
I
think
the
planning
department
could
have
done
a
lot
better
with
the
applications
coming
in.
E
Where
and
I
appreciate
that
this
is
an
administrative
process
when
these
site
plans
come
to
us
if
they
have
made
the
changes
that
they
are
required
to
make,
we
don't
have
a
choice.
We
we
do
have
to
approve
it.
My
concern
is
has
to
do
with
the
interaction
with
the
public
that
allows
us
to
craft
our
ordinances
that
recognize
what
the
people
in
the
community
want.
Now
it's
happening
after
we
have
had
to
approve
a
particular
site
plan.
E
That's
there's
no
choice
there,
but
it
has
been
a
good
way
of
communicating
with
the
public
and
I'll
be
interested
I
as
I
say,
I'm
torn
you've
got
to
approve
it
if
it
meets
all
our
ordinances.
On
the
other
hand,
the
interaction
with
the
public
gives
us
a
chance
to
look
at
our
ordinances,
particularly
from
the
point
of
view
where
they're
coming
from
and
an
opportunity
to
be
a
learning
experience
for
both.
Thank
you.
J
We
had
to
develop
Carefree
Highway.
We
needed
the
tax
revenues
to
survive.
They
did
what
they
had
to
do.
They
did
their
job,
and
so
I
am
not
about
to
criticize
the
commissions
from
the
last
10
years.
But
I
do
agree.
One
other
thing:
I,
I,
don't
think
that
this
is
separate
from
the
overall
goal
of
addressing
our
our
our
current
ordinances.
L
Roads
seems
like
we're
shuffling
a
problem
that
exists
in
one
location
and
moving
it
to
another
location.
We
need
to
find
a
solution
to
the
problem
and
I'm,
not
picking
on
the
Planning
Commission,
because
I
think
they're
doing
a
great
job.
I
truly
do
and
I
feel
sorry
for
them,
because
they
take
a
lot
of
slings
and
darts
for
stuff.
They
have
no
control
over
and
I
truly
empathize.
With
with
what
you
know
they
have
to
go
through,
but
at
the
same
time
I
think
this
is
part
of
a
integrated
hole.