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A
B
So
judge,
first
of
all,
let
me
just
start
by
saying
thanks
for
letting
me
slip
in
here
and
get
back
with
you
all
on
a
budget
workshop.
You
and
I
had
a
conversation
briefly
last
week
and
letting
you
know
that
our
jail-
and
I
know
some
of
you-
have
kept
the
breasts.
I've
not
kept
you
abreast
of
the
latest.
The
captain
on
mondays,
has
kind
of.
Let
me
know
where
the
status
of
the
jail
is,
but
since
I
knew
we
were
going
to
be
here,
I
thought
I'd.
B
Let
him
tell
you
what
the
status
is,
but
there's
no
doubt
we're
at
max
capacity
and
and
one
thing
for
sure
you
all
have
kind
of
realized.
As
I've
spoken
over
the
years,
80
to
85
jail
capacity
is
full
because
of
classification
and
having
too
many
of
one
classification,
whether
it's
minimum
medium
or
maximum.
You
just
you,
can't
there's
no
way.
B
You'll
ever
have
a
perfect
amount
of
to
be
able
to
have
a
full
capacity,
meaning
a
hundred
percent
so
but
like
when
it
comes
to
our
female
vets,
because
we
only
have
12
female
beds,
we're
always
at
3x
now
with
them.
B
B
Why
they're
going
to
grant
you
the
36
month,
temporary
facility
and-
and
obviously
you
know,
the
good
part
for
you
and
I
do
it-
is
the
jail
commission
knows
that
we've
been
looking
at
a
jail
they,
you
know
quite
often,
when
I
see
him
at
conferences
like
we
started
at
jail.
Yet
so
I
mean
they.
They
know
that
it's
got
to
happen,
and
so
this
will
not
be
a
surprise
to
them.
If
we
try
to
do
a
temporary
facility
because
they
know
they've
known
for
a
number
of
years,
that
need
something.
B
So
the
only
thing
that
I
think
that
todd-
and
I
are
definitely
going
to
have
to
work
through
with
you-
is
location,
but
for
right
now
I
want
pod
to
kind
of
give
you
an
idea
of
the
status.
A
A
Liberty,
county's
keeping
friendship,
lasalle
and
the
poll
and
hardin
county
is
full
and
justin
county.
Of
course
they
contracted
us
out
as
well
for
their
overflow,
so
the
only
other
county
that's
able
to
help
us
out
is
galveston
when
it
comes
to
female
bends,
they
have
given
us
all.
They
can
do
and
taking
work
this
time
so
unless
their
population
shifts,
which
is
unlikely
where
it
becomes
stuck
right
now
we
have
15
galveston
females
and
11
in
the
house.
That
puts
us
at
270
percent
of
maximum
capacity
and
325
of
operations.
C
B
Here's
here's!
What
I'll
tell
you
is
that
commissioner,
I
this
is
not
a
new
problem
so
right,
so
the
district
courts
and
the
county
courts
have
have
really
tried
to
help
us.
Keep
the
jails
down
to
a
minimum.
They've
been
doing
it
for
years
really
and
we're
just
in
a
little
bit
of
a
bind
so
yeah
they
we
could
probably
help
them
get
a
couple
like
the
judge
said
a
couple
out,
but
it's
not
changing
our
problem.
C
B
That's
for
sure
it
is
obviously
the
reinsurgence
back
todd's
had
a
little
bit
of
a
run
through
it
through
the
jail
and
some
of
our
employees,
and
so
we're
we're
we're
we're
kind
of
at
this
point
now,
where
I
got
a
feeling
we're
going
to
be
living
with
this
co-vid
or
some
kind
of
a
pandemic
issue
for
a
while.
We
may
be
dealing
with
it
for
the
next
five
years.
I
I
don't
know,
but
what
I
know
for
sure.
B
Is
there
two
things
and,
and
I'm
I
you
know,
I've
always
kept
a
good
relationship
with
commissioners
court
and
I'm
always
gonna.
But
one
of
the
things
I
know
for
sure
is
that
todd
and
I
do
a
very
good
job
of
managing
our
jail
and
we
have
been
for
many
years
and
we're
at
this
point
where
I
need
you
all
to
do.
Your
part
and
and.
B
It
but
we're
at
this
point
now
where
he
and
I
have
done
all
we
know
to
do
it's
if
the
burden
is,
is
gonna
really
be
got
to
be
shifted
on
y'all,
to
figure
out
where
you
want
me
to
take
it,
and
let
me
tell
you
why
I
I've
caught
really
some
pretty
heavy
heat
from
some
of
our
other
jurisdictions,
primarily
baytown
and
I'm
not
upset
with
baytown
at
all.
It's
they
they're
upset
with
me,
because
we've
turned
them
away
so
many
times.
B
Well,
I
know
what
it's
like
to
be
a
police
officer
and
have
a
felon
that
you
need
to
put
in
jail
and
no
place
to
put
him
or
the
sheriff's
turning
you
down.
Well,
I'm
done
turning
people
down.
It's
it's
becoming
my
political
nightmare.
When
I
tell
other
law
enforcement
agencies,
I'm
not
taking
your
prisoner
anymore,
it's
a
guy
that
just
pulled
an
armed
robbery
or
whatever.
C
B
Coming
to
my
jail,
we
go
out
of
compliance.
We
go
out
of
compliance
because
I
it's
important
for
me
that
my
role
as
sheriff
is
to
provide
for
the
city
of
baytown
provide
for
the
city
of
mount
bellevue
provide
for
the
highway
patrol,
and
I
mean
the
highway
patrol
will
tell
you
how
frustrated
they've
been.
We've
always
been
able
to
try
and
take
all
their
felons,
but
right
now
we're
putting
we're
in
those
areas
where
we're
having
a
difficult
time
taking
taking
felons
and
in
the
nightmare
we
have
created.
B
B
C
B
B
We've
got
a
nightmare
ahead
of
us
right
now,
and
so
you
know-
and
we
all
know
we're
three
years
from
getting
to
jail.
B
Something
today
which
I'm
not
I
know,
you're,
not
obviously
that
wouldn't
be
the
responsible
thing
to
do,
but
if
you
did
we're
three
years
away
from
a
permanent
facility
and
we're
one
year
away
from
the
temporary
we're
there,
we
can't
throw
something
up.
We've
been
doing
a
lot
of
research
and
most
of
them
say
minimum
nine
to
ten
months
well,
nine
to
ten
months.
What
does
that
really
mean
guys?
It.
B
Months,
that's
that's
right!
So
there's
a
lot
to
putting
up
a
temporary
facility
and
throwing
basic
numbers
we're
we're,
probably
looking
at
a
million
dollars
a
year
if
we're
going
to
go
into
this
lease
world
versus
versus
buying
a
million
a
year.
So
I
don't
know
what
and
we
can.
B
I'd
kind
of
fill
them
in
on
what
so.
Let
me
ask
you
all
this
from
a
commissioner's
court
perspective.
If
we
try
and
move
into
a
temporary
facility.
What
are
you
all
thinking
for
a
location,
because,
because
here's
one
of
the
things
that
I
will
tell
you
if
the
location
isn't
right
on
top
of
our
facility,
now
we're
doing
two
things:
we're
making
it
extremely
labor
intensive
and
then
we're
making
a
serious
security
issue.
B
That'll
kill
you
just
as
fast
as
a
man
would
and
and
the
and
then
the
other
issue
that
we
have
is
we
don't
have
that
many
female
detention
officers,
so
one
of
the
things
that
todd
and
I
feel
very
uncomfortable
about-
is
having
a
completely
separate
female
facility
which
would
be
the
right
way
to
do.
It
would
be
the
proper
ways
to
have
it
separate.
B
But
when
you
do
that-
and
all
you
have
is
majority
male
detention
officers-
you
see
the
nightmare
that
you
slowly
but
surely
so
you
know
cameras
are
going
to
be
so
important
and
all
those
other
things.
So
for
that
you
know
almost
shout
out
momma,
let
the
expert
guy
that
knows
how
to
run
prisons
and
jails.
A
If
I
had
my
brothers,
we
would
not
know
the
least
option:
okay,
a
hard
structure.
Well,
let's
look
at
that,
but
I
understand
that
maybe
issues
I
think.
Okay,
let's,
let's
look
at
both
the
structure.
A
This
is
structured
across
from
jp
to
the
gymnastics.
Building
is
100
by
80
and
about
75
feet
of
that
is
pretty
much
open
space
on
the
inside
75
by
75,
actually
clear,
clear
space,
undercover
space
that
will
be
large
enough
to
put
in
two
female
housing
areas
of
the
dorm
style
or
barrack
style
environment.
A
You
have
to
have
a
mechanical
room,
pipe
chase
at
the
back
side
of
it
plumb
everything
in
and
set
up
your
restroom
and
shower
areas
they
have
to
have
at
least
for
every
12
inmates.
You
have
to
have
one
tall
at
one
shower
one
one
wash
wash
base
so,
but
if
you,
if
one
of
those
goes
down
or
malfunctions,
then
you
gotta
move
people,
so
you
wanna
put
three
in
each
so
that
you
have
a
spare
always
double
so.
A
We've
talked
about
housing,
48
inmates,
both
minimum
medium
and
max
so
long
as
their
behavior
allows
in
that
dorm
type.
Setting
they'd
have
a
solid
wall
down
the
middle
to
separate
the
two
custody
levels
you
could
house
backs
the
medium
together.
You
have
the
minimum.
You
meet
them
together,
but
you
can't
house
on
the
max
classification
standards,
so
you
have
to
have
a
barrier
in
between
that
space.
Has
a
already
has
a
office
space
and
restrooms
for
staff
and
could
be
retrofitted
for
visitation
for
attorneys
and
family
experience.
A
A
A
From
there
it's
a
matter
of,
it
wouldn't
be
difficult
to
retrofit
that
facility.
It's
just,
but
it
has
no
air
conditioning
outside
the
office
area,
so
it
would
have
to
be
ahead
of
heating
and
ventilation.
It's
tall
enough,
the
lighting
there
you
wouldn't
be
able
to
use
you
wouldn't
have
to
top
the
housing
area.
You
can
leave
it
open
because
it
makes
me
able
to
get
to
the
lighting
or
the
structure
as
high
as
it
is,
and
you
can
probably
easily
hang
air
returns
and
air
handlers
across
that
to
them.
A
B
So
obviously,
currently
the
facility
is
vacant.
So
I
don't,
I
don't
know
the
scenario
or
situation
on
that
at
all,
but
that's
the
that's
our
what
we,
what
we
see
is
our
quickest
fix,
still
going
to
take
some
money
on
you
know,
and
and
obviously
when
you
look
on
land
app
or
you
look
at
the
county
records,
it
appears
that
that
particular
owner
owns
two
pieces
of
property.
There's
no
piece
of
property
next
to
it
that's
vacant.
B
That
would
help
us
be
able
to
create
that
perimeter
and
since
obviously
the
facility
we
all
have
now,
you
all
realize
the
the
interior
has
the
wreck
yard
and
it
has
a
perimeter
cover,
has
a
fence
over
the
top
of
it
where
they
can't
crawl
out.
So
the
type
of
fence
that
is
required
is
not
going
to
be
the
most
beautiful
thing
in
the
world,
so
we
would
probably
want
to
pay
attention
to
what
we
build.
B
B
You
can't,
I
don't
think
they're
sufficient
not
to
not
to
do
48
beds
and
really
48
beds
is
what
we
need.
What
we
need
to
do
the
size.
A
Footprint
that
we
required
was
basically
the
best
estimation
I
give.
You
is
a
22
car
park
square
so
about
the
size
of
where
the
category
model
is.
If
you
remove
that,
that
would
be
about
the
size
of
the
structure,
the
way
those
modular
pop-up
tails
are
done.
You
have
several
different
housing
units,
they're,
basically
housing,
and
they
only
have
a
separate
shower
area,
a
separate
truck
for
showers
restroom.
A
D
On
the
corner,
if
temporary
would
work-
and
I
think
that
would
be
big
enough
to
do-
that-
we
wouldn't
have
to
purchase
that
building.
But
I
mean
that's
just
an
option.
B
B
G
B
A
B
B
H
C
H
B
A
As
far
as
lead
time
from
the
basically
what
would
occur,
if
you
go
with
a
modular
option,
release
option,
we
would
have
to
pay
them
5
thousand
up
front
to
draw
the
90
drawings.
They
would
send
that
down
here
to
the
county
engineer.
The
engineer
would
have
to
inspect
it,
make
sure
it's
up
to
our
code
and
then
once
approved,
put
this
seal
and
stamp
on
it.
Approving
it
there
it
gets
to
the
commission
adjust
standards
for
approval
once
they
approve
it
then
y'all
would
drop.
A
They
start
acquiring
materials
and
appliances.
There's
a
90-day
lead
on
the
tension,
great
fixture,
so
it's
90
days
before
they
even
have
the
fixtures
available
to
install
and
they
start
construction.
So
it's
about
eight
month
lead
time,
boring
no
issues
or
problems.
Getting
the
contract
signed,
initiated
and
site
prep.
A
They
would
bring
it
down,
they
would
assemble
it
and
they
would
use
local
contractors
to
tie
in
the
utilities
and
also
they
would
use
local
contractors
to
service
the
facility
necessary
issues
they
own,
the
they
would
own
the
product.
They
released
it
for
a
minimum
of
36
months
and
hopefully
that's
enough
time
to
get
out
of
it.
A
G
G
A
B
A
B
Yeah,
no
there's
there's
no
doubt
this
second
round
of
cobids
put
has
put
this
into
an
emergency
because
now
everybody's
everybody's,
full
everybody
is
full.
I
don't
know
a
sheriff
one
that
has
room
in
fact,
newton
county.
If
you
remember
newton
county
had
a
temporary
private
prison
up
there.
I
think
newton
county
is
now
trying
to
do
it
in
contract
with
some
kind
of
a
jail
facility
trying
to
open
that
thing
up,
because
they
realize
everybody's
in
panic
for
inmates
space.
B
But
for
us
it
doesn't
really
work
very
well
because
it's
so
far
and
and
so
many
of
what
we're
holding
right
now
are
pre-trial
detention
felons.
I
just
I
mean
I
can't
like.
I
see
it
so
much
county
court
system
moves
people
pretty
quick
right
now.
Our
pre-trial
felons
is
what
we're
sitting
on.
D
B
So
with
that
being
said,
thank
you,
we'll
we'll
try
and
move
move
forward,
but.
B
D
B
I
mean
the
judge
and
I
talked
back
you
know
eight
years
ago
that
we
built
a
new
facility.
It
was
gonna,
take
more
personnel,
it
kind
of
felt
like
we
could
get
away
with
about
six
to
eight,
so
you
know,
but
as
the
county
keeps
growing,
and
our
court
system
keeps
growing
out,
we've
created
a
whole
other.
H
B
A
A
B
Decide
to
go
kind
of
the
modular
style,
it's
a
48-bit
modular
facility
with
direct
supervision
where
you
have
a
rover,
but
you
have
somebody
in
that
48-bit
facility
at
all
times
now
your
maximum,
I
think
we've
dropped
it
down
to
like
24-36
per
guard
in
maximum
security,
thanks
man
that
that's
so
yellow.
That's,
probably
one
of
our
biggest
problems
that
we're
faced
with
right
now
is
that
we
do
not
have
a
proper
maximum.
Remember
that
jail
over
there
was
never
built
for
maximum
security.
B
Todd
works
through
it.
Larry
cook
worked
through
it,
there's
a
big
difference
between
a
maximum
facility
and
your
medium
minimum.
So
it's
all
open
bars,
so
our
staff
take
a
brutal.
I
mean
I
can't
tell
you
I
bet.
Once
a
month,
one
of
our
staff
is
going
to
the
bathroom
cleaning
faces
off
their
face
and
where
our
people
are,
are
I
mean
my
exaggerating
thought.
B
H
A
A
So
I
think
you
can
clearly
justify
using
some
amazing
health
services.
As
you
know,
when
you
have
to
enjoy
election,
you
have
to
wait
sometimes,
a
year
before
you
can
get
them
into
a
treatment
facility.
They
are
there
90
days
they
get
their
meds
away.
They
give
them
confidence
enough
to
stand
trial
by
the
time
they
give
them
back.
It's
time
served
so
they've
been
languishing
in
jail
for
over
a
year,
and
we
finally
give
them
where
they
can
understand
the
charges
against
them.
A
Granola's
with
capital
crazy
group,
because
they're
industrial
appraisals,
this
last
name
wilcoxon.
Thank
you
we'll
continue.
We'd
ask
him
to
be
here
today,
along
with
mitch,
to
talk
about
inventory
and
inventory
tax
time
the
inventory's
come
down
and
just
bring
some
speed
on
you
know,
because
it
does
affect
our
budget
tremendously.
A
C
A
Everybody,
how
are
you
good?
Are
you
mitch
good
good?
Thank
you,
okay!
So
we're
about
to
get
started
here.
We
got
noel
with
us
and
I'm
just
going
to
turn
it
over
to
you
guys.
A
This
previously,
in
that
the
fact
that
the
the
values
were
down
substantially
for
2021.,
we
were
up
locally
about
340
billion,
but
you
know
from
the
industrial
sense
when
it
goes.
There
they'll
speak
to
some
of
those
changes,
we're
down
about
900
billion
dollars,
and
so
overall.
G
Sounds
good
sounds
all
good
as
far
as
you
know,
I
said
what
you
don't
have
it.
I
said
I
don't
even
know
what
evaluation.
A
Hello,
hey
nathan,
all
right
we're
going
to
try
to
get
you
a
link,
but
for
now
I
got
you
on
speaker
on
my
cell
phone.
A
So
we'll
get
you
the
link,
aaron's
going
to
send
it
to
you
and
we
haven't
started
yet
we
had
we
had.
We
have
sheriff
first,
we
got
mitch
on
the
phone
and
we
got
no
technical
practices
here.
J
No
okay
is
that
microphone.
Yes,
it
is
yeah
chambers
county
is
a
very
heavily
industrial
area
and
it's
mostly
on
the
the
baytown
and
mont
bellevue
side
of
the
county,
where
your
industrial
is
got
a
lot
of
industrial
on
the
hill.
You've
got
a
lot
of
industrial
in
the
baytown
area
and
both
are
growing
and
they
have
been
for
about
the
last
decade.
J
We've
had
the
the
economic
meltdown,
and
now
we've
had
kobit
going
up
against
industrial
growth
and
we've
seen
a
little
bit
of
the
stuff
that
was
planned
on
going
in
in
the
mont
bellevue
area,
pull
out
and
not
be
built.
We've
also
seen
a
lot
of
the
warehouses
in
the
baytown
area.
J
One
they've
set
up
foreign
trade
zones.
I
think
there's
now
seven
active
foreign
trade
zones
in
chambers
county,
so
you've
got
inventory
that
goes
from
being
taxable
to
being
exempt,
and
that's
one
way
you
get
them
here.
J
J
So
you've
seen
a
substantial
amount
of
growth
of
the
past
decade
here,
but
with
the
the
covet
event,
it
definitely
impacted.
The
economics
worldwide
is.
D
J
J
That's
up
to
the
the
warehouse
itself
when
they
set
up
the
foreign
trade
zone.
The
federal
government
inspects
them
and
make
sure
that
they're
doing
what
they're
supposed
to
for
things
coming
in
and
things
going
out.
So
it's
the
federal
government
that
that
really
keeps
track
of
what
is
and
what
isn't
so
they've
got.
J
D
H
D
The
foreign
trade
zones
that
I'm
aware
of
that
the
county's
done
and
there's
a
few
of
them
most
of
them
are
not
actually
utilizing
those,
I
think,
there's
only
that's
true.
I'm
gonna.
I
Is
that
they're
becoming
more
sophisticated
in
their
use
of
the
foreign
trade
homes?
Is
they're
they're
starting
to
go
to
school
on
it
and
they
are
moving
some
more
products
out
of
the
country
and
so
those
products
that
are
going
to
be
destined
to
be
shipped
overseas,
qualify
from
that
federal
extension
standpoint
and
no
can
be
more
specific.
I
know
that
I
received
a
spreadsheet
from
me
a
while
back
and
I
think
he's
having
some
trouble
there
with
his
connection,
but
I
do
know
that
we
have.
We
have
some
details
on
that.
I
We
can
follow
up
with
a
little
bit
more
detail
of
what
kind
of
products
went
here
again,
I'm
not
connected
to
life.
But
what
is
your
attendance?
I
We
and
our
end
have
to
rely
a
lot
on
this
self-reporting.
There's
no
great
system
of
checks
and
balances
on
this
type
of
property
from
a
local
standpoint.
It's
we
can
go
with
these
warehouses,
in
fact,
nola
and
I
visit
most
of
these
properties
every
single
year.
If
we
look
at
this
stuff,
but
when
you
go
into
these
800
000
square
foot
warehouses,
we
still
have
to
rely
on
them.
I
A
lot
to
tell
us:
what's
in
the
foreign
trade
zone,
what's
not
who's
got
what
here
we
work
very
diligently
with
them,
but
at
the
end
of
the
day
you
know
the
same
thing
with
what's
in
those
wells
on
the
hill
we've
got
to
allow
those
on
our
corporate
partners
to
you
know
be
somewhat
forthcoming
and
I
guarantee
you
there's
folks
in
our
community
that
think
they're,
not
you
know,
and
so
that's
a
struggle.
H
H
J
J
So
you
know,
like
I
said
you
guys,
have
been
blessed
very
much
of
the
past
10
years,
and
this
is
just
one
of
those
hiccups.
We
don't
expect
it
to
last
forever,
but
who
knows
how
long
this
covet
event
is
going
to
to
go
on
for
so
during
kobed
some
people
thrive.
Some
people
fail
and
you've
got
both
of
those
scenarios
going
on,
but
nobody's
really
willing
to
invest
in
in
new
stuff
or
drawing
in
a
lot
of
inventory
or
anything
like
that.
J
J
With
the
business
personal
property,
you
kind
of
expect
to
lose
some,
and
you
expect
to
gain
some
and
we
had
a
whole
lot
more
losses
this
year
than
we
had
gains
significantly
more,
obviously,
to
the
tune
of
almost
a
billion
dollars.
930
million.
J
D
Problem
personal
property
was
660
million
different
from.
I
You
know
right
age,
life,
depreciation,
they're,
getting
older
and
we've
been
so
accustomed
to
new
projects
coming
online
virtually
every
year.
If
you
look
back
even
to
2013,
you
know
we
had
6.7
billion
dollars
worth
of
debt,
taxable
value,
five
billion
of
which
was
industrial.
I
Today
you
know
we're
up
to
even
with
the
loss
we're
up
to
seven
billion
dollars,
so
we've
been
accustomed
to
some
pretty
phenomenal
growth
in
the
last
six
or
seven
years
and
and
very
steady
growth,
and
I
think
we're
still
going
to
see
that
with
the
prices
turning
around.
I
think
that
I
heard
that
ethylene
was
way
up
the
other
day
compared
to
what
it
was
at
this
time
last
year,
and
so
the
demand
for
these
products
is
going
to
go
up.
I
J
Just
with
just
with
ethylene
or
no
just
overall,
I
have
not
looked
at
what
2022
is
going
to
look
like.
H
Yeah,
I
guess
one
of
the
things
that's
been
puzzling
me
and
is
my
bellevue
went
up,
they're
very
heavily
dependent
upon
the
industry
and
the
inventory
in
in
the
assault,
domes
ccid
number
one
went
up
and
they
encompass
all
of
cedar
port.
You
know
and
they're
very
heavily,
I
mean
so.
The
two
parts
that
you
identified
a
while
ago
that
we
rely
on
that
makes
up
a
huge
amount
of
our
tax
base,
both
of
them
independently.
I
I
For
example,
for
barbership
isd,
when
you
see
11
billion
768
billion
dollars,
that's
their
concept
of
total
appraised
value
which
doesn't
include
any
chapter
313
agreement
reductions
for
the
m
o
component
of
their
tax
rate.
That
doesn't
include
so
that,
if
you
look
at
the
same
number
from
the
county
and
added
in.
C
I
Amount
of
appraised
value
that
is
debated,
the
county's
overall
market
value
is
much
higher
than
barbara
seal's
value.
It's
just
that
what
you're
seeing
on
that
spreadsheet
is
just
their
eye.
That's
a
taxable
amount
of
value,
not
their
chapter
313
value,
it's
a
much
lower
base.
So
there's
the
primary
difference
in
the
big
number
is
that
we're
looking
at
for
the
county
debt
taxable?
It
doesn't
include
the
exempted
abated
value
that
number's
higher
so.
I
Total
appraised
market
value
the
county
is
still
higher
than
barbara
hill's.
It's
just
that.
Your
number
reflects
the
net
taxable
where
there's
reflects
the
net
and
taxable
just
on
the
interest
in
seeking
funds.
Part
of
the
tax
rate
and
smaller
jurisdictions
can
be
up
compared
to
the
previous
year,
as
in
the
case
of
of
the
id.
H
H
J
So,
mr
miller,
I
would
like
to
address
what
you
had
said
about
the
ccid
one,
I'm
showing
that
in
the
business
personal
property
category,
they
lost
192
billion
between
last
year
and
this
year.
A
Property,
I
know
but
kind
of
the
depreciation.
J
H
C
J
The
personal
property
was
down
very
significantly,
so
real
property
was
up,
108
million
minerals.
We
were
fairly
close.
We
were
within
a
million
dollars
and
then
for
the
j
category,
which
is
the
utilities
we
were
we
estimated
year
over
years
of
about
11
million
so
overall
down
135
million
year-over-year
for
the
jurisdiction
for
industrial
and
mineral
property.
A
So
nathan
watkins-
I
were
talking
a
couple
weeks
ago
and
did
we
ever
out
at
any
of
these
folks
ever
go
in
there
and
say?
Oh
everybody
said
yeah:
did
we
audit
that
or
there,
but
we
just
take
the
word
I
mean
I.
J
A
I
The
years
with
various
different
parties
and
so
property
tax
code
really
doesn't
speak
to
taxi
units
current
appraisers.
It's
it's
one
of
those
things
that
kind
of
why
our
appraisal
districts
were
created
to
begin
with,
and
certainly
we
could.
We
could
look
at
maybe
strategy
where
the
apprenticeship
spends
more
money
on
this
effort
in
order
to
try
and
make
sure
that
we're
doing
a
good
job.
I
But
I
don't
think
there's
any
legal
frameworks
where
the
energy
could
do
it.
Whether.
A
A
city
or
well,
I
wouldn't
talk
about
that.
D
D
That'd
be
great,
but
I'm
saying
I
mean
these
the
even
even
in
the
salt
bones
I
mean
my
insurance
company
audits
me
at
the
end
of
the
year
on
my
fuel
because
they
based
my
exposure
rate
off
the
number
of
gallons.
I
purchased
it's
the
same
way
with
industry.
They
have.
They
can
furnish
us
this
stuff
as
part
of
our
abatement
agreement
or
something
I
don't
know,
I'm
just
throwing.
H
Something
out,
I
agree
with
you,
and
I
I
like
that
about
the
gas
I've
been
thinking
about
it
for
some
of
the
other
things
we
do,
especially
when
I
started
trade
zones.
You
know
like
we
did
today.
You
know
we
approved
one
substituting
them
guaranteeing
50
million
a
year,
a
minimum
of
50
million
a
year
in
inventory,.
G
You
know-
and
I
think
you
know
as
we're
doing
abatements-
that's
something
we
need
to
start
working
on
more.
I
think,
hey
mitch
and
some
of
these
embankments
that
you've
looked
at,
I
mean
like
billy,
just
brought
up
with
a
good
good
example
today,
but
are
some
of
these
totals
if
they're
of
inventory,
whether
it
be
50
million
units
or
150
million
units
or
whatever
kind
of
product
they
have
that's
a
box
pellets
or
whatever
are
represented
by
the
to
me.
J
Sure,
no
yes,
when
they
render
us,
then
we're
under
volumes
and
what
their
their
intended
market
value
is.
So
they
do
give
us
information
on
what
they
do
have
when
they
render
okay.
I
In
the
past,
we
have
been
able
to
independently
very
verify,
especially
on
the
hill
say,
for
example,
outdoor
over
at
enterprise
products.
In
the
past,
it's
actually
giving
them
some
detailed
information
about
people
that
leave
space
for
them
to
store
their
hydrocarbon
products
and
we've
been
more
or
less
successfully
getting
that
information
from
folks
like
him
as
the
years
go
by
some
years,
he's
been
very
forthcoming
about
independence,
not
just
enterprises,
products.
J
J
A
J
One
monkey
wrench
I
want
to
throw
into
your
plan
on
getting
the
the
volumes
from
these
guys
is
that
there
are
two
lien
dates
that
you
can
use
for
inventory
and
that's
september
1st,
and-
and
so,
if
you
just
get
the
volumes
on
january
1st
that
doesn't
go
us
any
good.
It
does
because
there's
people
that
they
go
for
january
1st
and
there's
people
that
go
for
september
1st.
So
what.
J
D
J
Different
when
it
comes
to
it
absolutely
is
easily
manipulated,
because
if
they
choose
september
first
they
move
everything
out
by
september
and
then
they've
got
it
on
january,
shoot
if
they
got
two
facilities,
they
could
just
work,
and
we
know
that
they
do
that.
Okay,
but
there's
nothing.
We
can
do
about
it.
I
That
they
move
the
product
out
before
the
statutory
appraisal
date,
whether
it's
the
september
date
or
whether
it's
a
january
day.
It's
curious
that
the
legislature
created
that
that
september
day,
some
years
back,
it's
because
they
got
a
lot
of
pressure
from
the
industry.
I
The
industry
is
very
good
at
you
know.
A
F
Yeah,
you
know
I
I
don't
begrudge
industry
for
wanting
to
pay
as
little
taxes
as
possible
me.
Personally.
I
want
to
pay.
You
know
as
few
taxes
as
I
can
too
and
they've
definitely
got
some
things
weighted
in
their
favor,
but
I
do
want
to
make
sure
that
they're
not
just
cooking
the
books-
and
you
know
this
year.
One
example
we
saw
was
shell-
had
100
million
dollars
in
value
last
year
and
they
reported
zero
dollars
this
year,
they're
going
through
a
sale.
You
know
I
I
understand.
F
But
you
know
if
they
are
in
fact
moving
their
inventory
out
and
it
is
an
interstate
commerce,
I'm
okay
with
that,
but
I
want
to
know
that
they're
actually
doing
that
that
and
they're
not
just
saying
they're
doing
that
you
know
my
understanding
is:
we've
got
600
in
six
hundred
thousand
mcf
or
whatever
the
volume
of
of
natural
gas
liquids
is
stored
on
the
hill
if
it's
empty
on
september,
first
and
january.
F
First,
that's
fine,
but
in
my
mind
all
the
brine
ponds
should
be
empty
as
well,
because
it
takes
brine
to
move
that
natural
gas
liquid
out
of
those
caverns.
So
we
ought
to
be
able
to
look
at
an
aerial
and
say:
hey
yeah.
We
started
we
started
getting
product
out
of
the
caverns
on
this
date.
Brine
ponds
ought
to
be
empty.
Okay,
we'll
prove
to
us.
I
don't
have
to
know
what
is
actually
stored
in
there
as
much
as
I
would
have
some.
F
I
want
some
level
of
comfort
in
knowing
that
the
volumes
are
at
least
accurate
as
a
starting
point.
So
if
10
years
ago
everybody
got
you
know
in
a
bind
for
reporting,
actual
storage
and
and
and
all
of
that
and
industries
always
told
us-
you
know
they
don't
want
us
to
know
exactly.
What's
in
the
pipeline,
exactly
what's
in
stores,
we
can
sign,
you
know
ndas.
F
I
like
the
idea
that
the
court
has
of
tying
it
to
tax
abatement
agreements
in
the
future,
but
the
additional
constraint
that
we're
operating
under
with
property
tax
caps
makes
that
makes
this
even
more
important
to
the
county
and
the
city.
F
Moving
forward
in
my
mind,
because
we
have
a
fluctuating
tax
base
before
we
set
aside
funds
to
get
us
through
years
like
this,
when
values
dropped
and
then
whenever
all
the
value
came
back,
if
it
was
at
eight
percent,
or
you
know,
ten
percent
or
twelve
percent
or
four
percent,
we
just
took
it
back
whenever
it
came
back.
Well
now
we're
capped
at
that
three
and
a
half
percent
rate
on
how
we
can
on
how
those
values
can
come
back
on
our
books.
So
you
know
this
year.
F
Preliminary
values
in
mont
valley
were
down
500
million
or
15
percent,
and
that
looked
like
that
was
going
to
be
a
five
year
to
get
back
to
even
was
going
to
take
us
four
to
five
years,
depending
on
property
tax
caps.
F
So
you
know
industries
should
expect,
based
on
the
constraints
that
the
legislatures
put
on
us,
that
we
have
a
more
vested
interest
in
knowing
exactly
what's
being
valued
on
the
hill
and
in
other
areas
of
the
county,
because
we're
limited
now
on
how
we
can
how
we
can
provide
the
services
that
our
our
residents
and
taxpayers
expect.
J
A
H
Looking
at
the
aerials
and
doing
it,
maybe
maybe
we
set
up
the
fly,
let's
get
out
there
first
and
september
first
and
get
some
areas
of
aerials
on
them
days
I
mean
makes
sense.
G
Mitch
anything
you
can
think
that
that
could
help
the
commissioners.
Clearly,
you
know
some
of
the
things
I've
mentioned.
I
I've
already
told
what
they
said.
G
Those
of
those
new
constraints
on
the
way
you
calculated
the
tax
rate,
it
kind
of
changed
the
landscape
a
little
bit
for
you
guys
and
makes
it
hard
to
to
get
back
to
where
you
were,
even
if
the
values
come
roaring
back
because
of
those
constraints
on
the
tax
rate,
I
I've
I'm
open-minded
to
these
ideas.
I
personally.
I
Never
thought
about
the
the
brian
pond
scenario,
where
the
obvious
change
in
that
would
be
with
if
the
product
comes
out
as
the
bride
goes
in,
that's
just
kind
of
a
good
common
sense
way
of
looking
at
it.
I
don't
think
anybody
who
has
any
sort
of
a
way
to
persuade
them
to
be
more
forthcoming,
whether
it's
with
the
language
in
an
abatement
agreement
or
any
other
mechanism,
we're
always
open
for
any
any
ideas
that
might
help.
I
think
no
one
will
agree
to
that
when
things
are
going
really
good.
I
You
don't
think
about
some
of
these
things
quite
as
much
as
you
do
when
they
drop
off
stuff
and
dole.
Did
it
make
some
good
points
that
hopefully
this
year
is
just
a
sort
of
an
anomaly
with
the
pandemic,
but
it
doesn't
seem
to
want
to
you
know
every
time
we
think
we've
got
it
headed
in
the
right
direction.
I
It
comes
back
on
us,
so
luckily
we're
not
locking
anything
down
presently,
but
there's
there
are
indicators
that
things
are
going
to
improve
and
we're
hopeful
that
some
of
these
projects
are
going
to
be
they're,
going
to
be
more
robust.
As
they
move
forward
based
on
on
the
you
know,
supply
and
demand,
but
any
of
you
guys
that
know
anything
about
the
the
the
movement
of
these
products
that
might
be
different
from
what
they're
reporting
to
us
anytime
year
round,
when
you
open
to
that
reception.
I
For
that,
I
think
the
fact
that
we're
talking
about
it
together
is
important
and
nolan,
and
I
would
be
willing
to
spend
more
time
with
you
guys,
because
you
actually
spend
more
time
with
these
industry
partners
than
we
do
by
the
fact
that
you'll
negotiate
these
agreements
and
stuff.
We
only
spend
a
few
weeks
each
year
with
them.
We
go
visit
their
property.
We
go
on
tours.
I
But
again,
I
think
it's
just
a
little
sketchy
for
us.
What
they're
reporting,
sometimes
in
these
wells.
A
I
Address
been
agreeing
with
so
many
years
that
I
think
maybe
one
one
advantage
that
doll
and
I
have
is
that
we
do
have
a
good
network
of
friends
in
other
areas.
It's
just
that
barbership
is
so
unusual
when
it
comes
to
that
specific
property
type.
There's
very
few
places
with
underground
storage.
C
F
Nation
yeah,
so
the
other
thing
too.
The
tax
payments
will
help
us
definitely
help
us
moving
forward
and
get
us
a
seat
at
the
table.
But
another
thing
too,
we
need
to
be
thinking
about.
Is
I've
sat
in
these
meetings
with
industry
and
and
loved
hearing
the
stories
about
how
the
salt
dome
was
developed
and
all
the
technology
and
and
everything
that
took
place
to
bring
us
to
where
we
are
today?
F
But
you
know,
I've
heard
examples
used
that
you
can
put
an
empire
state
building
in
a
salt
dome
and
it
wouldn't
be
exposed
out
of
the
ground.
To
me,
I'm
just
a
layman
and
just
using
common
sense
here
and
brian
ponds
was
just
one
one
analogy,
or
one
measure
that
I
could
think
of,
but
also
it
should
take
a
considerable
amount
of
time
to
empty
the
heel
to
greatly
swing
and
affect
volume
and
taxable
volume
and
value
on
the
hill.
F
You
know,
I'd
like
to
understand
is
that
a
month,
long
process
to
empty
a
cavern
out
is
that
a
six
month
long
process
and
then
are
the
pipeline.
Is
the
pipeline
structure
infrastructure
even
in
place
to
handle
all
of
the
volume
on
the
hill
if
we
took
it
all
out
of
the
ground
and
put
it
in
interstate
commerce?
Is
the
actual
pipeline
capacity
even
there,
and-
and
I
feel
like
what
I'd
heard
earlier.
F
When
I
was
on
my
phone,
was
we
don't
have
the
authority
as
taxing
jurisdictions
to
audit,
but
if
the
appraisal
du,
if
the
appraisal
district
does
if
we
can
put
the
funds
together
and
find
the
right
company
to
perform
an
audit,
I
would
hope
that
the
appraisal
district
would
support
that
from
barbara
seal,
the
county
and
the
city,
and
I
don't
know
that
I
heard
that
earlier,
but.
I
Yeah,
I
don't
think
there's
any
doubt.
We
would
support
that
if
we
can
find
the
proper
way
to
approach
the
problem
and
it's
all
about
the
information
and
you're
100
correct.
But
when
you
start
talking
about
the
size
of
these
salt
bones,
if
we
can
calculate
the
volume
that
they
should
be
able
to
hold
multiplied
by
the
number
of
wells,
that's
out
there
and
they're
all
different
sizes
and
shapes,
but
yeah.
A
lot
of
them
are
pretty
big
enough
to
hold
the
empire
state
building
and
then
how
much
is
how
much
is
brian?
I
How
much
is
gas
and
you're
right?
It's
clear
that
you
can't
do
these
things
out,
like
you
know,
filling
up
your
car
with
gas
or
something
that
there
was
lots
of
times
involved
in
folks
and
stuff
right,
and
sometimes
it
takes
not
just
my
understanding
is
no
one
can
correct
me
if
I
run
more
than
a
year
to
leach
out
one
of
these
wealth
to
get
it
even
ready
to
hold
the
product,
but
it
still
goes
back
to
this.
This
concept
of
self-reporting
is
really
the
only
tool
that
we
employ
right
now.
I
I
don't
know,
no,
I
mean,
are
you,
what
are
you
talking
about?
Yeah.
J
I
I
sending
al
north
email
and
yeah.
I
don't
think
he
ever
responded
very
good,
so
yeah.
So
we
asked
about
it.
We
haven't.
A
This
other
situation,
I'm
gonna,
be
interacting
with
him
in
the
near
future
and.
I
I
I
A
constant
in
progress
for
us-
and
we
know
that
those
things
are
not
ever.
A
Empty
yeah
and
we
got
bj
simon,
joined
us
bj
nathan
watkins
is
on
and
we
got
mitch
on
the
phone
and
we
got
noah
with
capital
appraisals
and
we're
talking
about,
of
course,
the
loss
of
inventory
and
what
we
can
do
to
make
sure
we
are
getting
all
that
we
should
be.
F
I
think
you
know
just
as
you'd
mentioned
you're
well
aware
of
peers
and
other
appraisers
in
other
jurisdictions.
It's
the
same
thing
for
us.
You
know
we.
We
hear
horror
stories
from
texas
city
and
and
bolero
and
shell
and
deer
park.
You
know
talking
to
the
city
manager
and
the
mayors
there
as
well.
I
mean
we
have
a.
F
We
have
a
very
amicable
relationship
with
our
oil
and
gas
partners
and
we
don't
want
to
do
anything
to
jeopardize
that,
but
at
the
same
time
they
shouldn't
have
unfair
advantage
tax
advantages
that
our
homeowners
and
residents
don't
whenever
we
have
in
mont
bellevue
and
west
chambers
county
we're,
seeing
valuations
increase,
10
15,
20
30.
In
some
cases
we
understand
they're
in
a
depreciating
market.
F
But
if
the
storage
is
there
and
the
volume
is
there
or
it's
in
a
warehouse,
they
need
to
pay
for
it
and
they
shouldn't
be
able
to
gain
the
system
which
ultimately
is
to
the
detriment
of
our
our
residents
and
homeowners
and
puts
a
greater
tax
burden
on
them
just
because
they
have
certain
advantages.
So
that's
all
we're
looking
for
mont
bellevue
is
making
sure
that
we're
holding
their
feet
to
the
fire.
F
They
know
we're
watching
and
and
we
want
to
continue
to
work
with
them
and
be
business
friendly
long-term,
and
I
know
that's
the
that's
the
goal
of
the
county
in
the
school
district
as
well.
We
wouldn't
be
who
we
are
today
without
industry
being
here,
but
at
the
same
time
you
know
we
should
have
the
right
to
ask
the
questions
that
that
that
we're
all
proposing
here
today.
A
C
Yeah,
there's
a
lot
of
there's
a
lot
of
folks
out
there
that
you
know
they
view
that
whole
abatement
issue
as
some
sort
of
corporate
welfare,
but
is
they
we've
been
very
fortunate
to
have
overall
good
corporate
citizens
in
our
communities?
We've
worked
well
with
them
and
we
do
not
want
to
do
anything
to
jeopardize
those
relationships
because
it
takes
years
to
cultivate
them
and.
I
So
that's
that's
always
in
the
back
of
our
minds,
but
again,
if
they're
moving
stuff
around
and
being
disingenuous
about
it.
That's
something
that's
important
to
us,
and
you
mentioned
the
concept
of
independent
experts
and
one
of
the
things
that's
frustrating
to
knowledge
myself
and
we've
both
been
in
this
industry
a
long
time.
I've
been
in
39
years,
I
was
in
texas
city
from
some
of
those
nightmare
scenarios
happened.
I
I've
seen
that
with
my
with
my
own
eyes
and
valero,
and
that
sort
of
thing
bp,
and
and
having
to
fight
and
spend
lots
of
money
on
lawyers
every
year.
But
what
we've
encountered
is
is
that
a
lot
of
times
the
industry's
best
experts
already
work
for
the
industry
and
it's
hard
to
find
engineers
that
aren't
with
one
of
these
appraisal
farms
already
it's
hard
to
find
independent
engineers
that
aren't
already
working
for
shell
and
exxon
and
valero
and
all
of
them.
I
So
that's
kind
of
one
of
the
frustrating
things
is:
is
that
when
we've
gone
into
protracted
litigation
in
other
jurisdictions
as
appraisal
districts,
the
best
engineers
in
the
country
were
on
the
other
side
of
the
table,
and
that's
that's
something
that
we
deal
with
as
obsessed
with
professionals
in
texas.
Is
that
those
guys
know
who
these
these
folks
are?
The
people
that
are
writing
the
articles
that
are
publishing
the
textbooks
and
that
are?
Are
the
recognized
leaders
in
that
side
of
the
industry
already
worked
for.
G
J
J
There
was
definitely
volume
difference.
I
mean
when
michelle
pulls
out
160
million
dollars
of
inventory.
It's
not
going
to
be
replaced.
I
think
that
can
be
audited.
I
did
send
shell
an
email.
They
confirmed
that
they
had
zero,
but
you
know
they're
gonna
confirm
what
they
already
have.
So
I've
tried
to
go
to
a
third
party
source
and
go
to
the
enterprise
yeah.
J
I
also
want
to
address
the
the
volume
issue.
We
don't
have
a
problem
with
getting
the
volumes
in
these
caverns,
so
they
file
reports
with
the
railroad
commission
and
we
do
have
volumes
as
of
september
and
as
of
january,
so
we're
not
really
hurting
for
getting
volumes,
it's
more,
a
matter
of
who
owns
it,
because
it's
not
enterprise
that
owns
all
the
stuff.
That's
there,
enterprise
stores
stuff
for
shelves
for
for
chevron,
for
exxon,
for
everybody,.
J
Yeah
I
was
curious
yeah
and,
yes,
you
can
look
at
the
brine
ponds
and
see
roughly
how
big
they
are
and
that
kind
of
stuff
you
know
how
full
they
are
as
to
you
know
how
much
is
going
in
the
the
ground,
but
we
get
those
reports.
So
it's
really
not
that
big
a
deal
to
find
out
volumes.
It's
more
a
matter
of
ownership.
D
J
The
foreign
ownership
entities
almost
never
give
us
a
response,
and
I
don't
know
how
you
would
even
go
about
getting
them
to
pay
their
fair
share
taxes.
I
About
trying
to
capture
some
of
this
value
and
we
would
we
would
send
out
notices
where
we
specifically
thought
somebody
might
have
had
something
it
never
seemed
to
work
out
as
well
as
it
was
visions
say,
for
example,
we
felt
like
michelle
was:
was
stopped
being
forthcoming
or
lying
to
us.
We
would.
We
would
just
slap
a
value
on
a
notice
of
appraised
value
for
a
couple
hundred
million
dollars
and
send
it
to
him.
I
Well,
I
found
out
that's
called
official
oppression,
and
so
I
got
my
hand
slapped
for
doing
that
in
the
past,
because
remember
every
activity
that
we're
doing
is
being
audited
by
some
entity,
mostly
the
controller
of
public
accounts.
But
he-
and
even
you
know,
the
other
side
will
will
will
come
back
at
you
pretty
hard
if
you
start
doing
the
old,
throw
it
up
against
the
wall
and
see
what
sticks
message.
So
we
kind
of
pulled
back
from
that.
That
was
something
that
we
tried
a
lot
of
years.
I
Past
works
occasionally,
but
this
is
it's
a
little
bit
more
frowned
upon
today
than
it
was
because
you
know
my
instinct
would
be
as
an
assessment
person
is
to.
J
J
H
So
if
I
got
stuff
in
my
warehouse-
and
I
say
it's
not
mine-
it
wants
to
a
brother-in-law.
I'm.
J
Not
responsible
for
the
taxes
yeah,
if
it's
not
your
honor,
if
you're,
not
the
right
owner,
so
we
have
that
situation.
We
have
people
that
say
no,
that's
not
mine,
it's
theirs,
and
so
during
the
protest
period,
we
leave
them
on
and
send
a
notice
to
the
new
one
and
wait
until
we
figure
out
who
actually
claims
it.
If
the
the
person
that
they
pointed
to
owns
it
will
take
these
guys
off
the
roll
and
it'll
be
their
responsibility,
so
that
scenario
happens
quite
often,
especially
with
the
warehouses.
J
J
They've
got
72
inch
pipes
that
come
in,
which
means
they
could
reverse
that
to
go
out.
They
could
empty
the
hill
in
a
week
or
two.
That's
what
I'm
thinking
it
would
not
take
very
long
at
all
and
as
they
develop
the
technology
they
get
bigger
and
bigger
pipes
that
go
down
in
these
wells,
they're
they're,
pretty
significant.
When
you
get
a
24-inch
pipe
going
to
a
well,
you
can
empty
that
thing
in
a
hurry.
J
J
D
Are
stocking
inventory
getting
ready
for
winter?
You
know
I'm
saying
january,
one
yeah
I
mean
we're
getting
into
quote-unquote
texas
winners.
These
companies
are,
these.
Stockings
are
filling
these.
C
J
Over
in
houston,
in
harris
county,
they
got
caught
because
they
did
it
the
wrong
way.
They
put
all
their
stuff
in
on
september
1st
and
they
moved
it
on
january,
1st
to
the
other
place
that
was
taxable
and
they
got
hammered
and
harris
county,
wouldn't
let
them
out
of
it.
They
screwed
up
and,
and
they
got
crosstalk,
they
paid
double
they
paid
for
the
same
inventory
twice.
I.
F
Legal
is
anybody:
has
anybody
challenged
the
september
1
and
january
1
dates
at
the
legislature
and
say
it's
a
annual
average
instead
of
it.
F
J
I
In
the
legislature
that
I
was
surprised
that
that
there
was
so
much
so
many
legislators
letting
that
thing
go
away
and
it
may
be
time
to
resurrect
it
or
a
lot
of
deals
have
to
get
done.
But
so
few
what
you
have
is
you
have
a
situation
where
all
over
the
state
of
texas
you
have
what
I
like
to
call
professional
jealousy
on
the
part
of
legislators
that
sit
down
and
let
wealthy
districts
and
see
us
on
the
on
the
gulf
coast
and
some
sort
of
beneficiaries
of
all
this.
I
This
industrial
property
and
they're
delighted
to
take
away
some
of
the
tools,
and
so
I
worry
about
312's
in
a
similar
way
because
they
come
up
every
so
often
I
don't
know
when
312's
are
going
to
come
up
again,
but
we
always
need
to
be
aware
that
the
tides
change
in
the
legislature
is
something
that
seemed
like
a
really
great
program
for
school
districts.
So
313
is
gonna,
be
allowed
to
fade
away
because
a
lot
of
people
see
us
as
rich
and
gritty
coastal
communities
that
have
all
the
industry
and
they
don't.
I
In
fact,
quayle
out
of
the
valley
said
that
he
guessed
that
kids
in
313
districts
were
more
valuable
than
kids
in
non
313
districts.
They
were
making
comments
like
that,
and
so
you
know
we
don't
want
to
poke
the
legislature
too
much.
A
I
guess
it's
my
point:
when
it
comes
to
those
sort
of
subjects
you
might
back:
firearms
yeah
the
ability
to
do
313s
and
312s
380
81
that
benefits
the
whole
state
of
texas.
You
know
they're
gonna.
We
can't
do
these
kind
of
these
type
incentives,
they're
going
to
louisiana
or
arizona
like
we
bingo
and
gordon
new
mexico.
H
Hey,
I
do
have
one
question
on
overall
tax
values:
what's
look
at
this
summary
of
the
values
the
entire
appraisal
district
has
a
total
of
11
billion
834
million
and
the
counties
got
11
billion,
300
or
11
billion
33.?
What's
the
difference
of
about
800
million
dollars
there?
That
would
be
the
apprentice
district.
Doesn't.
I
Over
65
homestead
disabled
persons,
so
that
difference
in
that
appraisal,
value
and
that
that
county
or
some
of
the
other
jurisdictions
is,
is
there's
no
notations
on
our
summaries,
necessarily
or
intentions
right.
The
major
difference
would
be
the
cradle
district
since
it's
not
attacking
entity,
it's
not.
A
Affected
you're,
looking
at
a
net
taxable
value
for
the
county
that
subtracts
all
of
the
extensions,
whereas
the
appraisal
district
value
itself
would
reflect
those
those
same
exemptions
make
sense.
We
don't.
F
No,
I
don't
have
anything
else,
but
for
the
record,
I'm
not
afraid
of
poking
the
legislature.
K
Judge,
I
think
I
concur
with
nate
something
could
be
addressed.
I
mean
we've
seen
various
approaches
that
are
used
for
industrial
district
agreements
with
the
city
of
baytown.
You
know
for
managing
for
those
folks
who
manage
other
people's
inventory
and
so
there's
a
rational
basis
to
explore
some
of
those
options.
H
Before
you
signed
on,
we
were
talking
about
portray
zones,
and
I
had
asked
a
question
about
how
much
inventory
actually
was
in
foreign
trade
zones
last
year.
That
you
know
was
not
taxed
because
of
that,
but
I
don't
know
how
many
are
actually
operating.
Are
you
do
you
know
how
many
foreign
trade
zones
that
are
actually
operating
currently
in
change
county.
K
Yes,
so
the
rivago
has
an
active
foreign
trade
zone.
Ktn
has
an
active
trade
zone
floor.
K
Applying
for
a
foreign
trade
zone
as
part
of
their
approach-
and
I
think
I
mentioned
that
to
you
and
commissioner
hammond
yesterday-
that
the
county's
going
to
have
to
revise
their
the
policy,
because,
if
they're
incentivizing
physical
facility
and
like
we
need
to
balance
that
with
impact
that
our
inventory
that's
impacted
by
foreign
trade
zones.
So
currently
in
the
case
of
404,
they
have
inventory
in
ftc
84
harris
county
and
they
anticipate
moving
that
inventory
over
to
their
chambers
county
operations.
K
So
when
they
approach
the
county
for
a
letter
of
non-objection,
it
would
be
recommended
that
the
county
enter
into
a
pilot
agreement,
just
like
all
the
other
tax
committees.
To
balance
that
the
I've
asked
ims
worldwide
to
provide
a
list
of
current
foreign
trade
zone
participants
and
then
going
to
cycle
back
with
a
mitch
and
his
staff
to
look
at
effectual
affected
inventory.
What
those
levels
are,
because
I
would
suspect
that
would
be
the
case
with
chicago
as
well.
K
And
when
the
county
entered
into
or
provided
the
letter
of
non-objection
for
rivago's
ftc.
There's
a
stipulation
there
that
there
is
an
existing
agreement,
namely
the
tax
abatement
agreement
for
phase
one
that
can
be
modified
to
reflect
changes
in
the
ftc
impact.
K
A
A
A
After
break,
we
still
have
bj
simon
nathan,
watkins
on
nathan.
We
discussed
how
bad
we
needed
to
do
a
10-year
plan,
and
I
know
you
had
discussed
it
with
tommy,
so
you
want
to
kind
of
fill
us
in
on
what
you're
thinking.
F
Thanks
for
the
reminder,
I
almost
have
that
down
after
a
year
and
a
half
of
doing.
F
But
we've
done
a
lot
of
planning.
It's
been
a
considerable
amount
of
money
here
at
the
city
on
developing
different
long-range
plans,
just
one
of
the
ones
that
has
served
us
best
that
I
was
talking
to
tommy
about
was
our
10-year
financial
plan.
Essentially,
what
we
did
is
we
take
all
of
our
known
values,
a
lot
of
the
same
stuff.
F
We
were
talking
about
earlier
with
midge
and
capital
appraisal,
and
then
we
have
to
add
in
all
the
value
that
we
get
from
our
380
agreements
and
other
revenue
that
we
generate
create
a
master
spreadsheet
for
all
of
that,
and
then
our
tax
rate
here
at
the
city
is
broken
up.
It's
about
50,
50,
between
maintenance
and
operations
and
interest
and
sinking,
and
once
you
take,
we
take
a
very
conservative
approach
because
of
what
we
were
just
talking
about,
we
do
have
a
volatile
tax
base
can
fluctuate,
so
we
only
take
known
value.
F
That's
on
the
ground
today
that
can't
go
away
and
we've
actually
are
considering
after
this
year
building
some
new
parameters
into
that
where
we
would
like
to
get
where
we
don't
even
count
the
storage
value
or
the
inventory
value
into
this
10-year
financial
plan,
so
that
can
fluctuate
as
much
as
it
wants
or
as
much
as
it's
going
to
without
affecting
the
long-term
health
and
our
ability
to
deliver
capital
projects
and
then
back
to
once
you
get
the
plan
developed.
F
You
apply
that
to
your
interest
and
seeking
side,
and
you
come
up
with
a
a
debt
plan
and
then
with
your
debt
plan,
and
once
you
know
how
much
taxes
you
can
dedicate
each
year
to
interest
in
seeking
an
issue
in
debt,
then
you
come
out
with
your
10-year
capital
improvement
plan
that
says
over
the
next
10
years.
Can
conceptually
we're
going
to
build
these
projects
based
off
the
needs
of
the
city
or
the
county?
We
obviously
did
the
city
here
and
then
you
and
then
you
we
publish
it.
F
We
adopt
it
formally
at
the
city
council
meeting
and,
and
we
refer
our
residents
to
it-
it's
a
tool,
hey,
you
know
what
what
are
y'all
looking
to
expand
drainage-wise
near
where
I
live.
Well,
hey!
You
know
here
in
the
capitol
plan
we've
got
20
million
dollars
dedicated
to
drainage
in
the
next
10
years.
F
F
So
it's
taking
known
values
which
won't
be
that
hard
to
get,
because
we
can
work
with
mitch's
office
to
get
a
lot
of
that
it'll
be
going
through
all
the
tax
abatement
agreements
and
building
a
master
tax
abatement
schedule
which
bj
and
his
group
or
somebody
at
the
county
may
already
have
that.
F
What's
that
you
said
city,
sorry
and
looking
all
the
revenue
that
comes
into
the
county
and
then
and
then
just
really
building
the
spreadsheet,
I'm
thinking
it's
probably
a
40
to
60
hour
project
depending
on.
F
Yeah
I
have
a
consulting
company
that
I've
I've
done.
That's
pretty
common.
A
lot
of
city
managers
consult
around
the
state
on
various
projects
and
so
yeah.
I
could
we
could
do
that
run
it
through
my
consulting
company
and
kale,
and
I
would
could
build
that
for
y'all
and
so.
F
Well,
really,
what
it
is
it's
so
we've
adopted
the
philosophy
here
and
this
some
of
it
would
take.
You
know,
interviews
and
this
kind
of
process
with
the
court
is.
We've
adopted
the
philosophy
in
the
city
that
we
wanted
to
keep
our
tax
rate
the
same,
and
we
wanted
to
build
as
much
as
many
projects
and
as
much
capital
as
we
could
without
increasing
our
tax
rate.
F
So
as
new
value
comes
on,
a
new
value
rolls
off
you
look
at
your
interest
and
sinking
side
of
your
debt
and
what
it's
going
to
take
to
service
that
and
that's
how
you
plan
it.
So
if
you
have
two
or
10
cents
available
that
dictates
and
drives
how
much
debt
you
can
go
out
and
get,
and
we
do
take
a
conservative
approach
to
that
and
we
can
take
whatever
standard
debt
issuances
the
county
may
do
for
a
long
time.
In
the
city
we
only
did
10-year
debt.
Issuances
was
as
far
as
we'd
go
out.
F
We've
changed
that
with
the
amount
of
growth
we've
got
and
we've
extended
that
to
20
years,
and
I
believe
the
plan
we
have
now
assumes
a
three
or
three
and
a
half
percent
issuant
issuance
rate,
which
obviously
we're
beating
that
the
last
dead
issuance
we
did
at
the
city
was
under
two
percent.
F
That's
great,
you
know
it's
great,
it's
basically
free
money
and
then
two.
Whenever
you
have
this
plan
as
well,
maybe
you
decide
hey
we
want
to.
We
want
to
move
some
of
the
debt
up
and
take
advantage
of
lower
rates
and
we're
going
to
go
ahead
and
instead
of
issuing
10
million
dollars
this
year,
we're
going
to
issue
two
years
worth
of
debt
and
we'll
do
20
million,
but
we
just
take
very
conservative.
You
know
if
it's
gonna
be
a
20-year
issuance
at
three
percent
rates.
F
We
build
that
in
into
the
debt
service
and
it's
and
it's
a
lot
ends
up
being
a
long-range
planning
tool.
G
F
And
I
think,
there's
a
there's
a
lot
of
other
studies
that
this
kind
of
opens
the
door
to
one
of
the
another
one
that
I've
recommended
that
served
us
well
was
a
facility
study.
So
we
went
around
and
looked
at
you
know
all
the
growth
has
come
to
the
city,
staffing
levels
and
and
what
facilities
we
were
going
to
need
to
build
to
house
the
additional
staffing
and
and
that's
why
we're
building
the
city
hall
and
it's
a
chance
really.
F
I
see
the
real
value
in
it
for
the
court
to
come
together
with
all
the
department
heads,
everybody
gets
input
in
your
capital
projects
or
your
facilities
study,
and
then
you
sit
down
and
and
create
those
additional
plans
and
projects,
and
it
creates
a
road
map
internally
and
externally
for
the
county
and
the
staff.
People
know
what
to
expect
and-
and
I
think
that's
what
has
helped
us
in
issuing
ceos
here
in
the
city.
F
Yeah
we
can
we'll
send
a
scope
and
a
proposal
over
I
would
recommend
an
hourly
not
to
exceed.
I've
talked
to
kailyn
a
little
bit
about
it.
Both
of
us
would
bill
out
at
200
an
hour
which
is
a
pretty
standard.
I
think
consulting
rate.
F
If
you
looked
at
your
engineering
rates
and
then
not
to
exceed
25
000,
if
we
get
it
done
sooner,
it'll
be
less,
but
if
it
takes
longer
to
get
the
information
and
put
things
together,
you
know
we
may
have
to
come
back
and
say:
hey
look
this
took
longer
than
expected
and
then
maybe
a
little
bit
more,
but
I
don't.
I
don't
foresee
that
happening.
A
F
Correct
so
I
went
back
and
looked
at
what
we
paid.
We
hired
an
engineering
firm
to
do
our
cip
study
and
it's
very
robust
with
maps.
Preliminary
engineering
estimates
based
off
values,
which
you
know
today.
You
know
who
knows,
but
we
paid
65
000
for
our
cip
study.
F
F
Once
you
know
your
debt
capacity
and
if
you're
going
to
be
so
our
last
one,
that
we
paid
65
000
for
was
the
development
10
years
around
150
to
175
million
dollars
in
debt.
I
think
you
made
that
determination
on
whether
or
not
you
want
to
hire
an
engineering
firm
to
do
that
or
how
far
you
want
to
carry
that,
based
on
the
total
amount
of
debt
that
you
plan
to
issue
from
the
long
range
financial
plan.
F
A
F
H
F
H
F
F
We
don't
update
ours
every
year.
You
almost
need
to
with
the
amount
of
growth
we
have
going
on,
so
we
formally
adopted
ours,
and
then
we
may
substitute
projects
in
and
out
every
year.
So
because,
once
you
have
the
plan
two,
what
it
allows
you
to
do
is
we'll
start
doing
preliminary
engineering
on
the
project
on
the
projects
that
we
know
we're
going
to
issue
debt
on
the
next
year,
we'll
try
to
get
them
to
30
or
60
percent
to
get
a
better
idea
of
the
actual
cost
on
those.
F
But
then
also
whenever
we
issue
the
debt,
the
residents
and
the
taxpayers
aren't
waiting
for.
You
know
an
entire
12-month
design
schedule
to
come
down
the
pipe
before
they
actually
see
dirt
tournament.
So
what
we
like
to
do
is
hey.
This
is
conceptually
what
we're
going
to
do.
F
H
Another
thing
I
think
we
would
end
up
shifting
some
of
our
projects
from
capital
we're
doing
a
lot
of
projects
that
are
capital
out
of
our
general
fund.
Now
yeah.
That
really
should
be
on
the
ins
side.
It
should
be
on
our
debt
side
and
stretch
that
out,
and
I
so
I
think,
we'll
probably
end
up
seeing
some
of
that
m
o
go
down,
and
you
know
the
is
go
up
a
little
bit.
F
A
A
You
know
like
asap,
okay,
so
do
you
go
ahead
and
and
do
your
bond.
F
A
F
Okay,
on
a
say,
it's
100
million
dollar
project
so
that
100
million
dollar
project
is
going
to
take
probably
just
say,
12
to
18
months
to
design
to
go
through
the
entire
get
all
your
construction
drawings
ready
to
go
out
to
bid
so
say.
Next
year
you
have
a
debt
issuance
of
10
million
dollars,
100
million
dollar
project
10
architectural
fees.
You
probably
have
10
million
dollars
in
design
fees,
but
they
can't
get
all
that
done
in
one
year.
F
So
you
can
break
that
out
over
a
roughly
a
two-year
period
and
say:
hey
we're
going
to
issue
5
million
and
start
designing
this
year
and
then
next
year,
when
we
do
a
debt
issuance
we're
gonna
issue,
another
five
million
dollars
to
finish
design
and
then
in
that
third
or
fourth
year,
when
we
know
we
have
capacity
to
issue
to
deliver
the
100
million
dollar
project
and
and
do
the
debt
service,
then
it's
ready
to
go.
You
issue
the
debt
and
you
go
to
construction.
A
G
A
A
H
F
I
like
that
idea,
no,
you
can
and,
and
you
and
that's
where
taking
the
10-year
plan
and
knowing
what
capacity
you
have
and
then
taking
your
capital
projects
plan
and
marrying
the
two.
That's
where
you
decide
on
exactly
how
you're
going
to
fund
those
projects
in
your
cip
too,
so
you've
got
different
funding
sources
that
you
incorporate
into
your
cip.
So
at
the
city
we
do
cash
projects
and
we
typically
do
around
10
to
15
million
a
year
in
cash
and
then
we're
averaging,
probably
close
to
20
million
dollars.
Now
in
debt,
issuances.
F
100
million
projects,
a
big
project-
you
know
that's
a
that's
a
expensive
project
to
fund
so
probably
would
have
a
tax
rate
increase.
I
imagine,
but
we
will
know
that
whenever
we
get
in
in
there
and
after
we
build
the
plan,
but
but
you
can
plan
for
it
over
multiple
years
to
try
to
keep
the
the
impact
on
the
taxes
to
the
to
the
voters
as
minimal
as
possible.
E
Yeah,
thank
you
guys.
I.
E
K
Have
vips
new
municipalities
do,
but
the
framework
that
nathan's
talking
about
would
be
essential,
particularly
given
the
roll-on
values
that
are
going
to
be
coming
on.
That's
been
presented
to
court
for
consideration
over
the
next.
I
guess
between
2021
and
2031,
essentially
on
average,
the
county's.
E
K
Have
approximately
940
million
dollars
of
value
going
on
per
year?
You
know
so
it's
a
there's.
K
But
starting
in
2024,
you
know
that's
what
starts
yeah
and
so
the
cip
framework
is
very
efficient
and
allows
for
you
guys
to
prioritize
and
and
the
line
debt
appropriately
as
nathan
has
mentioned.
I
think
it's
a
great
idea.
F
The
the
other
side
of
it
too,
I
don't
remember
if
commissioner
cones
or
judge-
which
one
of
you
mentioned
this,
but
using
your
cash
right
now,
doesn't
help
you
on
your
property
tax
caps.
The
higher
your
ins
is
the
39
cap
doesn't
affect
your
ins
yeah
one
of
the
things
that
we'll
look
at
and
consider
and
work
with
you
on
as
these
projects
roll
on
and
you
bring
value
on.
F
If
you
issue
debt
in
the
same
amount-
and
this
is
conceptually
if
you
issue
debt
in
the
same
amount
of
value
that
you're
bringing
on
in
new
projects,
you
can
keep
your
tax
rate
the
same,
and
you
can
protect
that
from
the
three
and
a
half
percent
cap
which
we
know
new
value
doesn't
count.
But
it's
still
there's
still
some
question
to
be
answered.
Whether
or
not
you
know
tax
payments
of
that
size.
Is
that
new
value
and
how
that's
going
to
be
calculated?
F
Yeah
well,
no,
they
they
caught
wind
of
it
this
year
and
buttoned
it
up
a
little
bit,
but
we
did
it
here.
Last
year,
our
bond
issuance
for
mblink
was
being
funded
or
being
paid.
The
debt
service
was
being
paid
out
of
mblink.
F
So
what
we
did
last
year
because
we
exceeded
the
three
and
a
half
percent
cap
was
we
just
moved
that
bond
debt
back
into
our
tax
rate
ins
side
and
and
it
kept
us
under
because
our
debt
issuances
were
higher
and
it
kept
us
under
three
and
a
half
percent.
K
Yeah,
that's
something
that
we
started:
some
dialogue,
pre-covet
about
looking
at
special
purpose,
districts
and
other
sort
of
revenue
frameworks
for
the
county
and
as
far
as
the
courthouse
project
was
concerned,
and
we
have
to
take
that
back
up
but
curious
how
municipalities
and
use
of
government
can
use
revenue
bonds
to
finance
projects.
I
know
lee
college
is
very
successful
in
funding,
deferred
maintenance
and
repairs
using
revenue,
bonds.
F
Yeah
yeah
there's
a
there's
a
lot
of
companies
out
there
that
are
pretty
creative
and
helping
with
that
too,
though,
they'll
come
in
and
you
can
guarantee
the
debt
off
the
revenue
that
you're
going
to
generate
from
the
project.
It
seems
to
be
a
successful
way
to
to
deliver
more
projects.
We
just
haven't
had
quite
the
need
here
to
go
very
far
down
that
path.
F
G
A
G
F
H
E
G
A
Chelsea,
okay,
so
chelsea
you're
up,
you
know,
that's
justin,
crainer.
L
The
vacation
policy
that
we
currently
have
based
on
years
of
experience
and
kind
of
combined
the
hours
that
they
would
receive
for
vacation
as
well
as
what
they
would
receive
sickly
for
a
year
and
the
one
eight
hour
personal
day
that
they
get
a
year
and
combined
it
all
and
divided
it
by
26.
So
they
would
actually
technically
be
working
and
earning
all
this
pto
on
a
bi-weekly
basis.
L
I
have
set
a
cap
per
based
on
years
of
experience
as
to
how
much
hours
that
they
would
get
per
year.
So
that's
what
the
top
part
is
based
on
years
of
experience
for
service
for
the
cap,
how
much
you
would
earn
per
pay
period?
They
would
start
earning
it
on
the
first
day
of
full
time
and
for
employment,
but
they
can't
use
it
until
after
90
days
of
employment,
plus
we
also
added
in
that
they
would
be
able
to
use
per
se
borrow
16
hours
worth
in
advance
if
they
needed
to.
L
L
L
A
L
D
L
L
So,
for
instance,
I
did
mine
okay,
just
for
spike
here,
202
hours,
0.75
hours
of
sick
leaves
what
I
have
in
the
bank,
currently
76
hours
of
vacation,
plus
my
eight
hours
of
personal.
That
would
make
my
total
286.75
well
based
on
my
years
here,
I'm
in
the
five
year
to
10
year
bracket.
So
my
cap
is
224.,
so
since
I'm
over
the
224
I
know
I
have
I
just
put
a
year
limit.
L
J
G
L
Right
that
way
for
hr
standpoint,
this
would
be
so
much
easier
to
keep
up
with
on
time
sheets.
Yes,
whether
you
have
it
or
you,
don't
I'm
constantly
having
to
call
departments
and
say:
hey
so-and-so,
you
don't
have
enough
sick
leave.
What
else
do
you
want
to
use
instead?
That
would
eliminate
that
just
called
one
of
those
exactly
this
would
still
go.
A
J
A
A
D
L
H
G
H
A
D
A
D
D
D
And
I
think
we
need
to.
I
know:
we've
got
some
hot
tax
and
you
know
I
understand
the
20
million,
but
there's
lots
of
things
like
some
of
this
stuff
from
mental
health
in
the
jails.
I'd
like
to
see
a
budget
on
that,
and
you
know,
we've
got
our
hospital
district
looking
at
it.
You
know
it
just
seems
like
it's
just
a
money
tree,
but
that
money
tree
will
last
forever.
You
know.
D
I'm
open
to
that.
I
think
we
may
would
like
to
discuss
the
hospital
district
stuff
a
little
bit.
A
So
what
if
we
budget
anything
in
the
hot
pond.
J
H
A
D
A
H
Okay,
actually,
commissioner
hammond
had
been
looking.
He
did
this
because
I've
worked
on
some
other
stuff.
Looking
at
improving
that
ramp.
A
H
H
H
H
So
at
first
I
thought
man
that
just
don't
sound
like
a
good
idea
whatsoever,
because
all
we're
doing
is
shifting
the
burden
from
one
tax
to
another.
But
then,
when
you
look
back
at
it,
you
look
at
the
rates
you
look
at,
where
they're
really
putting
their
money
at
and
where
they're
servicing
they're
servicing
the
west
side.
F
H
Us
in
the
west
side,
central
and
a
little
bit
over
on
east
county
and
they
are
making
up
the
differences
with
grant
money
and
with
the
tax
base,
so
it
could
be
probably
proven
in
that.
Actually
the
taxpayers
in
central
county
are
subsidizing
that
hospital
district
serving
the
integer
in
the
west
side
and
in
east
county.
So
that's
how
in
my
mind,
I
could
justify
making
that
swap.
It
would
cut
the
tax
rates
in
central
county.
It's
not
going
to
change
a
thing
of
what
we're
doing
anywhere
else.
H
You
know
people
we
collect
more
tax
on
the
west
side,
because
there's
more
sales
and
more
activity
over
there,
but
people
in
central
county
shop
in
west
county
I
mean
they
go
to
bellevue.
They
go
to
heb,
that's
right!
So
I
mean
I
don't
know,
that's
how
I
personally
could
get
my
grips
around
about
possibly
going
along
with
that
some.
G
Don't
know
maybe
750
you
know,
or
even
a
million
at
the
most
but
not
1.5.
But
when
you
look
at
taking
what
you
said
was
spot
on
billy
and
I
concur
I'm
I'm
on
the
same
page
with
you
and
that's
the
way
I
see
it
too
and
at
first
I
didn't
mean
jimmy
talked
about
it.
You
know,
and
I
we
visited
probably
30.
D
Minutes
on
the
front
more
numbers,
I
think
the
numbers
he
followed
up
with
were
cleared
and
then
explained
the
underinsured
and
not
insured,
not
just
the
engine,
because
when
he
first
threw
it
as
he
had
it
all
lumped
together
and
he
broke
it
out.
Very
good.
42
percent
on
the
west
side,
x-men
percent
here
and
a
little
representative.
D
E
C
H
G
A
D
A
A
D
You
you
sent
it
to
me
because
he
mike
called
me,
and
I
told
him
that
you
would
just
send
it
to
me.
C
D
A
All
right:
let's,
since
we
don't
have
quorum,
4,
10,
pm
court's
adjourned
in
executive
budget
workshop,
okay,.