►
From YouTube: CHAOSS GMD Workgroup July12 2018
Description
CHAOSS bi-weekly Growth-Maturity-Decline Work Group Meeting
A
I
think
I
think
oftentimes
when
one
records
that
the
meeting
is
more
might
be
more
fruitful,
I,
don't
say
our
meeting
won't
be
fruitful.
I
want
to
curse
it,
but
I'm
saying
one
of
the
things
that
we
need
to
work
on
as
getting
Community
Managers
engaged
in
this
and
I'm
hoping
the
trip
to
Portland
is
going
to
help
get
people
about
three
and
two
to
twenty
seven.
B
A
A
C
A
Crap
I
saw
that
D&I
meeting
come
across
the
radar
and
I
did
not
put
it
on
the
calendar,
cuz
I'm
stupid,
so
you
can
watch
the
recording,
yeah
yeah
I'm
sure
it
was
an
excellent
meeting.
So
the
things
we
looked
at
last
time
were
a
couple
of
pull
requests
that
hey
Suz
put
together
and
we
talked
about
velocity
and
the
difference
between
velocity
and
community
growth
and
and
that
distinction
and
the
importance
of
tracking.
A
Been
some
discussion
on
the
mailing
list
and
in
our
monthly
meeting
about
difference
between
engineering
and
the
growth
of
or
getting
people
to
use
a
metric.
So
that
was
the
discussion
and
the
monthly
meeting
a
couple
days
ago,
and
then
he
sent
out
a
nice
summary
email
at
NAT
and
I
and
I.
Think
if
you
other
folks
responded
to
so
he
sicced
you
have
a
preference
about
where
we
start.
E
D
D
The
rest
is
more
important
from
my
point
of
view,
which
is
why
this
metric
is
important,
and
here
is
where
I
agree
with
Penn
that
proposed
the
metric
that
this
gives
you
a
lot
of
information
about,
whether
or
not
only
if
the
plate
is
growing
or
not,
but
whether
the
crate
is
becoming
stable,
maybe
because
there
is
no
more
less
interesting
stuff
to
do
or
even
need
to
start
into
the
client.
So
from
the
point
of
view
of
growth,
Authority
be
kind.
D
D
But
in
addition
is
if
the
thing
is
related
to
activity,
it
is
a
good
metric
for
learning
about
the
English
stage.
The
project
is
I
mean
it
is
growing
in
the
in
that
case,
at
what
place
it
is
growing.
It
is
maturing
because
you
see
that
metric
is
starting
to
start,
or
you
know
like
like
a
patrol,
or
things
seems
to
be
quite
similar
to
the
month
before
or
whether
the
point
is
started
to
the
client,
because
activity
is
declining,
maybe
because
they
played
maturity
enough.
There
is
no
need
for
additional
functionality
forever.
D
A
So
it's
it
seems
like
the
velocity
and
acceleration
are
ways
to
express,
but
I
think
of
his
meta
constructs
that
transcend
a
lot
of
the
metrics.
So
when
we
think
about
it
on
augur
one
of
the
reasons
that
we
show
the
one
reasons
the
time
is
baked
into
the
way
that
we
represent
metrics
is
because
that
helps
people
see
the
trend,
the
acceleration
or
the
deceleration
in
the
context
of
their
projects
in
a
fairly
straightforward,
visual
way
velocity.
A
You
know
if
I'm
like
at
some
point:
what
does
what
does
velocity
mean
in
the
context
of
my
project,
because
when
I'm,
if
I'm
hypothetically
running
a
community
I'm
more
interested
in
knowing
what
the
change
over
time
is,
is
there
are
there
Peaks?
Other
valleys?
Are
people
leaving
the
project,
and
there
was
some
discussion
about
the
last
time
about
the
number
of
contributors
versus
the
volume
of
contribution.
A
D
In
any
case,
one
when
you're,
comparing
to
your
own
project,
I,
think
that
all
of
these
metrics
make
sense.
When
you
are
comparing
to
all
the
projects.
Maybe
you
need
to
having
to
count
the
size,
at
least
for
velocity,
because
the
number
of
commits
per
month,
for
instance,
for
big
projects
are
usually
going
to
be
much
bigger
than
for
a
very
small
project.
D
So
that's
interesting
because
when
you're
thinking
about
comparing
projects
and
I'm
trying
to
find
metrics
that
allow
you
to
compare
the
different
stages
for
projects
which
are
very
different,
maybe
our
acceleration
could
be
better
and
velocity
and
velocity
should
be
taking
relative
to
size
or
something
like
that.
If
you
want
to
compare
yeah.
A
B
A
D
The
one
been
started
to
open
these
issues.
The
idea
was
to
help
like
higher
level
metrics
on
top
of
the
VC
ones
that
we
have
now
and
he
proposed
it
is
one
of
one
of
those.
So
maybe
we
could
just
open
me
new
descriptions
like
if
you
remember
what
commenting
about
having
the
most
meta,
matrix
or
higher
level,
metrics
or
yeah.
B
D
A
Context
I
agree,
so
we
just
would
create
a
markdown
document
explaining
meta
metrics
as
they
as
they
really
become
I.
Think
so,
if
I
have
a
meta
metric
like
this
I
think
about
it
as
metadata
about
metrics,
and
so
we
want
to
describe
what
these
things
are.
In
the
case
of
a
lot
of
the
metadata
that
we
are
choosing
to
describe
about
metrics,
it's.
D
D
This
is,
this
relates
to
will
be
toward
Daniel
Daniel
Freeman
said
about
a
considering
the
snapshot
matrix,
a
matrix
that
you
can
measure
from
time
to
time
as
time
serious.
You
know
there
would
be
things
that
we
can
apply
off
on
those
case
of
matrix.
It
can
be
understood
as
a
time
series
you
can
always
compute
the
velocity
and
acceleration
yeah.
A
D
A
D
In
any
case
of
acceleration
itself
is
also
time
serious
in
the
sense
that
you
can
calculate
acceleration
over
time
and
you
can
find
out
which
periods,
for
instance,
acceleration
is
positive
or
is
negative,
and
they
sit
on
that.
You
can
find
out
when
the
great
describe
in
a
wooden
crate
is
declining.
Just
by
looking
at
how
acceleration
Boreas
over
time.
A
D
A
D
And
the
way
the
wetland
are
framed
it
if
you
look
at
it,
it
was
more
like
and
it
says,
development
speed,
and
it
says
this
meta
metric
can
be
relative
in
compared
to
separate
periods
or
two
points.
Imperator
can
be
busy
blah
blah
blah
and
then
the
next
thing
the
finance
data
use
cases,
because
that
were
that's
where
he
relates
the
metric
to
some
use
for
the
metric
I.
A
D
I
mean
we
can
discuss
this
thing.
I
want
the
name
in
a
velocity
or
acceleration,
and
talking
about
this
is
really
a
way
of
expressing
time
series,
and
so
on.
I
mean
all
of
this
discussion
that
we
have
in
now
talking.
We
can
either
follow
up
in
the
issue
or
gasps
move
the
issue
to
a
markdown
and
maybe
have
the
discussion
elsewhere.
I.
A
Think,
starting
with
I
think
taking
the
issue
and
working
on
a
markdown
document
seems
like
I,
guess
the
only
the
only
we
could
attach
the
certain
thing
about
the
pregnant
pragmatically.
How
we
do
how
we
have
a
discussion
about
a
markdown
document.
If
it
exists,
do
we
create
a
draft
of
it
and
then
put
it
in
the
repository
as
a
pull
request
point
and
allow
commenting
on
that.
A
There's
a
there's
like
a
level
of
work,
probably
to
that
I'm
thinking
needs
to
be
done
to
create
the
markdown
and
develop
it
enough
to
propose
it
as
a
and
maybe
that's
something
that
we
could
do
I'm
just
trying
I'm
talking
a
lot
or
anything.
How
can
we
like
in
a
lot
of
contexts,
I'll,
do
collaborative
editing
on
you
know
overly
for
a
Google
Doc
and
to
work
something
like
this
out
and
I'm
trying
to
think
of
the
right
github
way
to
do
that
so
I.
D
B
D
We
have
a
first
version
of
it
if
somebody
opposes
that
spec
because
of
a
comment
in
the
pull
request
itself,
and
then
we
discuss
in
the
pull
request,
whatever
the
comment
that
can
be
addressed
or
not
or
whatever,
and
until
we
reach
some
consensus
and
that's
the
version
that
we
are,
we
we
could
follow
that
procedure
and
we
can
yeah.
They.
A
B
D
D
B
A
B
A
Me
it's
a
little
bit
different
than
what
I
had
in
my
mind
for
the
construct
of
velocity
and
I'm.
Not
sure
I
completely
understand
the
logic
there
like.
It
would
seem
that
a
project
would
have
to
function
in
a
particular
way
for
code
commits
over
code.
Direct
code,
merge,
duration
to
have
have
meaning
so.
D
B
D
Okay,
one
is
ever
getting
commits
over
time,
basically,
and
the
other
one
is
getting
commits.
Compare
it
to
something
like,
in
this
case,
God
mercy
racing,
which
is
what
they
are
talking
about
and
I
find
both
are
telling
different
stories
and,
and
maybe
the
one
that
pain
is
proposing.
We
should
stick
to
what
he
is
proposing
and
forget
a
bit
about
the
other
thing
and
even
with
a
different
name.
A
D
Maybe
what
do
you
think?
Maybe
we
could
have
both
of
them
and
try
to
convince
them
for
some
projects
and
see
what
the
duration
there
seems
to
be
some
correlation
of
not
because
they,
the
two
concepts,
seems
to
be
to
some
extent
similar,
but
they
are
they
act
in
them.
So
it
I
think
that
what
bad
things
is
that
both
are
capturing
different
information
about
the
project,
because
you
know
that
the
usual
way
of
thinking
is,
as
the
near
human
said.
Velocity
is,
as
the
number
of
the
Mitzvah
time.
B
D
A
D
A
B
B
D
A
D
So,
in
fact,
Ben
is
is
saying
exactly
that
when,
when
the
next
rule
he
says
development
acceleration,
this
simply
compares
a
local
speed
into
the
propulsion
time
right.
Exactly
the
idea
of
acceleration,
so
I
think
maybe
maybe
the
warden
is
a
bit
difficult
field
because
he
is
not
meaning
velocity,
but
different
kind
of
thing.
Mm-Hmm.
A
D
A
A
D
D
And
in
the
template
that
we
had,
it
is
the
script
in
use
cases,
formula,
filtering,
visualization,
sample
implementation
on
implementation,
aesthetic,
a
test
cases,
so
it's
quite
similar
to
what
he
has.
The
order
is
a
bit
different,
really
I'm
going
to
try
to
write
it
that
way,
and
then
we
can
interact
in
the
pull
request
and
if
you
feel
or
if
anybody
else
feels
like,
we
should
be
dealing
with
it
in
a
different
way.
Yes,
let's
let's
discuss
your
proposal.
A
D
B
D
B
B
D
D
B
D
A
Yeah,
there's
there's
I
think
most
of
the
time.
When
we're
talking
about
organizations,
we
really
mean
the
people
who
who
do
you
work
for
and
who's
paying
you
and
that's
that's
what
we
mean
by
organization,
but
because
github
has
this
notion
of
organization
I,
think
there's
cheese
yeah
and
same
on
the
other
one
yeah.
A
D
So,
in
our
case,
we
have
this
sorry
hand,
tool
that
uses
different
approaches
depending
on
the
on
the
scenario
and
usually
it
tries
to
capture
the
idea
of
organization
that
the
create
hands,
but
it's
very
much
time
consuming
and
in
many
cases
you
cannot
automate
it
because
you
need
assistance
from
the
plate
itself.
So
I
agree
with
in
the
cases
were
the
data
souls
two
bytes
information
related
to
that,
like
the
github,
for
instance.
Maybe
we
could
use
that
and,
and
that
could
be
an
old
to
the
definition.
D
E
D
A
D
A
Unless
you
disagree
but
I,
it's
it's
a
point
of
confusion,
because
when
people
are
very
accustomed
to
github
and
nothing
else,
when
you
say
organization,
the
first
thing
they
think
of
as
a
github
organization,
but
most
of
the
people
I
think
in
this
community.
When
they
we
mean
the
thing
we
were
just
talking
about.
Yeah.
D
E
D
A
D
That,
since
this
is
in
fact
generate
to
any
metric
using
organizations,
maybe
we
could
have
a
kind
of
a
footnote
or
something
in
the
table.
They
are
saying
we
refer
to
organisations,
we
are
not
referring
to
github
organisations
I
initially,
why
deploy
it
understands
them
or
something
like
that?
I
think.
A
B
A
D
Okay,
it's
now
issue
number
16
and
I
am
assigning
it
to
myself,
so
that
I
can
check
it
later.
Okay,
at
the
file
and
I
would
really
pull
pull
request
in
the
change
at
least
to
this
file,
but
I
would
be
reviewing
some
other
files
just
in
case.
We
should
be
writing
the
clarification
in
some
other
places.
B
D
Yeah
I
I
was
thinking
about
it
and
and
I'm
completely,
not
sure,
but
the
main
thing
is
maybe
we
should
be
talking
about
the
time
period
on
something
in
all
the
places
and
it's
again
the
same
issue
as
before.
Should
we
should
we
be
discussing
this
at
the
level
of
the
list
of
metrics
or
at
the
level
of
the
description
of
the
metrics
the,
since
this
is
the
detail
description
so
I
find
it
it's
more
convenient
to
discuss
it
here.
So
basically,
I
agree
with
you.
A
D
A
I
dreamt
of
having
that
as
a
thing
but
I,
don't
think
I,
don't
think
I
know
of
what
it
would
be
I
wonder
if
I
wonder
if
you've
talked
about
filters
and
I'm
thinking
of
it
as
parameters,
we
had
a
long
email
discussion
about
that.
Yeah
and
I.
Think
I
wonder
if,
if
this
becomes
part
of
the
description
of
these
velocity
and
acceleration
meta
metrics
that
mm-hmm,
that
that
there's
necessarily
a
dimension
of
time,
that
I
mean
it's.
Not
it's
not
guarant.
A
You
know
it's
not
a
a
priori
decision
that
all
velocity
and
acceleration
is
going
to
be
evaluated
in
one
week
window
or
one
month
window
or
a
60
day
window.
Then
addressing
the
windows
I
call
it
I,
guess
I
called
window
size
because
that's
what
you
call
it
addressing
the
window
size
is,
is
a
meta
construct
related
to
velocity
and
acceleration.
D
A
And
it
can
be
specified
when
you
implement
a
metric
and
maybe
in
the
metric
implementation.
We
would
want
people
to
say
and
I
think
you
have
that
in
there
you'd
want
people
to
indicate
when
they
deploy
something,
what
the
what
that
window
is,
and
there
could
be
various
ways
of
doing
it.
There
won't
be
a
cup
or
an
now.
A
B
D
D
A
D
A
D
A
D
D
A
D
B
C
Premise
is
just
to
provide
start
to
demonstrate
the
rigor
that
is
being
done
around
either
identifying
metrics
and
that
can
be
as
simple
as
just
a
citation.
So
this
is
a
this
metric
comes
from
Goggins
article.
You
know
they
took
a
look
at
this
BAM
whatever
so
just
provide
a
citation.
You
just
thought
what's
currently
happening.
That's.
A
D
C
Think
one
of
the
things
that
Danielle's
talking
about
still
release
weight
brings
forward
backwards.
Hey
perhaps
there's
a
paper
that
has
talked
about
this
metric
and
just
like
this
form
item
evidence
so
I
mean
I.
Think
if
we
think
about
this
from
an
academic
paper
perspective,
if
you
think
we're
gonna
go
look
for
items
a
B
and
C
some
text,
it
just
at
least
provides
little.
A
E
D
C
So
I
think
that's
that's
one
area
where
we
can
easily
provide
some
rigor,
some
methodological
rigor,
I
think
the
other
is
what
hey
soos.
What
you
did
put
out
yesterday
to
the
man
list,
which
was
a
more
systematic
survey
of
how
these
metrics
are
being
used
in
practice,
which
is
a
different
I,
think
a
different
method
than
why
these?
Why
are
these
metrics
important
in
the
first
place,.
C
D
The
academic
community,
there
is
some
discussion
on
to
look
extend
if
you
forget
a
bit
about
source
code
analysis
if
the
rest
of
the
metric
system
body
actually
using
them
or
not.
In
fact,
there
wasn't
a
special
issue
or
fights
of
the
software,
which
was
basically
with
this
and
in
fact
it's
going
to
be
published,
I
think
in
the
next
term.
That's.
D
The
father,
which
was
specifically
about
supportable
of
a
matrix
I,
think,
is
the
name
and
it's
to
be
published
because
I
think
the
results
of
the
papers
were
early
this
year,
so
it
should
be
published
during
the
last
part
of
this
year.
I
think,
and
it's
specifically
about
use
cases
of
metrics
in
industry.
I
know
because
I
submitted
I
was
not
accepted.
That
I
submitted
and
under
the
durational
for
the
especially
issue
was
many
people
think
their
metrics
are
not
really
using
it
in
industry,
stead
for
source
code
analysis
right.
D
So
we
want
you
to
learn.
If
there
are
people
who
can
submit
use
cases
of
metrics
and
and
especially
to
a
specific
level
that,
since
we
have
a
lot
of
people
from
industry,
both
in
in
cares
and
in
the
in
the
leaders,
condition
events
in
general,
maybe
we
could
try
to
find
out
which
cane
of
metrics
they
are
using
and
as
a
second
step,
which
kind
of
matrix
they
will
lock.
They
would
like
to
have
to
use,
and
they
don't
have,
because
you
can
have
the
software
over.
D
D
D
That
could
be
as
like
the
starting
point
that
I
was
asking
for,
because
my
impression
is
that
the
first
point
is
to
now
what
to
ask
I
mean
if
you
just
ask
people
are
using
metrics
or
something
that
the
question
is
too
broad.
You
should
be
trying
to
focus
if
your
service
is
providing
this
evidence,
that's
nice,
because
then
we
can
focus
on.
You
know
more
concrete
questions,
so
I
would
be
happy
to
work
with
you,
or
maybe
you
can
just
post
in
the
Middle
East,
because
maybe
there
are
some
other
people
interested
well.
A
B
A
I
thought
I
think
because
I
think
when
I've
talked
to
community
managers
in
other
contexts,
they
do
they
do
have
an
interest
in
these
other
kinds
of
metrics
that
are
not
entirely
source
code.
Based.
It's
true
that
source
code
metrics
are
still
the
lingua
franca
of
evaluating
an
open-source
project,
but
I
think
things
like
community
size
and
how
people
communicate
about
issues
influenced
newcomer
uptake
and
I.
Think
I
think
everybody
wants
to
capture
the
newcomers
and
issues
are
where
people
start
so
understanding
where
they,
for
example,
get
a
newcomer
to
transit.
A
D
What's
that
and-
and
they
can
say,
I
would
like
to
have
that
or
not,
but
in
the
case
of
software
development
metrics
apart
from
commits
a
month
or
something
like
that,
people
really
don't
care
now
what
measure
and
how
it
only
very
specific
people
and
many
of
them
we
have
them
count.
So
that's
why
Servine
people
in
cows
are
related
to
people
who
already
thought
on
metrics
is
especially
important
because
they
they're
MA
as
most
of
mystic
ated
and
their
than
the
mean
community
manager,
for
instance,
I.
D
A
A
A
C
B
A
D
A
That's
that's
really
that
my.
That
is
the
reason
I'm
going
because
I
care
about
understanding
the
diversity
and
inclusion
tension
with
growth,
maturity
and
decline,
metrics,
because
I
think
there
is
one
right,
but
my
hidden
agenda
is
recruiting
Community
Managers
into
the
dark
world
that
we
live
in.