►
From YouTube: CHAOSS Value Working Group 1/13/22
Description
Links to minutes from this meeting are on https://chaoss.community/participate.
A
Welcome
everyone
welcome
to
the
chaos
valley,
working
group
meeting
of
january
13th
first
meeting
of
this
year.
So
first
thing
in
the
agenda
is
fear.
Metric
which
saw
sean
was
supposed
to
give
us
some
update,
but
he's
not
here,
so
we
can.
If
anyone
has
any
update,
we
can
proceed
or
we
can
skip
that
yeah.
I
don't
have
any
update
on
that.
A
Okay,
so
the
second
one
was
stephen,
was
supposed
to
share
academic
os
point
ospo
collaboration
or
something
that
was
in
the
agenda
in
the
last
meeting.
So.
B
I
can
I
can
do
some
quick
updates.
I
guess.
B
B
My
emails,
but
anna
runs
the
dora
pride
dora
community,
the
ora
declaration
on
research
assessment
and
they
received
a
1.2
million
dollar
grant
to
work
on
metrics
and
analytics
and
build
a
dashboard
and
a
pool
kit,
which
often
seems
to
me
a
bunch
of
texts
and
boilerplates
talk
about
how
to
talk
about
these
types
of
people
versus
building
software.
Traders,
like
we
need,
say,
toolkit
so
they're
in
that
process.
They
had
a
couple
of
meetings
and
I
shared
a
bunch
of
stuff
with
you
folks
from
those
meetings.
B
C
B
They
they
named
the
foundation.
I
can't
remember
it
all
okay,
but
it's
it's
right
on
the
website.
If
you
drop
in
your
favorite
search
engine
d-o-r-a
space
t-a-r-a,
because
their
dashboard
effort
is
called
tara,
you
should
be
able
to
see
the
stuff
there.
Okay
and-
and
you
know,
I
think
folks-
should
really
look
at
the
organization-
if
not,
if
not
the
overall
organization's
website,
which
is
pretty
rich
at
least
looking
at
what
they're
doing
with
tara
and
where
they
are
and
what
the
production
timeline
is.
B
C
C
B
And
then
the
other
piece
that
kind
of
relates
to
this
is
the
national
academies
of
science,
engineering
and
medicine
and
doing
the
larger,
open
scholarship,
open
science
community
of
practice
they
haven't
picked
their
first
meeting
yet
originally
they
said
it
was
going
to
be
february
now
they're
bleeding
into
february
or
march,
but
I
do
know
from
conversations
with
them
that
they're
up
to
a
list
of
60
some
odd
participating
organizations.
B
There
are
four
presidents
who
are
driving
this
ship
and
one's
the
president
of
hopkins
once
the
president
of
asu
one
is
the
president
of
a
small
liberal
arts
college
that
I'm
flanking
on,
and
one
is
the
president
of
one
of
the
hbcus
so
and
apparently
one
of
the
big
delays
in
picking
the
date
is
trying
to
find
a
common
time
and
for
university.
President
calendars
accept
the
first
meeting.
C
C
Gotcha,
okay,
I
don't
know,
are
you
part
of
that
group,
so
I'm
I'm
rit's
rep
to
that?
Okay,
so
can
so
you'll
be
like
the
liaison,
for
example
right
I
will.
I
will
certainly
you
know,
make
mention.
B
C
I
think
one
of
the
important
things
in
like
these
I've
been
finding
in
these
types
of
conversations
is
kind
of
expressing
that,
like
the
work
we
do
in
chaos
is
to
help
like
document
what
people
need
like.
We
don't
know
what
people
need,
but
we
have
processes
by
which
we
can
document
and
share
the
work
of
others.
That's
what
we
do
so
like
our
list
of
metrics
is
not
you
get
the
idea.
It's
not
like
some
like
single
idea
from
some
single
person.
C
B
B
Is
going
to
be
allowed
to
say
in
the
first
meeting,
that's
true:
I
would
anticipate
knowing
that
there
are
16
people
there.
None
of
who
know
each
other
that
they're
going
to
ask
us
ideally
ask
us,
rather
than
create
on
their
own
some
kind
of
directory
document,
where
there's
a
paragraph
or
two
people
talk
about
what
they're
doing.
B
C
C
B
B
You
know
I
will
you
know,
I
don't
know
whether
whether
we
get
to
pick
pick
them
or
we're
assigned
to
them
and
whether
we
can
only
do
one
or
whether
we
can
do
multiples,
but
certainly
anything
touching
on
you
know,
analytics
and
metrics
of
academic
performance.
Certainly
I'm
going
to
try
to
get
involved.
C
So
that
sounds
good.
It
sounds
quite
similar
to
like
the
oscilloplus
plus
stuff,
like
there's
like
some
like
administrative
and
infrastructural
work.
C
That's
needed
to
be
done
over
the
first
year
before
we
can
even
talk
about
like
connecting
with,
for
example,
the
chaos
project
to
document
the
metrics
that
are
critical
in
that
space
like,
but
I
mean
it
seems
like
in
asphalt,
plus
plus
a
lot
of
the
conversations
really
have
been
about
onboarding
new
universities
they've
been
about
like
just
creating
a
cohort
of
people,
first
yeah
and
then,
and
that's
good
and
appropriate
work
right.
Oh
it's
great
work,
but
like
we're,
the
chaos
project
is
more
we're
more
in
the
details
than
like
the
implementation.
C
Details
of
this
is
what
university
ospos
want
to
see
to
help
articulate
whatever
the
rpt
process
or
how
softwork
plays
a
role
in
that,
and
then
we
can
talk
to
folks,
like
you
and
say
carlos
at
uc,
santa
cruz
and
the
folks
at
yeah.
B
B
The
president
of
the
university
engaged
has
to
sign
on
to
certain
things,
and
so
it's
they
they
have
to
sign
on.
Yes,
my
university
will
engage
in
these
practices.
I
will
make
sure
this
work
gets
highlighted
across
the
university,
and
here
is
the
person
who's
actually
going
to
do
the
work
right?
Okay,
so
carlos
and
his
folks
can't
just
say:
oh
yeah,
we'll
we'll
go
to
this
and
represent
santa
cruz
right.
They
have
to
convince
the
president
to
buy
in
and
then
have
him
designate
them.
Gotcha.
C
So,
just
a
as
a
for
like
elizabeth
and
venat,
I
think
at
least
this
is
how
I'm
seeing
a
lot
of
this
academic
engagement.
Kind
of
playing
out
is
that,
like
in
the
corporate
space,
ospo's
are
obviously
way
further
along,
like
they're,
they're,
old
and
they've
been
around
for
a
while,
and
we
work
with
a
lot
of
corporate
corporate
partners
and
community
members
who
are
at
the
point
where
they
can
ask
pretty
detailed
questions
about
community
health
and
those
questions
could
be
around
dei.
C
Those
questions
could
be
around
like
value
or
they
could
be
around
risk.
You
know
whatever
they
might
be
so
because
they've
had
these
ospos
running
for
whatever
10
years.
You
know
what
I
mean
they've
been
around
and
they're
at
the
point
where
they
can
ask
these
types
of
questions
in
the
university
side.
C
It's
it
kind
of
feels
like
it's
where
the
corporations
were
10
years
ago,
like
they
they're
just
forming
the
ospos
they're
just
coalescing,
and
to
ask
a
question
like
what
is
the
specific
metric
or
metrics
model
that
we
should
have
it's
it's
like
the
it's
true
to
be
asking
that
question.
Like
there's.
There's
formulation
work
that
needs
to
be
done
so
from
a
chaos
perspective.
My
guess
is
that
we
like,
as
as
steven
has
been
keeping
us,
super
well
posted.
B
B
Open
source
in
and
of
itself
right,
it's
it's
coming
from
this
trickle
down
of
the
academic
and
research
world,
really
pushing
much
harder
on
open
everything
and
then,
as
a
byproduct
saying,
we
need
to
rethink
how
we
measure
and
reward
work
in
rpt,
because
a
lot
of
you
know
we
have
to
incentivize
people
to
do
the
open
work
that
isn't
all
driven.
It's
just
getting
it.
C
B
So
it
depends
on
who's
there
right
different
universities
or
different
places,
and
dora
dora's
been
around.
For
I
don't
know,
I
don't
remember
how
long
when
they
first
were.
I
mean
they.
First
were
just
a
group
of
people
who
got
together
to
write
a
declaration
which
is
the
the
main
right
on
the
website
to
say
this
is
broken
right.
So
it's
what's
been
happening
is
that
there
have
been
small,
smaller
groups
like
dora
and
some.
B
Journal
articles
and
conferences
right
and
there's
there's
all
these
different
models
on
the
website
and
stuff.
So
there's
been
this
kind
of
various
splinter
groups:
individual
universities,
occasionally
an
entire
universe
at
the
university
chains
since
they're
state-driven,
not
independent
in
some
country.
Right,
so
there's
been
this
undercurrent
of
people
saying
hey.
We
need
to
fix
this.
There's
been
lots
of
people
trying
to
fix
it.
B
Yes,
intellectually.
I
totally
agree
with
this
that
says,
professor
whoever,
but
I
don't
have
the
kind
of
cycles
push
for
my
university
to
actually
do
this
stuff
right,
so
open
science,
a
lot
of
it-
and
this
is
a
very
broad
statement,
but
across
the
overall
world
of
academia,
it's
kind
of
like
been
building
the
cap
right.
Everybody
thinks
it's
a
good
idea,
but
most
people
don't
do
anything.
B
Even
though
they've
had
things
like
the
human
genome
project
and
other
things
pointing
to
the
fact
you
know
it's
a
really
good
idea
right
right.
So
so
now
now
the
government's
come
in
and
the
funders
come
in.
They
start
to
put
some
weight
behind
it,
and
now
here
comes
coke
and
covet
has
just
accelerated
everything
right.
B
B
C
B
Don't
rise,
I
will
be
able
to
send
out
a
save
the
date
in
two
to
four
weeks
for
a
conference
up
here
in
september.
D
B
C
B
D
E
E
B
Yeah,
I
think
that's
right.
The
only
thing
holding
me
back
from
getting
going
on
this
to
save
the
date
and
then
starting
to
try
to
flesh
out
what
this
thing
should
look
like
is.
B
I'll
get
c
funding,
probably
in
the
next
two
weeks,
because
the
university
won't.
Let
me
the
university
won't
sign
contracts
for
hotels
and
stuff
around
the
conference
until
they
know
the
money's
in
the
bank
to
start
with,
of
course.
So
I
think
I
will
have
that
chain
of
events
completed
by
the
month
of
first
week
of
february.
B
And
then
then
I'll
start
being
able
to
work
on
it.
B
Well,
that
would
be.
That
would
be
my
hope
exactly
because
you
folks
and
your
experience
in
metrics
in
general,
as
sean
said.
B
Once
I've
got
contract
signed,
hopefully
see
if
you
know
I'll,
be
able
to
pursue
more
money
for
stuff
like
travel,
funding
and
stuff
like
that.
B
B
One
is
a
reception
at
the
magic
center,
which
is
our
30
million
dollar
multimedia
and
film
and
game
production
studio
that
we
built
a
couple
years
ago,
which
is
a
great
toy
place
to
come,
see
and
the
second
one
that's
required
is
a
two
or
three
hour
appetizers
and
run
around
in
the
strong
national
museum
of
play.
C
The
museum
of
what
play
the
largest
collection
of
toys
games
tell
me
about.
B
This
is
my:
I
have
a
scholar
and
residence
position
there
and
it's
cool
and
I'm
not
sure
whether
by
no
no
by
the
following
we're
going
to
be
building
on
another
edition
for
more
exhibits
that
won't
be
ready,
but
even
the
exhibits
that
are
there
this
week
right
on
and
that
that
that
include
that
that
usually
includes
tours
through
the
archive
areas
which
friends
I
have
taken
through.
B
C
B
So
in
terms
of
the
arcade
machines
and
the
pinball
machines,
they
have
have
hundreds
and
the
ones
that
aren't
too
rare
that
have
to
be
preserved
just
for
scholarships
and
scholars,
and
research
and
they're
always
rotating
and
off
off
floor.
So
there's
always
an
arcade.
There's
video
game
machines
everywhere.
There's
it's
a
thing
you
can.
You
can
put
a
link
in
the
notes
if
you
want
to,
I
won't,
but
it's
it's
a
good
place.
C
This
is
a
yep,
so
this
is
a
metric
that
was
brought
forward
in
asia,
pacific
hall.
Yesterday,
okay
and
sean,
you
seem
to
kind
of
understand
what
the
angle
was
here.
Do
you
want
to.
E
Yeah,
I
think
the
the
most
interesting
or
critical
part
are
the
ways
that
they're
awaiting
different
types
of
engagement
down
here
so
count
of
d0,
which
I
don't
know
what
that
is.
But
I
guess
those
those
first
three
are
activity
metrics
that
I
exist
in
the
literature
by
the
looks
of
it
and
then
there's
org
count
issue
count
common
frequency,
so
these
are
all
different
things
that
exist
different
kinds
of
engagement
and
they
are
awaiting
them,
which
I've
advocated
for
over
a
decade
that
you
need
to
weight
things.
E
So
this
has
great
faithful
validity.
In
my
view,
the
one
critique
ahead
of
the
visualization
that
matt's
showing
right
now
is
it's
just
a
pie
chart
of
the
top
10,
and
I
think
it
would
be
more
interesting
if
it
was
a
pie
chart
of
the
top
10
and
then
a
a
pie
piece
for
other.
So
we
had
a
sense
of
what
proportion
this
top
10
is
of
all
of
the
engagement.
C
Constitutes
yeah,
so
their
their
angle
was
that
this
this
community
has
a
bunch
of
different
cigs
and
they're,
trying
to
sean
correct,
mirror
a
little
bit
too
correct
me.
If
I'm
wrong
is
that
they're
trying
to
get
a
handle
on
which
of
the
things
are
active
and
which
of
these
things
are
kind
of
hanging
out
and
not
doing
anything
right?
They
have
these
weightings.
E
C
Yeah,
so
I
mean
this
is
comprised
of.
Like
sean
said,
I
don't
know
what
d0
through
d2
is
are
yeah
but
yeah,
so
contribution
count,
pull
request,
counts.
A
And
and
in
our
metric
we
have
a
list
of
atomic
metrics
that
we
have
referred
when
it
was
left
say
it
again
when
I
broke
up
yeah.
So
I'm
saying
when
we
developed
this
project
popularity
metric,
we
have
those
like
downloads,
clones
and
searches
and
that
so
different
individual
metrics
that
were
referred
as
a
way
to
assess
a
project
popularity.
A
Yep,
so
this
section
from
1
to
13
has
like
folks
is
a
metric
or
change
request
new
issues.
These
are
atomic
metrics,
which
were
developed
over
the
period
of
time.
When
this
was
this
metric
was
developed.
Those
were
not
the
metrics,
they
were
like,
okay,
how
we
assess
this.
This
is
how
we
are
assessing
it.
E
F
E
Project
health,
so
I
I'm
not
sure
that
the
metric
proposed
is
actually
project
popularity.
I
think
that
might
be
a
a
translation.
I
think
it's
more
like
a
mind
share
metric,
because
the
way
that
they're
awaiting
the
the
atomic
metrics
in
this
case
seems
to
be
biased
towards
in
a
not
a
bad
way
but
biased
towards
investment
level.
What
does
minecraft
mean
to
you?
Engage
engagement,
like
organizations
and
individuals
are
actually
spending
their
time
doing
work
to
keep
this
project
going
like
project
engagement,
maybe.
E
C
A
Comment,
I
need
to
add
here
is
like
the
way
they
have
done.
The
waiting
I
have
created
like
a
year
back
a
similar
issue
on
the
value
working
group,
where
the
same
thing
was
done
for
the
business
side
of
it
like
business
writing
review
model
where
they
have
taken
bunch
of
metrics
weighted
it
and
used
it
as
a
assessment
or
way
of
measuring
the
health.
A
No,
this
was
proposed
as
a
like
thing
to
be
lived
on.
C
C
For
example,
you
know
what
I
mean
and
saying
we
should
actually
move
this
out
of
the
value
working
group
and
into
the
model
working
group.
It
doesn't
really
change,
I
mean
yeah.
We
would
just
have
to
template
it
as
a
model
martin,
which
is
okay
to
do
but
yeah,
I'm
wondering
how
many
metrics
are
actually
remember.
We
would
sean,
we
would
call
them
like
composite
metrics.
C
C
I
don't
know.
If
I
can.
I
don't.
I
don't
think
I
can
edit
this.
I
can't
that
project
popularity
might
be
best
named.
D
G
C
E
A
A
And
I
can
at
like
one
was
we
developed
a
social
currency
metric,
which
also
seems
to
be
model
rather
than
hector.
C
C
C
A
A
C
Not
what
we're
doing
in
the
metric
model?
That's,
why
perhaps
an
app
ecosystem,
but
so
then,
if
we
so,
for
example,
to
move
project
popularity
out
of
here
as
a
metric
and
create
it
as
a
metric
model
right
like
we
don't
have
a
metric,
for,
I
don't
think
a
defined
metric
dependencies.
We
we
have
a
dependency
metric
in
the
risk.
F
And
false
fork
and
clones
metric
in
the
common
working
group.
E
D
A
C
D
C
Have
okay
because,
like
we
all
know
too,
that
any
of
our
definitions
are
not
perfect,
they're,
a
way
to
just
kind
of
locate
people
in
understanding
project
popularity?
Okay,
in
this
case,
yeah
like
there
may
be
other
metrics
that
could
help
in
popularity,
but
this
is
a
sample
list
like
here's.
Here's
an
example
of
things
that
can
help.
You
understand
popularity,
all
right,
okay,
so.
C
Again,
only
linking
to
existing
chaos
metrics,
I
think,
there's
a
possibility
like
in
this
one.
C
E
C
G
E
A
I
I
cannot,
because
I
don't
add
it-
access
to
the
metric
model
working
group.
If
I.
A
That,
okay,
I
can
do
it.
Okay,.
D
C
A
D
C
C
C
Yeah
my
concern
is,
is
like
it's
one
thing
to
define
a
few
metrics
like
this.
You
know
if
we
have
the
model
and
we
have
to
spend
a
little
bit
of
time,
defining
some
of
these.
What
they
call
parameters,
but
my
concern
is,
is
that
we've
had
we've
had
the
definition
of
the
atomic
multiplicity
on
the
agenda
for
a
while.
E
C
E
E
C
Agreed,
okay,
I'm
gonna
at
least
kind
of
put
something
out
there.
We
should
that
we
honestly
that
we
remove
this
as
a
metric
yeah.
I
don't
think
it's
a
metric
well.
G
C
A
But
but
the
only
concern
I
have
I'm
fine
with
removing
this,
but
we
we
just
want
to
retain
this,
because
it
has
a
lot
of
ideas
that
we
can
refer
them
in
the
future,
as
we
evolve
agreed.