►
From YouTube: Pittsburgh City Council Standing Committees - 8/30/23
Description
No description was provided for this meeting.
If this is YOUR meeting, an easy way to fix this is to add a description to your video, wherever mtngs.io found it (probably YouTube).
A
B
C
A
B
Next
order,
business
is
roll
call
when
I
would
like
to
remind
our
speakers.
I'm
sorry,
our
next
one
of
the
business
is
public.
Common
and
I
would
like
to
remind
all
speakers
of
the
rules
of
council
state
that
comments
are
limited
to
matters
of
concern.
Official
action
ordered
Liberation,
which
are,
or
maybe
before,
city,
council
and
profanity
will
not
be
permitted
after
you
recall,
please
restate
your
name,
provide
your
neighborhood
for
the
record,
you'll
be
given
three
minutes
to
speak.
Our
first
registered
speakers,
Dr
Ronald,
Lynn
Miller,
whom
I
do
not
see
with
us.
D
Yeah
83
not
shady
deals
in
Bon
Air
Bursts
Do.
No
harm
is
not
just
the
role
of
medicine
government
shall
not
harm
the
people
or
can
be
held
accountable.
Love,
busting
and
infliction
of
emotional
distress
has
occurred
against
Bon
Air.
Those
who
oppose
Property
Owners
of
Bonaire
do
so
at
their
own
terms.
D
D
The
Public
School
Board
of
Education
in
Pittsburgh
has
zero
regard
for
the
rights
of
the
property
owners,
Health
Care
citizens
and
voters
in
the
Pioneer
Community.
We
do
not
consent
to
the
detrimental
School
building
remaining
in
our
communities.
We
do
not.
What
we
do
want
is
a
free
state
to
replace
the
building
and
improve
the
location.
This
is
the
lease
that
can
be
done
to
repair
the
loss
that
has
occurred.
The
Public
Service
of
the
school
board
shall
work
with
the
community
to
the
best
of
their
ability.
D
D
Thank
you.
Dr
Miller
for
promoting
Global
intelligence,
not
Global
governance,
stop
the
who.com
screwthewho.com
say
no
to
the
who
in
any
case,
follow
real
science
and
not
gotten
paid
for
propaganda
on
June
20th
2022,
the
detrimental
Bon
Air
School
building
worsens
into
becoming
a
disruptive
and
nuisance
property.
We
have
objected
to
apartments
or
anything
other
than
a
green
space
to
replace
the
schools
Terry's
home.
The
building
is
magnet
to
youth
who
broke
in.
In
addition
to
trespassing,
three
of
the
three
of
the
seven
had
to
be
escorted
out
of
the
building
here
at
home.
D
Other
neighborhoods
have
been
politic
with
worse,
do
not
allow
it
happened
to
on
air
the
out
price
to
the
school
board,
has
proven
futile,
put
pressure
on
them
to
sell
it
to
the
city
for
a
dollar
tear
it
down.
Now
that
McKinley
Park
is
no
longer
in
finance.
We
want
this
role
to
become
a
green
space,
as
replacement
open
deals,
not
shady
deals
in
Bonner
the
weight,
Fraud
and
Abuse.
The
school's
tax
resources
is
tremendous.
D
E
I'm
here
my
name
is
Carol
Whaley
and
I
have
lived
in
Lawrenceville
for
18
years.
I
have
worked
in
the
animal
protection
sector
for
the
past
20
years.
I
am
speaking
today
to
express
my
strong
opposition
to
bill
2023-1845,
which
proposes
an
ordinance
to
amend
the
Pittsburgh
code
of
ordinances
to
allow
for
the
implementation
of
a
deer
calling
program
within
the
city's
Parks
Advocates
have
been
discussing
deer
population
management
for
years
with
the
city
without
any
actionable
steps
being
taken.
E
Where
is
the
transparency
in
this
process?
Where
is
the
Strategic
long-term
plan
for
the
management
of
the
deer?
How
will
the
city
measure
the
success
of
the
program?
What
even
has
the
city
identified
as
the
issues
which
need
to
be
mitigated?
What
is
the
urgency
on
this
matter?
What
are
the
ramifications
to
Public
Health
that
necessitate
a
waiver
to
rule
eight
to
call
dear
well
I
understand
the
concerns
outlined
in
the
bill.
I
believe
neither
killing
or
sterilizing
deer
is
the
appropriate
solution
to
address
these
issues.
E
The
implementation
of
a
deer
calling
program
raises
ethical
and
environmental
concerns
and
should
not
be
a
default
solution.
The
proposal
to
discharge
Firearms
air
guns
and
arrows
in
our
Parks
contradicts
the
principles
of
conservation
and
non-violence
that
should
guide
our
interactions
with
wildlife
and
public
spaces.
If
we
are,
as
mayor
Davy
says,
a
community,
why
have
we,
the
residents
and
Park
Builders,
been
given
little
opportunity
to
voice
our
interests
in
this
matter?
Opinion
should
be
a
significant
factor
in
decisions
related.
F
E
Management
of
our
City's
Parks
and
Wildlife
as
responsible
and
compassionate
citizens,
we
have
a
duty
to
protect
and
preserve
our
natural
heritage
for
future.
Generations
I
encourage
a
council
to
engage
in
transparent
and
inclusive
discussions
with
community
members,
Wildlife
experts
and
environmental
organizations
to
explore
sustainable
and
Humane
solutions
that
prioritize.
Both
human
and
ecological
well-being
in
I
am
for
the
council
to
reconsider
the
proposed
deer
calling
program
outlined
and
built
2023-1845.
Let
us.
G
Thank
you.
My
name
is
Christian
Graziano
I'm,
a
resident
of
Squirrel
Hill
North
on
a
street
close
to
Shenley
Park,
where
we
owned,
an
acre
of
land,
half
of
which
is
in
Woodland
slope
and
we're
Deer
Run
freely
down
the
streets,
cyborgs
and
driveways
in
search
of
foods
spilling
out
in
the
Parks
where
they
have
eaten
through
the
understory
and
continue
to
grow
their
numbers.
I'm
writing
to
encourage
you
to
pass
the
ordinance
code,
change
and
contract
before
you
today.
G
That
would
allow
for
proper
deer
management
in
our
city
parks
as
a
former
nine-year
board
member
of
Allegheny
land
trust
and
founder
of
a
non-profit
organization
of
originally
focused
on
planting
trees
for
Community
Health
and
as
well.
A
property
owner
of
wooded
land.
I
can
tell
you
firsthand
how
Humane
and
responsible
these
actions
would
be
at
this
time.
Unmanaged
deer
populations
are
destinating.
Our
ecosystems
and
the
consequences
are
catalytic
setting
in
motion
the
removal
of
understory,
which
leaves
soils
susceptible
to
erosion,
which
leads
to
water
quality
decline.
G
The
soil
exposure
further
destabilizes
the
ground
clean,
especially
on
slopes
and
the
larger
tree.
Canopy
trees
have
less
to
Anchor
than
in
the
ground,
leading
to
the
mature
decline,
mature
tree
decline,
death
and
landslides.
There
are
meaningful
impacts
happening
now,
with
meaningful,
Economic,
Consequences
and
climate
consequences,
landslides,
destroy
poverty
and
are
expensive
water
pollution
remedies
are
expensive,
losing
big
trees
when
we
need
carving
sinks
for
CO2
capture
is
catastrophic.
G
Getting
to
the
heart
of
the
problems,
the
efforts
felt
like
running
up
a
downhill
escalator.
Last
night,
the
county
voted
to
develop
a
climate
action
plan,
one
of
the
most
impactful
things
you
can
do
right
now
for
the
climate
and
our
resilience
to
climate
change
is
to
set
the
stage
for
healthy
ecosystem
revitalization
and
manage
the
deer
populations
properly.
G
I
love
animals,
I
love
deer,
but
our
systems
are
out
of
balance.
There
are
no
predators
and
they
are
growing
thin
and
mangy,
as
they
desperately
roam
the
city
for
any
scrap
of
vegetation.
They
can
reach
simply
because
there
are
too
many
of
them.
We
can
fix
the
other
structural
problems
later
that
take
longer
I,
hope,
creating
Wildlife
corridors
and
less
fragmented,
Landscapes,
building
more
densely
and
reintroducing
predators
in
appropriate
places.
But
we
must
act
now.
We
cannot
lose
our
forests
on
a
few
of
the
alt
properties.
Deer
management
is
encouraged
with
bow
Hunters.
G
The
results
are
truly
noticeable.
There
is
a
healthy
understory
diversity
native
plants,
and
the
deer
that
you
do
see
are
healthy.
If
you
haven't
visited
Properties
or
areas
with
and
without
deer
management,
please
do
so
and
see
with
your
own
eyes.
It
makes
a
difference
in
quality
of
life
for
All
Creatures.
Thank
you
for
your
consideration.
B
Hello
hi
everyone,
my
name
is
I,
live
in
East
Liberty
I
have
a
master's
in
sustainability
from
Chatham
University,
and
my
bachelor
is
in
Environmental
Studies
from
the
University
of
Pittsburgh.
I
am
not
an
expert,
but
I
have
to
learn
from
those
who
are
and
I've
also
studied
the
ecology
and
resource
management
of
local
areas
such
as
the
Hazelwood
Greenway,
where
I
discuss
deer
management
and
Forest
succession
alongside
issues
with
water
flow.
F
Into
erosion
today,
I'm
speaking
strongly
in
favor
of
enacting
in
dear
con
plan
that
is
enacted
by
verified
expert
archers
from
elevated
purchase,
which
has
particularly
been
needed
for
decades.
Deer
are
a
vector
for
ticks
and
disease,
and
their
impact
on
Native
ecosystems
is
seriously
destructive
at
their
current
numbers.
This
estimated
that
your
density
might
be
50
deer
per
square
mile
of
green
space
or
at
appropriate
Pockets.
There
might
only
be
50
year
total
across
our
Parks.
F
Saplings,
shrubs,
fruiting
and
flowering
species,
and
even
grasses
and
Woody
shoots
can
all
fall
to
the
over
browsing
by
deer
depending
on
their
population
size
and
when
mature
trees
fall
in
space
in
the
canopy
opens.
Deer
browsing
will
halt
the
process
of
natural
forests
succession
preventing
new
trees
from
establishing
when
this
occurs.
F
We
must
consider
deer
calling
as
an
opportunity
to
improve
the
city's
Green
Space
without
by
allowing
natural
succession
to
occur,
which
will
encourage
healthy
native
species
survival
rather
than
toxic
for
invasive
ones.
Forests
can
regain
the
ability
to
host
diverse
root
structures
and
brush
which
will
improve
soil
retention
and
decrease
the
intensity
of
water-driven
erosion.
Additionally,
ice
has
been
widely
mentioned.
A
reduction
in
deer
population
means
a
reduction
in
vehicular
accidents
which
presently
kills
and
means
a
significant
number
of
deer
end.
F
Only
again,
I
believe
that
we
should
move
forward
with
the
deer
collagen
program,
I,
hope
to
see
it
succeed
immediately
and
I
hope
that
it
can
be
followed
by
the
introduction
of
resilient,
diverse
and
vast
Pro
native
species
that
can
reclaim
the
forest
floor
and
restore
natural
succession.
Thank
you.
H
This
was
a
planned
crisis
for
several
years,
The
Game
Commission
and
to
be
our
Wildlife
Area
has
got
dough
permits
by
the
thousands,
for
example,
in
2019
to
2020.
It
was
cut
by
2000
in
2020
to
2021.
It
was
cut
by
5
000..
At
that
point,
the
commission
decided
the
deer
population
in
2B
was
stable.
No,
no
efforts
to
curb
the
population
were
made.
H
These
are
the
people
you're
putting
in
charge
of
controlling
the
population
in
Frick
the
people
whose
job
it
is
to
maximize
hunting
opportunities
in
the
state
and
whose
funding
comes
from
hunting
licenses.
Urban
hunting
and
Frick
Park
in
particular,
are
crown
jewels
and
they're
going
to
make
sure
the
population
in
Frick
is
high
enough
to
always
need.
H
Hunting
are
in
one
indicator
that
they
are
not
serious
about
population
controls
if
they
allow
bucks
to
be
killed
in
these
hunts,
bucks
or
placeholders,
who
will
not
reproduce,
killing
them
and
opening
up
space
for
dose
that
will
reproduce
will
cause
more
of
a
problem.
The
problem
will
never
go
away
by
Design.
Second
year
do
not
carry
Lyme
disease,
mice,
Chipmunks
and
other
rodents
do.
In
fact,
these
there's
there's
one
study,
one
of
many
whitetail
deer
serum
kills
the
Lyme
disease
spirochet.
It
actually
kills
the
Lyme
disease
spirochet.
H
They're
going
to
feed
off
things
that
do
have
Lyme
disease
in
their
blood
and
and
potentially,
in
fact,
more
ticks
and
make
the
problem
worse.
Third,
the
complaints,
the
deer
are
destroying
ecosystems
in
the
park
ring
Hollow
when
you
allow
unmitigated
clearing
and
destruction
from
mountain
bike
creation
there.
These
are
more
destructive
to
Habitat
than
deer
into
strap
nesting
and
new
areas.
Whenever
they're
opened
up
one
former
Park
official
told
me
that
the
trails
were
to
blame
for
the
erosion,
particularly
to
Braddock
Trail.
Finally,
this
is
going
to
be
a
bloody
Horror.
H
H
The
people
who
are
pushing
this,
some
of
whom
I
know,
are
not
going
to
be
there
they'll
be
gone.
The
people
who
have
to
show
up
for
work
or
who
have
family
obligations
are
going
to
see
this
in
their
yards.
I
urge
you
please
do
not
do
this.
If
you
do
do
it
make
sure
there
are
no
bucks
killed
and
make
sure
this
is
done
in
the
most
humane
way
possible.
Thank
you.
B
With
that
she
may
not
want
to
speak.
Are
there
anyone
else,
we've
exhausted
our
list
of
registered
speakers?
Is
there
anyone
in
Chambers
wishing
to
speak?
If
so,
please
come
forward
at
this
time,
provide
your
name
neighborhood
you'll,
be
given
three
minutes
to
speak
last
call
for
anyone
in
Chambers.
If
not,
that
moves
us
on
to
our
standing
committee
agenda.
Our
first
Committee
of
the
day
is
finance
and
law,
which
is
chair
by
myself.
B
B
C
A
I
Would
you
come
up
for
a
second,
please
you're
generally
really
good
about
this
I
know
we
have
a
a
unusual
number
of
ordin
or
of
of
why
did
I
lose
the
word
invoices
invoices?
Thank
you
because
we
were
on
recess,
but
generally
speaking,
I've
reviewed
you
you've,
reviewed
and
you're
comfortable.
I
I
Let's
do
that
then
Mr
chair.
Will
you
lead.
B
Us
through
that
sure,
we
need
to
waive
the
rules
for
civic
plus,
which
supports
our
code
of
ordinances,
and
all
of
these
are
because
it's
been
four
weeks
that
we
haven't
approved
invoices,
while
they're
over
the
amount,
but
Civic
plus,
is
an
amount
of
6260
for
our
Municipal
Code
electronic
updates.
We
need
to
waive
the
rules
for
a
Dollar,
Rent
A
Car,
which
our
Police
use
for
undercover
vehicles
and
that
total
is
eight
thousand
three
hundred
eighty
two
dollars.
B
You
need
to
waive
the
rules
for
leadership
Pittsburgh,
which
we
have
two
invoices
at
six
thousand
six
hundred
dollars
and
that's
for
I
believe
director
Schmidt,
as
well
as
Chief
Ragland,.
B
To
go
through
leadership
Pittsburgh,
and
we
need
to
waive
the
rules
for
pro
knitwear,
which
has
a
total
of
6625,
which
our
parks
department
uses
for
t-shirts
when
they
have
races
and
events
of
the
like.
Okay,.
B
I
J
A
K
I
Yeah
same
same
thing,
Mr,
chair
being
that
we've
had
such
a
an
unusual
amount,
I've
had
I've
had
an
option
to
pass
through
them,
but
just
solicitor.
You,
you
generally
review
these
just
identification.
B
You
have
those
yes
yeah.
There
are
seven
items
that
need
to
be
to
be
a
ways
to
approve:
one
is
for
twillow,
which
is
supports
three
one,
one:
okay,
that
total
is
seven
thousand
nine
hundred
ninety
five
dollars
still
City
media,
which
are
purchases
for
human
race
resources
as
six
seven
thousand
online
ship
supplies,
which
is
a
total
of
six
thousand
three
hundred
fifty
four,
which
supports
Fire
EMS
and
Public
Safety
Pittsburgh
tire
surface
three
purchases
of
six
thousand
two
hundred
dollars.
B
And
then
oh
zero,
fossil
ink,
which
was
two
purchases
for
two
separate
events
and
two
separate
departments:
totaling
six
thousand
dollars,
Valley
Tire
Bell
Vernon,
which
is
three
purchases
made
on
different
dates:
five
thousand
eight
hundred
dollars
for
DPW
and
then
PayPal
and
I
would
support
public
shows
for
Department
of
parks
and.
I
Rec
perfect
thanks,
Mr
chair
appreciate
your
diligence
motion
to
waive
the
rules
on
pickards.
B
Second,
all
those
in
favor
say
aye,
aye
aye
any
opposed.
Now,
all
those
in
favor
of
approving
the
P
car
say
aye
aye
any
opposed.
P
cars
have
been
approved.
Now
that
takes
us
to
Public,
Safety
and
wellness
committee,
which
is
chaired
by
councilman
Cog
Hill.
We
have
two
supplemental
papers:
I'm
assuming
you
want
these
both
read
together.
M
A
P
Good
morning,
everyone
I
apologize.
The
the
changes
in
the
amendment
that
you
have
in
front
of
you
are
technical
in
nature
regarding
the
contractual
relationship
between
the
city
of
Pittsburgh
and
the
United
States
Department
of
Agriculture,
which
is
one
of
the
two
authorizations
that
is
being
sought
today.
These
were
worked
out
between
usda's
legal
counsel
and
the
city
Law
Department
over
the
weekend,
which
is
the
reason
for
the
late
introduction.
So.
P
Have
a
substantive
effect
on
the
outcome
of
the
legislation
that
members
of
the
public
will
see
or
that
our
our
program
will
entail.
They're
simply
meant
to
further
clarify
and
document
in
agreement
between
the
legal
counsel
of
both
parties,
what
the
program
will
entail
and
how
that
agreement
will
be
structured.
A
You
and.
I
The
reason
that
I'm
asking
for
solicitor
to
be
here
is
I
have
this
entitled,
as
the
law
reviewed
version
of
the
of
the
ordinance
I'm
just
curious
as
to
your
thoughts
as
to
the
technical
amendments
here,
what
they
propose,
you
know,
I,
don't
mean
you
to
go
through
detail
by
detail,
but
to
give
the
the
counsel
and
overview
as
to
the
importance
of
how
or
why
we
changed
some
of
the
verbiage
in
the
technical
agreements.
R
Sure
and
to
be
clear,
it
was
a
council.
R
It
wasn't
me
who
worked
on
it
with
the
USDA
over
the
weekend,
but
that
said
in
my
review
of
it,
we
started
with
the
USDA
version,
but
we
wanted
to
make
sure
that
we've
got
all
of
the
proper
city
issues
involved
and
also
we're
trying
to
tailor
it
as
much
as
possible
so
that
it
was
not
overly
exclusive.
So,
in
going
back
and
forth,
the
USDA
had
some
requests
that
they
needed
from
their
side.
R
We
had
some
requests
from
our
side
and
I
think
we
came
to
a
good
agreement,
so
both
sides
are
in
agreement
and
I
think
we
are
in
a
good
position
to
be
able
to
move
this
so.
I
There
we
we
had
one
person
come
down,
so
I
can
see
you.
Thank
you.
Oh
come
on.
I
only
got
a
couple
more
months
left.
Thank
you
appreciate
you
being
here.
There
was
one
caller
that
that
called
the
smear
first,
probably
comic.
That
was
very
concerned
about
the
the
expedition
of
of
this
ordinance
and
and
I
believe
we
owe
it
to
the
public
to
have
a
full
understanding
as
to
how
and
why
this
timeline
is
the
timeline
that
it
is
and
so
I'm
just
trying
to
get
to
that
set
so
Chief
Frank.
S
Chief
Operating
administrative
officer
for
the
city.
Sorry,
there
were
a
lot
of
questions
in
there,
so
the
USDA
involvement
just
shall
we
start
there?
Yes,.
I
S
So
I
think,
because
this
is
a
very,
very
new
thing
for
the
city.
We
wanted
to
have
a
strong
partnership
with
an
organization
that
has
done
this
in
lots
of
locations
has
done
it
professionally
without
incident.
S
Also,
you
know
to
get
even
some
just
procedural
guidance
like
this
is
what
the
Game
Commission
is
going
to
need,
so
they
just
really
really
experts
in
it
and
will
help
us
with
everything
from
getting
as
far
as
we
are
now
with
the
the
ordinance
to
actually
the
contract.
I
think,
as
you
see
in
the
scope
to
work
with
us
to
qualify,
The
Archers
to
you
know
just
make
sure
that
everything
is
going
to
work
and
that
we're
not
jumping
into
it.
S
I
S
That's
your
timeline,
question
I,
think
so
it
it
really
comes
down
to
I
I
think
we
feel
some
urgency
to
move.
If
we're
going
to
do
this
because
time's
not
really
marching
on
our
side.
What
we
hear
from
our
Ranger
is
what
we
hear
from
DPW.
What
we
hear
from
the
experts
on
I'm
sure
you've
read
the
newspapers
as
well
as
I.
S
Have
is
that
I've
I've
seen
people
you
know,
use
the
phrase
Tipping
Point
that
that
we're
going
to
get
to
a
place
where
we're
not
going
to
be
able
to
recover
our
deer.
Do
not
have
any
natural
Predators
anymore,
you
know
so
so
we,
but
you
can
only
you
know,
do
deer
management
in
season,
and
so,
if
we
do
the
pilot
now,
then
we
can
review
it.
We
can
evaluate
and
we
would
be
in
a
position
to
start
with
a
more
city-wide
deer
management
program
in
2024..
S
If
we
don't
do
it
now
in
the
kind
of
pre-deer
hunting
season,
then
we're
gonna
have
to
kick
that
all
for
another
year
and
so
for
the
USDA
to
have
enough
time
to
properly
qualify
people
to
get
everything
kind
of
in
place
in
time
to
do
that
controlled
archery
we
have
to.
We
just
have
to
get
the
things
together,
so
their
deadline
was
September
6th.
I
Oh
okay,
so
I'm
trying
to
understand,
maybe
I,
don't
know
if
Deputy
Mayor
Paula
can
help
or
I
Know
Chief
Frank.
What
was
historically,
what
was
our
deer
management
plan?
Do
we
have
a
sense
of
what
it
it
was?
I
I
apologize,
I.
P
Haven't
had
one
for
a
very
for
I
think
as
far
back
as
as
anyone
working
here
presently
can
remember
frankly,
well
I
should
say
we
have
engaged
in
efforts
in
fencing
off
portions
of
parks
that
have
been
significantly
negatively
impacted
ecologically
by
by
deer
overpopulation
to
attempt
to
prevent
them
from
accessing
Those
portions
of
parks
and
allow
understory
growth
to
resume.
P
Typically,
that's
occurred
in
conjunction
with
stormwater
management
projects
and
has
largely
been
led
by
pwsa,
but
we've
found
those
efforts
to
be
largely
unsuccessful.
It's
it's
not
especially
easy
to
keep
a
deer
getting
out
of
a
place.
They
want
to
go
even
with
fencing
and
things
of
that
nature
and
in
in
you
know,
wild
places.
You
know
plastic
fencing
they
can
find
a
way
around.
It.
I
P
The
city's
not
had
a
meaningful
deer
management
policy
for
a
long
time,
I
think
for
many
years
as
the
population
has
grown
for
a
long
time.
That
population
was
mainly
growing
in
suburban
and
outer
ring
communities
and
hadn't
been.
P
As
deeply
into
the
city
as
it
is
now,
but
as
the
the
issue
has
gone
unmanaged
in
other
places
as
well,
the
population
here
has
grown
and
the
lack
of
natural
predators
in
in
in
developed
areas
has
become
a
again
Chief.
Frank
use
the
term
Tipping
Point.
We're
approaching
that
where
both
as
it
relates
to
the
impact
on
public
lands
and
and
private
lands,
as
well
as
the
safety
impacts
caused
by
primarily
collisions
with
vehicles,
is,
is
unsafe.
I
Where
can
we
go
from
here?
We
are
I
know
where
we
are
right
at
this
point
in
time
and
I
shared
with
you
that
I
wasn't
going
to
vote
for
this
I
may
be
the
only
one
but
and
I
told
you
why
and
that's
not
to
be
disruptive
in
any
way.
It
is
to
to
get
us
on
the
record
from
this
day
forward
that
we
won't
find
ourselves
in
this
situation.
Again
that
we
will
have
a
better
strategy,
you
inherit
a
lot
of
this
I
understand.
I
Trust
me
this
is
this
is
not
about
about
blame.
It
is
about
opening
opportunity
for
us
to
do
it
better.
Next
time,
I.
I
P
The
college
might
also
want
to
react
to
this,
so
one
of
the
challenges
we
confronted
is
is
we
essentially
learned.
The
timing
was
unfortunate.
We
learned
during
the
council
recess
that
what
the
timeline
in
order
to
get
an
agreement
with
the
USDA
was
at
a
time
when
we
weren't
able
to
bring
this
legislation
any
sooner
than
yesterday,
because
of
the
timing
of
the
recess.
P
Had
we
known
that
earlier
or
had
you
know,
have
we
had
that
occurred
at
a
time
when
Council
was
in
session,
we
would
not
have
requested
the
waiver
of
rule
eight
and
there
would
have
been
an
opportunity
for
the
traditional
dialogue.
P
However,
it
was.
It
is
true
that
we
learned
of
usda's
very
particular
timeline
at
a
point
in
which
we
had
to
ask
for
this
expedited
review
to
your
point
about
proactivity
versus
reactivity
Having
learned
that
we
had
essentially
two
options.
P
One
was
to
pursue
somewhat
expedited
review
now
and
engage
in
an
initial
pilot
Management
program
this
year
before
the
conditions
both
among
the
population
and
within
the
ecosystem
become
worse
or
to
say
that
we
can't
pursue
it
that
quickly,
unless
we
have
to
wait
an
entire
year
to
engage
in
a
management
program
and
to
allow
the
population
to
continue
to
grow
and
the
ecological
impacts
to
continue
to
compound
over
that
time.
So
we're
advancing.
P
S
S
T
S
Know
you
can't
use
birth
control
strategy
to
reduce
the
population,
but
if
you
get
where
you
want
to
be,
you
can
go
there
to
do
that.
We
have
to
understand.
You
know
what
is
exactly
the
target
pop.
You
know
number
that
we're
looking
for
I've
heard
that
you
want
to
have
seven
deer,
an
acre
and
we've
got
about
40..
I
R
It
talks
about
a
full
Saw
Timber
stand
of
a
forest,
which
is
that
I
mean
that's
just
kind
of
a
number
that
they've
got.
That
is
a
standard,
but
from
all
of
our
testimony
we
believe
we
have
way
more
than
that.
So
I
I
will
say
that
I
think
this
is
the
initial
stuff
and
we're
hoping
to
learn
from
the
pilot
program
so
that
in
the
future,
we'll
have
a
better
sense
of
what
is
an
appropriate
number.
So.
I
S
I
think
I
think
it
started
with
our
our
Rangers
and
our
DPW
folks,
who
have
just
been
increasingly
concerned,
and
they
began
to
explore
a
number
of
avenues
and
began
to
understand
what
the
Game
Commission
required
and
began
to
understand
all
of
those
things.
So
we
kind
of
worked
our
way
to
that
solution
for
the
pilot
through
you
know,
just
figuring
out
and
talking
to
people
and
talking
to
people
who
had
already
done
it
talked
to
Mount
Lebanon
talked
to
the
county.
S
I
So
Mr,
chair,
I,
don't
know
this
is
the
right
time
to
do
this
or
not.
I
did
ask
Humane
action
to
come
in
and
offer
some
strategies
ideas
for
future
management.
I.
Don't
know
that
this
is
the
appropriate
time
for
that
I
can
I
don't
do
that.
Why.
A
I
Monopolize
the
conversation
because
I
know
a
lot
of
a
lot
of
members
wish
to
to
engage
I
I
will
I'll
end
my
out
in
my
what.
I
Just
let
me
ask
one
more
question:
so
I
have
a
clear
understanding
the
it
is.
It
is
the
USDA
that
is
requiring
that
we
assemble
this
group
of
volunteers
to
train
to
go
out
to
do
this,
or
is
this
is
something
that
we're
taking
on
I'm
I'm,
just
sort
of
a
little
confused
about
how
who
is
going
to
do
it,
how
they're
trained
and
what
their
qualifications
are.
P
Lisa
should
really
speak
to
the
the
usda's
role
is
in
qualifying
The
Archers,
so
our
agreement
with
them
would
ensure
that
the
folks
we
issue
permission
to
participate
are
adequately
qualified
and
have
agreed
to
particular
terms
of
their
ability
to
utilize
city
land.
P
In
this
way,
so
we
we
essentially
agree
that
we
need,
as
a
preliminary
step,
to
assess
the
effectiveness
of
a
population
management
strategy
that
we
need
to
solicit
volunteers
to
participate
and
the
USDA
agrees
to
assess
the
qualifications
and
provide
stipulations
to
those
individuals
that
they,
they
essentially
agreed
to
regulate
the
activity
and
relationship
of
those
volunteers
to
our
program
and
just
speak
very
briefly.
To
one
point
that
was
raised
in
in
public
comment.
A
P
Among
those
stipulations
are
that
the
first
your
harvested
be
antlerless,
which
is
a
term
of
art
that
essentially
means
a
doe
or
an
immature
Buck,
which
I
think
speaks
to
a
point
that
was
was
raised
earlier
around
focusing
on
those
members
of
the
population
that
are
not
in
reproductive
either
are
if
male,
not
in
reproductive.
I
R
Just
clarify
because
we're
not
going
to
be
training
them.
Our
expectation
is
that
people
who
have
bow
hunted-
you
know
for
years
and
and
we
have
a
very
robust,
bow
hunting
program-
there's
lots
of
people
both
in
the
county
and
in
Western
Pennsylvania,
who
have
bow
hunted
for
years
and
who
are
really
experts
at
that,
and
that's
really
what
we're
hoping
for
right.
We're
hoping
for
people
who
have
a
long
history
of
bow
hunting
they'll
come
for
the
qualification
to
be
able
to
establish
it,
and
then
the
city
will
be
able
to
choose.
R
Hopefully
the
you
know
the
people
who
will
therefore
both
prioritize
the
safety
of
the
situation,
but
also
be
able
to
prioritize
the
you
know
very
good
bow
Hunters
make
sure
that
the
Hill
is
as
painless
as
possible
for
the
deer
and
that's
really
one
of
our
goals
as
well.
I
S
The
the
just
to
go
back
to
your
question:
it's
a
Game
Commission.
You
know
the
Game
Commission
sort
of
exists
to
protect
the
rights
of
our
hunters
and
give
them
an
opportunity
to
be
hunters
and
so
on,
and
so
as
part
of
establishing
a
professional
management
program.
S
You
have
to
open
the
door
for
a
minute
to
folks
who
are
just
kind
of
hunters,
and
so
that's
why
we've
got
two
steps
in
this
because
we
can't
and
why
indeed
we
have
to
Pilot
it
so
but
to
your
point:
the
qualifications
are,
they
do
background
checks
on
them
and
then
they,
actually,
you
know,
watch
them
do
it.
They
take
them
out
to
the
range
and
they
and
they
test
them
and
I
believe
that
they
are
willing
to
test.
S
Oh,
the
numbers
are
going
to
go
out
of
my
head,
some
number
of
people,
and
then
they
want
to
take.
They
will
not.
They
can
only
have
30
participants
and
if
we
need
to,
we
can
sort
of
draw
out
of
a
hat
now
whether
or
not
we
want
our
residents
to
have
first
opportunity
to
do
that
is
is
really
up
to
us.
S
I
think
at
the
moment
we
were
thinking
that,
yes,
we
should
give
our
residents,
who
are
you,
know
qualified
and
skilled
Hunters
first
opportunity
to
sign
up
and
there's
you
know,
there's
I'm
trying
to
think
what
else
was
in
the
rules
it
establishes
if
you're
going
to
participate
in
this.
You
know
you
get,
you
have
to
be
qualified.
You
have
to
pass
the
background
check.
S
P
Essence,
sorry
in
essence,
you
need
to
have
a
bow
hunting
license
in
good
standing,
I,
see
and
thank
you
and
pass
a
background
check
that
determines
you've
not
had
a
wildlife
related
criminal
violation
on
your
record
within
a
certain
period.
P
So
you,
you
are
a
qualify
under
the
laws
of
Pennsylvania.
You
are
a
qualified
bow
hunter
in
good
standing
with
access
to
Deer
tags
is
what
they
call
it
a
license
to
take
to
harvest
deer
and
then
that's
what
gets
you
in
the
door
right
and
then
and
then
of
those
folks.
They
observe
your
practices
as
a
bow
hunter.
They
identify
from
among
a
volunteer
population,
the
folks
who
are
best
qualified.
I
Do
we
director
do
we
have
a
timeline
by
which
this
is
going
to
happen?
I
mean
a
length
of
time.
I
know
we
have
to
do
it
within
deer.
Hunting
season
quote
unquote.
Is
there?
Is
there
a
number
that
you're
looking
to
call?
Is
there
a
time?
This
is
going
to
happen
one
day
two
day
four
days
seven
days,
and
is
there
a
risk
that
we
don't
have
enough
qualified
licensed
bow
Hunters
that
will
come
in
you're?
Looking
at
me,
like
that's,
not
going
to
be
everything.
P
Well,
I
I
certainly
don't
think
that
enough
people
who
meet
the
minimum
criteria
for
qualification
is
going
to
be
any
challenge
even
entirely
among
City
residents.
Frankly
and
and
I
should
note
here,
though,
we
don't
condone
it
and
in
fact
take
enforcement
acts
against
it.
There
are
sometimes
folks
who
operate
outside
the
law
within
our
Parks
now,
if,
if
they've
been
caught
doing
that,
they
would
be
disqualified
by
that,
but
that
violation
point.
But
there
there
are
any
number
of
responsible,
Sportsman,
Sports
people
Sports
women
in
in
within
the
city.
P
You
know
who
participate
annually
in
deer
hunting
and
who
are
otherwise
qualified
to
have
tags
and
who
would
enter
that
process
and
then,
in
addition
to
them,
if
we
think
about
individuals
who
might
live
outside
the
city
who
have
similar
qualifications
in
in
the
off
chance,
I
I,
don't
presume
it's
been
the
off
chance
that
not
enough
City
residents
either
apply
or
qualify.
We
can
certainly
meet
the
criteria
with
folks
from
this
region.
I,
don't
think,
that's
a
particular
concern.
P
The
purpose
of
the
pilot
effort
is
to
begin
developing
Baseline
data
right,
so
I
we're
not
going
to
achieve
population
management
with
the
pilot
we're
going
to
take
the
initial
steps
necessary
to
collect
data
and
anecdotal
information
necessary
to
design
an
effective
strategy
from
there.
So
we
can
only
make
it
to
that
step
if
we
start
small,
with
a
limited
number
of
available
places
and
an
opportunity
for
volunteers
to
participate,
to
build
a
clear
case
that
a
management
strategy
is
warranted.
P
I
Yet
yeah
again
I'm
dominating
the
conversation
I
don't
wish
to,
because
I
know
everybody
wants
to
to
to
to
to
participate.
I
just
I
just
want
to
conclude
my
remarks
by
expressing
my
Universal
frustration.
This
is
not
aimed
at
anyone
in
particular
and
that
we've
gotten
to
this
point
to
where
we,
where
we
have
to
approach
the
deer
management
in
this,
what
I'm
going
to
call
violent
way-
and
it's
just
it
does
you
know-
I
told
you
last
night,
this
I
just
I,
can't
do
this
I.
Just
you
know.
F
I
And
that's
just
me:
that's
you
know,
that's
just
my
Constitution
and
my
makeup.
I
am
not
able
to
do
this,
but
I
will
take
opportunity
when
the
time
comes
to
bring
Humane
action
to
this
see
I'm
getting
emotional,
bring
Humane
action
to
the
table
to
talk
about
other
ways
that
we
can
be
more
effective
in
the
in
the
future.
R
Councilman
we
appreciate
your
questions
because
I
do
think
you
know
this
is
a
big
important
issue
for
a
lot
of
people,
so
it
still
is
something
we
should
be
discussing
and
bringing
out
all
of
these
issues.
So
yeah.
I
P
Know
good
yeah,
the
the
only
thing
I
might
add
there
if
you'll
permit
me
is
that
allowing
a
population
to
exceed
sort
of
the
natural
limits
of
growth
due
to
you
know
the
unique
impacts
of
Urban
Development.
P
Where
they're
you
know,
they
proliferate
to
a
point
that
they're
exceedingly
likely
to
become
ill
to
be
killed
in
a
car
accident
in
a
you
know,
potentially
more
violent
and
less
humane
way
because
of
the
disequilibrium
sort
of
between
what
would
be
a
natural
ecosystem
where
Predators
existed
to
to
maintain
a
stable
population
versus
a
situation
that
doesn't
occur
and
the
Predator
essentially
becomes
Motor,
Vehicles
right
and
and
that
that
has
real
impacts
on
every
you
know.
Every
living
entity
involved
is
also
our
concern.
There's.
I
I
You
have
to
do
it,
but
we
do
it
as
kind
and
gentle
and
Humane
as
we
possibly
can,
and
this
just
seems
like
such
a
violent
way
to
do
it
and
that's
really
where
my
my
reservations
come
from,
but
thank
you
again,
I'm
dominating
the
conversation
conclude
my
comments.
Let
members
speak
and
then
Mr
chair.
If
you
own
dogs,
will
bring
them
up
later.
Yep.
K
Thank
you,
I
appreciate
it.
I
I,
don't
know
if
I
should
be
constraining
my
comments
to
the
amendment
or
to
the
bill
in
full
at
this
point,
since
we've
kind
of
opened
it
up
to
everything,
but
I
have
had
a
chance
to
review
the
amendment
that
we
just
had
in
front
of
us
and
it
does
seem
to
go
to
the
beginning
of
councilman
cross's
questions
that
there's
some
change
to
the
recitations,
the,
whereas
Clauses
that
says
that
there's
Forest
can
support
up
to
20
deer
per
square
mile.
K
A
R
K
K
R
That
the
usda's
attorneys
are
like
we're
not
going
to
promise
exactly
how
many
there
are,
because
we
didn't
do
a
study
on
you
know
we
didn't
do
a
study.
I
have
heard
that
number
quite
often
and
and
I
certainly
know
that
we
are
vastly
beyond
the
Stan
the
minimum
standards
or
you
know
the
healthy
standard,
but
I'm
not
aware.
K
I
also
noticed
in
the
second
section
that
it's
toxic,
the
amendment
is
to
you
know,
there's
no
hunting
but
there's
an
exception.
That's
added
just
for
everyone's
awareness
that
persons
may
take
sex
actions
that
are
prohibited
in
this
section,
with
respect
only
to
snakes
known
to
be
poisonous.
So
that's
a
new
thing
that
wasn't
in
the
first
draft
and
that
there's
the
section
of
that.
K
There's
authorized
except
authorized
participants
in
this
official
City
deer
management
program
and
then
there's
permissions
added
to
discharge
bow
and
arrow
under
that,
and
that
they
are
only
applicable
to
the
strictures
of
The,
Game
Commission
and
the
USDA
program,
and
then
I
noticed
just
a
few
other
technical
things
like
changing
the
part
that
says
you
know
in
partnership
with
USDA,
under
a
contract
from
one
section
to
another.
So
it's
really
not
a
substantive
change,
so
those
are
the
only
things
that
jump
out
to
me.
K
If
I'll
take
a
little
bit
of
time,
Mr,
chair
and
but
if
I
go
on
for
too
long,
then
I'll
I'll,
you
know
let
other
members
have
a
chance.
So
can
we
just
kind
of
revisit
from
the
top
I
think
councilman
cross
touched
on
this
too?
The
wesa
article
mentioned
that
it
was
bow
hunting
that
you
will
be
permitting
in
partnership
with
USDA,
but
there
are
bows,
and
then
there
are
bows
right.
K
P
K
P
K
P
Short
is
is
that
you
know,
basically,
if
you
think
about
a
gun,
it
contains
a
confined
explosion
to
propel
a
projectile
bo,
whether
a
longbow
crossbow
or
a
compound
bow.
The
sort
of
like
the
energy
comes
from
the
effort
of
the
person.
L
K
So
I
the
wsa
article
said
it
was
one
day
call
and
then
I
saw
some
shaking
heads.
So
did
we
answer
that
question
we
can?
Should
we
wait?
Maybe
for
that
one
too,
we'll
revisit
we'll
revisit
that
one
in
a
minute
we
talked
about
the
Bucks.
We
talked
about
I
think
that
the
the
hunters
do
have
to
have
Game
Commission,
issued
tags
and
I
just
want
to
comment
for
a
minute.
I.
K
I
went
to
a
conference
on
Urban
soils
because
having
served
for
six
years
at
PWC
and
paying
attention
to
stormwater
issues,
landslides
which
I've
have
very
damaging
landslides
in
my
district
I,
wanted
to
know
more
and
there's
a
it's
a
fairly
large
local
Conference
of
experts
on
soil,
and
so
you
know,
one
of
your
pilot
sites
was
one
of
the
parts
that
I
was
look.
K
You
know
watching
an
entire
half
hour,
slideshow
about
between
the
jumping
worms
that
are
invasive
that
have
like
eaten
everything
that
would
normally
be
protecting
the
soil
through
the
leaf
layers
and
all
that
kind
of
stuff.
And
then
the
deer
which
I've
learned
the
technical
term,
just
like
goats,
are
browsers,
not
grazers,
so
like
sheep
eat
grass,
but
deer
eat
brush
ends
of
their
browsers
and
so
they've
cleared
out
all
of
the
shrubs
and
small
trees.
And
so
they
just
devour
everything.
And
so
you
end
up
with
just
bare
dirt.
K
You
know
at
the
top
of
the
hill
and
you
get
landslides
and
so
there's
nothing
retaining
the
water.
We
know
that
that
protective
forest
floor
and
the
native
shrubs
and
trees
are
the
best
things
for
retaining
our
storm
water,
and
so
it
isn't
just
a
little
damage.
It
isn't
just
a
constrained
small
amount
of
damage,
I
heard
someone
liking
them
to
Trails
and
for
the
kind
of
long-term
health
of
the
Park
Forest
and
the
stability
of
the
actual
hillsides.
K
We
do
need
to
be
concerned
about
restoring
the
native
plants
and
forest
floor
layers
so
that
that
is
an
issue.
I
would
like
to
understand
more
of
about
the
pilot
sites
that
are
chosen
as
well
and
then
I'll
again
I'll
revisit
this.
When
we
have
more
experts
at
the
table
but
and
of
how
we
are
protecting
the
public,
how
is
the
area
going
to
be
cordoned
off?
How
is
there
going
to
be
kind
of
signage
like
if
you
know,
I
have
no
idea
what
you're
going
to
do?
K
P
Well,
I
do
have
an
answer
on
the
question
about
timing.
Thank
you
just
to
clarify
that
one.
So
the
the
broader
rules
governing
a
pilot
of
this
type
require
that
the
period
the
the
pi
the
management
period
be
contained
to
within
normal
deer
hunting
season,
which
is,
of
course
not
one
day.
It
begins
as
early
as
September
18th.
P
We're
not
looking
to
Target
anything
that
soon,
but
but
we
have
the
ability
to
establish
a
time
frame
within
the
normal
deer
hunting
season
during
which
these
activities
can
be
conducted,
and
that's
not
a
determination.
That's
been
made
yet
so
so,
while
it
is
true
as
a
matter
of
form
that
it
could
be
as
little
as
one
day,
we
would
anticipate
a
multi-day
program
exactly
which
and
how
many
days
are
our
things
that
we
look
to
determine
in
conjunction
with
some
of
the
other
questions.
P
You've
raised
around
appropriate
protocol
to
to
effectively
manage
the
areas
in
which
this
could
occur.
But
but
one
day
is,
is
not
I
think
our
intention,
even
if
it
is
technically
possible-
and
that
might
be
the
cause
of
the
confusion
cited
in
that
report.
K
Right
so
again
it
then
we
I
think
that's
been
called
cross
trusts
on
this
too.
Then
we
need
I,
think
we
need
and
the
public
needs
to
understand
kind
of
like.
Well,
then,
what
is
the
goal
like?
When
is
enough
enough?
How
do
you
know
whether
you're
going
to
do
it
for
30
days
or
two
days
or
it's
I'm,
really
confused
I
feel
like
somebody
should
know
that
and
I'm
not
I'm,
not
the
expert
here.
K
S
I
think
our
general
direction
is
to
go
light
here.
As,
as
the
deputy
mayor
has
said,
we
can't
achieve
population
stability
with
this
pilot.
What
we
need
to
achieve
is
self-understanding
and
and
whatnot,
so
the
conversation
I
think
around
that
would
be
worked
out
with
those
parties
and
understanding
what
those
goals
are
and
I.
Don't
I.
Think
people
already
know
enough
to
know
that
you
probably
can't
get
that
done
in
one
day,
but
I
don't
think
we're
talking
about
30
days,
certainly
not
30
days.
K
N
N
We
knew
if
there
was
a
deer
in
and
around
our
house
in
Pittsburgh.
Okay,
there
were
none
in
the
late
70s.
You
could
not
find
a
deer.
There
were
no
dare
living
inside
stray
or
two
maybe,
but
there
was
not
herds
and
the
the
population
was
nothing
to
be
concerned
about
back
then,
and
I
lived
on
a
big
Greenway
and
we're
the
biggest
area
of
woods
in
the
city
of
Pittsburgh.
We
used
to
go
down
there.
We
used
to
look
for
tracks.
N
We
used
to
think
why
aren't
there
any
deer
in
here,
but
but
there
weren't
so
so,
and
that's
relevant
for
a
couple
reasons,
because
whether
it's
development
up
in
cranberry
and
all
the
surrounding
suburbs,
why
that
population
came,
you
know
South
into
Pittsburgh
or
North
I'm,
not
quite
sure
that,
but
I
will
tell
you
yeah
35
years
ago.
There
was
you,
couldn't
you
couldn't
find
it?
N
N
Just
can't
believe
with
the
population
of
the
deer,
how
it's
increased
I,
don't
know
how
I
don't
know
why,
but
that
is,
but
I
will
tell
you
it's
Stark
difference
from
when
when
I
was
a
younger
man,
you
know
so
so.
In
this
call
we
have
it
worked
out
where
the
hunter
or
Hunters,
when
they
you
know,
bag
their
first
dough.
They
have
to
give
that
meat
to
us
for
food
banks.
Things
of
that
nature,
wherever
we
decide
to
distribute
to
and.
N
P
On
who
they
donate
it
to
yeah,
for
example,
there's
an
organization
called
Hunters
sharing
the
Harvest
who
do
handle
that
processing
if
they,
if
they
were
to
choose,
to
give
it
to
a
different
food
bank,
they
may
or
may
not,
depending
on
what
they
choose
to
give
it
to
cover
the
cost
and
the
the
you
know,
experience
of
processing
it
themselves,
but
they
are
required
to
contribute
their
first
harvest
to
a
food
bank,
and
you
know
those
Hunters
Who
harvest
at
least
two
deer.
P
Our
prior
would
be
prioritized
in
future
rounds,
but
which
I
mean
we're
not
necessarily
sure
that
at
this
pilot
stage,
anyone's
going
to
get
more
than
one
or
two
broadly
speaking
again,
that
depends
on
how
many
people
sign
up.
N
Okay,
well,
I
think
that's
important
because
you
know,
as
we
know,
through
covert
and
everything
that
you
know:
food
supply
and
the
people.
You
know
you
know
just
cost
of
buying
meat
is.
Is
you
know
so
so
if
we
can
feed
people
with
this?
That's
that's
an
advantage.
That's
a
bonus
for
me,
but
you're,
saying
if
you
have
mult,
if
you
have
a
multiple
tag,
you
can
add
two
of
them
you
can,
but
the
first
one
goes
to
a
food
bank
in.
P
Order
to
participate
in
our
program,
the
first
antler
list.
You
were
required
to
take
an
antlerless
steel
deer
first,
which
would
mean
either
a
female
or
an
image
or
a
male,
and
you
are
required
to
donate
the
proceeds
of
that
to
a
food
bank
which
may
or
may
not
include
the
one,
the
designated
one
that
we
know
handles
some
of
that
processing.
N
Course,
right
right,
so
I
do
a
lot
of
work
in
Mount,
Lebanon
I
know,
Mount,
Lebanon
I
know
a
lot
of
people
live
there.
I
just
have
a
lot
of
I
freak
frequent
the
place.
Often
they
went
through
this
a
couple
years
back:
okay,
it
wasn't
because
they
were
eating
the
flowers
and
you
know
attacking
your
garden.
N
They
did
it
mostly
out
of
the
concern
of
safety.
Public
Safety,
Route
19
is
a
very
busy
corridor.
They
would
cross
their
like.
You
wouldn't
believe
so.
It
became
a
danger
to
motor
vehicles,
and
you
know
my
father
was
a
truck
driver.
He'll
tell
you
number
one
reason
why
people
were
killed
on
the
highway
is
trying
to
avoid
a
deer,
okay,
doing
a
sharp
term
when
you're
going
45
50
mile
an
hour,
so
it
became
more
safety
concern
for
the
citizens.
I
will
tell
you
I'm
on
Lebanon
and
that's
why
they
approach
that.
P
U
F
A
P
The
municipality
was
considering
that
question
and,
as
a
result
of
that
participated
in
some
of
those
conversations
attended,
some
of
those
public
meetings.
I
will
agree
with
you
that
the
primary
motivation
of
the
municipality
was
the
sharp
and
concerning
increase
in
dear
the
motor
vehicle
collisions
and
the
public
safety
implications
of
that,
the
public
dialogue
was
certainly
very
robust
and
they
explored
a
number
of
different
options
at
that
time.
P
You
know
from
there
certainly
into
your
District
councilman,
but
but
it's
no
less
a
reality
in
in
in
the
North
side
or
in
the
East
End
in
areas
around
our
larger
parks,
where
again
migrating
in
from
the
outside
large
populations
of
deer
that
are
not
managed
in
the
ecologically
regular
way,
VIA
Predators
or
are
growing
very
rapidly
and
causing
very
real
safety
risks.
N
Right
and
if
you'd
have
told
me
the
day,
would
come
where
I'm
feeding
deer
in
my
backyard
on
Windsor
Avenue
I,
said:
you're
you're,
crazy,
okay,
but
but
that
is
the
case
today.
So
there's
no
question:
the
population
has
I,
don't
even
I
don't
want
to
say
it
fluctuates
okay,
but
there's
no
doubt
about
it.
We
have
a
large
population
in
my
district.
I
will
tell
you
I'm
surprised,
we
don't
see
them
downtown.
Honestly,
I,
don't
know.
They're
close
I
know
they're
all
over
Mount
Washington
and
everything
like
that.
Yeah
they're,
working
from
home.
R
V
N
Which
is
pretty
deep
in
here,
so
you
know,
I
got
so
many
some
emails
and
some
texts
today.
You
know
some
some
folks
that
want
to
protest
this
and
my
my
message
to
them
would
be
you
know
if
you
eat
beef
or
pork.
N
You
know
it's
the
same
thing:
okay,
you,
the
animal,
you
kill
the
animal
and
it's
been
going
on
for
thousands
and
forever.
So
there's
nothing
inhumane
about
it.
I
find
hunters
in
my
when
I
used
to
hunt
are
some
of
the
most
respectful,
careful,
responsible
people
and
nobody
I
know
ever
hunts
just
for
the
game
of
it.
It's
always
about
you
know
they.
They
love
it.
They
make
jerky,
and
you
know
they.
You
know
they
eat
it.
So
so
it's
good.
It
actually
saves
them
money
on
their
grocery
bills.
N
So
so
that
argument
doesn't
hold
up
for
me.
I
will
tell
you
unless
you're
going
to
protest,
the
farmers
Across
America
and
everybody
else,
that's
okay,
so
my
main
concern
is-
and
somebody
touched
on
it
earlier,
like
you
know
when
whether
it's
two
days
three
days
ten
days
whatever
it
is.
N
Obviously,
these
are
in
places
that
are
frequented
by
families,
kids,
things
of
that
nature.
We're
obviously
going
to
shut
that
area
down,
but
I.
Just
wonder
like
what's
to
keep
a
12
year
old
kid
who
doesn't
read
up
on
what
the
city's
doing
it
has
a
secret
way
into
those
woods
from
being
in
there
and
are
we
going
to
have
Rangers
kind
of
circumferencing,
the
area
or
and
I
know
councilwoman
gross
touched
on
this,
and
that's
to
me
is
the
most
important
factor
of
this
is
that
it's
done
safely.
N
I
believe
the
agencies
you're
working
with,
are
very
reputable,
very
safe
I.
Just
worry
about
the
perimeter
and
somebody
couple
12
year
old,
kids
that
don't
keep
up
on
what
the
city
of
Pittsburgh
is
doing
in
the
calling.
So
I
would
imagine
that
those
are
in
place.
Do
you
have
anything
to
say
on
that.
R
Yeah,
so
we
will
be
shutting
it
down
and
posting
probably
Public
Safety
people,
you
know
using
DPW,
cross,
arms
and
and
and
the
like
to
shut
it
down.
We
will
be
posting
as
well
and
I
will
say:
that's
going
to
be
something
that
we
go
over
with
our
Hunters
as.
A
F
R
Are
going
to
be
very
aware
that
this
is
not
you
know
and
as
they
are,
as
as
you
talked
about,
councilman
I
mean
this
is
something
that
Hunters
face
a
lot
when
they
go
out
right,
they
could
have
run
into
people
who
are
just
hiking
on
a
game
lands
or
something
along
those
lines,
and
so
they
have
to
be
careful.
R
That
is
certainly
something
we
will
be
stressing
with
our
Hunters
as
well
that
they
need
to
be
on
the
lookout
and
that
they
need
to
make
sure
that
you
know
they
need
to
be
safe.
They
need
to
err
on
the
side
of
caution
and
there
were
making
sure
that
everyone's.
P
P
N
N
Bow
is
just
a
bigger
bow,
that's
easily
brought
back
and
then
there's
a
regular
bow,
which
is
you
know,
they've
been
doing
for
thousands
of
years,
so
so
I'd
be
interested
in
that
I
believe,
like
a
compound
bow
that
projectile
will
go
much
further
and
you
know
we
can't
count
on
them
being
up
on
the
tree
and
shooting
down
if
some
doe
walks
out
in
front
of
them
and
they're
at
the
bottom
of
the
hill
and
the
does
at
the
top.
You
know
it's
going
to
go.
N
Oh
so
they
don't
they're,
not
restricted
to
I,
don't
want
to
say
fire
I,
don't
know
what
the
term
is
for
for
Bose,
but
they're
not
restricted
to
be
in
a
tree.
Stand
is
what
I'm
saying
so.
R
I'll
also
just
state
that
is
part
of
the
reason
we
entered
into
the
contract
with
the
USDA
is
because
they
have
had
such
a
long
experience
with
this
with
no
negative
consequences.
So
we
really
wanted
to
this.
Isn't
the
kind
of
thing
that
we
just
you
know
wanted
to
do
it
on
our
own
and
start
it
fresh?
We
wanted
to
be
able
to
use
a
program
that
has
been
successful
and
safe
in.
N
N
Eat
I
don't
need
to
the
meat,
so
so,
for
those
two
reasons:
I
I've
never
picked
up
a
hunting
rifle
since
I
was
a
time
of
18
years
old,
but
the
whether
it's
and
I'm,
not
quite
clear
as
to
you
know,
if
you
have
a
tag
for
tudo,
you
have
to
give
the
first
one
to
a
food
bank
or
or
if
you
have
a
tag
just
for
one,
though
I
I'm,
what
I'm,
what
I
guess,
what
I'm
getting
to
is,
if
there's
the
need
which
I
believe
there
is
to
feed
people,
you
know
I
think
we
should
get
the
maximum
effort
out
of
this
call
in
distribution
of
the
venison
to
whoever
was
going
to
eat
it
or
whoever
it's
needed
so.
P
N
R
Only
for
their
own
sake,
I
want
to
let
people
know
too.
There
is
also
a
program
that
the
Game
Commission
does
where
you
can
sign
up.
If
you,
because
some
people
have
medical
reason
that
mean
they
can't
eat
commercialized
meat,
and
so
the
gaming
commission
is
also
there's,
there's
a
list
of
people
who
need
to
eat
venison
in
order
to
be
able
to
eat
meat,
and
they
also
have
a
great
program
that
way
so
right.
N
So
I
would
just
like
to
get
the
maximum.
If
that's,
if
it's
everyone
so
I,
imagine
it's
going
to
be,
and
that
would
be
City
food
pantries.
P
It
it
so
100
sharing.
The
Harvest,
for
example,
is
a
Statewide
initiative
that
is
specifically
designed
for
the
processing
and
donation
of
wild
caught
rather
than
commercially
raised
meat
products.
I,
don't
I,
don't
believe
that
it's
localized
in
that
way
right:
okay!
Well,
that's
an
option.
Certainly.
R
N
Sure
you
know
it's
not
something:
I
really
wanted
to
see
either
I'm
with
the
councilman
here,
but
I
feel
it's
necessary
at
this
point,
and
I
do
feel
that
you
know
there's
a
danger
in
overpopulation
over
deer
jumping
out
on
our
highways
and
people
wrecking
and
dying.
So
if
you're,
comparing
the
life
of
a
human
being
to
a
deer,
I'm
gonna
decide
on
a
human
being
every
time
so
I.
U
B
A
O
As
far
as
this
sort
of
being
sudden
I
do
want
to
clarify
that
you
know
since
I
got
here
in
December.
This
is
the
one
of
the
very
first
things
that
was
on
desk
from
my
constituents
and
I
know
that
Chief
Frank
and
lots.
O
Have
been
working
very
very
hard
for
many
many
months
on
this,
so
I,
don't
I
do
want
to
sort
of
I
understand
it
for
the
public.
This
is
the
FR
and
there
have
been
a
few
articles.
Oh
sorry,
sorry-
and
there
have
been
a
few
articles
here
and
there
over
the
course
of
the
months,
but
nothing
like
now
right,
obviously
with
the
introduction
of
this
bill.
O
As
far
as
the
you
know
why
we
needed
to
waive
rule
Aid
and
expedite
now,
I
I
can't
speak
to
why
it
has
taken
so
long
to
kind
of
get
all
the
ducks
in
a
row.
I
do
understand
the
the
deadline
given
by
the
USDA
and
again
you
all
can
speak
to
that
when,
when
we
get
to
it,
but
I
do
want
to
say
that
I
think
here
now
there
are
a
lot
because
of
this
suddenness.
There
are
lots
of
questions
right
about.
Why
do
we
need
to
do
this?
O
O
Humane
action,
okay,
so
Humane
action.
We
have
on
the
city-wide
deer
management
task
force,
we
have
our
park
rangers
and
we
have
Public
Safety.
So
again,
this
is
my
recommendations
that
the
you
know
the
chair
UPS,
the
chair,
of
course,
but
I
I,
don't
know
how
this
will
work
with
so
many
people
to
come.
Talk
at
the
table,
I've.
O
This
before
yeah
yeah,
but
I
do
just
want
to
say
that
once
we
do
begin
discussion
on
the
amendment,
my
recommendation
would
be
to
begin
with.
The
concerns
which
would
I
would
say.
Humane
action
would
be
the
representative
of
sort
of
the
concerns
of
that.
So
many
people
do
have
about
this
program
and
the
hopes
for
the
future.
Then
the
then
the
why
and
for
that.
O
You
know
so,
and
that
would
be
the
how
and
so
I
think
that
might
help
organize
the
conversation
a
little
bit
so
that
we
can
kind
of
go
through
methodically
and
and
make
sure
that
everybody's
questions
are
addressed,
because
these
are
all
important
questions,
but
it's
kind
of
hard.
You
know,
I,
don't
want
to
ask
all
the
questions
to
the
to
you
know
to
this.
We
only
have
so
many
chairs
so
at
the
table,
so
at
any
rate,
with
that
all
said,
motion.
O
A
U
Q
A
I
P
N
B
I
I
You
yeah
please
do
yeah
good
morning.
So
is
this
your
first
time
at
the
table,
yeah.
I
I
First
time
at
the
table
it
was
terrifying,
so
please
don't
be
afraid
you're
amongst
friends,
but
we
do
need
you
to
introduce
yourself
a
first
last
name
in
an
organization
you
represent.
Please
sure.
X
I'm
Shannon
Dickerson
I'm,
also
with
Human
Action
Pittsburgh,
the
director
of
operations,
great.
I
So
we
had
an
opportunity
to
to
speak
last
Friday
at
a
breakfast
about
the
bills
potentially
coming
to
to
council
and
and-
and
you
and
I
had
exchanged
some
thoughts
about
how
we
got
here
and
how
we
might
be
able
to
do.
D
I
Mr,
chair,
yeah
and
so,
and
so
I
I
thought
our
I
thought.
Your
responses
to
the
conversation
were
very
enlightened.
I
found
them
to
be
very
spot
on.
We
understand
the
reality
of
the
situation
that
we
are
in,
but
there
are
probably
some
better
ways.
We
could
do
things
and
that's
really
why
I
wanted
you
to
to
come
down
and
speak
to
the
council
and
and
share
your
experience,
which
is
voluminous
with
the
council
as
to
how
we
may
not
find
ourselves
in
this
situation
again
and
and
do
things
a
little
differently.
T
Let
Shannon
do
most
of
the
talking,
because
she
really
is
the
expert
on
our
team
on
this
issue,
but
I
do
want
to
say
you
know
as
an
organization,
we
are
an
animal
welfare
organization
as
I
think
you
all
know.
We've
worked
with
you
before.
We
acknowledge
that
you
are
overpopulated
in
our
community.
So
we're
not
we're
not
disputing
that.
T
This
discussion
has
been
going
on
for
a
long
time
behind
the
scenes,
apparently,
and
now
it's
all
of
a
sudden,
a
huge
rush
with
no
time
for
public
dissemination.
We
haven't
seen
anything
in
the
plan
in
terms
of
long-term
management
plans,
and
so
we
share
some
of
the
concerns
that
some
of
you
brought
as
well,
but
I'm
going
to
pass
it
to
Shannon
to
speak
more
on
our
concerns.
X
I
I
think
that
you
know
what
we
just
want
to
address
is
I,
of
course,
Echo
everything
that
Natalie
said.
I
headed
up
a
lot
of
the
research
that
we
did
into
you
know
what
our
recommendation
should
be
and
why
and
speaking
to
experts
across
the
country
and
other
municipalities
who
have
done
deer
management
programs
and
so
again,
I
just
want
to
emphasize
like
we,
we
agree
that
steps
need
to
be
taken.
X
We
don't
think
that
you
know
to
all
of
your
points
councilman,
that
this
is
something
that
needs
to
be
ignored,
or
you
know
putting
deer
ahead
of
Public
Safety
and
human
lives
not
at
all,
but
we're
just
not
getting
questions
answered,
some
of
which
you
brought
up
this
morning.
Several
of
you,
as
far
as
you
know,
we're
we're
hearing
that
this
pilot
is
required
to
do
any
kind
of
long-term
management,
but
we're
not
seeing
where
that
language
is
coming
from
who's,
requiring
this
pilot
who's
requiring
the
nature.
X
The
specific
nature
of
this
pilot
there's
a
study
referenced
in
the
ordinance
from
the
USDA
that
we're
unaware
of.
We
know
that
the
numbers
have
been
struck
from
it
in
the
amendment
now
this
morning,
but
you
know
all
the
experts
I've
spoken
to
in
order
to
do
an
accurate
count
which,
to
our
knowledge,
has
not
been
conducted
by
anyone,
the
city
or
the
USDA,
or
otherwise
it
would
cost
around
two
hundred
thousand
dollars
just
to
get
an
accurate
count.
X
They're
saying
that
this
pilot
with
volunteer
bow
Hunters
is
going
to
somehow
help
with
understanding
our
numbers
better
or
understanding
how
to
control
the
population
better,
but
it
doesn't
seem
like
this
I
mean
by
the
own
admission
of
our
Administration
and
that's
certainly
not
a
criticism,
but
this
pilot
is
unintended
to
work.
It's
just
a
requirement
that
we
have
to
do,
but
we're
not
seeing
that
there's
been
evidence
to
demonstrate
that
point
Who's
requiring
the
pilot
who's
requiring
the
nature
of
this
pilot
who's
requiring
this
timeline.
X
We
don't
have
those
answers,
we
asked
and
we
don't
know
if
it's
Federal,
we
don't
know
if
it's
state,
we
don't
know.
If
it's
you
know
language
from
our
Game
Commission.
X
We
just
we
there's
a
lot
of
unanswered
questions
and
it
seems
like
if
we
know
it's
not
going
to
work
and
we
can't
demonstrate
that
it
is
required.
Why
the
rush,
why
the
urgency?
Why
can't
we
have
these
questions
answered
before
we
make
such
a
rash
decision
and
move
forward
with
this?
So
that's
really
our
position.
T
I
Well,
so
how
do
I
want
to
formulate
my
question?
The
some
of
my
reservations
are
based
in
comments
that
you
made
as
to
understanding
the
totality
of
the
problem.
How
what's
the
expression,
when
you
only
have
a
hammer?
Everything
looks
like
a
nail
that
we're
we're
kind
of
just
we're
going
after,
because
we
know
it's
a
problem,
but
we
don't
quite
understand
fully
the
scope
of
the
problem.
This
is,
to
sort
of
you
know,
kind
of
get
started
and
I
I
had
the
same
question
with
a.
A
I
Mayor
Pollock
last
night,
when
we
spoke
about
the
requirement
and
how
we
got
to
this
point,
where
we're
being
told
that
we
have
to
do
it
this
way
in
order
to
do
any
other,
effective
deer
population
Management
in
the
future,
so
I
I
promise.
We
will
get
that
clarification
and
and
share
with
you
how
and
why
we
got
to
where
how
and
why
we
got
to
where
we
we
are
at
this
moment
in
time.
I
But
if,
if
you
were
to
to
be
able
to
offer
to
this
Council
recommendations,
because
this
bill
is
going
to
pass
this
I
know
this
bill
is
going
to
pass
and-
and
we
will
ultimately
launch
this
strategy.
But
my
hope
in
the
last
four
months
that
I
have
here
is
to
make
certain
that
we
put
preventative
measures
in
place
that
we
don't
get
here
again,
and
maybe
part
may
be
part
of
the
passage
of
this
bill
is
a
requirement
that
certain
things
take
place.
I
X
I
think
that
you
know
there
are
a
lot
of
options
you
heard
in
public
comment
today.
Some
people
who
are
against
this
moving
forward
are
also
against
sterilization
and
therefore
a
birth
control
method
with
Darden,
you
can't
even
get
a
panel
together
of
experts
in
non-lethal
management
of
deer
populations.
There
just
aren't
enough
people
who
practice
this
as
their.
X
Going
in
with
bows
are
not
going
to
do
that.
What
they're
going
to
do
is
take
the
population
down
a
small
amount
which
frees
up
resources,
food
and
other
resources
to
make
the
deer
that
do
stay
healthier,
and
this
is
a
well-documented
phenomenon.
This
increases
twin
and
triplet
births,
and
then
you
get
a
higher
population
than
when
you
started.
A
X
If
you're
not
doing
a
call
effectively
you're
getting
volunteers,
you're
not
having
it
done
professionally,
you
don't
have
an
accurate
account
to
know
how
many
you
need
to
take
it
down.
Etc,
you
are
going
to
create
a
much
bigger
problem,
and
so
anything
has
to
be
done
in
a
very
expensive
way,
whether
it's
a
call
or
otherwise,
because
you
have
to
have
professionals
doing
it.
A
X
X
Yes,
and
because
is
the
nature
of
deer
males
versus
females,
we
have
been
told
that
the
recommendation
would
be
to
do
females
and
it's
done
right
out
in
the
field.
So
you
have
veterinarians,
the
someone
is
darting
them.
You
know,
tagging
them
and
the
veterinarian
is
literally
performing
the
procedure
out.
I
On
site
that
I
would
love
well,
I
mean
I'd,
love
to
holistically
EX
dive
into
that
com,
that
sort
of
approach
and
and
then
there
becomes
the
budgetary
impacts.
X
And
we
admit
that
up
front
a
call
is
less
expensive,
but
again
in
the
long
term,
because
of
the
effects
of
a
call
versus
sterilization,
the
costs
will
average
out
and
eventually
and
I,
can't
give
you
an
exact
number
of
years.
It's
dependent
on.
You
know
your
topography,
the
size
of
the
location,
the
deer
population
that
starts
with
so
I
couldn't
speak
to
at
year.
Seven,
it
will
even
out,
unfortunately,
I
don't
have
that
information
and
I.
I
J
You
and
thank
you
for
being
here
I
did
want
to
dig
in
a
little
bit.
J
You
don't
have
to
get
me
the
numbers
now,
but
when
I
also
approached
the
administration
winter
of
last
year-
and
you
know
at
the
urging
of
so
many
constituents
who
are
extremely
concerned-
you
know
some
part
of
the
district
I
represent
is
between
two
Regional
Parks,
so
the
deer
are
constantly
Crossing
and
on
our
roads
and
in
our
yards
and
I
I
too
fear
for
those
who
are
you
know,
driving
and
getting
into
a
collision
more
so
swerving
to
avoid
a
deer
and
striking
a
pedestrian.
J
That's
my
worst
fear
here,
actually
so
at
the
urging
of
my
of
the
constituents
I
represent,
did
bring
this
up
almost
a
year
ago
and
I'm
grateful
that
we
are
at
the
point
where
we're
actually
considering
action.
Okay,
so
at
that
time,
I
heard
that
from
other
experiences
and
other
municipalities
that
the
as
you
as
you
sort
of
insinuated
that
maybe
in
the
that
in
the
short
term
sterilization
and
birth
control,
is
both
more
expensive
and
less
effective
and
I
understand.
There's
a
conversation
about
you
know.
J
X
I
can
I
can
only
cite
another
experience
with
this
in
New
York
City.
They
actually
did
a
non-lethal
program
and
that's
honestly,
the
only
thing
that
I
can
cite,
because
everything
is
specific
to
the
region,
that
you're
in
right
I,
don't
even
know
what
a
call
would
cost
effectively
here,
because
we
don't
have
that
information
or
those
numbers.
X
X
Don't
think
that
it's
a
question
of
you
know
if,
if
this
pilot
is
required
in
order
to
do
any
kind
of
long-term
management,
we
we
would
not
be
objecting
if,
but
we
haven't
been
shown
that
that's
actually
the
case,
and
then
there
are
no
long-term
plans
to
for
us
to
to
see
or
kind
of
dissect
and
answer
that
question,
because
we
can't
I
mean
we
can't
show
you
that
a
call
would
be
effective
either,
because
it's
that
it
hasn't
been
a
fully
kind
of
like
thought
out
program.
Yet.
A
X
So
I'm
not
trying
to
Dodge
your
question
I
guess
we
don't
even
have
a
deer
population
to
give
those
those
answers,
but
I
can
cite
a
specific
experience
in
New
York
City,
where
they
did
have
success
with
a
sterilization
program
and
the
cost
was
more
effective
in
the
long
term
and
for
them.
The
reason
I
gave
the
example
of
year
seven
before
was
that
was
the
year
that
they
kind
of
Hit
the
Tipping
Point,
where
it
was
more
cost
effective.
J
Okay,
thank
you
and
I'll,
also
just
State,
and
this
is
going
to
be
my
last
comment
for
now
until
we
have
other
speakers
up
here,
which
is
that
I
think
when
we're
talking
about
costs,
it's
also
imperative
that
we
bring
in
the
externalities
of
the
cost
of
lesson
tree.
J
You
know
diminished
tree
canopy
and
understory
the
cost
of
landslides
to
our
city,
which
have
been
extremely
damaging
to
our
budget
over
year
after
year,
the
cost
of
not
even
doing
nothing
but
the
cost
of
an
ineffective
program
over
time
and
a
lack
of
Maintenance.
So
that
was
just
the
last
thing.
I
wanted
to
state
for
now
and
I'll
Reserve
further
comment
until
later.
Thank
you.
Thank.
B
You
councilman
cargo.
B
N
You
hello,
Natalie.
N
N
Yes,
is
that
right
yeah,
so
my
first
instinct
is
that
seems
awfully
expensive,
but,
and
the
other
point
I
wanted
to
make
is
what
we're
proposing
or
what
the
administration's
proposing
it's
ten
thousand
dollars
or
so
I
think
our
expenses
are
probably
just
in
the
Personnel
that
we
have
to
secure
the
place,
and
you
know
things
of
that
nature.
The
hunters
I
believe,
will
take
their
game
and
process
it
and
pay
for
it
themselves.
N
As
far
as
food
pantries
goes,
I
don't
know
who
processes
it
who
butchers
them,
but,
like
I,
guess
it's
a
question
of
mine,
but
I.
Don't
expect
you
to
know
that
but
I
do
appreciate
your
passion
for
this
I
really
do
and
and
I
too
hate
to
see
something
like
this
happen.
I
really
do
but-
and
let
me
ask
you
this
Natalie,
you
said
it
would
have
to
be
done
annually
and
I
heard
the
explanation
right.
Where
do
you
have
an
example
where
this
has
been
done
or
that
population
has
increased
or
we.
X
Can
provide
that
information
to
you?
It
is
you
know
in
scientific
studies,
the
phenomenon
I
spoke
to
is
is
documented
throughout.
You
know
not
just
in
deer
calls
and
deer
population
management,
but
just
a
natural
phenomenon.
N
Yeah
yeah
I
find
that
one
hard
to
believe
I
really
do
but
I'm
not
disputing
your
your
claim,
but
I'd
have
to
see
that
be
honest
with
you
and
I'd
love
to
know
the
expense.
Do
you
have
any
idea
of
the
expense
to
say
A
hundred
Deer
have.
T
To
you
can
probably
speak
to
this,
but
I
do
want
to
say
that
we
spoke
to
the
country's
leading
expert.
That
does
both
calls
and
non-lethal
management.
He
does
both
in
hybrids
and
we
offered
them
as
a
resource
to
the
mayor's
office.
To
answer
some
of
these
questions
and
to
our
knowledge,
they
did
not
reach
out
to
this
person,
so
we
have
provided
opportunities
to
have
those
questions
answered
that
have
not
been
taken
up
right
as
far.
N
As
we
know
right
and
when
you
say
that
I
guess
someone's
you're,
assuming
that
the
deer
population
in
say
Riverview
Park,
is
the
Dare
population
we
come
and
we
spay
them,
they
grow.
They
die
naturally
and
they're,
not
not
able
to
reproduce
but
I
think
it
fluctuates.
I
know
in
my
own
backyard,
there's
a
different
set
of
deer
that
come
in
and
out
all
the
time
there
are
the
usuals,
though
you
know
the
ones
again,
I
feed
them.
If
you
ever
want
to
feed
a
deer,
Ritz
crackers,
they
love
them.
N
So
so
so
you
know
so
I
I
guess
I
have
a
hard
time
of
understanding
non-lethal
and
the
expense
of
it.
Do
you
have
any
idea?
What
would
it
cost
to
come
in
and
do
that.
X
No
because
even
if
you
have
a
city
of
the
exact
same,
say,
square
mileage
and
exact
same
deer,.
X
We
don't
even
know
that
answer
right,
the
topography
makes
it
I
mean
if
you're
trying
to
scale
Mount
Washington
to
get
a
deer
that
you
just
started.
It's
a
very
different
kind
of
you
know
it
just
expense
in
all
of
the
different
equipment
that
you
need
and
the
experts
that
you
need,
and
things
like
that
versus.
If
you're
going
to
be
like
in
my
backyard
in
Brookline,
for.
N
N
A
X
I
was
I
was
particularly
concerned
when
the
answer
to
the
question
of
how
will
these
areas
be
sequestered
off
was
maybe
Department
of
Public
Works
or
something
I.
Don't
think
that
that
question
was
answered
appropriately.
N
N
I
I,
just
you
know,
in
the
one
particular
place,
is
300
plus
acres
Greenway
in
my
district
Beachview
area,
and
you
know
I
can't
imagine
I
mean
you
could
come
in
a
thousand
different
ways,
and
and
if
it's
not
super
secure
somebody,
some
kids
I
used
to
build
Shacks
I
spent
half
my
childhood
down
there.
T
T
N
Only
Advantage
I
would
say
versus
non-lethal
versus
lethal.
Is
that
we're
providing
food
to
people
where
the
non-lethal
way?
We
would
not
be
not
to
say
that's
the
Difference
Maker
for
me,
but
just
you
know
one
small
portion,
okay,
well,
listen!
I,
appreciate
your
passion,
you
know,
I'll
be
supporting
it
today.
I
think
the
rush
is
I.
N
O
Yeah,
so
just
quickly,
because
I
do
I
mean
this
question
of
who
is
requiring
the
pilot
and
what
is
the
purp?
You
know
why
do
we
have
to
do
a
pilot
I
think
that
is
a
very
good
question
that
we
haven't
answered
yet
I
I
do
think
a
a
number
of
the
other
things.
I've
heard
again,
I've
read
things
too
right
that
say,
birth
control
is
more
expensive,
doesn't
really
work
like,
but
I
don't
want
to
speculate,
because
because
I've
read
something
you
know
or
someone
I
would
rather
so
for
those
questions
again
like
the.
O
Why
I
do
want
to
wait
until
we
have
the
deer
management
task
force
Folks
up,
who
actually
do
have
some
numbers
to
provide
about
number
of
Derek
cetera
so
at
any
rate,
but
if
we
could
have
perhaps
Chief
Frank
again
and
I,
don't
know
who
else
would
be
best
positioned
to
to
answer
sort
of
who
is
required
like
the
legality
of
it?
Why
do
we
need
a
pilot?
O
O
So
yeah,
so
why
so
you
know
who
is
requiring
the
pilot?
Why
do
we
need
to
do
a
pie?
You
know
why
are
we
proceeding
in
this
way?
First,
with
the
pilot
which,
which
has
been
acknowledged
already
at
the
table,
is
not
going
to
reduce
our
deer
population.
So
why
do
we
need
the
pilot
and
then
what
is
the
right?
Is
it
to
show
that
we
can
do
this
without
screwing
it
up,
and
you
know
like
what
is
the
purpose
of
the
pilot
for
those
and
who
is
requiring
it
I.
Y
Would
say
the
the
Pilot's
more
of
a
test
run
for
for
us?
Obviously,
the
USDA.
Does
this
all
the
time
they
do
this
in
different
municipalities
within
Pennsylvania?
They
do
this
all
over
the
place,
and
this
actually
just
gives
us
the
ability
to
test
run
and
do
it
the
right
way.
Y
I
think
that's
the
most
important
part
we
picked
Riverview
Park
and
we
picked
freck
Park
based
on
the
areas
that
the
parks
are
in
shunley
park,
for
example,
that
that
can
be
for
next
year
or
the
year
after,
depending
on
how
long
this
pilot
is
those.
Those
are
heavy
wooded
areas
specifically
being
that
there
are
restricted
areas
within
those
Parks.
Y
So,
basically,
we
will
have
parameters
set
up
in
the
Parks
where
you
can
have
no
hunting
zones,
and
we
want
to
basically
have
it
specific
where
we
have
full
control
over
the
hunting.
If
that's
allowed,
you
know
that.
O
S
To
be
certified
by
The
Game
Commission
as
an
entity
that
can
engage
in
I,
don't
know
what
to
call
it
full-blown
deer
management
and
it,
and
it
felt
a
little
bit
like
a
catch-22
for
us
right,
because
you
can't
get
permission
to
do
deer
management
unless
you've
done
a
little
deer
management.
And
so
what
we'd
like
to
be
in
a
position
to
do
next
year
is
make
our
application
to
the
Game
Commission
to
to
be
I.
S
Don't
know
certified
to
be
a
fully
capable
deer
management
entity,
and
to
do
that,
we
need
to
do
a
little
bit
of
a
deer
management
and
it
is
stumped
us
for
a
while
that
we
have
to
do
the
thing
that
we
that
the
commission
wants
so
I
mean
that
that
is
the
short
answer
to
to
your
question.
Also
about
you
know,
I
I
know,
there's
been
a
lot
of
concern
about.
Why
so
quickly?
Why
so
quickly?
S
I
mean
what
the
Rangers
shared
with
me
is
that
their
expectation
is
that
the
deer
population
will
double
in
a
year,
and
so
getting
this
box
checked
and
behind
us
so
that
we
can
engage,
we
can
debate.
We
can
talk
about
how
to
do
it.
We
can
have
a
lot
of
questions
about
that,
but
getting
this
box
checked
as
our
deal
population
is
doubling
is
important
to
put
us
into
a
position
with
the
state
of
Pennsylvania
to
do
deer
management
of
any
variety.
O
S
S
Legal
in
the
state
of
Pennsylvania,
so
that
leaves
us
with
the
sterilization
program
that
runs
about
fifteen
hundred
dollars,
a
deer
and
so
in
with
the
experts
that
we
spoke
to
the
most
I
guess,
just
straight
up,
feasible
thing
that
we
would
do
would
be
a
I
think
you
said
it.
S
Councilman
strasberger
would
be
to
do
culling
to
get
ourselves
into
a
position
where
we
could
move
into
management
through
some
kind
of
you
know
sterilization
or
birth
control
program,
but
that
we
did
not
think
we
would
ever
really
have
sufficient
funds
to
get
to
a
manageable
population
just
by
doing
surgical
sterilization.
It's
about
it's
about
fifteen
hundred
dollars,
a
deer.
O
Okay
and
then
also
just
to
address
so
I
did
I
mean
well,
and
we
can
do,
and
maybe
we'll
come
back
to
this
a
little
bit,
but
as
far
as
the,
how
is
it
going
to
work
now,
I'll
say:
I
I
was
sort
of
under
the
assumption
that,
in
order
to
begin
any
of
this
process
sitting
down
with
the
USDA,
how
is
this
going
to
work?
Lay
it
out.
Where
is
it
going
to
be?
What
time
is
it
going
to
be
like?
O
S
The
USDA,
understandably,
would
like
us
to
enter
into
a
contract
to
get
to
work
on
executing
on
the
skill
and
given
the
length
of
deer
season
and
I
will
also
share
they.
They
were
flexible
with
us.
There,
everyone
was
was
sort
of
gone
when
they
sent
over
the
contract
and
I
think
they
said
this
needs
to
be.
We
need
to
have
this
contract
in
place
to
begin
that
planning
with
you
to
get
the
website
up
for
the
qualifications.
S
To
do
all
of
these
things,
we
need
the
contract,
I
believe
Jonathan,
correct
me
if
I'm
wrong,
but
August
10th
and
I
called
them
and
said.
Well,
that's
not
really
something
the
city
of
Pittsburgh
can
do,
and
would
you
work
with
us
if
we
said
we
will
make
this
the
first
order
of
business
and
we
under
understanding
that
that
is
going
to
create
some
discomfort.
I
mean
truly
understanding
that
is
going
to
create
some
discomfort,
but
we
are
really
right
up
to
their
last
possible
day
to
be
able
to
execute
a
contract.
U
U
Well,
it's
kind
of
odd,
since
it's
in
my
district,
so
just
to
yeah,
so
I
would
like
to
have
been
informed
a
little
sooner,
especially
when
this
was
coming
about.
This
would
take
place
around
the
residents
that
so
I'm
just
going
to
state
that,
but
given
that
I'm
curious
to
know-
and
this
was
more
directed
at
departments
rather
than
experts-
if
you
have
some
questions
for
experts
but
I'm,
not
sure
if
there's
any
experts
in
the
room
on
the
success
of
calls.
Y
I'm,
not
an
expert
but
I've
had
extensive
conversations
with
the
the
PA
Game
Commission
and
they
recommend
that
this
is
the
best
way
to
do
it.
Now
we
could
probably
get
someone
from
the
PA
Game
Commission
to
come
in
and
speak
with
you
directly,
but
they
are
the
experts
they
do
this
for
a
living.
The
USDA
works
with
them
hand
in
hand.
They
are
the
experts.
I
would
say
that
we're
we're
trying
to
learn
how
to
be
an
expert.
Y
This
is
why
we're
working
and
partnering
with
the
USDA
and
The
Game
Commission
on
how
to
be
experts,
but
this
is
the
one
thing
that
they
constantly
say
regardless.
If
we
talk
to
a
game
warden,
if
we
talk
to
someone
from
the
PA
Game
Commission
that
this
is
the
number
one
way
to
reduce
deer
population
within
the
state.
U
Thank
you,
okay,
so,
in
terms
of
the
the
number
that's
been
thrown
around,
whether
it's
50.,
so
there
hasn't
been
any
account
and
if
anyone's
in
the
room
that
has
done
the
count,
I'll
be
interested
to
hear
from
them,
but
they're
as
a
number
of
deer.
So
let
me
just
State,
like
the
the
majority
of
my
residents,
want
it.
What
I'm,
trying
to
understand
and
I
want
to
support
that?
U
What
I'm
trying
to
understand
is
just
so
we're
all
on
the
same
page
with
this,
because
even
information
that
their
tone
like
residents
are
reaching
out
about
I'm,
not
sure
if
that's
gonna
I
just
want
to
know
if
it's
gonna
solve
the
problem.
So
here's
a
lot
of
things
that
I
hear
dear
hat
dear
the
major
reason,
for
you
know:
people
getting
Lyme
disease
deer
are
causing
the
you
know
this
they're
eating
the
saplings
they're
eating
the
the
brush.
U
You
know
as
I've
been
other
than
just
like
hearsay
and
just
like
saying,
I've
lived
in
the
city
since
the
70s.
You
know
what
what
are
has
anyone
relate.
Is
anyone
in
the
room
here
have
they
counted?
Are
they?
Are
we
gonna
like
count
when
the
foliage
comes
back
or
the
brush
comes
back
I'm,
just
trying
to
understand?
If
there's
like
a
briefing
that
we
can
have
to
understand,
this
more
deeply
then
understand
if
we're
actually
gonna
solve
the
problem.
I
U
If
you
could
state
your
name
and
and
affiliation
or
expertise
to
the
this
matter,
like
some
of
those
credentials,
will
be
good.
A
V
V
Getting
information
on
collisions
is
difficult
because
it's
under
comprehensive
according
to
the
state
insurance
commission,
it's
not
reported
as
a
deer
Collision,
so
we
don't
have
city-wide
numbers,
but
we
do
have
some
national
studies
that
have
been
done
and
as
to
the
numbers
of
deer.
The
last
study
that
was
done
in
the
city
of
Pittsburgh
was
2010
and
it
was,
and
in
four
of
our
Parks
Frick
Shenley,
Highland
and
Riverview,
and
at
that
time
the
deer
overpopulation
was
well.
V
The
numbers
were
into
four
to
six
times
what
it
should
be
to
maintain
a
population,
and
that
was
2010.
And
if
you
consider
that
deer
double
in
population
every
two
or
three
years,
we're
looking
at
a
serious
overpopulation.
But
nothing
has
been
done
with
cameras
and
with
surveying
and
with
daily
going
back
to
track
the
numbers
since
2010..
V
U
A
V
Were
here
well,
I
was
chair
of
the
shade
tree
commission
at
the
time,
and
we
were
concerned
because
of
our
young
trees
that
we're
trying
to
repopulate
our
parks
and
our
tree
canopy.
They
were
being
eaten
faster
than
we
could
replant
them,
and
we
had
all
kinds
of
strategies
to
put
tubes
around
them
and
fence
them
and
do
everything
we
could
and
really
seriously
nothing
worked
and
we
weren't
able
to
get
the
issue
of
deer
management
to
city
council.
V
At
that
time
we
were
kind
of
shut
off
before
we
got
to
the
door,
but
in
the
last
year
we
have
been
working
providing
information
to
the
mayor's
office.
Our
Council
people
obviously
have
been
very
involved
in
Squirrel
Hill
I
have
a
partner
in
Riverview
Park,
because
that
seemed
to
be
one
of
the
worst
back
in
2010.
It
was
the
highest
density
of
deer.
L
V
And
Kate
St
John,
who
was
a
birder,
and
it
spends
a
lot
of
time
in
chenley
and
Frick
Park.
She
has
taken
a
lot
of
the
data
that
we've
been
collecting
over
the
last
year
and
put
it
together
in
a
format
that
we
hope
is
easy
for
everybody
to
understand,
and
we
did
send
it
to
the
city
clerk
so
that
you
could
all
see
it.
But
what?
U
V
F
V
Were
USDA
was
saying:
basically,
you
need
a
deer
management
program
and
at
that
time,
as
I
said,
we
worked
with
the
mayor's
office.
We
work
with
public
works,
I,
say
we
we
if
we
was
then
the
shade
tree
Commission
and
we
just
couldn't
get
it
the
conversation
off
the
dime.
Nobody
wanted
to
even
have
a
conversation
publicly
about
it.
So.
U
V
U
Yeah
I
mean
I'm
wondering
so
is
this?
Are
you
so
if
we
take
care
of,
if
there
are
deer
that
are
called
in
the
in
the
Parks
here
that
have
these
numbers
and
we
track
that
and
then
I
don't
know
as
if
there's
a
plan
to
contract
with
the
USDA
again
to
then
see
if
the
numbers
have
decreased,
but
even
if
that
does
decreases,
what's
stopping
the
deer
population
to
continue
to
grow
in
our
green
spaces,.
V
It's
it's
not
going
to
happen
for
certainly
for
a
number
of
years,
but
once
you
get
to
the
balance
and
then
once
you,
you
implement
an
effective
deer
management
program
in
your
Parks,
then
that
spillover
effect
doesn't
happen
to
your
green
spaces
and
your
public
streets
and
all
else
that
happens.
You
do
reduce
vehicle
collisions.
For
example,
in
every
city
we've
studied
when
they've
implemented
a
deer
management
plan,
they
have
in
fact
reduced
deer
vehicle
collisions.
V
When
you
implement
a
deer
management
plan,
they
have
reduced
the
number
of
spillover
deer
into
our
residential
streets
into
our
Greenways
into
the
other
parklet
areas
that
we
have.
So
it's
a
it's
a
proven
strategy
from
the
cities
that
we
have
studied
and
from
what
we've
gained
from
the
Game
Commission.
We've
we've
been
in
contact
with
the
warden
and
what
other
Pennsylvania
cities,
but
also
what
other
cities
throughout
the
country
are
doing.
V
For
example,
Cleveland
has
a
park
system
very
similar
to
ours
with
four
major
parks,
and
they
were
one
of
the
ones
that
we
contacted
I'd
like
to
turn
it
over
to
Kate,
because
she
has
a
lot
of
the
information
she's
been
going
into
at
looking
at
the
devastation
for
20
years.
So
she
can
begin
to
tell
you
what
the
over
browsing
actually
does
to
the
park.
U
Before
we
do
that,
and
since
you're
I
mean
you
said
that
you
formed
a
committee
and
and
you've
been
talking
to
the
experts
at
the
USDA
and
who
else
have
you
consulted
with
well.
V
The
biology
that's
in
the
field,
the
biologist
at
The,
Game
Commission,
the
warden
we've
talked
to
the
the
warden
who
was
assigned
to
us
to
our
area.
We
worked
with
the
park
rangers
we've
contacted.
We
have
a
vet
on
our
committee,
who
was
affiliated
with
Penn
and
we've
just
gone
to
as
many
places
as
we
can
to
gather
information.
V
W
I'm,
a
birder,
a
naturalist,
I've
been
following
the
deer
and
their
effect
on
birds
in
the
habitat.
Oh
I'm,
sorry,
I
didn't
introduce
myself.
Thank
you.
Kate
St,
John
I
live
in
North
Oakland
I
used
to
live
in
Greenfield
and
I'm.
W
A
birder
naturalist,
I've
been
following
the
deer
problem
and
how
it
affects
Pennsylvania
and
now
Pittsburgh
since
1998,
but
I'm
I
am
primarily
a
birder,
so
I
see
the
effect
on
birds
and
deer
have
an
effect
on
their
entire
habitat,
as
anybody
in
the
habitat
would
so
when
they
reach
an
overpopulation
point.
It
happens
rapidly.
W
They
every
year
98
of
the
does,
are
bred.
So
there's
very
few.
Does
that
aren't
pregnant
in
the
cities
in
suburbs,
40
percent
of
The
Fawns
breed
before
they're
a
year
old,
so
they
have
they
give
birth
when
they're
a
year
old
and
85
percent
of
the
pregnancies
are
twins
or
triplets,
so
they
double
their
population
every
two
to
three
years
and
so
whatever
number
you're
seeing
there-
and
this
is
that
doubling-
includes
those-
are
all
numbers
from
The
Game
Commission.
That
doubling
includes
the
deaths.
W
So
it's
just
how
many
we
have
so
I've
started,
looking
hard
at
Schenley
Park
in
2008
and
documenting
what
I
saw
and
now
that
we
are
they've
been
doubling
for
a
long
time
at
first
they
were
hard
to
notice,
but
now
you
can
walk
through
shunley
Park
I
can
show
you
eight
point
bucks
hanging
out
together
this
month
and
but
what
they
are
eating.
You
want
to
know
what
they're
eating.
W
W
When
you
take
somebody
who
knows
what
they're
looking
at
to
look
at
it,
they,
the
trees
that
are
growing
from
the
ground
are
like
Bonsai,
because
in
the
winter
deer
don't
have
leaves
to
eat,
they
eat
the
Twigs,
so
all
the
there
and
then
at
this
season
there
and
also
in
the
winter
they're
browsing
the
trees
up,
so
they
reach
as
high
as
they
can
and
pull
down
leaves
and
twigs
and
eat
them.
W
Nothing
else
does
that
and
I
have
in
a
PowerPoint
I
have
a
series
of
photos
that
show
the
effects
of
deer
brows
and
they
have
moved
out
of
the
parks
and
one
of
the
favorite
things
they
eat
is
you,
which
is
a
kind
of
shrub,
a
shrub
that
is
not
eaten
grows.
Normally,
if
you
look
at
the
shrub,
the
U
shrubs
behind
Frick
Fine
Arts
in
Oakland,
A
Carnegie
Museum,
as
you
drive
into
the
parking
lot,
you
see
Twiggy,
looking
wood
and
then
hidden
behind
that
are
the
use
and
that
that's.
W
I
think
Marty
can
speak
to
that
better,
but
I
do
know
that
it
that
I'm
speaking
for
the
forest
and
saying
this
kind
of
pressure
is
not
good
for
the
forest
or
the
plants
or
the
or
anything
that
relies
on
them,
and
it's
not
good
for
the
deer,
because
now
they
are
trying
to
eat
poisonous
plants.
They
are
eating
things.
They
don't
like.
There's
no
native
plants
left
and
there's
nothing
for
that.
Nowhere
for
them
to
hide.
When
a
dough
drops
a
fawn,
she
has
to
hide
it
there's
nowhere
to
hide.
W
If
you
have
the
population
right,
then
the
growth
will
come
that
there's
a
deer
exclosure
in
Frick
Park.
That
shows
you
that
outside
the
exposure
there's
nothing
growing,
especially
if
you
look
at
it
and
say
April
outside
the
exclosure,
nothing
on
the
ground
inside
the
exclosure,
where
the
deer
can't
be
their
stuff
growing,
yeah.
U
W
V
And
green
and
it's
an
invasive
actually
and
that's
all
there
is
no
native
plants
left
and
what
we
know
from
these
enclosures
that
Kate
was
talking
about
is
that
when
you
see
them
side
by
side,
you
can
tell
if
the
deer
have
been
kept
out.
There
are
native
plants
and
the
little
trees
that
we're
trying
to
native
trees,
not
invasive
trees,
but
native.
They
are
actually
coming
back
in
these
enclosures
and
it's
something
that
we
can
prove
to
you
through
photographs
that
it
will
work
if
we
can
reduce
the
deer
population.
U
Yeah
I
just
want
to
be
mindful
of
the
the
goals
that
we
have
here
in
the
pilot
just
seems
like
a
pilot.
That
is
one
that
will
let
us
know
if
we're
effective
at
reducing
the
population,
but
we
don't
have
the
numbers
currently
so
we'll
be
well
I,
guess
we'll
be
subtracting
what
we
have
and
then
we'll
be
making
the
count.
I'm.
Sorry,
do
you
know
this
information?
You
will
be.
V
And
then
that
becomes
just
the
trigger
that
allows
us
to
submit
to
the
Game
Commission
an
overall
deer
management
plan
which
has
to
then
include
all
of
the
options
that
we're
talking
about
and
possibly
get
their
approval
and
then
go
full
force
into
24
for
all
of
our
Parks.
Not
just
the
two
demonstrations.
So
I,
don't
believe
from
everything
that
I've
heard
that
we
will
have
any
kind
of
data
that
will
tell
us
reductions.
A
V
Other
than
how
to
do
it
seems
to
me
what
the
Game
Commission
wants
us
to
prove,
so
that
we
can
then
maybe
get
some
cameras
in
get
some
numbers
going
and
begin
to
survey
where
we
are
and
where
we're
going.
V
U
V
U
V
U
It
to
you
directly,
probably
yeah
I
mean
yeah
yeah
that'd,
be
great.
Just
you
know
once
again,
I've
had
multiple
residents
reach
out.
U
Every
everyone
is
in
is
you
know
in
favor
of
this
I
just
feel
that
it's
I
just
think
it's
our
all
of
us
sitting
here
our
responsibility
to
have
more
of
a
robust
conversation
about
this
and
so
I'm
just
concerned
about
the
you
know
about
the
the
timing
of
this
of
why
it's
you
know
why
we
can't
have
briefings
understand
more
deeply
on
like
how
we're
gonna
have
a
more
robust
plan
to
solve
the
issues.
U
Not
just
you
know
not
just
by
way
of
the
call
you
know,
there's
other
have
you
looked
at
other
strategies,
other.
U
Us
what's
going
to
come
alongside
the
you
know,
the
call
like
would
we
say
we
get
certified
and
then
we
have
these
hunts
that
are
I'm,
not
sure
how
often
it
would
take
place,
but
whatever
that,
whatever
that
number
is
then
there
there,
it
seems
like
there
should
be
something
that
goes
alongside
that,
to
make
sure
that
you
know
we're
taking
care
of
the
parks
appropriately.
Not
just
you
know,
because
I'm
not
I'm,
not
fully
I,
don't
fully
understand.
U
I,
don't
fully
have
the
understanding
to
know
that
this
is
going
to
solve
all
the
problems
that
people
are
emailing
me
about
and
I'm
just
concerned
about
that
like
if
there's
a
a
problem
to
solve.
You
know
I'd
like
to
be
involved
in
those
conversations
to
do
that
and
I'm
I'm,
just
not
seeing
that
and
but
I
want
to
be
supportive
of
what
you
know
everyone
has.
Has
you
know
how
the
work
you've
done
and
be?
Mindful
of
you
know
your.
U
U
I
think
that
the
time
you
know
I
understand
like
this
hunting
season
is
coming
up.
It's
like
we
just
found
out
that
you
know
that
hunting
season
happens
or
that
we
need
to
get
certified
to
do
this.
U
U
Whenever
other
people
talk
to
the
right,
the
expert
it
can,
it
can
get
a
little
bit
confusing
right
and
everyone
is
talking
about.
U
And
everyone
is,
everyone
else
is
talking
to
the
experts
and
I
feel
that
it
would
be
our
duty
here
to
talk
to
those
individuals
so
that
we're
fully
aware
of
the
potential
and
the
consequences
of
what's
going
to
happen
here
and
I
just
think
we're
not
doing
justice,
but
by
doing
that,
I
think
everyone
is
interested
in
solving
this
problem.
I
have
no
doubt
in
that
I
just
wish
that
we
flushed
us
out
more
and
we're
more
strategic
in
our
plan.
Here.
U
K
Yeah,
it's
out
of
sequence
for
sure,
yeah,
yeah
and
I
think
we
should,
because
it
doesn't
seem
actually
like
there
is
a
completely
fleshed
out
plan
honestly
right.
So
it
seems
like
we
still
don't
know
exactly
the
footprints.
The
time
frames
the
goal
again
kind
of
like
have
we
established,
and
maybe
it's
in
your
report,
I
apologize
that
Ken
seems
to
council
members
didn't
receive
the
report.
I
didn't
receive
the
report.
I
just
checked
my
email
kind
of
where's.
K
What
is
our
Baseline
and
it
does
seem
like
photographs
of
the
actual
you
know,
plants
in
this
specific
areas
compared
year
over
year
could
be
something
that
we
can
see
evidence
of
an
improvement
in
a
very
limited
area.
We
may
not
see
that
Improvement,
since
this
is
such
a
small
pilot
program.
K
I
also
I,
think
I
heard
enough
to
definitely
make
me
want
to
find
out
more
about
the
non-lethal
methods,
and
is
there
a
way
to
combine
both
of
these?
Do
we
get
to
a
level
right
that
we're
trying
to
aim
at,
even
though
we
kind
of
We
aren't
even
talking
numbers
about
like
what
is
this
we're
not
even
confident
of
the
numbers
that
we
have
or
what
levels
we're
trying
to
achieve?
K
And
then
I
I?
Don't
we
don't
have
the
right
people
at
the
table
yet
to
still
revisit
the
kind
of
weapons
that
are
being
used
again?
Bose
is
not
descriptive
enough.
All
the
compound
bows
do
travel
quite
some
distance
and
we
will
definitely
I
think
as
Council
want
to
hear
more
about
the
safety
precautions
and
the
the
footprints
and
how
these
are
being
protected
and
there's
I
think
a
lot
a
lot.
A
lot
longer
conversation
as
councilman
Wilson
was
saying
about
really
getting
people
to
and
us
to
understand.
K
Our
parks,
management
and
we've
talked
so
many
times
about
trying
to
manage
and
improve
invasive
species
where
we're
getting
we're
losing
our
native
trees
and
shrubs
because
of
invasive
species,
but
here
also
we're
we're
losing
them
because
of
the
over
browsing
by
the
deer,
and
then
we've
heard
just
a
little
hint
today
about
how
the
over
browse
them
by
the
deer
and
the
loss
of
that
canopy
or
it's
not
really
canopy,
but
the
loss
of
the
the
plants
at
Deer
height
that
has
to
have
an
impact
on
other
species
right,
and
so
you
know
the
bird
populations
or
other
animals
that
are
populations
now
have
no
habitat.
K
So
it's
a
loss
of
habitat
for
other
animal
species.
So
there's
just
this
is
like
a
really
it's
a
really
big
topic.
It's
a
really
big
topic
that
we
haven't
fully
fleshed
out.
So
I
am
wondering
about
the
timing.
It
does
seem
like
the
administration
is
asking
for
us
to
rush
this
vote
and
even
if
we
let
them
get
started,
that
doesn't
mean
that
we're
out
of
the
conversation
honestly
right.
K
So
we
should
stay
in
that
conversation
in
the
coming
weeks
so
that
we
can
get
these
questions
answered
and
frankly,
I
think
Council
has
the
authority
to
cancel
a
contract
even
if
it
Awards
one.
So
there's
that
too
not
to
open
any
can
of
worms.
I
think
I
just
did
so.
There's
that
so
that's
all
I'm
going
to
have
right
now,
Mr,
chair
and
I,
do
I
do
see
that
we
have
I
want
to
ask
our
guest
who's
been
eager
to
kind.
Z
Yeah
yeah
yeah
I
met
with
your
Chief
of
Staff
when
when
we
were
when
our
group
was
doing
some
Outreach
several
months
ago,
I
can
I
speak
like.
Z
Right,
okay,
yeah
yeah,
so
like
so
I'm,
I'm
kind
of
well
known
as
a
party
pooper
I,
I,
I'm
I'm.
The
person
who
shows
up
and
tells
everybody
that
they're
you
know
saying
things
imprecisely
like
like
dear
call
is,
is
a
specific
thing
like
like
a
deer
call,
is
when
you
go
in
and
you
severely
deplete
the
population.
Z
That's
not
what's
happening
here,
they're
they're,
doing
hunting,
it's
it!
It's
different!
I
like
there
there's
a
lot
of
things
that
have
been
said
that
have
been
that
you
know
I
would
more
than
more
than
be
happy
to
refute
like
about
the
sterilization,
that's
in
addition
to
the
birth
control.
That
is
also
not
approved
by
The
Game
Commission.
Z
To
do
you
know
like
we
could
spend
fifteen
hundred
dollars
to
sterilize
every
single
deer
in
the
city
and
people
would
wonder
why
we
weren't
solving
our
housing
crisis
instead,
I
have
so
much
information
inside
of
my
head.
I,
don't
know
where
to
start,
but
a
couple
of
the
things
that
I
can
say
is
that
Cincinnati
has
a
very
successful
program
and
they're
in
in
in
their
city
parks.
They
also
have
a
program
in
their
County
Parks.
Our
county
has
a
program
in
our
County
Parks.
Z
You
know
like
multiple
municipalities,
Fox
Chapel
has
a
program
that
largely
takes
place
on
private
property.
It
has
successfully
decreased
the
the
the
the
deer
and
car
collisions
in
their
community
and,
and
that
is
the
primary
metric
that
the
suburbs
use
to
explain
their
program
and
to
justify
their
program.
Z
That
is
something
that
we
could
also
do
that
you
know
there
are.
There
are
just
an
amazing.
It
is
a
very
complex
topic.
The
the
program
in
New
York
that
that
the
Humane
action
folks
were
speaking
about
that
is
on
Staten
Island
Staten
Island
is
an
island.
Pittsburgh
is
not
an
island.
If
we
sterilized
all
the
deer
in
the
city,
deer
would
come
in
from
the
suburbs.
Z
I
I
I
in
in
terms
of
the
the
quickness
of
this
program,
was
another
thing
that
I
I
am
sometimes
referred
to
as
a
professional
citizen,
because
I
go
to
an
awful
lot
of
public
meetings
and
engage
with
my
community
and
I
help.
People
with
a
lot
of
things
and
and
what
I
hear
from
a
lot
of
my
friends
who
work
at
the
city
is
that
maintenance
is,
is,
is
a
consistent
issue
in
the
city
due
to
Staffing
and
all
different
kinds
of
ways.
Z
There
another
agency
there-
yes,
okay,
okay,
so
so
I,
don't
think
we
explained
the
origin
of
the
task
force
as
well
like,
like
so
I'm
a
member
of
friends
of
Riverview
and
and
and
we
we
we've
been
pushing
on
this
issue
since
we
were
founded
and
I
heard
about
the
Squirrel
Hill
Urban
Coalition,
doing
doing
their
advocacy
in
the
fall
and
I
reached
out
to
Marty,
and
then
we
started
this
program
just
in
January
and
and
and
we
started
this
because
we
knew
that
none
of
the
non-profits
wanted
to
do
this.
Z
No
one
wanted
to
be
the
lead
on
this.
You
know,
and-
and
so
so
you
know,
we
use
our
our
knowledge
and
our
you
know.
Z
Just
all
of
you
know:
I
I
I,
reached
out
to
people
who
I've
worked
on.
You
know
the
ecological
issues
throughout
the
city,
you
know
like
Tree,
Pittsburgh,
goatscape
and
you
know,
and
and
just
got
everyone
involved,
and
you
know
we
started
sharing
information
and
having
meetings,
and
you
know
and
then
and
then
the
you
know,
folks
who
work
at
the
city
started
getting
involved
and
that's
and
that's
how
we
engaged
started
to
engage
with
the
Rangers.
Z
We
are
the
ones
who
encourage
the
Rangers
to
reach
out
to
USDA.
You
know
like
that.
That's
the
connection
that
we
made
we
we
we
helped
this
happen
because
you
know
we
saw
that
it
wasn't
happening
otherwise.
Z
I
Z
A
W
A
B
I
I
If
there's
any
one
thing
that
I'm
hearing
from
the
discussion
today
is
through
the
the
process
of
lack
of
action
for
now
decades,
we
have
all
been
diminished,
regardless
of
what
role
we
may
play
in
this
conversation
we
have
all
been
diminished
and
that
we
find
ourselves
now
at
critical
mass,
and
so
we
are
crafting
strategy
just
to
get
us
through
critical
mass,
which
will
only
get
us
through
critical
mass
and
no
further
and
next
year,
we'll
be
back
here
again,
asking
the
same
questions
and
and
trying
again,
unsuccessfully,
hopefully
not
to
find
a
a
comprehensive
yearly,
Wildlife
Management
plan
across
the
city,
and
so
what
does
that
look
like
what
shape?
I
A
I
Baseball
and-
and
that
is
that
is
the
challenge
we're
faced
with,
and
unfortunately
no
maybe
fortunately
what's
coming
out
of
this
conversation
is
that
this
Council
may
want
to
want
to
have
another
moment
to
to
clear
our
heads
and
and
understand
the
holistically
understand
the
challenge
before
us
and
what
is
being
asked
of
us
to
do.
I
Are
we
going
to
just
react
to
This
Moment
In
Time
and
do
this
call
if
that
is
the
right
terminology
and
without
any
clear,
comprehensive
strategy
for
long-term
long-term
Wildlife
Management
across
the
city
and
what
those
budgetary
impacts
are
and
how
we
plan
for
them
Jonathan.
I
There
was
one
thing
that
you
said
about
this
this
the
USDA
says
this
is
the
best
solution,
but
my
question
for
you
is
it
the
does
the
USDA
say
this
is
the
best
solution
because
of
the
situation
we
are
in,
or
is
that
holistic
across
the
board
comprehensive
statement?
Saying
yes,
calling
is
your
most
effective
strategy
and
you
can?
Can
we
bring
them
I
bet
if
we
just,
we
can
bring
them
in.
Y
I
Y
Is
it
anything
really
yeah
hunting
would
be
the
best
solution.
I
mean
it
won't
happen
overnight,
but
it's
over
time.
I
Y
I
think
over
over
time,
when
we
kind
of
let
things
go
and
not
saying
it
was
anyone
here
at
the
table
or
anyone
in
other
administrations,
I
think
over
time.
This
whole
situation
transpired
and
multiplied
and
we're
in
this
situation
today
and
I
I
feel
like
we
have
to
start
somewhere,
and
this
might
be
the
somewhere
where
we
need
to
start
and
it's
something
that
has
been
developing
since
there
was
a
study
in
2010
I'm
sure
other
directors
were
pondering
about
this.
Y
Other
council
members
have
been
pondering
about
this
and
I
feel
like
we're
at
this
point
where
it's
a
Tipping
Point,
like
someone
said
earlier
that
we're
we're
here
now,
and
it
would
be
great
to
start
at
some
point,
hopefully
soon.
I
B
You
before
turning
over
to
councilman
strasberger
I,
just
want
to
use
my
programs
here
to
chime
in
for
one
second
and
follow
up
on
your
comments.
I
view
this
in
many
respects,
similar
to
our
affordable
housing
conversation,
as
you
may
recall,
because
you
would
hear
other
members
weren't
years
ago,
I
put
in
a
bill
that
said
30,
affordable
housing
and
any
special
planned
District
in
the
city
and
I
then
went
to
the
Planning,
Commission
and
admitted
I.
Don't
know
if
this
is
the
right
thing
to
do.
I
know
we
have
a
problem.
B
I
know
we
need
to
do
something
about
it,
but
I
don't
know
if
this
is
right
right
that
we
then
table
that
bill
in
favor
of
ultimately
bringing
forward
and
trading
the
affordable
housing
task
force
to
which
we
then
studied
and
figured
out.
Okay,
here's
what
needs
to
be
happening.
Here's
how
many
units
short
here's
the
strategies
of
that
which
we
then
ultimately
created
the
Housing
Opportunity
fund.
We
we've
done
the
bond,
and
so
we've
done
all
these
other
things
that
sort
of
came
out
of
an
initial
moment.
B
I
view
this,
as
that
sort
of
similar
thing,
which
is
we've
got
to
do
something
and
then
after
we
do
this
initial
thing.
Let's
then
spend
time
to
your
point:
councilman
Krauss
of
really
wrapping
our
Collective
Minds
around
how
we're
going
to
tackle
this
because
right
now
we're
just
talking
about
the
parks.
B
My
real
concern
is
all
the
deer
in
the
streets,
but
that's
for
us
to
collectively
think,
through
of
all
the
appropriate
parties,
to
go
down
that
road
to
come
up
with
full
plan
a
year
from
now,
so
that
we
can
have
a
comprehensive
thing
in
place.
So
I
just
want
to
give
my
perspective
on
why
I'm
comfortable
moving
this
forward.
Councilwoman
strasberger.
J
Thank
you
I.
You
know,
I
really
agree
with
both
of
you.
Councilman
Krause
I
respect
you
greatly
and
it's
amazing
how
similar
our
thought
process
is.
With
regard
to
the
questions
that
need
to
be
answered,
the
conversation
that
still
needs
to
be
had
even
our
own
personal
Constitution.
If
anyone
has
ever
lived
with
me,
they
know
that
I'm,
the
person
who
catches,
The,
Spider
and
releases
is
outside
because
I
can't
stand
to
kill
a
spider,
so
you
know
there's
so
much
similarity
there.
J
I
I
have
questions,
and
many
of
us
still
have
questions
with
regard
to
the
notification
to
council
offices
around
the
timing
of
of
this
all
happening,
and
what
will
the
notification
to
Residents
look
like
so
that
to
you
know,
councilman
cockle
is
concerned
we're
not
seeing
the
kid
running
down
from
Somerset
from
Frick
Park
into
the
you
know,
Frick
Park
accidentally
when
this
is
occurring.
J
That's
my
major
concern
as
well.
Perhaps
we
do
need
a
post
agenda
or
a
set
of
briefings
briefings
with
maybe
coordinated
by
a
designated
council
member
who
can
work
with
the
administration
and
everyone
outside
of
the
city
who's.
Working
on
this,
we
do
need
to
understand
our
ongoing
maintenance
plan
not
just
this
year,
but
on
an
annual
basis
and
I
think
actually
ask
the
question:
if
there's
a
need
for
additional
legislation,
rather
than
internal
policy,
to
compel
a
regular
report
or
revisiting
of
the
maintenance
plan.
J
So
we
understand
and
exactly
what
is,
what
is
what
is
happening
and
the
effectiveness
of
this
I
don't
know
I,
don't
want
to
add
bureaucracy
to
the
process,
but
I
also
know
we
need
to
know
if
we're
succeeding
in
this.
So
all
of
those
questions
have
to
be
asked,
and
yet
I
come
to
the
conclusion
that
councilman
Lavelle
comes
to,
which
is
that
we
need
to
take
the
first
step.
J
I
would
recommend
passing
this
both
bills
today
related
to
this
topic
and
taking
that
first
step
so
that
we
can
continue
the
conversation
rather
than
ending
it,
but
not
kicking
the
hand
further
down
the
road
so
that
in
2024
we're
just
back
here.
Having
talked
a
lot
about
it,
having
perhaps
solidified
kind
of
both
sides
of
this
issue
without
actually
having
taken
action,
I
would
feel
a
lot
better
about
taking
some
sort
of
action
with
questions
remaining
than
not
taking
action
today
and
missing
opportunity
to
do
so.
In
coordination
with
USDA.
O
Yeah
so
well,
I
actually
have
well
one
one
thing:
I
did
want
to
note,
because
I
got
a
I
got
a
note
from
Rebecca
Rinaldo,
just
to
note
that
that
the
city
has
had
more
than
600
311s
regarding
deer,
and
that
is
without
even
a
category
in
the
3-1-1
drop
down
for
deer.
So
that's
just
to
kind
of
give
a
little
bit
of
perspective
too
from
the
from
the
residents.
O
I
I
agree
too,
and
I'm
I'm
happy
and
once
once
this
plan
is
in
place,
I
mean
you
know.
Once
we
are
at
the
point
where
we
actually
know
how
this
is
going
to
work
I'm
more
than
happy
to
call
a
post
agenda,
because
that
I
mean
without
a
doubt
just
for
safety.
That
needs
to
be
clear.
We
need
to
understand
it,
and
then
the
public
needs
to
understand
it,
obviously,
including
the
Outreach
right,
including
how
we're
going
to
let
people
know
so
I'm
happy
to
to
support
that.
I
F
O
I
M
O
So
yeah,
if,
if
director
Schmidt,
could
come
to
the
table.
O
So
so
my
questions
and
we
got
a
very-
we
had
a
bunch
of
emails-
I,
don't
I
think
maybe
this
one
came
to
all
of
us
through
the
clerk
I'm,
not
sure,
but
it
was
one
particular
email
that
I
think
made
some
very
good
points,
and
that
was
this
is
that
you
know
here
we
are
tackling
this
deer
issue
at
you
know,
in
order
to
protect
our
parks
and
at
the
behest
of
many
residents
in
neighborhoods,
like
Squirrel
Hill
and
such
when
the
fact
is,
we
have
enormous
numbers
of
requests
for
folks
to
deal
with
raccoons
and
such
in
their
homes
that
are,
in
you
know,
far
less
affluent
communities.
O
We
get
lots
of
raccoon
requests
and
all
we
can
do
is
trap
and
we
don't
have
enough
traps,
and
it
is
you
know
and
I,
think
deer
are
beautiful,
I
think
raccoon
are
terrifying
and
if
I
had
one
in
my
house,
I
would
flip
out
right
so
just
to
take
a
little
bit
of
a
Sidetrack,
because
I
know
that
at
the
end
of
last
year
we
moved
some
200k
out
of
animal
control
and
into
something
for
police
equipment.
I,
don't
recall
so
I
just
wanted
to
check
in
very
quickly
on
that
it.
O
Are
lovely-
and
there
are
some
other-
not
so
lovely
animals
that
I
know
that
folks
would
like
to
have
some
help
with.
Q
So,
regarding
the
raccoon
trapping,
it's
not
a
matter
of
not
having
funding
for
traps,
they're,
actually
fairly
inexpensive,
it's
a
matter
of
having
the
staff
and
the
resources
to
check
those
traps
on
a
regular
basis.
So
we
because
of
the
I
know,
people
consider
raccoons
a
nuisance,
but
we
still
don't
want
to
be
cruel
to
a
raccoon
that
is
caught
in
a
trap.
So
we
need
to
ensure
that
if
there
is
a
raccoon
that
ends
up
in
a
trap
or
any
animal
ends
up,
because
cats
can
go
in
those
traps,.
A
Q
Any
variety
groundhogs,
any
variety
of
animals
that
fit
inside
of
those
traps
can
go
in
those
we
need
to
make
sure
they're
monitored
by
a
homeowner
or
a
resident
or
somebody,
and
then
they
have
to
contact
animal
care
and
control
and
Animal
Control
has
to
be
able
to
come
out
in
a
short
period
of
time
to
come
out
and
deal
with
that
animal.
However,
that
process
is
with
by
state
regulations
with
a
raccoon
or
a
groundhog
that
is
euthanasia
of
that
animal.
Q
Other
animals,
such
as
a
cat,
or
something
like
that
that
would
obviously
been
be
taken
to
an
animal
shelter,
but
we
don't
want
to
leave
an
animal
in
there
for
two
or
three
days
without
anyone,
knowing
it's
in
there
or
without
being
able
to
go
out
there.
So
with
talking
to
Dave
Madden
after
December
of
last
year,
we
did
talk
through
that.
We
do
not
have
the
staff
on
animal
care
and
control
to
really
expand
that
program.
Q
Q
We
can
put
him
a
trap
in
the
neighbor's
yard
or
a
neighbor's
property,
but
someone
has
to
be
able
to
be
there
to
watch
that
trap.
We
can't
put
it
on
vacant
property
just
because
we
don't
want
someone
to
not.
We
don't
want
an
animal
to
be
somewhere
and
die
in
a
cage.
Q
Q
But
Wildlife
Management
in
an
urban
area
is
a
challenging
thing.
Our
animal
care
and
control
follows
and
only
deals
with
city
ordinances.
We
don't
have
Humane
Animal
officers
or
Humane
rescue
officers
because
we
don't
have
our
own
shelter.
That's
a
study
that
we're
working
on,
but
we
don't
have
that
yet.
So
we
have
very
limited
control
in
what
we're
allowed
to
do
as
a
city
I
think
that's
something
worth
exploring.
O
O
So
so
this
really
was
more
just
to
to
for
who's
the
person.
I,
don't
remember
their
name,
but
to
acknowledge
that
you
know
that
comment
came
in
I,
think
it's
a
very
valid
comment
and
that
you
know
these
these
types
of
that.
You
know
that
Wildlife
Management
overall,
is
certainly
something
that
we
need
to
be
looking
at
in
a
broader,
broader
Spectrum
than
just
just
a
deer.
So
at
any
rate,
that's
all
for
me.
B
I
You
third
round
councilman,
thank
you,
maybe
maybe
I'll
close
it
out.
Okay,
I'll
do
my
best
to
do
that.
I'm
always
reminded
of
then
councilman,
paduto
and
and
ultimately
mayor
paludu,
peduto,
challenging
Council.
That
budget
is
a
reflection
of
our
priorities
and
it
is
budget
season
it's
upon
us
here.
We
are-
and
this
is
our
golden
opportunity
to
say
that
this
matters
that
this
is
part
of
our
our
priority
and
and
it
is
something
that
we
value
and
that
this
conversation
has
brought
it
to
the
Forefront.
I
So
perhaps
in
closing
out
the
conversation,
if
we
are
going
to
vote,
it
would
be
to
challenge
us
as
the
fiduciary
agents
of
the
city
and
the
managers
of
the
budget
to
reflect
our
commitments
to
a
holistic
strategy
for
for
wildlife
management
throughout
the
city
that
now's
the
time
to
do
it.
Budget
season
is
upon
us,
and
so
I
will
I
will
challenge
us
and
gladly
participate
in
that
process.
If
we
wish
to
do
so
thanks
Mr
chair,
thank.
J
E
C
N
I
really
don't
have
any
questions
you
know.
I
know
my
cheapest
staff
was
looking
into.
Was
this
a
no-bit
contract
director
or
not?
Do
you
even
know
that
I
I
find
it
necessary?
I?
Think
it's
the
you
know.
Q
N
Hey
lieutenant
welcome
just
state
your
name
for
the
record
and
we'll
go
from
there
right.
L
Anthony
Palermo
Lieutenant
City
of
Pittsburgh
Police
current
training
director
at
the
police
academy,
got.
N
It
you
and
just
fill
us
in
on.
You
know
the
training
that
we're
sure.
L
The
goal
was
to
offer
continuing
education
to
the
instructors
at
the
training
academy.
This
year
we
were
looking
at
Advanced
firearms
training
for
our
Firearms
instructor
Cadre.
This
company
we've
I've
had
and
some
other
instructors
have
had
prior
classes
with
them.
L
The
level
and
Detail
in
which
they
approach
the
class
and
the
material
they
deliver
will
was
appealing
to
us
in
terms
of
taking
that
material,
incorporating
updating
curriculum
for
in-service
personnel,
as
well
as
recruit
training
to
in
lieu
of
sending
a
small
amount
of
instructors
out
of
town
or
to
other
courses
where
room
and
board
is
paid
Etc
to
host
it.
Here
we
could
send
more
instructors
and
then
have
that
at
a
centralized
location.
That
would
benefit
benefit
us
all
for
years
to
come.
N
Right
and
Lieutenant
Palermo,
when
you
say
this
training
would
would
it
be
exercised
at
the
outdoor
firing
range
that
sits
in
councilwoman,
gross's
District,
or
do
they
go
to
neutral
sites
or
other
sites
for
the
training.
N
L
So,
for
instance,
September
of
2022,
three
of
three
myself
and
two
instructors,
went
to
Detroit
and
took
a
class
with.
N
This
company,
okay,
that's
all
the
questions.
I
have.
K
L
I
can
answer
to
my
knowledge,
so
I
requested
approval
for
this
training.
Last
November
of
2022,
then
acting
Chief,
Stan
grecky,
approved
it
in
December
of
2022
and
I
began
working
with
then
business
administrator,
Whitney
Nicholson
in
December,
providing
her
with
you
know:
approval
from
the
chief
and
necessary
materials
from
that
company
I
was
of
the
understanding
that
it
was
to
clarify
that
type
of
it's
not
it's
out
of
my
purview
and
knowledge.
L
Q
The
department
of
business
administrator,
who
he
mentioned
left
in
I,
want
to
say
May
or
June.
It
was
never
sent
to
procurement
to
go
through
the
normal
process.
Q
Lieutenant
Palermo
in
the
academy
were
not
notified
that
it
had
not
received
final
approval
from
OMB
and
they
proceeded
with
the
training
without
omb's
knowledge
until
and
them
not
realizing
that
to
hear
my
process.
So
that
was
you.
R
K
K
And
the
mayor's
budget
office
I
think
as
well
as,
if
you
as
a
public
safety
director,
to
make
sure
that
the
proper
procedures
are
followed.
But
let
me
get
back
to
the
training,
so
it
already
happened.
It
happened
in
June
and
it
did
happen
at
the
outdoor
firing
range
correct.
K
Take
too
much
time,
we
have
had
spent
a
lot
of
time
on
this
agenda,
but
I
I
have
noted
in
the
past
and
I'm
grateful
to
you,
director,
Schmidt,
for
literally
sitting
with
me
in
your
office
and
calling
other
ranges
in
the
region
trying
to
find
time
for
our
officers
to
spend
some
of
their
training
time,
not
in
Highland
Park.
But
you
know
with
the
nearest
out
of
Highland
Park
and
also
our
new
police
chief
when
he
was
being
interviewed
here.
K
I
asked
him
and
he
agreed
that
it
would
be
so
much
nicer
to
have
an
indoor
firing
range
that
it
would
be
better
for
the
officers
and
better,
certainly
for
the
neighborhoods
and
would
be
a
just
more
conducive
and
it
could
be
even
a
better
situated
firing
range.
We
know
our
local
municipalities,
like
Mount
Lebanon,
have
just
built
new
ranges
that
meet
qualification
specifications
and
we
will
continue
I'm
sure
to
try
to
put
as
many
hours
as
we
can
at
other
ranges
and
so
I'm.
Just
kind
of
reaffirming
your
commitment
to
that
director.
K
Q
Yes,
that's
definitely
a
commitment,
I,
actually
just
an
email
chain
with
director,
hornstein
and
others
about
our
future
range
and
making
sure
that
moves
forward
and
I
I
do.
As
you
said,
the
chief's
very
supportive
of
it
I
believe
Lieutenant
player,
most
supportive
and
indoor
range
would
be
beneficial
to
everyone
all
around,
including
the
officers
who
then
they
could
manage
the
weather
and
not
have
to
work
schedules
around
the
weather
and
that
sort
of
thing
so.
K
I
appreciate
that
okay,
so
I
just
need
to
get
that
on
the
record
every
because
it's
still
it's
an
active
conversation
and
we
wanted
to
reaffirm
that
commitment
and
just
get
it
on
the
record
one
more
time.
So
I
look
forward
to
an
update.
Thank
you.
That's
all
I
have
Mr
chair.
A
B
C
B
U
B
C
Bill
661
ordinance
accepting
a
new
street
named
Woodring
court
and
the
23rd
ward
of
the
city
of
Pittsburgh,
as
per
recommendation
by
the
city
of
Pittsburgh
addressing
committee,
the
following
street
name
was
approved
by
c
c
pack
in
June
2022.
The
name
listed
in
this
ordinance
shall
be
made
official
in
accordance
with
the
Pittsburgh
code,
title
IV,
public
places
and
property
chapter
420,
uniform,
Street
naming
and
addressing.
U
Yeah
I'll
just
saying
thanks
to
all
members
for
allowing
me
to
hold
this
street
name.
This
was
in
a
a
community
that
I
was
trying
to
get
the
rcos
saying
that
they
get
a
city
that
they
were
the
developer
and
they're
working
on
that
now.
So
we're
all
good
to
go
on
this
little
more.
A
C
1809
ordinance
accepting
a
new
street
name,
Chapel
Hill
Road
in
the
fourth
ward
of
the
city
of
Pittsburgh,
as
per
recommendation
by
the
city
of
Pittsburgh
addressing
committee,
the
following
street
name
was
approved
by
CPAC
in
July
2023.
The
name
listed
in
this
ordinance
shall
be
made
official
in
accordance
with
the
Pittsburgh
code,
title
IV,
public
places
and
property
chapter
420,
uniform,
Street
naming
and
addressing.
B
N
B
A
B
Opposed
affirmative
recommendation
that
does
exhaust
our
agenda.
We
do
have
meeting
announcements
this
afternoon
at
1.
30
Council
will
hold
a
cable
cast
public
hearing
on
Bill
1665
related
to
fresh
food
access
as
a
Performance
Point
option,
speaker
registration
closed
at
noon
and
tomorrow,
Thursday
August
31st
at
10,
A.M
Council,
holding
cable
cast
post
agenda
to
discuss
pwsa
rate
increases
in
water
sewer
utilities.
Lastly,
in
reservance
of
Labor
Day
city
council
will
be
closed
on
Tuesday
of
next
week.
B
K
Q
A
J
B
O
I
did
just
briefly
want
to
bring
up
the
the
incident
with
the
there
was
a
video
that
circulated
on
social
media
last
Friday
I
want
to
say
from
last
Friday
night,
I
I
do
not
know
the
details.
I
just
know
the
video
that
that
I
saw,
but
there
seems
there
were
a
number
of
law
enforcement
officers
subduing
someone
on
the
ground
again.
I
know
that
there
is
a
an
internal
inquiry
into
this
and
that
Chief
Serato
is
is
working
on
it.
O
But
what
really
jumped
to
mind
for
me
was,
you
know
we
were
just
here
at
the
table
not
two
months
ago,
spend
talking
about
45
million
dollars
for
body
cams
and
tasers.
That
are
specific,
and
you
know
that
are
specifically
intended
to
enable
our
Law
Enforcement
Officers
to
deal
with
situations
from
a
distance,
and
you
know
that
they
are
intended
to
be
safer
and
that
there
is
this
body,
camera
footage,
and
so
that
we
have.
You
know
we
can
clearly
see
what
happened
Etc.
What
happened?
O
You
know
so
that
we
don't
necessarily
have
to
rely
on
on
on
our
residents.
Taking
you
know
taking
video
from
the
sidelines
so
I
just
given
that
incident
it.
It
certainly
gave
me
pause
and
I
I
have
questions
about
why
there
were
took
so
many
officers
to
to
physically
subdue
one
person
and
I.
O
Also
just
in
you
know,
I
also
just
want
to
say
that
for
the
the
the
individual
or
perhaps
individuals
who
took
the
video
that
night,
you
know
that
I
I
do
want
to
say
that
that
is
very
brave
right.
Our
officers
are
heavily
armed.
These
are
scary
situations.
O
If
the
video
that
we
have
from
these
incidents
was
was
made
of
was
made
available,
I'm
sure
there's
some
legal
issues
surrounding
that.
But
you
know
if,
if
there
is
footage
out
there,
it
would
be
nice
to
be
able
to
see
it
and
have
a
full.
You
know
allow
the
public
and
us
to
have
a
full
understanding
of
what
happened,
because,
certainly
from
what
I
saw,
that
was
an
unfortunate
way
to
handle
that
incident,
to
say
the
least.
So
that's
all
thank
you.
Thank.
I
Thanks
Mr
chair
so
I
just
received
this
during
the
meeting
and
I
was
asked.
If
I
could
please
read
it
into
the
record?
Many
of
you
know
officer
Christine,
Lefty,
Christine
Luffy
is
truly
one
of
my
most
favorite
people
that
are
on
the
planet.
I
I've
I,
don't
know
that
I've
ever
met
anyone
that
has
a
bigger
heart
than
than
her
in
in
just
so
many
ways,
and
many
of
you
know
her
championing
for
animal
safety
and
Welfare
and
and
she
deals
with
our
most
horrific
cases
of
neglect
and
abuse
and
abandonment,
and
does
that
on
a
daily
and
regular
basis
and
is
a
huge
advocate
for
fundraising
for
the
health
and
safety
and
Welfare
of
animals.
I
She
does
her
biscuit
Bingo
every
year,
I
I
this
past
year,
I
think
it
was
like
seventy
thousand
dollars
she
raised
in
one
day
and
I.
Forget
I,
think
it's
close
to
a
half
a
million
dollars
over
the
years
that
she
has
raised.
But
she
sent
this
to
council
and
asked
that
I.
Could
please
read
it
into
the
Record
She
said
dear
councilman,
Krause
I
am
contacting
you
as
a
private
citizen.
My
family
and
I
live
in
private
wooded
area
in
the
beach
View
Community
I
have
lived
in
the
city
of
Pittsburgh.
I
My
entire
life
and
I've
never
been
more
disappointed
and
ashamed
of.
My
city
leaders
than
I
am
today.
I
am
shocked,
heartbroken
and
appalled.
The
city
leaders
would
even
consider
the
killing
of
deer
at
freaking
Riverview
Parks.
Please
understand
that
the
deer
population
can
be
controlled
using
non-lethal
methods.
I'm
aware
that
Humane
action
Pittsburgh
have
met
with
City
officials
to
discuss
these
methods
dear,
are
beautiful
animals
that
should
be
appreciated.
They
are
simply
trying
to
survive
in
a
cruel
world.
We
live
in
killing
them
to
control.
The
population
is
wrong
and
it
is
cruel.
I
We
need
to
learn
to
how
to
coexist
peacefully
with
wildlife
residents
in
the
city
of
Pittsburgh
are
subject
to
violence,
drug
addiction,
crime
properties
that
are
not
cared
for
homelessness,
mental,
mentally
ill
individuals,
garbage
and
Etc.
It
seems
that
officials,
it
seems
that
officials
to
have
empathy
for
people
causing
severe
problems
in
Pittsburgh
and
no
mercy
for
the
innocent
and
defenseless
trying
to
survive.
The
city
of
Pittsburgh
needs
to
take
a
strong
stand
on
the
issues
that
are
truly
harming
our
communities.
Please
try
the
non-lethal
methods
that
were
recommended
before
resulting
to
this
violence.
I
If
this
Slaughter
is
passed
by
city
council,
I,
respect
respectfully
ask
that
each
member
voting
in
favor
be
present
when
they
are
killed.
City
officials
need
to
witness
the
cruelty
they
voted
for.
Watching
an
animal
die
is
awful.
There
will
be
another
way
that
there
has
to
be
another
way
to
handle
deer
population
in
Pittsburgh
I.
Thank
you,
councilman
Krause,
for
caring
about
our
animals
in
Pittsburgh,
I,
appreciate
your
animals.