City of Bloomington, Indiana Board of Zoning Appeals, 19 Mar 2020

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From YouTube: Bloomington Board of Zoning Appeals, March 19, 2020

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meeting packet: https://bloomington.in.gov/onboard/meetingFiles/download?meetingFile_id=5585

A

I call I call to order the city of bloomington board of zoning appeals for.

B

March the 19th 2020 roll call. Please.

B

You're here doc, marten bro, we have minutes from november that need to be.

B

Approved you have a second okay. Can I have a roll call, please revoke. Burrell.

C

C

Clapper, yes, doc, marten 3:01. Thank you reports, resolutions and communications. I.

B

Want to first welcome flavio burrell officially to the board of zoning.

B

Appeals thank you for joining us and for your service, and I want to say, for those.

B

Of you who are listening at home, that the hearing is also being streamed, live.

B

On facebook, facebook.com forward slash city bloomington that offers an.

B

Opportunity to public comment, if you can't make it here this evening or do.

B

Not wish to come for obvious reasons, so we welcome you to comment through that.

B

Forum is there anything else, jackie.

C

Two of the petitions listed on the agenda that was sent out tonight in the.

C

Packet, administrative appeal, a a 4119 and variants. The 4419 have been.

C

Continued to the next hearing, so the only petition we will hear tonight is.

C

Variance 0 720, so this is in response to an executive order issued by the.

C

Governor related to meetings, which we've talked about a little bit here and what.

C

Sort of items should be being heard to try to make the meetings as timely and.

C

Short as possible, so this evening we're gonna, hear v: 0, 7, 20 city of.

B

Bloomington staff report please so the petition before you tonight is from the.

C

City of bloomington redevelopment commission, and it is related to a.

C

Parking garage that is planned to be built at the southwest corner of 4th and.

C

Walnut at 105 and 111 west 4th street, you can.

C

See here on the right, the property is 0.7 acres, joint zone, commercial, downtown.

C

In the comprehensive plan in this area is also downtown. The previous garage.

C

That you can see here in the aerial is, has actually already been razed demolished, so the site is currently vacant. Some surrounding uses include.

C

Waldron arts center to the north bank, multifamily bar and restaurant, to.

C

The west and then firestone and office to the east, with office to the south as.

C

Well, so the variance before you this evening is two variances from entrance.

C

And drive standards from twenty point: zero. Five point: zero: three: five! So the.

C

Two variances being requested are one related to a separation requirement for.

C

New driveways from walnut street and the second variance is for the width of the.

C

Drive that's being requested on 4th street, so you can see here two numbers.

C

Shown at the top of this image, the 39 feet is the width of the driveway that.

C

Is proposed for the new parking garage and then 65 feet is the distance from.

C

The corner at walnut to the location of the new driveway. So, as I mentioned.

C

Before there was a pre-existing garage at this location, the garage that was.

C

There previously did have a roughly 40 foot wide vehicular entrance so similar.

C

To what is being proposed here code requires that any entrance on 4th street.

C

Because it is a non-classified road or otherwise may be called a neighborhood.

C

Street would not exceed 24 feet and again the petitioner is proposing 39.

C

Feet which is comparable to what was there before part of the reason why they.

C

Are requesting that width is that there are three drive aisles planned for the.

C

Entrance- and you can see that here this area here is where the entrance would be.

C

Located you can kind of see the stop bars here for the three aisles, so there.

C

Would be one dedicated entrance, one dedicated exit and then a middle lane.

C

Would be entrance and exit as needed so because this building only has one.

C

Entrance exit location on 4th street, which is the required street to be used.

C

By code, three lanes have been included in the design in order to facilitate and.

C

Prove to be vehicular flow so that if this structure is being.

C

Just at one particular time for an event that is filling up or emptying out.

C

Quickly that this can be adaptable and what that little, that middle lane be.

C

Able to help ease some of the pressure there, so the other variance is distance.

C

From the edge of this third drive aisle to walnut so because of the road.

C

Classification of walnut they're required distance separation is a.

C

Hundred feet and the petitioner is proposing a 65 foot separation, the site.

C

As you can see, here is limited in width, so the petitioner is requesting the.

C

Variance so that the driveway can be closer to walnut here then otherwise,.

C

Would be allowed code does have some leeway in that the driveway as long as.

C

It's as far a far away from the intersection as possible, if it cannot.

C

Meet the hundred feet that is allowed, however, the design of this garage and.

C

Many garages requires a stair tower at this location in the corner. Additionally,.

C

This garage is planned to have public restrooms on 4th street.

C

That was part of the mandate from city council and those need to be located as.

C

Well, in this location, limiting how far west that drive entrance could be.

C

Located in the design, so the department has found that, based on the limited.

C

Amount of space on the 4th street frontage to place not only vehicular.

C

Entrances but pedestrian entrances as well, that the location that the.

C

Petitioner has submitted is probably the best we as far west as would be possible.

C

While also taking into account the other requirements that need to be included on.

C

That frontage and the department also finds that having the wider entrance.

C

Exit of 39 feet allows the building to function in the way that it is needed.

C

And intended for public good and we recommend.

C

That the bca adopted proposed findings and approve v 07.20 with the following.

C

Conditions that the petitioners, of course, must obtain a building permit.

C

Prior to construction, that this petition is approved per terms and conditions of.

C

The plan commission case associated with the parking garage and that it is for.

C

The drawings we have received only any other non code. Complaint changes require.

C

Additional barents approval, so I can answer any questions. Thank you.

B

Petitioners representative, could please step to the podium.

D

We're with the cso design team on the parking garage project, do you swear to.

B

Tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I do okay, you have up to 20 minutes. Okay, I have really nothing more to add to what jackie has.

D

Said other than it is part of the structural design to have these openings.

D

Where they are and almost imperative that they be there to reconfigure, it.

D

Will offset the configuration within the parking garage and be able to host these.

D

Additional features like the restrooms jackie spoke of, as well as the stair.

D

Tower which has to line up with the overpass that used to exist or currently.

D

Is just hanging out there over fourth street, so I too can answer any questions.

D

Perhaps that you have thank you, you're welcome.

E

Okay, so we are to the board for questions or clarifications. Could you.

E

Please stay at the podium, the stair tower to the corner. I simply have the.

F

Bridge exit on the second level into the parking space, could you explain why that.

F

Was this was decided against me to move the stair tower from where its current.

F

Position is to the corner of 4th and walnut instead to allow for the setback.

F

Right so there currently is a connector that why it's not feasible to get the.

F

Setback because the stair tower can't be moved to the corner instead. Ok, yes, well,.

D

It has to realign with the overpass, to reconnect to the downtown square. If we.

D

Don't have that connection, it would jeopardize what we had in the past and.

D

This is a replacement facility, so we're trying to match up with what we had. I.

D

F

We go out onto the small pad there on the second level. It doesn't have to go.

F

Into a stairwell, or is it required by code to go into a stairwell? Yes? Well, it.

D

Would be because there's an elevator and it's a da compliance! So if you are in.

D

Need of an elevator, that's the connection, otherwise you'd have to.

D

Traverse back and forth through the garage and maybe not even use the first.

D

Floor you're welcome. Thank you any other.

E

Questions cassandra: do you have any questions I want to follow up? Could you.

B

Please explain the placement of the bathroom core. Am I correct and.

B

Understanding that right and the previous, the former garage that the.

B

Entry and the entry and exit was shifted over next to the stair tower. That was in.

B

The northwest corner, so it's really the back so what's changed in this plan is.

B

That the bathrooms now are being inserted crack. Could you see, could you.

B

Explain that a little bit and why that that's not flipped or married, well we're.

D

Trying to there's a series of things, we're kama dating bicycle parking and.

D

Those are housed in a corral essentially on the west side, for convenience and.

D

Ease of entry and exit, and then there are the actual travel lanes within the.

D

Garage so the way the design is set up is to allow that those vehicles come in.

D

And out toward the center, so then they can go up the ramp and come back out.

D

Below so there's some key features to the operation internally for the cars.

D

That it it just optimizes entrance and exit- and this was the best place to set.

D

The restrooms so they're on the forefront on 4th street. Now we also have.

D

The parking office is that that flanked along walnut street, so the parking.

D

Division will have offices to the south of where the bike corral or bike parking.

D

Is followed, I potential leasable commercial space.

D

That trunks found that forefront so that really sets the stage as to where these.

D

Other features can be placed and the choice was then to move the part. The.

D

Restrooms up near the front of the building for the public and then keep.

D

Everything else come inside along those corridors essentially established along.

D

Walnut street and then the travel lanes in the center. So if there's an event.

B

Letting out- and there are a lot of cars leaving so there's an ability for cars.

B

To stack within the garage sort of waiting for that light to change yes and.

D

Then there is also well. There are two lanes that can exit, so you could go.

D

Right out or left out, okay and then, if there's a problem with stacking with.

D

Signals of course, then they can wait in the garage.

D

Okay, a question about the visibility. I think there was some discussion of this.

B

In the staff report it looks the plan that we have in the packet anyhow. It.

B

Looks like that there is some sort of wall, that's between the exit lane and.

B

The the bike parking area is that an actual wall is there glass in that wall.

B

Is there a way that if I'm in a car and I'm coming out, then I can actually see.

B

Through that space and see pedestrians approaching yes, those are columns actual.

D

Columns so there's no wall that complete opening on what would be the east side.

D

Is where all the bikes would park? So it's open and you can see directly.

D

Through between the columns out, you can see directly east toward walnut street.

D

So there are no there's, no walls that block the line of sight. So so the plan.

B

That we have on sheet 45 is not accurate. It's not does not represent. What's.

B

Actually happening: do we have that? Okay, justice? I have the.

B

Yeah page 45, it's just not it's not clear yeah, I'm just gonna get go to the.

C

B

Right, I'm talking about the two lines that are between the east exit lane and.

B

The that whole bike parking area exactly so right so as you're coming out.

G

B

Right where the cursor is that's yeah, just right below that exactly.

D

It's a curve. There looks to be a bit of sidewalk there, so there is sidewalk next.

B

To the yes, okay and there's a curve, that's a curb or a curb, and then there's.

B

Then there's a double line that runs north-south, that one they are yes. What.

B

Is that, I believe, that's the curb line, that's also a curb mm-hmm, the other, the.

D

Other might just be a painted line. Okay, I don't know absolutely okay act so so.

D

Just just to clarify, then the bike parking area is open to the interior of.

B

The garage yes, that's, correct, okay, great! That's what it was at one.

D

Point we're supposed to be motorcycle parking spaces, but they've decided not.

D

To do that, okay, so the ones that were facing toward the.

D

East that jackie's is running her cursor across we're. In one point, motorcycle.

D

Spaces but but there's not a wall. There is a curb.

E

Okay, any other questions jackie just procedurally, will we be taking two votes.

G

Or will these be, can we change yeah, it's up to you, you can't lump them. If you.

C

Want to okay so, depending on the motion sure: okay, thanks! Okay! So thank you.

B

You're welcome. We are now to the public for any additional or any comments. If.

B

You could step to the podium please and state your name and then I'll swear. You.

B

In and then you have five minutes, hi, I'm greg alexander. Do you swear to.

B

Tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I do thank you. I'm.

H

Here to speak against the width of the driveway, we have a problem at just to.

H

Motivate that at the 7th and walnut public garage, if you're coming from the.

H

North as a pedestrian on the sidewalk, then drivers coming out with a garage.

H

Are coming right at you and they're looking left they're preparing to make a.

H

Right turn and they're looking left because that's where the traffic is coming from on walnut and because the it's fairly wide open from from their.

H

Perspective, they don't have to look right, they're, not it's not so close. That.

H

They're gonna run into the wall or they're gonna run into the curb, and so.

H

They very early while they're still within the garage they begin. Looking.

H

Left and as a pedestrian coming across that they're not looking directly ahead.

H

They're not looking to their right they're, not looking at me and we.

H

Recently had a fatality from this mode at 3rd and washington, where somebody was.

H

Turning right looking left and they were not looking ahead and they ran over a.

H

Pedestrian and killed her, and so that's very important to me, so the width it.

H

Does two things when it's very wide: it allows you to zone out as a driver. You.

H

Don't have to worry about, you know, holding a line, so you can start looking.

H

Left earlier and then as a pedestrian, the width, it's longer that you're.

H

Exposed to the danger, you know a pedestrian moves about 3 or 4 feet per.

H

Second, and so this could be a 5 second crossing if it was only 25 feet wide or.

H

It could be a 15 second crossing if it's 40 feet wide, like they're, proposing and.

H

A car is only 6 foot wide and the proposal is for 13 feet per lane, so I.

H

Understand why they want to have three lanes, but you don't need that much width.

H

For car it's structurally convenient for them. It.

H

Allows them with the machine that raises, lowers the gates in the middle of the.

H

Driveway but there's no reason to do that: you can put the machines at the.

H

Edge of the driveway there, one machine has to be in the middle, but just one and.

H

The lanes themselves don't have to be wider than eight feet in most parts of.

H

The world eight foot is the standard lane width for a travel lane only very.

H

Large trucks that won't fit in a garage are whiter than eight foot. So there's.

H

Really no reason for them to be wider than eight feet as a general lane, so.

H

That's 24 feet for the opening. You'll need a little bit of space here and.

H

There, but there's just no reason for us to be wider than 30 feet and 39 feet is.

H

Just ridiculous, thank you. Thank you. Anyone else here would like to comment.

E

Okay, seeing no one else, I'm back to the board for action. Further questions.

F

Forward right now, I move approval of v dash 0 7-2 zero, based on the written.

F

Findings with the three recommendations provided, the petitioner must obtain a.

F

Building permit approved per terms and addition and the approval for drawings.

F

E

Okay discussion here that petitioner addressed the comments from the public.

I

If that's possible, the actual opening for the driveways, I don't have the.

D

Dimensioning z' for it, but my guess is that the actual travel lane is probably.

D

Eight feet: we've got columns that are on the order of maybe three to four feet.

D

And so there's a column between the single lane and the double lane.

D

So you take that out of the equation. So if you start parsing this down to a.

D

Pedestrian way and two car lanes with a kiosk or device in between taking up two.

D

To four feet: so, if that's 4 times 3, that's 12 take 12 off a 39 and your n.

D

And a sidewalk you're down to 24, so you really are dealing with a foot travel.

D

Lanes now the x that the whole width of- and maybe we can look back at at the one.

D

Floor plan, you can't pull a column out or you can't support the whole garage. So.

D

We've got some structural obstacles that really require those those widths to be.

D

There, I guess we could have if we needed to break down and create smaller. You.

D

Know have a shelter for a 4-foot section, but it seems more simpler. Just to leave.

D

The opening wide- oh okay, yes, it seems more simpler, just to leave it leave it.

D

Wide open, as we take our curb line out to the street so for the pedestrian you.

D

Really have a two gaps: you've got about an 8-footer and then you've got the.

D

Column line and then you've got the double with with the with the gates that.

D

Would right in between so you've got to have those devices you can't just.

D

Randomly put you, you have to have a place for someone to check out.

D

Pay their with their credit card that takes space for that device and in it.

D

The dual operation, so not having a dimension drawing in front of me, I can't.

D

Tell you precisely how wide those lanes are, but they're on the order of eight.

D

Feet or ten feet max, so it's not the full width of where we have the curb.

D

Outlets onto the street concerns about pedestrian safety and our trying to.

I

Address that what are there some things other cities have done? It sounds like.

I

This is going to be a problem, no matter what, like, I'm, not really sure what you.

I

Can do what are the options yeah so, for instance, the morton street garage here.

D

On morton and 7th, they have mirrors that are mounted on their way to monitor or.

D

To that you can look up and see pedestrians coming your way as well. So.

D

We looked at some other options, but they they really didn't feel they were.

D

Appropriate, like lighting the surface, where a car would approach, and it would.

D

Illuminate the walkway, giving a pedestrian the sense or knowledge that.

D

Someone would be pulling out, so you know, part of this is in a city where you have.

D

To have parking garages and driveways pedestrians also have to play a part in.

D

Being alert and understanding like just I get a signalized intersection, you've.

D

Got a crosswalk with a signal that says it's time or or that it's your turn to.

D

Cross the street now I would think pedestrians also would be cautious.

D

Walking in front of a garage so and the drivers leaving should be looking both.

D

Ways now I don't know of any fatalities in this town since, since I've been here.

D

Where someone got injured, crossing a parking garage exit or entrance and.

D

That's over 30 years, it's unfortunate the recent incident at 3rd and.

D

Washington, but that was on a street intersection as well.

D

Thank you. You're welcome at the fatality was a street related in not parking.

F

Garage related estrine crosswalk at washington and not and 9/3 in front of a.

F

That's correct, yes, is that accurate, okay, I'm sorry I was. I was led to.

F

Believe it was happening at a parking garage. Sorry, thank you. Is there any.

B

Perceived is there more a need or an understood, need for having to exit two.

B

Lanes or enter two lanes or is there it's a bounce, I'd say: it'd, be a balance.

D

Okay, so, for instance, if you're coming, I went in morning when people come to work.

D

I presume the entrance is the maximum flow and then, in the evening, when.

D

Everybody leaves right the opposite. If you have an event say: there's a play at.

D

The waldron or an art show, or something everyone be coming in at the time before.

D

The show starts, and they was exit after right, um so then to help with the flow.

D

You, okay, you have that option. Okay, so the arrival time is just as critical as.

B

The exiting okay cuz I just I could I was just wondering if there, if it were.

B

More related to exiting, if that, if that third lane is, can be closed down when.

B

It's not necessary, not necessarily used so that you could actually neck down the.

B

Actual width of where the activity is yes yeah, so I I really haven't, talked.

D

With the operations people at the garage, but I would think if you, if you just had.

D

A normal day with no peak flows coming in or out, you could just use to the.

D

Incoming and outgoing right see the 7th and morton garage.

D

Those gates are inboard of the garage. You don't see them out in the front, so.

D

You're funneled down into one single lane, leaving right in one entering.

D

But here, because of because it has to be pushed out, the orientation of the travel.

D

Lane with respect to the street this, you know that one's 90 degrees to the street.

D

Okay, so it's related then to the signage. So if the, if the third lane becomes the.

B

Overflow lane, so that that that you know that the middle lane is the one that.

B

Flips back and forth, and you only use that third lane, when you actually have.

B

To then the majority of the time it would only be, you would only be crossing.

B

Two lanes of traffic yeah that's correct. If they they choose, if they believe they.

D

Would have that option with the controls for the gates? Okay,.

B

Just the the reason I ask, that is because I think there was some of the.

B

Imagery on the outside, where the signage it said enter in the middle, and I just.

B

Didn't know if, if there would be the flexibility, it would have to be to one.

D

Side or the other in order to have a dual lane, which which optimally would be.

D

In the center, so you're not mixing the two. I don't so perhaps on the elevation.

D

Just graphically it's yeah get it right. Okay, that might be misleading at this.

B

Point party right right because two exes don't enter. You know: yeah yeah, right.

D

Well, I just I think that there was a good point made and I think whenever we.

B

Can minimize the conflict between pedestrians and people entering and and.

B

Leaving we want to do that and we want to. We want to neck that activity, that.

B

Width down, and so, if the majority of the time it could be that way that I would.

B

Hope that the design could could respond to that desire. Okay,.

E

Any other questions or thoughts answer to this, but there is no street parking.

I

Near these entrances right entrance exit.

D

To the west, to the west yeah the restroom right and I don't even think.

D

Now I don't believe, there's any in front of wfh be on the north, where that.

I

There's going to be part street parking there. Well, because it is an issue at the.

I

Morton and morton street garage people coming in and out with the street.

I

Parking there, you can't see a car coming mm-hmm and that's angular2. It's not.

D

Parallel, so it goes out even further the so I guess we didn't go far enough. North.

D

To see what's really happening on 4th street, I believe for sure there's.

D

Parking on the south side to the west, but I don't recall.

F

Is there I believe, just passed the little I think you're? Yes, I believe.

F

You're right, but two designers point, though, is that parking you're.

F

Questioning the parking in front of the chinese restaurant to the left, which.

F

Coming out of the building out of the partners to the left, its obstructive is.

F

What it no, I think, I think it would really wouldn't be much of a problem.

I

There, as long as it's as you said, parallel and they're, not sticking out.

I

And that there's nothing closer than that planned? Yes, okay, okay, that's all! I.

I

Need to know tonight I'd like to correct myself, I believe that we were talking.

D

Earlier about that line- and it may be not just occur, but a crash wall, so it.

D

Might be up a little higher, so someone can't drive a conduit into that space.

D

Okay, so if I may correct myself there, you would still be able to see over it.

D

So a crash wall essentially is at an, I think, about two or two and a half feet.

D

Tall, so essentially, you know me essentially about this high so that yeah.

D

And your eye height in a car, the standard is three and a half for your.

E

Eye height, yes, yeah above above the pavement, okay,.

D

G

Okay, so well, are we ready to vote roll call? Please.

C

Okay, so the motion is approval of the petition with the three conditions.

C

Listed in the staff report- husky yes, clapper, yes, throckmorton and burrell.

C

Okay, the motion is passed. Miss lafleur before you adjourn sorry.

C

I think the minutes you guys discuss you called them to the november minutes, but.

C

I believe there's a january 20 20 minutes. Could someone check your january.

B

2020. Okay, so I just wanted to have someone clarify that because I believe.

C

The motion was said november, I'll wait for the president to check, but I think.

F

The ones I read were from last month.

B

November 21st, I believe so so I can produce lillard.

C

She said the only ones we needed were the january 2020, so if we could do a.

C

Motion for that or the minute I read were from the january, so I my motion was.

F

And I will make it again. I motion approval of the minutes from the january.

F

Bzj meeting january into 2020, okay, second, please.

E

Roll call: okay, clapper, yes, throckmorton, yes,.

C

Burrell, okay in husky! Thank you sorry about that. Sorry, for the confusion. No.

C

It's fine, we are adjourned. Thank you.

A