City of Bloomington, Indiana City Council, 9 Sep 2020

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From YouTube: Bloomington City Council Land Use Committee, September 9, 2020

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meeting agenda: https://bloomington.in.gov/onboard/meetingFiles/download?meetingFile_id=7536

A

B

Well I'll go ahead and call to order this meeting.

B

Of the land use committee of the bloomington common council for wednesday.

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September 9 2020.: we have one item on the agenda.

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And that is ordinance 20-15 to re-zone a 19.73 acre parcel.

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From employment to residential estate regarding 2300 west tap road.

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Uncle duncan campbell petitioner, um so let's start with a staff.

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um Overview of this petition, I think we have mr ryan robling.

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To present from the planning and transportation department.

C

Yes, thank you I'll share my screen here in just a second.

D

I hardly hear you, oh, uh is this better a little bit speak louder.

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Sorry uh kind of limited in my microphone.

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C

Okay is: is that better, that's uh basically yelling but okay. Sorry sounds.

B

Great, that's good sounds good and we can see your screen.

C

Okay, thank you all right, so uh this petition.

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Is for the property located at uh 2300 west tap road? uh The property is.

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Currently, zoned um employment em, uh the property is.

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Currently developed with a single-family dwelling, the comprehensive plan has designated the property as employment center.

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The surrounding uses include vaping parcels to the north.

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South west and uh clear, clear creek trail is to the east.

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uh The property to the south is a vacant quarry and is owned by the petitioner.

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And it is also outside of the city's jurisdictional bounds.

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uh So this petition is proposing degrees on the property from its current zoning.

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Of employment to residential estate, the em district does not allow for the.

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Construction or expansion of single-family dwellings, uh the petitioner is therefore requesting to rezone this in order to.

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Expand the currently existing uh single-family structure.

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uh So, just a little bit of a history of the site, the site includes a historic.

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House constructed in the 1830s, the property.

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Is within the borland house and first quarry state listed historic district.

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The property was annexed by the city of bloomington and zone.

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Quarry the property had been identified by its adjoining use to the south.

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While the property was within the areas intended for.

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Annexation, uh this caused the property to be brought into the city.

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And zoned as court, uh the newly adopted udo.

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And its conversion map uh changed the zoning from quarry to.

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Employment uh again, the comprehensive plan.

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Designates this portion of tap road as employment center, the uh intent of.

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Employment center designation was to provide locations for a variety of.

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Commercial, employment and utility uses the comprehensive plan uses a broad.

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Brush approach to land use mapping rather than parcel level analysis. This.

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Allows for some flexibility uh when evaluating parcel level.

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Considerations um so the couple of things the.

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Comprehensive plan gives goals and guidance, so the.

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Goal 2.2 sets a goal of preserving assets of historic and architectural.

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Significance policy, 2. 5.2.3.

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Is historic, neighborhood and districts preserve.

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And enhance authentic design characteristics such as building form by.

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Encouraging new or remodeling of structures to be of historic compatibility in neighborhoods or adjacent.

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Areas, historic preservation is a goal: uh the to enhance the sense of community.

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And preserve stories of older cultures found in uh in the landmarks.

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And landscapes we visit and protect the memories of people.

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Places and events honored in our local uh monuments and markers uh the.

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Comprehensive plan proposes to ensure development decisions.

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Are balanced with the protection and conservation of both natural and historic resources, comprehensive fan plan further this.

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Purpose with vision, statement principle 9, which.

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Discusses the importance and desire to enhance our natural assets and.

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Protect historic resources, vision statement principle: 12 is focused.

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On the virtues of historic preservation and rehabilitation of historic.

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Structures helping to ensure their continued use.

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Goal 3.4 is sets a goal to increase areas of native plants within the city.

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These native plants help to improve uh soil, air and water quality.

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Soil, air and water quality and increase the.

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Ability for local wildlife to thrive within the city.

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Comprehensive plan also give guidance to allow residents to age in place.

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Including the ability to meet basic needs and ensure self-sufficiency.

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Goal 1.2 of health and safety seeks to support strategies that sustain and.

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Enhance health and safety of residents policy 4.4.5 encourages the.

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Special design to promote housing, which is built for a range of ages,.

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uh Policy 5.3.2 uh specifically seeks to enable seniors.

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To remain in their homes, allowing them to age in place.

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Here is a uh an overview of the site plan. The proposed site plan.

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um You can see the existing structures, I don't know if you can see my mouse.

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I never remember how this works, um so the existing primary structure.

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There's a detached garage, a shed and a barn, um and then you can also see the.

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Existing drive, which runs along the western border uh and.

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Enters a long tap there here is a.

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Slightly more zoomed in uh version, uh so you can see the addition to the.

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Southern portion of the site, um along with the proposed setbacks.

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It's about 25 feet from the rear setback and uh 215 feet.

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From the side here is a drawing of the proposed.

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Edition showing the additional first floor living spaces in the restroom.

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This is the south elevation showing the proposed edition.

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uh So there are some issues, um which is why I showed those.

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Those items there are some issues with the rezoning the site to.

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uh Re um the re district has a minimum rear setback of 60 feet.

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The current structure is already set at the 60 feet, line from the rear property.

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Line uh so the proposed edition would encroach 35 feet into the rear building setback, so it.

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Would require a variance in order to be constructed.

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If this petition were approved, additionally accessory structures are.

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Eliminated in the re district to 55 or 50 of the cumulative footprint.

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Of the primary structure, uh so that puts the the current.

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Structures accessory structures over the uh a limit, as they are.

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um Roughly a thousand square feet over.

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What would be, or over the what would be allowed? Excuse me.

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uh So a variance would be required to legitimize these existing.

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uh Historic accessory structures all right, so uh the in conclusion here.

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uh The plane commission, who voted 9-0, to send this petition to the council with.

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Favorable favorable recommendation uh and the.

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Department both promote uh the rezoning of this property, which is both unique historic and environmental.

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Characteristics that should be preserved for the future.

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uh The plant commission also feels that the current em zoning is not.

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Appropriate for a large residential property um that, with a.

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Historic use on on it, the current zoning does not.

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Allow for an expansion of the current historic use.

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So again, while the comprehensive plan does identify the site as employment.

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Center, this is a result of existing zoning.

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Using existing zoning as guides and a desire to not make granular.

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Decisions about individual properties and instead to focus on broad strokes for large areas of the city.

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uh Parcel level changes were not part of the conversion map process.

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But the possibility for some that some would be needed.

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To be addressed uh was anticipated with the upcoming zoning map.

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Process so uh the department believes that aligning the zoning and the use.

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Will best protect the historic structure and the surrounding properties.

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In it and the surrounding properties is in line with the intent of the.

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Comprehensive plan, the uh rezoned to a single family.

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District will allow will also require future uses on.

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Surrounding properties to be set back further than they would otherwise.

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Additionally, be required to further extending protections to the both the.

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Environmental and historic structure, all right so.

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There's a couple things that the planning commission has to review.

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In order to make a recommendation, uh the comprehensive plan.

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um The recommendation of the comprehensive plan.

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The comprehensive plan designates the property again as employment center.

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But uh there there are goals and policies.

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Set in place to ensure things that um to ensure development uh is limited, but.

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Allowed uh historic and environmental um uh development is allowed.

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Or allowed to continue and as well the agent era, if sorry as well.

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uh The um there is goals and policies set in place to allow.

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Residents to age in place.

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Current conditions and characters of structures.

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Use in the zoning district, the current zoning district does not allow for the.

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Currently, existing structure to exist uh or expand, so the em district does not.

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Allow for single-family uses uh the re district, however, would.

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uh The most desirable use uh for which the land in each.

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Zoning district is adapted, uh the property contains a historic.

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Single-Family dwelling, which is unique and should be reserved the historic.

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Nature of the property makes for a single-family use to be the most.

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Desirable use for this property as a loss would be detrimental to the.

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Character of the city, the property is heavily wooded and the.

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Re district would help further protect environmentally sensitive assets within.

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The city, the conservation of sensitive.

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Environmental features again, the property is heavily wooded. The.

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Re district is specifically created to allow for the.

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Conservation of protected environmental assets.

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um And would limit the the large property to a single family use.

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um With light agricultural uses that are associated.

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uh The conversion of the property values uh throughout the jurisdiction.

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um The property is currently developed by the single-family dwelling and has.

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Caused no detrimental effects to surrounding property values. The properties to the north and west are.

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Currently vacant the property to the east is home to the clear creek trail and the property to the south again is owned by the.

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Petitioner and is outside of the city's jurisdictional boundaries and then finally, responsible development and growth. The.

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um The property is currently developed with a single family dwelling and has.

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Been for over 150 years, uh it is responsible to protect the.

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Historic property and preserving it from becoming another, more intense use.

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This uh there are vacant airplanes set for more intense developments to the.

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North and west of the property, these properties are far more suitable for non-single-family uses, whereas this property should maintain a single-family.

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Finally, the uh the when the plan commission.

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Reviewed case zo1620, uh the recommendation came with.

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Two conditions, I just thought I would mention them here.

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That, again, is that the proposed addition to structure.

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uh Will need a variance from rear yard setback or rebuilding setbacks.

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And that the uh the accessory structures will need to be.

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Lit size will need to be legitimized, and that is all I have for you, and I can.

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Answer any questions.

B

All right, thank you. Mr robling appreciate the presentation.

B

um So uh I just wanted to follow up, because you mentioned.

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Several times um the uh part in the comprehensive plan that.

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Talks about aging in place, and so uh maybe I can have.

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The petitioner explain uh how that is relevant to this petition and make any.

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Additional statement that the petitioner would like to make at this time.

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Well, if you have your, if you can see us in the video you, we.

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Can see that we're already aging in place.

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We would you give your names for the record. Please well. Mine is duncan.

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Campbell, it's my wife, cathy.

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um We've lived here since the 80s and restored the entire.

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House and property: it was pretty much of a disaster when we acquired it.

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And um we've been able to manage to raise kids here.

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And have our family life here, but now we have one bathroom which is upstairs.

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Where the bedrooms are um the basement, entry was outside.

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And so for our own convenience, especially as we get.

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Older we plan to enclose the basement entrance.

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Put a second bathroom on the on the primary floor of the house, the.

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First floor and create another bedroom suite, if you.

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Will to accommodate us if we get to wheelchair.

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Status or basically, we've created an accessible addition and so um and it's created some modern.

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Space for us that will add to our comfort. I don't know if you've ever.

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Tried to heat a house, it was built in the 1830s, but.

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We pretty much live in sweatshirts and flannels all winter.

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And so we've put in radiant floor and we've done some other things to just.

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Make it more comfortable for us and we, you know, we in terms of aging in.

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Place we spent quite a bit of time thinking, okay! Well, maybe it's time to.

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Let go of this and move to town and live in a.

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Condo or do whatever people are supposed to do, and we just.

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Couldn't part with the property, we've spent our lives here and we don't.

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Really want to want to stop doing that so when.

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I, when I and I'm a preservationist by trade, so I I designed this edition with an.

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Architect, friend, kathy and I did and and started to.

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Consider all these things that might make it easier for us to stay here.

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And it wasn't until I went to get a building permit, that I realized that.

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I was zoned out of permission to live here.

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So- and I never complained about it because it was quarry for years, it was.

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Agriculture before that, and then of course, it was here forever.

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Before there was any such thing as zoning so but this is the consistent use.

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I mean it's been a big farm. It's obvious. You've read my petitioner statement.

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We feel like we've done a really good job of stewarding. It we've spent our.

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You know the second half of our lives. If you will protecting it and.

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Getting it listed and um participating with it in this in the.

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Culture of the city, and so we just we don't want to let go of it, and this.

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Was the plan for us to be able to stay here.

B

All right, very good, thank you. Are there questions.

B

uh From committee members, either for staff or for the petitioner.

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Council uh committee member volun- yes, hello, uh mr campbell, ms biaggio good.

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To see you, um this seems very promising.

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You know I, I don't think that uh the property hadn't even contemplated being.

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Brought into the city limits of bloomington, uh let alone subject to.

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Zoning law, but um can you talk a little about.

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The potential someday 50 years from now, when none of those are around.

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Of the property to be for to I'll just use, the d word developed uh is.

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There any reason to think that it could be.

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Developed is there any reason to think that it should be further developed than it already is, or is it permanently.

D

Historic, uh I, like I just don't know uh what to make of the the place.

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There are some uh some physical and legal restrictions uh on.

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On building anything here because about a third of the property.

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Is flood plain so there as you come in that long driveway.

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To the east between us and the clear creek trail is an enormous wetland.

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And it right now it's dry, but most of the year it's.

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It's soggy, so it can't it can't be developed because it's in a flood plain.

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And then um uh the a significant portion of.

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We own we own an additional 30 acres behind us, which is all abandoned.

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Quarry, okay, so that's that was developed as industry as mining industry and now.

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That's been left on its own and I think you'll see in my statement. I I use that you know we. We use that to give tours.

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For the city and visitors, center and stuff, like that and.

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I'm an advocate for the limestone industry, so it's we've. We've.

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Basically put it on the state register of historic places in order to.

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To that that doesn't actively preserve it.

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That that basically calls attention to it.

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And and makes people think okay. Well, maybe this is something I want to see.

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Or participate in, um do you think that local designation.

D

For the entirety of it I mean I, I.

D

I know I'm yeah. This has been a conundrum for me.

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Professionally I'll I'll I'll be totally upfront with you about it,.

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I've served in both as a an advisory capacity and also as a voting member of.

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The bloomington preservation commission, I wrote it. I wrote the ordinance I've.

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Been there almost since the beginning, um I still think it's one of the very.

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Best state ordinances, city, ordinances today and and I've been.

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I'm not actively a voting member, I'm not really.

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Quite sure why the administration hasn't seen fit.

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To appoint me, but it hasn't, but I am actually appointed by the.

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Council, as an advisory member and over the years.

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And I and I'm not, I don't think this is a bad thing, but.

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Over the years, I've seen volunteers and other membership.

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Members come and go, there was a time when we had a very.

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Well-Established professional representation on that commission.

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And other, and I mean people who were trained in in.

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Aspects of historic preservation and both in the law.

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About it, as well as in the sort of the more socially.

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The social meaning and purpose of it and more recently.

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That has not been the case. We have several very, very qualified members.

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From other walks of life, but.

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When I look to stewarding my own property.

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I look to trust myself and my own professional training and my own.

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Judgment about how to best take care of it, and I have not been convinced.

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Recently that I want to put it in the hands of the city of bloomington,.

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Until they take this such time as they create commissions that are.

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Professionally capable of doing it, so I'm maybe I should rephrase it I'm.

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Actually afraid to designate it locally, because I can't.

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Because I've seen the local commission damage historic property.

D

Okay, so I I guess, maybe I should to make a fine point on this. In other.

D

Words uh you're not concerned.

D

About it uh well, I I can't quite tell what your.

D

Concern is whether you're concerned about them messing up the existing property, as it is.

D

Or whether you're concerned about them uh densifying the property.

D

Either: okay either but okay. Well, that's a.

E

But um I mean I could give you some specific examples which I.

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You know I I we fully intend to preserve this property through covenant.

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Or through uh easements or through.

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Legal agreement with indiana landmarks or somebody else so we're not going to.

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Die away, and just let this go to whoever whatever real estate developer, wants to.

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Get his hands on it, I so, but I don't I haven't so far.

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Been convinced that the best strategy is to put it in the hands of the city of.

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Bloomington as much as I love the city and have.

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Served it myself, I I just you know, I just don't think.

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That's, I just don't think that's the best strategy. I imagine that's a difficult thing to admit. I I'm sorry.

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You know I mean I, I want you to hear it in a way because.

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I think I might be able to convince you that it's true, but on the other hand, for.

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My own purposes and to protect the property itself.

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Stewardship of historic property isn't about ownership.

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It's about long-term preservation, it isn't.

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The person who lives there isn't the important person you know.

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The culture that holds on to it and respects it and understands it.

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And takes meaning from it. That's that's what's important about it.

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So the trick in preservation is to put that in the best.

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Hands that you can to make sure that that happens.

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And there are lots of different ways to do it, one of which is through easements.

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And and other legally binding methods that.

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Can't be violated by anybody who comes along as the next owner.

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And we're you know at this age, looking at how we best want to do that.

E

And we will do it, so I may have more questions but uh isabel.

F

Can I jump in, I was going to say thanks for thanks for.

D

Your stewardship and very interesting- and I have some more questions I think I'll hold on to them. Do you have something to say to this.

F

Sure I just wanted to add to that. um That uh duncan makes a good point.

F

About the floodplain on most of the property, so.

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Part of the reason that we chose that the re zoning district, as opposed.

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To others is that uh those environmental restrictions would.

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Make it difficult to develop in the future it it could be possible um to do some sort of.

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Subdivisions here of a smaller or slightly slightly a larger scale, but.

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uh It's unlikely um with one with the intent of having the home be.

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Preserved and the surrounding lands, and then two just with the floodplain that does exist and with the shape of the property, it's.

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Just kind of an odd um an odd uh little piece down there and.

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As duncan mentioned, you know if they choose to do.

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Deed restriction to protect the house, um we felt that the zoning.

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The re zoning also makes sense for what is there now so it it could.

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Allow something in the future, but it does match what's there and what has been there historically. um So that's kind of how we came to that.

B

All right, thank you, ms ganlin. Are there other questions from council members.

B

Councilmember flaherty did you have a question? uh Yes,.

G

A couple, maybe um I feel like I- we waded into preservation waters that.

G

Are deeper than with my understanding, um but uh I was.

G

Wondering if staff could comment on um the the memo which, which mentioned.

G

That um uh would help ensure the long-term.

G

Preservation of the of the historic structure, but it is designated by the state in some capacity. What.

G

What state designation? What? What does that designation do.

G

To already protect the property, uh you know.

G

Absent the zoning- uh let's say this is zoned.

G

Mixed use or r4, or something instead, for instance,.

G

What what type of protections would this structure have based on that.

E

The state the state designation is honorary.

E

Okay, it doesn't it, you know this. This local city, designation, is, as is.

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Puts legal restrictions on what you can do and creates certificates of.

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Appropriateness and uh the commission would have control.

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Over what alterations were made to the exterior of the building and so on.

E

The state designation is usually given um at the time of a national national.

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Register recognition and it's a way for the state.

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To sort of align itself with the national park service recognition.

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Standards, and so when I first bought the property.

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I was, I was involved professionally with the state office, the division of historic preservation and.

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Archaeology, which is the state historic preservation office and one of.

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The staff persons there said well, you know to put it on the state register.

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If you can't get around to putting it on the national register at this time,.

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We can put it on the state register with a letter and so.

E

I wrote up a legal description of the property and I did some.

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Historic research and I gave it to the state and they designated it.

E

But it doesn't do anything other than at you on the back.

E

Basically got it so so uh to the to the question at hand for.

G

Staff to I appreciate that, mr campbell, the the the answer basically is, is the state historical designation won't do anything.

G

And and this zoning um the residential estate zoning would help to.

G

Preserve the property's current use is that that's right. Yes,.

G

Yeah, that's correct. Yes, um I have a second. I can wait for.

G

Second round or just go ahead, if uh the chair wishes, whatever.

B

Go ahead council member flaherty, um so it was also mentioned.

G

um In your presentation, mr rubling, in the packet that.

G

uh The kind of broad strokes of the conversion mapping process.

G

Led to this being zoned employment. um Is this something you would have.

G

Anticipated encountering and and correcting or addressing in the next.

G

Year as we go through the zoning mapping process with the udo.

G

Is this the type of granularity that that that staff anticipates getting into.

G

In other words, if um petitioner was coming to us a year or two later,.

G

uh Could is it likely? This already would have been rezoned to.

G

Residential estate, uh so it's hard to say exactly but.

C

There is a good chance that uh properties such as this.

C

Due to its size and nature would have been caught in a rezoning process.

C

Of uh an entire map, but um there again the granularity it does cause.

C

Issues um at you know, pinpointing exact spots.

C

Like this, but again, a large property like this could potentially be found. Okay, thank you.

B

Ms scanlon, I see you have reappeared. Did you want to add anything to that.

B

I have sorry, oh, I was going to say that in our preliminary look at the map and.

F

What it and um just things where issues have been raised, we have been flagging areas where it feels like the comprehensive.

F

Plan maybe was too broad and um little spots.

F

Have come out so, even if they had not come forward, it's very likely that we would have identified this because it's a known property. We know it came in in the afa, with the other acreage as part of a.

F

Quarry that it never, you know, really was it was, uh you know, obviously associated.

F

But not quarry land, so um I do think this one. We could say with.

F

Confidence would probably have been identified.

G

Thanks. Thank you. um Other questions from council members.

B

um I have a question and it's: it's uh sort of.

B

Similar to uh councilmember flaherty's question.

B

um And that is uh why uh the staff feels that re is the.

B

Most appropriate residential zoning, rather than a more dense residential.

B

Zoning district- and this is uh mainly because, as we as we know,.

B

We we need to allow more people to to live in the city. It's a more.

B

Sustainable way of developing to have denser.

B

Population in the city and the re zone really seems.

B

More rural to me, but if you could describe.

B

Why uh you settled on re as the most appropriate? I would appreciate that.

C

Sure, of course, so there's a couple things at play here.

C

um The big one uh as mr campbell addressed is the floodplain uh exists.

C

And it covers a good chunk of that which would make developing hard.

C

But then there's also other issues such as.

C

New uh single-family or residential excuse me, residential properties need to.

C

Front to a public right-of-way, the pro current.

C

Property has about 190 feet of uh right away, a long.

C

Tap so uh in to subdivide it into smaller.

C

um Residential districts, you would either need to be required to build a.

C

Public right of way that can access through cap or um it would.

C

Only create roughly two more lots: two or three more locks. Depending on the zoning district. You chose.

C

So the those um those are reasons why we didn't look at.

C

More dense but then also re has um protections in place for the.

C

Environmental, uh the heavily wooded lot, which was something we wanted to.

C

Make sure that we protected and subdividing it further would.

C

Require you know roads and structures to be built further, reducing that that area.

B

How much of the property is wooded? I have.

C

It's greater than 60, I don't know if I have the exact number on the top of.

C

My notes, but it is quite a bit of the the.

C

A lot is, is wooded.

C

uh Mr campbell might be able to go in, for I think that's.

E

That's probably close that there could. There are some old.

E

Farm fields that we keep mowed that are in the wetland.

E

uh In the lowlands, so they can't they couldn't be developed, but we've.

E

Kept the woods from encroaching there, but most of the rest of it, including a.

E

Lot of the quarry space has grown back in over the time we've been here.

B

All right, thank you very much. Any other questions.

B

For staff or the petitioner about this.

B

Proposal: okay, well seeing none, we will go to the.

B

Public is there any member of the public who would like to speak.

B

To the petition to rezone 2300 west, tap road from commercial or for from.

B

Employment center to residential estate, um you can.

B

Either, use the raise hand function within zoom.

B

Or type into the chat directed to a.

B

Council meeting host and mr lucas will assist us in.

B

Seeing if anybody would like to speak.

B

I don't see any raised hands, mr lucas. Anything in chat.

D

I see no takers, okay, we'll give it one more minute. This is a.

B

Public comment on the petition to rezone 2300 west tap.

B

B

All right well seeing none will come back to committee members.

B

For any final comments or um a do pass recommendation or a motion to.

B

To have another hearing either way.

B

Any committee members want to make a comment: yes, council member flaherty.

G

uh Yeah, thank you, um mr gamble, and and uh miss.

G

I'm sorry, I forget your last name speech.

G

Thank you both and thank you to staff for, for such a detailed.

G

uh Packet and memo, I thought that was really helpful and and for your answers.

G

Tonight, um I'm supportive of this petition.

G

Tourism, uh and in particular I think it's an.

G

Interesting sort of demonstration of an appropriateness of residential estate.

G

um Which, I think got sort of a misunderstood bad rap during.

G

The udo discussions uh it was sort of made out to be a boogeyman of uh of zoning, as this is like.

G

Massive, you know mcmansion uh states or something.

G

And it's actually quite the opposite. It's about like if you look at the conversion map, it's a farm in largely wooded lots in a few areas.

G

That are directly adjacent in most cases to other.

G

uh Public amenities, like griffey woods or in this case the clear.

G

Creek trail, so I think, as a preservation uh as an.

G

Environmental preservation uh tool, it makes sense in in narrow and.

G

Targeted ways and I think, um for all the reasons described in in.

G

Tonight's presentation, in the memo um it makes sense in this case so I'll, be voting in favor and I'd be happy to to do that tonight and send it back to um the council for second reading. Thank you.

B

Thank you any other committee members wish to make a.

B

Comment or a recommendation.

B

I'll just say, I also support this rezone. I think this is.

B

One of the rare cases where a residential estate is appropriate to.

B

Both because of the shape of the property as being so long and narrow.

B

Having environmental constrictions and trying to preserve the tree cover.

B

These are all good reasons to use the re zoning.

B

um Any uh do I hear any other committee members.

B

Feedback or a recommendation- yes, council, member.

B

Volun yeah, I mean in a way this is still.

D

Technically, I guess you call it an upzoning like it's going from.

D

From zero residential to one you know, so uh it's slightly getting slightly more.

D

Urban, you know, and but of course uh not every.

D

Part of the urban place needs to be uh gritted streets and uh multi-story.

D

Buildings, so um you know I, I did have hope that.

D

Maybe you know one other house could be built there or something just you know we anything for the cause of more housing.

D

But uh having said that, you know we also talked a lot about.

D

uh You know in other contexts about uh uh climate change and it's important to.

D

uh Preserve the lungs of the city, which this property does so or at least, is trying to do the.

D

Properties of trying to do it so um amen to that, and uh you know I see.

D

Certainly, no harm here and plenty of benefit so.

D

Thanks thanks for bringing it.

E

All right can I say one more thing: uh yes, go ahead. I this is.

E

uh And this is address partly what steve is saying saying and I and I think you.

E

All probably know this, but when this property, this property was.

E

Divided out from at one time, it was close to 2 000 acres.

E

Of agricultural land- and they were.

E

The people who owned it and operated were.

E

Fro pioneers, if you will, they were developers in their own right. They.

E

Helped build the university, they became important citizens and they in the in.

E

The process they sequestered quite a bit of land and supported themselves by.

E

Farming and over the next you know a couple of.

E

Centuries it got it's been divided out when we bought it um all that was.

E

Offered for sale was the house and some surrounding property and.

E

Because everything else was going to to development.

E

I mean their whole intention was to liquidate the property for.

E

You know uh as much as as much money as they could and they knew that the.

E

Frontage along tap road was valuable and or if it wasn't then would be, and it.

E

That evolved into this development of the surgery center and some other things.

E

That we now have on tap road when kathy and I moved here, you could.

E

Drive all the way across tap road, and we were the only residents.

E

I mean imagine, so I'm not advocating one way or the other development can be good.

E

But this ended up being this piece ended up being a.

E

A remnant, if you will the owner just happened.

E

To want to preserve the house, and so they cut.

E

Out the piece that we own and said we're going to sell this separately.

E

To somebody who will do what essentially, we've done.

E

And with full knowledge, everything around you is going to go.

E

The way of the world- and so we chose to do this because we understood.

E

It as a remnant- and it was only subsequently that we.

E

Ended up buying the quarries when they couldn't sell them to anybody else.

E

And so, and that's the odd the odd thing is that I'm about to encroach on my own.

E

Property, which is you know, I have one one lot and.

E

I objected to being anak in the first place because it just didn't make any.

E

Sense to me I don't even have any city services so.

E

It you know, but I I lost that that fight, but.

E

And I it's fine, I don't want to argue that all over again.

E

But I just I think there are places like this when people come here.

E

They see it and they go. Oh, my gosh look. What we have right here in the city.

E

Limits um and so you know, we've really fought.

E

To preserve that, notwithstanding, the need for affordable.

E

Housing and all kinds of other development that we, you know in our time.

E

Support but but this is, this really is an odd.

E

Piece and a remnant, and we we feel lucky to have it and we've been.

E

We've been happy to take care of it, um so I you know. I appreciate your.

E

Support and and um hopefully the council will see the same.

E

We'll do the same thing. Thank you, and I do want to thank you.

B

Both for preserving the historic structure uh on this.

B

Property, I think it does have a lot of value for.

B

uh Remembering the history of bloomington and yeah, it's an important.

B

Place yeah, so, okay, uh do we have a.

B

Recommendation, I did mr volun, do you want me? I just.

D

Want you further I'll make the recommendation.

D

But just say it's rare that we have a petitioner, who also would be the.

D

Foremost expert on the topic that we're discussing so I'm happy to allow the the debate.

D

uh But uh you know, I think, also, we've learned something.

D

About uh the the area, and certainly I'm no fan.

D

Of uh sprawl development that happened around it.

D

So you know the kind of work that uh that they're doing here is to be.

D

Emulated, you know all the more reason to support it and with that I'll move, the recommendation do pass.

G

Just a point of order, I thought I saw committee member rosenberger's hand earlier. I just wanted to check oh yeah how's, the map rosenberger.

H

Thanks, I was just going to chime in it's nothing really of substance. Honestly,.

H

um I was just going to say I appreciate such a thorough and detailed letter from.

H

You all with all the supporting evidence. It was really great reading through.

H

Everything and having that context there, so thanks very much. I support this.

H

You know, staff recommendation was lovely, that's it.

B

All right: well, let's go down the line, then, with this due pass recommendation.

B

Council member flaherty, yes councilmember, rosenbarker.

B

Yeah council member fallen, yes, and I also vote yes.

B

Point of order recommendation yes, council member holland, so.

D

This is because of our vote tonight. This is going to come back next week that the.

D

Regular session of the 16th- yes, that's right: okay,.

D

That's going to be a fun night, so we need to schedule.

D

Schedule this one first, but yes, let's see what we can do about it.

B

Yeah, okay, council president, see what you can do about that.

D

I'll talk to people, okay, all right, okay! Well, thank you very much to staff.

B

And the petitioner and everybody for your time.

B

Thank you see you next week, thanks.

A