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A
Hey
everybody
I'm
glad
we
all
came
this
evening.
Thank
you.
Thank
you.
Thank
you.
So
I'd
like
to
call
her
the
Bloomington
historic
preservation
commission
meeting
to
order
Thursday
April
13
2023.
B
E
G
A
A
Out
they're
glorious
that
problem.
H
A
F
F
B
F
B
D
D
J
L
F
H
D
M
I
I'd
like
to
move
to
approve
with
an
amendment
that
I
in
the
minutes
that
I
did
not
move
to
approve
COA
23-15
I
moved
to
postpone
it.
G
B
G
D
I
G
F
B
B
B
B
L
L
D
D
D
I'm
making
and
just
doing
a
test
right
now,
Justin.
Can
you
unmute
yourself
and
say
something
just
so
we're
just
testing
the
system,
hello.
I
B
I
I
L
A
G
D
A
I
J
H
D
L
G
A
Right
so
Dee
did
you
get
the
approval.
We
need
to
take
the
role
for
the
approval
of
the
minutes.
F
G
A
J
H
K
L
Dee,
if
you
can
hear
me,
I'm
gonna
do
a
Google
doc
with
the
role
so
that
yeah
I'll
show
you
can
all
see
what
I
can
figure
out
on
that.
It's
so.
A
All
right,
so,
let's
move
on
to
statistics
that
appropriateness
and
I'll
do
the
staff
yeah.
A
A
List
I
was
next
and
Elizabeth
Mitchell.
L
A
A
Bernard
cross
Duncan,
Campbell,
Christian
I
think
that's
everybody.
O
K
L
D
So
we
actually
saw
this
case
last
week:
336
South
Euclid
Avenue,
with
Tim
Devine.
Actually,
the
request
is
not
new
windows
in
the
back
of
the
building.
The
request
was
to
remove
a
window
on
the
side
of
the
building,
so
I'm
going
to
comment
on
that.
Instead,
it's
in
the
packet,
let
me
see
if
it's
in
the
correct
corrected
version
of
the
packet
yeah
remove
all
over
the
window
facing
the
alleyway.
D
This
addition
I,
actually
went
and
looked
at
the
aerial
photographs.
This
Edition,
where
the
removal
would
have
will
happen
is,
is
a
later
Edition
post,
World,
War,
II
and
I
also
have
been
doing
an
exercise
of
looking
at
the
guidelines
more
carefully.
What
is
Staff
review,
what
should
be
staff
windows
will
usually
not
be
staff
review.
D
However,
the
greater
Prospect
Hill
made
it
a
real
point
that
they
want
the
HPC
to
concentrate
on
new
construction,
Demolition
and
moving
of
buildings
and
staff
to
work
on
changes
of
materials
and
a
facade
is
particularly
front-facing
facade
work,
so
as
staff
actually
looked
at
the
building
at
couldn't
find
it
on
the
Sanborns,
but
did
look
at
different
historical
aerial
photographs
for
when
the
Edition
was
added
and
determined
that
one
of
the
windows
could
be
removed.
There's
two
windows
and
removing
one
of
them
and
staff
approved
this
one.
D
The
second
staff
approval
COA
23-22
for
508,
West,
3rd
Street
and
Prost
in
the
core
Prospect
Hill
historic
district
is
for
patio,
Hardscape
and
installation
of
an
arbor.
The
proposed
Arbor
is
not
a
fence,
but
it
is
related
in
materials
and
functionality.
The
placement
is
proposed
midway
between
the
front
and
back
of
the
lot
and
would
stand
on
its
own.
At
the
moment,
the
proposed
Hardscape
would
be
made
of
materials
congruent
with
the
neighborhood
and
Beyond.
D
Unobtrusive
I
did
advise
the
petitioner
to
consult
with
planning
and
the
planning
and
transportation
department
regarding
possible
requirements
with
regards
to
The
Hardscape,
and
here
is
just
a
bit
more
information
on
the
Arbor
and
the
materials
he
eventually
wants
to
plant
to
kind
of
a
plant
fence
around
the
harbor.
D
A
All
right,
so,
let's
move
on
to
commission
review.
Coa
23-20
820
was
Kirkwood
Avenue,
okay,.
A
D
D
The
materials
would
match
the
addition
currently
being
built,
which
had
been
approved,
which
had
been
approved
previously
by
the
HPC
and
a
neighborhood
found
no
objection
to
the
project,
and
then
he
recite
the
near
West
Side
design,
Review
Committee
reviewed
the
plan
and
determined
that,
given
the
mixed
use,
zoning
of
the
lot
and
the
fact
that
the
door
on
the
street
facing
side
of
the
new
garage
can
be
defensively
interpreted
as
the
entrance
to
the
apartment,
as
opposed
to
the
entrance
being
on
the
Alley.
D
We
do
not
object
to
the
proposal,
and
so
here
are
three
different
images
plans
where
you
can
see
the
whole
site.
The
first
is
an
aerial
photograph
of
how
it
currently
looks
the
second
and
the
third
have
sort
of
the
layout
of
how
it
will
look
with
both
the
addition
that
is
had
already
been
approved
and
is
being
built
right
now
and
with
the
additional
structure,
and
this
is
the
structure
that
is
being
proposed.
D
Let
me
see,
and
I
can
find
a
looking
here
at
the
so
it
would
be
wood,
siding
and
and
trim
Windows
to
match
the
structure
under
construction
currently
and
I
do
have
the
petitioner
online
for
additional
questions.
This
is
how
the
lot
looks
right
now,
it's
a
long,
thin
lot
and
that's
kind
of
the
footprint
of
what's
going
to
be
built
behind
the
house
or
what
is
being
built,
and
this
is
the
view
towards
where
the
the
proposed
garage
could
be
located
and
with
that
being
said,
staff
does
recommend
approval
of
co8
23-20.
D
P
Planning
and
everybody's
been
great
great.
A
Thank
you.
Justin
we've
got
a
questions.
Daniel.
Do
you
have
any
questions?
No
I,
don't
no
I
don't
regard.
G
I
A
I
Yeah,
this
is
I,
guess
a
question
for
planning
and
or
legal
since
this
is
an
additional
dwelling
unit
and
an
accessory
building.
It
basically
is
an
accessory
dwelling
unit
and.
I
This,
the
petitioner-
this
is
a
rental
property
on
the
front.
Is
this
legal?
Because
if
you
look
at
the
Udo
20.0
3.030
Point
G,
they
got
to
live
there.
If
they're
going
to
put
an
accessory
dwelling
unit
in
there
do
we
have
legal
or
planning
present
at
the
meeting?
We.
I
Oh,
where
are
we?
Oh
sorry,
I
couldn't
see
you
back
there
what
you
got
yeah,
so
my
understanding
correctly
that
this
is
multi
multi-family.
Already
it's
mm.
P
There's
gonna
right
now,
the
under
construction,
it's
a
duplex
so
ignore
that
that
floor
plan
inside
there
that's
an
old
one.
That
is
the
footprint,
but
currently
it's
a
duplex
it'll
be
two
three
bedrooms
that
does
not
include
the
garage
and
talking
with
Eric.
This
is
the
first
I've
heard
about
that.
So,
if
this
is,
if
this
is
the
case,
I.
H
Just
have
no
one's
made
me
aware:
yeah
I,
don't
think
you
can
wait
yeah,
you
can
do
an
Adu
with
the
duplex,
but.
B
I
H
I
Have
this
no
so
at
this
point
and
and
if
they
can
clear
a
planning
hurdle
and
we
can
get
an
establishment
from
planning
that
it
somehow
clears
that
hurdle
or
Mr
Fox
wants
to
move
to
Bloomington
to
this
front
house,
I
yeah
I,
don't
I,
don't
I,
don't
think
we
should
be
discussing
this
well.
K
I'll
just
jump
in
very
quickly
to
the
extent
that
the
owner
occupancy
requirement,
it
exists
and
I
again,
I
think
both
Karina
and
myself.
Neither
of
us
have
had
the
benefit
of
having
had
Direct
conversations
with
Mr
Fox
I
think
this
is
yeah
and
playing
petition.
So
I,
don't
I,
don't
have
the
full
background
here,
but
typically
we
wouldn't
want
to.
If
that
becomes
an
issue
it
will
be
regardless
of
what
the
HBC
does.
A
I,
don't
have
any
questions,
let's
move
the
comments.
Daniel.
A
D
So
yeah
so
historic,
preservation
and
planning,
we
often
work
in
tandem
with
each
other.
Most
cases
and
larger
cases
such
as
this
one
have
to
go
both
through
planning
and
through
the
historic
preservation
process,
but
at
some
point,
there's
always
a
little
bit
there.
D
There
is
the
potential
for
things
to
bounce
back
back
and
forth
more
than
once,
when
there
are
discrepancies
between
the
historic
preservation
side
and
the
planning
side,
some
cases
don't
have
to
go
to
planning
such
as
like
a
window
or
a
fence,
sometimes
that
window
and
fence
do
have
to
go
through
planning
and
a
lot.
D
You
know
so
there's
kind
of
a
Venn
diagram
where
there's
a
slice
and
then
there's
always
a
question
of
whether
people
should
apply
to
one
first
and
then
the
other
many
people
come
to
Historic
preservation
first,
because
oftentimes,
it's
more
rigorous.
However,
the
way
that
the
ordinances
and
I
think
Mike
you
can
clarify
your
Colleen.
If
you
you're
up
to
it,
the
stricter
rule
takes
precedence
is
what
I
understand.
Yeah
and
Mike
is
nodding.
His.
D
The
times
preservation
is
more
strict,
but
then
there
are
moments
such
as
with
signage
or
with
things
in
the
Udo,
where
planning
is
more
strict
and
therefore
it
kind
of
sometimes
things.
There's
they
just
go
back
and
forth
so
yeah.
Do
you
want
to
chime
in
Karina.
H
D
A
A
J
What
the
owner's
plans
are
once
let
me
rephrase
it.
My
understanding
is
that
if
it's
determined
in
the
future
that
it
isn't
owner
occupied,
then
that's
an
Enforcement
issue,
but
it
doesn't
affect
us
now,
because
the
owner
could
decide
today
to
live
in
one
of
these
units
and
it
would
negate
the
the
preclusion
of
or
would
negate
what's
the
word
I'm
looking
for
the.
I
G
B
A
Necessarily,
it's
not
you're
right.
What's
going
on
with
the
property
I,
really
appreciative,
we
like
their
plan
and
what
they
want
to
do
if
it
meets
with
guidelines
the
neighborhood,
whoever
lives
in
it
and
whatever
happens
after
that
or
with
planning
and
how
many
people
can
be
in
there
or
the
Adu.
That's
up
to
planning
I
think
ours
is
to
make
a
decision
to.
Q
N
N
Fabric
and
if
this
is
allowed
or
not
it
within
our
purview
and
then
it's
up
to
planning
to
because
it's
before
us
now,
typically
these
things
get
caught
before
it
gets
here.
If
you're
playing,
we
don't
we
don't
know,
there
may
be
another
exception
in
the
Udo
that
allows
this
I
don't
know
but
yeah,
but
I
I,
guess
I'm.
F
Right,
for
example,
investigate
for
a
single
family
unit
how
many
people
are
going
to
live
in
it.
That's
a
totally
separate
issue
that
happens
after
or
sometime
later
in
the
future.
Sometimes
so
I
mean
it's
it's
not
that's
just.
It
makes
no
sense
for
us
to
evaluate
who's
going
to
live
in
the
home
after,
but.
F
Now
you
know,
planning
is
on
alert
and
they
will
most
likely
make
sure
that
our
our
whether
everything
is
being
followed.
A
F
J
N
Yeah
I
mean
my
my
I:
don't
have
a
problem
with
the
project
and
I.
Also
another
common
movie
is
we're
going
to
see
more
adus
because
the
city
now
the
website
is
live
with
the
adus
on
it.
So
we're
going
to
see
more
adus
in
a
lot
of
the
core,
neighborhoods
I'm
sure
so
that'll
be
something
I.
Think
planning
will
end
up
having
to
deal
with
and
and
again.
N
My
other
point
was
is
that
when
something
is
before
us
and
they've
worked
with
planning
I
think
we
have
to
take
that
this
Project's
in
front
of
us
it
meets
whatever
planning
has
deemed
it
meets,
and
we
aren't
discussing
that
Merit.
You
know
we're
and
we're
not
asking
Gloria
to
be
up
to
speed
on
the
Udo
and
every
bit
of
its
nuances.
A
Q
G
K
K
There
is
there's
clearly
some
some
questions
that
need
to
be
answered,
so
that
addresses
my
general
concern
when
we,
when
we
spend
times
on
things,
I
approve
a
petition
for
somebody.
I
do
also
think
there's
you're
raising
a
good
point
Duncan,
which
is
that
we
don't
like
to
waste
our
time
on
petitions
that
may
turn
out
to
be
totally
irrelevant
that
this
project
might
have
to
come
back
to
the
HPC
again
looking
different,
if
in
fact
it
does
violate
the
UVO
but
I
think
we're
pretty
close
to
the
end
of
this
one.
K
Q
If
a
mistake
was
made
of
planning-
and
it
got
here
in
what
through
that
mistake-
then
it
needs
to
go
back
to
planning
and
you
need
to
reconsider
it.
They
need
consider
it
and
then
we'll
hit
and
then
we'll
hear
it
well
after
you've
made
up
your
mind
if
this
is
a
legal
project
or
not,
that's
that's
my
point.
F
F
G
J
B
A
C
P
P
We're
not
planning
is
not
going
to
approve
something.
That's
that's
not
legal
and
I'm
sure.
There's
steps
that
need
to
take
place
after
this
meeting
and
going
forward,
but
I
can
assure
you
I've,
had
multiple
meetings
with
Eric
and
I've
got
emails
to
where
he's
even
saying
to
go
ahead
with
the
the
site
plan,
we
had
to
work
through
a
bunch
of
things,
and
this
has
just
never
come
up
and
I
do
want
to
add
that
the
West
unit
is
being
built
for
my
son.
So.
B
P
Don't
know
technically,
if
that
even
checks
the
box,
if,
in
fact
it
does
need
to
be
underoccupied
and
I
appreciate
that
time.
J
J
What
does
it
mean
to
be
owner
occupied?
Is
it
just
enough
to
be
the
owner
and
have
it
as
my
legal
residence?
Even
if
somebody
else
is
physically
living
there
I
mean
a
divorced
couple.
For
example,
I
could
be
the
owner
of
my
host,
but
my
wife
legally
resides
there
as
as
the
occupant
does,
that
I
mean
I.
J
K
Yeah,
so
that
so
we
can
come
up
with
a
lot
of
hypotheticals
that
run
run
right
on
the
line
here.
So
I,
don't
know
if,
in
terms
of
when
the
annual
affidavit
is
filled
out,
there
should
be
their
owner.
Occupancy
is
completed,
I'm,
not
sure,
precisely
how
much
how
much
money
has
allowed
people
to
have
some?
C
J
K
K
A
I
B
I
So
I,
if
I
want
to
apologize
if
I've
muddied
the
waters
here,
all
I
meant
to
do
was
raise
a
flag.
I've
raised
the
flag,
the
flag's
up.
There
planning
will
do
with
it
what
they
want.
The
Adu
legislation
was
very
contentious
because
many
people
were
concerned
about
developers
coming
in
from
out
of
town
and
doing
you
know,
densifying
properties
that
they
didn't
live
on
and
had
two
rental
incomes.
That
said,
I
think
the
project,
just
you
know,
architecturally.
I
Historically,
it's
fine,
the
only
other
flag
I
would
raise,
which
I
don't
necessarily
want
discussed,
is
that
the
the
unit
appears
to
be
the
walls
appear
to
be
exactly
on
the
setbacks,
and
there
appears
to
be
an
eve,
and
if
you
haven't
Eve,
it
needs
to
be
no,
it
doesn't
need
to
be
that's
a
big
lie:
okay,
I
retract,
that
I
just
got
in
trouble
where
my
crotch
was
off
the
property,
and
that
was
off
the
property.
I
So
it
was
just
off
the
property,
but
you
know
for
as
far
as
the
the
project
itself
goes,
I've
got
no
issues
with
it.
A
L
A
G
H
G
A
D
A
R
D
A
D
So
the
petitioners
we
have
very
clever
but
there's
additional
petitioners
are
requesting
for
the
creation
of
construction
of
a
a
Edition
to
the
court
building
historic
district
and
staff
comments.
The
following:
the
proposed
edition
of
carefully
balances,
the
need
to
balance
combines
the
need
to
balance
the
form
and
aesthetic
of
the
new
structure
with
the
historic
one.
D
Well,
looking
different,
the
addition
is
taller,
but
would
have
a
substantial
setback
from
the
front
facade
facing
the
facade
of
the
core
building,
and
this
is
what
the
understanding
that
the
core
building
is
already
uphill
and
is
retracted,
quite
a
bit
from
the
far
away
from
the
street,
and
the
petitioner
has
also
Incorporated
the
feedback
or
took
into
account
the
feedback
of
the
historic
preservation.
D
Commission
particularly
enlightening
the
color
of
the
proposed
materials
for
the
addition
staff
recommends,
approval
of
co8,
23-23
and
I
just
wanted
to
show
some
just
what's
in
the
packet,
I
put
the
materials
with
the
fiber
cement
board
panels
and
the
V
panels.
So
there's
different
materials
used,
including
Limestone,
which
is
more
reminiscent
of
the
historic
structure,
along
with
the
vinyl
windows
that
would
be
on
the
Edition
and
the
storefront
aluminum
storefront
system.
D
And
here
you
can
see
it's
more
like
a
well
actually,
the
original
building
is
more
of
a
Tetris
blocked
like
the
tea
Tetris
anyways,
and
the
new
edition
is
bigger.
It's
longer,
but
it's
more
in
a
way
more
tucked
away.
D
D
So
this
is
the
elevation,
the
west
elevation
of
the
new
structure,
where
it
emulates
the
patterning
sort
of
an
abstraction
of
the
already
simplified
art
deco
with
the
combination
of
limestone
and
your
materials.
D
Yeah
and
with
that,
the
presentation
is
done.
R
Hi
everyone
I'm
Barry
Clapper
from
Spring,
Point,
Architects
and
Todd
rotman
is
here
Robin
player,
architects
in
Indianapolis,
and
we
also
have
grin
Shore
who's.
The
developer
of
Peter
lavavi
is
joining
us
via
Zoom.
This
evening
we
were
here
last
your
last
hearing
for
an
informal
discussion.
I
know
some
of
you
were
not
present
at
that
I'm
happy
to
give
an
overview
of
the
project
we
find
it
helpful.
Otherwise,
I
will
just
pick
up
with
some
of
the
changes
that
we
made
from
the
feedback
that
we
received
from
you
last
time.
R
So
the
information
I
would
share
with
is
what
is
included
in
your
packet
just
about
the
overall
approach
to
the
project.
What
the
project
consists
of
the
scope
of
the
project
is
everybody?
Okay,
with
that,
if
I'm
able
to
move
on
okay,
so
there
were
a
number
of
changes
we
wanted
to
call
your
attention
to,
and
I
just
want
to
have
I
have
one
clarification
and
that
this
plan
is
actually
the
original
plan
that
was
part
of
our
response
to
an
RFP
that
the
city
issued.
R
This
was
when
we
had
thought
that
we
actually
had
more
property
to
work
with
than
we
ended
up
having
because
of
the
location
of
Jackson
Street.
So
that
is
in
essence,
why
we
had
to
go
from
three
stories
to
four
stories,
because
it
was
not
our
first,
our
first
craft.
R
It
was
not
our
preference,
I
should
say
okay,
so
we
had
to
tighten
things
up
and
in
order
to
maintain
the
Integrity
of
the
project,
this
project
is
going
for
a
historic
tax
credits
and
for
affordable
housing,
tax
credits
as
well,
and
so
it
there
are
certain
things
that
are
dictated
in
terms
of
unit
counts
and
stuff
to
make
the
the
project
be
able
to
qualify.
R
So
after
our
last
discussion,
we
took
all
of
your
comments
under
advisement,
and
you
will
see
that
there
were
a
number
of
changes
so
just
quickly
the
first
one,
the
top
story.
We
lighten
that
we
we
kind
of
darkened
up
the
body,
the
mass
and
that
top
story,
rather
than
having
that
dark.
R
Impactful
color,
we
sort
of
lightened
that
up
to
lessen
that
visually
and
we
were
able
to
step
that
framing
back
slightly
about
four
inches
and
also
enhance
the
the
articulation
of
the
cornice
at
that
point
between
the
the
change
of
materials
to
help
a
a
visual
kind
of
recession.
If
you
will
of
that
top
story
to
make
that
read
a
little
bit
more
clearly,.
M
F
M
R
It's
a
bit
richer
than
what's
being
portrayed
here,
so
that
was
one
change
that
we
made.
Another
was
further
a
further
articulation
of
the
vertical
panels.
The
vertical
grouping
of
the
the
two
top
story:
windows
in
the
core
building
sort
of
forms
a
unit-
and
we
are
working
with
that
kind
of
language.
How,
however,
Translating
that
from
Stone
into
trim-
and
so
we
have
worked
to
to
get
some
more
play
of
Shadow
and
depth
if.
R
The
other
change
that
we
made
is,
we
are
no
longer
showing
the
stair
Towers
clad
in
Limestone,
but
rather
we
have
gone
to
the
fiber
cement
board
cladding
to
make
that
more
homogeneous,
because
those
forms
were
taller
than
the
poor
building.
We
really
felt
that
it
was
those
masses
were
a
bit
too
dominant
in
relation
to
the
poor.
R
So
this
way
there
it's
more
of
a
homogeneous
treatment
rather
than
a
calling
out
of
those
of
those
stair
Tower
elements
that
we
think
is
more
successful
and
then,
lastly,
the
front
entry-
and
you
can
maybe
go
back
to
the
previous
slide,
Gloria-
that
front
entry.
We
have
now
stepped
that
back
in
stages
in
Limestone
that
Echoes
the
treatment
of
the
poor
at
the
entry
that
has
kind
of
a
cool
beveled.
R
You
know
stacking,
and
so
we
are
we're
kind
of
referencing
that
that
echo
of
form
in
that
element,
so
those
were
really
our
main
changes
from
our
last
hearing
and
we
look
forward
to
hearing
your
promise.
Let's
go
around
is
that
good?
Okay.
A
So,
okay,
great,
thank
you.
So
let's
move
to
questions
Daniel
have
you
got
any
questions.
N
All
right,
yeah,
just
a
couple
and
I,
didn't
make
the
the
first
hearing
but
reading
the
statement
and
looking
at
the
drawings,
so
to
be
a
tax
credit
project.
N
So
you
you
talk
about
matching
the
existing
windows,
so
I
assume
the
existing
windows
are
not
replaced
when
are
they
historic
and
those
will
be
refurbished.
Thank.
N
R
The
existing
windows
in
the
core
building
are
not
original;
they
were
replaced
at
some
sometime
in
the
7,
their
storefront
they're.
Basically,
an
aluminum
window,
I
should
say
an
aluminum
anodized
aluminum
window.
Those
we
intend
will
stay.
What
we
are
matching
are
the
head
Heights
and
the
heights
of
the
windows
yeah.
M
N
That
gets
one
of
the
questions,
and
and
and
that's
good
thanks
for
that,
and
then
the
other
is
then
I
assume
and
again,
I
haven't
been
up.
Close
I've
only
been
as
close
as
the
fence
will
allow
me.
M
N
A
F
You
Allison,
yes,
will
this
project
need
to
go
okay
and
then
has
there
been
any
application
for
funds
from
the
bua
at
all?
No.
R
A
not
that
I
know
of
no,
unless,
unless
Peter
has
more
information
on
that,
but
I
do
not
believe
so.
C
A
Q
M
Q
Q
B
R
The
storefront
windows,
the
it
was
always
an
uneven
pattern,
so
the
top
sash
was
larger
than
the
bottom
sash,
so
that
from
photographic
evidence
was
followed
when
they
replaced
the
wood
windows
with
the
aluminum
windows,
which.
R
Q
I
The
the
existing
replacement
storefront
is
a
mill
finish
at
this
point
and
then
you're
putting
in
some
vinyl
windows
in
the
new
building.
So
talk
to
me
about
the
finishes
of
the
new
storefront,
the
new
windows
and
the
the
new.
So.
M
B
I
I
Have
is
what
is
the
so
you've
got
a
this
metal,
this
chord
gate?
Well,
it's
not
corrugated,
but
it's
like
a
standing,
seamish
metal,
paneled
stuff
that
you're
putting
on
the
third
floor
and
then
coming
down
the
spandrels,
and
so
what's
the
reveal
on
the
fin?
It's
like
every
four
inches.
How
far
does
it
come
out?
If
we
could.
R
M
Yeah
I
think
the
depth
on
this
one
was
a
three-quarter
inch
deep.
We
picked
one,
it
was
fairly
deep
and
that's
probably
a
five
and
a
quarter
inch
space
in
between
the
vertical
ribs.
I
I
I
I
just
want
to
say
thank
you.
It
is
massively
I'm
massively
happier
than
I
was
last
time
and
I
didn't
mean
to
sound
so
grumpy
last
time,
but
you
know,
but
I
think
the
the
the
massing
is
so
much
cleaner
than
it
was
before,
and
I
appreciate
that
the
stair
Towers
don't
pop
up
to
the
roof.
I
That
said,
I
have
a
couple
of
concerns,
mainly
around
this
metal
stuff.
I.
Think
this
metal
stuff.
It's
not
going
to
wear
well
on
a
public
housing
project.
It's
especially
at
the
garage
at
street
level
at
pedestrian
level,
so
I
would
strongly
encourage
you
to
move
all
that
to
the
roof
and
leave
it
there
move
it
all
up
to
that
third
floor,
like
get
rid
of
all
those
drop
downs
and
just
keep
it
simple,
because
it's
going
to
get
dented
it's
going
to
get
ugly
and
it's
going
to
be
a
maintenance.
M
B
I
I
would
I
would
strongly
suggest
you
make
it
something
that
people
aren't
going
to
run
their
bikes
into
blah
blah
blah
blah
blah.
It's
just
yeah.
It's
just
asking
to
get
big
dents
in
it.
So
I've
got
one
other
question
which
is
I,
guess
more
of
a
comment.
It's
sure
it's
what
it
is.
You
have
all
this
fiber
cement
coming
down
to
the
ground.
M
A
Thank
you,
Duncan.
Q
Yeah
I
I,
like
it
a
lot
better
I,
know
I
like
the
other
version.
Okay,
I'm
I
I'd,
rather
see
more
setback
on
the
fourth
floor.
I'd
rather
not
see
the
fourth
floor.
So
it's
like
I'll
just
be
honest
with
you
I
it
troubles
me.
I,
agree.
Q
And
I
and
I
know
there
are
reasons
for
it
and
not
the
least
richest
money,
but
I
I
think
it
I,
think
thinking
about
secretary
standards,
I,
don't
think
four
inches
setback
and
and
the
cornice
Improvement,
which
does
enhance
the
setback.
Slightly.
It's
going
to
be
adequate
to
diminish
its
impact.
I,
don't
think
it's
going
to
diminish
it
enough
and
so
I.
Q
You
know
I
think
you're
gonna
have
to
give
up
some
square
footage
and
get
it
back
a
couple
of
feet
at
least,
and
that's
my
minimum
kind
of
reducing
the
upper
floors
and
I
and
I
I
get
the
cost
of
it,
but
I
just
think
it
I
think
it's
even
even
though
you
changed
the
the
color
and
you
lightened
it.
It's
not
it's
not
going
away
in
any
picture.
I've
seen
and.
B
Q
C
A
Thanks
Victor
Kirsten
any
comment:
Allison
no.
N
Doug
yeah
a
couple
of
things:
first,
I'll
start
with
just
what
Duncan
said
and
I
agree
with
Duncan
on
that
that
it
seems
to
almost
still
over
overwhelm
the
the
core
building
and
I
think
when
we
look
at
it
from
street
level
down
below
which
may
have
a
a
it
may
have
more
of
a
towering
Vision
than
we
see
now
from
from
the
some
of
these
renderings.
N
But
that
being
said,
a
couple
of
things
one
is
I
wish.
Chris
Thurmond
was
here
because
I
remember
all
the
hearings
and
meetings
and
discussion.
We
had
about
boy
that
we've
got
to
save
this.
N
We
can't
tear
this
this
core
building
down
and
I
think
this
is
a
process
and
a
project
that
shows
that
you
can
save
it
and
it
can
be
worthwhile
and
it
may
take
that
fourth
floor
to
do
it,
but
here
sits
the
building
and
so
I
appreciate
that
and
and
then
I
would
add,
that
I
also
appreciate
your
efforts
in
this
design
and
to
me
the
depth
of
design
even
going
to
the
the
windows
and
other
things
that
you've
done
so
I
think
you've
done
a
good
job
on
it.
A
Thank
you,
Bernard.
O
Great
thanks,
Richard
Lewis
of
Prospect
Hill
neighborhood
resident
and
a
member
of
a
small
group
that
we
self-named
the
Hopewell
group
the
help
meetings
local
meetings
in
the
past
couple
years,
knowing
that
this
neighborhood
was
going
to
open
up
and
I'm
thrilled
to
see
that
so
much
effort
has
been
put
into
preserving
the
court
building,
which
I
think
is
an
important
aspect
of
this
whole
football
neighborhood
project
and
and
I
appreciate
the
work
that
Barry
and
and
team
have
done
to
take
your
suggestions
and
improvements.
O
It
certainly
looks
improved
to
me
visually
and
and
the
fourth
floor.
Edition
looks
less
monolithic,
less
kind
of
bidding
as
it
did
in
the
darker
version
earlier.
I
would
just
point
out
to
the
members
of
the
commission
that
from
street
level
along
Rogers,
there
is
a
very
steep
slope
upward
that
front
lawn
is
a
very
steep
incline
from
street
level.
Up
to
the
front
door
of
the
core
building,
I
have
to
wonder
that
I
am
not
an
artist
I'm,
not
a
rendering
specialist
but
from
street
level.
I.
O
Don't
know
that
I
would
see
that
fourth
floor,
Edition
at
all,
just
just
from
angle
and
perspective
I
realize
obviously,
if
you're
on
First
Street
or,
if
you're
from
an
angle,
further
up
Rogers.
O
Yes,
of
course
it's
going
to
be
visible,
but
the
public
way
facade
view
I
think
would
you're
largely
going
to
see
that
for
build
them,
but
at
any
rate
kudos
to
all
that
have
worked
so
hard
to
preserve
this
and
make
it
a
truly
functional
building
with
housing
that
helps
with
our
housing
needs
and
our
affordable
housing
needs,
especially
going
into
the
future.
So.
A
Exactly
thank
you.
Thank
you,
Richard
for
your
comments.
I'd
also
like
to
introduce
that
we
have
Jan
core
with
us
this
evening
and
her
daughter,
and
would
you
guys
like
to
give
us
some
comments
about
the
property.
E
It's
certainly
very
impressive
to
see
all
the
people
here
and
to
see
the
renderings
and
to
have
your
information.
We
are
here
really
just
to
gather
information
in
a
farm,
our
own
selves
and
as
I
look
at
this
I
think
I.
Think
I
would
be
very
pleased.
A
A
L
Just
Lego
yes,
Sam
installer,
yes,
I'm!
Sorry,
yes,
yes,
okay,
John,
Saunders,
yes,
diverse,
yes,
Liz
Mitchell,
yes,
Allison
Chopra,.
F
F
C
A
B
C
I
C
I'm
just
thrilled
that
we're
going
to
be
able
to
work
together
to
preserve
this
really
important,
building,
working
together
with
the
city
and
and
everybody
here.
So
thank
you
so
much
for
approving.
A
D
D
As
Commissioners
okay
there's
a
lot
going
on,
but
as
Commissioners
all
of
you
have
to
read
the
applications
because
they
are
part
of
the
packet
as
the
staff
I
have
to
process
all
of
the
applications,
and
some
of
you
are
also
petitioners
every
once
in
a
while
and
you
fill
out
these
applications
I
noticed
that
they
haven't
really
changed
at
all
in
over
20
years,
just
the
most
minor
of
tweaks
right
now,
the
caseload
is
growing
pretty
quickly,
as
in
last
year,
we
had
94
coas
individual
coas
that
were
submitted,
and
we
saw
a
hundred
two
COA
cases,
including
the
repeats,
the
ones
that
were
tabled
and
returned
to
us,
so
that
that's
a
lot
of
work
for
all
of
us
and
so
I
just
wanted
to
be
able
to
get
the
information
that
I
actually
use
in
a
way.
D
That's
very
clear:
that's
concise,
so
I'm
just
bringing
this
to
you
so
that
you
can
see
it
it's
not
for
like
a
full
review,
but
if
there's
anything
that
stands
out
that
you're
like
wait,
a
minute,
that's
wonky
or
that's
weird
or
that
doesn't
make
any
sense
you
can
flag
it.
Let
me
know:
I'll
probably
be
testing
it
out
in
the
next
month
or
so,
and
seeing
how
that
goes.
D
I
also
included
instructions
to
the
petitioner,
including
hyperlinks,
where
they
can
find
the
historic
district
and
fill
that
part
out
and
the
survey,
and
also
what
they're
building
a
survey.
So
they
can
fill
that
out.
I'm
not
going
to
ask
them
to
guess
what
the
survey
rating
for
their
property
is
or
what
their
or
what
the
personal
number
is.
So
I
just
put
as
many
hyperlinks
as
I
could,
but
I
and
I
also
gave
the
checklist.
So
whenever
somebody
calls
me
I
go
literally
go
to
the
certificate
of
appropriateness,
webpage
and
copy
paste.
D
All
of
that
information
into
an
email
and
send
it
to
them
with
this.
I
can
just
send
them
this
packet
with
these
three
pages
and
they
have
everything
in
one:
go
I'm
just
trying
to
find
ways
to,
because
I
am
also
my
secretary
I'm,
also,
my
office
manager
I'm,
also
my
inspector,
so
having
all
these
different
little
hats
on
all
the
time
and
trying
for
them
not
to
fall
off
all
the
time.
Just
trying
to
do
this
and
then
the
other
part
of
it.
D
D
A
lot
of
people
who
are
working
on
their
own
homes
are
not
going
to
contract
an
architect
or
an
engineer,
and
even
the
builders
or
Carpenters
are
not
expert
drawers,
so
at
least
with
this
I
just
try
to
give
a
sort
of
a
sample
of
what
it
might
look
like.
A
drawing
could
look
like
with
some
tips,
and
you
know,
tips
and
suggestions
he's
like
using
a
ruler.
D
Some
people
don't
understand
that
I've
received
documents
that
look
like
a
five-year-old
drew
them
and
when
they
come
to
you
and
the
part
that
the
commission
doesn't
necessarily
see,
is
me
calling
petitioners
over
and
over
them
trying
to
get
them
to
send
me
better
drawings,
and
they
send
me
better
drawings,
but
they're
not
up
to
the
standards
of
the
HPC.
So
there's
a
lot
of
stuff
behind
the
scenes
that
you
know
doesn't
get
to
us,
so
this
may
or
may
not
pan
out.
D
They
may
or
may
not
use
it,
but
I
do
want
to
offer
additional
resources
online
that
might
make
somebody's
life
a
little
easier.
This
is
this
would
be
a
separate
document
that
they
could
download
if
they
so
choose,
chose
to
and
I'll
put
like
images
of
it
on
the
web
page
so
that
they
can
see
the
resource
if
they
wanted
to
anyways
that.
That's
that,
on
that.
A
F
B
I
F
A
F
Sure
so
I
would
like
to
make
a
motion
to
add
to
the
agenda
for
next
time.
F
I
was
like,
what's
that,
keep
going
a
motion
that
the
chair
or
just
I,
guess
I,
probably
just
have
to
request
a
chair
because
you're
in
charge
of
the
the
agenda
correct,
but
we
can
make
it
a
formal
motion
to
to
eliminate
the
hybrid
nature
of
these
meetings
such
that,
so
that
we
can
have
better
attendance
and
it's
fair
to
everyone
to
make
sure
that
that
we're
getting
the
appropriate
amount
of
people
here
in
boats.
If
I
like
that
to
be
a
ninja.
A
A
Another
thing
I
want
to
add,
since
we're
talking
about
adding
some
stuff
yeah
is
I,
want
us
to
try
and
get
a
group
together
to
talk
about
alternative
Roofing
for
historic
homes,
because
we
ran
into
that
a
while
back
ago
with
one
of
the
petitioners
one
of
these
composite
or
what
whatever.
That
step
was
Plastic.
G
A
I
think
we're
just
I
just
wasn't
really
terrific,
because
that's
right
now,
you
can
put
in
right
now
you
put
on
a
just
a
regular
dimensional
single
roof
but
like
in
that
case,
you
wanted
to
use
something
like
more
like
slate
and
we
were
struggled
with
it,
but
I
think
we
need
to
look
at
new
materials
being
offered
out
there,
because
I
think
we'll
see
it
again
right
in
the
future.
Marlene.
A
So
you
know
we
might
want
to
do
some
committee
or
something
we'll
figure
that
out
on
our
next
meeting
but
we'll
put
around
our
gym
and
discuss.
Okay,
do
we
have
any
old
business?
We
do.
Oh.
D
Just
yeah
yeah,
let's
just
very
quickly,
we
were
going.
D
Case
today,
but
the
owner
reached
they
retracted,
but
they're
gonna
resubmit
for
next.
The
next
meeting,
all
of
this
happened
in
the
time
that
I
Was
preparing
the
agenda,
so
I
was
erasing
and
putting
back
and
taking
out
and
putting
back
so
the
agenda
looks
a
little
weird,
so
it's
gonna
be
a
completely
new
resubmittal,
but
it
will
be
almost
identical,
but
some
corrected
things
and
a
little
bit
of
clarification
on
the
Limestone
on
what
could
be
the
new
Limestone
versus
the
old
Limestone,
but
yeah
that
that
that
was
it.
Okay.
A
Thanks,
so
do
we
have
some
commissioner.
A
D
I
still
have
a
lot
of
novs
lined
up
and
a
pending
meeting
with
legal.
That's
probably
gonna
happen
much
sooner
rather
than
later.
Now
that
we
have
oh
by
the
way
we
have
new
legal
representation.
F
F
K
B
A
Do
we
have
any
public
comments.
A
All
right
hearing
none,
we
are
adjourned.