City of Boulder, CO Planning Board, 15 Jul 2021

Previous Meeting Next Meeting

⏯

youtube image

►

From YouTube: 7-15-21 Boulder Planning Board/TAB Joint Meeting

Description

7-15-21 Boulder Planning Board/TAB Joint Meeting

A

Okay., I'm cindy have you and keep an eye on the attendees,. I will share screen and go through the protocol. okay. community here, but I will do it anyway., the record. yeah,. We need to hit record, and then I'll quickly.

A

All right,, we should be recording. so,, welcome to the july 15 joint meeting of the city of boulder planning board and the transportation advisory board. It's so nice to be together, again.

A

I'm dave, then sign I'll, be just doing the few little tasks and cheering. tina, and I exchanged an email on that. And since I made the agenda setting meeting, we figured that would work.

A

I'll go ahead and hand it over there to gene got six. Do the virtual participation rules you mate.

B

Thank you,, david. so,, the city is engaged with the community members to co, create a vision for productive, meaningful and inclusive civic conversations.

B

This promotes safety for our community members, staff, council and boards,, as well as the democracy for the, for people of all walks of life. More about this vision, and the full rules can be found on the city's council webpage under, under participate in.

B

City council, meetings.

B

okay,, let me move to the next one.

B

All right. are you seeing my next slide. there we go.

B

the following are examples of rules of decorum found in the boulder revised code,, and these will be upheld during this meeting. So all remarks and testimony she'll be limited to matters related to city business. Now participant shall make threats or use.

B

Other forms of intimidation against any person., any obscenity, dehumanizing language, racial, racial epithets or other speech and behavior that disrupts or otherwise and pizza the ability to conduct the meeting are prohibited, and participants are required.

B

To post., actually it's just there, the name that they're currently known by and we typically require a full name before public comment., I'm still not seeing members of the community. But if we get any in the next few minutes before open comment.

B

We will use the raise hand function to do that and I can go over a little more protocol, at that point, should we have folks.

B

I think that's all that's all I have david.

A

Ray thank you so much team, and I just wanted to just if everybody would indulge me for a moment. We have a very big update next week on cu south. and I've been asked to just remind the public, for I guess there isn't any public little, but if anyone listens.

A

Later that we have a 48 hour cut off for any communications electronically that will be considered as part of public record for that hearing,. So please remember to get comments in 48 hours before the meeting that will be 6pm on tuesday.

A

If you have anything to submit in writing or if you have any presentations, and otherwise the speaking engagements, of course, go up until meeting time, so.

A

So I just wanted to make sure to highlight that.. So there's no surprises for folks next week for the fairly big item. and so now before we go into public participation..

A

I'll just turn it over to our planning director jacob lindsay the welcome yes. Thank you jacob for attending.

C

Thank you david, and welcome to all the members of planning board, as well as transportation advisory board,. I just wanted to first of all give a word of thanks from all the city staff to each of you who give so much to the city of boulder volunteering.

C

Your time and effort. and,, and, and insights to the work that we do.

C

Tonight you'll be hearing from staff, an update on the east folder sub community plan, and, more importantly, will be listening to you to hear the feedback that you have. The insights that you have and the important dialogue that comes from having these.

C

Two boards convene as one..

C

I think that this is a special meeting for us, and it also works a milestone in the course of this plan,, as we are really crossing the 50% mark and reaching a point where this plan is beginning to have recommendations that coalesce into something greater.

C

Than what it was before., this part of boulder, of course, is a unique place,. It's a place, that's in transition,, and this sub community plan comes at just the right time to guide the growth of this place. Efforts like this and meetings like this are part of what makes boulder the.

C

Number one city to live in america. according to some sources., and it's because of your effort that we've achieved that kind of milestone.. So thank you all for being here, and thank you all for the,, the robust, showing and city staff that I see as well.

C

And with that, I will turn it over, and we can continue on this meeting.

C

So, thank you all so much jacob and great. So um the next item on the agenda then, would be for public participation.

A

Gene, do we have anyone on to participate in the public participation at this point,? I'm not unless anybody who's here for the next item.

B

As a panelist would like to address the board on some other topic, or this topic as open comment, but oh here we go. looks like we've got one other attendee.

B

Kurt we're just,, I see that you just joined us. We've just opened up the open comment and are asking if folks would like to speak,, would you like to.? If you would like to address the board,, you can use the raise hand, function, and go public speakers. Will.

A

Have three minutes to address the board and you can address this on any subject, including this folder sub community calm.

A

So we'll look to see if parents didn't raise his hand.

B

Okay, so he just joined us.. You are the only member of the community.

B

And that's why we were naming you specifically.

D

All right. well, looks like,, then we're probably good to go to move forward.. We don't see hundreds.

A

Thank you, gene to that. okay,, so we have one discussion: item tonight. and that is,, each folder sub community plan joint board work session to provide feedback on the community review draft of these folders of community plan.

A

And so we'll be hearing from a number of staff members and consultants tonight, and so it's going to be quite a,, an extensive presentation. I think so I think tonight. What we'll do is go ahead and hear the presentations,, because then we'll hear all of the.

A

Related concepts, put before us, and then we open it up for questions after the presentations,, because there might be things in this life and answer some previous things. So just keep your hold your questions, tonight.

A

And then we're going to try to keep it to about 20, to 30 minutes for for questions and then we'll go into four key questions for the presenters, that is, and then we'll go into four key issues that have been we've been asked to comment on, and those four.

A

And those four issues we're putting our packet, and we'll go through them one at a time and then what we're going to do is jean will kind of run us through calling on each individual board member to speak. For,, you know, a minute or two on each of those.

A

Key issues., since we have so many people involved with that, that would be a good way to go forward and jen,. You can fill me in if I missed anything on that, since I know you kind of came up with that proposed race. Do things.

A

Does that make sense that that's great. well, once we get to the discussion times, will will show you are fun way of starting off.

A

Yeah, we're going to start with a random person and then go by alphabetical order by name so that way people can just kind of not worry about whether they go first until they get colder.

A

So, with that,, then I'll go ahead and turn it over,. Charles did you want to kick us off.

A

On behalf of the planning department and we'll look forward to the presentations.

E

You know I don't have any remarks this evening, so we can go ahead and just turn it right over to kathleen to get us started.

A

Great,, thank you. So much kathleen, go ahead and take it. Away.

F

Okay,, I'm gonna share my screen and pull up the presentation.

B

Kathleen do you want to introduce the other staff that are consultants that are here, too., yeah, absolutely., so, um,? We have staff from both planning and transportation. So folks that will be speaking tonight include myself, jean.

F

Jean samson. and I know, erica from transportation or transportation directors, also here as well as chris hagglund., I saw natalie this year.

F

And then holly who's also on our staff, team.

F

And then we're going to be joined by our consultants on the 55th arapaho station area plan so that includes.

F

Mark dilatory, and jay rankin's from mig,, as well as a couple other folks who make up that consultant, team and I'll. Let them introduce themselves when, when we get going.

F

But I'm, I'm super excited for tonight.. I'm really grateful to have these two groups back together.

F

And,, you know, get your thoughts about our engagement strategy for the upcoming window in the fox.

F

F

it. david just kind of ran through this, but you know there was a ton of new material in your packets and we're going to try to break that down for you and go through a couple of key pieces tonight before we dive into the discussion. City staff is going.

F

To first present some of the key features of the draft plan, and then we will be joined by that consultant. Team who's been working on a key site, 55th and arapahoe station area.

F

And,, as david mentioned,, I'm sure there's going to be questions, so we reserve time for that. and then we'd like to break into discussion and collect your feedback about key features of the draft will do another quick presentation and talk about strategy.

F

For engagement, and then hope to hear from you. on the kind of input you would want to hear from the community in order to support the plan as we work our work, our way towards completing the project.

F

So, as I mentioned, big topics for tonight, or the draft, and our engagement strategy.

F

I wanted to give you an overall picture of where we're at in the planning process, the work that we're going to be reviewing tonight is the result of two years of working with the community, to learn about each folder, generate ideas about how it might.

F

Change in the future, and way trade offs about priorities for the community.

F

So we believe that,, you know, we're really at a milestone in the project where we're close to the finish line on the vision for each folder, and how that manifests in a land, use and connections. Plan.

F

So we started thinking about implementation and how to make that vision. A reality over time.

F

So we're here to confirm that the land use and connections recommendations have your support to move towards implementation, planning, and we'll be taking your feedback, along with the east builder working groups. Input to counsel in two weeks will make.

F

Any recommended refinements over the remaining weeks of the summer, and then plan to launch this engagement window after labor day.

F

After the engagement window closes we're going to evaluate the feedback, we hear from the community to solidify recommendations and stuff will be working across city departments, to negotiate options for implementation, and then bring a final draft of the.

F

Plan back to boards, towards the end of the year, looking for tabs recommendation and planning boards adoption.

F

So we're hoping to wrap the project and seek adoption from council in early 2022.

F

And, with that in mind,, you know, the key questions for tonight or do you support the land use plan, the connections plan,, the concept for 55th and arapaho station area.

F

And if the answer is no to any of these,, what are the key, refinements or changes that needs to be made, prior to these key features of the draft, going to the community in september.

F

Okay, so let's get into it. I'm going to walk through walk through those key features of the plan.

F

The thing to keep in mind as I go through the material and as we talk about engagement, is that this phase of the project is really the last major opportunity for community members to continue to help shape the outcomes of the plan and weigh in on recommendations.

F

For the future, so that's really,, that's why we call it the community review draft those key features. I keep mentioning, or the vision, land use and connections. Plan.

F

So we're gonna start with the vision. and over the past few years, we've learned a lot about the people and places that make up the east boulder sub community.

F

And I think part of what we found is that the subcommittee is a little misunderstood by people who may not be regulars to the area.. I think most people know that it's a job center in the city.

F

There are over, 800 businesses in the area and very little housing, so almost everyone working in east, boulder, commutes.

F

But beyond those great local, businesses, and the workforce, that's so important to our local economy. there's a myriad of other amazing assets, parks and creeks and green ways. Tight, knit residential community at sun, lazaro and funky places to buy a banjo.

F

Or learn how to paint., and so those are the assets,. The plan is really built on. Our mission has been to evaluate each folder and find ways to implement the six focus areas of the comp plan into the sub community,, and that came with a lot of discussion.

F

And weighing the trade offs to be realistic about what is achievable in this part of the city. and,, you know,, I think we're landing in a great place.

F

The recommended vision for the sub community is that area neighborhoods will evolve to make the east boulder sub community thrive as an innovative working industrial sub community of boulder.

F

We're all community members have access and options for living, working in plane.

F

And, you know,. I think this is a big challenge.. This is not a small idea.. The vision describes a place that maintains its industrial nature, but welcomes new uses, the most significant of those being residential and,. You know,, this really hasn't been accomplished.

F

Successfully in many places in the united states., I think our team and the community is very cognizant of the history of gentrification of industrial neighborhoods in cities across the country.

F

And so, you know,. We've really studied the successes and failures at those places and have developed a land use and connection strategy that is designed to be strategic about change, but flexible enough to take advantage of opportunities if they arise.

F

So here's the land use plan, and we reviewed a version of this back when we met in april and boards gave great feedback that helped us make some key updates, like extending the reach of unexcused industrial venues to 55th street corridor and reserving.

F

Lambda jason tk away lake for community industrial uses.

F

The plan includes changes to existing land use and those areas are outlined in yellow, and redefining what some of those land uses means. Adding a new land use designation, and pursuing the annexation of important areas to help create more cohesive, neighborhoods.

F

So what are the major changes, and this graphic compares the amount of land designated to each kind of land use in the bbc? P land use map.

F

Those are in blue, and to the recommended land use is returned. Orange.

F

You can see you know that the most obvious shift is the designation of light industrial and to mixed use designations.. So we're going to take a look at those.

F

And the bb bb cp land use map includes a designation called mixed use. Industrial carver. The definition of this is relatively vague and it leaves some considerations about key characteristics to other guiding tools, using the community feedback. We've received.

F

About how mixed use industrial neighborhoods should look and perform in boulder, we're, including a revised definition for this land use in the draft plan, we're also adding a new mandy's designation that will help guide redevelopment in the 55th arapahoe.

F

Station area,, this recommendation is also meant to provide guidance for other areas of the city into the future, as we continue to plan for transit, oriented neighborhoods and shifting travel behaviors across the city.

F

So that, that's the kind of main components of the land use map,, but I'd like to spend a little time describing how those changes, along with other recommendations, are moving east boulder closer towards achieving a vision for the area.

F

And so first design quality and place making on the screen is the vision statement for this focus area.- and this was probably one of the most hotly debated focus areas because it's you know it's mostly about aesthetics and everyone has their own preferences.

F

And tastes for, for what they think is beautiful or appropriate or memorable.

F

So what we're attempting the sub community plan recommendations, is to remove some of the more subjective characteristics of places and focus on form, and performance of space,, so that we can generate the types of places that people will love, but allow.

F

For that experimentation and unconventional personality to come through are very creative design. Community.

F

We worked with the east boulder working group to collect images of buildings neighborhoods in public spaces and listen to find,, find out what they loved about these images and how they might see. These types of places come to life in east boulder.

F

This helps us generate a tool in the east. Folder sub community plan called place, types.

F

Place types provide an additional layer of information and guidance for the land use plan and help set expectations about the characteristics and performance of redevelopment in different areas of the sub community.

F

As we move forward towards plan completion,, the place types map and descriptions will guide key implementation. Steps for potential code updates, rezoning, the potential creation of new zones or considerations about the creation, application of a form based.

F

Code in these folder.

F

so, um, you'll notice that the police type performance standards combine expectations about things that are generally more land use, oriented like density and fly ranges, with those that are more transportation. Oriented like access and mobility.

F

We're hoping that this planning effort, helps us continue to move our practices forward,, considering how environments inside and outside the right of way, support and complement each other in places. We all experience every day.

F

The next major focus area is housing, affordability and diversity.. We used our place types, performance and mapping to help evaluate the types of housing that could be located throughout the sub community and how much new housing could potentially be added.

F

By changes resulting from this plan.

F

Realistically, based on the land uses in place types, the team generated,, we can expect east boulder to contribute between 2000 604,400 new homes to the city's housing stock. That range is,, it's entirely dependent on private redevelopment.

F

Using the 25% requirement of new residential development allocated for affordable housing., this could contribute between 580 and 1100 new permanently affordable units,. Should they be built on site.

F

And then you'll remember last fall, we presented three different land use scenarios to boards in the community for evaluation feedback.. So comparing our recommended land use plan with those scenarios.

F

I think we've landed at a pretty healthy balance between, between the three and a major reason for this is our strategic approach to identifying key neighborhoods where residential density could be well integrated into some of these business oriented.

F

Places, and also help create 15 minute neighborhoods.

F

And that that 15 minute neighborhood strategy is a key component to our efforts for supporting local businesses in east boulder,, being able to build a great network of business, workforce and customer, and each folder will help the area thrive in businesses.

F

F

additionally, the land use plan does maintain a significant amount of land that will be prioritized for industrial use.. We made no changes to the general industrial land and nice boulder,, so we will still have a place for those heavier manufacturing sites.

F

And businesses in the sub community., we slightly increased the amount of community industrial land in the sub community by identifying key areas where small businesses and small business space can operate freely, but still have great access for transporting goods.

F

While the land use recommendations do change, other areas of the sub community, from, excuse me,, light industrial use to a mixed use. Industrial category.

F

The intention is to bring greater access and allow for more density in these areas, so that we can safely integrate red residential into industrial neighborhoods in a way that supports a solid network of residents, businesses and work for workforce,. So.

F

They all experienced success, together.

F

For resilience and climate commitment,, a big piece of the plans contribution is tied to our mobility strategy and connections plan. So james hansen, we'll talk through, through that shortly.

F

But there are a number of other great ideas that have come from the community that we're looking for ways to implement as well.

F

A pretty significant one being a contribution to the city's urban forest will be working with our urban forestry team to reevaluate priority planting sites to increase the sub communities canopy from where it's at today,, which is less than 5% to the city's.

F

Goal of over 16%, helping us manage a variety of climate impacts, including stormwater management, carbon sequestration, air quality and energy use.

F

There are also a number of potential capital projects, as well as opportunities for public private partnerships that have been identified as potential recommendations of the plan.

F

One such idea that the group is maybe familiar with, and some of the initial concept work surrounding potential future of the belmont power plants, site.

F

And then, community members and city staff have also identified a wide variety of opportunities for the city to make greater contribution to our arts and cultural community in east boulder,. Some of these ideas include community cultural space, as part.

F

Of the programming for future renovations at the municipal services, center, and landmark designation of the old mill site at belmont, view.

F

So now I'm going to turn it over to my colleague and transportation james hansen, and talk about how the subcommittee plan will make contributions to our access and mobility goals, and she will walk through recommendations of the connections. Plan.

G

Thank you, kathleen,, so in regard to access and mobility and,, you know, the point of creating access and mobility connections and improvements to safety and comfort in the area is really to think about how transportation can work to support redevelopment.

G

And changes in east arapahoe as it evolves over the next 1020 years, so that transportation is not necessarily an end in itself,. But it's a way to ensure that we're considering all people,, regardless of how they travel and doing it in a way that supports.

G

The community values, many of which, kathleen just walked through., and so, as we know, much of east boulder grew up around the car, the automobiles trucks and vehicles and such.

G

And so, as we think about changing land uses in the area, we need to think about how to better accommodate more safely, accommodate different travel modes, and so, as you'll see as we walk through some of these slides, there's. Some big moves kathleen. If you.

G

You can go to the next slide. there's some new connections, and then their system enhancements. What sorts of things can we be looking at in addition to, what's already in our transportation master plan, to support some of the recommendations that are coming out of the larger east folder.

G

Said community plan. so, in regard to the big moves.

G

Here we go., so I don't think many of these should be new to you. I think you've seen them in one form or fashion, but we're all aware that eastern ohio state highway seven is our major east west regional connection, to I 25 and beyond, and eastern arapahoe.

G

The west end of a much larger segment where we're looking to develop in partnership with our communities to the east,, a complete street. That's going to include high frequency, high quality, best rapid transit and include a commuter bike way and other features.

G

That are going to help people to safely navigate easter appa with better travel options,, both through the quarter, because we know it's a commuter quarter, and also within easter app, a hoe and the community itself. So that's one of our big moves.

G

The next one is related to the hops, so we've had plans in the works for quite a while to extend our urban circulator. The hop transit service that currently circulates too much of our community out east to the flatter business park into 55th and arapaho.

G

We're currently looking at the best way to design that service,, it could look like a fixed route service,. It could look like more of a transit on demand service, but that is a big move to prep to provide that transit, that high frequency transit service.

G

That's currently lacking in much of this area. Today, micro mobility is our third big movement and very exciting one. As we move into the world of incorporating dockless,, he bikes and scooters into the area. There's a lot of excitement around this area,.

G

Frankly, it's one of the best ways to solve that first and final mile problem to provide an easy connection to people to get from, say,. Let's just say the fighter business park to those that can be like a pretty uncomfortable walk, but might feel like.

G

A really comfortable eat bakery scooter ride. Curbside management is another big move. The idea of there being that you know, there's a lot of demand for curb space in our community, and particularly in east boulder, as we think about just the volume of freight.

G

And goods movement that moves through this area. So it's incumbent upon us to look at this area in a very focused way to ensure that, as the city establishes policies for curbside management, we're doing it in such a way that accommodates freight movement..

G

Uber, lyft, pick up and drop off, and other uses of our curbside space in a way that's efficient, and then related to this bit. Last big move would be the 55th street mobility. Heaven, you're going to be hearing more about this. As our consultants speak.

G

To the station area master plan,, but we really see 50,000 arapahoe being that anchor for mobility to the rest of the east. Boulder said community plan connected with satellite hubs so that you could for example, get off the bus. Rapid transit, get on a.

G

Scooter take that to another location and then hop on a high frequency, local transit, service., so again,. The idea is to start to connect these transportation options in centralized locations.

G

So moving on. kathleen thank you.

G

So I won't go through this in much detail, but you know: a complete key component of the sub community plan is to develop new connections. As much of you know, they're very long blocks, through much of the sub community hard to navigate.

G

And the idea is to create a more fine grained network of connections to move people comfortably through these areas., so you'll notice. There are several new connections proposed to be able to support the redevelopment and changes that we're looking at.

G

That we just previously looked at in kathleen's land use, recommendations and system enhancements, speak to the types of system enhancements that we would like to see whether they're part of the transportation master plan or she should be considered. As.

G

Part of transportation master plan updates., you know,. This is sort of a grab bag of recommended system enhancements and I will say that you're looking at a work in progress, it staff and staff intention to likely not necessarily pinpoint specific geographic locations for some of these enhancements,.

G

But to speak more broadly, for example, to where we would like to see street upgrades so, for example, you'll notice that there are several,. You know indications along 55th street,, the idea here being that we are reflecting what we've heard from the community.

G

In terms of the need to enhance the comfort of bicyclists pedestrians and vehicle movement along 55th street and are respecting what we have adopted as part of our transportation master plan to do a quarter assessment of how that street might be upgraded.

G

In the future, so there's an example of a system enhancement. other types of enhancements might be more low hanging fruit and things that we can actually start to implement in the coming weeks or months, for example, putting some signage into the multi use.

G

Path: network, adding some of the missing sidewalk links that our community members have pointed out to us to our list of improvements that need to be made.

G

So, we're going to be working through the system enhancements, a little bit more, but it would be nice to get some feedback as we move into the conversation piece of tonight's agenda..

F

Thanks think seem, so you know how do all of these pieces come together.? What could this evolution of east boulder neighborhoods really look like., and I'm going to attempt to demonstrate this for the area of change where we're lovingly call calling the park west neighborhood.

F

Because it's located on the west side of element to the park.

F

and, and I'll mentioned that I,, you know, sarah brought this up earlier, but I got an email from sarah silver yesterday. and I hope she doesn't mind me calling her out, but she described the challenge of trying to understand it and visualize changes just.

F

Based on maps.- and this is something that I hear from our working group members and community members- all the time. so,- we have been building a 3d model of the area.

F

Our staff is all trying to get up to speed on the technology and how to share it with the community.

F

And, but the tools were using. are you know, for, for lack of a better word,, really heavy. I can't, I can't fly around and be very nimble about it., I'm on the laptop with my home internet over zoom.

F

So I've got some diagrams, I quickly made, and some images of our model that I'm going to share.. I hope that these are helpful and who would actually be really useful to get your input on on these images, and especially because we're trying to figure out.

F

The best way to communicate with the public, who may or may not love maps as much as I do. so,, we'll give it will give it a whirl.

F

Okay,, so I'm not a map.. This is that park west neighborhood as it is today.- and this is a bird's eye image from google earth and so here's belmont city park, velma road, foothills, parkway pro streets down here. This is the goose creek greenway.

F

And then this is sterling,, and this is also sterling,. If you spend a lot of time in east folder,, you'll know that most of the streets surrounding belmont city park are called sterling, so.

F

Okay, so then. this is that same area with the, with the police types applied. So this is that parkside residential, please type. the trail oriented live, work,. These two reddish areas are the hands on industrial.

F

And then this is that main street industrial., so we've built out in our model what these place types could translate: to, and the types of spaces that we're hoping that they would generate.

F

So,, this would be that parkside residential opportunity, we're standing just south of belmont road in the park, and you can see how these townhome units front on to the park, and these new residential homes would have this great access and connection to.

F

Green space,, as you make your way, south. we're now at sterling drive.

F

And this incorporates our ideas about upgrades to the street,, as well as the potential for redevelopment.

F

And the key connection between the neighborhood and a more eventful entry into and out of the park and what's there today.

F

So now we've, we've actually walked all the way beyond the south and the park, and you can start to see some of that trail. Oriented live workspace, or please type along goose, creek, greenly.

F

Today, this greenway include some flood control facilities and a multi use path,. It has some great views to the west and but it's not particularly attractive and doesn't offer a ton in the way of amenities. So the vision for this area is to make that greenway.

F

A centerpiece of the neighborhood, where businesses and residents on either side could really enjoy the green space in this industrial area. so, this,. This image also shows some of the recommended street upgrades to pearl street,, which is the sky here..

F

And, and then this image takes a closer look at how we're thinking about live, work, buildings of a more industrial nature in the area, and repurposing space. That today is long here. This is a really really long, driveway.

F

For more of a kind of boardwalk, where some of these light industrial businesses could actually start to incorporate a retail component.

F

This is another bird's eye view demonstrating upgrades to pro street, those live work buildings and how we're hoping to build in great active public spaces as part of redevelopment to create those third places in the neighborhood that generate great activity.

F

And help create local destinations for community members.

F

So, you know,. I just want to reiterate that this plan is about evolving neighborhoods and an evolution is a process that builds off strengths and little by little over time, become something greater.

F

So, um, you know,. That was a lot of information, but wait, there's more., I'm sure there's questions,, but they might just get answered by our consultants. So hang tight, I'm going to turn it over to jay rankings and mark dilatory to talk to you about another.

F

Key site and east folder at the 55th and arapahoe station area.

F

And I will stop sharing.

F

So I think mark, you should be able to share your screen.

H

Excellent things. definitely. and thanks again for the opportunity to discuss to you tonight kind of where we've gotten through on the 55th and arapaho stationary, a master plan,, as you all know, we're investing into a much larger effort and send it to.

H

Dig into the details with you personally wanted to introduce myself. My name is mark dilatory and the consultant team project manager for this episode with mig.

H

I'm joined by jay, rankin's or director of denver area operations and principal with the firm,, as well as josh melon from apex design,, the transportation consultant and rachel steadman from aps economic and planning systems, our market analyst,. So we'll.

H

Go through a quick, 10 minute, presentation, and then hand it back over to kathleen.

H

So I'm going to try and again compress about a year's worth of work into about 10 minutes or so so. I'm going to gloss over a couple of those things on the early end,, but breaking it down into existing condition to community engagement, really direct kind.

H

Of how we got to where we're at, and you will focus more specifically on land use, mobility and urban design.

H

Beginning with the area of focus for the stationary master plan, we're on the southern edge of the larger east folder sub community plan on around the 55th and arapahoe, it's relatively are about 60 acres, south of the rail line. Just on that northern edge.

H

There. and we got through the technical analysis and input from a land use and transportation. Perspective, really saw that there's an opportunity to leverage that transit investment, part of the identified easter, apo transportation plan by creating a mix.

H

Of uses in the area, and better utilizing land use and zoning policies to create an effect. Some of that change. The caffeine was noting to deliver those attractive, attractive and walkable neighborhoods and kind of maintain that unconventional personality.

H

And local culture. there's also opportunities to create additional bike and ted connectivity,. Building on again that initial trains, investment and and focusing specifically on mobility, have both added about the stations and throughout the rest of the.

H

Development, area. and lastly, and a really important one, and it goes back to identifying that that character and flavor of this area there's, there's a strong desire and need to balance the provision of the amenities, with very rightful concerns around gentrification. So.

H

The maintenance of that character and culture and balance as we move forward into considering change from a market standpoint, there's a strong demand for office, industrial flex, retail multifamily from a suite of complimentary uses in the area.

H

However, there's no current incentive for me developments, or landowners and properties are doing with their return. So not a lot of incentive currently to change.

H

So when we think about the opportunity for growth and change to,, you know, focused on the community, and you think about the types of policy and from a land use and development standpoint that can affect that change,. So that change is. It won't likely.

H

Want to say, without greater entitlements stamp engagement. the we've been burned by the obviously the working group we've been working with the great subcommittee from that group focused on the same specifically that a chance to engage the community affairs.

H

Council, and have hosted a number of public meetings and focus groups focused at different points in the process to help guide the vision, components, the guiding principles and the various concept. As we look through opportunities and constraints of the.

H

Larger stamp, stamp boundary, some of those guiding principles, help not only think about conceptual development, but how we engaged in spoke to the community to ask questions and ask for input so prioritizing transit supporter strategies. Obviously, at the.

H

Front and conference center of this process, thinking about growth over time, right, change doesn't happen, overnight. looking out 20 years, and how can we facilitate incremental change through appropriate sequencing and development and delivery of community.

H

Amenities,, maintaining that flexible development framework that ultimately stays true to the community input that we received throughout the process.

I

Great., so I'm going to cover the land, use and mobility on the land, new side of things.

I

Mark highlighted some of the key port parts of that,. I think, kathleen actually teed it up. Well talking about the greater sub area., there was concerned about integrating any new development into the surrounding area,, making sure that it was compatible,.

I

There's concern about losing some of the employment space that is there currently, and also looking at ways that we could actually leverage the transit and other transportation investments in the area.

I

So,, in addition to a gene, had talked about with the improvements on 55th or long arapahoe,. There's also plans to do a study, long 55th.

I

So,, what we looked at was a, and we'll go back to that map and just a moment we wanted to. Let you know what the legend was representing. So thinking about those place, types.

I

So land use component, of course, but also thinking about form and transportation and open space that would support those uses.. We have four flavors within that to the mixed use. Land use, designation.

I

That is in the draft sub community plan.. The first is flex. that is really representative of what's in the flat irons business park today. So looking at some of that, extending south ball might fall in that category as well.

I

Flex makes use., so that would be really an emphasis on the office and industrial, but in introducing some retail and service on the ground floor. that would both serve the employment uses in the area, but also be accessible, especially with transportation.

I

Improvements to new and existing residents in a nearby.

I

Next is residential mixed use., so this would be predominantly residential uses, but again with some neighborhood scale, retail and personal services,, particularly on ground floors,. You could think about that and key intersections on corners.

I

Among ground floors of mixed use, buildings. and then finally, something that we're introducing. that is really,. I think representative of sort of an aspiration for the larger area, but really trying to do it in a pretty condensed way,, which is innovation.

I

Mixed use., so this would be a combination of light industrial, creative office, retail services. You might have heard the idea of maker space or maker hoods.

I

So that really being that sort of active, engaging ground floor,, we know that we can support retail everywhere across this area, but but we would ideally have that in strategic locations.

I

So that's represented with a red hatch on the map there, so introducing a new connection, east and west, along the alignment of kind of stoke, a court that exists today which could have traditional retail as well as maybe some of the makers, having accessible.

I

Showrooms and tasting rooms and things like that, for different crafts,, retail, and then also long arapahoe, building on the success of some of the sort of disparate retail locations and retail front images that we have today.

I

But again, leveraging the transit investment along arapaho., the plan to be rt station at 55th and arapaho, as well as a longer term regional, real connection that could come along the north side of the area.

I

We would hope that there'd be a step at 5050 to create that close proximity to the rt in some sort of a commuter rail.

I

You can see those smaller purple asterisks throughout representing some of the mobility hubs. I'll explain those little bit more detail than gene did earlier,, but you can see generally residential mixed use at the station itself. At the intersection of.

I

55Th and arapaho transitioning to the innovation mixed use to the north, and ultimately heading west towards the ball campus into the hospital complex transition to flex mixed use and flex..

I

Thank you, mark., so we've gone through an exercise of doing an illustrative plan.

I

The biggest caveat in any sort of an illustrative plan at this stage of planning, and it's sort of this sub very planned scale is I can guarantee that what gets built is not going to look like this.

I

What the way reason we do this is to begin to articulate some of the design intent.

I

The idea of having setbacks of have not necessarily doing zero lot lines where we create a canyon, effect.

I

But relating to the street in a more effective and meaningful way, thinking about how these different uses may be supportive, a structured parking longer term versus just surface parking.

I

And then, ultimately, looking at informing the block, structure,, the transportation network, and some of the market economics., the next slide actually begins to articulate some different ways that development could occur in the area.

I

There was some concern among stakeholders that the transformation would happen, overnight, that the city was going to come in and, you know,, take people's property or force them to,. You know, change, uses.,.

I

And we've reassured folks that this is a 20 year, vision for the stamp area and development, really happening multiple ways. It could be improvements to existing buildings to accommodate existing or new uses. Adaptive reuse, infill of some of the surface.

I

Parking lots,, or maybe it is host sale redevelopment., but the brilliant beautiful part about the vision for this area is that even if folks decided to stick with what they have today.

I

It fits,, obviously we don't want everyone to decide that are the one big, you know, large transformation wouldn't be leveraging that public investment that will be required.

I

But, you know,. There is a place for folks who want to stick with some of the existing uses. Their existing form., lastly, would be height.

I

Really focusing the highest development that we anticipated, probably at the station just north of arapaho heading south. We transition to existing single family, neighborhood and and detached, single family.

I

So we would be stepping down rather quickly, two three or fewer stories.

I

But as we had north to the rail and across the flatiron business, park, stepping down to four stories and heading west to probably a three story, scale.

I

Next, looking at the transportation, mobility and circulation., if you have questions, gene and josh,, I'm sure we'll be able to answer those. But a quick highlight for you.

I

One of the things that we really want to do is leverage that transit investment,, not just on arapaho, but on 55th,. Looking at how do we make that more pedestrian and bicycle friendly and connecting folks to that and that person final mile.

I

A connected street network. really right now the street network, it supports the existing uses fairly well. But thinking about this vision about flex, residential mixed use, innovation, mixed use.

I

We need to think about greater connectivity, and access to ensure that we are creating a walkable likable place.

I

We need to think about curbside management, the about this mobility hubs on the map. Here you can see we began to think about a hierarchy of streets,, really building on the street standards and st classifications and other parts of boulder by introducing.

I

Some important nuances. so looking at, where do we have dedicated bike lanes along the major materials thinking about how do we create pedal bike connections where maybe a street does not know, you know,? It would not be planned.

I

So one important one would be a long kind of soda court., as I've mentioned earlier,. This idea of an activation street a really generous public realm,, creating a cafe seating zone amenities zone, buffering the sidewalk from the streets,, but creating a really.

I

Nice area, where people can bike in a mixed flow environment. We want this to be very slow, where people are having to engage with each other, and probably on street parking to support that retail and maker space next to the commercial street. Pretty similar.

I

And its configuration,, but we would not anticipate everywhere having those large amenity cafe kind of seating, zones.

I

The next is, I believe, the residential street, have a little leg here for a second.

I

Oh, here we go commercial street with multiuse path. thank you,, mark.

I

So this is something that we see in a couple different places: the multi use path, being in place of a sidewalk and places where we could fit that with a larger many zone where we might in anticipate higher volumes of pedestrians and bicyclists or those.

I

Using other micro mobility, devices, residential streets,, really having that nice flavor and character, with,, probably a little narrower sidewalk, but having tree lined streets again having on street parking for visitors,. And then I had mentioned that pedestrian.

I

Bike access and places that might not have traditional vehicular access, and so we've seen this be achieved in some more recent developments and other parts of boulder. But this would be something perhaps on the south side of the commercial on the south.

I

Side of arapahoe a budding the existing residential, a place where people and expressed a desire for new connections,, but not wanting motor vehicles. You know passing right through their backyards or next to their backyards.

I

Last piece for me, and then we just have a couple of slides on urban design- is the ability hubs. I wanted to,. I guess clarify because there were have been some misconceptions.

I

We're not talking about a big facility right at 55th and arapaho, in essence, they're, enhanced bus stops, serving the brt 55th and arapahoe,. We would. We would anticipate structured parking distributed throughout the area,, perhaps embedded a little deeper.

I

Could be a public parking structure,, but not right along 55th or arapaho.

I

Instead,, this would be a series of different elements, jean mentioned several of those the,. You know,, he bikes, the scooters,, but there could be mobility, oriented retail, thinking about enhanced pedestrian connections, amenities for those using a variety.

I

Of modes long term bike parking for someone may be coming from the existing neighbor to the south, wanting to use, transit or visit some of these businesses. So, along the top there, you can see a variety of different mobility hub elements.

I

And then along the left, we started to think about where those might be applied throughout the area.

H

It says j know they're just going to wrap up here at the few more slides,, really focusing on the quality of the space.

H

They get kathleen noted it pretty well when she was trying to,, which was describing the park west when you're, when you're thinking through planning applications. Only at that that bird's eye view you kind of lose a bit of the texture and the feel of space.

H

We want to make sure that, as we thought, through the implications of scale and volume and that that texture, right, the industrial identity and all those different aspects that we heard were were critical to this area and redevelopment. We wanted to make.

H

Sure we're thinking about it in a way that aligns with expectations for me development, but also contributing to those those more publicly oriented, communities, thinking about those transit stops and as enhanced transit stops and those mobility have elements.

H

And and the character of those spaces in between,. Thinking about improving that that current,, I think, presence, perhaps along some of those major obey. So looking north here on 55th, thinking about the convenience of of safe,, comfortable ministry and a.

H

In bicycle, traffic,, both north northward on 55th, as well as throughout the development itself, and we think about the extension of kind of soda.. That was a pretty critical piece as it relates to the activation street. So as we're looking as we're looking.

H

Eastward here, on kind of slogan, thinking about what the potential is for a new street to connect across 55th with redevelopment supporting that we want to think about the texture of the architecture. That's already there and help contribute to that,. That.

H

Unconventional personality right that that flavor of this particular area, thinking about being able to celebrate that industrial identity, while still providing opportunity for redevelopment that can impart from a district standpoint, help to support that.

H

Both financially and in the character. so with that, I'll go ahead and wrap it up.

F

Kathleen. yeah. thanks, mark., I'm going to pull up the questions.

B

See,, can we do we want to go to just general clarifying questions, first.

F

Yeah, yeah, we can, we can stay,, so we can all see each other and answer any clarifying questions. I think yeah,.

A

Great job on reading them. so yeah, I guess I was going to go ahead and look for hands, but jamie and kathleen is better and call on people.. We don't have the race, or we do have the raise hand function. I guess so. You can either use the raise hand, function.

A

Or raise your physical hand, and I'll call on the order that I received, see people,, so I'm john your hand went up, first. so, go right ahead and then let's try to keep on we're, going to try to keep it to 20 or 20 minutes. Actually, because we have another.

A

Section to go through so try to keep your questions kind of brief, and if you have, like, additional elaboration, you want to be saved up for the comments later john go ahead.

J

Yeah, thank you. as someone who's joined in a lot of the meetings associated with this effort I,, I appreciate kathleen's presentation, there. so, thank you.

J

I wonder if you could describe kathleen, how this fits into the city bigger picture in terms of what changes and impacts. this plan might have on the availability, for example, of industrial land within the city city wide,, so that we understand the marginal.

J

Impact on the city of of what we're proposing here.

F

Yeah, so, you know, and when we look at industrial uses in and how industry in boulder is changing., I think you know the plan really tried to first preserve that industrial, general industrial and entirely so for heavy manufacturing.

F

We still, you know,, have heard from the community that we want to place for that, and so the land use plan for east boulder preserves that that the other, you know,, maybe.

F

Different changes or other types of changes related to that industrial land and how they may impact the city overall, is we're increasing by a little bit community industrial land use and the amount of acreage that's dedicated to that type of land use.

F

And so that's really oriented towards smaller businesses. Smaller types of manufacturing, smaller types of industrial.

F

And we've located those,, you know where we try to preserve some of that, that existing space for that,, but also expanding that area for that, along places where they have great access to transportation, because that movement of goods is so important.

F

So then, you know that big change is the amount of light industrial land,, and so that's where we've made a pretty significant shift in the amount of acreage that's dedicated just for light industrial,, which today does allow you can develop residential.

F

And light industrial today., but it tries to be more intentional about how we talk about where the best places for integrating residential into light industrial are.

F

And so, changing and updating. I think that mixed use, industrial land use category to be pretty specific about what we want. Those places to evolve to look like and to include.

F

That's it., that's a change that I think will make a big difference in east boulder, but we can also start to think about,. You know, as we pick back up on the project.

F

How does that, that shift the implications for for uses in in specifically industrial zones for other areas of the city and are there other places in the city where we want to be really intentional about incorporating residential or retail and in a way.

F

That allows greater density.

F

And that might be when we start to really start to apply that mixed use, industrial and use category. so does that is that into your question.

J

Well, firstly,, I don't mean to monopolize the discussion here, but if I can just follow up with one additional factor or related factor. and that is, can you point to other examples within the city of successful mixed use, industrial residential.

J

Development that we could use it as an example for what we're dealing with here.

F

I think the place that people have gravitated to.

F

And that does have an excuse. Industrial designation is the steel yards area.

F

I would say it's probably have a smaller scale than what we're envisioning for each folder.

A

Right, sarah. thank you., our next and I think elephants on her hand. So thanks so much. and I'm going to bring my hand down in a second. sorry about that.

K

Um,, so these are two questions: they're, both numeric questions.

K

What is the breakdown in terms of dwelling unit types that are imagined for these anywhere from 20 602 4600, new dwelling units., and what's the projected number of jobs expected over time to be produced as a result of all this identification.

F

So,, unfortunately, I don't have those numbers for you and part of the reason that I don't have them, but that we had them under our scenario. Testing and not modeling is that for for these land use, recommendations.

F

We're breaking a lot of our existing rules, and the parametric modeling that we use is built off of our existing zoning. and so,. I'm the types of units,, and we tried to describe that a little bit in the, in the place. Types.

F

And, you know,. Some of the feedback that we got from the working group is it'd, be great to have images to go with those descriptions to give people a better idea of what those types of of homes could be. So that's something that we're thinking about adding,.

F

And then, similarly for the, for the jobs, numbers.

F

And I'm not able to project that because it's we've changed the rules, of, of how that space gets generated, and so I can't,, I can't model it quite yet..

K

Will you be able to model it over time because I would think from a planning, perspective.

K

That would be valuable.

F

Yeah, and that's part of., I think why we're trying to use these new digital tools, is. It will allow us to work back and forth to figure out how specific code change or how.

F

A type of parking requirement might shift the amount of space that we're able to provide might shift that unit count or shift the job. job projections.

K

Can I just follow up on that. I'm sorry, david,? I just it's a follow up, specifically to that question and it ties to john's question, which is, I would.

K

Are you going to be doing some,, maybe econometrics forecasting, since the value of the land is going to change with the opportunity for residential development and industrial areas, the value of the land is going to go up, and I think you would be, I'm.

K

Wondering if you're going to try and figure that out.

F

We, as of today,, we do not have budget for that type of consulting that. We would have to bring on a consultant to perform that, and there's no money allocated for that.

A

Okay, thank you., all right. alex, um,. Did you have your hand up before and then I think hutch also has his hand up, of you, and then mark.

A

Go ahead and unmute alex.

L

I didn't end up back. We go, oh,, you didn't okay, so I think how much have you go by hex right.

M

Right. um, I'm very sympathetic to the industrial themes that I was hearing., but as a non painting guy I'm on the tab.

M

I'm curious whether there's any, you know,, rent, number per square foot or any other attributes of the space,, which is basically required for our industrial stuff to survive and if so,, what is it and how does that factor into all these amazing looking.

M

Improvements we make, because it strikes me the spaces are probably renting for pretty much what they can get now and in boulders industrial marketplace. So I'm trying to think about the economics of the future industrial space,. If a whole bunch of improvements.

M

Have gone in in various ways. and who would be there. and if those actually exist or whether we're just not sure.

F

Yeah,, I might actually ask, rachel from ets, who's been working on the 55th and arapahoe station area from.

F

Market perspective to weigh in on that.

N

Definitely. thanks kathleen,, um so like kathy mentioned,, I'm an economic and planning systems and we're on the mit team., and we did the market analysis for the stationary a master plan. But the general market trends can be applied to the broader east boulder.

N

Area, and the industrial piece is, it's an interesting characteristic of this area and it's a great question- and this gets back to the first question as well.

N

There's a couple things going: on. one is the nature of the industrial uses in the area that building stock generally speaking, is older. Industrial and the tenants that are there are utilizing the space, but what we heard, we did to our secondary data research and then also interviews with.

N

With real estate professionals active in the area., and what we heard was that, once once, companies outgrow their space, and they leave the area, just because there isn't a space physically large enough for their use, or you know, newer industrial. The ceiling.

N

Heights are higher, the bay requirements are different, and, and the physical building stock in the area does, doesn't meet that requirement right now, and to your question.

N

If the building stock in this area is going to change, it's likely not going to be that sort of true industrial space.. It's just simply cheaper to build that space in, say, broomfield.

N

And there's also in terms of the users of the spaces.

N

There's, there's what looks like an industrial building on the outside and then there's who's actually inside it., and what we found is that a lot of the building stock in the area is actually being utilized as more of this flex space,, whether it's research.

N

And development.- your, your sort of fun functional office, space. and so the rents that you can get from a more office. Oriented user are higher. and so, who's in these spaces tend to be these more office. Oriented users who are paying more than an industrial user would.

N

Pay. and so when we look at the changes and we've done some, some redevelopment modeling to look at what what could go into these spaces with some of these mixed use, prototypes.

N

And generally speaking, you're,, you need a flex or a high pain office. User.

N

And then there's, there's the impact that new tech users are having on the market. and when you have some tenants who are just willing to pay more, and that's where to mark's earlier point during the presentation about no incentive for redevelopment.

N

The buildings in this area are performing very well,, they're generally pretty full and their commanding high rents without that much reinvestment,, because there is this demand for this older industrial space to function more as office.

N

And so that's a somewhat roundabout way to answer your question,. We do have numbers, and we did a market analysis for the sub community plan in terms of actual numbers.

N

You know, for the quote: unquote: industrial spaces,, it's sort of anywhere from 16 to $30, a foot or more, and if you're, if you're, building new or redeveloping, you're, looking at the high end of that just in terms of land and materials, costs.

N

To make the redevelopment work so and it is a challenge, it's,, it's a challenge throughout the city and this area is no different.

A

Mark,, did you want to go next. sure., thanks, um,? I take it from some of the prior questions that there is a assumption that, by having more density, will have more jobs.

O

And by having more jobs,, we have more in compute in computers,, etc.

O

So,, I think I look at it differently in the sense of.

O

Really the point of much of this change in zoning and I'm asking I'll ask this as a question of set. Isn't the point to by identifying vertically and providing live work spaces that we in fact, eliminate in commuting, while maintaining our economic vitality,.

O

For a broad range of businesses., and I think about what colbert has done for many workers who have discovered the joys of working from home, I've worked from home for over 20 years.

O

And for people who paint cars for a living, or repair bikes for a living.

O

They haven't been able to do that,, but with a really truly live workspace.

O

Suddenly, that's possible, and suddenly you eliminate commutes and enhance the life for a lot of people that, outside of kind of sitting in front of a computer screen tech work,, haven't been able to enjoy those kinds of benefits. So I guess my question is,.

O

Isn't that the point of really creating a broad range of live work spaces in this area.

F

And I would say, yes, you know,, I think that's a major component of the strategy and the idea of introducing residential and the idea of creating these denser neighborhoods, is to get some cars off of the road and really be able to provide people with.

F

Those options for maybe living down the street from their office,, maybe working from home, but being able to run down and grab a sandwich.

F

All of all of you know the benefits that come with kind of a more urban neighborhood are major components of both this strategy and, I think major benefits to,. You know, changing some behaviors around driving by yourself and your car to work.

D

A

Great. thank you,, mark.

A

gosh,. I don't see me hands up,, so maybe I'll just ask a quick, oh and then the pizza. um,. Can I ask first and then you're going to die.

A

So my question just was for gene sansom.

A

When I looked at the, the connection clan recommendations,, there were just a couple of things that are in the tmp master plan that I didn't see, and I,. I don't know if I should be worried about that. One that I noticed was one that comes up and it has.

A

Come up a couple times, which is a connection from that. a couple times, which is a connection from that. levy path into the central avenue park at the southern south.

A

Kind of eastern part,, as well as that northern connection and another one, is just out by the airport road connection from the bike park out to the backs of all those buildings that were still kinda.

A

So,, I just want to,, if you could just assure us whether we're giving up on those are. Those just didn't come up with something from this particular plan, and that we were still looking at them from the master plans or they're. Two separate separate views.

G

David, I'm glad you brought that up., so the connections plan. thank you, is not necessarily intended to identify all the projects which are currently in the tmp.

G

But one thing that I didn't mention the presentation is that we are doing a scrub, if you will, of all the 87 tmp projects that are located in the east, boulder said community. So, for example, you mentioned the connection to south brother creek to the multi.

G

Use path., what we're recommending to do is to consolidate those two one connection on the north and one connection on the south where, where they're feasible. So I know that planning board in particular, had to address that issue with the development review that.

G

Through, and the issue of being able to cross that levy was one that prevented the construction of that multi use path.. So that is an example of where we are identifying those changes that we need to make to the tmp to ensure that we can continue to advance.

G

The intent of providing, for example, connections between the father and business park and the south boulder creek multi use path,, but do so in a way that we know is viable, and then I would say the same. For example, the connection up.

G

I think you mentioned one to airport boulevard,, part of which is being constructed, part of which is being reevaluated today to understand what some of the more viable connections might be around the airport area. Given some faa restrictions.

G

So what you're going to see as we continue to work through this and thanks for bringing this map up,, is you're going to see a list of recommendations for changes that we'd like to see made to the tmp you've seen some of the additions that we would like.

G

To make to the tmp., and then there are a series of connections here we go that we are recommending to be removed, either again, because it was not considered a feasible connection, or you'll notice. Many of these connections- north south connections, to the.

G

East of 55th north of arapaho, which were part of what was called the east arapaho connections, plan. a plan that was developed several years ago, but was not fully vetted by property owners and the community and was not in fact accepted by city council.

G

But had somehow made its way into the tmp so again we're looking at a lot of cleanup.. So I would say thank you for paying attention to that and if there are specific projects that you don't see, either in the list of changes or those to be removed or amended.

G

Please continue to let us know so that we can stay on top of that.

A

Right,, thank you and I'm sure tab will be reviewing those going forward to, and I just I wanted to hear that. you too, and thank you so much on the pizza. You will next and then we're going to go with georgie.

P

Okay. so, um,, I think acting was the person who made the statement about that. You felt excited about going and breaking rules, and I'm in,, I'm in.

P

Intrigued, but why rules you were not willing to break. so, I've been trying to get at what has been the criteria that release, you know, is central to you in this project and that's my first question. So.

P

Was there something that you were not willing to do in this exercise.

F

You know, that's a great question.. We haven't gone through.

F

I would say a really comprehensive evaluation of the,. The coaching changes that we would be making., but I think, you know, the pieces of the comprehensive plan that spoke most to this process, and that was most consistent with what we heard from the community.

F

Members, and was really you know that the description of design quality and the commitment to 15 minute neighborhoods and. and I think, you know we are really looking for opportunities to advance some of our climate goals in this area.

F

And so those are probably the, the, the pieces of the comp plan that stand out in my mind.. I think the, the, the challenge, the biggest challenge of of the community process and.

F

Determining how far the community wants to go related to our housing, goals, has been.

F

The one where I think the working group and the community has displayed really a pretty wide range of opinion on whether or not they want to have a kind of new housing in this area and change. A lot of industrial and versus maintain all industrial and.

F

And have no new housing, and so that that's the one that was, I think, the most challenging to find the sweet spot. For.

P

Okay, so I have other questions, and maybe maybe I'll just ask one more and then if we have a chance,, we can come back but, um,, so in more direct way or succinct. Way.

P

Um, this question already came up in terms of how does this project specifically can help us address our,, you know housing and work, or jobs, imbalance.

P

That has most kfc have must have happened in the discussions that might come up,, because that that is one of our biggest challenges in the city.

F

Yeah, absolutely. and,, you know,. When we tested those scenarios in the fall under our current code, we had really significant jobs, projections., and I think that the number of jobs in the area almost doubled.

F

And also, you know, pretty significant increase in housing units, so there's only 313 homes there today there's 17,000 jobs. and this plan,. You know brings.

F

I think an average of 3500 new homes to the area so we're not even with the number of jobs, but I think what we heard from the community was that,. Creating a one to one ratio in this area of the city is not what we're going for.

F

We do want this to continue to be a job center,, but we're strategically trying to integrate those housing opportunities to give people an option to live in each folder and support some of the existing businesses in workforce that are there by providing.

F

Them with, with an opportunity to live near where they work.

P

So just know that I get. I I'm clear on the approach that you guys taking, that your floor is not korea, more jobs that will increase our imbalance.

P

That's your floor, making sure not necessarily doing you help us close the gap that we have, but you at least one increase. It is that,. Am I interpreted, I don't,. I don't think that that's a no. I don't think that that's a characterization that that represents.

F

Represents the land use changes I think, from some of rachel's work, and from what we know about how industrial space is changing and being used.

F

A lot of that larger warehouse space that maybe at some time, you know supported 10 jobs, can support significantly more and I might ask rachel to weigh in if she has thoughts about that. But you know I do think that with increase density and with redevelopment.

F

In this area,, it's realistic to expect there to be more jobs here in the future. okay, so,. So we're not saying that, but I just want to be clear in which you are guys taking us in,, you know,. I think that just to be clear,, we want to go in this direction.

P

And you're taking us that direction. I just want to be clear,. That's how I'm reading this.

A

Will we can also discuss that when we get feedback as well? Let me give jersey a chance to ask a question and then we'll see if we want to do double dipping based on our time, because we're over 20 minutes now so, go ahead.

E

George yeah,, thank you, and the peters questions were along kind of the same line that I was going to go.

E

So I wanted to understand a little bit more, maybe rachel you can elaborate, because I heard you talk about how industrial is being used for office.

E

And I have great concerns about that, because it does two things number one: it displaces ultimately industrial, because those, those renters can can pay significantly more.

E

And then, and then obviously the density of that office space. I thought mark painted a beautiful picture of a bike: mechanic, you know, living and working here,. But then I heard rachel, talk about how this industrial space is really being used by high.

E

Tech office. and so I'd like to understand that difference, and also kind of go back to what peter was saying. Around. currently,- and I heard you say about 3500 homes, added, and potentially double the amount of jobs is sort of a general ballpark is that,.

E

And that's two separate questions, so maybe I'll start with the question to rachel is, is how this space is being used and how do we make sure as a city,, it's being used for industrial and not high tech, office.

E

Are there are there land use or zoning things that we can do to prevent the escalation of ramps to prevent that dense suffocation of this industrial space? That's you know more suit me. Maybe communities,, looking more towards manufacturing, manufacturing.

E

N

Yeah,, that's a great question and that's sort of a realm of ideas that guided a lot of this analysis.

N

There's a couple components of that. One piece, is, is what the market is already doing. and part of that is just,. You know what industrial space in general is doing to my point earlier about the the physical nature of the space, and the industrial space.

N

In this area works for some users that sometimes.

N

They're growing they're building, but that there just isn't physically the space for them in the area anymore and that's when you see them move,, maybe to done barrel more likely to mama long, monitor, broomfield just that physical space, then there's also.

N

The functional space, and that gets to the older needs of the building stock, and that's a lot of times. I'm concerned the market evolution perspective. When we see these other sort of alternative user tenants come in because there is that older building.

N

That's at its base keeper not really functioning for the originally intended user anymore and can be repurposed.

N

And there is this, this tension between the sort of long standing, industrial nature of the area, and the way the market is moving with these now., I'm not always office users,. Some of them really are flex users where they need sort of build larger spaces,.

N

The higher bays and they're doing r&d they're doing,, they need,, you know manufacturing, space,, say, and part of how we're getting at this from sort of a policy perspective is looking at what what the area looks like and how we innocence. Curate. Some of.

N

These really important so one of the ideas that we're looking at as a district for a number of functions,, part of which is parking,, but also looking at what what these first four uses our and can be encouraged and keep and preserve. Some of the smaller,.

N

More industrial users to jay's earlier point about these makers at this maker space.

N

Because that that really is one of the biggest opportunities in this area, the large scale industrial users for better for worse, are likely to migrate out. Just it's just the nature of the evolving market.

N

At the end of the day, the land values in this area are too high to support.

N

Traditional industrial use., if you're, if you're redeveloping the you, know the rent per square foot, you can get for an industrial building versus an office or flexibility,. You just don't support development,, given the land value in the area.

N

But how can we keep some of that industrial nature of the space, through curating, some of that first for space,, creating affordable, smaller scale? Industrial for those startups are small businesses to start and eventually maybe they will grow and have.

N

Move out, but but maintaining that character in the area. so,. Does that mean that the uses the land uses that we're talking about.

E

Include office as a use.

F

Yes, office isn't allowed to use.

F

And I, I don't,- I don't want to give an impression that all of that industrial space in east boulder is being used for office. There really are artists in the area, falafel king really does manufacture home this year,, and we have a lot of catering, companies.

F

And these are users that.

F

Can make smaller industrial space work, but they need high ceilings. They need some of these h back requirements and those are the types of things that we can control through our code, the size of spaces, the heights of of buildings, of floors.

F

And then, you know,, the use table project is is a place where it, it's possible to get into the details of really specifics about. What's allowed or not allowed and different types of zones.

E

That's that's helpful,, I guess, and I'll stop and let someone else chime in, I guess, my,. My concern is: if offices categorizes the use, here, and rachel just said the highest and best use his office.

E

And this is a 20 year plan.. How does this ultimately just not migrate to high rent high tech office,, if that's permitted in this us.

F

And I think it's a threat,, but we have to be really careful. About, you know, preventing office from using some of these spaces and office workers make up a really important component to our local economy.

F

And also,- and there are maybe smaller businesses, creative businesses like architects, or advertising, agencies that need smaller space needs smaller office space, and when we restrict those uses, they also have nowhere to go and the area. So it's a balancing.

F

F

and, you know,, maybe as rachel said curating, those office uses, is really important.

F

If I could say chime in really fast yeah, absolutely jay yeah one example that we are very familiar with is essentially side in portland.

I

They've actually gone through pretty nuanced zoning, regulations, whereby.

I

There's a certain flavor of this industrial makes us that does allow kind of full flex, you know, office and industrial, but there's others where industrial does have to be. The primary use and office is subservient to the industrial, so you're gonna have.

I

Office and has to be an office, that's in supportive and industrial use.

I

What they have found and what we're thinking about, at least with a stationary area, is that the industrial uses.

I

While there are some examples,, you can find that may be going vertical with industrial. You know. Second, third storey buildings, smart, sort, of, harkening way back to some of the industrial.

I

Most of that desires for the ground, floor, space., and so what we're talking about with the stationary is being more restrictive on the ground, floor, and then being more permissive on the upper floors, where maybe there is multi family, residential or office.

I

Allowed in the upper floor, spaces.

A

Thank you. um,, so we are almost to 30 minutes. Now.

A

Are we okay for looking back? I john and sarah, each have want to take a second.

A

That's me: okay with that. and then we'll. Hopefully we can move on to then the questions.. So john, why don't you start.

J

J

this is a for kathleen night,. I know that in the meetings that were held in association for this project., there was quite a bit of discussion about whether to devote housing area to what we call missing middle or whether to focus more on providing stacked.

J

Flats for affordable housing.

J

Of course, that leads to very different outcomes in terms of both the type and the quantity of housing, supply.

J

Can you talk about the status of that distribution. yeah,, so we, that the working group really pinpointed locations in those areas of change where they thought would be most appropriate to fill that missing middle category and provide those types of homes.

F

And so that thought is built into those neighborhood descriptions, and the place type performance, standards.

H

J

Just to follow up real quick. so, is what's in there now is that the the staff recommendation about what sort of the nature and distribution of housing that should be developed, here.

F

Yeah, I think, um,, you know, we're working on all of this material every day, but I think we're getting closer and closer on those place, types to be pretty solid and our recommendations for how that gets, mapped out and what the standards include.

A

And sarah,: do you want to super super easy question.

K

The train stop the train, stop. Is it 55th, and just sat just north of kind of struggle or 63rd, which was my recollection of where it was originally going to be.

F

So, yes., originally, I think, planned for 63rd and as part of this sub community plan, a recommendation is that we would consider either adding to or moving that station to 55th. But I might let james hansen talk a little bit more about that, because she's.

F

Involved in the northwest real study. sure. thank you. yeah,, so just real quickly,. There is a renewed interest in motivation. at the state level and by rtd and potentially amtrak to look at a peak service commuter rail sooner rather than later..

G

Between denver boulder in longmont, that peak service would include one station in boulder and that would be located at boulder junction.. The idea is to try to build something that might, that would be less expensive than the full build out with more.

G

Stations such as one out in east boulder, so the idea is, if and when rtd and other partners are looking to construct, a, the full build out of northwest rail and we would like to see a station east boulder area,. We would like to look at the area around.

G

55Th,, as opposed to 63rd, that's the recommendation and but there's a lot of as much of our transportation stuff. There's a lot of assumptions in there there's assumption of money. The assumption of.

K

Right, okay., just as long as we know. thank you. yes.

D

Right. okay, well, I'll go ahead and share my exciting little thing that we're going to jean and I are going to use here. so, what we have three key issues that we're going to go through now. I think, before we have a presentation on public outreach right.

A

For the in the fall., so we thought we try to keep everybody on their toes and start with a random person and then go through an alphabetical order and gene,. I don't know if you noticed, but robert hutchinson wasn't in the list, because I wasn't sure he.

A

Was going to be here so if you could add him between john gusto and mark mcintyre's, I'm spinning the wheel.

A

And the winner is.

A

alex., so alex you will lead us off.

A

Q

Since,, no, it's georgie! When one past you alex sorry about that., we're gonna start with georgie and then we're going to go through and then I probably won't bother to share the next time I spend unless people really like to look at it.

A

So, with that, gene go ahead and put up the key questions.

B

That's kind of the key questions, but I might suggest that we do a short break.. Oh that's right! Thank you for reminding me. Let's do I break and we'll reconvene at 747 10 minute break.

N

A

A

Oh,, I will fix that., but I guess I'll have to display the spinner again.

A

A

E

Jane, if you're still there,, would you mind putting up the questions while we're still on while we're on break.

B

B

Sorry, georgia was that for me, okay kathleen's got that great.

A

Thanks. glad you heard that since jordan, who's going first call.

A

I can't believe I forgot the break, so I get I get so into this zoom world. It's like,, I just, I,. It isn't intentional. I know I'm supposed to be trying to do more frequent short breaks,, but this was,. This has been such an interesting conversation. I think.

K

Was the right was the right thing to do.? Well, good did a little longer than usual five to seven minutes. So that's good.

A

Junior okay, I've been calling on people and we're gonna once we're all back together I'll just hand it over to you and then I'll spin in between.. That's fine.

B

Yep. so, that was it.. I think we just to clarify the intention that we would go question by go through all of the land use con comments first and then move on to the connections, comments right and then I'll spin, the wheel between women, too, and between.

A

Two and three. okay. and then we can play this winner for the last spin. So that would be the fees that I.

A

Thought I'm sorry about that.. I actually I typed in all the names without like looking at anything, and so I'm surprised, I'm there might be other typos in your mouse.

B

David you'll have to send me your the link for the spinner app. I like it should roll it's just like it's just like this silly website and all you do is you put a list of things in and it makes the wheel immediately.

A

A

I've used it for nonprofits for like raffles, for nonprofits to raise money.

K

It's like one of those icebreakers for when you're, not actually in the same room.,.

H

I too would like a link to this.

A

I'll send it., I don't think it's considered a serial meaning if I send out a link to a website. right.

A

So awesome, I think, we're all starting to continue looking for cameras to go back. On.

A

So let's go ahead and. and then, jean, jean will lead us them through the key questions,. We'll all go all answer to try to keep our comments down to. As close to you know one to two minutes, as we can.

A

I know that there's a lot to go through and jim go ahead and take it away.

B

That's awesome,, great. and so we'll start with georgie and then followed by tila and dave, and then john crystal.

E

So first question do board support the recommended land use plan.

E

I first. thank you for the presentation.. It was was really interesting and I think the work looks and sounds great.

E

I sort toward the tail end of our conversation and kind of got to the meat of the issues that that I have on on land use, here.

E

And that, while it sounds and looks great, using the term industrial,, I think, in order to for me to be supportive of it.

E

I'd like that definition of what light industrial is to be much tighter.

E

Because what I hear the market doing versus what we intend, as a community may be different.

E

And if the highest and best use of this light, industrial is high tech office, and that is a permissible use within this space.

E

I have no doubt that it will migrate towards that. and that we will, we will exacerbate our jobs, housing imbalance and we will continue to eliminate the industrial light industrial that the community desires, here.

E

I also heard, you know,. The increase in housing,, I think, is great from 313 over 3500 homes.. But again, if we are potentially doubling or more, the jobs that will or could exist, here, then we're taking boulder backwards.

E

In, in what we can do as far as in commuting. and while, you know,, I understand that some people will now be able to live on site.. The net effect to boulder will be detrimental on a community standpoint,, as well as the overall imbalance that this would.

E

Create. and so the,, I guess I'd like to separate the ideal from,. What will happen, and try to isolate what could happen and make sure we address it.

E

Before we, we just idealize what light industrial could be. Here.

E

That's,, that's my response. thank you.

B

Thanks georgie.: how about sheila.

R

Hi., thank you for the presentation and especially for all of the background information at the end of the packet, all of the, the detail on the, on the meetings,. It was really informative and shows how long and come in this process has been I'm here tonight.

R

Mostly looking at the transportation side of things, I had very little to say on the land use, except to say that I do support this proposed plan.

R

I am sensitive to sort of some of the nomenclature being a little dense. and when you hear something like mixed use, industrial you expect it to be industrial uses and to sort of exclude kind of office uses. I think that's a fair critique.

R

And it might just be a mistaken labeling, but not really.. I do think that there has been some expression of preference to keep some light industrial uses, but it also includes a whole lot of service industry, things that are hard to define. So this is definitely.

R

A step in the right direction and in particular, expanding the use of mixed use, development in general. I think that's something that's sorely missing.

R

Throughout boulder and to the standard, this will increase flexibility of thinking, flexibility of permitting flexibility for for using spaces differently and less rigidly than in the past. I think this is an excellent step in the right direction.

B

Thanks sheila., okay next day and and then jen crystal and then hutch.

A

Right. well, I'll just say: that, yes,, from a from a land use perspective., I'm generally supporting this land use is a higher level designation and we are defining new categories to meet new demands and new times. The concerns that I'm hearing are valid.

A

And so I think that it will be important as we as we go forward, to try to get more granular.. I think that the place types were a step from the last time we looked at the plan that was pretty informative on that and then, of course that raises more questions.

A

Because it is more important, more informative., so when we see place type suddenly we're seeing some of the visions of what can go in there.. I do think that with place types, perhaps we can start looking at a little bit more granular percentages of different.

A

Uses that we'd like to see and and the out of those place types I assume that will have new zoning districts,, not the existing set of zoning district. So we have some flexibility to maybe address some of these concerns of oh gosh,. We don't want 80% office.

A

Space in these buildings, we want, you know, 40% or something so to try to, to try to get,. You know, get a little bit more precise on on the percentages of the different kinds of uses, we'd like to see and then look at the mechanisms to drive that.

A

But mui is makes sense to me.. Mutod is something that we've sorely needed in this city. Transit oriented zone is a wonderful thing to see in this city.

A

We don't have it yet and places that are looking at how to center appropriate density, around development or transit for doors or happening all over the world and over the country, and I think it's great that boulder is taking that step.

A

And I'll leave it at that for now.

B

Great. thanks, dave,, okay, I'm john and then hutch.

J

J

well,, I have to say, that,, I think, george made excellent points and in general I,. I agree with his thoughts on that., my concern, as,, as my colleagues on planning board, no longer with what actually happens in industrial areas when they get developed or.

J

Redeveloped and the latest example was in the gun barrel, alley area celestial seasonings,, where we saw what is intended intended to be a,, an industrial area, being developed for a purely residential project.

J

And given the, the use, codes, we,, we didn't have any control over that.. We have to allow it. and I think that's exactly what will happen here,, either with in terms of residential or office uses in what's,. What is called here? Mixed use, industrial and.

J

And so I think that that has to be much more firmly controlled.

J

Before I would be willing to support the land use plan that is being proposed, here.

J

Secondly, another concern I have is to be more explicit about how the residential activity takes place.

J

And I'm particularly concerned about the decision about how much it's devoted to to high density, stacked flats type developments and how much might be allocated to what what we call missing middle type. Developments,. Because I think when people talk about.

J

Live work situation, and they talk about people living in this area and working in this area.. We have to provide, if we're serious about that, we need to provide the sort of housing that the people who are working in this area, would, would seek, and that.

J

Is I think, in, in many cases, what, what we call the missing middle.

J

So I'd like to make that point.

J

And thirdly,, I think that we have spoken in very general terms about both the development power plant area, and, and, again,. We've almost not spoken about what happens in the airport area, both the airport itself directly, and the area surrounding it,.

J

Which is now, primarily industrial, and I have no problem with that., but I think we should.

J

That should be explicitly discussed in the land use plan and we haven't talked about that tonight, or, or very much in the past, at all. and with respect to the airport itself.

J

I'm very aware that that the city has commitments to the faa that it needs to honor,, but we're talking about what happens in the long term.. And we need to have some explicit discussion about what we think is going to happen at the airport. In the long.

J

Term., I'm not saying that we shut it down within the next 20 years even,, but this planning effort is supposed to be thinking about what happens over a period of longer than that.

J

And thirdly, at the.

J

Or maybe I'm on for now. the power.. We have talked in very general terms about the desirability of. eventually, having that facility as some sort of a cultural or arts facility, among other things,, and I think that's, that's an excellent idea,, but in those discussions, we need to be aware.

J

Of both of the cleanup concerns of the power plant, and also the fact that the water rights in the lake. that makes that area, very attractive will probably continue to be held by public service or excel, until they sell it. When they decide they don't.

J

Need it anymore. and that could may lead to a big change in in the nature of that area,. There's no more. more, like their baseline risk for no sorry, not baseline risk for but belmont life.

J

So those are just a few of my concerns is john okay, hi cheer up,, followed by mark,, and then the pita.

B

Still here., and do we want to take the questions down just so that we can see each other a little more, and make folks know what those are,, at least for the rest of this round.

B

Fine. okay. all right,. How much of your here you can go ahead,. You cannot unmute.

B

Okay, we'll circle back and give her a turn.. Perhaps he just stepped away for a moment. mark. Are you ready.

O

I am. great., I'm gonna break some, my own rules and not really answer those particular questions.. I just have a couple comments. first,. I really want to honor the work of staff, and the working group having been part of working groups that have taken 18 months, two.

O

Years to do their work.

O

I was always sensitive when people who were not part of the working group came up and said well, did you think about this,? Did you think about that and it's like? Well, yes, we did.

O

So anyway, I,. I think that what was presented here represents a tremendous amount of work, and I'm generally very supportive of it.

O

Regarding connections,, I talked with gina little bit, gene.

O

Some today a little bit about this and I spent some really time. I spend some good time with the maps.

O

And I've come to the conclusion that what I've really worked for me as a transportation advisory board member would be super helpful, is to show a simple map showing all of the non automotive connections.

O

Currently, with the gaps highlighted.

O

And then, a subsequent map showing how we would treat those gaps and the gaps might be segments that are missing or the gaps might be areas that are too large to large an area without a cycling, transit, pedestrian, connection.

O

I find the current mapping to be really hard to be really challenging,, even for a map guy to kind of get my head around, what,. What it means is this something is going to be built, or not. So, anyway,, I would ask,. Can I just get not going to get to the.

B

Connections: question next.

B

this one, and then you., you weren't. You were going to break your own rules.

B

To keep us to land use right now and we'll do connections.

O

You know I did this last time I answered. the other. Questions on the screen is ok.

O

All right, I'll get the land use,, forgive you., okay, sorry. well,. You can skip me on connections. okay. in trying to get us done on time.

O

In regard to land use,, I spent some time with the plan, looking at this, and looking at it in light of the city's latest climate commitment,, which is 70% reduction from 2018 by 2030..

O

That's eight years, and I don't see under the land use.

O

Design here, serious commitments that change the built environment in ways that are quantifiable by saying how many more., if we build this,, how many more bike head, transit, trips.

O

Are we able to shift from vehicles from single occupancy vehicles or other vehicles, how what what will this do to our bmt.

O

What will this do to induce bike, pat transit trips,? How will this.

O

These land uses house workers that are currently in commuting., and so I see this in, in many city documents where we have. We have these really aggressive goals and and our current on our current plans and plans and documents that are under construction,, don't fully address.

O

Our climate commitment and that's,- that's my single biggest criticism of land use connections, every aspect of this is that it doesn't seem to take into account the latest urgent commitment of the city to reduce our greenhouse gas emissions by 70% by.

O

B

Thanks, mark., okay, loopy, then sarah then alex.

P

Make sure first. we can hear you. hello, peter. sorry,. I forgot, I press the wrong button.. I want it to be unmuted, not missing my face, sorry about that. I was here.

P

Um, so yeah, I think I spoke a little bit in the line us. I am a little bit concerned actually more than a little bit concerned. I am seriously concerned about the direction in which a project like this takes us by looking at the line, use that allow us to.

P

Increase the gap between our,, you know housing, needs, and the job creation,, also in terms of the light or the industrial use,, which is been in our conversations in the last few meetings. Repeatedly,, because we becoming increasingly concerned that those.

P

Spaces are becoming fewer and fewer,, and I think it's becoming a little bit more urgent for the planning board, at least some of us to become a little bit more protective of it,, precisely because it comes up regularly and there's always a reason. Why? Maybe.

P

It's not okay here or there. It is okay here, but not in the future. So I think the future is here.

P

We need to be a little bit more concerned about the spaces that we have. and so,. I think, george. You brought up that specific issue in a way that I think everybody should be able to understand,, because having that.

P

Definition of industrial as office., I think we already seen what may, may very likely happen unless there are restrictions or some guidelines set in place.

P

I think that that's something that I think the developers as well as the city needs to kind of see our perspective,. I hope, because seriously from the, from a planning board member,, we try to look in the long range, development of the city.

P

And we are being having this challenge grappling with individual projects that oftentimes don't necessarily contribute to the vision that we want for the city.

P

And that our citizens want and half for the city.. So at some point somebody has to do the work, or the painful work., and so I I just want to be, you know, clear about it.

P

This is a very part, difficult piece to agree with,, because I don't think you take us in the direction that our city needs to go., and that is not even counting with my just talked about, with regards to a real challenges with climate change which,, as you.

P

Know, we're living in right, now.

P

Yes., I hope that's clear enough., so I think in my perspective, from my point of view.

P

It's hard to support the plan. Users is coming right, now, unless there's some clear guidelines.

P

But I think there's enough.

B

Okay,, thanks to peter. all right, sarah and then alex.

K

Okay. so, not surprisingly,. I have like a three page treatise that I wrote out that I'm going to try to get down to the number ones.. I will start with any proposal that includes the following statement should be seriously reconsidered, and this is a quote from.

K

Our own, our this project, mixed use, industrial neighborhoods, are not common in the united states.. There are a few places in the world that have successfully achieved integrating industrial and residential uses.

K

These are typically separated and are considered incompatible due to conflicts over noise potential smells or emissions trucking and access among other issues.

K

And yet, this is what a huge swath of our land use re designation proposes. I I'm,. I was really sort of stunned when I read.

K

You know, this,. This quote from our staff,, pointing out that this has been this doesn't work.. And while I really appreciate the staffs idealism that it could work.

K

I'm quite concerned that it will not work because it doesn't work.

K

And it points exactly to what george has said and what john has said and what peter has said about this mixing together of industrial.. Well, what we hope will be light industrial, but will likely be offices and residential,, but we.

K

So, I want to support everything. George said, I want to support everything. John said,. I want to support everything with peter said, and I want to make a couple of other comments that hasn't come up. Yet.

K

In this mixed use, industrial framing.

K

You are,, you have made the comment that the assumption is that will put a lot of permanently affordable housing in this industrial area,, and these industrial areas.

K

I am not really clear why, at a time when we're talking about racial equity and environmental justice,, we would be putting low and moderate income residents into what we hope will be light industrial areas. That seems to me to have completely missed the.

K

Point of these whole disk, all these discussions about fighting racism and trying to address systemic racism.. That's item number to item number. Three is a reiteration of what john said about missing middle.

K

In this case, particularly forms, I was really surprised during our retreat., when we were told by jay sudden that that are missing middle strategy as a financial one and not one about form,, but for matters,, and we don't have. We have very little between.

K

Single family homes and high density residential,, and we have to,, we must try to figure out how to get more missing middle forms of housing into the city and the east. Boulder sub community plan seemed to me to be an opportunity to do that.

K

But in fact, we have only a few small spaces where that's proposed.

K

We need much more of those forms throughout the east boulder sub community plan.

K

And those forms should not be limited to middle income. Families so should also be for low and moderate income families. They also want to live in houses with yards or townhomes or cottage courts or whatever the form might be..

K

And I think this all comes back to this fundamental challenge of in doesn't mixing industrial and residential,, and I realized, right now, I'm in washington dc and I've gone to see the home, all the new funky areas that have been built and they are a mix.

K

Of offices and residential,, but they are all very high, end.

K

They're very high end: there was no affordable housing there and it isn't. It is absolute gentrification.

K

And it's been going on for 20 years., so, what's being proposed is not going to produce affordable housing and it's, it's,. We need to separate out as much as we can at the most granular level that which will be industrial, that which will be office, and.

K

That which will be residential,, and we must do it, because we also have a problem in the skin in our use code in our,. I'm sorry in our code,, in which if, if, industrial zone touches a residential zone on one sixth of its boundaries,. It can become residential.

K

Residential is always a higher value than industrial, and we will just keep losing more and more industrial land. so, you know,. There are many things.

K

I know this is you guys have been working really hard. and I think in some ways what this gets down to is the granularity question,. But boulder has not been all that great, but super granular when it comes to individual parcels,. So we have pretty broad.

K

Definition, so this is would require you know these kathleen's framing, really changing the rules,, and I have a feeling that, because this has been driven and in because there's been a lot of voices from the development community- and you even saying here.

K

The change in the studies not likely to happen with greater entitlements,, a big part of what's driving. This is the idea of creating those greater entitlements, that should not be what's driving this,. What should be driving. This is what's in the boulder.

K

Valley, comp plan. and I am done. thank you.

B

Thanks, sarah. okay, alex,, you're up.

L

Yeah, having less experience with zoning and our land use tables, the visuals that you guys presented tonight really helped me develop an understanding of the land use technologies that I think he'd been alluding to in the past and I, that really helped.

L

My understanding and I would imagine, as you do, public outreach it'll, be beneficial moving forward.

L

I think the team's done a good job catering solutions that are unique for each folder.

L

Working in the sensitivities of boulder overall with the unique and changing land races out, there.

L

As things transition, so overall, yes, I am supportive of the land use plan.

L

One big hope of mine would be that, as redevelopment occurs, that access to that rely more on structured parking, then surface slots, or free on street parking.

B

Hey, thanks alex.

B

and if hunch is back., we can circle back and let him have a chance. if he goes on, I'll. Stop sharing my.

B

Which, if you're here and would like to speak to this., you can just unmute,. But if not, we'll keep going and we'll keep trying to rope you in on the next, and the next round.

B

Great. thanks, everybody.

A

Let me ask this: did,: did we want to have time for any of the things that came up to be addressed by the presenters, or should we keep going.

A

And do that at the end? How were you all thinking, did you want to say anything or just should we just keep going through the feedback at this point.

F

I think the feedback has all been super super helpful., I'm looking back through my notes.

F

You know, the only thing I want to make sure that it's not misunderstood or miss characterized is the idea that we are.

F

Locating affordable housing in industrial neighborhoods and intentionally as a way to produce that affordability,, and I don't,, I would not say that's our approach.

F

And our approach is providing a diverse mix of housing types in mixed use, neighborhoods to create 15 minute neighborhoods.. So I just want to make sure that that's not misunderstood.

K

I can respond to that. I was not saying that you're putting them in light industrial areas in order to make them affordable,, but you very clearly state, a priority of innovative mixed use as ample resident residential options admits the light industrial,.

K

Especially affordable housing., so it's just,, it's I'm,, I'm responding to. What's in the report.

F

A

Okay. great. well then, I'll, go ahead and with the correct spelling spin, the wheel for the next round.

A

And the winner is., I'm gonna, have to spend twice going to be judging him.

B

We said we don't get to go to you, don't get to go first, twice.

A

Now it says it's tila. okay, there we go.

R

I got confetti tonight. Yeah you get confetti.

A

For me,, I'm sure.

R

Okay, okay, so,. So this is the connections plan. correct, quick, and, yes, in general,. I do support the,. The proposed connections, plan.

R

I,, this is kind of where I was parking,, my thoughts,, similar to what mark had said about trying to be impactful. and really,. This is a large chunk, and an evolving chunk and a place to really change how we are approaching,, how we think about the city.

R

And how how people should be getting around or not getting around or what they should be expecting and their streets, because we have a chance here in certain places to just build it. Fresh.

R

At the same time,, I think some of the things in the connections plan, especially the,, the enhancements that were shown highlight places where we have not in the past, adequately thought about connectivity with different modes.

R

So for instance,, like the one of the enhancements- and I and I recognize gene said it- was a work in progress, but was better signposting between the multiuse path along south boulder creek and the flat aaron business park,. Because there's there's very.

R

Little activity now it's kind of long, been on on the books, as maybe hoping for one or two connections.

R

And those are very essential connections, because today, people not in motor vehicles and not in trucks, are scared off of 55th street., and so this is the only way for them to access that section and we've done a poor job of doing it and the fact that we.

R

Need to put signage, on the one existing connection which looks like you're doing the wrong thing.

R

It's a right,, the cyclists are left with the absolute drugs,. It's a drainage, ditch people,, which must mean it floods during bad conditions., and this is the only connection we've managed to build so far. That is a far cry from what I see as the aspirational.

R

Tone throughout this document about having, you know, flexible connections and connecting multimodal, and all these micro mobility devices in the new places.

R

You know the corner is between valmont and 47th and pearl, like the great that looks nice and permeable same thing with the station area. really permeable by these smaller modes,. But it highlights to me that we have failed on some of our existing infrastructure.

R

And I would really like to see more attention paid to fixing those past mistakes.

R

In particular, connecting to some of these office parks, or to the flat irons, business, park, more, more directly, more welcoming and more feasibly. so,.

R

And that highlights, another, I'm not quite clear on whether we are treating this as a 20 year planning horizon. when gene also says we're looking to rethink how we do the tmp, because the next dmp update is going to come much sooner than that..

R

And in particular I'm hoping that- and this is the same street I talked about on our last joint meeting- 55th street is a huge barrier,. It's a highway de facto highway and I can understand how it happened. That way was kind of on the edge of town before,.

R

But it is an untamed beast and I don't see enough effort right now in this connection plan to attain that particular beast. again with the with the new sections that we're building new connections and new roadways,, they look lovely.

R

I think that the variety of kinds of roadways and the different names are a little bit unnecessary., but it all tends to just obscure the fact that we have a many headed hydra running right through this plan and it's called 55th street and just to say.

R

We recommend a corridor study for it to fix it, make it a complete street at some point in the future is deeply unsatisfied.

R

So I'm hoping to rethink refit 55th street sooner.

R

It should operate more like,, you know, a definitely a corridor or definitely an arterial roadway, but not the scary thing that it is now because there's no reason to think that this micro mobility product pilot that we're about to start it's going to go.

R

Well., I think my last comment is that the focus focus on micro mobility, fleets and these transit hubs, these mini transit, hubs., pretty interesting thought.

R

I believe that they tend to overlook the use of privately owned micro mobility devices that we're already seeing on our streets and so to focus on them as being part of a b cycle fleet. Or,, you know, part of the city of boulder sponsor program is overlooking.

R

The fact that they are revolutionary, they're, affordable, they are on the streets. Now they are coming,, there's a massive influx of inventive power going into making the the batteries for such devices better for making them usable for different kinds of.

R

Users with different levels of ability.

R

and so to say that they're going to be prioritized on one or two little streets on the, on the corners is again,, highlighting our failure to accommodate them and can connect them using our existing multi use path, network or our arterial roadways. Where.

R

They're scared off now, so I think that we should be focusing as a much more.

R

Urgent matter on bigger changes that will lead us to bigger impacts toward our say, greenhouse climate initiatives.

R

As part of the connections plan because we're letting the big visco untamed right, now.

A

Really the next one.

A

all right., I'm wondering about the random. Was this field now.? I'm sorry we're almost in the same order, but anyway.

A

The everything that he said, I agree with a really great points. everything that tina said. I agree with a really great points. I,. I think I also.

A

And we're still early in the plan, so I understand that.. A lot of this stuff is still going to get worked out,, but I don't want to be too conservative, with regards to transportation.

A

If we do put in more car circulation in places like the stamp area.

A

I'd like to make sure that they're really de emphasized., that's not very many square blocks, and so people can go 15 miles per hour or less, and if they're in a car or maybe,, maybe some of them don't need to be open to carson, and really finding really.

A

Envisioning, how the pedestrians and the bikes, enter and exit one of the very important places they need to go is important. So just keep, keep thinking about all that circulation from emphasizing the pedestrian and and bike because, with the transit core.

A

Transit hub there were. our vision is to make it a lot more interesting and exciting to go without your single occupancy vehicle right so that that's the real priority is to make sure that that it's welcoming and easy for this new world, because you know.

A

With the time frames that were talking about a lot of these shifts are really going to be happening by them, so.

A

So, jean you are muted, but.

A

I needed before I started.

B

Alright, great I'm john you're, still you're up and then hutch and then mark.

J

Okay. well,, I think.. I agree a lot with what david said, and tila.

J

The,, the challenge here is not to be too conservative, but uh,. One of the things I'd like to point out is that I'm very concerned with making this area as much a part of older as possible, and right now, it's to some degree isolated, because of the foothills.

J

Highway. and very few crossings of that highway, there's,, there's a couple of bike tunnels and a couple intersections,, and it serves to physically isolate this neighborhood from the rest of older,. And I think we should be thinking about how we can do more to integrate.

J

It with more bike paths.

J

can processing the foothills highway.

J

for example, to, to make it more more integrated.

J

Beyond that, I can just say I agree with david until.

B

Thanks john hunter beer: here you can take a turn and unmute and speak, and if not, mark will get ready for you.

B

Now's, your time connections.

O

Well,, I don't want to repeat what I said.

O

mistakenly at the wrong time., so I want., but what I said about connections, still stands.. I just wish I had a better map to help all of us plan to make real connections, and I am the guy. I wrote down something about identifying those gaps.

B

And I think that's where a lot of this, this work is going.

B

Okay, I'm lou peta, then sarah and alex.

P

I don't have a whole lot to add about this. I I think that some of the people have brought some important points.. I didn't get to speak before, and sarah did bring up something regarding equity.

P

That was one of my questions, earlier, and my list,. Just in terms of making sure that some of the proposals we see going forward,, we are more deliberate in the way that we treat.

P

You know,, especially in this area, where we do have enclaves of some of our,, our more vulnerable company communities, where I think it will be a good opportunity to.

P

Include in this development elements that integrate this usually disconnected communities. and so, in the,, you know, breaking of rules. That will be one that I would like to see broken one where we do not segregate the other, but integrate the other.

P

And so, that that will make it.

P

I think, whether it's we're going through the transportation piece.. How do we know that? Why we're proposing will serve the needs of some of our communities within the city of boulder that maybe will not be able to afford a electric vehicle for example.

P

Just as a point of reference.

B

Thank you, look it up. okay, sarah alex and then george.

K

So I'll just I support what has been said, before, and will add just one thought, which is some of the micro mobility stuff,, which are really interesting ideas and obviously already rolling out both in boulder and crossing many places across the country,.

K

Aren't necessarily utilize can't can't necessarily be utilized by families., and we have to make sure that we figure out the first and last mile for people who are might have one or two children with them or an elderly relative or hat. You know it's coming.

K

Back from the grocery store and doesn't have a car isn't going to use a scooter, or a bike. and so,. We just need to keep that in mind.

K

Great. thanks, sir.

B

Okay,, I'm alex I'm george.

L

Thank this plan is a really good job of building a grid where there isn't one today. and that's really important for easing pressure on the nearby arterial streets and creating a more walkable area.

L

I think the network, as shown supports the proposed land uses,, it's rooted in best practices,. I feel like it's doing so without any planned extravagance or grand expenditures,, which is something I don't think we always achieve when we're doing visioning.

L

Exercises so I think that was really well done..

L

Sheila mentioned earlier: the importance of 55th street,. We have very few north south articles in town and they're, very vital for people, cycling and walking.

L

And so the that will be a critical next step after we've, we've looked at arapahoe, but we need to take a closer look at 55th, which I see is called out for a future quarter. Study in both this.

L

And in the tmp one nitpick within the current draft is the rendering for 55th street.. I think, as a retrofit accomplishes a little,, but it's not all that imaginative are rated and best practices for what we want to see. If we were to rebuild 55th, it shows.

L

Little payments and flex posts. and if we were to reconstruct that street., if we wanted it to align with best practices for safety, we would want to reconstruct it with a little safer facilities, backup curve for people walking and biking.

L

I hope to see the lowest low cost opportunities really called out in the 90%,, a draft of this and the implementation section by shining light on those. I think, it'll be easier for transportation. The mobility to insert those into coming cips, where appropriate,.

L

And one area, I see an opportunity for coordination, is.

L

It seems like we're about 10 years away from rebuilding east arapaho, at least that's what transportation leadership has indicated to me.

L

And so we could see some redevelopment in the area before then. and the placement of transit stops to something that I think should be coordinated with three developments.

L

And it could also be coordinated with our upcoming east arapahoe maltese path project, where we're going to rebuild.. Some of the bus stops out there.

L

And so, if we were able to determine the ideal, stop spacing and the placement of those stops, we could determine if some of those we that are out there today,, we want to remove them, and so there's no need to upgrade them right, now, or if there's one, that.

L

We want to be that we want placed in front of a future development that that developer knows that we want to do that. So I think taking a look. At. stop spacing and the specific placements sooner than later could benefit both this effort and that project.

L

Overall, supportive of this network and think it could be best communicated with a single map that shows not just the projects that have come up through this effort, but overlays those on top of the already plans tmp projects, perhaps that could differentiate.

L

Between the two., but seeing that total network, I think, would help the community, develop a better understanding of what you're trying to construct out there.

B

Great. thanks alex. okay,, george. I'll be I'll, be quick.. I don't have a lot of commentary on the actual plan itself, outside of sort of how the land use mary's with what's proposed.

D

My biggest concern is that is, is to mitigate in commuting.

E

And with the, the, the land uses it currently stands,, I don't know,. I don't like to understand the data around sort of this plan, kind of cover up mark had said in your first set of comments mark. I thought that was really interesting and enlightened around.

E

Just trying to understand all the data of how we're getting people off the road, how we're? How we're? How we're meeting our climate change, goals.

E

And I think that goes hand in hand with, with the land use and making sure that we don't have a jobs, housing imbalance here and so that's,. Those would be my sort of 30,000 foot comments.

B

Thank you. great, thanks, georgie. okay,. I think we are..

B

We are through the list for this question.

B

Dave, do you want to spin again.

B

B

You can unmute., I'm sorry. I was muted, I'm it came up with alex.

B

Alex are you ready to jump back in so? The third question is around the recommendations for the 55th and arapahoe station area.

L

I don't think I have a whole lot to add, but in addition to what I said about when we use and the connections plan.

L

One thought, I guess, is throughout boulder what a lot! What motivates a lot of our decisions is: preserving views of mountains or providing access to open space.

L

And I think one underutilized thing we we have, we don't do enough of- is provide public access to rooftops.

L

Seeing the success of avanti downtown. the longer waits for a table at the rooftop of the rio,, the public space on top of the site of the former daily camera building.

L

I think it'd be good to integrate some sort of either it's a public space or just places where customers have access to a place, with, with great views, and perhaps the best place to do that would be in the vicinity of the station at 55th..

B

Great, thank you., okay, and then up to george, and then tila and monday.

E

Can you repeat the question for me one more time I think I understand them push one.

F

Do support the proposed concept for the 55th and arapahoe station area.

E

So,, I think my comments first for the first question, are the same here.

E

So maybe you can just ditto me for for question. One. thank you., okay., great., thanks.,.

B

Okay, tila and the date.

R

Okay, I forgot to I'm in the wrong spot. um,. I, with the caveat that as mark said,, I guarantee what you see here is not what's going to get built.

R

It doesn't make sense to nitpick.

R

in general. I really really like what I see here.

R

and let me tell you a couple of things that I do like about it. As just things I hoping will, will remain.

R

I love the obvious permeability throughout the site, the cross plazas,, the places that people are likely going to be able to access on foot, and probably going to choose as walking paths on foot, or on bikes. And I like that, there's an understanding that.

R

Pedestrians and cyclists and other micro mobility modes will be using those things.

R

As I mentioned, before, I thought, having these four different flavors of streets was a little bit much.. I thought it was just too much categorization and not necessary..

R

And in particular, I really liked the idea of the activation street on calistoga court,.

R

If, if,, if I'm understanding it right,, it would kind of operate and feel like that. main street in the 29th street mall,, not that I, like the 29th street mall that much. But that seemed to be the kind of thing that you were going. For.

R

And I thought that just, you know, three or two blocks long on one axis was maybe a little too little, and so I'm curious about making it more of a district, and having one of the intersecting streets, the yellow residential street. That's I think, unnamed.

R

On the area master plan concepts. I'm looking at page one of three at 199 and the packet.

R

I'm trying to have more than just one activation street would help create a feel of a kind of a general area to be instead of just the one one spot to be in instead of clustering. Everything on one one drag.

R

The have one more thought on this. oh,: I appreciated the, the plan, multi use paths and trying to integrate those again. This is trying to avoid some of the mistakes that we've had that. I talked about my last, my last little rant,, because I think that this.

R

Is helping to to integrate multi use path, access across the site in the community, to kind of pinpoint.

R

When people are on smaller devices to pinpoint where they want to be they'll have the ability to kind of go right there, and I really like that. one other thing that I really like about this is you've tried to create a grid.

R

But in clear spots, you have offset some of the intersections so that it doesn't necessarily look like a grid from the road users perspective. It kind of keeps all users of the road and, in particular, the motor vehicle users, sort of a little bit more attuned.

R

To what's closer to them and what's right in front of them, because they don't have that, you know 2000 quarter mile view,, because they'll just have to navigate these things and that all of that kind of participates in creating a sense of space. Where you.

R

Have to be more cognizant of smaller people around you more cognizant of the near area and drive slower. and that's,. That's really good! So I understand it might not,. You know, end up being this final alignment, but those kinds of tricks are really great.

R

I note them- and I applaud that. and the final thing that I really liked about. It was planning for heavy vehicles and routing for them.. Instead of making the large you know, semi truck, that's delivering stuff, sort of the default design vehicle for all.

R

Of these streets, I think actually making it difficult for such large vehicles on some of the streets would be a desirable thing to do to route some of the heavier slower, lumbering, noisier, crappier, traffic, kind of on the perimeter.

R

I think is a wise move and something that we should be trying to do elsewhere in the city. Lots of cities have designated truck routes. We don't in particular,, but we're we're envisioning. Something like this with a lot of large transit vehicles and trying.

R

To concentrate some industrial and some, you know, retail, uses and things that will have some of this kind of traffic. To not say it all goes everywhere, all the time,, but to say certain times and places it's more appropriate.

R

I think you can accomplish with with broad designs like this.

R

R

I think that's about all I have.. I really liked the pedestrian bike emergency access street and I was kind of bummed.. It was just relegated to one edge. I understand why, but if you can, if we can see more of that, I would love to see more of that.

R

That's all I have. thanks.

B

Thanks taylor. okay, um,: how much welcome back, and we'll circle will circle you in just a minute. after a few other folks, and give you time and space to answer any of the questions that you'd like.

B

Since we missed your comments on land use and connections as well, right now or providing comments on the 55th generation, 55th and arapaho stationary, a master plan.

B

Okay, so I have dave john and then hutch.

A

Okay, thank you. um,, well, I,. I really love the comments that have been said so far.

A

I think that I.

A

I agree with dealers comments on transportation, completely.

A

So I won't keep any of those. um I love the pauses on the concept and I'm hoping that the outcomes can really, really have a lot of these smaller kind of places where people gather outdoors.

A

It really makes for some, some fabulous places so that that's really a great concept. one thing that strikes me looking at this area, that's going to be a challenge, and I want to acknowledge it is that they're, currently a lot of very beloved, a little.

A

And shops in along arapaho, there that, you know,, then this changes that segment pretty drastically. So I think the public is going to be a little bit nervous about losing their.

A

Is it pico mexican restaurant or there.

A

I think maybe backhoe a fix in advance in the desert. You know there's a lot of, lot of things there that there's an indian restaurant, there's a lot of nice businesses and people are going to want to see an evolution that won't cause us to feel like we're.

A

Losing our personality.

A

But I think it's the right thing to do in a transit corridor, so hopefully we can find ways to do it. Smoothly.

A

It is a little bit asymmetrical,, the south side being so close to residential. I see that we've gone with lower building forms to try to kind of taper down to residential, which is a little unfortunate, but I guess that can't be helped because we don't want.

A

To put the taller buildings too, close to the residential neighborhoods,, but I would just kind of try to see if we can, you know,, see how we can kind of make the north and the south side of arapahoe somewhat feel compatible with that challenge. Knowing.

A

That we do have that challenge that the south side gets closer to existing residential.

A

And I'll just take the opportunity to then reiterate one more time that I'm hoping that some of these concerns with things like housing, types and and mix of uses, can be ironed out so that we don't have quite so much reluctance because I,. I do think that.

A

That there are opportunities once you get a little further down into the zoning designations, to address some of them.

B

Thanks dave,, okay, I'm john and then hot.

J

Well,, thank you. I I agree with most of of what I've heard on this topic. in general, the,. I have no major problems with the physical layout that is proposed here,, both in terms of streets and and buildings in general,, but my concern is once again, the.

J

Classification of mixed use, and what what the ultimate fate of that will be given our experience. and so,, I would say, my, my comments.

J

Again,, as I mentioned, previously, to the concern, with,, not the physical form, but the use that is allowed in these buildings and to assure that it will continue to be a place where service industrial can actually be found,, rather than just be permitted.

J

And yet not found there.

J

I want to keep a tire store and a garage available to us in boulder,, and this is the area where it's most likely to be possible, unless we make it impossible, by our activities. Today.

B

Thanks. thanks john. okay, hutch, welcome, back,, hope, you're doing, I hope you're feeling.

M

Yeah,, I'm sorry, I don't have the same power for the whole thing at the moment,, because I think I can stay one hour lists and number damage ribs at the moment. But thanks for letting me come and go.

M

And if I make faces it's not because of anything, that's going on with the content of the meeting.

M

I only have two comments and they both reflect the things that just came up on the others. one is I'm resonating very much with with, like john said, that,. I think that unless we take some care.

M

The economics of an improved offer will make certain types of things, unavailable., and I think we have to think about what sort of what sort of structures enable that you know,. As.

M

It's almost as if boulder needs a slightly shady zone somewhere, where certain things can happen and where you know the artistic types can, you know feel more at home or wherever,, and I don't know what to what to do about that thought in the planning, guys.

M

Because the reality as soon as there's much in the way of amenities amenities are always scarce,. Everything gets built up., and so it's almost as if my wishes that within the overall area, since this is sort of our playground, zone, a little bit more than.

M

Other parts of town. we might even think in terms of sequencing, you know, okay,, this fit.

M

It really is it's time to get improved. You know these buildings are just about to fall down, and you know things are a mess here and the streets or disaster and their safety problems here and there and.

M

But over the over there will let go into genteel decay a little more before we do something.. So that's more philosophical point.

M

But I think the hard point in this is that there may be things that we did do kind of that actually do affect the facing of what happens where and what genuinely can can benefit from these things, and I like, when all these plans look like,, believe me,.

M

It looks great. and so,, so that's,, that's one topic. and I think the other,. The other topic is that, although I agree with somebody else, I think it was somebody on the staff that said look, this.

M

As we do, this planning transportation is sort of the service element,, but there there are ways in which, when, when things are very, very when they become multimodal destinations in particular,. This is there's a decent number of people hanging around.

M

Stuff springs up,, as long as there is some flexibility of the spaces to be allowed to spring up,, and so the the transportation stuff will drive some of the organic stuff.

M

And I'm not quite sure where that happens, but I do have my hopes around that 55th area that I think there's enough goodies that you guys are thinking about their core. That could be one of the things for just the patterns of where people are going to do.

M

Do some walking, and to me the key, is always walking, as soon as people are walking, you have a different interactive construct. You know you can nose into something when you're walking you can't nose into something when you're even pushing your bike, figure.

M

Out where to put the bike and whatever.

M

but we're basically creating a mini walkable neighborhood there or at least parts of it,, which means that parts of it need to have those capabilities, of,, of,, then putting in place.

M

Those niche and service businesses that are that are amenable to higher traffic, and I didn't. I'm not a kind of guy. So I don't know how that how and when that fits into this whole process,, but the interplay between the transportation,, particularly the.

M

Walking element,, including you know, when you get off your bike or your scooter, your micro mobility, vehicle.

M

The the walking thing actually drives that you know, and and as soon as you have a high walkability neighborhood, you know,, the data is in the value, goes up a lot. So don't try to put any low rent stuff right there and have walkability bit. It's not going.

M

To last, it's going to go high rent, whether you want it to or not.. So those are my two reactions on a high level.

B

Thanks so much. appreciate you hanging in here with us. all right,, I'm mark and then lupica.

O

So I don't, I don't have much on the transit hub,. I will say that the idea of smaller, more frequent transit hubs, is it mobility. Hubs, is, is like smaller frequent, more frequent bosses,. It makes things work a lot better for people.

O

I do want to emphasize that at 55th and arapaho that the to be our key station slash, mobility hubs, need to be flushed out with curbside management for shared viet for uber, lyft,, not that I'm an advocate of them, but that just let's just acknowledge that.

O

There may be, there will be times where people get off the bus and into a chair vehicle onto a shared bike onto a shared scooter.

O

Any number of things but,, so I would really like to see those design and fleshed out as as true little mini transit stations. I think the success in the before times of the new transit station.

O

At pearl and 33rd,, you know, that was quite successful until everything went to hell., so, anyway,, I'm excited by this whole concept: and, and the more frequent location, one block, another block that a user can walk a business user. I would like to see.

O

This as something that an out of town business user could end a business meeting. walk out with their briefcase, jump on a scooter,, go to the 55th and arapaho brt catch the bus east to the holiday inn in lafayette or wherever they're also they're going.

O

And and just skip the rental car.

O

that,, I think in the future we're going to see that sort of thing.. If we have these kind of accommodations, form.

B

That's it. thanks mark okay, let peter, and sarah,, and then I think we are.

P

I appreciate mark making the comments about the, the,, the visual mental vision that he sees. You know that will be using the space because I was kind of going in another extreme because that's really talking about you know like a business person and why.

P

They will do here and leaving the town. When I was on the, on the other extreme about,, you know,. How can we make sure or,? I will encourage the developers in our in our city to look at a space and how we can serve our families that are already here.

P

And so the envisioning a scooter. I have a hard time thinking about our family being served that way. So I would like to expand that vision to include some of the other demographics and know that our family types or resident citizens that are in now in.

P

Our city,, so that that will be something that I would like to see more off.

P

So one is about: how do we serve our families and now like it to be in a more deliberate and explicit ways.

P

So that I can all have that vision as well. and also with regards to what could be done to serve our sizable and highly esteemed nonprofit and artistic sector. And this community.

P

You know we haven't spoke about. This is a good opportunity where we can also do a tremendous good for the city, and their vision,, but focusing on some of this groups that are a vital and important.

P

Been vibrant part of our city that we don't often talk about, so I just wanted to bring those back into the discussion so that our vision becomes a little bit more comprehensive.

B

Great, thanks for pizza., okay and sarah., can you tell us stone? I was gonna say,. I think this would actually be the perfect place for the kind of public, private, arts and culture center. That you've heard the planning board propose as a way to address.

K

Some of the community benefits phase two conversation.

K

Because if you were able to build such a thing here, it would be a destination point for people not only from boulder, but people, east and folder..

K

So I just want to agree with the pizza that I think you should be planning that into this area. now. That said, I have some other comments. I'd like to make.

K

If I under, if I read the material correctly, essentially, the intensity level of development in this area would be similar to transit village,, which is very intense.

K

And I'd like to make sure that we correct some of the mistakes that I think we're made in transit, village.

K

First and foremost, trees, transit bill does not have enough trees. It's extremely,, I guess, urban is the right term, but it lacked, it's like this., you walk into transit village and it's a neighborhood,, unlike any other neighborhood in boulder. It's not.

K

A lot of green, not a lot of trees,, very uninviting and kind of boiling hot, and lots of canyons, and I think you want to get away from that. So more trees.

K

I off of what alex said, I'd like to talk about the opportunity for green roofs and that that's another way to utilize. Some of that space.

K

In terms of the place types that you've proposed to be honest with you,, they all looked like various iterations of the same idea..

K

And they were hard to distinguish, and I would write. I would urge you all to try to be much more clear about the differences.

K

It all looks sort of exactly like what you would expect from it kind of looks. Like a high end, america usa,, I mean all kind of look the same, and up with, you know, garage doors and anyway. So I would urge you to really try to differentiate what each of.

K

Those place types is really what's really unique about each of those places. Types.

K

I also want to talk about form based code, which was only mentioned briefly by kathleen, but clearly form based code is going to be part of the conversation for this area. Form based code is solely about making development, go faster, which is fine,, but it.

K

Has nothing to do with affordability and affordability? Is our problem, not design,, although design might be the thing that gets people interested in talking about projects in boulder,, affordability? Is our issue.

K

We need to figure out how to make sure that we have on site affordability in this area, and I would actually suggest that we contemplate a higher level than 25% of permanent affordability, in this area..

K

If we want to make mark mcintyre's idea of the, the bike, repair guy actually being able to live near his bike, repair, shop., the only way that's going to happen is if we have enough permanently affordable housing that he can either rent or buy,, and we got.

K

To go higher than 25%, I think in this area.

K

I just as a point of disagreement with david,. I think it's very important that we we lower the height, near the residential I'm here and say,, not to do it.

K

I'm not disappointed with the idea that we're lowering the height near the existing single family homes that are, that backup to the southern, the southern extension that we have added, even though it's outside the boundaries of the east, boulder sub community.

K

Plan that area behind there is actually small single family homes on small plots, they're the kind of single family homes that even a density advocate could think are great.

K

And I wouldn't want it, wouldn't want us to create a conflict with that neighborhood.

K

And I guess I have a question,, which is really how would the actual station be paid for quick? I guess I'm not really clear.. How were the funds for something? That's a lot of a place would be paid for.

F

And I might ask, jean samson or jay rankin to talk about our concepts are on the district and implementation for the station's.

I

You want to speak to the brt improvements first. yeah,. I can speak to the physical brt improvements in the phasing and timing of that particular project..

G

So, we're still in the very early stages of designing the brt system for arapaho, and next year. We will be initiating a project in coordination with the car department of transportation, and it is a state highway to move from the concept plan that we had.

G

In the east arapaho transportation plan to a preliminary engineering design,, which would include the actual design of the station, and when I say the station, I do mean the bus platform so the best platform and the amenities that we would want to see. At.

G

Those best platforms. and then we have to go out and get funding for that. So I'm rtd doesn't have a heck of a lot of funding at the moment.

G

We have seen,, we are going to see a big infusion of money through the state, with senate bill to 60 passing and our largest transportation funding bill and getting signed by the governor. So you know I am optimistic that there will be funding opportunities.

G

To not just build the platform's themselves, but also to find the funds to operate, to purchase and operate the vehicles for the brt system. and then, as that, relates to sort of the other types of amenities,. We would want to see at that particular station.

G

Or bus platform,, all at j, speak to some of the conversations we've had about how to move those mobility hubs. Forward.

I

Yeah,, so the kind of the bigger idea would be- and I think rachel maybe alluded to it earlier- but a district.

I

Does nation and so there's a lot of different types of districts that can be put in place in the state of colorado.

I

Metro districts are frequent, one for a large scale redevelopment, but there's also general improvement districts and all the flavors.

I

And so the idea would be that there'd be,.

I

Or the purpose of the district would be that as part of the development and part of the development fees that we would look at parking.

I

So parking management is one aspect, so it could be actually looking at shared parking opportunities. Now that would open up some of the existing surface parking for redevelopment, long term ideally,, some sort of structured parking, that would have a public.

I

Purpose. and again,, with tdm and or transportation demand management and all sorts of things to reduce the overall demand for parking as well, but understanding that,, you know, people are still going to drive here, sometimes other aspects that would be the place.

I

Making,, which I think you were asking about, sarah, so those would be plazas enhanced, streetscapes. and with that could also be programming, and one of the other ideas that we had that we're investigating still and kind of seeing what kind of market economics.

I

Might be able to support, because you can only extract so much,, but it's some sort of maybe master lease or management of the ground floor space to at least in certain areas to actually facilitate,. You know the curation of a you're talking about artists.

I

Space and spaces, and things like that,, that the market might not bear naturally. so,. So those would be the kind of the four big pieces that we're exploring as part of the district.

A

Great. so jean marie now gonna go on to a presentation on the phone engagement window., it looks like marks, got a hand up.. I think there might be one more question and then I just want to do a quick time. Check of folks need a stretch minute before we jump.

B

Into this last one, or if we should just power on.

O

I just wanted to sarah, the transportation advisory board has been advocating that parking in the public right of way,, not only bd subsidized,, but that we make money from it, to use for tpm products like mobility, hubs, like,. You know, incentives to get.

O

People out of their car and that's something that we we fail in doing that, but right now,, transmitter, parking, and in the near term, future parking doesn't pay for itself, doesn't pay for the administration of it, much less actually provide funds, but tab.

O

Has been quite vocal on it, and strong advocates that we should be making money from party for doing exactly what we want to do out here with transit and other mobility. Improvements.

K

Hi,, try can just respond to that. I appreciate that. That's something you all are pushing for, but it always has to be done within the context of addressing the needs of low and moderate income, families and the,, not just their economic needs,, but many of.

K

Those families, their cars are their business.

K

And we have. This is something that we've seen with ponderosa and other low, moderate income developments, and it's just it's never as simple as., let's just slap a $50, something or $100 or something.

K

Or let's get rid of parking, so I appreciate that you all are pushing for that and I appreciate you bringing it up and it's always a balance.

K

are pushing for that and I appreciate you bringing it up and it's always a balance.. But when we charge $17 a year for a 200 square foot parking space on maple, hill.

O

And that doesn't cover the cost of actually issuing the permit to a homeowner who owns a 456 $10 million home on maples and hill, and we charge them $17 a year.

O

Anyway, we're off on a different subject, but I would love to pick this up with you. But sure there are equity concerns as well. absolutely. I'll just point out to both of our boards had a chance recently to weigh in on parking in great detail, and I know.

A

I've heard a lot of these points, made.

A

Great. so, jim, did you.. Why? Don't we go ahead and give people like a just, did three minute bio break and then we'll be back by 10 after at the latest., so okay.

B

A

We're going a little bit longer than we had hoped, but what to talk about here.

A

So yeah, jane, I forgot when you share your screen, you have to hit the button twice., and so I spend the wheel without displaying last time, but oh well.

Q

A

It's always fun for people to watch. You sit and talk when they can't hear anything. You're saying.

A

Alright., hopefully, people are getting ready to come back on.

D

Sarah thank you.

B

Kathleen I'm going to ask if you can go ahead and share the slides for them.

B

F

Yes,, I definitely can.

B

Do we think everybody's back already.

D

Looks like we're getting there.

Q

A

Turn on your video just to signal to us, you ready., we'll get going.

R

Even as tila I'm back, but I'm not gonna, have my video on for just a minute., no problem. great. okay, thank you.

Q

D

George, neither peter are you. Okay, with going forward.

A

Why don't we just kind of do a slow roll forward and hopefully they'll get on. since we're couple minutes past 910. okay, that sounds good. um,, I think, you know, the previous conversation and people's thoughts around the land, use planning connections.

F

Plan and concepts for for 55th and arapahoe gave a lot of insight into what you might be looking for in community reactions and responses to the these ideas and proposals.

F

As we move into our next big phase of engagement,, which, as I described his plan for this ball, so I'm going to turn it over to jean data and let her describe our strategy for the fall. Engagement, window, and we'll have a discussion about what you all hope.

F

To get out of that, that window. so go ahead, gene and just give me a heads up when you want me to advance the slide. there, you can go ahead and go on to the next one, kathleen! That's a good point. I such a great conversations. I've been taking notes as.

B

We go about pieces of analysis that I think we're going to need to develop for the community engagement or some of the frequently asked questions and some of the key messaging to, to be able to help communities, community members understand the benefits.

B

And impacts and and rationale for a lot of these pieces.. So the purpose of this next engagement room window is really being in that homestretch to circle back to both ensure awareness that the plans happening and what the recommendations mean. Moving forward.

B

And together in together feedback that will really help us truly refine and improve that final plan, or, I think we're going to,. We need to hear a lot more from the community about priority their priorities for the implementation, pieces.

B

I think we've, we've heard about phasing in various comments tonight and that will.

B

It'll be important as we as we continue to develop the implementation part of the plan as to what's most important to do, and then your chairman, what would be in those mid, mid or long term.

B

Peace strategies.- I do want to emphasize on kathleen, I think maybe it's the next slide.

B

Yeah,, you can go ahead and.

Q

Move ahead, I just wanted to say that in one of the.

B

Well,, let me move to this one and I'll hit that and then one of the next slide.

B

We really want to build on this capacity that our community, as demonstrated for virtual engagement citywide, this is,. This is a theme of our community- has learned how to engage virtually and as come to really expect.

B

On demand important, you know, information that they can reach and understand and be able to participate at their convenience and not have to show up in person.

B

We will be targeting our engagement resources with the in person. Event, events to harder to reach populations are those populations where they really, it's, it's much harder to engage online or not as comfortable.

B

So we're going to be working in that direction. we've definitely established great tools, I mean, we've,. I thought we were really impressed with the community members in our last engagement window last winter.

B

Both the participation in the online events and the participation in the online questionnaires.

B

You know, just really great feedback, and we had some,. We had some really nice work with,, especially our event. well,. I think, to,, to have the events where we had breakout groups that were led by our working group members and participated in the in each.

B

Of those small conversations,, as well as the event that we held it in spanish.,.

B

It was online and virtual, but we were able to have some good conversations with those community members with that to see.

B

I think one of the key messages here is that we're not starting from scratch,. We need to be able to demonstrate, where the feedback that we've that people have given us already fits into this plan and kathleen,. You can go ahead and move to the next one.

B

Big picture, really,, you know,, are we on the right track? Is there? Is there something that's truly not in the direction that people want to go.? One of the very intentional things that we asked in the last engagement window was around some of this tension.

B

That folks have talked about tonight about conversion of industrial land to into housing, to potentially.

B

Add some of those housing types or forums that that folks have talked about for the missing middle or lower low to moderate income.

B

But then the result of that is displacing some of the industrial, or is it,, emphasizing the industrial and adding some housing.. And then there were questions about. You know mixed use, and so I was trying to pull up the reports from those just to refresh.

B

On some of those feedback, the feedback that we got but the,, the majority was around being really strategic about the changes, and a lot of support for some mixed use areas. So I think that that's one of the things that we need to demonstrate is,, here's.

B

What we heard, and here's, how it's showing up. and,, is that what you met with the feedback that you've given us are working group members have asked us to ask folks, you know: are we being visionary enough,, and I think that these the comments that we've.

B

Heard tonight, align with that as well as what are some of the assurances and cautions that we can build into the plan to make sure that we're getting the things that were intending.

B

To move to the next one kathleen.- and I think I mentioned this- to diving deeper, some of the specifics, we're going to we're going to want to.

B

Happen. they're going to be some folks that are going to really want to dive into all of these place types and all of the detail, and we're going to want that feedback from them to refine and improve all of the specific details for the key recommendations.

B

Around housing, local business and implementation.

B

So, with that, it's building on what we, what we've already heard and talked about tonight, I think it would be really helpful for us to have feedback from you, around the types of things that would help you gain assurance that we've made the revisions and.

B

The plan and the plan reflects the vision that the community wants to see a nice folder and meets the goals that we are committed to be to meeting from the comprehensive plan.

B

Kathleen anything else to add.

F

No, I think, you know, just I would mention we're planning for this engagement window to take place in september and october.

F

We've got a variety of methods that we're going to be using and so we'll be taking your,. Your input and feedback to, I think, first create the sort of educational materials that will supplement any type of question here that we put out there, as well as.

F

Develop your input will inform how we develop those questions and then analyze the feedback to deliver back to you when we come back with final recommendations.

F

Towards the end of the year.

B

That's it. right,. You folks have questions before we jump into comments.. I see john's hand.

A

And I can help out with them and I think, sheila, and I see one more hand.

J

Yeah, thank you. so,. Can you describe a little bit more.

J

How many public meeting, you mentioned, that you would have a public in person, meeting or two, as well as online stuff and, in my opinion,, the in person meetings are extremely valuable and provide feedback that you don't get online, and so I'm just wondering.

J

How many in person meetings who are, you're contemplating.

B

Well, honestly,, I'm the approach, the word that we're thinking about and feel free to give us direction. otherwise,. As far as resources, and staffing.

B

We're really thinking about the,, you know,, the main engagement.

B

The like overall city, wide targeted engagement to still be virtual, with it, an event or more, and an online feedback form for them on our beaver builder, platform.

B

But then, targeting in person, events, potentially with, you know, very,, you know targeted population, so we're thinking you know for sure about the some. Those are some other own neighborhood.

B

And really focusing those to going to where people are meeting people where they already are.

B

With the considerations of making sure that it's safe feels right within our code,, you know code regulations and just in general of feeling, like that's an okay way to gather.

F

I think we have three events. Specific that would be in person.. So, one,, as was mentioned, would be that son last row, community meeting.

F

And then two opportunities for property owners to come. In, look at the maps point where their property is talking about their concerns.

F

So,, those are the three that we have planned right. Now.

D

J

Um, my comments.

A

R

Thanks., I just wanted to point out like,. As I mentioned, earlier, there's been a ton of background work.

R

24 meetings, some in person, some virtual.- I just want to do another nod to the amount of public outreach that has happened so far. and so I've scammed, those, I won't admit, I've, memorized them or read them. Carefully.

R

But my question was,: how much outreach to older adult population is? Has there been.

R

I have to have all four of my parents,, you know, in laws and things all alive and they range in age from 70 to 85..

R

And so we are in the midst of trying to figure out where people should live their various levels of cognitive and physical decline., and it's really opened my eyes to the opportunities for a kind of communal living situation. That's not a retirement community.

R

Some members of my family really don't want to go into a retirement community but would be open to going into an apartment, because there's no no landscaping to take care of their neighbors. There's elevators,. That's all on one level that kind of thing.

R

And so the kind of smaller and affordable housing opportunities that I'm seeing, you know glimmers of here would potentially be answer. A lot of questions and the and the other thing on my mind is that boulder,, along with a lot of communities in the united.

R

In their two or three level home with a lot of lawn., and I'm just wondering what kind of outreach or input you've received from that age group or that kind of community,, bearing in mind we're still looking 20 years, out, but,, you know,, how have we been.

R

Pitching it or or gathering feedback from that portion of the population.

B

Well, I would say that in a lot of these conversations, the housing has to really the the discussion about new housing has been geared toward those that work in that east boulder area.

B

So, you know,. I don't think that we've emphasized a flavor of housing for older adults in this area, necessarily,, not to say that that some of these types wouldn't wouldn't work for that. I know that in the transit village.

B

A lot of that housing has been folks that wanted to downsize from single family homes because they're in retirement and want to move to one car. So I think that there's probably,, you know some opportunity of that,, especially around that the station area.

B

Potential but but it's a really good point and I think we do.

B

We do typically hear from all older adults in our city wide engagement.

B

But I would,, I would welcome your thoughts on.

B

How to invite folks to this conversation, knowing that this is not just about senior., you know, for older adult housing, but really the the all of the dynamics that are happening and use boulder. So I would welcome your, your thoughts on how we might do.

B

That. well,, when we were talking about moving to a virtual format,, you know some,, some members of my family are really great at figuring out zoom and some of them there's no hope.

R

And so I,, and I end when you were speaking of hard to reach populations. That was a bit of a euphemism, for I'm not sure who you were talking about, and I was wondering about elder populations being some of those hard to reach in a virtual format. And so.

R

I would kind of echo john's concern about going all virtual and trying to think about the different barriers in place for different kinds of people and families,, for whom a virtual format is quite difficult..

R

How do we reach them? Let me think more about that. I just wanted to know more about how hard you try to reach out to that segment of the population.

F

We do,, we do ask questions about age, and demographics in our survey work, so we could, you know, kind of look up that number and see how successful we've been in the past,, but that other other idea that I'm thinking about right now is we have a lot of.

F

Medical facilities, and medical services in this area.

F

And prior to covet,, we did have some in person, stations and kind of drop in at the hospital and around those neighborhoods. Restrictions are really different now, but it's probably that area is probably if we were to do something in person,, a good kind.

F

Of location, right so sort of man on the street intercept surveys might work okay,. You won't have to go into the building, but could be in the vicinity. Maybe, huh.

A

Any more questions, sir.

K

I thought a question,. I was ready to try to answer the questions that we were showing.. Should we do the question.

A

Yes. all right,, let's do it and let's go ahead and I forgot to share last time- will spin the wheel, just because it's so much fun to do. and the person who will start us off this time is sarah.

Q

Oh,, I'm sorry.

A

But if she's in on then sarah.

A

Touch me, may have guns, take a break, we're going to have been.

M

I'm,, I'm here,. I am a little confused about what I'm supposed to do: though. well, we're going to give feedback now on the public outreach plan for the fall, that we just saw the present.

M

Right, right. and I did see that, um,.

M

It by in my eye., I always say the same thing about public outreach. Is, is that,, you know,. Are there ways to get a hold of people that don't normally give public outreach.

M

And, and sometimes there's some special category and sometimes they're not.. I think the boulder does a pretty darn good job with trying hard on this,, and I don't have any particular insights into mechanisms.

M

Because of my personal background, I I resonate with some of the communities that repeated you might might also resonate with the,. You know spanish native language, communities.

M

So,, I'm really glad to see that we're doing materials and other languages,, but I don't really have any explicit feedback that feedback that I think it's going to be helpful.

M

I think we just keep trying.

Q

I guess I would just I, if I could quickly follow up with.

F

And certainly, love to hear feedback about mechanisms and ways to reach different populations and the different demographics or communities that you want to hear from,, but would also really love your feedback about what is the type of information, or what.

F

Is the content of the feedback that you'd like to see us come back with.

F

When we return, towards the end of the year, with some final recommendations and helping, I will add.

B

It'll, be super helpful to also take your, your suggestions back to our working group members. They are our wonderful conduit and john you're one of them.

B

To help us get the word out and to help you know, use their networks to help.

B

Say hey: this is going on and this, this, this,. This meeting is going to be here. Come come, come to it or here's this here's, this questionnaire, please fill it out. So we do have all of our wonderful champions, to help us get the word out. Into.

B

It's very specifically our spanish speaking community, with our connectors that are on the working group, but then all of the others too.

B

Okay. who's next.

A

Did you want to go through in order jean or shall we. oh,? We can.

B

I'm a little split brain right, now., okay, hutch! So then, if hutch started then we're on mark and then the pita and then sarah.

O

Oh, I'll simply say that,, I think,.

O

Wow, I miss are in,. I missed many city in person, meetings that we used to go to.

O

I have been pleasantly surprised with the accessibility of online meetings, and I know that it's, it's, it's accessible to those that have the tools to get online to come to our meeting, but it has,. I do feel like for tab,. It has broadened the ability for.

O

The public to participate, rather than sitting in in council chambers for waiting for a public hearing item,. I think it's broadening participation,, so I would advocate,, as the city goes to a hybrid model.

O

Talk to sarah huntley the other day about what things look like going, forward, that if you can do in person, meetings with online accessibility.- and I know it's a challenge. But if you can, I would advocate for that.

O

And then, on your slide, where you was entitled specifics and you had three lines: there.

O

I would simply add: ask that you add one, and that is how does every action.

O

And I hope this plan develops into concrete actions that can be taken,. How does every action in this plan, help us reach our climate goals.

O

And that needs to be.

O

when you go through the plan and you read the different when you search for the word climate. That comes up many times,, but there is no, it's,, it comes up and it says climate and then the words below. I don't really don't really connect to our climate action.

O

Plan at all, so I would,. I would request that we put that into the specifics that the public has to comment. On.

B

Okay. peter then sarah.

P

Um,, so I have some comments earlier now. I'm trying to go back to that space because it came naturally to me when you were speaking about the reach out to the latino community, and I know that we had a very effective program going on.

P

As the pandemic hit, that was through outreach.

P

Outreach through the catholic community are specific sacred heart of jesus,, where we will have activities with a cd.

P

And we call that the program converse as soon as con su that so chats with the city,, and we have city council and people like sarah huntley, will come.

P

And I'm ryan pension, and he was very successful and getting good feedback and in many cases, it all new ideas from the community, telling us directly what they need it, and that was going really well and unfortunately, we stopped that.

P

But in that context, that I will offer that as a model that has work to make sure that those communities feel comfortable. and, in fact, in the past,. We have this discussion early. I thought about.

P

Another question regarding that is like making sure that you are getting,. You know not only your message across to this communities, but you also get information from them.

P

So when you actually have a true direction, communication channel.

P

I think that that's when you really reach success, when you know that you are getting good ideas that were not on your list that came from this communities.

P

That's what I call real sepsis.. So if there's an opportunity for that, I offer that as an option. because, at least we sacred heart of jesus, church services are going sort of back to normal.

P

Some of us are still listening in the parking lot,, but a few of us most of the people are back in there, but certainly some of these activities and getting back in order.

P

So, if you're interested in that avenue,, given that you know school is back in session. so,, some of these things out a possibility. I'll be happy to kind of.

P

Help with that.

P

And what else was I gonna say? Oh yes., regarding the modality for.

P

Information., I know the thing that we found with this city previous initiatives with the latino community, in terms of providing information to the community.. They tried a text messaging program that apparently didn't go as far as we hoped, for.

P

But in the process found out the face book works fairly, well see just the. I just found that for a project, I'm involved in puerto rico, where we doing for research purposes.

P

Also using facebook to get information for the communities., so I think that being an open minded about the different modalities that you can get, people engaged that's useful and helpful..

P

So I'm just wanted to mention those things we have have things at work. and I hope that we can resume some of those activities. great.

B

Thanks for peter,, I'm just going to jump back in that,, that's a great suggestion and will we would be working with, um,. Let me see.

B

Let me see. garcia, garcia, and on various customers who are connectors.. They help us shape that those, those sessions,, so I can bring those up with them to be great.

B

Perfect. okay,, I'm sarah than alex.

K

Okay,, so the question was,: what are the elements necessary to support the recommendations that you will bring back to us.

K

So I'll start with some, some specifics and it really is based on the earlier comments made by john and george and the pita, and my own comments.

K

I think that we need definition in place, types that are very clear and distinct from each other, so that we really do know what it is: that's being proposed, and how they are different,. The granularity of zoning.

K

Obviously, the devils in the details with this, and there's not much., I mean, there's,, it's a huge packet and you guys have done a ton of work,, but there's not a lot of granularity and I think what we have heard today: is, there's a need for granularity.

K

Given the risks to the industrial nature,, the industrial zones, and, and, and, and not having this just become the highest.

K

The most expensive development, that is allowable, you know,, it has to be less about what is allowed,, but what we is preferred. What is wanted? What is requested.

K

Because we will get what we regulate for and if we regulate for something vague, we're going to get the most expensive option of those vague choices.

K

Let's see., we need clarity on missing middle housing, forms.

K

So that and and clarity on on additional areas were missing. Middle housing is an option.

K

We need new, new, creative home ownership opportunities, as well as creative thinking about where we can utilize some of our existing home ownership opportunities. We, you know we have deed restrictions and covenants as a tool.

K

And I realized that we're talking at the sort of 30,000, foot level in this plan, but we really need to be clear,, because this will drive. what a, what a applicant brings to planning board,. We really need to be clear about where we want to make sure that.

K

Their home ownership, opportunities.

K

I would like to see real clarity on the separation of housing, residential and industrial and some,, how you might how you would go about protecting our industrial, spaces.

K

Their zones. I'd love for there to be a talking about outreach to specific communities,. I'd like to have, I'd like to see the city have a engagement opportunity with artists and or cultural organizations to run by them. The idea of locating a space and.

K

Arts and culture space at the stamp location,, as well as what the implications of the proposal might be on on the artistic community that currently utilizes the east boulders area at for their livelihood.

K

The plan as it stands.

K

I don't want to just be you know the skunk at the party, but you know the be heard. Boulder is not a statistically significant survey. Tool.

K

I think it gives you some insight,, but I think we should not pretend that it's something that it is not.

K

And if we're going to do statistically significant surveys, let's do statistically significant surveys.

K

I want to,, I really want to make sure that you have done outreach to the neighborhood that lifts the south of the proposed transit hub.

K

And, you know, to just leave a tie on to what lupica set up by using facebook.. I know that be heard. Boulder posts on next door.

K

But maybe next door is a tool that can also be used for ongoing input, specifically on maybe elements of this project,. Since it's such a complex project, next door is probably a tough tool,, but it's, you might get some input.

K

Along the same lines as what the kind of input that you would get an a be heard boulder survey, but you would be able to engage more people and let them know that if they are interested in participating in an online event, specifically on this project,.

K

They can reach out and find out where they are because I, I mean gene. I appreciate you saying that you feel that the staff feels that the online engagement has been really successful.

K

I can tell you from the people that I talked to on a regular basis,, that this was ever the city's doing might as well be 1000 miles away in this past year and a half, people don't feel like they access it. Much.

K

They don't know, what's going on.

K

Things are kind of hard,, it's not that.. It's not even they're, not even said about technology. It's just about.

K

It's, it's over there, versus.

K

Something that you go to who you know.. So those are my comments and we'll see what you guys bring back to us.

B

Sarah, those are awesome.. Can I just circle back on a couple of little things with that.

B

Very good. we do not have a budget for a statistically valid survey or., so I just wanted to make that clear to make sure that nobody was expecting that.

B

And I think, you know, I,, I totally agree.. I think that there are a lot of folks that totally struggle with the online engagement in the platforms.

B

But we have seen, higher numbers than we would have seen in person.

B

And I know that like lots of new faces and lots of new people,, so it's not everyone. I totally recognize that. but,, but there is some movement.

B

And there are probably some folks that haven't that, you know,, so no I hear it. I hear you in genius,, you have the hardest job., I think in boulder. So I really appreciate all you do.

K

And you know the mark, mcintyre's point,, a hybrid approach would will be the,. I think hybrid approach going forward is the right way to go whenever, where it is, we're allowed to be back in, in our seats in the chambers,, but I still, I do think it's still.

K

Important to make it possible for people to participate.

K

Online online,, but I'm just passing along that there are lots of folks who are not,, there's just something less real about it, you know.

B

Agree. okay,, very good. Sorry, I didn't mean to.

K

B

Okay. sarah then alex and then george.

L

Think. sorry,, just one of the city's many strengths and I've been impressed with all of the outreach. That's been done so far,. Especially with the working group.-.

L

And so, if that's any indication of what's to come., I think we're in a pretty good spot.

L

I would like get if some of the engagement.

L

That's done to those who have a presence in the study. Area, currently was sort of showcased and highlighted, and would hope that this study areas, advertise to the community as a whole as a potential more of a destination than it is now, perhaps,. So that.

L

More people are engaged,, but a mix of.

L

Yeah, broad engagement, citywide, but really highlighting and showcasing some of the feedback you hear from from those that have a stronger presence in the stuff here. Today.

L

And then from the transportation side of things would,, I would more confidently support the recommendations. If the transportation elements were all summarized on a single map, I think that would help me get a pic picture of what's being proposed within.

L

The public right of way.

B

Thank you,, george.

E

Thank you, and an encouraging does have the hardest job in the city.. Thank you for everything you do.

B

It make my team members work, offline.

E

Not to discount everyone else too, because I'm,, I know, putting us all together and going through all this public feedback and everything that you guys do to try to make these things as successes is no easy. Feat.

E

So,, I would echo some of what sarah said around, as it relates to the type of informations listening from the public feedback.

E

Being as granular as possible., I think one of the challenges that I face on sort of echoing the difference between in person and sort of be heard. Boulder survey is a survey as sort of a one, a one way, dialogue that that person is having with the computer.

E

And specific questions. and what happens even in a forum like this? That's virtual, that's not in person. Is people get a deeper understanding by by everyone's questions.

H

All of a sudden, there are things that are brought to light that, you know,, someone might not have even thought of, and that it's, it's impossible to frame survey, questions to bring to light.

E

You know specific things, as as people have completely different points of view.

E

So that collective aspect of that in person meeting with the back and forth dialogue with people like yourselves., I think, is critical to the success of a community really understanding and buying into something..

E

And I don't feel like there's an online survey that does that I think there's a place, but I understand the constraints that you have as well as it relates to specific things,. You know, like,, like the use of the term light industrial.

E

I think people need to understand that it could include, you know, office.

E

And I don't know if we use that nomenclature in a survey,. If people really will understand the granularity and the impact potential for something like that.

E

And it may give us a false positive as to what people may want.

E

If they don't truly understand what that means.

E

And it takes a meeting like this to really understand what that means.

E

Similar to that things around the,, you know,. I would like to see outreach around the jobs, housing and balance for people to really understand that the project as proposed takes us backwards, as it relates to the job, housings and balance..

E

And I think that should be put forth black and white to the public., so they clearly understand what the potential imbalances of,. Even though we're going to get 3500 units, are we going to get 15 or 17,000 more jobs,, and how does that impact boulder, as.

E

It relates to affordability, citywide.

E

I think these are critical issues that are not really clear in this plan. and, and I, if the public is not asked those things. specifically,, they won't be informed enough to give you the answers that you may need in order to get this project and excepted.

E

And the outcome that we may want as a city.

E

So those are my high level comments. thank you., great., thanks, george.

B

B

Retailer, and then dave. tila, and then dave.. I think that's how the alphabet goes. Okay and mark, do it. Did you were you finished.

B

Did you get everything set that you need, way down. yeah.

R

Right. and then the mic again.

A

Maybe john would go after me.

B

Um,, so I think we have tila dave and then john. yeah.

R

Yeah., I do not have a whole lot to add. On top of what has been mentioned,, I suppose,. The one thing that I am wondering, is how how realistic are some of the assumptions about what people want and what the what the demand is out there for for kinds of spaces.

R

It is concerning right now that you know high tech office uses the highest dollar paying per square foot out there. Is that going to be true in 20 years? I really don't know I think, like, mark mentioned earlier.

R

We've learned a lot about this work at home revolution from coven.

R

And it's a little early to say what what the world is going to look like in 20 years and we're always going to get it wrong.

R

But one thing that we do know is that, you know, we've had these evil in computers for the longest time, and proposing developments and planning for mixed use,, and you know smaller housing and a bigger range of housing closer to employment, centers, is,.

R

In theory,, a great idea is that, is there really a demand for that here and perhaps because I'm not in the planning space? I don't know a whole lot of background information on that, but, to the extent that we've been able to reach out to people who live.

R

Here now who worked nearby, now, or who live nearby now., and I know that there has been an attempt to talk to local employers in that in the folder area. I don't know how successful we've been at reaching the actual evil and commuters to say if we build.

R

This would you come., and so I would just sort of feel better if I had a better understanding that these proposals, these changes in land use, these kinds of development patterns are actually meeting an unmet need that we can demonstrate is an unmet need right now, or you know.

R

That there's a desire out there if to fill the spaces in the way that we expect them to be..

R

I think that there are very good reasons to think that you're right,, but if there's a way to put some meat on those bones, I would,. I would feel more confident in in supporting this plan.

R

That being said, that's completely separate from my support for the, for stamp, stamp area. I think, if we're planning a transit.

R

You know hub there were planning to have bus, rapid transit and arapahoe. We've really got to build out that that kind of development that I think you have really good bones on that on that part, but just in general, the larger stuff community plan I'd like.

R

To feel more confident that I could understand a little bit more about what people are wanting and what we, what the rationale for thinking that we're right in 20 years,. But that's what they're going to want.

B

A

All right, and I'll just add, that..

A

A lot of great things were said about equity outreach, so I won't say much more, except that I will point out that there are good meeting spots in aged community facilities, and sometimes those are good places to have in person meetings and also visit. The.

A

Is adjacent to the site and might be another mobile home community to reach out to, and also say that on a cost. This must be about 18 different people, because she's done so much with the city in the last year, and so I want. I want to really commend the,.

A

The working group for getting people like on on.- and I want to also point out that the working group is sub,, how we do some community planning and that is public outreach and I,. I want to make sure that people don't discount, all the public outreach. That's.

A

Happened already,. This is these: are people who really dug deep into this problem.

A

So that said,, I will say it's going to be a challenge to get the larger group of the public to understand everything.. So I want to commend the idea of using 3d visuals,. I think that's really good idea.

A

And, and that can really stimulate some great conversations,, so I think it's wonderful to go to go out with the 3d.

A

The 3d representations.- I just want to take one issue with the point georgie on the jobs, housing imbalance.. If we were to build out the max development potential for the scientists currently zone,, we would horribly upset the jobs, housing and balance.

A

A scenario with the current zoning. so,: we can paint scenarios under which business conditions caused various things to happen, but I don't know if there was an actual acknowledgement by staff or the presenters, that this would exacerbate the jobs, housing.

A

Imbalance., it really depends on a lot of the things that still have yet to be set like the zoning and the stop gaps that might prevent various outcomes.

A

So I think it's a good point to say that we don't want to upset it, but I don't think anybody's admitted that, that this land use it by, in and of itself is going to lead us in that direction.

A

So unless somebody wants to correct me, I just want to make that clarification.

B

Great,, thanks to all right.

B

Meet your need to unmute.

B

there, you go., but I'm sorry. thank you.

J

So I guess I'll organize my comments in two categories.. One is the substance of the plan and the other, and the other is the public. contact procedures that were being asked about. Specifically.

J

The first, I would just like to say that I think, george and and sarah presented it extremely well some of the issues of concern, and I I agree with that.

J

And in response to david's comment.

J

I think when we., it's very important for us to talk about the, the ultimate consequences of what a community plan could lead to.. I understand that the present zoning may may result in, in a certain situation, which should also be discussed because that's an alternative.

J

But when we are doing planning., I think it's very important for us to consider what the consequences of following that plan by be now are implementing that plan..

J

And so,, can I just correct that I didn't say that it was. It might be. The statement that was made was it does exacerbate the jobs how's it in balance., and so I was, you do so, you know,. If you want to say that I'm on go ahead, that, but that's,, but I wasn't.

A

I wasn't discouraging. what could have us talking about what could happen? I was discouraging us from saying that something will happen, that we may or may not know, I've just had because we're talking about my comment. Let me,! Let me clarify.

E

I heard, specifically from staff, david, that we would get up to 3500 units, and that it would not be a one to one ratio. in fact,. It would be potentially double. What's there today.

E

And it's in the planning exercise., so I was talking about the plan that we were talking about unnecessarily talking about the conditions that exist, today.

E

But that's a that's a result,, that's a potential result of redevelopment and this plan is. It will exacerbate the jobs, housing and mountains as presented.

A

You can correct me if I'm wrong,, you agree with that kathleen, and yeah. Let me pull up because I do have the.

F

I do have the numbers and I think that there is some confusion around.

F

Numbers right now, so I just want to make sure that we're all on the same page.. Let me see if I can pull that stuff. Up.

P

Give kathleen a little bit of time to relax, so you can find it because sometimes when you're on the spot and because to me harder to find the most of you,, so don't feel bad.

P

He makes those statements as well., I think, there's a number of us will felt comfortable being concerned about a david.

P

And that is because I think that when we tried to do the math- and we asked him for the evidence that the math can possibly in a different direction than him- we don't get it,. We go by the most likely direction of things.

P

And so,, if I were to put my bed and I'm not a betting person, unless I know I'm winning., I will bet, there will be an increase in that gap..

P

And so yes,, based on what we heard today., I have no qualms whatsoever, saying that these will make things worse.

P

So I'm using that statistics, dreaming that I already have to at least reach something where I can feel comfortable. Saying.

P

Now, there is the lack of enough information. That's what the other questions are about, trying to find out. How do they come out with the project? What criteria.

P

Were they hold the most important, so that the exercises that they came up with is actually what they think is important to go? Forward.

P

I think sarah did an excellent job asking, and even quoting the report. when she found specific evidence that even our own staff is, you know, thinking,. This is not going to work in this direction, so wouldn't all these things together, I think some of.

P

Us are comfortable making some statements where it just shows are concerned, and that, at the very least, I think he has to be respected., because that's the reason why we're in the planning board,, we have the best.

A

Excuse me,, but I am fully respecting everybody's opinion here,. I simply want to find out if we're talking about conjecture of what could happen to max, build out or something that's based on actual models. That would predict an outcome.

A

Right., we know that in today's world, if we were to build out the maximum development potential for all of those zones,, we would have, we would seriously increase the job, housing and balance.

A

So does this area plan a self contained plan make that picture worse or better, right,, because right now you so you can build as much housing. okay,. So I did,, I did find the material that I was looking for.

F

So let me pull this up on the screen.

F

so that we're all looking at the same thing. so, when we went through that scenario, testing phase in the fall. We looked at changing differently and uses, and this is where our model came into play.

F

And so the model builds projections for the number of new homes that could be supported and the types of homes, and the number of jobs that might be created under these different scenarios,. And this assumes under our current land use code,, which dictates.

F

And size of these different spaces, building heights,, all of those things were built into the model.. So when we did that exercise.

F

We found, if we did nothing if we made no changes to the land use, and we could only anticipate or expect around 300 new homes added to 600 homes in the area. Total.

F

And then the number of jobs could potentially double.. So that's that double number that I brought up earlier and I think I misspoke when the topic came up,, because what we have done with,. You know the numbers that I provided in our presentation about.

F

The new housing that could be generated., we went through some calculations to create those numbers, but we don't have enough information to be able to project jobs.

F

Because of that,, because we have broken a lot of the rules around our zoning code, so there's just not a button that I can click that would demonstrate the number of jobs.

F

So we have,, we have a housing unit count for the proposal.. We do not have a jobs count for the proposal.

F

But, you know,. If we look at the other scenarios that were created in the fall.

F

When we do make some of those mixed use, land use changes., we see an increase of homes, created,, not a ton of change in the number of jobs, created.

F

And,, you know little reductions.

F

For each of these, but really not a significant amount and part of that is, um,, you know, I think something that was noted in the market study,, which described how underutilized, a lot of these parcels are today.

F

So I hope that.

F

I hope that clears up some confusion that I think I created earlier.

A

I just wanted to,. I didn't want to necessarily say that this wasn't a concern, because certainly economic conditions can push us to the jobs, housing and balance, but I want to make sure that we understand,. We cannot draw some sort of hard to conclusion.

A

This subcommittee plan has done that yet, without some additional data.. So is that clear? Now, john and you can- I can go back to you now and I'm sorry interrupting.

E

John you're muted,, but I'll just I'll, say one more comments. This was a comment that we were talking about., I made, which is,. I do believe that this kind of planning pushes the direction I mean. The whole purpose of this planning is to develop this area.

E

And so, supporting what the peter said I don't, I don't,. I don't necessarily think it's conjecture., I think we're going to accelerate the build out, which is which is fine, if that's what we're choosing to do, but we need to acknowledge that what this plan.

E

Does is accelerates a lot of stuff that could happen. Here.

E

Good and bad. and,, and what, by accelerating development here, you are, whether or not you're, building 3500 units.

E

You will it will result,, it will likely result and increasing the jobs, housing and balance, because also going to accelerate development of all this additional industrial and office. Space.

E

And so that you know someone else brought up the idea. Of, you know,, walkable neighborhood is great, but it will raise rents and it will bring in development,, which is which people just need to understand,. So I don't,, I don't think it's necessarily a misstatement.

E

To characterize this as., this has an extreme potential to increase the job housing imbalance versus what is there today,, because we are, we are putting in place a plan that incentivizes development.

E

So,, if I wasn't clear on that, that's that's what I meant. around that.

E

Okay., if I may add one last thing just so that we're clear, I think that the intention here is really that we are trying to solve, very difficult problems.

P

And so some of these things are easy and understandable, things that will help, and some of the ones are much more complicated., and I just want to make a comment also, because one of the things that we're dealing with is this whole issue of the people. That.

P

Coming in and I wouldn't call it evil., I'm in this is a little facetious,, because I know that you landed a minute in a bad way, but I'm saying if people think of what the way I look at these people coming in, is, I think, is is, as no do it not doing a good.

P

Job as a city to serve this people that come to work here.. So as long as we have this imbalance that these people cannot afford to live here., we are failing.

P

I wouldn't call them evil, if anybody's evil here is doing a poor job., that's the way I look at it, so I put it on I'm not asking the hard questions or you know, gsb and a little hard on ourselves to us, harder, and it just taking a harder stance on how.

P

We gonna help the city., so this difficult problem.

P

B

Okay. john,: let's get back to yours.

J

I, I had a whole series of brilliant remarks and there are all out of class by this discussion. So anyway.

J

So, anyway,, I just wanted to categorize my remarks in two ways: one is with respect to substance. and that is,. I think that there needs to be some,, there's a couple, significant elements that need to be clarified and one is the discussion of the entitlements.

J

That may be given to developers in order to entice them to do what we want. I,. I personally think that it's something we need to think carefully about both in principle and in practice, because if these developers are making so much money.

J

The way things are now that they can even be enticed to do something different without giving them an additional entitlement.. I think that's something that we should be talking about. Explicitly.

J

At some point and the sooner the better.

J

the., the other point I just wanted to make to kathleen was that you propose to have three in person sessions in the in the process in the public process that you described,, one with the sunglass are all people, and one or two with the landowners in the.

J

Area. well,, it seems to me that that may be a inappropriate proportion, because first of all, the land, owners and and office owners and developers are those who have been already most involved in the public in the in the working group,. And they are already.

J

I would think, very aware of what's been going on and in fact,. I think that they have had a tremendous influence in the planning activity, so far. so,, which is not bad,, it's appropriate for them to do. That.

J

But I don't think it's appropriate to focus the public meetings for their benefit.. I think they should be focused more for the to the city at large,, because that's the group that has been least active, so far in the, in the,, in the public efforts and.

J

And they need to be more involved.. So that's just my thoughts on that.

B

Thanks john. um,, I think the word through everyone and just to that point,. I think we really wanted to make sure that we were focusing on making sure that folks that hadn't been involved were aware of the project and the recommendations of,, especially.

B

Those landowners. did we miss anybody and is there anything left anything else that folks would like to add on this question,.

B

Are we are we all worn out.? I know I'm worn out.

K

I just have a process question., so eventually this will come back to planning, board, and then the council.- when it comes back to planning board.

K

Is there some presumption that, because it's gone through the process, it's gone through that.

K

All we have is a thumbs up or thumbs down opportunity, or is there more opportunity for feedback,, I'm just a little confused as to what how this goes.

F

Yeah,, so we will bring., we will bring the community feedback that we hear, and the revised sub community plan back to planning board for subcommittee plans. I see hella is on so please correct me if I'm wrong, but for sub community plans.

F

Those are adopted by planning board, and then they require adoption by planning board, and then would go to city council for adoption as well.

K

K

Yeah,, but I just want to make sure so I requiring adoption, can mean a deep engagement,. The way we do on any project,, you know,, we were looking for.

K

You know what we're trying to get feedback, or it can just be either we vote for it or some of us vote for it and some of us don't,, I'm just,, is there a.

K

Is there another hearing, experience to come up, or that will actually again, sort of go through some of these issues? Because that's what I heard from, from our the planning board? Colleagues was,, I would be uncomfortable with this intel. These other things.

K

Are explored and considered, and hopefully addressed.. So that's what I'm trying to understand is at the next here, the next hearing is,. We will be able to look closely at how these issues were considered an address or not.

F

Yeah,, I think I will need to check in with charles and jacob, about the schedule on that right now we were just planning for to come back with those refinements and a complete plan for adoption,, but if.

F

It's needed to have another, another kind of working session or study session prior to that, to go through some of the details.

F

We can look at the schedule and try to figure that out.

K

Okay,. Thank you. It's helpful to understand sort of next steps. I appreciate that.

A

Right. any other questions, john.

J

I would strongly encourage another working session,, the type that you described,, because this is a big enough and complicated enough issue that that we need to be able to go through it in detail and satisfy ourselves about it..

A

Right. anything else we wanted to cover tonight.. We have a debrief on the agenda, any comments on the meeting.

D

R

I was thinking about an hour ago.. I'm really glad that we're having these joint meetings, like. I think it has been really interesting. How much input we've had from tab and from planning board have very different aspects,, which I think demonstrate something.

R

To attempt to be complaining about for a little while, but we're not necessarily very good at cross thing game from from cross perspectives, and so I I think this has been a very illustrative. I'm hoping planning boards learned some from us. I've definitely.

R

Learned a lot from you guys., but I think it's really been quite useful to have us all on the same call.

A

Yeah, I like that and thank you all for.. I know it probably takes a little extra time, but we do learn a lot more and.

A

And I also want to thank staff, kathleen, and the entire team gene and.

A

And everyone for, for all this great work.. I know how hard this is. To, you know,, get something this big, and get the communities, comfortable with it. So, thanks for all the hard work you're doing on this and look forward to the next, next iteration.

A

All right. alright. so with that,. Are we ready to get out. thanks so much everybody.

F

Q

All right,, thank you. Thanks to our consultant and jay and marketing and. no,, thanks, everybody.. Sorry, I didn't say all the names but.

P

Take care. thank you.. Thank you. Everyone.