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At the conclusion of this forum, we invite community members to provide their feedback through an online survey.
https://survey.zohopublic.com/zs/eeD7sS
A
Thank
you
so
much
to
everyone
who
is
here
this
evening
in
person
and
for
those
of
you
who
are
joining
us
via
Zoom
or
YouTube.
My
name
is
Amy
Kane,
my
pronouns.
Are
she
her
and
hers
and
I
am
the
equity
officer
for
the
city
of
Boulder?
Tonight
you
are
joining
us
as
we
do.
Our
community
panel
for
the
independent
police
monitor
recruitment
process.
A
We
are
doing
a
Spanish
interpretation
for
this
this
panel
this
evening.
So
the
ask
is
that
everyone
speaks
a
little
more
slowly
panelists
when
you
are
or
candidates.
When
you
are
answering
those
questions,
please
keep
that
in
mind.
We
do
have
online
if
you're
joining
us
online.
You
should
have
seen
that
there
is
a
feedback
request
document
at
the
end
that
you
can
click
on
to
complete
a
survey
to
provide
your
feedback
for
those
of
us
joining
us
in
person.
A
You
also
have
some
QR
codes
on
the
seats
we
are
have
been
collecting
some
questions
in
advance,
so
we'll
be
starting
with
some
of
those
questions
for
those
of
you
who
are
joining
us
via
Zoom.
You
can
also
add
additional
questions
that
way
for
the
the
audience
who
has
joined
us
this
evening.
You
should
have
picked
up
some
note
cards
if
you
need
another
note
card
feel
free
to
raise
your
hand.
Also,
if
you
need
a
pen,
we
can
provide
that
and
Amy
will
be
collecting
those
questions
as
we
move
forward.
A
If
each
of
you
could
provide
just
an
intro
and
then
why
you're
interested
in
this
position
and
if
you
could
stick
to
about
two
to
three
minutes,
we've
been
really
fortunate
to
have
many
questions
already
submitted
and
I
know.
Our
wonderful
audience
is
going
to
have
some
questions
as
well.
So
with
that
I'd
ask
Mac,
would
you
start
off
with
the
introductions
and
then
we
can
go
towards
Gina
and
then
Kathy.
B
B
Can
everyone
hear
me
yep
sounds
good
I'm,
Mack
Muir,
most
recently
supervising
investigator,
with
the
Civilian
Complaint
Review
Board
in
New,
York
City,
my
pronouns?
Are
he
him
and
his
want
to
jump
back
from
to
the
beginning,
grew
up
in
Oakland,
California
born
and
raised,
and
my
career
really
started.
B
Tutoring
youth
in
Oakland
I
worked
at
an
organization
throughout
high
school
that
was
focused
on
literacy
in
Black
among
black
youth,
I
went
to
Oberlin
College,
where
I
studied,
policing
politics
and
Africana
study
studies,
and
then
I
worked
for
governor
Hickenlooper
here
in
Denver.
For
about
two
and
a
half
years
in
various
roles,
I
worked
on
judicial
appointments
with
him.
I
worked
archiving
executive
orders
and
I
also
traveled
around
the
state
with
Governor
Hickenlooper
briefing
him
on
policy
issues
as
we
went,
I
spent
the
last
seven
years
at
the
Civilian
Complaint
review
board.
B
That's
the
largest
oversight
agency
in
the
country
I,
as
I
worked,
my
way
up
organization
really
starting
out
as
a
level
one
investigator
and
ending
up
as
a
supervisor.
I
worked
on
high
profile
cases,
that's
shootings,
choke
holds
Serious,
Force
cases,
complicated,
multiple
officer,
multiple,
multiple
civilian
cases
and
supervised
a
team
of
six
or
seven
investigators.
A
given
time
toward
the
end
there,
along
with
that
I
trained
investigators,
mentored
investigators
developed,
actually
broke
grants
developed
a
monthly
case
workshop
for
investigators
to
share
investigative
tactics
and
then
have
continued
to
work.
B
Membership
and
attended
whatever
conference
I
can
and
I'm
on
several
subcommittees.
Pardon
me
working
groups
for
Nicole,
so
I'm
really
excited
to
be
here.
I
think
Boulder
has
an
excellent
opportunity
to
continue
to
create
robust
oversight,
that's
because
of
the
community,
the
Community
Values
here,
and
also
because
you're
just
here
at
a
time
where
there's
expertise
in
civilian
oversight
as
you're
building
it
up
as
opposed
to
a
lot
of
other
cities
that
had
to
build
it
with
just
less
knowledge,
less
fewer
resources
and
I've.
A
D
A
A
D
I'll
continue;
okay,
that's
okay!
Prior
to
that,
I
was
a
police
officer
for
Albany
Community
or
Albany
Police
Department
for
the
better
half
of
my
career
and
I
was
a
police
officer
in
general
for
about
five
years,
I
studied
at
the
State
University
at
Albany
and
have
a
degree
a
bachelor's
degree
in
emergency
preparedness,
Homeland
and
cyber
security.
D
D
So
I've
done
a
lot
of
initiatives
in
that
regard
as
well.
My
I
guess
my
my
come
about
of
Boulder
was
kind
of
a
very
organic
happening.
I
was
doing
a
Naco
conference
and
I
saw
the
opportunity
online
and
I
decided
to
look
into
it.
I
looked
at
Boulder
and
I
said
this
is
a
gorgeous
place.
I
started
doing
some
research
into
the
community
and
it
is
a
beautiful
community.
So
I'm
excited
to
share
my
expertise
and
my
experiences
and
to
also
gain
an
outside
perspective
as
well.
So,
yes,
thank
you.
Thank.
C
C
I
have
been
there
for
about
four
and
a
half
years
as
the
compliance
manager,
I
supervise
almost
half
of
the
team
at
post
and
our
purview
currently
has
to
do
with
overseeing
all
peace
officer
academies
there's
about
35
of
them
in
Colorado.
If
you
didn't
already
know
and
I
also
oversee
certification
of
police
officers
with
that
comes
removal
of
certification
due
to
a
variety
of
different
reasons.
C
So
we
are
the
regulatory
body
for
peace
officers
in
Colorado
prior
to
that,
I
earned
a
bachelor's
degree
in
Psychology
from
Metropolitan
State
University
I
am
a
Colorado
Native
I
grew
up
in
Arvada,
so
I
have
spent
the
majority
of
my
time
in
the
Denver
metro
area.
I
currently
live
in
Denver
and
work
downtown
Denver
after
graduating
college
I
worked
with
committed
youth
in
a
rehabilitation
facility
for
two
years.
I
then
became
a
probation
officer.
I
did
that
job
in
Adams
County
for
10
years.
C
A
D
C
So
I
would
I
would
say,
along
with
Gina
I've,
had
the
opportunity
to
also
build
working
relationships
with
police
officers
and
police
departments.
In
my
current
position,
while
I
am
in
a
regulatory
position
and
handling
compliance,
my
motto
has
been
that,
in
order
to
manage
compliance,
it's
really
important
to
work
with
law
enforcement
on
the
front
end
by
having
really
clear
expectations
and
building
strong
relationships
that
prevents
a
lot
of
problems
so
that
we
don't
wind
up
having
issues
and
that's
that's
actually
gone
a
long
way.
C
Also
doing
Outreach
efforts.
That's
one
of
the
favorite
parts
of
my
job,
I
love
going
out
and
educating
and
providing
curriculum
and
providing
information
to
people
who
may
not
understand
or
have
certain
information
and
finding
ways
to
do
that.
That's
creative
is
something
I
really
really
enjoy.
I
think
how
you
do
that
can
be
a
combination
of
factors
getting
to
know
leadership
in
the
police
department.
B
You
need
expertise
first
and
foremost,
and
you
can
do
that,
particularly
in
this
kind
of
role,
with
both
officers
and
the
community
and
the
department
in
the
community
by
showing
that
you
really
know
what
you're
talking
about
and
that
begins
with
knowing
how
this
Ordinance
Works
and
in
the
history
of
the
ordinance
over
the
last
few
years.
That
is
followed
by
knowing
investigations.
Well.
I
think
that
the
community
needs
to
know
that
I
would
hold
myself
to
the
highest
investigative
standard.
When
looking
at
someone
else's
work
and
I.
B
That's
accessible,
not
only
from
a
professional
perspective,
but
one
that
can
be
brought
up
back
to
the
community
and
say
here's
what
I
learned:
here's:
what
I
learned
about
police
officer
standards,
here's
what
I
learned
about
investigations
and
here's
where
Boulder's
standards
are
hopefully
higher
than
they
are
on
a
national
level,
along
with
trust.
You
need
Clarity,
and
that
means
really
explaining
how
this
process
works,
how
the
ordinance
impacts
the
lives
of
everyday
people.
B
So
that'll
mean
saying:
here's
where
you
you
stand
as
a
civilian
relative
to
the
police
department,
here's
what
the
independent
monitor's
office
is
intended
to
do
and
explaining
that
in
clear
language
on
a
really
regular
basis.
It's
the
challenge
of
bureaucracy
for
us
to
get
lost
in
acronyms
I,
think
that
happens
really
easily,
and
my
hope
would
be
that
the
independent
monitor
could
ensure
that
every
time
there
was
a
public
meeting,
there
was
a
even
just
a
re-explanation
of.
Why
we're
here
and
be
doing.
B
That
constantly
is
going
to
reinforce
Community
Trust
that
there's
somebody
who's,
always
acknowledging.
There's
going
to
be
somebody
else
in
the
room
who
doesn't
know
what's
going
on
and
we
need
to
bring
them
in
and
if
we
do
that,
every
single
week,
every
single
meeting
we
can
have
Community
Trust
through
that
Clarity
and
through
that
expertise.
A
C
Probably
the
best
example
would
be
the
work
that
I've
done
on
community
notification
and
through
the
job
that
I
had
with
the
sex
offender
management
board.
I
was
required
through
my
responsibilities,
in
my
position
to
assist
law
enforcement
in
conducting
notification
meetings,
Town
Hall
meetings,
similar
to
what
we're
doing
right
now
and
to
ensure
that
not
only
the
meetings
were
conducted
effectively,
but
that
the
community
received
the
information
that
was
helpful
to
them
and
that
also
that
they
received
information
that
was
required
by
law.
C
Those
were
done
all
over
the
state
and
when
I
started
doing
them,
the
the
meetings
were
done
in
in
one
sort
of
way
and
I
worked
really
hard
to
change
those
over
the
course
of
a
couple
of
years,
meaning
that
I
asked
for
feedback
from
the
community
because
they
were
the
customer
right
I
mean
yes,
there
was
a
statutory
mandate
that
law
enforcement
had
to
do
this
and
it
wasn't
an
easy
task.
We
wanted
to
make
sure
that
people
weren't
scared.
C
B
So,
in
terms
of
transparency,
if
you've
worked
in
police
oversight
for
long
enough,
you
know
that
there
aren't
a
lot
of
initiatives
across
the
country
that
I
think
hit
the
bar
in
the
way
they
need
to.
So
what
I
can
say
is
that
I've
been
a
political
advisor
and
I've
worked
on
policing
legislation
with.
B
Before
in
terms
of
what
they're
going
to
propose
and
that
I
try
to
advise
that
they
advocate
for
the
most
transparent
policing
over
policing
policies
that
allow
for
oversight
to
do
its
job
beyond
that
as
an
investigator.
That's
simply
just
not
the
role
of
of
That's
Not
Your
Role
when
it
comes
to
community
involvement
as
an
investigator
and
as
a
supervisor
I
went
out
into
the
community
and
took
complaints
from
people
who
had
been
victims
of
police
violence,
and
that
means
meeting
with
their
families.
B
That
means
meeting
with
their
children
and
explaining
the
process.
I
mean
I've,
explained
the
process
in
front
of
mothers
and
fathers
multiple
times.
Children
who've
been
victims
to
police
violence
and
explaining
the
process
in
a
clear
enough
way
that
they
have
some
confidence
that
something
me
if
not
something
meaningful
is
going
to
be
done.
B
As
a
citizen
and
I
think
that
there's
a
benefit
every
single
time
of
saying
you
know,
if
you
want
something
else,
you
should
be
aware
of
what
exactly
exists,
because
that's
the
only
way
you
can
change
it
and
then,
in
terms
of
community
involvement
at
the
ccrb.
Certainly
what
you
could
do
is
you
can
encourage
the
participation
of
anyone
who
came
and
filed
a
complaint
and
changing
the
rules
of
the
ccrba,
showing
up
at
public
meetings
and
trying
to
understand
it
as
best
they
could.
Thank
you.
A
D
You
I
would
say
my
biggest
initiative
in
the
transparency
of
just
what
we
do
as
a
an
oversight.
Review
board
is
really
the
education
piece.
It
is
kind
of
this
kind
of
up
and
coming
thing.
This
new
initiative
that
has
been
really
taken
by
force
recently
and
I
think
it's
a
very
necessary
thing
that
that
needs
to
be
in
every
place.
Department.
Just
for
the
simple
fact
of
you
know:
the
community
knows
that
there
are
others
who
are
objective
and
independent
of
the
police
agencies
that
are
looking
at
their
complaints.
D
So
you
know
this
has
also
influenced
just
the
people
who
normally
wouldn't
submit
a
complaint,
because
it's
going
straight
to
the
police
department
and
there
is
no
independent
body.
So
just
really
really
picking
that
piece.
A
part
of
of
the
education
factor
in
what
exactly
the
review
board
does
how
it
operates
that
we
are
an
independent
body
that
we
have
our
own
bylaws.
D
So,
as
far
as
the
the
transparency
piece
I
have
taken,
I
have
taught
initiatives
in
the
community
for
what
police
officers
are
taught
in
the
academy.
Are
they
taught
de-escalation,
what
type
of
de-escalation?
What
type
of
you
know
how
they
handle
certain
situations?
Traffic
stops
Etc,
so
at
least
if
they
are
stopped
or
if
they
you
know,
do
have
a
situation
where
they
run
into
with
police
they're
able
to
have
some
Education
and
Training
as
to
you
know,
maybe
why
and
how
to
respond
to
that.
D
B
C
B
B
It
polices
very
seriously,
I've
seen
that
in
the
annual
reports
from
the
police
department,
I've
also
heard
complaints
about
how
that's
handled
and
I
think
that
the
monitor
would
need
to
weigh
both
effectively
and
give
the
department
credit
where
credit
is
due
and
continue
to
raise
questions
where
they
exist.
I
think
the
future
of
the
Boulder
Police,
Department
and
police
and
police
departments
Nationwide
really
depends
on
and
you'll
hear
this
from
me
again
tonight.
Hiring
more
women
I
think
it's
the
core
of
the
future
policing
that
police
departments
have
far
more
women
among
their
ranks.
B
At
average,
Nationwide
is
15
percent
average
in
police
leadership
is
three
percent.
The
Boulder
Police
Department
has
a
bunch
of
vacancies
for
police
officers
and
a
great
opportunity
to
hire
a
lot
of
women
and
show
the
nation
how
we
can
do
this
effectively.
The
benefits
are
Myriad.
You
find
that
female
officers
get
fewer
complaints,
they
are
the
subject
of
far
fewer
lawsuits
and
they
tend
to
have
better
relationships
with
the
community
and
they're,
often
far
more
equipped
to
handle
investigations
into
sexual
crime.
Sex
crimes.
D
B
D
You
know,
for
me,
I
think,
a
revamp
of
again
I
know.
I
only
have
a
couple
of
minutes,
but
a
purge
of
our
Criminal
Justice.
System
kind
of
you
know
as
a
whole.
I
think
that
there
are
a
different
style
of
doing
things
now,
and
my
simple
answer
would
be
for
more
compassion,
more
relatability
and
empathy,
just
in
general,
in
policing
and
having
those
conversations
and
having
you
know,
bringing
back
feelings
into
policing.
It's
not
you
know.
It
can't
be
an
agency
anymore,
where
it's
it's
a
fear-based
agency.
D
First
of
all,
that's
not
how
you
get
anywhere
and
especially
with
these
newer
Generations
up
and
coming
they're,
not
fearful
at
all,
so
you
know
having
it
as
a
fear-based
mentality,
a
paramilitaristic
mentality
that
has
to
go
because
it
does
not
work
anymore.
It
doesn't
make
the
differences
that
we
need
to
see
in
our
communities
in
the
community,
in
the
vision
that
we
see
for
having
community
and
police
come
together
as
one.
So,
if
we're
gonna
keep
on
we're
going
to
keep
having
the
same
fear-based
system,
then
it's
never
going
to
work.
D
So
if
they
can
build
those
connections
and
instead
of
in
a
rest-
and
you
know,
jail
and
kind
of
the
the
same
cyclical
process,
it's
more
of
that
relationship
building,
instead
of
just
this
cyclical
process
of
that
that
we've
been
going
through
for
now
centuries.
So
that's
where
I
see.
Thank
you
excellent.
Thank
you.
Kathy.
C
Thank
you,
so
my
personal
Vision
is
probably
a
bit
idealistic,
but
for
now,
I
would
like
the
Boulder
Police
to
continue
working
on
the
plan
that
they
have
laid
out
for
the
reimagining
police,
which
they
talk
about
the
holistic
governance.
I.
Think
that
that
is
one
start.
I
think
also
the
work
that
the
city
has
started
on
with
the
racial
Equity
plans
and
incorporating
that
into
the
police
department
is
really
really
important.
C
Part
of
what
Gino
was
talking
about
with
the
academies.
I
know
that
Boulder
and
CU
Boulder
are
both
looking
at.
You
know
the
possibility
of
hosting
an
academy,
and
that's
something
that
I'm
quite
familiar
with
and
post
itself
is,
is
doing
a
long-term
project
at
revamping
all
Academy
curriculum,
which
is
a
massive
project,
because
we're
very
aware
that
in
the
Attorney
General's
very
aware
that
things
need
to
be
revamped,
so
I
wholeheartedly
agree
with
what
Gina
was
was
referring
to.
I.
C
Think
that
some
of
the
things
that
need
to
be
a
part
of
the
police
department
moving
forward
are
things
like
sanctity
of
life,
and
that
needs
to
be
something
in
all
police
departments.
Really,
when
we're
looking
at
use
of
force
and
de-escalation,
and
also,
though,
trust
and
legitimacy,
when
we're
talking
about
procedural
Justice,
those
are
things
that
are
incredibly
important,
whether
it's
with
oversight
or
the
police
department,
that
has
to
happen
in
order
for
policing
to
be
effective
in
the
community.
At
this
point,
thank
you.
A
A
D
D
D
It's
you're
not
going
to
get
anything
different,
you're
not
going
to
get
a
different
side
of
me
and
when
I'm
speaking
to
the
police
chief
I'm
Gina,
when
I'm
speaking
in
the
community,
I'm
Gina.
So
as
far
as
the
neutrality
and
the
consistency
with
that,
that's
always
going
to
be
me.
You
know
I'm
going
to.
C
D
My
words
I'm
going
to
not
know
what
to
say,
but
I
am
resourceful
and
I
will
get
the
answer
for
you:
I'm
not
going
to
make
something
up.
I'm
not
going
to
pretend
I,
know
the
answer
or
pretend
I
know
all
the
answers,
but
one
of
the
things
that
I
have
been
very
successful
at
in
my
career
is
being
resourceful
and
finding
the
people
and
the
experts
in
those
fields
that
I
can
get
the
answer
from,
and
you
know
bring
it
back
when
we
have
this
instance.
C
Kathy,
thank
you.
So
I
am
an
incredibly
genuine
person
and
I
really
I.
Think
present
as
I
am
regardless
of
what
role
I'm
in
or
what
position
I'm
in,
but
I,
think
having
experienced.
Some
of
the
positions
that
I
have
fulfilled
in
the
past
has
helped
me
being
a
probation
officer
and
an
investigator
through
probation.
C
C
I
think
that
you
know.
Obviously,
the
relationships
are
incredibly
important.
Having
good
relationships
with
the
panel
and
with
the
police
department
are
very
important
and,
like
I
said
before,
having
worked
in
compliance
for
so
long
and
in
regulatory
capacities,
it
doesn't
have
to
be
adversarial.
You
can
still
have
good
working
relationships,
but
still
maintain
a
high
level
of
objectivity.
B
So
maybe
this
could
be
best
described
by
me,
walking
you
through
the
investigative
process
at
the
ccrb.
So
if
you're
an
investigator
first
a
stack
of
papers
just
left
down
on
your
desk,
it's
got
the
information
about
a
new
complainant.
It's
got
details,
maybe
the
identity
of
the
officer.
Maybe
not
it's
got
an
instant
location.
You've
got
to
go
out
there
and
you've
got
to
find
the
people
involved.
You've
got
to
contact
them
over
the
phone.
You
gotta
go
in
person.
B
What
did
you
see
what
happened
and
what's
your
take
on
all
this
and
then
you
go,
and
you
summarize
all
that
and
then
you
find
the
officers
and
once
you
find
the
officers
you
bring
them
in
and
you
you
sit
down
with
them
with
their
union
attorney
present
and
you
have
some
what
what
happened
here
and
they'll
tell
you
what
happened
in
their
own
words,
just
as
everyone
else
did,
and
you
need
to
really
listen
to
every
single
person
in
that
process.
You
hear
what
they
said
and
you
take
to
a
certain
extent.
B
You
take
them
at
their
word.
You
ask
follow-up
questions.
Help
me
understand
what
you
mean
by
that
help
me
understand
what
you
mean
by
that
place.
Tell
me
more
tell
me
more
tell
me
more
and
as
an
investigator
you're,
a
fact
finder,
but
there's
a
transition
when
you
do
the
analysis
of
a
case
right.
You
have
all
this
facts.
You
have
everybody's
testimony.
Maybe
you
have
video
footage.
B
You
summarize
that
to
whatever
Professional
Standards
you
can
and
then
you
stop
and
you
have
to
write
a
report
that
summarizes
what
took
place
and
it's
not
everybody's.
Take
as
to
what
happened.
It's
your
take
that
synthesizes
all
that
information
together
and
that's
a
roll
of
treasure.
That's
one,
a
role
that
I've
always
treasured
because
you're
taking
everyone's
lived
experiences
and
trying
to
translate
into
something
translated
into
something.
That
really
applies
as
it
relates
to
the
law
and
that's
not
really
a
lived
experience,
but
you
so
you're
sort
of
creating
your
own
incident.
B
What
do
I
think
happened
here?
What's
my
analysis
and
I
think
at
its
core
to
have
Independence,
you
need
to
be
willing
to
think
very
critically
and
take
time
to
think
of
what
am
I
going
to
determine
happened
here.
What's
my
analysis
of
it?
Is
it
fair?
Is
it
within
the
law?
Is
it
appropriate
and
then
you
take
a
step
back
and
you
say
I
did
my
best
and
so
for
me,
I
think
I.
Take
that
approach
with
whatever
work.
B
I
do
I
know
that
I
have
the
respective
officers,
their
Union
representatives
and
the
people
whose
cases
I
investigated,
because
the
victims
in
the
cases
knew
that
I
was
busting.
My
butt
and
the
officers
knew
that
I
was
good
at
my
job
and
oftentimes.
That's
the
best
you
can
ask
for
in
one
of
these
tough
processes.
So,
as
I've
said
before,
I
think
expertise
shows
your
professionalism
in
in
that
way.
It
shows
neutrality
because
there's
only
one
way
to
be
an
expert
in
this
particular
field.
C
C
You
know
people
in
the
community
I
think
while
I
am
a
Colorado
Native
I
am
not
a
resident
of
Boulder,
so
I
would
really
want
to
learn
more
about
the
the
community
as
far
as
the
the
community
groups
and
all
of
the
different
you
know,
organizations
and
the
different
partners
that
are
available
so
that
there's
really
really
diverse
representation
and
opportunities
for
partnering.
If,
if
there
isn't,
you
know
that
representation,
then
I,
don't
think
that
this
position
will
be
effective,
especially
given
that
there
has
to
be.
You
know.
C
C
B
Thank
you,
I,
think,
to
be
culturally
sensitive
in
this
job
is
to
know
the
history
of
harm
in
the
community.
Frankly,
I'm
not
from
here
I
I,
don't
know
the
history
of
harm.
I
know
that
white
people
probably
came
here
and
killed
a
bunch
of
native
people
and
then
that's
what
we're
working
with
as
a
starting
point
for
the
land
we're
on.
B
But
it's
really
important
to
me
that
I
learn
the
history
of
Boulder
and
of
the
various
communities
that
feel
aggrieved
by
the
police
and
that
the
history
of
the
city
itself
in
order
to
make
any
progress
in
this
role,
I
think
to
be
sensitive
in
this
role.
You
need
to
understand
generational
trauma.
You
need
to
understand
that
a
complaint
is
more
than
a
single
incident.
It's
about
somebody's
life
and
their
story
about
what
their
life
is
and
how
it's
been
disrupted
and
I.
B
Think
this
role
is
going
to
rely
on
expertise,
I'm,
not
an
expert
in
racial
Equity
I.
Have
my
values
and
I
think
that
we've
got
a
wonderful
University
here,
that's
going
to
be
able
to
supply
a
lot
of
expertise
in
terms
of
how
to
make
this
the
most
equity
role
possible
and
I
would
lean
on
it.
Certainly.
D
Kind
of
piggyback
off
of
what
Max
said,
I
think
literally
everything
you
just
said
is-
is
super
important
to
take
note
of
just
in
general,
especially
when
we're
dealing
with
land
sensitivities,
and
you
know
just
kind
of
cultural
sensitivities
in
general.
I
think
one
of
the
one
of
the
hurdles
that
were
that
we
are
working
towards
right
now
is
having
a
place
and
a
an
opportunity
where
culture
is
part
of
that
decision
in
law
enforcement.
And
then
you
know
it's
not
just
dealing
with
a
specific
culture.
D
D
You
know
backlash
from
police
generational,
I,
Choose
You,
just
because
of
what
you
look
like
or
what
you
talk
like
or
or
where
you
live.
You
know
those
conversations
with
Community
stakeholders
and
the
police
need
to
happen.
So
that's
kind
of
where
I
see
the
direction
for
being
culturally
responsive
in
this
role.
A
D
D
When
you
deal
with
racial
bias,
you
deal
with
more
than
just
you
know:
hey
I,
don't
like
you
because
you're
this,
it
is
most
most
likely
a
part
of
how
a
person
was
raised
or
an
experience
that
they've
had
that.
That's
made
them
be
that
way
or
think
that
way,
so
I
think
that
the
best
way
to
go
about
that
is
to
ask
somebody
why
you
know:
why
did
they
make
this
arrest
or
why
did
they
do
this
action
to
get
their
reaction
again?
D
I,
don't
think
it's
a
surface
level
issue
when
you
deal
with
any
sort
of
racial
bias,
I
think
it's
it's
something
that
can
be
trickled
down
to
okay.
Well,
how
were
you
raised
kind
of
thing
or
you
know
what
what
did
your
family
tell
you
that
you
know?
Why
are
you?
Why
do
you
see
this
kind
of
point
of
view?
D
D
That's
going
to
take
a
community,
it's
going
to
take
experts
in
different
fields.
It's
going
to
take.
You
know,
stakeholders
from
every
angle
and
also
cooperation
from
the
police
departments
to
even
be
open
on
that
level
and
again
you
know
we
can't
get
anywhere
with
moving
towards
the
the
right
way
to
do
things.
If
we're
not
honest
and
open
about
these
conversations,
because
it
it
may
not
be
that
you
know
you're
you're
like
this,
because
you
want
to
be
like
this,
it's
what
you
were
taught
or
it's.
D
C
C
It's
not
just
policing
I
mean
it's
like
most
employers
are
having
issues
recruiting
and
retaining
employees,
but
policing
is
having
a
serious
issue,
getting
people
to
fill
the
positions
and
there's
there's
a
lot
of
reason
for
that,
and
and
I
won't
get
too
diverted
into
that
situation.
However,
I
think
that
part
of
this
can
be
looked
at
at
hiring.
C
That's
not
going
to
fix
the
problem.
I,
don't
think,
there's
any
one
way
to
fix
the
problem
necessarily,
but
I
do
think
that
if
you
are
looking
at
people's
biases,
even
through
some
assessments,
we
ask
officers
to
go
through
quite
a
rigorous
process
for
hiring
including
psychological
assessment.
Physicals
they're,
usually
going
through
extensive
backgrounds,
but
I,
don't
know
that
they
ever
look
at
any
kind
of
biases
before
they're,
hired
and
I
think
that
that
would
be
really
interesting
to
do
before
they
are
determined
to
be
suitable
candidates
for
hiring
so
I.
Think.
C
The
other
thing
is
that
I
think
that
they're,
you
know
like
Gina
was
saying.
Is
you
know,
having
open
conversations
and
talking
about
it?
I
know
that
this,
the
state,
the
legislature
mandated
anti-bias
training
that
is
required
by
police
I,
don't
think,
there's
a
whole
lot
of
research
that
supports
the
effectiveness
of
that.
However,
you
know
it
is
a
training,
that's
required
there.
C
There
are,
maybe
you
know,
awareness
of
implicit
bias,
I,
don't
think
that
that's
harmful,
but
it's
it
is
one
other
thing
that
could
probably
help
when
we're
talking
about
law
enforcement
and
specifically
the
role
that
they
have
and
the
populations
that
they
are
working
with.
As
far
as
completely
ferreting
out
you
know,
people
that
have
issues
and
that
are
are
possibly
acting
out.
B
That
we'll
go
through
and
look
at
the
demographics
of,
say,
people
who
are
stopped
in
car
stops
and-
and
you
can
control
for
raise
by
the
amount
of
lighting,
for
example,
and
and
determine
that
there
was
racial
bias
in
officers
as
general
policies
right
in
Nashville.
They
found
that
way
more
people,
black
folks
were
getting
stopped,
I
mean
I'm,
sure,
that's
not
the
only
city
in
Oakland
they
found
by
using
body
cam
footage.
B
They
analyzed
the
language
that
the
officers
were
using
and
found
that
officers
were
way
more
likely
to
just
use
harsher
language
toward
black
drivers,
which
is
really
useful.
But
then
you
question
like
to
what
end
and
I
think
that
that's
the
challenge
is
there's
one
thing
to
measure
the
racial
bias.
B
At
every
moment,
and
that
the
police,
who
need
to
be
brought
into
that
process
at
every
moment,
because
they're
the
face
of
the
government
but
I
I
think
the
best
you
can
do
right
now
is
you
can
study
disparities
in
policing?
You
can
study
disparities
in
stop
and
frisk.
You
can
study
disparities
and
arrests,
but
that
also
phases
its
own
problems
in
in
New
York.
B
There
have
been
moments
in
which
officers
have
adapted
by
say,
arresting
more
people
who
are
white,
and
then
your
numbers,
change
and
I
think
that
there's
a
limitation
to
that
to
the
studying
over
time,
because
it
changes
the
incentives
of
the
officers
it
may
or
may
not
help
anything.
What
you
can
do
is
have
a
really
inclusive
environment
that
acknowledges
that
racism
is
present
around
us
within
us
and
that
we
can
all
be
doing
better
at
every
week
moment
and
that
our
policy
should
reflect
that.
A
B
Well
that
that
I
think
applies
to
every
case
that
I
investigated
and
supervised
I
mean
this
is
I've
I've
investigated
a
case
in
every
NYPD,
Precinct,
there's,
77.
and
and
supervised.
Thousands
at
this
point.
So
in
terms
of
varying
perspectives,
I
mean
at
its
core
right,
like
it's:
no
secret,
the
nypd's
police,
Union
endorsed
Donald
Trump
and
most
of
our
complainants
were
from
highly
Democratic,
well
they're,
black
and
brown
folks
from
highly
Democratic
areas.
B
I
might
give
probably
would
be
too
personal,
but
I
would
say
that
that's
part
and
parcel
of
being
a
professional
investigator.
You
listen
to
people's
perspectives.
You
get
the
facts.
You
explain
the
law
we're
all
here,
because
this
is
the
role
of
government
at
its
current
stage
and
you
respect
what
people
have
to
say.
A
D
I
guess
I
I
guess
I'll
first
touch
on
kind
of
the
opposing
of
views,
I
think
we've
gotten
and
we've
gotten
to
a
place
just
in
our
country
in
general,
where,
if
you
have
a
certain
view,
I
can't
talk
to
you
or
can't
be
your
friend
or
can't.
You
know
work
with
you
for
whatever
reason-
and
you
know
my
my
opinion
on
that
is
I-
think
we
all
have
differing
views
about
everything
right.
D
That's
what
makes
us
that's
what
makes
us
unique
so
bringing
those
views
you
know
together
is
is
another
obstacle
and
another
in
another
way.
I
think
this
position
could
be
really
instrumental
in
change,
because
you
know
respecting
opposing
viewpoints
is
absolutely
part
of
this
and
it's
how
this
department
is
going
to
grow
again.
I'll
say
it
again:
I
I,
don't
have
all
the
answers
and
that's
okay,
because
some
of.
D
But
that's
one
of
the
things
that
I
hold
very
high
in
any
work
that
I
do
I,
always
welcome
differing
opinions,
because
it
makes
me
better
even
if
I
don't
necessarily
agree
with
it.
I've
been
in
plenty
plenty
of
situations
where
I
haven't
agreed
with
whoever
I
was
speaking
with,
but
they
give
me
their
interpretation
and
I
learn
and
for
a
situation
that
I
may
have
that
comes
up.
That
I
can
use
that
information
for
that's
more
valuable
than
having
a
disagreement
and
winning
winning
the
arguments.
D
So
I
guess
I
would
say
an
experience
in
an
actual
case
or
a
hypothetical
situation
where
I've
had
kind
of
this
experience.
As
Max
said,
it's
probably
every
case
there.
There
are
many
stakeholders
all
the
time
in
this
work
and
that's
okay,
because
again
you
have
the
views
of
the
police
department.
You
have
the
views
of
the
independent
monitor.
D
You
have
the
views
of
the
community
and
I
think
if
you
can
bring
those
all
together
and
have
an
open
conversation
where
you
can
speak
about
all
of
these
things,
then
that's
what's
going
to
make
this
grow
and
that's
what's
going
to
make
us
all,
be
able
to
collectively
make
this
in
every
city
somewhere.
You
know
where,
where
we
all
Thrive
and
we
can
live
together
to
actually
have
bridge
that
Gap
that
everybody
talks
about
for
community
and
police
department.
C
C
So
in
either
situation
we
we
get
a
notification
that
there's
an
issue
and
at
that
point
we
need
to
determine
if
we're
going
to
take
action.
And
similarly
we
have
a
lot
of
parties
involved.
Typically
because
we
have
due
process
built
into
our
system,
and
so
we
have
hearings.
Official
hearings,
I'm
a
part
of
those
hearings
and
I
have
an
investigator
on
my
team
and
that
person
you
know,
conducts
the
investigations
when
necessary
and
I
oversee
those.
We
have
attorneys
that
are
often
utilized
for
the
certificate
holder.
So
they
represent.
C
You
know
the
certificate
holder,
and
then
we
have
our
own
attorney,
that's
housed
through
the
AG's
office
and
that
person
would
be
kind
of
like
the
City
attorney
right
now
to
the
panel.
Then
we
have
our
board
and
the
post
board
is
is
Big,
it's
24
people
so
and
we
have
a
whole
process.
We
go
through.
You
know
if
we
determine
and
and
typically
it's
our
director
who
determines
if
really
all
statutory
requirements
are
met
and
we're
going
to
proceed
with
a
revocation
and
it
is
going
to
go
before
our
board.
C
At
that
point,
the
person
has
the
right
to
request
an
appeal,
and
so
we
may
go
through
a
whole
appeal
process
and
we
we
have
perspectives
that
range
from
you
know.
The
employer
may
get
involved
they
even
with
a
conviction
or
they
they
may
have
disputes
about.
Well,
the
the
officer's
attorney
didn't
realize
this
was
a
decertifying
crime,
because
there's
a
whole
lot
of
crimes
that
you
can
commit
and
not
lose
your
certification,
so
perspectives
from
the
officer
that
may
you
know
they
may
think
that
you
know
they
just
pled
guilty.
C
They
didn't
really
do
it
or
the
attorneys.
You
know
they
they're
there
to
represent
their
clients,
so
they're
going
to
do
what
they're
going
to
do,
but
we
still
always
listen
to
everybody
and
especially
to
the
the
officer
and
hear
them
out
and
consider
all
sides
and-
and
our
director
is
really
great
at
that-
actually
seeing
the
big
picture.
So
we
that
is
one
thing
is,
is
ensuring
we
have
a
very
thorough
due
process
and
and
I.
A
D
So
I
think
racial
Justice
means
that
you
know
everyone
is
treated
like
a
human
at
the
end
of
the
day
and
like
they
like
anybody
would
treat
their
families
their
parents.
You
know
anybody
that
they
love
I.
Think
this
side
of
Justice,
especially
in
the
police
department,
is
more
on
the
side
of
equal
treatment
for
that
as
well.
So
you
know
not
being
arrested
just
because
you
looked
or
act
or
lived
a
certain
place
or
way
you
know
having
it
be.
D
D
You
know
we
can't
control
how
how
we
look
or
or
what
nationality
or
race
we
are,
so
that
shouldn't
be
something
that
we
should
be
treated
differently
for
or
picked
on
for
you
know,
but
it
still
happens,
unfortunately,
so
I
think
getting
to
a
place
where
you're
treated
differently,
because
you're
a
bad
person
as
opposed
to
looking
or
or
acting
differently,
is
kind
of
the
the
racial
and
and
part
of
that
social
justice
piece
at
least
the
beginning
aspect.
For
me,
for
what
I
I
see.
C
I
think
it's
a
complicated
answer,
but
I
would
say
that
I
agree
with
a
lot
of
what
Gina
is
saying,
but
I
also
think
that
some
of
the
tangibles
to
that
are
things
like
inclusion
in
policies,
and
you
know
language
access
and
seeing
representation
in
our
leadership.
And
if
we're
talking
about
I
know,
the
question
was
in
Boulder,
but
also
in.
If
we're
talking
about
in
policing.
C
Just
I
know
that
Boulder
has,
you
know
recently,
really
prioritized
the
the
racial
Equity
plan
and
and
even
today,
in
our
tour,
we
talked
a
little
bit
about
how
that's
playing
out
in
some
of
the
the
way
that
policies
are
being
implemented
and
and
how
assessments
are
being
done
and
how
it's
different
now
than
it
used
to
be,
which
is
really
encouraging,
because
it
is
a
lot
more
Progressive
than
than
things
that
I
have
been
involved
in
in
government
in
the
past.
So
to
me,
it's
quite
encouraging.
C
B
Let's
admit
this
is
a
white
City
predominantly
and
I
think
that
when
you've
faced
issues
of
racial
Equity,
you
need
to
acknowledge
what
that
is
up
front
and
then
really
acknowledge
that
the
minorities
and
more
of
a
minority
than
it
might
be
in
other
major
cities
with
that
said,
I
think
that
at
least
two
prongs
you've
got
Equity,
which
right
you
can
have
the
the
studies,
and
then
you
try
to
ensure
that
Equity
is
factored
into
all
future
decision,
making
I
think
I.
Think
racial
Justice
is
also
restorative.
B
It's
acknowledging
the
past
and
figuring
out
how
you
can
not
necessarily
make
up
for
it,
but
account
for
it
whenever
possible.
Talk
about
the
history
and
talk
about
what
a
future
looks
like
that
is
racially
just
and
I
think
that
needs
to
take
into
account
the
voices
of
the
community
that
are
in
the
minority.
The
people
who
who
who
want
racial
Justice
need
to
be
the
ones
who
are
speaking
out
and
whose
voices
are
heard
most
because
that's
the
only
way
things
are
going
to
change.
A
Police
oversight
panel
Chief,
has
final
authority
over
case
adjudication
and
disciplinary
action
that
ordinance
also
established
an
oversight
panel.
Have
you
taken
a
look
at
the
current
ordinance
and
considered
ways
that
it
could
be
fixed
a
result
to
assist
transparency
in
the
report
out
to
the
community
and
we'll
start
with
Kathy
on
this
one.
C
A
Repeat
the
question
yes
I:
can
the
police
oversight
panel
ordinance
provides
that
the
police
chief
has
final
authority
over
case
adjudication
and
disciplinary
action
that
ordinance
also
established
an
oversight
panel?
Have
you
taken
a
look
at
the
current
ordinance
and
considered
ways
that
it
could
be
fixed
or
resolved
to
assist
transparency
in
the
report
out
to
the
community.
C
A
C
C
The
transparency
issue.
That
I
believe
is
the
actual
question.
I
think
I.
It's
my
understanding
that
there
is
some
work
being
done
on
the
charter
and
I
think
my
understanding
is
that
d
discussions
about
discipline
and
the
cases
can
only
occur
during
meetings
and
I.
Think
that's
where
the
issue
of
transparency
is
coming
up
so
I.
Yes,
I!
C
Think
that
if
there's
an
appetite
to
go
in
and
change
the
charter
and
allow
for
a
different
process
without
violating
any
coma,
which
is
Colorado,
open
meetings,
act
or
just
minor
modifications
to
the
Charter,
so
that
there
can
be
more
transparency
about
the
recommendations
or
even
about
summaries
on
the
cases.
That
would
be
important
because
you're
still
summarizing
cases
in
the
quarterly
reports
and
in
the
annual
reports.
So.
B
I
agree
with
you
on
the
appeals
process
that
exists
in
a
lot
of
cities
and
to
what
extent
it
should
exist
here
is
not
clear,
but
I
think
that
it's
something
that
should
certainly
be
looked
into.
Regarding
transparency,
I
mean
in
in
most
cities,
there
is
the
ability
for
members
of
a
version
of
the
police
oversight
panel
to
discuss
those
cases
to
some
extent.
It
varies
and
I
think
that
if
this
is
going
to
be
a
transparent
panel,
then
it
should
have
to
be
able
to
discuss
these.
To
some
extent.
B
The
important
part
is
prioritizing
the
safety,
though
the
safety
of
the
civilian
involved,
ensuring
that
their
information
isn't
disclosed
just
because
we
feel
like
talking
about
this
bad
thing
that
happened
to
them
I've
seen,
and
that
creates
a
huge
chilling
effect
on
complaints.
If
you
think
that
in
a
public
meeting
somebody's
going
to
discuss
your
life
and
the
sad
thing
that
happened
to
you
and.
A
B
Think
for
the
officers
due
process
as
well,
you
don't
want
to
discuss
the
case
that
would
in
any
way
identify
them,
because
the
process
isn't
complete
and
you
you
can't
at
point
fingers
until
there's
been
a
full
adjudication
of
Justice
beyond
that.
I
think
that
whichever
candidate
is
selected,
we're
going
to
learn
a
lot
more
about
what
this
shortness
looks
like
in
practice.
B
You
can
stare
at
language
for
a
long
time
and
you
can
even
have
reference
points
for
what
it
looks
like
in
other
cities,
but
Boulder
is
going
to
be
handling
this
differently
than
other
cities.
I
think
that's
been
clear
to
all
of
us.
Having
been
here
is
that
you
guys
handle
things
differently
and
I'll
be
excited
to
see
what
exactly
that
looks
like
how
everything's
going
going
forward.
A
D
There
is
an
appeal
process,
so
I
think
that
is
an
important
piece
of
having
the
ability
to
appeal
is
something
that
I
I
think
is
is
necessary
to
have
this,
especially
if
you
know
the
the
chief
who
is
looked
at
as
probably
in
support
of
police
is
the
the
one
that
ultimately
is
making
the
the
ultimate
decision
on
the
complaint
and
I
think
further
than
that
appeal
process.
There
needs
to
be
maybe
some
sort
of
a
a
formal
process.
Beyond
then
beyond
there
with
other
stakeholders
who
can
review
this
process.
D
The
appeal
itself
and
you
know,
come
up
with
a
consensus
that
way.
So
it's
not
just
based
solely
on
one
person's,
you
know
opinion
or
discretion.
I,
sorry
remove
the
the
word
opinion.
I
did
not
mean
it
did
not
mean
to
say
that
we'll
go
with
discretion,
but
you
know
just
to
to
not
have
it
fall
on
just
one
individual
person
because
again
kind
of
as
we
have
seen
and
and
discussed
that
you
can't
have
all
views
with
just
one
perspective.
D
There
needs
to
be
multiple,
and
if
that
means
bringing
in
you
know
the
officer
and
the
complainant
in
different
ways
to
discuss,
you
know
different
processes
moving
forward,
then
you
know,
maybe
that's
the
case
if
it's
through
an
appeal
process
with
maybe
a
mini
kind
of
judicial
court
set
up
where
there
is
community
stakeholders.
There
are
other
stakeholders
that
you
know
kind
of
want
to
grow
this
department,
including
the
panel
as
well.
You
know,
then,
maybe
that's
the
process
that
we
need
to
go
but
kind
of
how
Mac
discussed.
D
A
You
so
it's
7
21,
so
we
have
time
for
one
more
question
and
I've
also
been
asked
by
the
interpreters
that
you
also
slow
down
rate
of
speech.
That's
okay!
So
it
wasn't
just
you
that
was
a
blanket
statement,
so
one
guilty:
what
is
your
personal
and
professional
relation
to
achieving
inclusivity
through
language
and
actions?
Gina
we're
going
to
start
with
you.
D
D
You
know
people
who
identify
different
ways,
and
it's
a
it's
a
it's
been
a
little
bit
of
a
learning
curve
for
me
and
it's
something
that
I'm
so
heavily
delve
into
now,
because
you
know
I
never
want
to
disrespect
anybody
or
make
anybody
feel
any
sort
of
way.
So
I
have
these
open
conversations,
and
you
know
make
it
very
clear
that
I
I
want
people
to
be
open
and
honest
with
me.
You
know,
even
just
as
far
as
you
know
how
they
identify.
D
You
know
what
kind
of
culturally
is
disrespectful,
because
that's
another
Factor
as
well,
you
know,
maybe
a
handshake
in
another
culture
can
mean
a
sign
of
disrespect.
You
know
just
kind
of
getting
over
those
those
those
boundaries
that
that
you
know,
maybe
maybe
I,
haven't
been
exposed
to
yet
and
then
I'm
so
willing
to
learn
and
be
open
to.
You
know
these
Community.
These
conversations,
and
you
know
just
having
respect
all
around.
D
C
We're
talking
about
language,
one
of
the
things
and
I
think
I
I
was
talking
about
it
earlier
this
evening
was
when
I
worked
for
the
DA's
office.
I
had
a
project
where
I
helped.
It
wasn't
me
specifically
my
team,
I
I
had
my
team
translate
our
documents
and
it
wasn't
just
for
our
County.
It
was
for
the
entire
State.
Even
though
I
worked
for
the
county,
because.
D
C
Not
getting
notifications,
they
were
receiving
English
letters
and
our
population
was
vastly
latinx,
and
so
they
were
primarily
Spanish
speaking
and
this
made
quite
a
difference
and
I
wondered
when
I
was
looking
at
everything
that
is
in
the
current
infrastructure.
For
this
position
and
I
know
it's
new,
so
no
criticism
whatsoever
if
there
are
forms
in
Spanish
and
if
there
are
like
the
complaints
and
on
the
website
and
those
kinds
of
things.
D
B
Language
and
action
is
about
spending
time
it's
about
spending
time
with
people,
because
I'm
not
going
to
tell
somebody
else
how
I'm
going
to
be
inclusive
toward
them.
They're
going
to
tell
me
how
I'm
going
to
be
inclusive
toward
them
and
it
takes
listening.
It
takes
having
a
growth
mindset
at
all
times
and
being
willing
to
have
some
egg
on
your
face
from
time
to
time
and
say,
I'm,
sorry
and
move
on
and
improve
and
be
committed
to
improving
I'm
sure.
B
B
Policy
itself,
you
know:
I
I
worked
briefly
with
the
city
of
Oakland,
the
Oakland
police
commission,
drafting
some
of
their
policies
in
their
patrol
guide
and
regarding
sort
of
related
adjacent
to
a
scandal
that
took
place
and
I've
worked
with
politicians
in
the
presidential
level
and
senate
elections,
Congressional
elections
and
on
local
levels,
and
you
have
to
be
really
thoughtful
about
how
you
speak
in
the
actions
you
take
and
you
have
to
be
genuine.
If
you're
going
to
be
any
good
at
it.
A
Thank
you.
So
that
concludes
our
interview
panel
for
this
evening.
So
I
just
want
to
thank
the
candidates
so
much.
That
was
that
was
an
hour
and
a
half
of
a
lot
of
questions,
and
thank
you
guys
so
much
for
for
participating
and
for
our
studio
audience
and
then
also
for
those
who
are
joining
us
online
via
Zoom.
We
do
again
have
the
feedback
mechanism
on
our
website.
So
please
do
provide
your
feedback.
We
do
have
a
bunch
of
interviews
tomorrow
scheduled
for
our
candidates,
so
we
are
going
to
graciously.
A
Let
them
go
go
for
the
evening
and
get
some
rest
and
just
want
to
thank
everybody
who
came
out
this
evening,
really
appreciate
you
and
for
those
of
you
who
were
able
to
join
us
via
YouTube
and
zoom
just
much
gratitude
to
you.
This
is
an
incredibly
important
position
for
our
community
and
our
organization
and
I
I
appreciate
everybody
making
the
time
for
this
work.
So
thank
you
so
much
and
with
that
have
a
very
safe
drive
home
tonight.