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Description
Governor Gavin Newsom hosts a virtual conversation with Dr. Fauci, Director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases.
Recorded December 30, 2020.
For more information regarding the impact of the COVID-19 outbreak in Cupertino, please visit https://www.cupertino.org/coronavirus
C
Hey
doctor,
can
you
hear
me
I
can
hear
you
fine,
governor
honor.
I
don't
know
how
you
anytime,
I'm
feeling
exhausted.
I
then
just
think
of
you
and
I
have
no
excuses.
No,
nothing
just
gratitude
to
you.
C
God
bless
you,
I
don't
know
how
you
handle
the
criticism
nor
the
accolades.
I
don't
know
the
the
the
triumphant
quality
that
is
all
things
you
and
how
grateful
we
are
as
a
country
and
a
world.
So
I
really
really
honored
to
be
with
you
today.
C
D
Well,
governor,
first
of
all,
I'm
not
surprised
that
you
have
a
a
case
unlikely
more
cases
in
california
and
we
likely
will
be
seeing
reports
from
other
states.
Colorado
were
the
first
to
do
that.
I
think
you're
going
to
start
seeing
it
because
if
you
have
that
much
of
a
prominence
of
this
in
the
uk,
with
all
the
travel
not
only
directly
to
the
united
states
but
through
other
countries
intermittently
like
where
you
go
from
uk
to
france,
france,
to
the
united
states,
etc,
then
canada
has
cases.
D
So
I
don't
think
that
the
californians
should
feel
that
this
is
something
odd.
This
is
something
that's
expected
with
regard
to
your
specific
question:
there's
a
lot
we
know
about
it
because
the
our
british
colleagues
have
been
studying
it
carefully
and
there
are
things
that
we
will
soon
learn
more
about
them
in
a
more
definitive
way,
literally
as
the
days
and
weeks
go
by.
D
So
the
things
you
mentioned
is
that
it
looks
pretty
clear
from
the
uk
group
that,
in
fact,
the
transmissibility
of
this
mutant
is
more
efficient
than
the
transmissibility
of
the
standard
virus
that
we've
been
dealing
with
up
to
now,
namely
it
just
it's
able
to
bind
to
the
receptors
on
cells
better
and
therefore
is
transmitted
better.
There's,
no
indication
at
all
that
it
increases
the
virulence,
and
by
virulence
I
mean
the
ability
to
make
you
sick
or
kill
you.
It
doesn't
seem
to
make
it
more
strong
in
that
regard.
D
One
of
the
things
governor
we
want
to
keep
our
eye
out
on
is
that,
since
these
are
specific
mutations,
we
want
to
make
sure
that
they
don't
evade
the
protection
of
certain
of
the
monoclonal
antibodies,
because
the
monoclonal
antibody
is
against
the
very
specific
component
of
the
virus,
whereas
when
you
get
vaccinated,
the
immune
response
that
you
make
is
called
polyclonal,
which
means
it's
against
many
different
parts
of
the
virus.
So,
even
though
you
have
one
part
of
the
virus,
that's
changed.
D
It
is
very
likely
that
the
other
components
of
the
vaccine-induced
response
will
protect
you.
So
that's
what
we
know
about
it
now,
but
we're
following
this
extremely
carefully.
We
have
isolates
from
the
uk
we're
working
on
it
here
at
the
nih
and
at
a
number
of
other
laboratories
throughout
the
country.
C
Yeah,
it's
interesting,
california,
just
to
level
set,
so
people
have
a
sense.
We've
been
testing
about
five
to
ten
thousand
tests
a
week,
genomic
tests
with
our
partners
ucsf
up
here
in
northern
california,
cz
biohub
partnership
and
we've
not
seen
that
strain
until
again,
the
news
out
of
southern
california
today.
But
what
because
imagine
any
mutation
and
it
just
scares
the
average
person
the
average
person
hears
that
variation.
But
this
is
not
abnormal.
C
D
Issue,
okay,
so
to
all
of
my
my
californian
friends-
and
I
have
many
they,
they
should
realize
that
that
this
is
an
rna
virus.
In
other
words,
the
makeup
of
it
is
rna.
Rna
viruses
they
make
a
living
out
of
mutating.
They
love
to
mutate,
the
more
you
replicate,
the
more
you
mutate.
So
when
you
have
a
lot
of
virus
that's
circulating
in
the
community,
it
means
it's
infecting
a
lot
of
people.
It's
it's
replicating
a
lot,
and
when
you
replicate
you
mutate,
the
overwhelming
majority
of
mutations
are
irrelevant.
D
They
don't
have
any
impact
on
any
important
function
of
the
virus
every
once
in
a
while,
you
get
a
mutation
that
does
impact
a
function
of
the
virus.
It
appears
from
what
we
learned
from
the
uk,
and
what
we'll
prove
here
is
that
this
particular
mutation
does
in
fact
make
the
virus
better
at
transmitting
from
one
person
to
another.
C
Got
it?
What
is
I
mean
of
all
the
things
I
mean
and
forget
the
politics,
the
the
atmospherics
and
all
the
surround
sound
as
it
relates
to
the
disease,
this
pandemic
itself?
What
has
surprised
you,
the
most
over
this
last
year?
What
has
been
sort
of
the
stubborn
reality
that
you've
had
to
come
to
grips
with?
More
often
than
not?
That
really
distinguishes
your
experience
and
your
expertise
with
this
particular
disease.
D
Well,
you
know
governor,
I
think
it's
it's
something
that
we
learned
in
the
beginning,
but
we
didn't
know
right
from
day
one
most:
viruses
that
are
respiratory
viruses,
the
they're
driven
by
people
who
have
symptoms,
people
who
sneeze
on
you
and
cough
on
you
and
all
that
sort
of
thing
what
we
began
to
learn
sort
of
end
of
january,
beginning
of
february,
and
then,
as
we
got
into
february,
is
that
even
though
the
chinese
were
giving
us
information
that
really
was
a
bit
misleading
first,
they
said
it's
generally
from
an
animal
to
human.
D
It's
not
very
efficient
human
to
human.
Then
it
was
well.
It
can
go
from
human
to
human,
but
it's
mostly
people
who
were
symptomatic
and
then
they
began
to
say
now:
wait
a
minute
we're
seeing
that
even
people
without
symptoms
are
transmitting
it,
and
that
to
me
is
something
that
was
the
game
changer.
It
was
the
game
changer
in
everything
we
did.
It
was
the
game,
changer
and
testing,
because
you
can't
just
test
people
who
are
with
symptoms
because
you're
gonna
miss
the
asymptomatic
people.
D
Number
two
mask
wearing
became
much
more
important
because
if
you're
only
worried
about
somebody
who's
symptomatic,
then
you
know
who
you're
dealing
with.
But
if
you
don't
know
who's
infected,
then
everybody
should
be
wearing
a
mask,
which
is
the
real
fundamental
rationale
for
saying
we
need
universal
and
uniform
wearing
of
mass.
So
to
me
that
was
one
of
I,
you
know
I
guess
you
could
use
the
word
surprising.
D
It
was
a
combination
of
surprising
and
disturbing
yeah.
The
other
thing,
the
other
thing
that
has
really
been
an
issue
is
that
the
the
the
I've
I've
never
seen
a
virus
like
this
and
I've
been
dealing
with
viral
outbreaks
for
the
last.
You
know,
40
years,
where
you
have
such
a
range
of
involvement
of
seriousness
from
40
of
the
people
who
get
infected
and
have
absolutely
no
symptoms
at
all.
D
To
those
who
have
symptoms
about
80
percent
have
mild
to
moderate
symptoms
that
generally
require
staying
at
home
for
a
few
days,
maybe
sometimes
a
couple
of
weeks,
and
then
you
get
about
10
or
15
percent,
not
10,
maybe
20
percent
20
to
25
percent
of
the
people.
That's
you
know
a
quarter
of
the
people
who
get
symptoms
get
severe
enough
symptoms
that
they
may
require
hospitalization
intensive
care
intubation
and
they
die.
Hence
the
335
000
deaths
that
we've
had
so
far.
D
D
Why
do
I
need
to
interrupt
my
life
and
interfere
with
the
normal
life
when
I
need
to
get
shut
down,
and
that's
the
reason
why
there's
that
you
know
in
some
respects
dichotomy
of
people
that
sometimes
takes
political
connotations
like
you
wear
a
mask
if
you're
on
this
side
of
the
group-
and
you
don't
wear
a
mask
if
you're
on
the
other
yeah,
I
you
know,
the
uniqueness
of
I've
been
through
many
many
crises
for
public
health.
I've
never
seen
someone,
not
someone
some
infection
that
has
been
in
the
middle
of
such
divisiveness.
D
No,
not
at
all
there
was
the
the
in
many
respects
shameful
stigma
with
aids
for
a
while,
particularly
among
men
who
have
sex
with
men
in
this
country.
There
was
the
lack
of
paying
enough
attention
to
it
in
the
early
years
when,
in
the
very
early
years
of
the
reagan
administration,
with
all
the
many
good
things
that
president
reagan
has
done.
D
The
fact
is
they
didn't
put
enough
of
the
bully
pulpit
of
the
presidency
to
warn
people
that
this
is
a
disease
that
is
not
a
problem
of
people,
it's
a
problem
of
a
virus,
but
other
than
that.
It
wasn't
anything
like
the
divisiveness
that
we're
seeing
right
now,
which
really
makes
implementation
of
public
health
measures
and
public
health
messaging
very
difficult.
Yeah.
Now
I.
C
D
C
Assure
you
I
there's
no
daylight
in
that
point
of
view
and
the
practical
application
look
we're
in
a
state.
That's
in
population
terms,
is
larger
than
the
populations
of
21
states
combined
and
with
a
form
of
government,
a
system
of
government
where
we
put
a
lot
of
pressure
and
responsibility,
accountability
at
the
local
level,
local
county,
sheriffs,
rural
urban,
all
of
those
traditional
divides
and
and
so
you're
right.
C
The
mixed
messaging
has
been
a
challenge
not
just
from
the
top,
but
also
looking
sub-nationally
state
by
state,
but
looking
within
states
and
looking
at
those
realities
and
the
application.
From
your
perspective,
did
you
see
I
mean
six
months
even
six
months
ago?
Did
you
think
we'd
be
where
we
are
today?
300
plus
thousand
lives
lost,
or
did
you
think
that
we
would
get
it
and
get
something
done
more
impactfully
in
terms
of
mitigating
the
spread
and
transmission
of
this
disease?.
D
C
D
Doubt
I
thought
the
latter
governor
I
I
was
very
disappointed.
What
I
was
hoping
that
we
would
see
is
that
when
we
had
the
real
serious
challenge
in
the
late
winter
and
early
spring
of
2020,
when
new
york
was
really
getting
hit
badly
and
they
were
sort
of
dominating
the
situation
in
the
country,
I
would
have
thought
that,
as
we
came
down
to
a
baseline
we'd,
get
down
to
such
a
low
baseline,
that
we'd
be
able
to
contain
these
blips
that
occurred.
D
But
if
you
go
back
historically
and
look
at
the
at
at
the
that
the
evolution
of
the
outbreak,
we
had
the
big
hump
as
it
were
in
the
late
winter
and
early
spring.
But
instead
of
going
down
to
a
very
low
baseline,
it
went
down
to
a
baseline
of
20
000
cases
a
day
which
is
a
lot
of
cases
of
infection.
And
then
we
went
along
at
that
level
and
we
decided
appropriately
that
we
were
going
to
try
to
open
up
the
country.
We
wanted
to
bring
back
the
economy.
D
So
it
was
open
up
america
again
and
we
put
together
a
number
of
guidelines
that
I
spent
a
lot
of
time
with
my
colleague,
deborah
burks
and
others
in
the
on
the
task
force,
gateway
phase,
one
phase,
two
phase
three-
that
would
have
been
great
except
that,
given
the
federalist
approach
in
this
country,
multiple
states
did
it
very
differently.
So,
instead
of
opening
up
and
going
down
with
the
baseline,
we
went
up
to
70
000
cases
a
day.
D
D
As
we
had
these
individual
little
blips,
we
could
do
identification,
isolation
and
contact
tracing
and
we'd
be
in
good
shape.
The
only
trouble
is
when
you
have
70
80,
90
100
000
community
cases.
On
a
given
day.
It
makes
it
almost
impossible
to
do
effective
identification,
isolation
and
contact
tracing,
so
we've
been
hit
badly
and,
unfortunately,
california
has
hit
right
now
currently
as
bad
as
anybody,
if
not
worse,
yeah.
C
Our
positivity
rate,
not
as
bad
as
many
other
states,
but
we
we
certainly
have
seen
the
impact
in
our
icus
and
hospitals
in
certain
parts
of
the
state,
southern
california,
san
joaquin
valley,
central
valley.
Broadly,
and
that's
certainly
the
case.
It's
interesting.
You
talk
about
contact
tracing,
you
know.
Five
months
ago
we
were
all
talking
about
contact
tracing,
we
were
put
together,
contract
tasting
workforce
and
we
partnered
with
ucsf
and
ucla
and
started
training
workers,
and
we
got
a
lot
of
our
state
staff
to
contribute.
C
But
a
lot
of
folks
aren't
talking
about
it
right
now
and
I
think
it's
the
point
you're
making
is
the
magnitude
now
of
the
community
spread,
puts
so
much
pressure
and
makes
almost
the
incapacity
to
substantively
trace
now.
Isolate
and
quarantine.
Is
that
I
mean
is
that
I
mean.
Is
that
point
the
point
you
were
making
or
is
that,
should
we
should
we
actually
double
down
now
on
the
isolation
contact
racing,
despite
those
headwinds,
despite
the
magnitude
of
the
community
spread.
D
So
I
think,
if
we
just
very,
very
much
utilize
that
testing
in
schools
for
teachers,
even
ultimately
for
the
students
intermittently,
you
could
get
a
good
feel
for
what
the
penetrance
of
infection
is,
and
you
can
do
something
about
it
so,
rather
than
individual
identification,
isolation
and
contact
tracing,
which
we
shouldn't
abandon.
There's
still
a
role
for
that.
I
think
we
should
put
much
more
emphasis
on
community
type
of
surveillance
testing
so
that
you
get
a
feel
for
where
you
are
where
you
are
with
schools,
with
prisons
with
nursing
homes.
D
C
Of
pcr
versus
anagen
and
you're
making
a
case
anew
for
for
antigen
testing,
despite
some
of
the
false
positive
debates,
car
are
you
I
mean
it's
interesting.
I
mean
it's
sort
of
someone
described
to
me
the
difference
between
the
tests
and
sort
of
layman's
terms
like
an
x-ray
or
an
mri.
We
keep
focusing
on
these
mris
these
pcr
tests
when
x-rays
may
work,
just
for
broad
understanding
of
community
spread
exactly
what
what
do
we
need
to
do
more?
C
D
You
know
that's
a
great
question
governor.
I
think
it's
a
multi-faceted
reason.
I
don't
think
there's
been
one
reason
why
we've
not
done.
I
think
it's
just
a
gradual
evolution
now
we're
starting
to
realize
the
well.
Some
of
us
realized
that
all
along
but
we're
starting
to
now
putting
the
putting
the
pressure
on.
We
really
need
to
do
this.
We
need
to.
D
We
we've
shown
that
when
you
do
that
kind
of
testing
like
in
universities
and
colleges,
the
ones
who've
done
it
right,
have
a
very
low
level
of
infection
where
you
can
just
continually
screen
and
then,
when
you
get
somebody
who's
infected,
you
pull
them
out
of
circulation.
You
keep
them
isolated
for
a
while,
and
then
you
bring
them
back
rather
than
closing
everything
down
when
someone
gets
infected
that
doesn't
work
well
and
we've
proven
that
it
doesn't
work
well.
C
What
do
we
say-
and
I've
heard
some
of
your
public
comments
around
the
importance
of
default
for
in-person
instruction
for
social
emotional,
not
just
data
and
intellectual
purpose
or
academic
purely
wrote,
but
on
the
basis
of
also
the
epidemiology
and
the
basis
of
spread
or
the
lack
thereof
comparatively?
What
do
you
say
to
to
anxious
parents?
I've
got
four
young
kids.
We
have
two
anxious
parents
at
home.
That
includes
me.
What
do
we
say
to
the
millions
of
others?
C
D
Yeah,
we
can
do
it
safely
and
I
think
there
are
two
elements
to
that.
One
is
the
safety
of
the
children
and
it's
the
safety
and
concern
appropriate
concern
that
the
teachers
have.
So
my
as
you
know
you
alluded
to
governor
just
a
moment
ago.
My
stance
has
been
that
we
should
use
as
our
default
position
getting
the
children
back
to
school
and
keeping
them
in
school
by
putting
together
a
program
of
supporting
ways
to
prevent
infection
by
giving
the
schools
and
the
teachers
the
resources
that
they
may
need
to.
D
Do
that,
including
what
I
was
alluding
to
just
a
moment
ago,
of
testing
them
and
doing
testing
of
the
teachers
and
of
the
students
in
a
surveillance
way.
We
know
something
that
we
didn't
fully
appreciate
several
months
ago,
that,
unlike
influenza,
where
the
children
get
infected
and
they
come
home
and
they
infect
the
parents.
D
It
looks
now
like
if
you
look
at
the
school
as
a
unit
where
people
are
versus
the
community
and
the
home
as
a
unit
where
people
are
the
children
in
school
seem
to
be
doing
better
when
it
comes
to
the
level
of
infection
than
whatever
going
on
in
the
community,
so
that
was
almost
counter-intuitive,
but
it's
turning
out
to
be
that
way.
So
with
that
as
an
epidemiological
bit
of
data,
what
we
should
do
is
to
do
everything
to
support
the
maintenance
of
the
children
in
school.
D
C
Yeah,
I
know
I
appreciate
and
doctor
I'm
very
sensitive
to
your
time.
Just
a
few
additional
questions.
I
mean
the
top
question,
we're
all
getting
right
now
and-
and
I
I'm
of
the
humble
opinion
we
all
should
be
a
little
humble
because
I
think
it's
an
extraordinary
accomplishment,
and
I
want
to
just
congratulate
you
and
all
the
team
vice
president
on
down
on
operation
warp
speed.
I
think
it's
an
extraordinary
accomplishment,
the
idea
that
you
know
I
was
here
in
february
learning
about
this
virus
think
and
it
was
corona.
C
It
was
cn.
I
didn't
even
understand
it.
We
had
a
princess
cruise
line
off
the
coast
of
california.
We
were
starting
to
bring
repatriation
flights
for
mulan,
no
other
state
wanted
those
flights,
and
we
were
just
grappling
with
the
idea
that
now
we've
already
applied
administered
over
300
000
doses-
I
think,
is
extraordinary.
So
I
say
that
with
respect
that
is,
I
think,
deserved
is
well
earned
by
all
of
you
that
made
that
possible,
but
there's
been
some
frustration.
C
A
little
bit
of
frustration.
We
may
have
over
promised
a
little
bit
in
the
short
run
about
the
availability
in
the
distribution
of
the
vaccine.
Have
you
adjusted
based
upon
some
of
your
previous
comments
where
you
expect
we
will
be.
I
know,
we've
gotten
into
herd
immunity
conversation.
Is
it
70
75
80,
85
percent,
but
but
moreover,
what's
your
sense?
C
What
do
you
say
to
someone
who's
looking
out
and
it's
just
hoping
they're
gonna
have
a
fourth
of
july
like
they
had
two
years
ago,
or
is
it
really
september
october
reality
of
some
semblance
of
normalcy?
Are
we
behind
a
number
of
months
or
are
we
within
a
margin
of
error?
Third
quarter?
Second,
quarter
of
the
next
year
of
hitting
close
to
hurt
immunity.
D
D
So
they've
delivered
11
million
doses
and
there
have
been
about
two
to
three
million
people.
Who've
been
vaccinated,
that's
below
the
2020,
but
as
we
get
into
january,
the
feeling
is
that
we're
going
to
gain
momentum
to
be
able
to
catch
up
so
that
my
feeling,
then,
is
let's
assume
governor
that
we
do
catch
up
and
I'll
answer
the
rest
of
your
questions,
which
are
all
important
questions.
If
we
go
through
the
priority
people,
we
started
off
with
health
care
workers
and
people
in
nursing
homes
and
long-term
care
facilities.
D
D
If
we
then
diligently
vaccinate
people
in
april
may
june
july
that
we
will
gradually
and
noticeably
get
a
degree
of
protection
approaching
herd
immunity,
which
I
believe,
first
of
all,
no
one
really
knows
what
absolute
herd
immunity
is
for
coronavirus.
We
know
what
it
is
for
measles,
because
we
have
decades
of
experience
with
measles,
so
I
would
say
it's
somewhere
between
70
and
85.
C
That's
encouraging
and
final
question
a
lot
of
asked.
You
know
lessons
learned,
1918,
so
many
ways,
some
similar
contours,
the
politics,
the
politicalization
of
masks,
even
back
102
years
ago,
some
of
the
issues
around
surge-
some
have
suggested
we're
in
a
second
wave.
Some
have
suggested.
This
is
a
third
wave.
Some
suggested
it's.
You
know
this,
it's
insignificant
debate,
but
there
is
a
sense
that
there
is
a
hopefulness
rather
not
just
sense
that
this
may
be
the
last
big
surge
and
someone
describes
surge
on
top
of
a
surge.
C
You
have
others
surge
on
top
of
a
surge
on
top
of
a
surge
with
the
prospect
now
christmas
hanukkah,
obviously
the
holidays,
more
broadly
defined
new
year's.
Do
you
believe
this
is
the
last
big
surge
that
we
will
have
to
battle
through.
D
So
I
believe,
with
those
two
things,
adherence
to
the
kind
of
things
that
you've
been
talking
about
in
california,
the
public
health
measures
and
as
we
gradually
get
more
and
more
people
vaccinated,
we're
going
to
be
looking
at
this
thing
in
the
rear
view
mirror.
I
can
you
know,
I'm
I'm
very
confident
that
if
we
do
those
things
right,
that
will
happen.
C
I
appreciate
it
and
forgive
me
for
belaboring
just
one
quick
question
because
we're
in
the
midst
of
this
intense
dialectic
not
in
the
midst
we've
been
for
many
many
months
on
stay-at-home
orders
on
guidelines,
modifications
to
how
businesses
operate.
I
come
from
a
private
sector
background
restaurants,
hotels,
bars
and
wineries
that
have
all
been
impacted.
C
So
I
it's
not
it's
not
an
intellectual
exercise
for
me
as
a
as
an
entrepreneur
before
I
got
into
elected
office
and
the
impact
the
emotional
impact,
not
just
financial
impact
of
people
whose
entire
dreams
are
on
the
line
in
terms
of
that
entrepreneurial
mindset
and
the
impact
it's
having
on
their
families
and
that
those
that
they
employ
and
they
support.
C
There's
this
intense
debate
we're
all
having
around
the
issue
of
the
economy
or
public
health
and-
and
I
just
I've
heard
you
say
it
before,
and
I
I
just
it's
so
important
if
you
can
just
help
amplify
the
public
health
message
is
the
gateway
economic
message
to
get
us
exactly
where
you
just
described.
We're
about
to
go.
D
You
well,
you
said
it
very
well.
I've
been
saying
this
now,
for
you
know
nine
or
ten
months
ever
since
we
tried
to
so-called
open
up
the
economy
again,
and
that
is,
we
need
to
use
public
health
measures
as
a
vehicle,
a
gateway,
a
tool
to
get
the
economy
back.
It
isn't
the
economy
versus
public
health,
it's
public
health,
bridging
you
to
getting
the
economy
back.
That's
what
we've
got
to
realize
and
not
say.
I
don't
want
to
do
this
because
I
want
the
economy
to
open.
C
I
appreciate-
and
let
me
just
close
as
only
a
former
san
francisco
mayor-
can,
by
quoting
the
late
great
jerry,
garcia
of
the
grateful
dead
who's
asked,
or
rather
once
stated
that
you
don't
want
to
be
the
best
of
the
best.
You
want
to
be
the
only
one
that
does
what
you
do.
That
is
a
great
way
to
describe
you,
dr
fauci,
a
national
treasure,
I'm
humbled,
honored
and
so
grateful
for
everything
you've
done
for
our
country.
Thank
you.