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From YouTube: 8-9-21 City Council work session
Description
Des Moines City Council morning work session on Monday, August 9, 2021.
View the agenda: https://DSM.city/CouncilMeetings
A
B
C
D
All
right,
thank
you.
Scott
good
morning,
everyone
corey
bogen
rape,
principal
traffic,
engineer
here
at
city
des
moines,
so
I'm
going
to
give
a
little
overview
of
the
southwest
infrastructure
planning
study
and
then
I'm
going
to
turn
it
over
to
our
consultant
team,
lead
jesse
core
with
felsberg,
holt
and
olivig,
to
get
through
the
bulk
of
the
presentation.
D
So
we've
got
a
lot
of
information
to
go
through,
so
I'm
going
to
go
ahead
and
jump
right
in
again
we're
here
to
talk
about
southwest
infrastructure
and
planning
study,
I'm
going
to
give
a
little
overview
talk
about
the
purpose.
Why
we're
doing
this
study
talk
about
the
goals
and
then
I'll
turn
it
over
to
jesse
to
talk
about
kind
of
the
process
we've
had
to
date,
some
of
the
recommendations
that
have
come
out
of
our
stakeholder
input
and
open
house
that
we
had
a
couple
weeks
ago,
we'll
touch
on
the
grayslake
wetland
analysis.
D
That
was
a
component
of
the
study
and
then
we'll
wrap
up
talk
about
the
next
steps
and
key
dates
for
the
project.
So
this
may
be
repeat:
information
for
you
and
you'll
probably
know
this
information,
but
just
as
a
refresher
of
why
we're
doing
this
study
back
in
the
late
90s
early
2000s,
there
was
a
study
and
a
plan
put
in
place
called
the
southwest
connector
and
that's
basically
the
extension
of
a
veteran's
parkway.
D
That
kind
of
goes
diagonal
through
this
study
area
goes
on
an
old
rail
line
and
past
graze
lake
to
southwest
7th,
and
that
study
was
really
needed
for
number
one
growth
in
this
area
so
expected
traffic
growth
and
then,
at
that
time
the
des
moines
international
airport
had
planned
to
move
the
terminal
to
the
west
side
of
the
airport.
And
since
then
the
airport
has
now
decided.
D
You
know,
they're
pursuing
the
terminal
on
the
east
side
of
the
airport
along
fleur
drive,
and
so
because
of
that
there
hasn't
been
as
much
growth
in
the
area
as
expected,
and
so
traffic
volumes
didn't
reach
the
forecast
levels
with
those
changes.
So
in
2018
the
southwest
connector
was
removed
from
the
long-range
transportation
plan,
and
so
what
this
study
is
is
now
that
that
is
no
longer
the
plan.
Then
what
is
the
plan?
D
What
improvements
do
we
need
to
make
to
the
area,
and
so
what
we're
really
talking
about
is
the
study
area
shown
here
in
red,
which
is
about
highway
20
28
on
the
west
side
over
to
southwest
seven,
so
some
of
the
goals
of
the
project.
I
should
step
back.
One
second
also
here
shown-
and
I
mentioned
the
gray's
lake
wetland
analysis-
that's
shown,
I'm
just
south
of
grey's
lake
in
the
green
area
and
then
the
area
shown
in
blue
we're
gonna
kind
of
touch
a
little
bit
on
that.
D
So
some
of
the
goals
of
the
study,
really
we
want
to
establish
that
regional,
multimodal
transportation
infrastructure
and
we
want
to
develop
a
strategy
to
implement
that.
So
how
can
we
prioritize
projects-
and
you
know
to
meet
the
goals
as
as
growth
continues,
we
want
to
improve
the
network
reliability.
D
We
want
to
accommodate
that
long-term
economic
development.
You
have
residential
commercial
and
industrial
in
this
area,
so
how
can
we
be
flexible
and
build
our
transportation
network
to
serve
that
future
growth
and
then?
Lastly,
we
want
to
you
know
this.
This
really
focuses
on
around
the
grace
lake
area,
but
really
applies
to
the
whole
study
areas.
How
do
we
protect
that
the
recreational
natural
resources
in
this
area
and
really
build
out
the
infrastructure
to
support
that
existing
system
and
expand
it?
E
Good
morning,
happy
monday,
my
name
is
jesse
poor
with
feldsberg
holding
the
levig.
It's
been
a
pleasure
to
work
on
the
study
alongside
corey
and
the
staff
and
city
and
other
departments
also
a
pleasure
to
meet
some
of
you
who
came
out
to
our
open
house,
which
we
had
about
a
week
and
a
half
ago,
interacting
with
some
of
the
information.
E
Some
of
it,
which
is
presented
today
in
presenting
the
slides,
certainly
would
be
open
to
any
interaction
or
questions
that
come
up
as
we
make
a
presentation,
but
I'm
going
to
go
through,
like
I
said
our
process
and
kind
of
what's
coming
next
down
the
the
recommendations.
Oh
you
already
advanced
the
slides
for
me.
So
the
first
step
that
we
did
was
to
create
an
advisory
committee
and
a
stakeholder
group
that
would
help
formulate
some
of
the
understanding
and
the
background
and
also
the
the
needs
and
goals
that
corey
went
over.
E
An
extension
of
the
project
also
identified
the
south
of
gray's
lake
master
plan,
and
so
that
took
a
cohort
from
the
stakeholder
group
and
also
added
a
few
for
the
specific
need
of
the
development
plan
to
create
an
advisory
committee
which
met
separately
and
then
reported
back
to
the
stakeholder
group.
A
lot
of
that
purpose
was
to
identify
any
opportunities
to
capitalize
on
thomas
back
improvements
that
might
need
to
be
made
in
concert.
So
a
lot
of
fun
input
and
addition
of
that
group
was
able
to.
E
I
think,
catalyzed
a
lot
more
input
on
this
on
this
project.
The
infrastructure
project
than
maybe
would
have
been
otherwise.
At
last
count,
we
sent
out
information
to
over
300
individuals,
community
members
about
recommendations
that
would
be
coming
forward
and
we
had
great
attendance
at
the
public
meeting.
We
had
over
90
people
sign
in
which
was
great
to
to
experience
and
be
a
part
of,
especially
on
the
heels
of
dovid.
E
No
real
surprises
there
with
sort
of
the
justification
for
the
study
overall,
identifying
over
time,
some
of
the
the
intersections
that
would
start
to
break
down
and
some
of
the
roadways
that
might
need
to
be
improved
since
the
southwest
connector
wasn't
going
to
come
through.
There
still
is
a
need
to
address
some
of
those
those
optimization
opportunities
and
identify
the
network
changes
that
would
allow
the
higher
level
goals
that
we
address
to
be
accomplished.
E
Not
only
did
we
look
at
the
the
roadway
infrastructure,
but
we
heard
a
lot
of
input
from
the
active
transportation
group,
the
natural
resources
ideas,
transit
needs
as
well,
and
so
those
were
top
of
mind
as
well
as
we
were
looking
at
different
network
changes.
What
could
be
done
to
accelerate
other
opportunities
beyond
just
the
roadway,
the
airport,
layout
and
development
plan,
specifically,
the
development
plan
which
came
through
as
we
were
doing.
E
One
of
the
main
things
that
came
through,
obviously
as
we
get
to
our
recommendations
were
the
typologies
that
move
dsm
identifies
topologies
for
a
lot
of
the
roadways
the
major
arterials
collected
throughout
the
community,
and
so
what
you
see
here
on
the
screen
is
a
lot
of
what
our
game
plan
is
for
typologies.
That
would
move
people
through
this
infrastructure
study
area,
as
corey
said
all
the
way
from
willow,
creek
intersection
with
highway
28
all
the
way
up
to
southwest
7th
street.
E
We
continued
our
study
into
the
connection
with
southwest
2nd
as
well,
because
of
that
south
of
graze,
like
master
plan
and
the
no
the
knowledge
that
there's
going
to
be
increased
pressure
in
there
as
well
one
of
the
main
bullets
there.
The
second
one
is
just
the
truck
route
directness
and
reliability.
E
E
So
as
an
engineering
company,
we've
obviously
looked
at
the
different
roadway
alignments,
that's
what
you
see
in
the
different
boxes.
There
studying
about
12
different
segments
or
alignments
willow,
creek
southwest
56th
street,
a
new
alignment
in
the
southwest
corner.
We
also
looked
at
different
approaches
to
southwest
56
north
of
mckinley
how
to
handle
park,
avenue
george
flagg
transition
and
then
all
the
way
into
bell
avenue
and
thomas
beck.
So
a
lot
of
I'm
going
to
talk
about
today
really
isolates
a
handful
of
the
major
segments
that
we
studied.
E
The
report
obviously
will
go
through
every
segment
that
we
studied.
I
don't
have
time
and
I
don't
think,
there's
a
lot
of
value
in
unpacking
all
of
them,
but
I
am
going
to
go
through
the
yellow
ones
today.
Suffice
it
to
say
a
lot
of
the
development
pressure
that
will
happen
in
the
southwest
quadrant
will
lead
to
the
need
for
improved
infrastructure,
but
decisions
will
need
to
be
made
on
southwest
56
north
of
mckinley
george
flank.
Parkway,
obviously,
is
the
elephant
in
the
room.
I
think
and
then
park
avenue.
E
George
flagging
southwest
46
intersection
was
a
significant
area
of
focus
for
us,
as
well
with
the
south
of
grades,
like
master
plan
and
thomas
beck.
Road
improvements
we're
dovetailing
those
together,
as
those
recommendations
come
out
for
a
master
plan
and
the
ultimate
land
use,
improvements
to
thomas
beck
will
be
addressed
as
well.
We
also
heard
and
advanced
recommendations
for
the
supporting
the
indianola
hills
neighborhood.
Obviously,
our
study
focused
on
thomas
beck
and
and
indiana
road,
but
then
there's
interactions
between
southwest
9th
and
southwest
7th
and
2nd.
So
some
of
those
recommendations
come
forward.
E
Okay,
we're
doing
good,
sounds
good
for
southwest
56
and
mckinley
this
between
southwest
mckinley
and
park.
This
became
a
immediate
focus
area
because
a
land
use
plan
identifies
business
park
in
the
area
and
you
have
development
pressure,
sort
of
single
family
residential
on
the
west
side
and
then
in
the
future
business
park,
operations
or
office
in
the
future.
E
On
the
east
side,
watrus
avenue
becomes
important,
the
connection
to
park
avenue
and
whether
we
make
the
connection
to
southwest
mckinley
or
not
was
a
large
conversation
that
was
had
by
a
handful
of
folks
in
the
stakeholder
group,
and
so
we
look
at
that.
The
airport
runway
timing
is
very
much
unknown,
certainly
was
understood
that
the
intersection
is
overlaid
by
the
airport
runway
protection
zone,
and
so
it
is
kind
of
off
limits
for
development.
E
But
it's
still
in
private
ownership,
so
adjacent
to
the
roadway,
so
with
increasing
residential
development
pressure,
you're
going
to
see
increasing
traffic
loads
on
that
roadway,
but
once
business
park
operations
happen
or
office,
development
happens
to
the
east
certainly
is
going
to
be
a
need
for
connectivity
to
highway
28
in
multiple
locations.
So
our
recommendations
are
continued,
obviously
to
keep
continuity
to
highway
28
and
park
avenue,
and
so
we
do
see
the
need
to
continue
to
connect
southwest
56
to
southwest
mckinley
avenue.
E
So
there
you
can
see
on
the
screen
there.
The
recommendations
that
I'll,
like
the
high
level
recommendations
that
come
through,
do
make
that
connection
to
southwest
mckinley.
A
decision
will
need
to
be
made
about
the
airport
and
the
city
obtaining
the
property
to
put
that
alignment
in
eventually,
I
think
the
development,
though
the
need
for
improving
the
intersection,
will
likely
happen
before
the
airport
runway
actually
happens.
E
So
a
decision
will
need
to
be
made
there
regarding
that,
on
the
north
side,
you'll
see
kind
of
that
southwest
56,
improved
portion
just
south
of
park
avenue
that
was
done
a
while
back
in
anticipation
of
a
t
intersection
with
the
southwest
connector,
and
so
with
that
not
being
present
in
the
future
and
this
continuing
to
become
business
office
park.
You
would
anticipate
needing
to
make
that
connection
somehow.
E
So
we
looked
at
a
handful
of
different
options
to
support
the
existing
subdivisions
that
are
being
approved
on
the
west
side
for
single
family
and
the
business
businesses
that
are
developed
along
that
alignment
as
well.
Unfortunately,
there
are
potential
property
impacts
related
to
either
alignment
that
would
occur,
and
so
we
recommended
going
forward
with
the
original
connection.
There
point
number
four
so
challenge
in
the
design
there.
E
That
alignment
is
intended
to
sort
of
be
a
secondary
connector,
not
a
not
a
through
connection
for
traffic
trying
to
bypass
the
highway
28
park,
avenue
to
george
flagg
sort
of
through
movement,
and
so
a
lot
of
attention
is
going
to
need
to
be
placed
on
traffic
control
and
calming
along
that
alignment
to
prevent
some
of
that
movement
for
george
flagg
parkway.
You
know,
I
think,
folks
who
have
lived
in
the
area
know
it
well
enough.
E
I
don't
need
to
go
too
deep
into
the
study
and
obviously
the
southwest
factor
would
have
elevated
this
alignment
up
out
of
the
floodplain,
which
is
the
major
concern
currently
for
it
being
utilized
efficiently
and
reliably,
and
so
there,
like,
I
said
there
was
a
public
input
about
relieving
pressure.
That's
growing
on
park,
specifically
families
coming
out
concerned
about
access
and
safety
adjacent
to
schools,
school
crossings
and
such
so
not
wanting
to
widen
park
avenue
to
the
east
of
southwest
46
and
george
flagg.
E
Elevating
the
alignment,
though,
is
within
the
floodplain.
A
significant
amount
of
fill
would
be
required,
regardless
of
what
alignment
is
chosen,
and
so
there
is
a
compensatory
or
compensation
of
some
of
that
fill
concern
that
would
be
addressed
with
floodplain,
permitting
we've
had
to
kind
of
think
about
how
to
handle
some
of
that
soil
balancing
requirement.
E
F
E
That's
a
great
question,
so
a
detailed
floodplain
analysis
was
not
done
as
part
of
the
study.
The
understanding
of
what
the
floodplain
elevation
is
today
helped
us
understand
what
those
elevations
would
need
to
be.
If
it
did
go
forward
with
final
design,
you
would
have
zero
impact
and
you
would
need
to
identify
a
way
to
not
have
impact
on
adjacent
properties.
Obviously
I
believe,
if
I
understand,
if
I'm
recalling,
that
the
plan
is
right,
the
flood
the
roadway
doesn't
start
to
elevate
until
further
to
the
northeast
of
the
isaac.
E
E
Our
expectation
would
be
to
recommend
culverts
through
george
flagg's
elevated
alignment
to
allow
for
wildlife
passage
to
prevent
them
from
coming
across
on
top
of
the
road,
but
also
to
act
as
a
way
for
those
plug
the
the
flood
flows
to
to
bypass
pass
back
and
forth
between.
So
it
doesn't
act
as
a
levy,
and
it
creates
some
of
those
concerns
upstream
for
flooding.
E
So
again,
with
the
compensatory
storage
we
were
identifying,
you
can
see
there
on
point
number.
Two
identifying
a
place
within
des
moines
waterworks
park
where
we
might
be
able
to
pull
additional
storage
from,
and
that
has
been
discussed
with
some
of
the
folks
with
the
des
moines
wadworks
foundation
already
so
they're
aware
of
it
and
the
change
in
their
master
plan
of
having
some
facilities
there
in
that
location
has
changed.
So
the
idea
seems
to
be
acceptable
to
them.
At
this
point,.
E
Right
so
in
2040
we
were
looking
anticipating
about
27
000
vehicles
coming
down
park,
avenue,
27
000,
coming
down
park
avenue
and
so
trying
to
figure
out
the
split
between
which
would
take
park
and
which
would
take
george
flagg.
If
this
roadway
segment
is
is
improved,
then
you
see
the
same
amount
of
balance
on
park
avenue
today,
as
you
have
with
the
growth
and
the
increase
being,
basically
we're
expecting
them
to
transfer
over
to
the
georgia
flag
somewhere
between.
E
E
G
E
E
E
E
This
is
illustrative
of
an
area
that
we
would
need
to
calculate
from
it's,
not
a
final
design
or
we
didn't
do
any
grading
plans,
it's
just
where
could
you
take
the
borrow
from
because
for
every
cubic
foot
of
soil
you
put
in
for
george
flagg?
You
need
one
and
a
half
to
come
out
of
this
basin
area
and
so
we're
looking
for
a
place
where
that
could
happen.
The
easiest
place
is
number
two
there
on
the.
H
E
C
G
B
B
C
C
E
Yep,
that's
that's
great
great
discussion,
thanks
for
bringing
up
those
ideas
during
the
conversation
here,
the
george
flake
parkway,
beyond
the
raising
it
out
of
the
floodplain
you'll,
see
recommendations
for
leveraging
connections
to
great
western
trail,
which
exists
today.
It's
a
fresh
limestone
surface,
which
was
improved
as
a
temporary
improvement
until
the
southwest
connector
would
come
through.
E
So
we've
spent
a
little
time
specifically
on
the
intersection
that
I
just
mentioned:
we've
analyzed
it
from
the
traffic
counts
that
were
just
discussed,
but
also
the
additional
types
of
safety
concerns
that
you
might
have
at
that
intersection.
As
you
experience
those
increased
traffic
volumes
as
well
as
some
of
the
existing
development
that
is
there
today
and
what
might
occur
in
the
future,
as
well
as
natural
resource
concerns
with
bring
creek
and
multimodal
with
great
western
trail
in
2005.
That
intersection
was
improved
and
realigned
slightly
to
its
current
alignment.
E
It
today
is
improved
without
the
raised
medians
that
you
see
further
to
the
west,
but
long
term
can
support.
Traffic
operations
is
suitable
for
the
amount
of
traffic.
That's
expected.
Should
the
improvements
be
made
to
george
black
parkway
to
get
it
up
out
of
the
floodplain,
provide
that
connectivity.
It
does
raise
some
opportunities
to
reevaluate
the
orientation
and
and
for
the
flow
of
the
intersection
itself
proper.
E
For
those
who
are
cyclists,
you
know
the
great
western
trails
prize.
We
just
heard
it
come
up
multiple
times
the
challenges
that
this
intersection
presents,
to
make
your
way
across
park,
avenue
two
at-grade
crossings
and
further
on
south
or
north,
as
well
as
people
who
park
along
southwest
46,
is
a
temporary
alignment
to
get
south
and
enjoy
that
amenity
to
the
south,
as
well
as
the
economic
development
potential
there
on
the
northeast
corner.
E
So
we've
we're
presenting
three
alternatives.
We
did
look
at
a
t,
type
intersection
that
would
bring
park
avenue
up
into
the
sort
of
smooth
out
alignment,
but
we're
not
presenting
that
today.
We'll
we'll
talk
briefly
about
two
intersection
alignments.
The
one
is
what's
there
today
is
improved
to
match
the
existing
cross-section
with
the
raised
medians
and
some
controlled
access
to
north
and
south
to
provide
that
to
efficient
flow
onto
park,
avenue
and
george
flagg
to
have
it
operate
with
the
level
service
that
you
would
need
during
those
peak
hour,
events
that
are
expected
down.
E
The
road
the
intersection
does
work
the
level
of
service
with
the
signalized
intersection.
It
would
support
anything
that
would
occur
down
southwest
46
and
existing
residential
apartments
there
on
the
corner,
but
there
will
be
a
little
bit
restricted
flow
and
challenges
with
maintaining
the
level
surface
as
you
get
to
the
peak
traffic
volume,
so
it
can
work,
but
in
the
concept
we
also
looked
at
I'll
just
touch
on
this
briefly.
This
is
just
a
random,
an
idea
that
came
out
of
trying
to
solve
a
bunch
of
different
problems.
E
Free
creek
adjacent
there
to
the
west
passes
under
a
triple
box,
culvert
that
was
improved
with
that
2005
project,
and
so
it
operates
very
well
today.
But
as
the
watershed
develops
and
more
flows
come
through,
there
is
concern
that
maybe
those
boxes
would
be
undersized
over
time,
as
well
as
potentially
an
opportunity
to
utilize
the
the
easement
or
the
alignment
of
the
creek
a
little
bit
differently.
E
You'll
see
on
the
next
screen
here
we're
recommending
park
avenue,
have
the
bike
infrastructure
on
the
north
side,
so
a
side
path
on
the
north
side
of
park
avenue.
So
this
underpass
under
park
avenue
would
connect
cyclists
up
to
park
avenue
and
then
down
into
lake.
I'm
sorry
what
des
moines
waterworks
park
so
it'll
be
a
recommendation
or
a
concept
that
comes
through
in
our
study,
but
certainly
more
more
to
vet
out
there.
E
If
it's
desired
or
helpful
for
users
to
make
that
improvement,
it
would
really
only
come
forward
if
you
made
improvements
to
the
park
avenue
george
flagg
intersection,
we
looked
at
an
alternative
intersection
alignment
not
to
try
and
be
fancy
or
try
and
push
some
sort
of
specific
idea,
but
just
to
consider
the
alternative
alternate
ranges
of
options
for
the
intersection
there's.
Certainly
some
geometric
challenges.
With
the
skewed
entrance
of
george
flagg
parkway
into
park
avenue
and
with
increased
traffic
flow.
E
A
single
lane
that
would
move
truck
routes
and
vehicles
more
efficiently
from
park
avenue
to
george
black
or
george
flagler
park
avenue
was
considered
and
designed
as
a
sort
of
a
concept,
as
you
can
see
there
on
the
screen
on
that.
On
that
concept,
you
can
see
where
we've
identified
the
opportunity
to
realign
to
the
great
western
trail
underneath
park,
avenue
and
and
connect
back
up
to
the
infrastructure
to
get
people
into
the
park
and
along
park
avenue
why
it
works.
E
You
know
it
improves
the
mode
improvement
safety
for
all
modes
crash
severity
at
roundabouts,
relative
to
signalized
intersections
generally
are
safer,
and
so
there
is
a
benefit
there
with
the
increasing
traffic
over
time.
If
there's
an
opportunity
to
improve
the
intersection
to
consider
a
roundabout
option.
E
E
E
Yes,
sir,
the
the
design
of
the
roundabout
would
be
accommodating
the
highest
intensity
use,
and
so
you
have
roundabouts
across
the
cross
country
being
designed.
Mountable
curb
apron
gives
you
additional
circum
circumference
for
that
tractor
to
make
that
turn
as
well
as
emergency
vehicles.
I
know
our
folks
here
with
the
fire
engines
would
make
sure
that
they
could
be
accommodated
as
well.
E
Yeah,
this
was
well
thought
out
in
terms
of
the
how
we're
trying
to
move
people
off
of
part
on
the
george
flagg,
the
design.
Specifically,
you
see
the
little
nose
there
to
help
get
that
orientation.
Safety
right
takes
away
a
lot
of
the
friction
that
you
would
expect
if
it
wasn't
designed
well,
but
that's
a
long
way
down
the
road,
maybe
a
little
public
art
in
the
middle
of
it.
I
love
the
idea.
E
That's
all
right!
Well,
roundabout
can
work
like
I
said
a
lot.
There
are
some
folks
who
aren't
certain
about
them,
but
they
certainly
do
work.
The
major
thing
about
them
is
that
if
there
are
intersection
impacts
or
accidents
or
crashes,
I
apologize
they
tend
to
be
less
severe.
They
have
less
property
damage,
impacts
and
personal
injuries
and
fatalities.
So
that
would
be
the
biggest
outcome
of
making
a
change
for
that
intersection.
E
A
E
E
Are
you
talking
about,
like
a
multi-use
trail
from
highway
28
to
great
western
trail?
I
think
the
expectation
would
be
a
side
path,
type,
your
eight-foot
side
path
that
would
provide
safe
access
like
multi-use,
yep
yeah.
You
know
multi-use
trail
to
me.
I
sometimes
think
about
it
more.
Like
a
10
foot,
you
know
a
little
bit
more
robust
type
design
for
some
of
the
maintenance
equipment
that
might
be
using
it.
So
I
don't
know
that
it
needs
to
be
that
again,
but
yeah
all
right,
thomas
back.
E
As
I
said,
we've
added
the
south
of
gray's,
like
master
plan
to
this
study,
largely
because
of
you
know
the
opportunity
that
the
city
and
others
see
down
the
road
for
this
in
this
segment.
It's
a
fantabulous
roadway,
a
lot
of
history
for
the
city.
Obviously,
it's
closed
today
do
a
little
slide
on
the
great
parks.
So,
but
we
know
that
there's
additional
capacity
challenges
that
will
be
presented
on
this
segment.
E
The
great
grays
lake
park
master
plan
identified
parking
lot,
a
large
parking
lot
off
of
thomas
beck
road
through
the
stakeholder
involvement.
We've
gone
through
that
our
intent
was
not
to
make
any
changes
to
the
trace
lake
master
plan,
but
we
have
had
the
suggestion
not
to
include
additional
parking
off
of
thomas
beck,
a
parking
lot
into
the
into
the
park.
E
As
far
as
the
alignment
concern
we
kind
of
broke
it
into
two
two
pictures
here,
you
can
see
on
the
screen,
thinking
about
the
traffic
volumes
and
also
the
potential.
What
might
be
there
in
the
future,
there's
some
pieces
that
are
going
to
come
together
here
as
confluence.
Our
teaming
partner
brings
together
their
recommendations
for
development
plan,
our
land
use
plan
for
the
development
area,
but
largely
we're
looking
at
two
lanes
from
floor
to
a
revised
intersection
at.
E
What's
today,
the
bell
avenue
business
park,
this
acts
as
a
very
long
corridor
with
very
little
interruptions,
and
so
we're
basically
recommending
to
add
an
intersection
or
create
an
intersection.
This
is
in
support
of
that
land
use
plan
would
create
a
gateway
into
the
redeveloped
area,
as
well
as
slow
traffic
and
calm.
E
E
If
this
area
does
redevelop
existing
access
management
may
need
to
be
consolidated
to
be
supportive
of
the
master
plan,
so
all
in
all
a
really
good
opportunity
to
enhance
this
corridor
and
allow
for
the
redevelopment
that's
expected
and
support
the
multi-modal
connections
coming
kind
of
to
the
end
of
the
infrastructure
study,
just
real
briefly,
indianola
hills,
neighborhood
area
had
great
representation
at
our
open
house,
which
was
awesome
to
interact
with
them.
They
had
a
lot
of
good
ideas.
E
Our
infrastructure
study,
the
traffic
analysis,
roadway
capacity
really
looks
at
that
throughput
along
thomas
beck
and
southwest
9th.
I'm
sorry
indianola
road,
but
we
do
look
at
the
capacity
and
sort
of
the
operation
at
the
intersection
with
southwest
9th
and
and
thomas
back.
Basically,
at
that
point,
so
we've
identified
some
improvements
there.
We
don't
look
any
further
south
on
southwest
9th,
but
certainly
future
traffic
studies
can
can
identify
improvements
as
well.
Beyond
this
infrastructure
study,
we
do
know
there's
constraints.
E
E
G
E
E
G
G
H
K
Yep,
honorable
city
council,
steve,
never
city,
engineer,
yeah
we've
had
mobile
requests,
including
our
discussion.
Earlier
this
year,
councilman
obama
and
cosmonagato
we've
had
multiple
requests
to
to
look
at
and
study
the
quota
to
the
south.
We
have
not.
We
have
not
done
a
study
or
developed
that
we've
been
the
latest
thing.
That's
been
working
with
our
parks
department.
How
do
we
improve
pedestrian
and
pedestrian
access
and
improve
sidewalks
along
the
corner,
but
we
have
not
looked
at.
I
don't
know
overall.
G
And
I
know
we've
had
for
years
at
least
four
to
five
years,
since
the
angry
goldfish
has
been
there
he's
asked
for
a
stop
like
there.
I
I
don't
believe,
that's
the
fix.
I
mean
the
lanes
are
very
thin
through
there
and
I
don't
know
if
we
just
we
take
it
down
to
you
know
two
lanes
with
the
turning
lane.
I
don't
know
how
that's
I
know
when
we
talked
about
that
right
when
we
started
doing
the
southwest
9th
revitalization.
G
G
Either
slow
things
down
or
I
mean
like
I
said
we
we
tried
to
we,
we
tried
and
I'm
christine,
and
I
was
on
that
committee
along
with
others.
There
was
probably
a
hundred
different
people
and
when
we
brought
up
that
two
lanes
with
one
turning
lane
and
and
access
for
multi-modal
on
each
side
that
they
immediately
pushed
back,
I
mean
so
I
mean
that
that
will
be
a
challenge
to
do
something
like
that.
G
Yeah,
I
don't
think
so
they
want
to
use
that
as
a
as
a
thoroughfare
to
get
to
and
from
downtown
as
a
main
corridor
through
through
there.
You
know,
I,
I
think,
they're
going
to
push
more
for
wider
lanes
to
to
make
that
turn
in
instead
of
less
lanes.
You
know
what
I
mean:
they're
they're,
that's.
That
was
the
push
that
we
heard
okay
for
years,
that
one
speed.
No,
it
will
not.
I
I'm
not
agreeing
with
them.
I'm
just
telling
you
that's!
E
The
area
has
specific
excavation
limits
for
soils.
It
is
cleared
for
various
uses
that
are
identified
in
in
that
purchase
agreement,
but
about
four
parcels.
Partial
part
of
four
parcels
are
under.
What's
called
covenant,
restrictions
that
would
limit
their
ability
to
be
developed
beyond
just
parking
lots,
the
existing
maintenance
building,
other
types
of
development
type
situations,
and
certainly
not
additional
excavation
without
expensive
testing.
E
But
we
did
have
to
truncate
some
of
the
overall
recommendations
for
wetlands
to
stay
on
the
west
side
of
that
comrades
family
trail.
To
avoid
those
restricted
covenant
parcels,
there
were
also
challenges
with
excavation
depth
and
storage
for
this
location
to
be
handled
and
used
as
a
wetland,
it
needs
to
have
a
suitable
volume,
that's
also
as
well
as
the
depth.
So
the
challenges
with
this
is
at
the
bottom
of
a
very
large
watershed
about
260
acres
of
watershed
draining
to
this
location,
and
it's
very
long
and
narrow.
E
So
you
have
very
little
distance
in
order
to
treat
that
stormwater
coming
in
as
well
as
the
depth,
and
so
it's
already
below
ground
a
lot
of
wetlands.
You
want
it
to
come
in
at
a
higher
level
filter
down
in.
We
already
have
to
excavate
down
fairly
deep,
just
to
get
to
any
type
of
a
permanent
pool
or
opportunity
for
treatment
pool
to
occur.
E
So
another
kind
of
challenge
that
we
had
to
wrestle
with
with
our
design
and
the
grading
plan,
the
drainage
pathway.
As
I
said,
it's
very
long
and
narrow,
and
so
we
have
three
points
of
entry.
We
had
to
create
a
circum
navigating
opportunity
for
that
storm
water
flow
to
filter
out
and
go
into
micro
treatment
locations
and
provide
that
water
quality
ponding.
E
We
also
met
on
site
with
the
park
staff,
the
graze
lake
park
staff
that
were
there
as
well
as
headquarters
staff
to
understand
opportunities
for
staffing
and
resourcing
the
establishment
and
ongoing
operation
maintenance
of
the
of
the
wetland.
There's
currently
not
a
facility
like
this
anywhere
in
the
parks
department
for
the
city
of
des
moines.
E
There
was
expectation
that
there
would
be
walking
trails
and
trail
connectivity
throughout
the
wetland
design,
so
pedestrian
bridges
and
interaction
between
the
storm,
water
and
those
pedestrian,
bridges
and
trails
was
a
challenge
as
well
and
connection
to
the
redevelopment
to
the
south.
Also
led
to
some
of
the
concept
of
how
the
grading
plan
looked
so
the
next
slide
shows
kind
of
how
that
layout
would
go
with
again
the
constriction
to
the
parcels
that
aren't
under
covenant
restriction.
E
We've
identified
the
low
flow
path
and
a
handful
of
locations,
I
think
12
micro
pools
where
stormwater
would
would
would
treat
be
treated
before
it
discharged
in
the
graze
lake.
There
are
three
significant
sediment
basins:
the
the
main
concern
there
is
one
they're
designed
well
enough,
but
two
that
they
can
be
accessed
for
maintenance.
E
I
have
a
nice
flow-through
model.
I
can
send
you
the
link
that
you
can
watch
it
kind
of
fill
up
and
fall
out,
but
it's
designed
really
it's
its
potential
is
for
a
two-year
design
storm.
It
really
can't
serve
anything
more
than
that
and
so
about
every
other
year.
You
would
you
know
on
on
a
relative
basis.
E
You
would
expect
this
thing
would
fill
up
to
the
brim
and
overflow
into
graze
lake
park,
so
lots
of
potential
for
it
to
fill
up
and
drain
out,
but
some
of
those
larger
storm
events
are
going
to
not
be
able
to
be
treated
with
this
particular
location
and
size
and
layout.
Just
because
of
like
I
said,
the
amount
of
excavation
that
would
need
to
be
happening
to
provide
that
pool,
but
it
would
be
an
amazing
amenity.
E
It
certainly
would
provide
some
of
the
water
quality
and
we've
definitely
thought
through
how
to
navigate
people
through
they're
not
shown
on
this
illustration.
But
you
can
see
about
four
locations
where
we
have
pedestrian
bridges
and
in
our
cost
estimate
we
basically
put
in
a
basic
cost
of
again
a
multi-use
trail,
concrete
sort
of
as
a
mid
middle
of
the
ground
type
of
cost
estimate.
E
I
think
you
could
go
more
expensive,
with
sort
of
a
boardwalk
type
of
a
concept
which
would
flood
quite
often
and
have
a
lot
more
maintenance
to
the
other
extreme,
where
you
could
just
leave
it
as
a
sort
of
a
native
grass
walking
trail
with
a
couple
of
locations
where
you
provided
some
entries
with
a
paved
pavement
into
the
wetland
structure.
I
think
a
lot
of
that
concept
would
be
vetted
out
over
time,
but
all
those
assumptions
need
to
come
forward,
so
we
kind
of
get
an
opinion
of
probable
cost
of
construction
again.
E
This
is
just
for
construction
and
design.
There's
also
staffing
and
establishment
maintenance
costs
that
would
go
on
top
of
this,
but
estimating
kind
of
a
cost
bracket
gives
you
a
level
of
understanding
of
what
might
go
into
checking
this
out.
There's
a
lot
of
excavation
that
would
be
needed.
A
lot
of
excavation
will
be
needed.
E
I
think
it
would
be
a
neat
asset
if
it
could
be
built.
As
you
can
see,
we
went
through
a
lot
of
the
infrastructure
study
today,
but
not
all
of
it
unfortunately
can't
go
into
that
much
detail.
The
next
steps
for
us
is
to
assign
some
of
the
traffic
controls
related
to
the
south
of
graziac
master
plan,
as
it's
coming
through
after
the
public
input,
meeting,
they're,
refining
their
recommendations,
and
so
we'll
balance
our
traffic
accounts
based
on.
What's
coming
out
of
that
recommendation,
we'll
find
our
preferred
concept
for
george
flagg
parkway.
E
We
did
look
at
two
alternatives
for
george
flagg.
This
was
the
one
we
talked
about
today
that
we're
advancing,
makes
the
most
sense,
and
so
we'll
start
developing
our
cost
estimates
and
bring
those
forward
so,
as
was
discussed
earlier
today,
sort
of
which
projects
and
what's
the
timing
of
them
and
what
would
be
the
triggers
for
those
projects
to
go
forward.
E
E
G
E
Alternative
to
for
george
flagg
yeah,
we
pulled
that
one
out
after
discussion
last
week.
The
alternative.
The
concept
was
very
similar
to
alternative
one.
The
difference
is
we
tried
to
minimize
the
amount
of
fill
that
would
be
needed
in
order
to
do
that.
We
flipped
the
great
western
trail
alignment
and
the
george
flagg
alignment
and
coming
through
all
of
our
criteria.
It
really.
It
was
a
lose-lose-lose
situation.
E
J
L
Good
morning,
mayor
members
of
council,
john
t
kipp,
chief
of
the
fire
department,
thank
you
for
the
opportunity
to
come
before
you
today
and
talk
about
fire
department
operations.
I
also
have
with
me
assistant
chief
todd
francisco
who's
in
charge.
His
duties
also
include
and
be
in
charge
of
our
training
and
assistant
chief
percy
coleman,
whose
dues
include
the
operations
he's
the
one
who
the
daily
shift
commanders
work
with
and
and
and
make
make
our
operations
go.
L
So
the
basic
questions
are,
in
addition
to
things
like
citizen
survey,
the
outcomes
that
the
manager
is
providing
all
of
you
in
the
kpis
and
response
time.
The
service
level
expectation
is
about.
How
much
can
we
produce
with
the
number
of
people
in
the
apparatus
we
have,
and
so
what
we've
used
for
a
number
of
years
is
simultaneously
having
two
structure,
fires
and
three
ems
calls.
At
the
same
time,
obviously,
the
pressure
that
comes
on
that
is
over
time.
All
volumes
go
up
that
stretches
the
resources.
H
H
L
An
ems
call
things
like
that.
Those
are
used
to
put
together
what's
called
the
standard
of
cover.
This
is
how
many
people
it
takes
to
do
these
functions
and
that's
a
community
and
a
council
conversation
about
what
do
you
want
the
new
service
level
expectation
to
be
and
that
that's
a
process
where
I
think
we
we
literally
are
out
in
the
public
with
the
neighborhoods
doing
an
education
piece
on
this
is
what
all
these
things
mean.
It's
really
it's
it's
taking
the
citizen
survey
to
an
educational
component,
so
the
citizens
themselves
can
say.
G
L
I'll,
let
you
go
ahead
and
finish,
and
just
I'd
be
I'd
be
great
with
that,
because
that
would
save
us
a
lot
of
capacity.
The
concern
now
will
be
that
you
can
get
a
you
can
get
third
parties
to
to
do
this.
The
feedback
I
get
from
other
chiefs
is
it's
a
much
more.
It's
a
deeper
dive
when
you
do
it
internally,
but
I'm
I'm
totally
open
to
having
a
third
party
do
that
standards
cover
absolutely
I'm
back
on
the
on
how
many
people
does
it
take
to
to
provide
the
service
level
protection?
L
L
The
better
question
is:
how
many
people
does
it
take?
Have
everything
in
service
all
23
at
each
station
or
even
more
than
that
when
station
11
opens?
What's
the
magic
number
to
have
everything
in
service?
That
number
is
64.,
currently
we're
running
a
high
daily
vacancy
rate,
and
so
we
need
a
solution
that
gets
us
over
a
delay
in
hiring
so
we're
at
the
64.,
because
I
think
that's
what
everybody
wants.
I
want
station
11
to
open
up
with
everything
in
it
and
everything
to
be
in
service.
L
L
L
L
By
about
nine
months,
they
would
come
in
in
june,
they'd
hit
the
station
in
in
august
because
we
wouldn't
be
teaching
them
how
to
do
the
work,
we'd
be
verifying
their
skills
and
showing
them
the
des
moines
operational
guidelines
and
how
we
do
business.
There
are
some
costs
to
that,
and
perhaps
there's
some
long-term
gains.
L
When
you
hire
a
certified
list,
you
have
to
be
able
to
recognize
other
people's
certifications
through
the
state
of
iowa
it'll,
be
a
challenge
on
our
on
diversity.
It'll
be
a
challenge!
Finding
women
you're
you're,
essentially
grabbing
people
from
other
departments,
already
working,
full-time
and
you're,
enticing
them
to
come
to
the
city
of
des
moines,
which
they
should
already
want
to
do,
and
we
do
get
applicants
in
every
process
for
people,
particularly
from
florida,
colorado,
california
and
the
minneapolis
area
of
st
of
minnesota.
L
L
I
I
guess
I
could
look
at
it,
doesn't
change
on
how
quickly
they
get
in
the
station
or
how
quickly
they
are
operating
on
an
apparatus
we
we
use
the
probationary
period
to
so
that
station
officers
versus
being
in
the
academy
can
assess
the
skills
and
they
have
a
what's
called
a.
They
have
a
skills
book
that
they
walk
through.
So
many
ivs
cooking,
hydrants
things
like
that.
G
L
It
used
to
be
oh,
it
used
to
be
a
very
short
when
we
went
to
paramedic.
This
is
a
number
of
years
ago.
It's
2004
or
five.
The
feedback
we
got
from
the
officers
was
by
the
time
they
get
done
with
the
training.
We
don't
have
any
time
to
assess
them,
so
they
hit
the
station
and
a
month
later,
they're
off
probation
and
the
officers
are
like.
L
Yes,
and
and
the
reason
I
think
it's
really
valuable
is
we
have
had-
and
this
is
a
real
credit
to
our
company
officers.
We've
had
some
people
that
were
new
to
the
fire
service
and
they
kind
of
struggled.
They
were
good
people
working
hard.
Their
learning
curve
was
a
little
longer
and
they
hit
the
station
and
they
needed
a
performance
improvement
plan
and
they
worked
through
it,
and
I
think
those
successes
are
worth
it
because
you
want
to
hire.
You
want
to
hire
well
train
well
now,.
G
I
L
L
L
M
Excuse
me
so
just
a
little
bit
of
background,
I
don't
quite
understand
this
new
station
has
been
in
the
work
or
planning
in
the
works
for
like
a
couple
years,
so
it's
going
to
open
in
september
now
or
september
or
october,
so
like.
Why
are
we
talking
about
this
now,
when
a
year
for
getting
staffed
a
year
from
now
like,
haven't
we
had
two
years
to
get
ready?
I'm.
L
L
L
L
along
the
way.
We
also
knew
that
we
needed
a
bridge
operationally
in
the
northeast
and
so
formally
in
2018,
but
we
really
started
doing
this
in
2016
by
working
with
the
altoona
fire
department,
so
we're
both
responding
into
each
other's
northeast
and
west,
and
so
that's
that's
been
good
for
all
of
us.
We
needed
a
way
to
pay
for
all
those
additional
positions.
That's
where
the
local
option
sales
tax
really
helped
boe
us
we
needed
to
build
the
the
new
fire
station
which
we're
we're
doing
now.
L
It's
we're
what
one
or
two
days
into
them
being
late
again.
I
don't
know
that
the
the
cabinets
are
in
that
kind
of
thing,
but
we
can't
we
can't
build
it
any
faster
than
they're
building
it
and
then,
along
the
way.
We
needed
to
monitor
the
trends
for
not
just
planned,
but
unplanned
retirements
and
changes
in
our
daily
vacancies,
and
that's
the
point
on
the
next
slide.
That's
really
about
today's
math
and,
like
I
said
on
the
first
slide,
our
calls
continue
to
go
up.
L
There's
not
going
to
be
relief
where
we're
going
to
knock
off
10
or
20
of
our
calls.
Our
firefighters
are
responding
to
a
lot
of
calls
and
we'll
set
another
record
again.
This
year
had
covid
not
delayed
our
hiring
today,
our
operational
strength,
the
274,
the
whole
department's
306
274,
is
what
assigned
to
operation.
L
L
L
B
B
L
G
L
L
The
above
and
the
below
on
that
it's
pretty
busy
there's
a
lot
of
math
there.
Obviously
the
above
is
what
was
planned
and
at
the
historical
daily
vacancy
rate
of
22
everything's
in
service
with
station
11,
but
64
people.
That's
not
to
say
that
the
minimum
on
every
rig
is
is
the
optimum,
but
that's
the
answer
to
the
question
about
things
being
in
service
with
station
11..
What
is
below
shows
that
both
we
have
the
15
vacancies
we
planned.
L
We
have
17
in
the
academy
that
should
have
graduated
over
a
month
ago,
and
we
have
that
higher
than
normal
daily
vacancy
rate,
all
at
the
same
time.
That's
why
our
the
daily
availability
is
about
55
and,
of
course
that
fluctuates,
if
you
have
say
more
sick
leaves
or
vacations
or
militaries
those
things
go
up
and
down.
So
that's
why,
on
a
third
of
the
days
we're
paying
overtime
to
keep
those
53
people
in
those
20
apparatus
in.
J
J
J
A
J
J
So
does
it
mean
that
we're
not
capable
of
running
two
classes
at
the
same
time
or
why
are
we?
Why
is
the
the
the
recruitment
so
long,
and
I
think
some
of
that
in
in
what
my
understanding
is
anyway,
is
our
civil
service
commission?
I
just
got
a
text
from
somebody
who's
who
has
a
family
member
that
has
applied
and
he
said
he
must
be
watching.
I
don't
know
if
we're
on
air
or
what,
but
he
said
they
he
was.
He
was
deducted
some
points
he
would
have
made
it.
He.
J
It
says
he
scored
like
something
and
he
lost
five
points
through
the
civil
service
commission
because
he
wasn't
a
resident
can't
we
make
some
changes
to
our
civil
service
commission
requirements.
I
know
they
have
to
go
through
the
civil
service
commission,
but
it
seems
like
we're
losing
good
applicants.
J
Maybe
because
this
point
score
and-
and
maybe
I
just
don't
understand
it-
but
you
know
when
I,
when
I
know
of
people
that
have
applied
two
or
three
times
didn't
make
it,
but
they
ultimately
did
wouldn't
we
have
been
better
off
just
to
hire
them
the
first
time
you
know
two
applications
before
I
guess.
That's
where
I'm
hung
up
is
that
we
have
good
people
that
are
applying.
J
Why
are
we
having
such
small
classes
when
we
know
that
there
are
good
recruits
out
there
that
really
want
this
profession?
My
nephew
included?
I
mean
you,
know
full
disclosure.
I've
got
a
nephew
that
in
the
class
right
now,
but
it
just
it
just
seems
like
we
could
make
the
hiring
process
a
little
easier
and
still
get
good
quality
people.
I'm
not
asking
you
to
to
take
a
a
less
capable
person,
but
are
we
really
knocking
people
giving
them
points
off
because
they
don't
live
here
or
you
know,
for
whatever
reason.
L
Okay,
so
in
a
different
order,
the
where
the
changes
for
civil
service
would
occur
would
be
with
the
civil
service.
I
know
that
they
have
specifically
and
deliberately
assigned
the
residency
point
that
was
very
that
was
strong
there
and
and
all
of
the
things
before
them
obviously
can
be
a
conversation.
L
They
have
helped
us
and
and
starting
last
year
with
the
code,
because
we
could
only
put
so
many
people
in
a
room
and
we
knew
that
we
hired
a
class
of
25.
We
didn't
have
them
all
in
the
same
room.
We'd
have
to
do
some
pretty
interesting
things,
but
generally
on
our
process-
and
I
credit
chief
francisco
with
this-
it
literally
used
to
take
a
year
of
when
just
the
application.
L
When
I
applied
it
was
greater
than
a
year.
He
got
that
part
down
to
about
seven
months.
Some
of
that
is
tied
to
the
licensing
of
the
cpap
testing
that
we
do,
which
is
about
the
only
test
out
there.
That's
made
it
through
the
department
of
justice
and
does
not
disadvantage
people
without
prior
fire
service
or
women
in
particular,
and
so
we
have
some
good
pieces.
L
Can
it
be
shorter
with
the
certified
list
it
can
be
we'll
want
to
make
sure
we
don't
disadvantage
anybody
long-term
in
using
that
process.
That
could
be
a
way
to
go.
So
there's
there's,
there's
military
points,
people
get
that's
the
part
of
the
process.
They
can
get
either
five
points
or
ten
points
out
of
a
hundred.
There
are
five
points
that
people
can
get
for
being
a
resident
of
des
moines,
as
evidenced
by
their,
I
believe,
their
voter
registration,
but
all
that
falls
under
the
jurisdiction
of
the
civil
service
commission.
L
So
any
of
the
ideas
that
are
possible
there
we'd
have
to
present
with
them
and
and
work
on
on
that-
and
I
think
they're
all
in
on
hiring
good
people
become
part
of
the
city
organization,
not
worried
about
that.
There's,
probably
some
things
that
that
we
can.
We
can
come
up
with
that,
might
help
them,
but
they
they
interviewed
over
200
people
in
this
current
process.
For
us,
and
one
of
the
benefits
of
covet
is
by
changing
their
order
and
changing
their
process.
L
They
shorten
the
window
for
people
to
go
through
the
cpat
and
the
interview,
so
that
has
helped
us.
If
you
just
had
the
pieces
of
the
hiring
and
you
didn't
have
different
calendars
for
the
council
and
the
commission
and
everything
else,
you
could
scrunch
it
into
12
weeks.
That's
never
worked
out
in
the
calendar.
The
the
shortest
we've
gotten
it
is
is
right
at
seven
months,
could
we
get
it
down
to
four
potentially,
but
the
cpap
would
be
the
would
be
the
struggle
there.
L
I
agree
that
we
have
a
lot
of
good
people
that
apply
and
it
is.
It
is
painful
to
go
through
those
last
40
to
50
people,
especially
if
you're
only
hiring
18
to
25,
and
you
don't
get
to
that
point
without
being
quality,
but
there's
there's
nothing
magic
about.
You
know
I
was
a
I
applied
three
times.
You
know
people
that
have
applied
a
lot.
L
We
had
feast
and
famine
through
the
late
80s
and
early
90s,
and
so
we
had
wide
fluctuations
and
no
hiring,
and
then
we
would
hire
33..
And
now
our
department
is
an
average
age
of
just
over
46
years
old.
So,
five
years
from
now,
we
are
going
to
see
a
lot
of
turnover
and
I
would
rather
see
us
get
to
a
point
where
we
are
regularly
having
an
academy
of
a
predictable
number
of
people
so
that
our
retirements
are
predictable.
And
we
don't
see
the
fluctuations.
I
After
hearing
all
this,
I
just
would
like
to
recommend
that
we
do
go
out
for
a
study
to
determine,
because
I
think
your
calls
are
way
up,
so
how
many
firefighters,
who
really
do
need
and
em
you
know
the
paramedics
because
of
the
volume
of
call.
So
what
is
the
right
number?
Is
it
300
or
is
it
350?
I
don't
know.
Is
it
whatever?
The
right
number
is:
let's
determine
that.
The
other
thing
is
on
civil
service.
I
think
you
get
who
they
send
to
you.
I
think
we
need
to
reverse
the
order.
I
I
think
staff
needs
to
interview
everyone,
and
then
you
determine
the
ones
you
would
like
to
go
to
civil
service.
I
don't
know
how
we
change
that
you
know
the
questions
to
ask
and
then
how
do
we
get
larger
classes
if
we
need
to
catch
up
right
now?
How
do
we
get
the
larger
classes
to
get
caught
up,
and
how
do
we
speed
up
the
hiring
process?
I
J
I
Don't
have
to
meet
the
experts,
we
just
got
to
sleep,
but
we
just
need
to
make
sure.
So
those
are
just
a
couple
of
things
that
I
would
think
that
I
don't
know
what
would
help
speed
it
up,
but
I
think
the
civil
service
thing
where
you
get
to
select
from
the
list
where
it
should
be
the
opposite.
You
should
be
asking
the
questions
to
determine
who
you
feel
are
the
best
but
and
maybe
be
able
to
get
more
people.
M
L
L
L
It's
three
people,
it's
two
to
four
people
and
what
chief
coleman
tracks
every
day
is
not
only
every
type
of
leave,
but
how
many
rigs
were
out
of
service
and
specifically
how
many
of
firefighter
fire
medic
senior
medic
whatever
was
called
back
so
that
that's
known
each
day
specifically
to
the
person.
What
that
level
is.
Does
that
answer
your
question.
L
L
M
M
M
M
A
M
H
I
want
to
explore
a
little
bit
more
that
we
haven't
really
talked
about.
I
think
we
started
going.
There
was
requirements
and
we're
talking
about
solving
this
for
the
short
term,
and
I
think
we
still
have
a
lot
of
questions
about
that.
But
we've
got
a
lot
of
folks
for
retirement,
and
so
the
question
is
what
how
many,
how
many
are
coming
up
for
retirement?
How
many
are.
H
Eligible
how
many
are
in
our
drop
program
and
then
what
is
the
plan
so
that
we
don't
have
to
have
this
conversation?
You
know
repeatedly
like
what?
What
is
the
plan
to
make
sure
that
we
are
having
a
consistent
number
of
classes
so
that
we
are
prepared
and
we
don't
get
behind
when
we're
facing
all
these
retirements.
L
L
L
L
But
what
can
also
happen?
Is
people
can
leave
before
that
date?
There's
a
penalty,
but
that
doesn't
seem
to
be
much
of
a
deterrent,
and
so
it's
the
unplanned
and
unexpected
retirements
and
we've
seen
a
couple
of
those.
But
the
numbers
today
are
really
about
the
injuries.
The
long-term
solution
is
about
the.
What
the
what
the
overall
number
is
and
the
speed
of
the
hiring
process,
I'm
I'm
totally
with
everybody
on
that.
C
Mayor,
if
I
could
add
just
I
mean
there
are
several
answers
to
that
question
that
I
see
the
the
size
of
the
academy
will
be
looked
at
and
increased
beyond
the
20.
That
has
been
historic,
the
opportunity
to
put
in
and
insert
the
pre-certified
classes
going
after
existing
firefighters,
because
that
expedites
the
process.
C
So
that's:
where
we'll
go
back
and
we'll
look
at
what
right?
What
opportunity
do
we
have
to
hire
a
consulting
crew
to
come
in
and
help
the
council
and
the
general
public
understand
this
balance
of
you
have
both
an
immediate
potential
need.
That's
the
two
structure,
fires
and
three
ambulance
calls
that's
just
one
service
level
aspect,
but
then
you
have
the
number
of
calls
that
are
going
on
and
increasing
you
have
the
geographics
of
the
locations.
C
That's
incredibly
important
right
for
response
times,
so
all
of
that
could
be
put
together
in
a
community
conversation
that
will
lead
us
to
a
number,
that's
likely
to
be
different
than
64..
We
don't
know
we
need
to
go
through
that,
but
the
best
number
we
have
right
now
is
to
target
the
64
and
to
get
there
and
to
be
with
the
hiring
with
with
maybe
some
tweaking
and
civil
service.
C
H
C
G
G
I
C
G
So
let
me
just
ask
this
question:
since
2018
has
our
response
times
gotten
better,
because
where,
where
I
sit
and
and
I
know
probably,
the
mayor
would
feel
the
same
way
we
went
out
and
we
lobby
for
the
local
option.
Sales
tax
and
part
of
that
was
the
service
level
that
we
were
going
to
provide
in
the
staffing
level
that
we
were
going
to
provide,
along
with
a
new
fire
station,
was
going
to
give
our
citizens
a
better
service
level
and
we
went
out
and
we
pushed
for
it
and
it
passed
overwhelmingly.
L
G
D
G
G
G
Then
engine
three
I
mean
it's
really
a
net
zero,
so
engine
three
you're
gonna,
you're
gonna,
pull
out
of
there.
That's
the
one
on
the
east
side,
but
then
we're
gonna
put
it
at
engine
11..
So
really
what
we
went
out
and
sold
east
side
and
the
rest
of
the
city
is
a
net
gain
of
zero,
and
that
is
not
something
that
I
can
hang
my
hat
on
and
I'm
not
proud
of
that
and
I'm
not.
G
That
is
not
what
we
signed
up
to
do
and
and
you've
known
that
your
administration
has
known
that
I've
sat
in
a
meeting
with
those
two
gentlemen
when
they
were
not
in
those
white
shirts
telling
me
the
exact
same
thing
that
I'm
telling
you
so
I'm
not
sure
where
the
disconnect
is.
But
I'm
going
to
ask
the
mayor
that
I
would
like
to
form
a
small
committee
myself,
the
mayor
and
council
member
boss.
Okay,
we
would
like
to
look
at
your
unit
hourly
utilization
for
the
last
five
years.
G
G
G
G
Part
of
that
money
that
lost
revenue
is
for
firefighters,
we've
said
it,
they
voted
for
it
and
we're
going
to
give
them
that
and
whether
you
want
to
be
a
part
of
that
and
your
administration
wants
to
be
a
part
of
it.
But
somebody's
going
to
be
accountable
for
it
and,
ultimately
that's
going
to
be
you,
it's
not
a
budget
issue.
This
is
not
a
budget
issue.
G
G
it
it's.
This
is
beyond
just
keep
talking
about
it.
Talking
about
it,
your
stop.
Your
response
times
are
not
better
they're,
not
you
can't
sit
here
and
tell
us,
and
they
should
be.
If
you
don't
hire
you're
going
to
lose.
If
we
only
hire
20
to
25,
you're
gonna
lose
two
to
three
every
class.
You
know
that
chief,
it's
not
something
new
you've
all
done
it.
They
can
both
tell
you
the
same
thing.
G
So
our
residents
know
you
know
what,
when
they
call
911
they're
going
to
be
there
in
less
than
four
minutes,
and
you
know
what
that
happened
to
my
mother
at
medic
six
and
it
saved
her
life
within
40
minutes.
She
was
in
a
surgical
unit,
fixing
her
heart
from
the
time
I
picked
up
the
phone
to
the
time
she
got
to
methodist
hospital
and
that's
because
medic
6
was
in
service.
G
Okay,
so
we've
got
to
fix
this.
We
can
talk
all
all
we
want
about
it,
but
we
we
are
going
to
sit
down
and
all
of
us
need
to
know
what
type
of
service
level
we're
providing
and
taking
three
engines
out.
I
don't
know,
that's
not
my
job,
but
I
want
a
professional
to
tell
me-
and
I
understand
you're
professionals,
but
I
want
somebody
outside
the
box
looking
at
I
mean
we
can
continue
to
talk
about
it,
talk
about
it,
but
I
think
a
lot
of
our
time's
up.
G
I
would
like
to
see
that
type
of
committee
set
up
mayor
and-
and
I
think
that
we
can
all
sit
down
and
have
a
and
have
a
discussion
with
your
administration
with
with
the
guys
on
the
ground,
and
then
we
can
feed
back
the
rest
of
the
council.
I'd
like
the
whole
council
to
be
part
of
it.
But
then
it
would
be
an
open
meeting.
I
G
G
I
just
can't
and-
and
I
hope
you
understand-
that
it's
it's
nothing
personal
against
it.
I
think
you
guys
but
you're
you're,
not
following
through
on
what
our
policy
and
what
we
set
our
standards
to
be
you're.
Not
so
I
mean
we're
gonna
fix
it
one
way
or
another.
You
can
be
a
part
of
it.
You
can
be
a
part
of
it
or
one
way
or
another
it's
going
to
get
fixed.
G
G
L
G
We're
all
going
to
sit
down
and
talk
about
who
we
think
the
best
vendor
you
can
come
with
a
recommendation.
I'm
sure
local
4
will
come
with
a
recommendation.
We'll
the
city
manager
can
come
with
the
recommendation
and
then
we'll
decide
who's
who
it's
going
to
be
right,
but
no,
I
don't
we're
not
going
to
wait.
This
needs
to
be.
We
need
to
get
this
under
control
and
figure
out
where
we're
going
to
go
with
the
next
class
and
where.
G
L
If
they're
on
their
first
day
off
they're
getting
time
and
a
half
and
if
they're
on
their
second
day
off
they're
getting
double
time-
and
I
guess
the
other,
the
other
on
linda's
list
of
questions
was
about
when
we,
when
we
come
to
the
hiring
and
we've
had
vacancies
for
a
period
of
time.
We
do
work
with
the
manager's
office
in
finance
and
I
think,
each
of
the
last
six
classes
we've
hired
over
the
authorized
strength
to
get
up
up
to
four
people
additional
in
the
academy.
G
You've
only
had
20.
the
last
time,
scott
and
I
talked
about
it,
which
was
a
few
years
ago.
He
he
said
I
gave
the
okay.
We
had
local
auction
sales
tax
to
hire
more,
but
you
you're
stuck
on
the
number
of
20..
You
told
me,
you
didn't
want
to
do
a
class
more
than
20
people
when
we
toured
station
number
11.
that
came
right.
H
L
I
If
trainers
are
an
issue,
are
there
possibly
retired
guys
this?
They
can
come
back
and
take
the
role
of
trainers
versus
the
current
staff
or
to
beef
it
up.
So
you
get
more
people
on
it.
Just
curious.
If
you
could
do
that
or
people
from
other.
You
know
they
have
the
same
standards.
I
appreciate
they're
on
the
duty
now,
but
if
they
have
just
retired,
possibly
come
back
to
beef
up
training,
I
don't
know
what
all
is
involved,
but.
L
I
That's
true,
I
am
just
saying
how
just
looking
at
every
possible
what
is
the
struggling
block,
what's
the
obstacle
to
get
them
hired,
trained
and
out
the
door
and
in
the
stations,
so
whatever
those
stumbling
blocks
is
because
we
don't
have
enough
trainers,
so
we
got
to
figure
that
out
and
if
we
don't
have
this,
we
got
to
figure
that
out,
because
it's
enjoys
joe's
point
and
everybody's
point.
We
just
need
to
move
on
it.
We
need
it.
We've
got
on
the
budget,
let's
get
the
people
hired
and
let's
get
them
out
of
the
stations.
L
Yeah,
that's
the
the
the
third
slide
was
to
the
current
process
goes
and
you
get
a
class
started.
They
they
begin
with
emt
training
while
we're
recruiting
the
second
class
and
they
go
and
they
do
their
fire
operations
at
the
time
we're
getting
done
with
them.
We
do
the
certified
class
and
so
that
that's
where
it
fits
best
for
the
facilities,
the
number
of
people-
and
I
really
believe,
that's
that's
the
fastest.
You
can
get
them
through
unless
you
get
rid
of
the
current
process
and
you'll
lose
four
months.
Yeah.