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From YouTube: 2-24-21 Zoning Board of Adjustment
Description
Des Moines Zoning Board of Adjustment meeting via teleconference on Wednesday, February 24, 2021.
View the agenda: https://DSM.city/ZBOAatHome
B
B
All
right
good
afternoon,
ladies
and
gentlemen,
this
is
our
monthly
meeting
of
the
wednesday
february
24th
2021
of
the
city
of
des
moines
zoning
board
of
adjustment.
B
I'm
just
going
to
take
a
couple
minutes
here,
I'll
introduce
our
board.
I'm
doing
this
part
with
our
video
camera,
but
then
I'll
go
ahead
and
turn
that
off.
So
we
can
save
bandwidth
for
everybody
on
their
connection,
speed
here
I'll,
introduce
our
board
members
they're
citizens
of
the
city
of
des
moines.
They
have
been
appointed
to
the
board
by
the
city
council,
the
board
members
are
volunteers
and
they
receive
no
compensation
for
their
public
service.
B
B
Legal
counsel
for
the
zoning
board
of
adjustment
is
judy
parks,
cruz,
also
assisting
as
bert
drost
city
planner,
eric
lundy
city,
planner,
jason
van
essen
city,
planner,
catherine
drajas
city
planner,
suanne
donovan
is
the
city.
Zoning
enforcement
officer,
michael
ludwig,
is
the
planning
administrator
and
tyler
hall
is
our
meeting
moderator
now
I'm
going
to
cover
the
meetings
procedure
for
everybody,
who's
participating
for
some
of
you.
This
may
be
the
first
time
you're
here
at
the
board
of
adjustment.
B
So
I'm
going
to
kind
of
explain
how
the
hearing
process
will
work
today
and
how
we
make
our
decisions,
but
during
the
actual
hearing
we
will
help
everyone
through
the
process.
So
don't
be
worried
that
if
this
is
all
new
to
you,
first
and
foremost,
the
board
of
adjustment
is
a
quasi-legal
board.
This
hearing
will
be
conducted
with
the
procedures
and
format
as
authorized
by
iowa
law.
In
this
city's
ordinance,
the
meeting
is
open
to
the
public.
The
meeting
is
being
recorded
by
both
audio
and
video
for
a
legal
record
of
these
proceedings.
B
B
B
Then
the
applicant
or
the
representative
of
the
applicant
will
be
allowed
up
to
10
minutes
to
present
their
appeal.
After
that,
we
will
move
to
the
public
comment
portion
of
the
hearing.
Anyone
wanting
to
speak
in
support
of
opposition
to
or
in
neutrality
of
the
appeal
will
be
allowed
up
to
five
minutes
each
to
provide
their
comments.
B
B
B
If
you
have
not
already
provided
those
documents
to
city
staff
prior
to
the
hearing
once
all
concerned,
citizens
have
spoken,
the
board
will
then
ask
any
additional
questions
of
city
staff
and,
lastly,
the
applicant
will
be
given
three
more
minutes
for
a
rebuttal
or
closing
comments.
If
they
show
choose
to
all
speakers
are
required
to
begin
their
presentation
by
giving
both
their
name
and
address
of
business
or
residence
in
the
event
that
you
may
need
to
be
contacted
for
legal
notices
related
to
the
outcome
of
this
appeal.
B
B
B
Finally,
the
decisions
of
this
board
can
only
be
appealed
in
the
iowa
district
court
if
you
believe
you've
been
harmed
by
an
error
made
by
this
board.
Your
only
remedy
is
to
seek
relief
through
the
court
within
30
days
of
the
filing
of
the
board's
decision
and
order,
if
you
believe
the
zoning
regulations
applied
by
this
board
are
wrong.
You
may
petition
the
city
council
to
change
those
regulations
for
future
considerations.
B
B
Also,
we
ask
that
you
keep
your
microphone
on
mute
other
than
when
addressing
the
board
so
as
to
limit
distractions
during
the
hearing.
While
it
is
in
progress,
we
also
ask
that
you
refrain
from
using
any
chat
or
question
and
answer
function
as
part
of
the
zoom
meeting.
As
that
conference
function
will
not
be
monitored
for
response,
and
use
of
that
function
could
be
construed
as
an
ex
parte
communication
occurring
outside
of
the
hearing
process,
which
is
not
allowed.
B
So
that's
my
introductory
comments
for
today
and,
as
I
said,
will
help
everybody
through
our
agenda.
So
I'm
going
to
turn
this
over
to
bert,
we'll
go
back
to
that
consent,
agenda
and
review
that
with
everyone.
So
bert
turn
it
back
to
you.
A
Thanks
all
members
of
the
board,
this
is
bert,
drost
planner
for
the
city
of
des
moines.
We
do
have
two
items
on
our
consent
agenda
today.
These
are
considered
minor
nature
and
we
did
not
receive
any
objections
to
either
of
these
two.
The
first
is
item
number
one
for
a
temporary
storage
spot
at
or
in
the
vicinity
of
401
southeast
4th
street,
and
then
the
second
is
for
a
conditional
use
approval
at
2101
dickson
street.
A
So
unless
any
of
the
board
members
have
concerns
about
these
two
or
if
there's
anybody
in
attendance
today,
who
would
like
to
speak
on
against
either
of
these
staff
recommends
approval
in
accordance
with
the
conditions
listed
in
the
staff
recommendations.
B
So
I'll
go
ahead
and
I'll
pull
the
audience
here.
First,
so
again
as
items
one
and
two
are
on
consent,
city
staff
is
recommending.
Approval
of
these
appeals
for
one
is
in
the
vicinity
of
401
southeast
4th
street
would
be
a
temporary
use
approval
by
the
city
of
des
moines
itself
for
variances
to
paving
requirements.
B
B
B
So
anybody
in
opposition
to
us
granting
those
from
the
audience
any
signs
bert.
I
am
not
seeing
any
okay
all
right
board
members.
Is
there
anybody
on
the
board,
who
would
have
an
objection
to
approving
items,
one
or
two?
If
so,
please
say
so:
if
not,
would
there
be
a
motion
to
grant
approval
for
items
one
and
two.
F
F
G
B
All
right,
thank
you,
tyler,
okay,
so
that
concludes
items
one
and
two.
If
you
were
here
for
those
items,
they
have
been
approved
and
you
will
get
a
copy
of
the
decision
in
order
within
the
next
week.
Okay,
that
will
bring
us
now
to
our
discussion
portion
of
the
agenda.
B
A
As
long
as
the
tire
repair
shop,
that's
there
now
doesn't
cease
for
a
period
of
six
months
or
longer.
They
still
retain
this
conditional,
I'm
sorry,
this
use
variance
that
allows
them
to
continue
to
do
that,
but,
as
I
mentioned
they're
wanting
to
expand
to
include
more
types
of
vehicle
repair
like
the
oil
changes
and
minor
maintenance.
A
A
If
you
read
it,
you
can
follow
along
how
they
attempted
to
rezone
were
denied
under
the
retired
ordnance
zoning
ordinance,
and
then
they
were
issued
a
use
variance
back
in
2017,
and
that
was
amended
in
2018
to
how
it
appears
today.
A
They
subsequently
attempted
to
amend
the
use
variants
again
to
allow
for
either
auto
sales
or
auto
repair,
but
at
that
time
the
board
of
adjustment
denied
those
requests.
So
more
recently,
they
attempted
to
rezone
the
property
from
the
n3a
district
to
the
mx3
district,
and
in
january
the
city
council
denied
that
rezoning,
which
is
why
they're
now
back
in
front
of
this
board,
requesting
a
new
use
for
experience
that
would
allow
for
general
motor
vehicle
repair,
also
contained
in
the
staff
recommendation.
You'll
find
our
rationale
for
why
staff
has
recommended
denial.
A
A
So
we
just
don't
feel
that
this
is
the
proper
location
for
a
general
vehicle
repair
business,
and
we
also
note
that,
as
long
as
that,
tire
shop
doesn't
cease
for
more
than
six
months
that
the
property
would
retain
those
rights
to
have
the
tire
shop
use
which
staff
feels
is
more
appropriate.
A
Given
the
size
and
location
of
this
property.
Here
are
the
comment
cards
we
had
one
card
in
support
and
then
the
neighbor,
the
accent
neighborhood,
which
represents
the
land.
On
the
south
side
of
eastern
boulevard,
we
had
a
card
from
them
saying
they're
in
support
as
long
as
there's
no
cars
being
sold,
and
then
we
did
get
one
card
in
opposition
and
I'll
show
you
the
consent
map.
Here
I
forgive
you
a
second
to
read
this.
A
B
B
Okay,
maybe
some
folks
are
thinking
on
that
bert,
to
the
best
of
your
knowledge,
did
the
board
of
adjustment
grant
any
exceptions
for
setbacks
or
green
space
or
landscaping,
or
is
the
site
in
compliance
with
those
requirements
based
on
the
current
code.
A
A
B
But
but
at
this
stage
of
the
game,
there's
no
violation
per
se
of
standards
for
the
site,
as
is.
A
H
A
Yeah
and
they
went
through
that
rezoning
process
back
in
2017
when
it
was
owned
r160
at
that
time,
they
requested
c2
and
were
denied
and
then
now
with
the
new
zoning
ordinance
that
took
effect
in
2019,
they
came
and
zoned
n3a
neighborhood
district,
and
that
was
because
the
city's
land
use
plan
designates
this
area
as
low
density
residential
and
so
when
they
applied
late
last
year
to
the
planet,
zoning
commission
to
rezone
from
n3a
to
a
mx3
mixed
use,
district.
A
B
So
burke
kind
of
a
statement
and
a
question
related
to
that
you've
mentioned
a
couple
times
that
in
essence
the
site's
too
small
to
facilitate
a
vehicle
repair
shop,
and
I'm
assuming-
and
I
think
cindy
might
even
alluded
to
this-
that
you
know
people
have
got
to
pull
in
and
out.
Cars
have
to
be
jockeyed
around.
Sometimes
vehicles
come
in
that
are
inoperable
so
now
you've
got
tow
trucks
and
basically,
while
the
site
might
be
quote
too
small
for
a
setup
there,
that
would
be
have
enough
visual
setbacks
and
be
appealing.
B
B
Okay,
so
it's
not
that
the
property
is
too
small
for
any
use.
It
would
be
feasible
and
sizeable
enough
for
multiple
uses
that
are
allowed
in
its
current
zoning
district.
Correct.
A
E
B
B
Okay,
seeing
none
so
what
happens
next
in
the
order
of
testimony
is
the
applicant
gets
to
present
to
the
board.
They
need
to
give
their
reasoning
for
their
request
for
the
appeal.
So
that's
either
the
applicant
themselves
or
their
representative
they've
got
up
to
10
minutes
to
present
their
appeal,
so
whoever
that
might
be
we'll
just
need
you
to
give
your
complete
name
an
address,
and
then
you've
got
the
floor
for
10
minutes.
I
I
I
think
the
mr
gross
and
his
companions
have
satisfactorily
presented
to
the
board
all
of
the
facts.
In
regard
to
this,
I
would
like
to
highlight
that
this
has
always
been
probably
for
at
least
the
last
20
years,
a
facility
for
car
sales.
It's
always
been
an
automotive
use.
I
believe
that
in
2009
miss
groff
actually
purchased
it
and
used
it
for
one
of
her
own
car
lots.
She
has
two
other
car
lots
over
on
southeast
14th,
and
this
was
a
good
location
because
of
a
change
in
what
happened
in
her
own
career.
I
She
no
longer
wanted
to
run
the
car
lot.
We
had
a
tenant
come
in
and
run
it.
They
did
have
a
variance
at
one
point,
am
I
still
being
heard?
Yes,
sir?
Go
ahead?
Okay,
thank
you.
They
had
were
granted
a
variance
and
the
individual
that
was
running
the
car
lot
quit
using
the
car
lot,
but
then
indicated
he'd
like
to
use
it
for
a
tire
shop.
He
went
in
there.
I
believe
in
roughly
2015
ran
it
for
a
short
time
and
then
left
and
left
miss
croft
without
any
continuing
rent.
I
I
took
a
look
at
the
rest
of
the
area
in
the
neighborhood
to
see
if
they
had
any
other
type
of
limited
minor
shops
that
I
could
not
find
in
within
a
short
distance
that
she's
not
the
application,
isn't
to
turn
this
into
some
large
repair
area,
but
more
of
a
neighborhood
repair
with
minor
workings
going
on,
such
as
putting
in
batteries
oil
changes
and
what
not,
because
the
limited
size
that
they
have
there.
That's
exactly
correct.
I
I
They
don't
clean
it
up
and
they
let
it
run
out,
and
frankly,
I
was
surprised
you
allowed
a
tire
shop
to
be
in
that
vicinity,
because
my
past
experiences,
tire
shops
have
a
tendency
to
leave
their
tires
outside
that
gets
kind
of
unsightly
miss
groff,
and
I
can
have
her
tested
this.
She
has
attempted
for
the
last
year
plus
to
try
to
get
somebody
in
there
to
do
another
tire
shot
and
she
has
not
met
with
any
success.
I
I
think,
if
you
look
at
the
surrounding
neighborhood,
even
considering
the
fact
that
the
interstate
is
close,
it
would
behoove
the
neighborhood
to
have
such
a
shock
put
into
it,
and
by
that
I
mean,
is
there's
no
really
close,
dealership,
there's
no
close
other
repair
shops
that
can
do
minor
repairs
and
with
the
exceptions
of
people
living
in
the
suburbs.
I
A
lot
of
folks
don't
have
easy
access
to
a
repair
shop,
for
instance,
to
get
a
truck.
Their
car
started
jumped
get
new
batteries,
oil
change,
antifreeze
change
and
just
kind
of
simple
things
that
are
necessary
and
especially
older
model
vehicles.
I
So
if,
if
the
board
like,
I
can
have
her
address
that,
I
think
there's
three
things
we
need
to
address
specifically,
and
that
is
the
question
whether
or
not
there's
a
reasonable
return
on
the
property,
and
I
think
I've
just
described
that
there's
been
difficult
to
get
any
kind
of
tenants
in
there.
In
fact,
the
last
tenant
that
did
the
tire
shop
has
left,
miss
groff
short
at
least
three
or
four
months
worth
of
rent.
I
This
property
is
unique
from
the
standpoint
that
it's
always
been
used
for
automotive
and
that
to
continue
with
that
on
that
road
it'd
probably
actually
be
a
good
use
of
it
and
then,
lastly,
I
don't
think
she
has
a
miss
croft
ignored
the
what
the
boards
requested
city
zoning
unless
you
went
ahead
and
did
a
number
of
updates
with
the
site
plan
to
be
in
conformity
with
what
has
been
requested.
So
what
we're?
I
Really
asking
for
is
a
chance
to
use
this
facility
this
this
this
area
to
the
best
potential
for
it
I
don't
think
it'd
be
a
good
residential,
even
though
it's
in
a
residential,
because
the
way
it's
just
laid
out
and
built,
I
don't
think
it'd,
be
a
good
use
of
anything
else
other
than
what
it
was
probably
20
plus
years
ago,
and
that
is
a
small
minor.
You
know
for
lack
of
better
terms
with
ma
and
paw
type
of
repair
shop.
I
That's
what
we're
asking
in
fact
what
we'd
even
be
willing-
and
I
think
miss
grafford-
definitely
would
be
willing
to
give
us
a
test
at
it,
a
temporary
use,
variance
and
allow
to
show
for
the
next
several
months
that
it
can't
operate
that
can
be
kept
in
compliance
with
the
neighborhood.
I
was
very
pleased
to
see
there
were
three
cards.
No
cards
that
came
in
people
are
very
concerned
about
the
neighborhood,
and
rightly
so.
It's
their
neighborhood
and
they'd
like
to
keep
it
that
way.
I
I
B
Mr
blossom,
I
would
have
kind
of
a
related
question
topic.
You
know.
I
appreciate
your
discussion
from.
I
don't
have
a
better
term
here,
but
just
from
a
conversational
perspective
about
what
you'd
like
to
see
be
allowed
here,
but
from
a
legal
perspective.
If
you're
familiar
with
this,
the
board
of
adjustment
operates
under
the
zoning
ordinance
and
a
number
of
years
ago,
many
decades
ago.
B
In
fact,
the
zoning
for
this
property
and
this
district
was
determined
and
set
as
what's
called
r160,
so
single-family
residential
and
at
that
time
the
business
was
operating
as
a
car
lot
and
that's
called
a
non-conforming
use.
So
in
essence,
you
have
grandfathering
rights.
Are
you
familiar
with
the
term
grandfathering
rights?
Yes,.
I
B
B
But
if
I'm
correct,
we
had
a
period
of
time
for
gosh
two
and
a
half
years
where
we
did
not
have
a
vehicle
display
lot
present
so
that
use
had
discontinued.
B
So,
therefore,
we
revert
back
to
r1
uses
and
and
that's
why
she
came
back
to
us
initially,
so
the
idea
of
having
a
car
lot
here
again,
it's
not
consistent
with
the
zoning
ordinance.
So
we
we
tried
to
give
your
client
every
opportunity
we
could
to
look
at
something
that
would
be
more
reasonable
or
commensurate,
and
perhaps
you
know
comparatively
what
we
would
call
a
neighborhood
commercial.
B
Is
there
any
reason
why
she
has
not
explored
looking
at
an
office
operation
there?
A
tax
preparer
could
locate
here
a
investment
guy.
It
could
be
a
small
retailer.
Somebody
could
sell
appliances
from
here
maybe
have
a
service
truck
in
the
shop
bay.
Why
does
this
have
to
hinge
on
auto
repair?
What's
the
deal.
I
Okay,
thank
you.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
The
reason
for
that
is
that
she
has
put
out
notices
to
rent
it
and
I
think
she's
and
I
don't
have
any
copies
to
provide
the
board.
I
apologize,
but
it's
been
a
general
advertisement
to
say,
come
and
rent
this
facility.
I
don't
think
it's
been
limited
to
the
automotive.
I
She
hasn't
been
able
to
find
someone
who
wants
to
do
a
tax
service,
and
I
don't
disagree
with
the
chairman
that
that
would
be
a
potential,
but
she
hasn't
found
anyone
that
was
interested
in
and,
like
I
said
earlier,
she
she
was
in
the
automotive
in
the
sales
business
herself,
she's
had
people
a
number
of
times
approach
her
for
that
yeah
and
that
it
was
actually
what
she's
familiar
with
and
what
the
neighborhood's
been
familiar
with.
And
so
that's
that's
what's
happened.
I
I
don't
think,
and
I
apologize,
I
don't
have
the
advertisement
that
she's
used.
She
hasn't
tried
to
limit
it.
It's
just
who
has
approached
her
and
that's
why
we're
asking
to
have
that.
She
does
have
a
a
number
of
businesses
that
would
readily
use
it
for
the
light
she
just
has
not
had
anybody
say.
Yes,
I'd
be
interested
to
open
up
that
small
accounting
law.
Yes,
thank
you.
B
All
right,
yeah
and
mr
blossom-
I
I
I
don't
want
to
kind
of
continue
to
circulate
on
this,
but
in
trying
to
look
for
potential
tenants
for
other
retail
uses.
Does
she
have
a
commercial
real
estate
agent?
That
is
helping
list
the
property
or
reaching
out?
Are
there
sufficient
signs
on
the
property
that
says
for
lease
for
rent
for
retail
or
office
space?
B
I
She
has,
in
the
past,
put
up
four
rent
signs
and
I'm
not
sure
what
the
status
is
now,
because
I
I
haven't
been
by
for
the
last
couple
months
myself
to
look.
I
think
there
was
a
little
concern
about
continuing
with
a
a
for
rent.
I
think
there
are
some
restrictions
that
you
can't
do
that
very
long,
or
maybe
it's
just
a
business
interest
and
to
answer
your
first
question.
She
does
not
or
has
not
discussed
this
with
any
commercial
realtors
as
to
potential
either
dale
or.
B
B
Him:
okay,
seeing
none
well,
sir,
we'll
check
back
with
you
in
a
minute.
So
what
we'll
do
here
now
for
the
next
portion
of
the
hearing?
If
anybody
wishes
to
speak
and
support
of
the
applicant's
request
for
this
requested
use,
they
can
have
up
to
five
minutes
to
present
their
comments.
We
first
need
to
have
them,
hit
the
raise
hand,
icon
and
zoom
or
hit
star
9
on
their
phone,
and
then
we
can
have
staff
look
to
recognize
them.
B
B
B
E
B
See
none,
okay,
all
right
so
board
members.
Do
we
have
any
further
questions
for
city
staff
here.
J
J
J
It
probably
does
get
a
lot
of
attention
for
vehicle
uses
because
it
is,
it
is
set
up
that
that
way,
and
so
people
probably
naturally
think
of
it
as
that's.
What
the
use
should
would
be
in
that
property,
but
it
doesn't
fit
the
character
of
the
neighborhood.
It's
not
an
asset
to
the
neighborhood
as
a
as
a
repair
shop.
It
would
be
a
detriment
to
the
neighborhood,
so
I
would
respectfully
ask
the
board
to
deny
the
use
approval
for
a
minor
vehicle
repair
shop
or
any
kind
of
sales
or
storage
of
vehicles.
Thank
you.
J
B
All
right
seeing
none,
mr
blessum,
you
can
have
three
minutes
for
a
final
closing.
If
you
would
like
to
that's
up
to
you,
if
you
feel
you've
said
your
piece,
that's
also
fine,
but
you
have
any
closing.
I
Thoughts-
I
I
do
mr
chairman
and
thank
you
board
members
and
staff
as
well,
and
I
think
our
our
main
thrust
in
this
instance
is
the
fact
that
everything
all
of
the
staff
have
indicated
miss
donovan.
Lastly,
is
that
this
is
set
up
for
an
auto
use.
I
It
is,
it
was,
as
the
chairman
pointed
out,
at
one
time
was
grandfathered
in
for
a
sales
place
for
vehicles.
It's
just
set
up
that
way.
There's
two
buildings:
one's
partially
storage
one
can
be
used
for
bays
to
use
it
for
the
use
of
auto
repair.
I
Miner,
not
major,
and
we
understand
the
concerns,
and
I
think
the
real
concern
is
how
it
will
look
in
the
neighborhood
and
that's
why
we're
asking
to
give
us
a
chance,
even
a
temporary
variance,
because
it
was,
as
the
chairman
pointed
out,
it
was
in
fact
a
non-conforming
use
and
they
lost
it
by
not
continuing
the
sales.
For
whatever
reason
I
wasn't,
you
know
privy
at
the
time,
I
wasn't
a
counsel
the
time
to.
Let
them
know
that
they
needed
to
continue
with
that
a
lot
of
times.
I
Businesses
just
go
through
some
changes,
but
it
isn't
a
prime
location
and-
and
I
think,
even
though
it's
residential
and
I
understand
the
city
is
concerned
that
way,
but
even
residential
areas
still
need
just
your
automotive
small
repairs,
not
everybody
has
brand
new
vehicles.
A
lot
of
people
have
older
models
and
again
I
I
heart
them
back
to
the
fact
that
everyone,
that's
recognized.
B
G
This
is
marvelous,
I
drive
by
this
location
often,
and
I
would
recommend
the
denial
just.
The
staff
would.
K
Lynn
carlson,
I
also
drive
by
their
or
not
as
probably
as
often
as
mars,
but
I
have
and
as
a
car
place
it
just
does
not
look
attractive
and
if
the
building
is
set
to
be
set
up
for
autos,
that's
not.
K
The
concern
here
is
the
concern
is
that
it's
it's
not
appropriate
for
the
zoning
right
now
and
I
do
believe
that
a
good
faith
effort
has
not
been
made
to
market
this
property
to
somebody
else,
as
maybe
a
small
office
or
a
coffee
shop,
which
everybody
always
claim
clamors
for
on
the
east
side.
So
I
also
agree
to
go
along
with
staff.
I
just
don't
think
a
car
repair
shop
is
appropriate
for
this.
C
Location
is
nathan,
I
don't
think
they
met
the
variance
test.
L
C
B
Yeah
and
folks,
something
that
comes
to
mind
here,
you
know
when
we
talk
about
grandfathering,
it's
one
of
the
most
basic
fundamentals
in
understanding
how
zoning
ordinances
not
only
work
in
current
time,
but
their
intent
over
time.
B
So
when
a
site
is
grandfathered
in
that
is
not
because
you
know,
planning
staff
like
to
see
the
use
or
think
that
use
is
only
commensurate
for
that
property.
B
B
So
I
don't
believe
it
was
the
intent
of
the
past
zoning
ordinance
or
our
current
one
that
the
idea
was
yeah.
This
can
only
be
used
for
automotive
repair
like
it
used
to
be
the
use
that
it
used
to
be
wasn't
deemed
to
be
consistent
with
the
intent
of
the
zoning
ordinance,
let
alone
the
actual
zoning
district
that
the
site
is
in.
B
I
think
this
board
has
always
understood
that
and
tried
to
be
semi-reasonable.
First
of
all,
no
expansion
of
the
use
which
was
denied
by
this
board,
but
secondly,
once
the
use
had
expired
for
more
than
two
and
a
half
years.
Something
tells
you
if
this
was
such
a
great
use,
then
why
wasn't
somebody
in
there
all
the
time,
so
we
eventually
have
to
come
back
around
to
there
are
uses
that
would
be
allowed
on
the
property,
certainly
residential
by
zoning.
B
This
board
gave
it
reasonable
exceptions
to
allow
some
reasonable
uses
consistent
in
a
neighborhood
setting.
So
again,
this
could
be
a
bookstore.
This
could
be
an
appliance
store.
I'm
not
going
to
go
through
a
list
of
100
ideas.
The
board
of
adjustment
is
not
here
to
be
a
leasi
and
real
estate
planning
consultant
for
property
owners.
B
B
As
such,
I
see
no
reason
to
grant
the
requested
use
variants
of
the
site
so
staff's
recommended
denial.
I'm
going
to
make
a
motion
to
deny
the
requested
use
variants.
Would
there
be
a
second.
B
All
right,
so
we
got
a
motion
by
pins
and
a
second
by
marvelous,
so
we're
we'd
be
voting
for
denying
the
use
variant.
So
if
you're
voting
for
denial,
you'd
say
yes
I'll
have
tyler,
take
roll
call.
G
C
B
M
M
This
would
allow
up
to
four
female
residents
on
parole
or
in
the
property
which
is
located
west
of
southeast
14th
and
south
of
east
waltras.
You
might
for
a
little
bit
of
a
landmark.
You
might
recall
that
classic
frozen
custard
is
over
on
the
corner,
with
southeast
14th.
M
M
M
Staff
does
feel
that
with
the
rezoning,
this
would
be
an
appropriate
use
with
conditions
on
the
property.
We
have
listed
those
conditions
that
are
pretty
standard,
but
two
I'll
call
out
specifically-
and
this
is
in
accordance
with
the
conditions
that
the
rezoning
were
approved,
was
approved.
Any
group
living
use
of
the
property
shall
be
limited
to
the
freedom
house
group
living
use
in
form,
as
described
in
the
rezoning
and
in
the
conditional
use
applications
with
no
more
than
four
female
residents.
M
Then
we
have
a
couple
of
pretty
standard
conditions
to
ensure
that
they
comply
with
the
various
city
ordinances
and
then
the
other
one
I'll
call
out
specifically,
is
that
the
conditional
use
approval
shall
be
subject
to
reconsideration
by
the
board
of
adjustment.
If
at
any
time,
the
zoning
enforcement
officer
determines
that
the
facility
has
become
detrimental
to
the
surrounding
neighborhood,
we
did
receive
a
handful
of
cards
and
emails
back.
M
K
B
So
catherine,
I've
got
a
basic
question
for
you
here,
so
it
looks
like
the
property
was
re-zoned
through
pnz
and
the
council
back
in
december
for
use
of
the
property
for
the
freedom
house
group
living
use.
B
M
I
will
do
my
best
to
make
sure
I
answer
that
correctly,
but
then
I
think
I
might
have
bert
clarify,
but
the
the
rezoning
from
the
n3a
neighborhood
district
to
the
limited
nx2
neighborhood
allows,
to
a
certain
extent
the
use
of
the
group
living,
if
I
recall
correctly,
but
it
does
then
need
the
conditional
use
to
allow
the
otherwise
not
specified.
A
She's
correct,
but
the
reason
it's
put
in
the
code
as
a
conditional
use
is
that
gives
the
zoning
enforcement
officer
extra
powers
to
bring
it
back
for
reconsideration
if
it
ever
becomes
a
problem.
So
if
it
was
a
permitted
use,
then.
B
B
Yeah,
okay,
all
right
staff
is
recommending
approval
here,
correct,
correct.
M
A
B
Yeah,
I
just
don't
want
to
see
any.
I
I
mean
we'll
we'll
hear
the
testimony,
I'm
not
sure
what
our
decision
would
be,
but
I
I
certainly
don't
want
to
see
any
expansion
of
parking
in
front
yards
or
anything
like
that
or
or
extra
maneuvering
in
a
front
yard
area
beyond
the
minimum.
Driveway
width,
that's
allowed.
N
O
Justin
catherine,
I
know
in
looking
at
the
the
responses
from
the
neighborhood.
There
was
a
couple
concerns
about
the
exterior
and
safety
and
maintenance
of
the
property,
and
I
mean
I
know
it's
not
equivalent
to
like
a
rental
property.
When
you
have
like
the
inspection
done
by
the
city
and
rental,
you
know
rental
certificate,
but
is
there
a
way
that
we
can
assure
the
neighborhood
that
this
property
will
be
well
maintained?.
B
B
Yeah
and-
and
we
can
talk
to
her
in
a
few
minutes
on
that
so
catherine
anything
else
you
want
to
present-
are
you
good.
B
Okay,
all
right!
Well,
let's
go
ahead
and
hear
from
the
applicant,
because
I
think
if
we
have
some
further
questions
here
in
the
short
term,
the
applicant's
presentation
might
help
answer
them.
So
applicant
you've
got
up
to
10
minutes
whoever's
going
to
speak.
We
just
need
your
complete
name
and
address
for
the
record
and
we'll
have
staff
recognize
you
hit
the.
B
A
D
Yeah
gotcha,
okay,
I
just
didn't
want
to
go
back
over
everything
that
I've
already
said.
Okay,
so
my
name
is
deb
thieler
I
have.
We
have
had
the
house
as
a
freedom
house
on
marion
since
2001.,
and
I
can
tell
you
we
have
never
had
one
complaint
in
those
20
years.
D
The
man
that
started
the
freedom
houses
died
of
pancreatic
cancer
in
2005,
and
I
took
over
running
the
houses
which
I
now
have
six
of
them,
and
I
run
the
house
that
we
are
talking
about
at
1100
east
marion
now,
and
I
just
want
you
guys
to
know
that
the
idea
I
went
to
prison
in
99
and
I
have
21
years
sober,
and
I
knew
what
I
saw,
what
it
was
like
to
come
out
of
prison
and
it's
not
nice.
It's
nothing,
nice
and
places.
D
People
go
just
puts
them
right
back
in
the
same
environment
that
they
were
in
when
they
first
went
to
prison.
So
I
decided
then,
that
I
wanted
to
help
people
find
a
safe
place
to
live
drug-free
which
we
are
and
that's
actually
how
I
met
you
guys.
I'll.
Just
tell
you
briefly.
D
I
had
one
of
the
girls
on
the
line
with
me
and
she
spoke
to
that
certain
group
of
people
and
I
just
want
you
guys
to
know
how
important
it
is
for
people
to
have
a
safe
place
to
go
that's
drug
free
and
that
I
also
do
not
tolerate.
I
have
a
zero
tolerance
for
methamphetamine
or
anything
like
that,
and
I
try
to
keep
our
neighborhood
and
our
neighborhoods
as
safe
and
drug-free
as
possible.
D
By
doing
that,
I
have
a
very
good
relationship
with
the
department
of
corrections
so
that
if
one
of
the
women
starts
struggling,
I
can
immediately
call
their
parole
officer,
which
I
always
tell
people.
Why
won't
you
hire
people
on
parole,
they're,
the
best
people
to
have
because
they're
being
supervised,
where
the
lots
of
people
on
job
sites
are
not
being
supervised?
And
you
know
don't
know
what
people
are
doing
when
they're
not
at
work
anyway?
D
I
just
had
to
throw
that
in
we
work
really
hard
at
keeping
the
neighbor
our
yard
nice
for
the
neighbors,
the
women
mow
the
yard
themselves.
They
shovel
their
snow.
Like
I
said
we
have
never
gotten
a
ticket
for
a
snowy
sidewalk
or
for
the
city
to
come
to
clean
up
debris
or
whatever
we
they
take.
The
women
take
pride
in
in
their
home,
that
is
their
home
and
most
of
the
time
the
women
are
there
at
least
a
good
year.
D
So
it's
not
something
that
people
are
coming
in
and
out
going
in
and
out
all
the
time
constant
changeover,
it
becomes
their
home
and
we
try
to
keep
it
that
way:
they'll
decorate
for
the
holidays,
plant,
flowers
in
the
garden
outside
by
the
front
walkway.
B
B
H
D
No,
I
do
not
live
in
the
house,
it's
for
other
women.
I
can
just
give
you
an
idea
on
how
bad
we
need
houses
like
this.
I've
already
had
three
calls
from
the
parole
office
this
morning
trying
to
find
placement
for
women
who
are
struggling
on
the
street
on
parole
and
it's
just
yeah.
No,
I
do
not
take
up
a
bed
there.
However,
I
do
have
a
house
over
on
23rd
street
and
my
assistant
lives
at
that
house.
D
So
between
the
two
of
us
we're
constantly
making
rounds,
I
make
rounds
every
day
to
my
houses.
I
talk.
I
have
a
head
of
house
at
every
house
that
is
comfortable,
giving
me
updates
if
somebody's
struggling,
if
I
need
to
come
right
away
whatever
so
I
I
watch
over
my
houses
very
carefully.
D
B
B
So
deb
I've
got
a
couple,
quick
questions
for
you,
but
first
of
all
I
wanna
commend
you
on
not
only
your
own
rehabilitation.
B
Yeah,
because
you
know
the
idea
is
to
return
people
to
society
to
be
productive,
sounds
like
you're,
being
productive
and
you're,
not
only
being
productive,
you're,
helping
others
so
that,
hopefully
they
don't
have
to
learn
from
from
others
mistakes.
They
can
move
forward.
So
it
sounds
like
you're,
a
good
counselor
as
well,
but
just
a
couple
questions
for
you
and
we
often
find
people
who
are
in
front
of
us
asking
for
forgiveness
rather
than
permission.
B
D
No,
I
did
not,
and
like
I
told
him
in
december,
I
had.
I
didn't
even
realize
that
I
needed
to
do
that.
I
pretty
much
inherited
this
house
and
I
just
went
on
running
it
after.
D
B
B
A
very
very
long
time,
my
second
question:
you
talked
about
being
neighborly,
so
I'm
assuming
that
the
neighbors
know
what
you're
doing
there
they've
been
okay
with
it,
at
least
to
the
best
of
your
knowledge
over
time.
Is
that
correct?
Absolutely.
B
Cool,
well,
that's
that's
good
to
hear
always
good
to
have
good,
neighbors
and
deb.
I.
I
trust
that,
while
you
know
you
care
about
this
work,
I'm
assuming
do
the
women
pay
a
a
rent
fee
or
something
to
live
there.
Then!
Yes,.
B
B
And
you
don't
have
any
excessive
parking,
you're,
not
parking
cars
sideways
in
the
front
yard,
or
anything
like
that
right.
Absolutely!
No!.
D
B
B
D
You
know
we
don't
own
the
houses,
we
lease
the
houses,
so
the
only
reason
I
am
on
this
call
and
I've
been
taking
care
of
this
zoning
issue.
My
landlord
there
is
laverne
and
maxine
anderson
they
they're
87
years
old.
They
both
got
covered
when
all
this
zoning
stuff
came
up,
and
so
I've
been
communicating
with
bert
about
the
situation.
D
K
I
just
have
a
comment:
you
know
the
concern
about
not
being
correct.
Zoning
or
conditional
use
permit
before
not
knowing
she
needed
one,
but
obviously
law
enforcement
officers
were
not
concerned
either.
If
we
have
parole
officers
calling
to
place
people
there,
if
they're
not
asking
if
they
have
the
conditional
use
permit
either.
So
it
might
be
something
of
a
gray
area
that
people
need
to
be
educated
on
about
the
landlords
probably
need
to
take
responsibility
for
that.
K
But
I'm
glad
you
clarified
the
issue
that
your
ownership,
but
I
think
it's
a
great
thing.
I
know
several
people
who
have
gone
through
recovery
and
it's
a
hard
start,
and
so
I'm
glad
they
have
a
safe
place
to
go
with
some
rules
because
they
need
their
rules.
They
can't
exist
without
them
right
away.
So
thank
you
for
watching
exactly.
B
All
right!
Well,
what
we'll
do
here
now
deb
we'll
see
if
there
are
other
comments
from
the
public,
either
pro
or
fun
on
this
issue,
so
we'll
come
back.
B
In
a
few
minutes,
all
right
sounds
good.
Okay,
all
right
is
there.
Anybody
present
participating
here
in
the
audience
that
would
like
to
speak
in
support
of
the
applicant's
request
for
this
conditional
use
permit.
So
if
somebody
would
like
to
speak
in
support
of
the
requests,
please
hit
the
raise
hand,
function
and
zoom
or,
if
you're
listening
by
phone
hit
the
star
and
then
the
number
nine
to
be
recognized.
B
It's
part
of
the
funnest
zoom
okay
is
there.
Anybody
wishes
to
speak
in
opposition
to
the
applicant's
request,
we'll
do
the
same:
sign,
hit
the
raise
hand,
function
and
zoom
or
star
nine
on
your
phone.
Anybody
that
wishes
to
speak
in
opposition
to
potentially
approving
this
conditional
use
request.
B
Okay,
so
the
number
area
code,
773
you're,
being
recognized
so
hit
star
six
now
on
your
phone
and
that
will
there
you
go
all
right.
We
just
need
your
name
and
address
hello
board.
My.
P
Of
southeast
12th
and
marion,
so
there
is
one
lot
separating
myself
in
this
house.
C
M
P
Thank
you,
I
believe
in
second
chances,
and
I
believe
it's
a
it's
a
good
cause
as
to
what's
going
on
I'm
a
brand
new
homeowner
to
this
house.
We
moved
in
in
august
and
it's
needless
to
say.
It
was
a
complete
surprise
to
me
to
get
the
letter
in
the
mail
for
this
meeting.
I
have
noticed
that
the
property
isn't
always
maintain.
You
know
maintained
there.
P
There
is
snow
on
the
sidewalks,
maybe
not
enough
to
get
a
ticket,
but
I
just
I
have
concerns
I'm
taking
care
of
my
elderly
parents
in
this
house.
All
my
neighbors
surrounding
me
are
actually
widower.
P
P
Besides
that
it
was
run
by
volunteers,
so
I'm
concerned
with
how
tight
a
ship
this
is
going
to
be
run.
You
know,
are
they?
How
often
is
their
drug
testing
is
with
with
four
women
in
the
neighborhood
also
brings
potential
for
many
more
guests
as
well.
So
those
are
my
concerns,
like
I
say
I
believe
in
the
cause,
but
I
I
have
safety
concerns.
P
Does
it
make
me
feel
good
that
they've
been
operating
without
knowledge
for
a
long
time,
but
I'm
glad
to
have
knowledge
of
it
now
the
recidivism
rate
is
about
30
percent.
From
what
I
understand
for
parolees
in
iowa
right
now,
so
statistically
more
than
one
of
those
women
each
time
is
going
to
be
a
re-offender.
P
B
You
can
make
some
statements
seth,
but
you're
not
allowed
to
ask
questions
and
dab.
Okay,
we're
not
allowed
to
respond
to
questions
from.
N
P
B
All
right
all
right
well
sas.
Thank
you
we're
pleased
you
purchased
a
house
here
in
des
moines
and-
and
I
think
you'll
find
that
it's
generally
speaking,
a
good
neighborhood.
I
think,
from
what
you've
seen
you've
noticed
that
so
far
okay,
is
there
anybody
else
who
wishes
to
speak
in
opposition
to
this
item?.
B
Hit
the
zoom
raise
hand,
icon
or
hit
star
9
on
your
phone
to
be
recognized,
and
if
there
are
no
others,
anybody
that
wants
to
speak
in
neutrality
still
has
to
be
related
to
this
specific
item.
J
Thank
you
chair
and
members
of
the
board.
I
do
have
some
comments.
I
think
it's
quite
clear
from
the
statements
made
by
the
person
who
operates
this
house,
that
this
is
a
correctional
placement
facility.
J
Previously,
I
believe
it
has
been
classified
or
determined
to
be
a
group
home
group
residence,
not
otherwise
categorized,
which
is
treated
differently
under
the
zoning
supplemental
use
regulations.
This
is
clearly
clearly
a
correctional
placement
facility
and
I
believe
this
needs
to
be
continued
to
be
re-noticed
as
such,
and
the
staff
recommendations
need
to
come
back
with
the
supplemental
use,
regulations
that
are
applicable
to
a
correctional
placement
facility.
B
J
I
I
always
understood
it
to
be
to
be
a
correctional
placement
facility.
I
think
there
was
some
question
at
the
pnc,
although
I
did
not
attend
that
meeting
as
to
what
exactly
it
was,
and
there
was
an
indication
that
it
wasn't
correctional
placement
again.
I
wasn't
there,
but
it's
clear
from
today
that
this
is
is
a
correctional
placement
facility.
J
B
B
Well,
ho
hold
on
a
second
deb,
we'll
we'll
we'll
come
back
to
you,
we're
not
going
to
leave
you
hanging
so
suan.
If
you
had
those
concerns,
then
when
the
application
was
first
discussed
before
being
put
on
the
agenda,
should
that
not
have
been
reviewed,
I'm
I'm
not
trying
to
be
punitive
here,
but
I'm
just
trying
to
figure
out.
Oh,
it
seems
like
we're
almost
out
the
gate
here
and
now
we
need
to
maybe
pull
this
off
and
reevaluate.
J
I
I
was
talking
to
staff
about
it
during
staff
recommendation
meetings
and
was
assured
that
she
testified
it
was.
It
was
not
correctional
placement,
it
was
group
living
otherwise
classified,
but
not
otherwise
classified
I'll.
Let
it
go
as
of
the
testimony
of
today.
I
am
convinced
it's
correctional
placement
facility
and
we
ought
to
re
review
this
under
those
standards
and
re-notice.
It.
B
And
if
that
happens,
if
we
would
delay
this
or
it
would
need
to
be
re-noticed
there'd
be
no
additional
charge
to
the
applicant,
for
that,
would
there
be
no
okay,
okay,
all
right,
always
something
of
interest
at
the
zoning
board
of
adjustment,
all
right
anything
else.
You
want
to
share
at
this
time,
suanne.
J
B
Right:
okay,
okay,
so
questions
for
city
staff
from
the
board,
which
could
include
su-lan,
so
board
members.
It
looks
like
there.
There
might
be
kind
of
a
point
of
order
here
being
noted
by
the
city,
but
does
the
board
have
any
questions
for
city
staff
not
just
related
to
the
application,
but
obviously
what
suanne
has
just
noted.
K
Cislyn
cross,
I
have
a
question:
can
we
what
are
the
differences
in
granting
approval
for
correctional
versus
group
home
yeah?
That's
what
I'm
looking.
J
For
it's
a
good
question
chair
members
of
the
board,
we
would
have
to
look
at
separation
from
other
facility
like
facilities.
There
are.
There
are
other
considerations
like
the
square
feet
of
the
living
space.
J
Sort
of
the
calculation
of
usable
living
space
and
how
many
people
could
occupy
it.
It
probably
meets
the
lavatory
and
toilet
pretend
residents
there's
some
dining
and
recreation
square
footage
areas
and
it
has
to
provide
supervision
24
hours
a
day
by
a
person's
responsible
for
the
care
of
the
residents.
J
B
So
suanne
a
question:
I've
got
I'm
trying
to
track
with
all
of
this,
so
group
living
other
than
parolees.
Well,
like
group
living
is
just
hey,
I've
got
a
house
for
rent,
and
it's
now,
it's
a
multi-family
house
I
run
out
bedrooms
is.
Is
that
what
you're
saying
that
that
that
we
could
consider
it
if
there
weren't
parolees
or
is
there
some
like
post-prison
release
group
living
where
they're
not
parolee,.
J
I
would
say
that
that
if,
if
part
of
their
parole
is
they
have
to
live
there
and
their
parole
officer
has
to
know
that
they're
there
or
know
where
they're
at,
but
that's
that
is
a
placement
through
the
correctional
placement
now,
if
they're
out
of
prison-
and
they
don't
have
any
requirements
to
live
in
a
sober
house.
J
B
L
G
J
K
Staff
sergeant
this
is
uncorrect,
so
if
the
parole
officer
is
just
trying
to
help
somebody
because
they
know
this
is
a
place
that
takes
parolee
but
not
placing
him
there
is
that
then
a
group
home,
or
is
that
the
correctional
thing
or
is
that
what
we
need
to
do
more
investigation
from
finding
out
how
people
are
being
placed
there.
J
Yeah,
I
wouldn't
mind
a
continuance
to
find
that
out,
but
I
would
say
if
a
parole
officer
is
calling
saying
you
have
a
bed
for
this
person.
I
can
get
them
on
parole.
If
you
have
a
bed
for
them,
then
that's
probably
correctional
placement.
They
can't
get
out
until
until
they're
housed
somewhere
and
the
parole
officer
is
looking
for
it
right.
J
Of
prison-
and
I
have
no
no-
I
don't
have
to
tie
to
anywhere
and
I'm
just
released
from
prison.
Then
I
I
can
choose
where
I
live
and
that's
not
correctional
placement.
I
I
think
right.
We
have
to
be
very
careful
that
we
understand
exactly
what
what
the
terms
of
the
of
the
parole
and
occupancy
are.
B
Sure
and
suanne
we've
got
a
lot
of
people
who
come
back
into
society
on
parole.
So
if
I
was
on
parole,
but
I
got
an
apartment
in
a
properly
zoned
apartment
building,
that's
not
considered
correctional
placement.
Is
it
correct.
B
J
B
B
J
Well,
group
living
not
otherwise
classified
they
had
to
rezone
from
a
regular
neighborhood
district
to
addition
to
a
zoning
that
allowed
that.
So
this
is
not
looked
at
as
a
customary
incidental
to
a
residential
got.
It.
A
Yeah,
I've
got
it
when
catherine
has
the
text
highlighted,
but
when
it
was
rezoned
back
in
december
to
the
limited
nx2
it
had
the
zoning
condition.
That
said,
any
group
living
used
to
the
property
shall
be
limited
to
the
freedom
house
group,
living
use
and
form,
as
described
in
the
rezoning
application
and
the
group
living
use
that
the
both
the
correctional
placement
and
the
use
otherwise
not
classified
that
we
have
on
the
agenda
for
both
of
those
fall
under
that
same
category.
There.
J
A
D
B
B
So
the
staff
is
saying
what
what
they're
saying
at
this
time,
we'll
give
you
a
chance
for
closing
here,
which
will
be
very
very
shortly,
all
right,
so
board
members.
Do
we
have
any
further
questions
for
city
staff
or
suanne.
C
N
B,
3.2
b
there's
a
correctional
placement
resonance
definition
that
goes
on
for
quite
some
length
and
right
now,
I'm
just
tossing
around
what
I've
heard
in
terms
of
the
testimony,
because
I
think
there
is
a
fact
question
that
we
are
unclear
where
we
fall
on
and
in
order
to
determine
that
it
probably
is
not
out
of
line
to
request,
to
continue
or
to
seek
to
grant
the
continuance
so
that
we
can
determine
that,
because
I'm
not
sure
that
it
falls
in
correctional
placement
either.
Given
the
limitations
of
this
definition.
C
Well,
could
we
at
least
ask
when
I
know
that
there's
going
to
be
a
rebuttal
here,
but
at
the
end
of
that,
maybe
based
on
your
understanding
of
whatever
the
definitions
into
the
categories
are,
maybe
you
could
ask
that
question
of
the
applicant
to
to
kind
of
determine
I
mean
I
guess
I
obviously.
If
we
need
to
continue
it,
we
should,
if,
if
it
is
categorically
misplaced
right
now,
we
should
continue
it.
C
But
if
there's
some
open
question
which
we
can
establish
right
now,
we
might
as
well
just
hear
it
and
it,
and
it
comes
the
other
back
the
other
way
and
it
does
fit
into
the
group
home
rather
than
the
correctional
facility.
Whatever
category,
then
I
think
we
should
just.
We
should
try
to
do
a
little
more
work
to
make
sure
that
we
can
figure
that
out
and
just
handle
it
today,
if
possible.
B
Right
yeah,
I
I
think
the
vice
chair
has
a
good
point.
If
this
is
something
that
staff
really
has
to
work
through
and
do
a
lot
of
legal
consultation
on
for
the
benefit
of
everyone
from
the
process,
the
proper
process
and
certainly
for
consideration
of
of
any
applicant
we'd,
probably
be
best
to
defer
this,
but
if
it
is
something
we
can
work
through,
I
think
the
applicant's
been
very
clear
what
they're
doing
and
how
they
do
it.
B
If
there's
a
way
that
we
can
work
through
that
in
today's
hearing,
I
would
be
okay
with
that
judy.
Do
you
want
to
add
anything
to
that
or
do
you
have
any
advice
for
the
board
and
we
can
certainly
get
to
more
of
this
and
board
deliberation,
but
just
briefly
on
what
nathan
referenced,
can
you
help
us
there?
B
N
What
thank
you
this
is
judy
parks,
cruz,
the
legal
counsel
for
the
board.
What
I'm
looking
at
in
terms
of
definition,
talks
about
correctional
placement
in
terms
of
specific
types
of
status
that
the
individual
has,
and
there
are
three
of
them
listed
and
typically
these
would
be
something
that
would
be
documented
in
the
correctional
record
of
the
individual.
N
B
Well,
yeah,
I
I
guess
what
I'm
getting
at
is
yeah,
so
somebody
leaves
the
newton
correctional
facility
in
jasper,
county
and
they're
being
sent
to
fort
moines,
that's
a
correctional
facility,
but
they
are
being
assigned
to
it
by
the
court
right.
In
a
case
like
this,
this
is
voluntary,
yeah
they're
on
parole,
but
the
person's
decided
they
want
to
be
there.
The
prison
system
is
not
sending
them
there
as
part
of
carrying
out
their
sentence
or
carrying
out
their
rehabilitation.
B
J
B
Okay,
all
right
yeah-
I
I
guess
what's
good
about
this
is-
is
I
think
we
can
find
a
way
through
it,
but
it
sounds
like
potentially
in
order
to
preserve
everybody's
interest
here,
and
this
does
include
the
neighborhood
by
the
way
reserve
the
interest
of
the
neighbors
in
the
neighborhood.
B
This
might
warrant
some
some
more
intense
thought
by
staff
and
their
legal
counsel
beyond
this
agenda
item
today.
But
so
since
nathan
had
a
question
of
statement
staff,
do
we
have
anything
else
that
staff
or
questions
for
staff
from
the
board.
B
Well,
what
what
we're
reading
there
is?
What
staff
wrote
as
original
prose
here?
This
is
not
the
code.
This
is
this.
This
is
a
staff
report,
so
I
think
city
staff
has
to
go
back
through
the
intent
of
the
ordinance
and
either
tie
up
those
loose
ends
or
clarify
what
a
facility
is
or
assignment
to
a.
A
But
with
this
condition,
that's
highlighted
here
that
says
any
group
living
use
of
the
property
shall
be
limited
to
the
freedom
house
group
living
use
in
form,
as
described
in
the
rezoning
application
and
then
right
below
that
this
was
what
was
taken
from
the
application.
That
says,
the
freedom
house
is
a
women's
house
for
those
on
parole
and
for
those
who
desire
a
clean
and
sober
life.
A
A
B
A
B
So
so
I
I
think
board
members
yeah.
Do
you
have
other
questions
for
staff?
We
will
have
a
board
deliberation
here
yet
today.
G
K
This
is
lynn
carlson.
I
got
a
comment
and
maybe
to
answer
dave's
question.
For
me.
It
seems
like
it's
a
correctional
house
if
they
are
told
by
their
parole
officer
that
they
need
to
live
in
this
place
and
the
parole
officer
places
them.
It's
a
group
living
if
it's
a
person
who
happens
to
be
on
parole
and
finds
the
house
and
says
these
are
people
by
people
that
I
want
to
live
with.
Who
will
support
me
yeah
if
it's
a
voluntary
or
if
it's
a
mandatory
and
who's
telling
them
to
live
there.
P
D
D
Unless
you're
discharging
and
you're
done
with
your
sentence,
but
pretty
much
as
far
as
I
as
a
neighbor
and
want
to
know
who
lives
in
my
neighborhood,
pretty
much
everybody
coming
out
is
going
to
get
a
parole,
except
for
the
people
in
life
for
life.
Okay.
So
anyway,
the
fort
des
moines,
the
women's
work
release
or
the
women
or
all
the
work
releases
in
the
different
counties
in
iowa
are
correctional
placement.
They
are,
they
are
ran
by
correctional
staff.
D
B
D
A
D
But
these
women
are
not
being
sent
to
a
correctional
facility,
they
are
globalist
enough
that
the
correctional
facilities
and
we
need
to
really
think
about
being
grateful
for
that
where
the
high
risk
offenders
go
where
the
correctional
staff
is
and-
and
I
think
I
probably
I
really
didn't
say
at
the
beginning
of
this-
this
today,
like
I
did
in
december,
I
take
people
who
aren't
on
parole.
D
B
L
P
D
Our
town-
and
I
I
just
I
can
only
say
this
one
more
time
I
take
any
women
or
men
that
want
to
live
a
sober
right,
living
life.
Okay
and
you
won't
believe
how
many
of
them
can't
go
to
their
families.
The
the
parole
board
might
say:
hey
you
don't
have
to
go
to
the
fort
des
moines.
You
don't
have
to
go
to
the
work
release
see.
If
do
you
have
a
family
member
you
could
go
to
because
they
don't
want
to
use
up
my
beds
either
because.
L
D
N
D
L
B
D
B
B
Got
it
all
right
board
members
as
a
courtesy
to
you,
do
you
have
any
final
questions
you'd
like
to
ask
deb.
B
B
So
all
right,
my
smart
fellow
board
members-
let's
let's
think
through
this-
if,
if
for
the
purpose
of
legality,
this
is
a
little
too
confusing,
it
might
warrant
us
to
put
this
off
and
defer
this
for
the
benefit
of
the
applicant
as
well.
If
we
think
we
understand
where
staff's
concerns
were,
but
yet
we
feel
we've
addressed
that
with
testimony
and
our
questions,
then
maybe
we
can
make
a
decision.
C
A
Yeah
see
our
definition
of
correctional
placement
residents,
the
first
part
of
it
says
I
guess
I
read
it
to
you.
It
says
a
correctional
placement
residence
is
a
group
living
occupied
by
three
or
more
persons
who
have
been
convicted
of
public
offenses
and
who
have
been
released
to
such
facility,
and
I
think
the
fact
that
they're
not
released
directly
to
this
facility
was
why
it
had
been
put
on
the
agenda
as
a
group
living
not
otherwise
categorized.
A
So
if
the
board
would
grant
that
today,
that's
what
they
would
be
approved
for
so
if
it
was
ever
discovered
that
these
people
are
actually
being
released
to
this
facility,
then
that
would
be
a
clear
zoning
violation,
but
I
think
sue's
wanting
to
avoid
having
to
do
that.
Enforcement
should
rather
take
a
step
back
now.
Just
make
sure
the
board's
decision
is
the
right
one,
and
then
she
wouldn't
have
to
do
the
enforcement
on
the
back
end.
C
Well,
on
the
flip
side
of
that,
though,
why
don't
we
just
allow
it
right
now
and
if
it
is
the
case
through
some
legalities
that
it
seems
like
it's
actually
required,
although
I
will
say
from
my
perspective,
it
doesn't
seem
like
it
hits
that,
but
if
it
requires
some
other
conditional
use
permit,
then
staff
can
bring
it
back
next
month
right
and
instead
of
continuing
it,
we
can.
I
mean
she
can
have
two
conditional
use
permits.
C
Well,
I'm
not
recommending
it
because
I
actually
think
based
on
her
description
and
what
you
just
read
of
the
the
requirement
for
correctional
use
facilities.
I
mean
it
may
not
be
the
case.
I
mean,
as
she
said.
It
may
not
be
the
case
that
there
are
three
or
more
people
there
from
that
have
been.
You
know
that
are
on
parole
right,
it
could
be
zero
or
it
could
be
one
yeah
and
it
would
still
be
a
group
home
living
spot.
F
F
I
K
Dave,
I
agree
with
you
on
that
that
we're
reading
twitch
because
she
mentioned
that
she
has
people
living
in
her
places
who
are
not
on
parole
specifically
and
the
whole
thing
lies
down
to
is:
are
they
placed
there
by
the
pos?
Not
just
the
pos
can
check
there,
but
who
places
them
there
and
if
people
are
calling
from
prison.
K
C
B
B
It's
not
a
choice.
This
is
a
choice.
All
the
parole
officer
wants
is:
where
are
you
living,
so
I
can
find
you
to
make
sure
you're
you're
you're
not
running
out
of
state
or
you're,
not
or
you're
doing
what
you're
supposed
to
so
without
belaboring
this
fellow
board
members.
We
have
more
discussion
and
judy,
since
you
are
our
advisor.
B
If,
if
there's
a
motion
we
might
make
that
is
so
far
off
the
rails,
it's
not
even
within
legal
confines.
Please
let
us
know.
B
Further
debate
I'd
want
to
have
my
board
members
decide.
Do
we
want
to
defer
this
to
next
month
to
see
if
there's
clarifications
needed,
or
do
we
feel
that,
with
the
testimony
that
was
presented
by
the
applicant
the
questions
we
had,
and
certainly
as
well
as
testimony
and
concerns
from
those
in
the
neighborhood,
do
we
have
what
we
need
to
decide
if
a
conditional
use
permit
is
warranted
here
for
this
group
living.
K
This
is
lynn,
I'm
going
to
go
ahead
and
move
staff
recommendation
of
allowing
this
with
the
conditions
that
were
listed
in
the
staff
recommendations.
I
believe
there's
five
of
them.
There.
B
So
if
there's
no
further
discussion
on
that,
then
all
that
would
be
in
favor
of
granting
the
requested
conditional
use.
I
will
take
roll
call
and
I
for
approval.
P
B
B
About
this
address,
if
you've
got
some
other
operations
in
the
city
of
des
moines,
it
might
behoove
you
to
discuss
it
sooner
rather
than
later,
but
I'll
just
leave
you
with
that
advice.
B
Yes,
you're
very
welcome
all
right.
So
that
concludes
agenda.
Item
number
four,
so
board
members
we
just
got
a
few
minor
items
of
business.
One
is
to
approve
minutes
from
last
month's
meeting.
I
think
six
of
seven
of
us
were
here.
B
G
B
There
we
go
motion
by
smith
second
by
jones,
all
in
favor
of
approving
the
minutes
you're
here
last
month.
We'll
take
roll
call,
that's
everybody.
C
G
B
B
Both
burj
and
judy
worked
with
me
and
helped
develop
language
for
a
letter
to
ask
the
city
to
reconsider
allowances
for
some
signage
within
a
flood
district,
because
right
now
wouldn't
allow
for
any
on
a
pre-existing
building
so
and
birch
or
judy.
If
you
want
to
add
anything
to
this,
this
went
to
council
and
then
they
do.
What
with
it.
N
They
actually
consider
that
there
is
a
consideration
of
it
at
the
february
8th
council
meeting
and
they
then
refer
it
back
to
staff
to
determine
exactly
the
parameters
of
any
kind
of
amendment
that
would
be
proposed
there
are,
there
will
probably
be
a
number
of
amendments
to
the
newly
enacted,
134
135,
taking
place
probably
around
mid-year
of
this
year,
and
this
will
be
included
among
those,
so
they
favorably
consider
you
know
getting
this
kind
of
feedback
so
that
they
can
get
it
in
the
chain
of
events
to
get
it
actually
written
into
code.
B
Okay,
yeah,
we
did
this
a
few
years
ago.
A
few
of
you
were
on
the
board
at
that
time,
but
it
was
the
zoning
board
of
adjustment
that
said,
hey
city,
we'd,
love,
to
see
an
ordinance
that
says
no
more
poll
signs
for
new
development
and
also
to
in
in
essence,
eliminate
old
pole
signs
if
they're
no
longer
in
use
and
that
that
wound
up
getting
put
in
the
city
code
and
updated
a
couple
times
and
is
still
reflected
in
our
new
ordinance.
B
So
so
it
gives
us
a
chance
when
we
see
things
on
a
continual
basis
that
might
need
tweaking
or
adjustment.
Just
as
a
citizen,
as
I
say
in
the
preamble
citizens,
can
ask
the
city
to
change
the
regulations.
So
can
we
so?
I
think
that
was
a
nice
bit
of
homework
on
our
part.
This
issue
will
probably
rarely
come
up,
but
it
might
help
us
avoid
having
some
of
these
in
the
future
when
they're
really
minor
considerations.
B
A
The
only
thing
I
was
going
to
mention
was
that
likely
on
the
april
board
of
adjustment
agenda.
In
addition,
the
annual
election
of
officers
will
also
have
a
item
to
approve
any
proposed
amendments
to
the
bylaws.
So
I
sent
the
bylaws
out
about
a
month
ago
with
the
workshop,
so
if
anybody
has
any
suggested
changes
or
edits
to
those
feel
free
to
send
them
my
way,
but
at
this
point
I'm
shooting
for
the
april
meeting
to
approve
those
any
revisions.
A
I
don't
remember
which
version
I
have
the
version,
that's
currently
on
the
books,
and
I
also
have
a
version
where
I've
highlighted
the
stuff,
I
think
should
be
changed.
I
don't
remember
which
version
I
sent
out.
B
B
Oh
yeah
cool
and
so
we'll
have
two
elected
board
positions
up
we
have
vice
chair
and
chair.
I
I
would
anticipate
that
this
could
be
a
very
large
and
expensive
campaign
for
canada,
so.
O
Chair,
I
got
a
general
question
for
staff.
If
I
could
just
ask
at
one
point:
accessory
dwelling
units
were
kind
of
something
that
was
going
to
be
in
the
purview
of
the
board,
and
yet
I
haven't
seen
anything
come
up.
Is
there
an
update
on
that?
Are
they
still?
Is
it
still
being
kind
of
worked
out
among
new
language.
O
O
A
Yeah,
okay,
yeah,
the
short-term
commercial,
rentals
and
airbnbs,
I
think
sue
knows
the
most
current
upper
the
most
current
status.
But
right
now
it's
on
the
books
as
though
those
would
require
a
conditional
use
permit
from
the
board
of
adjustment.
But
last
summer
the
state
legislature
passed
some
legislation
that
stripped
the
city
of
the
ability
to
regulate
those.
E
A
O
L
User
in
the
code
and
are
generally
allowed,
they
might
have
some
things
that
would
maybe
go
to
the
board
as
long
as
they
have
the
right
zoning.
I
think
it's
more
of
a
matter
of
chapter
130.
B
Yeah
yeah
yeah
the
little
grandma's
cottages
on
existing
property
like
in
sherman
hill.
You
you've
addressed
that
now
in
the
zoning
ordinance
for
certain
right.
B
Got
you
cool
all
right,
but
justin
good
question
all
the
way
around
yeah?
That's
one!
We've
been
busy
enough
with
with
taverns
and
cell
phone
towers,
I
hadn't
thought
about
our
vrbo
airbnb
stuff.
So,
okay,
all
right.
Well,
if
nobody
has
anything
else,
I
appreciate
everybody's
attention
and
commitment.
So
thank
you
all
and
we'll
see
you
next
month,
thanks
everybody.
This
hearing
is
officially.