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From YouTube: 4-27-22 Zoning Board of Adjustment
Description
Des Moines Zoning Board of Adjustment meeting on Wednesday, April 27, 2022.
View the agenda: https://www.dsm.city/zoning_board_of_adjustment_meeting_schedule.php
A
B
B
The
members
of
this
board
are
citizens
of
the
city
of
des
moines
and
have
been
appointed
to
this
board
by
the
city
council.
The
board
members
are
volunteers
and
receive
no
compensation
for
their
public
service.
I'm
going
to
take
a
moment
here
and
introduce
our
board
members
on
the
audience's
right
is
tom.
Decio
next
to
him
is
rhonda
cedillo,
I'm
mel
pins.
The
board
chair
on
my
right
is
marlos
jones
and
next
to
her
is
justin
gross.
B
This
is
a
seven
member
board.
We
have
five
members
present
today
and
I'm
going
to
come
back
to
that
in
just
a
second
I'm
going
to
go
ahead
and
introduce
our
city
staff,
who
will
be
assisting
us
today,
first
and
foremost,
the
zoning
board
of
adjustments.
Legal
counsel
is
gary
guidelock
to
my
left
for
city
staff
that
will
be
assisting
in
giving
presentations,
answering
questions,
frank
dun,
young
senior
city,
planner,
bert
drost,
the
deputy
planning
administrator
trey,
yossi
chakraboti
city
planner
and
eric
lundy
zoning
enforcement
officer
for
the
city.
Tyler
hall.
B
Is
our
meeting
moderator
I'll
cover
the
meetings
procedure
here?
For
some
of
you,
this
may
be
the
first
time
that
you're
in
front
of
us
at
this
board.
You
may
hope
that
it's
the
only
time
you're
in
front
of
us
but
we'll
try
to
take
everybody
through
the
process
here.
So
if
you
haven't
done
this
before,
don't
worry,
we
will
work
you
through
this.
B
First
of
all,
the
board
of
adjustment
is
a
quasi
legal
board.
This
hearing
will
be
conducted
within
the
procedures
and
format
as
authorized
by
iowa
law
and
the
city's
ordinances.
The
meeting
is
open
to
the
public,
but
the
meeting
is
being
recorded
by
both
audio
and
video.
For
a
legal
record
of
these
proceedings,
the
board
members
have
each
received
a
copy
of
the
agenda
and
the
staff
recommendations.
B
B
B
We'll
then
move
to
the
public
comment
portion
of
the
hearing.
Anyone
that
wishes
to
speak
in
support
of
in
opposition
to
or
even
in
neutrality
of
an
appeal
will
be
allowed
up
to
five
minutes
each
to
present
their
comments.
This
will
be
their
one
and
only
opportunity
to
address
the
board
in
relation
to
that
item.
B
B
All
speakers
are
requested
to
speak
only
from
the
podium
here
at
the
front
center
of
the
room
by
where
the
laptops
up
there
on
the
podium.
You
must
give
first,
both
your
name
and
address
of
business
or
residence
as
appropriate
for
your
presence
here.
In
the
event,
you
may
need
to
be
contacted
for
legal
notices
related
to
the
outcome
of
this
appeal.
B
All
speakers
are
requested
to
remain
courteous
and
to
focus
their
comments
only
upon
those
facts
that
demonstrate
whether
or
not
the
criteria
established
by
law
has
been
satisfied.
Speakers
are
asked
to
ensure
they're
respectful
of
time
considerations
and,
if
necessary,
the
board
chair
will
limit
further
comments
by
a
speaker
if
they
exceed
their
time
limitation.
B
After
all,
comments
have
been
received.
The
board
will
then
close.
Any
further
public
comment
on
the
agenda
item
at
hand
and
the
board
will
immediately
deliberate
the
request
and
we
will
make
a
decision
here
today
on
the
appeal.
Please
note
that
it
takes
at
least
four
affirmative
votes
for
any
zoning
appeal
to
gain
approval.
B
I'm
going
to
take
a
moment
to
comment
on
that
we're
a
seven-member
board.
There
are
five
board
members
present
today.
It
always
takes
at
least
four
board
members
to
approve
any
appeal.
So
basically,
you
got
to
get
four
out
of
the
five
of
us
to
agree
to
approve
your
appeal
with
only
five
board.
Members
present,
if
you
feel
that's,
maybe
not
enough
of
a
audience
here
to
consider
your
appeal
for
approval.
B
Basically,
it's
going
to
set
you
back
a
month,
but
if
you
feel
like
you
have
a
good
case
and
you're
following
the
reasoning
of
how
we
would
grant
an
appeal,
you
can
give
it
your
best
shot,
but
you
either
got
your
chance
today
or
you
can
ask
to
be
moved
to
next
month.
Next
month,
somebody
could
have
a
broken
leg,
get
hit
by
a
bus.
I
don't
know
so
with
seven
members.
I
can
never
guarantee
that
there
will
be
seven
members
here,
but
there
must
always
be
four
to
have
quorum
for
a
hearing.
B
All
material,
written
or
otherwise
used
today,
as
part
of
any
presentation,
is
part
of
the
permanent
record.
So
if
you
have
not
already
provided
copies
of
your
presentation,
materials
to
staff,
you'll
need
to
do
that.
You
may
contact
city
staff
after
the
hearing.
If
you'd
like
a
copy
of
anything
presented
today.
B
Finally,
some
quick
housekeeping
items:
we
ask
that
you
avoid
any
undue
conversation
in
the
audience
so
as
to
limit
distractions
during
the
hearing
you're
doing
a
fine
job
on
that.
Also,
please
ensure
your
cell
phone
has
been
silenced
and
if
you
need
to
use
a
restroom,
just
go
right
back
through
these
doors,
you
don't
have
to
go
back
downstairs,
walk
past
the
staircase
and
there's
restrooms
on
your
left
based
on
the
agenda.
If
we
need
to,
we
will
take
about
a
five
minute
break
around
three
or
three
thirty.
C
C
B
Just
nod
your
head:
okay,
all
right!
All
right,
so
we've
got
a
request
to
continue
that
item
until
the
next
regularly
scheduled
hearing,
that's
item
for
it,
1623
6th
avenue
so
board.
Members
there's
been
a
request
to
continue
that
the
applicants
in
agreement
with
that,
unless
there's
any
real
basic
questions,
would
there
be
a
motion
to
continue
that
to
the
next
hearing
moved
by
tom
second,
by
rhonda,
all
those
in
favor
raise
your
right
hand.
B
B
And
on
consent
agenda
again,
the
city
staff
is
recommending
approval
of
these
items,
so
we
are
not
planning
on
hearing
those
directly.
So
unless
there's
a
member
of
this
audience
that
request,
we
hear
the
item
directly.
We
would
be
voting
for
approval
and
unless
there's
a
member
of
this
board
that
wants
the
item
heard,
we
would
also
consider
it
as
part
of
consent
agenda
for
approval.
So
what
I'm
going
to
do
here?
Just
read
the
item
item.
One
is
a
radical,
well
wait!
A
minute
item.
One
is
the
ratification
of
a
decision
in
order.
B
There's
really
nothing
to
do
there.
Besides,
just
a
real
quick
review
on
that
that
was
from
last
month-
and
I
think
everybody
was
agreeable
to
some
terms
that
the
board
wanted
to
put
on
continuing
the
conditional
use
permit
for
operation
of
a
tavern,
but
we
wanted
to
see
some
modifications
and
make
sure
that
both
the
applicant
and
staff
are
on
the
same
page.
So
frank:
could
you
give
us
a
quick
summary
of
what
some
of
those
key
items
were
that
we
wanted
in
that
decision
in
order.
C
There
were
four
items
in
particular.
The
first
item
was
allowance
of
our
use
under
the
revised
conditional
use
for
a
probationary
probationary
period
of
12
months,
after
which
they
shall
return
to
the
board
for
reconsideration
at
the
april
2023
zoning
board
of
adjustment
meeting.
In
order
to
allow
the
use
to
continue.
C
C
C
B
Yeah
and
frank's
just
giving
this
to
us
as
a
review,
so
we
don't
really
have
we
there's
nothing.
We
need
to
hear
no
testimony
to
take,
but
the
board
just
wanted
this
brought
back.
So
we
could
make
sure
we
were
clear
what
was
in
that
decision
in
order
that
was
kind
of
congruent
with
what
our
decision
making
was.
So
unless
anybody
has
any
questions
for
frank
or
any
other
concerns,
would
there
be.
B
D
B
Yeah
and
there's
probably
a
fine
line
there.
I
think
our
intention
was
clear
on
that,
but
you
know
well,
how
do
they
sign
it?
What
kind
of
plate
marker
do
they
put
on
it?
I
think
we'll
have
to
just
staff,
can
help
them
understand
what
the
intent
was
and
hopefully
they'll
carry
that
out
to
the
nth
degree
for
us
yeah
yeah,
but
I'm
on
the
same
page
too
justin
on
that
one:
okay,
any
other
questions
or
anything
with
the
review
of
the
decision
and
orders
presented.
B
B
B
Unless
is
there
anyone
in
the
audience
who
would
be
opposed
to
the
board,
granting
the
requested
type
2
zoning
exceptions
if
anybody's
opposed
to
that?
Just
raise
your
right
hand
if
you're
not
opposed
to
it,
then
we'll
consider
that
there
are
no
concerns,
seeing
none
any
questions
or
concerns
from
the
board
on
item
two
chair.
B
Okay,
all
right
so
we'll
be
moving
item
two,
which
is
the
remainder
of
the
consent
agenda
for
approval
motion
by
justin.
Second,
by
marliss,
all
those
in
favor
raise
your
right
hand
say
hi,
hi,
all
right.
That
motion
carries
five
zero
okay.
So
if
you
were
here
for
item
two
that
has
been
completed,
you'll
get
your
copy
of
decision
and
order.
Next
week,
all
right
that'll
bring
us
to
item
three:
the
vicinity
of
833
fifth
avenue,
a
type
two
zoning
exception,
generally
related
to
polk,
county
and
veterans
auditorium.
E
E
E
E
E
What
is
being
proposed
is
right
here
and
I'm
going
to
toggle
back
and
forth
a
little
bit
to
explain
what
the
appellant
is
proposing.
They
are
proposing
to
replace
and
add
to
their
existing
illuminated
wall
mounted
sign
on
the
north
frontage
wall
and
the
south
known
frontage
wall.
Half
of
the
signage
earned
on
the
west
frontage
wall,
where
there
is
an
existing
non-conforming
sign,
will
remain
and
is
being
applied
towards
the
proposed
signage
on
the
south
non
frontage
wall.
E
So,
as
you
can
see
here,
the
if
you
can
follow
along
with
my
cursor
right
here,
the
existing
veterans
memorial
letters,
the
line
and
the
community
choice,
letters
will
stay
the
credit
union
convention
center
letters
will
be
removed
and
in
place
of
that,
the
big
c
logo
is
being
proposed,
the
line
and
the
letters
convention
center.
The
dimensions,
as
you
can
see,
are
all
right
here
and
they
add
up
to
a
total
of
about
685
square
feet
area.
E
E
Since
the
proposed
type,
two
zoning
exception
appeals
request
signs
that
are
significantly
larger
than
the
square
footage
of
the
maximum
hundred
square
feet.
That's
allowed
for
any
wall
sign
as
well
as
for
what
can
be
earned
based
on
the
square
footage
of
the
building.
Frontage
staff
believes
that
the
appellant
does
not
satisfy
the
criteria
for
granting
a
type
2
zoning
exceptions.
Granting
these
appeals
would
not
be
consistent
with
the
intended
spirit
and
purpose
of
the
zoning
ordinance.
E
E
E
E
B
A
B
D
D
Can
you
explain
a
little
more
in
detail
why
the
city
doesn't
feel
that
it?
This
is
due
to
practical
difficulties
related
to
the
subject
property.
I
mean.
If
you
look
at
the
the
signage,
it
doesn't
look
like
it's
they're,
not
adjusting
it
or
modifying
too
much
out
of
what
it
normally
is
there
they're,
adding
a
symbol
it
looks
like
is
the
major
thing
that's
going
on.
Is
that
right,
yep
yeah?
E
So
the
and
you
are
exactly
right
in
observing
that
the
existing,
the
the
size
and
dimensions
and
the
character
of
the
existing
signage
is
not
very
different
from
what
is
being
proposed.
Staff
does
not
acknowledge
that
staff's
rationale,
primarily
for
denying
this
request
is
simply
based
on
what
is
allowed
within
our
code.
E
Typically,
staff
will
support
an
exception
if
it
is
50
over
the
maximum
of
what
is
allowed
in
all
of
the
instances
of
the
appeals
it
is
over
the
50
threshold,
and
so,
given
that
rationale,
staff
is
not
able
to
support
it.
Just
based
on
the
just
the
share
percentage
that
the
the
square
footage
of
sign
exceeds
over
that
fifty
percent
of
the
minimum
and.
D
E
What
is
set
by
code
is
the
is
the
number
that
you
see
here
in
the
table
in
your
staff
report,
which
is
the
100
square
foot
that's
allowed
for
any
wall
sign
in
a
dx2
district,
as
well
as
what
the
the
applicant
earns
as
a
result
of
the
building
square
footage.
That's
what's
set
by
code.
The
50
is
more
of
an
internal
policy
and
consistency
that
staff
has
been
following
in
order
to
evaluate
such
requests.
Thank.
F
B
B
E
B
B
Okay,
all
right
and
I'm
assuming
that
was
the
historic
signage
from
square
one
like
from
1957
or
something
is
that
right
or
or
from
from
the
edition
right
right.
It
just
looks
old
yeah
was
that
wouldn't
that
be
considered
legal
non-conforming
and
would
not
need
any
review,
or
does
that
total
add
into
their
other
totals.
B
B
I
believe
that
the
board
of
adjustment
a
number
of
years
ago
approved
the
existing
signage
and
there
were
probably
some
variances
or
exceptions
at
that
time,
and
I
don't
know
if
that's
in
your
staff
report-
and
I
realize
this
is
under
the
current
ordinance,
but
in
scope
and
scale,
what's
already
there
versus
what
they
want
to
add.
Now.
B
E
B
B
Yeah,
what
I'm
trying
to
do
in
my
head
is
just
you
know
of
what's
there
now
with
what
they
do
want
to
install
how
much
bigger
is
that
going
to
be,
but
I
realize
that
you
have
to
look
at
basically
what
what
the
menu
says
for
size
of
signs
allowable
and
what
they're
proposing,
not
comparing
it
to
how
it
looks
now
right.
Okay,
all
right!
Any
other
questions.
B
G
G
We
also
have
a
signed
affidavit
from
the
board
of
supervisors
approving
this
change
and
just
to
give
you
a
little
background
on
myself,
I
am
the
regional
vice
president
of
spectra,
partnerships,
which
is
our
sales
arm
of
the
venue
management
company
spectra
that
manages
on
behalf
of
polk
county.
My
team
is
responsible
for
all
advertising
sales
and
premium
seating,
so
I
actually
did
this
deal
back
in
2012
and
when
the
sign
was
put
up,
that
was
their
main
logo
and
they
were
still
using
credit
union.
G
Since
then,
we
have
they
since
changed
and
dropped
credit
union
from
their
name
and
the
reason
we're
trying
to
do
this
is
we
were
trying
to
save
as
much
of
the
original
sign
to
cut
down
on
waste
and
then
also
for
the
side
of
the
building
itself.
We
just
went
through
a
major
tuck
pointing
project
last
year
and
so
we're
trying
to
do
as
much
as
we
can
to
be
as
cost
effective
and
as
wesley's
waste
as
we
can.
D
G
B
All
right
other
questions
for
lori
lori,
just
in
scope
and
scale
with
this,
so
I'm
assuming
that
these
were
your
drawings,
you
and
your
sign
company
prepared
to
submit
so
where
it
says
community
choice
in
the
white.
Those
are
the
existing
letters
existing
size.
You
would
just
be
adding
in
the
new
c
and
and
the
convention
center
below
right,
correct,
okay,
all
right
so
you're
kind
of
getting
rid
of
credit
union
and
whatever
that
had
related
said
just
eyeballing
it.
B
B
G
B
G
B
E
B
D
D
So
I
I
would,
I
guess,
be
in
favor
of
granting
the
type
2
exception.
I
I
mean
I
think
it
would
meet
the
criteria
that's
listed
here.
You
know
they
may
be
jeopardizing
their
partnership.
I
think
that's
you
know
that.
Could
that
could
definitely
lead
to
some
difficulties
into
the
related
subject?
Property
here
I
think
it.
I
think
it
falls
in
line
with
the
this
essential
character
of
the
the
area
I
mean
this
is
a.
B
B
B
We
have
high
v
hall
and
still
veterans
community
choice
convention
center,
but
I
tell
you
when
the
wrestling
fans
come
from
nowhereville
iowa
to
des
moines
and
I'm
honking
at
them
on
fifth
and
second
and
seventh
like
where
the
heck
are
you
going,
they
need
to
know
where
they're
going
and
there's
so
many
activities
down
there
between
these
three
awesome
venues.
Even
sometimes
I
will
say
to
my
wife
now,
where
is
bravo
at?
Is
it
hyvee
halls?
Is
a
convention
center
where's
it
at?
B
I
think
it's
very
important
that
we
have
to
look
at
ensuring
that
you
know
signage
provides,
certainly
recognition
but
direction.
That's
important
to
me:
where
am
I
arriving
at?
I
think
there
are
some
practical
difficulties.
This
is
a
large
complex
up
here.
People
need
to
kind
of
see
where
they're
going.
B
I
I
feel
this
won't
have
an
adverse
impact
on
the
essential
character
of
the
surrounding
area.
It's
a
destination
convention,
complex
sports
entertainment
place.
I
need
to
see
where
I'm
at.
I
think
it
fits
in
with
that.
It
won't
have
an
adverse
impact
because
I
think
testimony
as
well
as
the
pictures
it's
about
the
same
size
as
it
was
before.
So
it's
not
going
to
change
anything
and
again
design
construction
operation
adequately.
I
believe,
safeguards
the
community's
interests.
That's
what
I
see
here
on
the
exceptions.
B
I
think
it
fits
that
when
I
did
see
this
on
the
agenda,
I
was
curious.
What
what
kind
of
you
know
large
scale
thing?
Are
we
proposing
here,
but
pretty
much
you're,
just
kinda
you're
actually
simplifying
the
name,
so
it
it
actually
looks
less
cluttered
than
it
did
before
in
my
opinion.
So
so
those
would
be
my
thoughts
and,
although
I
think
justin
was
close
to
emotion
in
close
to
a
second,
maybe
if
there's
some
other
comments,
we
could
take
those
if
not
I'd,
be
glad
to
enter.
Have
somebody
entertain
a
motion.
B
H
Yes,
mr
chair,
members
of
the
board,
bert
ross
planning
staff
for
the
city
of
des
moines
item
number.
Five
probably
looks
a
little
different
than
what
you
saw
in
your
packet
on
friday.
The
proposal
hasn't
changed,
but
the
appeals
needed
to
get
there
were
revised
ever
so
slightly.
So
what
you
see
on
the
screen
is
a
little
bit
different
than
what's
in
your
packet.
H
But
again
the
proposal
is
the
same,
and
really
the
gist
of
the
proposal
is
that
they
want
to
add
a
32
square
foot
sign
to
the
west
facade
of
the
existing
deluxe
hotel,
which
is
located
at
800
locust
street
as
I'll
get
to
shortly.
They've
already
been
to
the
board
of
adjustment
a
few
years
ago
to
get
the
appeals
needed
to
have
five
signs
total
on
the
building
and
now
they're
wanting
some
more
appeals
in
order
to
allow
that
sixth
sign.
H
So
I
know
this
is
I'll
zoom
in
a
little
bit.
These
are
the
images
of
the
existing
signs,
so
at
the
north
east
corner
of
the
building,
there's
a
projecting
sign,
that's
10
square
feet
on
each
side,
so
we
actually
consider
that
to
be
a
20
square
foot
sign
and
then
they
also
have
a
canopy
that
projects
from
the
north
side
of
the
building.
That
has
these
three
signs
here,
so
the
north
side,
the
east
side
and
then
the
west
side
and
then
on
the
west
facade
of
the
building.
H
So
where
this
one
gets
confusing
is
that
this
west
wall
is
considered
a
non-frontage
wall
which
the
code
only
allows
a
building
to
apply
up
to
50
percent
of
their
signage
earnings
from
one
facade
on
a
non-frontage
wall.
So
when
this
original
sign
was
approved,
it
was
in
it
was
attributed
to
the
north
facade.
H
But
since
that
north
facade
already
has
three
signs
on
this.
Canopy
staff
found
it
to
be
advantageous
to
actually
apply
the
signage
earnings
to
that
based
on
the
east
frontage
facade
to
allow
these
signs
on
the
west
facade,
I
know
that's
a
mouthful,
so
the
east
facade,
which
has
66
feet
of
frontage,
technically
earns
a
total
of
132
square
feet
of
signage,
which
is
two
square
feet
of
signage
per
lineal.
H
H
This
is
that
existing
projecting
sign
that's
at
the
northeast
corner
of
the
building,
and
this
is
that
existing
sign,
that's
already
on
the
west
facade
and
then
that
new
sign
would
go
generally
here
where
my
mouse
is
moving
and
then
here's
just
a
zoomed.
In
version
of
that,
then
here's
the
dimensions
would
be
eight
feet
across
by
four
feet
tall.
So
it
would
be
a
total
of
32
square
feet.
F
H
And
then
this
is
the
decision
in
order
from
2015
when
they
were
given
the
at
that
time
it
was
still
a
variance,
so
they
were
given
variance
to
have
all
of
that
square
footage
of
signage
on
the
west
facade.
But
again,
I've
just
mentioned
that
these
original
appeals
are
under
the
retired
zoning
ordinance.
H
So
what
we're
considering
today
is
slightly
different
as
far
as
the
staff
recommendation
goes
similarly
to
that
last
item,
since
all
signage
appeals
have
become
exceptions
now,
instead
of
variances,
it's
staff's
rule
of
thumb
that
we
only
support
up
to
50
over
what
is
allowed
and
based
on
that
240
square
foot.
Sign
that's
already
existing
on
that
west
facade.
That
already
puts
them
way
over
the
50
more
than
the
66
square
feet.
That's
allowed
on
that
west
facade,
so
staff
has
recommended
denial
of
those
two
appeals
needed
for
the
area.
H
H
H
B
B
B
H
B
H
If
they
would
remove
the
sign,
then
they
would
forfeit
the
peel,
since
I
don't
believe
it's
a
cabinet.
If
it
was
a
cabinet,
they
could
change
the
sign
face
out
with
with
just
getting
a
sign
from
it
without
losing
the
appeals.
But
if
they
had
to
entirely
remove
the
sign,
then
it
would
lose
its
interesting
non-conforming
rights
and
they
would
need
to
even.
B
I
What
we
found
with
the
small
bar
sign
is
it's
hard
to
read
if
you're
driving,
if
you're
kind
of
in
traffic,
it's
almost
bad
to
try
and
read
it
as
you're
driving,
because
it's
so
small
and
high
up
so
really
trying
to
appeal
to
more
traffic
and
get
more
people
to
see
our
business
as
the
hotel
functions
almost
separately
from
the
bar.
They
all
are
run
under
the
same
umbrella.
I
D
I
I
I
Yes,
we
actually
it's
it's
a
surprising
amount
of
foot
traffic
that
we
get.
I
think
the
sign
would
actually
improve
our
option
of
getting
more
street
traffic
for
the
festival
and
such
and
the
western
gateway,
because
right
now,
there's
really
no
there's
nothing
that
says:
come
have
a
drink
from
that
side
of
the
building.
B
Okay,
all
right
anything
else
for
carl
all
right.
Thank
you
for
your
presentation,
we'll
check
back
with
you
here
in
a
minute.
Okay!
Is
there
anybody
who
wants
to
speak
in
support
of
the
applicant's
request,
seeing
none
anybody
in
opposition
and
again
any
neutral
countries
or
parties?
Seeing
none
do
we
have
any
final
questions
for
staff?
B
Yeah,
so
so
marla
says
they
have
a
lot
of
signage.
You
do.
Maybe
they
do.
But
frankly,
I
don't
see
it
that
way.
If
I
drive
down
locust,
this
is
one
of
the
cleanest
looking
hotel
frontages.
I
think
you
should
certainly
have
your
name
on
your
canopy.
If
I
was
standing
on
one
of
those
four
street
corners
approaching
from
the
northeast.
B
Aha
there's
a
bar.
I
like
that
little
sign.
That's
the
best
way
to
drink.
Downtown
is
just
walking
around
on
foot,
but
if
I
haven't
had
a
drink,
yet
I'm
driving
down
locust
street
and
I
would
never
know
the
bars
here-
I'd
be
looking
at
the
traffic
light
and
I
would
be
going
down
to
the
republic
or
I
mean
some
other
place
instead.
So
to
me
I
think
it
makes
sense
to
have
a
reasonable
size
sign
at
a
reasonable
scale,
with
a
reasonable
view
shed.
B
If
I
was
approaching
from
locust
to
know,
hey
there's
the
deluxe,
because
I'm
very
familiar
with
your
sign
on
the
west
facade
and
oh
there.
There
is
a
bar
here
and
I
was
looking
for
that
bar
gee.
I
better
pull
into
the
parking
ramp.
I
don't
think
it's
out
of
scope
or
scale,
you
know
if
we
look
and
I
like
bert's
presentation
and
yep
with
even
suggestions.
Some
exemptions
were
granted
or
even
a
variance
before
I
think
it
would
have
been.
We
are
at
exception
level.
B
Now
I'm
happy
for
that,
because
I
think
it
lets
the
board
make
some
better
decision
related
to
the
property
and
area
in
question,
and
I
would
feel
here
we
do
have
a
practical
difficulty.
We
got
a
one-way
street
approaching
this
place.
I
don't
think
it's
going
to
impact
the
health,
safety
and
welfare
of
the
neighborhood
and,
frankly
it
blends
in.
I
don't
think
it
would
really
change
change
the
character
of
the
area
with
any
degree
of
concern,
but
those
are
just
my
thoughts,
anyone
else
or
any
proposals,
one
way
or
the
other.
F
J
I
I
don't
agree,
I
think
you
need
signage
coming
from
that
direction
and
I'm
I'm
like
with
mel.
I
didn't
know
that
that
was
even
in
there
so
to
me
having
something
that
would
stand
out
and
say:
hey
come
on
in
in
the
parking
ramp
right
there.
I
I
just
see
it
as
a
plus
for
that
building
and
for
that
area
I,
like
the
signage.
D
Just
I'm
really
torn
because
it's
not
like
it's
a
separate
entity
here,
we're
talking
it's
it's,
it's
a
hotel
that
has
a
bar
right,
yeah
and
so
there's
many
hotels
that
have
a
bar.
They
don't
have
you
know
the
marriott
marriott
bar.
You
know
you
don't
see
signs
like
that
either
it's
sort
of
intuitive
that
there's
going
to
be
a
bar
there
or
not.
You
know.
I
think
there
was
a
good
point
brought
up
that,
if
I
mean
would
there
ever
be
a
scenario
where
the
bar
would
be
taken
over
by
a
different
business?
D
A
J
I
I
kind
of
like
the
idea,
because
if
you
travel
and
you
go
from
any
place
else
being
out
of
state
or
out
of
town,
you
come
up
to
some
place
like
the
marriott,
but
they
have
like
a
bar
louie
or
a
bar,
something
that
indicates
that
there's
a
bar
in
there
I
wouldn't
have
thought.
I
would
have
known
that
this
one
did
so.
I
wouldn't
have
known
there
was
a
bar
in
there.
So
I
kind
of
like
the
idea
of
something
telling
me
that
there
is.
J
A
J
B
Yeah
that
I
I
get
where
justin's
coming
from
on
on
that
you
know,
I
think
each
situation
can
be
a
little
different.
You
know
there's
a
lot
of
bars
that
yeah
they
got
six
stools
and
for
three
hours
you
can
get
a
drink
with
a
ticket
or
something
yeah.
I
assume
in
a
lot
of
hotels,
there's
a
quote
bar
right,
but
this
is
more
of
a
destination
by
itself.
B
Every
situation
is
different,
but
we
have
the
huge
hotel
fort
des
moines,
there's
a
restaurant
bar
that
is
quote
attached
to
it.
I
would
assume:
there's
a
restaurant
bar
there,
but
I
think
proud,
foot
and
bird
has
signage
or
their
predecessors
did
many
people
go
there
and
they're
not
connected
to
the
restaurant.
I
think
it's
a
it's
a
delicate
balance
on.
Is
it
connected
or
not?
I'm
I'm
just
gonna
come
back
to
based
on
scope,
scale,
the
intent
the
criteria
to
meet
the
exception
request.
B
I
don't
feel
that
it's
out
of
sorts
and
there's
some
practical
difficulties
approaching
the
place,
so
I'm
gonna
just
run
something
up.
The
flagpole
we'll
see
where
it
goes.
I'm
gonna
recommend
or
make
a
motion
for
approval
of
the
type
2
zoning
exception
for
the
one
wall
mounted
sign
as
presented
with
conditions.
You
know
it
shall
be
constructed
within
the
size
and
scope
as
presented
by
a
permitted
signed
contractor
licensed
to
do
business
in
the
city.
B
B
F
B
So
keep
up
the
good
work
down
there.
I
know
it's
been
real,
tough
on
the
hotel
bar
industry,
but
I
think
des
moines
is
a
great
city
and
we're
all
bouncing
back
so
glad
you're,
a
part
of
it.
We'll
have
your
decision
in
order
about
this
time
next
week,
all
right
have
a
good
evening
all
right.
That
brings
us,
I
believe,
to
our
last
item
on
the
agenda
today:
item
six,
a
type
two
zoning
exception
request
at
6157,
southeast
14th
and
frank's,
going
to
carry
us
home
with
this
one.
C
C
C
Fourth
sign
that
they
are
looking
for
is
a
monument
sign
of
101.20
square
foot.
It
would
be
12
foot
tall
and
it
would
set
within
zero
feet
of
along
the
property
line
along
southeast
14th
street,
and
so
the
appeals
are
going
to
be
type
2.
Zoning
exception
for
one
sign
over
the
maximum
two
wall,
signs
earned
for
the
west
occupant
wall
and
then
the
second
appeal
would
be
a
type
2.
C
C
C
C
C
You
have
two
of
them
that
face
west
one
here,
one
here
and
then
the
third
sign
along
the
that
would
be
in
addition,
would
face.
North
is
right
here
and
I
will
pull
up
some
photos
or
some
drawings,
so
we
can
see
specifically
what
those
look
like,
and
so
this
is.
This
would
be
the
main
sign
along
the
west.
C
C
C
C
C
C
That
is
four
feet
over
the
maximum
allowed
eight
feet
in
height,
subject
to
the
following
conditions.
Any
monument
sign
that
is
over
eight
feet
in
height
shall
be
set
back
a
minimum
of
12.5
feet
from
the
west
property
line,
and
this
is
similar
to
some
of
the
questions
that
had
come
earlier
today.
Where
staff
has
this
this,
this
50
policy,
where
we
we
look
to
look
at
the
criteria
and
if
it's
possible,
we
support
up
to
50
percent.
After
that
we
we
believe
that
it
should
come
back
to
the
while.
C
It
should
be
before
the
board
to
make
a
determination
if
they're
willing
to
grant
anything
greater
than
that.
So,
with
the
setback
being
12
25
feet
for
a
12
foot
sign,
we
looked
at
50
being
12
and
a
half
feet,
it's
certainly
within
the
purview.
If
the
board
wishes
to
consider
that
condition
to
be
any
less
than
that
as
well.
C
D
Just
here,
frank
yeah,
if
you
can
go
back
to
page
23
there,
so
that's
a
monument
sign,
correct
right
there
is,
I'm
wondering.
Is
there
going
to
be?
Is
there
a
concern
that
if
someone
is
driving
out
of
that
parking
lot
and
trying
to
go
left,
you
know
going
through?
Is
there
any
obstruction
issues
that
the
city
has
with
that
monumental
sign?
Being
there
I
mean
that's
eight
foot,
that's
an
eight
foot
tall
sign
right.
It's
right
up
against
that!
D
D
C
B
Yeah
yeah
good
observation,
though,
on
that
justin
related
to
that
frank,
so
what
the
applicant
is
showing
for,
where
they
want
to
place,
the
sign
would
be
allowable
if
it
was
an
8-foot
sign
correct.
That
is
correct,
which
means
that
a
monument
sign
can
go
right
up
against
the
right-of-way,
the
frontage
right
away,
correct,
correct
yeah!
I
don't
know
why
you
guys
ever
allowed
that
I
I
think
the
city
must
have
been
thinking
about
the
dense
urban
core.
B
B
C
B
B
B
A
B
Okay,
yeah-
and
we
can
ask
the
applicant
a
few
things
on
that,
but
it's
just
good
to
see
that
a
little
closer
so
with
what's
proposed
on
the
building
itself,
you're.
Okay,
with
that
okay,
one
related
question
I
would
have-
and
I
don't
want
to
do
a
bill
gray
here,
our
former
chairman,
but
bill
gray,
lived
and
worked
everywhere
in
des
moines,
I
kind
of
have.
B
I
worked
at
major
video
in
the
shopping
plaza,
I'm
not
going
to
say
what
year,
but
the
building
was
brand
new
and
menards
was
where
aspen
was
a
number
of
us
from
the
south
side.
Remember
those
days-
and
I
remember
a
lot
of
that
signage-
is
still
the
way
it
was
then
so
the
poll
sign
that
would
be
at
the
far
maybe
south
end
of
this
property.
That's
really
tall,
I
don't
know
whose
property
that's
on,
but
it
has
the
big
aspen
sign
on
top
aspen's
been
empty
six
months.
B
K
K
That
poll
sign
will
be
removed
with
the
site
plan
as
part
of
the
site
plan
approval
of
the
the
olive
garden
restaurant.
Okay.
Now
they
still
have
the
option
of
doing
another
freestanding
monument
sign
sure
further
north
to
because
that
old
pole
sign
is
a
directory
type
sign
right.
That
advertises
tenants,
and
I
think
they
have
some
obligation
to
provide
tenant
sure
advertisement,
but
they
still
have
the
option
to
add
another
monument
type
sign
on
the
front
edge
to
the
north.
Of
this.
B
B
B
C
L
L
L
My
name
is
katie
good
afternoon.
I
am
here
from
site
enhancement
services
representing
olive
garden
for
their
signage,
at
this
new
restaurant
at
6157,
southeast
14th
street,
requesting
additional
signage
that
we
feel
will
add
the
property's
overall
value
and
also
aid
in
additional
safeway
fighting
for
future
patrons.
L
So
in
our
zone
as
frank
mentioned,
we
are
well
over
I'm
sorry
well,
under
our
square
footage
allowed
for
our
wall
signs,
we
are
just
simply
requesting
an
additional
wall
sign
be
placed
on
the
north
elevation.
We
want
to
take
from
the
leftover
square
footage
from
the
front.
Put
it
to
the
north
elevation
code
does
restrict
the
wall.
Signs
can
only
face
the
street.
This
technically
does
not
face
a
street
a
plotted
roadway,
but
it
does
face
two
of
our
major
access
points
for
the
site.
As
shown
on
the
screen.
A
L
Have
to
go
past
our
portion
of
the
property
to
access
the
drive
there
coming
south.
You
do
have
two
options,
but
it
is
farther
away
so
that
left,
I'm
sorry.
The
left
elevation
which
faces
north
does
provide
extra
visibility
to
those
motorists
which
does
provide
them
extra
time
to
cross
lanes
exit
safely
to
access
the
site,
especially
if
they
are
interested
in
entering
from
that
northern
entrance.
There
our
request
for
the
monument
sign
as
he
as
he
mentioned.
We
are
requesting
an
additional
four
feet
over
the
required
height
or
the
allowed
height.
L
Now
this
quest
request
is
50
over
what
has
allowed
an
overall
height
for
code
based
on
its
setback.
We
do
appreciate
staff
recommendation
of
approval
for
the
height
but
like,
as
he
said,
there
is
a
condition
of
the
12
and
a
half
feet
setback.
We
would
like
to
request
that
it
stays
in
its
currently
proposed
position.
L
L
Also,
if
we
slid
the
monu
back
12
and
a
half
feet,
it
actually
would
go
right
here
where
this
dark
arrow
is
at,
and
that
is
right
in
the
middle
of
the
landscaping
that
the
owner
of
the
entire
development
has
proposed.
In
addition
to
a
fence
line,
excuse
me
that
will
be
stopping
right
there.
So
it'd
be
right
along
the
fence
line
as
well.
L
Make
sure
I
didn't
miss
anything
another
reason
why
we
want
to
put
that
sign
as
close
to
properly
as
possible
at
that
height.
If
you
are
traveling
northbound
on
14th
street,
there
is
a
mattress
firm
that
is
just
right
below
our
property.
Here
does
block
the
building
by
itself,
because
the
building
is
set
back
quite
a
ways.
We
are
not
placing
signage
on
that
elevation
or
in
the
rear.
So
having
that
sign
out
front
does
increase
advanced
notice
to
voters,
as
they
are
traveling
and
also
just
you
know,
increase
safer
flow
of
traffic.
L
B
B
L
B
B
A
A
L
B
L
B
B
K
F
B
L
If
possible,
I'd
also
like
to
add
we're
also,
so
we
wanted
to
propose
a
monument
sign
because
it
is
code
compliant
as
of
now.
We
were
originally
promised
a
panel
on
that
existing
freestanding
sign,
which
now
that
the
entire
development
is
being
replated,
it
does
have
to
go
down
because
it's
not
conforming,
so
we
lose
a
little
bit
of
our
advertisement.
There
there's
a
big
billboard
there
as
well,
which
we
were
promised
a
little
bit
of
a
display
time
on
which
is
not
going
to
happen
either.
A
B
B
B
Be
a
huge
improvement
in
this
corridor.
I
can
tell
you
that
this
area
is,
you
know,
40,
plus
years
old,
for
this
development.
Now
some
of
this
stuff
goes
back
75
years,
there's
been
plenty
of
improvements
on
the
southeast
14th
corridor,
but
we
need
more,
and
I
think
an
investment
of
this
scale
says
something.
B
I
know
that
I
really
like
a
lot
of
local
restaurants,
especially
local
italian
restaurants,
but
at
the
same
time
I
think
that
what
this
would
bring,
including
probably
the
branding,
says
something
else.
It
says
that
the
southridge
area
remains
a
destination
which
is
how
this
area
had
been
developed.
B
D
A
D
B
D
Yeah,
I
don't
know
I'm
just
you
know.
The
city
has
they've
recommended
that
as
part
of
this,
you
know
in
agreement
with
sure
you
know.
I
have
no
problem
with
the
wall
signs.
This
is
just
the
one
issue
that
is
kind
of
a
sticking
point.
I'm
just
trying
to
figure
out
how
to
deal
with
that.
Personally,
so.
B
To
see-
and
certainly
people
could
advocate
that,
oh
well,
it's
going
to
block
everything,
but
there's
actually
pretty
long
right
of
way
in
there
it's
a
pretty
wide,
ditch
to
be
able
to
see.
What's
coming
up
yeah
I
would,
I
would
think
another
six
feet,
wouldn't
wouldn't
put
it
where
the
signs
back
so
far
that
no
one
can
see
it
would
still
be
in
front
of
the
front
parking
curb
for
the
you
know.
B
B
B
I
don't
know
yeah
yeah
with
the
applicant
proposal
and
again
we
don't.
I
appreciate
what
katie
said
about
well,
it's
like
25
feet
back
from
the
curb.
If
I've
got
that
right.
Of
course,
we
never
use
from
the
curb
as
a
true
point
of
compliance,
because
that's
not
how
the
zoning
ordinance
works.
It's
it's
right
of
way
and
setbacks
from
right
away,
but
in
practicality,
yeah,
it's
25
feet
back
from
a
curb
line.
B
It
sounds
like
if
you
know
that
everybody's
okay,
with
the
exceptions
on
the
building
right
yeah-
yes,
so
gary
I'll
put
you
on
the
spot,
would
it
be
possible.
We
could
maybe
get
some
easy
lifting
out
of
the
way
and
have
a
motion
to
approve
a
portion
of
this
just
in
our
own
minds
like
the
building
signage
and
then
address
the
monument
sign
as
a
second
motion,
one
way
or
the
other
I
mean
we
could
probably
do
it
all
together
saying.
B
B
B
F
A
B
B
B
All
right
tom
was
that
was
that
up
in
the
air?
Okay,
all
right,
so
it's
5-0
so
yeah,
so
we
passed
it,
but
you've
got
to
set
the
monument
sign
back
just
six
feet
from
the
right
of
way,
not
the
12
and
a
half
that
the
city
wants
all
right
great.
Well,
thanks
for
your
travels
over
here
today,
we
wish
you
a
safe
trip
home.
B
F
F
B
So
frank,
let's
see,
I
think
I
know
we
have
a
couple
business
things.
The
first
one
would
be
yes
approval
of
minutes
from
the
march
23rd
meeting.
If
you
were
here
on
march
23rd,
if
you
saw
any
changes
needed,
please
note:
if
not,
would
there
be
a
motion
to
grant
approval
of
the
minutes
and
I'll?
Second,
all
those
in
favor,
good
job
tom
all
right
motion
carries
five.
Zero
minutes
are
approved
for
march
now
we
have
to
elect
officers
so
much
like
the
iowa
caucuses.
B
B
F
B
B
B
All
right
so
tom
we
have
a
nomination
of
nathan
blake
to
be
vice
chair
before
we
vote
on
that.
Would
there
be
any
other
individuals
nominated
for
vice
chair
if
none
we'll
take
a
vote
nathan
for
vice
chair
all
those
in
favor
raise
your
right
hand?
Okay,
it's
just
great.
When
people
aren't
here,
they
get
voted
into
stuff.
This
is
how
neighborhood
leadership
works
at
its
best
too.
Okay
yeah.
Yes,
congratulations!
Nathan!
Okay!
Now
so
for
chairman
any
nominations
for
chair.