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A
E
Okay,
so
let's
get
started
so
welcome
to
the
october
21st
meeting
of
the
planning
and
economic
development
committee
I'll
start
with
the
agenda
review.
Are
there
any
changes
to
the
agenda
so
seeing
none?
We?
Our
next
section,
is
public
comment.
We
actually
did
have
one
person
who
wrote
in
I'm
just
going
to
read
that
into
the
record.
E
Just
give
me
one.
Second,
this
is
teresa
alt
206,
eddie
street.
She
writes.
We
are
delighted
to
see
that
the
common
council's
approval
of
the
carpenter
circle
planned
unit
development
district
will
be
made
contingent
on
a
formal
agreement
with
the
community
gardens.
We
note,
however,
that
elsewhere
in
the
legislation
there
is
a
real
missed
opportunity
to
ensure
that
a
fair
share
of
affordable
housing
be
included.
E
E
But
if
those
attempts
fail,
it
contemplates
an
amendment
permitting
a
different
use
other
than
affordable
housing
or
an
amendment
allowing
the
applicant
to
pay
a
fee
in
lieu
of
providing
affordable
units.
A
more
secure
solution
would
be
that
if
the
mixed-use
buildings
are
ready
to
go
and
the
affordable
building
is
not
yet
ready,
then
the
applicant
must
rent
40
apartments
in
the
mixed
use,
building
to
eligible
renters
at
affordable
rents.
C
E
So
I
guess
next
up
is
the
special
order
of
business.
This
is
a
discussion
of
the
ida,
local
labor
reporting
data-
and
I
know
heather
mcdaniel-
is
here
together
with
kurt
from
tcad.
C
Yes,
I'm
sorry
I
just
I
was
just
made
a
host.
So
now
I
am
looking
for
heather
there.
She
is,
oh,
I
think
she's
yep
she's
done.
Can
you
hear
us.
E
E
F
G
E
So,
thank
you
both
for
appearing
tonight
to
talk
to
us
about
the
local
labor
reporting
data.
As
you
know,
we
had
a
discussion
last
month,
kind
of
larger
discussion
about
the
ctap
and
some
of
the
the
requirements
around
the
ctap
and
this.
This
came
up
at
that
meeting,
so
you
graciously
decided
to
come
here
tonight
to
answer
any
questions
the
committee
may
have
and
also.
E
A
report
of
what
the
the
latest
is
with
this
reporting
data
so
with
that,
if
you
want
to
take
away
heather
and
kurt.
F
Okay,
so
can
we
go
ahead
and
share
our
screen?
We
have
a
little
bit
of
data.
We
want
to
present
to
you.
E
F
F
So,
while
kurt's
doing
that
I'll
just
introduce
introduce
kurt
anderson
joined
our
staff
back
in
february
right
before
covid
and
he's
the
new
martha
armstrong
for
those
of
you
who
are
wondering
he's
in
charge
of
development
and
strategy.
F
So
we
changed
our
name
today
we
launched
it.
It's
ithaca
area,
economic
development,
iaed,
we're
super
excited
about
it.
We
think
it
better
reflects
where
we're
located
and
the
area
that
we
serve
and
what
we
do.
We
do
economic
development,
we're
really
excited
about
it.
G
F
So
I
will
go
ahead
and
just
jump
in
kurt
if
you
could
advance
the
slide.
F
Okay,
so
I
just
want
to
remind
everybody
at
iad,
iaed,
formerly
tcad,
we're
dedicated
to
building
a
thriving
and
sustainable
economy
that
improves
the
quality
of
life
in
tompkins
county
by
fostering
the
growth
of
business
and
industry.
F
The
ida
adopted
a
new
mission
statement
a
couple
of
years
ago.
They
deliver
economic
incentives
to
business
and
industry,
to
diversify
and
strengthen
tompkins
county's
tax
base
and
enhance
community
vitality
by
supporting
job
creation,
business
and
industrial
development
and
community
revitalization.
F
F
I
think
we
all
agreed
all
the
stakeholders
that
it
was
really
the
best
thing
that
we
could
do
at
the
time,
not
having
enough
data
to
really
understand
what
the
implica
implications
of
requiring
a
percentage
of
local
labor
might
be.
So
we
we
defined
local
as
tompkins,
and
the
six
adjoining
counties,
cortland
cuga,
seneca,
schuyler,
shimon.
F
F
Since
that
time,
the
policy
is
countywide,
it's
not
just
for
city
projects
and
then
all
of
the
general
contractors
are
responsible
for
having
all
their
subcontractors
report
monthly
data
about
where
their
labor
force
lives,
not
only
where
they
live,
which
we're
using
zip
code
boundaries
as
a
proxy,
but
also
the
total
hours
worked,
the
wages
and
the
type
of
labor
force
that
they
are,
if
they're
carpenters
or
electricians,
or
what
have
you
there
is
in
our
policy.
Currently
as
it
stands
since
2016,
there
is
no
minimum
or
maximum
labor
requirement.
F
F
So
every
project
that's
been
approved
by
the
ida
since
april
of
2016
has
had
to
comply
with
this
policy.
We've
seen
a
number
of
solar
projects,
we've
seen
a
smaller
housing
project
through
this
policy
and
then
tonight
we're
going
to
focus
on
the
three
larger
projects
that
were
downtown
projects,
organic
nature,
which
is
the
green
star
project,
city
center
and
herald
square.
What
we've
seen
so
far.
G
So
in
the
case
of
the
labor
policy,
be
careful
what
you
wish
for,
because
the
the
gcs
and
the
subs
all
submit
monthly
reports
listing
the
names
and
identifying
codes
of
all
the
employees
that
were
on
site
for
that
month.
G
Again,
as
heather
mentioned,
you
get
the
hours
you
get
the
wages
there
is
a
ton
of
data
that
comes
in
heather
was
right,
and
then
I
I
started
right
before
covid.
In
fact,
three
weeks
after
my
start
date,
coveted
sent
me
home
and
so
kind
of
the
new
guy
orientation
was
to
really
dive
into
this
data.
What
had
been
done
prior
was
kind
of
a
kind
of
a
cursory,
quick,
quick
and
dirty
look
at
what
the
actual
percentage
of
local
labor
was.
G
But
one
of
the
questions
that
was
really
unanswered
was
well.
How
does
that
relate
to
to
a
particular
trade
or
even
a
contractor,
that's
used
and
so
being
unable
to
efficiently
transfer
the
the
pdf
format
to
an
excel
and
and
copy
and
paste?
I
hauled
out
the
handy,
dandy
calculator
and
went
to
work
so
the
first
one
that
that
I
dug
in
was
green
star
and
just
as
a
refresher.
G
The
total
project
cost
was
about
15
million
dollars
on
that,
keep
in
mind
that
the
type
of
building
it
is
is
really
it's
a
it's
a
shell
right,
there's
not
a
lot
of
interior
rooms,
thus
less
need
for
carpentry
in
this
type
of
project,
more
need
for
plumbing
and
and
metal,
but
regardless
the
I
put
at
the
bottom,
a
few
key
takeaways
and
I'll
kind
of
reference.
Those
as
we
look
at
this
graph
in
the
graph
to
the
far
left
is
all
that
is
all
general
contractors,
all
subcontractors,
all
trades.
G
That's
iron
workers
sheet,
metal
workers,
dry,
wallers,
everybody,
and
that
gives
you
an
accurate
indication
that
we're
roughly
two-thirds
local
labor
on
that
project.
That
is
the
laborers
that
were
there
had
a
a
residential
zip
code
that
falls
within
our
seven
county
region,
what's
tompkins,
plus
six,
but
but
six
seven.
Now
what
I?
What
I
try
to
highlight
here
with
these
specific
contractors
is,
I
I
grabbed
there's
a
whole
host
of
contractors
that
work
on
a
particular
project.
G
What
I
tried
to
grab
were
either
a
the
contractors
that
really
did
the
predominance
of
the
work
based
on
hours
and
wages,
or
in
this
case
b
you
see.
Comfort
systems
is
really
low.
Well,
that
was
the
leading
plumber
on
that
project,
plumbing
contractor
on
that
project.
G
So,
when
you're
looking
at
these
graphs,
I'm
either
grabbing
again
those
contractors
that
have
done
a
lot
of
work
on
that
project
or
that
represent
a
trade
here,
a
local
trade
that
maybe
wasn't
used
as
much
again
in
the
case
of
comfort
systems,
that's
a
plumbing
outfit
and
that's
less
than
10
local
labor.
On
plumbing.
For
that-
and
I
should
say,
comfort
systems
is
actually
based
out
of
texas.
G
The
electrical
was
was
give
or
take
50
percent
or
so,
and
then
rykon
was
another
set
of
carpenters
as
well.
So
again,
all
all
told
it
was
about
two-thirds
local
labor.
In
this
case
our
local
contractors,
that
is
edgar
and
rykon.
Both
out
of
elmira
use
the
predominance
of
local
labor.
They
they
dragged
the
average
up.
Average
wages
came
out
to
about
25
an
hour.
B
G
This
project
there
was
a
span
of
about
five
to
ten
dollars,
more
per
local
labor
hour
versus
non-locals.
So
in
this
case,
even
if
plumbers
weren't,
for
instance,
if
we
didn't
use
a
lot
of
local
plumbers
on
this
project,
but
on
average
they
get
paid
roughly
five
to
ten
dollars
more
an
hour
when
they're
used
carpenters
made
out
really
well
on
this
project
and
that's
about
75
local
labor.
G
Now
the
next
project,
this
one
really
took
the
longest
time
and
you'll
know
why.
If
you
look
at
the
total
project,
cost
it's
roughly
four
times
the
size
of
organic
nature,
so
it
was.
It
was
a
massive
massive
project.
G
But
in
this
case,
across
the
board,
only
33
local
labor
average
wages
were
up
a
little
bit
just
a
couple
dollars
per
hour
and
again
you
saw
this
was
a
solid
10,
an
hour
more
for
local
laborers
versus
non-local
laborers
and
again
the
importance
of
really
diving
in
and
looking
at
these
individual
trades
and
that
carpenter's
made
out
really
well
again.
Two-Thirds
local
labor,
their
average
wages,
were
about
60
bucks,
an
hour
which
is
which
was
a
really
high
rate.
G
G
Fos
is
not
considered
a
local
contractor
by
nature
of
being
in
broome
county,
but
but
did
use
a
predominance
of
laborers
that
actually
reside
and
how
what
the
idea
would
consider
local
again
comfort
systems,
the
plumbers
out
of
syracuse,
very,
very
few
plumbers
and
pipefitters
used
on
that
matco
electric
was
again
not
a
local
contractor
by
definition
of
geography,
but
did
use
a
predominance
of
local
laborers
and
we've
come
to
actually
understand
that
matco
is
a
union
shop.
G
So
I
don't
know
if
they're
required
or
if
I
don't
know
the
exact
nature
of
that
agreement-
they're
not
being
union
myself,
but
so
matco
taps
the
the
local
electrical
halls.
G
G
Out
of
city
center
diving
into
herald
square
there's,
there's
a
lot
of
work,
that's
been
done,
and
so
what
we
wanted
to
look
at
right
off
the
bat
with
herald
square
was
post
le
chase.
So
we
had
a
gc
again
prior
to
my
time
here
with
the
ied,
but
then
there
was
a
long
break.
You
know
it
all
got
reshuffled
and
now
the
chase
is
in
there,
so
we
decided
to
start
with
the
chase,
but
I
want
you
to
keep
that
in
mind
as
we
talk
through
some
of
these
points.
G
In
this
case
local
labor,
across
the
board,
both
in
aggregate
and
spanning
the
three
primary
trades
crosby
brownlee's
are
they're
plumbers
out
of
rochester
lowry
is
a
carpentry
shop
out
of
freeville,
and
macko
again
is
is
the
as
the
name
would
imply
electric
out
of
vestal.
All
three
of
those,
I
should
note,
are
union
shops
so
they're,
using
a
predominance
of
local
labor
on
that.
But
but
the
really
interesting
thing
is
that
and
I'm
cutting
this
data
right
now.
The
the
pre-la
chase
herald
square
data.
G
Is
that
again,
a
lot
of
the
early
stage,
workers,
that
is
the
iron
workers?
The
sheet
metal
workers
are
not
are
not
from
here,
there's
they're
with
subcontractors
that
are
located
buffalo
away.
So
we're
expecting
this
to
skew
down
a
little
bit.
I
I
don't
have
that
number
on
hand,
but
as
of
kind
of
the
finish
work
again,
carpentry
electrical
and
plumbing,
it's
been
predominantly
local,
so
67
all
told
area.
I
said
it.
I
meant.
G
When
we
use
the
term
area,
we
mean
surrounding
areas
and
not
in
not
necessarily
in
the
ida,
local
area,
so
even
contractors
out
of
these
various
far-flung
area
area
shops
that
is
rochester
and
vessels,
still
do
use
local
labor
and
again,
in
this
case,
they're
they're
union
shops
in
average.
G
Wages
as
as
of
right
now,
are
rounding
out
to
about
25
an
hour
and
again
you
see
a
consistent
ten
dollars
more
an
hour
for
local
labor
versus
non-local,
so
they
are
getting
paid
more
and
again
that
local
is
defined
by
having
a
residential,
zip
code
in
our
area.
In
this
case
the
carpenters
of
the
three
project.
This
is
the
only
one
that
they
were
awash
local
and
non-local
got
paid.
The
same
electricians
were
up
ten
dollars
and
pipefitters.
G
We
actually
had
a
meeting
with
marcus
from
the
local
steamfitters
union
yesterday
and
they
made
their
making
out
and
made
out
very
well
they're,
just
over
20
an
hour
or.
G
Local
pipe
fitter
versus
any
of
those
that
are
from
outside
our
area,
so
kind
of
some
preliminary
numbers.
We've
got
a
whole
bunch
more
stats,
but
we
thought
we'd
keep
it
kind
of
a
high
level
right
now,
but
this
by
actually
cutting
into
that
data
really
enables
us
again
not
just
to
look
at
the
overall
local
labor,
but
but
also
by
the
trades
that
are
really
represented
here.
And
I
should
say
that,
with
the
help
of
john
guttridge,
he
and
I
have
really
streamlined
the
data
collection
process,
and
now
it's
all
through
excel.
G
F
I
would
venture
to
guess
that
with
herald
square,
they
were
so
far
behind
schedule
and
there's
there
was
so
much
construction
going
on
at
the
time
right
before
covet
hit
that
it
was
really
hard
to
find
labor
force,
and
so
they
did
end
up
paying
more
to
get
things
done
in
a
more
timely
manner
and
that
60
local
labor.
F
So
those
were
the
three
that
we've
really
taken
a
very
deep
dive
into
and
we
have
put
together
a
labor
committee
that
ann
corman
from
the
ida
is
chairing
also
from
the
ida,
martha
robertson
and
jennifer
tavares,
and
then
tim
loge
from
the
city's
department
of
public
works
and
transportation
is
joining
us
on
that
committee.
We
did
have
marcus
willamy
from
the
steam
fitters
come
and
talk
to
us
this
week.
This
was
our
second
meeting
and
what
the
committee
really
wants
to
do
is
take
that
deeper
dive
into
the
the
labor
reports.
F
E
E
Are
there
any
questions
or
comments
on
the
presentation
and
is
there
any
way
you
could
stop
the
screen
sharing?
Just
so
I'm
able
to
see
who.
E
Thank
you
anyway,
steve.
H
Yeah,
I
just
had
a
quick
question
when
you're
looking
at
the
the
hourly
wage
comparisons
does
that
factor
in
like
expenses
that
they
might
have
to
pay
for
travel
time
if
people
are
coming
from
farther
away
or
lodging
or
any
of
that
other
stuff.
H
H
Okay,
all
right
cool,
so
that's
just
how
much
more
like
our
local
folks
are
making
than
somebody
who's
from
outside
the
area
would,
and
so
that's
not
necessarily
that,
like
ten
dollars
an
hour
more
that
we're
paying
per
hour
to
the
worker,
it's
not
necessarily
saying
that,
like
the
project
is
going
up
ten
dollars
more
per
hour,
because
there
are
some
costs
that
we're
not
subsuming
because
we're
not
paying
for
folks
to
be
traveling
from
very
far
away
or
we're
staying
here
or
any
of
that
stuff.
Is
that
right.
G
F
Yes,
the
part
of
the
project
cost
is
what
they're
going
to
pay
for
labor
and
materials
and
time
and
and
all
that
kind
of
stuff.
I
So
we're
so
and
all
three
all
three
of
these
projects
had
tax
abatements
right.
F
Yes,
we
phased
in
the
new
property
taxes
associated
with
the
improvement
value,
so
they
were
still
paying
the
base
taxes.
Two
of
them
we
phased
in
the
taxes
over
10
years
and
then
the
the
green
star,
the
organic
nature
project.
We
faced
the
taxes
in
over
seven
years.
F
F
You
know
the
the
labor
piece,
I
think,
is
very
complicated.
When
we
talked
to
marcus
from
the
plumbers
and
steam
fitters
yesterday,
you
know
he
said
that
sometimes
they
don't
even
bid
on
the
jobs.
They
have
a
couple
of
contractors
that
are
big
enough
to
bid
on
these
big
jobs,
but
they're
so
busy
that
sometimes
they
just
don't
bid,
and
sometimes
they
like
to
bid
on
the
jobs
with
the
general
contractors
that
they're
familiar
working
with
and
have
had
a
good
working
relationship
with.
F
F
He
also
noted
that
the
the
plumbing
contractor
for
the
organic
nature
project,
which
is
the
firm
that's
based
out
of
houston,
that
has
an
office
in
syracuse,
is
a
group
of
laotian
workers
and
he
had
gone
with
a
translator
and
tried
to
talk
to
them
about
the
benefits
of
being
in
a
union,
and
he
said
they'd
had
some
conversations
back
and
forth
and
it
really
just
with
the
language
barrier.
It
didn't
work
very
well,
but
he
said
those
are
great
guys.
They
do
great
work
and
I
think
it's
great.
They
got
that
job.
F
So
you
know,
I
think,
there's
a
lot
of
of
different
things
going
on
that.
You
know
we're
just
trying
to
get
a
handle
on
them,
because
the
last
thing
that
we
want
to
do
is
put
in
place
a
requirement
that
drives
up
the
cost
of
construction
to
the
point
where
developers
do
not
want
to
invest
in
this
market
any
longer.
A
The
original
intents
of
this
local
labor
reporting
process
was
to,
as
heather
said,
to
build
those
networks
between
local
contractors
and
and
different
ages,
different
general
contractors
who
are
looking
for
services
so
starting
those
networks.
A
I
think
it
actually
makes
a
lot
of
sense
that
when
we
have
projects
that
are
receiving
sizable
tax
tax
abatements
in
our
county,
that
they
are
associated
with
wages
that
are
getting
paid
back
to
people
who
live
in
our
county
or
surrounding
counties.
So
I
I
think
that
for
me
that
makes
a
lot
of
sense
and,
of
course,
local
contractors
will
need
to
be
competitive.
A
A
In
that
process,
I
don't
know
necessarily
that
that
it
will
result
in
higher
costs
for
local
labor.
I
think
over
the
long
term
we
will
see
a
much
more
competitive,
much
more
vibrant
local
industry
sector
with
our
electricians,
our
plumbers,
our
our
contractors-
and
you
know
maybe
who
knows
the
way
ithaca
keeps
growing.
We
might
have
people
who
install
elevators
to
specialize
here
locally,
because
so
many
of
our
buildings
will
be
including
them.
So
I
think
it's
a
good
thing.
J
J
Of
course.
The
one
thing
we
haven't
mentioned,
the
advantage
of
local
labor
is
that
local
labor
spends
their
money
locally
and
and
they
buy
houses
and
they
buy
cars
and
they
pay
their
taxes,
and
these
are
good
jobs.
We
have
a
highly
skilled
construction,
workforce,
electricians
and
carpenters
and
plumbers.
J
E
Great
any
other
comments
or
questions.
Well,
thank
you
both
for
this
presentation.
This
was
highly
informative
and
I
you
know
I
I
know
that
this
has
been
a
long
process,
but
it's
really
good
to
know
that
this
is
moving
forward.
I
feel
like
this
is
a
big,
very
important
change
for
the
ida
and
indeed
for
the
whole
community.
So
thank
you
for
coming
tonight
and
sharing
this
information
with
us.
E
E
E
I
don't
know
if
it
makes
sense
to
go
ahead
and
move
this
now,
maybe
just
just
to
start
off
the
discussion.
Is
there
someone
who
wants
to
move
the
resolution
moved
by
laura?
Is
there
a
second.
E
Second,
by
donna,
okay,
so
discussion.
E
About
this
I
mean,
maybe
we
could
start
off,
because
I
know
that
both
the
gardens
and
the
project
team
have
provided
comments.
As
I
said
earlier
in
the
meeting
I
was,
I
was
a
little
bit
confused
about
the
back
and
forth
between
the
gardens
and
the
project
team,
specifically
really
with
scott
whitam's
comments,
so
he
was
suggesting
that
an
earlier
that
there
was
an
earlier
agreement
between
the
developer
and
the
gardens
and
that
that
agreement
wasn't
reflected
in
the
resolution.
Do
I
have
that
correct.
K
Right,
it's
not
that
it
wasn't
reflected
in
the
resolution
is
that
a
representative
of
the
gardens
marty
had
written
in
with
some
suggested
edits
and
in
the
suggested
edit,
whereas
it
addresses
the
the
legal
agreement
there,
there
wasn't
any
reference
to
the
mou.
K
So
the
mou
is
something
that
that
both
the
gardens
and
our
team
worked
really
hard
on
for
a
very
very
long
time,
and
you
know
from
our
point
of
view,
a
lot
of
the
whereases
tend
to
be
kind
of
historic
and
and
say
like
this
is
where
we
were-
and
this
is
this
is
why
we're
doing
these
things.
So
we
just
wanted
to
make
sure
that
that
the
mou
is
represented
that
it
existed
it
exists,
is
represented
in
the
warehouses.
K
Well,
there
was
yeah
it's
kind
of
hard
to
track
so
two
weeks
ago
there
were
some
changes
to
the
resolution
that
were
made
that
did
not
include,
or
that
were
suggested.
That
did
not
include
that,
and
so
we
said
no,
please
keep
that
in.
So
I
actually
don't
know
if
it
if
it
is
a
change
because
we
had
it
there,
it
was
just
that
it
go
away,
and
then
we
had
it
again.
So
I
think
from
from
your
point
of
view,
it
might
actually
just
look
the
same
or
look
very,
very
similar.
C
C
K
No,
no,
so
you
know
we're
not
offering
the
resolution.
What
happened
is
the
resolution
was
there.
There
was
some
comment
from
the
gardens
with
suggested
different
language
regarding
the
the
the
the
legally
binding
agreement
to
kind
of
replace
the
idea
of
the
mou
and
all
we're
saying,
is
you
know
that
it's
fine,
because
there
is
going
to
be
something
else
coming,
but
we
still
wanted
the
mou
to
be
listed
as
one
of
the
things
that
has
happened.
K
So
I
think,
from
the
point
of
view
where,
where
everybody
else
is
singing
the
language,
you
didn't
see
that
back
and
forth.
B
We
would
know
so
I
had
language
from
both
you
and
from
marty
that
were,
and
so
that's
what
we
forwarded
today
to
everyone
and
I'm
not
sure
if
there
was
agreement
between
you
guys
of
where
we
landed
on
the
language
or
not.
And
if
I
have
all
of
the
language,
I'm
not
sure
if
I
was
copied
on
all
the
back
and
forth.
But
what
I
sent
was
the
most
recent
that
I
thought
was
submitted.
K
Right
and
so
if
we
want
to
take
a
look
at
the
the
actual
language,
that's
in
the
packet
section,
two
conditions.
C
C
B
K
So
if
you
want
to
scroll
down
just
a
little
bit
because
section
two
is
a
little
bit
cut
off
there
there
we
go
that.
That
would
look
too
far
now
sorry,
okay,
yep.
So
I
think
I
think
that's
where
we
had
kind
of
that
back
and
forth,
because
marty
requested
the
language
of
in
that
first
highlight,
and
then
we
just
asked
that,
based
on
the
memorandum
of
understanding
stay
in
there
because
the
in
the
rewrite
that
she
had
suggested
it
wasn't
there.
K
Let
me
make
sure
I'm
looking
at
the
right
piece,
legally
binding
agreement
is
executed
between
the
project,
sponsor
the
not-for-profit
sponsor
advocate
of
community
gardens
based
on
the
memorandum
of
understanding,
which
includes,
among
other
things,
finalized
details
as
to
how
the
costs
associated
with
reconfiguration
will
be
covered.
Yes,
that
is
that
is
the
language
that,
after
the
back
and
forth,
things
seem
to
to
hit
all
the
things
that
folks
wanted.
B
C
H
K
Scroll
down
a
little
further
you'll
see
the
comments
that
that
we
authored.
K
If
you
keep
going
down
so
all
those
bullets
are
the
things
that
were
were
suggested
by
the
community,
gardens
and,
and
those
were
all
fine
with
only
that
redlined
piece
that
we
wanted
to
change,
and
it
was
basically
just
another
another
clause
to
to
make
sure
that
we're
on
the
same
page
of
what
happens
when
things
go
under
construction
and-
and
there
have
to
be,
you
know,
changes
in
where
the
fencing
is
and
changes
where
the
routing
is
there's
going
to
be
some
period
of
time
where
in
in
making
sure
everything
is
safe
and
everything
is
fenced
off.
E
Are
there
any
so
I
see
cynthia
has
her
hand.
I
can't
see
everybody
because
we're
screen
sharing.
So
all.
E
I
see
cynthia
had
her
hand
up.
I
don't
know
if
there
are
others
who
had
comments.
A
So
to
this
point,
then,
if
I'm
understanding
correctly
in
order
to
incorporate
that,
we
would
need
to
replace
the
second
bullet
under
section
two
with
that
proposed
language
that
you've
agreed
upon
in
in
the
original
or
in
that
memo,
and
just
as
a
matter
of
form,
I
guess
I'll,
ask
ari.
I'm
presuming
that
we
wouldn't
use
bullets
in
an
ordinance.
We'd,
probably
use
one
and
two.
A
So
if,
if
that's
what
we'd
like
to
do,
I'm
happy
to
to
move
that
change
to,
I
think
new
item
two
section,
two.
E
Okay,
and
did
we
want
to
go
ahead
because
the
gardens
had
the
name
change
right.
So
I
think
that's
why
they're
they're
proposing
this
they've
written
because
they
they
had
a
name
change.
So
they're
like
proposing
this
change
to
make
the
language
sort
of
reflect.
That
name
change.
I
don't
know
if
we
also
want
to
change
language
elsewhere
in
the
ordinance
together
with
that
one
section.
B
Yeah,
so
in
the
comments
that
I
sent,
there
was
a
couple,
whereas
statements
that
had
the
name
change
where
the
top
section
that
says,
marty,
hillary's
comments.
E
Okay,
so
so
maybe
we
could
do
that
along
with
cynthia's
motion.
A
J
E
I
K
And
just
for
the
record,
I
I
just
got
a
text
from
marty
just
confirming
yes,
we
are
fine
with
that
language,
so
we
we've
kind
of
hashed
it
all
out
and
and
everyone's
kind
of
on
the
same
page
now
great.
L
E
Yeah,
normally
it
would
be
a
and
b.
That's
true.
E
L
I
L
Have
a
comment
about
the
affordable
housing
aspects,
the
42
40
to
42
unit,
affordable
housing
building
is
applying
for
tax
credits,
and
I
wonder
if
you
could
tell
us
something
more
about
where
that
is
in
the
process.
I
understand
there
may
have
been
a
first
application.
L
K
So
we
are
right
now
waiting
with
baited
breath
for
responses,
so
we're
kind
of
in
the
same
holding
pattern.
You
know
it's
kind
of
normal
for
these
things
to
go
through
a
couple
of
cycles
of
submission
before
they're
accepted
and
we've
gone
through
a
couple
of
cycles
and
we
feel,
like
we've,
got
a
really
wonderfully
strong
project
with
lots
of
backing.
K
Of
course,
when
it
comes
to
this
kind
of
funding,
it's
often
a
matter
of
what
else
you're
up
against
that
particular
cycle.
So
we
just
won't
know.
We've
got
a
really
great
project
with
lots
of
wonderful
support.
I
think.
Having
had
site
plan
approval
was
actually
a
major
move
forward
towards
having
that
project
approved,
so
we'll
just
wait
and
see,
and
yes,
if,
for
some
reason
there
cannot
be
an
affordable
piece.
K
Well,
we
don't
think
that's
going
to
happen
because
we
just
go
through
the
cycle
another
time
at
another
time
constantly
improving
until
we
we
get
the
funding.
But
if,
for
some
reason
there
isn't
the
funding
available,
then
yeah
we
would
have
to
come
back
to
council
and
site
plan
and
revisit
what
we're
doing.
A
So
actually
it's
a
question
for
staff.
Does
this
so
I
understand
that
these
parcels
are
going
to
be
subdivided.
The
community
gardens
is
going
to
be
subdivided
apart
and
have
its
own
ownership
correct.
That
is
correct.
Okay,
does
the
pud
see
does
that
meet
the
green
space
requirements
for
a
parcel.
A
A
A
Right,
I
believe
I
had
posed
this
question
to
the
planning
board
before
they
granted
psych
plan
approval,
because
there
had
been
conversation
that
there
was
adequate
green
space
on
the
community
gardens,
but
the
community
gardens
is
a
separate
parcel
and
cannot
be
included
in
the
green
space
requirements.
For
the
other
two
parcels.
D
A
Maybe
I
could
be
wrong,
I
mean
it's
been
a
while
yeah
so,
but
I
I
am
very
concerned
about
that.
A
There
is
a
lot
of
hardscape
on
these
properties,
and
that
was
the
primary
issue
of
concern
with
previous
proposals.
E
Sorry
I
got
booted,
I'm
a
little.
I'm
a
little
bit
behind
cynthia
was
talking
laura.
Do
you
have
a
question.
L
No
cynthia
had
raised
a
question
about
the
green
space
and
I
just
wanted
to
comment
on
the
parking
that
there
has
been
revision
so
that
parking
there
will
be
more
interior,
parking,
less
surface
level
parking
and
that's
that's
a
good
move,
but
that
doesn't
address
cynthia's
question
about
green
space.
E
L
In
terms
of
the
waterfront
waterfront
zoning
and
green
space
requirement,
I
need
a
refresher
on
that
and
does
the
multi-use
the
multi.
L
Use
project,
residential
and
commercial
does
it
meet
the
requirement.
B
The
zoning
the
underlying
zone-
sorry,
is
it
alright?
If
I
respond
yeah
sorry,
the
underlying
zoning
isn't
what
this
project
goes
with,
because
now
it
goes
with
the
pud.
So
that's.
C
L
A
I
do
recall
that
when
we
were
talking
about
the
pud
that
there
was
discussion
with
regards
to
the
green
space
requirement,
I
I
felt
pretty
certain
that
this
was
an
an
aspect
of
concern
that
was
raised
by
multiple
council
members,
especially
in
light
of
of
the
previous
projects
that
had
been
brought
forward
for
the
site
and
the
percentage
of
lot
coverage
that
they
themselves
had
proposed.
K
That's
true,
so
I'm
trying
to
recall
all
the
conversations
that
happened
during
those
beauty
discussions
and
I
think
what
we're
looking
at,
and
I
seem
to
remember
having
a
discussion
about
how
this
is
kind
of
the
opposite
of
compartmentalization
and
how,
in
a
lot
of
development,
departmentalization
is
an
issue
because
you're
looking
at
a
piece
of
property
by
itself,
and
maybe
by
itself,
it's
okay.
But
when
you
add
all
these
things
together,
you
end
up
having
these
negative
impacts.
K
This
is
kind
of
the
opposite
where,
by
looking
at
the
development
as
a
whole,
which
ultimately
will
be
multiple
parcels,
development
as
a
whole
meets
all
the
goals
that
were
set
forth
in
terms
of
making
sure
there's,
there's
green
space
and
then
there's
you
know
pedestrian
friendly,
walk
areas,
and
then
we
have
transit
and
bicycle
and
so
on
and
makes
all
this
connectivity.
K
So
I
think
the
discussion
that
we
had
back
then
was
that
in
this
case,
let's
look
at
the
development
as
a
whole
and
see
how
the
whole
development
meets.
The
ithaca
ithaca's
needs
as
put
forth
in
in
a
lot
of
our
documents,
and
I
think
the
idea
was
that
it
absolutely
does
meet
those
needs.
When
you
look
at
the
whole
package,
even
if,
after
we
do
some
of
the
parcel
changes,
there
might
be
some
number
that's
off.
E
E
C
It's
not
unusual
for
us
to
look
at
a
project
as
a
whole,
regardless
of
where
those
lines
lie,
because
oftentimes
developments
have
to
do
subdivision
for
matters
of
funding
or
whatever
so
and
lisa
correct
if
I'm
wrong,
but
we
often
look
at
the
entire
site
for
those
green
space
requirements.
D
The
planning
board
did
talk
about
this
during
their
approval
of
the
project,
and
you
know
they
saw
that
there
were
two
and
a
half
acres
of
permanent
green
space
in
the
community
gardens
integrated
into
the
site,
so
maybe
once
they
do
their
subdivisions.
Each
individual
lot
won't
meet
the
green
space
requirement,
but
the
project
as
a
whole
had
a
huge
amount
of
a
huge
and
very
unusual
amount
of
green
space
because
it
retained
two
and
a
half
acres
of
the
community
gardens
that.
L
D
Not
really
the
planning
board
looked
at
the
whole
project,
yeah
all
of
it,
including
the
community.
C
D
So
what
we
don't?
What
we
don't
didn't
know
when
they
looked
at
the
whole
thing
is
how
they
would
have
to
exactly
where
they
would
have
to
subdivide
it.
And,
of
course,
we
know
that
the
community
gardens
are
going
to
be
on
their
own
parcel
they're
going
to
be
a
hundred
percent
green
space,
so
we
were
looking
at
it
or
the
planning
board
was
looking
at
the
whole
project
as
a
whole
yeah.
D
So
you
could
say
it
the
way
you
said
it,
but
I
suppose
they
didn't
see
it
that
they
were
relieving,
that
the
the
project
sponsor
of
the
green
space
requirement,
the
project
sponsor,
was
actually
offering
a
large
green
space
contribution.
That's
the
way
the
planning.
K
Board
side
and
and
the
developer,
you
know
our
team
is
contributing
a
very
large
amount
of
money
towards
the
community
gardens
to
make
sure
that's
maintained.
So
you
know,
and
so
that
it
has,
you
know,
upgraded
water
and
fencing
and
so
on.
So
I
it's
not
it's
not
so
much
an
issue
of
oh
well,
that's
going
to
be
there,
so
we
don't
have
to
worry
about
it.
K
K
E
I
remember
a
lot
of
conversations
about
the
parking
area
and
parking
spaces.
I
don't
I'm
I'm
not
sure
that
I
remember
a
specific
green
space
requirement
discussion,
although
I
do
believe
we
had
that
discussion
when
we
talked
about
extending
the
waterfront
zone
to
the
cherry
street
area
the
boundary,
but
for
this
site
I'm
not
sure
that
we
did.
E
A
K
No
well
it.
It
depends
on
how
you
look
at
the
parcels,
but
I
think
it's
going
to
be
13
for
for
the
mixed-use
pieces
and
the
medical
center
as
far
as
the
affordable
building,
that's
probably
not
going
to
be
a
route
13
frontage,
you
know
by
zoning.
It
would
either
be
the
interior's
road
or
it'd,
be
third
street.
E
I'm
seeing
some
nodding
okay,
so
are
we
ready
to
vote
so
all
those
in
favor
of
sending
this
on
the
council?
E
All
those
opposed,
I
think
that
carries
unanimously.
Yes,
it
did
so
thank
you,
mela
and
that
will
go
to
the
november
council
meeting.
E
E
E
Us
to
allow
dogs
and
to
basically
allow
dogs
the
same
way
that
we
allow
them
elsewhere
in
the
city
that
they
require
to
be
on
a
leash
under
the
control
of
the
owner,
but
that
dogs
would
be
allowed
on
the
intake
and
the
commons
under
those
conditions.
B
E
And
yeah,
so
at
this
point
where
this
is
up
for
circulation,
so
we
would
circulate
this
and
come
back
next
month.
I'm
sure
that
we're
going
to
get
a
lot
of
public
comment
on
it,
but
I'd
be
curious
to
hear
people's
thoughts
on
this.
I
know:
we've
we've
discussed
it
in
the
past
I'll
just
start
out
I'll
say
that
my
position
on
this
has
changed
since
the
last
time
we
discussed
this-
I
I
was
a
no
vote.
You
know
since
then.
I
think
a
couple
things
have
happened.
E
One
I
got
a
dog,
so
I
think
that's
helped
to
be
a
dog
owner
and
realize
that
you
know
having
him
on
a
leash.
Is
you
know
you
control
him,
and
I
think
you
know
a
leash
dog.
E
That's
under
the
control
of
a
responsible
owner
is
less
likely
to
do
bad
things
do
irresponsible
things,
and
also
I
just
you
know,
looking
at
what's
going
on
on
the
commons
where
there
are
a
lot
of
dogs
there
now
and
the
rules
aren't
being
enforced,
and
you
know
I
think
we
have
to
make
a
decision
about.
E
You
know
whether
we
continue
to
keep
a
law
in
the
books
that
you
know
we're
not
able
to
enforce,
because,
frankly,
we
just
don't
have
the
police
staffing
to
to
enforce
it
or
we
change
the
law
and
and
allow
dogs
on
the
commons
leashed.
E
You
know,
and-
and
I
think
it
also
has-
you
know
it's
all-
it's
also
been
an
impact
to
tourism,
there's
a
lot
of
visitors
who
come
to
the
commons
and
they
want
to
bring
their
dogs
there's
a
lot
of
businesses
on
the
commons
that
have
that
have
been
in
favor
of
this.
So
those
are
my
reasons
for
for
supporting
it.
I
voted
for
it
at
the
dia
meeting
but,
of
course,
I'd
be
curious
to
hear
others
thoughts,
laura.
L
So
I,
for
that
reason,
and
also
making
the
comments.
The
rule
on
the
commons
consistent
with
the
the
ordinance
the
rule
throughout
the
rest
of
the
city,
for
consistency's
sake,
seems
to
make
a
lot
of
sense.
I
will
say
that
I
had
to
look
carefully
to
find
the
posters
and
others
have
brought
this
to
our
attention
in
the
past
that
are
at
the
entrances
to
the
commons
that
indicate
a
regulation
on
no
dogs
permitted
on
the
commons.
It's
not
very
visible,
it's
not
visible,
it's
not
enforceable.
L
I
don't
think
we
want
our
police
officers
to
be
dealing
with
dogs
on
the
commons
and
we
will
have
increased
residences
downtown.
I
do
think
it's
important,
though,
that
we
have
a
statement
about
dog
waste
and
the
dia
has
been
really
helpful
and
they're
making
available
receptacles
dog
waste
bag
stations
for
the
commons
entrances.
E
Is
that
emotion.
L
E
I
L
Yeah,
I'm
I'm
making
the
motion
to
include,
whereas
that
owners
are
responsible
for
cleaning
up
dog
waste.
Is
there.
E
A
second
steve:
are
you
seconding
yep,
second
by
steve,
so
that's
the,
whereas
so
that
owners
are
responsible
for
cleaning
up
dog
waste.
Any
discussion
on
that
motion.
I
I
I
I
I
think
people
should
pick
up
dog
poop
and
I
don't
think
dogs
should
urinate
on
the
commons.
I
don't
know
how
to
put
that
in
the.
E
Language
cynthia
did
you
have
a
suggestion.
A
As
to
laura's
motion,
if
there
is
an
obligation
to
pick
up
dog
poop,
I
think
that
has
to
be
more
than
a,
whereas
if
there's.
E
A
Okay,
good,
okay,
so
so
in
that
case,
it's
fine
to
donna's
point.
You
know
I.
I
fully
recognize
that
the
surfacing
that
was
selected
for
the
commons
was
a
bit
too
precious,
perhaps
for
the
type
of
usage
that
it
would
be
getting
by
the
general
public
and
by
animals,
and
perhaps
that
was
a
failure
in
terms
of
that,
because
it
does
require
special
cleaning,
special
maintenance,
more
so
than
a
typical
pedestrian
walkway
in
our
public
rights
of
way.
A
But
I
think
that
was
an
error
that
I
don't
think
we
need
to
preserve
it
by
asking
people
to
not
do
what
they
would
normally
do.
I
I
think
it
it's
absolutely
reasonable.
I
I
I
agree
with
others
that
this
is
a
public
right-of-way
in
the
city.
It
is
a
pedestrian
amenity.
It
is
a
tourist
attraction.
It
is
in
the
center
of
a
residential
and
commercial
area.
A
City
center
allows
dogs
in
the
apartment
complex
there,
so
there
are
going
to
be
dog
walkers
that
are
going
to
go
through
whether
there
is
a
sign
or
a
prohibition
against
dog
walking
or
not
or
or
allowing
them
to
pee
or
poop.
A
Even
if
you
clean
it
up,
so
I
think,
to
a
certain
extent
recognizing
that
human
nature
is
what
it
is
and
and
allow
ourselves
to
accommodate
for
that
either
through
increased
maintenance,
providing
receptacles
providing
bags,
I
think,
is
the
proper
way
to
go,
and
definitely
as
as
a
tourist
who
I
myself
have
gone
to
a
lot
of
areas.
A
I
appreciate
being
able
to
to
walk
my
dog
through
their
downtown
tourism
areas
and
being
able
to
walk
freely
through
it
without
having
to
think
about
whether
it's
allowed
here
or
not
there.
So
I
would
I
would
support
allowing
dogs
on
the
commons.
I
think
this
is
our.
What
third
try
to
to
get
this
done
seems
to
come
about
every
year
and
a
half
and
I've
been
consistent
throughout
that.
I
would
support
dogs
in
the
commons.
E
So
do
we
need
any
further
changes
to
laura's
motion?
I
mean,
I
think,
what
it's
essentially
saying
is
just
you
know
right
now:
it's
the
law
that
you
have
to
clean
up
dog
waste,
but
I
think
I
think
it
makes
sense
to
have
a,
whereas,
whereas
in
there
just
to
reflect
that
this
is
this
particularly
sensitive
area
and
we're.
E
We
really
want
to
emphasize
that
in
terms
of
dogs
urinating,
on
the
commons
I
mean
there's
a
certain
level
where
you're
not
going
to
be
able
to
avoid.
Like
I
mean,
there's
going
to
be,
there's
probably
going
to
be
dogs
peeing
in
the
commons,
but
you
know
it's
also
it's
possible
that
you
know
working
with
the
dia
or
the
city.
We
could
create
some
best
practices
and
just
to
try
to
really
encourage
owners.
E
E
I
And
can
somebody
clarify
there
so
the
city
code
regarding
dogs
on
leashes?
Does
it
specify
how
long
the
leash
is
and
those
stupid
retractable
leashes?
That
would
be
a
nightmare
if
they
were
all
over.
E
A
B
E
H
E
So
that
will
go
to
the
november
council
meeting
was
the
last.
E
Oh,
it's
circulated,
I'm
sorry
yeah,
that's
so
that
will
be
circulated
and
we'll
come
back
next
month.
Okay,
and
are
we
going
to
hold
a
public
hearing?
Is
that
yes,.
B
E
And
so
then
the
last
item
is
the
minutes.
Is
there
a
motion
on
the
minutes
moved
by
cynthia,
second,
by
donna
all
in
favor
of
approving
the
minutes
and
that
carries
unanimously
and
motion
to
adjourn
moved
by
laura
seconded
by
donna?
Thank
you
all
and
we'll
see
you
soon
tomorrow,
night.