City of Portsmouth, New Hampshire Legislative Sub Committee, 27 Jan 2023

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From YouTube: 1.27.2023 Legislative Subcommittee

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1.27.2023 Legislative Subcommittee

A

2023 meeting of the legislative sub committee- let's forget: we need to take role on these. I.

B

Sure we should thank you, um mayor mcgovern, here, assistant mayor kelly, here, councilor.

B

Tabor here, city manager, conard here jane freedy, all right, uh a weighted, a motion to approve the.

A

Minutes of the october 21st 2022 minutes still moved, oh second, all in favor hi and then we're.

A

Going to review uh adopted legislative principles and procedures for testimony.

B

Bruce and I included these is um because, just as a reminder on a refresher of the principles that we.

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Do have, and um just for a point of reference in the event that there's something that you folks.

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Want as a priority that doesn't happen to appear on the principles that we've already adopted, we.

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Might just revisit these as we go through some of the bills and the discussions to make sure.

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We match, rather than specifically, you know, review both of these, which were approved in february of.

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2022., if that's okay, with with the committee okay with me, is there an example where we would need to.

A

So far, um well, some things are very generic. There's a bunch of bills that I believe the.

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Assistant mayor is going to bring up relative to rents and requiring landlords to you know.

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Notify on eviction and that sort of thing that's a little beyond you know, sort of what.

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We've weighed in on in support, but it could be if we amended the workforce, housing or.

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You know the housing principle, that's all I'm I'm talking about stuff like that.

B

So if we want to move on to some of the bills, a lot of the hearings are now in full swing. There's.

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Over 1 100 bills, part of the goal of today's meeting is to try to get some direction from.

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The committee, insofar as you know, what are the topics that you really want to focus on? One of.

B

The things that's very different this year, as you all know, is how close the house membership.

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Is between republicans and democrats and what I'm hearing through the grapevine is.

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That that makes the committee recommendations uh not very effective because you have a 50 50 split.

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So years ago we would go before the house and we would submit written testimony. We were trying.

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To convince the committee to you know, follow uh whatever recommendation either opposed or.

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Or support a particular bill and then because our reps work so hard within their committees.

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Oftentimes they aren't familiar with the thousand bills that are coming. You know to them to vote.

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So they will follow the recommendations of their party, so um this year is a little more challenging.

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Because we really won't know, regardless of the committee recommendation, how a vote is going to.

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Go because it's going to be how many people show up to the floor. So that is just a sort of a new.

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Reality, maybe it will compel some bipartisan support, but it's just different than than it.

B

Used to be, whereas in the senate we still have the 1410 split, a smaller number of obviously senators.

B

And so just kind of throw that out there and just so this committee knows it's a it's a different.

B

It's a different climate and uh this year so and following up on senator perkins quoka's.

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Housing bills. I listed uh three of them that she sponsored relative to housing and they're in your.

B

Packet senate bill 145 is that the housing champion program senate bill 244 is creating.

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Housing opportunity zones and senate bill 47 is a commission to study housing density and you know.

B

All of those would definitely fit into our our legislative principles of supporting workforce.

B

Housing there are no hearings scheduled for any of these particular bills, but I wanted to make sure.

B

The committee knew that what was discussed at our last meeting actually came forward as as bills and.

B

And- and that was something that that was important- I know to the committee and the priorities so.

A

On that one jane was there and know that it specifically asked, and I think senator perkins.

A

Taking it under advisement the ability to let cities and towns set their own.

A

Rate of affordability with regard to new construction did that make it.

B

um There is enabling legislation that allows a requirement for workforce housing.

C

Thank you yeah, so I mean yeah. I guess what does that mean.

B

I think that's in the housing champion just one second.

D

Sorry about that.

B

I'll look at 145, it should be scanned.

B

A percentage of the construction that that it enables municipalities to require a developer.

B

For a particular percentage, I think it's ten percent and the in I think it's 10. Is it 20.

E

um We've got language in rebecca's, sb 224 for 20. for 20., um and I believe that it also.

B

Discusses what the income qualifications were um and for for sb 244? It's a hundred percent of the.

B

Median income, so that's very different. It's not like the federal requirement that says in order.

B

To qualify for this type of housing, you have to have 60 percent of the median income or whatever.

B

um So that's the that's 244 of the housing opportunity zone bill but 145, which I'm not.

B

Seeing right off the top of my head is the piece that is the enabling legislation that allows for.

B

A municipality to require a developer, to devote a particular percentage to workforce housing and.

A

So housing opportunity zones does that. How is that constricted? I guess the expectation would.

A

Be blanket across the city, or that was the expectation of the previous discussion. um I.

B

Believe this allows you to designate a specific, um a specific location for that inclusionary.

B

um Housing um opportunity zone well, it's it gives tax relief to the right person, so you wouldn't do.

B

It everywhere the whole city, oh yeah, it's it's it's attacked. So is there a way to change this.

A

um I guess, like that's, not really interesting um to like to give tax relief. I guess what.

A

Seems like we might have made that or it might have been kind of.

A

Like here in portsmouth, folks would be fine with no more development completely. I would say vast.

A

Majority of this city would be totally supportive of not having more development unless there was a.

A

Requirement that development had a percentage of percentage of that new construction be affordable.

A

And not through a tax relief or giving money back just this doesn't happen unless straight.

C

Up of units we have a percentage coming in as affordable yeah. I believe that is in senate bill.

B

145., so the the senate bill 244, is the housing opportunity zone which is the incentive? Is you.

B

Know incentivized the finance piece of it lets a developer, get a credit um and also, I think they.

B

Can demonstrate to the planning board, you know, there's a there's an out if the economic viability.

B

Of the development um you know, then they can get some relief on some requirements and some some.

B

Cost factors relating to the improvements the uh sb 145 is where you can, as a city require x.

B

Percent of a development to be okay and what else is in the housing champion bill? uh That's that's.

B

Pretty much it the inclusion, the inclusionary zone and then the tax release component of the.

B

Of the housing opportunity zones- sorry I thought there wasn't. I thought 145 was, was no tax relief.

B

I'm seeing I'm trying to look right now. Unfortunately, it's not coming up.

B

Do any of you have to? I can show it on zoom if that's helpful yeah. He now has.

C

The capability, I think we got a text of sb 145 yeah, that's what I'm sure, but we can.

E

Look it up online yeah, sorry about that guys, no worries.

D

B

A

And again, this would be there's language in that we would expect language. This is an opt-in.

A

So hampton wouldn't have to do it. Yes, exactly wouldn't have to do it. Okay, here we go so the bill.

E

D

All right now there we go nope, it's not coming up. Okay, view the bill.

D

And then I went to the general court ones that coming up yeah, I do too. But then, as you.

C

May have it on their build tracker, they would yeah if we can. Click on that link.

C

Mm-Hmm come on.

B

I got it okay, I mean it's only on my phone, but.

B

The bill establishes the new hampshire housing champion designation program.

B

Including a housing production, municipality grant program and a housing infrastructure.

B

Municipal grant and loan program the bill also establishes positions with the department of.

B

Business and economic affairs and makes appropriation to the program and let's see.

C

Is there a way to search here, so it seems like quite a large bill. Yes with loans and.

A

Things like that, not a specific carve out to allow us the local control to.

E

Yeah, that's: is there a bill that just says like a standalone towns can require.

E

A certain percentage of affordable units, my recollection, was in this bill.

B

And a hard time reading it, I feel like whenever they call something a housing.

A

Champion bill and it's introduced like by a republican or democrat, the other side is.

A

Going to think it's definitely not a champion bill would get pretty flowery with the language.

C

There's the build tracker on this computer. We can try that, but I can't search it so.

C

Yeah, it makes sense to print them out. Okay, it doesn't seem like the it seems like it's. It's.

A

It's stuck in a larger thing that was not really yeah exactly it's, not a standalone. It's it's.

B

Baked in in in other uh particular, I guess we would have to know what's in the housing.

A

uh Champion loan to be able to support it uh more fully, um you know having education.

A

Requirements for our boards is kind of a waste of time. Exactly my perspective,.

A

And uh you know it's just like training for training's sake and just a waste of money. So.

A

um That they're not going to uh they're not going to change their opinion by having to sit in a zoom.

A

You know talking about. Oh, um you know, this is uh just seems like propaganda to them. So um would.

A

Like to see what else is in support there um or in the bill to be able to support that or not.

B

Hold on that for a bit, so I could report back on that.

B

um The other one sb47 is just a commission to study housing density. Just a commission, it just.

B

Looks at zoning looks at means by which increasing density might improve workforce housing. It has you.

B

Know we need to study that to know that right, like I guess, like seems like you know, commissions, have.

A

To cost some sort of time or money, is it just staff? It would just be a report out in november.

B

From the yeah to make particular recommendations which then presumably springboards uh legislation.

B

But this in and of itself wouldn't be legislation on density, although there are bills that are.

B

Before the house and senate on increasing density for residential housing, this session.

B

um And then there were state retirement bills. um The good news is that hb50 came back again.

B

Rather than a one-time payment of 7.5, it's an annual obligation of the state to contribute.

B

That particular amount to two classifications of employees, teachers and police and fire good.

E

For all towns, good for everybody- that is, uh that is, that is good for everyone, so.

B

um There was a hearing on that the city registered in support of that without further.

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Written testimony the other bill house bill 555, is relative to the accrued unfunded liability.

B

For the retirement system, as you know, there are lots of, there is a huge uh amount of money that.

B

Is in the unfunded liability, this particular bill proposes that some of the surplus- quite a.

B

Bit of the state's surplus be paid towards that unfunded accrued liability for the retirement.

B

How that affects municipalities is presumably the employer contribution would then go down.

B

Significantly because this unfunded liability has been paid off, so that is something.

B

um You know to to I'm assuming in nhma as a champion and support of that as well, because.

B

It it helps all municipalities if, in fact, it moves forward to reduce that unfunded accrued.

B

Liability, which is which is hugely financially impactful for an employer's contribution to all.

B

Of the retirement in the state, the other bill that we did send tested just um sorry on that.

A

The 50 and 55 so this goes, and I think this was maybe it's the first time I noticed it in our.

A

Conversations with judy, but the unfunded portion accounts for 70 percent of the cost that we share.

A

With uh or or 70 of, the cost of the retirement for the employer, not the employee, correct. It's.

A

The employer cost absolutely and this started. I guess, what 40 or 50 years ago, when the state.

A

Said: hey we're going to consolidate all of your pension systems so that it comes under one roof.

A

Is it a fair assumption to say that the retirement that you get in portsmouth is the same retirement.

A

You get in manchester, or is that negotiated through collective bargaining individually.

C

That's a great question: that is a great question.

A

So maybe a follow-up on that to know like whether or not you know, because you know.

A

The state is not going to want to pay if our, if our benefits you know if this encourages us to.

A

Create better benefits than in manchester, but if it's my assumption, it's correct and they're.

A

All the same they're, all 70, that percentage was oh, no, so sorry, what I mean is the benefits like.

A

The actual benefits upon retirement is that the same for uh portsmouth as it is manchester the.

B

Classification of employee is this is the same everywhere. So you've got your your. What three.

B

Classes you've got your teachers in one class. You've got your police and fire another and then.

B

You have your government, the everybody else is in class, three there's a hugely complicated. You know.

B

Definitions and who gets to confirmed that you know so, a teacher in portsmouth retiring gets.

C

The same allocation as a teacher in manchester right, okay and then um you know, I think the this.

A

Was originally we were separate before and the state said: hey um it's going to be easier for us.

A

To to manage this on behalf of everybody, if you come in to the fold and we're going to make it.

A

Worth your while, by paying 30 of the cost, 35 35 of of the the cost of retirement to sweeten the pot.

A

um You know, I would imagine that you know given our track record in portsmouth, if we had continued.

A

On outside of the state, and now you know with our aaa bond rating and our generally healthy.

A

Finances we would have not been in the position of getting you know over the barrel when it comes.

A

To the taking that down from 35 to 30, because we thought we were going to get 10 returns in.

A

The 90s forever and then the uh and then the uh you know the economic crisis of 2008.. So.

A

um You know I very much support. I just wanted make sure that we are, we understand, you know.

A

That this is separate and yeah, they should use the they should use the money to to pay down the.

A

Cost because right now it's scheduled to be done in 2039. I think far far away yep. If ever, if ever.

B

um And uh we did submit uh testimony in support of house bill 311, which you got a copy of uh which.

B

Which is wastewater funding and those projects? um The other bill that is uh concerning and has a.

B

Fiscal impact is house bill 647. That is a bill that would eliminate all government immunity.

B

And nhma um did a little summary and discussion of you know what those, what those impacts are.

B

As you all know, there are certain liability caps when, when a government is sued, there's a certain.

B

Amount of money for a personal injury for an individual and a cap on you know more than one.

B

Individual of someone say, for instance, slips and falls. One example one one consequence of this bill.

B

Is that would be completely removed, so there would be no uh cap on liability it would. It would permit.

B

Monetary damages for every single action against a municipality which doesn't exist in in many cases.

B

um There's there's there's immunity. We have immunity from particular suits as a government.

B

A sovereign immunity, you can't you know, sue the king sort of thing, so there are certain.

B

Classifications of things, that's what that is yeah, so that we simply don't we're simply exempt.

B

From lawsuits right because of of of those of of those principles and certain on certain types of.

B

Suits basically, this this particular bill does away with with pretty much absolutely everything.

B

um It creates the a right to sue for monetary damages and the expense to that would be obviously.

B

Born by the taxpayer and the city, because the insurance premiums that cities would have to.

B

Pay to enjoy themselves would go up. Incredibly, I reached out to mike ricker, who is an attorney for.

B

Primex he has been working very closely with nhma to give them advice as to you know how this could.

B

Financially impact municipalities, they always it's a risk pool right for insurance, and so you have x.

B

Amount of claims- and so they quote what everybody has to pay for insurance, on whatever the risk pool.

B

Is this bill if it passed, would expand that risk pool because there'd be so many more other types.

B

Of actions that could be taken and therefore the premium to be insured, would be much higher.

B

Also, there's the way the bill is written. It's in the event, the the government made an error and.

B

A lawsuit is brought, and then you fixed it for whatever reason or you you tried to settle it.

B

You still might be obligated to pay the attorney fees associated with that, so there is somewhat.

B

Of a disincentive for set element, the way the language of this bill is written and the whole.

B

Attorney fees, things is, is something that you know. Typically, attorney fees are not awarded unless.

B

There's some you know gross want and negligence on the part of anybody, not just governments, but.

B

This would make the award of attorney fees. um You know a much much more uh frequent um and.

B

The other issue is um with this bill is that you know it just would also the floodgates.

B

Would open so to speak on on the types of suits that would be requesting monetary damages, and so.

B

um We have not submitted any written testimony relative to this, but we did register an opposition.

B

Because this is obviously affects our our fiscal ability to function, and so this is something that.

B

We certainly want to watch nhma, as is really taking the lead in opposing this, because of.

B

The fiscal impacts on on municipalities in the event that this passes and it's not to say that.

A

You can't sue the city of portsmouth, but in order to get past the bar of sovereign immunity, there.

A

Has to be some sort of provable gross negligence on our behalf in order to take and file suit, is.

A

That correct well, there are certain suits that people can just take by by statutory authority.

B

I mean exactly, but we don't always have monetary damages linked to those types of suits. If somebody.

B

You know if it's a right to know situation, it's not just attorney fees, it's monetary damages and.

B

Attorney fees they'd be asking for so you know if if we are brought in or you know, there's some.

B

No claim of you know, I don't know any claim. Faulty notice any right to know.

B

um And the other thing that's concerning is: is language board decisions right so.

B

We have our, you know, that's a government, you know action. Land boards decision makes makes.

B

Something favorable or unfavorable to either an applicant or uh or an intervener. Then you.

B

Know how what's the monetary damages there? So I'm sure this will be something that's closely watched.

B

um But it's something that you should be aware of. Can I jump in. I have some clarification on.

C

The teacher in different years, the the amount that's contributed in is state mandated and.

C

The same but uh municipalities could have different packages on top of that, so the.

C

Calculation, however, is the same for retirees in new hampshire retirement when they retire.

C

Just based on their years of service so uh and it you know if manchester were to put in a different.

C

Package or incentive for retirees they could do that over and above the mandated out of their own.

E

Okay, okay, but it's mandated what folks are supposed to put in and what they get out.

E

Uniform years of uniform contribution for all cities and towns, uniform contribution.

A

And then uniform distribution, distribution from that retirement from this system correct and so.

A

If we wanted to do something in addition to that, that would be done by the city.

A

Of portsmouth through collective bargaining right, okay, so uniform in uniform out. um Okay.

A

Councilor cook, thank you mayor. I have to apologize first for being late this morning.

F

For some reason I had this in my calendar at 10 30.. I was sitting waiting now so here I am.

F

um uh And thank you to the city manager for alerting me sure so on this uh particular bill.

F

uh That we were discussing um are there examples of states that have this legislation in place. I.

B

Doubt there is a state that has this legislation in place, so I'm I'm asking this question because.

F

There's there's just a really close analogy here to litigation and health care, because what you see.

F

Is states that don't have limits on liability and you can sue for anything in health care. Oh sure,.

F

um That doctors flee in hospitals, flee and hospitals go out of business. This pennsylvania has.

F

A major problem with hospitals going into business because there's no limits on litigation in health.

F

Care but states that have those limits in place like new hampshire can retain not only healthcare.

F

Workers but hospitals, yeah the difference between us and the only difference and that's.

A

A great analogy is that we we, unfortunately can't set up shop. You know in another state.

A

Exactly yeah, that's a uh that is a a good uh analogy and I I you know I I think that.

A

We should certainly uh be opposed to this. I would imagine that this would you know for the governor.

A

To sign this um and not veto, this bill would be shocking to me to take away or increase.

A

His ability as the state of new hampshire and the liability that the state would I'm assuming, would.

A

Also face in this or no, this does preserve some of the legislature's own immunity, as well as judicial.

G

Immunity, however, the local municipalities, you know we'll be happy to reconsider our position.

A

If the legislature is also removes their immunity, however, the voters are made up of.

B

The local municipalities who would be subject to this, so I I um I I think the governor would pay.

B

Attention to that who brought that bill forward, I will find it, for it is a representative lucas.

B

Representative smith, representative manion, representative mueller and senator murphy.

F

um I think it would be interesting to look at who's supporting this. I would guess it's the trial.

F

Lawyers um opposed to this- I don't imagine the trial lawyers would or litigate like it's good for.

F

Litigation attorneys yeah, I don't know, I think they uh it's an ecosystem. I mean it.

A

Would collapse our system of government pretty quickly in the the amount that we would then.

A

Be you know if you know primex isn't going to be supportive of it as as was discussed.

A

um They're not getting any of this money, it would just be risk pools to pay out claims.

A

um And then you know eventually, you know we have no, we would have no incentive to ever settle as.

A

It's written because um you know we could still be found liable there, but I think we should you.

A

Know definitely oppose, um and this goes against. You know a few legislative principles, but I don't.

A

Know if we're going to need to it seems like I would be surprised what the recommendation as.

A

It's gone through committee or is anything going through committee or they're just going. There was.

B

A hearing- but I don't think it reports okay this week but there's I don't believe a report's, been.

B

Generated yet on this municipal association, I assume is strongly very, very, very much opposed.

B

You know um banging the drum reaching out to municipalities, making people aware of it.

B

Because I think that's the trick, you know with a thousand one hundred bills, it's uh challenging to.

B

Keep ahead of it, but no um they. They are very much opposed and have been very active in not.

B

Only opposing it, but advising on the financial notes on particular bills. This year, which I had.

B

Not seen in the past, but they are providing in in the some of the the bills we're seeing there.

B

Are fiscal implications and nhma has been asked their advice and will comment on how.

B

This any particular bill or certain bills will will have impact on towns and cities and towns.

B

um Moving along hotel occupancy is back, and uh it is very similar to the.

B

um Prior bill that was introduced last year, there was a hearing on that bill february. 1St.

B

On in 2023, in room 100 in the senate, at 10 45 a.m I'll be happy to provide written testimony.

B

On behalf of the committee, this is one of our sure I might go to that sport, but if you would.

B

Like to provide a show up and provide testimony, I'm sure that would be very much appreciated.

B

um Are you he um can we get the um and what time is it all right? um Can we get the.

A

I know that there were questions last time from this in terms of.

A

They don't record their committee meetings, some of them are recorded, but I don't know how long they.

B

Retain them from you know from one year to the next. uh The committee reports I would leave would.

B

Be retained so again uh I remember there was yeah. There was a question in terms of like what the.

A

um The collection and administration- I think some some members were hung up on on that piece of it.

B

Which, I think is is easily addressed. There was also a a question on uh density and whether or.

A

Not you know from a property tax standpoint if this was already being taken into account.

A

um But right, don't don't you, you know, aren't your hotels, paying real estate taxes and shouldn't real.

B

Estate tax says, the argument is that shouldn't those taxes then provide the infrastructure.

B

Support for the tourism and I know in years past we've brought the police, the fire chief.

B

uh Testifying on a similar, similar types of bills, to say you know, there's a difference.

B

Between a residential call and a six-story hotel, and what we as a city need to provide for services.

B

um You know, and so that the answer is uh yes: they pay real estate taxes, but also you know.

B

There are other impacts that aren't fully captured by the real estate taxes with the.

B

Influx of of tourism, so uh this um this fund could be deposited in a capital reserve fund, a.

B

Tourism support fund, a revolving fund or other special revenue fund, and so it gives some you.

B

Know again, it's enabling legislation allowing not everyone has to do it. You know cities and.

B

Towns can do it if they choose if it's something that that would be would be beneficial to that.

B

City in town and it's similar to those in the past, so we can take a look and and do.

B

Some digging, as far as historically what those questions were and try to address those. As far as.

B

Last time I thought the house was supportive. What was it.

B

Four three years ago, two years ago, yeah it didn't get out of committee at this.

A

Time into a committee report, I think the best the most support it had was three years ago.

B

um Pre-Covered and then um yeah it didn't it didn't get out last year. This has some changes.

G

Compared to the other ones, where there's there's caps, there's minimum minimum occupancy rates, you.

G

Know if it's, if it's a yes, if it's a under a 50 or 40 dollar fee, you can't charge it. It's maxed at.

G

Two dollars a day, 24 hour period, so I think they took some of the things they heard in committee.

G

um And some of this uh had been in ones years before and then dropped out and then came back.

B

I think the yeah, the 184 and the number of days um you know sometimes there is uh and and the cap.

B

At the at the two dollars, I think there was some concern about creep. You know if it's two dollars.

B

This year it's going to be, you know five dollars uh the year after that and the forty dollars. I.

B

Think that was that was the campground lobby, uh because uh they they there's some sort of.

B

Limitation on that, because they want don't want to have to pass that on. If it's only a certain.

B

Amount of money, so this is something that um is, is moving forward so we'll see we'll see what happens.

B

um Then there is some bills relative to local authority house bill. 51 is relative to a pro.

B

Lobbying, but it's only affecting towns, they are requiring that if folks are going to lobby, they.

B

Have to have it come through a worn article again that doesn't apply to cities, but we're watchful.

B

Of those bills that that limit, you know city's ability to lobby house bill, 361 the peas board.

B

Membership I'll have the the mayor's aware of that. That is a bill that is requesting that newcastle.

B

And rye have a one member added to the the peas board um and then is it added or in place of the.

C

Speaker's choice, so the speaker gets to to pick to pick one now, so the whole thing works by I.

A

Forget all of the appointments, but we have uh one appointment. We used to have one and a half.

A

And then tom sherman uh got it so our appointment went to greenland, so greenland has an appointment.

A

um And then um and greenland shares that appointment with uh newington and then.

A

um There's appointed by the governor uh appointed by the speaker.

A

um Who am I forgetting here, there's governor speaker, uh newington.

E

I knowington might have 12 peggy lampson. Oh that's right. They have peggy too, yes and newington has a.

E

So it has, one has one and a half yeah sportsmen has one yeah um uh the uh yeah. So uh the speaker.

A

um The governor, um and so this would make it so the speaker's appointment would go to jointly.

B

Represent yeah one person, arguably see you know, you know rye with the harbor under the.

A

Pda, it's hard to imagine why newcastle would get a uh would get a position on there, but.

A

um The uh I think the this is a um you know, uh we'll see how this this comes. I I.

A

Would be for the next uh the year following, but yeah, it seems like over time. Our voice has been.

E

Deluded yeah sure yeah, so I mean I think if there was going to be again if there was to be changes.

A

To make up, I think our position would be that we'd want portsmouth's half seat restored on that, but.

A

That's neither here nor there the the system is holding together and relatively working over the.

A

Last 30 years to create an economic driver for the entire state, so it's always interesting that they.

A

Want to change that as much as they do but yeah. I think I think, with the growth of the airport and.

G

The potential of the actual flights and things people right. Look you look at what it what it.

G

Did to you know, obviously a larger size city but worcester when they revitalized to their airport.

G

And really became a an economic stimulant for that yeah. I was going to say that the cargo, the.

F

Cargo facility project emboldened people in rye to start thinking about and wanting this.

F

So, that's probably where it is yeah and they're on the flight status, yeah yeah there's a lot of.

E

Interest, we have not just the six to seven million dollars from the municipal services agreement.

E

Which we open up at our apparel, I mean that's, worked wonderfully well sure we just don't.

E

Want to open that up, but you know it's the job base. It's 9 000 jobs out there, jobs, tax revenue.

E

So, let's not mess it up yeah! I don't think they have to open the municipal service agreement to to.

A

Change the makeup of this, but again you know it's worked, uh it's worked well so far for the area and.

A

We'll see you know we we now will get more updates from karen on this as well. So.

B

Okay, um another one somewhat similar to the immunity bill and where is house bill.

B

292., it's a theft by public servant, yeah and the bill establishes it criminal penalty for.

B

Theft by a public servant who authorizes payment for legal actions against the.

B

Municipality and creates a right of action against such public servants.

A

um I'm sure we got an example in our history. I think to the grapevine is, I think,.

B

I think, and and there were I guess, somebody paid some attorney fees and and- and I guess this bill.

B

Is a a product of that? I think one of the comm there was. There was a conversation with that one.

G

Of the commissioners yeah yeah, that was a scam. So again, it's just bring that to your attention.

B

As well and then um we have the various cannabis bills were heard uh this week. They are voluminous.

B

And they are, um as a representative muse, discussed their last meeting they're trying to do everything.

B

You know a cup rather than do a standalone, you know and and cut things up uh several of them.

B

Are you know, lots of pages long? uh They all sort of have a different approach as to what the money.

B

Generated from the sale of cannabis would would be you used for, and so, for instance, there is for.

B

House bill for I'm sorry, 544, it's 50 percent of the money goes to the general fund and 50.

B

Goes to a municipality in house bill 639 80 go to the unfunded accrued liability for the retirement.

B

Which we spoke about already and once that's paid off, then 80 goes to the education trust.

B

Fund, however, that is the one that has the meals and rooms uh included in it, which was.

B

Discussed at the last meeting by brought up by the assistant mayor and so therefore the the sale of.

B

Cannabis would be taxed under the meals and rooms house bill 643, the um the the revenue would go. 50.

B

To the education, trust fund and 50 to the to health and human services that one's a little.

B

I don't know if that's administrative there's a lot of community community.

B

um And and aid to to to folks um that is baked into that particular bill.

B

um And then each bill 360 is just basically criminal penalties. It's not the legalization piece.

B

Insofar as it changes the um the criminalization because they're so different and and contain a.

B

Lot of provisions not just uh they're two common themes- one is most of them- allow municipality to.

B

Regulate how many dispensaries they want to have in their town there's some enabling legislation.

B

Baked in there, then they also give either directly or indirectly, you know money to the to.

B

A municipality either through you know the meals and rooms or directly or you know, through paying.

B

The unfunded accrued liability, um but uh the I did not submit any you know written testimony.

B

And support because I wanted some guidance from the committee. um Two of them went before finance.

B

uh Kate, marie is now one of our representatives. She sits on finance, it might make sense to find.

B

Out which one's going to survive? You know which one's going to come out of of committee and then.

B

Once it does, then we can, you know, see what what's actually moving forward um on this bill, because.

B

I can't imagine they'll they'll they'll all go, these three will will go through. I imagine there.

B

Will be one that will I mean it would be logical but again and has any have any of them touched on.

A

Maybe the system mayor would know. As far as I understand, you can't use a credit card to.

A

Pay for this, so it's kind of like scratchers at the gas station you got to have cash like.

G

How does so, how does that work? My understanding? That's still, there are some banks that seem to be.

G

Starting to accept it, I have a friend who deals with this legislation in massachusetts, but right.

G

Now it's more of the it's the banking system, all of them have language in them relative to.

B

Banks and and money being deposited- I didn't read them carefully enough to know about credit.

B

Cards but I do know that there are provisions in each of them that that define and acknowledge you.

B

Know what this uh cannabis fund is going to be in that we are able to put that money in a particular.

B

Fund and then distribute it, these various ways to the various state agencies, municipalities,.

B

Etc, so um I will be happy to reach out to kate murray to see if you know what the committee is.

B

Hearing what you know what the sponsors are doing um so that we can kind of get a distilled version.

B

Of what might pass forward and and whether or not the this committee wants to submit.

B

um Testimony and support and then the last bill that I had listed, uh we were contacted by the.

B

City manager of lebanon relative to senate bill 221, which is a child care property tax credit.

B

For facilities that provide daycare, I reached out to our assessor last night and she had just.

B

Two comments: uh the first comment was: it was for both profit and non-profit child care, so.

B

That's something a bit unusual for tax exemptions, typically they're they're non-profits or you know.

B

Particular individuals, which was a concern as far as maybe opening the door for things like.

B

That as far as future legislation and um and so um that was yeah again opening the door and.

B

For-Profit entities getting a tax credit, um and so I just uh I advise the time manager that I would.

B

You know bring this this forward to the committee uh for consideration again, it's a senate bill.

B

There's no hearing yet it we have time to kind of digest it. If we want maybe a more thorough.

B

Report back from our assessor um we can. We can get that if, if we'd like to kind of see what the.

B

Implications may be, I don't know what the kinds of numbers we have for for registered daycares here.

B

In the city, we probably don't have a lot five, okay, so five for profit is my understanding and uh is a.

A

um Is there a definition of a of a child care in you know? Is my neighbor used to do this.

A

Sweet old woman had four folk. You know it would take up to four like what is.

A

This meet the legal definition of a child care center. Is it a certain amount of kids.

B

E

Here to have any language on, like you know, on its face, would love to know. You know.

A

Love to be able to support people to you know, have the cost of child care selfishly lower.

A

um But I don't know, you know what the.

A

um I'm not sure a for-profit institution would pass on those savings, so the first sentence says.

B

May adopt an exemption for property tax purposes of property that is operated as a quote child day.

B

Care agency, as defined in rsa 170e, so it would be whatever that definition is. I guess which I.

B

Don't have in front of me, this is a bill that I've actually been having a lot of conversations about.

F

um With local women and the reason I've been doing, that is that it's women women have left the.

F

Workforce at such a huge rate because of covid and they haven't been able to return because of lack.

F

Of child care and it's very hard to find ways at the state level to incentivize child care, centers.

F

To hire more workers to have, they have troubles finding them because they can't pay them enough.

F

Money to get them in it's not a great model. Child care is not a money making model for child care.

F

Even for for-profit child care centers, it seems like it is apparent because you're paying an.

F

Unbelievable amount of money for that child care, but because of the ratios of teachers to children,.

F

You really you're not making the kind of money that you would anticipate in a child care center.

F

So we we talk about for-profit centers, we're not talking about them, making a lot of profit.

F

um And by rebating them like giving them rebates on their taxes, you're, essentially giving them.

F

The money back that they could then pay to recruit teachers, and so you get more child.

F

Care workers and you all of a sudden can have more classrooms and you have more child care.

F

I think that's that's the thinking here is that there's not another great way, because if you.

F

Incentivize on the front end, by giving bonuses and a lot of times, you lose workers a few months.

F

In so allowing these individual centers to make that decision on what is the best way.

F

To reinvest these funds to recruit, workers is the goal so have we noticed that the.

A

Has it been regionalized like the so we would be lowering the the property tax um here in.

A

Portsmouth is, uh would it be like in places where the property taxes lower have they found that.

A

There's more child care providers. I think that okay, so that that's a different kind of question.

F

um That is it's more about giving a rebate so that they suddenly have a little bit more money.

F

In their pocket to high workers, it's not that in places where the property taxes are lower.

F

um Their model is built differently, so it wasn't built based upon. Oh I'm going to get an incentive.

F

To all of a sudden hire more workers, this is supposed to be just an emergency cash of funds.

F

And then the city gets to decide. Even if this passes, we don't have to do it. It's about. It's.

F

Enabling legislation allowing us to decide whether or not I guess so not opposed to.

A

It I just I'm curious on like on having um like will this? Do we, it doesn't seem like it's going.

A

To create more child care centers, but allow maybe existing child care centers to expand.

F

Right or just hire more teachers, so so right now, a lot of them pre-pandemic they were paying around.

F

On average 12 dollars per hour for individuals that almost all have to have licensing and many.

F

Have college degrees yeah so at 12 an hour, so they haven't been able to retain those workers and in.

F

The current job climate- they can't recruit new ones, um so many of them have raised their their.

F

Rates to averages of 14 an hour is what we're seeing is the average, and I only know this because.

F

I do this on the side where I provide child care through the ymca through my other work and we've.

F

Had to raise pay rates to around 14 per hour, but that's unsustainable as a business model without.

F

Raising the rates on individuals as well, even if you're providing subsidized care so the end result.

F

Is that you can't hire as many workers, because your business model doesn't work anymore? You.

F

Can't raise rates beyond a certain level before you start losing subscribers for child care and.

F

You only have so many people if we're talking about returning um getting people to return.

F

To the workforce, there's a cost balance analysis there. So people aren't returning to the workforce.

F

If their cost of child care is more than their income, sure so not even not close to that after.

A

Tax, you know right exactly after taxes, yeah yeah, so so you're trying to give them the incentive.

F

To pay a little more and to do a little more recruitment without having to raise their rates.

E

One feature of the way this is drafted is it's just an exemption from the assessed value.

E

So the municipality could scale it to you know a percentage of the assessed.

E

Value as opposed to all or nothing, um our kids went to daycare on marcy street.

E

um At joan coffey's house- and I can't imagine that probably that house is probably worth a.

E

Million and a half dollars right now, and so you know this is dried up around the city from what.

E

It was to when, when we, when you were a kid or when my kids were little, I went to little.

A

Blessings and then the children's garden, but yes, this is, uh you know finding child care is.

A

um Incredibly difficult, it's a um and it's also uh you know finding uh folks that you know it's the.

A

It says here to build the you know strong children than fixed, broken men, so to speak, it's the first.

A

Five years of life, early childhood education, a lot of you know you see the the effects of uh society.

A

On you know just how unequal it is like on kids uh very quickly, so I guess my you know, um I'm I'm.

A

Supportive of this bill, I don't know how um how effective it's going to be in terms of the actual.

A

You know increasing somebody's uh doing it it might. um You know where I'm interested to see.

A

If it could incentivize more people, maybe doing it from uh you know, as child care is defined like you.

A

Have to be licensed in the the state, so I don't think this is going to do things like, for you know.

A

Maybe it helps where my daughter goes to the tree house or went you know at the tree house. Could.

A

Help that, in a marginal way, what I'd be interested to see is if this helps people that are deciding.

A

um To provide this service out of their home for child care activity, that could be a significant.

A

um You know and that's a win-win for for well, it's a cost to the city of portsmouth.

A

But also deliver something that you know. We want them to deliver. The definition.

B

Is broad, it's very broad, so it would encompass. You know quite quite a lot of.

B

Types of child care and there's also just to bounce off that there's also another.

G

um Bill this session that establishes a a fund to help grant child care establishments and workers.

G

More yeah more money, so I mean I don't think this is definitely going to help with the the larger.

A

And you know for-profit or the the larger and it might be for-profit because a individual, that's.

A

Providing child care in their home is not going to register as a recognized non-profit. In order to do.

A

That so for-profit likely has to stay in there for that, and I would be certainly happy to take.

A

As we do with the senior tax discount, the disabled veterans discount, bring it to the council and say.

A

You know we're going to incentivize those folks that want to provide child care in a recognized.

A

Way out of their home to be able to find income, you know help you know, pay their property tax. Also.

A

Lower their property tax and provide a service to the so that's where it probably helps more.

A

Than a you know, a larger institution that's existing and is struggling to to not that it.

A

Wouldn't I'm sure they'd like the tax relief, but hopefully this incentivizes people to to take this.

B

So this, um if this is supported, I think it weren't us looking back over the legislative positions.

B

And principles that we have and try to figure out where it might fit in in those principles.

B

um I am, are you struggling to find where we can shoot on this end? I've got to play like um it.

F

Increases local control yeah because it allows us to make the decision about the property taxes.

B

So it's because it's enabling yeah yeah yeah, it's just enabling legislation to.

F

Give more power back to that. It's a little city to make a decision.

A

That is one the old bucket of local control, um the.

A

Do you have any other thoughts on that jane? Well, I think that was one that was it that.

B

I could find yeah um so if this committee would like to register- and you know to support that or.

B

Or take a position, maybe maybe just take a vote to say we support this and then I can work with.

B

Writing testimony when it comes up and reaching back out to the city of lebanon.

B

To let them know that um who is it in the city of lebanon, sean sean yeah reached out.

B

And I I'd move that we support sb 221 as a legislative subcommittee. Second,.

A

All in favor uh any opposed all right and I'm happy to speak to it if at in concord, if.

F

We have testimony sounds good. You need me to and if you can't testify on the pillow attacks, I'd be.

E

Happy to drive, I think everybody wants to talk. um I don't need to talk the um so um I think the.

A

I'm always uh I'm I'm always happy for more people uh to testify on this uh than less. I'm also aware.

A

That um it's a weird thing uh being mayor: if I'm not testifying, they might view it in a different.

A

Way, but that's I think, especially around uh you know if we read through our testimony.

A

Before and make sure that we're hitting on different points, that's great, you know I was.

A

Thinking you know with the um you know, with the cannabis from a small business owner, you.

A

Know that, depending on what bill comes out of that, but um you know I think we can definitely.

A

Carpool up there and it would be impactful and meaningful to have more voices on there as long.

A

As we're not saying the same same thing, because then you know it's hearings, get pretty redundant.

B

February 1st, it's the start of my people's holiday. I can't be there yeah I couldn't do february, are.

A

There any other, there's other bills that we have that were tracking. There were just some um bills.

B

Of interest, uh the system may have brought up there's various bills on sort of evictions and.

B

What what others have to notify their their tenants and there's about four of them that.

B

uh Went tearing last week yep and there's um one of the the couple that I really touched.

G

On was uh hb44, which is something we've also touched on in land use, which is up zoning so on.

G

um Where a single house could be built, you could build up to four units, um then there's hb422, which.

G

Allows municipality municipalities to control rent increases by up to certain percentages.

G

um And then there's a there's, uh hb 95, which I don't have my notes on right now. So I can't.

G

Remember that up my head, um then there is hb311 which sets up funding from the state.

G

For wastewater treatment, allocation towards municipalities, so that may be something to.

G

Look into um then there's senate bill 138, which is it's in conjunction with another bill that.

G

I don't have listed, but it uh sets up a pfas um appropriation funding and grants to municipalities.

G

um And then one that I think would be really interesting for us to look at because we get.

G

A lot of requests or hb93 with authorized its municipalities to reduce speeds, seasonally.

G

hmm So I think that may be a potential because I know peter's gonna love, changing the signs.

G

Yeah well, like think about it in some of the areas that we have like the electric ones in.

G

Some of the areas, potentially that are more towards like when you're getting right off of.

G

A highway, you know things like that, so I know we get a lot of requests in in uh parking traffic and.

G

Safety and dpw gets a lot of requests, but again those are just. I think that morph I would effect.

G

As soon would affect like hampton and the ski mountain yeah, um but those are just a couple that.

A

um What is the is there qualifications on that? um I know that's coming up in.

A

uh In boston, I think it just hit committee yesterday, 422 yeah hit committee yesterday.

G

um So I don't have any in-depth notes on it right now. My ipad just died, so I have no words.

G

On it right now, so what would the okay, but it would be interesting to know if that's like.

A

Income qualifications- or you know, if it's just my understanding percentages, yeah hp 44, is just.

G

um Limiting the percentage there's also a couple that would allow tenants to break their lease with.

G

uh Income with rent increases there's another one that I don't necessarily think the town would has.

G

Merit to support, but is, I think, a really important bill that allows people to break their leases if.

G

They are victims of domestic violence, which I think is really important. That's a good one.

G

um Again, sorry, my ipad just died. I can get this list over to jane, but I think that's.

G

An important one to support, and then there is there's a lot of just tenant right bills.

G

That are going through. You know if you own a certain percentage of units. I don't know.

G

Exactly what it is, but larger companies are required, more advanced notice or rent increase.

G

um Just there's a couple house bills that are going through that are really kind.

G

Of protecting well, I mean hb95 yeah, that's! Okay! That's coming out of a new market, rep.

E

And that just oh ellen yeah caps, the amount that landlords can the percentage increase.

B

15. there's a houseboat 401. That's evictions based on the owner's intent to renovate you've.

B

Got to give people types of notices depending on the kind of property you are offer them comparable.

B

Dwellings and then um you know, if you permanently take it off the market, um then you have to pay a.

B

Penalty to the tenant that you got rid of yeah and then house bill 422 is a list at the registry for.

B

Rent charges for each unit for every landlord in the state uh house bill six. I'm sorry excuse me.

B

469 prohibits discrimination against a tenant from holding certain vouchers that are denying certain.

B

Vouchers, if the rents are within the range of what the vouchers um pay for and also meet a particular.

B

Type of federal standard for housing, there's house bill 567, which is um particular that's.

B

The one with the notice of rent in the type of property you have and how long you have to.

B

Give and if it's a fifteen percent increase, you have to give it six months notice of the rental.

B

Increase so there's a lot of a lot of tenant rights bills coming forward this session. Okay,.

A

Any other bills or things that we should be considering.

A

I'll just give a quick since uh I noticed there was some.

A

Senator shaheen put through a though there's a meeting of some of the mayors when it comes to.

A

Homelessness, I guess the things that I was surprised to find out in terms of you know, we.

A

Have you know around 100 beds in the city through crossroads house and then the auxiliary beds at.

A

Little or not little blessings operation blessing, and then we got some state funds.

A

For the warming shelters at crossroads and then some additional money through a.

A

Pilot program for finding more permanent, affordable house what I was surprised that.

A

That manchester doesn't even have twice the bets that that we do and yeah it's like 174.

A

um So it's a um there's, not a great solution so far to homelessness in the state. What it seems.

A

Like and that I think, that's probably you know nationally too, but um yeah cities are hesitant to.

A

Build more shelter beds because it at well lack of a better word. It attracts and becomes a magnet for.

A

More more homeless and conquered, for whatever reason did not. They do not accept state funds.

A

Because they don't want to list their shelter on the two-on-one, which is run by the united way. For.

A

For shelters, which is that was interesting, so I think there's you know getting upstream of this.

A

From a from a housing standpoint is, is, is critical, but there's going to be a certain percent and in.

A

Manchester they don't. I mean we have a homeless population in portsmouth. uh They they live. You.

A

Know out of sight, they live in the woods. um The police know um you know about them, uh but they.

A

They're, not camping, you know out in front of crossroads house. So there's a lot. That's.

A

There's a lot that uh goes is going into it. One of the things that came out of this was the meeting.

A

Was you know simply having more data and requiring cities uh to list what your residency is of this.

A

um You know and your residency isn't, you know the city of portsmouth when you're at crossroads house.

A

It's where you uh domicile before to try to give a sense of the the problem, because right now it it's.

A

Only it's only handled by the cities with homeless, shelters into the marroquin pointed out that the.

A

State prison in their county was simply driving about seven to nine people a week into their city.

A

Center and um and dropping them off and that's probably their best option without intervention.

A

For the state, but just one, I guess final uh finer point on this. The state has allocated.

A

Four million dollars uh to this uh this problem, um you know put that in context to operate uh the.

A

Crossroads house is around two million dollars a year, so it's a um it's a very uh tricky.

A

um Tough uh situation that has a you know a lot of um there's a lot of things that are going into.

A

It and when um and people choosing not to even be in shelters and and going to encampments, is.

A

um You know it's interesting, that the woman that uh that was in the paper uh for having the birth.

A

And also be reminded to dennis eckersley, you know was previously in concord before she moved down.

A

To to manchester, you know when they, you know were taking the policy of breaking up camps. You know.

A

They didn't do that in manchester, so it's a very complicated, I wouldn't say like um there was an.

A

Opportunity to sign on to a letter um I didn't mostly because I was sick the week, that it was.

A

Being drafted, but it was very, uh it seemed like a very political. You know, charged letter.

A

um With one that was also very focused on uh manchester, and I needed to know what you know, our.

A

What the status was in portsmouth- and you know you know. The last thing I wanted to do was sign.

A

On to a letter and then have you know, turn around and find out that, oh you know the million dollars.

A

That we did actually get for you know, increased uh warming, shelter, you know, capabilities would have.

A

Been kind of slapped over our heads importance for not knowing uh what's going on so there's a lot.

A

That's going on, I don't know if there's there's good solutions yet, but there is conversation and.

A

As the city manager of lebanon, sean did point out, um this cities are on the hook for uh this. When.

A

The hotels and that's the other thing, the hotels uh rental assistant program is set to end in.

A

April may and june so april for single families june for multi or for or single people or sing.

A

Single occupancy, you know um you know, but it's unlikely that those folks that are living in a.

A

Hotel are going to go move into a shelter. You know, after two years of living in a hotel, the.

A

Idea of bunking up with other folks in a shelter is probably not I, you know, that's not ideal. We do.

A

Have a requirement to fund that to fund this state obligation right now through the the emergency.

A

Relief, you know that's you know. Ellen has said that she's, the only one with an unlimited budget.

A

um You know, and so uh an old legislation like from like yep in the constitutional.

G

Legislation and this and the city of lebanon actually made an appropriation.

A

um In their budget to anticipate, you know something along those lines, but that's again.

A

um Rocky- and that was another point that was brought up, um was trying to get on the same.

A

Page on accounting level from this, because we have, I think about 18 folks that are living in.

A

The anchorage uh in right now but they're from stratford because stratford has you know a smart.

A

Idea to pay up front and in advance six months for hotel services, where rockingham county says.

A

We'll get back to you! So if you're, a hotelier you're, probably not super interested in taking.

A

Rockingham county's voucher in the future, when you can take stratford counties, you know now and.

A

Into the future, but not necessarily for this, but I want to update you because I know this.

A

Made it into the press, pheromone councilor cook- um I just wanted to highlight that um there are.

F

A lot more people that are homeless, that we don't realize here if you go through prescott park, late.

F

At night, you'll see people sleeping on benches even in the winter, and my husband has a pattern.

F

Of going on long walks through prescott park late at night- and you know so it's not just in the.

F

Woods, it's not just their cars, they're sleeping you know in our parks too, and the car situation.

F

Is is be, is increasing and we're starting to get complaints about it, but we're talking about.

F

Homeless people who have nowhere else to go so they're sleeping in their cars, so I think we we.

F

Need to be thinking seriously about how we find a way to address that to provide a better solution.

F

Sure, as individuals and on the you know, we've had, I know that we did get some um conversation on.

A

I think there are ordinances uh on the books right now, but um you know mike or deputy chief. uh Is it.

A

Assistant chief or deputy chief deputy chief mike mooney yep deputy, stated at the pts that there's.

A

Been no incidents and you know we can't do drugs. You know you can't have noise ordinances. You know.

A

We have laws that we can enforce. You know on uh these folks that choose to do this. I think where.

A

um It's difficult, it's probably in the um the south end because of the y'all live in.

A

Very tight quarters to one another trash trucks getting around. You know those are like there's a.

A

Movement of cars that you guys kind of figure out like okay, we can park here. We can't park here and.

A

um But I don't expect um this to. I don't know if there's anything that we need to do other than.

A

Enforce the things that we currently have right and I personally don't think no, the opening of.

G

As someone who has someone who's city, um you know sprinter van camps, around has done it around the.

G

Country there's there's, you know, I think that we have to make sure that we are not um creating laws.

G

And regulations for for made up scenarios, as you have said you know, deputy chief has said we have.

G

No problem in regards to that, so let's not yeah, I didn't want my comment to be misinterpreted. That's.

F

Not what I was suggesting I've heard from many people, so we find a better option for individuals.

F

Who have to sleep in their vehicles? Because I'm concerned about their access to restroom.

F

Facilities and shower facilities, and whether or not they have that kind of access and uh and.

F

I'm I'm not particularly concerned if they're necessarily sleeping in their vehicles, because.

F

I think that's better than them sleeping in the park or on the street if they don't have shelter.

F

I just I want to make sure that that we're kind of thinking ahead to how we can provide support.

A

And it'd be interesting for maybe a report back on the um or we can just talk to ellen around.

A

The any concerns we have financially from the um uh the the end of the emergency retinal relief.

A

Yeah would be good to know yeah all right. Okay, I think also just uh pts is going to be considering.

B

um Suggested statute relative to learning, camping on city, streets and property at.

B

The next meeting go so okay when's. The next meeting next meeting is thursday feb 2, 6, 30 p.m.

C

At the senior center we um we talked as a group about meeting rotating the at a time that more.

C

People might be able to attend, and one of the things we will be teeing up is a conversation.

C

About woodbury avenue improvements and we'll continue to talk about that, but this will come.

C

Up then, okay, all right uh way to motion to adjourn so moved. Second, all in favor all right. Thank you.