City of Portsmouth, New Hampshire Parking and Traffic Safety Committee, 5 Jan 2023

Previous Meeting Next Meeting

⏯

youtube image

►

From YouTube: 1.5.2023 Parking and Traffic Safety Committee

Description

1.5.2023 Parking and Traffic Safety Committee

A

Did you take the rule.

B

um We can all just say here, simplify it. I apologize marilyn mccoy here, steve.

B

Pesci here mark syracusa, here, harold white house, yeah erica. I got it yeah.

B

Please captain mike maloney here after our chief todd germaine. I'm excuse me.

B

Peter and ice, but the doors director here, senior manager, karen uh karen.

B

Conan here and chairman andrew bagley you're here wait my face red. Thank you.

C

So uh to the first meeting of the year, so we're gonna do the selection of the chair and voice.

C

Chair, I moved to um to propose a slate, a chairman being the councilor bagley and vice chair being.

D

Steve pesci, I would second that I mean yes, I moved it all nomination states how's that.

C

Well, let's just have some discussion first in case you're ready.

C

I think we instituted the vice chair position last year and I think it was helpful.

C

um To have backup for meetings that the chair can't make, so I support it. Yeah.

C

I guess I'll take a do. We need a roll call vote this one or let me just do it I'll get you right.

B

At this time, the ground person, unless someone wanted a roll couple- and I think voice- is okay.

E

It's good all those in favor all right, okay! um So now we're going to oh sorry, financial report.

F

Because yeah there we go, he's she's pulling it up.

B

Go ahead so we're pleased to report that, uh with uh 41 of the year gone by we're about.

B

53 of our budgetary revenue coming in so uh this is our uh slowest month of the year.

B

Coming on right now- and uh I think we'll see it start picking up in in march this year and.

B

I think we're going to do a little bit better than budget, which is what we're hoping for and.

B

We're about 10 below on expenses right now, so we're happy with where we're at.

B

Excellent yeah mary lou. Yes, uh at some point, can we get a a listing of all of the expenditures.

G

That come out of the transfer to parking fund. I think we've done this in the past. Just to review.

G

Of where that money goes through the parking fund, it often comes up when we have a request for.

G

Crosswalk or an rfp that the financial end of it comes in and I think it'd be.

G

Helpful for the community to know where those funds go to that's 71 percent.

C

um I think we have that information in the um the annual budget. However, it might be helpful.

C

If we had a presentation for the parking traffic and safety committee, because I believe the funds.

C

For say, a rapid flashing beacon come from cip allotments to this committee. The funds.

C

From parking, which, I believe last year resulted in a reduction of taxes for.

C

The medium household of 318 either go into improvements to the downtown parking area.

C

um Such as plowing stone, removal, trash pickup things like that, and then some of those funds go.

C

To the general fund as well, so, mr chairman, did 2.4 million dollars, go straight to the general fund.

D

That that helps offset taxes, an additional 1.8 go to services such as snowplow removal, garbage.

D

Collection, cleanup of downtown crossing guards, maintenance of of the the downtown area. These.

D

Items are identified in the budget annually uh and you know it is something that ben is more.

D

More than versed on being able to rattle off all the types of things that we we do.

D

um And you know if the if the chair in the committee would like, we could.

D

Do a brief presentation on that? um You know in advance of the budget process.

H

Now before I make a motion to accept the financial report as as presented, can somebody give me a.

H

Brief report on how we're coming along on a high hanover street uh parking garage I mean, are we.

H

Working safely, I just don't want to anybody. You know get hurt like it has another city.

D

So we're, as you know, it's a three-year project if you've walked by and looked into the base.

D

Basement floor you'll see all the um temporary supports in place. uh The garage there's been.

D

Zero injuries associated with the work to date uh knock on wood, um the the we have weekly meetings.

D

With the contractor to you know reinforce that we have an independent structural engineer that.

D

Comes to those meetings and reviews the the progress- and there have been to my knowledge.

D

No public complaints relative to the work yeah. So it's it's! You know it's not going as quickly as.

D

I would like, uh because it would be nice to have it done, but it's a three-year project and you can.

D

Only go so fast when you're doing renovations on a project of this size. Okay, thank you. A lot peter.

H

Yep, you know I'm worried about what's happening in other cities. Sure we we are. We are as well.

D

Yeah safety is, is what we lead with yeah. Thank you, yep uh steve, just a quick comment. I'm very.

I

Happy to see the uh ev charge, revenue running wellhead projections, so that's great to see.

G

I think my questions were answered, the regarding the 71 percent. I don't think.

G

We need a presentation prior to the budget. Okay, I can I'll send you the link to um the page yeah.

G

Yeah yeah for the general public to see where that 71 actually goes to all right all right. Okay, thank.

J

You I was just gonna say I feel like if we could just see the page from the right budget, I mean we.

J

Can look through the report, but I bet ben has that page memorized? Maybe you can just tell us.

J

To look on page 70., 575. yeah, maybe we can put it in the packet for next month. Okay, thank you.

H

Is there a relation to accept day? If I never, I think you were going to make one okay. Thank you.

H

Very much I moved there. We accepted financial report as presented. Second, all in favor, aye aye.

C

Any opposed all right so now we're going to move on to public comment.

C

um So typically, we limit the public comment session to 15 minutes, which is not normally.

C

An issue, um however, there's a lot of people in the room. I'm not sure how many are on zoom, so.

C

Perhaps peter you want to speak to it. Well, I I know there's some folks here for the.

D

Woodbury quarter traffic coming and I just want to say out front that we are aware of.

D

This uh it is in design and that we're not presenting the designs today that they will.

D

Be presented on the february meeting and we anticipate you know feedback from you all.

D

um There, the monies are authorized, they exist um and it is not something we have to go. Get approval.

D

For these monies are are in place, so I just wanted to clarify that. Mr chairman, if I could add, maybe.

E

The february meeting would be appropriate to be held in the evening so that we can capture as.

E

Many folks who would like to give comment and see the the presentation as possible. So if the, if the.

E

Committee, I know we've talked in the past about considering off hours or special times to meet.

E

And maybe february's meeting could be an evening meeting, perhaps a new franklin school I'll. Second.

C

That if that was a motion, add some motion. Okay and I, I would say new franklin school. If that.

C

Makes sense if we can do the audio visuals to people february 2nd, uh join us every second yeah.

H

What's the date on that second february, 2nd, that would be the thursday that we typically meet yeah.

D

So that was a motion in a second yeah 6 30.

K

Sure has got her hand out. Oh that my question was just: do we have a time? No, what is a typical.

J

Time, sorry, typically, we do 6 30. we'll confirm that. But let's let's hold on to that for now.

E

All those in favor all right any opposed.

C

And then um with that being said, so when we start the public comment, uh I.

C

Know there possibly are some people here to speak to.

C

Done that street? So if you are here to speak for something that's on the agenda, I would prefer that.

C

Those people get a chance to go first than people that are speaking to things that are not on the.

C

Agenda uh just in the interest of efficiency and fairness, so I'm going to open the public.

C

Comment and uh if you have anything that's on the current agenda, please feel forward to come forward.

C

L

I was kind of in hopes. You've got a couple of residents that actually will be partaking on.

L

Bartlett, but you do that after the live people, so I'm going to go first and do the best that I can.

L

um I had several phone calls met with several people concerned about a proposed roundabout.

L

That is going to be voted on by the committee tonight and that roundabout.

L

Has not really been discussed with the entire residents of that area. I seem to be living.

L

I guess a nightmare over and over again, this is something that happened during pevely hill road.

L

I don't know why that we're not meeting more in person covet for the most part. Yes, we should.

L

Still have restrictions but we're not having live people, um I'm interested to see that it says that.

L

The mini roundabout is presented by dpw and the residents, but it was not all residents actually.

L

I believe that at least three out of the four that will be impacted by this roundabout were.

L

Never partaking in anything. There was one that contacted me after she went and saw the last.

L

Meeting and now we're going to be voting on it today at park and traffic and safety, I've.

L

Got legitimate concerns when it comes to this. We dealt with this for many many many years on.

L

Pebble hill road until we come to a consensus with 100 of every resident that was on there, we.

L

Should be having meetings on this live in person that we can go and address their concerns? You are.

L

About to impact a neighborhood, that's there and you are about to impact one person in particular.

L

That had gotten a four-way stop sign put in with years and years of work and now you're about to.

L

Eliminate them and you're going to basically go and have an ongoing flow of traffic they're, not.

L

Going to be stopping anymore they're stopping same point, you've got neighborhoods on woodbury avenue.

L

Some that are in the audience, you had great concerns that were on banfield road for years.

L

About simply putting a stop sign in to calm that traffic and we implemented and done those things.

L

This committee, if it votes today, will actually be removing a very safe way for stop signs and.

L

A roundabout is simply to go in calm traffic. It's within a hundred feet of the start of a road I've.

L

Never seen or heard anything where a roundabout at the end of one road or the other, we should have.

L

Done this road differently, I know that it wasn't perfect. Peter knows that as far as unitil coming.

L

In and digging it up and everything, I don't think many of the residents there object anything and I.

L

Think they believe that you're, basically going to narrow the street and you're going to widen.

L

The sidewalks, this roundabout thing is something that has to be discussed further and then I'm.

L

Just going to give my two cents fleet street I'm very concerned when it comes to that with.

L

A with a 1 way going all the way through you're about to eliminate 17 parking spaces at 3 500, a.

L

Year, according to the city manager, that's almost sixty thousand dollars a year that will be giving.

L

Up in revenue that we so desperately need in uh desperate times. Thank you very much. Thank you.

F

A

I brought a few handouts, but I don't have enough, but we can pass them around and share good shares.

M

You can share yeah all right. My name is ryan baker, and I've lived in portsmouth.

M

For 20 plus years, I am here to fully support drafting an ordinance to eliminate overnight.

M

Camping on city, streets and portsmouth property, I've spoken to a few of you over the past few.

M

Months and I represent, you know quite a few people that have brought this up as an issue.

M

um As we all know, covet has changed a lot of things within our lives. One major change was.

M

The ability to work from home, which has led to the ability to work from basically anywhere using.

M

Tools like zoom over the past two years, there's been a huge increase in people living and working.

M

On the road in campers, vans, rvs, even mini school buses and cars, I want to be fully clear. I want to.

M

Be clear that I fully support people's choices to live and, however, they want. In fact it sounds.

M

Like a lot of fun to travel the country and work from these types of vehicles, I personally would.

M

Love to be able to do it, uh my dad actually has a sprinter van he drives down in the summer and.

M

He frequently stays at libby's libby's campground in york when he comes to visit. Needless to stay.

M

Portsmouth has seen a dramatic increase of people, camping sleeping in vehicles, especially in the.

M

Warmer months and our rules and laws need to be adjusted to reflect this new reality.

M

Most people that live the the van life use apps to tell each other where to go and where to stay. For.

M

Free and to use services such as public toilets, libraries, water, where to get water and to even.

M

Where to dump their sewage, one of the many apps is called. I overlander, which I've printed a copy for.

M

All of you to look at if you look at the first pages, the map of the seacoast and portsmouth is.

M

Literally, the only place you can camp overnight in a vehicle from newburyport to saco maine.

M

On the second page of the handout are places, people have tagged in.

M

Portsmouth to spend free nights, camping on our streets, pierce island, saunders,.

M

Fish market parrot ave to name a few right across from the middle school.

M

And on the last page, it goes into more detail and shows some of the comments from people who.

M

Have spent time sleeping on parrot ave right next to the middle school and I'd like you to read the.

M

First post, which which discusses somebody who was trying to park on paradab, which was really.

M

Busy that night, because there was actually a middle school dance right across the street,.

M

The net net is that we should not allow people to sleep in vehicles at all on city, streets or.

M

Portsmouth property overnight, let alone 72 hours. We are the only city within a very large radius.

M

That allows this to happen and it is going to catch up with us over time. Technology continues.

M

To change the way we live and work and if we don't do something to change our outdated parking.

M

Rules when it comes to camping and vehicles, we are going to regret it over the coming years.

M

um So if you have any questions, I would love to answer them. I I do think that over the past few.

M

Years people have started to see this increase. You know I walk my daughter down to soccer practice.

M

um You know down near the middle school at those fields and I counted 10 rvs this summer, camping.

M

Overnight, on that street alone, and with the the changes that we're making on pierce island to.

M

Put in the new bath house and to be able to use the pool you know, do we want to continue.

M

To allow people to park on pierce island and pay two dollars a day to go, use the new bath house and.

M

Stay there for 72 hours and then move their car to paradav and go back and forth yet again and.

M

Just continue to do it and maybe there's a place that people can stay where we can. You can actually.

M

Make so you just show the budget, maybe there's money to be made on rv parking in portsmouth, but.

M

It does it shouldn't be just wherever you want, and people shouldn't have to be stealthy about it. You.

M

Know parking in front of saunders fish market and taking up a spot for somebody to come and buy fish.

M

Or somebody who lives in the south end to live and work like it's just not fair to people, so I.

M

Think there's a better way to do it and I think, there's definitely a you know a way to help the.

M

Law enforcement to be able to take care of in the future great. Thank you, ryan appreciate it.

N

O

Good morning, elizabeth brighter property owner of 159 mcdonough street cabot street clinton street.

O

In bartlett street- and the reason I mentioned, that is because I am the queen of bartlett street.

O

I probably on a normal day, can go up and down that street about 12 times, I'm very familiar with every.

O

Little nook and cranny, where the polls are that block your view and stuff like that, I wanted to.

O

Talk to you about the mini roundabout, the mini roundabout idea comes from europe and much of the.

O

Anecdotal research forgets to mention that in most european countries there are enforcement cameras.

O

In most small towns, and that's where most of these mini roundabouts exists, these cameras take.

O

Pictures of offenders of their license plate and then they get nailed a ticket. Now these tickets.

O

Are pretty much it's your car, it's your driver's! It's your car, your plate and therefore it's your.

O

Responsibility, so you don't get out of them easily it's it's not like. It is here where you can come.

O

Up with some story sometimes so it was. I just watched the little um video, which was rather long.

O

Of the meeting which I missed, I'm sorry I tried to go to all of them, but sometimes there's a conflict.

O

And what I understood, the neighborhood people who were there to say was that they were interested in.

O

A pilot program for the roundabout, but then it kind of um developed into a conversation about.

O

Drainage and that there was some urgency- and it's we've been looking at this for about two years.

O

If I remember correctly, but it sounded like a lot of people, preferred stop signs, but something that.

O

Worked now it's my experience, I'm having driven down there many times is that there are people who.

O

Blow through that stuff, well, they do a california stop. um So when I stop a real stop, because I have.

O

Been stopped there for doing a california stop, I have to admit when I do a full stop. The people.

O

Behind me act like oh, my god, what did you do, but I do it every time because it's the right.

O

Thing to do not everybody drives that way, so my thought on this would be. um It would be easier to.

O

Do a pilot program, which probably could happen now similar to what happened on by white heron.

O

So one of the things they talked about was they show splitters on the mini roundabout. So I found.

O

That the splitter on woodbury ave, that's almost to rite aid up. There actually does slow cars down. I.

O

I'm trying to be 100 sure, but I think it does have bump outs on both sides and then the splitter and.

O

The vehicle, but it really pinches the traffic and I do see they slow down there, but then they.

O

Speed up once they get past it, but for that moment they do slow down. So I would like to suggest that.

O

Right off the bat, how about doing a pilot program.

O

Where their pilot program involves, if it could be done and the fire department would know that, would.

O

Involve having bump outs on the left and right side of all four corners and a and a splitter all.

O

Made out of bollards for a period of three to four months, which would be the winter when we don't.

O

Have any tourists who who have all kinds of other issues that go on when they come through there.

O

um The issue I have about the mini roundabout is that um right now the biggest complaint.

O

For people is people coming out of thornton street because everybody's going left, they.

O

Do a california stop, nobody gets to cross the street. Nobody gets to come out of there.

O

um And if people aren't required to come to some kind of stop or slow down, they are not.

O

Going to do it and what's going to happen in my opinion, is people are going to come down bartlett.

O

Street they're going to get to the circle they're just going to go around it and nobody is going to.

O

Stop for any of the other intersections, so the cars that have the most cars they're going to.

O

Be going back and back and back and we see that at the route 4 thing it is much bigger, it was.

O

Made bigger to be able to compensate for it was supposed to be made bigger for the dot, so that.

O

People on the side streets could get in coming from a side street. I can tell you you can't.

O

Get in during any kind of high volume town, so I believe that during high volumes, when people are.

O

Trying to get to work, they will not be able to get through that circle if they live on a side street.

O

So I feel strongly that it sounded like a lot of people wanted to keep the stop signs. I think.

O

That pinching the traffic there as a pilot would be a way to see what happens when that.

O

Happens, do people actually slow down and stop there a little better do they at least hesitate.

O

Before they just drive right through before trying to do the um a pilot program for the.

O

Mini roundabout, which sounded like it would be a lot more difficult to do. That's my thing. Thank you.

O

Very much, thank you liz. um Are there any people in the room that are to speak to stuff on the agenda.

C

P

From 160 bartlett street I own, um I own a house, I moved there in 2007 and I want to say that in.

P

The last few months I have met with neighbors from my street and some maybe from a block away.

P

To discuss the new project, the new redesign, so we have gone door to door. We created a facebook page.

P

Which is open only to resident of by that street, it's just easier to manage, and it's really for our.

P

Street, like mr beck said mansion it's for the people who live on the street, so we have that.

P

We also send emails and we talk to people on the street. I um I notice, I know a lot more neighbors.

P

In the since we started this than I've lived there 15 years, so that's that's embarrassing. Actually,.

P

um I I sold my car. My husband has a car, but I sold my car two years ago, so I walk and I ride my.

P

Bike mainly even in enter, and actually you need to cover my bike. It's just not um it. You know. That's.

P

Another discussion anyway, um I'm in favor of all the traffic calming measures um for bartlett.

P

Street and the project that was presented by the engineers um seemed great to me as a resident of.

P

The portsmouth- and I want to say thank you for that. Thank you for listening to us. We had several.

P

Meetings, we did not hide our meetings and you had a meeting at the dpw a few weeks ago, so I think.

P

We could all give input. Personally, I was born and raised in france, and I moved here when I was 20.

P

I go to france at least two or three times a year, I'm very familiar with roundabouts. I've never seen.

P

The cameras, but maybe it's some in bigger cities, there are fewer conflict points at roundabouts.

P

Vehicles have to slow down and if you're not sure how to go about around about, then you.

P

Slow down right, that's the point, and so right now what we see um with the four-way stops. We don't.

P

Have those in france by the way it would be like who's going? What where we would get out of the car.

P

And fight so that wouldn't work so, but with the four-way stop right now we see a lot of people.

P

Rolling through the subside not even stopping and it just it's not safe one of our neighbors.

P

um Who lives right at this intersection um was uh rare. I think his car was totaled actually.

P

um Some someone driving too fast so really we're thinking about safety for the people.

P

Who are driving for the pedestrian? The people who live right at this intersection or not too far,.

P

um So for me, I think the roundabout is really something that it's unknown to a lot of people.

P

But it's worth trying, I think we should um I personally, I would go ahead and do it. It.

P

Would improve the traffic flow in new hampshire? According to the new hampshire department of.

P

Transportation we have over 40 of those they might be big, they might be smaller. This is a.

P

Mini one there's not going to be a tree or a sculpture in the middle, it's going to be flat.

P

It's going to be easy for trucks, although we don't want trucks but buses or we're going to.

P

Make it accessible to everyone, it's not going to prevent an ambulance or a police car to go.

P

Through so we just need to get used to it, and I do think it is a way to slow the traffic down, but not.

P

um Prevent it um and, and the whole point is, is right: now our street is really just.

P

A thruway and that's fine. I understand people need to go from the highway to.

P

Downtown but it's also a place where their kids walk into school, walking to the park.

P

um We walk to the grocery store, so it would be nice to have this in mind, and so um I invite.

P

Anyone to come talk to me at the end. If you live on bartlett street and you haven't heard.

P

From like this, this project going on or you want to participate more or I'm sorry that we didn't.

P

Make it obvious enough, and I'm happy to include you in our emails, I'm also supporting any possible.

P

Traffic calming measures on dennett street, it's in the agenda today and finally for fleet street.

P

um As a pedestrian in my town, when I go to a bank or the stores downtown, I um I want to be safe, so I.

P

Would really like a design that prioritize safety for all and I'm a little concerned about this wide.

P

Travel lane the um that's proposed in the most popular project, but anyway thank you. I'm sorry.

P

I took so long, but I'm hoping we can continue the discussion. Thank you. Thank you. Foreign.

Q

My name is jim swisher. I live at 77 hanover street which, for those who don't know the hilton garden.

Q

Inn the south end of it is a condominium and we happen to live on the corner, overlooking fleet.

Q

Street so the future of fleet street, especially the beauty of it, is important to us in particular,.

Q

uh According to the survey which uh completed last year, as we all know, the one way seems to have.

Q

Been the uh the consensus of those surveyed, one thing that we see and I'm sure the uh engineers.

Q

uh With parking see, it also is that there are trucks that deliver both groceries to the to.

Q

um Restaurants, that are in that area and then there are also trucks that stop and by the way.

Q

They drive up onto our sidewalk and have crushed it quite effectively at the shared office, space.

Q

Across the street, I think it's 333 fleet street blocking traffic, even as it is two-way. If we.

Q

Restrict it down to one way: we have that much more of a problem early morning isn't a problem.

Q

When there isn't much traffic blocked by the uh by the uh the garbage trucks, but now having said that,.

Q

I personally would love it to be a tree lined wide sidewalk. It would look best from from my.

Q

Standpoint but I can see that a factor might not have been completely considered by those surveyed.

Q

That there are trucks that block the road and if it's just a one-way and wide sidewalks, there's.

Q

No way of getting around that and the fire department might be concerned with that too.

Q

R

Good morning I'm kyle engel 24 honking street and just want to.

R

Voice my opinion about the overnight parking and rv parking in the city.

R

I think that it's time, uh like ryan alluded to that there needs to be.

R

Some updating of the policy in the city um in the warmer weather on any given.

R

Night there's rvs parked uh in some of our neighborhoods uh livermore street.

R

um Down along the fish market, like has been noted along mechanic street, in addition to using city.

R

Services, some of these rvs have left trash behind. I think that it's a security issue, a safety issue.

R

The situation is not going to get any better without addressing it in some way. I think.

R

Again, like ryan alluded to other communities, have addressed it and there's a reason for that.

R

um And I think that maybe portsmouth should look at some of these reasons.

R

And some of the ways that it had been addressed, so thank you. Thank you.

S

Hi there, my name is katie miller and I live in the south end and I'm also here to support the.

S

Ordinance for restricting overnight camping, I walk our neighborhood daily and I have seen five six.

S

Seven campers in the stretch of paradav, my concern is it's by a middle school and people who are.

S

Parking go there to leave their vehicle to go to work, to go downtown even to go to their apartments.

S

But somebody was camping, there is potentially in their camper. We have children coming and going.

S

From a middle school, we don't know what's going on in those campers um places that allow camping.

S

Often require some sort of registration, so you know who's there. Nothing of that sort to the best.

S

My knowledge is happening in portsmouth, so it's a scary thing from personally. From my perspective,.

S

um And I can also from my house, see campers on pierce island and I know this community has worked.

S

So hard to make pierce island a community place they've been working hard to eliminate any kind.

S

Of illegal activities going on there, they've really really tried to patrol it. You know to.

S

See the campers getting ready to leave tossing the trash out, I think around halloween time they.

S

Decorated some pumpkins and then they just left them there pretty. But that's not that wasn't the.

S

Intent, so I really think that this needs to be addressed by our town. Thank you great. Thank you.

C

T

170 mechanic street and I won't go through all the the folks did about the uh rv and overnight.

T

And just hoping to that, we can find some way to have that maybe find another location in town.

T

um That folks could pay to camp overnight like we do in the boating world, because there's no.

T

Place I sent a note to peter rice back some time ago, just finding out who to be able to.

T

Talk to about this, because I I walk a lot and I see it in the last three years we've seen.

T

Huge increase in overnight much like everybody has said, and one of the issues that brought.

T

Sort of I focused on at one point was coming down paradab in the morning and happened to smell this.

T

um Smell that was obviously a head tank, which we call in the boating world, the head tank, but.

T

A you know a black water tank and an rv. I guess it is that was down at peridot right near a drain.

T

That obviously was dumped in the street can't say it was that person that was there who knows, but.

T

You know it it's becoming an issue, that's all, and it's just concerning and in my world or our.

T

World we do a lot of boating and there is no place that you can go, whether it's municipal or private,.

T

From northeast harbor to key west florida, and you have to pay whether you're going into lunch.

T

In town, at a municipal, marina, whether it's overnight, you you pay, you pay for it. So maybe.

T

Maybe there's an area somewhere in portsmouth that could be designated as a campground and.

T

For rvs and that way, there's a spot to go to as opposed to just picking any random neighborhood.

T

Anyways I could go on and on, but I just and the pictures I have pictures galore of.

T

Different ones that I've seen so if anybody wants on this I've got maybe a hundred of.

T

Them so uh hopefully we can do something about it. Great. Thank you appreciate it.

U

Howdy, uh my name is kenneth ferreira, I'm a woodbury resident. I'm not going to talk about that.

U

um But I'm here kind of voice, support for any major or minor traffic calming in barnett and.

U

Then it um as well as uh just comment on fleet uh and just voice uh support for increasing the.

U

The pedestrian, um the pedestrian walkways uh and my concern as a designer of myself and.

U

Is that we we need to look at a little bit more on those maintaining continuous.

U

Sidewalks and and and just visibility and slowing down people through those streets.

U

um On all three um and uh yeah, that's it great. Thank you. Thank you.

V

Good morning I'm dan freund 37 prospect street. I regretfully wasn't able to attend the last.

V

Meeting on november 3rd, I'm here to express my concern over the exit ramp at maplewood.

V

And prospect street for several reasons, one as was stated in the meeting last week. There is.

V

Not ample time when someone is coming around that corner at 20 30 miles an hour which I.

V

See frequently uh to stop and to the dismay of my neighbor at number nine prospect street who.

V

Was hit just two years ago was found to be at fault, because there was no proof that uh that.

V

The individual that struck him ran that stop sign, but, as was attested, it is common knowledge that.

V

People round that that turn at excessive speeds, that's my uh my main concern and then my plead.

V

Is especially for emergency vehicles, and I've expressed this directly on several accounts.

V

Whenever I have the opportunity, especially with ambulances coming through that intersection, just.

V

Last night this hasn't been a problem for a while, since I first addressed it several years ago, but.

V

Just last night, a ambulance coming through that intersection, rounded without sounding an audible.

V

Signal, and so I would like to see codified into some manual, some training- that there is a policy.

V

That emergency vehicles rounding that corner sound. It make an audible signal to warn people exiting.

V

Prospect street that there is an emergency vehicle coming and, lastly, I'd like to see some stepped.

V

Up uh enforcement at that turn several years ago, when cover carlton born, was still on the.

V

Road he would sit on the exit ramp and catch people that were turning left. When that turn.

V

Was not a legal turn and I would like to just see some enforcement. I would like to see that.

V

Policy codified, so that that is so that emergency vehicles that are on response don't come through.

V

That intersection, without making an audible signal warning traffic. Thank you. Thank you.

C

Anybody in the room with agenda items go to zoom, so if you're on zoom- and you want.

C

To speak to something on the agenda now would be a great time to raise your hand.

F

First, one up there: okay.

F

Okay, william, go ahead.

F

Good morning can't hear me: yes, thanks keith, um my name is bill davis. I live at 339, bartlett.

W

Street, which is the last house on bartlett before the intersection with thornton, and I have three.

W

Breed points to make this morning number one: the stop signs that exist there now are not affected.

W

um Pretty much in any way number two: the truck prohibition that was implemented after the opening.

W

Of kate street is consistently disregarded uh and thirdly and lastly, in regards to traffic.

W

Coming and I've I'm part of the neighborhood group that um was referred to earlier by anne.

W

Full blue um we've been working on this for quite a while. I would ask why why aren't we.

W

Trusting our city professionals that are making the recommendations for how to manage the solution.

W

Not looking for answers for that question, just they've made some recommendations. I I trust them.

W

They're professionals and I'd recommend that we go with uh at least adhere to what they're suggesting.

W

Thank you very much great. Thank you william or bill uh andrew cahill.

F

Go ahead andrew good morning, can you hear me? Yes, we can. Thank you very much for your time. um My.

N

Name is drew cahill andrew cahill. I live at uh 276 dennis street with my wife and our five-year-old.

N

Daughter, I just like to speak briefly to the dentist. The demonstrate speeding issue.

N

um We moved here a few years ago and even though the speed limits posted 20 miles an hour, we've.

N

Noticed regularly cars travel through here, going 30 35 plus miles an hour. So we've spoken with.

N

Several neighbors and everyone sees the same thing- has the same concern um just briefly. The.

N

Way, the dentistry is laid out, there's a sidewalk on one side for those who don't know, and there is.

N

No shoulder really at all between the sidewalk and the road. um So since that the road was repaved, the.

N

um The actual height of the sidewalk and many spots is only a few inches around.

N

The road itself, so you know we see people come flying through here. The neighbors neighborhoods.

N

Saturated with children, new franklin schools right there and uh denton street is the street that.

N

um Everyone has to use coming from one side of the neighborhood and through the school to walk there.

N

The um I would say that the speeding is especially true during commuter hours and then we've noticed.

N

That we noticed it in the summer during the touristy season dentistry. It's obviously a.

N

Prime cut through between the major highways in downtown and will be even worse off with all the.

N

Development happening in downtown, particularly in the north end of town. This is fine, of course,.

N

It's a street people can drive on it. That's that's the whole point, but it's it's uh makes it unsafe.

N

In terms of when folks are going above, the speed limit without um having any shoulder there on the.

N

Road and just having the sidewalk and many small children walking around really anything. There's.

N

No room for error at all on the side of the road, so a driver looking at their cell phone in.

N

You know a child taking one step off the sidewalk. That's why the speed limit is 20.

N

Miles an hour and not 30 35 miles an hour because it would give the driver just a nanosecond more.

N

Opportunity to react, and without that about compliance with the speed limit.

N

You know: there's risk of death really or serious injuries, so.

N

Just in terms of the road itself, again, there's a blind spot when drivers are coming down, bennett.

N

From woodbury they leave bark at the stop sign at birken. That's the last stops I'm coming into.

N

Town, there's no other stop sign, there's no speed boat, nothing else between burkett and maplewood.

N

So that stretch really becomes like a quarter mile speedway and when drivers are coming to the point.

N

At thornton and then they come up over a hillcrest and they can't see up over the hillcrest when they.

N

When they get up over thornton until they're there, and then we actually live a few houses.

N

um From the hillcrest- and I I cannot tell you how many times I've been doing, yard work in the front.

N

Yard heading out for a walk with my daughter or bike ride and I've seen something come up.

N

Over that hill in 35 40 miles an hour- um and you know we have to- we have to be extremely vigilant.

N

Because that person is going to have no time to react at all, if someone is in the road, so.

N

um You know again, I know the city did a brief speed study in this area that I saw a copy of.

N

Pennies in space hearing, I believe one of my neighbors zach jenkins feedback to the study.

N

Last night and this morning I would urge the community to review those comments from him.

N

In detail, I mean at the end of the dates I speak study study, isn't the end all be all it's just you.

N

Know part of the analysis, but looking at you know the way where zach jenkins is interpreting the.

N

Map on the street study would seem to me that the speed setting supports traffic common.

N

If there's an alternative way to read that, but that's what it appears to be.

N

To me that that said, it's um it's just one piece of the problem that one piece of the.

N

Analysis, I can tell you from like a real. um You know: real life bystander perspective.

N

um This is a serious issue. The city has a chance to fix. You know a list of 10 to fix the problem.

N

With a potentially a stop sign at devon in thornton with some speed, bumps or speed tables,.

N

um Common sense, really it's a chance to fix a problem before something unfixable happens.

N

So we'd appreciate the attention to the issue that, like I said about the several neighbors who.

N

um All feel the same way so with that. uh Thank you all for your time. Your continued.

N

Service to the community, and we appreciate the attention to the machine. Thank you. Thank you. Drew.

F

Okay, next is teresa hill.

F

F

Go ahead, teresa, are you there? Yes, we can hear you there. We go.

E

um I apologize for not being there in person um not feeling well.

X

My name is teresa hill, I'm at 340 thornton street, which is at the intersection with bartlett.

X

um I am very excited about the traffic calming measures all along the length of bartlett. I think.

X

um The folks, particularly on lower bartlett, got the crossings, moved and sidewalks are going to.

X

Be narrowed and hopefully we'll be adding some more trees. But I have to say that I'm really.

X

Not a fan of the roundabout [music] almost 30 years ago and when I moved in there were.

X

No stop signs on bartlett and I bought the house a historic house in the historic neighborhood on.

X

A very busy street had a very busy intersection. I knew that when I bought it, um I don't think I.

X

Would buy this house if I had the roundabout in its front door before we had the stop signs? The.

X

Name of the game was the 95 people who go through the intersection. Come up the hill on bartlett.

X

Most of these are local people who [music] are avoiding the traffic circle. Frankly, and that's.

X

Not going to change time, the game was to see how quickly you could go through the intersection.

X

And um that included trucks at the time and cars and my neighbor, uh the beaches across the street.

X

Support very hard to get the four-way stop put in, so the cars would stop running into our houses.

X

Particularly his he has a guard rail in front of his house now.

X

Because of this, when the stop signs were put in.

X

Actually, the intersection got a little louder because people were slowing down and.

X

Then speeding up you take calm the traffic, our history, neighborhood, is littered with.

X

Four-Way stops, and I know people have tried to tell me over and over that.

X

Our intersection does not merit a four-way stop because of the traffic volume, but again there are.

X

Four way stones, all throughout the neighborhood on dennis important and they do calm the traffic.

X

There's always going to be somebody who's not going to stop or who's going to roll.

X

But my biggest problem with the roundabout or even the raised cable design.

X

Is that the stop signs will be removed.

X

Please don't take our stop signs away.

X

But the around about who's not appropriate for this neighborhood.

X

It is a historically that most of the houses were built more than 100 years.

X

Ago and although this is a busy through stream, it is part of this neighborhood.

C

Thank you thank you teresa, and I hope you feel better.

F

Okay, next is uh jonathan sandberg.

F

G

Actually has a spice there we go. Yes, we can all right great good morning, my name.

Y

Is jonathan sandberg I live at 160 bar of the street. uh Listen I'm not an expert.

Y

um What I want for my suite is what safest and um if you do, some research, if you, google,.

Y

uh Advantages of roundabout over four-way stock you'll find there's incredible amount.

Y

Of research that shows that roundabouts are much safer, they reduce the number.

Y

Of traffic incidents, as well as the severity of traffic is in, and if that's what the data shows.

Y

Then that's probably the way to go the reason why they're suggested that they're they're more.

Y

Successful from the poor race stops is that every all the traffic going in one direction reduces the.

Y

Opportunity for head-on collisions, which are the most dangerous kinds of collisions. um I I know.

Y

That, right now, what we have is not successful. um The police have um have said that is one of.

Y

The most police intersections in the city, there is often a cruiser parked uh right there at the.

Y

Eden and not right rather sorry authority and uh that's not you know if they're putting that.

Y

Kind of resources into it, it means that the design before we stop there's not a lot of compliance and.

Y

um So I really think the important thing to do is to listen to some evidence. Listen.

Y

To our experts also look at other examples in europe, where I travel quite frequently before.

Y

We stops don't exist, everything is either a mini. Roundabout life is being proposed.

Y

Four is um when one way has priority, but quarterly stops. Don't exist. It's an anomaly.

Y

In the world, and a lot of states are eliminating them now um is as it's as they're shown to be an.

Y

Effective and unsafe, and so um kind of the only caveat I have is at the presentation that we had.

Y

Last month that we're competing proposals, one for a raised, uh stop rather a raised.

Y

Intersection the one for a uh a roundabout and I really couldn't find any evidence. I was really.

Y

Searching I was hoping that there were studies existed that compared those two options, and I.

Y

Couldn't find any, and so if, if there's evidence that shows that uh a raised intersection reduces.

Y

um Traffic conflicts more than a roundabout student, then that's what I would be in favor of.

A

I don't um you know, so that's that's what I have to say. I think we have to listen to our experts.

Y

We have to look at evidence and that's how we make the decision not uh based on uh feelings.

Y

And and um sentimentality over the fact that that we're we're difficult, we have a hard time.

Y

Changing things just because we don't have any or I don't think we have any mini roundabouts.

Y

Doesn't mean we shouldn't be open to them, and so uh we have to broaden our horizons and be.

Y

Open-Minded and do what is safest? Okay! Thank you. Thank you. Jonathan okay. uh Next is thomas gross.

Z

I'm a gross, can you hear me all right? Yes, thank you very much for allowing me a couple of seconds.

Z

I live on 295, dennis street across from mr cahill, and we have about eight neighbors here who have.

Z

Agreed that their speed is a problem here. uh One thing that mr I'm adding just mr cahill's comments.

Z

Because a couple of things he didn't realize is in the last five years we've had many accidents.

Z

Right here at this corner of dennis street and thornton we've had one dog who's killed. We had.

Z

One woman who was getting a baby out of a car and another car came by over the top of the hill and.

Z

Ripped off her door, while she was reaching him to get the baby out. Another person of our neighbors.

Z

Was backing out of the driveway another car coming over the top of that small hill, like.

Z

Down the street, if you notice from the map it's a hill and hunter's hill, but there's a slight.

Z

uh Turn to the right, which doesn't seem much on the map. But if you realize, if you come out here.

Z

Actually, just drive back and forth a couple times, you realize there's a huge blind spot, so we had.

Z

Somebody else also backing out of their driveway slowly was getting was hit by a car coming over.

Z

uh Coming east on kenneth, uh coming from the bartlett area coming over the top, you know so.

Z

We all agree that the speed is a problem and uh we would like you all to address it, because we've.

Z

Already demonstrated that it really is unsafe and the person who's the dog was was going too fast. He.

Z

Was very apologetic, he stopped. He was very, very kind about it. There was another incident where.

Z

Somebody had a car hit my car and then took off, and uh so I had to fix that upon a timely.

Z

So I really wanted and I'm sorry for being salute to people sometimes, but I'm very emotional.

C

Thank you, tom uh see, judy miller, [applause].

AA

Morning, 97 hanover street um I'd like to address the fleet street reconstruction project.

AA

I am in favor of wider sidewalks, um but I'd also like to.

AA

um Mention something that I've mentioned before and hopefully the utility lines can be buried.

AA

um With with the um with the point made earlier by my neighbor jim swisher, about uh delivery trucks,.

AA

um In in this area, we have the legends, shalimar, 110, grill row, 34, the green.

AA

Room, the juicery and the wilder um I'm wondering if um looking at this whole.

AA

Fleet street reconstruction project, if a loading zone could be created for certain.

AA

Hours of the morning, and perhaps that could be in front of the shalimar and the legends.

AA

um These trucks need some place to go, and uh currently they go anywhere that they can so.

AA

um Perhaps the city can think about a loading zone uh for part of the day. Thank you very much.

C

Thank you judy. That's all um so I guess that's everyone on.

C

Zoom so now people with mr chairman martin ryan, showed up. He wanted to.

C

Thank you, peter martin ride, 221 woodbury avenue.

AB

um We've been working with peter and peter's staff and his recommendation of the roundabout.

AB

Is something we accept and support? I say I'm sorry. I have to caveat that. I did not recommend.

D

The roundabouts at the meeting, the question was asked, and I said that was not my recommendation.

A

Not that I don't think it'd be perfectly fine, but I just want to make sure that that's clear, okay.

AB

We find the roundabout a very acceptable solution. I think anything that is proposed.

AB

Would be a much needed improvement, but I do feel that uh you know.

AB

We've all heard the horror stories uh of accidents and hitting houses and things.

AB

um We feel like the roundabout is a solution that could be tried and if it, it works better than.

AB

Other solutions that it could be adopted and made permanent, if not it could be reversed without too.

AB

Much a headache, so I support the roundabout. I know if I support it. Peter I'll, execute it properly and.

AB

There are other people in our neighborhood that uh feel the same way. Thank you. Thank you. Martin.

C

And now I'll open up to people that have non-agenda items, and I thank you for your patience.

AC

Good morning my name is lenore weiss bronson. I live at 828 woodbury avenue, which is the corner.

AC

Of farm lane across from corpus christi, I'm here to first of all, to thank you for those.

AC

Of you, who are instrumental in addressing our needs on woodbury residential woodbury avenue,.

AC

Which is about a mile long with no requirements to stop or slow down? Well, basically, to stop and.

AC

Thank you for thinking in terms of a design to address these issues. I just like to really.

AC

Emphasize in the neighbor, I speak for a lot of our neighbors that it's important that it's.

AC

Approached the designers approach from a sort of um systemic viewpoint, because we have so.

AC

Many really important junctures throughout. We have 23 accesses and egresses on that stretch.

AC

Of woodbury so we'd we also have the school, of course. So there are a lot of things to consider.

AC

Almost at each access and egress- but I know that you'll look into that for the design. I just hope.

AC

That you do include the people who've lived there for for decades, especially for everybody.

AC

Actually, there has been, there have been so many accidents near accidents that involved bodily.

AC

Harm uh one woman who died after she was hit in the crosswalk and pets the other day, as you.

AC

Know or not long ago, with someone on woodbury had their whole front of their house was driven into.

AC

um And their front lawn now has to have they had to install a stone wall. I fortunately have.

AC

A stone wall because it's been hit before and if I hadn't, I probably would have had someone.

AC

In my living room, uh the stop sign at farm lane, um which is not a four-way, stop just that the.

AC

T there, the stop sign farm line has been taken out twice by a car speeding from woodbury into.

AC

Farm lane, the last time was christmas eve a year ago, so um things that I'd like to think in terms.

AC

Of when, when you could come up with a design, I think in terms of what you've done in the past.

AC

With stop signs and possibly tables speed tables, for example, on lincoln, there are seven four-way.

AC

Stops with a lot of signage, we don't have signage that shows that school children may be crossing or.

AC

That a bus school bus is stopping. We don't have any of that in that kind of indication. So you.

AC

Have seven four-way stops with a lot of signage on lincoln and I'm not saying you shouldn't, but.

AC

I understand that we are in a different part of town, but I really think that's something that.

AC

You could be considered for us, not necessarily seven. We suggested in our proposal about four.

AC

um Then also on banfield road we've been told that we don't uh warrant about stop signs in.

AC

The past and on by enfield road we have t-stops with flashing or blinking, stop signs. I suppose.

AC

They're necessary but they're much more necessary on woodbury, and there are other details that we.

AC

Could go into. I did just really quickly if I may want to play a message that I had on my.

AC

Voicemail- and I got permission- I I was told that a voicemail is public property, so to speak in 2015.

AC

um Actually, I have two of them, one I'll only play one, but in 2015 I did receive a call.

AC

After coming to this committee uh from then member here, uh ken smith, regarding um the.

AC

Traffic signs, because we've been told over the years that we didn't you know our neighborhood.

AC

Didn't warrant them so if I hope this works and if it doesn't, I can send you the transcript.

AC

This is not related.

AD

To tell me, uh you know what the time schedule is just didn't have that I will give you a form hope.

E

All as well, okay, okay, um and so I just want to say that was uh seven years ago and we've been really.

AC

Patient we had, I also had a message from brad lown saying we will get back to you. We have um you know.

AC

We're considering making changes to woodbury and so forth, and that was 2013.. They were great to.

AC

Work with us- and I know they meant well, but this is, I mean, we've really been pretty patient. I'd, say.

AC

um So I was also wondering um if we could, in preparation for the design, have a traffic value.

AC

A volume count on what residential woodbury um the last one was done in 1998, and the number of.

AC

Weekly uh vehicle uh passes passages, if you don't want to call them um on the residential part of.

AC

Woodbury that mile was uh in a week 57 000, plus we have school kids walking. We have people walking.

AC

With their dogs, I actually sometimes avoid working in my front yard, because I've seen.

AC

So many accidents or near accidents, for example, a neighbor pushing his daughter across the crosswalk.

AC

um And in a in a with his dog in a a baby, you know in a stroller and a car came up from 95 because it.

AC

Isn't inclined they don't see that crosswalk and there's no signage right at the crosswalk and he.

AC

Came within this far of hitting them, I and of course it traumatized them and me too so that.

AC

That's a common common situation. We would also be interested in the neighborhood to know, and I.

AC

Know I approached peter on this and you did give me instructions about how to get it, but I'm not.

AC

Quite sure how we could get a um the procedures that were followed to close echo avenue. I know.

AC

There was, I called the state about that, they said we don't deal with city streets and I, but I know.

AC

That the state was involved in closing echo, so I don't know the details, but if we could have that.

AC

um Sort of maybe a summary of what was done or the procedures that were followed to close.

AC

Echo avenue because the traffic that would have gone up, echo is obviously going up farm.

AC

Lane, with all of the traffic from the car dealerships to and from and fishing.

AC

Gear, so thank you very much. We appreciate some action as soon as possible from you and thank.

AC

You for agreeing to include neighbors in a meeting in february. Thank you. Oh.

C

Anybody else would like to make public comment.

C

Not seen any I'll close, the public comment. um Thank you. Everybody for coming, in speaking,.

C

And uh we're gonna move on to the presentation of wheat street.

C

However, um we did have a number of people to talk about overnight camping. Does anybody want.

C

To make a motion to move that this will be, this will be moved out to the february. No, no.

C

Just move that forward: oh yeah, let's move it forward because that's uh quickly, I think in.

C

A second, so you guys can stay there stay there. Okay, uh all those in favor all right. Any opposed.

F

Okay, so a overnight camping on city, streets and property request to restrict by resident.

C

uh Sample motion move to request craft ordinance and report back.

C

From city staff at next meeting, so I moved second um any discussion. I think.

G

I have seen what the com uh all of the residents have commented on and have been very concerned.

G

About it, so I'm glad that we're bringing this up for an ordinance regarding campers in the city.

C

Okay and I'll just comment that we did look at the ordinance um prior to this meeting with legal and.

C

It's actually fairly complex, there's a because we don't define parking as occupied or not, but.

C

As a vehicle, so it's going to take us some time to make modifications and then it'll have to go.

C

Through three readings of the city council, but we're hopeful that we'll have something in place.

C

By the spring, that'd be great, it's a big problem in the summer, all those in favor any opposed.

C

Okay, uh thank you for bringing that forward. um Okay, now presentations uh fleet street result of.

C

Public survey and cross-section alternatives by underwood engineers incorporated yes,.

F

Underwood our consultant on the fleet street project is here to present the results of the.

F

Public survey that was done last year, dan from underwood, will do the presentation.

E

Good morning, good morning, good morning,.

D

You may want to pull your microphones closer to you.

F

Eric you want to make it full put those green on it.

AE

Oh, the the powerpoint, the powerpoint yep, do the slideshow yep. Yes, yes,.

AE

All right thanks uh good morning, everybody, um my name is dan rochette, I'm with underwood engineers.

AE

um And I have jake started with me: I'm I'm the project manager for the for the fleet.

AE

Street area uh reconstruction and jake is project engineer uh working alongside me.

AE

um This is, as eric said, this is kind of a follow-up to I think zach and I were.

AE

Here last november, maybe yes uh just quickly presenting concepts that were going to be.

AE

Use in this in the in the public web survey, and so we're here today to just kind of review.

AE

The pub briefly review the public process um and go through go through our recommendations.

AE

uh So just real, quick, the project team uh zach zach sitting next to me, is the assistant.

AE

City engineer and eric eby they're kind of they're helping us uh guide us through this.

AE

On the from the public work side of things, uh the consultant team, it's ourselves underwood engineers.

AE

um We did use rsg for the traffic modeling, they are, as far as I know,.

AE

They are still the the firm that that maintains the the traffic model and.

AE

They they had the most recent one at the time, so they're familiar with the city's.

AE

City's operation and then from uh for landscape architect, we are using wood burning company who.

AE

Has also done a lot of work here uh here in the city with miscellaneous projects.

AE

um Again, the purpose uh just here to kind of review the public info.

AE

Process uh the concepts that we presented and then go through.

AE

Some of the some of the results and the recommendations for for moving forward.

AE

uh Just as a quick reminder, the fleet street area project itself is covers more than just fleet.

AE

Street, from a utility improvement point of view, it is a sewer separation project that includes water.

AE

Line water line replacements and full full utility upgrades fleet street itself, we are looking at.

AE

um Burying the the electrical the electrical underground, that is, that is part of the design and.

AE

Then but the the the concepts that were presented and we're talking about today is specifically for.

AE

uh Fleet street itself, which is also part of the city's consent decree for for separation.

AE

uh Sewer and combined sewer separation pulling the drainage out of the the sewer system.

AE

uh Public information to date we did there are approach for this project.

AE

Was to start out by just listening, uh trying to listen to the public, hold hold a couple.

AE

We held a public meeting just to try to get some feedback about. I guess needs wants desires just to.

AE

Kind of get a list of what people are looking for. We also held office hours. We are located right in.

AE

Town, so our office is convenient for the public to come in and provide feedback and input. We did we.

AE

Did get a little feedback but due to a lot of the public input process being online or zoom.

AE

And and covered stuff, you know, I think we felt we felt that the input we got was was fairly limited.

AE

um So then we we decided to proceed or try a web survey.

AE

uh Which was held, which was active, uh I think it was just before thanksgiving 2021 through uh just.

AE

After the first of the year in january, uh 2022 and as that was after presenting our comments,.

AE

Briefly, here um in november of 2021., the idea was to get kind of the most active time of year in.

K

The downtown, so we would get the most engagement from uh so we had used the kind of the the input.

AE

We had gotten to date and we we developed three concepts uh concept. A was that I guess it's a.

AE

Bullet further down, but there are a significant amount of space limitations in in the corridor.

AE

um I guess what I refer to as the lower the lower section, but the the parking garage uh block.

AE

Between congress and hanover is pretty restricted from a whiff point of view, um so the the concepts.

AE

Were fairly were fairly limited, but we do have. We did have concept a two-way traffic without.

AE

Parking uh concept b, one-way traffic with parking and concept c uh one-way traffic without parking.

AE

um The one-way travel direction that is being considered is, I believe, it's the.

AE

Normally northerly direction from court street to hanover and essentially that's.

AE

Driving away from the fire station, so given the fire department, the ability to just pull.

AE

Right out and pull right out and take off um and we we did split the uh corridor kind of.

AE

Into two sections and and got feedback on them separately, uh the first section was.

AE

uh The the parking garage block from hanover street to uh sorry from congress.

AE

Street to hanover, and the second section was from court street to congress street.

AE

And, as I said, there is throughout the corridor there there was, there is limited space and.

AE

um Replacing with the existing uh configuration, which is two-way traffic with parking.

AE

um Essentially, does not I don't, it does not fit in the lower section near the parking garage.

AE

And I think it would be very tight to fit up in the upper section um between court street.

AE

And congress, due to having minimum width sidewalks for ada and the ability for the city to properly.

AE

Maintain uh maintain the sidewalks with the field field, tractors, with the sidewalk tractors and to.

AE

Just be able to accommodate the width needed for just minimum street lighting and and whatnot to.

AE

Do to do that at a minimum, and we did use traffic modeling to evaluate the impacts of the one-way.

AE

um On the traffic circulation, the results of the traffic modeling, this was a. This is a.

AE

uh This was pulled right from the uh the the memo that rsg provided us after the after their.

AE

Their evaluation- and they did say that projected changes in delay, nqs associated with the one-way.

AE

Fleet street scenario are minimal and would not have a noticeable impact on on operations.

AE

um Getting into the concepts concept a, as I said, was two-way traffic, with no parking uh essentially.

AE

It maintains the existing traffic pattern, uh two-way it does, it does allow for some pedestrian.

AE

Amenity improvements, but essentially it's it's minimal improvements. um Just getting a usable.

AE

Width and providing some lighting- and this is kind of what we considered a narrow, a narrow, sidewalk.

AE

And I think it's in the six to seven seven foot range. This is what it looks like in.

AE

In a kind of a schematic cross section um just for point of reference, the left side.

AE

Of the cross section would be um in this case it's 55 congress street or the parking garage.

AE

Side and the right side of the cross section is um the franklin block, so the the two-way traffic.

AE

Would just simply be two 11 foot lanes in either direction and then the the sidewalk on each side.

AE

Concept b, uh one-way traffic with parking would provide moderate improvements of pedestrian.

AE

Amenities, it gives us a kind of a wide sidewalk, maybe in the in the getting into the 10-foot.

AE

Range, we did focus the in talking where the landscape, architects, the idea was to focus the.

AE

Wide sidewalk on the uh what they referred to as as an active side of the roadway, which would be.

AE

The side with a lot of the the most storefronts and retail and retail spaces, it does provide.

AE

Some space for some trees and it would provide some space for for benches or for some seating.

AE

um This one would maintain the existing parking layout throughout the corridor and.

AE

I think it would actually add two parking spaces primarily down by the barber shop. I think it's.

AE

Scuttlebutt barbers and then what used to be the drift uh clothing clothing store. This.

AE

I guess the change of the conversion of fleet street tool one way in the northerly direction.

AE

Does uh provide the ability to eliminate the left turn lane on congress street, and this we see as a.

AE

As an opportunity to also replace that left turn lane with um with some pedestrian amenities, you.

AE

Could essentially take all that and turn it into um you know sidewalk with seating areas.

AE

And and whatnot and again the one-way traffic pattern is is supported by the model. uh This.

AE

Is kind of what this is, what that looked like schematically again, the left side, the left side.

AE

Of the the cross section is the parking garage side in this case. It's 155 fleet street, which.

AE

I think is kind of the ohio, the ohio building. I think there's some insurance companies in there.

AE

And then the franken block again on. On the other side, it is uh it's a narrow sidewalk on the on.

AE

The parking garage side with an 18-foot travel lane, I think the 18 feet came from discussions.

AE

Earlier earlier on, with the fire department about what they would, what they would need to.

AE

Not just get a fire truck through, but I think if they had to stop and put the outriggers out.

AE

On the ladder truck, I think the 18 feet is is what they were. What is what they were looking.

AE

For and then an eight foot and then the eight foot parking parking base for parallel parking.

AE

um In in plan view, this is this is what that looks like.

AE

I tried to I tried to add on some of the the restaurants and the retail spaces on the.

AE

Down here showing the active side uh with the wilder, I think, there's a there's, a hair salon.

AE

uh The franklin, the franklin eatery and then a couple other a couple other storefronts.

AE

And then you can see the the parking is generally where, where it is currently.

AE

And then this is the the uh the second, the second section from court to congress.

AE

um Again, the parking spaces are generally where they exist now.

AE

um Here they are shown on the opposite side of the street, just to try to.

AE

Get a get a roadway alignment through here that is aesthetically aesthetically, pleasing.

AE

And then a couple additional parking spaces down down on the end by the barbershop.

AE

And then we did try to show here just the area on congress street, where.

AE

um Some sort of pedestrian amenities could be could be added.

AE

Concept c: one-way traffic, no parking, uh this essentially maximizes the pedestrian amenities.

AE

What we call the extra wide sidewalk again, it's on the active side of the roadway still.

AE

Provides space for trees and the seating areas for this, for this option would get.

AE

Into allowing for space for tables tables and chairs, and not just not just merely some benches.

AE

um Again, this does eliminate the left turn lane on congress. I do want to point out that I know there.

AE

Is there has been the goal or the focus on this project as well, to bury the uh electrical lines.

AE

That are on fleet street, get them underground. That does require some pretty extensive size vaults to.

AE

Put to bury the transformers, there's not a lot of space in in the area to add transformers and.

AE

They need to be located within a certain distance from where the services enter enter the buildings.

AE

And I think we're looking at burying one on fleet street, which I think would require a vault. That's.

AE

10 or 12 feet wide and it can't it can't go within a traveled way. It has to be in a pedestrian in a.

AE

Pedestrian area, just because of the the traffic loading over the access rates, it's large access.

AE

Rates and I believe they need to be open, grates or the eversource wants them to be open grades for.

AE

Heat heat loss and whatnot, so that would have to be figured out, but um so this option essentially.

AE

Provide provides the most space to us to be able to find a location for that vault underground.

AE

Which would be, I think, we're looking at at the bottom of the alleyway that goes between gillies.

AE

And the building uh next to it, on the opposite side of the on the opposite side of the street,.

AE

And again, the one-way traffic worked worked with the model.

AE

Schematically, this is what it looks like pretty similar to the other one, except you just see you.

AE

Just see we have the wider, the wider sidewalk here with some seats with some seats shown.

AE

um And I'm not I'm not an arborist either, but maybe with with more space. You start getting.

AE

Into some, you might get into some uh having a little more space for a bigger tree selection too.

AE

uh On plain view- and it looks pretty similar to the uh concept c except we did show- we.

AE

Did show the lots of parking areas here in the orange? This is the parking garage block.

AE

And then this is the the upper block from court street to congress.

AE

And again, the congress area that we can add some, we can add some uh some sidewalk elements.

AE

So we did the web survey with these concepts, as, as I said it, we.

AE

We gave we wanted to give it a shot as a way to really get some public input and feedback. uh We we.

AE

Developed the poster showing all of these concepts, then we displayed the poster in the project area.

AE

I'm on vaughn mall fleet street. I think there were some up on congress street. Maybe up towards market.

AE

Square, I can't I can't remember exactly where we put them all, but I think we had 20 or something.

AE

Of them printed so they were, they were around. It was active from november uh through january.

AE

So about two months and we did- uh we did have a pretty good participation rate. uh We think.

AE

We had 63 participants that were labeled as as residents or businesses in in the in the corridor.

AE

And the general public, we had almost 500 almost 500 participants and we did when looking at.

AE

The results um we did prioritize, we did try to prioritize. Excuse me the the results that we saw.

AE

From the the residents and the businesses, and um and not as much the the general public since you.

AE

Know the general public being tourists, people that come in from other other cities uh and whatnot.

AE

Just some pictures of the the posters and where, where they were around town.

AE

And so the web survey results um the for the section between hanover and congress.

AE

About 50 of the resident vote was for the one-way, uh the one-way traffic, with no parking in that in.

AE

That bottom section uh and then option b came in second uh with about 35 percent of the votes.

AE

And for the second section uh from congress street to court street, uh it was actually it was actually.

AE

An exact tie between option b and option c, uh one way with parking and and one way with no parking.

AE

um And just as a general note, the the general public, I think, always usually favored option, option c.

AE

So we took these results and we decided to move forward and recommend kind of a split, a split.

AE

Approach um since it was kind of a clear that had clear results with the with the residents.

AE

um We were selecting option c for the section between hanover street and congress, the one-way.

AE

Traffic with no parking and for the section section second section between congress.

AE

And court street uh we were going, we went with option b, one-way traffic with parking.

AE

We feel that this maximizes pedestrian improvements, where, where most desirable.

AE

um The areas where parking garage access has a lot of pedestrians and and retail spaces.

AE

And it also helps maintain some of the parking throughout the corridor. We do.

AE

You know we do acknowledge that parking is, is an important piece in the downtown, and it's.

AE

A it's a fine balance of trying to trying to fit everything in that we can in the limited space so.

AE

um All in all, it does maintain some spaces. I think it's a net loss of five spaces um on the on the.

AE

Corridor and all the parking would would be in this case, up between uh course read and congress.

AE

And I just some of the bullet points on that continued. It improves pedestrian.

AE

Features on congress street provides the best opportunity to accommodate the underground.

AE

Utilities and again the one-way traffic was was generally supported by the model.

AE

So just a kind of go through the project schedule, as we see it right now january.

AE

2023, obviously, that's that's right now! That's today we're presenting this to you guys, so you.

AE

Can go through it, digest it a little bit [music] um and then in the next in the next month or two.

AE

Depending on how the process unfolds, you know we expect that we'll get comments, comments.

AE

Or feedback on the concepts from from the committee, um and then we understand that once.

AE

Once we get the committee's, I guess approval or concurrence on on move on.

AE

The options moving forward the project will go to city council, hopefully sometime in the.

AE

Spring to get to get approval there, and then we would expect if things kind of.

AE

Move smoothly, we'd expect to kind of proceed with the final design uh later on this summer.

AE

um Start of construction there's a lot of wheels in motion right now. Some of it would be based on.

AE

How the process goes with getting approval on the on the on the the traffic? The you know, the the.

AE

Circulation concepts that we've that we've shown and but it also is dependent on uh completion of.

AE

Outfall improvements on maplewood avenue going to north mill pond when we were during the design.

AE

Process and we need to upgrade the capacity at the elk fall that is currently existing on north mill.

AE

Pond that comes from deer street to accommodate all the storm water that will be added to the.

AE

System we're currently in design for that now, working through permitting and easement easement.

AE

Things and so, depending on how all that goes, we'll kind of be dependent on the construction of that.

AE

And that needs to be constructed before we do drainage work on fleet street, um so.

AE

That is what I had for for you guys this morning. So just just.

D

To mr chair for me just to just to clarify the project's now broken into two parts.

D

The fleet street portion of the project is going to be two years from now.

D

At best we're doing the first section, which is a drainage project from hanover street, the end.

D

Of fleet street hanover street to deer street maplewood up to the north mill pond, that has to.

D

Get done first. The reason we wanted to bring this forward now was that the survey was done last year.

D

We wanted to bring it forward so that people had the opportunity to to digest the survey.

D

And digest the recommendations before we made some public commitment to one option or another.

D

So that's so the the intent is not to make a decision right now. The intent is really just.

D

An opportunity to kick the tires, ask some questions and just think about it.

D

So that's I just wanted to make that really clear.

G

Fears to get to gillies unless we close the streets down again for for on-street parking.

D

Or our design dining capital for next year, there's money, there's existing monies for capital. For this.

D

The drain portion there's additional monies being asked for uh to complete the project uh this year.

D

In the in the budget, right now, the cip, the only thing I don't like about it is a five five spaces.

H

We're losing downtown well. So, if I get to just clarify, if you went with option b completely.

D

And didn't do a blended there'd be a net increase in two parking spaces? Yes, okay, so one option adds.

D

Parking spaces: okay, oh wait, nice job! Thank you and I think the city's done a really good job with the.

I

Public input process and I think you've ended up in a really good spot with the the blended.

I

uh Concept that you're, showing, um I think the benefits to the city of doing this uh far outweigh.

I

The five parking spaces that would be displaced, we have a parking structure nearby and the economic.

I

Benefit and activity and safety are great. Just one question: in the 18 foot lane configuration the one.

I

Way, what do you envision as the pavement markings there? Is there any? Is it like a chero marking or.

I

I'm just worried about 18 feet is pretty wide. I we need it, I'm not, and we absolutely need.

I

It for the fire, but I'm wondering what will the public see on street? What's the kind of preferred.

I

Marking for that um we haven't, we haven't really looked at that, yet I think right now we're still.

AE

Just trying to get get you know some sort of traction or or a direction on uh what we're you.

AE

Know what we want to move forward with and once that happens, and we can, we can definitely look.

AE

Into configurations on on the striping um I know, there's been discussions about uh voting zones and.

AE

um Some concerns about that and you know so maybe some of it includes a physical loading.

AE

Zone, that's strikes um with 18 feet of pavement. um You know we think it does provide enough space.

AE

For a truck to be parked on the side of the road and still get vehicles through, it may probably.

AE

Even increases the safety, because you only have traffic going in one direction. You know what you.

AE

Don't have two-way traffic trying to trying to alternate around the intersections and whatnot.

AE

So, okay, very pleased with this looks good city manager. If I may, I think what we've heard from.

E

um Some residents and business owners, and as well as tourists and visitors to the city as well as.

E

um Policy discussions with the city council there's definitely been a thoughtful conversation.

E

About prioritizing pedestrians and other users of our downtown than just vehicles, so I think.

E

This strikes a nice balance of losing some spaces, considering the amenities and the.

E

um The vitality that wider sidewalks bring- and I think this is a great.

E

Place to be right now, thank you. Thank you mark yeah yeah. I saw this as compromise.

AF

At the end, so I think, like steve said you know that's where we're ending up and that's. I feel.

AF

Better, as you went on that, once you hit that narrowed it down to two and only lost five.

AF

It's like you, don't want to lose parking, but it was a compromise. Thank you. Eric.

J

I want to acknowledge that I did that traffic modeling, so I don't think I'm super biased here.

J

I'm not going to comment about the modeling or the I don't I'm not going to comment on that. I I.

J

Was I am curious about the 18 foot lane? I I get that that's um for fire safety, but it is really.

J

Really wide for a one lane, um that's wide enough that it could be two-way traffic, which I think is.

J

Hard to harder, it gets harder to enforce and you have people making silly decisions when.

J

It's that wide in terms of the need for the fire trucks and then the it sounds like we. It needs.

J

To be that wide, for the supports on the truck is that something like can the sidewalk can.

J

We does it have like you know: what is there any wiggle room there? We have other space right like.

J

We've got these sidewalks. We've got potentially some parking in some places. Is there any room to.

J

Narrow that and use some of the other space in the right-of-way for some of that secondary need.

AG

Mr chairman, if I mean yes so um this this project right, uh first of all, I'd like to thank the.

AG

Underwood group and rsg and city staff, one of the the challenges that we have is uh is getting our.

AG

Our vehicles to a uh an incident and then once it's there getting it set up, and um uh this was.

AG

Again, a a compromise on a series of things and and and the 18 feet is a bit of a compromise.

AG

Because it is uh less room than we really need to be able to set our vehicle up there. However, given.

AG

The the the traffic flow and the fact that we, we don't think we're going to be impeded.

AG

um That we feel comfortable enough in that short span, so to speak uh and the limited.

AG

Number of buildings that we're looking at there, that it's it's measured risk and that we can use.

AG

The sidewalk and we would be able to to get the vehicle set up and also understanding too.

AG

That you know this, this is an active city and that we do have delivery vehicles where we have.

AG

Snow in the winter time, those types of things so the there was a lot of discussion that went.

AG

On and we physically went and set the trucks up in various places to make sure that it would work.

K

If I may also speak, I think the the width also had to do with vehicles being able to pull over.

K

In the fire truck being able to pass by as well so they wouldn't need the pulling over.

K

Cars wouldn't need to put wheels on the sidewalk or anything of that nature. One of the concerns.

AG

Was that's an artery for us to be able to get out of uh downtown, especially when the we have.

AG

Bridge traffic and and things really back up and clog downtown yeah foreign, any other questions.

C

I've I've got two for consideration. One kind of in regards to the 18 foot width.

C

Is this a street a candidate for um I don't know if the term is continuous, sidewalks like we have.

C

On chestnut street, where it's, the sidewalk in the street are kind of uh all one plane, but.

C

There's a demarcation of uh we'd have to look at that. I understand what you're asking okay.

D

um My gut reaction would be probably not given the volume of traffic as a as a cut through area.

D

Typically, you do that on the shade, it's more like a pedestrian predominant, shared roadway.

D

And it needs you know we're looking at those in in streets that are.

D

You know chestnut street is an example right, not a high volume, slow speed. It's very obvious that.

D

Pedestrians predominate if you're coming off of congress and you're turning on to a street, that.

D

You know pedestrians could be out in the middle of the street that that would be problematic, so.

D

But you know we it's something that you know we can look at more thoroughly, but I my gut feeling.

D

Is that probably and eric you could speak to it better than I, um but I don't think it would be a.

D

Good application, okay and then the second question is the 18 feet um from the firehouse to congress.

C

Certainly makes a lot of sense. Is it equally important for the next section as well.

C

As far as getting out of town, if, if there's the bridge up or something again right, this is where.

AG

We were talking about that compromise right so now we're looking at um a a corner right on the corner.

AG

Of fleet in congress, where we have access to congress street, where we can still get access to.

AG

That building on the corner right on either side. But then, as you as you further down the street.

AG

Then we're looking at essentially talking about you, know, short-jacking our trucks and setting them.

AG

Up in an emergency operation mode to be able to access those buildings on the left-hand side of.

AG

The street right and then the likelihood again of being able to access the the parking garage.

AG

Again, we're able to do it off of hanover street unimpeded so a little bit of a trade-off here.

AG

Right is it ideal no from a public state, but again it's measured risk right. I think the likelihood.

AG

Of something occurring in us not being able to access the building at all is is even more remote.

C

Okay thanks and then the final one- and this is probably a unrealistic wish, but I know the.

C

Mayor's brought this up before it is, um since we are doing a comprehensive rebuild of the whole.

C

Street and the sewers and digging down deep is my understanding. There's been talk of retractable.

C

Bollards, um potentially being used somewhere in the city is this a candidate for any of that.

C

um We've we're really not supportive of that. Okay, um it's very expensive, very prone to to challenges.

D

When freezing conditions- and it would be an awful lot of money for something with very little value,.

D

So uh the recommendation from staff would be no okay, and I think this is probably the.

C

Best candidate that we're ever going to have to implement these considering the project.

C

We're doing now and the location so yeah, I think that's a good recommendation for us going forward.

C

Yes, okay, um yeah, and anybody at home that has questions you know, send them into the uh the city.

C

Like as as peter said, we're not going to be doing anything too quickly, so we have lots of times to.

C

uh Evaluate concerns. The goal here is really just to keep it in people's minds so that we.

D

Didn't wait two more years and we go yeah, we did a study, we did a survey, we want to make sure people.

D

Understand that you know this has been thoroughly vetted. We are we, you know we are moving forward.

D

With something and just keep it in people's minds, so they can digest it. Let it percolate.

D

um And hopefully, uh when time comes be more acceptable,.

C

Yeah steve would it be worthwhile to formalize kind of a consensus public comment, uh public.

I

Committee feedback that we we like the hybrid would that be useful. I mean I. I certainly.

I

Think it's worthy of suspect I would. I would hesitate to make a formal statement at this time.

D

um I think letting it percolate a little while um you know what what I would, what we're going to.

D

Commit to is putting this information online. There was also the survey online and that way people.

D

Will have the opportunity to see it uh and and they'll be there'll, be some feedback we've already.

D

Heard some concerns expressed, um you know earlier on, um so it you know it's something that people.

D

Want you're going to want to talk about, so I think you know we don't want to be premature. Yeah, harold.

H

Can I ask the chief a question and fire chief, please yeah, of course, yeah? Well, you know we're.

H

We're dealing with the franklin board and yeah you gotta when you use your ladder truck and you get.

H

The outriggers there have you, given consideration of the empire, the outbreak is going to take up.

H

uh That's that's part of the the discussions that we've had and additionally, as uh I was explaining.

AG

Earlier, that's part of the the compromise here is that we can get the truck onto the corner from.

AG

Congress street and still be able to fly the ladder and be able to make access one of the.

AG

Benefits is is if we, if we're burying the uh the utility lines that won't be in our way to impede.

AG

Us, where we'd have to move the truck and get it to a different angle. I see thank you both sure.

C

All right- and I guess um we uh we don't- have any action to take so uh we'll just.

C

Move on to the next agenda item, and I thank you guys for the presentation.

C

Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you. um So two is uh maplewood avenue, request.

C

To prohibit parking between route, 1, bypass and dennis street by resident.

C

um And I believe we might have a presentation from eric. Yes, uh we're gonna slide up here.

F

Okay, um so this is a slide of the area in question. Resident was concerned about.

F

There's a single parking space at this location on maplewood ave.

F

Just before dentistry coming down the hill from the from the bypass.

F

um And then the request was to eliminate that parking space to make it safer for bicyclists.

F

uh Coming down maplewood- and we looked at the the entire section of maplewood here and what.

F

Is shown in blue is the areas where a bike lane is suitable. It is enough width for a bike lane.

F

um And then the areas in red, where the very narrow shoulder and it's not suitable for a.

F

Bike lane this section of maple would have is, is very narrow from the bypass down the dennis.

F

Street, so even with the removal of a parking space at this location that we would not have.

F

Enough room for a true bike lane along this area, there is no parking in a few areas. These.

F

Bubbles are where parking is already prohibited in the ordinances it is allowed. In this section.

F

But it is so narrow that people are not parking there they're only parking in this one space in.

F

Front of this residence, where it is wide enough, it's eight feet wide. It's suitable for a parking.

F

Space, so their recommendation at this point is to leave it, as is removing this parking space. Would.

F

Not benefit bicycles in any way, because they're not able to have a separate bike lane in this area.

F

They're forced really to ride in the street as it is, and this is not going to give them any extra.

F

Room, except for you know for a 20-foot distance here in front of this one house, so you know.

F

Looking back at the when we had our maplewood ave reconstruction project a few years ago, originally.

F

This section was looked at to widen the section of maplewood to increase it for a bike lane, but.

F

Even then, because of the limited right-of-way, it still would have been a minimal travel lane.

F

Width and a minimal bike lane width, so it was not ideal for a bike lane either really in this.

F

Situation, this is a place where the bicyclists need to you know ride in traffic. It's the safest.

F

Thing is for them just to take the lane and not try to get squeezed off onto the shoulder. So by.

F

Eliminating that one parking space you're not really providing much benefit to the bicyclists.

C

Thank you erica. Can I ask I recognize that the shoulder is pretty narrow, so it's not wide enough.

J

To kind of officially be a bike lane, but I'm just thinking in terms of if one is riding along that.

J

Corridor there is a there is something wide enough to be a bike lane and then there's this.

J

Pinch point and then there's a kind of one car parked there. um I'm just thinking in terms of.

J

Like the practical reality of riding in that area- and I haven't ridden there so I I can't comment on.

J

That, if that one car would be disruptive, you know if someone kind of can squeeze in the edge long.

J

Enough to get through that section back to a space, that's wider, but all of a sudden there's a parked.

J

Car that kind of forces them into the travel way. Do you know what I'm saying yeah I mean they'd.

F

Probably be riding along the white line, anyways I mean other than a car door, opening which would.

F

Be you know from one car occasionally happening, it's it's mostly the res. I spoke to the resident.

F

Who used to live there and they said yeah? It would be occasionally be used by someone coming to visit.

F

Them but they have a driveway there for that house, so they're not parking out there. All the time.

F

um It you know it's not an area you to use that area. If you're on a bike, you would have to go to.

F

Your right to use that area, it's not in line with the the rest of the shoulder out there, so it's.

F

You know it's, it would be limited benefit to the to any bicycle yeah. uh Mr chairman yeah, I.

D

I appreciate your point and it is something that we've wrestled with this eric had mentioned.

D

We looked at it and I think it's worth looking at again and trying to figure out if there is a way.

D

To accommodate to make it, you know, yes, we won't technically be a bike lane, but it'll be a safer.

D

Shoulder um and and so that's something that we've we've talked about, you know looking at and and the.

D

Other item was the the off-ramp trying to tee that up, so that it's not a slip lane the d.o.t we've.

D

Requested that in the past and the dot has been against that, um so you know sometimes things get.

D

Done paints gets done, you know, you know who knows maybe it could get teed up um inadvertently.

AA

uh Harold surprise yeah, um I I move that we place this on file. I I think the comments.

H

We've made is taken seriously and I like to move that we replace this on file. Second,.

C

Any further discussion and I'll- I guess I'll just comment that um I understand the request.

C

And repeat, I appreciate the requests, but what we have is a two conflicting things, one. It may.

C

Seem safer for bikes with the car removed. However, the downside of that is that car actually provides.

C

Some traffic calming incentive so to speak and it's a long-term parked car normally so.

C

It's kind of a which one is better and it sounds like there's not a consensus, so we're not doing.

C

This to, in this case, to retain a parking spot, we're doing it because we think it actually.

C

Makes the road a little bit safer overall, far from ideal, but that's kind of where we.

C

Are and hopefully we'll have a solution at some point, but I support putting it on file for now.

C

So all those in favor aye aye any opposed. Oh, um mr chairman, yes, before we leave that graphic, if.

I

I could just make one little tangential comment: um maplewood avenue as you're heading out of town.

I

Towards the dent at intersection as a cyclist, that is a really challenging uh place to make.

I

A left turn as a cyclist from maplewood onto dennett, and I just want to point that out. I.

I

Mean when the rockingham overpass bike bridge was built, dennett maplewood was the the route.

I

To downtown as we move forward and think about the maplewood carter, I'd like to be sure that.

I

We don't uh that we look at that from a bicyclist perspective. You've got to be really intrepid to.

I

Make that left, I read that on a regular basis, yeah I frequently pull over to them saying you.

D

Got to get into that travel lane, you got to be looking up and seeing cars coming out. I'm.

I

Just pointing that out for future what we think about that! No, I I appreciate what you're saying.

C

Okay, yeah, so um good suggestions there and moving on in the agenda. uh Bartlett street uh proposed.

C

Mini roundabout intersection with thornton street by dpw neighborhood residence sample motion is.

C

Moved to approve mini roundabout as part of the bartlett street reconstruction project.

D

So I'll move for discussion purposes, I'll second, for discussion yeah. So, mr chairman.

D

um So, just to be really clear, city staff brought forward two options and did not.

D

Make a recommendation and when asked specifically relative to the the roundabout, I said that the.

D

Roundabout is a viable option, although it would uh probably become a political issue and it.

D

Would take you know you may make the decision, but it would be talking about it for years.

D

For those reasons I said, if you want to move forward, you know probably using the raised.

D

Intersection with stop signs would be the best way to move forward. That was, you know, a statement that.

D

Was made, the group of people at the time were very supportive of moving forward the roundabout saying.

D

Hey this is an opportunity to really dissuade people from wanting to go down this roadway.

D

And that was the major concern it was like reduce the volume of traffic. We explained also that.

D

Really, in order to reduce the volume of traffic, there were two things that needed to be done. The.

D

The roundabout, the state roundabout needed to be addressed, which is you know what my understandings.

D

Is a prior number uh top priority, or is a major priority for being added to the 10-year plan by.

D

Adding to the 10-year plan and the coakley road intersection circle, you imagine the traffic circle.

D

And the coakley road interest signals need to be addressed because that's a major cause of.

D

Of backups on those two areas, eliminating that that backup would incentivize having people use.

D

That area and reduce the number of traffic folks going through there, so we explained that those.

D

Those things would happen. The the consensus of the group was very clear that the roundabout was what.

D

They were pursuing, and this was a neighborhood group that had as ann had pointed out, that they.

D

Had multiple meetings they had, you know we had public meetings. We've had discussions on this.

D

This is not something that staff just came up with and just pushed it through on their own, without.

D

Any dialogue, so it's really I mean it is something that um has been discussed. It has been vetted and.

D

And frankly, uh if it's supported from the from the neighborhoods perspective, I'm comfortable.

D

um With moving forward it, but I I would suggest we try it as a pilot. First.

D

um It could be a little tricky to figure out how to pilot it, but I think some investment in.

D

Cones and barrels and things like that, and then we have an opportunity to let.

D

It kick the tires, see how it works, um and that would be my suggestion.

H

A pilot program- probably yeah, but we'd- want to do it in a relatively short time frame, because.

D

The goal is to be in construction this summer. Can it be done? Can it be done? Of course it can be done.

D

I wouldn't I wouldn't have made that motion harold. It couldn't have been.

D

Done oh mark and thomas there, no, this is going to clarify so peter at harold. So not so weird.

AF

Kicking back um so it's like you can do exactly what you did on uh by the bridge. That was a.

D

Pilot I'm making a motion to do this. Second, any discussion, uh mr chair, just to uh clarify some.

AG

Of the statements that were made earlier in the inquiries that we received electronically.

AG

This is the type of project again where we work with the public works and we actually.

AG

Get our vehicles down in there because we're talking the problem we have is with our aerial.

AG

Ladders, where we have two trucks in excess of 47 feet long one one has a significant hang off the.

AG

Back one has a significant off the front, and the the approaches to these can be a little tricky.

AG

But we do go down there and physically measure them and lay it out and and make sure that the.

AG

Vehicles can get in and out and again take into account uh parking uh snow banks on and so forth.

C

uh Erica then steve um last time we talked or one of the times we talked.

J

About mini roundabouts, I did some deep dives and they do have some can't find.

J

The the provider like I can't find the person to buy it from, but there are some kind of like.

J

Pseudo-Temporary versions that can be installed yeah, that's what we were.

D

Thinking? Okay, I think it would be hard to do a pilot of a roundabout with cones and have.

J

Especially because you'd want a fire, you want to be able to have the fire department over it.

J

um But I think that would be a great way to test it.

J

And I I agree, I mean I think it's a roundabouts work because they force people to slow down.

J

um And so it does, you know you can kind of stop. You know a stop sign, but around about forces. You.

J

To slow down so I think it they're really great um in terms of safety and traffic calming obviously.

J

Though we don't want a political landmine, I I think many roundabouts would be fantastic in.

J

The city, I will predict it, it will be a political thing, so I definitely have some vested interest.

J

In trying to make it not be a political landmine, because I'd like to see these regularly used, I.

J

Think it would be great, so I don't want it to. I don't want us to get burned out the gate, because.

J

There's too much controversy around it, but I think a pilot with um you know some sort of temperaments.

D

Of some sort that you could put down adhere to the roadway would be great steve. um I also I.

I

Value your kind of a conservative approach to this peter, I I I have some real worries about whether.

I

This is the best spot for it, but, more importantly, a land mine being turned where we're having this.

I

Kind of broader holistic discussion about the whole carter, and I wouldn't like to see something.

I

Transpire here that sours the larger discussion about the bartlett street carter improvements so.

I

uh To me, that's much more important than this immediate spot at this time, so a demonstration.

I

Is great, I would just add to the fire chief uh to the demonstration with the vehicles. uh Please.

I

Remember that we have coast and wildcat transit using that I don't think there'll be a problem.

I

But when you do have a physical goal test, if you could remember invite both transit providers to.

I

Bring their largest vehicle as well. That's a great that's a great point, mary lou. Yes, my concern is.

G

For pedestrian crosswalks, so I really want to make sure that that is optimized for safety.

AF

And mark I just had a comment on uh there's four addresses that are about those properties.

AF

337 340 358.. I didn't hear those numbers today and those are thornton street 346 bartlett. Those have.

AF

Immediate impact, the properties of an immediate impact on this on this project, I think about it.

AF

So I'd like to hear from one two three, four of those uh households we did have commenters from.

C

Previously, we were in, and we've had correspondence from 333 yeah, two flips um weighed in yeah 337 340.

AF

358 346 we didn't hear from and those are actual right on that corner. So I was just it'd, be it'd, be.

AF

Really advantageous to hear from them either for or against or at least get their thoughts, feelings.

AF

And ideas and concerns yeah and I understand, and I think that's going to happen counselor. I think.

L

I think I think yeah we're going to hear from that based on the pilot program and that's what.

AF

This pilot program is going to do it's going to give people more input is push back a little bit.

C

Because what we're hearing consistently from the neighborhood is there's too much traffic people.

C

Are going too fast and it's dangerous right? What it's unfair of us to ask from residents is for.

C

Them to become traffic engineers and then provide us with a solution. So what we're proposing here.

C

And we heard from several residents today that the current solution is not working.

C

um It was even worse before when there were no stop signs was my understanding right so.

C

We're going to try something here with a pilot right and we're going to hope that it's better.

C

Right, but if it's not it's not permanent, it's a pilot, um but I think the consensus.

C

Is that the current solution does not work? Oh absolutely. People are still using this roadway.

C

um Instead of the alternative option that we've created, that we were hoping, they would use so by.

C

Putting in a roundabout one of the complaints that we heard is it's gonna, there's gonna be.

C

Delays and it's going to cause traffic to move a little slower. What that will in effect happen.

C

Cause to happen is people will now take the alternative route, because it's quicker and.

C

Easier and they can avoid the roundabout, so I think there's a lot of um potential here. I think.

C

It's going to be a political landmine. I think people are going to be very upset about it, but.

C

um I think doing a pilot and doing a pilot the way that erica suggested, where it's not just some.

C

Cones and barrels, but it's a pretty robust pilot, I think, is what you were saying where.

C

It's yes, I think, is a good 100 agreement with a pilot, no question about it. I was very specific.

AF

With my comments on four addresses, okay for those particular residents that live live there, every.

AF

Day, how do they think feel concerned and we'll get that we'll get that from peter eventually.

AF

Through a pilot program and that's why I'm excited about a pilot program versus not having one and.

AF

Then the chief's going to have his concerns. It's all going to work its way out, but it's those four.

AF

Addresses I didn't hear today I didn't hear from any of those addresses 340 you did and the other.

D

Gentleman across the street you heard from so we heard we heard from two of the four okay.

D

Today your point is well taken, I mean we'll get feedback. That's it's just the point. I apologize.

AF

And I think once it goes to pilot, where there's going to be more public input, etc, etc. I use this.

AF

But more specific on those those addresses because they do directly butt those so yeah. I I think your.

C

Points will take him, but at the same time we have. We have to acknowledge that yeah we're.

C

Going to learn not happy with the intersection. No, so we have to find a new system and I don't think.

C

um To state instead earlier, we are not going to find any solution that has a 100 agreement.

C

uh So no, mr chair, there's we have to try something motion on the table. Yeah um roll call vote on this.

AF

Yeah sure sure we're all in all agreement. Can we restate the motion I felt like there were two.

J

Motions so I'm a little pilot program. The motion was to um move forward with the design, as is.

D

With the one component being the thornton barley, intersection doing a pilot on that for additional.

D

Review prior to final decision on that one session, the balance of the work was not contested. We're.

D

Going to do the balance of the design- and you know that one little area we're gonna we're.

D

Gonna evaluate a little bit and we're gonna try to do it in a robust manner. So that's that's the.

D

Motion, how long will that pilot program be enough to get some data so what a month, maybe yeah yeah.

D

We'll we'll know pretty quick yeah, mr chairman, it was already second again. Yes, one of the people.

F

Who lives at the corner was raising their hand? That's teresa. Yes, um I will motion choose or will.

C

Somebody have to suspend the rules move to social suspense. Second, would you have a motion on the.

AG

Floor is it oh um yeah. Therein lies the problem. uh I I I'd be happy to allow a comment for a friendly.

D

All those in favor aye aye any imposed.

F

Go ahead teresa.

F

Yes, we can hear you great. I actually.

X

The pirates of the roundabout.

X

Sidewalks and the bump outs in that area at the same time.

D

It would try to be configured to reflect how it would be at the end.

D

Obviously, the sidewalks would not be pushed out because I know that was your concern before.

D

um But you, you know, the road width would be configured in such a way uh to reflect that.

X

X

That's all I have to say thank you. Thank you for letting me speak. Yes, thank you.

D

um We'll we'll have to evaluate the data yeah, and I guess I'll just make one comment before we take.

C

The vote: um what I'm hearing is that we wanna not necessarily take the cheapest way to do this pilot.

C

um But to do the the best way to do this pilot yes well and uh it'll likely requires some investment.

D

Of time and money uh in order to do this, okay, so we will make sure we do the best we can.

C

So I guess uh we do it all those in favor aye aye any opposed thanks. um Moving on.

C

uh D dennis street request for traffic calming by resident uh sample motion to move.

C

To place an item on file uh so moved. Second, second, all right- and I think eric has a presentation or.

F

We do have a we did. A couple of locations out there spot speeds studies with the stealth.

F

Recorder and the results are in the packet, it shows that the average speeds are 24 and.

F

I believe it was uh 26 miles an hour on that section with 85th percentiles, 30, 29 and 31.. So.

F

One of the issues we have here is with a speed limit of 20 miles an hour when you look at that.

F

Speed limit: yes, there is a speeding issue, but that speed limit of 20 again is not.

F

Per state law, so when you look at 25 miles an hour as being the minimum state law, then.

F

The speeds are in that range, average speeds are right in line with the legal speed limit.

F

And but you know they are slightly above the average speed at 29 30 miles an hour. So I think.

F

The the commenters do raise a good issue with the sight lines on that hill and that's something we.

F

Can look at and maybe you know we can take some measures there, but speeding per se doesn't stand.

F

Out as being an issue, but I think in combination with the sight lines that something modify my.

D

Motion to place on file with continued evaluation on improvements to that site, distance.

D

Sight line second, a market that you had something. No, I just seconded his motion. Oh wait. Okay,.

J

That's what I had to say. I recognize the state speed limit as 25.

J

um But I do feel like what we're seeing is quite a bit of travel.

J

Notably higher than that 25 and I think for an area where people want to be walking with their.

J

Families, that's I don't know. 100 vehicles a day are driving 30 miles an hour higher. That's pretty.

J

Fast for what we would aspire for a walkable residential environment, um I don't you know.

J

I using the 25 mile an hour threshold, we're not meeting our kind of traffic calming warrants, but.

J

I I would think that there's a difference between there's a big difference between 25 and 30.

J

um In terms of both perceived in actual safety for a pedestrian environment and.

J

And so I I think I think, there's room for us to to do what we can maybe not to you know. We may.

J

Not get it down to 20, but I think there's room for us to do some things to try and.

J

Slow slow people down a bit on this section of road, any other comments or discussion.

C

um So I will make a couple of comments. I did receive quite a few emails, although not until last.

C

Night, this was a bit unique in that we didn't have a december meeting. The request came in in november.

C

um We got the results at the end of november and now we're kind of presenting the results with the.

C

Motion before we really had a chance to hear from the residents, so I think that was a mistake on my.

C

Part to kind of instead of following our normal process, we kind of sped things up inadvertently.

C

um So we, when we're efficient, it looks like we get in trouble as well. Yeah I'm happy to withdraw.

D

My motion and just to have a further discussion um and have our staff report back with further detail.

D

Allowing and I think maybe if you might consider peter adjusting it um and if the committee.

C

Would agree because it was requested by several residents and to erica's point. It is a interesting.

C

Configuration perhaps a sitewalk, um so we could just look at that section of roadway and see.

C

If it would uh be feasible to consider any other types of traffic, calming we'd be happy to do that.

AF

So I guess uh so your emotions to I'm withdrawing my motion. I'm saying that.

D

You know have staff report back. You know, move to half staff report back at the next meeting.

D

For further discussion second, and include a sidewalk okay, we'll schedule that yep.

C

After the meeting, if we're going to have a night meeting in february, does that change.

J

During the day, okay, I just wanted to check, and we I mean we can do a report back if it slips.

C

To march, that's fine as well, I suppose: okay yeah, it's not it's! Nothing's gonna get done in the next.

D

Couple months, so, okay, um so all those in favor all right all right any opposed. Now we're cruising.

C

Old business, maplewood avenue pedestrian signal phasing at congress, hanover and deer street status.

C

Update um sample motion move to request report back at the next meeting, I'll second, that right.

C

And I think this will be extra beneficial if we are having a night meeting, because this continues.

C

To be a topic of discussion in the community, um there are very good reasons for the changes that.

C

We made, however, those reasons are difficult, um perhaps for people to understand at their face.

C

Even though it does increase the safety according to most of the studies, what I'm doing yes.

C

I mean all those in favor, aye aye any opposed and then um from the deputy police chief, the monthly.

C

Accident report- thank you, mr chairman. uh So, as you can see, in um november we had a 69 total crashes.

AH

40 of those were reportable. If you can see down the bottom there, we have pedestrian and.

AH

Bicycles, you can see for bicycles, we had uh one collision between the vehicle and a bicycle in.

AH

October two collisions between uh pedestrians and motor vehicles in october and another one.

AH

In november, which is somewhat unusual, but it's worth noting that each time I look at these stats.

AH

Each month I look at the contributing factors, particularly with bicyclists and pedestrians.

AH

As to why the accidents occurred to see if it's something that is an issue that might be.

AH

Brought to this committee so just as background, I always do look at the contributing factors to why.

AH

In in these instances of uh crashes versus pedestrians and bicyclists, injuries were.

AH

Relatively minor, and in most, if not all cases, either the pedestrian or bicyclist was at fault.

AH

For the accident, which we do find quite frequently, and one of them occurred in a parking lot as well.

AH

Which is where we have a lot of our crashes, so we there's not a lot. You can do in it with.

AH

A pedestrian accident in a privately controlled parking lot. However, if, um if I may miss a chairman.

AH

Just to talk a little bit about, we didn't have a meeting last month, uh but we were really putting a.

AH

A an emphasis on dwi and impaired driving um over the last couple of months october.

AH

November december we have seen a marked increase in dwirs, impaired driving crashes and all things.

AH

Relative we've, we conducted saturation patrols along with new hampshire state police. We've had.

AH

A couple of fatal accidents and as part of this committee, you know reducing crashes and looking.

AH

At safety, measures as it relates to vehicles and traffic and safety, is something that we're always.

AH

Taking up a close look at and what we're seeing right now is the the one of the leading causes.

AH

Of our crashes and our crashes, where people are injured is not speed. It's not distracted, driving.

AH

Right, it's impairment, and most of that impairment is alcohol, not not drugs. The level of impairment.

AH

That we're seeing is uh our average dwi uh for those that uh agreed to take either a blood or.

AH

Breath test is a 0.14, so 0.08 is the legal limit. 0.16 is an aggravated dwi, which is twice the legal.

AH

Limit the average dwi that we're making that agrees to test is a 1 4., so your average dwi.

AH

That's out there right now is almost twice the legal limit. It's not an 09, it's not somebody.

AH

Who's borderline and that's why, whether it's the police department or the fire department.

AH

Driving around town we'll come across cars in the telephone, poles and cars in the trees, because.

AH

um They're just that impaired so anytime, we have an opportunity to to bring that to people's.

AH

Attention to spread the word to drink responsibly and find a responsible driver. That's part of part.

AH

Of our goal as well, so I know the holidays are over and we put that big pitch on. But just because.

AH

The holidays are over, it doesn't mean impaired driving is as well so mark. I was just curious.

AF

Chief is that more days, nights weekends um um it's more at night, but you would be probably.

AH

Pretty shocked to see the people that are twice the legal limit at 8 30 in the morning as well.

AH

But most of the most of the crashes or evenings in in or late at night, uh but.

AH

You know we will get severely impaired people at nine o'clock in the morning.

AF

So it was that a 60-day effort by increasing of effort by the state and municipality.

AH

That we didn't have it, it wasn't a time limit on it. um You're, probably aware of the fatal crafts.

AH

That occurred at the at the traffic circle on uh thanksgiving, which is likely contributing factor.

AH

Of alcohol there so uh and that in in response with a number of other serious alcohol-related.

AH

Crashes in portsmouth and then the seacoast in general, we partnered with new hampshire state.

AH

Police using grant funded money to conduct those that saturation patrol on that one night just to.

AH

Kind of set the tone for the holiday so so, based on the past years, has there been a spike. This.

AF

Year, oh certainly within the last october november december we'd compare and compare.

AF

To previous years, yeah yeah yeah, what's the contribution to that in your professional opinion,.

AH

uh I think it's a long answer. I I think um drinking habits for two and a half almost.

AH

Three years of covid uh have changed and I think we're still feeling the effects of that.

AH

Yeah in in the long-term effects of people's behavior, we all know that that.

AH

Alcohol consumption went up during two and a half almost three years of covid and I think.

AH

We're still seeing the results of that are you seeing about it? Can I ask these questions.

AF

I can do this over a coffee, yeah mark. Let me just um I'm just curious out here um so I have.

C

Read that mean is significantly up. New hampshire is up. Massachusetts up seems the whole country's.

C

Up with fatal crashes, um and a lot of it is being attributed to driving habits changed during covid.

C

But now there's a lot more cars on the road and people are still driving fast and they're.

C

Still driving impaired, so I don't know in city manager- is not here at the moment, but perhaps.

C

This committee could suggest that we have a a marketing campaign around the city with with signs.

C

About impairment or or to to get an uber or a taxi, or something like that, so this is sure I would.

D

Say that the funds are not, we haven't allocated funds for that.

D

Type of activity- and you know we run into situations where committees often make.

D

Commitments and without having the funding appropriate appropriated, so I would, I would.

D

I would you know not this year, but if, if as part of the budget process, if this monies get set aside.

D

For committees, this is an opportunity as an example of one of those things. Okay, I'm just.

D

I'm just cautious because we've received a lot of require requests from committees. This last.

D

Year, that required expenditures and I'm sensitive to that all right. Okay and given the time I'll.

C

Move on to miscellaneous, but if it's not urgent, maybe next meeting might be a better place for it.

C