City of Portsmouth, New Hampshire Parking and Traffic Safety Committee, 2 Jun 2022

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From YouTube: 6.2.2022 Parking and Traffic Safety Committee

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6.2.2022 Parking and Traffic Safety Committee

A

Okay start webinar: there you go.

A

Okay, we're going good morning, everyone, it's 8, 30. we're going to get started with the portsmouth.

B

Traffic safety committee this morning, councilor bagley, is going to be probably about 30 45 minutes.

B

Late, so I will start the meeting, so we can get going on time. We will start with our call to.

B

Order and attendance- okay, mary lou mcelwain here steve pesci, here mark syracusa he's online. Now, if.

C

You want to promote him. Oh come on, uh he's still an attendee. I think harold whitehouse yeah erica.

D

Wygonic here police captain mike maloney here assistant fire chief bill mcquillen.

E

Public works director, peter rice here, city manager, karen connard, here, uh chairman andrew bagley. Do I.

D

Mark him at center uh soon to be here, okay mark, let's see if he actually shows up right. So, yes,.

B

Yeah he'll be here trying to promote mark to panelists, but it doesn't seem to be working.

B

Is it something he needs to do on his end? No, just introducing mark we're trying to promote you.

B

From attendee yeah well, hey thank you for recognizing me this morning. uh Just couldn't make.

F

The meeting physically so the last meeting I made in common to someone in my office while on zoom.

F

When my microphone was on I'd like to apologize to the speaker,.

F

The public and the committee members for their interruption. I just wanted to acknowledge that.

B

Okay, thank you very much mark, mr chairman. Can we welcome leela to uh to our staff into the pts.

G

Meeting leela will be helping, uh coordinate an admin and basically tell us all what we need to.

D

Thank you do to be here. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, I'd like to move on to the financial report. Okay,.

H

H

Mr chairman, uh before I make a motion, um does the city council see these reports because they.

E

They are quite interesting to see you know, do they I can. I can try and answer that they do. We provide.

G

Parking updates on a regular basis, certainly as part of the budget conversation we've had many of.

G

These and I believe either peter or ben, or I have mentioned where we are at uh relative here to date.

E

Yes, I'm very impressed with the percentage. Sometimes it's amazing draws my attention.

E

Mr chairman, acting chairman, I will move the financial report be accepted as presented. Okay,.

E

We'll accept that I'm we're waiting to there. We have it on screen just so. The public can see it.

B

So we have a motion to accept. Is there a second second? Second marylou.

B

Any comments, oh I'm sorry, mary lou. Second, harold.

B

Any comments on the financial report, a lot of money.

B

Good to see the revenues coming back right as we return to normal okay, there are no.

B

Comments, I'd like to call a motion to accept the minutes or the excuse me. The audit, the.

B

Financial unaudited financial report yeah- if you have a motion, we just need to vote right. Yes,.

D

It needs to be roll call, yeah, we'll call mary lou mick calaway, yes, steve pesci, yes, mark syracusa. Yes,.

D

Erica wagonic, yes,.

D

Please captain mike maloney, yes,.

D

Public works director, peter rice, yes, city manager, karen connard, yes, okay, unanimous. Thank you.

B

Thank you, yeah, harold, harold, we missed tyrone. Did you forget me? I made the motion. Oh well. I assume.

D

Sorry, harold whitehouse, yes, how could we forget harold? I didn't. I didn't.

B

Okay, we're gonna move on to public comment period. Item number four.

B

Typically, we start with people in the room if you'd like to come forward and uh pull the mic.

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Up to you and identify yourself and we ask yeah, and we ask that all of our speakers try to limit.

B

Their comments to three minutes today, I'll try to do it. Am I right. Thank you good morning, everybody.

I

My name is dave underhill I live on pinehurst road. I send a 2-page letter which is in your packet. I.

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Won't reiterate it, but I'm delighted and grateful that after that or as that process went forward.

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This team took our streets concerns very seriously. You've looked at the intersection, you've looked at.

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And made recommendations on changes uh it appears to me. The data you collected is supportive of.

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What I suggested in the letter before the data occurred, that's always nice to see. I think if.

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You had sampled over the weekend, you might have found even higher speeds. It would not surprise me.

I

Because I think there's a difference between how locals behave on south street and others.

I

The sample motion in the agenda to me appears to be very, very good and addresses the concern.

I

The only other thing I would suggest you think about is the possibility of a no parking hereto.

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Corner sign on pinehurst, because vendor trucks particularly park right in the intersection.

I

And I know you're not supposed to, but they forget so with that said.

I

I'm grateful for your look at it. I hope you will adopt the sample motion cited in 6a.

I

I'm happy to answer questions about my submission and otherwise grateful for your time. Thank you.

B

Yes, welcome hi there I'm alison melcher, also a resident of pinehurst. Excuse me, I'm just.

C

Echo most of what dave said- and I just wanted to thank you all for your time and attention to this.

I

Dangerous intersection and, as you know, many of us um who are not here today and couldn't be here.

I

Because they have young children, um the speeds in that area are a concern for for all of us, knowing.

I

That our kids will be riding their bikes on the street and moving on to schools at some point and.

I

Eventually, moving on independently without us with them and that's pretty nerve-wracking.

I

Also, just the traffic going in and out driving to and from school is kind of.

I

A hairy experience sometimes so. Thank you all for your for your time on this. Thank you.

J

uh Good morning everybody, my name is chuck collins. I live at three little harbor road.

J

I wish I was here to echo some great successes. We've had on considering speeds on little harbor.

J

Road, this was brought up a year ago during the heavy use season. Little harbor road with camps.

J

And recreational people on the little harbor loop trail visiting the wentworth coolidge mansion.

J

And the committee has taken action at that point to do some um speed monitoring of the street and.

J

Other actions that have been taken since that time has been to remove about 20 trees along the edge.

J

Of the road we've also repaved the road to make it a nice smooth surface and we've cut the brush.

J

Back along the side of the road increasing the sight lines of little harbor roads, so you can see.

J

Even further down and june begins the camp season again for the gondola camp and the people down at.

J

Creek farm it'll bring more traffic down for people recreating down the end of the.

J

Street using the sandbar as a great refuse to go swimming and put their lawn chairs out at low tide.

J

I'm disappointed that I'd learned that the committee has.

J

Just decided to do nothing, basically, I from what I understand, I'm sure I'll, learn.

J

That there's been other actions taken uh we'll sit on it, we'll survey uh we'll watch it.

J

And see what happens in the future? Well, my fears of what might happen in the future.

J

I guess really what I really need to know as a concerned, citizen and resident of that street.

J

Is how I am aware of these committee meetings? I do go to the website frequently and I notice this one.

J

How I get make sure that the agenda items are on the committee's meeting and what the minutes.

J

Are from the meeting after and what has been decided, I've scoured the website and I am not.

J

Able to find a way to do that so at some point in a breakout, if somebody would be kind enough to.

J

Show me the right way to find that information. I would be very very grateful.

J

If there anybody can give me any kind of update, I noticed there was a pedestrian cam.

J

Down there, sometime in probably march april time frame and another covert, speed, camera.

J

But I don't know what the results of any of those are. Thank you for your time. Thank you.

B

Yes, is there anywhere else in the room who would like to speak.

B

Okay, we'll go to zoom. Do we have any hands raised? Yes, we have a first hand, raises annie, pubo,.

B

Okay, good morning, annie good morning, um thank you for taking my comments. um This is anikubo from.

G

Bartlett street I'm calling for three different items today, all three in my neighborhood.

G

The first one is cottage street: there's a lot of pedestrian activity with the new senior center.

G

Western yards connecting um through kate street to cottage we see a lot of people.

G

Walking there's no sidewalk on a lot of large portions of cottage street. So if you truly.

G

Favor traffic safety over traffic flow, you should not encourage speed, and I am personally against.

G

Raising the speed limit on college street. My second item is bartlett street. There's a.

G

Proposal in the packet today for a rectangular flashing, beacon at bartlett and pine street.

G

There's nothing wrong with adding a beacon, but it should not be thought of as a substitute for.

G

Actual traffic calming measures which are badly needed on our street on bartlett street.

G

Rfbs are traffic flow management tools, no different than stop sign or traffic flights.

G

And we see drivers ignore them. So please keep that in mind and then my third point.

G

Is not in the packet um it's about the intersection at bartlett in islington? Why.

G

Is there no crosswalk connecting the corner where two brothers garage is to cvs? It's a very.

G

Exclusive walk signal: why do pedestrians have to cross-part led then in linkedin to get cvs.

G

Why inconvenience, pedestrian or even put their safety at risk? I see in the packet the.

G

Proposal for changes at the intersection with joel court, which is really close.

G

So maybe it's a good time to also add a crosswalk. Thank you all for your time. Thank you. Annie.

B

All right do we have anyone else? Oh yes, uh justin richardson is the next.

B

Good morning justin good morning, everyone, um I hope you can hear me. Okay. Yes, we can.

K

Thank you, justin richardson, at 586, woodbury avenue, uh and the reason I'm coming in today is- is that.

K

For a long time, I've had a concern about the speeds on woodbury avenue.

K

And um in particular the final stretch as you come down the hill from where.

K

I can't remember the name of the church: that's at the top of the hill, but as you approach.

K

Going down to the traffic circle, it's where I live at edmond street. There is actually a.

K

Bus stop and people who are in the jewel neighborhood or gemstone state's neighborhood.

K

Have to cross woodbury avenue, but there's no crosswalk anywhere near there.

K

Traffic's regularly is only 50.. People are driving like they're already on the highway.

K

I'd like to suggest that, um and if this is already under consideration, I apologize, but I think what.

K

Is sorely needed is the type of improvement that was made on maplewood, where there are.

K

These rises in the in the road that you know are very manageable at speeds of 25 or even 30 miles.

K

Per hour but eliminate the 50 mile per hour traffic, which is um a real, significant concern.

K

I've never seen anyone measuring the speeds that are traveling on uh loot, very agony, but.

K

They're terrified um and truly terrifying, um so uh that that's my only comment really, I'm hoping.

K

um If this is already under words, maybe someone could make a brief record for that, because I.

K

Don't really know what the price is. I'd love to hear what the follow-up may be. Thank you.

B

Thank you, justin uh next person is james christie good morning, james.

L

Good morning, hello, everybody um yeah, my name is james christie. I live on jones avenue.

L

And I'm calling in to comment on the proposed or discussed rrfb that might be going in um on south.

L

uh Roundabout, where broad meets south um just wanted to uh say that definitely in favor of that.

L

um With a couple of caveats um that whole sort of area is, is very iffy for cyclists, for.

L

Push chair users or anyone with an accessibility need because of the uh the broken up. Sidewalk.

L

There um connecting broad to to the intersection at sagamore and south, so beefing up the sort of.

L

Across what we've got there to being an rf rfb would be an improvement. um Certainly, I've got two.

L

Young children, one who goes to little harbour the other one who goes to the middle school. They both.

L

Like to cycle to school and yeah, currently, you know they've got to kind of across sagamore.

L

In traffic uh to do so, or you know, deal with the very busy um crossing down at the bottom abroad,.

L

um One of the other uh commenters did say that not all drivers seem to know what to do with an rfb.

L

And that has also been my experience. I have seen a couple of people at the rrfb at the top of.

L

Sagamore at the graveyard just sort of blow right through that, even when the lines are gone, I think.

L

Maybe you know there's just not that much public awareness of what they are perhaps.

L

So that's one consideration. Another one is in my observation is that people coming out south street.

L

uh Crossing sagamore and then carrying on up south street often tend to accelerate fairly.

L

Hard at that intersection, you see people sort of really start to speed up there. So.

L

I've only got a very short space between the intersection and where this rrfb would be going in.

L

So I'm wondering if this committee would consider any other traffic calming measures. In addition,.

L

To an rfp um to ensure that incoming traffic that way is not going too too fast. I guess you could.

L

Say the same for people um coming down the hill uh from south street as well. That's incredibly fast.

L

Overall, I think it's a much needed improvement and would definitely improve access to to town and to.

L

School for for my family and many other families in my area, who you know, are otherwise a bit cut.

L

Off by these two busy roads, thank you. Thank you. Next person is brian o'neill good morning, brian.

I

Good morning, can you hear me? Yes, we can okay good morning um yeah. My name is brian o'neill. I'm on.

M

Day, 15 south street and I'm here to support the group. That's in there already talking about the.

I

The speeds on south street um just reiterating the comments that others have said: um yeah the speeds.

M

Are pretty fast coming down the hill? um For me, I have to come to a complete stop when I turn into.

I

My driveway before I can see the cars coming the other way. um There's there was a problem.

I

In the winter time too, where there was a ton of cars sliding off the road due to the high speeds.

I

And icy conditions, um but yeah. I just wanted to thank the committee for considering this issue.

B

Okay, thank you. Next person, aaron parol good morning, erin.

G

Good morning, can you hear me? Okay? Yes, we can okay. Thank you. um Aaron49 martin.

I

I just want to thank everybody for the work that you do for our city and thank you for allowing.

I

Me to chat um I'm just calling in support of the rrfb that's being proposed for the intersection.

I

Of broad and south street, and also just echoing uh james comment regarding the.

I

Sidewalk in between broad and um sagamore, where there's a where there's a tree, the roots have.

I

Grown up and it's very difficult to pass for anything with wheels, bikes, strollers.

I

And we have two young kids that go to little harbor. They do both walk and bike to school.

I

I think that it would be a great addition for safety reasons.

I

For this to be added, so thank you very much for your time.

A

Thank you. uh That's all I have for hands raised any final zoom comments going once twice.

D

I think you have a comment that someone typed in is it oh? Is that a chat comment? Oh yes,.

A

Anna k, vorstig from 35 pinterest writing in to express our families.

A

Thanks for your actions to address safety at the intersection of south and pinehurst,.

B

Okay, thank you. Anna seems to be a lot of support on that and for the record. We do have.

B

Follow-Up under old business on woodbury avenue and south street abroad, so we'll come back to that.

B

All right, I think we can close the public comment period.

B

We have no presentations under item 5 today, so we'll go to new business item. Six first item is.

B

South street at pine house, pinehurst road, okay, so eric just. Let me uh bring this up on the screen.

A

Okay, it's not the uh the best. I think I'm showing a few different pages here, but.

H

That's the formatting issue, yeah figures, it's so big.

I

There we go perfect okay, so this is a diagram here, showing the area around the intersection.

A

Of south street and pinehurst road in the middle here is pinehurst and at the end, to the right of.

A

The page is the intersection with broad street and to the left is the intersection with union street.

A

So we uh city staff, measured speeds and sight lines at the intersection, as well as turning boom.

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Accounts at the intersection and what we found was the average speed along south street in the area.

A

Of pinehurst road was measured at 28 miles per hour and an 85th percentile of 31 miles per hour.

A

So sight lines are based on the 85th percentile speed and which is 31, and what we found is for.

A

Intersection sight distance, which is a driver, pulling out a pine hurst looking to the left.

A

Up the hill, they can see 256 feet, which is sufficient for speeds of up to 32 miles per hour.

A

So the intersection sight distance does meet the the minimum criteria.

A

And that is probably why you're not seeing a high amount of accidents at the intersection. However,.

A

What is lacking is the sight distance for drivers approaching the intersection on south street.

A

As they come over the crest of the hill, their sight distance is limited to only 188 feet, which.

A

Is sufficient for speeds up to 26 miles per hour? However, as said the average speed was 28 and the.

A

85Th is 31, so we really want to have a stopping sight distance of of greater than the 188 and.

A

Since we can't increase the stopping site distance because that would require rebuilding the road and.

A

Lowering the hill, the other option is to address it from the speed standpoint. It's something to.

A

Lower the speeds on south street to bring them down to the uh 20 to 26 miles per hour or less.

A

So, which would be making them come into compliance with a posted speed limit of 20 miles per hour.

A

So I have a couple of recommendations on this chart and this one is to put up another speed.

A

Limit 20 sign, which is consistent with the rest of the street in advance of the intersection.

A

Probably somewhere up around union street, as well as installing one of the speed feedback signs that.

A

Tells drivers how fast they're going combine those two they realize what the speed limit is.

A

And hopefully that gives them time to react and lower their speed to at least 26 miles per hour.

A

In addition, put up with one of these intersection warning signs with the street name of pinehurst.

A

Road underneath it that would be in advance as well, so the drivers know that, on the other side,.

A

Of the crest of the hill there's an intersection where it could be have traffic pulling out.

A

Those measures would be something that we can do fairly quickly to address the speeds in the area.

A

And these speed signs usually have uh you know an effect and as far as driver education, you know it.

A

Wouldn't be enforcement, but it would be alerting drivers to the conditions of the roadway and, as.

A

Mentioned another item that could be done is to install the no parking here to corner sign per.

A

State law, when you have a stop sign intersection, you should have no parking within 30 feet of the.

A

Stop sign so that would bring it back to about that first driveway here at the bottom of the page.

A

So that could also be done, and these measures could be done fairly quickly. You know once if.

A

If the committee agrees with these recommendations and then it would go to council for their approval,.

C

Erica um one question: I got the impression I don't know what's right, but I got the impression that.

C

Trucks are also parking on the other side of the road, and that might be almost more of a concern.

C

When people are turning in, you know, they're coming down the hill and turning in and then there's the.

C

Vehicle there do we have the authority to put a no parking. I know the state law with the stop.

C

Sign helps us on the east side of the road on the west side of the road. Can we say no parking for 30.

C

Feet on that side also, or is that well, the state law on south street would be no parking within.

A

20 feet of an intersection because they're not under stop sign control. Oh no, I mean on pinehurst.

C

On the west side of pioneer on the west side, yeah that you can put 30 feet as well on that side too,.

C

Yeah, it would be personally, I guess I think it I mean I don't know I have. I don't go by there.

C

Enough to see when the trucks are parked there, but I get the impression that they're parking on.

C

Both sides, so I think that would be a good idea, yeah yeah, because when.

A

Someone parks on there you're, basically having a one lane road. It's too close to.

I

Yes, well very new. Thank you also, at the sidewalk someone mentioned that these.

N

Delivery trucks are parking on south street at the corner, so I'm wondering if no parking.

N

Signs should be put up there, also yeah. That is something that's an area where they can pull in.

A

Along this area here we could post no parking within 20 feet of the intersection here.

A

Yeah and as well as on this side here, right blocks of visibility coming out of in the side.

A

Here within 20 feet of the intersection, that's a state law, so we can put those signs up and there.

A

Wouldn't be any approvals needed for that? That's just a signage, in conformance with existing ones,.

E

Harold yeah also on the site, it was mentioned uh extending the sidewalk on south street.

E

Turning into uh practice, um can the staff comment on that? Is there money available.

A

Well, I can comment on the locations that the existing sidewalks are shown in this picture along.

A

The south side of south street between broad and pinehurst and all along the other side. But where.

A

It's sidewalks are lacking, is a dis section here, west of pinehurst road along this side of south.

A

Street there is no sidewalk, there is a crosswalk at this location. So what could possibly be done.

A

There appears to be enough land within the state, a street layout, to construct a sidewalk along this.

A

Side of the roadway, however, there is grading and there's ledge here, issues that would have to be.

A

Dealt with so you'll most likely need a retaining wall along here, and you know, it'd be a little bit.

A

More of an effort than a typical sidewalk would be, but I don't know if peter might be able to.

A

Address the funding for it or the time frame, I know we are have a paving project. That's coming.

A

Along soon on south street and as part of that project, we'll be installing a line of curbing.

A

On that side of the roadway, so if there is a future sidewalk that work would already be done.

H

To answer that, mr chairman, we are, we are looking at what resources are available.

H

We do have you know, monies that are allocated every two years for sidewalk work.

H

The intent was to commit that money already to other projects. However, you know we may have.

H

Some residual funds available and the the cip is structured to allow for.

H

Miscellaneous additional sidewalks to address situations just like this.

H

So we, you know we're currently reviewing uh where we're at um the bids um for the sidewalks.

H

Are currently out so once we have those we'll have a better feel for available monies, whether we can.

H

Add that or not, but as eric mentioned um as part of the road project, we've asked to add curbing.

H

Along that edge, so we don't have to rework uh the edge of the road when, when adding the.

H

You sidewalks when monies are available yeah. Thank you. Thank you peter question. Peter.

B

um Do I'm sure we have a queue of sidewalk requests in cip or just public requests.

B

That have been made. So what's the metric used to evaluate one need versus another.

H

Typically, it's there's. A number of things that we look at safety is is one of the higher elements.

H

Obviously um connectivity um does it, does it complete a section of sidewalk? That's currently.

H

You know not connected, um so you know there are a number of sidewalk projects out there.

H

You know one would think sidewalks would be something that everybody would be clamoring for.

H

um But oftentimes when we move forward to do a sidewalk, there's folks that don't want sidewalks.

H

In this case, you know we have heard no negative feedback about this proposal.

H

um So you know we are proceeding with the assumption that this is an acceptable project.

B

Because one of our comments this morning, someone was speaking to cottage street as well: yep.

B

Just so you know, I'm sure there are always more needs than we have resources for these.

H

Absolutely- um and you know, bartlett street cottage street have all been part of a discussion. uh We've.

H

Been you know, we had a public meeting last fall, um you know, there's uh you know that area is in.

H

Review in terms of what traffic coming measures and upgrades um you know are going to be done.

H

It's just a matter of you know we're already in this area. We already have defined work going on.

H

um For south street, uh so it's it's something that if we're there already mobilized, uh it probably.

H

Makes sense to take care of it? Okay, mr chairman, mark syracuse has yes mark hi yeah. Thank you.

F

The 778 south street there was an email that was brought in by the corn family, their their concern.

F

Is that uh beat the not a beacon like, but it's a light that flashing overhead light uh peter? That.

F

Goes over the roadway at union in the future? Will that take it out or would that be? Is that.

F

Standard anymore, does the city still use those or install them yeah? It's it's a it's a it's.

H

A standard traffic um management um technique we use them in a number of places throughout the city.

F

Is there any alternatives to that light based on their input.

H

um Like you know, we can review alternatives, but you know: there's alternatives. Wouldn't.

H

Would be what um rapid flashing beacon? um It's really, the the the need for that location is that.

H

There's uh ambulance traffic going to edgewood um off of union street, um so it's really a um to make.

H

People aware that there's a busy intersection uh that they're coming to or potentially busy.

H

Intersection they're coming to so I know eric could could speak better to you know what.

H

Other options are out there um yeah, because that overhead beacon is for that intersection of union.

A

And edgewood and there is a somewhat of a blind curve as you're coming uh inbound on south street.

A

Coming around that curve, you don't see that fourth leg of the intersection, so that's a it's a warning.

A

Device for that intersection- um okay, so that's been evaluated probably numerous times over the.

F

Years, it's definitely a safety feature. It's just unfortunate that you know their emails complains.

F

Of it flashing in their bedrooms, but um it you know that that light has probably been there for.

B

Decades, it has yeah, it's still abuse yeah, okay. That was my only comment. Thank you.

B

Any more comments on this proposal, so we have a recommendation from the city engineer for some.

B

Improvements and we've had some additions of no parking here to corner signs which can be done.

B

Right now, under state law and local ordinance, erica perfect, is that a motion, mr chairman.

C

I think he's looking for a moment. I'm looking forward to interrupting quickly is parking allowed.

C

On south street at all right now, I believe it is, and people just don't do it, because there's just.

A

Very difficult to do. Yeah, essentially, parking is allowed on any street unless it's prohibited.

A

So they would have to check on the jet ordinances to see if it was prohibited. um I'm happy to make.

C

It, yes, I was hoping you would listed and then, with the additions of the no parking.

N

Second, okay, all right, we have a motion and a second roll call vote. Okay,.

D

Mary lou mcelwain, yes, steve pesci, yes, mark syracusa, yes, harold whitehouse, yes,.

D

Erica wygonic, yes, police, captain mike maloney, yes, public works director peter rice, yes,.

D

City manager, karen connard, yes, okay, passes unanimously. Thank you.

B

Item b bartlett street at pine street request for an rrfb crosswalk. We have a sample motion.

B

Put forward by staff eric: do you want to give us an update.

B

Okay, right here.

B

Let's try the pine.

B

Here so I'm going to demote myself and.

B

And relocate myself. Thank you thanks. Thank you! Apologies for being late. It was double.

O

Booked this morning, you take the red eye. No, no. I was in town, but.

G

I think we're at item 6b. You know 6b bartlett street at pine street, yes, request for.

O

Rfb at crosswalk by resident a sample motion would be to move to refer to staff for review.

O

And report back at future meeting I'll make that motion. Mr chairman, okay, all right can you make.

E

We go by roberts, in other words, the chairman can make the motion if he wants to. I think we.

O

Generally avoid doing that, so somebody else will make the motion and then, if we have a second.

G

For purpose of discussion all second and then maybe eric can speak to it. Okay,.

A

Is that on the screen? No, I believe it is okay. uh This is the uh crosswalk located.

A

At the intersection of bartlett street and pine street is the nearby playground on pine street.

A

So we are, we have put out a camera at this location. We collected data over a weekend. We.

A

Just got the data back, it's not in your packet. At this time we had the camera out there for a.

A

Total of 39 hours over three days and we saw a total of 14 pedestrians in those 39 hours.

A

The most we saw was three pedestrians in one hour, so it doesn't really raise the high priority list.

A

Because of the volume of pedestrians crossing at this location, but we do have another project.

A

We have started the public process on is the the traffic calming for biola street. So I think this.

A

May be a better opportunity to maybe do some traffic calming and pedestrian improvements.

A

As part of that project, this doesn't raise the issue of being something that seems to need to be.

A

Addressed immediately, uh we have especially with an rfb where that you know the significant cost.

A

And we have other locations where we have seen the need for these uh devices. This doesn't seem to be.

A

A critical need, as the old ones do I mean there is traffic on here and you know they're traveling.

A

Faster than 20 miles an hour, but we're not seeing the heavy pedestrian volumes at this location.

A

But we can continue to monitor this and report back or the the pleasure of the committee steve.

B

I I would like to support that the concept of waiting and dealing with this request, as we.

B

Look at the street in total, I totally empathize with the requests being made. I appreciate the.

B

Data, but I think we would be better to hold this request and deal with it comprehensively.

B

As the public works department comes back with the proposal for bartlett street.

O

Amanda, yes, thank you. um I at what point. At one point, we decided that we were going to talk about.

N

Where these beacon requests are coming from and kind of do an overview of what is in the city.

N

Right now and how we prioritize so I'd like to there are three week requests on today's agenda.

N

So I would like to see us do a more comprehensive look at the beacon flashing beacons before we.

N

Make approvals um on all three? Thank you erica! Well, a bunch of us are in a speed working group.

C

To address regular concerns, would you like to head up a rfb working group? Oh, let's see.

N

Let me think about that for five minutes.

N

But I think it's a great idea: yeah where's, our intern. Where is.

H

He's not an taylor yeah he's a full-time employee.

H

He's on he actually earned a vacation, so we let him off yeah. We let him go already. I know.

H

Him yeah he reached probation and he's like I'm done. I'm going tyler does great great.

B

Work for us, I'm saying that in just uh so, should we rescind the motion and motion to.

O

Place on file, or do we want to continue to evaluate this? The motion's okay for the purpose.

O

Of study and report back- that's: okay; okay with the yeah, the anticipation that we probably wouldn't.

O

Do anything until the traffic calming project gets started and underway all right good? Do we.

B

Need to vote on that motion or we're just going to yeah. I think we landed with him, so I I would.

B

Support the motion with that interpretation that it will be part of the part, let's street.

B

Review um mark has his hand raised. I don't know if that's residual. No, I think it's new.

F

I I will take it down. Okay, I'm sorry. Do you want to promote him to panelists yeah I've.

A

Tried that, but it doesn't, you might have an older version. Okay, yeah, when I joined, should I stay as.

F

A stay as an attendee or join as a panelist join as a panelist. If you can, on your end,.

H

I have the option: yeah yep, all right there we go that way. You can participate more regularly.

O

Thank you all right, so all those in favor we have to. We have to do a question. Mary lou mcelwain, yes, steve pesci,.

D

Yes, mark syracusa, yes, harold whitehouse, yes, erica wygonic! Yes, please, captain mike maloney, yes, assist.

D

Public works director, peter rice, yes, city manager, karen canard, yes, chairman, andrew bagley, yes,.

O

All right on to seven on the agenda old business.

O

Item a woodbury avenue traffic calming update on alternative options; okay,.

A

So uh the last meeting we were asked to come back with some.

A

Other alternatives for the intersections along woodbury at both dennett street and rockingham.

A

Have this first diagram, it's a little hard to see, but this is an overlay taken from the.

A

Design plans that we had drawn up several years ago by a consultant for this corridor, and this.

A

Is the intersection of woodbury, ave and dennett street and what was proposed at that time is to.

A

Put in a median aisle which is hard to see, but it's right here where the wood woodbury is.

A

Median island, at this point and with a pedestrian crosswalk- and this would be a gateway treatment.

A

Coming into that lower section of woodbury avenue, the rest of this would be paint and they would be.

A

Expanding the roadway alignment, this alignment would actually tie in nicely with the new.

A

Alignment on the bridge, when the state rebuilt the bridge over the bypass on woodbury, they widened it.

A

And so now there's a little bit of a misalignment of jog going through this intersection with the.

A

Northbound ramp, and this proposed improvements at this intersection of dentistry, would align the.

A

Roadway with that new alignment over the bridge, it would also provide a better pedestrian crossing.

A

A two-stage pedestrian crossing here at the intersection and the island would act as a pinch.

A

Point that would help to slow traffic as they're coming into the section of woodbury. The traffic.

A

Really seems to just keep on coming until they get to that 90 degree bend up by cottage street.

A

So this would help to let them know they're coming into a different area of woodbury avenue.

A

The next slide we have is uh some other alternatives very rough at drawing.

A

Here this would be a mini roundabout at the intersection of woodbury ave and rockingham ave.

A

This could be done with some type of raised treatment or paint bollards in this area. It's.

A

A mini roundabout, so trucks would have a difficult time, but trucks would be able to just you know, cut.

A

The corner on this or drive over it and because there's a truck restriction, this area, we don't.

A

Get a lot of heavy traffic heavy truck volume- something like this is effective at slowing.

A

Down traffic as they need to maneuver around the roundabout, this, this uh measure has been very.

A

Successfully implemented in many cities around the country in residential neighborhoods.

A

There is a little there would be. Some minor reconfiguration need is that you move your.

A

Crosswalks, possibly out of the way of the travel path, you don't want a vehicle coming in and then.

A

You know swerving around and into a sidewalk a crosswalk as they're maneuvering, the roundabout.

A

So, but that is something that could be done. Another option is the next slide. Is this: um we.

A

Looked at this intersection again at rockingham and there was comments about possibly making a.

A

Protected bike lane up here along this side or doing some other bicycle treatment, but because of.

A

uh The desire to have a median island in here, such as at dennis street, that the alignment you need to.

A

Keep the through lane on this side, north close to the sidewalk and and to allow your through.

A

Movements to go through you wouldn't want to have your through movement in the middle, with a wide.

A

Bike lane, because then your through traffic is, is running into an island, um but there was.

A

Also, a desire to get rid of the left turn lane there and make the left turns from the through.

A

Lane which acts as a traffic calming measure the left turns, would stop and slow traffic behind it.

A

So that is where we came up with this proposal to put a raised median island.

A

That would allow a two-stage crossing similar to the island on the other side of the intersection.

A

There is no bike lane on this section of woodbury, so the bike lane coming under the overpass ends at.

A

This point and bicyclists either have to share the road, uh the rest of woodbury or they take a.

A

Left and come down rocking him and get onto the bicycle trail here that comes over the bypass, so.

A

It didn't uh see the much benefit of increasing the the bike lane on this side. It's a wide bike.

A

Lane right now, but it it goes to nowhere so being able to cross pedestrians and bicycles safely at.

A

This intersection, by putting in a raised median, seemed like a better alternative than trying to.

A

uh Do something in the with a traveling in the middle, so these are ideas that uh you know we.

A

Just wanted to bring back to the committee as a request to see what other options could be done.

A

Rather than the previous plan that had been shown, mr chairman, I notice um attendees raise.

H

Their hand, it's past public comment and I make a motion to allow um justin to speak last. Second,.

O

Do we need a vote on that? Yes, we do so. I guess I'll need a real claw vote.

D

Mary lou mckellawain, steve pesci, yes mark syracusa, yes, harold whitehouse,.

D

Yes, erica wygonic, yes, police, captain mike maloney, yes, public works director, peter rice.

D

City manager, karen connard, yes, chairman and andrew bagley, yes, mr chairman, before we leave the issue.

E

Can I ask a question yes when I, when a roundabout is uh proposed, do they the engineers take in.

E

Consideration the attractive trailers on that street. They do yes, okay,.

A

That's why it would have to be something mountable if we were to do that or or a lot much larger.

A

Circles such as at foys, corner over in rye, where trucks can maneuver around the entire router that.

A

Would that would require significant, more road work and land takings to do something that large.

I

Thank you very much. So do we want to hear from yeah justin research then thank you. I believe.

K

I'm unmuted now um just two uh comments. One is on the um the the comments about the bike lane.

K

On the opposite side that I I like all the time to death to downtown along that section and that left.

K

Side is the um or the upper side on the plan is the better one, because it avoids bicycles.

K

Being um running into the intersections of the traffic turning onto the traffic circle,.

K

So so in this I guess it's the north side, that's a much safer side to bike on, and there is enough.

K

Space, you are correct. It does cut off right before, as you're coming from wood barrier down the hill.

K

um The the other question I had about the mini traffic circle or round about issue is whether.

K

That would cause traffic congestion because um it's very difficult to turn out of driveways.

K

Along this section of woodbury avenue, because cars are going both directions, they are going fast. So.

K

Slowing them down, that would be a great aspect, but I wonder if really the the better solution might.

K

Be to put one of those raised um like traffic curves, I forget what they're called uh rather.

K

Than the roundabout, which could cause the traffic to back up- um and you have people essentially stop.

K

Waiting to go around the roundabout and unable to enter because of the volume uh coming up and down.

K

Woodbury folks on rockingham wouldn't be able to enter into the traffic circle. Those are just my.

K

Thoughts or comments on that I'd love to hear if there's any reaction or response to that. Thank you.

O

Thank you, justin. Is there any steve? Oh, mr chairman, um one of the challenges.

H

With uh woodbury avenue is its designation, um its designation is an arterial road and design.

H

Criteria, don't really acknowledge or recommend raised tables you traffic, those types of crap.

H

Traffic bombing measures in an arterial um road as designated uh the designation is, is.

H

Not something that the city creates, it's a it's, the rockingham planning commission and the state.

H

uh Dot that define those designations, and so you know we wouldn't want to um necessarily.

H

uh You know go counter to those recommendations for those those design requirements. um The.

H

You know the the concerns relative to the to the roundabout are are really um it's more of an.

H

Inconvenience or or something you know, it's just a change that people are not necessarily used to.

H

Around here, but it does not create a larger queue. It actually reduces cues because it makes it a.

H

Very predictable movement of traffic uh through the through the roundabout. um But you know that.

H

I I would be interested in piloting it and seeing if it's if it's something that is an acceptable.

H

Treatment, you know, there's it's used in many places throughout the country successfully and.

H

I think it's one tool in our traffic comic toolbox that could be tried out and just monitor it and.

H

See and report back in terms of you know we don't have to pursue it, but it would be interesting to.

H

Try it as a pilot effort, um but I would be interested to hear other other people's.

H

Feelings on it, um the alternative configuration if the pilot forward roundabout was not acceptable.

H

I think the way eric has shown it um is with this additional median is a probably the best approach.

H

uh To address this issue, uh but well you know I'm interested to hear others. uh Thoughts on this.

O

Thank you, steve I'd like to hear cause. That's what, if you were first, no.

C

um I I really like all these designs. I think they're great. I think they're.

C

Nice steps forward, I love mini roundabouts. I I would love to see them in our neighborhoods.

C

As neighborhood calming, I think they're really great options that.

C

I I would love. I mean I'd, love to pilot that in my neighborhood I volunteer my my corner. um I don't.

C

Know if people will be, I should probably talk to my neighbors first, I use it as a mini roundabout.

C

Sometimes, if we need to change directions, I probably shouldn't say that out loud, I don't know.

C

It works really well yeah um for parking, because we only have parking inside of our street the.

C

I think they're great they're great for traffic calming they work. Well. Trucks can.

C

Navigate them, I, I think it certainly could work in this location. I don't have strong feelings.

C

Which would be better, I I wouldn't have thought of one here, but I don't think it's a bad idea. I.

C

Think it's it's interesting, I think piling it. I think it'd be great. If we wanted to pilot a.

C

Couple of them- and I volunteer my road, which I think it's a great use for a you- know, a.

C

Bike corridor that I can't remember the title: we're using um boulevard. It's a it's a great.

C

Way at like either end of a bike, boulevard, um I'd love to see us try some, I think, that'd be great.

C

But I like the design that um the other two designs eric put out there, the one comment.

C

I'd like to make is I'd really like for there to be some landscaping involved. I think it.

C

Really makes a really big difference with speeds to have some plantings and not just paved. You know.

C

A median helps, but it also creates a sense of just this paved paradise right, not a human scaled.

C

Environment, so I think, to the extent you know it doesn't need to be trees. If, if there's not enough.

C

Space for trees, but even bushes or neighbors, can adopt the traffic circle or the or the.

E

Mini roundabout or the or the medians just to I think that makes a really big difference.

C

So I'd love it if that could be added, but otherwise I really like all those designs.

O

Steve and then harold just to the I think, a great example is that the little neighborhood garden.

B

Spot at thornton and woodbury, which is a little diamond and it's you know it's this little bit.

B

Of annual perennial landscape- and I think it really changes the feel of that intersection.

B

um I totally support introducing these. I call it a mini diverter mini roundabout into portsmouth.

B

I think there's a lot of great neighborhood streets where this would be an excellent traffic.

B

Calming device it's inexpensive, it's simple: it doesn't create any dangerous situations.

B

I don't know that I think this is a great spot for it and I worry about doing a pilot of something.

B

That might be great in the wrong spot and then forever people say: oh, not that that was terrible.

B

So I want to support the the other design you presented eric for this car and I really.

B

Appreciate the what I call this, the eastern or the southern end by the hotel, that is really important.

B

What you've shown as the protected crosswalk there and fixing that whole area? So I guess I.

B

Support either, but I would like to see a pilot of the mini roundabout diverter in other locations. In.

B

Town and go with your more traditional alternative presented for woodbury and I think those.

B

Improvements would be very appreciated by people who live in and travel through. The neighborhood.

E

Of public works director um do we. We have to be very careful.

E

In reference to federal and state funding, what we do in that story right.

E

When we talk about roundabout, you know, um would that jeopardize our federal or state funding.

E

No, absolutely not, those are those are except federally accepted uh treatments uh for roadways.

H

All right, I don't know that yep um and and mr chairman, if I may, I acknowledge uh steve's point.

H

Relative to uh to a bit, you know not bridge too far but uh floating out a a a.

H

A treatment that becomes an episode instead of a program. um I I think we, you know I I agree.

H

With what you're, saying and and and retract my thought about trying it out here, okay,.

H

I think it'd be a better place, a better location to do it, not in america's neighborhood, because it.

H

Seems to be, uh you know, preferential treatment, it's just based on my lots of observations.

C

I think it'd be a good location, but I would die. I can get good neighborhood buy-in too. I think.

C

I think it'd be something to move through the committee inappropriately.

A

I'd also point out: you know, as peter mentioned, you know, being an arterial roadway. You know around.

A

About a mini roundabout is probably not the best way to be on an arterial road where you'd rather.

A

Have more full-size standard roundabout on the I'm just I was showing that because it does fit.

A

But it's really not the the best solution here. Just trying to get me excited. Yes, I thought these.

B

Were called diverters because I get very concerned with people like we say people interchangeably, say.

B

Traffic circle, which is like our traffic circle, then roundabout, which is smaller. I thought these.

B

Were even tinier and called diverters? No, no, I'm sorry good! um A mini roundabout is what eric has.

C

Drawn- and I think the question really has to do with the volumes- and I I don't know if you've.

C

Looked at them yet whether it would work in this location. um I've been joking about the idea of.

C

Testing it in my neighborhood, but I actually think it would be a great pilot because it is the pike.

C

Boulevard and the volumes and things, but that's I I set it aside as like a personal advocate.

C

I a diverter usually involves um limiting through traffic in a particular direction, so it might be.

C

A almost like a winged curve in the middle, so you can go this way or this way, but you can't.

C

Go through, for example, you know, there's various you can have it so bikes can go through, but cars.

C

Can't there's lots of options like that, but that's what I would consider, but this, I think, is a mini.

C

Roundabout um and just to build on what steve said before about the hotel end, that's the end that I.

C

Think really needs the well. I think they all need plantings, but I think that really has a lot of.

C

Potential to be a really nice neighborhood gateway with plantings would make a really big difference.

G

I would need to do well. Do we need to do it again, yeah? I don't think it was specific to justin that.

A

Was just to let somebody he he had his hand raised at the same time as justin. I would.

H

Say we interpreted this yeah? We don't have a attorney here to tell us we're.

O

Wrong, so let's go ahead. Kenneth do you have something to add to the conversation.

O

I think is he muted, I don't know if he could hear you aren't talking into the mic.

O

Oh kenneth, do you have something you'd like to add to the conversation.

I

Hello here we go. Yes, we can hear you, oh hi uh hi. uh My name is ken.

A

I live in woodbury avenue there, uh just just above in one and nine one. Fifty.

I

One fifty um and I just wanted to echo that I do agree that traffic coming some of them are.

I

Very uh positive, so the circle is interesting, the the other one- um and I would stress that.

I

We look at the other minor intersections between maple wood and rockingham. Now would vary because.

I

A lot of the speed I see walking down biking down, that street um happens there I mean that's where.

I

The police post themselves right there at the church to try to catch somebody speeding. That's.

I

Where most of the feeding happens right right in between maplewood and rockingham avenue and not.

I

Necessarily in the intersection, uh so traffic coming on the non-intersection.

I

Portions, I should see if you guys have looked at that uh like the road diets or something like that.

O

Great, thank you. Thank you steve. So are we looking for a motion on um eric's recommendation? I think.

O

um I'd like to propose one if we are, is that what you're looking for eric.

A

It's the pleasure of the committee, I'm at this point uh how you want to go with us.

A

I would say: yes, we are okay, okay, I don't know where we go.

G

I don't know that we wanted to presume that emotion might be made, but we're.

G

Well, I would like to make a motion, so I would like to make a motion that we support the.

B

Traditional design, the non-mini roundabout designs for both the.

B

For both sections of woodbury avenue, as presented by the city engineer, I think they're.

B

A significant safety improvement and I think we should support moving forward on those as designed.

C

I'll second, all right can I make a friendly amendment and identify a location to test.

C

A pilot mini roundabout uh-huh elsewhere in the city. I don't support that friendly number.

I

I think it should be treated separately. That's fine, okay, okay, all right! So without the friendlier.

C

My friendly amendment, okay, I will comment about the mini roundabouts. I do believe.

O

In the elwynn park traffic calming study, there was mention of a mini roundabout, so I might put.

O

That forth as a possible, because I too would like to see these many roundabouts in places.

O

Where they make sense, and that might be an easy place to start, mr chairman, if I may, I would.

H

Encourage us to separate the two issues: okay, treat them as clearly distinct um proposals.

O

All right, so, let's take a roll call vote on the motion uh for this particular intersection.

O

Okay, where are we now so we're on the um oh? I don't have one of those fancy things.

D

Yes, steve pesci, yes, mark syracusa, yes,.

D

Harold whitehouse, yes, erica wagonic, yes, police, captain mike maloney, yes, public.

D

Works director, peter rice, yes, city manager, karen connor, yes, chairman, andrew bagley, yes.

O

um Old business uh item b, islington street at rail.

O

Trail entrance update on citizen request for rr fb sample motion would be move to install rrfp.

O

Crosswalk and tip tip-down ramp on islington street, as funding allows.

A

Mr chairman, we've collected some data out there at the intersection.

A

We're seeing you know about 15 pedestrians, an hour crossing, you know in the early spring.

A

Good weather, I only expect that number to increase, so it certainly would appear to support the.

A

Warrants to putting a crosswalk in at that location, and it is on the apex of a curve so.

A

Sight lines are very good out: it's actually the best spot out there for a crosswalk, because the.

A

Sight lines are good in each direction, and you know it's. A rfb could be also helpful. You know.

A

Just to alert drivers to a new crossing in that location, although watching the video I mean the.

A

Pedestrians are not having a hard time crossing the street most of them. I think two-thirds of the.

A

Pedestrians in the videos were not having any delay whatsoever, they were just coming up and.

A

Just walking across the street there's plenty of gaps in traffic when they are waiting for a.

A

Gap in traffic waiting about five seconds, so it's not a hard place to cross the street so.

A

You know crosswalk looks to be warranted. An rfb possibly could be put in at a later date.

A

If needed, or if you had to desire the committee because they are, we do get requests for them. Many.

A

Places- and this would not be a high priority in my opinion, but it is a good location for a crosswalk.

O

Steve um I I would like to make a motion that we install a crosswalk with.

B

Appropriate vertical crosswalk signage.

B

Maybe the pointer arrows as well and then monitor for consideration for future rfb installation.

O

Okay, uh mary lou. Yes, I just wanted to comment that on in other communities, where there are.

N

Rail trails, there is a significant crosswalk and often the rrfp be on them, but um it seems that if.

N

You're coming out of the rail trail, you need to cross over islington street to go north into town.

N

So it's that to me would be more of a concern than seeing a few uh pedestrians crossing at that point.

N

And I would agree with steve's recommendation his motion. Can I make a parallel comment? We we.

B

Traverse this during the mayor's bike ride several weeks ago, which, by the way, I want to thank the.

B

City staff and the police- and we had- I don't- know- 50 75 people- all age ranges. It was really a great.

B

Event, so thank you for everyone that participated and helped on that, but thinking long term.

B

Someday, we hope to have the rail trail completed from portsmouth to seabrook and.

B

This is going to be a major crossing and certainly at that point you know, will become a major um rrfb.

B

Whatever, but I think this is a great first step, if we can okay and I'll just add a comment.

O

This particular access point isn't really that noticeable, if you're not already familiar with it,.

O

So putting a crosswalk there I think, might draw some attention to people that to let them know.

O

That they can access this pathway, so I think it's a great motion: good! Okay! Okay, uh can you hear me.

F

Yes, yes, yes yeah. I I second that motion. I don't know if anybody heard me, which steve said is to.

F

Do it in increments, where you put the sidewalk, not the sidewalk, the crosshawk in now, then reevaluate.

F

It for a beacon, light or something else in the future that could be done in the short term right.

F

Peter um we have to do a tip down, um so I mean short term. Is you know it's a matter of getting.

H

Well, we have, I believe we have the funding to do it. um So I mean painting is an easy thing, uh but.

H

You need a tip down uh to access it to make it ada compliant. um So we, you know we will we'll.

H

Strive to get it done as quickly as possible um and I'm not sure what our availability in.

H

Terms of staffing, uh whether or whether we have a contractor available uh to do it uh at the moment.

F

Can you repeat your emotion yes before do that? One final question for this is for the engineers mutcd.

B

Would that be appropriate to have a? Is there such a sign that shows a ped and a bike symbol crossing.

B

Because I think that's what this is: it's, like a trail crossing right, so yeah. There is a different.

A

Sign there: well, it's not part of the trail, it's it is just a crosswalk at this point used by bikes.

B

And pads anyway I'll leave that, for you guys to sort out, let's get to this st steve brings up a.

H

Good point: um it is a short section of shared use that bicyclists will be coming off. A vine.

H

And crossing that section, so I can see incrementally uh adjusting the area depending upon.

H

Volume of traffic and need to potentially either making a shared use path section of the sidewalk.

H

Or making some sort of doing some sort of further treatment in the roadway to make it clear that.

H

There's bicycles as well as pedestrians crossing, but I think in the near term this the incremental.

H

Approach is the way to go, and if we have sinus, I can do both that's great um yeah. I think that.

A

Sign can be put up. You know the combination of the pedestrian bikes go on there. So motion. Sorry, daryl.

E

I just want somebody bring me up to speed on this rail trail, I'm not too familiar with it. How far.

E

Does it go? Where does it go? It goes all the way to massachusetts. Actually yeah yeah, the states.

H

The state is currently in design uh they're looking at construction. I think next year.

H

It's a former bus, main railroad, the state the state owns the quarter now.

E

So I'll just reset the motion that we move forward with the installation of a crosswalk.

B

With vertical signage and necessary tip downs as a first step, understanding that it is also.

B

A trail crossing and leave it to the staff to determine the appropriate mutcd signage. For that.

F

Second, it's a long motion. Second, all right and we'll take a roll call vote. Mary lou mcelwain. Yes,.

D

Steve pesci, yes, mark syracusa, yes, harold, whitehouse, erica wagonic, yes, police, captain.

D

Mike maloney, yes, public works director, peter rice, yes, city manager, karen connard, yes, chairman andrew.

D

Bagley, yes, all right old business item c south street abroad, update on staff request for rrfb.

A

Thank you, mr chairman. We've been continuing to collect data at this location. Looking at video.

A

To see you know how how pedestrians are crossing and how the traffic conditions are out there.

A

So what we've seen is that there are a couple times during the day, especially it seems to be.

A

School pick up and drop off times when traffic is backing up from the intersection that the signal.

A

At south and sagamore, and comes back as far as broad street and.

A

We've been watching to see if pedestrians are coming out, but we haven't seen a lot. Maybe.

A

Five instances a day where a pedestrian is coming out between those cars that are queued up.

A

It seems to be that pedestrian traffic and cars are not heavy. At the same time, I think it's.

A

People are all coming to the school or walking to the school, and then the traffic comes to pick.

A

Up the the people that by car and then they're leaving and then the pedestrian traffic picks up.

A

So it hasn't, it's been working well watching it on the video. It hasn't been a critical concern.

A

Where a lot of pedestrians are coming out between that those stopped cars.

A

um So you know as traffic increases for somewhere. We can continue to look at it, but we haven't seen.

A

The critical need at this point yet for the rfb I mean. Certainly we could put up uh the static signs.

A

You know the regular, yellow diamond signs with pedestrian crossings, as we just discussed for.

A

Islington, um but not yet seeing the critical need for the rfb, the drivers are allowing.

A

Pedestrians to come out, the drivers are stopping so they're, not blocking the crosswalk. Even though.

A

They're on either side of the crosswalk and and the pedestrian activity hasn't been heavy when the.

A

Vehicle queue has been there, but it's certain. We can certainly continue to monitor on this one. It.

A

Now this is an update on what's happening so yeah, so we'll just continue to monitor.

I

Erica sorry, um one of my concern, I have a couple of concerns with this location and it's part of.

C

Kind of this whole area, I'm not as concerned with people crossing in between stopped cars.

C

I'm more concerned with people crossing when cars are moving because they're going. You know.

C

The speed data indicates they're going pretty quickly and seeing the pedestrians and stopping.

C

For them in those locations, I don't know what the video has shown for me. I think the concern is just.

C

This is effectively a safe route to or what we're telling people is the safe route to school. For.

C

That quadrant of town we've just discussed the south and pinehurst neighborhood. You know we're.

C

Encouraging them to come down to this location across. We have all the folks on broad and back.

C

That whole neighborhood, who will need to come this way to cross unless we want kids crossing sagamore.

C

Which I really I think that could be a great spot for them to cross and go through the cemetery. But.

C

In effect, I think this is probably a better location, um so I I don't know I just want to.

C

Advocate to make sure that we're thinking about the whole comprehensive plan of getting kids.

C

Safely to the schools in this direction and I'm curious what your observations were in terms of.

C

Not when the cars were stopped, but when they were moving, how that appeared to work from a.

C

Safety perspective yeah, I mean there certainly is a lot of pedestrian activity at this intersection.

A

Of seeing a lot of traffic pedestrians on broad street crossing at this location, continuing up.

A

Broad street and and if the sidewalk is removed on the other side of south street,.

A

To that last block it'll be more pedestrians crossing as well. So um you know we we've seen.

A

The pedestrians crossing without an issue I mean they are waiting for traffic to to for a.

A

Gap in traffic and crossing, but it hasn't been any close calls, but it is a heavy pestering location.

A

So you have the traffic, you do have a pedestrian light down at the intersection.

A

Of south and sagamore, and it seems to be when that button is pushed down there, that's when traffic.

A

Gets stopped and when the traffic cues up back to the broad street intersection, so um people coming.

C

Down abroad won't be able to get that to that intersection anymore. No, when we take the sidewalk.

C

Out yeah and that sidewalk section on south is only from right now from pinehurst to broad.

A

Well to to sagamore, and but that last section would be removed between broad and sagamore.

A

So it's it's a you know, it's a tough call because it's it is working well now, but.

A

But there is a lot of pedestrian activity at that location, mary lou. Yes, um thank you.

N

When is the sidewalk work going to be done with the tree? When are we going to pull it.

N

Up, yes, because I would imagine when that work is done, the pedestrian traffic will increase.

N

As eric mentioned, yeah I'll mention, I'm hesitant to pull that sidewalk up.

N

You're hesitant to pull sidewalk up because it'll affect the trees.

H

Well, because it'll it'll impact, uh I wanted to get some consensus here uh before we did anything.

H

um You know, obviously we're very cognizant of protecting the trees.

H

We also are very cognizant of you know, trying to protect the protect the pedestrians right.

H

um So right now it's it's a heaved sidewalk, but people are using it. They know it's heave. It's not.

H

There's no delusion that it's an ada compliant sidewalk, but it's still a section of sidewalk.

H

That people are comfortable enough to navigate so for that reason, I'm hesitant to pull it out.

H

Right, peter, I'm sorry go ahead mark my question was: is there any plans in the future for.

F

Enhancement, traffic safety enhancements at the lights on the corners of south and sagamore. No.

E

Okay, it was just upgraded yeah, it was, it was done a while ago, so people are using that that.

F

Pedestrians are used to that intersection to cross. Yes, okay, for sure one concern has been.

A

Raised about if rfb was installed at broad street, that drivers often will stop. You know until those.

A

Lights, stop flashing and, if they're coming out of town on south street and they come to that.

A

Flashing light they may stop, which would then cue traffic back up into the signalized intersection.

A

So that that's another thing to consider, we don't know if that would happen or not, but.

A

It is a concern. That's been raised, the reason why I brought that up- and you know.

F

This came up before indirectly with peter, and I, when I was talking, is that if you take those.

F

Trees down it's going to leak, we're not going to need to have some kind of crossing people.

F

Can go down to the to the roadway, but then young families are going to say well, that's too busy of.

F

An intersection we don't feel comfortable, but then again people. How do families feel when.

F

They're crossing on the corner of congress and in islington street, which is, in my view, I'm not an.

F

Engineer is comparable when it comes to traffic versus pedestrian crossing. So I you know it's.

F

I try to alleviate putting in that that beacon light and to have people use that intersection.

F

As it is, um but then again too, the catch-22 is taking down old trees and putting in.

F

And putting the sidewalk in there yeah there's no there's no support for taking those trees down.

F

No there's not so your concern relative to the function of the of I assume you're.

H

Talking about the south and um miller sagamore intersection.

H

It's working very well, yes, uh so that so there's no there's no issues at that intersection.

C

I mean families are using that intersection. I don't think they feel unsafe crossing memory.

F

Yes and they can go from there's a sidewalk, so if you're living on jones avenue in that neighborhood.

F

There, in order for them to use that intersection that are going down abroad, they would go down.

F

Sagamore but they would have to cr, there's no sidewalk on the. What's that the west side.

F

You'd have to go on the other side where there is a sidewalk, so you have to cross somewhere.

J

I'm just trying to think of that neighborhood and how they can use that intersection safely or if.

F

They can use that instead of using broad street to cross steve. You had a comment. I I just I've always.

B

Felt that an rfb is not appropriate here when you're one block from a recently updated, safe.

B

Fully signalized crosswalk intersection, so I and this speaks to mary lou's point about.

B

Thinking about the the metrics for where we consider our fees and not because we're getting.

B

A lot of requests for them, so my feeling is that this is not a highest and best need for an rrfb.

B

So I would not support one there: a crosswalk potentially but not an rfp.

C

Erica um in response to steve's comment, I agree that we're close to an intersect signalized.

C

Intersection that works well, but if there's a barrier that prevents people from getting to.

C

That signal as intersection- I think, that's you know it's a false option for them. If they can't.

C

Get to that intersection safely, it doesn't matter that that intersection is close by.

C

But I recognize that an rfp might not be desired at this location.

C

This is, I think, the only significant crossing of one of these larger roads that school kids use to.

C

Get to school that doesn't have a crossing guard. Could we, instead of an rfb, consider.

C

Putting a crossing guard there during school.

H

Can consider we times have a crossing guard at uh miller and south, but that doesn't help.

H

I I know it doesn't mean at that location, yeah it'd be just too you know the other.

I

Thing we could consider is moving that person over um and then rely on the kids to use this.

H

The buttons which is not necessarily you know, I have a question for eric. I'm sorry eric.

F

Are you done uh peter was talking, I'm sorry, pierre, I'm I'm finished sorry go ahead. Mark.

F

Is there any video showing people walking past the the old trees in the old sidewalk, because.

F

The public work is going to remove that sidewalk and put lawn in there instead of lawn. Can it be.

F

Some kind of natural path, so people can use that is really tight. I've walked that several times.

F

Between the roots of the tree and the fence, but it is walkable, it's just making its.

F

Making it smooth without taking down the roots. That's that's a no that's an untouchable too.

F

um I mean: are people there's a video, any video show that people are used to still walking.

F

Yeah, you know oh yeah, I've seen I've observed people going through it with strollers and.

H

Bicycles- and you know they- kids people use that section of sidewalk. Okay. So, even though.

F

It's based on the condition, even if the sidewalks would move people will still be using that okay.

O

And we don't need a motion on this. This is we're just going to continue to monitor.

H

Update all right, so, let's move on um because we spent quite a bit of time on that item.

O

Old business item d, state street crosswalk, african burial, ground report back from nbb4.

O

Oh that's a date: okay, oh yeah, because that was like an rsa or something yeah. I was first.

A

On the agenda, so we've been collecting video at the state street crosswalk at.

A

The african burial ground and watching that there we have not seen issues with.

A

Traffic yielding to pedestrians at this crosswalk, we do have one of those in-street pedestrian yield.

A

Signs on the rubber base, and that seems to be effective, pedestrians are crossing without.

A

Hesitation or delay you know, drivers are yielding to them. It's it's working very.

A

Well, as watching the video that we have so, I would not recommend an rfb at this time. Okay,.

O

Item e mechanic street suggested angle parking by resident sample motion to place on file so moved.

H

Second, any discussion, uh roll call vote, please marilyn mcelwain, steve pesci, yes,.

D

Mark syracusa, harold whitehouse, erica wagonic, yes, police, captain mike maloney, yes,.

D

Public works director, peter rice, yes, city manager, karen connard, yes,.

D

Chairman andrew bagley, yes and now we have the speed limit working group presentation.

C

uh Tyler's not here so I'm gonna. Yes,.

C

Give you guys an update uh unrehearsed here we go so we have this organized by. um I think decisions.

C

Oh here we go what's been been accomplished and what our next focus is and if we keep going.

C

So, as uh we talked about last time, um we have uh re-established neighborhood connectors.

C

As 25 mile an hour recommendations instead of 30 mile an hour recommendations.

C

And I think if we go to the next slide. Oh sorry, let me just uh oh thanks. Yeah.

C

Great team effort, thank you.

C

um So we've also been looking at the neighborhood connector streets as as we've.

C

Mentioned a couple times we're trying to be pretty systematic about this um and not kind of spot.

C

Jump from place to place so with that change in the design guidelines, we've also evaluated.

C

The neighborhood connector streets to see what is in alignment with that new guideline recommended.

C

Guideline and what's different in general, I think we've adjusted pretty much all the neighborhood.

C

Connector streets to come to alignment in some fashion, islington and middle road have.

C

We're doing six month trials at a 25 mile an hour speed limit. South street is one road.

C

That we're still working on- and I think that's probably obvious why we are given the number of.

C

Things that came up today so we'll keep looking into that a bunch of others are already at 25.

C

There are a couple of neighborhood connectors streets that we are recommending to change to.

C

Primary connectors, they have a target speed of 30 miles an hour, and this has to do with.

C

The nature of the roads and also the supportive treatment that would make sense on these roads so.

C

Farmland and rockingham avenue connect directly to spaulding turnpike and really connect through.

C

To uh I think it's woodbury there right, yes, and so they they don't feed into neighborhoods in in the.

C

Same way that our other neighborhood connectors do the type of traffic that they're getting the.

C

Number of curb cuts on them. Not only do we think they serve as primary connectors, but the type of.

C

Pedestrian and bikes bicycle treatment you would want to put on a road like this is more consistent.

C

With what one would see on a primary connector instead of a neighborhood connector street.

C

So we think this is a better alignment for those roads. I don't know if anyone has questions about.

C

That or I'll keep going we also have a handful of neighborhood connector streets that we think.

C

Really should be neighborhood slow streets, neighborhood slow streets have a target speed.

C

Of 20 miles an hour and there's a handful of roads that had been classified as neighborhood.

C

Connector streets that we really think are more functional as neighborhood slow streets. That's.

C

um You know they're not really getting you to a neighborhood they're part of the neighborhood.

C

um And so, instead of changing the speed limit from 20 to 25, we think it's more.

C

Appropriate to change the category for those from neighborhood connector to neighborhood, slow.

C

And so that it starts to increase the consistency of.

C

The categories, the speeds and the context of the road- so um these are just maps of.

C

The roads that we just mentioned.

C

What comes um she did that we did that neighborhood connector streets? um There are a couple of neighborhood.

C

Connector streets that are currently posted at 20 that we recommend breezing to 25.

C

This is in accordance with how they're operating as neighborhood connector.

C

Streets and not neighborhood slow streets, you know they're accessing neighborhoods, they're.

C

Getting you two neighborhoods: they do have some amount of through traffic on them. The context of.

C

The roads again looking at the number of curb cuts, the users of the road and what supportive.

C

Treatment for bicycle and pedestrians would be appropriate. Mr karen, can I ask a question now? Yes,.

E

Did you take into consideration the cardinal street, which is uh with the senior center.

E

You know and increasing it you know from 20 to 25 miles an hour um we did and um all of these things.

C

Can are up for discussion if folks feel like it isn't appropriate. um We do feel like it's not.

C

20 miles an hour is a is a very slow speed. That's actually not in accordance with state law,.

C

And really is meant for kind of within a neighborhood. This is cottage street is a road that.

C

Serves local land use, but also is serving traffic going through the road and the amount of.

C

You know you, wouldn't you wouldn't think of it as a shared street, where people would just walk down.

C

The street that's kind of the sort of street that one would look at as a neighborhood, slow street.

C

Where you would have that 20 mile an hour speed limit, if it kind of a rule of thumb, is if you.

C

Feel like you would want a sidewalk to feel safe on that road. Then we probably want it.

C

To be 20, you know it's a 25 mile, an hour road, it's a neighborhood, connector street. It's not.

C

A 20 mile, an hour neighborhood slow street was, I think, is one way to think about that.

E

I was just concerned, you know, did they take in consideration that this is where the senior center.

E

And they just opened up and they've got a lot of activity. I think steve has a well. I I think the.

B

Issue there is we do and earlier commenter in public comments mentioned the sidewalks. I think.

B

That should be on the list for completing the continuity of the sidewalk system on.

B

Cottage street, but if you look at the surrounding streets and the use of cottage.

B

It's not it really is. It should not be a 20 mile per hour street. It should be.

B

We think appropriately a 25 mile per hour street with a completed sidewalk system.

C

um We're working really hard to try and make sure there's this consistency and continuity.

C

With the contacts of the street and with the context of other streets, and so.

C

People know what the appropriate expectations are, and I think steve summarized well.

C

The direction here um so that's those are decisions that we've.

C

The recommendations that we have, if we move on to the greens, where we're looking forward, um we are.

C

Looking into primary connectors in the same way that we've kind of comprehensively looked at the.

C

Neighborhood connectors to look for alignment with the guidelines.

C

And make sure the context is all aligned, so primary connector roads include ocean road, elwin.

C

Peverly hill sagamore lafayette, banfield, newcastle long road lang road. We are recommending adding.

C

Farmland and rockingham avenue to those these have target speeds of 30 miles an hour.

C

Many of them are already at 30.. There are a couple of inconsistencies. I think that's the next slide.

C

Peverly hill and elwynn road are posted at 20.. Both of those are in the middle of some um plans.

C

For mixed-use pads and pedestrian bicycle treatment, um and so what we'd like to do.

C

Here, I think, for both of those is wait until those projects happen and monitor speeds and traffic and.

C

See what makes the most sense in those locations newcastle ave is a little bit tricky.

C

It's a primary connector, it's posted at 20 in some places. I think it's posted at 30.

C

uh Right along the bridge up into newcastle, um so this is one we're just starting to.

C

Work on and think about, that is a tricky one. Newcastle is tricky because of the switch from.

B

City of portsmouth to state to tech back to town of newcastle. There's a lot of.

B

Inconsistencies there and obviously there's a lot of it is obviously a primary route.

B

But also has a lot of ped bike traffic, so we need to do more, thorough work on that and think about.

B

Coordination with the three entities yeah, but I think most of the others- are already posted at 30..

C

So that category isn't generally in pretty good shape and I think we're moving towards resolving.

C

Most of that we've also continued exploring the idea of a downtown advisory speed zone. There's.

C

We're getting some, I guess, legal guidance in terms of what what makes sense what's allowed here. um So.

C

You know the rough idea is that we would advise that this is a dense uh pedestrian zone um to.

C

Keep these in in the 20 mile an hour range. That's generally, what people are already driving, but just.

C

To reinforce that again, you'll hear this theme from us every time you know we're just trying to.

C

Get consistency with the road context and what people should be doing and the speed limit in.

C

State law and have that all be the same message and just to amplify what eric is saying there. We.

B

We did meet uh with constituents in the city and the city uh uh attorney and we're waiting.

B

Excuse me, assistant assistant attorney, thank you. We're waiting for response from the nhma new.

B

Hampshire municipal association, uh in regards to the concept, so this is still being discussed about.

B

Positives and negatives and possibilities, so no no recommendation yet at this point.

C

So, in conclusion, our summary of our neighborhood connectors, we recommend.

C

Reclassifying two of those streets as primary connectors instead of neighborhood connectors.

C

Reclassifying four of those streets to neighborhood, slow streets and adjusting speed.

C

Limits of three of them to match the remainder of the neighborhood connectors and those are.

C

Recommendations, I think we need a motion on those and then in general, our next steps are looking at.

C

The primary connectors and continuing to evaluate the idea of a downtown pedestrian speed zone.

M

Yes, I can make a comment. Yes,.

M

Just as we look at adjusting, perhaps speed limits throughout the city, I would recommend we have.

M

Some type of formal mechanism so that the officers on the street know about these changes.

M

For example, middle road- I can tell you that some of the officers that are out there saw.

M

The new 25 signs and they didn't they didn't know it had changed so, although they can see.

M

The sign and obviously they're out there every day, running radar and they see that it's changed.

M

It would be better for us to learn of a change in the speed limit by not reading it on a sign.

M

And as we as we move forward to potentially tweak some or have uh pilot speed limit signs,.

M

Whether um whether it's minutes from this meeting or somehow just a way that the police department.

M

Is aware of these changes and how they're gonna take place, um in fact is I I wasn't aware that.

M

That middle road changed to 25 as a six-month pilot. Is that correct? That's not permanent.

C

Yes, I think we discussed that at our last meeting. Okay, the idea that middle and islington right now.

C

The speed data isn't clear that we can reduce the speed limit, so we're trying to do some temporary.

C

A pilot to encourage lower speeds with traffic calming measures and simultaneously lower.

C

The speed limit to see if there's, that change behavior that we're looking for.

C

Okay and and how do all the city ordinance all the speed limits are contained in city ordinance, so is.

M

If there's a change determined in this committee, how quickly does the city ordinance get changed.

O

We do the omnibus so doesn't that help us out where we kind of give us a trial.

A

Yes, you know any measure, that's adopted by this committee and then approved by city council. Can.

A

Be implemented on a trial basis for up to a year, okay and then, if it's successful, then it would go.

A

Forward for three readings to become an official ordinance, because the officers actually use those.

M

City ordinances, frequently on the road we have, we have apps on our phone that we can access uh all.

M

The city ordinances so there's something that an officer doesn't know they actually consult those.

M

City ordinances, quite a bit for speed limits. So um if those are the sheriff um in terms of.

H

Clarity from the legal side, um I think you're best waiting for the ordinance to actually be changed.

H

Before you do enforcement uh reason being there is some dis there is some discussion or or.

H

Difference of opinion, whether um the temporary enactment by city council is is something that.

H

Is acceptable um if it came to get challenged, um so it is a I think, for now we're better off.

H

Using the judgment of you know, these are wrecking where it's like also pilot.

H

And we're you we're doing it we're seeing if we're affecting change but in terms of legal.

H

Action, I think, you're better off. You know to not be able to not be challenged by having.

H

It clearly in the ordinance, okay, fair enough, thank you so that would be on a trial. Excuse me.

N

You're done yes, anything that doesn't go through the ordinance change; okay, so that.

N

You're saying this can't be enforced at this point, I'm saying that the until it's until a lawsuit is.

H

uh Brought to that point, we will not have clear definition. It's murder hope that doesn't happen.

H

What's your motion, I'm not making any motion so this one yeah. This was just the discussion too.

B

Sorry, I really commend the work that has been done by the subcommittee. It's just amazing how detailed.

N

It is and how complicated it is, and I think it's a great start to get the speed limits, lowered or.

N

Consistent throughout the city and I'm not sure if you've gotten feedback from residents.

N

In the community- because I haven't seen this in the newspaper, I haven't seen these changes written.

N

Up by jeff, mcmanamy or anybody, so I'm wondering if there's been a, there has been feedback and the.

O

Feedback has been positive. um People noticed that the science went from 30 to 25 and they.

O

Actually commented that they thought there was going to be a lot of people in the uproar and.

O

All the feedback I've seen so far is actually no. We, we are happy with you. Lowering the speed limit.

O

Even if it may not actually help the they admire the effort, what I'm a little concerned about.

O

Is in the places, particularly where we're going from 20 to 30 miles per hour, I don't think we're.

O

Going to see such positive feedback, so I think we should be cautious with those we find that some.

B

Of the inconsistencies are streets that should be increased incrementally and you know first blush.

B

That's not as popular a thing to do, but what we, as a committee have been trying to do is stay.

B

Fixed on the classification, the neighborhood and the posting, so that there's a logical.

B

Connectivity and consistency between all of them so now we're going to get into these.

B

Recommendations where a couple of them should be raised, we're trying to stick to our logic and.

B

Protocol, of course, in the end, it's the council's decision on that, but we're trying to provide.

B

Recommendations based on principles and logic- and you know the legal precedent, mr chairman,.

H

If I may yeah, I I to commend the efforts and I think it's you know it's long overdue. I think.

H

The challenge will be those streets that you know if you're signing them, um if you're taking signs.

H

Down and not resigning them, that's one thing: if you're actually taking sign down and putting up a.

H

Faster speed limit, there will be some reaction. What I, what I would recommend is that, prior to.

H

Asking council to vote a presentation is given to city council so that it is clear.

H

What they are voting on good, um because what happens sometimes is there's.

H

It's not always clear what pts actions are being done and there's you know claim of foul. um So I I.

H

Would you know to be effective in this case to communicate it clearly, I think a presentation.

H

To councils before any changes were made, and I think we should think as a committee whether.

H

Leaving um sleeping dogs, you know lying, um uh maybe or doing it incrementally, as as roads are.

H

Changed maybe the better approach, um but that's uh for the community to decide city manager.

H

Mr chairman, uh perhaps a step for the pts to consider would be to re-notice this presentation.

G

Make it clear that we're looking for feedback at the next pts meeting or at a pts meeting.

G

Before this goes to council, because if I would, I would imagine, the council would want to know what.

G

Feedback pts got and and and I think we should give it due notice at a meeting- I don't know if.

G

July is the best meeting it's sort of the peak of the summer. I would defer to this group, but.

H

Would you consider a night meeting for that? I would consider a night meeting for that.

G

I think would pts consider a night meeting for that. I think that might be appropriate. Yeah yeah.

E

Yeah, uh harold anybody, any motion that I would suck uh repo support is the the word.

E

Pilot program has to be used in the motion very important, yeah, absolutely.

O

So erica at what point do we think we should I mean so we're doing our best to kind of.

C

Every month be making sure we're bringing recommendations, I think tyler's doing a good.

C

Job of making sure we're not just talking and uh actually getting to some sort of decisions, but so.

C

I mean with hope we will have more recommendations next month. I don't think I mean do we want to wait.

C

Until I don't know when we're going to finish at this rate, it's like two months per category yeah.

B

It's it's an amazing amount of incremental work, but there's no we're not in any rush. You know.

B

It's not like. We get points for fixing some of these incongruencies that have been there.

B

For 25 years, what is another month matter, but I think maybe we could pull together.

B

uh Work to date and show to the council in a streamlined thing. This is what.

B

Is in progress right now as a pilot, here's pending recommendations and try to get that boiled down.

B

Or do it here sorry in an evening our next, we could do that an even maybe we.

B

Pause and let people digest where we are and then one slide that talks about next steps.

C

What if we um just draw a line at neighborhood connectors, that's you know, we've. I think.

C

Not quite finished but mostly finished going sorry, I just started coming that's okay, drawing.

C

A line at neighborhood connectors and treating that as like a coherent packet of information.

C

To present, I don't know if it makes sense to get into what we're doing next or not or just kind of.

C

This we've kind of finished that section, so maybe that's a time that we can pause and share it.

C

um Because I do feel like we're just gonna keep having stuff. I don't wanna yeah like I do.

C

Think we kind of need to yeah. There needs to be a break at where we're sharing okay. So how about we.

O

Come back with this proposal, but with a motion attached to it that we'd be looking for public.

O

Input at a july ptsd july pts evening, possibly in the evening but not july, 4th.

O

Yeah time frame, because that would defeat the purpose.

O

And then you know we can raise some awareness to people because I think.

O

As we found you know, lowering speed limits is a is a kind of an easy one. There's not.

O

A lot of people against it at least that live on those streets. I think raising speed limits.

O

We're going to really want to hear from the public, because we're going to hear from them after we.

O

Do it if we don't allow for it beforehand? So, mr chairman, I think this is a great opportunity to.

H

To really highlight the work that is done to determine these um changes and and any of the.

H

Parking traffic and safety changes that we we do. This is not an arbor. These aren't arbitrary.

H

Decisions- these are things that are done. uh You know, with with rigorous evaluation engineering.

H

uh Looking at guidelines and actual data, you know we don't just arbitrarily take a book off and.

H

Say, well, that's what we got to do. We take. We take actual data, including hours and hours of video and.

H

I think it's a good opportunity to to highlight that for the general public, so they understand.

H

That there is a there is a process, there are rules, there are things and there is thought that.

H

Goes behind this, um and and how do we get to the determination that something can go down slower.

H

If something really should be higher um and what types of treatments can you do um and and talk.

H

About the resources that are online already uh for people to look at um through the through this.

H

Committee, so I I think it's a great opportunity, whether we truncate it to just one area or not,.

H

I I don't really just feel strongly one with the other than that, but I would suggest maybe.

H

For the july meeting, if the regular daytime that we come back with a proposed presentation,.

H

Or at least you know the firm solid outline of that for that next meeting so that everybody.

H

Understands what we're going to talk about at that meeting um and fine-tune it if needed,.

O

Okay, and so with the primary connectors, we're thinking of not bringing that back.

O

For clare yeah, I mean, I think it depends when we have a night meeting uh when we want to bring this.

C

To the public, we're still just kind of getting started with the primary connectors, I don't know.

C

That we have hardened, you know we don't. We haven't, brought any recommendations for primary connectors.

C

Yet, as a category, um we are recommending changing some neighborhood connectors to primary connectors.

C

But that means we're not really planning to adjust them until we evaluate the primary connectors.

O

So I'm just I'm looking at the slide with beverly hill road, elwin road and newcastle avenue.

O

And I'm worried they may those particular roads might overwhelm the conversation about.

O

Yeah we're not projects, so let's not yeah bring those into the mix, maybe not the first.

O

Yeah, let's just leave those off, and this is something we're just reviewing and talking.

H

About right now, there's no decision at this point um I know I live on. Newcastle avenue.

H

It's you go in 30, it's you feel like you're. Going really fast. I mean you're, not gonna.

H

It's not something that you're comfortable um unless you get on the other side of the river.

C

I think there's a short section of newcastle, which is what is really the the city's purview.

H

um The department from south from south to close from, like the marsey pleasant point.

C

South the pleasant point, I think, is, I don't remember the categorization, but I don't think.

C

Is in this category, but I think the primary connector starts at the end of.

C

Pleasant point out to newcastle right and that's that kind of definition, that distinction.

H

You know doesn't really get seen by anybody yeah, so they just see it as being oh you're,.

H

Gonna increase this everybody's gonna go flying down this little road right yeah. So I.

O

Think that's a good idea that we look to schedule something in the evening in july and that we leave.

O

Those particular streets out of the discussion at this time, because we really want to focus on.

O

As peter said that this is a methodical process, that's done with studies and engineering data.

O

And things like that and try to take as much emotional because of the challenges of those.

O

Particular streets already have out of the equation, so everybody understands that we're.

O

Looking at a very analytical approach: well, I think if we focusing on the neighborhood.

C

Connector streets, which are the ones that we've finished, I think if we, if in the public meeting.

C

uh Like the dedicated public meeting um focus on the method and the neighborhood connector streets,.

C

I think that's plenty of content and I think we'll illustrate the process that we're going through.

C

I don't think there are quite as many uh hornets nests in the neighborhood connector streets.

C

um But I think, there's important things to talk about, so I I think that would be a good.

C

Package of information to discuss- I don't maybe we'll- have made some progress on the primary.

C

Connectors by then- but I don't I mean, two of them are not going to do anything with until the.

C

Project is done so you know we might pause on the neighborhood connectors anyway.

C

Okay, so do we need a motion to do this, or do we want to? I don't think so. Okay, so we'll we'll.

B

You've, given us some directions, yeah we've got some direction and then special meeting of the.

E

Traffic parking safety committee before next month, before maybe in july, you'll, be in july.

H

Yeah, we'll we'll talk and whatever you guys come up with and then we'll present that and make.

O

Sure it's a well-noticed meeting and everything that yep and we realize this does get a little.

B

Mind-Numbing this stuff, but we're, I think we all appreciate that you guys are doing all this work.

O

um Because it's not easy work and you know the pay is- is not very good. Excuse me. I just want.

O

To comment on a july evening date july is such a vacation month. I think you'll get feedback from.

N

Residents saying july you're going to give this information to us in july. Just be careful yeah. I.

N

Know I think, yeah we're just saying everybody gets out of town in july. I don't think there's any good.

O

Time for meetings like this somebody's going to always have to be in convenience, so I think if we.

O

Avoid the july 4th week, obviously yeah that would, but I don't think we can really pick a good time.

A

Our next regular pts meeting is july: 7th, uh-huh, okay, um so we're.

O

Running a little bit over time here, so let's try and speed up through um so old business.

O

Islington street at drill court request, do not block intersection by resident.

O

Sample motion to move and place on file. Okay, um anybody wants to make that motion.

N

I thought there was more talk about that. uh Well, let's make a motion, then we can discuss.

O

Okay in a second second, okay and discussion, I think that that is a craze.

N

It is a crazy intersection- and I think we've talked about this before.

N

um Of putting the do not block, I'm not sure what the problem is with not putting that.

A

Yes, I I couldn't address that, so we we have the new signal we have at the intersection of.

A

Bartlett and islington has provides video of that location that intersection of jewel court as well.

A

So I've watched a lot of peak hour video when the traffic is the heaviest at that location. um You.

A

Have a thousand cars an hour going through that look at that intersection, but the left turns into.

A

Jewel court are only 20 cars, it's very low left turn volume into jewel court and most of those.

A

Cars are coming off of bartlett street because, as you can see, you know, traffic coming out of town on.

A

Islington has a chance to make a left on albany street to get into that neighborhood and that's.

A

What they're doing, rather than coming through the signal and trying to make a left into jewel, so the.

A

Predominant flow is the 20. Cars are an hour coming out of barley street and then making a left and.

A

Out of those 20 cars an hour watching, the video 17 of them are making that movement without a problem.

A

There's only a few cars an hour that are actually having to wait and then, when that happens, they.

A

The backup I s, the worst backup I saw- was three or four cars behind them. Making that right turn.

A

And that right turn from bartlett street is allowed to be. You know it's a right on.

A

Red they got it right when the left turn is going from islington street the only time they you know.

A

They can make it right just about any time they want, so it doesn't really slow them up too much.

A

And uh what I and the way the signal works also is that left turn after the right turn comes out.

A

To borrow the street and say they're stopped to make a left into jewel and they're blocked. Well,.

A

That very next movement of the signal is a left turn arrow for that islington street onto barlet.

A

So that clears up that blockage in that on that islington street approach and those left turns are.

A

Able to get through and then what happens after that left turn goes to red. You have the green.

A

Traffic, the green light for the traffic on islington street, and so if you were to put.

A

A do not block box there. You would have the left lane stopping to allow a gap, but then the green.

A

The through lane has a green light, so if you were to make a left turn across the stop traffic.

A

You would be trying to cross a lane that is not stopped. So it's it's a dangerous situation where.

A

You're allowing traffic to cross one lane, not realizing that both lanes are not stopped. That's.

A

Why I'm not recommending that we do the do not block box here, because the the way the phasing is.

A

Operating on that signal, you don't have both lanes stopped at the same time, and and it's not a heavy.

A

Movement and I'm not seeing it causing a lot of backups, I mean it does occasionally, but it's not.

A

Predominantly and it's not a significant backup when it does happen, so I think you're you're.

A

Trying to make uh solve a solution, but it's uh creating other problems inadvertently by that that.

A

Through traffic having the green light, not having to stop for the box move to place on file, second,.

E

What yeah, I think you know, the public comment was split on this, where people wanted it and people.

O

Didn't want it and now we're hearing from the experts that it doesn't make sense. I think this.

O

Is a fairly straightforward one, I'm not going to vote against the motion, but for the record I mean.

B

Ideally, jewel court wouldn't be there and it's really a mess due to prior generations. Decisions.

H

Yeah, it's it's it's all great to say. Well, we should have we we oughta, but the reality is we.

H

Don't own those properties, yes someday, that's what we got someday. Hopefully we can change that yeah.

B

Let's take a roll call vote, please mary mary lou mcelwain, yes, steve pesci, yes, mark syracusa,.

D

Harold whitehouse, yes, erica wygonic, yes, police, captain mike maloney, yes, public works director.

D

Peter rice, yes, chairman andrew bagley, yes, now we're on to uh h, mckinley road, harrison avenue and.

O

Garfield intersections request for an always stop inside and crosswalk by resident sample motion.

O

Move to recommend implementation of proposed improvements in alta study, as funding allows.

H

I was just going to say, mr chairman, I don't I think, prior to making this motion there should be.

H

An update to the neighborhood as to the status of the of the plans and programs and making it clear.

H

That um that this would be something that would be done, I think there'd be some confusion. You.

H

Know, there's already a lot of concern relative to moving forward and I wouldn't want to take.

H

Action without the uh the neighborhood being made aware, mr chairman, join mark yeah. This is similar.

F

To what peter's saying so, I'm going to make a friendly amendment move to refer the allen park.

F

Mckinley road, sidewalk capital improvement, pop project, public comment and input process.

F

So to take up this idea as a resident, I like the idea, but as a as a committee member, I agree with.

F

Peter that there are going to be public input and comment sessions coming up in the future.

F

And uh people will be able to weigh on what they would like to see.

F

And so uh the friendly amendment would be to refer to the ellen part.

F

Mckinley road, sidewalk capital improvement project, public comment and input process.

H

So if I could reword that.

H

Make this part of the project uh and don't take action independent of the project.

O

I think that's a simpler motion. Do you agree with that mark just that we would place on.

O

File until the cip project comes forward, yeah we'll roll it into the it's part of the project.

F

Yeah, it's part of the project, but other people would like to be heard.

F

On their ideas, and if someone from the I'm just looking at continuity here.

H

Right we're just agreeing we would agree with what you're saying marco, it's just how rewarding it.

H

It's it's! Okay, all right, we're, basically placing it on file until the project in its entirety comes.

O

Forward it's my understanding. There is a concern that you know, people have ideas and they want to.

F

Be heard and a resident did come forward through the pts with their idea, which is great and as a.

F

Resident, I agree with it. I like the idea, but there is a since there is a process. You know a capital.

F

Improvement process for the public that we should be using that, instead of the ptf to approve it.

H

I withdraw my my motion and I'll say: uh move to place on file.

H

Second, can we have a roll call vote, please mary lou mckellen, yes, steve pesci, yes, mark syracusa.

D

Yes, harold whitehouse, yes, erica wygonic, yes, police, captain mike maloney, yes, public works.

D

Director peter rice, yes, chairman andrew bagley, yes and then uh I maplewood avenue at dennett street.

O

Report back on request for rrfb: yes, uh we've been collecting video data at the intersection.

A

And uh seeing you know we're certainly having a substantial amount of pedestrian activity about.

A

15 uh pedestrians, an hour at the peak times, um the weeble at sun in the intersection is working.

A

Well, I mean traffic for the most part yields you do get some traffic. That's coming down the hill.

A

Or? Out of town at a greater rate of speed, who aren't necessarily stopping every time.

A

So I mean this intersection is very busy a lot of activity going on side, streets and driveways.

A

Pedestrians bicycles, so you know this could be a location where an rfb could make sense. The.

A

Existing crosswalk is going into a driveway on one side. It really needs to be brought up to standards.

A

With tip-down ramps in the in the sidewalk, so you're getting pedestrian traffic out of driveways.

A

So it does need some some additional work in the rfb, maybe an appropriate measure to implement at.

A

This location move to uh have further evaluation done by staff and report back I'll. Second, that.

O

Discussion, mary lou, nope, nope, okay, uh we'll call vote, please mary lou mcelwain, yes, steve pesci, yes,.

D

Mark syracusa, harold whitehouse, yes, erica wagonic, yes, police, captain mike maloney, yes, public works.

D

Director peter rice, yes, chairman, andrew bagley, yes and then uh final in old business is jay maplewood.

O

Avenue pedestrian signal operations report back; okay- I don't have anything in the packet on this.

A

But we have uh looked at additional hours. We collected another four hour uh four days worth.

A

Of video out there and we've been watching the video and even got leela involved this time so.

A

We we aren't seeing the pedestrian uh pedestrians being cut off by the vehicles as the concerns. It's.

A

Operating as correctly as it should, I did see one instance where a vehicle cut in front of a.

A

Pedestrian but that pedestrian waved the vehicle on it was an older person who was slowly getting.

A

Across the street and said, oh come on, you can go first and let them through other than that. The.

A

Drivers are yielding, as they should they're turning behind the pedestrians.

A

Not seeing safety concerns out there, it's operating as it should and doesn't seem to.

A

Be the confusion I mean drivers get impatient, they honk their horns because they don't know.

A

Why they're having to wait for pedestrian, but they are, they are doing it it's working as it should so.

A

You know: we've collected additional data, we can continue to collect additional data, but.

A

We really haven't seen it. We've looked at over 100 hours now of video and we're just not seeing.

A

The conflicts that have been raised as a concern.

N

Yes, thank you. This is a hot button for me because it happens to me too frequently and.

N

I see it happening to other people that traffic coming from congress turning right on maplewood.

N

Come across their crosswalk and come right up to the next crosswalk- and I that's happened to me.

N

Three times in april, at congress street and at deer street. So until the light stays red.

N

While pedestrians are crossing, I think that these are problematic intersections and it's anecdotal.

N

So any other comments.

O

So I think I mean this is a challenging one, because there's anecdotal.

O

There's you know, it's been a big change that a lot of people don't like, but the engineering.

O

Data and the survey data supports, the change is working as it's supposed to be um so I.

O

Don't know that we can, you know we kind of have to go with what the data and the engineering.

O

People tell us as we'll make sense um the light turns green after the pedestrian icon turns to 15.

N

That's not enough time, you know I'm just barely and I'm not a slow walker across there when.

N

Even a flatbed trailer came from congress turning right on maplewood and came right.

N

Up and I just feel threatened by those and they're chomping at the bit to get past where I'm crossing.

N

Or with others I saw it happen yesterday I saw two people younger people dash across.

N

At congress in maplewood, because the car was coming to turn right, so I just, I think that.

N

There needs to be a change that there shouldn't be a green light, while the pedestrian light is on.

N

That's my take on this any other comments. Yeah we've discussed this so many times. You know.

E

Unbelievable yeah, I think you know we have. I wouldn't want to.

O

Say limited resources, but we have a lot of streets in the city to monitor and I yeah.

O

When it first changed, I was against it, but I walked that intersection every day and.

O

You know once all the changes to the lights were where the pedestrian gets. The ghost.

O

Signal before the cars get the green light so that you're actually into the intersection.

O

um Before they're moving yeah, I think it works unless they're staying. I know that's not.

O

Not everyone agrees, um but I I think the intersection works as intended and you know I'm.

O

Not a traffic engineer so when traffic engineers and research studies tell me it works and then.

O

We study that specific intersection and the video says that it works. I gotta go with the science on.

O

This one yeah, the problem we see sometimes is like you said: the pedestrians are not paying attention.

A

To the signal it turns gives them the walk signal and they don't realize that by the time they.

A

Step off the curb, it's already started to count. That does happen but didn't happen to me. I was.

A

Crossing ready to cross yeah three times in one month, it happened and that's just don't go there.

N

Yeah they get the pedestrian gets a seven second advance before the drivers get their green light.

A

So it gets them out into that they're jumping on the bit they're right at the crosswalk, where.

N

The pedestrian is yeah and there's a no turn on red sign, there's a yield to pedestrian signs. I.

A

Mean drivers will no matter what situation we have. Drivers are going to disregard signs yeah. This is.

N

The light turns green, while the pedestrian light is on that's my point. Yes, as a common practice,.

O

So, okay, now we have, I don't think we need a motion or anything on that. That's just.

O

That was for information.

O

Informational items, a monthly accident report from police, so we had 59 total crashes in april.

M

33 of those being reportable zero accidents involving bicycles, one involving a pedestrian.

M

When I look at the, I think I read these numbers on a monthly basis, but.

M

We don't necessarily see what these numbers mean or appreciate what these numbers mean.

M

All the time, but when you think of the amount of vehicles in our city every day and the amount of.

M

People in our city every day to have 33 reportable crashes in a month is quite.

M

Remarkable and it speaks to the enforcement efforts that our officers are out there.

M

Doing on a day-to-day basis, when you look at 33 crashes over four weeks, roughly uh that boils down.

M

To maybe one reportable crash a day for a city that has a tremendous amount of pedestrian and.

M

Vehicle population, so I'm glad to see those numbers, I'm not a knock on wood type guy, but.

M

Just last week we had a staff meeting and they put out eight reportable crashes for last week. So.

M

Hopefully that stays on trend even in april, when we're starting to see more people and vehicles.

M

Overall, for months month to month, are our crashes and, more importantly, our crashes with injuries.

M

Are where we like to see them and that's due to the efforts of the police officers out there.

M

um Being very highly visible, so that's it great. Thank you and I will say that is.

O

um One of the most common requests is, you know we like to see the police officers out there.

O

As much as possible- and I think you guys are doing a great job- thank you. So we have.

O

um I keep scrolling back and forth. I should have printed out the agenda um roadway projects in june.

O

Yes, this information is a memo in the packet just describing the projects that are coming up.

A

um If you haven't seen it we'll be doing work, work is ongoing right now on harvard princeton.

A

And dodge avenue and uh we'll be coming doing the final paving on islington street. The construction.

A

That was done the last couple years I'll look at this final coat of pavement out on marcy street.

A

There's a lot of gas line work and then that will be paved after the gas line. Work is done, bridge.

A

Street lot has reopened after its reconstruction there's some electrical contracting work going on.

A

On lad street, they were on market street. The past couple weeks and now they're moved to lad street.

A

And so that is closed, except for access to the parking garage and kate street and partly street.

A

Intersection will be uh finalize the construction with the median island and new crosswalks and rfbs.

A

And that will be in accordance with the plan that was approved by city council last fall.

A

So that will be coming up next uh by the end of the month great and there there is.

O

For the garage I know, that's not roadworks, but there's a public meeting. I believe, coming up.

H

Yes on the 9th, so if anybody's interested in what we're doing at the high hanover garage.

O

There's a chance to to learn more about that exciting project, exciting.

O

And I think that does it for informational items, is there any miscellaneous steve just the in.

B

Response to the one comment about little harbor road. Could we at a future meeting july august.

B

Get a report on little harbor road and next steps just to respond to that speaker. We can. I thought.

H

We had reported back and made wreck, you know and there were recommendations, and I thought that.

H

The decision was that there would be no action taken, um okay, but I would need to pull back and I.

A

Believe that we were going to uh re-monitor it in the summertime without we're going to remeasure or.

B

Re-Something yeah after the paving, also yeah yeah. Well, we after final paving, yes, we had paving done.

H

And we did monitoring, we reported back on the changes in speed and then I think we're going.

B

To wait for peak season this year to collect some more data, so maybe that's all I'm asking that we.

B

Remember to do that yeah and then the fall report back and then I I would love to see the mini.

B

Roundabouts thing in the fall: there's no, no time crisis. uh You know we developed some standards.

B

And thoughts about a pilot on that there seems to be some consensus anyway on many roundabouts.

H

If committee members feel like they would like to add an addend item to the.

H

Agenda to cover that that'd be fine, they often make good alternatives to four-way stops.

C

We have a fantastic crossing guard.

C

We have, in general, fantastic crossing guards. One commented to me this morning that they.

C

Would love it if um the waste collection could be delayed until after the school time, nope hey.

H

No way, I guess, they've observed a lot of close calls and they knew I was on the way to parking.

C

Traffic safety, so they asked that I mentioned it so I mentioned. I appreciate that concern our.

H

Staff is very, very cognizant of kids and they do a great job. If anything, I would encourage people.

H

To pay more attention to them, uh because they've had many very, very close, near accidents and we've.

H

Had an actual accident that a gentleman lost his leg, um so it's a very dangerous profession, yeah.

H

And I appreciate people's concerns, uh but you know we. We are very well run tight organization when.

H

It comes to picking up stuff there's, not a lot of room to push off yeah. You know pick up for a.

H

Couple hours right, the school board have final decisions on crossing gods. um The appointments.

H

The appointment of them, no, no, no! No! It's it's! It's parking traffic! It's it's! The.

H

Parking division that supplies the uh at the you know, request of the school department.

C

They're all great, by the way, they're all great uh maryland. Yes, at next meeting.

N

Can we talk about the parking and traffic situation on penn hollow daniel with the.

N

Continued construction because it's not going to lay let up in any fast and- and you know the I'm.

N

Just commenting that the trucks are parking sure, but it's there nearly this note this.

H

There's no benefit to talking about it because by the time we're talking about it, we get done.

H

They're they're working to get done, they're going to have to they've got another they've got to do.

N

The interior, my comment is: why can't the city request that these trucks that sit there all day.

N

Long park at the lot at the end of state street near the bridge, instead of taking up places where.

N

Businesses require some parking. I will comment that I did speak to some business owners in the.

O

Area and they didn't forget the gentleman's name, but they said the problem's gotten much better.

O

Because there's somebody out there telling the trucks to move along now, especially the big box.

O

Trucks that park in front of shops- but I think you know director rice- is correct. It's.

O

It's going to be an ongoing problem that we just need to stay on top of on the ground, and I don't.

H

Know my point, is we don't need to pile on? We already know that this is an issue we're already.

H

We're already, on top of it, we're already constantly day-to-day dealing with it. Okay,.

H

Just having that additional, you know, fervor will not assist in what we're doing already.

N

I just want to say that the businesses are affected by the pickup truck the construction.

N

Truck we're sitting there all day, long with all due respect. Marlow, I get emails from the.

H

Businesses every day, I bet I'm very much aware of the impacts. So all I'm saying is that we do not.

H

Need as a committee to take it up and to kind of I'm making a comment about it, peter I'm making a.

N

Comment as a member of this committee sure that we should be paying attention to the businesses and.

N

If the city is doing it, we need more information on that, because I think it's a big concern.

H

And I'm explaining to you that that you asked to make it a topic that we do not need to do.

H

That topic, if you'd like to make it a topic, we've already made it the topic all right. Well, I think.

O

We're a bit over time and that's kind of the you know we're trying to keep these meetings.

O

Two hours, um so, if we put too much on the agenda, if we could get, we don't get through everything.

O

That's right, yeah, mr germany, adjourned. Okay, wait a second okay and I think we need a roll call vote.

O

um All right, mary lou miguel, wings, steve pesci, mark syracusa, harold whitehouse, erica wygonic, yes,.

D

Director peter rice chairman, andrew bagley, yes, thank you. Everyone.