►
From YouTube: City Council Meeting 07-03-18 Part 2
Description
Description
A
Have
for
potential
use
to
the
for
the
fish,
Ville
sale
I
feel
strongly
that
any
monies
that
come
out
of
that
should
not
be
something
that's
used
to
kicking
a
can
down
the
road
in
some
of
our
budget
items.
I
certainly
have
no
issue
when
it
comes
to
adding
security
to
a
building
or
refurbishing
a
durable
ability
that
has
a
durability,
durable
value
to
the
asset
of
the
city.
I
just
would
want
us
to
be
caution
to
not
think
in
terms
of
that
also
bails
out
as
I've
expressed
previously.
A
My
concern
of
not
meaning
minimum
standard
for
operating
budget
reserve
I
would
prefer
to
see
us
since
we
are
an
affluent
community
to
see
us
much
above
standard
in
that
regards
and
I
would
hope
that
we
would
philosophically
not
think
in
the
back
of
our
heads
that
that
that
those
assets
that
we
have
from
the
fish
field
sale
would
be
used
for
that
type
of
type
of
expenditure.
So
I
just
wanted
to
state
that,
as
a
matter
of
record
and
philosophy
on
my
individual
part,
I
would.
C
Would
like
to
see
us
take
a
serious
look
at
some
of
these
line
items
and
where
there
are
things
that
are
maybe
not
absolutely
necessary.
Maybe
we
do
need
to
push
some
of
these
back
into
other
calendar
years.
Maybe
we
need
to
spread
some
of
these
projects
out
that
are
even
though
they're
one-time
thing.
C
Maybe
we
need
to
spread
them
out
over
a
couple
more
years
so
that
our
numbers
reflect
that
we're
not
in
such
a
deficit
position
I'm
looking
at
seven
hundred
and
ninety
eight
thousand
for
use
use
of
reserves
in
2020,
that's
going
in
the
wrong
direction,
we're
hopefully
trying
to
get
rid
of
using
reserves,
and
this
is
absolutely
going
the
wrong
direction.
So
there
may
be
things
that
we
can
take
a
serious
look
at
pushing
back
a
year
or
two
or
spreading
things
out
the
to
so
even
even
the
City
Hall
renovations.
C
Maybe
we
have
to
spread
it
out
over
a
few
more
years,
rather
than
doing
everything
at
one
time,
we
really
were
very
I,
mean
I.
Think
we
pretty
much
all
agreed
a
while
ago
that
we
didn't
really
want
to
look
doing
a
millage
rate
increase,
but
there's
not
going
to
be
a
way
we
can't
if
we
approve
all
of
these
expenditures-
and
we
haven't
even
taken
into
account
what
it's
going
to
cost
for
the
citizens
master
plan,
which
is
mandatory
in
my
opinion,
I
think
then
we
don't
have
a
choice
on
that.
C
B
D
D
E
B
I
think
what
the
the
educational
piece
that
I'm
glad
that
you
put
together
here
kristin,
is
that
when
you
relate
those
kind
of
numbers
that
we're
talking
about
that's
point,
one
mil
like
that's
what
it's
actually
gonna
cost
to
take
to
do
this.
The
master
plan
like
people
need
to
realize
they
want
the
services
they
want.
You
know
the
drainage
that
we've
already
been
down,
that
road
we're
paying
for.
B
Everything
that
we
do
here
has
a
relatable
millage
rate
that
goes
along
with
it
and
so
to
me,
school
resource
officers
has
that
has
to
be
done.
It
shouldn't
even
be
in
the
discussion
of
the
yes/no
and
maybe
and
I
agree
with
Howard
as
much
as
we
heard.
We
need
another
dispatcher
and
the
fire
training
chief
and
that
we
did
the
pay
and
classification
study
that
we're
going
to
hear
about.
But
I
agree
with
his
philosophy
that
we
need
to
think
about
the
employees
that
we
have
here
now
before
we
delve
into
more
but
I'll.
D
Agree
with
the
with
what
I've
heard
I
looked
at
this,
and
when
you
introduce
I'm
glad
to
see
this,
what
a
military
the
mill
would
be.
Yes,
because
when
I
look
at
the
hundred
fifty
thousand
dollars
in
anticipated,
that's
how
much
the
property
values
have
gone
up,
then
that's
a
half
a
mil,
so
we're
already,
you
know
asking
people
to
chip
in
a
half
a
mil
and
without
you
know,
when
we
put
it
in
that
perspective,
the
other
thing
is
I
see
these
and
I.
Guess
it's
just
the
way,
I
think
we're
asked
to
do.
D
You
want
to
do
this
at
multiple
City
Council
meetings
I'd
like
to
see
all
this
on
a
spreadsheet,
so
we
can
show
these
and
allow
us
to
then
say:
yes,
no,
maybe
in
a
spreadsheet,
because
we
see
these
things
on
multiple
slides
in
it's
like
they're,
not
all
put
together,
but
yet
they're
all
part
of
a
plan,
and
you
know,
and
until
I
see
this
in
totality
like
that,
then
and
then
we
show
2019
separate
from
2020
and
okay
I
get
it.
We
want
to
show
the
impact
on
2020.
D
D
Those
are
all
part
of
this
whole
dialogue,
and
so
it's
just
it's
a
it's
a
con,
it's
a
it
isn't
separate
from
they
all
add
up
and,
and
so
it
needs
to
be
all
covered
in
one
document,
so
we
can
see
it
together
rather
than
multiple
because
I'm
looking
at
this
and
going
at
my
brain
I'm
trying
to
add
these
things
up
and
it's
you
know
I
think
for
us
to
be
transparent.
That's
the
way
we
need
to
reflect
it
and
and
I
agree.
B
E
C
Would
also
like
to
put
it
out
there
that
I
mean
we're
possibly
looking
at
a
1
mil
increase
from
the
school
board
if
that
goes
through
on
the
tax
bill
next
year,
for
the
average
person
in
Punta
Gorda
Isles,
that's
anywhere
between
four
and
five
hundred
dollars
per
property.
We're
also
looking
at
the
$100
increase
for
these
canal
assessment
for
PGI
and
I'm
speaking
right
now.
C
Only
for
PGI,
every
other
part
of
the
city
is
going
to
be
a
little
bit
different
because
they
don't
have
the
same
tax
base
that
we
do
but
and
I
can
I
can
honestly
say
in
20
years
that
I've
lived
here.
My
taxes
have
never
gone
down,
so
the
average
increase,
if
you
add
it
all
together,
I'm
looking
at
potentially
an
additional
eight
or
nine
hundred
dollars.
Just
for
my
house
and
I
mean
if
we're
talking
about
putting
an
additional
millage
amount
into
our
tax
structure.
E
G
C
D
B
B
You
know
they
can
come
here
and
say
that,
but
and
what
the
other
unknown
is
the
amendment
one
with
with
we're
going
to
have
a
decreased
revenue
source
coming
at
us
and
and
the
legislature,
the
bill
sponsor
you
know
was
basically
like
you
got
a
couple
years
to
plan
for
it.
That
was,
you
know.
That
was
the
response.
B
A
However,
I
think
we
also
need
to
be
cognizant
of
not
kicking
the
can
down
the
road
on
a
number
of
these
issues
and
if
it
does
require
a
millage
rate
increase
or
we
have
to
have
the
political
courage
to
do
such
because
what
we're
really
doing
by
doing
that,
if
we
have
to
and
I
want
to
emphasize,
if
because
sometimes
I
get
misquoted
on
some
of
my
thoughts.
But
if
we
have
to
what
we're
really
doing
is
preserving
and
again
the
asset
value
of
the
community.
A
By
doing
that,
that's
what
we
have
to
when
we
do
these
things.
We
have
to
keep
those
things
in
mind,
so
I
think
we
have
one
need
to
put
a
courage
not
to
kick
hands
down
the
road
and
two
to
do
what
we
have
to
do:
to
maintain
infrastructure
and
services
appropriately
to
maintain
the
value
of
our
community
and
I.
Think
that
there's
a
balance
that
we
and.
B
I
think
our
philosophy
of
keeping
the
millage
rate,
the
sole
basic
source
of
the
general
fund
has
you
know,
is
as
transparent
as
possible
with
with
the
public,
so
I'm
glad
that
we're
still
moving
in
that
direction
and
not
talking
about
fees
and
things
like
that
at
this
time.
Not
that
that
wouldn't
happen
in
the
future,
because
it's
come
up
probably
what
every
two
years
probably.
F
So
as
we
prepare
the
agenda
item
for
July
11th
included
in
there
is
going
to
be
a
adoption
or
approval
of
a
proposed
millage
rate
for
advertising
purposes.
I'm
not
hearing
from
everybody.
Our
goal
was
to
keep
it
the
same.
Are
we
still
going
to
provide
you
an
agenda
item
on
the
eleventh
that
does
that
we
can
do
that?
Yes,.
B
F
D
And
I
can
understand
that
and
I
and
agree
with
you
right
now,
because
we
have
a
lot
of
unknowns
at
this
point
in
time.
That
does
not
mean
that
calm
October
or
come
November
or
December
that
we
might
not
take
action
on
those
but
I.
Think
there's
a
just
a
couple
of
things
in
that
are
up
in
the
air,
so
I
think
it's
it's
prudent
for
us
to
really
lay
it
all
out
and
and
then
you're.
D
B
E
B
A
B
E
B
F
I
mean
we
I
mean
we're
gonna,
be
publishing
our
year
two
drainage
program
very
shortly.
But
remember
all
this
is
in
our
millage
rate,
our
general
fund.
We
don't
have
you
don't
separate
out
other
than
canal
maintenance,
a
lot
mowing
mm-hmm.
We
don't
do
what
other
communities
do
all
part
of
one
millage
rate.
E
A
Well,
Howard
I
think
that
the
consensus
of
the
five
of
us
has
been
commending
that,
because
we
point
out
how
much
we
get
and
in
the
quality
that
we
get
from
staff-
and
that
includes
you
too,
because
you
are
considered
on
staff
and
so
I
think
that
we've
been
very
complimentary
and
very
appreciative
of
what
we've
that
our
staff
has
been
able
to
do
a
lot
more
for
a
lot
less
I
emphasize
again.
We
don't
have
a
lot
of
fat
in
our
staff.
We
got
a
good
lean,
very
function,
staff
and
I.
F
D
B
H
H
Included
in
this
year's
budget,
as
in
the
cover
sheet,
we
allocated
some
funds
for
a
comp
and
classification
study
we
allocated
35,000.
The
actual
contract
was
for
26
and
change,
which
we
thought
was
a
pretty
good
savings.
The
company
that
we
chose
is
Cody
and
associates.
They
had
worked
with
the
city
before
back
in
the
early
2000s
and
then
in
2007.
We
did
a
comp
and
class
study
through
a
company
called
evergreen
and
it
had
been
11
years
since
we
done
it
and
we
were
due
each
year.
H
I
would
go
through
and
do
some
comparable
compensation
classification
comparisons
using
the
Florida
Lita
cities,
but
to
have
somebody
come
in
for
the
out
for
one
thing:
anytime,
you
bring
somebody
in
from
the
outside.
They
have
more
credibility
than
somebody
from
the
inside.
That's
generally,
the
way
it
works,
and
so
we
we
feel
like
coding
associates,
did
a
good
job
as
we
go
into
this.
H
H
E
H
Out
of
that
again,
20
for
retirees
and
we've
been
talking
about
retirees
now
for
about
five
years,
actually,
seven
years
going
back
seven
years.
So
as
we
did
this
comp
and
class
study,
we
wanted
to
look
at.
What
do
we
need
to
come
out
of
this
and
number
one
is
to
set
up
a
pay
plan
that
would
be
attractive
to
qualified
applicants
and
by
attractive
to
qualified
applicants.
We
were
looking
at
the
external
equity
component.
H
We
established
a
median
target.
In
other
words,
when
you
do
a
common
class
study,
you
set
your
percentage
of
where
you
want
to
be
with
respect
to
the
population
that
you
are
comparing
yourself
to
and
we
establish
median
as
where
we
want
it
to
be.
Now
that
me
was
the
same
target
that
we
set
the
last
time
we
did
this
in
2007,
so
we
didn't
really
change
any
methodology
there.
H
Obviously,
you
want
to
have
competitive
salaries
relative
to
the
marketplace,
but
once
again,
at
the
moment,
at
the
medium
target,
data
set
I
mentioned
north
court
earlier,
and
north
port
and
cape
coral
blowing,
the
top
off
of
it,
I
mean
to
a
point
of
almost
silliness,
but
they
have
been
very
blunt
and
saying
we
want
the
best
and
we're
willing
to
pay
for
the
best.
So
that's
where
they
are.
The
other
thing
we
wanted
to
look
at
was
equitable
internal
relationships.
How
does
this
position
that
does
these
things
compare
to
this
position?
H
H
H
H
So
our
methodology
was
pretty
simple:
it's
what
I've
done
every
year
for
the
past
11,
but
this
time
we
did
in
a
form
on
a
formal
basis,
and
by
that
I
mean
we
actually
sent
a
questionnaire
to
16
different
agencies.
They'll
be
listed
on
the
next
slide,
but
we
asked
not
only
for
salary
wanted
kind
of
an
idea.
Are
we
competitive
on
the
benefits
side
all
right
again,
using
median
data?
H
There's
the
target
data
set
and
you're
saying
well.
Why
would
we
target
city
of
Green
Cove
Springs,
because
they're
virtually
the
same
size
as
a
city
of
Cocoa
Beach,
is
about
our
size?
Believe
it
or
not?
City
of
Cocoa
Beach
is
an
East.
Coast
town
said
you
Bartos
a
little
bigger
than
us
centrally
located
in
the
state
city
of
st.
Augustine's
about
our
size.
H
Again,
East
Coast
tarpon
springs
west
coast
city,
water
parks
in
the
in
the
middle
of
the
state,
but
it
is
a
rather
affluent
community
and
I
fact:
I
interact
with
some
representatives
in
Winter
Park
and
then
obviously
some
of
these
and
most
of
these
others
are
West
Coast.
We
include
the
city
of
Arcadia
because
we,
they
are
a
direct
competitor.
Now
you
can,
you
can
say,
and
the
data
is
supported,
that
there
will
be
laws
in
terms
of
our
comp
and
classification,
but
they
are
a
competitor
and
same
thing
with
DeSoto
County.
H
Each
employee
was
given
a
what
we
call
the
PDQ,
which
essentially
asked
them
to
say:
what
do
you
do,
try
to
break
it
down
into
percentages
into
relative
priorities
based
on
their
experience?
Obviously,
we
got
into
qualifications
to
do
the
job.
You
know
how
much
education
and
then
you
know
knowledge
and
skill
sets.
Do
you
have
to
have
a
degree?
Do
you
not
or
you
know
what
what
do
you
need
to
have
in
order
to
do
your
job?
H
H
We
did
get
a
hundred
percent
participation
on
the
salary
side
because
what
usually
happens,
they
just
said,
and
their
compensation
and
classification
plan
which
is
on
a
spreadsheet,
same
thing,
I
do
when
they
asked
for
mine.
We
only
got
eighty
percent
three
percent
of
the
local
market
to
talk
about
the
benefits
benefits
are
a
little
tougher
because
you
actually
have
to
think
about
it.
You
have
to
look
in
terms
of
okay
on
vacation.
How
much
time
do
we
give
for
five
years
for
ten
years,
it's
a
little
more
complicated.
H
So
sometimes
people
are
loath
to
respond
to
that
section,
and
then
we
compile
the
results.
What
we
found
is
that
majority
positions
are
under
the
median
market
in
some
cases
substantially.
So
in
the
20s,
others
were
right
at
market,
maybe
even
a
skosh
higher
than
the
market,
but
on
average
we
were
about
eight
and
a
half
nine
percent
below
you
know
what
the
market
was
saying.
We
should
be
doing
when
we
talked
about
the
surrounding
area.
It
was
interesting.
H
She
found
that
the
surrounding
market
and
we
know
who
they
are
they're-
north
port,
Cape,
Coral,
Charlotte,
County,
Lee
County
for
Myers,
basically,
I
describe
it
as
if
I
go
out.
My
driveway
I
can
either
turn
left
or
turn
right.
Okay
and
because
I'm
conservative,
you
turn
right
to
go
to
the
city
park,
but
anyway,
the
the
information
that
we
have
in
one
of
the
area's
that's
very
peculiar
and
she
said
I
have
no
answer
to
it
and
she,
by
the
way,
is
Linda
bunting.
She
was
she's
the
CEO
of
the
company.
H
She
said
for
some
reason:
the
west
southwest
corner.
There
are
little
pocket
values,
public
safety,
inordinately
beyond
what
the
rest
of
the
state
of
Florida
does,
with
the
exception
of
the
Broward's
and
the
Tampa's,
the
huge
metropolitan
areas-
and
she
said
I,
don't
have
a
right
answer
for
it.
I
just
know
what
the
data
tells
us
so,
but
the
raw
data
on
the
last
table
she
gave
gave
us
a
summary
that
shows
the
raw
data
summarized
and
averaged,
and
it
reflects
all
of
the
participants.
H
H
One
of
the
things
that's
notably
missing
is
Public
Safety
and
the
reason
for
that
was,
as
I
stated,
we
are
in
the
middle
of
negotiations
with
both
unions
and
what
we
don't
want
to
be
is
in
a
situation
where
we
have
police
officers
making
more
than
command
staff
and
firefighters,
making
more
than
command
staff,
and
so
on.
So
we're
taking
a
look
at
that
separately
and
as
we
move
forward.
One
of
the
things
that
the
last
comp
and
classification
study
had
done
was
established
a
paying
classification
table
that
wasn't
consistent
between
positions
between
pay
grades.
H
We
had
ranging
from
five
to
eight
and
a
half
percent,
and
it
was
really
not
a
justification.
Given
just
that's
what
the
data
said.
We
should
do
so.
They
set
seven
percent
as
the
consistent
separation
between
positions.
So,
as
a
consequence,
we
have
some
positions
that
were
separated
by
eight
and
a
half
percent
sudden.
H
Suddenly
they
are
not
as
far
apart
as
the
position
that
was
below
them
in
the
previous
paying
classification
table,
we're
really
comparable
on
our
benefits
and
I
worked
for
a
an
assistant,
county
administrator
way
back
in
the
day
when
I
was
young
and
he
he
used
to
say
you
work
for
government
for
the
benefits
not
to
pay,
and
there
is
some
truth
to
that.
Hourly
benefits
are
average.
E
H
Pto
is
not
it's
paid
time
off,
but
it
is
a
an
aggregation
of
your
two
benefits,
sickness
and
sick
and
well
and
vacation,
but
it's
not
one
for
it's,
definitely
not
one
for
one
generally,
you
do
about
a
75%,
so
if
you
have
20
days,
you'll
get
15
or
17
and
health
insurance.
Our
benefit
is
solid,
although
we
did
see
an
8
percent
increase
this
year
and
then
pension
most
of
the
surrounding
areas
and
most
of
the
people
in
that
comp
and
class
study
they
still
retain
a
defined
benefit
program.
They
have
not
gone
DC.
H
Second,
alternative.
Obviously
the
first
two
are
the
first
one
is
the
same:
adopt
the
pay
grades,
pay
grades
in
class
and
salary
schedule.
The
second
is
to
adjust
employees
to
minimum
rate
or
increase
by
3%.
That's
cross
board
everybody,
okay,
not
taking
into
account
that
we
had
planned
to
do
a
pay
to
do
a
merit
increase
in
October.
This
is
over
and
above
that
this
would
just
be.
Everybody
gets
us
and
then
once
again
freezing
salaries
and
then
doing
the
lump
sum
bonus
at
the
at
the
top
four.
H
H
If
you
look
at
your
report,
you'll
see
you
know,
alternatives
see
basically
TBD
to
be
determined,
so
city
staff
is
put
together
the
following
and
again
adopt
the
paint,
grades
and
salary
schedule,
adjustment
employees
to
the
minimum
rate
or
increase
three
percent.
Now.
This
is
a
little
bit
different
and
I
struggled
with
the
wording
on
this,
but
essentially.
H
This
does
not.
This
is
not
all
employees.
This
is
a
distinct
data
set
which
is
employees
and
need
to
be
brought
to
minimum
or
a
three
percent
freezing
the
salaries.
One
of
the
things
that
we
will
would
recommend
that
we
do
is
the
freeze,
new
hire,
post
probation,
pay
increases
and
what
we
mean
by
that
is
right.
Now
the
PR
provides
that
when
you
come
off
of
probation,
you
are
eligible
for
an
up
to
a
pay
increase
so
and
that
up
to
pay
increases
the
percentage
that
was
authorized
for
merit.
H
On
10:1
of
the
fiscal
year
in
which
you're
in
we
are
recommending
to
freeze
all
those
post,
ovations
increases
number
one:
we've
increased
the
pay
grade,
so
you're
bringing
people
in
at
a
higher
rate
of
pay,
and
if
you
allow
them
to
get
that
pay
increase,
then
they're
going
to
be
making
the
same
as
people
that
have
been
there
a
year
or
two.
We
don't
want
that.
Okay,.
H
We
would
like
to
look
at
some
kind
of
a
pay
plan
adjustment
and
it's
highly
conditional-
and
it
is
broken
down-
I'd
like
to
touch
on
each
one
individually
by
May
number
one.
Is
you
hired
prior
210,
102
thousand
nine?
Why
that
date,
2008
started
the
with
or
calling
the
Great
Recession
2009?
We
were
deep,
we
are
in
it
and
we
were
offering
employee
buyouts.
We
were
offering.
You
know
we
were
encouraging
people
to
retire.
We
were
we.
H
These
are
employees
that,
during
that
nine
year
period,
have
not
been
promoted
or
had
some
type
of
unscheduled
pay
increase.
All
right.
We
have
some
that
got
some
different
things
he
got
promoted
or
there
was
an
adjustment
because
of
various
reasons,
number
three:
they
weren't
demoted
voluntarily
or
otherwise.
H
In
those
nine
years
they
don't
have
a
career
progression
path
a
few
months
ago
or
a
year
ago.
Actually,
over
a
year
ago,
you
approved
a
career
progression
process
that
enabled
employees
to
move
up
if
they
achieve
certain
education,
time
and
grade
certifications
and
so
on,
and
we've
had
a
lot
of
employees
doing
that
it's
been
very,
very
positive
and
our
and
our
turnover
in
certain
positions
that
have
this
available
to
to
them
have
been
has
been
reduced.
H
H
F
It's
not
perfect.
There
will
be
employees
who
other
than
the
3%
merit
system.
That's
already
in
our
budget,
there'll
be
some
employees.
Many
employees
actually,
who
other
than
a
different
pay
range,
will
get
nothing
but
they've
had
the
advantage
of
career
progression.
They've
been
promoted,
they've
received
increases,
so
alternative
C
is
just
for
those
that
are.
B
B
So
is
that
being
taken
into
consideration
because
of
that,
if
you're,
considering
those
type
of
people
that
were
possibly
reclassified
under
those
circumstances,
that
I
think
they
should
be
considered
as
well,
because
they
took
on
additional
responsibilities
and
some
of
them
I
talked
to
you
about
at
least
one
I
know
of
because
you
could
tell
the
person
was
doing
more
than
one
job
at
the
time.
So
if
they're
left
out
of
this
I
would
have
a
problem
with
that,
I
wouldn't
consider
that
a
career
progression
they
weren't,
they
stayed
they
stuck
with
us.
F
H
Yes,
because
our
criteria
were
our
criteria
were
fairly
draconian
in
that
regard,
and
the
reason
for
that
was,
we
had
to
draw
a
line
and
all
of
us
took
on
more.
All
of
us
did.
As
I
said,
we
went
from
310
to
250
now
we're
back
up
to
about
265,
regular
full-time,
but
the
reality
is
that
everyone
that
worked
for
the
city
took
on
more.
We
had
one
group
of
people
that
actually
was
working
took
a
one
day
a
week.
H
Pay
cut
work
four
days
a
week
and
they've
gotten
nothing
back
out
of
that
and
to
address
those
issues.
Could
we
go
back
and
identify
and
really
zero
in
on
some
position?
Absolutely
we
can
do
that.
The
question
then
becomes
how
deep
into
those
weeds
do
you
want
to
burrow
and
we
can
and
will
do
whatever
you
direct
us
to
do
in
that
regards
our
city
manager
has
a
favorite
phrase.
We
can
do
anything
just
bring
money.
Actually
he
says
we
can
do
anything.
We
just
can't
do.
H
Everything
is
the
way
he
puts
it
and
again.
I
have
no
problem
and,
and
some
of
the
process
he
described
described,
we
may
be
taking
into
consideration
some
of
those
positions
or
those
people.
This
is
one
time
we
will
turn
away
from
position
and
get
into
either
people
or
because
the
requirements
of
the
position
have
changed
substantially.
So
we
will
be
looking
we'll
be
looking
at
some,
but
right
now
it's
a
very
limited
subset
of
about
five
or
six.
G
G
E
A
Couple
things
one
is
is
that
in
the
very
beginning
of
your
presentation,
you
talked
about
the
costs
due
to
attrition
the
people
leaving
and
so
forth,
and
that
if
we
are
able
to
hold
people
I
assume
some
of
that
would
be
said
there
would
be
a
savings
in
the
cost
of
retraining
people
and
hiring
people
etc.
Would
that
be
a
correct
assumption?
Yeah.
H
H
But
let's
go
back
and
look
at
this
for
the
first
six
months:
they're
virtually
useless
unless
they're
coming
in
exactly
a
whole
bunch
of
skills
and
they
can
hit
the
ground
running
and
we've
been
fortunate
to
get
a
few
of
those.
But
for
the
most
part,
the
first
six
months,
you're
eating
their
salary
until
they
get
up
to
speed
exactly.
A
A
If
we
went
down
to
250
and
now
we're
at
265
roughly,
but
when
you
gave
us
that
265,
you
didn't
take
into
account
that
we've
also
had
an
increase
in
population.
So
if
you
were
to
use
the
ratio
of
how
much
staff
we
have
per
1000
it
still,
it
goes
back
to
what
I've
been
saying
before
we're
doing
a
lot
more
with
a
lot
less
and
at
the
same
time
we're
paying
less
than
than
the
median
I'm.
Just
saying
that
there's
a
balancing
act
here
that
we
wanted
to
be
prudent
about.
A
A
That's
really
what
our
cost
are
to
get
them
trained
versus
the
people
that
rachel
is
putting
out
through
cross
trained
and
they're
doing
more
than
one
job
now,
and
really
aren't
being
there's
more
of
a
burden
that
they've
taken
on
their
back
and
God,
bless
them.
And
thank
them
very
much
so
I'm
just
saying
is:
there's
a
balancing
act
here
that
I
think
that
we
need
to
be
a
peer
cognate
set
of
in
the
way
you
go
about
this
and
also
be
willing
to
take
the
political
courage
they
have
to
pay
the
piper.
E
H
The
preponderance
of
our
turnover
for
money
has
been
coming
out
of
utilities.
The
county
is
taking
our
trained
people
and
starting
them
much
higher
than
what
they're
making
now
now
that
doesn't
mean
that
our
entry-level
wage
isn't
competitive.
If
you
adopt
this
pay
plan
we'll
be
competitive,
but
that
still
doesn't
change
the
fact
that
essentially
they're
saying
if
you'll
come
work
for
us,
we'll
pay
you
two
bucks
an
hour
or
more,
when
you're
a
$32,000
a
year,
employee-
and
you
can
add
four
thousand
dollars
to
your
bottom
line.
H
Just
by
turning
left
instead
of
right,
that's
pretty
significant!
We
can't
stop
that.
Nor
do
we
intend
to
try
and
get
in
the
middle
of
that
when
I
was
in
the
marine
industry.
We
did
that
a
lot.
We
had
three
boat
builders
in
the
square
in
one
square
mile
and
they'd,
go
for
25
cents
an
hour
and
pretty
soon,
six
months,
later,
they're
back
working
for
us
again
and
the
other
thing.
When
you
talk
about
utilities,
especially
with
distribution
and
with
the
distribution
collection,
the
field
operations
and
also
the
plant
operations.
H
H
H
Choice
of
words
on
my
part,
but
you
were
in
the
utilities
business
you
understand,
the
the
people
you
want
distributing
your
water
are
people
that
have
the
license
here
to
ensure
that
they're
testing
correctly
that
they're
hosin
pipes
up
correctly
those
kind
of
things
the
people
that
are
making
our
water
really
so
it.
Those
are
the
issues
when
we
look
at
what
they
were,
the
positions
they
held,
the
preponderance
fell
into
utilities,
we
had
a
few
public
works
and
then
we
had
quite
a
few
retirements
and
other
changes.
A
Are
we
paying
based
on
grade
of
training
versus
greater
position?
In
other
words,
if
your
your
you've
got
that
you've
been
there
two
years
but
you're
at
the
one-year
level
and
the
guy
above,
you
isn't
gonna
retire
for
another
ten
years,
but
you've
continued
to
take
the
the
grades
and
get
that
the
the
higher
licenses
are
we
compensating
for
that
education?
Yes,.
H
We
are,
we
have.
The
career
progression
plan
takes
that
into
account.
We
used
to
have
a
situation
where,
let's
say
water
distribution,
they
could
have
a
maintenance
worker,
they
could
have
five
one:
five
maintenance
worker
ones,
three
maintenance
worker,
twos,
three
maintenance
worker
threes,
and
it
was
capped.
If
there
wasn't
a
two
or
three
available,
the
ones
stayed
there.
We
have
employees
they've
been
here
over
20
years
that
were
still
ones.
Okay.
When
we
took
that
career
progression
step.
H
Far
I've
been
told.
Yes,
there
are
some
employees
who
just
flat
say:
ain't
gonna,
okay,
that's
fine!
That's
it
that's
their
choice,
but
for
the
most
part
where
the,
where
that
has
been
available,
the
other
thing
we're
offering
is
do
a
licensure.
So
if
you're
a
water
distribution
for
and
then
you
want
to
say,
take
some
overtime
shifts
in
wastewater
collection
and
you
get
dual
certified.
We
pay
an
extra
five
percent
for
that.
F
And
that's
what
we
mean
by
career
progression.
The
employees
have
had
an
opportunity
to
get
raises
over
these
years
by
getting
those
extra
certifications
or
training.
Certifications.
They're
not
covered
by
this
proposal,
already
received
something
mm-hmm.
They
want
to
it's
those
that
have
no
career
progression.
They
have
had
none
and
they've
stuck
with
us.
B
H
E
H
C
F
H
D
Asked
question:
so:
do
you
feel
based
on
what
you
were
telling
us,
then
that
this
addresses
the
critical
needs
of
the
business?
It
addresses
the
the
areas?
We
would
say
our
positions
that
are
critical
to
the
needs
of
the
business,
ensuring
that
you
know
we
target
the
areas
where
we
want
to
make
sure
we
minimize
the
turnover
I
mean
I.
You
know,
I've
been
through
this
in
my
corporate
life
and
an
experience
I've
been
the
recipient
of
and
the
beneficiary
of
or
the
not-so-good
all.
D
Yeah
I
mean
I've,
been
through
it
all
and
and
understand
it's
the
position
and
that's
a
hard
thing
for
some
people
to
understand,
but
it
is.
But
yet
we
we're
doing
this
because
we
are
trying
to
change
some
things.
Yes,
and
so
is
it
going
to
help
us
address
those
issues
and
minimize
the
turnover
cuz
25
percent?
So
a
lot
yeah.
H
H
The
city
manager
said
earlier
that
it's
not
perfect,
it's
not
okay!
Is
it
better?
Oh,
yes,
it's
a
lot!
Better!
Can
I
come
back
to
you
two
years
from
now
and
say
that
we
only
reduced
it
by
you
know
we
only
lost
30
employees
and
only
five
of
those
were
because
of
money.
I
can't
tell
you
that's
going
to
happen.
What
I
can
tell
you
is
this
makes
us
more
competitive
by
taking
the
second
step
of
alternative
C,
which
is
to
address
those
long-term
employees
that
went
through
thick
and
thin
with
us,
especially
thin.
H
B
B
So
that
was
pretty
much
out
so
really
the
middle
ground.
Alternative
B
is
where
we
wouldn't
like
to
be,
and
maybe
every
year
we
need
to
build
something
in
so
we're.
Looking
at
you
know,
we
don't
want
to
get
in
situations
where
we
were
before
we're,
like
you
said,
with
our
utilities
that
we've
been
there
with
police
and
fire.
We
don't
want
to
get
in
those
situations
where,
where
the
training
ground
for
everybody
else.
D
H
D
H
H
One
of
the
things
that
we
did
recently
was
to
relieve
the
pressure
of
starting
people
at
the
bottom
of
the
range,
especially
in
professional
and
managerial
positions,
because
we
have
employees
that
started
here
at
the
bottom
of
the
range.
Your
finance
director
is
a
case
in
point
and
independent
finance
director
she
was
promised
hey.
We
get
five
to
six
percent
raises
every
year.
Well,
she
guess
when
she
got
here,
try
2008,
okay
and,
as
consequence
she
got
in
on
the
worst
of
it
we
were
able
to.
H
H
H
H
This
year,
and
it
just
kind
of
rolls
out
two
or
three
years
or
two
or
three
people
every
year,
I
can
get
you
that
list.
That's
not
a
problem,
but
yeah
we
and
and
the
other
is
just
because
we
have
a
five
or
a
seven
year
drop
or
say
man
what
we
got
seven
years.
No,
because
we
have
some
that
leave
within
one
or
two
or
three.
H
E
B
Would
just
like
to
say,
we've
been
lucky
know
for
the
most
part
that
we've
had
people
to
promote,
so
we've
been
really
lucky
on
that
side
and
we
just
got
somebody
from
the
private
sector
to
come.
Work
for
the
city.
So
yes
and
we've
recruited
some
young
hometown
people
to
be
in
our
ranks
for
police
and
fire,
which
is
very
exciting.
So
we're
doing
some
things
right.
Well,.