►
Description
San Bruno City Council Meeting Dec. 14, 2010 10d. Appeal Hearing related to Award of ?Bid for Purchase of Mobile and Portable Radios
A
Already
done
item
10c
an
attendee
is
to
conduct
an
appeal
hearing
related
to
a
ward
of
did
for
purchase
of
mobile
and
portable
radios.
What
I'd
like
to
do
first
is
asked
staff
for
an
overview.
Then
we'll
ask
the
appellant
to
complete
his
case
for
no
more
than
10
minutes
and
then
we'll
have
staff
follow
up.
Mr.
a
lyric
and
chief.
B
Mr.
mayor
members
of
City
Council,
the
subject
of
this
appeal
hearing
is
related
to
action
of
the
city
and
reviewing
bids
that
will
lead
to
award
of
the
contract
for
a
mobile
and
portable
radio.
Did
the
city's
Municipal
Code
provides
that
bids
May
shall
be
awarded
to
the
lowest
responsible
bidder
in
practice?
Two
related
but
separate
terms
are
considered
both
questions
of
being
responsible
and
being
responsive
for
the
mobile
and
portable
radio
bid.
Williams
USA
was
the
lowest
dollar
bidder.
I
understand
the
analysis
of
this
bid
found
no
issue
with
Williams
USA.
B
As
a
responsible
bidder.
There
is
no
known
reason
that
the
firm
is
incapable
of
providing
the
radios
bid
at
the
price
at
the
price
quoted.
However,
the
finance
department
determined
with
the
technical
assistance
of
the
fire
department
that
Williams
USA
bid,
was
not
responsive
to
the
bid
specifications.
In
fact,
the
department
determined
that
Williams
USA
bid
failed
to
conform
to
several
specification
requirements.
B
Williams
USA
then
requested
administrative
hearing
by
the
city
manager
on
this
determination
of
non
responsiveness.
The
designated
hearing
officer
for
the
city
manager
affirmed
the
findings
of
the
finance
department
that
the
Williams
USA
bid
was
non-responsive
to
the
bid
specifications.
Williams
USA
then
requested
this
hearing
before
the
City
Council.
B
In
order
for
a
bitter
to
be
eligible
for
word
of
a
bid,
the
bid
must
be
responsive
and
if
you
have
any
question,
the
city
attorney
would
be
glad
to
answer
any
question
on
this
matter.
But
I
would
say
that
a
responsive
bid
is
one
that
meets
all
of
the
established
terms,
conditions
and
specifications
of
the
bid.
An
agency
has
limited
discriminated
I'm,
sorry
that
the
agency
has
limited
discretion
and
may
only
wave
minor
irregularities
from
the
bid
specifications.
B
The
specifications
for
more
for
mobile
and
portable
radios
were
developed
in
conjunction
with
the
millbrae
central
county,
san
mateo
and
the
san
bruno
fire
departments.
The
specifications,
at
least
in
part,
were
prescribed
by
the
requirements
of
a
grant
application
submitted
by
the
city
to
the
Federal
Emergency
Management
Agency.
On
behalf
of
all
four
agencies,
the
bid
by
Williams
USA
materially
deviated
from
the
following
specification
requirements
that
the
radios
be
p25,
compliant
that
they
have
the
capability
and
capacity
for
512
channels
and
50
zones.
B
B
Specifications
specifications
by
definition,
narrow
the
possible
products
to
those
meeting
the
operational
and
safety
needs
of
the
agencies
beyond
just
answering
the
question
tonight,
if
USA,
if
Williams
USA
is
responsive
to
the
specifications,
the
City
Council
should
well
have
an
interest
and
if
the
specifications
unintentionally
allowed
only
one
firm
to
bid
a
sole
source
or
if
the
specifications
unreasonably
or
arbitrarily
narrowed
the
possible
responses,
I
believe
the
facts
show
that
the
bid
specifications
do
not
create
a
sole
source
and
are
not
unreasonable
or
arbitrarily
narrow.
I
am
unclear
exactly
the
basis
for
the
USA.
B
What
Williams,
USA
appeal
in
the
record,
Williams
USA
stated
that
its
bid
exceeds
your
specifications
in
every
way
and
in
a
later
email,
further
protests
that
the
radios
are
completely
compliant
to
the
city's
specifications.
Yet
within
the
62
page,
written
appeal
appear
statements
acknowledging
that
the
bid
does
not
meet
the
specifications.
I
can
say
this
appeal
hearing
is
not
about
the
city's
financial,
financial
condition
or
the
revenue
expenditure
imbalance.
The
City
Council
has
dealt
with
over
the
last
several
years.
B
In
fact,
the
City
Council
has
been
extremely
diligent
in
acknowledging
taxpayer
costs
and
the
costs
that
this
city
is
exposed
to
over
a
long
period
of
time.
In
fact,
twelve
of
the
hundred
and
twenty
radios
in
this
bid,
12
of
them,
go
to
the
city
of
San
Bruno
and
eighty
percent
of
the
cost
for
these
radios
is
paid
through
the
FEMA
grant.
The
worst
financial
impact
who
all
the
cities
would
be
if
the
city
took
action
that
makes
us
ineligible
for
the
FEMA
grant.
A
C
You,
okay,
then,
I'm
assuming
that
I'll
good
evening
to
everyone
I'm,
assuming
that
you've
all
received
my
packet,
okay,
so
I'm
going
to
respond
to
mr.
O'leary's
letter,
a
couple
of
inconsistencies
in
there
that
I
really
don't
care
to
bring
up
right
now,
but
the
bottom
line
is,
is
that
you
know
when
this
bid
was
let
I
was,
and
the
visionaries
we
responded
to.
C
I
was
never
given
an
opportunity
to
meet
with
anybody
in
the
city,
the
police
department
or
anyone
else
with
my
numerous
emails
and
voicemails
that
I
wanted
to
come
by
and
discuss
the
opportunities
that
the
icon,
radio
equipment
would
do
and
how
it
complies
with
the
bid
specifications.
I'd
never
happened,
no
matter
how
many
times
I
asked
everybody
number
one
in
mr.
O'leary's
non-compliance
he
says
were
p25
non-compliant.
That
is
not
true
and
in
fact,
actually,
the
kenwood
radio
is
not
non-compliant
an
attachment,
a
right
here
which
you
have
in
your
packet,
I
emailed
mr.
C
teles
and
asked
him:
does
the
radio
need
to
be
full
p25
compliant
we're
just
merely
capable,
and
he
said
capable
it
would
be
done
used
later
on
now.
The
difference
is,
is
that
I
come
makes
a
radio
that
is
p25
upgradeable
its
compliant,
but
it's
upgradeable
later
on.
So
why
spend
a
thousand
dollars
now
on
a
radio
that
you
don't
have
after
you
do?
P25
is
something
you'll,
never
do
it's
not
mandated
by
the
city,
the
county,
the
state
or
the
federal
government
only
for
federal
agencies.
C
If
you
wet
p25
everybody
around,
you
would
have
to
go
pee,
25
and
you're
talking
millions
and
millions
and
millions
of
dollars.
So
that's
it
say:
icom
came
up
with
a
radio
to
allow
people
to
buy
a
upgradable
radio
to
make
them
feel
better
that
they
could
buy
it
later
on,
save
yourself,
a
thousand-dollar
Radio.
That's
why
we're
109
thousand
dollars
low
on
the
bid
on
the
basic
bid.
So
we
believe
that
we're
compliant
because
of
the
email
from
mr.
Kelly's
advising
us
that
it
was
a
b-25
capable
radio.
We've
been
a
p25,
capable
radio.
C
C
Also
stated
fifty
zones
and
512
channels:
well,
that's
another
kind
of
a
something
that
people
put
in
bid
specs
that
because
they
get
it
off
the
back
of
a
radio
brochure,
512
channels,
you
don't
need
512
channels,
I've
been
in
the
radio
business
37
years
in
public
safety
in
the
bay
area,
with
Motorola
videl
many
different
agencies,
San
Mateo,
County,
Fire,
Services,
published
document.
We
have
43
channels
in
the
whole
Bay
Area
on
fire
channels,
state
of
California
fire
scope,
cAL
FIRE,
83
channels.
C
They
mean
the
total
of
126
channels,
their
radios,
we
bid
or
256
channels.
You
got
130
left
over.
What
do
you
do
it
they're
not
even
out
there,
so
the
512
channels
that
really
a
kind
of
a
non-existent
type
of
bid
specification?
You
don't
need
it.
Why
are
you
asking
for
it?
Well
because
it
was
on
the
back
of
the
brochure
of
the
kenwood
brochure.
So
that's
what
we
put
in
there.
C
We
feel
that
that's
a
not
a
good
specification
to
put
in
there
and
it
brings
you
into
a
radio
and
makes
you
more
of
a
sole
source
type
of
radio.
When
it's
something
you
don't
need
again,
you're
paying
100
nine
thousand
dollars
more
for
something,
you'll,
never
use
p25
again
the
p25
people
are
buying
the
p25
radios
that
they
don't
need
to
buy
because
they're
not
mandated
by,
like
I
said,
the
city
county
or
the
state,
and
also
there
was
a
University
of
Pennsylvania
survey.
It
just
came
out
about
p25
interoperability
and
the
security.
C
Oh
it's
already
been
compromised,
so
it's
basically
worthless
right
now,
number
two
is
or
number
30.
Mr.
O'leary's
we're
not
compliant
listed
the
five
channel
direct
entry.
The
five
channel
direct
entry
is
a
proprietary
spectacle.
Would
nobody
else?
Does
it?
We,
however,
and
I
come,
can
do
that
versus
using
the
channel
select
knob
in
a
bank
to
accomplish
pretty
much
the
same
thing,
however,
getting
back
to
your
bid
specs
here's,
the
kenwood
control
head.
It's
got
nine
buttons
on
it.
It's
going
to
take
five
buttons
for
you
to
do
this.
C
5-Channel
operation
select,
which
means
you
don't
have
enough
buttons
to
do
a
bit
speck
in
here.
It
said
you
had
to
have
Cal
Fire
interoperability.
That
means
a
command
make.
You
have
no
button
for
that
by
the
time.
You
add
that
by
the
time
you
add
the
multiple
peel
select
four
caliphs
ire
to
select
a
mountain
top
sites,
the
scan
and
delete
functions,
an
emergency
button
that
were
mandatory
in
the
bid
spec,
you
don't
have
enough
buttons
left
over,
so
it's
it's
worthless.
C
It
was
put
in
the
bid
spec
to
make
it
proprietary
next
thing
is:
is
that
the
there's
a
voice
enunciation
capable
on
the
portable
it
wasn't?
A
mandatory
inspect,
was
an
option
state
so
in
the
option
list
and
voice.
Announce
EA
shin
in
my
opinion,
is
just
one
of
those
Gucci
kind
of
things
that
really
nobody
cares
about
and
in
the
fire
department,
it's
probably
more
detrimental
than
anything
else.
When
you
change
the
channel
knob,
it
says
channel
one
bank
one.
C
Why
do
I
need
to
know
that
I've
been
a
fireman
for
20
years?
I
know
what
channel
1
and
channel
2
is
when
they're
on
a
scene
in
a
fire
and
there's
a
lot
of
hectic
going
on
and
he's
changing
channels,
and
it's
going
to
keep
saying
LOL
channel,
5,
channel
6
channel
7,
that's
something
you
don't
need
it's
again,
a
proprietary
feature
of
kenwood
and
not
worth
100.
Nine
thousand
dollars,
also
on
the
bid
where
options
for
FM
approved,
not
incentive
and
intrinsically
safe.
C
Let's
take
FM
approved
non
incentive
if
I'm
approved
non
incentive
is
a
federal
classification
that
guarantees
at
the
radio.
When
you
push
to
talk
to
talk
on,
it
doesn't
produce
a
spark
in
gaseous
atmospheres.
Methane,
propane's,
acetylenes
dust
filings,
any
kind
of
gasolines
things
like
that,
which
the
fire
department
handles
a
lot
of
time
from
a
vehicle
accident.
The
gasoline
spill
to
go
into
somebody's
home
that
the
water
heater
is
leaking.
That's
propane,
all
over
the
gas
all
over
the
place
reference
your
PG&E
gas
explosion.
C
C
Their
price
list
on
the
bid,
those
are
options-
submersible
ax
t-
is
an
option
which,
of
course,
the
fired
fun
would
really
like
to
have
because
they
crawl
through
water
and
things
like
that
during
a
structure
fire.
It
makes
the
radio
sealed
against
water
intrusion
and
brings
up
the
life
likelihood
of
the
radio.
That's
another
twenty
one
thousand
five
hundred
dollars
on
the
kenwood
and
every
two
years
you
got
to
spend
another
twenty
thousand
one
hundred
and
sixty
dollars
to
get
a
recertified
Wow.
Okay.
C
So
now
we're
up
to,
let's
see
here,
163,000
dollars
more
to
get
two
options
that
I
come
has
standard.
It's
a
no-brainer.
Now,
additionally,
when
you
run
with
the
FM
approved
option
on
the
kenwood,
you
have
to
go
down
to
a
lower
battery
on
the
bits
Beckett's
at
3,300
milliamp
hour.
You
have
to
go
down
to
with
2500
million
power
battery
and
you
lose
about
three
hours
worth
of
battery
talk
time.
That's
critical,
critical
in
a
fire
operation.
You
don't
have
time
to
change
batteries.
The
icon
is
a
14
and
a
half
hour
battery.
C
It's
a
quality,
high
quality
radio.
It's
far
surpasses
the
kenwood
radio
that
was
Spector.
We
request
that
we
get
the
bid
and
if,
if
you
need
time
to
consider
this,
maybe
we
could
call
a
special
meeting.
We
can
talk
about
it
further.
I,
don't
see
anybody
in
the
city,
that's
37
years
worth
of
experience
in
evaluating
radio
communications
that
may
have
used
them
for
37
years.
I
may
have
talked
on
them,
but
they're,
not
degreed,
they're,
not
accredited,
and
really
it's
like
having
a
maybe
a
city,
sanitation
worker,
doing
brain
surgery.
C
D
Mr.
mr.
Williams
I'm
wondering
mr.
leery
stated
that,
in
your
initial
bid,
or
perhaps
during
the
initial
bid
that
you
submitted
did
not
meet
some
of
those
specifications,
did
you
at
any
point
change
the
model
or
any
of
the
specifications
that
you're
proposing?
No
I
do
not
so
your
initial
bid
did,
in
your
opinion,
meet
all
of
the
specification.
C
Absolutely
and
the
three
items
that
I
brought
up,
which
were
it
is
in
his
letter
response
to
me
that
I
was
non-compliant
on
was
p25
when,
in
fact,
we
are
because
we
were
told
we
couldn't
bit
of
capable
radio,
which
we
did
the
512
channels
yeah.
We
don't
have
512
channels
when
you
need
it
for
I'm,
giving
you
a
radio.
That's
you
can
have
a
hundred
and
thirty
left
over
there's,
not
that
many
channels
in
the
United
States
you're
going
to
get
so
that's
ridiculous.
The
voice
enunciation.
C
C
If
you
utilize
all
those
five
buttons
you're
going
to
take
buttons
away
from
things,
you
actually
need,
like
your
MDC
signaling
acknowledgement,
your
cal
fire
command
bank,
what
you're
supposed
to
have-
or
she
can't
go
to
a
cal
fire
fire
and
get
money,
and
your
multiple
PL
select
foresight,
selects
for
cal
fire
repeaters
and
a
few
other
items
emergency
button
which
was
required
in
the
vid
specs.
If
you
take
all
those,
if
you
put
all
those
features
you
need
in,
you,
don't
have
five
buttons
left
over
to
meet
that
spec.
D
C
The
five
channel
was
that's
a
proprietary
specification
to
to
kenwood,
and
so
is
the
voice
Annunciation,
so
that
makes
the
bid
proprietary
right
there
with
those
two
features.
The
OC
Annunciation
was
an
option,
not
a
requirement.
The
512
channels,
I'm
attributing
you
know.
If
you
look
at
the
bid,
specs
they're
pretty
atrocious
for
anybody
that
went
out
and
put
together
a
bit.
There's
no
transmitter
and
receiver
specifications.
C
There's
nothing
that
tells
you
what
the
quality
of
the
radio
all
you're
asking
for
is
a
50
watt,
radio,
it's
a
mobile,
it
has
512
channels,
and
it
does
this.
Isn't
this
there
was
no
transmitter
receiver
spectra
which
you're
always
in
bid
specifications.
Always
that
tells
you
what's
inside
the
radio
and
how
quality
it
is.
Anybody
can
make
a
milspec
radio,
but
can
they
all
do
point
25,
25,
microvolts,
a
sensitivity,
no
point
35?
C
Maybe
so
the
inside
of
the
radio
is
what
tells
you
what
the
quality
is
and
then,
of
course,
you
got
the
options
and
things
like
that,
so
I
attributed
the
512
channels,
because
that,
if
you
look
at
that
bid
the
way
that
that
bid
was
laid
out,
it's
exactly
it's
just
a
copy
off
the
back
of
a
kenwood
brochure.
That's
the
bids
back,
usually
bin
specs
about
five
pages
for
these
kind
of
radios.
So
these
are
right
off
the
back
of
the
kenwood
vert
here.
So
I
attributed
the
lack
of
experience
to
the
512
channels.
C
People
don't
know
that
they
don't
need
512
channels
or
maybe
they've,
never
thought
about
it.
Think
about
it.
I've
got
it
all
right
here
for
you
there's
your
channel
plan,
that's
for
the
whole
yep
for
the
whole
technical
county
or
the
Santa
san
bruno
and
the
san
mateo
county,
43
channels,
state
of
California
fire
scope,
83
channels,
that's
a
hundred
and
twenty
six
channels.
Why
do
you
need
512?
Why
10
radiance
256
channel
for
give
you
a
hundred
thirty
leftover,
noodles.
B
C
E
You
made
a
comment
that
you
wanted
to
meet
with
city
people
though,
and
you
were
unable
to
yes
I
made
several
calls
to
mr.
teller.
Could
you
be
specific
to
you
who
you
did
not
talk
to
you
or
meet
with
him?
I
know
you
said
me,
I,
want
to
understand
and
ensure
my
understanding,
you're
saying
you
did
not
have
you
had
communication?
Yes,.
C
C
C
I
left
several
voicemails
for
mr.
tulley's
and
several
emails
over
the
course
of
the
three
months
because
he
had
the
you
had
the
gas
explosion
off
and
everybody
was
quite
protective
and
I
did
manage
to
talk
to
him
once
for
about
three
minutes
and
then
a
fire
call
any
goes
yeah
yeah.
We
need
to
talk
and
sit
down
and
find
out.
Why
your?
Why
you
did
what
you
bidden
what's
all
about
and
then
a
fire
call
came
in
and
he
was
gone.
C
He
goes
I'll
call
you
back
and
that's
the
last
I
ever
heard
from
him
and
I
left
several
more
calls.
After
that
I
talked
to
mr.
O'leary
when
he
was
doing
the
review
and
I
said:
let's
get
together.
Let
me
show
you
how
my
radio
is
compliant
with
these
specifications
and
the
intent,
but
that
never
happened
either.
So
nobody
ever
took
me
up
on
my
offer,
which
is
really
kind
of
strange,
that
nobody
wanted
to
talk
about
the
videos.
E
And
I
want
to
be
clear
to
because
I
know
that
you
were
asking
for
some
special
meetings
when
it
came
to
this,
of
course,
under
Municipal
Code.
This
is
the
form
in
which
we
have
this
type
of
Appeal.
The
other
thing
is
you
stand
to
four
members
of
the
City
Council
asking
for
us
to
call
a
special
meeting
under
the
Municipal
Code,
which
three
of
us
can
do.
Unfortunately,
when
you
do
that,
we
can't
respond
and
coordinate
that,
because
that's
a
violation
of
brown
act.
E
So
that's
why
nice,
one
of
that
clear,
I,
don't
want
you
to
assume
because
I
talked
to
her
city
attorney
to
get
clarification
and
do
that
cuz.
I
know
you
wanted
the
mayor
to
call
it
and
that
didn't
seem
to
work.
So
then
you
went
to
the
four
of
us
trying
to
get
us
to
call
a
special
meeting
by
three
of
us,
calling
that
and
we
can't
coordinate
our
efforts
like
that,
because
that
is
in
violation
of
the
the
brown
act.
So
I
just
wanted
that
to
be
understood
and
clear
too
yeah.
C
A
F
G
F
F
B
F
B
I,
try
out
me:
yes,
okay
and
just
just
1
1
comment
on
the
specifications.
I
guess
my
observation
is
that
the
specifications
call
for
very
robust
radios.
These
are
not
bottom
of
line,
I
mean
they
are
high
quality
they're
they're
requiring
high
quality
radios
with
a
number
of
safety
features.
But,
as
the
chief
indicated,
these
specifications
were
developed
by
the
four
agencies
and
we
needed,
as
far
for
for
the
for
the
application
to
FEMA
that
all
the
radios
needed
to
be
the
same.
So
the
four
agencies
came
together.
B
There
were
some
agencies
on
some
of
the
specifications
felt
very
strongly
that
they
needed
to
be
included
and
I'm,
not
to
suggest
that
the
san
bruno
fire
department
for
each
one
of
them
felt
that
that
was
but
as
a
group,
these
were
the
safety
and
operational
features
that
the
four
agencies
agreed
upon
as
meeting
they're
meeting
their
needs.
So.
B
The
City
Council
back
in
July,
passed
a
resolution
for
the
city
to
submit
the
grant,
on
behalf
of
the
four
agencies
and
I'd
like
to
read
the
first
two.
Where
asses
of
that
of
that
resolution,
the
first
one
says
where,
whereas
the
Federal
Communications
Commission
will
require
all
public
safety
agencies
to
switch
from
from
wideband
to
narrow,
bound
radios
and
p25
compliance
by
January,
first
2013
and
whereas
san
mateo
county
fire
agencies
are
tentatively
planning
to
be
in
compliance
in
2011,
a
regional
grant
was
submitted
on
behalf
of
the
four
of
the
four
agencies.
B
B
B
Mr.
Williams
further
argued
that
an
email
prior
to
the
bid
deadline
from
battalion
chief
dais
that
the
radios
must
be
p25
capable
was
the
word
that
the
chief
used
lead
Williams
to
bid
their
upgradeable
unit.
I
can
only
say
that
chief
k
is
intended
to
reiterate
that
the
units
must
be
p25
compliant.
The
word
he
used
capable
means
having
the
attributes
required
for
performance.
The
radios
bid
by
Williams
USA
do
not
have
the
attributes
to
be
p25
compliant
and
could
only
become
so
at
an
additional
cost
of
about
seventeen
hundred
dollars.
B
B
B
Admit,
I,
don't
have
the
37
years
of
experience
in
radio.
Mr.
Williams
refers
to.
My
understanding
is
that
these
two
features
are
not
proprietary
for
the
kenwood
product
product
that
it
is
a
feature
of
that
product,
but
there
are
other
radio
products
in
the
marketplace
that
also
feature
or
offer
both
of
those,
but
both
of
those
capabilities.
B
Again,
I
would
just
say
that
the
combined
safety
and
operational
requirements
for
the
four
agencies
are
reflected
in
the
bid
specifications
and
again
the
question
to
the
council
tonight
and
the
question
to
the
finance
department
when
they
made
their
determination.
I.
Believe
the
question
before
the
city
manager
in
making
the
having
the
hearing
with
mr.
Williams
was
a
determination
is
the
bid
responsive
to
the
specifications
just
in
closing
over
in
the
far
back
of
the
room
is
mr.
Darryl
Jones
mr.
Jones
has
had
and
has
in
some
instances
contract
with
agencies
in
San
Mateo
County.
B
As
a
consultant
for
communications
in
the
process,
I
asked
mr.
Jones
to
look
at
the
specifications
and
to
look
at
the
bid
submitted
by
Williams
USA,
and
if
you
have
an
interest,
he
can
answer
for
himself
I
believe
he
would
say
that,
in
his
opinion,
the
bid
submitted
by
Williams
USA
does
not
meet
the
specifications
that
were
part
of
this
bid
and
I'd
be
glad
the
chief
answer.
Any
other
questions
you
have
any.
H
Future,
yes,
mr.
larry
evans
and
sir
Williams
makes
very
compelling
case,
but
then
there
is
a
number
six
in
your
findings
and
your
letter
is
just
as
compelling
because
it
says
the
bidding
party
shall
not
dictate
the
requirements.
What
I'd
like
to
know
is
that
I
think
you've
made
it
clear
what
compete
25
compliant
is
means
that,
whatever,
whatever
rate,
if
we
have
a
p25
compliant
radio,
it
will
you
know,
qualify
when
these
guidelines
take
place
either
this
year,
2013.
No
sir
upgradeable
like
I,
understand,
that's
not
incapable.
H
I
can
understand
that
I
guess
what
not
knowing
technically
you
know
what's
going
on
with
these
types
of
pieces
of
equipment,
can
this
agency
set
these
specs?
Even
though
there's
going
to
be
debate
amongst
other
providers,
service
providers
are
equipped.
What
can
the
agency
set
specs
and
stick
by
them,
whether
or
not
they're
viable
or
not?
I
You
know
from
from
day
one
I
think
staffs
opinion
has
been.
Mr.
Williams
argument
is
with
the
specs
and
he
just
has
a
different
opinion
as
to
what
we
should
have
required,
but
you
know,
and
he's
admitted
that
with
a
p25
and
with
the
512
50,
so
yes,
we
can
set
whatever
specs
we
want.
I
mean
the
specs
could
even
be
higher
than
what
set
here.
If
we
wanted
to
my.
B
B
H
B
D
A
D
A
few
questions
so
getting
back
to
the
p25
p25
from
from
what
I've
read
and
was
able
to
understand,
is
a
digital
infrastructure
for
radio
communications,
something
that
we
don't
currently
have
in
place
and
I
think
in
the
battalion
Chiefs
email.
He
responded
that
he
wanted
the
radios
to
be
compliant
yet
out
of
the
box,
not
using
p25.
So
clearly
it's
something
we're
not
going
to
use
immediately
and
from
mr.
Williams
comments
it's
something
that
would
be
very
expensive
for
us
to
upgrade
to.
D
If
we
decided
we
were
going
to
go
that
route
and
also
indicated
that
perhaps
that's
a
requirement
that
would
only
be
required
for
federal
agencies,
even
though
the
federal
grant
would
state
that
everyone
needs
to
be
compliant.
They
would
likely
not
force
a
local
agency
to
be
on
that
on
that
bandwidth,
so
I
mean
it's
almost
like
the
whole
digital
television
thing.
If
you
have
a
box,
you
you
get
digital.
D
I
know
that
the
the
grant
has
language
in
there
that
that
says
that
these
things
have
to
be
included
and
that's
how
they
ended
up
in
the
end
of
spec,
but
being
that
we're
not
going
to
use
it
from
a
functionality
standpoint.
It
seems
like
we're
almost
splitting
hairs
on
how
these
things
are
going
to
work
out
of
the
box.
We're
not
going
to
be
using
it
anyway.
D
B
B
B
See,
I
might
just
add
that
I
don't
think
the
the
difference
between
the
512
channels
and
256
channels
is
a
significant
cost
difference
in
in
the
radios
and
again,
as
even
mr.
Williams
I
think
point
pointed
out.
The
real
cost
difference
in
the
bid
I
mean
the
difference
between
mr.
Williams
bid
and
the
other
three
bidders
are.
The
three
bids
that
received
is
really
this
issue
of
P
2520
I
a'n't
and
and
and
that
variation
I
mean
I
would
agree
that
I
think
that's
the
price
difference
in
in
his
bid.
Okay
and.
D
B
Actually,
the
second
bidder,
when
it
one
of
the
one
of
the
requirements
stipulated
in
the
bill
and
in
the
bid,
was
that
the
bitter
needed
to
submit
sufficient
literature
with
their
bid
to
allow
the
review
of
responsiveness
and
to
be
sure
that
the
bid
met
the
city's
bid,
specifications
and
requirements.
The
second
bidder,
the
one
immediately
above
mr.
B
B
D
B
Don't
believe
it
was
included
in
the
specifications
and
no
comment
of
mine
is
to
say
anything
negative
about
mr.
Williams
equipment
or
the
icon
equipment.
You
know
I'm
sure
it's
very
good
equipment
and
it
may
it
may
have
some
features
that
are
different
and
are
very
good
and
helpful
and
safety
features
again.
B
D
C
D
Like
they're,
going
to
be
the
first
Thanks
yeah
I
think
there
might
be
some
opportunities
where
we're
actually
leveraging
the
various
vendors
and
maybe
not
just
a
single
vendor,
but
maybe
a
subset
of
vendors,
to
supplement
our
our
knowledge
and
our
the
depth
of
our
knowledge
into
some
of
those
products.
Because,
yes,
yeah
I,
don't
think
any
of
us
can
be
experts
in
everything
and
leveraging.
Some
of
that
expertise
in
even
or
upfront
and
developing
the
specs
might
be
might
be
useful.
E
How
many
years
have
you
been
with
one
department
or
another
you're
approved
32
years
32
years,
so
you
would
say
you
have
some
experience
in
radios
I
like
to
push
the
button
and
talk
yeah,
okay,
good!
So
give
me
your
assessment
and
view
because
to
me
what
we're
here
for
and
is
about
as
the
specifications
that's
what
this
appeal
is
about.
I
mean
I
can
tell
you
that
this
floor
is
better
than
that
floor,
but
in
essence,
if
you've
specified
this
is
the
floor.
E
You
want
I'm
using
my
analogy
for
me,
then
that's
what
I'm
supposed
to
give
you
specs
on.
So
to
me
it's
about!
Are
the
specs
and
specifications.
Have
they
been
met
for
what
we're
asking
for
what
FEMA
who's
up
to
going
to
pay?
Eighty
percent
or
is
would
be
paying
eighty
percent
for
these
four
agencies.
We
know
we've
certainly
been
denied
by
FEMA
before
so
I
want
to
make
sure
we
are
compliant.
So
in
your
opinion
on
the
specifications,
can
you
tell
me
a
little
bit
about
those
as
far
as
what
it
meets?
E
G
Again,
this
was
a
collaboration
between
four
agencies
who
developed
these
specifications
and
I.
Think
you
know
in
our
discussion
with
mr.
Jones
I.
Don't
think
these
specifications
are
over
the
top
I
think
they're
high
quality
units
that
we
were
looking
for
and
I
think
the
one
things
we
haven't
talked
about
in
this
county.
We
look
interoperability,
you
know,
so
this
puts
four
agencies
with
the
same
equipment.
Interchangeable
if
need
be
and
compatible
so
I
mean
that
that's
one
of
the
focuses
of
the
of
the
entire
FEMA
grant.
You
know
mr.
G
Williams
is
not
incorrect
on
the
p25,
the
the
directions
on
the
FEMA
grant
was.
We
refer
to
the
safe
calm
and
as
part
of
that,
unless
we
could
demonstrate
that
p25
was
a
detriment
to
the
organizations
or
communications,
then
that
would
be
included
in
the
pit
specification
as
that's
what
chieftess
went
ahead
and
did
so
the
512
I
understand
you
know
we
might
not
use
all
five
12,
but
we
certainly
have
expandable
capabilities.
G
You
know
we're
going
through
cal
cal
fire
is
going
through
their
changeover
right
now.
So
who
knows
what
might
happen
down
the
road?
So
you
know
in
mr.
Jones
experience
we
do
have
agencies
in
this
county
with
512
channel
capability.
Also,
so
you
know
san
bruno
wasn't
a
voice.
Enunciation
enunciation
wasn't
a
san
bruno.
G
E
J
Good
evening,
mayor
and
council
members,
my
name
is
Darryl
Jones,
I'm,
contractually
responsible
for
design
and
engineering
of
the
fire
communication
system
throughout
the
county
of
san
mateo
and
I've
about
32
years
of
experience
in
various
phases
of
public
safety.
Communications
I
was
not
involved
in
preparation
of
the
bid
specifications
that
are
in
question.
I've
had
a
chance
to
briefly
review
them.
J
I
am
thoroughly
aware
of
the
benefits
and
the
downside
of
p25,
and
one
thing
I'd
like
to
call
to
your
attention
is
that
it's
extremely
unlikely
that
the
fire
service
in
san
mateo
county
will
ever
have
a
p25
radio
system.
However,
the
fire
service
throughout
the
state
of
California,
in
fact
throughout
the
United
States,
depends
critically
on
mutual
aid
and
the
ability
of
a
firefighter
a
fire
engine,
a
fire
truck
and
the
radios
that
are
associated
with
those
firefighters
to
go
out
of
jurisdiction
and
by
having
a
radio,
that's
capable
of
numerous
channels.
J
It's
not
uncommon
for
on
a
mutual
aid,
instant.
If
you
remember
back
when
our
apparatus
had
to
go
to
Southern
California
to
assist
with
the
firefighters
or
the
wildland
fires
there,
that,
depending
on
where
you
go
in
the
state
over
the
next
five
years,
I
believe
that
we
will
start
to
see
more
agencies
using
p25
radios
and
if
a
san
bruno
or
san
mateo
or
millbrae
firefighter
has
to
respond
out
of
the
area,
especially
into
u.s.
Forest
Service
jurisdiction.
J
There
is
a
possibility
that
those
radios
will
have
to
be
programmed
once
they
get
on
scene
to
operate
in
p25
mode.
However,
I
don't
believe
it's
likely
that
we
will
be
using
p25
for
fire
service
radios
here
in
San,
Mateo
County,
probably
ever,
but
that
is
a
very
important
distinction
or
consideration
that
when
we
go
out
of
jurisdiction,
we
do
need
to
have
equipment.
That's
capable
of
operating
in
digital
mode.
K
K
My
name
is
john
singer
and
I'm:
a
San
Mateo,
County
resident
and
I
on
metro
mobile
communications,
also
located
in
San
Mateo
County
for
over
25
years
and
I
do
have
a
business
interest
in
this
matter.
I
will
say
that
you
don't
need
37
years
of
experience
in
this
industry
to
understand
the
difference
between
a
p25
or
digital
radio
and
a
non
p25
or
analog
radio.
K
So
the
bid
spec
was
very
clear.
It's
it's
minimal,
I
agree,
but
it
says
two
things
on
the
front
face
the
document.
It
says
with
narrowband
capability
and
p25
compliant.
It's
very
clear
to
me
that
what
you
were
looking
to
purchase
was
a
p25
radio,
a
p25
digital
radio,
they're
very
expensive
now.
I.
Think
mr.
Williams
argument
is
that
he
has
a
roughly
equivalent
product
that
you
can
buy
from
him
for
half
that
money
hundred
thousand
dollars
versus
roughly
two
hundred
thousand
dollars,
but
the
bid
spec
is
written
for
p25
digital
digitally
compliant
radius.
K
His
radio
is
not
digital,
it
is
not
p25
compliant.
If
you
want
to
buy
an
analog
non
p25
compliant
radio.
There
are
a
lot
of
radios
in
the
price
category
of
the
ones
that
he's
selling
that
are
also
very
good
products.
I
also
only
want
to
add
that
the
city
of
san
bruno
fire
and
central
county
fire
are
already
using
a
version
of
the
kenwood
p25
radio
and
they're
very
happy
with
it
has
proven
to
be
a
very
exceptional
product.
Thank
you
for
your
time.
Thank
you.
C
Real
quick,
okay
just
wanted
to
respond
to
some
of
the
things
that
mr.
O'leary
brought
up
and
just
so
everybody
knows
all
radios
are
pretty
much
they'll
talk
and
listen.
It's
like
a
cell
phone.
It's
just
features
different
on
them,
so
having
an
icon,
radio
and
a
kenwood
radio
next
to
each
other
in
the
same
truck,
there's
no
difference,
they
all
talk,
listen
the
same
way.
So
don't
think
that
one's
different
the
other
and
they
can't
intervene
goal
they
can
number
one
is
mr.
C
O'leary
said
in
his
report
that
the
no
abandon
mandate
of
January
first
of
2013
is
correct
by
the
FCC,
but
he
also
stated
that
p25
compliances,
and
that
is
incorrect.
There
is
no
and
I
repeat.
No
mr.
Jones
and
fear
can
answer
the
same
question.
There
is
no
mandatory
mandate
or
any
mandate
at
all
by
the
FCC
for
cities,
counties
or
states.
Only
the
federal
government
period
interfacing
with
us
for
service
engines.
They
one
of
the
features
of
p25,
is
its
dual
mode.
C
It
works
in
conventional,
like
you're
on
now,
and
it
works
in
p25
at
the
same
time,
programmable.
By
channel
they
have
your
fire
channels,
they
have
cal
fire
channels,
they've
got
everybody's
fire
channels.
When
you
show
up
everybody
and
their
department
goes
to
the
analog
channels,
not
an
issue.
When
you
go
in
on
cal
fire,
they
reprogram
your
radio
for
you,
nobody
else
does
they
do
and
they
wipe
out
all
the
channels
are
in
there
and
they
put
their
channels
in
so
512
channels
is
a
moot
point.
C
The
reason
why
some
people
have
512
channels
is
because
that's
all
kenwood
makes
that'll
make
a
tent
channel
radio
or
a
50
channel
radio
same
with
icom
same
with
motorola.
They
all
pick
a
channel
amount
that
they
think
is
sufficient
for
the
industry
and
that's
what
they
make.
There's.
No,
it's
512,
that's
it
or
it's
256,
that's
it
so,
just
because
they
have
512
channels,
that's
because
that's
all
they
could
get.
C
They
couldn't
get
anything
less
so
you're
on
the
five
button
programming
and
also
the
other
agencies
that
have
all
these
different
features
and
the
p25
mandate
would
challenge
mr.
O'leary
to
show
me
show
me:
the
specifications
show
me
the
law,
the
federal
grant
show
me
the
anything
you've
got
that
tells
you
that
the
federal
government
mandating
what
you
buy.
They're,
not
one
thing
I
will
say,
though,
he's
correct
on,
and
this
is
a
big
misnomer.
C
The
state
of
California
is
fallin
for
it,
and
a
lot
of
public
safety
agencies
around
the
country
of
fallin
for
it
and
I've
been
bringing
bring
this
up
too
many
people
and
they've
realized
it
and
bought
the
radios
that
I'm
selling
or
the
competitors
equivalent.
That
is,
is
that,
on
a
on,
a
p25
federal
grant
depends
on
who
you
get
it
from
and
what
agency
in
the
federal
government,
sometimes
they
make
you
buy
a
p25
radio.
You
don't
have
any
choice.
C
If
you
want
that
money,
you
got
to
spend
three
thousand
dollars
for
a
radio
instead
of
11
hundred
dollars
for
an
analog
radio
that
can
be
upgraded
to
it.
They
make
you
do
it,
even
though
you'll
never
use
it,
which
of
course
is
a
waste
of
everybody's
money
since
there's
no
mandate
for
it.
If
you
folks
go
digital
everybody
in
this
county
and
everywhere
and
around
the
barriers
gonna
have
to
go
digital,
you
can't
talk
to
him
and
their
consortium
for
here
in
San,
Jose,
that's
millions
and
millions
of
dollars.
C
We've
already
stated
that
nobody
would
probably
ever
do
it
state
of
California.
Don't
have
any
money
to
do
it.
It's
not
mandated
they're,
not
gonna.
Okay,
we've
got
to
wrap
it
up
here,
pretty
quick,
okay,
so
all
I'm
saying
is
that,
depending
on
the
on
the
ground,
the
federal
government
sometimes
says
quote
unquote
has
to
be
for
p25,
some
say
just
p25.
So
it's
open
for
debate
if,
in
fact
that
it's
full
p25,
then
the
email
that
I
got
back
in
mr.
C
Telly,
stating
that
hey
it
could
be
capable
was
the
wrong
thing
for
him
to
say,
and
that
led
me
to
bid
what
I
bid
can
I
get
a
full
p25.
Absolutely
can
I
be
kenwood
absolutely
so.
At
the
very
least,
you
know
if
we've
got
all
these
semantics
going
around
and
people
not
understanding
what
the
bid
specs
are
and
what
p25
is.
Maybe
it
ought
to
be
well
I'd
like
to
get
the
bit
of
orbit.
Maybe
it
ought
to
be
rebid
I,
don't.
I
Through
the
microphone
plus
I'm,
my
name
is
Bill
Bauer
I'm
a
15
year
resident
of
san
bruno,
and
I
represent
the
kenwood
factory
for
the
manufacture
of
the
kenwood
radios
and
I'll.
Just
make
two
brief
points.
After
a
long
dialogue,
a
lot
of
this
over
many
of
our
heads
I'll
just
simply
say
that
the
if
the
big
one
hit
tomorrow,
the
federal
agencies
that
would
assist
us
would
show
up
here
talking
on
digital
radios.
I
They
will
bring
their
own
digital
infrastructure
with
them,
and
it's
important
with
the
experience
we
had
here
in
the
city
where
60
homes
are
impacted.
You
can
imagine
the
chaos
every
one
of
our
all
of
our
heroes
in
the
city
were
pressed
to
the
limits.
Addressing
that
you
can
only
imagine
in
a
much
more
scalable
large
disaster
how
important
it
will
be
to
communicate
with
our
federal
agencies,
who
will
be
communicating
on
p25
radios.
I
Finally,
that
we
do
have
radios
at
Kenwood
that
are
p25
upgradable
radios
that
are
in
the
same
cost
category
is
the
ones
that
are
the
gentleman
who
is
competing
with
us
for
this
contract,
and
should
you
want
those
analog
radios
that
are
upgradable
to
p25?
They
don't
adhere
to
the
specs
that
for
agency
set,
we
have
those
radios
available.
I
A
You
very
much
okay,
discussion,
action,
I,
just
like
to
say
a
couple
words
I
think
the
key
for
me
was
was
what
mr.
Williams
said
a
number
of
times
in
my
opinion
and
I,
don't
believe
we
set
these
specifications
out
to
ask
for
opinions.
We
set
them
out
to
ask
for
a
specific
product
that
complied
to
certain
specifications,
specifications
that
were
fairly
well
laid
out.
It's
you
know,
I
work
in
a
construction
industry
and
I
deal
with
bids
and
specs
all
the
time,
and
it's
fine
for
me
to
and
try
to
anticipate
in
the
future.
A
What
may
happen
and
what
I
might
be
able
to
get
away
with
and
what
I
might
be
able
to
to
save
the
owner
that
but
sure,
as
hell,
I
go
in
in
the
very
beginning
with
plans
and
specs.
Otherwise
they
just
throw
you
out.
So
I
think
it's
it's
just
a
real
basic
question
of.
Did
you
bid
the
specifications?
No
I,
don't
believe
he
did
I'll.
Let
the
council
speak
any
action.
Michael.
D
But
one
comment
I
would
make
what
would
be
that
I
believe
he
may
develop.
Mr.
windows
made
a
valid
point
in
that
in
the
email
from
the
talent
chief
tells
it
did
say
that
he
did
not
want
it
to
be
digital
out
of
the
box
which
to
me
meant
it
wasn't
a
hard
fast
requirement,
and
if
the
digital
radios
are
in
fact
digital
out
of
the
box,
then
that
was
a
little
lady,
misleading,
okay.
F
E
I
was
just
going
to
say
that
I
think
it
comes
down
to
this
is
about
the
specs.
That's
what
this
is
about
and
and
I
think
mr.
Williams
indicated
he
does
have
a
radio
that
would
meet
the
specs
and
you
chose
not
to
bid
that
I'm
somewhat
with
the
mayor
in
that
when
somebody
asks
for
specific
specifications,
that's
what
should
be
adhere
to
that's
what
these
four
agencies
came
together.
E
That's
what
the
professionals
are
provided-
and
you
know
maybe
I'm-
just
sentimental,
because
what
happened
three
months
ago,
but
when
I
stood
there
and
watched
it
unfold
and
watched
those
that
needed
everything
at
their
disposal
in
action
for
what
they
had
to
do
when
what
our
resident
suffered
I'm
not
willing
to
take,
in
my
opinion,
I
want
things
to
be
specific.
I
want
things
to
be
assured.
I
want
specifics
to
be
met
because
I
want
to
ensure
that
whatever
happens
in
the
future,
we
are
prepared.