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Description
Public Works, Finance & Safety Committee Meeting - 01-04-2021
A
C
B
D
B
D
B
A
A
Those
opposed
signify
by
saying,
nay,
motion
carries
the
next
item
on
the
agenda
is
public
comment
and
that's
the
time
reserved
for
anyone
who
would
like
to
make
a
public
comment
to
step
forward
and
do
so
and
please
state
your
name
for
the
record.
If
your
comment
is
related
to
an
agenda
item,
then
please
wait
until
the
agenda
item
is
taken
up.
Is
there
anyone
else
online
that
would
like
to
or
anyone
that
would
like
to
speak.
A
Okay,
so
we'll
do
d
first,
and
that
is
approval
of
a
temporary
suspension
of
the
new
wastewater
utility
rate
increase
from
resolution
20-48,
specifically
for
dakota
tube
inc,
returning
their
account
to
the
2020
wastewater
rate
and
accommodating
for
a
refund
or
credit
for
the
additional
costs
incurred
to
date.
From
the
new
rate.
A
E
Absolutely
thank
you
mayor
and
hello
to
the
public
works
commissioners
here
this
evening.
This
item
was
brought
to
staff
in
relation
to
our
new
wastewater
utility
rates.
As
you
all
know,
they
went
into
effect
here
recently
and
are
going
to
be
billed
out
in
january
with
the
new
rates,
for,
I
believe,
is
december's
usage.
But
anyway,
during
the
process
being
rolled
out
and
implemented
as
we
speak,
dakota
tube
is
one
company
in
watertown
that
is
known
as
a
significant
industrial
user.
E
That
is
one
of
the
categories
that
our
rates
are
established
with.
We
have
the
residential
rates,
we
have
the
commercial
rates
and
then
we
have
this
significant
industrial
user
rates.
So
they
fall
into
that
specific
category.
What
we
call
the
siu
rate
category
dakota
tube
approached
staff
with
concerns
from
whether
there
should
be
additional
tiers
or
a
different
structure
on
how
we
charge
high
level
users.
E
Dakota
tube
is
a
high
level
water
user.
They
are
the
highest
significant
industrial
user
at
about
32
000,
roughly
32,
500
gallons
per
day,
and
the
second
user
beneath
them
is
only
about
a
third
of
that
by
11
000
gallons
per
day.
E
So
effectively,
what's
happened
here
with
our
new
rates
is
dakota
tube
has
been
hit
the
hardest
by
the
increase
on
this
siu
rate,
this
significant
industrial
user
rate
and
they're,
seeing
about
a
20
percent
increase
on
their
2021
wastewater
utility
bill,
it
adds
up
to
approximately
a
14
000
annual
increase
on
their
wastewater
rate,
and
I
guess
where
we're
at
tonight
is-
is
bringing
this
proposal
to
the
council
per
the
the
businesses
request
that
staff
look
into
these
rate,
this
rate
structure
with
our
consultants
and
see
if
we
shouldn't
modify
this
high-end
siu
rate
to
see
if
there
should
be
a
different,
tiered
system
or
not
it,
and
that's
something
staff's
more
than
willing
to
do
with
our
consultants
and
try
to
find
some
answers
to
that
and
see,
if
that's
appropriate,
to
consider
or
not.
E
Now,
with
all
that
being
said,
I've
got
mike
berger
wastewater
superintendent,
marcy,
luno
and
justin
peterson
engineering
staff
that
have
all
helped
with
the
rate
study
and
then,
of
course,
councilman
bill
hauer
and
councilwoman
manty.
E
A
Thank
you,
heath,
all
right,
so
we
have
a
committee
that
went
through
this
through
and
through,
and
both
council
woman,
manty
and
councilman
vilhauer
were
on
that
committee
and
and
then
we
met
and
with
dakota
tube
personnel.
So
we
have
john
steinbauer
and
jason
murray
are
in
the
audience
in
case
anybody
has
any
questions
for
them
or
if
they
want
to
ask
any
questions,
you
know
I'll
give
you
an
opportunity
to
do
that.
Just
raise
your
hand
if
you
want
to
speak.
D
I
guess
I'll
say
a
few
words,
because
I
was
on
the
committee
that
that
brought
this
forward
for
our
consideration
a
couple
months
ago
and
we
passed
it,
and
I
I
was
one
that
voted
in
favor
of
it
and
it
wasn't
until
it
was
brought
to
my
attention
by
mr
murray,
mr
steinbauer,
from
dakota
tube.
What
the
impact
would
be
relative
to
their
business
and
then
also
looking
at
some
expansion
plans
that
they've
got
in
works.
D
D
I
would
not
be
in
favor
of
bring
this
forward,
reconsidering
it
and
making
an
exception
for
a
particular
business,
but
I
think
that
their
significant
usage
relative
to
everybody
else
that
is
a
that
is
an
industrial
user,
does
merit
reconsideration
and,
like
the
mayor,
alluded
to,
we
did
meet
here
a
couple
weeks
ago
and
I
think
the
consensus
around
the
table
was
that
hey.
This
is
one
that
merits
some
special
consideration.
D
That,
let's
sit
tight
as
far
as
as
far
as
the
rate
increase
that
will
go
into
effect
now
for
this
year
and
review
where
we're
at.
If
there's
some,
if
there
is
some
fair
method,
yes,
there
will
be
a
rate
increase.
I
think
you
folks
acknowledge
that,
but
it's
a
matter
of
what
is
fair
relative
to
your
usage
compared
to
other
other
industrial
users.
So
I
I'm
I've
reached
out
to
councilman
manti,
and
I
spoke
to
a
couple
others
of
you
in
the
council
about
this.
D
F
I
just
wanted
to
echo
what
gr
glenn
said
so
that
everybody
knows
where
I
stood
on
this,
that
it's
worth
looking
into
and
it
so
basically
what
he
said.
I
guess
pardon
me
I
would
support
it
as
well.
A
A
D
Guess
I
would
suggest
that
if
you
gentlemen
would
like
to
comment,
you
took
the
time
to
come
here,
and
I
appreciate
that
if
you
guys
like
to
say
anything
on
your
behalf,
you're
more
than
welcome.
G
B
G
So
thank
you
for
taking
the
time
to
consider
this.
What
we
initially
brought
this
up
with
glenn
right
when
we
got
the
notice
of
the
increase,
and
we
wanted
to
just
make
him
aware
and
make
make
you
guys
aware
of
what
the
impact
to
us
was
from
an
industrial
user
perspective.
G
There
are
a
number
of
different
things
that
we
thought:
weren't
fair
in
the
increase
and
they're
primarily
related
to
the
amount
of
pre-treatment
that
we're
doing
with
our
water
already
and
the
amount
of
treatment
that
has
that
has
to
happen
to
our
water
after
it
leaves
our
plant,
which
is
nothing
it
just
gets
mixed
in
with
the
rest
of
the
city,
water.
So
most
of
the
treatment
is
already
done
ourselves.
So
there's.
G
I
think
that,
like
our
type
of
a
category,
what
we're
suggesting
is
that
we
just
take
a
look
at
companies,
not
just
the
co2,
but
companies
like
dakota
tube
that
are
using
a
lot
of
water
and
returning
a
lot
of
water
into
the
into
the
city
treatment
system.
But
pre-treated
and
I'll
answer
any
questions.
I
have
a
lot
of
information
that
I
did
in
in
research
about
what
our
company
does,
how
the
water
works
and
I
guess
comparable
how
comparable
cities
handle
it.
H
G
So
we
have
two:
we
have
two
separate
streams.
One
is
one
is
for
our
particular
process:
treatment,
water
and
that
and
then
the
rest
is
just
our
general
sewage,
like
any
business,
would
have
so
that
that
type
of
water,
the
general
sewage
you
know
from
bathrooms-
and
things
like
that
has
to
get
treated
they
meet
in
the
same
sewer,
though
sewer
lines
that
go
right
back
to
the
to
the
city.
Water.
G
H
Okay,
that
was
kind
of
my
concern
with
it.
I
it's
a
little
challenging
because
we
just
talked
about
some
pumps
right
and
what
that
does
to
our
system
and
when
we
pump
into
it.
I'm
just
curious-
and
maybe
mike
can
weigh
in
on
this.
Are
there
alternatives
for
them?
If
they've
already
got
two
separate
lines
and
they're
just
connecting
right
now,
where
it's
pumping
into
the
sanitary
sewer?
H
If
this
water
is
pre-treated,
it
seems
a
little
redundant
to
treat
it
again
as
a
city,
if
there's
another
alternative
that
could
be
looked
at
so
that
maybe
there
is
a
pro
rate
or
a
discount
or
something
that
could
be
put
in
place
because
naturally,
epa
and
stuff,
you
probably
would
have
to
do
all
the
processes
you're
doing
with
that
used
water.
So
I
don't
see
why
we're
double
tapping
it
to
filter
twice
and
clean
twice
or
treat
twice.
I
No,
this
is
mike
berger
at
wastewater.
I
have
craig
mitchell
the
assistant
superintendent
with
me
here
as
well.
No,
there
are
humming
crater,
have
a
pre-treatment
under
the.
B
I
Are
several
others
of
the
14
that
that
pre-treat,
their
water
before
it's
discharged
and
the
reason
they
need
to
do
that
is
because
they've
got
to
get
the
water
down
to
meet
the
local
limits?
The
local
limits,
which
are
the
concentrations
that
we
can
accept
from
the
industries,
are,
are
there
and
those
are
developed
technically
to
protect
the
wastewater
treatment
facility
from
pass-through
or
interference,
so
they're
they're
doing
the
pre-treatment
because
they
need
to
pre-treat
for
us
to
even
accept
it
here
at
wastewater,
okay
to
protect
this
facility.
Thank
you.
F
Yeah,
I
just
wanted
to
add
that
I
support
us
looking
into
this
further.
I
want
to
be
clear
that
I
don't
believe
there
should
be
no
increase.
I
I
believe
that
an
increase
is
warranted.
As
the
mayor
said,
with
everybody
else
getting
entries,
there
hasn't
been
one
for
a
long
time.
F
I
guess
my
thinking
on
this
is
to
keep
it
in
this,
in
the
spirit
of
what
we're
trying
to
do
here
with
getting
our
users
fees
up
to
and
closer
to
where
they
need
to
be
overall,
because
we
are
behind
on
some
of
those
things
and
yet
acknowledge
that
this
is
going
to
be
a
tremendous
increase
for
this
particular
user.
Dakota
tube
is,
you
know,
looking
to
have
this
significant
chunk,
so
by
giving
us
a
stall
here
and
having
a
chance
to
look
at
it
with
a
consultant.
F
We
have
an
opportunity
to
see
what's
going
on
in
other
communities
and
things
like
that.
So
that's
that's
where
I'm
at
with
it.
I
think
we
owe
them
a
look
at
it,
and
I
also
know
that
they
understand
that
there
still
would
be
an
increase
of
some
sort.
So
it's
not
a
matter
of
not
having
them.
Have
the
increase,
it's
a
matter
of
how
much
and
to
what
degree.
A
H
I
guess
overall,
the
biggest
thing
to
decide
tonight
is:
if
we're
going
to
keep
them
at
their
current
rate,
they'll
be
the
only
people
that
get
that
benefit
and
then
other
folks
are
not
receiving
that
same
benefit
or
if
we
keep
them
where
they're
at
for
now
re-look
at
it
with
the
committee
and
consultant
and
then
refund
it.
If
we
see
it's
appropriate,
I
think
it's
just
the
only
concern
I
have
is
that
it
does
seem
to
show
a
little
bit
of
exceptionalism
for
one
group
versus
everyone.
H
A
So
if
we
leave
it,
as
is,
there
will
be
billing,
there
will
be
an
extra
billing
in
there
somewhere
to
catch
up
for
the
rate
increase
that
didn't
occur
after
you
figure
out
what
the
reasonable
rate
increase
is
and
then
that's
charged
above
the
2020
rate
versus
what's
written
now,
which
is
they
stay
at
2020
when
everyone
else
goes
to
2021
rates
and
or
give
a
refund
if
they
were
to
stay
with
everyone
else
so
refund
or
billing.
B
Thank
you
mayor
this
question
be
for
mike
burger
mike.
Is
there
a
difference
in
cost
with
this
water
coming
into
the
wastewater,
the
fact
that
it's
pre-treated
at
their
facility?
I
think,
if
I'm
not
mistaken,
epa
kind
of
requires
that
anyway,
but
is
there
a
difference
as
far
as
the
cost
for
you
to
clean
that
water?
If
it
comes
from
them,
pre-treated
versus
everybody
else,.
I
Them
there's
different
from
everybody
else's.
No,
just
the
more.
We
get
the
more
cost
we
have,
because
this
water
is
is
pumped
and
it's
transported
through
the
facility
and,
of
course,
the
more
water
you
have.
It
can
affect
your
aeration
and
a
lot
of
different
processes
so
but
say
that
the
corded
tube
is
waste
is
different
than
someone
else's.
No,
I.
A
B
It's
probably
a
question
for
mike,
I
said:
dakota
tube
hasn't
had
an
increase
in
the
water
rate
in
10
years.
Are
there
any
other
companies
or
has
nobody
else
had
an
increase
in
the
water
rate
in
10
years?.
I
No-
and
I
would
point
out-
we've
been
on
about
every
10
years-
we've
done
a
rate
evaluation,
so
the
20
is
really
2
a
year
over
10
years
and
so
there's
many
years
that
there
was
no
increase
for
like
for
the
last
many
years,
and
so
no
I
mean
I
mean
we
could
probably
do
rate
evaluations
more
event
more
frequently
and
do
them
sooner.
But
that
comes
at
a
greater
cost
as
well,
and
all
those
costs
have
to
be
recovered.
So,
but
I
would
just
point
that
out.
A
All
right,
thank
you.
Councilman
hoyer,.
H
B
D
You
raise
a
good
question
michael,
but
I
got
to
say
when
we
looked
at
this.
If
you
recall
the
discussion
that
we
had
a
couple
months
ago,
we
we,
as
a
group,
actually
got
kind
of
hung
up
on
the
the
residential
side
of
it,
the
the
the
sump
pump
variance
and
the
rate
increases
there.
D
I
got
to
say
when
we
as
a
committee
were
going
through
this
and
and
that's
probably
just
my
own
fault,
I
don't
recall,
having
a
whole
lot
of
conversation,
at
least
not
much
that
sunk
in
with
me
as
far
as
what
the
impact
was
going
to
be
on
our
industrial
users
that
that
we
got,
we
got
bogged
down
and
looking
at
the
residential
side
of
it.
D
E
Yes,
thank
you
mayor.
I
see
mercy's
got
her
hand
up
too,
and
I
was
going
to
defer
to
her.
We
did
just
for
the
council's
information,
we
did
research,
other
communities
rates
and
we
actually
had
our
consultant
plug
this
amount
of
consumption,
this
32
gallons
per
day
into
those
other
communities
rates,
and
we
found
that
we
were
with
our
new
rate
fairly
comparable
with
a
couple
of
those
communities.
E
I
don't
have
a
list
right
in
front
of
me,
so
I
apologize,
but
I
believe
aberdeen
and
sioux
falls
were
two
of
them
that
were
very
comparable
to
where
our
new
rate
would
be
for
this
exact
same
level
of
usage,
and
there
were
other
communities
that
did
fall
significantly
less
than
our
rate,
but
they
too,
I
don't
think,
have
updated
their
rates
in
quite
a
few
years,
so
we're
not
necessarily
comparing
apples
to
apples
when
we
look
at
some
of
those
communities.
E
I
just
wanted
to
point
that
out
too
for
for
the
for
informational
purposes,.
C
Yeah
I
same
things
as
he
said,
but
also
want
to
add
that
you
know
we
did
have
the
discussion
that
dakota
tubes
water
is
pre-treated.
Now.
Is
there
other
options
for
them
to
reuse?
That
water
ahead
of
time
is
something
that
we
can
look
into
and
help
them
with,
as
well
from
the
dnr
perspective
of
permitting
and
different
things?
C
But
you
know:
ryan
was
on
the
meeting
with
us
when
we
talked
to
dakota
tube,
and
we
do
feel
that
the
rates
are
fair
and
equitable
for
recouping
the
costs
of
what
the
wastewater
treatment
program
is
for
the
city
of
watertown.
H
Do
we
know
ten
years
ago,
when
we
upped
the
rates?
What
was
what
did
that
look
like?
Was
it
close
to
two
percent
a
year?
Was
it
comparable
to
this,
or
because
I'm
just.
J
I
I
Yeah,
it
was
about
a
20
10
years
ago
too,
and
so
it
was
it's
about
the
same
two
percent
a
year
roughly
but
same
ballpark.
G
Sure
my
name
is
john
steinbauer,
president
of
codetube.
This
is
jason
murray,
purchasing
manager
of
the
code.
G
There's
there's
a
couple
other
things
that
that
some
of
the
some
of
the
rates
that
we're
talking
about
they're,
not
as
simple
as
they
look,
because
when
we
consider
certain
things
and
comparing
them
to
other
communities
like,
for
instance,
if
we
compare
our
wastewater
treatment
costs
to
a
different
community,
you
have
to
consider
that
some
of
them
have
combined
utilities,
public
utilities
and
so
they'll
charge
a
water
rate
and
they'll
charge
a
wastewater
treatment
rate.
G
So
it's
like
the
the
cost
of
using
a
gallon
of
water
is
the
cost
of
getting
a
gallon
water
and
then
also
sending
that
gallon
of
water
down
the
drain,
so
that
that
has
to
be
like
put
in
the
analysis
too.
We
can't
just
say
that
the
wastewater
treatment
is
comparable
to
other
communities
and
not
look
at
what
the
gallon
of
water
costs
in
that
community
versus
ours.
G
That
was
one
point
and
then
another
reason
that
we
were
asking
for
this
to
be
reviewed
is
it
was
a
20
increase
and
when
you,
when
you
bring
up
that,
what
did
the
rate
look
rate
increase,
look
like
10
years
ago,
the
I
just
wanted.
I
wanted
them
to
look
at
the
concept
of
compounding
interest
instead
of
looking
at
the
costs,
allocating
where
those
costs
are
incurred
and
then
allocating
them
fairly
to
the
users
what's
happening.
G
A
A
G
The
last
thing
I
just
wanted
to
add
was
that
our
community,
when
I
looked
at
the
report
from
the
consultant,
he
was
comparing
our
community
separates
industrial
and
commercial
users
for
wastewater
treatment
usage
and
the
communities
that
he
was
comparing
to
didn't,
always
do
that
so
some
of
they're
using
commercial
rates
and
comparing
to
our
our
industrial
rate.
So
that
was
just
another
inconsistency
in
the
in
that
consultant's
recommendation
that
we
wanted
looked
at.
B
A
If
you
decline,
if
you
vote
down
the
resolution,
then
they'll
be
with
everyone
else,
they'd
be
getting
the
same
rate
as
everybody
else,
but
you
can
still
do
some
research
and
then
give
them
an
adjustment
if
their
rate
is
reduced
to
paying
back
essentially
what
they
overpaid.
If
the
council
decides
to
reduce
their
rate,
is
that
understood
by
everybody
any
questions
before
we
vote?
Did
you
have
anything
else,
nope,
all
right,
I'll,
look
for
action,
all
those
in
favor
signify
by
saying
I,
I
all
those
posts
signify
by
saying,
nay,.
H
D
H
B
H
E
A
All
right
thanks.
I
should
have
noted
that
for
the
record,
one
councilman
holy
and
came
in
at
right
at
the
beginning
of
this
item,
so
you
heard
pretty
much
all
of
the
discussion,
so
this
carries
so
your
rate
will
be,
if
it's
approved
by
the
council
at
the
next
meeting,
which
it
should
it's
on
the
consent
agenda.
A
A
E
Yes,
thank
you
mayor.
This
is
our
annual
contract
with
first
district
association
of
local
governments.
It
is
to
provide
a
public
works
department
services
that
pertain
primarily
to
the
community
development
function
of
public
works.
That's
helping
us
with
planning
and
zoning
and
gis
mapping
and
the
data
needs
that
go
into
our
gis
maps.
E
First
district
helps,
for
example,
provide
monthly
meeting
data
needs.
You
know
we
have
meetings
every
month
regarding
development
and
preliminary
plans
and
plats,
and
zoning
and
things
of
that
nature
and
first
district
helps
keep
those
records
updated
in
our
mapping
system.
E
They
also
help
the
land
record
management
system
and
continually
provide
information
like
that
throughout
the
year
for
this
service
fee
amount.
This
is
this
fee
of
twenty
thousand.
Seventy
dollars
is
identical
to
what
we
paid
last
year,
not
proposing
any
rate
increases
this
year
at
all,
and
otherwise
pretty
routine
agreement
and
standby
for
any
questions.
A
Okay,
no
one
else,
all
right
I'll
look
for
action,
all
those
in
favor
signify
by
saying
aye.
B
A
Those
opposed
signify
by
saying
nay,
motion
carries.
Thank
you.
Item
b
is
approval
of
a
professional
services
agreement
with
first
district
for
services
related
to
the
development
and
hosting
of
the
city
county
geographic
information
system.
Gis
website,
in
the
amount
of
four
thousand
five
hundred
dollars
authorizing
the
mayor
to
sign
all
applicable
documents,
have
a
motion
by
law;
second,
the
second
buyer,
dempsky
and
heath
I'll.
Let
you
tell
us
about
this.
One
too.
E
E
E
Our
share
is
forty
five
hundred
dollars.
The
counties
looks
like
thirty,
one
hundred
municipal
utilities
at
1500
and
watertown
development
company
at
900,
and
so
those
are
the
financial
splits
for
each
partnering
contributor
to
these
services.
A
Anyone
else
all
right
I'll
look
for
action,
all
those
in
favor
signify
by
saying
aye
aye.
Those
opposed
signify
by
saying
nay,
motion
carries
okay.
Item
c
is
the
presentation
on
conflicts
of
interest
and
ex
parte
communication
by
our
city
attorney
matt
roby,
and
no
action
on
this
just
going
to
give
us
a
refresher
so
go
ahead.
J
Matt,
thank
you
mayor.
I'm
gonna
see
if
I
can
get
my
screen
to
share
here
correctly,
just
one
second.
J
J
So
I
gave
a
similar
presentation
on.
I
guess
it
was
november
at
the
plan
commission
meeting
and
councilman
bill
howard
asked
if
I
give
give
this
presentation
to
to
the
council
as
well.
J
So
essentially,
you
know
with
the
with
the
board
of
adjustment
plan.
Commission
ex
part
day
communications
are
are,
are
more
more
important
to
consider
because
all
of
their
actions,
as
I
said
as
the
board
of
adjustment,
are
considered
quasi-judicial,
but
I'm
going
to
touch
on
ex-party
communication
here,
but
I
am
also,
but
the
primary
focus
of
the
presentation
is
on
conflicts
of
interest.
So
just
a
quick
overview.
J
The
legislature
has
created
multiple
different
ways
to
ensure
that
actions
of
of
all
sorts
of
organizations
and
agencies
and
local
governments
are
free
of
conflict,
a
few
of
them
just
just,
for
example,
here
the
statements
of
financial
disclosure
that
council
members
are
required
to
file
as
well
as
the
mayor
campaign
finance
disclosures
that
we
recently
enacted.
That,
of
course,
has
already
been
already
required
at
the
state
level.
We
recently
chose
to
enact
it
at
the
local
level.
J
There's
a
list
of
incompatible
offices
that
the
there's
a
few
called
out
by
statute,
but
mostly
that's
been
over
the
years
the
attorney
general
has
weighed
in
on
various
offices
that
would
be
incompatible
for
a
council,
member
or
various
office
holders
to
hold
at
the
same
time,
there's
a
there's
some
language
in
statute
about,
if
you
haven't
known
a
business
that
intends
on
getting
on
city
contracts
or
that
sort
of
thing,
there's
certain
protocols
that
have
to
be
followed.
J
But
today
I'm
just
going
to
focus
on
the
conflicts
of
interest
that
arise
most
frequently
as
the
as
the
board.
As
the
council
considers
its
week-to-week
agenda
items
so
in
2005
the
supreme
court
adopted.
I
believe
it
was.
J
I
remember
right.
It
was
new,
hampshire
or
michigan.
I
can't
remember
it.
It
kind
of
went
through
a
discussion
about
how
different
states
have
characterized
different
types
of
conflicts
of
interest,
and
the
supreme
court
in
2005
adopted
this.
These
four
categories
of
conflicts
of
interest,
and
they
are
the
direct
pecuniary
interests,
the
indirect
pecuniary
interest,
direct
personal
interest
and
the
indirect
personal
interest
direct.
J
J
Now
after
the
court
adopted
these
these
four
categories
and
essentially
said
that,
basically,
if
you
have,
if
you've
identified
yourself
as
falling
into
any
of
these
four
categories,
you
more
or
less
need
to
recuse
yourself
and
our
good
friend
senator
lee
schoenbeck
jumped
into
action
that
that
immediately
following
legislative
session
and
said,
wait.
A
second
indirect
personal
interest
is
going
to
basically
require
the
city
councils
in
the
state
of
south
dakota
to
recuse
themselves
from
every
action
they
they
need
to
take.
J
J
If
you
have
any
of
the
other
three
types
of
financial,
any
of
the
other
three
interests
that
were
identified
by
the
court,
you
should
think
through
them
as
they
apply
to
you.
J
Consider
whether
or
not
you
can
be
impartial,
but
regardless
you
need
to
make
them
known,
but
you
don't
need
to
recuse
yourself
unless
that
that
second
bullet
point
there,
unless
two-thirds
of
the
governing
body
decides
that
hey,
we've
considered
your
your
direct
personal
interest
in
this
matter,
and
we
don't
feel
that
you
can
be
that
you
can
be
impartial
and
so
essentially
the
brightline
rule
is.
If
you
have
a
direct
financial
interest,
it
requires
recusal.
J
If
you
have
a
direct
personal
or
indirect
financial
or
indirect
personal,
it
requires
it's
more
nuanced.
I
guess
I
would
say
requires
you,
you
should
disclose
it
to
the
to
the
board,
and
then
you
should
make
a
decision
on
your
own.
Whether
you
personally
feel
you
can
be
impartial.
J
If
you
don't
feel
you
should
be
impartial,
refuse
yourself
if
you
do,
but
your
fellow
council
members
disagree
with
you,
they
can
force
you
to
recuse
yourself
if
you've
identified
that
interest
and
then
one
other
piece
that
I,
as
I'm
talking
here,
I
forgot
to
mention
I'm
thinking
of
my
cousin
don.
That
statute
also
does
require
any
holder
of
an
alcoholic
beverage
license
to
recuse
themselves
from
all
issuances
and
renewals
of
alcoholic
beverage
licenses.
J
J
You
don't
there's
not
a
lesser
level
of
you
can't
say,
I'm
just
going
to
abstain
from
the
vote,
but
recuse
myself
from
participation
in
the
discussion.
You
can
abstain.
If
you
don't
believe
you
have
enough
information
to
make
a
decision,
I
mean
there's
there's
that
type
of
abstention,
but
if
you've
identified
a
financial,
direct
financial
interests
or
your
fellow
board,
members
have
identified
an
interest
and
they
vote
two
thirds
to
force
you
to
recuse
yourself.
J
You
cannot
participate
in
discussion
and
you
can't
vote,
and
ideally
you
would
step
down
from
the
diocese
during
that
portion
of
the
discussion,
but
as
abstention.
Of
course,
you
could
do
that
at
any
time.
If
you
felt
like
there
was
a
an
action
you
were
considering,
you
didn't
have
enough
information
to
take.
If
you
were
concerned
about
the
political
ramifications
he
could
abstain.
Is
that
did
that
answer
your
question
don.
B
It
does
I'll
just
put
that,
in
my
words,
if
you're
recusing
yourself
you're
out
you
don't
discuss,
you
don't
vote
you
just
you're
done
with
the
topic
on
abstaining,
you
can
participate
as
much
as
you
want.
You
just
decide
not
to
vote
at
the
end
just
oversimplify
it.
J
Yeah,
that's
right,
you're,
right
yeah!
You
could,
if
you
just.
If
you
come
into
a
vote
or
you're
participating
in
the
discussion
and
that,
for
example,
the
the
question
is
called
and
you
were
one
of
the
dissenting
votes
to
call
the
question
you
might
decide
to
abstain
because
you
felt
like
it
needed
more
discussion.
You
know
you're,
not
ready
to
say
yes
or
no
so
yeah.
Absolutely
that
is,
that
is
a
distinction
there.
B
Matt
on
that
one,
if
two-thirds
of
the
council
feels
that
you
need
to
recuse,
is
that
something
they
could
do
after
the
fact
or
like
something
came
to
light
after
a
vote,
I'm
just
throwing
out.
J
No,
no,
the
intention
would
be
that
you
would
disclose.
So
the
agenda
item
comes
up,
for
example,
and
you
say
chair,
I
just
want
to
disclose
that.
I
you
know
I'm
a
member
of
the
elks,
and
this
is
a
consideration
for
some
non-profit
funding
for
the
elks,
but
I
don't
feel
like
I
can
be.
I
don't
feel
like
I'm
going
to
be
impacted.
I
I
don't
intend
to
recuse
myself
at
that
time.
The
board
could
disagree
with
you.
J
If
somebody
could
make
a
motion
to
force
you
to
recuse
yourself
and
then
it
would
be
voted
upon
and
if
two-thirds
of
the
board
decided
that
you
couldn't
be
impartial,
you
would
be
forced
to
recuse
yourself.
J
The
other,
the
other
thing
you
know
that
disclosure
is
highly
encouraged.
The
other
reason
for
that
is,
if
it's
a
intention
and
there's
an
applicant
or
an
interested
party
in
the
audience,
if
you
disclose
and
don't
feel
like,
you
need
to
recuse,
the
board
doesn't
think
you
need
to
recuse,
and
the
interested
party
doesn't
object
to
your
not
to
your
non-recusal,
potentially
in
a
future
lawsuit
their
failure
to
object
after
your
disclosure
could
be
deemed
as
a
waiver
of
their
concern
over
your
conflict.
D
Matt,
you
probably
know
that
I
recused
myself
from
a
couple
agenda
items
just
a
few
minutes
ago.
Is
this
a
was
this
recusal
appropriate?
I
sit
on
the
board
of
directors
for
first
planning
district.
I
didn't
disclose
that,
but
I
did
recuse
myself.
Is
that
a
situation
where
I
should
be
recusing
myself,
because
those
come
up
every
year
as
long
as
I'm
on
the
council
and
also
on
the
first
planning
district
board
of
directors.
J
Well,
under
under
the
statute,
it
would
not
require
refusal
because
you
don't,
presumably
you
don't,
have
a
direct,
any
sort
of
financial
interest.
You
just
sit
as
a
board
member,
but
if
you,
if
you
don't
believe
you
can
be
impartial,
then
there's
no
reason
you
shouldn't
recuse.
Now
now
it's
in
some
in
some
respects,
you
know
there's
that
appearance
of
impropriety,
and
so
I
think,
as
a
you
know,
as
a
board
member,
it's
probably
appropriate.
J
But
if
you
you
know,
if
you
soul,
search
and
decide
that
you
don't
feel
like
you're
being
conflicted,
I
would
say
that
you
could
kind
of
make
that
judgment.
But
you
know
I
in
the
you
know
it's
probably
always
better.
If
you're
questioning
it,
it
probably
means
you
should
recuse.
J
J
J
Okay,
next
piece
here
is
just
about
x,
parte
communications.
Now
what
is
the
next
part
take
communication?
Essentially
it's
just
communication
between
an
interested
party
and
a
decision
maker
relating
to
the
merits
of
a
pending
decision
made
outside
of
the
official
channels
of
the
proceedings.
So
you
know
examples.
Are
you
know
if
you
get
a
phone
call
or
you
get
an
email
on
a
pending
decision?
J
When
does
it
become
an
issue?
It
becomes
an
issue
when
when
and
if
the
council
is
acting
in
a
quasi-judicial
capacity,
now
most
almost
all
actions
of
the
council
are
legislative
in
nature,
meaning
they
set
out
a
future
course
of
conduct.
J
They
they're
not
adjudicating
adjudicating
a
dispute
they're,
not
adjudicating
that
setting
out
a
decision
based
on
current
facts
and
current
law.
J
J
Now,
what
if
it
happens?
So
if
you
get
into
one
of
these
situations,
what
if
it
happens
again
disclose
prior
to
the
hearing
in
the
presence
of
the
board
and
the
public
and
on
the
record,
does
it
require
recusal
if
the
communication
is
invited?
So,
for
example,
if
you
took
it
upon
yourself
to
call
an
applicant
or
interested
party
or
if
you
decided
to
go
visit
a
site
that
might
be
under
some
sort
of
consideration,
you
should
recuse
yourself
if
it's
uninvited
again.
J
This
is
that
gray
area
where
you
have
to
decide
whether
or
not
what
you've
learned
outside
the
presence
of
the
rest
of
the
board
and
the
public.
You
have
to
decide
if
what
you've
learned
or
if
the
community,
the
nature
of
the
communication
was
such
that
you
don't
feel
like
you
can
be
impartial
any
longer
or
if
you
ask
me,
and
I,
and
I
say
it
seems
pretty
fishy,
you
should
probably
recuse
yourself.
J
That's
another
instance,
but
again,
there's
not
a
most
everything.
The
city
council
does
is
legislative,
but
on
those
two
two
types
of
considerations
permits
and
and
licensing
airing
on
the
side
of
caution,
I
would
treat
those
as
quasi-judicial
when
it
comes
to
ex-parte
communications.
So
just
you
know
just
be
on
the
lookout
for
that
now,
as
I
mentioned
earlier,
virtually
everything
that
the
board
of
adjustment
does
is
quasi-judicial
in
nature,
variances
and
conditional
use
permits,
and
so
keep
that
in
mind
as
you.
J
Well,
you
know
in
your
role
in
on
the
council,
keep
in
mind
that
you
shouldn't
be
reaching
out
to
those
those
board-
members
lobbying,
for
example,
if
a
constituent
contacts
you
that
has
a
question
in
front
of
the
board
of
adjustment,
it
would
be
inappropriate
to
reach
out
and
allow
the
board
of
adjustment
on
an
action.
J
The
ex
parte
communication.
So
keep
that
in
mind
as
well.
Any
questions
on
the
x-parte
communications.
D
Man,
I
got
a
question
for
you
because
I
know
that
comes
up
fairly
frequently,
I
mean
we
we
as
a
body
of
10
people,
we
quite
often
will
will
bounce
up.
You
know
questions
off
each
other.
You
know,
as
far
as
what
your
thoughts
are
in
a
particular
issue
outside
of
a
council
meeting.
You
know
in
small
groups
of
you
know
two
three
four
whatever
is
is
that
okay.
J
Yep
again,
most
almost
all
those
issues
that
you're
discussing
are
legislative
in
nature.
So
you
you
think
about
your
legislators.
For
example,
you
know
there's
lobbying
that
gets
done
on
a
day-to-day
basis,
all
that
all
those
types
of
discussions
are
they're,
forward-looking,
you're,
gonna,
maybe
approve
a
contract
or
you're
gonna
approve
a
project
or
you're
going
to
approve
a
an
ordinance.
J
All
those
things
lay
out
a
course
of
future
conduct,
so
they're
legislative,
and
so
therefore,
those
those
communications
are,
are
completely
appropriate
as
long
as
again
as
long
as
the
issue
is
legislative.
Now,
if
you
get
into
one
of
those
two
areas
I
mentioned,
I
don't
I
don't
expect
you
you're,
probably
talking
a
whole
lot
about
alcoholic
beverage
licenses,
but
if
you
ever
find
yourself
doing
that
and
pertaining
to
a
particular
applicant
for
a
license.
B
A
D
Got
a
question
some
because
it
was
about
exactly
this
time
of
the
year
roughly
within
a
day
or
two
probably
of
when
there
was
the
the
tow
truck
driver
killed
on
the
south
highway
20
bypass.
You
know
we
renamed
that
dale
jones
memorial
highway,
but
there's
also
conversation.
I
thought
I
recalled
that
time
about
putting
some
kind
of
memorial
marker
out
there
whatever's
become
of
that
part
of
the
the
discussion.
E
Yes,
absolutely
mayor,
I
have
not
been
approached
yet.
There
was
a
second
party
that
was
involved
with
the
monument
there
was
an
actual
marker
or
a
monument
that
they
wanted
to
install
there
somewhere
along
the
route
potentially
near
the
intersection
of
highway
81
in
the
south
bypass.
E
The
people
that
wanted
the
the
roadway
designation
and
the
signs
put
up
was
one
group,
and
then
there
was
kind
of
a
second
group
that
was
going
to
reapproach
the
city
with
the
memorial
and
that
that
has
not
surfaced
back
my
direction.
I
haven't
heard
anything
more
from
them
on
that,
so
I'm
not
sure
if
it
fell
silent
due
to
whatever
factors
may
be,
but
I
just
haven't
heard
anything
further
on
it.