►
Description
Financing The Future from Abundance Investment
A
Right
financing
retrofit
this
is
a
really
really
really
difficult
one.
I'm
gonna
there.
I
I'm
gonna,
therefore
tell
you
a
little
bit
around
what
the
issues
are
and
why
it
is
very
difficult
to
retrofit
and
find
well
not
retrofit,
but
finance
the
retrofit
and
also
just
talk
a
little
bit
about
some
ideas.
Potentially
so
you
know
there
is
room
for
more
innovation
in
financial
products.
A
So
often
it's
quite
altruistic
the
work
that
people
do
it's
very
expensive,
it's
very
disruptive,
so
it's
a
very
difficult
sort
of
area
to
try
and
get
people
to
invest
in
there's
a
further
issue.
When
you
look
at
rental
properties,
because
then
you've
got
the
split
incentives
of
the
landlord
and
the
tenant,
how
do
you
get
a
landlord
to
pay
for
something
when
he's
not
necessarily
going
to
get
the
increased
levels
of
rent
from
doing
that?
A
Work
very,
very
tricky,
so
just
to
get
dig
into
a
few
different
sectors
and
again
talk
about
sort
of
some
of
the
key
key
issues
there
and
what's
available
now
you
know
if
you're
financing
in
the
private
residential
sector,
the
money
needs
to
come
from
an
occupiers
or
a
landlord's
own
funds,
a
bank
loan
or
could
be
through
a
sort
of
third-party
share
of
savings
model,
now
sort
of
on
the
share
of
savings
side
of
things.
That's
not
very
difficult
on
res.
That's
not
very
easy
on
residential
properties.
It's
it's
pretty
difficult.
A
You've
got
an
issue
whereby
you've
got
funders
wondering
how
they're
actually
going
to
get
their
money
back.
If
they
do
that,
because
it's
very
difficult
to
directly
take
money
off
people's
energy
bills,
people
don't
necessarily
have
a
very
strong
covenant
strength.
You
can't
secure
against
anything,
there's
lots
of
different
issues
here
now.
What
you
might
be
able
to
do
is
harness
economies
of
scale.
If
those
could
be
harnessed
through
a
sort
of
area-based,
strategic
mass
retrofit
project,
you
might
attract
more
investment,
because
a
small
percentage
of
the
lost
revenue
could
then
potentially
be
absorbed.
A
Also
ecology
does
a
renovation
mortgage
which
offers
a
discounted
rate
for
projects
that
improve
a
property
by.
I
think
it's
two
or
more
epc
ratings
and
there's
also
additional
borrowing
mortgages.
That
nationwide
do
which
has
a
low
initial
rate
on
the
loans
to
pay
for
energy
efficiency
improvements,
and
I
think,
there's
also
something
from
lend
invest
in
the
buy
to
let
market,
which
is
basically
a
loan,
a
bridge
to
let
loan
they
call
it,
which
offers
cash
back
to
landlords
that
improve
the
epc
rating
of
their
investments.
A
So
there
are
some
things
out
there.
The
the
other
issue
that
you
have
got
is
it's
not
linked
directly
to
the
property.
A
lot
of
these
things
are
linked
to
the
person
themselves,
which
makes
it
very
difficult,
if
you're
not
going
to
be
there
for
very
long
time.
How
do
you?
How
do
you
make
your
money
back
on
these
long-term
investments?
Is
it
going
to
be
added
to
the
value
of
your
house?
Not
really
george,
I
think
it
was
mentioned.
A
Carbon
pricing
is
probably
the
only
way
that
you'll
get
this
to
actually
link
in
to
house
housing
prices
and
how
people
make
their
decisions
on
their
investments.
For
for
these
kind
of
works,
so
yeah,
as
I've
just
said
kind
of
to
unlock
it,
you
need
some
long-term,
clear
policies.
That's
going
to
provide
confidence
that
a
return
can
actually
be
made
from
the
investments
if
you're
going
to
actually
unlock
retrofit
on
a
large
scale.
A
According
to
the
green
finance
institute,
a
value
really
does
need
to
be
attributed
to
the
improvements
as
I've
as
I've
said
earlier,
and
ideally
linked
to
the
property
itself,
not
the
owner
or
the
occupier.
Otherwise,
structural
change
just
won't
happen
at
all
we're.
Otherwise
you
know
relying
on
the
mortgage
providers
to
drive
the
market
for
whole
house
retrofit
and
that's
just
going
to
happen
with
piecemeal
funding,
that's
being
provided
for
sort
of
measures
like
heat
pumps,
for
example,
and
as
again
we've
heard
today,
it's
not
about
individual
measures.
A
It's
about
whole
house
retrofit,
it's
about
doing
things,
thinking
about
the
fabric
of
the
building,
and
then
you
know,
building
in
the
individual
measures
like
heat
pumps,
solar
whatever
it
might
be.
In
addition
to
that,
to
make
sure
you
get
the
very
best
outcome,
so
just
talking
about
the
commercial
sector
hasn't
really
been
talked
about
today,
but
the
good
thing
is
that
we
do
need
to
retrofit
commercial
buildings,
and
you
know,
alongside
social
housing
and
public
sector
buildings
that
can
provide
a
really
good
stream
of
work
for
the
retrofit
supply
chain.
A
It
is
easier
to
finance,
not
not
perfect.
It
is
still
still
tricky
because
you
know
it.
It's
just
readily
more
readily
available
for
sort
of
larger,
longer,
longer
term
tenants,
people
with
a
longer
horizon
in
relation
to
how
long
they're
going
to
be
occupying
a
property
people
with
a
stronger
balance
sheet.
A
Certainly
you
know
some
smes
have
faced
difficulties
in
accessing
finance
for
this
kind
of
thing,
and
that's
often
due
to
the
sort
of
scale
of
the
investment
being
a
bit
small
really
for
a
bank
to
finance
and
also
their
balance
sheets
being
less
robust.
You've
also
got
the
issue
of.
I
don't
really
know
how
to
do
this,
so
they
need
advice
and
help
really
in
order
to
kind
of
move
things
forward.
A
So
there
are
different.
There
are
different
kind
of
models
that
you
can
use
that
are
a
bit
easier
to
use
in
the
commercial
sector.
So
just
on
the
public
sector
side,
you
know
fantastic
opportunity
really
to
leverage
that
public
sector
can
potentially
borrow
at
a
lower
rate.
They
can
do
work.
That
is
informed
that
is
sort
of
forward
thinking
that
perhaps
other
people
wouldn't
do.
A
A
You
know,
low
low
rate
of
interest
there
are
is
also
the
public
sector
decarbonization
scheme
and
that
provides
grants
for
public
sector
bodies
to
fund
decarbonization
and
energy
efficiency
measures,
and
the
government
has
started
to
allocate
a
small
share
of
the
promised.
I
think
it's
3.8
billion
of
the
social
housing
decarbonationisation
fund,
which
will
be
spread
over
the
next
decade
as
well.
A
You
know
it's
a
real
issue
that
there
aren't
enough
people
with
the
knowledge
and
skills
to
be
able
to
actually
do
this
work
and
it's
a
bit
of
a
chicken
and
egg
scenario,
because
until
you
get
lots
of
it
happening,
you
won't
get
enough
people
training.
So
there's
a
whole
training
element
of
this.
That
needs
to
happen
alongside
everything
else,
for
the
people
that
are
actually
going
to
do
the
work.
A
It's
the
first
of
its
kind
by
uk
bank
and
there's
an
increasing
focus
on
retrofit,
with
some
specialist
funding
available,
and
also
social
housing
providers
can
also
access
the
social
housing
retrofit
accelerator
and
that
helps
them
to
bid
for
160
million
pounds
of
money
from
the
social
housing
decarbonization
fund.
So
it's
quite
a
lot
available
for
social
housing
and
it's
you
know
a
great
opportunity
for
them
to
lead
the
way
really
per
the
public
sector.
A
Now,
as
I've
said,
this
is
really
difficult.
If
we're
gonna
deliver
retrofit
on
a
large
scale,
we've
got
to
engage
people
on
the
way.
If
we
don't
we're
not
going
to
be
able
to
do
it,
basically,
the
only
way
that
we
would
do
it
is
by
pumping
hydrogen
into
everyone's
houses.
I
think,
but
you're
still
going
to
lose
a
lot
through
a
lot
of
energy
through
the
walls.
A
The
whole
house
approach
disappears
unless
you
do
something
alongside
it.
So
you
know
if
you,
if
we're
going
to
meet
these
challenges,
we're
going
to
need
political
leadership,
public
will
and
and
the
money
we're
going
to
need
400
billion
pounds
put
into
the
green
economy
in
the
next
decade,
which
is
an
awful
lot
of
cash.
A
It
can
be
achieved
through
government
sticks,
but
it
can
also
be
in
getting
happened
through
engagement,
and
you
know
you
can
engage
people
through
finance
over
60
of
people
put
money
aside
regularly.
Over
60
billion
pounds
is
invested
and
saved
in
isis
in
the
in,
and
uk
pension
funds
were
valued
at
something
like
six
trillion
a
few
years
ago,
so
it's
probably
actually
more
than
that.
Now
there
are
funds
there,
let's
harness
them.
A
A
A
What
is
fantastic
is
that,
when
people
invest
in
things,
they
then
become
engaged
in
what
it
is,
they
start
to
understand
more
about
it,
and
so
this
we
hope,
will
accelerate
the
transition
to
net
zero
because
as
they
invest
in
in
products
and
then
and
businesses,
then
they
will
end
up
doing
more
in
their
personal
life
as
well
we're
regulated
by
the
fca.
We
arrange
debts,
not
equity
and
people
can
can
sell
their
investments
in
our
secondary
market.
As
well,
so
we
raise
money
in
a
few
different
ways.
A
We
have
a
crowdfunding
platform
where
the
general
public
citizens,
retail
investors,
whatever
you'd
like
to
call
them,
can
invest.
We
raise
money
for
for
small-scale
project
finance,
so
that's
for
sort
of
infrastructure
projects.
Typically
they've
all
got
a
net
zero
focus.
We've
done
all
sorts
of
different
things
from
sort
of
vanilla,
renewables
right,
the
way
through
to
controlled
environment,
agriculture,
electric
vehicles,
for
example.
A
We
also
do
structured
corporate
debts
where
money
is
sort
of
earmarked
for
a
specific
purpose
for
for
a
corporate,
so
there'd
be
sort
of
bigger
organizations
where
the
risk
is
on
the
the
parent
or
the
group.
That's
got
a
strong
balance
sheet
and
then
the
final
one
is
community
municipal
investments,
and
this
is
debt
issued
by
local
authority
where
they
raise
money
for
particular
projects,
and
then
the
interest
and
capital
is
repaid
from
money.
That's
available
to
that
local
authority.
There's
no
security.
A
So
just
a
couple
of
couple
of
case
studies
really
so
just
in
relation
to
retrofit
we've
done
a
few
few
things
on
the
on
the
retrofit
side
of
things.
This
one
is
for
some
apartments
in
liverpool
and
a
warehouse
in
the
heart
of
liverpool
has
been
converted
into
33,
supported,
living
and
affordable
rental
homes
by
a
property
develop
developer
called
optivo.
A
We
raised
3.1
million
for
them
it's
a
two
and
a
half
year.
Investment
at
10
and
oxivo
works
with
the
the
registered
social
landlord
and
local
authorities
to
identify
the
types
of
homes
that
are
most
needed
in
that
area,
and
in
this
case
it
was
affordable
and
supported
housing,
and
then
it
renovates
and
builds
those
homes
specifically
for
the
long-term
rental
market.
A
And
the
idea
is
that,
basically
it's
a
it's
a
50-year
investment.
They
they
refinance
us
out
or
we
refinance
it
out
on
the
long
in
on
the
long
term
basis
and
then
at
the
end
of
the
50
years,
and
they
revert
to
the
local
authority
or
the
rsl
for
a
pound.
So
it's
quite
a
nice
nice
model
and
then
just
talking
about
some
community
municipal
investments.
A
So
we
did
this
with
university
of
leeds,
which
has
been
mentioned
a
few
times
now,
and
also
with
a
couple
of
nhs
trusts.
A
couple
of
councils
to
structure
a
climate
municipal
investment
and
the
idea
of
it
is
that
it's
cheaper
than
pwlb.
It
can
compete
with
pwlb,
but
at
the
same
time
you
can
borrow
money
from
your
residents
from
the
citizens
in
order
to
drive
forward
your
your
ambitions.
A
The
reason
that
it
works
is
that
crowdfunding
means
that
it's
easy
to
issue
a
bond
and
manage
a
bond.
It's
interesting
because
leeds
council,
they
did
try
and
do
this
years
years
ago,
but
it
was
all
paper-based
bonds
and,
as
you
can
imagine,
it's
really
difficult
to
do
costs
a
lot
of
money,
but
the
innovation
of
crowdfunding
means
that
this
can
now
be
done.
A
You
know
efficiently
and
cheaply.
The
model
sits
alongside
pwlb
and
it
just
becomes
a
really
simple
way
to
build
a
local
finance
market.
So
the
idea
is
that
you
harness
that
money
in
a
local
area,
that
people
are
saving
and
put
it
towards
local
projects
and,
at
the
same
time
engage
them
in
what
you're
doing
we
just
raised
a
million
pounds
for
both
those
bonds.
They
raised
the
money
ahead
of
schedule.
A
What
was
really
interesting
was
that
25
of
the
investors
invested
100
pounds
or
less
so
that
just
shows
you
that
you
know
people
were
interested
in
it
and
it
really
was
open
to
all
it
created
a
communication
platform.
So
every
six
months
the
local
authority
can
engage
with
the
people
invested.
Let
them
know
how
they're
doing,
but
it's
also
been
given
us
the
opportunity
to
trial
a
mechanism
for
receiving
interest
donation.
A
There
was
local
pr
which
raised
the
profile
of
the
local
authorities,
because
some
of
the
feedback
initially
was
people,
don't
really
know
what
a
local
authorities
are
doing.
Do
we
trust
what
they're
doing,
and
this
really
helps
to
engender
the
trust
in
what
the
local
authorities
doing
and
increase
knowledge
of
what
they're
doing
in
this
in
this
area
of
net
zero
and
we
just
launched
another
one
with
islington
council,
that's
raising
funds.
Now
I
should
have
looked
before.
A
I
came
up
to
see
how
it
was
doing,
but
that
was
that
was
only
launched
a
week
or
two
ago.
So
and
we've
got
a
number
of
councils
that
are
looking
to
move
forward
with
community
municipal
investments
in
the
next
sort
of
few
months.
I
think
york's
looking
at
it
as
well
and
they've.
You
know:
we've
had
a
number
of
them
that
have
signed
up
to
pledges
with
the
the
green
finance
institute
that
they
will
look
at
these
opportunities.
A
So
that's
good,
so
just
some
features
of
these
and
how
they
might
be
used
and
just
to
recap,
it's
cheaper
than
borrowing
from
from
pvw
lb
from
central
government.
It's
simple
low-cost
templated
documents
really
flexible
replicable.
So
once
you've
done
one,
it's
dead,
easy
to
do
some
more
engage
residents
and
also
the
opportunity
to
do
interest
donation-
and
you
know
you
can
use
the
the
proceeds
for
funding
retrofits
in
in
lots
of
different
ways
if
they
decided
to
use
it
for
retrofit.
A
A
You
can
look
at
individual
measures
for
properties
like
heat
pumps
or
insulation,
perhaps
on
a
mass
basis
as
part
of
a
wider
scheme.
Look
at
demand
management,
monitoring
and
controls.
You
could
even
look
at
other
other
things
like
renewable
energy
projects
as
well,
solar
on
rooftops-
and
you
know
if
a
local
authority
wanted
to
it
could
perhaps
set
up
its
own
service
for
assessments
and
advice
in
this
area,
which
perhaps
had
a
sort
of
some
sort
of
payback
model
over
time,
and
that's
that's
it
from
me.
I
hope
that
was
helpful.