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From YouTube: Office Hours: 2021-09-16
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A
D
Yeah
sure
I
just
had
one
quick
question
about
you
know
and
reading
through
some
yeah,
I'm
just
starting
up.
You
know
really
diving
in
this
week
reading
through
some
of
the
docs
there
was
this
distinction
between
a
meta,
build
pack
and
a
build
pack
group
and
was
just
trying
to
better
understand
that
sounds
like
they.
Both
are
used
for.
D
Composing
multiple
build
backs,
build
packs
together
in
different
ways
and
ordering
them
and
kind
of
treating
them,
as,
as
you
know,
a
collection
of
bill
packs
as
kind
of
a
single
unit
that
that
can
be.
You
know
for
the
detect
life
cycle
phase
and
things
like
that,
just
trying
to
understand
if
it
what
what
is
the
difference
between
the
two
concepts
or
like
when
would
you
use
one
and
not
the
other,
or
might
there
be
an
opportunity
to
collapse
those
into
one
single
concept?
So
just
trying
to
understand
that
better?
C
A
B
B
So
meta
buildbacks
are
more
around
the
distribution
of
a
group
of
buildbacks,
rather
than
the
actual,
like
group
concept
that
you
have
here.
So
each
a
meta
build
pack
is
when
you
have
a
build
pack
that
just
defines
the
grouping.
C
B
And
includes
a
bunch
of
other
build
packs,
a
meta
build
pack
itself
could
include
other
metal
packs
because
it's
just
pointing
to
them.
A
buildback
group
is
just
the
final
resolved
individual,
build
packs
that
are
run
together
and
must
satisfy
all
their
provisions
and
requirements
through
one
detect
cost.
So
when
you
have
a
bunch
of
groups
of
build
packs,
the
life
cycle
detect
phase,
goes
through
each
group
and
tries
to
find
the
first
group
where
all
the
required
buildbacks
parks
and
all
the
provisions
and
requirements
match
up.
B
And
then
the
the
the
the
entity
of
this
like
the
whole
packaged
entity
of
these
group
of
buildbacks
is
called
augmentable
private.
I
don't
think
that's
canonically
written
anyway
down
in
the
spec.
It's
just
referred
to
as
a
metaphor
pack
in
the
documentation
and
in
rfcs.
I
don't
think
it's
anywhere
in
respect.
A
Yeah,
not
the
terminology,
but
definitely
the
spec
does
define
that
you
could
have
an
order
or
you
could
have
the
binaries.
I
think
right,
I
don't
remember,
but
basically
it's
x
exclusive
one
or
the
other,
so
you
can't
have
a
build
pack.
That
also
has
an
order
defined,
which
is
something
that
I
think
I
kind
of
maybe
argued
for
initially,
but
yeah
I
mean
I,
I
think,
the
way
that
I
would
define
it
is
maybe
slightly
different,
not
saying
that
sam
is
wrong.
A
I
think
that's
very
much
accurate,
but
it's
ultimately
the
same
concept
right,
the
ordering
concept,
and
it's
just
the
idea
of
it's
defined
at
the
stack
level,
but
then,
in
order
for
you
to
also
be
able
to
kind
of
make
it
portable
that
same
concept,
it's
like
reusing
the
same
concept
in
order
to
create
the
these
sort
of
build
packs
that
then
could
be
injected
and
distributed
elsewhere
or
separately
right.
A
So,
if
you're
thinking
about
like
a
java,
build
pack
right
or
java
meta
build
pack,
you
would
essentially
kind
of
wanna
say
like
hey.
I
want
to
include
all
these
other
build
packs
as
part
of
this
order,
and
this
is
how
they
would
work
or
operate,
and
that's
more
or
less
what
we
it's
it's
like,
reusing
it
for
the
sake
of
the
feature
that
we
already
have.
But
I
I
understand,
where
it
kind
of
creates
this
confusion
of
where
to
use
what.
D
A
Yeah,
no,
I
mean,
I
think,
you're
right.
I
think
a
really
good
example
to
look
at
right
now
would
be
maybe
something
like
the
the
potato
build
packs.
They
have
a
build
pack
less
builder
right,
which
basically
has
no
build
packs.
It's
just
a
base
image
and
then
you're
able
to
specify,
like
language,
specific
meta,
build
packs
that
then
provide
technically.
It's
called
the
build
package.
Please
don't
like
harp
us
on
the
naming,
but
it's
a
build
package
that
you're
pointing
to
that
essentially
is
a
middle,
build
pack.
A
D
D
A
I
think
that's
essentially
what
it
is
right:
okay,
that
how
you
distribute
in
a
order
group
or
buildpack
group.
A
A
Yeah,
if
you
have
feedback
on
how
to
maybe
improve
you
know
getting
that
point
across.
I
think
that'd
be
awesome.
C
I
wanted
to
know
what
was
your
experience
last
year
like
did
you
get
more
contributors
than
usual
and
I
know
that
a
lot
of
projects
got
spammy
pull
requests
during
that
time.
So
basically,
what
was
your
experience
and
is
there
anything
we
can
do
to
prepare
for
oktoberfest
in
advance
and
during
october?
First,
would
you
like
something
some
more
contributions
in
other
non-code
ways.
A
Personally,
I'm
trying
to
remember
whether
or
not
we
partook
in
oktoberfest
last
year,
it's
been
so
long.
I
do
remember
there
was
another
one.
A
Where
what
was
that
tool
that
got
bought
out.
A
Yeah
there
was
an
event.
It
was
like
a
singular
thing:
hacking.
B
B
If
I
remember
what
yeah,
I
think
that
was
it
in
terms
of
oktoberfest,
I
know
we
can
explicitly
opt
in,
but
what
happened
last
time
was
like,
even
if
you
didn't
opt
in
there
was
like
hacktoberfest
used
to
have
this
criteria.
If
your
repository
satisfy
certain
things
like
if
it's
an
organization
and
also
private
repository
or
something
your
pull
request
would
still
count
as
like
for
for
the
whatever
price
they
have.
B
C
I
look
through
the
pack
issues
and
pull
requests
and
there
wasn't
anything
labelled.
So
it's
like
some
mentioned.
It
must
have
been
the
criteria.
A
I'm
gonna,
I'm
gonna,
like
speak
my
personal
opinion
right,
but
the
the
previous
little
hackathon
we
had
didn't
yield
too
many
really
good
prs.
I
think
I
would
say
maybe
25
of
them
were
actually
good
and
then
the
other
one
like
the
other
percentage
were
not.
A
You
know
not
as
bad
as
like
read
me,
files
and
stuff
like
that,
but
they
were
tangential
and
just
some
of
them
we
had
to
reject
and
it
literally
it
was
more
of
a
burden
for
us
to
configure
music
and,
like
again
kind
of
like
take
some
time
to
learn
how
that
even
worked
and
stuff
like
that.
So
for
that
reason,
like
that,
wasn't
very
useful
for
me
personally
or
I
didn't
see
a
lot
of
value
in
it.
A
I
I
have
no
opinion
of
hacktoberfest,
but
that's
kind
of
like
the
thing
that
sticks
to
the
back
of
my
mind
is
it?
Is
it
going
to
be
worth
the
effort
that
we
put
into
it
kind
of
thing.
B
Hacktogglefest
used
to
be
like
a
grab
box
where,
like
people,
would
just
submit
per
request
for
the
sake
of
it
with
like
minor
minor
fixes,
and
it
didn't
result
in
any
long-term
engagement
with
the
actual
contributors.
They
would
just
make
the
fix,
grab
their
price
and
then
never
touch
or
contact
the
community.
Ever
again,
I
think
the
hacktoberfest
from
like
the
organization
they've
tried
to
improve
or
like
prevent
such
things.
They
have
like
a
much
more
filtered
criteria
for
how
to
include
your
repositories
or
organization
into
hacktoberfest.
B
We
can
consider
if
we
want
to
do
this,
but
at
this
point
I
don't
think
we
can
definitely
say
yes
or
no.
We'll
just
ask
how
the
other
maintainers
feel
about
the
burden
of
like
extra
pull
requests
which
may
be
spammy
but
may
also
lead
to
some
good
contributions.
So
we'll
just
try
to
figure
out
the
pros
and
cons
and
see
if
we
want
to
enable
ourselves
for
this.
C
That's
understanding.
Okay,
next
is
we
mentioned
tragedy
issues,
as
well
as
the
possible
contributions
on
our
website,
as
for
the
possible
ways
to
contribute,
but
trying
issues
mainly
involves
access
to
labeling
issues
as
well,
changing
and
adding
labels,
and
currently
that's
only
possible
if
you
are
a
member
of
that
team
like
I
recently
became
a
platform
number,
so
I
can
access
the
labels
on
stack
and
stuff,
but
I
can't
do
it
on
docs
on
the
docs
website
or
anything.
B
There
is
a
separate
github
level
which,
instead
of
write,
only
allows.
You
only
gives
you
triage
permissions,
so
maybe
we
can
bring
it
up
that,
like
we
can,
we
can
create
a
separate
team
which
just
has
like
people
who
want
to
try
as
issues
and
limit
their
scope
down
to
just
like
changing
labels,
because
that
would
lower
the
barrier.
You
need
to
become
to
be
a
part
of
that
team
and
also
allow
for
charging
contributions,
while
still
preventing
other
things
like
board,
reviews
and
stuff.
C
A
I
had
a
maybe
slightly
different
proposal
is
because,
honestly,
I
think
I
kind
of
forgot
that
there
was
a
triage
permission,
but
then,
to
some
extent,
there's
there's
two
challenges
I
see
with.
That
is
one.
They
have
maybe
a
little
bit
more
access
than
what
we
would
want
them
to
have,
which
is
literally
add.
You
know,
status,
labels
and
and
whatnot,
and
then
the
other
one
is
that
they
still
have
to
kind
of
ask
for
permission
to
do
that
to
some
degree.
A
So
I
do
wonder
I
don't
know
that
I
want
to
go
with
prowl,
because
I've
heard
that
that's
a
pretty
big
you
know
beast
to
maintain,
but
I
do
wonder
if
we
could
create
a
bot,
essentially
that
just
allows
for
triage
commands,
which
would
literally
just
update
labels,
and
anybody
would
be
able
to
do.
That
would
be
my
kind
of
proposal.
B
B
A
I'm
intrigued,
although
it
seems
like
it,
has
like
a
ui
that
might
be
a
little
bit
of
a
deterrent
but
interesting.
B
B
A
A
Okay,
put
that
and
then
I
think
the
only
other
one
would
be
give
permissions.
C
A
C
And
the
next
days
I
was
looking
through
the
buildbacks
documentation
and
trying
to
understand
more
so
first,
I
looked
at
the
tools
and
I
understood
most
of
what's
going
on
so
circle.
Ci
is
using
tab
or.
A
Sorry,
could
you
maybe
elaborate
on
on
the
question
I
get
what
you're
saying
about
there
being
different
tools,
but
what
do
you
mean
by
repos
for.
C
This,
so
pack
is
one
platform
that
we
have
and
what
are
we
expected
to
be
supporting
and
what
tools
are
just
about
using
something
that
they've
provided,
but
not
directly
intended
for
their.
A
So
a
couple
things
come
to
mind:
if
I'm
understanding
the
question
correctly,
we
have,
let's
see.
A
So
we
have
this
tools
area
on
our
website
and
then
we
have
the
community.
I
thought
we
were
moving
the
community
adopters
somewhere
else.
A
So
now
so,
if
we
have
these,
is
there
something
that
what
you
were
thinking
about,
or
are
you
thinking
about
something
different
yeah.
C
I'm
on
the
docs
tools,
page
and
I'll,
just
press
like
I
know
circle
ci
we
support
do
the
repository
that
we
have
and
get
up.
Auto
devops
is
using
the
pack.
Tecton
also
has
a
repository
separately
that
we're
supporting.
I
think
I
didn't
understand
what
kpac
does.
B
So
kpac
is
it
sort
of
applies
like
kate's
native,
like
philosophies
to
the
buildbacks
ecosystem.
You
have
a
declarative
way
of
defining
all
the
resources
and
also
pushing
changes
from
one
source.
So
right
now,
let's
say
we
create
a
new
builder
or
we
update
a
buildback.
We
rely
on
our
users
to
pull
these
changes
into
their
application,
image
and
sort
of
get
the
latest
fixes
or
patches
with
kpac
if
they
register.
So
you
can
register
a
repository
onto
kpac
and
it
continuously
monitors
various
inputs
so
required
to
create
the
image
out
of
that
repository.
B
So
that
includes
the
repository
itself,
the
builders
it's
using
the
build
packs.
It's
using.
So
let's
say
you
as
the
app
developer
pointed
that
resource
to
a
particular
branch
on
your
git
repository
and
you
updated
that
branch
and
pushed
a
new
commit.
It
will
automatically
build
the
image
for
you.
Let's
say
as
the
platform
controller
you
operator,
you
updated
your
builder's
stack
image.
It
will
automatically
run
the
rebase
throughout
the
cluster.
B
You
updated
a
build
pack,
it
would
rebuild
all
of
the
applications
that
are
using
that
build
pack.
So
it's
sort
of
a
way
to
manage
images
in
at
scale
and
reduce
the
amount
of
effort
to
like
do
the
operations
that
build
packs
enables
you
to
do
so.
Things
like
rebase
and
rebuilds
are
based
on
buildbacks.
C
Looks
after
the
life
cycle
and
learning
themes
for
dogs,
but
what
are
the
platforms
that
the
platform
team
works
on.
A
I
see
we
should
have
a
page
for
that
as
well.
A
Might
need
a
little
updating
which
is
kind
of
the
problem
with
documentation,
but
that
documentary
governance
yeah
should
talk
about
like
on
the
platform
right.
We
have
pac
tecton
and
circle
ci.
A
As
far
as
I'm
aware,
those
would
be
it
I'm
trying
to
think
if
there's
another
one
that
we're
missing
so
kpac
is
a
vmware
open
source
project
at
this
point
in
time.
So
it's
actually
outside
of
the
cnb
project.
A
Yeah,
I
definitely
think
it
would
be
better
if
we
had
better
documentation
or
this
better
defined,
but
I
think
a
lot
of
it
honestly
kind
of
relies
on
maybe
like
ui
design,
which
isn't
the
primary
focus
of
our
of
most
of
the
members
in
this
team.
Right.
A
All
right,
I
think,
I
think
we'd
be
ready
for
you
to
try
to
give
us
a
pitch.
All
right
tell
us
how
build
packs
work.
The
only
thing
I
would
ask
is:
maybe
put
your
mic
a
little
bit
closer.
A
C
Yeah,
so
we
have
a
builder
image
that
comprises
of
a
build
image
that
provides
the
environment
for
which
central
process
will
take
place.
We
have
a
life
cycle
that
will
that
is
responsible
for
running
the
processes,
and
we
have
built
packs
and
build
packs,
are
basically
a
a
set
of
processes
that
wait.
I
should
go
through
life
cycle
first.
I
guess
that's
where
I
rehearsed
this
a
bit,
I'm
forgetting
now.
C
Okay,
so
I'll
just
start
with
build
packs,
so
build
packs,
looks
at
our
source
code
and
first
of
all,
sees
which
build,
which
language
sort
of
sees,
which
language
it's
from
so,
for
example,
for
npm
build
packet,
will
look
for
a
package.json
file
and
certain
for
different
languages.
It
will
look
at
those
and
detect
which
builder
it
should
use.
C
Then
it
has
a
build
phase
that
in
our
research.
C
C
The
life
cycle
has
different
stages,
including
detect
and
build,
so
it
also
analyzes
it
also
analyzes
stage
which,
for
example,
if
I
input
a
certain
name,
hello
world,
it
will
see
if
I
already
have
an
image
by
that
name,
and
so,
if
there
is,
it
will
use
that
image
and
give
me
the
layers
for
that.
So
I
can
rebuild
on
top
of
that.
A
It's
cool
yeah,
I
mean
at
to
that
level.
Yes,
I
think
that
pretty
much
defines
what
build
packs
are
there's
a
lot
of
weeds.
We
could
go
into
right,
but
but
at
a
high
level,
yeah
that
definitely
makes
sense.
A
A
All
right,
sam,
what's
up
is
there
anything
else.
A
I'm
trying
to
think
if
there's
anything,
but
I
mean
the
only
thing
is
kubecon,
but
that's
like
till
next
month
right
early
next
month.
I'm
not
sure
that
there's
been
a
lot
of
communication
outward
from
that.
So
maybe
that's
something
that
we
should
take
note
of
and
communicate
a
little
bit
more.