Cloud Native Buildpacks Working Group, 4 Nov 2020

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From YouTube: Working Group: 2020-11-04

Description

* Incubation
* Manifest Size: https://github.com/buildpacks/rfcs/pull/121

A

A

All right should we kick things off.

A

uh First thing: I don't think we have any new faces, nope uh incubation. So, uh as uh many of you know, there was a big big vote over the last couple weeks uh and um we just passed eight votes on the mailing list uh and uh we think or given the the size of the tlc and super majority rules. We think that um we're still waiting for an official announcement for the scene from the cncf. But uh that means that we should uh enter incubation soon.

A

So congratulations. Everybody.

B

Yeah a uh request from the leadership team, though, like uh don't go off and tweet about it, we're letting the cncf make the first announcement about it. But congratulations to everybody on the call for the hard work.

A

Awesome and uh next thing in the list is add, manifest size to report tamil.

B

A

Not doing outstanding.

B

A

Oh yeah, sorry I got copied from the last thing. I guess the copy from the thursday thing uh release, planning and updates.

C

um We found one bug in the life cycle when someone slice pattern had a trailing slash. We weren't matching it anymore and with that fixed in the life cycle, I think we're gonna cut an additional patch, either later today or early tomorrow. With that fix.

D

Cool on the platform side, uh we just released an rc build for pack. uh Oh 15 0., uh david fralick, will be the one kind of taking point on that release, so uh we are currently in feature complete and we expect to ship the stable beta version uh next wednesday.

E

A

uh I will share my screen, so we can go through rfcs.

A

Everybody see that good cool good, uh add image manifest size to report tamil. This is on the list. Is that right, sorry for tamil there so, but I am supposed to add a label to it.

A

I'm supposed to see if this works. What is this about? uh This is buildpack api.

B

It needs a team, so it's gonna either be core distribution, implementation learning and I don't know.

A

So this is uh image manifest size to report tamil. Is this something that this isn't something that build pack would put in? This is like a.

E

C

I call this implementation or core, although I feel like the distinction between those two gets blurry right, because almost anything that goes on implementation would go in the spec as well.

D

C

D

If it's worth reviewing the rfc, or at least getting a refresher before annotating, it.

A

All right, we will not put things on this until we talk about it. In a second uh add stacks: dot base image label.

A

Is kenny here chad about this one? Somebody have context on what this one is.

A

A

A

Describing the base image that a stack came from so this would be like a platform thing, so I had the platform tag to it.

B

That, I think, is what we're thinking.

A

So, which which platform tag platform, maintainer issues created, platform or platform or spec platform platform, just platform, okay, yeah and then.

D

Should we prefix us with team, maybe team, slash not right now a spec.

B

C

Right we said we labeled things by the spec too, while we're in here right.

A

Right so spec platform, okay, and then it wasn't supposed to assign people to it. Now that I put that.

B

Hey look who got lotteried up good job, emily.

A

Wait, I I don't see it, I'm only just edited I've.

C

Actually, already reviewed.

A

C

A

I'm up there supposed to assign somebody right.

C

Diligently reviewing these as they come in.

B

Implementation, let me see I'm looking behind the scenes at the vlog message.

B

uh No, it didn't quite go. Okay, we'll have to figure it out I'll I'll. Take another look at it, uh keep going. We can skip it this week.

A

uh Extension spec for builders dave here.

C

It's an fcp right. Have we passed the time or are we ready to merge it today.

A

I have to be closing at 11.

C

Or that's today.

A

So somebody want to take closing this.

B

uh Somebody some maintainer has to take that over right because they need to open a bunch of spec issues.

C

Yeah now we have to add the issue labels and then we can merge it.

E

And that's on spec spec repo.

A

So should I assign a maintainer group to this- probably what's what's builder fall into? Is this implementation.

B

It's an extension stack that stands alone right.

E

A

B

A

Core okay, so this one doing this: okay, we're the labels now, so we can try adding them later. Is that better, so that.

B

Yeah yeah just get to skip the labels. For now I have one which will allow me to troubleshoot what went wrong and we can have a go next time got it all right.

A

uh Pre-Release versions and experimental features for api.

A

C

I think this has the approvals to fcp right.

E

uh Just waiting on you, stephen uh for votes, uh as far as I guess, core team voting, but.

A

But it has majority right, it doesn't.

E

Yeah, it has enough, uh just if you want to review it you're the only one missing.

A

uh I can I can still review it during fcp right, yep, there's no reason to not push into fcp right now.

C

You can leave a final comment during the designated period exactly.

A

That's the proper process, uh eleven eleven, it's all right, yep cool seven days.

A

Oh and then I should add the label to it. This needs distance. Other labels too right. Do we decide if this does this affect the spec.

C

I think this one is pure implementation.

C

Is that right, maybe it affects the spec too.

A

C

All the specs, because it's about a type of thing that can be in the spec right, which actually makes it appropriate for none of the labels. I'm.

A

Not going to put more labels on it, then uh it needs the fcp label, though right.

A

All right uh application- mix-ins! Sorry, I should have clicked on that. That's pretty stack packs uh stack packs on the list this week. Anything with stack packs this week.

B

D

Meeting will focus on that right. Sorry, yeah.

B

Yeah, I think we'll do like some more readout of it for tomorrow.

A

Cool as a reminder, if anybody wants to be involved in that sort of sig, I guess that we're doing on thursdays for stack packs, please show up if you have any any opinions about that looks like we're. Trying to get to something that have strong consensus on uh buildpack should be able to provide the default process for an app.

A

Is this still looking for approvals where we have with this one.

E

I think you can go into fcp.

A

Yeah, it looks like you got everything: cool scp, closing on 11 4, nope, 11, 11.,.

A

Hang on these labels, I think.

A

All right, fcp for project, descriptor flexibility, that's draft uh layer, origin, metadata.

A

Anybody talked to paul recently somebody's gonna just volunteered to talk to paul. Well, we'll put that on.

E

A

Until you talk about cool offline, build packages, rfc I need dan this week. Is this just looking for approvals? I see some approvals.

A

A

Looking for approvals seems, like he's just doing polishing now, cool rest, our drafts. So that concludes our uh rfc review. Going back to the agenda. Next thing is incubation, which I already talked about, and then the last thing in the list is add manifest size to your port tunnel.

E

uh Yeah, this is something I submitted. um It's it's extremely simple. It's just adding the manifest size to report tunnel. It's like self-explanatory, so the size that you see when you dock a push, that's reported. I would just like that size to be in report.tamil uh selfishly. I want it just because it makes integrating with notary easier in k back.

A

um This is the size of the uncompressed manifest json. Is that correct.

E

I think so I just called it like, whatever the canonical format is but like, if you like, I have an example in the summary, but if you curl for that manifest from docker, like whatever it returns, the content.

A

Length up there.

E

A

A

uh How does this interplay with manifest lists.

E

uh I don't know it's a good question.

A

That's not something I thought about, should it be the should we say it's the manifest of it's the size of the resolves manifest. That was because it's report tunnel. So at that point you know what manifest you ended up using it's just not going to be the first one that gets requested.

C

This is about like an image that we exported right, so we don't currently create multi-architectured images, so I feel like the manifest list question, although hopefully will be relevant, someday, isn't totally relevant right now.

A

Well, I didn't wasn't sure if what images are going to get sizes.

D

A

That makes more sense how big are manifests.

E

Small, like on the order of like like alpine yeah 500 bytes, 2000 bytes, maybe 4k.

A

Someone said downloading a manifest and a config blob for a build pack was like several hundred kilobytes. That seemed much larger than I thought it would be.

C

The image config, I'm not the manifest yeah.

A

The config blob is also just json also, and we don't put that much json yeah. We know if.

C

You've seen what have.

A

B

I would say that, for the average java application, one of the things we put in is light or for a boot. Application is likely around 600k alone, just on one entry that we put into the bom.

A

Someone was complaining that it was too much to get an admissions controller. uh Two larger requests to do an admission controller like.

B

We're going to do something so so there are like different pieces of that particular question. It sort of comes up as part of the separate the bomb from the matching metadata and we're going to like shrink down the matching metadata. There are some places where we have some really large things. All we're going to do is we're going to hash that content, which I think is a reasonable change to to make, uh but like it's that doesn't solve the bill of materials problem, we are going to start.

B

We are going to not only continue shoving everything that we currently do into the bill of materials. We want to do a lot more than we currently are so like. If we are already running into problems with how the build material manifests itself, we should have another discussion about that.

A

I don't think it's a problem this this, like admissions controller thing I bring up, was like for a hypothetical architecture of a thing that shouldn't be architected like that, and the only other place was falco. Does some validations that enforce a label length that is not enforced by the spec and it's the only tool so far that we've seen? That does that. So I am not worried about it. I think we are just back. It is a fs. There is a blob and not metadata in the manifest.

A

That's you know it's a compressed blob for a reason right.

C

I feel like if it was a question. It wouldn't necessarily be a spec question right, it's more about like build pack decisions about how verbose to be with different types of metadata.

B

Oh, I think, on the table that the bill of materials would not be added as a label and we'd have to come up with something else. You.

A

Could put in an fs blob that just just downloaded separately or we could have a way of x, another file that exports data to something like you know, if you want, you want to put a lot of stuff in graphios or something like that. Yeah.

C

B

So like for that particular.

C

Image, I'm not even sure it's the build materials itself. It's that large. um I think it's like a additional custom label when I was looking at this before that's larger the ones like spring metadata in this case.

B

A

Interesting so sorry, back to the back of the topic, though, of report tamil and uh the manifest size, um any more questions about this or is do people feel like this is pretty reasonable.

E

The only thing I didn't answer is what to call this field and report to tamil, but like very ambivalent about that. So.

D

E

D

uh Like example of where it's going to be placed, you know again it seems simple, but I think it would just make it clear. You can do that.

A

A

You can propose a name too and just say final name will be decided in the spec br right, yeah, there's another approval process to get that through cool sounds good all right.

A

I think that is the last item on the list unless somebody's added something since clicked on it, and uh now we could all I'll probably use some time back today. So uh we can call it here unless anybody has anything else.

A

All right thanks, everybody.