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Description
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Don't miss KubeCon + CloudNativeCon 2020 events in Amsterdam March 30 - April 2, Shanghai July 28-30 and Boston November 17-20! Learn more at kubecon.io. The conference features presentations from developers and end users of Kubernetes, Prometheus, Envoy, and all of the other CNCF-hosted projects
One-on-One Discussion: Quinton Hoole, Huawei & Chris Aniszczyk, CNCF
Technical Oversight Committee (TOC) member, Quinton Hoole, chats with CNCF COO, Chris Aniszczyk, about the Cloud Native Computing Foundation and its hosted projects.
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A
I
guess
we'll
get
started
a
little
bit,
so
you
know
we
initially
intended
this
session
to
kind
of
be
a
open
kind
of
Q&A
session
with
folks
who
had
questions
on
how
the
CNC
f
technical
process
works,
the
you
know
how
the
technical
board
is
representative,
and
you
know,
if
you're
interested
in
bringing
projects.
You
basically
have
the
two
right
people
to
talk
here,
but
my
name
is
Chris
Anna's
archive
the
fun
job
of
helping
run
C
and
C
F,
mostly
on
the
technical
side
of
the
house.
Quinton
is
yes.
A
B
Jamie,
yes,
I'm
on
the
TRC
on
the
technical,
Oversight
Committee,
so
I
work
closely
with
Chris
and
his
team,
and
we
basically
take
care
of
most
of
the
technical
aspects
of
the
project
and
the
technical
vision
for
the
for
the
foundation
and
for
the
CNC
F
in
general.
I
have
a
few
slides,
so
one
format
we
could
we're
gonna
use
is
just
go
through
some
of
the
basic
content
and
then
we'll
open
it
up
for
discussion.
Yeah.
A
B
A
I
think
the
important
thing
here
to
point
out
is
you
know:
CN
CF
has
kind
of
different
constituencies.
We
have
like
a
board
of
directors.
That's
mostly
consisted
of
members.
We
created
a
technical
board
that
is
completely
separate
from
the
business
board
there
for
independence.
So,
like
you
can't
you
can't
like
buy
your
way
into
a
CNC,
a
project,
there's
an
independent
technical
board.
That
Quinton
is
part
of
that
helps
with
the
due
diligence,
so
it
was
done
on
purpose,
essentially
for
it's
a
good
governance
practice.
In
my
opinion,.
A
Try,
the
crazy
governance
structure-
I,
don't
know
if
this
is
really
relevant
but
basically
kind
of,
like
you
know,
US
Supreme
Court.
You
know,
there's
nine
folks,
it's
an
odd
number
of
folks
that
decide
which
projects
get
in
the
CN
CF.
The
simple
solution
is:
we
have
different
projects
level
early
stage
kind
of
project
projects
only
need
to
toc
members
to
sponsor
them
to
move
to
the
higher
levels,
which
are
kind
of
the
more
formal
statement
that
these
are
high.
Quality
projects
meant
to
be
used
by
pretty
much.
A
B
With
you,
some
people
elect
some
of
the
people
and
some
other
people
like
other
of
the
people
and
the
end
result
is
we
have
nine,
hopefully
good,
TV
actors
may
be
worth
briefly
mentioning.
Is
you
know
what
does
a
good
TOC
member
look
like?
We
have
some
qualification
criteria,
so
basically,
these
are
people
typically
with
a
fairly
long
track
record
in
cloud
computing
in
general.
So
you
know
not,
unusually,
they
come
from
companies
that
have
been
doing
this
for
ten
plus
years.
B
I
personally
came
out
of
Amazon,
where
I
did
it
for
quite
a
few
years
and
Google
and
now
Hari
and
many
of
the
other
contributors
come
for.
Trc
members
come
from
similar
long
histories
with
container
you
know,
micro-services,
big
cloud,
computing,
etc,
and
you
know
the
other
thing
we
look
for
not
only
in
the
in
the
companies
that
provide
these
individuals
because
they're
all
you
know,
members
who
provide
these
individuals
to
serve
on
the
TRC,
but
the
individuals
themselves
need
to
be
able
to.
B
A
So,
like
we
mentioned
before,
there's
nine
members-
and
you
know
they're
really
from
all
like
you
know,
when
CN
CF
was
formed
three
years
ago-
is
kind
of
a
it's
different
than
it
was
today,
but
you
could
kind
of
see
the
different
representations
here
where
Alexis
who's.
The
chair
that
you
see
comes
from
a
start-up
in
the
cloud
native
ecosystem
called
we've
works.
A
Ben
is
from
the
Mesa
sphere,
mesas
Fame,
one
of
the
original
creators
there,
who
I
used
to
only
work
with
that
Twitter
Brian
grant,
who
is
of
kubernetes
fame
from
Google
Brian
Cantrell
of
joint
joint
fame
camille.
Who
is
you
know,
zookeeper
she's,
was
very
instrumental
in
that
jonathan
bull
did
a
lot
of
core
container
work
at
core
OS
Ken
Owens
rubber
is
at
MasterCard
these
days,
but
heavily
involved
in
the
kubernetes
community
in
all
sorts
of
areas
like
Federation
and
so
on.
A
I
was
Quentin
here
on
stage
with
us
and
then
Sam
Lambert
from
github,
who
represents
the
end
user
community.
So
these
are
kind
of
the
nine
folks
that
have
the
great
responsibility
of
ensuring
that
our
projects
are.
You
know
high-quality
and
we
have
a
consistent
technical
vision
throughout
CN
CF,
so
it's
kind
of
like
the
Supreme
Court
in
some
ways.
Yes,
so
Quentin
touch
on
this.
You
know
the
more
the
most
important
thing
to
realize
in
CN
CF
is
there's
different
project
levels
out
there.
We
have
three
stages.
You
know.
A
Graduated
is
essentially
the
highest
quality
stage,
so
only
Prometheus
and
kubernetes
fit
this.
Our
envoy
will
fit
that
bar
soon,
so
we'll
have
three
projects
that
are
essentially
are
meant,
for
you
know
wide
adoption.
You
could
bet
your
business
on
it
essentially
and
have
the
blessing
of
the
TOC
as
a
strong
kind
of
technical,
independent
community.
That
you'd
bet
your
business
on
incue
bation.
Oh.
B
Sorry
yeah
just
one
thing
to
add
there,
so
it's
not
only
the
graduated
phase
is
not
only
about
the
actual
technical
quality
of
the
project,
but
also
making
sure
that
you
can
bet
your
business
on
it
for
a
long
time.
So
you
know
that
that's
not
necessarily
possible
if
it's
a
single
company,
that
is,
you
know,
doing
the
majority
of
the
development
because
they
may
you
know
change
direction
or
whatever.
So
it's
very
important
that
we
have
multiple
companies
all
contributing
actively.
B
A
A
Service
meshes
are
important,
so
let's
take
a
little
bit
of
a
bet
on
this
and
then
see
what
happens.
So
it's
really
early
stage.
We
don't
expect
all
sandbox
projects
to
succeed.
You
know
you
could
almost
think
of
it
as
a
I.
Don't
want
to
use
like
the
VC
analogy,
but
you
know
if
you're
like
a
venture
capitalist
you
bet
on,
and
some
companies
right.
A
A
Yeah
exactly
so,
some
people,
like
the
VC
analogy,
some
don't
yeah,
so
this
is
kind
of
where
we
are
CNC
if
things
have
changed
a
lot,
we're
about
that
our
three-year
anniversary.
So
it's
kind
of
little
sentimental
for
me.
But
so
you
know
we
have
three.
You
know
incubating
projects
in
December,
2016
and
we've
grown
to
a
ton
right
now
to
graduated
projects.
I
can
mention
before
he.
B
A
Yet
17
incubating
projects
with
harbor
being
announced
today
from
VMware
China,
so
yeah
we've
definitely
grown
quite
a
bit
in
in
in
the
two
years,
and
then
these
are
kind
of
our
early
stage
projects.
You
know
that
we
have
dragonfly
from
Alibaba
will
be
on
on
this
starting
tomorrow,
but
it's
a
like.
If
you
look
at
it's
a
mix
of
projects
and
very
interesting
spaces
and
of
all
different
sizes,
we
have
cloud
events
which
is
from
server
lists.
A
B
Is
not
you
know,
super
interesting
slide
not
produced,
but
the
intention
here
is
there's
a
lot
of
stuff
in
the
pipeline
here.
You
know
both
on
the
way
in
two's,
sandbox,
yeah
and
also
on
the
way
through
the
graduation
process
to
equation
so
there's
a
very
healthy
inflow,
and
we
imagine
that
the
number
of
projects
in
the
CNC
have
to
grow.
You
know
pretty
dramatically
in
the
next
12
months,
yeah
so.
A
If
you
have
questions
in
particular
of
how
the
process
works,
you
have
two
folks
here
that
could
help
answer
them.
We
try
to
operate
like
an
open-source
project
like
the
TOC
has
its
own
github
repo.
It's
how
we
expect
the
community
basically
to
interact
with
us
the
most
through
project
proposals.
We
do
meetings
twice
a
month
that
are
open
to
the
public,
but
you
know
now
is
a
good
time
to
answer
or
ask
any
questions
for
us
and
have
them
answer.
You
answer
them
for
you,
so
think.
So,
that's
basically
it!
C
I've
had
a
too
specific
technical,
specific
question
for
you
guys.
So
one
is
the
languages
you
know.
Crowd
native
is
more
toward
the
asynchronous,
no
collaboration
within
small
piece
of
software.
It
is
quite
different
from
the
past
language
ratio
or
something
so
that
language
like
a
ballerina
gonna,
be
there,
but
my
personal
interest
so
that
they
have
any
plan
to
host
those
languages
itself
to
write
down
crowd,
narrative,
application,
more
natively
or
more
asynchronous
and
the
one.
The
other
thing
is
a
chaos
engineering.
So
yes,
German.
A
Only
go
first
so
so
like
like
yeah
Mille
was
never
intended
to
kind
of
be
the
way
most.
You
know
engineers
and
developers
interact
with
kubernetes,
but
that's
kind
of
how
it
is
now.
There
is
a
very
wide
ecosystem
of
things.
There
I
mean
there's
ballerina
meta
particle,
there's
a
bunch
of
higher
level
developer
tools
that
try
to
hide
the
animal
as
much
as
possible.
A
Microsoft
has
draft
there's
a
bunch,
so
I
think
you're
gonna
see
a
lot
of
innovation
in
the
space
in
the
next
six
to
18
months
in
CNC,
yep
and
outside
whether
the
TOC
has
an
appetite
to
accept
any
of
these
projects
in
the
future.
I
don't
know,
that's
that's
up
to
them,
but
you're
gonna
see
a
lot
of
activity
and
I
think
it
I
think
it's
healthy,
like
you
know,
treat
yeah
molas
kind
of
the
assembly
language
of
of
cloud
native
and
then
build
the
tools
on
top
so
I'm
sure
you
have
yeah.
B
I
mean
I
can
I
can
put
a
bit
of
my
own
personal
spin
on
it,
and,
and
that
is
that
you
know
there
are
many
different
languages
out
there
for
good
reason,
like
many
of
them
are
very
good
at
certain
things
and
less
good
at
other
things,
and
many
of
them
have
you
know
some
of
them
are
expedient
they're,
easy
to
understand.
People
get
started,
but
there
may
be
have
performance
issues
down
the
road
or
whatever.
B
My
personal
belief
is
that
there's
actually
a
space
for
quite
a
few
languages
I
mean
just
to
quote
a
few
there's
a
lot
of
rust
projects
coming
in.
It's
got
a
lot
of
strengths.
It's
pretty
new,
quite
difficult
to
find
people
who
good
rust
programmers.
So
you
know
there's
the
pro
and
con
and
the
other
end
of
the
spectrum,
millions
and
millions
of
good
Java
programmers
out
there.
It's
also
got
its
challenges,
not
all
of
them.
Technical
and
I.
B
Don't
think
if
you,
if
you
think
of
the
CNC
F
in
a
sort
of
a
multi-decade
sort
of
lifespan,
I,
don't
think
it's
sensible
for
us
to
say
you
have
to
write
your
stuff
and
go
and
you
have
to
use
Yammer
or
you
can't
use
whatever
I
think.
What
we
need
to
do
is
enable
as
many
languages
as
makes
sense
to
be
used.
B
A
And
then
there's
the
chaos,
engineering
question,
so
chaos,
engineering
and,
in
my
personal
belief
you
need
to
in
order
to
build.
You
know
cloud
native
systems.
You
have
to
test
resiliency
right
and
you
know
chaos.
Engineering
is
kind
of
a
modern
practice
of
doing
that.
A
lot
of
these
companies.
You
know
that
you
know
kind
of
work,
clown
native,
because
we're
popular
had
ways
to
test
of
systems.
A
You
know
worked
so
in
CNC,
F
we're
exploring
booting
up
a
chaos,
engineering
focused
working
group,
that's
kind
of
in
the
bootstrapping
phase,
it's
not
officially
blessed
yet,
but
we're
basically
gathering
interested
parties
learning
about
different
technologies
out
there.
There's
really
not
many
open
source
chaos.
Engineering
projects
out
there,
in
my
opinion
that
are
focused
on
like
say
kubernetes
in
particular,
but
see
there'll,
be
a
lot
of
innovation
in
this
space
and
and
I,
wouldn't
be
surprised
if
next
year,
if
you
see
a
chaos,
engineering
working
group
proposed
in
CNC
F,
it's
answer
your
questions.
A
B
On
that,
which
is
you
know,
I
come
from
a
very,
very
big
system
background,
so
you
know
the
Google
thing's
had
that
Iran
had
literally
millions
of
you
know
machines,
and
so,
when
cows
engineering
camera.
In
that
context,
I
was
like,
but
our
machines
randomly
fail
all
the
time
anyway.
So
you
know
we
have
at
least
ten
machines
fail
every
minutes,
so
I
don't
need
a
chaos
monkey
to
make
that
happen.
B
But
but
it
is
true
that
you
know
if
you
have
some
much
smaller
infrastructure,
you
have
ten
machines,
you
know
they're,
probably
not
gonna
fail
every
day,
and
if
you
don't
know
what
happens
when
they
do,
you
have
to
have.
You
know
some
way
of
doing
that.
You
can
either
run
around
pushing
buttons
and
stuff
like
that
or
you
can
deploy
a
chaos
monkey
so
I
think
it
has
its
place.
I
think
pretty
quickly.
You
get
to
a
scale
where
you
don't
get
as
much
value
out
of
that,
because
stuff
crashes
and
breaks
anyway.
D
Hi
my
question:
I
have
two
questions
as
well.
Actually,
the
first
one
is:
what
triggers
a
project
going
from
Sam
BOTS
to
incubating
to
graduation
like
how
do
you
guys
run
that
process?
The
second
part
is:
how
do
you
treat
conflicting
projects
like
link,
Rd
and
Envoy,
or
how
do
you
guys
think
about
that.
A
A
There
is
actually
concrete
criteria
that
we
have
online
publish
in
the
github
repository
and
a
lot
of
it
is
around.
You
know
if
it's
just
from
like
one
organization
right,
that's
probably
an
earlier
sandbox
saying
if
you
have
multiple
maintains
from
different
companies.
Good,
do
you
have
like
a
code
of
conduct
securely
disclosure
problems?
There's
all
these
kind
of
criteria
that
help
kind
of
divide.
A
You
know
where
you'll
be,
and
then
there's
also
this
subjective
requirement
or
subjective
view
where
the
TOC
themselves
has
a
judgment,
call
based
on
their
experience
in
the
industry
where
they
think
things
kind
of
kind
of
fit.
The
sandbox
is
a
much
lower
barrier
to
get
in
and
we
kind
of
because
we
want
to
encourage
experimentation,
but
the
other
levels
are
much
more
difficult
to
get
to
and
require
the
you
know
subjectivity
of
these
industry.
May
you
know
experts
who
have
been
around
for
a
while
now.
B
Maybe
I
can
add,
I
mean
there's
quite
a
lot
of
stuff
and
it's
all
available
over
there.
So
if
you
want
the
details,
go
there,
but
I
can
give
you
a
very
brief
summary
of
I.
Think
the
big
key
points
so
to
go
from
sandbox
to
to
incubation.
You
need
to
have
the
stuff
in
production
used
by
multiple
companies,
and
so
these
are
like
real
things
that
are
being
used
in
production.
If
you're,
not
there,
you're,
not
in
great
in
incubation,
yet
you
may
not
have
so.
B
B
Yeah,
exactly
not
not
highly
available,
not
scalable,
but
you
know
it
didn't
actually
meet
our
criteria
for
graduation
because
it
had
a
you
know
relatively
small
number
of
companies
behind
it
at
the
time-
and
you
know
things
have
changed
which,
as
I've
mentioned
earlier,
that's
you
know
not
necessary.
If
Google
decides
that
they
don't
want
to
run
YouTube
on
the
test
anymore
and
they
you
know
sunset
it.
We
don't
want
to
have
told
our
members
that
they
should
met
their
business
on
it.
So
we
needed
to
have
multiple
companies.
B
You
know
actively
working
on
the
stuff
into
the
future
and
the
second
thing
is
you
know
one
or
two
or
three
production
uses
is
different
than
20,
and
so
many
about
you
know
kubernetes
isn't
used
by
more
than
two
or
three
or
four
it's
used
by
thousands
of
companies.
So
that's
you
know
the
the
sort
of
big
steps
between
the
two
and
there's
a
lot
more
detail
behind
it,
which
you
can
look
up.
The.
A
A
E
A
A
First
question
was
really
around
what
do
what
amenities
serve?
What
do
projects
get
from
CN,
CF
in
terms
of
services
and
what
they
could
request,
and
is
there
a
difference
between
the
services
we
offer
at
the
different
levels
of
things?
So
we
have
kind
of
a
centralized
mechanism
where
projects
could
request
services.
It's
it's!
It's
it's
on
github.
If
you
go
to
github.com,
/t
and
CF
service
desk,
it's
a
variety
of
things.
Projects
could
request
technical
documentation,
help
we've
done
a
lot
of
websites.
We,
for
example,
we
just
redid
the
website
for
container
D.
A
We
spent
a
quarter
million
dollars
in
security
audits
for
a
lot
of
our
projects.
We
host
events.
Basically,
you
could
think
like
technical
documentation,
help
security
audits
event
like
hey
I,
want
to
host
an
event.
Hey
I
want
to
go
speak
at
a
conference.
Can
you
pay
for
my
travel
I'm,
a
maintainer
I'll
they're,
all
kind
of
listed
on
that
repo
iMessage,
but
it's
like
events
marketing.
A
You
know
travel
services,
it's
it's
quite
a
big
list
that
that
we
have
do.
We
offer
different
levels
of
services
for
projects
generally.
We
haven't
necessarily
discriminated
like
you
know.
If
earlier
stage,
projects
wants
like
a
security
audit
like
we're
generally
open
to
it,
but
we
generally,
you
know
my
opinion-
is:
if
you're
a
more
established
project,
graduated
incubator
will
offer
more
services.
A
We
have
very
strict
rules
in
terms
of
marketing
related
services
that
we
offer
our
projects
if
you're
an
early
stage
like
sandbox
project,
we
generally
don't
do
any
proactive
marketing
like
we
don't
do
press
releases
or
huge
promotion,
because
you
know
they're
still
experimental
right,
we're
not.
We
don't
want
to
essentially
bet
and
push
a
project.
They
may
not
be
ready
to
a
wider
community.
So
those
were
your
two
and
then
your
third
question
was
around
an
investment
like
what?
What
do
you
mean
by
like
to
see
and
see
if
in
vet
like?
A
We
don't
like
projects
or
independent
communities,
we
don't
we're
not-for-profit.
We
don't
do
like
venture
capital
style
investment
in
projects,
and
we
have
a
philosophy
that
Dan
briefly
touched
on
this
morning.
Where
our
goal
is
to
cultivate.
We
call
it
three
P's,
it's
CNCs
roles
like
we
host
projects.
We
have
members
that
pay
us
fees
that
essentially
they
build
products
based
on
those
projects
which
generate
profits
for
these
members
that
they
reinvest
back
into
the
project.
So
that's
kind
of
the
role
of
CNC,
if
that
makes
sense,
but
yeah
we're
not
for
profit.
B
A
A
Any
other
questions
for
us.
Otherwise,
I'm
happy
like
we're
all
you
know.
If
you
go
to
the
CN
CF
TOC
github
repo,
we're
easy
to
contact
or
you
could
just
email
us.
So
we
have
open
meetings
everyone's
welcome
to
attend
and
ask
any
questions
there
too.
So,
if
not
thank
everyone
for
your
time
and
it's
good
to
have
folks
learn
a
little
bit
more
how
these
sausage
is
made
in
in
CNC
F.
So
thank
you.