►
Description
Join us for Kubernetes Forums Seoul, Sydney, Bengaluru and Delhi - learn more at kubecon.io
Don't miss KubeCon + CloudNativeCon 2020 events in Amsterdam March 30 - April 2, Shanghai July 28-30 and Boston November 17-20! Learn more at kubecon.io. The conference features presentations from developers and end users of Kubernetes, Prometheus, Envoy, and all of the other CNCF-hosted projects
Panel: Beyond Codes of Conduct: Igniting Diversity in Your Community - Jemma Bolland, The Scale Factory; Lara Owen, Github; Shanis Windland, VMware; & Kevin Stewart, Independent
There’s diversity – and then there’s inclusion. The difference between being invited and being a valued participant is vast. The Kubernetes and KubeCon community have made significant strides on both the diversity and inclusion front – but should not be satisfied with progress to date. Join this panel of thought leaders to learn how to turn a diverse community into an inclusive one, hear the challenges of building versus changing a culture, and how to ignite the power of diversity where you contribute. How does the KubeCon/K8s community continue to lead the way in both diversity AND inclusion? Time to fill the dance floor. It's still too empty.
https://sched.co/UaWK
A
A
Hopefully
all
of
you
saw
it
as
well,
so
I
thought
he
gave
us
the
perfect
opening
to
this
discussion
today
and
it's
clear
that
he
feels
included
and
part
of
the
community,
but
as
the
community
is
growing
and
changing,
we
have
to
continue
to
ensure
that
the
people
that
are
here
can
continue
to
participate
and
we
can
invite
more
folks
into
the
community
and
ensure
they
feel
included
in
able
to
participate.
And
so
that's
the
topic
of
our
panel
today,
so
I
would
love
it.
B
B
C
D
Good
morning
I'm
Lara
Owen
I'm,
the
director
of
global
workplace
experience
for
github.
We
are
1,100
people
in
21
countries
and
part
of
my
responsibility
is
to
build
community
both
locally
in
our
offices
and
remotely
and
virtually
around
the
world.
Kubernetes
is
a
huge
repo
on
our
open-source
platform,
with
2,300
contributors
and
over
86,000
commits.
So
there's
a
lot
of
lessons
that
we've
learned
between
how
we
run
our
company
and
how
our
platform
operates
and
I'm
excited
to
share
that
here
today,
perfect.
A
C
I
think
the
main
thing
with
the
kubernetes
community
is
that
the
early
founders
placed
a
very
high
premium
on
inclusiveness,
diversity
collaboration.
So
a
lot
of
the
attributes
of
the
community
were
baked
in
from
the
very
start
I've.
My
experience
with
the
community
has
always
been
almost
exclusively
a
positive
one.
I've
watched
people
come
into
the
community
who
knew
nothing
about
kubernetes,
nothing
about
cloud
native
and
see
other
members
of
the
community
tried
to
help
them
out.
Get
them
started
if
they're
unclear
about
how
to
contribute.
If
they
wanted
to
get
a
job.
C
C
It's
hard
for
me
to
say:
you
know
what
we've
missed
the
boat
on,
because
that
almost
assumes
that
there's
a
perfect
end
state,
which
there
isn't
you
know
we're
always
going
to
mess
something
up
at
some
point,
but
I
think
where
we've
done
the
best
is
the
community
as
a
whole
is
always
trying
we're
always
listening
to
others
when
a
problem
arises,
we're
always
responding
as
things
come
up
and
a
perfect
example
is
actually
something
that
led
up
to
this
event.
That
I
was
actually
involved
in.
C
There
was
a
dispute
on
Twitter
because
Twitter
that
involved
only
making
some
comments.
You
know
sort
of
trying
to
tone
police,
others
and
people
sort
of
jumped
on
her
about
that.
Then
a
friend
of
hers
sort
of
jumped
on
them.
You
know
trying
to
white
knight
the
situation
which
led
to
others
sort
of
piling
on
and
in
turn
a
person
that
was
a
friend
of
the
original
white
knight
started,
making
some
videos
and
tweeting
about.
You
know
why
this
was
unfair,
even
though
what
his
friend
said
was
wrong
and
turns
out.
C
This
person
was
going
to
come
to
cube
con
and
you
know
I'm
a
grown
man
I'm,
not
you
know,
put
off
by
people.
I
disagree
with
being
in
the
same
place
that
I
am
but
I
wondered
whether
others
would
feel
the
same
or
even
feel
like
they
could
speak
up
about
this
person.
That
was
causing
a
lot
of
harm
over
the
weeks
that
this
incident
was
going
on
and
I
just
said:
hey
I'm,
not
sure
I
wouldn't
even
want
to
come
to
cube
cotton.
C
A
A
B
The
community
does
so
many
great
things,
but
I
think
the
barriers
to
entry
is
still
very
high.
I
think
the
knowledge
isn't
very
equally
shared,
so
I
think
the
main
thing
we
can
do
is
champion
people
to
actively
invite
them
in
to
create
space
and
hold
space
for
them
and
not
wait
for
them
to
come
to
us,
but
maybe
go
out
and
offer
help
and
offer
that
leg
up.
I
wouldn't
be
sitting
here.
B
A
That's
great
and
I
know
there's
a
number
of
talks
here
and
tracts
and
blog
posts
and
a
lot
things
were
where
folks
are
in
the
community
are
reaching
out
to
help
others
join
and
learn
and
get
up
to
speed.
So
I
would
encourage
everyone
to
seek
those
out
so
Laura.
Let's
move
on
a
little
bit
to
open
source
as
a
whole.
What
do
you
think
are
some
systemic
concerns
that
make
it
difficult
for
underrepresented
groups
to
contribute
to
open
source
yeah.
D
D
One
of
them
is
explicit
consent
just
like
on
Facebook,
where
you
have
to
accept
a
friend
request.
You
can
also
you
have
to
accept
being
invited
to
a
repo.
This
is
decrease
the
incidence
we
had,
people
get
invited
to
repos
that
have
racists
or
malicious
content
of
some
sort
and
they
somehow
get
associated
with
that
simply
because
they
were
added
other
things.
We've
done
include
creating
a
sponsorship
program.
D
We
have
a
lot
of
maintained
errs
on
our
platform
that
contribute
a
huge
amount
of
time
and
effort
to
ensuring
that
our
communities
are
functioning
properly,
but
they
don't
get
paid
for
this
work,
and
you
know
there
may
be
the
the
trope
that
engineers
are
all
you
know
well-paid
and
have
a
ton
of
time
to
do
this
kind
of
work,
but
a
lot
of
them
art.
So
we
wanted
to
make
sure
that,
regardless
of
your
financial
situation,
you
rewarded
and
appreciated.
C
C
C
So,
in
terms
of
like
things
that
we
can
start
looking
at
doing,
better
is
just
understanding
the
scale
of
the
community
that
we
have
and
realizing
that
not
everybody
is
going
to
feel
as
comfortable
engaging,
and
we
should
be
looking
at
mechanisms
to
how
to
reduce
that
scale
for
folks
so
taking
kubernetes.
For
example,
we
have
a
lot
of
different
audiences
that
are
interested
in
that
platform,
but
developers
are
different
from
operators.
C
Operators
who
are
familiar
with
units
are
not
the
same
as
operators
or
permit
familiar
with
Windows,
and
we
just
rolled
out
a
bunch
of
features
that
were
targeted
at
Windows
users,
so
taking
into
consideration
the
context
that
people
are
coming
from
and
seeing.
How
do
we
approach
those
folks
to
engage
them
and
bring
them
in
as
I
think
the
next
step
of
what
we
can
start
doing
versus
just
sort
of
the
hey
we're
welcoming
everybody
come
in?
A
I
was
actually
at
a
talk
yesterday,
which
I
thought
was
really
interesting.
The
scale
the
project
is
so
large,
but
it's
divided
up
into
so
many
subgroups
that
it
becomes
really
dependent
on
four
or
five
people
that
fixing
bugs
you
know
before
release
so
there's
a
huge
scale,
but
small
groups
of
people
really
showing
up
and
contributing
to
the
project,
and
so
I
think
newcomers
should
just
understand
that
showing
up
to
the
community
being
dependable,
being
reliable
is
a
way
that
you
know
you
can
easily
contribute
and
be
part
of
something
really
big
and
scalable.
A
B
The
problem
with
meritocracy
is
that
it
seems
a
level
playing
field
which
is
just
not
the
case.
So
if
you've
had
the
opportunity,
the
educational
opportunities
you
have
the
spare
time
to
contribute
to
open
source
because
you're
not
working
a
second
job,
then
you
may
appear
to
have
merit
when
actually,
what
you
have
is
privileged,
so
I
think
that
we
should
focus
on
leveling
that
playing
field
rather
than
calling
it
a
meritocracy.
A
C
Good
be
good.
The
problem
with
meritocracy
is
that
it
doesn't
exist.
There's
no
such
thing,
I
think
Kara
Swisher
said
it
best,
it's
more
of
a
mirror
autocracy
that
reflects
the
privilege
of
the
people
that
sort
of
put
those
barriers
in
front,
and
you
know
when
I
first
got
involved
with
open
source.
You
know
it
was
all
about
meritocracy
sold
out
your
contributions,
except
when
it
didn't
actually
match
the
expectations
of
the
people.
A
D
You
know
there
have
been
studies
done
on
github,
where
female
contributors
there
commits
are
accepted
more
often
than
male
contributors
unless
their
gender
is
easily
identified.
You
know
these
biases
come
in
really
quickly
and
even
though
people
are
aware
of
them,
awareness
does
not
equal
action.
So
I
think
when
it
comes
to
meritocracy
all
those
biases
that
have
been
mentioned
before
come
into
play
and
yeah
I
think
it's
it's
moot
at
this
point
I'm.
Hopefully
more
people
in
agreement
and
there's
lessen
usage
of
that
word.
Yeah.
A
And
I
think
even
companies
are
focusing
a
little
bit
on
this
and
maybe
not
using
the
same
language
in
terms
of
hey.
We
let
everyone
at
the
table
have
an
opportunity
to
speak.
We
don't
speak
over
each
other,
but
I
think
that
a
lot
of
people
are
missing
the
point
that
not
everyone's
actually
at
the
table
to
speak,
and
we
have
to
continue
to
focus
on
that
as
our
goal.
A
B
So
last
year
we
had
a
Reading
Week
Cuba
Nettie's
Reading
Week,
where
everyone
could
stop
their
normal
work
and
just
learn,
and
that
gave
people
who
might
not
have
had
the
opportunity
to
play
with
the
new
shiny
bits
of
the
attack
to
actually
get
in
there,
get
their
hands
dirty
and
and
and
really
kind
of
progress
other
than
that
flexibility,
I
think
giving
people
flexibility
makes
diversity
among
the
team
better.
It
gives
people
the
time
the
space
they
need
to
come
get
into
this
droid
yeah.
A
We
were
just
having
a
conversation
before
this
panel
around
policies
at
companies
on
flexible
work
and
the
more
that
we
can
make
that
playing
field.
Even
everyone
gets
an
opportunity
to
work
where
they
want
when
they
need
to
that
provides
an
opportunity
for
more
people
to
participate
in
companies
and
in
the
community,
but.
A
C
Since
again,
I'm
not
working
for
any
companies,
but
I
will
talk
about
a
company
I
used
to
work
with
with
Janice
before
it
got
acquired.
One
of
the
things
that
we
really
focused
on
in
terms
of
helping
to
grow
the
community,
since
that
was
actually
one
of
our
corporate
goals,
is
how
do
we
expand?
The
carbonize
community
is
to
get
over
this
whole
over
focus
on
senior
people,
I
think
everyone's.
You
know
any
startup
that
comes
up
everyone's
immediately.
C
Looking
I
want
senior
engineers,
I
want
senior
this,
and
once
you
near
that,
we
have
to
start
looking
more
people
for
interest
and
potential.
Everybody
can
learn
like
this.
Is
you
know?
Yes,
it's
complex.
Yes,
there's
a
lot
to
a
lot
of
cloud
native
stuff,
but
everyone
has
the
capacity
to
learn
and
I'm
way
more
interested
in
folks
that
show
that
they
have
an
interest
that
they
you
know
want
to.
C
Learn
I'd
rather
invest
the
time
in
the
rather
than
folks,
who
already
know
they're
good
and
have
already
accomplished
a
ton
of
stuff
I
mean
you
need
those
people
to,
but
I
think
we've
skewed
things
so
much
that
we're
only
looking
for
those
senior
folks
and
not
looking
to
invest
in
growth
and
others,
and
the
more
that
companies
adopt.
That
approach,
I
think
the
better
off
we'll
all
be
yeah.
A
A
You
have
new
folks
who
look
at
it
differently,
then
new
and
different
ideas,
and
that
makes
everything
better
okay,
Laura
so
I
think
one
really
important
thing
is
that
both
technical
and
non-technical
leadership
is
seen
and
appreciated,
not
only
in
the
kubernetes
community,
but
in
companies
and
I
would
love
to
just
understand
how
you've
seen
this
work
at
github
or,
for
you
know,
an
ideas
for
the
community
to
ensure
that
both
of
those
skill
sets
are
recognized
and
appreciated.
Yeah.
D
So
when
I
started
github
six
years
ago,
we
didn't
have
ith
our
sales.
We
had
a
bunch
of
Engineers
and
a
few
basic
GNA
folks
and
when
I
came
on,
I
was
probably
should
hire
IT
and
was
told
if
you
don't
know
how
to
fix
your
computer.
You
probably
shouldn't
work
for
a
tech,
company,
carte
blanche
and
I
told
them.
Well,
if
you
don't
know
how
to
do
payroll,
you
should
probably
work
working
for
free.
D
D
And
the
idea
that
you
know
you
can
build
a
company
just
with
technical
people,
you
know
is
a
fallacy.
We
now
have
HR.
We
now
have
sales.
We
now
have
you
know
a
bigger
finance
team
of
amazing
IT
team,
and
you
really
have
to
look
at
your
community
in
a
lipstick
way.
Everybody's
bringing
a
different
skill,
set
a
different
contributing
something
else
and
to
really
build
a
successful.
Diverse
company
diversity
comes
from
seniority
from
age
from
race.
From
you
know,
all
kinds
of
different
things.
You
know.
D
One
of
the
good
things
about
github
is
that
both
our
technical
and
our
non
tech
to
technical
people
use
github
to
collaborate.
So,
for
instance,
my
team
is
opening
a
new
office,
we're
looking
at
New
York
as
we
do
the
design
we
share
it
on
in
a
repo
in
github
and
people
are
allowed
to
comment,
contribute
make
changes,
ask
questions,
express
concerns
through
the
whole
process,
and
that
helps
me
when
I
go
look
at
what
our
engineers
are
doing.
D
I
understand
the
tools
they're
using
so
our
entire
leadership
team,
both
technical
and
non-technical
and
everybody
below
them
are
all
working
on
the
same
platform.
We
can
speak
the
same
languages
even
if
it
all
isn't
code,
but
we
understand
how
to
work
together.
I
think
another
thing
we
do,
which
is
probably
really
important
for
the
open
source
communities
learning
how
to
work
remotely.
D
You
know
there
are
different
ways
you
hold
meetings
if
people
are
on
video
conferencing
or
if
you're
in
an
open-source
repo,
then
if
everybody's
in
the
room
together-
and
we
spent
a
ton
of
time,
doing
manager,
training,
teaching
people
different
tactics
and
tools
that
they
can
use
to
be
successful
when
you're
communicating
across
different
mediums
and
platforms.
In
addition,
we
have
a
really
cool
feature
that
I
love.
You
know
it's.
What
is
a
collaboration?
D
It's
like
a
pause
button,
so
maintainer
z'
can
essentially,
if
things
start
getting
heated
within
a
repo.
If
people
you
know
are
not
communicating
well
or
somebody's
trolli
and
they
can
put
the
pause
button
on
that
person
for
24
hours.
People
can
step
away.
So
it
gives
you
that,
like
in-person
experience
of
like
hey,
this
is
getting
a
little
too
much.
D
A
And
Kevin
I'd
love
to
hear
from
you
as
a
technical
leader.
You
know:
how
do
you
build
that
appreciation
for
non-technical
leadership
or
even
different
types
of
technical
depth?
The
term
technical
is
so
broad
and
can
be
used
to
make
few
people
feel
wrong
a
lot
of
times
if
you're,
not
an
infrastructure,
engineer
you're,
not
technical
enough.
So
how
do
you
build
that
sort
of
appreciation
and
understanding
into
technical
teams
that
you
work
on
I.
C
Weird,
because
you
know
what
exactly
is
technical
just
because
you're
not
writing
code
doesn't
mean
you
don't
understand,
technology
that
you
don't
work
with
technology
and
I
think
the
whole
calling
someone
non-technical
is
just
again
another
form
of
gatekeeping.
You
know
where
this
protected
class,
this
hierarchy
and
if
you're
not
doing
the
things
we're
doing
you're,
not
one
of
us.
C
To
be
frank,
that's
a
lot
of
bull.
We
also
have
to
work
with
engineering
teams
to
make
sure
that
they
understand
that
the
code
isn't
everything
if
you're
working
as
part
of
a
business.
Yes,
the
code
is
maybe
important.
It's
probably
the
majori
where
the
revenue
is
coming
from,
but
you
can't
do
it
alone.
I
need
to
work
with
sales,
folks
and
marketing
folks
and
designers
and
product
managers
to
make
that
final
product
that
actually
generates
the
revenue
so
trying
to
act
as
if
the
only
work,
that's
important
is
the
work.
That's
being
done.
C
Engineering
you're,
just
fooling
yourself
so
I've
seen
a
large
part
of
my
role
as
an
engineering
leader,
is
sort
of
bringing
that
appreciation
for
all
the
other
roles
to
engineering,
inviting
folks
in
making
sure
that
we
have
lots
of
cross-functional
interactions
and
making
sure
that
everyone
treats
everyone
else
with
respect,
no
matter
what
their
role
is,
and
you
know
most
people
get
it
there
are
times
I.
Do
you
have
to
elbow
somebody
and
say:
hey,
that's,
not
cool!
You
know.
C
B
And
so
I
think
soloing
is
is
the
main
issue.
If
you
aren't
all
pulling
in
the
same
direction,
so
the
technical
team
are,
we
are
technical.
We
work
to
different
rules,
then
you
can
end
up
with
a
lack
of
cohesion
and
lack
of
direction,
and
one
of
the
things
that
I
think
some
companies
don't
do
well
is
combining
those
skills
for
the
greater
good.
B
So
I
think
that
if
the
technical
team
are
off
doing
something
over
here,
they
might
not
have
the
context
of
the
sales
team
of
the
marketing
team
and
that
just
ends
up
with
conflict.
It
ends
up
with
with
kind
of
blame
culture
and
all
of
those
things
so
I
think
bringing
everyone
together
and
and
yet
removing
the
labels.
Everyone
is
technical
if
they
were
going
to
tech
business,
basically
making
each
overall
work
into
the
same
plan.
Sometimes.
C
It's
something
as
simple
as
having
the
engineering
team
rotate
on
writing
a
blog
post
for
the
website,
and
that
way
they
have
to
work
with
the
marketing
team
and
just
forcing
those
little
interactions
where
then,
the
marketing
team
gets
exposed
to
engineering
maybe
understands
that
concept
little
bit
better.
Just
through
the
process
of
writing
a
blog
post
create
those
natural
interactions
and
start
removing
those
barriers.
Yeah.
A
And
I
think
the
more
that
leadership
teams
can
ensure
everyone
understands
how
the
business
functions,
how
we
make
money,
how
we
pay
payroll
all
of
those
things
and
not
allow
people
to
just
focus
on
I'm
an
engineer,
so
that's
all
I
care
about.
Then
it
really
gives
much
more
respect
for
for
the
scale
and
expertise
across
companies.
A
C
They
were
seeing
lost
and
new
develop
a
resource
at
Godot
dev
because
they
recognize,
as
I
was
mentioning
earlier,
that
there
are
different
contexts
that
people
have
when
they're
coming
into
a
community,
and
the
original
golang.org
site
was
really
about
the
open
source
project
and
development
and
very
technical,
and
they
need
another
resource,
her
folks
that
were
just
coming
in
like
well.
What
is
go,
you
know,
why
would
I
use
this
programming
language
who's
using
it?
You
know
it's
decision
makers.
C
People
want
to
say
well,
who
else
is
doing
something
similar
to
us
and
they
created
this
go
to
dev
site
that
answers
a
lot
of
those
questions
targeted
at
that
group
of
people,
so
I
think
that's
a
technique
we
can
use
to
help
deal
with
the
developers
versus
operators
versus
decision
makers,
but
as
a
whole.
I
can't
point
out
another
whole
community
and
say
they're,
really
knockin
out
of
the
park
copy
that
I
have
more
reinforced,
hey
we're
doing
a
lot
of
things
right.
C
B
At
the
scale
Factory
I
was
the
ninth
employee
and
I
was
the
first
person
who
was
there
to
oversee
things.
There
were
two
directors
that
they
were
handling.
They
were
both
engineers,
but
they
were
handling
things
like
pay
and
finance
and
all
those
other
things
between
them.
So
I
came
on
and
started
to
look
at
how
we
could
build
culture
as
we
grew.
A
Because
I
love,
a
lot
of
leaders
asked
this
question
to
me:
you
know
water,
what's
like
something:
I
can
do
every
day
to
you
know
affect
diversity.
Inclusion
in
my
company
and
so
I
would
love
to
hear
what
are
one
or
two
kind
of
everyday
actions.
You
think
folks
in
the
community,
folks
and
their
company
can
do
to
ensure
that
they're
keeping
these
top
topics
top
of
mind.
So
Laura.
D
D
What's
not
working
in
the
office,
I,
don't
think
I'm
going
to
solve
all
the
systemic
I'm
in
Institute
Iced
problems
that
we
have
in
tech,
but
letting
someone
know
that
they're,
appreciated
and
heard
is
just
a
really
easy
way
to
make
your
community
a
little
bit
stronger
and
then
I
think
also
having
a
growth
mindset.
You
don't
know
what
you
don't
know
and
learning
about
other
people.
A
C
Say
be
mindful
of
you
know
how
much
you're
focusing
on
any
one
area
I
think
it's
an
easy
trap
to.
You
know,
be
passionate
about
diversity,
inclusion,
but
that
over
focus
on
one
particular
approach,
whether
it's
you
know
trying
to
get
more
women
into
your
company
or
into
the
community,
or
you
know,
providing
scholarships
or
whatever,
there's
no
one
solution
to
rule
them
all
and
if
you're
not
paying
attention
to
the
whole
expanse
of
things,
you're
most
likely
going
to
create
a
situation
where
people
end
up
feeling
excluded.
C
F
C
Include
me
so
I
think
it's
a
trap
that
leaders
fall
into
pretty
easily
and
you
just
have
to
be
mindful
of
that.
Diversity
is
broader
than
that,
and
inclusion
really
means
that
it's
as
comfortable
for
me,
as
for
you,
as
is
for
everyone
in
this
room
and
if
you're,
focusing
on
any
one
area,
you're,
definitely
creating
an
environment
where
people
are
gonna
feel
excluded.
That's.
B
Stating
intent
is
really
important,
so
if
you're
talking
about
one
thing
to
be
inclusive,
ask
people
are
we
being
inclusive,
does?
Does
a
dual
action
stand
up
to
to
our
intention?
If
you
state
your
intention
often
and
you
invite
feedback
on
whether
you're
actually
achieving
it,
you'll
actually
get
much
better
feedback
than
if
you
just
kind
of
check
in
with
yourself
and
think,
hey
I'm
doing
this
a
great
job.
The
other
thing
is
happy
very
aware
of
intersectionality.
B
It's
not
just
race.
It's
not
just
gender
there's!
There's
euro
a
typicality
there
is.
There
is
physical
mobility.
There
are
people
whose
lives
are
just
vastly
different
for
any
given
reason,
whether
that's
class
with
that's
religion
be
very
aware
of
intersectionality
you,
this
isn't
pokemon,
you
can't
just
tick
boxes
and
say:
hey
I've
got
my
number
of
women
and
I've
got
my
number
of
diverse
people.
That
I
can
see
so
therefore
I'm
doing
well
using.
D
F
That
conversation
I
can
tell
he
felt
like
a
very
single
death
minority
and
he's
almost
the
point
of
entertainment.
He
walked
around
with
mobility
cameras
and
when
I
first
approached
Doug,
he
didn't
want
to
talk
when
he
heard
that
my
daughter
has
a
saint
in
that.
If
I
condition
he
did
then
get
engaged,
but
his
response
was
wound
up
closing
off
because
of
how
he's
treated
in
this
apartment.
I'd
love
to
hear
your
suggestions
and
ideas,
I'd
love
to
bring
this
to
CN,
CF
and
others
to
open
this
up.
I
know:
income
trying
to.
F
A
You
and
just
so
everyone
I'm,
not
sure
if
you
heard
that
in
the
back
but
he's
talking
about
mobility,
disability
and
how
we
can
engage
disabled
folks
in
the
conference.
So
I
don't
know
panelists,
do
you
have
any
feedback,
I
think
yeah?
We
just
have
to
do
better.
That's
my
feedback.
I
agree
with
you
wholeheartedly.
I've.
B
Got
time
so
I'm
involved
in
DevOps
days
London
and
we
as
standard
have
closed
captioning
and
we
have
signing
I.
Think
the
thing
that's
really
important
is
having
these
things
there
and
not
I've
seen
other
conferences
where
they
say
hey.
If
you
have
any
needs,
come
and
come
find
us,
and
we
will
do
this
for
you,
that's
not
good
enough.
We
need
to
have
it
available,
even
if
nobody's
using
it,
because
if
it's
there,
maybe
the
second
or
third
year
same
thing
happens
with
child
care.
B
D
Yeah
I
think
it
goes
back
to
it
has
to
be
the
default,
not
the
role
github.
We
definitely
started
looking
into.
How
do
we
make
our
offices
more
accessible?
Can
you
open
all
the
doors
and
get
through
the
office
if
you're,
in
a
wheelchair,
if
you're
on
crutches,
not
all
disabilities
are
permanent,
some
are
temporary.
You
know
many
are
not
visible.
D
Do
we
I
think
we
have
1/5
of
our
population
is
colorblind,
so
do
we
use
red
in
any
of
our
signage,
and
these
are
things
we
have
to
think
of
as
we
help
people
navigate
the
space
and
the
only
way
to
do
it
is
to
have
conversations
with
those
impacted
and
to
reach
out
to
lots
of
nonprofit
groups
that
are
interested
in
doing
this
work
and
advancing
this
cause.
So
thank
you
for
bringing
it
up.
Thank
you.
E
E
E
A
Just
so,
if
n
everyone
didn't
hear
the
question,
so
the
question
is:
how
do
you
actually
increase
interest
and
diversity,
inclusion
topics
outside
of
the
folks
in
marginalized
groups
who
are
showing
up
to
talks
like
this?
How
do
you
get
the
majority
to
be
interested,
and
so
what
are
some
some
ways?
The
panel
has
ideas
there
so
know.
Somebody
want
to
start
Kevin
I'm.
C
Conflicted
with
us,
because
I've
spent
so
much
time
trying
to
push
for
diversity
push
for
inclusion
and
after
a
while,
you
kind
of
get
tired
when
you're
saying
the
same
things
over
and
over
again,
and
the
folks
that
have
the
most
ability
to
make
change
have
no
real
incentive
to
do
so.
So
it's
like
all
right,
so
I
just
keep
pounding
the
drum
banging
on
it
or
do
I
just
focus
my
energies
where
it
makes
the
most
sense.
C
We're
talking
in
those
folks
and
trying
to
you
know,
encourage
them
to
do
the
things
that
need
to
be
done
because
again
they
felt,
like
you
know,
I'm,
not
in
a
position
where
I
can
do
these
things
and
invest.
My
energy
is
there
at
this
point.
You
know
for
as
long
as
we've
been
banging
the
diversity
inclusion
drum
I'm
just
going
to
go
on
the
assumption
that
sorry,
white
people
y'all
know
that
there
was
a
problem
and
that
you're,
the
ones
that
have
to
make
that
change.
C
D
Once
you
get
people
in
the
door,
it's
a
little
more
challenging
once
you
get
people
face
to
face
we're
gonna
make
biases,
but
we
standardized
a
lot
of
the
processes
and
we
ensure
that
people
ask
the
same
questions.
So
it's
not
just
a
free-flow
conversation
and
I
like
that
person.
I
want
to
grab
a
beer
with
them.
I
didn't
like
that
person.
It's
I
can
compare
these
same
three
questions
and
see
which
ones
ranked
appropriately
yeah.
A
At
VMware
we
have
each
interview:
panelist
has
a
specific
area,
they're,
focusing
on
with
standardized
questions,
and
they
meet
as
a
group.
Before
and
after
to
get
a
diverse
set
of
opinions
on
on
the
the
person
they
interviewed,
and
then
we
also
standardized
how
long
we
will
have
folks
at
an
interview.
So
we
never
asked
somebody
to
come
in
for
75
interviews.
Like
some
questions.
Some
companies
do
so
like
six
interviews,
that's
the
end.
You
make
a
decision
and
we
really
standardize
that
process.
G
C
I've
personally,
you
know
talked
to
my
interviewers,
my
recruiters
and
sort
of
de-emphasize.
The
whole
gap
thing
like
there
are
tons
of
valid
reasons
why
people
have
gaps
in
their
resumes
now
and
the
old
sort
of
thinking
of.
Oh
there's.
You
know
so
much
time
between
jobs.
Something
must
be
wrong.
It's
just
outmoded
thinking,
and
so
we've
had
those
conversations
before
we
started
sourcing
and
interviewing
folks
to
sort
of
dispel
that
thing.
I've
personally
done
is
I.
C
Just
inject
myself
at
the
beginning
of
the
process,
I'm
like
I'm
involved
in
sourcing
I'm
involved
with
the
first
set
of
interviews
to
try
and
reduce
that
buys
before
we
get
down
the
chain
because
a
lot
of
times
that's
always
the
problem
is
that
you
know
things
get
filtered
out
so
early
in
the
process
that,
by
the
time,
you're
actually
dealing
with
the
actual
interview,
you've
already
lost
out
on
a
lot
of
wonderful
potential
candidates.
Yeah.
C
Were
happy
to
carry
that
message
on
for
you
and
you
don't
always
have
to
feel
like
you
have
to
make
a
big
public
statement.
If
you
find
one
person,
do
you
feel
confident
to
talk
to
say
hey?
This
is
my
experience
at
this
and
I
think,
especially
in
this
community,
people
are
more
likely
to
act
on
it
and
talk
to
the
appropriate
folks.