►
From YouTube: MAKERS & BUILDERS - The state of Drupal Development Environments panel discussion / DrupalCon Eu...
Description
Last year in Amsterdam we confirmed that everyone had their own favorite Drupal Development Tool. Is the same happening this year? Are we on the way to standardizing on top of something more uniform? https://drupal.kuoni-congress.info/2019/program/abstract/321
A
We're
live
hello.
Everybody
welcome
to
this
panel
session
about
local
blue
development
environments
in
drupal.
So
this
is
a
continuation.
Last
year
in
amsterdam,
we
confirmed
that
everyone
can
add
their
own
favorite
drupal
development
tool.
Is
this
this
the
same
happening
this
year?
That's
a
question:
are
we
on
the
way
of
standardizing
on
top
of
something
more
uniform
at
triplecon
global?
The
discussion
went
to
another
level
and
some
numbers
were
actually
revealed
this
time
we
will.
A
We
will
have
an
awesome
panel
with
people
from
lando
docsal
dev
cloud
id
launchpad.
I
I
in
drupal
vm.
I
hope
I
didn't
miss
anyone.
So
with
me
I
have
my
name:
is
ricardo
maro?
By
the
way
I
I'm
I'm
from
macquarie
I
manage
devops
and
sre
there
and
with
me
I
have
katherine
drukman
and
she
will
be
basically
from
the.
A
So
one
one
quick
thing:
you
should
have
a
live
q,
a
part
where
you
can
actually
put
your
questions
like
I
see
there,
there's
some
questions
already
there.
Let
me
see
it's
refreshing.
We
will
have
time
for
these
questions,
so
go
ahead
and
put
your
questions.
Meanwhile,
while
this
is
starting
and
the
panel
will
start
with
a
couple
of
minutes
per
panelist
to
actually
present
their
own
their
own
thing.
C
I
will
tell
you
things:
I'm
katherine,
I
actually
don't
contribute
to
any
of
the
projects
we're
talking
about
today,
but
I'm
here
to
give
you
my
perspective
as
a
user
who
has
tried
a
lot
of
environments
and
usually
just
use
a
homegrown
diy
native
environment.
I've
also
done
a
few
different
types
of
work,
and
I
find
that
my
needs
change.
Depending
on
what
I'm
working
on
I've
built
and
maintained
production
sites,
some
larger
scale
than
others.
C
I've
worked
on
software
products,
I've
done
some
drupal
core
and
contrib
module
contributions,
and
I
think
the
needs
are
a
bit
different
for
each.
So
what
do
I
use?
I
actually
used
map
for
many
years
while
on
a
mac.
Until
I
found
it
too
limiting
I
was
frustrated
with
its
performance.
I
found
its
configuration
to
be
a
bit
of
a
hurdle.
So
now
I've
been
using
a
local
diy,
amp
stack
for
a
while
now
and
it
works
very
well
for
me.
C
C
I
use
it
every
day
now,
alongside
my
local
setup,
it's
great
for
unifying
a
team
experience.
I've
also
been
playing
with
lando
for
the
past
year,
but
I
don't
use
it
regularly,
though
I
plan
to
change
that.
I
expect
that
if
you
ask
me
in
six
months
I'll
tell
you
I
use
a
combination
of
window
and
cloud
ide.
Maybe
I've
gotten
tired
of
the
craft.
C
I
don't
know
my
background
is
that
I
ran
all
the
jubilee
stuff
at
linux
journal
for
12
years,
and
for
that
reason
I
always
wore
a
few
hats,
one
being
technical,
the
other
being
slightly
journalistic
and
generally
a
diy
er
in
the
spirit
of
the
sort
of
work
we
did
covering
open
source
generally.
So
for
that
reason,
I've
done
a
lot
of
experimenting.
I've
played
with
most
of
the
projects-
I
think
we're
talking
about
today,
but
ultimately
settled
on
what
was
most
comfortable
and
easiest
for
me,
though
they
all
absolutely
have
strengths.
C
A
D
D
D
D
For
example,
xdebug
just
works,
you
know,
php
cut
sniffer
runs
automatically
with
the
drupal
snips
you
need,
and
you
can
run
your
drupal
functional
js
tests
easily,
because
we've
installed
and
pre-configured
the
chrome
driver
for
you.
So
you
don't
have
to
really
it's
just
a
dev
environment
that
is
made
by
drupalists
for
drupalists,
and
it's
not
only
that
you
know
cloud
id
is
fully
disposable,
scalable
and
reproducible,
so
you
no
longer
run
into
any
kind
of
environment
disparity
at
all.
D
G
F
Started
working
on
drupal
vm
a
long
long
time
ago,
this
was
before
docker
was
even
a
glint
in
the
eyes
of
all
of
us
who
developed
locally
or
in
the
cloud,
and
I
still
maintain
it.
I
would
say
that
nowadays
it's
more
of
a
side
project.
I
don't
actually
actively
use
it
on
a
project
that
I'm
working
on
right
now,
but
I
do
still
use
it
for
a
couple
other
projects
and
for
some
other
local
development.
But
it's
kind
of
like
the
the.
A
H
Hello,
my
name
is
matthias
as
a
requirement,
I'm
the
best
from
architects
at
drop
solids
and
we
built
a
tool
ourselves.
As
in
three
years
ago,
we
tried
to
solve
some
issues
with
our
local
development
stacks
from
in
the
company,
so
yeah
what
what
is
launch,
but
actually
it's
a
docker-based
local
environment.
So
there
are
no
other
dependencies.
It's
completely
integrated
in
the
dropship
platform
ecosystem.
H
H
So
all
of
all
our
developers
struggle
to
do
that
to
get
your
php
phpstorm
and
nick
debug
working
both
on
cli,
it's
also
for
the
debugging
or
profiling
rush
which
hroff
so
yeah.
It's
actually
an
and
very
tailored
on
for
the
developers
in-house.
So
it
started
as
a
bad
project
because
for
my
own
sanity
I
had
to
have
something
better
than
recreating
my
own
stack
and
solving
issues
for
other
developers
breaking
their
stack
after
they
updated
some
local,
tooling.
So
yeah,
it's!
H
A
G
G
G
G
I
think
that's
very
exciting.
One
of
the
very
nice
things
about
lando
is
having
these
deep
integrations
with
these
hosting
providers.
So
if
you
get
something
you
get
your
local
development
environment,
but
it's
not
built
for
one
specific
provider.
It's
not
on
an
island.
It's
connected
to
sort
of
all
the
projects
that
you're
working
on
so
to
me,
that's
one
of
the
things
that
makes
it
a
little
bit
different
than
some
of
the
other
environments.
A
A
E
E
You
know,
starting
a
starting,
a
project
is
usually
like
20
seconds
got
great
fast.
Community
support
runs
the
same
on
every
platform.
It
runs
on
windows,
mac,
os,
linux
and
wsl2,
and
we'll
have
it
on
the
apple
m1.
As
soon
as
docker
is
ready
for
that,
you
can
run
a
whole
bunch
of
different
projects.
They
can
all
have
different
configuration,
it's
one
of
the
big
advantages
for
teams
and
for
and
for
diverse
projects.
So
you
can
have
one
project,
that's
still
on
php
5.6
and
another
one.
That's
on
php8.
E
E
We're
hoping
to
have
more
platform
integrations
and
user
customizable
platform
integrations
for
for
hosting
providers
in
the
next
next
round.
That's
the
most
ambitious
goal
for
the
next
version
of
ddev
is
the
ability
to
for
people
even
to
wrap
their
own
integration
for
their
own
private
hosting
environment,
as
well
as
making
it
easier
to
do
things
like
like.
A
Thank
you.
Thank
you.
That
was
very
enlightening,
so
I
I
want
to
kick
start
this
our
discussion
today
here
and
I
have
some
really
interesting
results
from
the
survey
that
jeff
did,
and
I
kind
of
wanted
to
share
this
with
with
with
you
all
so.
I'm
curious
that
lando
and
doxol
have
both
grown,
but
ddef
alone
has
jumped
up
four
spots
in
that
in
that
survey
that
was
done,
while
drupal
vm,
the
dev
desktop
vagrant
and
homebrew
have
all
shrinked.
F
Yeah,
it's
it's
a
trend
that
we've
we've
seen.
Let
me
meet
myself:
it's
a
trend
that
we've
seen
the
past
couple
years
in
in
general.
I
think
a
lot
of
developers
have
been
moving
from
a
vm
based
or
a
local
like
building
your
entire
local
environment
and
the
slide
just
went
away
from
me
there.
It
is,
and
they've
been
moving
towards
something
that's
docker
based
like
lando
or
just
plain
docker.
That's
what
I'm
using
right
now
for
my
personal
site
and
the
reason
why
a
lot
of
people
are
doing.
F
That
is
because
it's
easier
to
share
those
tools
between
members
of
a
team
and
it's
easier
nowadays
to
run
that
on
windows,
mac
and
linux,
without
any
real
ability.
Issues
and
virtual
machines
still
do
some
of
that.
But
it's
just
a
little
bit
the
layering
and
heavyweightness
of
it
is
a
little
higher.
So
I
think
that's
just
a
natural
progression
as
the
as
the
doctor-based
tools
have
gotten
so
much
better
and
so
much
easier
to
use
in
the
communities
around
them.
We've
grown
so
much,
but
I
think
that
that's
just
an
interesting
thing.
F
The
other
thing
is
with
drupal,
8
and
9.
Now
soon
in
the
next
couple
years,
drupal
10
coming
down
the
pike.
Everything
has
been
moving
towards
a
more
structured
environment,
and
so
you
need
some
of
those
tools
that
are
built
into
these
other
systems
like
lando
and
oxel
and
dev.
And
additionally,
with
your
development
environment.
You
would
want
to
use
a
tool
that
integrates
so
like
a
thing
like
cloud
ide
or
in
github
code
spaces
or
an
ide
like
phpstorm.
Those
have
also
been
growing.
E
You
know
you
know
the
one
thing
that
I'll
bet,
what
that's
really
interesting-
that's
happening
right
now,
maybe
even
kind
of
since
the
survey
is.
I
see
lots
of
people
jumping
over
to
windows
wsl2,
because
doctor
is
so
fantastic
there,
so
mac
os
has
had
a
stranglehold
on
developers
for
forever
and
all
of
a
sudden,
wsl
2
provides
both
the
linux
environment,
the
the
environment,
where
you
can
do
everything
you
expect
and
incredible
performance
and
people
are
just
going.
H
H
I
we
had
exactly
some
kind
of
situation
that
randy
talked
about,
so
a
devil
horse
due
to
corona
dynamically
wrote
home.
So
he
starts
using
his
his
his
windows
computer,
a
powerful
machine
to
start
developing.
He
made
its
work
with
or
launchpad.
He
made
it
work
with
wsl
and
he
didn't
open
his
mac
anymore.
It's
just
the
the
performance
improvement
you
have
just
by
being
on
vs
and
yeah,
like
randy
said
that
the
mac
mac
os,
I
o
issues
yeah.
It's
still.
It's
still
a
pain.
A
E
B
Yeah
thanks
so
dark
soul,
dark
soul
is
standard
about
building
less
tools
to
achieve
the
same
flexibility
that
basically
docker
compose
gives
you.
This
was
the
main
idea
behind
dark
soul
is
that
we
don't
want
to
invent
another
dialect,
because
whatever
we
would
do
would
be
more
limited
than
docker
compose
is
and
docker
compose
is
a
great
tool.
B
So
what
we
tried
to
build?
What
was
the
main
idea
behind
dark
soul
is
to
put
some
agreements,
some
conventions
behind
daca
compose
to
make
to
make
spinning
up
your
local
environment
easier
than
it
is
with
regular
docker
compose
and
also
make
it
cross
platform,
because,
with
docker
compose,
if
you
have
a
team
that
uses
different
operational
systems,
obviously
they
have
to
change
it
manually.
B
Well,
that's
the
main
things
that
we
wanted
to
solve
with
dark
soul
and
over
the
time
it
evolved
and
not
well,
it's
still
cross-platform.
This
is
the
the
main
idea,
that's
why
it
works
everywhere
and
we
have
been
developing
different
filesync
options,
because
we,
we
all
know
the
pain
of
syncing,
your
files
with
docker
and,
frankly,
this
is
the
main
hurdle
of
docker
on
desktops
and
docker.
As
a
local
developer
development
environment
at
all-
and
that's
that's
why
we
are
that's?
Why
we're
developing
like
keep
adding
those
options?
B
A
Okay,
thanks
alexi,
and
thanks
for
being
here
with
us
that
that
is
great,
we're
now
going
to
jump
to
q
a
sessions
if
people
in
the
in
the
organization
can
pull
pull
down
the
the
slide.
So
we
can
see
us
all
in
the
in
the
meeting.
That
would
be
great,
so
I
go
for
the
first
question,
which
is
a
very,
very
interesting
question.
A
F
E
Wants
to
ask
you
learn
from
each
other,
which
is
the
good
part.
The
bad
part
is
no.
We
don't
seem
to
have
any
synergy.
Everybody
has
their
it's
like
many
things.
Everybody
has
their
own
specialties
and
integrations
and
remember
that
a
lot
of
these
tools
aren't
just
drupal
tools.
So
they're,
you
know,
ddef
has
a
specialty
in
typo.
Three
lando
is
working
into
the
wordpress
space.
More
I
mean
d.
G
Yeah,
I
would
echo
that
for
sure
randy-
and
I
have
done
these
things
like
a
million
times
at
this
point.
I
know
that
him
and
I
don't
feel
like
lando
need
to
have
our
competitors
in
any
sort
of
way.
I
think
it's
easy
to
fall
into
the
trap
of
thinking
that
these
tools
are
the
same,
but
they're
built
for
different
reasons
and
for
different
audiences,
like
lando.
G
Only
like
20
of
lando
users
are
using
it
for
drupal,
so
drupal
is
like
a
small
segment
of
the
total
amount,
but
on
the
tool
consolidation
front,
this
is
actually
happening.
It's
just
not
with
the
people
who
are
on
stage
here.
You
know,
so
I
know
that
I
know
that
ddev
has
like
provided
itself
as
a
solution
for,
for,
I
think
typo
three,
for
example,
that
they're
not
making
their
own
thing
now
like
lando,
is
helped
build
pantheon's,
local
development,
dev,
environment
and
platforms,
local
dev
environment.
G
C
B
I
think
I
think
we
enrich
each
other
definitely
with
the
ideas
at
the
scene.
I
think
every
project
has
its
own.
How
do
you
call
it
raisin?
I
don't
know
that's
how
we
call
it
something,
something
very
special
about
the
project
that
you
love.
It's
like
a
car
right,
you,
you
choose
a
car,
because
technically
all
cars
are
the
same,
but.
B
A
E
Well,
the
the
answer
is:
use
wsl2
on
windows,
yeah
lando,
you
know,
dwev
works
great
there.
I
think
lando
works
great
there.
I'll
betcha
doxel
works
great
there.
So
the
answer
is
use
wsl-2
or
use
nfs.
I
think
that
all
the
tools
allow
nfs
the
performance
of
of
our
regular
windows.
Dev
with
nfs
is
adequate.
B
I
would
also
add
that
it's
it's
it's
very
hard
with
file
sharing.
It
degrades
performance
greatly,
and
that's
why,
like
in
daxol,
you
can
disconnect
your
your
use,
ducks
volumes
non
and
disconnect
container
completely
from
your
file
system,
I'm
pretty
sure
it's
possible
without
with
other
environments
and
guys
can
chime
in
on
that.
But
one
of
the
setups
I
would
recommend
for
someone
who
is
looking
for
the
top
performance
with
dark
soul
is
disconnect
that
use
dark
soul
volumes,
none
and
then
use
a
vs
code
server.
You
can.
B
H
Too,
we
we
try
to
just
locally
and
make
some
kind
of
hook
or
a
firewatch
locally,
very
simple
thing
or
just
unsafe
sync
it
to
your
the
docker
copy
to
your
image
and
it's
it's
insanely
fast
and
then
like
for
debugging
purposes.
You
want
to
just
have
debug
through
something
yeah
yeah.
All
the
data
is
in
your
container
and
then
in
the
container
itself
there
is
no
local.
I
o
anymore.
It's
yeah!
It's
it's
very,
very
fast.
Actually,.
E
B
G
I
would
I
would
echo
what
landi
what
randy
said.
Initially,
it's
like
a
first
thing
to
look
at,
which
is
is
regardless
of
what
tool
you
use
if
it's
a
docker-based
tool
like
moving
to
wsl,
that's
like
everyone
that
I've
talked
to
has
basically
expressed
a
night
and
day
sort
of
reactions
when
they
switch.
We
have
people
on
our
team
who
are
long-time
mac,
people
who
are
now
running
windows
as
their
dev
environment,
because
wsl
is
so
nice.
A
D
Yes
sure
so
I
answered
this
question
by
saying:
we
don't
need
to
think
about
local
dev
environments
only.
You
know
it
was
local
because
we
didn't
have
a
choice
before
now.
We
have
other
options.
You
know
you
don't
have
only
cloud
id,
you
have
got
spaces
from
github,
you
have
cloud9
and
several
diy
solutions
as
well.
D
So
the
idea
is
that
now
you
have
the
tools
and
the
file
systems
that
work
for
you
to
be
able
to
have
some
good
productivity
in
the
cloud
and
that
just
works
and
in
terms
of
vendor
lock-in,
it's
based
on
top
of
an
open
source,
ui
called
thea,
so
there's
no
lock-in
per
se.
The
only
lock-in
that
you
can
have
with
cloud
ide,
because
I
can
only
talk
about
this-
is
the
integration
with
the
cloud
platform
inside
factory,
which
is
obviously
some
custom
integration.
D
D
A
F
F
One
thing
that's
happened
in
the
past
two
or
three
years
is
almost
every
docker
image
that
I've
used
is
now
being
built
for
multiple
architectures,
so
you
can
run
it
on
intel
or
natively,
and
I
actually
yesterday
I
converted
two
of
my
images
I
have
like
15
or
so
left
to
do
nice,
but
it
took
like
10
minutes
now:
there's
open
source
tools
from
docker
like
buildex,
it
lets
you
make
it
so
it
can
run
on
the
m1
on
intel
chips
on
windows
and
everything.
Just
by
changing
a
couple
configuration
lines
and.
D
E
All
of
devs
containers
are
already
ready
with
arm
64
and
already
run
on
raspberry,
pi
and
other
arm
64
places,
but
docker
desktop
isn't
ready.
Yet
so
we'll
see
when
that
comes.
I
hope
it
comes
soon
and
we'll
see,
and
but
they
may
have
the
same
exact
problem
with
the
file
system,
which
has
been
the
problem
all
along
arm.
64
architecture
doesn't
solve.
H
H
Well,
actually,
I
think
all
the
like.
I
don't,
I
think
it's
randy
that
said
that
you're
all
docker
compose
orchestrators,
we
just
assemble
a
file
that
makes
something
work
with
containers.
We
provide
ourselves
with
some
other
configurations,
so
yeah,
I
think
double
compose
is
the
base
language
of
every
tool.
Yeah
docker-based,.
F
A
A
C
Used
that
I
I
can't
say,
I've
used
it.
I've
looked
at
it.
I've
read
some
documentation,
I
think
it's
you
know.
I
think
something
that
we
said
earlier,
that
each
each
one
of
these
tools
has
something
special
about
it.
There's
something
there's
a
reason
why
you
settle
on
one
thing
or
another
and
for
whatever
reason,
at
the
time
that
I
evaluated
it
didn't
have
a
special
thing
that
made
me
want
to
try
it
out.
E
B
C
A
E
On
the
they
released
on
linux,
they
released
the
20.09,
which
I
think
is
probably
what
we're
talking
about.
The
the
docker
desktop
versions,
bundle
docker
in
them
and
the
big
change,
I
think,
and
probably
what
they
released
is
that
docker
20.09
has
a
whole
bunch
of
nice
new
things
in
it,
and
I
gave
it
a
test,
drive
on
ubuntu
yesterday
and
didn't
encounter
any
trouble.
So
I
would
bet
that
that
all
of
the
docker
using
things
will
be
fine
with
that.
E
A
B
H
A
E
I
think
the
the
right,
the
the
easiest
answer
most
is
you
in
in
wsl
2,
you
just
run
the
code
command
and
it
launches
vs
code
on
windows,
and
that's
the
easiest
way
to
experience
that
I
think
there's
similar
things,
but
that
integration
is
absolutely
perfect.
So
you
just
type
in
in
wsl
2
you
just
type
code
dot
and
it'll
bring
up
the
current
checkout
in
vs
code
on
windows,.