DXdao DXdao Weekly Meeting, 15 Aug 2022

Previous Meeting Next Meeting

⏯

youtube image

►

From YouTube: dxdao on 2022 08 15 16 01

Description

00:04 Welcome
01:45 Nimi Incubation Discussion
43:02 Capitalize on current crypto environment

A

B

A

Oh um welcome to the dick style, biz dev call for monday august, 15 2022, um sorry uh on the agenda. Today we have, um we don't have any new membrane elections or we don't have any uh explorations, uh but we will, I think, um good, to sort of like focus. Most of the discussion to I guess, what's coming up is like the execution incubation, um so we're continuing the discussion with mimi. um How do we structure this deal?

A

How do we make this work and how do we uh like, starting with you, know having this being beneficial to both geek style and dynamic team uh and then like the way? I see it at least. Is that also incentivize additional teams either? um You know from inside the style and also external to the extel uh to also pursue like similar things and- and you know, deep style um yeah, I guess resources and and know-how uh in order to so yeah come out.

A

um Another topic to discuss is uh the increased focus uh uh on privacy, uh so these are sort of like uh coming up after the events of the past um couple of weeks. So how do we manage our messaging, uh our messaging uh uh messaging platform, video, twitter, uh presentations, etc um and under dx events? I think we have a few uh updates about uh infinite and bogota um and yeah um under yeah.

A

So that's that um I don't know anyone wants to take us away, maybe um dave if you want to update us some, like you know some of the stuff that has been happening in the forum or.

C

Sure I mean we actually made, uh I mean we're very professional team, as most of you are probably aware.

D

So we made a very.

C

Nice presentation about mimi, actually, if you guys want, I can share that.

A

Yeah, let's do it.

C

I just need to figure out how, because I have a new macbook and I've never done this before.

A

Oh, you have a mac. Won't you like a pc maximalist.

C

Yeah but like the new m chips are good. You.

E

Know we see your screen, it looks nice great. You can still see it. Yes, I like the surprise, I feel like a child at the moment. Well, there you go.

C

Itself, sorry, why is it moving by itself?

C

Okay, maybe this is better. Yes, no, so we just put a little presentation together, actually just in general, to give a bit of an overview of nimi uh overview of the team. Of course, you guys are pretty familiar with the whole team. uh Nei was actually some like. I think some of you guys know him sky knows him, maybe a couple of other people, but he's just very passionate about mimi and he's been like helping with the whole more growth and exposure stuff, so to speak um and um yeah.

C

um So I think, like we kind of like identified like three kind of like target audiences nimi wants to go after or like which nimi can serve with its product, uh which are one uh your regular users. So people who own an ens who just want to create like a customized version of their profile, hosted on their ens kind of like a very basic link, tree competitor right and then the two others are for once for one, the more creator style people so like nft, artists or musicians, etc.

C

Who actually want to sell some of their content um on on their page and can have like a somewhat more professional, mimi page, where you can perhaps even just buy content or like follow your uh favorite creators, etc directly on the nemi profile. And then the third one is more like organizations right so like dx val, for example, could have its own mimi page, uh which could just have like links to the most important resources, etc.

C

It's also very common among, like web 2 companies to put post their link tree into their twitter url bar right, and we also have like some really cool ideas around. Like uh organizations could like issue kind of like nfts on chain, proving that people actually work for the organization, etc, and so that's kind of like the three main profiles and target audience who are looking at and then one idea we actually really like with the whole like connection stuff, is actually having like these so social circles.

C

You know where you might want to share information with some people, but not others, so you might want to share all your content and contact details with your friends, but only some specific detail with like work colleagues or like the community at large and um yeah. So he, like you know if you want to share like your email address with your friends and community, but not between others. You know and that's kind of something we want to enable and the way we want to do that is actually with, like unchained friendships, so to speak.

C

uh So, where you know just imagine a pull-up today, you just scan it right and you get the power directly, but the only thing we add is kind of like an extra step where, like, if uh zed scans, my qr code, claiming my friendship, I actually have to accept it right.

C

So it's like very, very classic kind of, like friendship style request that it just has to be mutual right, and then we want to add a lot more gamification and like here's, where the whole circles come in as well, where based on different information or different stuff, you can like level up your friendship between people, so to speak.

C

So if you meet in real life or if you're, both part of certain communities etc or work on projects together, yeah, we want to add, like a whole gamification element to like the friendship you know and then based on all these friendships, you can actually create your kind of social circles, uh decide what information you want to share with whom and all of this kind of like data sharing stuff and um one one like thing we really want to do is just like aggregate.

C

A lot of the stuff that's out there, so you know there's a lot of cool stuff out there. Like pro apps, you know nfts uh your ens default content and what we really want to do is just connect that all together right so like that mimi can be like your page, uh where you can display your favorite stuff.

C

You can display your favorite nfts, sell them, and we just want to kind of aggregate that- and you know, rather than building out all these products ourselves like we're, not going to build our own ens marketplace or our own nft marketplace.

C

um But we had like some chats with some existing marketplaces and, for example, if we wanted to sell nfts, etc, we could just white label an existing solution, just use their contracts, but have it all go through the mimi profile page? You know, and I think for that the most important part is just like having users right like just the focus for nimi.

C

I think at the beginning should just try uh to be to on board as many users as possible, get them to set up their enemy page and uh just have a great new experience overall and that's kind of like, I think, where we right now see ourselves where we want to position uh nene uh kind of like be this entry point work for web free as well.

C

So of course, one thing we want to do is just compete on a very basic level, with what link tree has today and kind of get users onboarded that way, and then we can kind of push them more in the web, free direction and social. So we really see ourselves as like a really good entry point as well for moving new users from web 2 into web3 and kind of grasping into that.

C

Like social media play as well, that's kind of like there's a migration happening at the moment from web 2 to web3, and then we actually just pushed the release out with some really amazing new features.

C

The first one is actually gasless updates, so we now use ipns, which means that you only have to claim your nimi page once and then you can edit and add information completely for free anytime. You want- and this is really awesome because, as we build out more features in the future, um users will be able to just add them without having to pay gas costs all the time. So that's really awesome.

C

We also changed like our infrastructure for ipfs pinning. So we actually like deploys are like pretty much instant now well. In the past, you had to wait like 10 to up sometimes 20 30 minutes to actually see your website live, and we've completely migrated that and also looking to set up our own ipfs node for pinning and uh content directly ourselves, but it's pretty much instant now already.

C

So, if you check that out, it should be quite cool and then just some regular ui ux improvements and squashed a couple of bugs here and there and so make sure to go check it out. And then one thing of course we've been thinking about. A lot is, of course, as well. The like relationship between nini and dxdow, of course, there's been a lot of discussion going on on the forum as well, and uh so we came up with like two kind of just like ideas, which we would really like.

C

Your guys feedback on uh some feedback we got is that you know mimi should be more built under the external umbrella initially, and so we kind of like just came up with two different structures.

C

One of them would be the original one which we actually posted in the forum where most of the discussion has been happening upon for now, which was like 150k for like five percent of future equity or tokens, um and that would really just be a grant right so like that goes to the new multisig, and then uh the nemi contributors would like just cut their time. Dedication to dxdow and uh work on mimi, completely separately, and the second option we came up with was like a bit more kind of inspired.

C

I would say by the cow swap deal or although it's like very different uh would be more like 100k for like 10, so this would be more like to have some funds in enemy multisig to be able to move quickly as a young startup. You know if we have a opportunity to just not have to go through the governance process of the excel every time to like a eight-day process to get something paid, and then the team would still kind of build dx style on the dial.

C

So we'd, probably like just include it in our workout proposals and, of course the x-star would get a a much higher stake for that in nemi and yeah. That's pretty much what we came up with, not sure if you guys have any questions or feedback, would be great to hear what everyone thinks and.

C

Am I am I still on the call.

E

C

Yes, that would have been fun if I dropped off and gave the whole presentation.

A

That was uh yeah. That was great um like super, like I like the vision personally, and I think this is like very interesting and yeah. I think thanks a lot for um sort of coming up like waiting and coming up with like uh um yeah a way to make this. uh I guess like two different paths to proceed, and I think yeah we'd like to hear like some of what. What what are the other people on the call thinking.

E

I I like the vision for the product. uh It's promising. I, like the new design, it's very um engaging.

E

In terms of the like, the the crux of everything is like: how do we move forward and- and the last slide I feel like there- isn't much of an option um with the given options, because the the second one uh begs the question like if we were to build nene under uh dx, dao and kind of like buy it out in a way like buy a certain equity from from the team that um uh came up with the idea, which is totally fine and rightful.

E

It begs the question when, when carrot launches a token, do we need to like uh does dx dao have to uh pay federico for equity from karat tokens? So I'm not saying this as as, if there's any issue, I'm saying it's not much of a choice between the two, I think it's pretty much.

E

The the first one and and in terms of the first one um you've provided clarity about how you wish to proceed with um like developing it by reducing the amount of time you spent like working for dx now and- and that would pretty much be.

E

Something to to work on.

A

F

A

Fully agree that you can't yeah the first version. Yes, sorry chris, I.

G

Was supposed to try the same thing as yours like nathan? I guess I don't understand you just kind of said. The second one is not an option, but you didn't really say why.

E

I mean because it it says uh the dao would get 10 percent if they paid nimi 100 000 dollars and it will be developed on the dx dial, but that's pretty much what we're doing with carrot. So it almost begs the question: do we need to pay federico for for building carrot outside of him getting paid? As a contributor like for the almost like for the ip I mean.

H

We didn't build nimi.

H

And then asked right, so it's the other way around we're asking to do that.

H

I would, I would maybe argue if you contribute poor leaks now and have put up the task, and it has carrot and nothing, maybe that that could have been said during your proposal.

H

Proposals right um but yeah, maybe like I, I think from from this perspective. I think we should look at this. From from the incubation perspective, whatever we're gonna do to incubate nimi, it's gonna be looked at an incubation of an external product versus internal products with I wouldn't compare this to swapper, oh man or or even carrot, because they are actively being uh at inside. Of these now already.

C

Yeah- and I think one of the long-term goals of the whole incubation is that dx dao is not the only one footing the bill for these projects right, that's like uh after you know, I don't know five six months. The project can actually go out and raise external funds right. So then, you also kind of have to prove the product to the market, and the excel, of course, is completely open and has a possibility to invest as well at whatever those terms will be in the future right.

C

But I think, like that's a big thing, that you have access to outside capital investment and specifically in the case of nimi, I think, like we also planning to like perhaps release a mobile app and like if you want to sell nfps and stuff, you also need a company where, like it's not fully decentralized, also it's like very difficult to do some of these things. You know like. Sometimes you need a little entity and stuff, but um yeah curious to hear other thoughts.

F

So so is the main difference between the options that, in this second option uh dx, I would be paying full salaries during the you know, some number of months until outside funding is set.

C

Yeah for like I guess the deal would still be like that we still only work on it two days a week, though right so like we would still like do our regular responsibilities, but I think it's also open. You know like we that's what we wanted to discuss here. Yeah.

G

Yeah I I guess I think that whatever that specific is if it's two days and if it's two days for three months or five months, I think like that commitment is kind of like just as important as the ten percent or whatever the 100k payment is because, like that to deke style is kind of like an investment of resources right. So if it's five months for two days a week of the five team members there, I don't.

G

That would be something like a hundred thousand dollars that geeks, that would be investing in nemi product development, obviously would be doing it through worker proposals and through salaries that that people are paid through for other products, um but like I'm kind of looking at as the all-in-one cost to de-excel.

A

Yeah, I guess um like without like diving into the numbers, and you know how much the salaries or you know, four contributors for three days a week looks like without sort of like analyzing, that um I personally, like the idea of you, know the team of nami continuing to have some responsibilities with it within dxdow, while developing nimi and then when the time is right, you know they can spin out um fully raise some external funds and then you know sort of like spread their wings and fly and still be sort of like under the umbrella of the exo, and maybe also you know, still be a part of.

A

I don't know the general dxo team. Like I mean I think, I'm representing here something that's uh I don't know, maybe like a bit utopian quote: unquote but uh yeah. Maybe it's viable.

F

Do you guys uh have some idea, and I don't think you need to know now per se, but like would the plan be that some number of the team goes full-time like when raising money is that is that sort of like the idea going forward.

C

Yeah, I would I guess that would also be a requirement right once you raise like from traditional vc firms, uh you have like uh people going full time. um I I think yeah. I think it's difficult to say now. Like I mean I would personally love to stay involved at dx now, even if it's just 10 or 20 of my time and it's unpaid, you know uh like there's just some stuff right now, which I definitely want to keep working on.

C

But I, if we, if we do raise, let's say in six months, like 10 million, I would expect that a couple will probably go full time and I think, like that, transition like we obviously want it to be a natural and good transition right. We don't if we raise we're not just going to quit from one day to the next, um but yeah. That's definitely something to keep in mind. Yeah.

F

Yeah I mean I think the outside raise is like an important goal, and I and I would expect vcs to want people to be full-time, so yeah. I think it's just just good to know that that's kind of like part of the thinking again like I don't think it has to be like all figured out yeah, and I mean I think it should be fluid to even like if it ever like, doesn't work out like you guys can like work for it's not like you've left the exterior forever or anything like that right. So.

C

Yeah I mean I actually think like it's difficult for nimi to fail in a way like it's already like people already love, it's like a decentralized link tree right and like maybe, if it doesn't get the commercial traction we expect. I think it would still be awesome to keep it live under the dexter umbrella. As like your decentralized link tree right, like in in the worst case scenario, you know, if, like we don't gain traction or anything, I think it's like an awesome way to also just funnel attention to the extar and stuff.

C

You know like put some use to your ens and stuff, but um yeah definitely agree. The investment like the raise is going to be a big thing. Yeah and like we also just to be clear on the call like we also already received some investment uh interest, uh mostly around, like the five to seven million valuation um area, but um first of all, we wanted to kind of do a deal with dxtile. First, second of all, the investments are like informal, I would say so.

C

They're, like you know, we we didn't receive a any documents to sign. Et cetera, I mean we don't even have a legal entity, so some of them asked us to go, set up a legal entity in singapore to start the process, but so there's already some interest, I would say- and I think like if we have some time to work on it- and you know like get the help from the excel and the resources. I think we can also raise at a much higher valuation down the line.

C

You know- and I think that's kind of the main goal here right and then, of course, with dx style owning a larger stake in nimi. It's also incentivized for mimi to do a good race and uh yeah build awesome, stuff.

F

E

C

F

Of the talking points in the the forum, or at least some discussions was the keeping the terms private um at this point in time, and I was actually just thinking about that a bit this morning and I feel like there should be a way for diesel to achieve this, and I think one way we can maybe do it is to have a document uh that gets shared amongst contributors, but then is um is not made public, it could just be hashed, and then the hash could be part of the proposal.

F

uh But, like is distributed to enough like rep holding contributors. I think that could maybe achieve the you know the necessary, like trust or whatever, to to have terms, but but still keep it private.

C

Yeah, I I I don't know I don't. I mean I'm just speaking on my own behalf here, but I think if like it's on the second, if we, if the dao side's like the second option, is like more or more better or whatever, I think then disclosing the deal is also not so much of a deal because we're kind of building it under the dxtel umbrella. Right and like I guess people can see the transfer of money but yeah. I I don't know I think in the second case, it's less important to keep the details.

C

Private, I don't know, that's just my idea.

F

Yeah that kind of makes sense to me, and but I would also think maybe the second deal it becomes, it becomes less attractive to outside money would be my guess, though, I'm not like certain of that.

A

I I I don't think so, like I don't see a reason for like, as I said, in the forums, I don't see a reason for the deal to be private and I don't think this will be a deterrent from like future. Investors like dick's now is incubating this um or whatever incubating helping, and you know from this point till the point of the race. I think there will be some progress. There will be more traction and that will warrant like a higher valuation um yeah. Basically for the next round. I guess.

C

Yeah- and I think you can- I think it's very justifiable as well because like we were, we attended the hackathon. We were all the external hackers right, the five people on the team, so I think like it's should be easy to justify in the future. Why uh we we did it. I would think so yeah, but I don't know.

A

Yeah so uh I have to drop but um yeah, listen to the rest of the call and yeah nathan or a sky. If you want to take over.

E

Sure man uh make sure you mention dxdawa to talk.

A

Oh I'm wearing the dxdow decentralized shirt. Obviously,.

E

H

I actually have a comment- and maybe it's not fair to say this, but I think from nemi's perspective. We it's gone almost almost four months since the hackathon and obviously we could have moved a bit further with the product and a lot of stuff. We are doing, and I want this to move forward. So nimmy can we move forward and- and I think the discussions are necessary, but maybe we could keep.

H

I don't know like more focused discussions and try to solve stuff and uh and think about like moving forward instead of finding like the perfect solution, I think moving forward and and if some things are unknown, maybe we can keep that in in in the whatever yeah, whatever agreement we go, go through and and try to solve stuff uh during the time and and obviously if maybe we could even do like a single proposal um about how things can go. uh We the contributors are not necessarily all the rep holders right.

H

So so, whatever we think and whatever we agree on, is it's not like uh the the on-chain agreement, uh but I want to move as soon as possible. So we could so we could start working on on nimi.

H

I'll, be honest with you guys, it's it's a lot happening on the style and a lot of on the product and, uh like last last week I was I couldn't work on email. It was too much and and- and it's probably going to be- that for a while right, we have a lot a lot to work on and I think we we need to some.

H

Do some resource planning.

E

I mean that's a really tough question uh for, for the whole dial to solve it. It's basically kind of like a the the protocol for future product development. It because if we take the hackathon aside, uh any any gx style contributor at any point can come up with a product idea and they own that idea, like you, guys, built this product and you own it it's yours like dxdo, has no claim on it.

E

But, like say, say, someone came up with a new idea for for a new product over the weekend and they presented it to dx dao. That's basically the kind of question we are trying to figure out at the moment. It's not really about nimi. It's it's more of a high level question! What if someone within dxdow comes up with a product idea, do they spin off? Take it private?

E

Do they share it with the dow and like it's more of a personal question and like I don't think it's that much for the doubt to decide, then then the people themselves to to have a clear idea and it seems like you're, asking the dao, but I mean what what do you guys want? What's what's best for you and it's I'm not saying it as if it's an issue, I think we're all cool, just like. What's in your heart, like which scenario would make you happier and and help you build this product, I mean.

H

From my perspective, I I wanna stay at the style. uh In reality, uh niimi needs full-time attention. uh The best scenario would be a a hybrid right. uh Deke style owns a large enough part to care about nimi.

H

The people I work with can work with nimi without being an issue. I have people dming me asking me how they could help with nimi, and I'm super happy about that. But at the same time the style has has a lot to work on.

H

We can't just leave swapper and all of that stuff, so I I have a responsibility to to to deliver the the roadmap I I given so from my perspective in a hybrid, we're can work with both but at the same time also get the help and resources from the style, because I think we we've grown into like a good good network of people that could help out on the stuff. um So something where both wins uh is is the best scenario.

H

And also like, if you asked me when I started the style like what do you want to do like I, I didn't know exactly what I wanted to do at the style and swapper was there and- and I I took took over responsibilities of swap, I mean swapper didn't exist at all. It was a forum post and uh I mean yeah here we are like swapper is not my product. I have a responsibility of it, but it's not my product right.

H

um If someone, someone has better ideas than me or want to drive the initiative forward, they're free to do it, it's not my product, but I I feel like it is still my product and my responsibility to to make it successful, and so that's that's where the hybrid thought is in and and if there's a period where I need to like move away from from my position, then then we need to find a a good enough person to take over my responsibilities. I mean we're lucky at swapper.

H

We actually have two people doing like project management and product ownership, and so so it's not a huge deal if, if from from the project management perspective, we have venky, but uh there's there needs to be someone that that can take over product design and and and some of the other stuff.

H

um So from swapper perspective. Losing that is is not a great thing losing adam. It's not the great thing. I think the style should didn't be reliable, like dependent on people like this, uh so forget about us as people. Just we shouldn't have like weak links. If someone quits or someone yeah, I mean this, is that say but dies or whatever it shouldn't like fall fall apart, so we should be. We should be a little bit scalable in that sense, uh and I'm ready to help out on that stuff.

F

But I think the framing is good here right like up to 40 percent. It gives a few months to figure it out right, and I think you know you milan adam. That's a big chunk of the swapper team. Obviously, but I think you guys, you know it's kind of up to you to like make it a good transition, and I think you kind of already have the trust of the external work on that.

F

So it's sort of, I think it all makes sense so, like I think one of your original points is like it'd be better. If we could do this quicker right, and so I mean uh other than like finding a way to kind of like specify the terms I sort of feel like it's ready to go once you pick an option.

H

I mean the important thing is I mean just if we go back in time, maybe and and if the dow goes through another nimi. I think the dao should be quicker on on. Like I know, dao is not an entity, but us people active. We should be quicker on deciding this kind of stuff. Like we let almost four months four months go, we had a lot of hype.

H

We still do have a lot of hype, but I think um if, if let's say, an external team has nothing to do with the style, comes to us and say hey guys. We really like we really like. You would like to be incubated like we need to be much much faster than that.

H

um So from that perspective, like we, I in my mind we lost four months of that time, and obviously this is the first time we do it and- and I I expect it to take much much longer time, but I think yeah we should we should try to form whatever we are doing here so so the next time this happens. We we're a little bit quicker on this.

D

So uh yeah, I think the key here is to like push it along to see if this see where this thing moves and if there are certain people that want to dedicate part of their time outside of dick style towards this.

D

I think it makes sense for dick stout to be to support it because it originated from within the ecosystem, and it needs some money to hire some people to work on it to to go, hire other people to to contribute things to the product and, like three months six months from now, I think you'll see you'll, see where the product is the traction. That's gaining and you'll see how people are working with it. How new people are working with it?

D

How current people are working with it, how those people are also working on existing dx style things and you and then dx dab will be able to make another decision, and the me team will be able to make another decision in in like a bunch of months. But right now, yeah, like I like zed just said like four months of it was hot when it came out like it would have been great to like push it along faster from the start, and now it's four months later, so we need to catch up. Basically.

E

Yeah I mean I, I don't think that the dow has done anything wrong at the end of the day. It comes to a personal decision here and, like um I mean.

G

E

It if we were still in a bull market, this wouldn't would not have been an issue at all like let's hire people, let's invest, let's build it. Let's incubate it. Let's help the team, but now we're like in a way struggling with figuring out what our runway is. Where money is invested um and yeah, I I think it actually is something good, because we are in a way diversifying the roadmap.

E

The the swapper squad is delivering, but the product doesn't have a clear roadmap of revenue generation at the moment, and the expenditure incurred uh from developing swapper is big. So if we could diversify that into a product that has a clear idea of how to bring in revenue, maybe it's a good thing, but but worst case scenario. We could have spending money on two products that don't bring revenue and then um swapper has less people working on it, and then we have this new product.

E

So I don't know like whether the team is capable because it it takes a lot. Is it possible realistically to work on two products like if, if we have to like, we should find people who who would substitute those people and let those people stay within the external but work full time on nemi if they have to.

E

Because the equity on one hand, is an investment, that's clear. It's an exchange of um stable coins against uh tokens from from the new protocol from the new product.

E

But then, if say another six months down, the line people have been working for the dow and working on like fifty percent on one pro product 50 on another product, like that is still an investment from the dow on that new product and say if, if four or five people are working for half a year on this product and and half of what that they're, getting paid for being a part of dxdo goes to that product. That is also gx tower investing on the in the product and and like there's no equity for that right.

E

A

E

A problem like uh guys.

C

Exactly why the equity is higher in the second option, though, right like it's not higher, because yeah.

E

Yeah but like what's the timeline like when, when do we kind of like how what's the runway you're giving yourself for it like? Is it a quarter half a year one year and and again I'm not saying it as someone like um attacking or being negative or not liking? What's happened? I actually like what's happening, I'm I'm optimistic, I'm just playing the devil's advocate and asking those questions that just need to be asked. I I'm not being negative.

C

Yeah, for sure I mean I think there are first of all quite a few people working part-time at dx style, and I I don't think that makes that that makes them not capable of delivering if they're working part-time. That's just what I think and um yeah I mean I'm definitely happy to share more details, and I think you know that should be part of the doc to go around. I I actually think, like you know, if from I don't know, if the way you described it seemed like we're.

C

Spending monies on products that are not making any revenue, and maybe like doubling down on those is maybe not the right decision either. Maybe like trying something new is could be a good way and like even outside of nimi. I think the incubation program could be really cool, even if the dao decides neemi shouldn't get one for whatever reason I think, like dx biz should still pursue the opportunity and look to incubate other products and kind of like grow the umbrella like that, because, in my opinion, it gives you a much wider exposure to projects.

C

Of course, the idea is like in any vc you you invest in 100 projects and hope that one or two make it you know, and but the great thing is that these projects have access to outside capital right like if you look at swapper carrot or uh dxgov, it would be very, very difficult for them to justify getting a raise outside of the dow right, and I think that's the main differentiator right that these products are not just going to stay kind of on the dow bankroll forever, but they have the opportunity to go out and get more like commercialized raise some money, etc.

C

But that's just my point of view and I respect your point of view as well.

F

I do think the question on the timeline for the second option makes sense right just because there's like a commitment to pay people to work on mimi there do you guys already have an idea of the of the timeline for that.

C

I mean yeah, I would roughly say half a year to be honest, like you know enough time to build up a product and then one two months of fundraising yeah, but it's off the top of my head. I'm like I don't know what the other guys think.

H

I would say six months: it's a good transition period also for for for us to um yeah for for for us with responsibilities uh at swapper and other parts to to transition also, but uh I mean there is um as an example. um Obviously the incubation model- I I I mean why would an external product would be interested to to to be incubated by these, though? It's also because of like what we have internally.

H

If we have people interested in in helping out that the uh nimi, obviously nimi nimi, would would need a lot of help like let's say on on community side, with with keenan and disco, like we're already struggling with small, and I don't want to put more on on kenan, but but there's some smaller stuff that we we learned during the time and then we would love having like.

H

I would say, like for six months, seeing this as an internal product until we can stand on our own feeds, so basically a quicker model of of what carpet called. It is how I see it.

H

You want to say something.

B

No, I just try to type bring it baby in the chat, and I thought b is the hotkey to raise your hand- maybe not I don't know how I did it, but just uh agreeing to that bring it baby.

B

H

Well, yeah, I mean some some time time times. We could have some estimation on time and and what happens after that time? Obviously, when dose is built, cow protocol or gnostic protocol v1 and then v2, they probably didn't think it would be its own product. uh That's why it?

H

I can't imagine how many millions it cost to build that and then they only got five percent right. Maybe in my mind, that's not fair, but that's how they did it with like two products. um I don't know how deex style would have done this.

H

Let's say if if swapper would have yeah, I mean we already gave token allocation, but let's say carrot: if if careful would become its own product um uh but yeah, let's not go into more discussion, so yeah some time frame, and then uh I'm I'm happy to have a more like focused discussion on that.

E

All right good um on to the next topic, but it seems like we should all be chiming in in in on the forum on dow talk in key base. Trying to help the nimi team get a better picture of what the feedback from the community is. So they could come up with an unchained proposal and move forward.

E

Next on the agenda, how do we write the wave of what's happening recently? You know, after tornado and uh different product front ends um using trm labs to deny access to certain uh addresses that are associated with addresses, who are sanctioned.

E

What is the best way? Maybe kingdom could chime in here twitter threads, individual people, interacting with other individuals on twitter, uh doing a special on the central on the what was the name of the operation decentralization, maybe a special on privacy posts.

B

So can you just repeat the the top of the topic here.

E

Basically, how do we increase focus on how dxdow has approached privacy in building its products so that we kind of like highlight and leverage what we've done in this particular time that we actually stand out as a as a role model in a way.

B

Yeah 100 we're talking uh through twitter threads, of course, uh and speaking on a couple different uh external community calls this week. Even but most importantly, I think operation decentralization should be starting this week, this thursday still waiting for a confirmation from alex from cow.

B

But if that's the case, it's going to be a really good avenue to talk about what we're doing uh why it's important and kind of reflecting on the broader market conditions- and you know, what's going on everywhere, um some more on that, uh hopefully today uh for an announcement just waiting on uh alex right now.

D

um What about like people?

D

The best way to share stuff, often is like a has been like a short video and we we had a very long video on swapper, and there was talk that we could break it up into pieces, and one of those pieces would be like why swapper is you know, private and how you can use swapper to, for example, trade on uniswap protocol in a private way or cow protocol in a private way.

D

Is it pos like? Do we think that it would be worth spending time to make a video that explains that a shorter one that is of the right quality that we could share around.

E

I mean it, it seems like now that we have uh zed split between uh nimi and swapper. We we got dirk but he's already um working on carrots, gx, gov um and infinite.

C

B

E

We we're short on.

H

um Turk, turk, isn't like exclusively working on carrot. uh He has a broad responsibility of all products that include swapper and, and we do have uh boris dirk on like the design side and and it's a lucky- I'm a hybrid. So I'm a designer too. So I could help on that. I'm not split, there's nothing approved yet and and I'm still 100 I've been 100 all the time.

I

I think it's totally possible to create a swapper video. We just need to know what we want to say how long it should be and what kind of budget we have for this kind of video.

I

That's for me kind of one of the crucial most crucial things.

I

Because quality motion and graphic design cost costs costs a lot of money and it's a matter of cost for gains more or less yeah.

D

But I think the most important thing to like potentially kick off. That idea would be like a script, for example, for the video of what we want to say in that video, because we can, we can create that that's the best place to start. We have a lot of that already. Just we could. We can narrow it down and put it into a proper script format. It would be relevant topic. I think.

I

Maybe maybe just one step before that would be an idea who we want to target with the video uh where it should be kind of located or hosted, or is it just for twitter and so on. So on, like a strategical approach to what this video is for, I think then we would have an idea how much money we should put on a video or spend and and then we can make a script. That uh kind of um is good for for the audience and for for the reason we we do. The video.

B

Yeah- and I have kind of been doing this exact thing for carrot uh side of things last week as dirk you likely are very familiar with. um So if we want to expedite this, I can kind of put together that plan of where we want to target why we want to target it and then maybe even moving into a script and kind of juxtaposing that against the budget. I think that's, probably the next steps, and if we want to expedite I can do that. I could probably fit that in today.

D

Yeah I mean overall the the main idea that we've been some of us have been talking about is just like with this topic so relevant right now um and the question is: how long can we does it take to make something like this, but having yeah videos?

D

Often the best way to share like we were people are tweeting out like oh well, you can use swapper for this like if you can't use unit swap you can use swapper and there's yeah people go to swapper, but if you go to swapper it's not very cl, it doesn't explain why you can use swapper for that. So a video sharing a video would seem like the easiest way to quickly convey that message to people in the space that are thinking about this topic.

G

Yeah, I think this is obviously extremely relevant right now, but I also think this is going to be extremely relevant in six months too.

G

So I think this is something that, like we kind of always talked about swapper, like leaning into this, and so I think we should both be thinking about how to capitalize on this specific moment, but also know that this is probably going to be a really important part of like swapper going swappers brand and identity going forward, and I really think like privacy is not something that I think you see right now on the swapper brand or on the swapper site and I think figuring out how to get that integrated into the brand again like a long-term thing.

G

Not gonna happen immediately in the next couple weeks, but I think that's yeah and we could be working towards that through this video too.

H

Yeah definitely I actually wanted to bring this up during tomorrow's call on dx voice uh to plan a campaign where it includes uh some redesign on the web apps on the landing page and maybe even include something inside of the dap that tells the user like hey you're, enjoying like uh 100 privacy and, like we tell the user, but I think we need to do that because we we only fork like unit swap it looks like the like use.

H

It looks like like any amm, and we can't trust that that someone will actually go look at at a video or read a blog post. I think it needs to be like a whole campaign will push on like three four places at the same time. So I'm thinking about the dap, the landing page, uh the communication on twitter, uh maybe a blog post and and we'll do do it as a campaign and then to extend that we could do like a video for later on.

H

I think a good video takes time and we could like make a like a video series where it's like it doesn't need to be like three four minutes video. It could be like short short sequences and then we'll do like a a longer video from that short sequences.

H

uh Something like that uh and uh yeah and anything is possible during this campaign. If we think, let's say the name, swapper is maybe not good enough for what we are doing anymore, because we're doing bridging multi-shane we're doing more than just swaps uh like if a rebrand would make our case stronger. Then then, I'm happy with that, but yeah. I think we should explore what we can do and push for a campaign.

B

Cool I'm gonna hold off on next steps. Today, uh let's chat this a little deeper tomorrow on dx voice, uh and then we can kind of move from there. Rail study, maybe.

B

We need to do something with the mix study, but this isn't the product strategy, so I won't act too different to that.

E

All right good, we kind of at the top of the hour. I don't know whether we could move into the next topic. Probably not. um Maybe it's something to move on to the uh dx voice call tomorrow uh regarding infinite bogota, so thanks everyone for attending today's call again, uh there are important topics to discuss, try and be active on dow talk in key base. It helps everyone, knowing what the hive mind, thinks cheers.

B

Thanks everyone, bye-bye.