Ethereum Cat Herders PEEPanEIP, 30 Jan 2023

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From YouTube: PEEPanEIP #98: EIP-5528: Refundable Fungible Token with Jerry Li

Description

Topics covered
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0:58 - Guests introduction
1:29 - Presentation
1:47 - Problem statement
2:32 - Idea
3:55 - EIP-5528 Specs
4:44 - Use Cases
7:11 - Six Core Functions
7:57 - Method
8:57 - An example
9:59 - Escrow Flow Diagram
10:52 - Why do we need EIP-5528 as a standard?
18:19 - Implementations in real-world (a demo)
19:25 - Difference between the contract for the escrow process
20:30 - Security consideration for project implementers
22:10 - Success stories
24:30 - ETHDenver session announcement
25:15 - A message to the community

Resources:
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EIP-5528 - https://eips.ethereum.org/EIPS/eip-5528

Discussion - https://ethereum-magicians.org/t/eip-5528-refundable-token-standard/10494

PEEPanEIP - https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4cwHXAawZxqu0PKKyMzG_3BJV_xZTi1F

ERC Playlist - https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4cwHXAawZxqXee9EMQDIEz2CslTnsW0K

Questions for Guests - https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdsmujnH_ncIlSEJ23s9jzXAKwfpTGNeJqjREWPloBbkJVQTA/viewform

Check out upcoming EIPs in Peep an EIP series at https://github.com/ethereum-cat-herders/PM/projects/2

Follow at Twitter
Jerry @sto_eth | Pooja Ranjan @poojaranjan19

Client Diversity Survey - http://tiny.cc/ECHsurvey

Contact Ethereum Cat Herders
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A

Eap20 provided a token standard to the ecosystem and application. Devs are now looking for better use cases alongside suggesting extension to the existing standard. If you want to learn about the first ethereum escrow standard, continuous name.

A

Welcome to p penny episode, 98 I'm Puja ranjan here with an interesting ethereum standard for decentralized project. Today we will learn about eip5528, refundable, fungible token. Eab 5528 is a standard track proposal of ERC category. It was proposed in August 2022 and is in the final status to provide an overview of The Proposal. We are joined by the author, Jerry and David from the team. Thank you both for joining us today.

B

Thank you so much Pooja, very great opportunities, very honored to be here sharing our latest work about the EIP 5x28 add-on group, standard VIP built on the EIP uh 20. um and so David. uh So it's by uh Tech lead and he's uh what do introductions of the EIP 5x28 today, thanks.

C

For inviting us having us for this great opportunities, uh EIP 520a is a fund of fundable token. The problem is currently the crypto character of the crypto. Decentralized architecture has no automatic recourse of the Recovery Fund that has already has been paid, so I've been working. The fintech industry a long time also Jerry also worked for funding part and a lot of financial part too.

C

So typical Fiat industry, there's a lot of hierarchy of the whole ecosystem of the art in industrial has been deployed and designed with a you know the protected fraud and Etc, but it is very centralized one and multi-level centralized architecture, but decentralized Services. It is from the from the burst. It is a totally all. Decentral architecture is difficult to deliver those the automatically courses for the cases already paid. So we designed this architecture and trying to solve a very simple way to stop problem and definition and idea is in the traditional Finance industry. We've.

C

We really work hard and find out how we can solve this problem in over the given the architecture of decentralized ethereum bases, the the structures. So so there is a we found. The Escrow Services, which in cases you buy the houses, you pay the money and there's a all the legal stuff of the houses and put into the Escrow Services as crop, so each other part is conditioned and one condition is met. Then the ownership is is transferred to the other side.

C

So in crypto stock crypto world, we we believe we can reflect very similar flow, but only problem is there cannot be. Any third party can be as a judge positions, so smart contracts should be automatically working between the transaction. So one side is uh the the money which is a usdt or ethereum. The other side is a digital asset.

C

It could be the sto or stocks and other the assets should be put into the escrow account and then a scroll account worked by the autonomously through the smart contract basis and make a or transaction succeed or failure cases they judges. So that's the basic idea we're trying to make it and and that's the idea we adopted so so. This is a eip-5528 specification. There's a two part: one is a payable contract, so cellular buyer have, to you know, send their tokens. One is equal. One could be the the the the pi value.

C

um The the embedded token, which is uh Bitcoin usdt, is actually the other one could be the the digital asset token, so they have a the token should be funded. The escrow contract, which is a payable contract specification. Another one is the escrow contract. Sql contract is defined. So if each side of the condition is made of fair is given the pre, the defined and mutually agreed the the definition. So that's the SQL conscious works so use cases Jerry.

C

Can you introduce our use cases how where you are started and what were the use cases for this.

B

Yeah sure um so the first use cases we're applying for electrical work with third-party A launch plan crowdfunding platform. um Is we um adding this EIP pharmaceuticali Escrow Services uh to the retail ambassadors? uh One major reason is we found that the retail investors tend to be very vulnerable when they investing um through icos, Ido or different kind of uh or like instruments of investment, and we use we I should work with chain link. We connect Oracle with the escrow contract and we're monetizing.

B

The secondary market prices, the token prices, so once the tokens or the projects, uh rug or fuzz or the token prices are going to kind of go to zeros or scam or extremely you know, kind of like bad actor happen on the escrow contract, automatically releasing the refund to all the retail investors, and we are working on this deal for quite a long time and we're expecting to launch this product uh q1 20, 20 23. Yes,.

C

Yeah, so so this will be. This can be used every any, the transaction which is between the buyer and sellers and senders and receivers Etc, because it's a basically escrow concept basis architecture, so it could be used. The crowdfunding Venture Capital Venture Capital. Sometimes they triggered some conditions. Okay, I put the money. Once you achieve this goal during this period, Then your money will automatically has been transferred, so that could be the escort like Venture Trend, Capital transaction and investment transaction, even small investment, small medium business investment.

C

They have a meet each other's okay, I put the money here, you put your asset there and and just make a fungible. The the non-fungible transaction through the Escrow Services, so sort of thing is the main concept, so this can be used in any kind of Commerce and transactions in between the two parties and here's. The six core functions that that is most. This slide is more like a payable part, so we inherit the eip-20 for payable contract.

C

So all of this component is from the payable contract uh for the contract coming from the eip1, the 20.. So that's why you would ask the question: is under the eip-20, so all the components and issues like security to everything is that we have the same situation and same characters. We have it, but escrow contract is a different.

C

So, as close contract is a is a user have to build it through the guider and we made it depends on to the there the demand, so they have to take care of the most of the whole issues by themselves. So this is a main method. One is a construct Constructors. This is a detailed escrow policies.

C

Etc each parties Etc, so that is that will be defined with a Constructor method and on otherwise an ethical fund, so fund should be sent uh with the under given conditions and refund refund case is automatically triggered when condition is not met. So some money does not deposit in certain period or some asset is not. You know, meta condition they predefined. So then there's a refund the process will be triggered and as for withdrawal, withdrawal is all canceled.

C

I have three different process trigger that can do the withdrawal each side, so so this is a very so yeah. This is a very basic flow and basic method. We designed, and not only we designed uh this protocols but we're trying to have apply this one into the real world.

C

So this one is a actual investment campaign, Cloud funding service platform, so we trying to spend our time to adopt our services if that is a feasible and acceptable to the actual user side, so we made issuers and issues and they made us set up the conditions and launched the campaign, and this is a defundable campaign. That means any user can invest a certain asset, the owner, the the ownership acquisition or some buying something and any investment transaction. They can do the investment.

C

During this period they always can get the refundable uh average cases has been set up as a refundable campaign cases, so this is a whole automatic process. Can they can design it? So this is the one we made it and other things we designed whole actual service flow, how to apply so. This will show how the whole services will work through the actual the service platforms user cases.

C

So this is a 520 as Pro, simple flow, so cellular bio, deposit and there's a condition and finally transactions. Okay,.

A

Thank you, so much I mean I, really loved the last two slides that they overflow of the process that you have shared um I hope this presentation will inspire some of the D5 projects to like future D5 projects uh uh developers to implement them in their project. I have a few questions uh related to um this proposal.

A

Instead of building a standalone project uh with the extension that is being proposed here, it was proposed as an EIP to make a standard for ethereum repository I know many people are convinced that it should be there, but there are few people who may not be fully aware of it. So why do you think we need 5528 as ethereum standard and what was your main motivation towards proposing this to be an ethereum master.

C

uh Yeah that that's very good questions of the crypto industry has has been started about a long time ago about, let's say 10 years and from the 2017s. A lot of you know. Project is is into the market, but but the barrier to the this industry is there's not many people use for daily life or actual asset transaction Etc and no breach between the the crypto world and real world.

C

So the reason why is their standard and also the policies and architecture, and also the guarantees of transactions such a level of the expectation and also level of delivery, isability gaps? So that's why crypto stays in the cryptos and real world stays in real world and they are sometimes fighting each other and deny each other and ignore each other. So the triangle, while we're trying to solve that issue, is okay, so escrow is a guarantee and everybody. Everything is transparency. We really deliver. So very basic transparency deliver is a decentralized architecture.

C

That's why people is crazy about wow. Crypto is sure that everything is open, source spaces and the regular structures. That's the first. The steps of the crypto second step is: okay: let's have some transaction deal with each other through the cryptos and and other the assets, the transactions and swap the asset Etc, but there should be I found that there should be the score like some. The architecture and Services I think that is also very following the philosophy of the Italian. The first day he designed about smart contractings. What is Smart contracts?

C

It's a it's like a simple if and then things, okay, that's good for start, but right now the escort like even then transaction, the the design will bring a lot of value for this industry. So that's why we're trying to you know, deliver right things and on the right times and write Solutions too.

A

Definitely on right time, so yeah I think escrow is an important component of uh Financial world. So having a standard around escrow is great to have we discussed about a different variation of implementation? Would you like to maybe talk about any project implementation of this EIP? There was a brief mention of using uh Escrow Services with the chain link, I'm, not sure if that is implemented there. But if you by any chance, are aware, please.

C

Share it so the apply the the 5x200 we applied last year at the final stage. This is a very, very general structure about 528. After that we work for to apply real world situation will be, you know, diluted into this, the flow and protocols. That's why we make some examples, and we are. This- is all we already have been work but deployed, but not at the library at this time yet, but uh but pretty much, it has been proved. So I will share that part.

C

This is so we said the 5.20r R means just a little bit revision, so so it's starting from the 528, but we changed some contract and something more on top of that. One is a closer contract because some of the escrow cases they do not want to open to the public, so it should be the open and close contract.

C

Another one is we added Oracle chaining technical Rocco's, so that means to settle some conditions in between so so escrow can can embrace the the chain link and then they always judge between how the return comes from the training networks. So that's when we have deployed it. So some little bit changes of the math for the part. For example, the bio wallet address has been predefined for security reason Etc. So we have a minor revision and then compare with our previous uh very general flow.

C

We added some Oracle part here and there is a lot of condition we set up, for example, one two: three four conditions: the mutual agree between the cellular and buyer and investor and investee. So this one is how the condition will match. For example, okay, I want to buy your digital asset, but I need to guarantee for six months of that, prices will be. You know above some bottom line, or it could be the you know, shorter period like even minimum several months, since they have to be hit into this top level or lower level.

C

uh Something like that. So if they have to predefine all the credentials for the escrow, then Oracle training could work and watching and absorbing in real-time basis, and they reported the escrow condition matter or not, and then their transaction will be preceded based onto the result. So that part we are the.

C

If we have some updated the the function and feature which we embedded in this part and that there is Oracles and more updated from actual transaction design, but still based onto the 520s little minor revision to add more and more module, I believe that this kind of approach will be the progressed and promoted by the many other developers and more and more that's what we're expecting. So this is a general simple, the the uh what is it say, demos, so, okay, so let's say this is a this is actually we deployed uh for testing purpose.

C

So when you see 5520 is in behind and Channing could set up the their own conditions, symbol, token address and selling price guarantee price and starting date and closing date and chain link Network on and off and allow refund deliver means once the condition is not met, they OS can be draw and different requests. So so those part we already have makeup very user-side interfaces to prove our protocol is right. So this is one part of set up the chain in coraco and then they it automatically deploy the contract.

C

Here once you click the depressed contract, automatically deploy the contract here and then it will be in the blockchain right after that, the investor side buyer side to send the ERC based on the contract and congratulations. They send the ERC here and after that, another transaction is the receiver side. They pay the the transactions.

B

C

So this one is generally show how between the transactions are succeed or fail. These cases are we designed the withdrawal, the reward we draw, the the cases if that's not works escort is failed, so so with the front-end design. So so that's how we invested our time and effort to bring this team to the market. I believe the ethereum foundation to accept this as a basic standard, and we really believe this will help the industry growing the more solid way and healthy directions.

A

I think this is great. uh This is great to have. um My understanding is because this is not a core proposal. It will never be a part of ethereum, mainly, however, because this is an ERC and probably would be very good for many other wallet implementers and probably some of the D5 project implementers. This could be used by different projects. uh There is this working group called wallet group.

A

It would be nice to have this proposal discussed in that group as well and see if any uh wallet implementers are willing to have it implemented in their wallet. Hopefully, that would help um so I'm, hoping that, with this, like you know, some of the D5 project, because wallet step group is a big group in which many new project developers joins in and talk about how to use these standards, which are already existing in ethereum repository in their project. So I think they could pick up this one for a future projects.

A

Okay, uh talking about the escrow contract, The Proposal describes two different escrow processes. uh One is payable, contract and escrow contract. What would you say would be the main difference? Is it just the Esco is refundable and payable is not payable.

C

Is for the transaction part that is very standard one? We can merge and and put things at one contract, but but our the design was okay, let's put the escrow escrow Parts only separated because it can make more flexibility for development and of deploy it. So payment is just the accuracy and focus onto the the the the Integrity of the payment part. Only and escrow part is just work for the charging the escrow and make a transaction between success and failure. Judgings.

C

So that's that's why we designed this two separate smart contracts but but depends on. We can merge into one contract, but we found that you know. Separation will be more in bring the more benefit. For you know, operational side.

A

I think that's a great idea, more flexibility. We can. We can write to the users I think the adoption of EIP has a greater chances. So that's a good to have um I would also like to discuss some security consideration. Do you think? Because this is highly uh involved with the financial aspect of the blockchain technology? What would be the security consideration that a project implementer should keep in mind.

C

uh The payable contract is just extension of vip20, so situation is the same like any erc20. Erp20 is a security situation, so they have to be follow that the instruction eip-20 also has a security instructions and guidelines. So most of people developers is following that instruction, but the escrow contract part is a is a purely developed responsibility, because it's we we provide the guidelines. We also designed. We also applied to do some test cases, work fine, but depends on the developers, ability and experiences. There could be some many challenges.

C

For example, Source codes should not allow any withdrawal token after the escrow account closed, so so sort of things they have to design by the developers so escrow part the contract Parts need to be paying attention to be. You know more secured through the the designers, the responsibility.

A

I get it and I as a body defining of the conditions on which this can be enabled or disabled is totally up to the developer, who would like to implement it in his or or her project right all right. My set of last questions are from the um stories around the proposal of this EIP and the experience all together. Is there any um success story, or maybe a road blocker that you may have encountered during proposing this proposal.

C

uh The success story is uh we we go to the final. Thank you. So that's our first and current success story and another proposal is our. This is our first time to apply to the IP process. I was a surprise, is a lot of people is helping uh very decentralized way or, at the same time very organized way so which is a way wow, it's wonderful! So one thing we are expecting more is uh yes, it's good to have all the Erp application is really smooth and a lot of advice.

C

We get it through the whole process. We really appreciate. We got a lot of knowledges and experiences too, but important thing is how to deploy this one to the real world. Your industry so I believe there needs some support to make a more and more use cases not only stay in as a protocol level, but also it should be delivered into the real world. The service application any kind of the application that will help and helping to change the world so I needed. That part need your support too.

A

Absolutely yes, we are thankful, of course, for having this standard in the ethereum repository. At the same time, we feel like it is generally easier, for you know a proposal to spread the word out. However, as a group of ethereum cat herders, we also try to support all these proposals which are in finance standard and recommend it to any project developer, who are looking for any standard around whatever their key concept is.

A

um Generally speaking, we encourage hackathon participants to implement these proposals in their project and that's one of the like first place where we can expect a project to be um getting born.

A

um Ethereum cat headers has organized a session in association with Fellowship of ethereum magician at ethanworth, which would be plan on March, 2nd there. We are inviting all EIT authors to maybe join us and talk about their project. We are hoping that there we could find more upcoming project developers and sharing about the existing standard would be a good place to. You know, share information, so if anyone from your team is planning to participate in either Denver, please join.

C

A

All right, I think that's it on my list and uh we can probably wrap up any final comment or chat that you would like to add or share with the ethereum community.

C

uh For myself, just thank you so much I really love the whole process. You were walking and cooperate with this kind of organizations is a new experiences and also we enjoy to achieve our protocol is accepted and hope to have more and more the the good ideas can be applied to be applied in this protocols. That's our missions and hoping to have a work together.

C

You know forever. Okay,.

A

C

B

Yeah so uh really love the process. um It's our first time. You know supported EIP and it's quickly after you know three months of hard work. um It's final and after this stage we're looking to collab with uh more projects, uh also cloud with other EIP editors, any ethereums um to expand to utilize the the usage of this escrow standard and make people think this will be something necessary when we making investment when we're doing transactions- um and you know looking forward to meet more people, more talented developers in East, Syria and Denver.

B

uh Definitely it will have a big support here.

A

That would be great. Thank you well, Jerry and David. We really appreciate you both taking our time and providing an overview of eip5528, refundable punchable token, which I think is one of a kind. Of course it is because it is in ethereum standard now. I hope that it will be helpful for many aspiring G5 projects to have the proposal implemented in their project. An important announcement before we go ethereum Caterers are collecting user suggestion for clients Improvement. If you run an ethereum node, please take out time to share your response.

A

Make your voice heard to the client development team link is available in the description on this note, thank you to our YouTube viewers for watching and podcast subscriber for listening to this special ERC episode. Should you have any question on this proposal or any other EIP? Let us know at Eid cathode is discard. Next week we will be back with another interesting talk till then. Keep watching and sharing your love with ethereum cat headers cheers.

A