Ethereum Foundation DevCon 6 - Developer Infrastructure Track, 3 Nov 2022

Previous Meeting Next Meeting

⏯

youtube image

►

From YouTube: The Showdown: Best Ethereum Language | Devcon Bogotá

Description

Visit the https://archive.devcon.org/ to gain access to the entire library of Devcon talks with the ease of filtering, playlists, personalized suggestions, decentralized access on Swarm, IPFS and more.
https://archive.devcon.org/archive/watch/6/the-showdown-best-ethereum-language/

This session will be an unconventional panel discussion. Instead of being boring and repeating the same things, we will spice things up a bit.

The goal is to decide which is the best language for Ethereum.

How do we find that out? Though a combination of "pub quiz" and on-stage activity (e.g. tug-of-war) between members of different language teams. The audience can chime in as well.

Speaker(s): Hari, Leo Alt, Alex Beregszaszi
Track: Developer Infrastructure
Keywords: solidity,vyper,fe

Follow us: https://twitter.com/efdevcon, https://twitter.com/ethereum
Learn more about devcon: https://www.devcon.org/
Learn more about ethereum: https://ethereum.org/

Devcon is the Ethereum conference for developers, researchers, thinkers, and makers.
Devcon 6 was held in Bogotá, Colombia on Oct 11 - 14, 2022.
Devcon is organized and presented by the Ethereum Foundation, with the support of our sponsors. To find out more, please visit https://ethereum.foundation/

A

A

Oh wait, so this is not the Spanish language. I showed up, am I bad I'm. Sorry, okay, so uh excuse me uh so welcome everyone. Thank you for being here. uh We have a lot of wonderful people in this panel and I'm gonna start by introducing the organizers uh in case you didn't know them already. Those three wonderful folks over there are the organizers of this event and we have the formal verification, lead and compiler engineer uh the ethereum foundation with over 2 000 Twitter followers and over 1 000 GitHub contributions.

A

In the last year, Leonardo aka, Leo, alt, big round of applause.

A

Next one we have Team Epsilon, lead and solidity language, X co-lead at the ethereum foundation, coffee addict and evm nerd, Alex AKA axic in that side. Over here and last but not least, it's like it's like and last but not least, um Harry AKA, Hari.

A

So I do need your password answer.

A

Foreign Y and now that we have introduced the organizers, let's introduce our wonderful participants, so from Faye we have Mr Grant Grant is a developer at the EF focused on design and implementation of field Lang before Fey, he mostly contributed to consensus clients. Thank you for your service. Yoshi yoshimoto is a developer at the ethereum foundation, working on FEI, Lang and sonatina compiler back end.

A

From half we have Joshua Joshua, AKA JT, former super fluid solidity engineer: mobile, app developer and half contributor. Thank you for being here, sir from Viper we have Bryant.

A

Bryant is the CEO of April x, a python Dev tool startup and a contributor to the Viper compiler. He has also contributed on several eaps and core python libraries in the ecosystem.

A

From the ATK language, we have Ansgar he's a researcher at the ethereum foundation previously at consensus quilt. He has worked on protocol improvements, including eips, 3034, 4488 and 48 44.. Thank you for your service. I'm amazed I pronounced that right now from the solidity team we have. Camille is one of the core developers at the salinity team at the ethereum foundation. He is also a co-founder of code poets, a Polish, Software, House specializing in chemi, informatics and blockchain.

A

In the past he worked on a variety of software projects in multiple languages, ranging from Video Editor to C, plus plus to python web development to Devos and infrastructure. His blockchain experience started with a printing cooperation with Golem he's currently focused on the solidity language and compiler wow. Thank you. Camille and Daniel.

A

Mr Daniel has been with the solidity team for the past 4.5 years. He's passionate about talking so taking somebody to the next level with generics and he will be taking over the language technical, lead role at the solidity team. Wow. Thank you everyone for being here. It is everybody Pleasant. Thank you all for being here as well, so we are coming with a pop quiz. There are no drinks, but maybe later will be so, uh let's start with some historical questions. Mr Leo would you mind uh showing them on the.

A

A

You can see that all this is improvised one for you just in time development. You know how this works.

A

So we are gonna, go through a couple of questions to make this fun in order to see which language is the best one. uh Please do not kill each other like we really appreciate your work and our bloodbath here is not wouldn't be actually quite fun so and don't cheat absolutely not I. We will verify.

A

We have a formal verification lead here and Harry is going to be taking over that role today he will be standing up and checking that your answers are actually correct, and if they are correct, then you will score a point and there may be or may not be a price at the end. I cannot confirm nor deny so, let's go with history, language. Okay, are you ready, listen to me so who was the original creator of each language so for Viper, half fade solidity and etk, and you have 30 seconds.

A

15 seconds.

A

A

Pins up pants up pants up ends up friends down or pencil.

A

Thank you. Okay, so should I say their answers. Okay, so for okay say that loud.

A

Favorite Sanders Mr. How are you confirm.

B

C

You're asking me.

C

I just put grant you know just optimistically.

A

Okay, uh what about you did you write it down?

A

ah Shall we given a half a point? Maybe.

D

A

Okay, so what did you? What did you write for a half?

A

Okay? So no point: what did you write for solidity?

A

No, let's go one by one solidity.

A

Whatever for 80k.

A

Doxed, okay, okay, so he gets the points as well right. Okay, what did you write for for Viper, okay, vitalik point.

D

So go through your list again.

D

Discuss your business again.

A

Okay, next one.

E

On the list, solidity no.

E

No TK, no idea.

A

D

uh Not like solidity is Gap in Wood, I, believe and Faye is David, but I only wrote David.

A

B

A

D

B

Go down the list.

A

B

F

How do you define your mind yeah, they.

C

E

C

Of this game they get to decide and.

A

The bottle begins.

A

Okay, next one.

C

But apparently that was wrong and I have I had no idea.

A

G

Salinity, okay, so for solidity we put giving increase uh for five Grant and we run out of time for others.

A

F

A

So, oh well, the answer is, if the colleagues are wondering about the answer so Viper is vitalik for half is Zach for Faye is David Sanders for salinity, Chris and God, and ATK Sam Mad Dogs. Again, that's fine! Let's go to the next question in regards to the parity, hack, Okay. So.

A

There's Ah that's a great question, so there's gonna be five um okay. So let's give you one minute for you this one. Okay, so there's gonna be five questions here so for the ability hack number one, what was the GitHub issued title of the priority hack by devops 199.?

A

The second question is: what was the text in the first comment? The third one: what year was it the fourth one? Was it solid is fault and the fifth one is what Viper feature proposal was motivated by it. You have one minute what.

A

A

Are you gonna? How are you gonna answer that okay, this is gonna, be good.

A

The last one is what Viper feature proposal was motivated by.

A

You have 25 seconds.

A

You have 15 seconds to open your Google browser and find the answers online.

A

A

Foreign okay, so let's go one by one and let's start from the other side, this time. Okay. So what was the GitHub issue title of the party hack by devops? No idea? Okay, what was the text in the first comment? Convince it I.

F

Killed it, that's probably what it was.

E

G

Accidentally killed it.

A

Yeah: okay: what year was.

F

A

Was it solidity's fold, of course, not.

A

Okay, what Viper future proposal was motivated by it? No.

F

A

Okay, so sir, let's go over here, yeah.

C

Okay, so uh I couldn't remember the title either. Something like anyone can I, don't know something something anyone can yeah, but I forgot. The rest, I don't know, can give me half a point. If you want to uh and then I put down, I think I killed it, but apparently it was I accidentally killed. It I, don't know uh 2017 I guess as well. Of course not solid. His fault I mean you know, given the judges here. What else can you say um and no idea about the Viper feature.

A

Let's go with you, sir.

D

Oh I forgot the title of the issue: uh I accidentally killed it 2017. and was.

A

It to leave this fault.

D

I have to think about that I! Guess not not this time and I forgot the feature proposals I probably made.

B

A

Was the GitHub issue title.

B

A

The text in the first comment.

B

A

What year was it.

B

A

What is the latest fault.

B

A

What Viper feature proposal wasn't divided by.

B

A

That was awesome, title.

H

uh So I guessed we got hacked, it was a joke.

A

uh Text in the first comment.

H

Dot: dot dot. What.

A

H

A

Was it the latest fault.

H

No, what Viper feature proposal was uh re-entrancy protection, but.

A

um Okay, so uh I guess they both have already been assigned. Let me go through the answers for the public and the audience at home.

A

Come here play with us, sir okay, so that's the first answer to the question: what was what was the text in the first comment? Does anyone know yes, sir? What year was it? Who knows that? That was easy? Was it. So this is fault.

A

I cannot confirm Northern ire at this point. What Viper feature proposal was motivated by it and yeah. So Alex said it was like cloning Factory all righty. Are we ready to go to the next section regarding ethereum evm knowledge?

A

Yes, alrighty? So here's the first question for which you will have uh 30 seconds, which is what is the cheapest evm up code, just name, one.

A

You can name more name as many as you can.

A

What is the cheapest evm up code.

A

Five seconds.

A

Oh, this point is awful okay. So, let's start with you.

A

Minus one point: okay,.

A

Zero points.

A

ah This is a dictatorship. Sorry.

G

We put down code size at two guys, but after the fact we think it was like jump this at one. No.

A

Okay, who here knows the right answer, sir.

A

There's two points for you, sir good job give this man a beer, and there is one more.

A

There is one more it's revert. Apparently, okay, shall we go to the next evm question 30 seconds, which up code was motivated by the dial hack 30 seconds, which op code was motivated by the Dao hack.

A

You got seven seconds, go.

B

A

It three two one.

A

Okay, so let's start from here which up code was motivated by the dial hack.

A

A

That's correct: he had no idea, but that's correct.

A

A

A

It's okay, people get lost, usually.

A

A

Okay, next question: are you ready? Can you emit logs in a static call.

A

I'm giving you 30 if the public wants to answer them. Please go ahead. You will gain nothing, but you will get knowledge.

A

You can write it down. Actually yeah you can just if you have a phone or something just like play along.

A

Well, this is what just two is you're, not even gonna bother something at all. Okay, so.

A

Shall we start asking.

A

Okay, so what about the public? Can you emit logs in a static call.

A

No, that's right! That's right!.

A

Okay, next one all right so which up code returns to stack items which op code returns to stack items.

A

So you have 10 seconds the audience. Also, if you, if you know it, then like write it down time. Yes, that's the spirit.

A

A

All right so shall we start with that side? Okay, so which op code returns? Two stack items.

F

Yeah, we should really know, but I don't right now.

A

A

Known it's like the answer or not like you, don't know.

E

H

It's just too fast, I, don't have any time.

A

So it's actually none.

E

Okay, what was it.

A

A

Next one Okay so which up code reverts on out of bounds, access into 30 seconds and I'm, asking you two this time.

A

Which? Up code reverts on out of bound access.

G

A

He's wrong: okay! So hey! Let's talk with you.

H

A

Copy, oh no, obviously, the.

G

C

I remember a bit too late: it's returning the coffee, I think.

A

That's true, though, we.

F

Had returned in a coffee, we actually got something in the Optima wrong about that. Once.

A

Well, I cannot ask you anymore, because I already know the answer, so it wouldn't make sense.

A

Okay, next category language, specific questions.

A

Wow someone has a follower here, okay, so the first question is: what is the latest release of Viper solidity, phase, half and ATK?

A

Let's do 35 seconds.

H

A

G

A

Okay, which way shall we start Alex? You tell this time.

A

Okay, so for Viper, no idea, okay for solidity,.

G

A

G

A

He's not wrong for half. Oh.

G

A

G

Something: okay.

C

Sir I have zero points.

A

C

Nothing soluti 0.8.10 is what I guess, but apparently we have power beyond that. Okay, no idea, Huff, no idea, ATK, no idea, slum I put down 1.0, just in case you know.

A

Oh, that was close, though sir Viper solidity.

B

E

A

Not applicable is that a valid answer: no and etk all right, I'm, sorry, okay, okay,.

E

Great now you can hear me buff it on the recording awesome. So.

C

E

0.3.4 solidity, 0.8.18 Huff, 0.1.0 etk, no idea fee, no idea.

A

E

E

I'm pretty sure the salinity docs points to 0.8.18, though I'm going to check that you've.

A

H

All right well uh fee might be 0, 18.0 um solidity, zero, dot, eight, that's something and I didn't know any of the other ones.

A

I, like his honesty, no okay. So let's give you all the answers. So Viper, 0.3.7, sorry, ET, 0.8.17, Fe, 0.19.1 have only night lies TK, 0.2.1,.

A

A

Okay, so next question.

A

What language was serpent written in Viper and Viper? How do you pronounce those foreign? Yes, so those are three questions 35 seconds folks.

A

What language was serpent written in Viper and Viper.

B

A

Okay, are you ready.

A

So, uh let's start with you folks, so serpent what language was it written with? Oh yeah, the mic. This is working yeah, let's say python: okay and Viper python and a Viper. We.

G

Said the rust but I suspected.

A

Might be python so what's your final answer.

G

A

C

You, sir, so uh for the three like I I, put down python python C so which which one is which well uh serpent python Viper python Viper with an y c I, don't know.

A

D

Surface are in C, plus uh Viper with a Y is written in Python and Viper with an I from the ecff, uh whatever it's a formal verification tools written in C plus.

D

Oh did you forget about that? Did.

E

You forget about.

B

That that's the reason why we have to change the.

D

Name from fiber, with an eye to Viper with a Y, because.

D

But they're not, though.

D

Technically correct is the best kind of correct.

A

Can someone verify this?

A

Can you give me like five or ten points for this? Okay, uh sir serpent.

E

uh uh I said python three times.

A

Well, that's two out of three so and you folks.

H

Yeah uh serpent python Viper with a Y Python and Viper with an I c plus.

A

Even 2.01 points wow. That was pretty curious. Actually how okay, so uh are you ready for the next question? So what language is half written in 35 seconds.

A

A

Yeah there's like multiple answers and you get many points.

A

Write down all the programming languages, they are.

A

I think it's in vipers, okay, you have five seconds.

A

You know that half was brilliant in half.

A

Okay, so let's start with you folks, rest okay, so that's the only answer you had.

H

Yeah there was a another language, I think it was. uh Was it originally implemented in C, plus, plus I, don't know, but now it's implemented in Rust. So.

A

Rust is correct.

A

Would you would you put the mic.

E

All right so original Huff, no idea uh slightly modern Huff, typescript, modern, modern Huff, rust.

A

That's two points for you, sir.

C

D

I wrote Haskell, which.

C

A

E

A

That's a solid answer: okay, yeah.

C

Mingus was dressed and then I I was just throwing in C plus, but apparently that's wrong. So rest.

A

That's one point.

G

So we wrote rust.

A

All right so well, the correct answer was also. Does anyone know? Actually there is three answers, so rust is one. Typescript is another there's a third one hands up.

A

So no I don't hear an answer. Javascript. Can we give him a point? Okay, I tried I'm, sorry, okay, so uh shall we go to the next question? Mr Leo? Okay, are we ready what was Faye originally called 35 seconds.

A

Five more seconds.

A

F

Yeah we had it earlier, but I don't remember exactly what's rusted something he put down rust Viper, but.

A

That's correct, wow.

C

Respect no I did not put down rust but I. Just you know, I put down fee with two e's, because that always confuses me, but you know.

D

uh The correct answer is Russ Viper, because it was originally supposed to be a rust implementation, a Viper compiler, even though it didn't follow semantics at all.

E

uh Not rust Viper.

H

Breast Viper.

A

Well, Harry's, not very fine. The answers anyway, so.

A

All right are you ready for the next one, which solidity version introduced named function arguments you have one hour to answer this question.

A

If, someone knows this stand up and scream it out loud, which saluted version introduced, name, function, arguments.

A

A

A

A

Yeah, let's do that one one!

A

Okay! We got two one and time's up. Okay, let's start from that side, one four: zero! Okay, the audience! Any answer.

A

E

A

You want to change your answer.

A

Okay, just write it down, don't forget.

D

I, give a little bit of a benefit of a doubt and I said zero one. Two, a little bit, I'm surprised the answer isn't immediately.

A

No answer changes right: okay,.

C

I put down zero four zero.

A

G

Okay, it was long before my time, but it was there for ages, so I said like 0.1.0, but.

A

Okay so we said, uh should I say no. You say this Alex.

G

So it could have been oh yeah.

D

So I get a half a point right, I guess something before that time.

A

Yeah, you know this Oprah Winfrey meme. You get a point.

G

You get a point.

A

Okay, so ready for the next question, which pre-compiles do not have a built-in in solidity, 30 seconds.

A

There's multiple Alpha leak.

A

Which pre-compiles do not have a built-in in solidity?

A

Multiple answers are allowed.

A

So, uh let's start here.

F

Yeah we had identity, that's the only one that I was sure. uh Then some hash thingy with B, but like something yeah, that's a that's. Does it ever Freedom? Finally, these days I don't know but they're, the only ones you have.

A

Okay, that's one point right.

A

C

Viper going hard, yes,.

C

Right pretty similar answers that, like the identity, one and then this hash thingy but I didn't even know that, like it began with a B, so I put it ah so do with that. What you want.

D

Maybe we should just rename it to the hash thingy pre-compile I said identity and Blake 2.

E

Identity and shot 256.

H

A

Okay, that's the audience, know.

A

A

So again, no well, for the sake of time it's going to be identity, pairing and black 2.

A

All right, let's go to the next one.

A

Okay, so two questions here when was Yule introduced and what was it originally called.

A

And you can get bonus points because Alex says so.

C

A

Okay, you have five seconds when was Yule introduced and what was it originally called.

A

Okay, uh shall we start with you, sir.

H

uh 2018. and something that started with a j.

D

Supposed to be a version.

A

A year it's a year, okay pause the mic; no, no, no points. I'm, sorry.

E

uh No idea when, but it was originally called Julia.

D

I rode zero, four, two: six, which.

C

D

Released in 2018, so that's kind of right.

B

C

Yeah I had no idea about the name I put down 2017.

A

That's a point for him: it says 2017 here but you're. The master.

B

F

So yeah you have, you also had I think we also only named the deal in 2018 but introduced it, maybe as Julia earlier, but.

F

E

So they got one or two feet.

A

You got yeah, let's do two, why not I'm 0.5 from him.

A

Is everyone happy? Yes, let's continue, then next question what version introduced metadata, support or metadata depending how do you pronounce it for solidity and also Viper?

A

So what version introduced metadata support in solidity and in Viper.

A

Two questions in soluti I mean Viber. You should know.

A

A

Two seconds no.

A

So we are discovering a lot of new things here. We are learning together, isn't that fun.

F

So yeah, why probably guess zero three four uh for solidity? It was before our time and we guessed there was three six.

C

Well, that's a fun puff quiz. Were there any questions and answers, but uh I put down solidity: 0.30, um Viper, I, don't know 0.20 plausible. You know.

D

Sure uh selated Team actually got the Viper one right: zero, three four and then I wrote zero. Four twelve for solidity probably have to look that one up then.

B

No idea straightforward.

A

No idea I also have no idea Alex.

A

Just one point for everyone.

A

Okay, uh we're almost done next question.

A

What version allows disabling the metadata in solidity and in Viper.

A

So personality and for Viper, which version allows disabling the metadata.

A

A

For Authority I'm for Viper, okay, everyone seems so confident. I'm just gonna oh thumbs up Okay. So.

H

Yeah I don't know any of these version. Questions.

H

B

D

For solidity, I put zero eight eleven, because why not and Viper I put zero three seven! That's.

A

One point: wow yeah.

C

If I put 0.34 and then solidity I put zero seven zero.

A

All right can I put some Mike.

G

Okay, for for Viper, we said 036 and for solidity, okay, 034 and for solution. We measured the pr like last week, so it will be 08 18.

A

That's one point: okay, the last question of the pub quiz.

A

If you win this, you win this. You win everything or not Okay, so if you name them correctly, all of them, so even the audience, if you name it, then you win as well, so name, one forgotten, evm language, there's multiple, apparently name one or a couple or name all of them.

A

A

Five seconds time flies.

A

Okay, so shall we start with you.

D

I just wrote surfing.

A

I'll do that.

D

uh There was like three others, I remember but vaguely.

A

Can you just like remember one.

D

Of them was uh that guy that used to work on formal verification for the EF before he left in protests right um yeah. What was it called? Okay.

A

So I'll pass the mic.

E

H

D

H

We put uh Serpent and solang.

E

's pretty actively developed guys what is souling okay,.

C

Sir yeah I didn't didn't think serpent counted as as forgotten, I put down move. You know, because why not I think that compiles to evm right.

G

Okay, so we have LL and nib.

A

Okay, the audience.

G

A

Your plan, oh wow,.

A

Hi uh well, the answers apparently are like mutton, lll and bamboo. Have you heard of those okay? Well, congratulations! Everyone for this amazing uh display of knowledge that we got here now. We have a should I introduce a yeah, the question audience right, but okay, so let's introduce the question for the audience. Okay, this is for you and you will have to scream and shout and jump or not. I, don't know okay. So what is the best solidity version in 2018.?

A

Why argument your argument? Your? What's your thesis.

D

The correct answer is it's a trick question so.

A

I'm would upset it.

B

A

Okay: okay, and what what feature would you remove.

F

A

Okay and well, um we are um out of time.

A

Okay, we have 10 minutes for you want to do this. Are you sure sorry.

A

Okay, so you are going to be, you have not only seen a massive display of brain power, but you will also see a display of strength. Okay, so Harry, would you mind, would you do? Would you do the honors?

A

Do you know what a tog war is.

A

And because uh there is like too many solidity people so I don't know you're one of them Okay, so.

D

A

Would you like that? Yes, yes, she likes that and he took my sock I want that talk back Okay. So how do you wanna put this? We need some people on one side and we need people on the other side. So, okay,.

A

You also count: do you do you think the organizer should also do like participate in this right.

A

Take positions.

A

Does anyone have like a rock music or like something solid to play in the background one until one loses, of course, so one two three four five.

C

B

A

Recording oh yeah,.

E

E

A

Need to talk a bit more in the middle okay, so you see you see you see this. If you put it a bit here in the in the in the middle.

A

Ah That's it: okay, at the count of zero. Three two one go.

A

The solidity team is becoming strong.

A

Thank you all for coming. Thank you all for tuning in in this language, Showdown. Thank you all for your time,.