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From YouTube: Devcon VI Bogotá | Tropical Sunset stage - Day 4
Description
Official livestream from Devcon VI Bogotá.
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The
panel
is
being
moderated
by
Yosef
and
he
is
being
joined
by
themes,
Tony,
Benson
and
Anda.
Please
welcome
them.
D
Good
morning,
everyone
thanks
for
making
it
out,
so
welcome
to
this
panel
conversation
about
web
free
adoption
on
the
African
continent.
How
many
of
you
have
been
to
anywhere
in
Africa
here
before
awesome?
How
many
of
you
are
working
with
anyone
from
the
continent?
Fantastic?
How
many
of
you
are
just
curious
to
know
about
the
continent
awesome,
so
we'll
try
to
do
justice
today,
to
give
you
a
little
bit
of
a
snippet
of
the
exciting
things,
the
challenges,
the
perspectives
from
the
ground,
and
one
of
the
reasons
why
we
actually
wanted
to
do.
D
This
is
many
each
events
that
at
least
I've
been
to
around
the
world.
We
hear
about
Africa
from
people
who
are
looking
from
the
outside
in
as
opposed
to
people
who
are
actually
building
things
on
the
ground.
So
I
think
it
would
be
really
amazing
for
us
to
really
understand
this
beautiful
amazing
continent
that
has
so
much
potential
that
we
don't
even
understand
what
that
potential
is.
D
To
give
you
an
example
and
I,
don't
know
how
many
of
you
might
be
aware,
but
Africa
right
now
is
1.4
billion
people
and
we
have
the
fastest
growing
population.
The
youngest
population,
the
median
age,
is
18.8
years,
so
very,
very,
very
young
and
and
we're
expected
to
get
between
2.4
to
2.8
million
billion
people
by
2050..
D
Just
to
give
you
like
put
that
in
context
we're
going
to
have
twice
as
many
young
people
as
all
the
young
people
in
China
in
the
next
18
years,
50
more
than
all
the
young
people
in
India
and
our
young
people
are
going
to
be
almost
three
times
as
many
young
people
in
the
US
and
Europe
combined.
So
if
you're
kind
of
thinking
about
youth
age,
Workforce
Talent
base
a
lot
is
developing
in
the
continent
of
Africa
and
the
economy
is
growing
really
fast
as
well.
D
We
talk
about
Finance,
about
500,
plus
million
Africans,
have
access
to
banking
infrastructure,
similar
number
of
people
who
have
access
to
Internet,
mostly
through
mobile
phones.
Internet
money
is
huge
on
the
continent.
The
economic
growth
is
expected
to
reach.
You
know
about
6.7
trillion,
dollars
of
consumer
and
retails
and
business
spending
by
2030..
So
there's
a
lot
of
capital.
It's
not
just
you
know.
Sometimes
we
look
at
Africa
as
the
probably
like
population
to
help
and
support
was
actually
real,
talent-based
real
economic
activity.
Real
access
is
not
enough.
D
There's
a
lot
more
to
build,
but
at
least
that
kind
of
sets
the
the
core
Foundation
of
how
we
can
think
about
the
continent
and
the
opportunities
there.
So
that's.
D
E
Hi
everyone,
my
name,
is
Tony
Orlando,
been
a
software
engineer
for
about
10
years.
I,
currently
work
at
polygon
as
the
senior
education
Solutions
architect
with
responsibility
for
zero
knowledge
technology.
E
I
am
a
early
member
of
developer.
Dao
I
worked
at
coordinape
and
I'm
really
excited
about
education
opportunities
in
Africa
and
that's
why
I
now
I'm
involved
with
the
web
with
the
web
3,
Africa
and
afrofuture,
which
which
has
like
the
premier
nft
artists
across
Africa,
and
we
have
like
fellowships
and
drops
that
we
do
where
we
work
with
a
lot
of
African
artists.
F
Hi
everyone
I'm
andan
NABA
I
serve
as
chief
of
operations
at
the
University
of
Cape
Town
Financial
Innovation
up
in
South
Africa
there.
We
essentially
translate
academic
research
into
novel
blockchain
applications,
so
we'll
work
with
Masters,
PhD
and
postdoc
students
to
convert
their
thesis,
ideas
and
topics
into
an
Azure
plugin
application,
ranging
from
everything
from
offline
payments
to
nfts
for
Content
collaborations
to
privacy.
Preserving
table
wallets
great
thanks
via
I.
G
My
name
is
femes
I'm,
a
dow
governance
engineer
and
researcher
I'm,
helping
Dallas
and
protocols
build
better
governance,
I
also
the
co-founder
of
the
Dow
governance
education
sessions,
which
is
basically
a
community
of
almost
close
to
100
people
of
Dow
governance
operators
and
enthusiasts
so
that
we
can
learn
different
models
and
tactics
to
build
better
together.
H
Good
morning,
everyone,
my
name,
is
Benson
yoguna
I
come
from
Kenya
I
I
work
with
the
ethereum
foundation
as
a
fellow
to
promote
the
next
billion
use
cases
from
Africa
I'm,
also
a
founder
of
safari
Dao,
East,
Kenya,
community
and
contributor
in
Africa,
defy
Alliance
and
also
working
with
smallholder
Farmers
to
de-risk
them
from
effects
of
climate
change.
Glad
to
be
here
expecting
good
conversations.
Thank
you.
D
Awesome-
and
my
name
is
Joseph
Ayala
I
am
from
Ethiopia,
grew
up
in
Tanzania
and
Kenya,
and
a
huge
part
of
my
passion
right
now
is
increasing
the
level
of
Education
around
Webster
across
the
continent.
Seeing
a
lot
more
protocols
and
projects
that
are
building
the
future
economic
infrastructures
and
the
continent
coming
out
and
also
helping
develop
a
new
narrative
for
the
continent,
which
is
so
far,
we've
been
talking
about
Africa
needing
crypto
to
develop
and
back
the
unbanked
and
all
of
that,
but
actually
the
deeper
I
go.
D
Many
African
Builders
couldn't
be
here,
which
is
kind
of
a
case
in
point
that
a
huge
part
of
the
world
is
closed
off
for
Africans
at
the
moment.
And
so
we
need
to
have
Defcon
and
many
events
happening
on
the
continent,
so
that
many
of
you
can
come
and
experience
the
full
potential
and
opportunity
on
the
continent.
E
B
D
Awesome
so
we
have
a
number
of
themes
to
unpack
here
today
and
I
guess
the
biggest
one
that
many
of
us
are
really
excited
about
is
around
the
talent
base
and
what
that
really
looks
like
in
the
context
of
web3
and
I
love
to
just
ask
fiends
just
to
share
with
us
a
little
bit
of
what
are
the
aspects
of
African
talent.
That
is
really
not
understood
and
what
are
the
biggest
opportunities
that
you
see
when
it
comes
to
web
3
and
African
Talent
yeah.
G
I
think
many
things
that
are
misunderstood
around
the
talent
in
Africa
is
that
we
have
close
to
one
of
the
largest
numbers
of
entrepreneurs
in
the
region.
You
know
there
is
this:
continual
Narrative
of
you
know
helping
the
unbanked,
but
there's
an
opportunity
also
to
engage
those
in
mid
or
senior
level
positions
to
transition.
Their
skill
sets
into
the
ecosystem,
so
I
think
that
there's
a
huge
potential,
particularly
since
majority
of
the
population,
is
under
the
age
of
35..
H
Yeah,
maybe
to
contribute
in
what
I've
seen
web
2
developers,
we
very
talented.
We
have
most
high
number
of
developers
working
for
international
organizations
remotely
others
have
moved
out,
so
we
we
see
a
lot
of
interests
for
web
2
developers
to
move
to
Earth
three.
So
in
fact,
one
of
the
barriers
that
we
we
were
solving
is
the
education
bit
because
most
of
the
web
tool
will
ask
you.
Why
should
I
move
from
web
2
to
web3?
Then
you
realize
it's
a
capacity
building
issue
because
of
the
benefits
web
3
offers.
H
F
I
guess
from
my
side
as
well,
we
partnered
with
party
on
an
impact
plus
to
do
a
web
2
to
web
3
bootcamp
for
developers
about
two
weeks
ago,
and
we
intend
on
doing
their
monthly
now,
focusing
primarily
on
people
at
the
University
doing
computer
science
we're
now
trying
to
transfer
over
and
we're
seeing
so
much
interest
like
our
list
was
over
subscriber
people
who
wanted
to
attend,
and
that
just
shows
you.
You
know
how
interested
people
are.
F
We
also
have
the
first
Masters
in
fintech
and
blockchain
at
University
of
Cape
Town,
every
oversubscribed
55
woman
this
year,
90
black
Africans.
It's
amazing
to
see
and
yeah.
E
Thank
you
yeah,
so,
for
me,
I
think
I
see
a
lot
of
potential
inside
of
the
education
space
specifically
because
I
mean
I
was
there
before
Google
or
Amazon
or
Facebook
had
presence
in
Africa,
and
so
a
lot
of
my
friends.
We
were
just
like
regular
developers
and
Google
Google.
E
You
eventually
came
and
set
up
shop,
Microsoft
came
and
and
set
up
shop,
Facebook
came
through
andela
and
we
saw
like
as
a
surge
in
terms
of
just
like
income
and
and
then
just
impact
and
just
quality,
even
of
like
engineering
and
I
think
web2
understands
the
potential
of
Africa
and
I.
Think
I'm
I'm
not
seeing
protocols
fully
understanding
the
full
potential
of
Africa
inside
of
web
3..
E
A
lot
of
what
I'm
seeing
currently
are
like
extractive
initiatives,
where
it's
basically
Shilling
so
I
am
export
to
call
I'm
actually
going
to
come
and
set
up,
and
the
whole
goal
is
for
me
to
actually
get
you
to
use
my
platform
I.
Don't
really
care
about
you
as
a
as
a
developer
and
I
think
one
of
the
the
biggest
challenges
with
that
is
that
is
the
inside
of
web
2.
Incentives
are
really
clear:
I
am
here
to
do
a
job.
E
You
are
here
to
pay
me
in
web
3
I
think
it
should
be,
it
should
be
slightly
different
and
so
how
we,
how
we
motivate
and
how
we
educate
existing
engineering
talent
in
Africa,
really
really
matters
at
the
level
of
just
base.
Interest
I.
Think
the
the
announcement
of
the
polygon
Africa
boot
camp,
the
blog
post
was
a
was,
was
the
best
performing
blog
post
in
the
history
of
the
polygon
blog.
E
E
But
so
the
main
thing
that
I
would
like
to
see
really
is
like
a
the
very
sober
consideration
in
terms
of
what
is
what
is
the
level
of
Education
impact
that
I
want
to
have
and
then
I
think
anybody
who
thinks
like
that
would
have
a
massive
Roi,
because
you
will
be
building
Community
you'll,
be
building
the
next
wave
of
African
developers.
D
One
of
the
things
that
is
a
little
different
from
many
other
markets
that
is
hardly
understood,
is
actually
most
devs.
If
you
just
even
look
at
developers,
most
devs
are
self-taught
or
learning
how
to
do
development
on
the
job.
So
recently,
Google
and
IFC
did
a
study
and
they
found
actually
it's
only
a
third
of
developers
that
learned
the
skills
through
formal
education.
The
rest
are
basically
self-taught
and
actually,
when
I'm
on
the
ground
and
chatting
with
a
bunch
of
people
at
you,
know,
community
events
and
so
on.
Most
people
I'm
coming
across.
D
They
taught
themselves
solidity
on
YouTube
without
anyone
hand
holding
them,
and
so,
when
you
think
about
education
yeah,
you
can
have
programs
and
structures,
and
all
of
that,
but
also
understand
that
it's
a
very
determined
hungry
self-driven
community
that
you're
working
with
and
I
think
that
really
sets
African
Talent
very
different
from
Global
Talent,
because
it's
there's
less
entitlement,
less
of
a
position
of
hey
I
have
15
things.
I
can
work
on
I
might
show
up,
I
might
not
show
up
it's.
D
The
word
really
means
a
lot
to
people
and
they're
building
and
investing
their
time
and
energy
to
actually
build
a
career
and
get
involved
in
this
space
and
actually
talking
about
web
2
and
web
3.
When
I
talk
to
people
who
are
transitioning
from
web
2
to
web
3.
This
narrative
and
this
idea
that
there's
no
one
basically
creating
a
ceiling
for
you,
you're
not
moving
you're,
not
moving
Upward
at
a
rate
that
your
manager
sets
for.
H
Also
seen
apart
from
web
2
or
the
developer
Talent,
we
have
other
talents
like
Community
Builders
people
who
are
really
good
in
mobilization,
really
good
in
online
social
Media
communication
doing
a
good
job,
because
at
the
end
of
the
day
developers
get
to
learn
of
things
going
on
through
such
people
and
yeah.
It's
still
a
space
that
we
feel
needs
more
and
more
people.
We
see
change,
evm1
chains,
hiring
relationship
managers,
Community
Builders
ambassadors,
which
is
a
really
good
thing,
since
it
helps
push
even
the
the
benefits
of
web3
into
the
market.
But.
G
Outside
of
a
focus
of
development,
like
my
background,
is
in
public
policy
and
information
Sciences,
so
there's
a
lot
of
opportunity
for
people
to
actually
participate
in
this
ecosystem.
I
think
what
also
sets
Africa
apart
is
that
we're
solving
problems
for
today
and
not
10
years
from
now,
and
so
I
think
that
we
have
the
opportunity
to
support
this
entrepreneurial
spirit
that
already
exists
there
to
actually
not
only
help
the
continent
but
to
help
help
globally
as
well,
because
many
people
don't
have
the
luxury
to
like.
G
F
Completely
agree
a
lot
of
the
work
we
do
at
the
University
there'll
be
lines
of
people
trying
to
get
into
our
Hub.
You
know
like
when
people
found
out
there
was
a
blockchain
based
Hub
at
the
University
of
Cape
Town.
They
thought
it
was
a
lie,
so
people
would
always
come
knock
on
our
door
back.
Is
this
really?
You
know
for
Wave,
3,
stuff
and
you're
like
yes,
it
is,
and
we've
really
sanded
ourselves
around
solving
African
problems.
F
D
I,
have
one
hypothesis
and
it'd
be
great
to
hear
if
it's
true
or
not,
and
what
you
all
think
about
it.
So
one
pattern
that
I'm
observing
is
a
number
especially
younger
Talent
gets
into
web
three.
Initially,
it's
all
about.
How
can
I
increase
my
earning
capacity?
How
can
I
earn
Global
income
and
stay
at
home,
and
then
once
people
get
to
a
certain
level
of
comfort
and
say
hey
I'm
out
of
survival
mindset?
Let
me
actually
think
about
what
I
can
build.
H
Yes,
that's
that's
for
sure.
I
can
give
you
a
story
of
myself
when
I
finished
campus,
where
in
fact
education
in
campus
I
did
computer
science,
but
it
was
only
20
percent
programming.
You
do
the
rest
on
your
own
self
train
all
developers,
not
one
has
learned
everything
from
school.
You
do
it
by
self
training.
Now,
after
I
finished,
I
started
a
startup.
In
fact,
I
was
selected
among
the
20
budding
entrepreneurs,
but
then
you
have
to
pay
bills.
You
have
to
move
or
move
from
the
seat.
H
I
moved
from
the
village
to
the
city.
You
have
to
pay
rent,
you
have
to
eat
so
without,
for
example,
funding
and
you're
starting
such
a
startup.
You
you,
your
mindset
is
hey.
Let
me
stop
trying
to
build
this.
Let
me
start
surviving.
Let
me
start
paying
for
my
rent.
Let
me
look
for
food
and
then
I'll
come
back
later,
so
actually
I
stopped
building
the
startup
and
moved
on
to
former
appointment
for
a
while
to
save
up,
but
actually
it's
a
real,
a
real
thing.
Yes,.
F
I
think
the
other
on
the
funding
Point
there's,
definitely
a
shortage,
but
we're
now
seeing
interests
like
CBC
cvvc
from
zuk
and
Switzerland.
Just
open
offices
in
Cape
Town
they're,
raising
a
20
million
dollar
fund
trying
to
invest
in
I,
think
over
100
startups,
all
based
on
blockchain
and
a
lot
of
other
VCS
now
based
on
the
continent,
are
not
looking
to
web3,
so
I'm
hoping
the
funding
app
can
be
filled,
but
I
think
it's
not
just
VCS
I
need
to
come
to
the
table.
F
E
And
I
think
that's
a
really
important
point,
because
there's
a
lot
of
aversion,
even
when
I
talk
to
protocols
about
doing
something
in
Africa
one
one
of
one
of
the
biggest
questions
I
have
is
we
want
to
see
something
you've
done
before
we
want
to
see
like
something
that
looks.
E
Basically,
they
want
to
see
a
model,
a
European
model
that
applies
to
something
that
they've
seen
before
before
they
want
to
invest
in
Africa,
and
it's
usually
a
really
frustrating
conversation
for
me
because
I'm
like
if
you're
looking
for,
if
you're
looking
for
something
that
is
European,
then
please
go
and
build
there.
You
know,
but
specifically
for
me
and
I'm
sorry,
I,
I,
I
just
won't
have
a
filter
because
I'm
too
tired
of
the
rule
of
all
these
conversations
and
people
have
the
passionate
and
they
see
yeah
and
every
time
they
say
yeah.
E
We
have
a
passion
for
Africa.
We
care
about
diversity
and
inclusion,
but
nobody
wants
to
put
their
money
where
their
mouth
is,
but
but
but
specifically
to
your
to
your
particular
question
that
that
is.
That
is
my
own
experience,
but
also
that
is
the
experience
of
very
many
people
in
terms
of
there's
a
because
of
the
because
of
the
social
economic
like
status
of
Africa.
You
have
you
most
of
our
developers.
E
Have
that
initial
need
for
like
a
Ubi
that
enables
them
to
actually
think
and
ideate
and
just
be
at
peace,
you
know,
and
so,
which
is
why
I
think
some
of
those
Learn
to
Earn
models
would
actually
be
really
really
successful,
because
once
it
is
I,
don't
have
to
I
I,
don't
have
to
think
about
meals
and
all
of
these
things
and
making
my
rent
and
I
could
just
focus
on
building
it
becomes
something
that
is
actually
really
really
powerful.
E
E
Just
could
not
afford
to
actually
do
that
because
of
the
social
economic
status,
but
but
over
time
we
have
to
start
to
invest
more
and
more
and
I.
Think
some
of
those
Learn
to
Earn
models
would
be
really
impactful
for
protocols
to
begin
to
consider.
D
What
this
space
is
about
to
a
broader
audience
which
is
really
about,
is
really
important.
It's
really
valuable
and
there's
BankPlus
Africa,
also
like
a
a
growing
Community,
that's
built
on
top
of
the
bank
list.
Now,
I,
don't
know:
if
do
you
guys
follow
like
the
bank
list
down
newsletter
pretty
much
every
newsletter
that
I'm
receiving
somewhere
on
top
is
an
update
from
bankless
Africa.
So
that's
a
group.
That's
got
like
their
stuff
together,
yeah.
G
Yeah
I
think
the
thing
is:
is
that
like
I,
don't
want
to
like
there's
a
continued
narrative
that
all
Africans
are
poor
and
rely
on
a
scarcity
mindset
and
I?
Think
that
that's
what
it's
really
important
to
really
engage
those
in
the
middle
and
senior
level
positions,
because,
although
they
are
in
a
mid
or
senior
level
positions
when
they
apply
for
jobs
in
the
United
States
or
counts
in
the
United
States,
they
say
that
they
don't
have
like
American
experience
and
so
for
me.
G
E
Yeah
and
just
my
own
personal
hypothesis
is,
dolls,
are
just
digital
tribes,
and
so
basically,
the
Tao
model
inside
of
Africa
would
have
particular
success
and
different
kind
of
like
application,
big
just
just
simply
because
of
the
whole
notion
of
community
and
people
working
together
towards
they
are
towards
a
common
good
and
people.
Having
that
kind
of
philosophy,
I,
think,
is
something
that
could
be
explored
really
powerfully.
F
I
know
in
South
Africa
we
have
the
saying
I
am
because
we
are
and
I
feel,
like
Tao's
really
embody
that
it
goes
beyond
you
as
an
individual
and
I.
Think
yeah,
the
uptake
in
Dows
in
Africa
I
think
will
be
high
based
on
our
just
our
culture,
you
know
and
how
we
look
at
working
together.
Individuality
is
not
really
a
thing
there.
You
know
it's
all
about
teams
and
communities
and
yeah.
D
And
tribes,
one
one
really
cool
project
that
I've
been
building
a
good
relationship
with
so
far
that
many
of
us
know
is
called
a
web
tree
Bridge
it's
based
in
Nigeria
and
they've,
been
around
since
2019
and
I
find
them
like
to
do
such
a
cool
mix
between
Community
Building,
Hanson
skill
skills,
education,
as
well
as
providing
the
values
based
foundation
so
that
people
are
getting
to
this
space
really
know.
First,
why
does
web
free
even
matter?
What
are
the
values
of
decentralization?
D
What
your
name
is
where
you
live,
where
you're
from
how
old
you
are,
if
you
know
how
to
execute,
if
you
know
how
to
build,
you've
got
a
track
record
and
people
will
work
with
you
and
I
think
that's
such
a
game
changer
for
a
huge
part
of
the
continent
where
you
know
people
try
to
apply
for
jobs
and
all
of
that
and
like
it's
hard,
it's
hard
and
there's
a
bias
against.
You
know
you're
from
Africa
people,
don't
know
what
to
trust.
D
But
if
you
move
to
a
much
more
meritocratic
environment,
actually,
like
your
work,
speaks
for
itself
and
and
I.
Think
that's
such
a
a
powerful
aspect
of
what's
being
built
here.
E
Yeah
and
please
don't
do
location-based
pay,
please,
because
it's
not
fair.
It's
not
fair
that
a
a
developer
who
has
a
similar
output.
E
A
a
African
developer,
who
has
similar
output
to
a
to
a
sub
to
a
SF
developer,
deserves
to
get
paid
the
same
amount
and
I
think
we
need
to
actually
correct
that.
It's.
D
As
you
know,
layer
ones
and
Protocols
are
coming
during
education
as
marketing
you're,
breeding,
mercenaries
and
people
will
leave
you
right
away.
People
are
smart.
So
if
you're
align
your
success
with
the
success
of
people,
you
will
be
the
really
solid
infrastructure
and
and
solid
users.
Solid
team
members.
Well.
G
I
think
the
important
thing
about
web3,
though
too,
is
that
it
has
an
opportunity
for
personal
branding,
right
and
so
independent
of
what
location
you
live
in.
If
you
do
really
good
work
and
you
promote
yourself
and
you
Pro
like
produce
something
that
has
a
product
Market
fit
and
generates
Revenue,
then
you
have
that
opportunity,
and
so
just
to
add
with
Dows
though
so
Dows
are
not
necessarily
places
for
people
to
Just
Vibe
or
develop
a
community.
G
D
Yeah
I
like
to
just
shift
the
gear
conscious
of
time
towards
financial
services
and
access
to
finance,
because
that's
a
huge
part
of
this
conversation
and
a
low
hanging
fruit
as
well
maybe
come
to
your
Benson
just
to.
Let
us
give
us
a
little
bit
of
a
perspective
from
the
lens
you
look
at
in
terms
of
how
web3,
crypto
and
financial
services
are
sort
of
working
together.
H
Thank
you
in
terms
of
financial
services
when
it
comes
to
to
peer
to
peer
transactions.
Africa
is
leading
that
shows
a
huge
need.
We
we
feel
the
the
problems
of
outright
leading
in
financial
services
is
some
of
the
countries.
The
regulations
are
not
outright
saying.
We
support
this
you're,
just
saying
use
it
at
your
own,
Payroll
use
it
or
don't
risk.
Others
are
saying
we
completely
burn
it.
Others
are
quiet
so,
but
in
the
in
the
ground,
people
actually
trading
peer-to-peer
exchange
and
the
statistics
show
Africa
is
leading
globally.
H
Now,
on
the
other
end
in
web
2
in
terms
of
mobile
money,
we
see
also
the
highest
number
of
transactions
coming
from
from
Africa,
where
the
penetration
of
mobile,
particularly
I
talk
about.
Kenya
is
very
high,
which
is
over
98
percent,
and
that
means
people
are
actually
using
digital
money,
it's
digital
because
they
moved
to
a
shop,
give
out
fiat
currency
and
they
receive
it
as
a
text
message
on
their
phone
and
able
to
exchange
for
goods
and
services.
So
what
this
shows
is
the
digital
education.
H
D
Just
one
example
on
that
so
every
time
I'm
traveling
in
Kenya,
Ethiopia
and
Nigeria
I'm,
not
using
my
card
I'm,
not
using
Fiat
I'm,
only
using
peer-to-peer
moving
U.S
a
stable
coin
to
local
currency,
either
through
online
banking
or
through
m-pesa,
and
basically
pray
for
every
single
bill,
even
small
little
shop
to
get
a
candidate
to
the
boat
ride
in
the
middle
of
a
village
or
whatever,
using
that.
So
some
of
the
infrastructure
actually
is
way
more
sophisticated
than
what
you
have
in
the
West
in
terms
of
payment
systems
and
all
of
that
yeah.
H
D
H
H
We
are
glad
the
new
president
of
Kenya
is
saying:
we
need
to
remove
people
from
The
Blacklist,
because
most
people
who've
done
mobile
money
borrowing
and
they
were
not
able
to
pay
in
some
Blacklist
and
they
cannot
borrow
again
so
we
we
feel
we
need
to
to
open
access
to
credit
and
in
a
way
build
build
economic
identities
through
their
transactions,
which
now
we
can
help
them
access,
cheaper
loans.
Here.
G
Well,
I
just
wanted
to
add
in
the
areas
of
remittance
as
well
is
what
the
the
benefits
so
remittance
of
not
everybody
knows
is
when
you
send
money
from
to
back
to
your
home
country,
and
so
those
also
have
like
a
middle
cost
as
well,
and
then
the
like
efficiency
of
sending
cryptocurrency
and
the
immediateness
of
it
as
well
as
a
benefit,
and
that's
like
a
billion
dollar
industry
right
there.
So
I
think
that
we
have
an
opportunity
really
because
they're
already
using
peer-to-peer
to
kind
of
merge
that
and
also
get
paid
in
crypto.
D
Of
all
crypto
transactions
are
cross-border
transactions,
so
the
remittance
part
is
actually
really
huge
and,
and
a
huge
part
of
it
has
been
driven
by
shortage
of
foreign.
Currency
is
really
really
hard
to
access
dollars
and
a
big
part
of
it
is
we're
just
not
exporting
enough
as
we're
importing
and
some
countries
keep
part
of
their
foreign
currency
Reserve
in
the
French
treasury.
So
just
to
give
you
some
education
here,
there's
this
thing
called
the
CFA,
which
stands
for
French
colonies
of
Africa.
14
countries
are
on
it,
it's
Saturday
1945..
D
What
that
basically
means
is.
They
have
a
second
currency
called
CFA
in
relation
to
their
local
currency
and
in
return
they
have
to
deposit
50
percent
of
their
foreign
currency
Reserve
in
the
French
Treasury,
and
the
French
government
also
determines
sort
of
how
much
you
can
borrow
land
and
all
of
that
as
a
nation
and
basically
you're
earning
income,
but
half
of
it.
You
don't
get
to
bring
it
to
your
country,
and
that,
basically,
is
in
some
parts
like
it's.
D
Some
people
say
it's
helping
create
lower
inflation
compared
to
other
countries,
but
you
don't
have
autonomy
over
your
money
and
it
creates
such
a
huge
need,
and
so
you
go
to
Ethiopia.
For
example,
there's
a
hundred
percent
premium
for
accessing
dollars
and
stable
coins.
So
you
basically
paying
twice
as
much
for
one
dollar
as
the
bank
rate
is
you
go
to
Nigeria?
D
Last
week
it
was
70
premium
compared
to
the
bank
rate,
because
there's
such
high
demand
for
foreign
currency
and
people
are
basically
overriding
that
and
using
peer-to-peer
stable
coin
to
basically
buy
things
from
overseas.
In
order
to
sell
like
how
can
you
do
any
type
of
Commerce
if
our
global
economy
is
highly
interconnected,
so
the
the
remittance
part
is
actually
to
me
is
like
more
than
a
trillion
billion
dollar
industry
across
the
continent,
and
we
still
haven't
fully
cracked.
It
I.
F
F
So
many
countries
like
South
Africa's,
Financial
Services
System,
is
completely
different
from
Kenya's
yeah
and
the
solutions
we
might
need
are
very
different,
like
maybe
we
share
similarities
with
sort
of
alternative
sources
of
credit,
but
in
terms
of
peer-to-peer
challenges
or
something
it's
it's.
You
know
it's
fundamentally
different,
so
I
think
when
you
guys
and
anyone
speaks
about
it.
B
don't
speak
about
it
as
one
monolith.
You
know
idea,
there's
so
many
different
countries
and
cultures
and
situations
that
can
be
built.
I
E
Yeah
so
I
think
one
of
the
most
impactful
areas-
I
live
in
Trinidad
and
Tobago,
and
my
mother
lives
in
Kenya
and
during
covet,
I
had
to
send
money
to
her
and
I
think
the
payment
reels
that
were
available
at
the
time.
There's
virtually
no
way
for
me
to
send
money
from
my
Trinidadian
Bank
to
her
Canyon
Bank.
E
E
I
got
her
on
to
crypto,
and
life
is
a
lot
easier
now,
so
I
just
want
to
I
just
want
to
shout
out
like
some
of
those
practical
examples
and
I
know.
This
is
an
eth
conference,
but
bitnob
is
using
the
Bitcoin
lightning
Network
right
now
and
they
launched
and
you
could
actually
trade
and
send
like
do
foreign
remittances
directly
to
m-pesa,
using
the
Bitcoin,
lightning
Network
and
those
are
some
of
the
like
interesting
applications
that
we
need.
E
But
specifically
one
of
the
areas
that
I
think
would
be
is
actually
severely
constrained
is
like
on-ramps
and
off-ramps
and
I
don't
want
to
preempt
the
next
conversation,
which
is
like
regulation,
but
on-ramps
and
off-ramps
continue
to
be
like
a
bit
of
a
constraint
and
so
right
now
we
have
a
lot
of
peer-to-peer
mechanisms
that
allow
people
to
exchange
Fiat
for
crypto
and
the
and
there's
there's
need
for
some
some
level
of
just
base
Innovation
and
Regulatory
support,
so
that
we
could
actually
have
sufficient
well
clear,
clear,
clear,
specifically
on
ramps,
because
Regulators
realize
that
they
could
actually
stop
crypto
on
ramps
and
that
helps
keep
the
foreign
currency
within
the
area.
E
But
I
did
want
to
also
talk
about
this,
not
just
in
the
context
of
foreign,
remittances
and
Africans
need
money
and
send
us
a
dollar
a
day,
but
specific
Innovation
on
I.
Just
hope
I
was
hoping.
Ben
could
give
us
like
a
tldr
of
what
he
does
and
the
specific
Innovation
that
he's
doing
set
at
the
defy
space
and
specifically
with
insurance.
So
Ben.
Could
you
just
give
us
like
a
overview
of
what
you
do,
because
I
think
it's
one
of
the
most
Innovative
Concepts
I've
heard
thank.
H
You
thank
you
very
much
so
for
for
us,
we
we
Endeavor
to
solve
the
the
insurance
penetration
problem,
so
there
was
only
two
percent
penetration
of
insurance
for
the
Agri
sector,
so
the
target
was
enterprising
individuals
who
were
able
to
generate
some
small
income.
H
How
can
we
ensure
they're
able
to
generate
this
consistently
and
it
can
help
them
grow
and
eventually,
without
any
help
from
outside,
they
can
build
themselves
so
because
we
realized
one
event
like
one:
drought
wipes
out
their
savings
wipes
out
their
money
to
use
for
next
season
money
to
pay
for
school
fees.
So
we
went
so
we
started
with
the
farmers
and
we
we
actually
realized.
The
lack
of
participation
in
insurance
is
the
lack
of
trust,
so
they
they
would
receive
Insurance
somebody
saw
the
problem.
H
Traditional
insurance
companies
came
in
brought
in
agents
who
sold,
but
then
they
disappeared.
You
don't
see
them
after
six
months
again,
when
the
next
season
comes
when
it's
when
they
come,
then
when
it
comes
to
payouts,
we
don't
know
how
much
when,
how
it's
all
a
black
box,
we
it's
very
opaque.
So
with
that
problem,
we
now
put
this
on
blockchain,
where
now
we're
able
to
put
up
the
triggers,
so
we
are
paying
it's
parametric
insurance.
H
So
if
there
is
rainfall
below
a
certain
parameter,
then
we
trigger
a
payout
and
that
list
is
generated
and
connected
to
mobile
money,
which
Now
using
a
smart
contract.
It's
able
to
constantly
check
the
existing
weather
conditions
we
and
then,
after
a
period
of
time,
it
can
say
now
pay
out
this
amount
of
money
to
this
person.
The
second
thing
using
ussd,
that's
where
you
dial
State
hundred
hash
Etc.
The
farmers
can
now
check
the
status
of
their
policy
by
dialing,
thou,
be
told.
Okay,
you
have
triggered
25
percent.
H
D
Yeah
I
really
like
the
experimentation
around
the
insurance
space
because
we'll
like,
as
you
said,
we
talk
a
lot
about
finance
and
it's
all
about
sort
of
sending
receiving
money
and
also
just
local
payment
systems.
But
if
you
think
about
all
the
different
sophisticated
economic
and
financial
infrastructures
that
you
need
basically
we're,
we
have
some
things,
but
we've
got
a
lot
to
build
and
I
think
what
web3
rails.
D
D
Actually,
it's
not
that
simple,
because
you're
entering
a
whole
economic
environment,
where
Dynamics
are
very,
very
different
from
what
you're
used
to
and
I
think
what
your
your
example
really
shows:
sort
of
how
you
can
build
a
bottom-up
solution
to
addressing
such
a
huge
Market.
B
D
Let's
talk
regulation
and
policy,
but
before
we
jump
into
like
the
specifics,
I
guess,
one
thing
I
like
to
mention
is
a
lot
of
the
conversations
about
crypto
policy
that
have
happened
so
far
with
policy
makers
is
hey.
How
can
we
legalize
this
token?
How
can
we
buy
this
crypto?
How
can
we
make
it
easier
to
sell
and
I
think
some
conversations
that
really
missing
is
really
zooming
out
and
helping
educate,
African
policy
makers
and
leaders
like?
Why
should
we
move
to
a
digital
economy?
D
Let's
have
that
broader
conversation
to
really
help
understand
why
we're
in
it
and
then
the
token
is
really
the
last
part
of
the
discussion
and
like
walk
through
the
the
whole
journey
of
why
this
makes
sense
for
you
why
you
all
have
actually
more
sovereignty,
more
income,
more
stability
and
like
make
building
that
narrative,
so
I
just
want
to
kind
of
point
out.
That's
the
scenario.
That's
really
missing,
but
I
think
it
is
important
for
us
to
also
talk
about
the
regulatory
conversation
specifically
to
access
to
financial
services.
E
Yeah
so
so
I
hail
from
Kenya
and
we
have
one
of
the
most
vocal
Central
Bank
well,
one
of
the
most
vocal
Governors
who
speaks
very
negatively
about
crypto.
So
he
is
very
team
ngmi
and
we've
seen
how
that
has
stifled,
stifled,
Innovation
inside
of
the
crypto
space,
because
we
had
startups
that
would
have
would
have
would
have
been
much
further
along.
This
is
five
years
ago
and
I
won't
go
into
the
specifics
of
all
the
drama
that
that
occurred.
E
But
essentially,
when
we,
the
the
level
of
the
intervention
that
is
actually
required,
is
a
lot
more
education
around
well,
the
education
director
towards
policy
makers
and
regulators
and
specifically
showing
their
models
of
how
regulation
could
actually
work
instead
of
this
particular
space.
That
makes
things
that
that
basically
allows
Innovation
and
and
and
development
to
actually
occur
inside
of
the
ecosystem
and
I.
E
Think
a
lot
of
a
lot
of
the
Paradigm
that
they
basically
come
from
is
that
they
see
they
see
crypto
as
being
like
opposed
to
what
they
are
trying
to
do
and
to
their
existing
Financial
system.
E
While
it
is
actually
complementary-
and
so
we
need
a
lot
more
education
in
in
actually
showing
that
no
there's
actual
there's
actual
economic
impact
and
value
in
you,
creating
a
favorable
regulatory
environment
for
the
adoption
of
crypto
and
I,
think
Sheedy
was
telling
us
a
story
about
how
they
intervened
in
in
Uganda
and
the
central
bank
said
we
don't
want
crypto,
we
don't
want
to
see
anybody
using
crypto
and
they
went
and
they
had
conversations
with
the
with
the
regulators
and
they
were
able
to
change
and
a
few
weeks
later
there
was
actual
development.
E
We
have
no
such
luck
in
Kenya,
but
those
are
the
types
of
conversations
that
I
think
we
need
to
have
in
terms
of
just
exposing
the
complementary
nature
of
of
crypto
hell.
Even
if
even
if
it's
a
cbdc
I'll
I
will
take
it,
but
yeah
yeah.
F
I
know
what
we've
done:
We've
working
with
us,
African
Reserve
Bank,
so
our
Central
Bank
and
they've
funded
two
masters
students
and
a
PhD
student
to
do
thesis
research
around
Financial
stability
and
crypto
guarantees
and
they're
now
coming
to
the
table.
If
you've
listened
to
the
South
African
kavana
before
they
were
very
anti-cryptocurrency,
but
in
the
last
two
months
they
are
now
forcing
all
the
local
banks
to
reopen
their
accounts
of
the
cryptocurrency
exchanges-
and
this
is
months
of
us-
is
going
back
and
forth
than
speaking
to
them.
F
Imagine
getting
Master
students
to
write
a
thesis
topic
over
two
years
and
they
were
starting
to
listen.
We
think
you
know
because
he
writed
that
stifle
Innovation
a
lot
and
African
government,
so
I
hate
to
to
generalize.
They
want
control
of
everything
and
unfortunately,
in
this
game,
that's
not
how
it
works.
So
I
I
hope
to
still
hear
different
yeah.
D
When
I
actually
talk
to
people
who
are
working
directly
with
central
banks
across
African
countries,
the
sentiment
that
I'm
hearing
is
actually
they're
not
categorically
opposed
to
this
space.
So
it's
not
sort
of
a
fundamental
like
no,
no,
no,
the
challenge
that
I
don't
know
about
Kenyans,
but
maybe
I'm
talking
from
the
Nigerian
lens
here
now.
D
The
the
Nars
that
I'm
hearing
is
actually
that
they
are
trying
to
get
to
act
more
financial
sovereignty
like
themselves,
because
there's
a
lot
of
foreign
interference,
there's
a
whole
lot
of
dependence.
Even
for
printing
your
own
currency,
more
than
40
African
countries
prints
their
bills
overseas
and
they
pay
six
percent
fee
on
all
the
currency
that
they
have
shipped
to
their
country.
To
whoever
is
doing
the
printing
press,
work
and
I.
D
Think
they're
interested
in
central
cbdc's
I
think
they're,
like
what
I'm
hearing
is
they're
building
like
an
internal
Network
across
many
central
banks
across
the
whole
continent,
to
even
be
able
to
do
settlement
amongst
one
another
without
having
to
go
through
Swift
or
without
having
to
go
through
these
major
Global
players
and
having
to
use
US
dollars
or
Euro,
and
all
of
that.
So
that's
those
are
the
problems
that
they're
trying
to
Grapple
with
and
so
I
think
working
with
them
on
a
step-by-step
basis.
H
Term
yeah,
let
me
allow
some
government
institutions,
because
we
have
others
who
are
really
helpful
in,
for
example,
the
capital
markets,
where
they're
creating
a
Sandbox,
they
say
come
and
experiment
with
anything
that
is
looks
like
a
security
which
includes
crypto.
So
this
is
giving
people
opportunity
to
to
apply
then,
for
example,
the
regulator
in
Insurance
also
has
a
Sandbox
come
and
experiment
some
of
the
solutions.
H
So
such
such,
if
we
see
more
governments
going
that
direction
to
be
really
helpful,
because
even
m-pesa,
which
is
now
really
huge
in
the
continent,
began
with
regulation
issues
the
central
bank,
we
do
not
know
where
to
place
it
is
it
under
the
the
bank
side.
Is
it
under
the
saving
side,
so
it
didn't
yeah,
but
because
it
was
just
an
innovation
they
had
to
adopt
so
I
feel
it's
the
same
thing
with
crypto
as
I
read
the
commentary
on
line
it's
a
host
that
has
been
let
out
of
the
race.
H
Now
it's
already
out,
it's
running,
you
can't
block
it.
So
you
yeah,
like
you,
see
one
thing
that
the
government's
also
noticing
is
the
capital
or
the
money
coming
in,
for
example,
in
terms
of
money
that
came
in
in
Africa,
between
May
2020
and
2021
was
1.105.
something
billion
dollars.
So
when
they
see
such
things
they
say,
oh,
it
can
actually
benefit.
You
can
actually
bring
in
development
in
the
country,
so
I
think
more
and
more
The
Regulators
are
changing
their
stance.
G
So,
just
to
add
to
that
politicians
are
motivated
by
their
constituents
right
and
so
why
I
got
into
doubt
governance,
because
I
was
a
political
scientist
as
well.
Is
that
our
systems
weren't
designed
for
us
so
I,
think
Community
design
is
really
important
when
you're
doing
these,
but
also
you
can
engage
people
through
experiential
learning
by
participating
in
governance,
so
they
actually
show
up
for
those
meetings
and
say
hey.
D
I'm
into
that
just
conscious
of
time
here
we
have,
we
had
a
number
of
other
things
to
cover
with
with
you
all,
but
would
be
amazing
just
to
hear
questions
that
people
have
so
that
we
engage
a
bit
more.
Does
anyone
want
to
ask
questions
here.
K
How's
it
going
really
enjoyed
the
panel
I
have
a
lot
of
questions,
but
I'm
just
going
to
ask
too
I
want
to
know
what
are
the
sentiments
of
pan-africanism
in
light
of
crypto
and
how
it
enables
Nations
to
be
a
lot
more
collaborative,
especially
on
one
network
like
ethereum,
and
then
second
question
is
just:
are
you
all
on
Twitter
social
media.
H
For
me,
I
I
can
I
can't,
say
I've
seen
crypto
or
cryptocurrency.
Bringing
people
want
to
become
one
one
African.
No,
it's
still
a
political
issue.
The
economics
of
it
has
not
really
influenced
the
politics
yet
yeah.
K
D
G
I
forgot,
as
one
thing
is,
because
we
can
collectively
you
know,
design
these
systems
or
talk
about
it
in
like
in
a
more
like
greater
light,
but
it
is,
it
has
like
52
countries,
it's
a
continent
right,
it's
very
deep.
It
has
histories
as
well,
and
so
I
think
that
really
aligns
us
is
that
we
have
a
huge
unemployment
rate.
G
You
know
we
have
entrepreneurs
and
we
have
opportunities
to
build
the
continent
better,
but
that
is
not
devoid
of
our
individual,
like
countries
or
cultures,
or
motivations
and
I'm
on
Twitter
I'm
themes
chat,
so
f-e-e-m-s,
chats
c-h-a-t-s.
F
I
think
you're
on
the
pan-african
question.
It's
it's
too
early
to
tell
as
well.
Hopefully
you
know
this
growing
youth
population.
We
might
see
something.
We've
tried
to
bring
different,
African
central
banks
together
to
discuss
crypto.
We
had
a
conference
in
Cape
Town
in
April.
It
wasn't
that
greatly
attended
we're
trying
to
do
them
sort
of
year
on
year
and
we'll
keep
you
updated
there.
My
Twitter
Anda
a-n-d-a,
ngcaba
and
school
thanks.
E
Everyone
yeah.
L
A
E
M
E
Think
I
think
where
actually
just
to
save
on
time,
I
think
what
my
other
panelists
have
said
is
actually
sufficient
and
it
gives
a
really
good
outlook
of
where
we
are
and
I
think
we'll
get
there
eventually.
D
I
have
a
slightly
different
view
like
a
lot
of
the
young
younger
people
like
20
and
under
that
I
engage
with
I,
don't
I,
don't
sense
this
world
view
of
hey
I.
Am
this
identity?
Your
dad
identity,
therefore,
like
we're
in
different
terms,
I
think
the
the
shared
native
that
I
hear
is
we
want
to
thrive
in
this
world.
D
We
want
a
piece
of
this
world
as
much
as
everyone
else
has
right
and
the
aspect
of
just
like
you
know
this
shared
experience
of
you
know
Africa
in
the
current
geopolitical
and
economic
Paradigm
kind
of
being
positioned
right
at
the
bottom.
This
is
like
that
shared
experience.
That's
there
so
I
think
there's
a
there's,
a
comment
as
people
wanting
to
live
a
better
life
and
have
much
of
this
world
that
we
enjoy
here
in
Western
and
in
other
parts
of
the
world
is,
is
something
that
you
know.
D
I
keep
noticing
and
my
Twitter
handle
is
y-o-s-e-p-h-a-y-e-l-e.
E
All
right,
Tony,
Orlando,
t-o-n-y-o-l-e-n-d-o.
A
D
Awesome
well,
thank
you.
I
hope
this
is
just
the
beginning
of
the
conversation
and
I
hope
we
give
you
enough.
Sprinkles
talk
to
us
come
to
the
continent.
Let's
make
Devcon
Africa
happen
somewhere
very
soon,
and
let's
do
this.
C
You
all
right
so
a
couple
of
announcements
before
we
start
our
next
talk.
The
closing
ceremony
is
today
at
3
30
on
the
top
of
the
mountain
and
there's
going
to
be
an
after
party
in
the
Shiva
lounge,
and
also
the
venue
will
be
open
to
anyone
with
a
wristband
on
Saturday
and
Sunday
from
9
A.M
to
6
p.m,
for
co-working.
C
Okay.
So
now
we're
going
to
go
ahead
and
start
our
next
talk
on
the
future
of
social
coordination
of
daos
and
the
talk
is
hosted
by
Chandler
decog,
who
does
growth
strategy
at
Astoria
and
Chandler
focuses
on
building
the
future
of
web
3
by
solving
the
problems
that
matter
to
people
that
work
in
the
space
every
day.
Please
welcome
Chandler
to
the
stage
wait.
A
A
C
C
C
C
Hello,
everyone,
if
you're
here
I'm
introducing
him
again,
but
this
talk
is
on
the
future
of
social
coordination
of
daos
and
the
talk
is
being
hosted
by
Chandler
decoc,
who
does
growth
strategy
at
Astoria?
Chandler
focuses
on
building
the
future
of
web
3
by
solving
the
problems
that
matter
to
people
that
work
in
the
space
every
day.
Please
welcome
Chandler
to
the
stage
foreign.
N
Just
a
quick
shout
out
before
I
get
into
my
talk,
the
previous
panel
that
we
had
before
this
was
wipe
web
3.
Adoption
in
Africa
I
really
loved
that
topic.
It
was
really
great
and
a
shout
out
to
the
fellow
Africans
I
held
from
from
South
Africa.
So
that
meant
a
lot
to
me
so
really
great
to
see
that
today's
talk
is
really
just
around.
Why
do
we
need
doubt
and
why?
Why
do
we
need
to
make
them
better
right?
N
Many
of
us
here
are
probably
endos
and
I
think
we
owe
it
to
ourselves
to
actually
make
them
designed
them
for
humans
and
kind
of
create
a
more
sustainable
system
for
how
dollars
work.
My
name
is
chonda
I
lead
growth
at
Astoria,
and
today's
lesson.
N
Just
thanks
why
the
dollar
experience
sucks
today,
it's
a
story
of
things
that
I've
been
through
in
the
Dow
ecosystem
and
really
the
three
main
topics
I
want
to
cover
today
is
just
things
around
governance,
incentives
and
the
organization
around
thousand,
as
we
as
we
know
them
today,
a
little
bit
about
what
I've
been
up
to
I've
worked
in
over
20
000
projects.
N
At
the
moment,
I
used
to
help
Implement
uma's
kpi
options,
that'll
tie
quite
heavily
into
what
I
will
be
talking
about
today,
I
used
to
work
on
an
optimistic
Governor
module
and
help
spread
awareness
around
just
what
optimistic
governance
is
and
I've
done,
a
ton
of
research,
around
governance
and
incentive
programs.
N
What's
up,
we
all
know
what
a
Dao
is.
I
think
this
group
is
a
little
bit
more
advanced
than
most
of
them,
but
this
is
kind
of
like
a
very
tldr
version
of
how
I
see
the
life
cycle
of
a
dow
start
right
and
that
was
created.
Everyone
joins
they're
excited,
there's
a
lot
of
hype,
a
lot
of
participation
and
a
lot
of
contribution.
N
N
Different
types
of
incentive
structures
are
at
play
at
different
types
of
contribution,
levels
and
skills,
and
then
you
kind
of
like
get
to
a
point
where
that
I
was
in
like
a
sort
of
a
heavy,
medium
State,
and
we
kind
of
continue
to
see
dials
operate
in
the
space
and
their
life
cycle
really
is
captured
in
this.
N
So
if
it
does
operating
you're
in
the
space,
but
really
then
it
kind
of
moves
over
to
when
the
Dow
explodes,
and
there
are
many
examples
of
those
that
will
kind
of
like
just
touch
on
very
briefly.
This
is
where
some
incentive
Dynamics
are
at
play.
N
This
is
where
some
of
the
governance
frustrations
come
into
play,
and
then
this
is
also
around
some
of
the
the
the
concepts
around
like
infighting
and
who
has
rights
in
the
space
and
who
can
contribute
and
who
can
participate,
and
some
of
the
reasons
why
why
does
explode
really
starts
around?
That
right
so
we'll
get
into
some
of
those
in
a
little
bit
but
I
think
the
one
thing
that's.
N
I
think
the
thing
that's
really
important
here
is
the
things
that
don't
work
right,
so
I
spoke
about
Community
contributions
and
participation,
and
those
two
things
are
actually
fundamentally
different.
My
participation
in
a
Dao
is
very
different
to
my
contribution
in
a
dial
and
I
think
the
way
that
dials
were
structured
at
the
moment
in
these
big
monolithic
one
token
one
vote
systems
don't
really
work
because
you're
always
going
to
have
a
sub-optimal
level
of
of
contribution.
Why?
Why
do
I
say
that
right?
So
participation
is
not
the
same.
N
So
when
I,
when
I
have
a
token
Vote
or
a
token
in
a
in
a
dial
and
I
can
vote
on
some
of
the
governance
actions,
I
will
always
give
the
bare
minimum
effort
that
it
takes
to
be
considered
a
contributor
for
future
rewards
and
future
incentive
programs
and
kind
of
just
be
known
in
the
ecosystem.
Most
organizations
actually
Thrive
and
do
better
by
by
individuals
contributing
above
and
beyond.
N
What's
expected
right
like
if
you
think
about
your
job,
you
work
for
an
intrinsic
value
and
an
extrinsic
value
and
those
values
you
combine
kind
of
give
you
what
your
output
is,
and
sometimes
you
know
the
jobs
that
you
don't
like
doing.
You
need
some
extrinsic
motivation
and
the
stuff
that
you
really
like
doing.
You
can
kind
of
just
do
for
free,
right
and
so
con.
N
If
you
think
about
how
down
incentive
structures
are
set
up
at
the
moment,
there
really
is
no
way
to
effectively
convert
people's
lacking
lack
of
willingness
to
participate.
N
Sorry,
a
lack
of
willingness
to
contribute
on
things
that
they
might
not
be.
You
know
so
excited
about
right,
and
if
you
look
at
the
the
vast
majority
of
of
how
how
dow
participation
work
is
really
around
token
rewards
right,
not
every
dollar
has
this,
but
the
majority
of
the
ones
that
we
all
know
today
have
like
a
token
reward
distribution
mechanism
that
actually
just
is
fundamentally
flawed
right,
if
you
think
about
taking
your
token,
that's
that's
going
to
ultimately
govern
your
system
and
airdropping
it
put
it
out
for
liquidity.
N
Mining
rewards
rewards
maximizing
individuals,
they're
kind
of
like
just
do
the
very
least
that
they
can
to
get
the
reward
ground
scraping.
All
of
these
kind
of
Concepts
provide
governance
rights
to
people
in
the
Dow.
That
might
not
actually
be
there
for
the
best
interest
of
the
dumb,
and
we
can
kind
of
see
that,
like
the
reward
mechanism
for
something
like
a
liquidity,
mining
is,
is
not
really
tied
into
the
longevity
of
the
doubt.
Why
do
I
say
that
in
kind
of
the
broader
concept?
N
Well
like
you're,
just
rewarding
capital
for
your
Dow
and
you're,
paying
an
extreme
cost
for
that
liquidity?
Show
your
particle
needs
to
function,
ensure
liquidity
is
King
in
the
in
most
of
the
D5
ecosystems,
But,
ultimately,
you're,
actually
giving
away
governance
rights
to
somebody.
That's
not
going
to
have
a
long-term
aligned
incentive
with
your
with
your
ecosystem,.
N
Okay,
the
things
that
do
work
right
now,
most
of
the
the
protocols
that
exist
today
that
are
highly
successful.
Have
this
like
concept
of
insert
your
protocol
name
labs
and
that's
the
foundation
that
works
on
the
protocol.
Uni
swap
Labs
works
on
uni
swap
I
used
to
work
at
Uma.
We
were
at
risk
Labs
that
helped
build
out
Uma
protocol,
and
these
are
normally
highly
skilled
teams
that
are
well
compensated
and
have
both
intrinsic
and
extrinsic.
Motivation.
N
N
Space
is
actually
going
to
be
an
important
part
of
what
I
want
to
kind
of
like
get
towards,
but
most
of
the
time
relative
to
the
size
of
dials
is
that
they're
small,
highly
motivated
teams
working
on
a
particular
problem
right
and,
if
you
think
about
like
some
of
the
the
dials
that
set
up
this
whole
conference,
the
shelling,
Point,
dial,
small,
highly
effective
team
and
Community
organizations,
the
ethereum
foundation,
again
same
small
small
relative
to
the
level
of
participation
and
most
of
the
people
that
work
on
on
these
protocols
or
these
dials
or
these
kind
of
groups
are
verifiably
credible.
N
So
you
you
know
you.
If
I
want
to
work
in
a
developer,
dial
I
really
need
to
be
able
to
know
how
to
how
to
develop.
So
what
are
some
of
the
lessons?
I
learned
in
my
time,
working
with
all
the
dials
and
kind
of
figuring
out
some
of
the
Dynamics
on
on
like
what
makes
somedao
successful
versus
others
and
I
think
the
one.
The
one
key
message
that
I
mentioned
a
bit
earlier
is
around
passing
the
access
to
the
governance
within
your
ecosystem.
We
do
that
far
too
cheaply
at
the
moment.
N
We
do
it
for
the
wrong
reasons
and
we
reward
the
wrong
types
of
behavior
and
I.
Think
there's
a
very
big
difference
between
what
is
effective
for
your
protocol
versus
what
is
effective
for
your
for
your
governance
and
your
long-term
management
of
your
of
your
of
your
doubt.
N
I
also,
fundamentally,
do
believe
that
the
the
kind
of
examples
that
we
have
at
the
moment,
I
put
up
here
the
sushi
swap
example
that
was
like
the
it
should
be
pretty
much
studied
in
every
Dao
business
school
when
we
eventually
get
to
the
size
of
the
ecosystem.
For
us
to
have
like
Dow,
Business,
Schools
and
Sushi
swap
will
most
likely
be
the
the
core
fundamental
case
study
on
what
what
went
wrong
and
what
are
the
one
of
the
things
that
we
could
do
better
about
that
and
again
token
reward
incentive
programs.
N
A
governance
system
that
was
extremely
monolithic
and
the
participation
in
that
dial
was
was
the
the
individuals
that
had
the
most
context
of
what
they
were
doing
were
being
stifled
by
by
members
of
the
of
the
community.
That
really
didn't
actually
have
the
best
kind
of
input
in
in
that
particular
topic.
N
I,
don't
think
we
should
be
getting
rid
of
big
monolithic,
dials,
we'll
get
into
some
of
the
the
Dynamics
of
how
I
think
they
can
change,
but
really
right
now,
I
think
they're,
extremely
painful
context
is
missing
for
everyone,
I
think
if
you
have
to
vote
on
every
single
vote,
you're
not
going
to
know
everything
that
you
need
to
do
and
why
this
vote
is
important
and
kind
of
like
some
of
the
decisions
that
get
made
Unchained
through
governance
votes
are
also
kind
of
they
don't
actually
need
to
do
that.
N
There's
a
big
difference
between
being
able
to
have
like
a
verifiable
trusted
execution
of
a
particular
outcome
versus
actually
something
where
you
can
just
kind
of
agree.
As
long
as
like
you
know,
there's
some
sort
of
like
soft
consensus
around
something
you
can
kind
of
move
on
and
I.
Don't
think
everything
needs
to
be
voted
on
and
I.
Think
one
of
the
more
important
elements
here
is
that
attention
in
a
Dao,
especially
if
you're
in
many
like
I've
been,
is
a
fading
acid.
Your
token
isn't
the
most
valuable
part
of
your
dial.
N
The
the
number
of
people
are
not
the
most
important
thing
in
your
Dao.
The
attention
that
you
can
Garner
from
people
and
of
particular
types
of
skill
sets
is
the
most
important
and
then
I
kind
of
also
briefly
touched
that
not
everything
needs
to
be
a
blockchain
vote
like
really.
There
are
many
elements
around
like
how
we
can.
What
gets
put
towards
the
vote
and
gets
discussed
is
sometimes
a
bit
over
the
top.
N
Bigger
is
not
better
size.
Size
isn't
really
that
important
in
terms
of
dollars.
N
If
you
look
at
some
of
the
most
effective
teams,
I
remember
how
like
I,
drew
parallels
to
like
highly
effective
teams,
building
out
something
if
you
look
at
the
size
of
uni
swap
their
team
is
famously
small,
yet
they're
the
biggest
asset
swapper
in
our
in
the
in
the
D5
space,
and
if
you
look
at
some
a
team
like
coinbase
famously
large
and
they
roughly
do
the
same
amount
of
volume,
sure
they've
got
differentiating
products
and
sure
it's
not
apples
for
apples
here.
N
But
really
the
concept
here
is
that
bigger
dials
are
not
necessarily
better
you,
the
more
people
that
you
introduce
into
the
dial,
the
more
elements
of
of
like
having
a
a
a
stifling
force
in
your
in
your
dial,
starts
to
become
prevalent,
and
these
like
mass
air
drops
and
these
Mass
token
distributions
I
kind
of
just
go
out
willingly.
They,
they
typically
kind
of
like
help,
perpetuate
that
these
large
dials
and
it's
not
really
designed
for
humans
right.
N
We
we,
as
individual
humans,
only
can
have
X
number
of
contacts
between
between
ourselves
right
sure
you
might
have
10
000
Twitter
followers,
but
you
actually
only
talk
to
five
people
on
your
Discord
or
five
people
in
your
Telegram,
and
then
you
ignore
all
the
rest
of
the
group.
N
Chats
right
so
towers
are
built
by
humans
and
are
for
humans,
and
we
should
always
kind
of
keep
that
as
like
a
core
premise
of
how
we
design
our
interactions,
even
in
the
data
space,
so
I've
I've
had
some
experience
with
some
tools
I'm
going
to
go
through
three
of
them.
This
is
just
from
my
point
of
view
on
some
of
the
things
that
worked
and
what
what
never
worked
so
the
first
one
was
kpi
options
from
the
Uma
protocol.
N
What
a
kpi
option
was,
was
it
basically
a
conditional
payout
token,
where,
let's
say,
for
example,
I
was
a
a
D5
protocol
that
wanted
to
get
increase?
My
tvl,
instead
of
just
Distributing
liquidity,
mining,
Rewards
or
or
doing
an
airdrop
to
kind
of
help
promote
this?
You
you
built
in
a
conditional
metric,
and
you
gave
that
token
to
your
community
members
or
the
stakeholders
that
could
actually
improve
that
and
then,
depending
on
how
that
metric
got
achieved
over
a
period
of
time.
N
You
could
get
more
rewards
and
you
can
kind
of
think
of
this
as
a
really
powerful
primitive
to
to
incentivize
people
kind
of
in
a
decentralized
way
right.
It
was
really
great
for
Community
compensations
because
you
compensated
people
for
an
outcome
that
you
got
and
so
that
outcome
really
really
helped
motivate
the
the
each
individual
kind
of
on
a
on
an
extrinsic
level.
So
you
kind
of
gave
that
reward
for
a
total
outcome.
Token
rewards
and
an
outcome
based
results
were
really
really
useful
for
that.
N
So
let's
say
you
as
a
dollar
really
wanted
to
get
some
something
done,
and
you
would
give
a
reward
or
a
bounty
out
for
it
depending
on
how
well
that
that
outcome
go
how
that
outcome
was
achieved.
You
would
end
up
getting
a
better
result
and
we
found
this
to
be
quite
a
powerful
like
primitive
mechanism,
but
then,
in
my
experience,
I
found
that
there
were
a
lot
of
issues
with
these
conditional
tokens.
N
Firstly
in
Dows,
no
one
actually
knows
in
a
doubt
what
your
important
most
important
metrics
are,
and
this
was
the
most
shocking
thing.
I
ever
experienced,
I'd
walk
up
to
a
team
and
say:
hey
they'll,
come
to
me
and
say:
hey:
do
you
want
to
do
kpi
options
and
I
say
yes,
great
I'm
here
to
help,
and
they
would
end
up
our
first
question.
N
I'd
ask
is,
what's
your
most
important
metric
and
they're
kind
of
like
just
stood
there
and
didn't
know
what
exactly
how
to
answer
that
right
and
then
they
were
competing
discussions
amongst
team
members
and
so
finding
a
core
metric
in
terms
of
what
you
could
do
in
a
dial
might
not
necessarily
be
the
most
valuable
thing
for
that
dial
because
they
there's
there's
a
wide
array
of
things
that
dogs
can
Target,
but
really
when,
when
you
have
too
big
a
dow
or
too
big
a
an
infrastructure,
it's
really
hard
to
figure
out.
N
What's
that
core
premise
of
what
that
does
ultimately
achieving
and
then
on
the
other
side
of
this
is
that
these
kpi
options
were
smart
contracts
and
tokens.
N
There
was
a
lot
of
effort
to
put
into
place
for,
like
smaller,
smaller
incentive
programs
and
in
the
case
of
like
something
like
sushi,
where
the
the
community
really
mistrusted
the
team,
and
there
was
this
conflict.
Kpi
options
made
sense
there,
because
it
was
kind
of
like
an
on-chain
guarantee,
whereas
most
dials
and
most
community
members
really
do
trust
their
dial.
So
just
saying
hey,
we
can
do
this
and
we'll
you
know
give
your
reward
out.
If
we
achieve
these
results
is
actually
something
that
is
a
lot
more
efficient
and
I.
N
The
other
topic
that
I
worked
on
for
a
while
was
optimistic.
Governance
I
call
this
the
lazy,
Dao's
Choice,
optimistic
governance
for
anyone
that
doesn't
knows.
Most
actions
of
governance
get
executed
by
multisigs
multi-cigs
are
a
legal
liability
for
the
signer
and
also
a
security
hole,
and
so
you,
what
you
can
then
do
is
instead
of
actually
submitting
everyone
sign
that
and
again
attention
attention
is
the
most
important
thing.
The
the
multi-sex
sign
is
ultimately
really
struggled
to
to
keep
up
with
the
context
of
everything
that
they're
signing
right.
N
Just
like
every
vote,
you
don't
have
all
the
contacts.
Every
every
signature
for
a
multi
executor
is
the
same.
So
what
you
can
then
do
with
an
optimistic
Governor
is
basically
submit
the
transactions
that
would
execute
on
the
on
the
on
the
on
the
wallet
and
that
execution
can
can
be
vetoed
by
someone
in
an
optimistic
sense.
So
transactions
can
be
submitted
and
all
you
have
to
do
is
have
one
person
disagree
with
it
if
there's
anything
wrong
right,
so
let's
vote
less
on-chain
actions.
So
great
idea
right.
N
There
was
actually
a
talk
on
this
stage
Yesterday
by
someone
called
Isaac
that
that
went
into
a
lot
more
detail.
So
if
you
want
to
know
more
details
of
how
how
that
all
plugs
in
from
snave
slap
to
reality.eve
and
how
that
process
and
the
configuration
of
one
of
these
are
that's
a
great
idea,
but
really
these
are
extremely
new
and
untested,
and
one
of
the
biggest
issues
that
you
can
have
is
you
could
actually
submit
a
transaction
and
if
no
one
is
watching
steal
some
funds
right.
N
Remember
how
I
said
like
attention
is
the
the
most
important
part
of
of
governance,
even
in
a
in
a
tool
that
allows
you
to
govern
in
a
more
optimistic
sense.
N
There's
a
security
hole
there,
because
the
security
is
based
on
the
assumption
that
everyone
is
watching
these
transactions,
so
optimistic
governance,
I
think
also
induces
a
lot
of
anxiety
for
individuals
when
you
as
a
as
an
executor,
execute
a
transaction
on
a
multi-sake.
You
know
when
you
have
to
do
it.
You
can
see
that
transaction.
You
know
nothing's
going
to
happen.
If
you
don't
do
something.
N
The
dynamic
with
optimistic
governance
is
flipped
around
where,
if
you
don't
look
at
something
something
might
happen
without
you,
you
kind
of
like
paying
attention
and
that's
hugely
scary
right,
you're
not
going
to
be
sitting
here
going
every
single
time
checking
your
multi-sig.
If
there's
a
new
proposal
for
a
transaction
coming
through
and
so
conceptually
I
think
optimistic
governance
doesn't
really
sit
so
well
for
those
that
are
lacking
in
attention
or
super
monolithic,
and
maybe
they
can
be
a
bit
more
effective
at
the
smaller
scale
and
also
a
smaller
treasury
size.
N
So
Isaac
yesterday
I
spoke
about
how
he
stole
17th
ethically,
he
returned
it
because
the
safe
snap
team
weren't
paying
attention
right
and
they
even
paid
attention,
try
to
catch
him
out,
and
so
they
blocked
the
transaction
he
re-initiated
and
then
they
forgot
to
pay
attention
again
and
then
he
ended
up
draining
that
small
honey
pot
and
so
optimistic
governance,
again
kind
of
an
interesting
Dynamic
on
on
how
you
can
like
improve
just
that
monolithic
governance
size,
but
really
the
most
important
thing
that
I
think
I
I've
seen
be
a
lot
more
effective.
N
In
my
time.
Is
this
concept
of
PODS
unit
to
cause
there's
not
a
clear
vernacular
on
exactly
what
we're
going
to
call
this,
but
these
small,
highly
effective
teams
that
fit
together
within
a
larger
organization
and
these
effective
teams,
basically
are-
are
focusing
on
One
Core
element
right
Mega.
Does
this
in
a
in
their
kind
of
units?
Breakup
and
that's
somewhat
have
has
somewhat
been
effective
and
they
largely
live
within
the
maker
ecosystem.
N
But
if
you
look
at
something
on
how
how
you
can
kind
of
compose
these
core
units
into
something
that's
far
more
effective,
you
can
actually
start
moving
your
core
mini
dial
or
core
mini
units
or
pod
to
other
dials
right.
So,
not
only
can
you
live
with
the
dial
within
isolation.
You
can
start
having
this
Hub
and
spoke
mechanism
where
you
get
dials
within
dials
and
those
dials
help
out
other
dials,
and
you
can
kind
of
see
a
far
more
interconnected
world.
N
N
They
can
govern
themselves
with
a
choose
that
to
be
optimistic
or
not
or
if
they
do
it
on
a
contract
layer
with
the
multi-sig
or
they
just
trust
someone
in
intrinsically,
but
we
can
kind
of
see
that
these
core
units
become
really
really
effective
and
I
I'm
sure
many
of
you
have
been
to
some
of
the
side.
Events
that
happen
at
this
conference
and
many
of
those
side,
events
actually
are
done
by
core
units
and
those
core
units
can
actually
be
helpful
to
other
teams.
N
So
the
one
that
with
one
example,
is
that
Divinity
event
last
night,
I
went
to
it
for
a
little
bit
and
they
can
that
team
really
highly
effective,
can
do
side
events
for
a
bunch
of
other
dowels
or
or
projects
if
they,
if
they
so
choose,
Joe
highly
effective
core
units
that
govern
themselves
that
fit
within
a
larger
organization
or
can
be
part
of
multiple
organizations
is
extremely
far
more
effective
and
a
better
return
to
scale,
and
so,
ultimately,
what
I
kind
of
get
towards
is
what
does
the
future
look
like
with
the
kind
of
lessons
that
I've
learned
and
some
of
the
the
things
that
I've
seen?
N
So
what
does
the
future
look
like
to
me?
I.
Think
any
sort
of
data
structure
needs
three
core
elements:
it's
incentive,
it's
a
an
incentive
program,
it's
governance
and
it's
organizations.
You
really
want
a
small
team
of
Highly,
Effective
and
motivated
individuals
to
work
on
a
particular
project
or
a
particular
problem
that
they
all
agree
is.
N
Is
the
common
goal
that
they're
wanting
to
work
at
work
on
and
that
the
smaller
you,
the
smaller
your
unit
or
the
more
effective
your
unit,
the
more
the
more
you
can
do
in
a
daily
basis,
and
the
other
side
of
that
is.
You
can
even
have
these
small
units
within
a
larger
organization.
Right
people
naturally
like
to
fit
within
a
small
group
and
that
small
group
can
identify
as
part
of
a
big
ecosystem.
N
All
right
and
then
the
other
one
was
being
clear
on
participation
versus
contribution
right
I
can
participate
in
the
ethereum
ecosystem.
I
can
also
contribute
to
the
ethereum
ecosystem.
Those
two
things
I
think
are
really
really
really
important
to
be
to
be
very
clear
on
when,
when
you're
kind
of
working
in
in
a
doubt,
right,
I'm
part
of
a
many
many
discords.
N
But
I
do
participate
in
many
of
them
and
keep
up
with
the
news
and
as
I
as
a
participant
in
many
dials
I
know
what
my
role
would
there
be
is
I
have
a
vested
interest,
whether
it
be
intrinsic
or
extrinsic
to
want
to
make
sure
that
that
dial
survives
and
grows
and
becomes
a
vibrant
ecosystem
within
the
contribution
side
should
be
an
active
decision
from
my
side
to
contribute
in
that
space
and
I
think
that
right
now,
a
lot
of
people
mistrude
being
a
contributor
versus
a
participant,
and
you
get
a
lot
of
armchair
commentary
from
participants.
N
Pretending
to
be
a
contributors
and
I
feel
like
that
often
is
quite
a
stifling
force
with
any
sort
of
like
governance
issue
in
action
now
now
being
a
participant
that
raises
a
valid
concern
and
a
valid
issue
is,
is
not
kind
of
the
point
I'm
touching
on
here.
N
The
point
is,
is
when
a
participant
that
has
no
understanding
of
the
problem
that
that
the
contributors
are
working
on
is
is
a
big
issue
like
I
can't
tell
you
how
many
times
you've
seen
like
these
long
well
thought
out
Forum
posts,
and
you
just
see
two
three
people
go.
No.
N
This
doesn't
make
sense
to
me:
I,
don't
I,
don't
like
it
in
in
Forum
posts,
and
that
governance
happens
on
a
lot
of
these
foreign
posts
and
that's
that's
sort
of
like
disheartening
to
the
actual
contributors
that
leads
to
the
inviting
and
the
ultimate
explosion
of
of
the
doubt
cool.
So
that's
mainly
what
I
want
to
do
and
talk
about
today.
I
have
one
last
shout
out
to
do.
N
Not
really
relate
it
to
to
my
talk,
but
my
ex-colleague,
Clayton
at
umer
sent
out
the
Tweet
where
he
is
asking
everyone
for
for
laptops.
Phones,
you
know,
for
everyone.
That's
got.
That's
upset
secure
that
bought
a
new
phone
bought
a
new
laptop
for
for
Columbia.
You
can
actually
put
that
to
use
these
are
going
to
to
students
for
on
an
education
path
to
basically
learn
have
the
access
to
the
internet
to
to
kind
of
just
learn
and
there's
going
to
be
web
3
Focus.
N
So
it's
basically
onboarding
more
people
in
the
web
3
for
people
that
are
in
need
he's
really
collected
over
20
devices,
I
think
actually
I
didn't
I
checked
with
him.
Yesterday,
it's
closer
to
50
at
the
moment.
So
if
you
have
a
new
phone
or
if
you
have
an
old
phone
or
an
old
laptop
or
an
old
iPad,
any
internet
connected
device
downstairs
in
the
in
The
Vibes
room
with
the
chair
in
the
music
there's
a
guy
there,
that's
called
John.
You
can
drop
your
device
there.
N
If
you
do
want
to
still
contribute
to
this-
and
you
don't
have
your
device
here
here.
I
also
recommend
handing
it
over
into
someone
in
Miami.
They
do
have
an
office
there,
so
if
you're
in
the
US,
you
can
also
contribute
to
this,
and
this
I
think
is
just
a
really
great
way
to
say.
Thanks
to
the
the
team
in
Bogota
and
the
entire
city
for
hosting
us,
it's
been
a
really
exciting
experience
and
I've
really
loved
my
time
here
in
Bogota.
So
thank
you
to
Bogota.
This
is
a
good
way.
O
You
mentioned
you
know
small
teams
working
towards
a
common
goal,
but
I
didn't
see.
You
talk
much
about
how
you
come
up
with
that
common
goal
and
how
all
these
small
teams
could
agree
on
that
common
goal,
because
that's
in
my
experience
has
been
a
big
problem
in
a
couple
dollars
where
they
don't
agree
on
the
common
goals.
So
then
they
break
apart
in
their
own
ways,
and
the
arguing
starts
happening.
N
Yeah
I
think,
naturally,
when,
when
like-minded
individuals
get
in
a
room,
they're
often
like
oh,
this
is
the
this
is
the
problem
that
we're
working
on.
This
is
the
kind
of
solution
that
we're
working
on.
N
Let's
go
do
that
right,
like
I
I'm,
gonna
use
the
sharing
Point
example
again,
they're
fundamentally
there
to
like
help
public
goods
and
the
the
conversation,
the
discourse
and
the
whole
like
Dynamic,
around
public
goods
funding,
and
so
they
they
all
work
towards
that
common
goal
right
and
if
you
no
longer
want
to
work
in
that
common
goal,
you
can
go
in
and
out
to
that.
That
was
like
an
organic
formation
based
on
people
just
coming
together.
I
think
dials
that
come
together
that
aren't
part
of
a
like
common
goal.
N
They
just
kind
of
want
to
you
know,
get
get
together,
I
think
that's
more
like
a
social
club
and
so
I
think
I,
think
being
intentional
about
what
you
want
to
do
with
a
group
of
individuals
is,
is
multi,
it's
extremely
important
right,
because
then
you
can
direct
your
effort.
You
can
direct
your
attention
and
you
can
direct
your
your
your,
like
common
Collective
outcomes,.
C
A
A
A
A
C
C
C
On
the
top
of
the
mountain
followed
by
an
after
party
on
the
Shiva
lounge,
and
also
the
entire
venue
will
be
open
on
Saturday
and
Sunday
from
9
A.M
to
6
p.m,
for
co-working,
for
anyone
who
has
a
Defcon
wristband,
but
please
join
me
in
welcoming
our
next
speaker,
who
is
going
to
be
talking
about
growing
the
global
ethereum
community,
Through
localization
we're
going
to
be
joined
by
Luca,
who
is
on
the
translation
team
for
ethereum.org
and
also
works
on
the
ecosystem
development
team
at
the
ethereum
foundation.
Please
welcome
me
in
joining
Luca
foreign.
P
My
name
is
Luca
and,
as
Madison
already
mentioned,
I
work
on
ethereum.org,
mostly
focusing
on
the
translation
program.
Thanks
for
coming
to
this
talk,
it's
happy
to
see.
There's
interest
in
this
topic,
which
is
something
I
feel
quite
strongly
about
being
in
South
America
for
this
Defcon,
which
is
Amazing
by
the
way
big
shout
out
to
the
Defcon
team,
yeah.
P
P
However,
with
ethereum
as
a
technology
growing
and
improving
a
lot
of
the
focus
is
and
will
continue
to
shift
towards
other
things
like
education,
Community,
Building
inclusivity.
This
talk
will
touch
on
all
three
of
those
as
they're.
Often
closely
related
ethereum
is
a
global
technology
that
is
inclusive
and
accessible
at
its
core.
However,
a
lot
of
the
content,
including
educational
content,
application
front
ends,
websites
or
anything
else.
People
use
to
interact
with
or
learn
about,
ethereum
is
usually
not
very
inclusive
and
accessible,
as
it
is
often
only
available
in
English.
P
You
can
see
some
stats
for
Languages
by
the
number
of
native
and
non-native
speakers
here.
Just
two
numbers
that
I'd
quickly
highlight
are
over
7
000
languages
in
the
world
and
10
languages
with
more
than
200
million
speakers.
P
P
So
English
is
the
most
widely
spoken
language
in
the
world
as
a
first
and
second
language.
It
is
also
the
it
is
also
the
most
learned
language
in
the
world
as
a
second
language,
and
yet
still
only
about
17
percent
of
the
world's
population
speaks
English
at
all.
If
we
really
want
to
gain
worldwide
adoption
and
on
board
the
next
billion
people
to
ethereum,
we
need
to
remove
this
language
barrier
and
make
our
websites
documentation
and
apps
available
to
everyone.
P
I
know
we
don't
like
to
compare
this
space
with
traditional
companies
or
existing
Tech
Giants
due
to
different
ideologies,
goals
and
approaches,
but
the
fact
is
that
they've
all
done
a
great
job
at
gaining
worldwide
adoption
and
increasing
their
total
addressable
Market,
including
by
breaking
down
language
barriers.
This
list
could
really
go
on
forever,
but
I'd
just
like
to
highlight
a
couple
of
examples.
The
most
popular
websites
in
the
world
by
traffic
are
Google,
YouTube,
Facebook
and
Twitter.
P
They
are
also
available
in
150,
80,
46
and
111
languages
respectively,
and
they
all
get
billions
of
views.
These
companies
aren't
translating
all
of
their
content
just
for
the
sake
of
it.
They
are
all
aiming
to
address
and
be
accessible
to
the
global
population
and
realize
that
by
providing
their
content
only
in
English
they
would
be
limiting
their
target
audience
by
about
80
percent.
P
Another
example
that
more
people
here
might
relate
to
is
Wikipedia,
which
doesn't
make
money
from
visits
and
is
essentially
a
public
good,
while
not
exactly
accurate.
Based
on
the
definition,
you
could
also
think
of
Wikipedia
as
being
open
source.
It
is
available
in
well
over
300
languages
simply
because
its
purpose
is
to
be
inclusive
and
accessible,
and
its
target
audience
is
the
entire
world.
P
An
english-only
Wikipedia
would
definitely
not
be
the
seventh
most
visited
website
in
the
world.
Yesterday
about
48
of
all
page
views
on
Wikipedia
were
in
English.
However,
the
English
version
of
Wikipedia
also
has
about
three
times
more
articles
available
than
most
of
the
other
popular
languages.
So
even
this
48
number
isn't
telling
the
whole
story.
P
In
fact,
Wikipedia
gets
about
seven
times
more
page
views
in
English
than
in
Japanese,
but
the
number
of
Articles
available
in
English
is
also
five
times
higher
than
in
Japanese,
accessibility
and
inclusivity.
Also
on
the
only
aspects
we
should
think
about
when
talking
about
translations.
Another
one
is
efficiency.
P
P
P
In
that
case,
you
should
still
definitely
be
thinking
about
translations.
Again,
a
lot
of
chat,
stats
to
choose
from
I've
just
identified
a
couple
that
I
think
are
pretty
telling
from
a
company
perspective.
Fortune
500
businesses
that
invested
in
Translation
were
one
and
a
half
times
more
likely
to
observe
an
increase
in
Revenue
and
the
second
one.
Fortune
500
companies
were
reported
to
be
over
two
times
more
likely
to
improve
profits
when
they
invested
in
translation.
P
And
from
a
user
perspective,
75
percent
of
consumers
are
more
likely
to
buy
products
from
websites
in
their
native
language.
Around
40
percent
of
Internet
users
said
they
will
never
buy
from
websites
that
are
not
in
their
native
language
and
another
stat
that
I've
already
mentioned,
but
is
telling
enough,
is
65
of
non-native.
English
speakers
prefer
content
in
their
native
language,
even
though
they
are
highly
proficient
in
English.
P
P
I
hope.
All
of
these
help
get
the
point
across
which
is
really
as
simple
as
we
should
be.
Translating
more
content,
make
it
more
accessible,
reach
more
people
educate
the
world
about
ethereum
and
onboard
people
from
all
over
the
world
to
this
space,
and
if
anyone
has
found
themselves
thinking
that
they
should
be
consid
start
considering
translations
for
their
content
or
level
up
their
translation
efforts.
We'll
move
on
to
some
concrete
ways
of
how
we
can
solve
this.
P
To
be
honest,
addressing
this
is
pretty
simple.
We
need
to
be
aware
of
why
translations
are
important
and
basically
just
start
doing
it.
My
main
goal
is
just
to
highlight
the
importance
of
translating
content
and
providing
content
in
different
languages,
making
the
space
more
accessible,
onboarding
more
people
to
ethereum.
P
It
is
up
to
individual
projects,
users,
people
organizations,
websites
and
content
creators
to
decide
if
they
want
to
start
translating
their
content
and
expand
their
translation
efforts
going
about.
It
is
fairly
simple.
There's
many
different
approaches
to
take.
For
example,
you
could
just
order
translations
for
your
content
from
a
translation
agency,
or
you
could
create
a
translation,
Bounty
translation
program
or
something
else
to
get
the
community
involved.
P
All
of
these
have
their
advantages
and
disadvantages,
which
we
don't
have
time
to
get
into,
but
you
can
find
more
information
about
all
of
them
online
if
you're
interested
we've
also
come
up
with
a
translation
program
Playbook,
which
is
mostly
aimed
at
ethereum,
related
projects
and
covers
some
of
the
basics
of
translating
content.
You
can
find
it
right
here
if
anyone
is
interested.
P
Hopefully
it
helps
answer
a
question
or
two.
We
created
this
as
a
resource
based
on
our
experience
with
translating
content
on
ethereum.org
and
a
couple
of
other
websites
and,
if
you
do
check
it
out
and
have
any
input
or
feedback
or
can
think
of
a
way
to
collaborate
with
us,
even
if
it's
just
looking
for
help
translating
your
content,
please
reach
out
to
us.
I
will
share
a
bunch
of
contact
details
in
a
minute.
P
I
would
also
like
to
mention
some
of
the
results
that
we've
seen
on
ethereum.org
by
focusing
on
internationalization
ethereum.org
is
an
educational
resource
that
covers
many
different
topics,
has
a
lot
of
resources
for
beginners
to
teach
them
about
ethereum
and
blockchains
to
help
them
get
onboard
it
to
help
them
identify
the
right
tools
to
use
when
they're
new
to
the
space,
so
making
it
accessible
is
very
important
to
us.
There's
also
resources
for
more
intermediate
and
advanced
users.
Community
members
developers,
basically
anyone
else.
P
The
approach
we're
taking
is
very
much
in
line
with
the
open
ethos
of
ethereum
and
focus
on
open
source.
The
website
is
fully
open
source
and
anyone
can
contribute
to
the
content,
features,
code,
design
and
Community
aspects
of
it.
As
well
as
the
translation
process,
since
the
translation
program
launched
in
2019
our
community
of
contributors,
translating
the
website
has
grown
to
over
four
thousand,
the
program
represents
a
simple
and
low
barrier
way
of
getting
involved
and
contributing
to
ethereum
without
needing
a
lot
of
technical,
Knowledge
and
Skills.
Basically,
the
main
requirement
is
just
being
bilingual.
P
These
contributors
are
also
the
main
reason
why
the
website
is
currently
available
in
50
languages
for
quality
assurance
purposes,
we're
also
working
with
a
translation
agency
to
make
sure
that
all
of
the
translations
get
reviewed
before
being
added
to
the
website.
So
our
approach
is
really
a
combination
of
the
community-based
and
professional
localization
processes.
P
The
ethereum.org
translation
program
is
also
very
much
a
community
building
effort,
and
this
aspect
is
an
important
part
of
why
the
community-based
approach
to
translating
website
content
works
for
us
getting
involved
and
contributing
to
the
website
is
a
great
way
to
join
the
ethereum
community.
Make
an
impact
add
some
value,
contribute
to
ethereum
in
some
way,
without
needing
a
lot
of
technical
skills,
and
it's
also
an
amazing
educational
experience.
P
We've
heard
from
many
of
our
contributors
that
the
knowledge
they've
gained
about
ethereum
by
simply
helping
to
translate
the
website
is
immense,
as
it
allows
them
to
really
read
through
all
of
the
documentation
that
is
available
on
ethereum.org,
while
also
contributing
at
the
same
time,
translating
content
has
impacted
the
website
in
different
ways
as
well.
Not
just
building
an
amazing
community
of
people
who
share
our
passion
and
goals
analytics
on
the
website
clearly
showed
that
the
more
translated
content
we
have
accessible,
the
more
non-english
pages
we
get.
P
The
number
of
non-english
page
views
still
depends
a
lot
on
the
general
traffic
to
the
site,
but
the
ratio
is
going
up
constantly.
In
fact,
this
month
has
been
the
12th
straight
month
where
the
ratio
of
non-english
versus
English
page
views
has
gone
up
and
hit
a
record
high
with
non-english
page
viewers,
currently
representing
around
26
percent
of
all
visits
to
the
website
over
traffic
over
a
quarter
of
all
the
traffic
to
the
website
is
in
languages
other
than
English.
P
This
chart
shows
the
total
page
views
on
ethereum.org.
In
the
last
couple
of
years.
You
can
see
the
total
page
views
on
the
website,
the
non-english
page
views
and
the
ratio
between
them,
as
you
can
see,
regardless
of
what
the
general
trend
is
and
how
many
people
actually
visit
the
website,
page
views
and
other
languages
continue
to
Trend
upwards
and
and
now
represent
an
ever-growing
pers
of
of
visits.
P
P
On
ethereum.org,
we
always
appreciate
feedback
inputs,
new
community
members,
new
contributors
to
the
website.
If
you
have
any
feedback
for
us
or
see
a
way
to
collaborate
in
any
way,
feel
free
to
send
us
an
email
to
translations
ethereum.org
if
it's
anything
related
to
translations
or
to
website
at
ethereum.org
about
anything
else.
Really,
you
can
also
stop
by
our
booth
on
the
third
floor.
P
That
should
be
it
for
the
most
part,
I'm
going
to
be
showing
a
cup
like
all
of
the
languages
that
the
website
is
available
in
right
now,
if
you
wanna
surf
the
website
in
your
language,
just
want
to
leave
you
all
with
a
few
few
closing
thoughts.
P
Everyone
should
be
very
proud
of
what
ethereum
has
a
technology
all
the
projects
building
on
top
of
it
and
the
ethereum
community
have
achieved
so
far,
and
we
can
all
be
even
more
excited
about
what
the
future
has
in
store.
There
is
obviously
still
a
lot
of
research,
development
and
building
in
front
of
us,
but
it
I
think
we
can
all
agree
that
we
have
a
lot
of
reasons
to
be
optimistic.
P
P
Repeating
another
number
that
I've
already
mentioned
only
about
17
of
the
world's
population
speaks
English
at
all.
This
doesn't
even
mean
that
they
are
proficient
in
English,
but
that
they
can
understand
the
most
basic
words
and
sentences
in
English.
If
you're
bilingual
translate
content,
create
content
in
another
languages,
make
videos
podcasts,
Twitter
spaces,
whatever
in
your
language,
spread
the
word
and
build
your
local
community.
If
you're
a
project
protocol
dap
website
make
sure
that
your
content
is
available
in
other
languages.
P
C
Q
P
So
we
have
thought
about
this.
A
bunch
really.
One
thing
is
that
we've
seen
is
a
lot
of
the
people.
Have
this
assumption
that
you
need
to
be
highly
Technical
and
have
a
special
skill
set
to
make
an
impact
to
contribute
to
ethereum?
P
We
feel,
like
the
translation
program,
is
a
good
enough
proof
that
that
is
not
the
case.
Anyone
can
get
involved.
Anyone
can
contribute
anyone
can
make
an
impact
and,
like
I've
said,
we've
had
a
lot
of
people
who
started
contributing
to
the
website,
learned
enough
that
and
were
exposed
to
the
community
enough
that
this
led
them
to
get
full-time
jobs
in
the
space
or
create
something
of
their
own.
It's
the
translation
program
in
our
mind,
is
a
great
starting
point
to
join,
contribute,
add
value
and
then
level
up
doing
whatever
people
want.
R
Foreign,
thank
you.
So
much
I
actually
worked
in
an
AI
translation
industry
before
migrating
to
web3.
So
this
topic
is
definitely
very
close
to
my
heart.
I
actually
have
two
questions.
First,
you
presented
the
translation
Playbook,
but
what
are
like
the
efforts
from
the
interior
foundation
on
creating
a
glossary
with
shared
terms
on
the
Webster
space
I
mean
you
mentioned.
Of
course,
like
every
day
we
come
up
with
a
new
technology
with
a
new
term.
R
With
A,
New
Concept,
but
I
think
like
having
those
foundations
would
be
important
to
also
escalate
and
to
also
like
people
create
independent
initiatives
on
translating
the
content.
The
second
one
that
I
wanted
to
mention
translating
text,
let's
say
static
contact.
Con
content
is
already
challenging
enough.
But
what
are
the
also
Alternatives
options?
What
are
like
the
efforts
to
also
translate
videos
infographics
any
kind
of
dynamic
content.
Thank
you.
P
Thank
you.
Those
are
two
awesome
questions
that
we've
really
thought
about
as
well,
so
the
first
one
is,
we
have
a
glossary
that
we
have
been
building
up
through.
Basically,
since
we
started
translating
ethereum.org,
it's
not
open
to
everyone,
but
if
you
visit
the
translation
program
Playbook
or
the
translation
program,
page
John
ethereum.org,
there
are
sections
in
there.
That
basically
say
do
you
want
to
use
any
of
our
resources
reach
out
to
us
and
we
will
share
them.
P
The
reason
they're
not
open
is
because
we're
using
a
translation
tool
that
really
doesn't
make
it
easy
to
share
the
glossary
and
also
another
point
on
this
is
there
are
a
lot
of
independent
efforts
to
create
glossaries
of
terms
for
specific
languages,
countries,
regions
which
I
think
is
what
how
it
should
work.
P
We
make
a
lot
of
efforts
to
translate
the
website
into
as
many
languages
as
possible,
but
not
everything
is
a
problem
that
the
ethereum
foundation
should
be
solving
for
if
you've
listened
to
any
of
the
talks
from
any
of
the
people
at
the
EF.
There
is
this
philosophy
of
subtraction,
which
is
pushing
power
outside
and
empowering
everyone
else
to
do
whatever
they
want
to
grow
ethereum,
and
that
can
mean
a
lot
of
things,
but
that
is
also
creating
glossaries
is
a
good
example
of
that.
P
P
It
didn't
go
great,
it
didn't
go
as
good
as
we'd
hoped,
but
that's
not
to
say
we
won't
pick
it
up
and
try
to
level
it
up
at
some
point
again,
as
far
as
infographics
goes,
there's
been
some
people
on
our
team
advocating
for
creating
infographics
for
the
website
that
are
made
in
a
way
that
they're
easy
to
translate.
C
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
B
B
B
B
B
B
B
B
B
B
B
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
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B
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B
A
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C
C
C
C
Okay,
hello,
everyone
I
hope
you
had
a
wonderful
lunch
break,
just
a
couple
of
announcements
before
we
start
our
next
talk.
We
have
the
closing
ceremony
today
at
3
30
on
the
top
of
the
mountain,
which
is
on
the
fifth
floor
and
then,
after
that,
we
have
an
after
party
in
the
Shiva
lounge
and
one
other
thing
is
that
this
weekend
the
entire
venue
will
be
open
for
co-working
from
9am
to
6
p.m.
C
For
anyone
who
has
a
Defcon,
wrist
band,
okay
and
now
for
our
next
talk
on
the
web,
3
social
layer,
web3,
social,
the
next
way
of
innovation
by
Stoney,
coolidgeoff
stani
is
the
founder
and
CEO
of
Ave
companies.
He
was
studying
law
at
the
University
of
Helsinki
when
he
first
began
learning
about
smart
contracts
and
dust
about
the
ethereum
blockchain
network.
This
led
to
an
exploration
of
how
blockchain
technology
could
impact
the
traditional
Financial
system.
S
Jim,
who
is
feeling
good,
nice
yeah,
so
I
want
to
thank
the
ethereum
foundation
for
organizing
Defcon.
It's
been
very
very
busy
week,
at
least
for
me
and
probably
for
everyone
else.
There's
been
a
lot
of
good
talks
here
and,
and
it's
the
last
day,
so
you
know
the
the
best
talk
is
probably
amongst
here
too,
don't
want
to
brag
too
much,
but
so,
okay,
today
we're
going
to
talk
about
web3,
social
and
as
a
next
innovation.
S
See
if
we
get
this
yeah
perfect,
so
something
I
want
to
talk
about
is
that
The
Innovation
for
the
past
years
or
decades
has
grown
quite
substantially
and
has
accelerated.
S
So
if
you
look
at
that
for
100
years,
we
have
Technologies,
for
example,
like
telephone
that
has
been
invented
over
100
years
ago,
and
it
took
decades
to
actually
adopt
automobiles
cars,
for
example,
took
decades
as
well
and
more
recently,
for
example,
the
television
has
got
higher
acceleration
and
and
also
the
infrastructure
underneath
the
internet,
the
the
computer
and
what
we've
seen
different
kinds
of
patterns
is
that
the
more
we
get
infrastructure,
The,
More,
We
Get,
compounding
acceleration
of
innovation,
and
this
is
one
of
the
reasons
for
why,
for
example,
the
internet
infrastructure
has
grown
substantially
and
if
we
look
into
the
I
guess:
oh
it's!
S
If
you
look
into
the
actually
recent
Innovation,
what
is
happening
in
Internet
ecosystem
is
that
we
have
a
lot
of
adoption
in
a
very
high
acceleration
curve
on
line
so
what
it
means
that
when
you
have
already
a
complete
infrastructure,
it's
very
easy
to
innovate
and
have
this
compounding
effect
and
recently,
we've
seen,
for
example,
Tick
Tock
being
one
of
the
recent
examples
of
of
how
we
had
a
scale
adoption
from
zero
users
to
one
billion
users
in
about
roughly
seven
years
since
the
beginning
and
I.
S
Okay,
oh
cool
yeah,
so
yeah.
So
what
I
want
to
say
is
that
the
internet
adoption
is
global,
so
we're
dealing
with
technologies
that
are
affecting
everyone,
every
single
human
in
the
planet
and
there's
a
large-scale
empowerment
that
is
related
to
not
only
the
internet.
What
what
we're
doing
here
and
the
the
ethereum
community
and
across
across
the
blockchain
space
I
mean
even
though,
with
high
amount
of
adoption
and
penetration,
there
are
still
places
where,
in
some
regions,
the
adoption
of
the
internet
isn't
really
in
its
fullest.
S
At
the
moment,
so,
for
example,
if
you
look
at
the
graph
of
sub
the
sub-Saharan
Africa,
we
have
adoption
of
roughly
30
of
population
using
the
internet
itself.
Colombia
is
at
70,
so
it's
very
Regional
and
and
they're
still
places
where
we
need
infrastructure
to
to
innovate.
S
So
the
way
I
see
how
Innovation
Works
and
specifically,
this
particular
chart
kind
of
like
a
I,
would
say,
like
a
circle
of
different
components,
demonstrates
what
Innovation
is
for
me
like
how
I
approach
Innovation
and
what
are
the
ingredients
to
come
up
with
a
product
and
also
get
that
product
into
a
growth
cycle.
So
obviously
you
have
the
opportunity
there.
So,
basically,
you
recognize
a
a
problem
or
an
opportunity
to
solve
having
knowledge
about
the
problem,
you're
trying
to
solve
expectations,
understanding
what
people
actually
need.
S
The
talent,
the
team
members
that
you're
building
with
and
they
actually
craft
and
the
craft,
is
what
I
call
the
the
product
itself.
Obviously,
there's
things
like
funding
related
and
also
Road
now,
what's
super
exciting
about
web3
and
innovation
in
web3
is
that
we
rely
on
open
networks
and
open
networks.
They
create
accessibility,
so
they
create
access
for
everyone
here
today,
for
example,
to
contribute
not
only
what
we're
building
in
the
other
team,
but
any
project
in
the
ecosystem,
because
they're,
relying
in
the
open
network
idea
and
open
source
technology.
S
Yeah
speaking
of
Technology,
so
yeah,
and
one
important
component
also
is
the
the
the
culture
aspect.
So
culture
equals
for
me
also
community.
S
So
when
you
build
open
networks,
open
infrastructures
you're
actually
in
a
different
kind
of
a
dynamic
setting,
then
as
if
you
will
be
building
a
product
within
a
company
or
a
service,
for
example,
this
means
that
when
you
have
accessibility
people
across
globally,
they
need
to
find
a
way
to
connect,
share
ideas
and
and
build
actually
different
kinds
of
Concepts
and
an
actual
Community
around
a
product,
because
accessibility
also
means
that
the
users
are
the
ones
that
are
part
of
the
Innovation
flywheel
and
in
in
an
important
part
actually
of
making
that
Innovation
happen.
S
One
important
thing
I
have
realized
in
the
past.
That
web3
is
something
that's
going
to
touch
everywhere,
so
it's
not
only
specifically
related
to
one
particular
area
to
solve,
and
we've
seen,
obviously
with
how
web3
has
borne
so
Bitcoin
tried
to
solve
the
idea
of
how
we
can
actually
transfer
value
between
humans
across
globally
without
intermediaries
and
create
a
public
money
as
public
goods
and
obviously
with
the
innovation
of
ethereum
and
the
ethereum
virtual
machine.
S
S
Yeah,
oh
yeah,
good,
so,
but
to
get
actually
beyond
what
we
have
today
in
our
community
and
the
user
base.
We
actually
need
something
more
than,
for
example,
the
essentialized
finance
and
just
an
example
is
that
these
interests
Finance,
is
incredible.
Innovation
what
our
space
has
been
able
to
create.
S
It
means
that
every
one
of
us
has
accessibility
to
a
fair,
transparent
market
across
globally
and
decent
just
Finance
doesn't
look
into
your
background
what
you
are
doing
when
you're
actually
participating
in
these
markets
or
when
you're
building
part
of
the
community,
but
to
get
into
more
bigger
adoption.
We
need
to
realize
that
we
have
to
go
beyond
Financial
applications
and
find
more
things
that
solve
human
problems
and
feed
their
needs
as
well
and
I.
S
Personally,
with
my
team
think
that
social
is
the
next
or
at
least
the
killer
app
for
web
tree,
and
the
reason
is
that
we
currently
have
almost
5
billion
users
on
social
media
and
it's
growing
constantly.
We
also
have
equal
amount
of
almost
equal
amount
of
internet
users,
social
media
users.
Then
we
have
Internet
users,
so
there's
a
big
opportunity
in
social
media.
S
And
we
also
see
that
it's
Global
phenomena
and
effectively,
if
you
look
at
this
chart
here,
we
see
a
lot
of
social
media
usage
in
Southern
America,
but
also
in
Asia,
compared
to,
for
example,
the
regions
of
Europe
and
North
America.
S
And
we
could
actually
ask
ourselves:
why
do
we
have
social
media?
Why
their
why
social
media
is
important
in
in
the
first
place,
so
what
I
have
been
looking
into?
Is
that
there's
definitely
a
need
for
people
to
connect
with
each
other,
for
particular
different
reasons.
S
And
there's
also
need
for
create,
so
humans
has
have
always
had
the
idea
of
being
a
Creator.
So
here's
a
picture
of
one
of
the
oldest
findings
of
creativity
back
in
a
long
long
time
ago,.
S
Pointers
unbelievably
yeah,
so
social
media.
It
allows
us
to
connect
with
people
one-on-one
basis,
create
relationships
and
also
in
groups
coming
together
and
forming
a
community
on
topics
that
we
care
about
care
about.
It
and
social
media
is
very
vital
to
our
lives,
because,
with
internet
and
being
able
to
connect
with
each
other,
we
are
able
to
learn
from
each
other
directly
from
the
people
rather
than
example,
from
institutions.
S
We
also
have
the
sense
of
belonging
when
we
can
create
communities
and
part
of
the
adoption
also
is
that
we
can
actually
do
this
connectivity
in
scale
across
the
globe
and
I
really
love
this
particular
slide,
because
there
is
this
concept
of
Six
Degrees
of
Separation,
which
means
that
we
all
people
here
and
everywhere
are
connected
to
each
other
across
six
hubs
of
friends
of
friends,
so
to
any
person
in
the
planet
and
there's
actually
recent
studies
as
well,
that
this
hope
distance
actually
is
becoming
even
more
narrow,
and
we
see
that
it's
roughly
4.7
degrees.
S
S
So
what
happens
when
we
are
actually
using
social
media
is
that
we
create
Social
Capital.
Social
capital
is
something
we
all
have
regardless
of
the
technology,
so
we
have
social
capital
when
we
are
forming
friendships
when
we
are
connecting
with
people
when
we
are
sharing
ideas
or
sharing
news.
S
The
big
problem
at
the
moment
is
that
we
create
a
lot
of
this
social
capital
actually
online
and
we're
using
platforms
such
as
the
bigger
social
media
platforms,
where
we
are
creating
this
networks
and
connectivity
and,
at
the
same
time,
we're
publishing
content,
and
these
platforms
are
designed
to
thrive
as
a
basic
platform,
instead
of
actually
striving
to
preserve
your
social
capital
or
aligned
with
your
own
ideas.
S
So
what
I
see
is
that
the
web
to
social
is
at
the
moment
a
zero-sum
game,
for
many
participants
that
create
social
capital
and
one
of
the
issues
is
that
all
of
the
users
are
actually
locked
in
a
particular
platform.
So
you
can't
actually
take
your
social
capital
and
do
a
digital
exit
and
transfer
transport
it
to
a
a
new
platform
or
a
new
venue
where
you
might
find
interesting
ways
to
connect
with
your
peers
and
share
ideas.
S
Creators
at
the
current
state,
lack
of
distribution
and
for
the
same
reasons
you
are
locked
in
into
these
particular
platforms
and
also
it's
very
hard
to
actually
monetize
Beyond,
sharing
the
traffic
of
what
you're
getting
to
maybe
your
home
page
and
for
the
developers.
There
is
actually
lack
of
freedom
to
come
and
and
build
and
innovate
ways
to
how
to
connect
with
people
innovate
on
the
experiences
as
well
and
create
new
applications
and
and
new
Networks.
S
So
I
believe
that
web2
social
is
right
for
disruption
at
the
moment
and
I.
Think
pep3.
Social
is
something
that
creates
the
positive
some
value.
So
it
builds
the
value
for
the
users
and
it
builds,
builds
the
value
for
the
community
and
what
I
want
to
introduce
here
is
the
web
free
social
layer,
the
components
that
are
actually
and
the
ingredients
that
bring
that
bring
these
benefits
for
for
all
those
three
parties,
the
users,
the
creators
and
also
the
Developers.
S
So
why
web3
is
a
game
changer,
especially
in
the
social
space,
is
because
the
creators
are
getting
ownership
of
their
content
distribution.
So
you
as
a
Creator,
can
actually
decide
how
you
distribute
content
to
your
audience.
You
also
own
that
relationship
between
you
and
your
peers
and
it's
not
locked
into
a
particular
platform
and
because
you're
not
logged
into
a
particular
platform.
As
a
user,
you
have
the
choice
to
actually
select
the
experiences
and
the
algorithms
that
serve
you
the
most
and
are
aligned
with
you,
the
most
and
for
developers.
S
It
means
also
when
all
of
the
web3
is
built.
On
top
of
the
open
networks,
you
have
the
accessibility
to
improve
these
networks
and
actually
develop
them
further.
So
you
have
access
to
develop
the
networks
and
web3
space
I
mean
it's
still
growing.
Quite
a
lot.
There's
more
investments
in
the
region.
We
also
have
locally
here
in
Colombia.
S
6.1
percent
are
owning
cryptocurrency,
and
we
also
see
here
in
Colombia
that
it's
one
of
the
countries
that
are
getting
accelerated
adoption
at
the
moment,
including
some
of
these
countries
in
Asia
like
Vietnam,
also
India,
turkey
and
and
amongst
others,
so
we're
in
this
perspective,
we're
in
the
right
place
to
talk
about
web3
as
a
an
open
networks
and
and
how
it
could
we
could
build
them
further.
S
There
are
ingredients
that
are
very
valuable
when
you
build
web
tree
social,
so
the
networks
must
be
open,
meaning
that
anyone
can
actually
compute
on
the
data
that
is
on
web3.
Social
can
actually
use
these
components.
Smart
contract
libraries
and
also
take
what
is
already
existing,
improve
it
and
make
it
available
to
people
and
also
one
key
point-
is
the
decentralization.
S
So
what
makes
web3
social
very
valuable
is
the
architecture,
and
the
architecture
is
where
you,
as
a
user,
owned
your
profile
on
chain
and
you
own
your
social
graph
and
connectivity,
which
means
that
you
own
your
social
capital
and
here's
the
social
layer
where
individuals
they
have
their
identity.
You
have
social
verification
when
you
are
connecting
with
the
peers
and
for
the
groups.
S
What
you
can
do
is
that
you
have
community-owned
interest
graphs,
open
algorithms,
so
when
we
take
the
base
layer
and
give
the
ownership
to
the
users
and
what
it
allows
us
to
do,
is
that
first
time
ever,
anyone
can
actually
build
new
algorithms,
and
these
algorithms
do
not
need
to
be
black
boxes.
They
can
actually
be
transparent,
algorithms,
where
developers
are
explaining
what
kind
of
algorithm
and
what
data
points
that
algorithm
is
using,
and
that
brings
alignment
between
developers,
the
users
and
the
communities
and
for
creators.
S
It
means
that
actually,
when
you
own
your
distribution,
Channel,
it
also
unlocks
your
you,
a
new
ways
of
actually
creating
content
and
creating
experiences
based
on
the
web3
social
footprint.
S
And
also
monetization
is
key
part,
so
monetization
is,
and
financialization
is
something
that
is
part
of
the
web
tree
value
proposition
and
with
with
the
idea
of
opening
the
identity.
At
the
same
time,
it
means
that
you
can
actually
own
the
way
you
monetize
and
you
don't
have
to
be
relying
on
the
platforms
but
actually
find
a
venue
with
your
social
graph
and
with
your
profile
and
actually
distribute
the
content
and
monetize
the
way
you
want
so
web3
social.
It
unlocks
the
power
of
creativity
connections
and
it
brings
more
Innovation.
S
So
what
we
did
with
financial
applications,
we
can
actually
do
the
same
for
non-financial
applications
and
the
reason
why
it's
important
for
us
is
that
this
is
this
is
the
path
how
we
can
bring
more
users
into
the
space.
It
means
that
people
who
don't
necessarily
have
that
Financial
Capital
but
they're
rich
on
Social
Capital,
can
actually
have
their
ownership
of
that
and
enter
into
the
space
and
use
non-financial
applications
and
also
generate
value
for
them.
And
what's
interesting
about
social
capital
compared
to
financial
capital?
Is
that
Financial
Capital
you
can
spend?
S
But
social
capital
is
something
that
you
can
carry
through
your
whole
life,
and
this
is
why
we
need
actually
people
to
come
to
the
web
tree
space
to
also
non-financial
applications
and
building
more
utility.
S
So
one
big
question
for
us
is
that
who
will
build
this
new
generation
social
media
applications,
and
we
have
a
perfect
answer
for
this
one?
It's
you
since
you
are
here
at
Devcon
and
it's
a
developer
conference
I'm,
pretty
sure
that
there
are
people
here
that
can
take
the
opportunity
and
build
some
very
interesting
applications
and
use
cases
and
Empower
the
users
and
empower
the
the
the
creators
and
other
developers
and
even
create
social
media
applications
that
have
better
values,
transparency
and
are
aligned
with
with
different
user
bases
as
well.
S
T
Hello,
my
question
is:
I
see
and
it's
hard
to
defeat,
Instagram
or
Facebook,
and
how
do
you
see
as
an
opportunity
like
how
we
as
a
niche
as
a
community
of
people
specific?
But
how
do
you
go
to
the
masses
to
go
to
defeat
Instagram,
for
example?
How
how
do
you
see
it
happening
that
people
will
stop
using
Instagram
and
will
use
another
web
tree
social
media
platform.
S
Yeah,
that's
a
great
question,
I
think.
Well,
there's
a
couple
of
things:
one
is
related
to
the
actual
development,
any
infrastructure,
so
building
applications
for
social
media
should
be
in
terms
of
the
user
experience
at
least
the
same
guarantee
that
you
have
in
normal
web
applications.
S
And
that
means
that,
as
a
user,
you
don't
necessarily
need
to
see
all
the
blockchain
transactioning
and
that
can
happen
in
the
back
end
delegating
signing
power
and
having
a
relayer
to
pay
gas.
So
that's
the
technical
component,
the
the
actual
the
application
and
the
growth
component
will
be
to
create
applications
that
actually
satisfy
new
interest,
graphs
and
New
Way
new
ways
for
people
to
connect
together
and
new
experiences.
S
I
think
I
would
not
go
towards
the
direction
to
build,
rebuilding
a
Twitter
or,
let's
say
an
Instagram,
because
those
networks
are
very
powerful,
so
this
companies
have
worked
for
over
a
decade
or
so
to
actually
make
those
networks
strong
enough
and
because
you
can't
actually
take
what's
yours,
your
Social
Capital
out
of
that
platform,
you're
pretty
much
locked
into
that
Network.
So
it's
more
about
building
the
new
and
showing
why
the
new
is
more
successful
and
why
it's
creating
a
bigger
Network
effect
in
case
of
lens
protocol,
for
example.
S
Every
application
that
is
built
into
on
top
of
the
protocol
actually
is
bringing
the
users
together
across
the
whole
whole
network,
and
those
applications
can
then
decide
what
they
actually
can
curate
and
also
I.
Think
building
better
and
open
algorithms
is
something
that
brings
people
into
the
space,
so
I
would
say,
building
new
and
better
will
be
the
right
answer.
C
Thank
you
so
much.
Thank
you
all
for
coming.
C
C
U
U
C
C
Okay,
everyone
we're
about
to
start
our
next
talk,
but
before
we
do,
I
have
a
couple
of
announcements.
So
today
is
the
last
day
of
Defcon.
The
closing
ceremony
is
today
at
3
30,
on
the
fifth
floor,
top
of
the
mountain,
the
same
place
where
the
opening
ceremony
was,
and
afterwards
in
the
Shiva
Lounge
there's
going
to
be
an
after
party
and
also
this
weekend,
the
entire
venue
will
be
open
for
co-working
from
9am
to
6
p.m.
For
anyone
who
has
a
Defcon
wristband.
C
Okay,
our
next
talk
is
on
mental
health
and
avoiding
burnout
in
your
crypto
gig
and
is
going
to
be
hosted
by
Hudson.
Jameson
Hudson
is
a
long
time.
Ethereum
contributor,
having
previously
worked
an
ethereum,
Foundation,
For
Five
Years
on
numerous
efforts,
including
protocol
development
coordination,
specifications
and
co-running
devcon's,
two
three
and
four:
he
co-founded
the
ethereum
educational
and
coordination
group,
ethereum
cat
herders.
He
has
three
cats
and
five
chickens
and
lives
in
Texas
with
his
spouse.
Please
help
me
and
welcome
me
Hudson
to
the
stage.
U
But
hello,
thank
you
so
much
for
the
introduction,
all
right
so
before
we
start
I
gotta
apologize,
I
kind
of
partied
too
hard
last
night.
The
element
Lido
thing
so
my
voice
is
out.
However,
dead.
Ass
I
was
just
at
the
coffee
table
and
I
had
honey,
I,
just
grabbed
it,
and
just
like
squirted,
a
bunch
of
my
throat,
so
I
should
be
okay,
all
right
so
yeah
today,
we're
gonna
be
talking
about
mental
health
and
avoiding
burnout
next
slide.
I.
U
Also
the
clicker's
not
working
I'm
gonna
have
to
be
like
click,
a
lot
because
there's
animations
click
all
right.
So
just
a
bit
about
me,
I've,
been
in
crypto
since
2011.
U
I
am
have
been
in
the
ethereum
community
since
2015.,
mostly
at
the
ethereum
foundation.
Doing
stuff,
like
the
all
core
devs
calls:
EIP
management
and
Devcon
I
left
in
2021
and
joined
flashbots
for
a
little
bit
and
then
I
also
co-founded,
open,
Innovations
and
ethereum
Cat
herders.
If
you've
heard
of
them
I'm
trying
to
get
a
hobby
outside
of
crypto,
that's
hard,
we'll
come
we'll
come
back
to
that
later,
but
I
like
ice
cream,
whiskey
and
taking
VHS
tapes
and
make
them
put
them
on
YouTube.
U
Okay,
so
before
we
begin
just
a
quick
heads,
up,
presentation
is
going
to
be
on
some
heavier
topics.
Around
mental
health,
maybe
like
mentioning
self-harm,
completely,
relate
to
not
being
in
a
place
to
want
to
hear
that
you
can
just
walk
out
at
any
time
or
you
know
turn
off
the
video
if
you're
watching
you
know
on
the
internet
until
you're,
more
comfortable
hearing
it
or
never
I'm,
also
not
a
doctor
I'm
not
trained
in
mental
health.
U
U
Click
all
right.
So,
let's
get
to
some
mental
health
tips.
Today,
I'm
kind
of
like
structuring
this
just
not
to
like
be
like
Webster's
defines
mental
health
as
but
just
kind
of
doing
things
that
I
thought
were
like
important
to
say
to
people.
That's
it's
not
always
talked
about
next
slide,
so
tip
number
one
adjust
your
perspective
on
Mental
Health.
It
should
be
treated
as
serious
as
a
physical
injury
so
like.
U
If
you
broke
your
hand-
and
you
can't
code
anymore
you're
going
to
do
everything
you
can
to
like
heal
that
hand
until
you
can
code
again
I,
it
seems
like
there's
like
a
stigma,
though,
especially
in
work,
some
workplaces,
where
it's
like
mental
health,
things
like
severe
anxiety,
depression,
other
stuff,
like
aren't
taken
as
seriously
in
some
parts
of
the
world,
when
really
that's
going
to
cognitively,
affect
your
work,
much
more,
sometimes
than
a
lot
of
physical
injuries.
U
So
it's
a
taboo
subject,
but
talking
about
it
helps
there
are
many
places
around
the
world
where,
like
it's
kind
of
like
a
suck
it
up,
you
know
just
be
stronger.
That
kind
of
stuff.
I
really
don't
believe
in
that
I
think
that
you
know
if
you're,
not
okay,
it's
okay
to
be
not
okay!
You
can
talk
about
it.
You
can
reach
out
and
get
help
for
that.
U
So
the
first
thing,
yeah
first
tip
adjust
your
perspective.
It's
as
bad
as
a
physical
injury.
We
should
treat
it
more
seriously.
Next,
one
okay
build
and
maintain
a
support
system.
Click
I
do
not
mean
this
support
system.
We
are
all
addicted
to
crypto
and
if
you
were
just
in,
if
all
your
support
is
people
who
are
also
in
the
same
Echo
chamber
as
you,
then
that's
not
going
to
be
as
effective
next,
so
don't
do
that
next.
U
Instead,
next
yeah
do
something
like
this.
My
support
system
is
my
parents,
my
friends
in
the
middle
and
I
have
a
therapist.
A
therapist
has
been
one
of
the
most
helpful
things
for
me.
But
again
it's
just
one
piece
of
your
support
system
and
hit
one
more
time,
click
and
you
can
have
a
little
crypto
friend
support
As,
a
treat
like
if
you
want
it
like.
U
There
are
like
some
really
good
Discord
groups,
I'm
in
where
we
have
a
mental
health
Channel,
and
we
could
just
be
really
open
about
what
we're
feeling
that
day
and
everyone's
support
system
is
going
to
look
different
I
mean
maybe
you're,
just
like
a
total
introvert,
and
you
just
have
like
your
cat
great
that's
part
of
your
support
system.
Everyone
should
make
sure
that
work
isn't
encompassing
their
life
and
that
they
have
some
kind
of
support
system
where
they
can
like
actually
say.
U
This
is
who
what
I
do
to
clear
out
by
mind
and
to
make
myself
understand
the
issues
I'm
having
click.
U
All
right
don't
be
afraid
to
ask
for
help
I
kind
of
alluded
to
this
in
tip
number
one.
You
are
not
weak
people
around
you,
especially
people
from
different
Generations
than
your
own,
might
not
understand
what
you're
going
through
and
that's.
Okay,
like
you,
you
should
be
the
number
one
priority
to
you.
I
had
this
problem
for
a
really
really
long
time,
it
was
very
difficult.
U
I
was
helping
a
lot
of
different
people,
not
taking
care
of
myself
still
struggling
with
that
to
this
day,
but
I'm
starting
to
finally
come
to
an
understanding
myself
that,
like
if
I,
can't
help
myself,
others
are
going
to
be
affected
as
well,
and
if
I
don't
help
myself
I'm
just
going
to
keep
burning
out
harder
and
harder,
so
yeah,
that's
kind
of
yeah.
The
tip
is
just
don't
be
afraid
to
ask
for
help
next
slide.
U
Right
so
burnout
is
individualized.
It
is
different
for
different
people.
I
I,
I
I've
never
admitted
this
publicly,
but
some
a
mistake,
I
made
early
on
in
working
for
ethereum
I,
was
at
the
ethereum
foundation.
Early
like
2015,
2016.
and
I
would
travel
with
metallic
a
lot
and
we've
all
seen
how
vitalik
works.
So
in
my
mind,
I
was
like.
Oh,
if
I'm
not
matching
vitalik
I'm
not
doing
good
enough,
but
in
reality
vitalik
does
take
time
to
himself.
U
U
If
I
didn't
say
that
got
me
places,
but
it
was
at
the
toll
of
my
mental
health
and
I've
had
a
multi-year,
mostly
burnout
period
because
of
it
like
16
18
hour
days
of
nothing
but
ethereum
for
like
three
to
four
or
five
years
gets
to
you
so
yeah,
don't
don't
compare
yourself
to
others
and
and
do
yourself
check-ins.
This
is
something
where
a
lot
of
people
I
find
in
the
crypto
space
are
very
analytical.
They
aren't
going
to
do
like
a
body
check
of
like
their
emotions.
U
I
had
a
lot
of
therapy
before
I
could
come
to
empathize
with
myself
and
I.
Think
that's
something
more
people
should
do
to
maybe
put
a
reminder
in
their
calendar
and
say
you
know.
How
am
I
feeling
like
is
everything
good.
Do
I
need
to
adjust
things
so
yeah
or
check
it
with
your
support
system
too,
my
spouse,
Lillet
is
amazing.
U
U
Here's
some
resources,
also
just
by
the
way
start
thinking
of
questions,
we're
going
to
have
a
good
amount
of
time
for
questions.
U
Additionally,
if,
like
people,
don't
have
exactly
questions
but
like
under
30,
second
personal
experience
that
they
want
to
share.
That's
fine,
too,
at
the
end
of
this
okay
resources.
Next
slide,
all
right.
Internet's
your
friend
there's
online
therapy
that
I
found
a
lot
of
people
have
found
very
helpful.
I
have
a
therapist
in
my
town,
but
we
work
remotely
it's
not
like
super
expensive
and
you
can
sometimes
get
work
to
pay
for
it.
U
So
I'll
talk
to
that
about
that
in
a
second,
also
something
that
was
really
good
for
me
and
understanding
myself
and
coming
to
terms
with
how
I
operate
as
a
person
is
taking
a
neurocycle
to
neuropsychological
tests,
one
of
them
one
of
them,
was
a
general
one
and
that
once
they
said
you
have
bipolar
two
you
have
ADHD,
you
have
OCD
and
I
was
like
okay,
cool
and
then
years
went
by
and
everyone
in
my
life
was
like
Hey.
You
really
seem
autistic
and
I
was
like
you're
diagnosed
right.
U
It's
like
No
And,
so
I
I'm,
not
the
kind
of
person
who
likes
to
self-diagnose
with
when
it
comes
to
medical
stuff.
So
I
did
that
test
and
the
autistic
testing
people
came
back
were
like
yeah
you're
autistic,
however
you're
so
good
at
masking
and
mimicry
that
and
I
and
eye
contact
that,
like
you
just
naturally
or
like
do
that,
but
it's
unnaturally
do
that,
but
it's
taken
you
a
while
to
get
there.
I
didn't
have
any
friends
till
High
School.
No
one
wanted
to
talk
to
me.
U
So
I
kind
of
just
learned
and
I
think
a
lot
of
us
do
this.
What
we?
What
what
facial
Expressions
we
have
to
do
to
get
a
positive
response
from
people,
so
yeah
join
or
start
chat
rooms
that
are
crypto
or
non-crypto
to
build
a
support
system.
Those
are
really
important.
Don't
let
all
your
chat
rooms
be
work
related,
that'll,
just
drain
you
touchgrass
go
outside,
don't
I
mean
you
can
walk
with
your
laptop.
It's
not
the
weirdest
thing
in
the
world,
maybe
and
being
outside
and
getting
exercise
is
a
very
important
thing.
U
I've
also
heard
there's
like
Sun
lamps
or
something
that
might
be
helpful.
I'm
actually
really
bad
at
this.
So
like
do
as
I
say
not
as
I
do
but
going
outside,
and
getting
exercise
really
does
do
physical
and
chemical
things
to
the
body
to
help
with
a
lot
of
the
emotions
we
struggle
with
slide,
okay,
so
in
our
ecosystem
in
ethereum,
what
can
we
be
doing
to
push
the
topic
of
mental
health
forward
slide.
U
So
if
your
company
doesn't
have
proactive
mental
health
measures
advocate
for
them,
we
need
to
make
them
common.
Some
examples.
Mandatory
vacation
days,
I've
heard
of
this
working
more
so
recently
for
people
who
are
truly
Workaholics
I
mean
it's
going
to
be
an
interesting
subject.
But
when
you
know,
if
you're
approached
about
it
or
if
you
talk
to
your
work
but
I've
heard
it
works,
stipends
for
therapy
or
Psychological
Services
I
mean
they
give
you
like
what
like
a
couple
thousand
dollars
for
a
new
Macbook
and
you
get
like
a
rolly
chair.
U
That's
really
cool!
If
you're
working
from
home,
why
not
monthly
stipends
for
therapy
I?
Think
that's
going
to
be
really
important
and
going
on,
like
everyone's
going
to
have
to
be
doing
that
eventually
and
then
the
last
one's
very
important
and
close
to
me,
because
behind
the
scenes,
because
I've
been
in
ethereum,
so
long
I've
dealt
with
a
lot
of
mediation
and
major
projects
where
they
didn't
have
like
a
traditional
HR
or
anyone
that
would
mediate
conflicts
within
their
organization.
U
So
I,
don't
like
the
term
HR
because,
like
HR,
is
hired
by
the
company
to
protect
the
company's
interest,
so
sometimes
they're
great,
and
they
really
do
go
to
bat
for
you.
But
there
needs
to
be
like
a
new
term
or
a
new
kind
of
person
that
is
like
paid
by
the
company
but
is
like
legally
and
in
all
other
ways
separate
from
the
company
so
that
they
like.
U
If
you
have
a
problem
with
the
highest
levels,
you
can
go
to
them
instead
of
having
to
escalate
it
through
other
means
or
being
too
scared
to
escalate
it.
So
if
you're,
a
crypto
company
right
now-
and
you
have
employees,
see
what
your
employees
need,
maybe
they
don't
need
any
of
this.
They
probably
need
number
three
at
minimum
and
I've
talked
to
a
few
companies
about
them.
U
Implementing
this
and
I'm
going
to
see
how
this
goes
but
yeah
just
really
advocate
for
this
stuff,
because
I
mean
they're
going
to
be
Pricks
if
they
say
no
right,
so
yeah
all
right
next
slide.
U
Okay,
be
kind,
take
care
of
yourself
and
ethereum,
we'll
continue
to
have
a
soul.
Ethereum
is
the
best
cryptocurrency
ecosystem
project
because
it
has
a
soul
and
what
I
mean
by
that
is
that,
unlike
other
projects,
that
kind
of
like
have
devs,
they
hire
just
for
a
short
amount
of
time,
and
then
they
get
uninterested
and
drop
them.
There's
a
lot
of
fun
cool
things.
U
There's
a
lot
of
great
people,
there's
a
lot
of
good
discussion
in
ethereum
and
there's
values
that
the
earliest
people
in
ethereum
have
like,
instilled
in
us
around
censorship,
resistance
and
decentralization
and
other
stuff,
but
also
just
like
not
being
a
dick.
Like
you
see
it
with
metallic,
you
see
it
with
Danny
Ryan.
You
see
it
with
Tim
baiko,
like
they
all
exude
this
value
of
like
not
getting
into
sticky
situations,
or
you
know,
having
useless
fighting
with
people
so
yeah
and
also
like
when
you're
on
Twitter.
U
U
U
Psilocybin,
oh,
oh
I'm,
not
I'm,
not
working
anymore
right
now.
I
can
talk
about
that.
So
psilocybin
is
an
amazing
amazing
tool
for
mental
health.
I've
tried
a
lot
of
non-traditional
things
for
my
bipolar,
2
and
depression.
One
of
them
is
IV
ketamine,
it's
very
expensive,
it's
legal
in
the
U.S,
but
it's
very
expensive
that
is
I've.
It's
helped
me
a
ton
sometimes
other
times.
It
doesn't
help
me
at
all.
Additionally
psilocybin
I've
heard
on
when
you
take
a
major
trip.
It
can
do
a
lot
of
things.
U
In
my
case
when
I
took
a
major
trip
on
mushrooms,
it
gave
me
more
empathy
because
that
was
a
hard
thing
for
me.
Additionally
I
in
a
very
dark
dark
time
when
I
was
had
to
be
working,
I
microdose
psilocybin
for
a
year-
and
it
was
one
of
the
only
things
that
helped
me,
because
the
prescription
medicine
wasn't
doing
its
job
exactly
and
I
was
doing
them
together.
But
you
know
I
just
was
on
the
wrong
stuff
for
a
while.
So
yeah
love
psilocybin
next
up
excellent.
L
Oh
wonderful,
talk,
Hudson
I
wondered
what
your
recommendation
for
like
post
Devcon
like
recovery
is
because,
like
Devcon,
you
come
here.
It's
like
really
intense
I'm
like
really
tired.
It's,
like
you
know,
doing
stuff,
I
always
decides
interactions,
and
then,
after
this
I'm
going
to
get
on,
do
18
hours
of
travel
and
then
like
sit
in
my
house
again
like
how
do
I
recover
from
that.
Like
Drop.
U
Yeah,
there's
gonna
I
mean
a
lot
of
people
actually
go
into
a
little
bit
of
a
depressive
slump
or
anxiety
slump.
After
a
big
conference
where
they're
like
overly
social
for
a
week,
I
used
to
go
way
harder
at
Dev
cons
and
I
would
crash
for
a
whole
week
afterwards.
I'm
actually
pacing
myself
this
time.
But
to
answer
your
question,
everyone's
gonna
be
different.
U
Some
people
like
just
want
to
watch
Netflix
all
day
after
they
get
back
from
a
conference
and
just
not
do
work
for
a
day
or
two
others
need
like
multiple
days
to
sleep,
depending
on
where
they
came
from.
Others
want
to
get
right
back
to
work
because
they
stay
energized
I,
don't
understand
those
people
some
of
the
time,
but
you
know
it's
different
for
different
people,
so
just
just
kind
of
like
really
focus
on
what
you
think
is
the
most
relaxing
thing
for
you
and
what
will
help
you
recharge.
V
Okay,
yeah.
Thank
you.
So,
in
the
title
of
the
talk
there
was
like
your
cryptocurrency
or
gig
your
ethereum
gig.
You
have
any
particular
advice
for
people
who
are
doing
gig
work
where
they
might
have
multiple
projects
or
you.
W
U
That's
a
really
good
question,
so
yeah,
if
you're
just
doing
gig
work,
it's
it's
there's
good
and
bad
with
it,
because
I've
also
been
there
to
an
extent
as
a
contractor
and
stuff,
usually
depending
on
where
you
are
in
the
world.
You
might
not
get
benefits
things
like
that.
U
I
would
set
aside
a
little
bit
of
money
for
like
therapy
and
stuff
like
that,
especially
if
health
insurance
in
your
country,
if
you're,
if
you're,
lucky
enough
to
be
in
a
country
that
just
does
it
for
free
great
but
like
for
us
that
you
know
you
need
to
like
set
aside
some
money
and
time
for
it.
U
Yeah
also
like
one
thing:
I'm
not
going
to
show
this
company
because
I
don't
know
the
ins
and
outs
of
it,
but
as
a
gig
employee
check
out
opolis,
they
do
some
stuff
around
having
gig
employees
get
Group
Health
Care
through
them
in
a
cryptocurrency
way.
It's
actually
the
East
Denver
guy,
John
powler
runs
it
so
yeah
check
that
out.
That
might
be
a
good
thing
for
Gig
employees.
X
Thanks
so
much
hi,
that's
an
amazing
talk
thanks.
So
much
thank
you.
I
noticed
that
a
lot
of
people
in
crypto
often
have
like
Mania
or
like
sometimes
just
a
little
bit
like
myself,
included
when
I
first
got
into
crypto.
I
was
like
very
manic,
and
people
tried
reaching
out
to
me
about
no,
no
I'm
fine.
So
I
was
wondering
like
what
is
a
good
approach
to
dealing
with
like
someone
that
you
care
about
who
may
be
manic.
U
Yeah,
so
if
you
yourself
romantic
and
you're
kind
of
coming
to
that,
realization
definitely
talk
to
Medical
people,
the
ones
that
I
would
recommend
to
look
up
for
would
be
like
therapists,
can
do
so
much,
but
then
there's
other
ones
who
can
prescribe
medicine
like
psychiatrists
and
sometimes
them
working
together
or
like
getting
a
piece
of
paper
that
the
therapist
says
like
yeah
this
person's
Manic
and
then
the
there.
Then
the
psychiatrist
is
like
I
agree,
and
then
they
get
you
something.
U
That's
one
thing
as
far
as
other
people
in
your
life
just
like
if
they
were
having
any
other
things
that
you
were
concerned
about
in
my
in
my
case,
I
think
I
would
just
message
and
be
like
hey
I'm
concerned
and
wanted
to
get
your
take
on
this
I've
done.
That
line
a
lot
and
also
it's
gonna
depend
on
the
person.
Some
of
them
are
much
more
responsive
with
that
kind
of
feedback.
Some
of
them
are
like
no,
no
talk
about
health.
U
Don't
talk
about
health
So
like
showing
that
you
care
is
usually
going
to
break
down
a
lot
of
barriers
to
people,
so
that's
kind
of
what
I've
done.
Y
So
quitting
a
position
for
mental
health
after
a
certain
period
of
Time.
How
do
you
deal
with
the
sort
of
the
drudgery
of
not
doing
anything
and
not
triggering
further
mental
health
issues?.
U
Yeah,
that's
a
tough
one,
because
I've
actually
been
on
a
mental
health
break
since
February
and
I
know
other
people
who
are
struggling
with
this
too.
One
thing
that
I
did
was
try
to
make
myself
busy
with
non-crypted
stuff
like
explicitly
non-cryptos
stuff.
So
we
had
a
friend
move
in
with
us
temporarily,
so
we
were
getting
their
room
together.
We
in
the
last
year,
we've
acquired
nine
chickens.
Please
don't
tell
where
I
my
my
County
in
Texas
that
we
did
this.
U
We
technically
have
an
illegal
chicken
there's
only
supposed
to
be
eight,
but
so
yeah
so
like
just
dealing
with
like
you
know
and
there's
like
a
garden.
We
have
like
there's
a
lot
of
things
to
deal
with,
and
so
it's
like
manual
work
like
that,
gets
your
mind
off
it.
Additionally,
rekindling
old
friendships
is
a
good
idea
like
finding.
U
You
know,
support
groups
that
are
in
or
outside
of
crypto
to
just
kind
of
stay
up
to
date
and
for
people
who
are
just
getting
out
if
there
are
opportunities
for
little
bits
to
help
little
advisory
roles
or
like
throwing
in
a
few
GitHub
commits
that
can
kind
of
help.
A
little
bit
with
like
I'm,
you
know
I'm
still
here,
I'm
still
doing
stuff,
but
yeah
don't
ever
Rush
getting
back
into
something.
Z
Thank
you
so
much
such
a
great
talk.
My
question
is
somewhat
related
to
that
is
with
your
spouse.
How
do
you
you
guys,
have
three
cats
yeah
I'm
going
in
that
direction
as
well?
So
what's
it
like
like
when
you're,
when
you're
off
the
mental
break,
and
you
guys
discuss
crypto,
do
you
not
do
you
intentionally
just
leave
it
there
or
yeah?
If
you
get
this,
if
I
don't
mean
to
produce
your.
U
U
Is
it
exactly
like
crypto
that
much
to
be
fair,
they
did
volunteer
and
actually
work
on
devcons,
two
and
three,
which
wasn't
the
best
experience
behind
the
scenes,
so
that
was
a
little
bad,
but
also
like
they
just
they
don't
jive
with
many
people
in
this
space.
It's
just
not
their
interest
they're,
just
like
artists
and
artists
and
stuff
so
and
not
into
nfts.
So
basically
what
I
do
is
I.
U
Don't
really
talk
about
crypto
that
much
sometimes
when
I
have
like
interesting
conflict
resolutions
or
like
hot
tea
for
crypto,
like
I,
bring
it
to
them,
because
it's
kind
of
just
fun
to
talk
about,
like
oh
I,
can't
believe
this
conference.
Video
is
ridiculous.
I
can't
believe
well,
what's
what's
one
that
I
showed
them.
Oh,
like
a
dfinity,
the
launch,
video
and
stuff
I
was
like
they
look
like
robots.
U
So
like
showing
cool
stuff
like
that
is
fine,
but
like
yeah
in
general,
there
are
some
crypto
power
couples
that
make
it,
but
for
the
most
part,
most
people
I
know
that
are
happiest
with
their
spouse
in
crypto,
try
to
keep
their
work
separate
and
because
it
can
blend
so
easily
that
can
cause
further
problems,
so
yeah
and
then
also
I.
U
Actually,
you
had
one
more
point,
which
was
when
you
start
getting
back
into
it
after
leaving
just
be
in
close
communication
with
that
person
to
say,
let
me
know
if
it's
too
much
or
like
hey
today
am
I
spending
enough
time
with
you,
I
had
a
lot
of
problems
early
on
where,
like
ethereum,
would
replace
my
friends
and
family
so
I'm
now,
like
hey,
are
you
feeling
do
we
need?
Are
you
feeling
connected
today
like?
Do
you
want
to
watch
a
movie
like
that
kind
of
stuff
and
that's
helped
a
lot.
AA
U
I
can
rip
a
little
bit
on
that.
Empathy
is
really
important.
Managers
should
have
that
and
my
personal
experience,
my
two
most
recent
full-time
Employments
were
the
ethereum
foundation
and
flashbots.
The
ethereum
foundation
I
had
to
I
broke
down
and
I
was
getting
sent
to.
I,
took
a
grippy
sock
vacation
to
brain
jail,
aka
the
mental
health
hospital,
so
I
was
doing
synth
there
and
I
messaged.
U
The
leadership
at
the
EF
and
I
was
like
hey
I'm
coming
here.
So
sorry,
I
feel
like
I'm,
letting
you
all
down
and
they're
like
no,
you
take
as
much
time
as
you
need.
You
will
have
a
job
when
you
come
back.
That
is
the
number
one
thing
I
think
managers
may
not
realize
is
that
they
think.
U
Oh,
if
I'm
going
away
for
one
two
three
four
weeks
at
a
mental
health
ward,
you
know
I
will
lose
my
job
because
of
what
I'm
doing,
but
though
they
said
you
take
as
much
time
as
you
need
we're
here
to
support
you
everyone's
covering
your
back,
so
shout
out
to
the
EF
for
that
and
then
later
I
worked
for
flashbots
first,
but
I
got
into
it
too
quickly,
and
there
was
a
point
in
late
last
year,
where
I
was
just
like
absolutely
a
mess
with
like
home
life,
stuff
and
or
family
or
family
stuff
and
other
things
and
I
just
was
like
bawling
on
the
phone
till
to
Phil
dying
and
I
was
like
I
can't
do
this.
U
I
can't
do
this
and
he
said:
there's
nothing.
We
have
full
support.
You
are
getting
a
two-month
paid,
mental
health
break
and
at
the
end
of
it
you
can
come
back
if
you
want
or
if
not,
we're
totally
cool.
So,
like
flashbots
had
a
policy
in
place
to,
like
you
know,
deal
with
this
and
I
was
really
happy
about
that,
and
it
took
me
a
while
in
February
when
it
was
over.
U
I
said
I
can't
come
back,
yet
my
medicines
aren't
right,
Etc
since
then,
I've
been
doing
a
lot
better
but
like
it
was
just
amazing
to
me
that,
like
they're,
so
Progressive
in
that,
so
as
a
manager
yeah
you
need
to
just
people
are
P
people.
First,
that's
what
like
the
EF
has
done
in
various
ways
and
flashbots
does
in
amazing
ways.
So
yeah
put
people
first
be
empathetic
and
make
sure
they
know
they
have
a
job.
Thank.
C
B
B
B
C
C
C
We
are
about
to
get
begin.
Our
next
talk,
but
before
we
do,
I
have
a
few
announcements
for
you.
So
today
is
the
last
day
of
Devcon
and
the
closing
ceremony
is
at
3
30
on
the
fifth
floor
on
the
top
of
the
mountain,
which
is
the
same
place
where
the
opening
ceremony
was
and
then
right
after
there's
going
to
be
an
after
party
in
the
Shiva
lounge
and
this
weekend
we're
going
to
continue
having
the
space
open
for
co-working
from
9am
to
6
p.m.
C
For
anyone
who
has
a
defconrest
band
okay-
and
our
next
talk
is
on
positive
Framing
and
communication
for
web3,
the
talk
is
hosted
by
Oliver
Renwick
Oliver
is
a
terminologist
SBC,
Enthusiast
and
translator.
He
currently
lives
near
Cleveland,
Ohio
USA,
with
his
wife
and
two
kids.
He
works
at
consensus,
creating
and
maintaining
support
documentation
for
metamask,
infra
and
other
products
and
in
general,
tries
to
explain
the
madness
of
web3
to
those
who
want
to
know
more.
He
speaks
Spanish
and
English
fluently
and
he
get
himself
into
trouble
in
Italian,
Arabic,
Catalan
and
French.
H
AB
Is
this
on?
Yes,
okay,
cool,
Hello,
everybody
welcome
to
Tropical
Sunset
stage.
I
am
Oliver
Renwick,
as
was
explained
in
my
introduction
before
I
get
started,
I
just
want
to
say
a
shout
out
to
the
interpreters
in
the
booth
back
there.
They
have
been
doing
an
amazing
job
all
week
and
I
will
try
to
speak
evenly
and
not
use
really
strange
words.
AB
So,
and
one
last
note,
I
will
be
giving
the
talk
in
English.
The
slides
will
be
in
Spanish.
If
you
see
a
slide,
that's
all
in
Spanish,
don't
be
alarmed
I'm
going
to
say
everything,
that's
on
it
in
English,
so,
okay,
so
with
that,
let's
get
started
okay,
so
the
current
state
of
affairs.
AB
Here
we
are
it's
2022
crypto
is
going
through
its
Rises
and
falls
and
we
had
incredible
user
growth
during
2021
and
the
ecosystem
is
expanding
outward
and
rather
than
sort
of
homogenizing
and
becoming
less
complex.
It's
opening
up
and
becoming
more
complex,
more
people
are
doing
more
different
things
and
we
have
people
who
have
heard
about
this
crypto
thing
and
want
to
get
involved
or
they've
heard
about
web3,
maybe,
and
they
want
to
get
involved.
So
how
do
we
explain
that
to
them.
AB
Oh,
come
on,
okay,
good,
so
as
a
terminologist
as
a
translator,
I
focus
on
Words,
it's
my
thing
and
what
I've
noticed
about
web3
and
the
terminology
that
we
use
to
describe,
distributed
or
decentralized
technology.
It
has
two
sort
of
main
features
that
Define
it.
First
of
all,
it's
very
technical
right.
AB
So,
as
a
result,
there's
this
sort
of
what
I
call
negative
theology,
but
in
general
it's
sort
of
a
negative
framing
that
that
permeates
web3
and
in
its
best
moments
it
can
be
sort
of
like
edgy
and
cool
and
like
makes
people
interested
and
want
to
know
more,
but
I
find
especially
dealing
with
people
who
are
new
to
the
space
that
it
just
confuses
things
it.
It
makes
things
impenetrable,
there's
a
lot
of
jargon.
AB
Sometimes
people
use
metaphors
to
describe
things
that
are
a
little
bit
like
unsettling
or
weird,
and
a
lot
of
things
just
get
framed
in
negative
negative
ways
instead
of
in
positive
ways.
So
how
do
we
go
from
the
negative
to
the
positive
briefly
in
this
session,
we're
going
I'm
going
to
lay
out
for
you
what
I
have
what
I
have
categorized?
AB
What
I
have
observed
about
this
terminology
and
then
hopefully
we'll
have
a
little
bit
of
time
to
sort
of
dive
in
and
I'm
going
to
be
like
pointing
at
people
and
asking
for
things
as
well.
Hopefully,
hopefully
we
can
get
interactive,
so
I
will
say:
I
do
have
a
background
in
linguistics,
I've
done
qualitative
studies,
I've
done
quantitative
studies.
This
is
not
that
this
is
more.
AB
You
know,
I've
been
working
at
consensus,
writing
documentation
for
end
users,
talking
to
people
that
are
new
to
the
space,
explaining
things
to
my
wife
over
and
over
again,
not
because
she
doesn't
understand,
but
because
probably
my
explanations
need
to
be
improved
and
so
what
you've
got
here?
What
I'm,
showing
you
is
sort
of
my
gut
feeling
about
where
we're
at
in
the
space?
This
isn't
meant
to
be
a
a
prescriptive
model
of
what
we've
got
going
on.
This
is
not
Based
on
data.
AB
Okay,
so
this
seems
to
have
stopped
working
cool.
Thank
you.
So,
in
my
time,
as
a
word
Smith,
as
it
were,
I've
gotten
a
lot
of
people
saying
things
like
yeah,
but
who
cares
man?
That's
just
implementation
details
right,
that's
just
words.
AB
If
we
make
solid
Tech,
if
we
make
a
solid
product,
people
are
going
to
use
it
right
right,
I'm
here
to
argue
the
opposite:
I'm
going
to
argue
that
if
we
want
adoption
to
increase
outside
of
our
crypto
bubble,
we
need
to
learn
to
explain
our
technology
in
a
clearer
and
a
more
empowering
way.
The
empowering
part
is
important
and
we'll
come
back
to
it
soon.
So.
AB
AB
First
of
all,
there's
what
I've
been
calling
negative,
framing
or
negative
theology.
The
second
sort
of
big
category
of
language
is
impenetrable
jargon
that
should
be
improved,
got
a
laser
here.
So
yes,
oh,
oh,
it
worked.
Okay,
okay,
it's
working
now!
So
the
third!
AB
So
we
we
all
know
what
I'm
talking
about
and
we'll
get
into
some
concrete
examples
of
that
soon,
the
last
one
gets
into
sort
of
marketing
or
branding
a
little
bit
and
it's
more
subjective
and
that's
the
question
that
we
all
have
to
ask
ourselves
is
what
I'm
saying
edgy
and
revolutionary,
and
is
it
going
to
energize
people,
or
is
it
like
kind
of
cringe
and
like
edgelord?
AB
So
that's
that's
not
who
we
want
to
be:
okay,
gracias,
okay!
This
is
I'm,
really
excited
about
this
topic,
so
negative,
Theology
and
negative
framing.
So
look
at
this
look
at
this
set
of
terms
right.
This
is
terms
that
we
all
know
from
being
in
the
space.
Non-Custodial
wallet,
immutable
transactions
and
things,
governance,
free,
trustless,
permissionless
permissionless
is
one
of
our
favorite
words
right,
there's
a
whole
event
called
permissionless,
decentralized
censorship,
resistant
and
arbitrary.
Arbitrary
is
in
bold
and
we'll
come
back
to
it.
AB
So,
let's
see
here
can
can
somebody
tell
me
what
permissionless
means
anyway,
yell
it
out
and
I'll
repeat
it.
You
don't
need
permission
to
use
it.
Yeah
I
think
that's
actually
what
it
means
yeah
but
like,
but
from
from,
like
imagine
like
wipe
your
swipe,
your
brain,
clean
and
imagine
you've
never
heard
of
crypto.
Imagine
you've
never
done
this
stuff
and
you're
like
oh,
it's
a
permissionless
computer
network.
AB
AB
Trustless
I
love
right
because
trustless
is
like
old
Bitcoin
OG
speak
right
and
they're
like
it's
a
trustless
system
and
that's
so
cool
and
people
like
I've
had
I've
used
that
word
and
people
have
been
like
that's
bad
right
like
you,
can't
trust
it
and
I've
had
to
be
like
no.
No!
It's
because,
like
you,
don't
need
to
trust
it.
It's
it's
provable,
it's
math
and
a
lot
of
this
comes
down
to
it,
being
technical.
So
we'll
move
on
to
that
in
the
next
point.
AB
But
I
want
to
talk
about
non-custodial,
because
non-custodial
is
one
of
the
biggest
examples
of
this
kind
of
language
in
our
space.
I
I
threw
up
a
screenshot
of
what
is
a
non-custodial
wallet.
Look
at
all
these
explainers
bit
pay
Gemini
I
can't
tell
what
that
one
is,
but
by
bit
economictimes.com.
AB
So
I
was
up.
I
was
upgrading,
rewriting
the
metamask
documentation
for
users
last
year
and
I
decided
to
try
and
translate
some
of
them
into
Spanish,
and
so
I
sat
down
with
the
first
article
that
I
was
going
to
translate
and
it
was
called
metamask
is
a
non-custodial
wallet
and
I.
Just
sat
there
staring
at
the
title
like
how
am
I
going
to
say
that
in
Spanish,
and
so
so
I
ended
up
sort
of,
as
they
say
in
Spanish
and
I
ended
up
with
metamask
is
a
self-custodial
wallet.
AB
So
this
is
what
I
was
saying
about
making
our
language
empowering.
So
if
I
say
to
somebody
check
out
this
wallet,
it's
a
crypto
wallet
and
it's
non-custodial,
they
say.
What's
non-custodial
and
I'm
like
oh,
the
bank,
isn't
the
custodian
you're,
the
custodian
so
I'm
telling
somebody?
This
is
a
good
thing
because
screw
the
banks,
man
you're
in
charge
right
so
I'm
automatically
putting
them
into
this
like
power
struggle
right
and
that
can
be
exciting,
and
that
can
be
interesting.
AB
But
it's
also
like
a
lot
of
information,
whereas
if
I
said
to
somebody,
here's
this
crypto
wallet
man,
it's
self-custodial,
whoa
right
there
I've,
given
them
the
power,
the
crypto
is
theirs
right
and
they
understand
it
immediately.
So
that's
the
difference
in
framing
things
negatively
versus
positively.
AB
You
don't
have
to
do
that
mental
gymnastics
to
work
out
how
the
negative
thing
is
a
good
thing,
the
same
way,
what
we're
saying
with
permissionless
and
trustless
right,
you
don't
have
to
figure
out.
Oh
I,
don't
have
to
trust
it
because
the
math
proves
it
and
that's
a
good
thing
like
anyway.
So,
okay,
dresses,
okay,
there's
a
lot
going
on
here,
impenetrable
jargon
that
should
be
improved,
so
RPC
Network.
AB
AB
It
doesn't
make
sense,
so
RPC
RPC
is
from
Json
RPC,
which
is
an
old
web
2
era
standard
for
passing,
Json
blobs,
which
is
a
type
of
data
around
computers
right.
So
so
we
we
refer
to
our
evm,
mostly
not
necessarily.
Actually,
we
refer
to
a
lot
of
our
public
blockchain
networks
as
RPC
networks
as
a
sort
of
technical
shorthand
and
those
of
us
who
are
like
initiates
into
this
technology.
We
get
it,
but
for
users
this
is.
This
is
putting
too
much
on
them.
We
had
a
lot
of
conversations.
AB
I
I
brought
this
up
in
a
slack
Channel
and
was
like
we
need
to
change
this
and
we
had
some
conversations
and
we
didn't
settle
on
anything
firm.
So
this
is
an
area
where
I
think
we,
as
a
community,
could
maybe
come
up
with
something
better
in
a
way.
Just
saying
network
is
a
better
option
like
add
a
new
network
or
add
a
new
blockchain
network.
AB
If
you
want
or
or
I
don't
know
and
a
connection
Point
connection
Point
might
be
good
right
because,
sometimes,
like,
let's
say
you're
somebody
who
wants
to
connect
to
different
endpoints
within
metamask
wallet
for
the
same
network,
we
might
need
a
term
there
to
differentiate
between
well
yeah
I'm,
connecting
to
arbitrum
but
I'm,
using
a
private,
node
right
and
so
what's
the
term,
for
maybe
we
call
it
Network
endpoint
right
and
maybe
that's
a
a
better
option.
So
RPC
network
is
a
great
a
great
example.
AB
There's
this
whole
mess.
How
many
of
you
do,
you
think
know
the
difference
between
a
wallet
versus
an
account
versus
an
address
versus
a
public
key
private,
key
seed,
secret
recovery
phrase,
and
you
use
them
correctly.
Every
time
you
do
good
job
good
job.
So,
like
a
lot
of
the
time
we
sort
of
shorten
it
right.
We're
like
yeah
I
sent
it
from
my
wallet
yeah.
You
sent
it
from
your
order.
AB
I
sent
it
from
my
address
or
I
sent
it
from
my
account,
like
they're
kind
of
different
things
and
getting
so
I
work
in
customer
success
within
consensus
right,
so
I
help
like
I'm
writing
the
documentation
and
in
coordination
with
a
lot
of
our
support
agents
and
the
support
agents
kind
of
have
to
work
with
users
who
might
be
using
these
things.
Interchangeably
right,
like
the
coins
got
stolen
from
my
wallet,
the
coins
got
stolen
from
my
account.
AB
What
do
you
mean
so
there's
a
lot
going
on
there,
so
smart
contracts,
they're,
neither
smart
nor
contract,
I,
know
I,
know
I've
read
about
the
history
of
them.
I
know
where
they
come
from,
but
I'm
like
a
word
geek
and
I
care
about
that.
Most
people
don't
care
about
that
anyway.
Smart
contracts
I
feel
like
that
that
ship
maybe
has
sailed,
and
maybe
I
shouldn't
fight
that
battle.
AB
So
I
wanted
to
point
out
this
example.
Though
I
saw
this
while
I
was
like
months
ago
and
I
was
I
was
like
this
is
perfect,
so
this
is
from
mirror.xyz
and
for
those
of
you
who
don't
know,
mirror
it's
kind
of
trying
to
be
like
the
medium
of
web3.
Maybe
don't
don't
at
me,
and
so
this
is
a
little
snippet.
This
was
like
a
clickable
thing.
This
was
supposed
to
make
me
want
to
click
and
read
more.
AB
AB
Yeah
yeah
right
so
I
work
in
this
space
and
I
don't
entirely
understand
what's
going
on
there.
So
thank
you.
Thank
you.
Here's
here's
another
great
one!
This
is
from
one
of
my
favorite
articles,
front,
running
the
Mev
crisis
or
Mev,
whatever
I,
don't
care
how
you
pronounce
it.
So
this
is
a
great
article
explaining
crazy
stuff
about
how
MAV
Works,
and
so
what
is
Mev
definition.
Minor
extractable
value
is
a
whole
paragraph
of
definition.
AB
AB
So
one
one
thing
that
we've
been
talking
a
lot
about
that
I've
been
talking
a
lot
about
during
here
during
the
conference
is
layer,
twos
and
ZK
snarks
love,
ZK
snarks.
They
are
like
the
most
empowering
revolutionary
technology,
not
just
for
the
web
3
space,
but
like
web3
plus
ZK
snarks
is
we
could
do
so
much
with
it.
They're
called
ZK,
snarks,
I,
don't
know
what
else
I
need
to
say.
So
obviously,
like
any
discussion
of
ZK
snarks
could
be
sort
of
massaged
right,
so
you
could
be
like.
AB
AB
Prove
a
true
or
false
statement,
without
any
other
information
being
shared,
yeah,
yeah
or
or
prove
prove
that
you
know
something
without
revealing
what
it
is
or
something
prove
that
you
know
a
secret
without
revealing
the
secret,
maybe
say
what
without
interactions
yeah
yeah,
so
I
don't
know.
That's
like
I
love,
the
technology
and
I
want
to
be
able
to
talk
about
it
better
and
Roll-Ups.
Right.
Roll-Ups
are
really
cool
anyway.
Okay,
I'm
running
out
of
time,
I'm
getting
I'm
getting
excited.
AB
Okay
last
one,
so
this
is
branching
out
from
sort
of
terminology
into
sort
of
softer
stuff.
Well,
softer
marketing,
branding
perception
right,
like
I,
was
saying
our
technology
has
the
potential
to
do
really
amazing
things.
We
can
change
centuries
old
power
dynamics
with
our
technology
and
that's
what
a
lot
of
the
biggest
Advocates
and
Minds
in
our
space
say
that
we
want
to
do
and
say
that
we're
trying
to
do
that's
awesome
for
some
people,
that's
going
to
bring
them
in
the
door
right.
AB
They're
like
I
want
to
I
want
to
burn
it
all
down.
I
want
to
start
over.
Other
people
are
like
I
I,
don't
want
to
burn
everything
down
right.
AB
So
the
question
of
how
you
brand
your
project
is
a
delicate
one,
moloch,
Dao,
they're
sort
of
my
favorite
example
of
this
they're,
like
a
cool
public
goods,
doll
right,
they
do
awesome
stuff
and
they
have
satanic
branding
it's
cool
Dogecoin,
maybe
maybe
they
kind
of
nailed
it
with
like
yeah
we're
a
coin,
but
we're
a
meme
and
apparently
that
caught
on
right,
dark,
Phi
I
had
the
privilege
of
sort
of
encountering
them
at
Eve
Barcelona
over
the
summer,
and
they
had
this
awesome
patch
that
had
this
logo
on
it
and
it
said,
like
I,
don't
know
something
really
sketchy
about
like
you
are
your
keys,
you
are
your
Finance
or
something
in
red
lettering.
AB
Their
their
Manifesto
is
really
powerful.
It
goes
into
some
some
pretty
hardcore,
they're
they're,
trying
to
work
on
more
more
Anonymous
D5
if
I,
remember
correctly,
really
cool
project
but
like
it's
very
much
like,
are
you
into
Edward
Snowden?
This
is
for
you
right.
AB
So
there's
a
lot
of
people
into
Edward,
Snowden
and
sure
in
this
room,
but
you
gotta,
you
know
as
as
you're
come
as
you're
coming
at
it.
You
are,
you,
are
you
pitching
for
a
public
audience?
Are
you
who
are
you
pitching
for.
AB
I'm
gonna
I'm
gonna
chill
mildly
here
and
say
that
I
feel
like
ipfs
kind
of
nailed
it
they
kind
of
got
a
middle,
a
Middle
Road
for
their
product.
This
is
on
their
home
page,
you
scroll
down
a
little
bit.
You
find
this.
The
resolution
isn't
great,
but
they've
got
sort
of
these
web
2
uh-esque
friendly
diagrams,
explaining
what
their
technology
does
right.
It
kind
of
illustrates
it
and
they've
got
brief.
AB
Pro
like
like
statements
about
what
their
product
does
so
this
one
down
here.
Let
me
see
if
I
can
back
up
and
read
it
a
little
bit
read
it
here.
It
says
today's
web
is
addicted
to
the
backbone
ipfs
Powers,
the
creation
of
diversity,
resilient
networks
that
enable
persistent
availability
with
or
without
internet
backbone
connectivity.
So
that
sentence
there.
It's
a
mixture
of
techy
people
talk
and
normal
people
talk
right.
They
say
it
enables
persistent
availability,
that's
sort
of
like
signals
to
the
people
who
care
about
cloud
computing.
AB
What
what
it
is,
but
then
they
they
gloss
that
by
saying
internet
backbone,
connectivity
right
so
they're
saying
these
are.
These
are
two
different
audiences
they're
speaking
to
this
means
better
connectivity
for
the
developing
World
during
national
natural
disasters
or
just
when
you're
on
flaky
coffee
shop
Wi-Fi.
AB
This
is
a
very
powerful
like
sort
of
value
added
statement,
right,
they're,
they're,
breaking
it
down
for
you
and
they're
saying,
look
at
what
ipfs
can
do
asterisk.
What
does
ipfs
stand
for
interplanetary
file
system
right?
So
this
is
where
we
get
that
mixture
of
like
yo
man,
we're
the
interplanetary
file
system,
we're
ready
to
go
to
the
Moon,
but
but
then
they
bring
it
back
down
to
earth
and
they're
like
look
we're
going
to
make
it
better
to
browse
Wikipedia
at
the
coffee
shop,
okay,.
AB
So,
okay
I
talked
a
lot.
These
are.
These
are
the
takeaways
that
I
I
wanted
to
sort
of
dissolve
distill?
All
of
that
down
into
as
we're
writing
as
we're
talking
about
our
space
as
we're
branding
our
space,
we
need
to
find
ways
to
phrase
things
in
the
positive
rather
than
in
the
negative
overall
in
general,
because
it
empowers
people
it.
It
is
a
lower
cognitive
burden
right
and
that's
what
we
want.
We
need
to
find
ways
to
approach
the
technical
jargon.
AB
AB
Making
comparisons
to
web
2
might
help.
Sometimes
it
might
hinder
sometimes
think
about
whether
your
users
want
to
be
empowered
on
their
own.
So
this
is
the
example
of
like
self-custodial
right
here.
It's
a
self-custodial
wallet.
Now
you
have
the
power
versus
they
were
part
of
a
social,
political,
economic,
technological
movement.
Right
like
it's
non-custodial
because
screw
the
banks
right.
There
are
two
different
audiences,
so
last
Point
consider
whether
you're
you're
branding
your
image.
Your
slogans
Etc,
are
culturally
bound
culturally
bound.
AB
This
gets
into
translator,
Theory
stuff,
but
basically
does
it
translate.
Well,
is
it
is
it
something
that
means
something
else
in
a
different
language
or
sounds
like
something
else
in
a
different
language,
and
if
you
think
I'm
overreacting,
ask
a
Spanish
speaker
about
the
Mitsubishi
Pajero.
AB
Okay,
this
is
this
is
the
the
final.
The
final
run
here
siente
before
this
is
a
comedy
in
three
parts.
This
is
from
Twitter,
if
you
guys
remember
when
the
axi
chain
got
hacked
like
a
year
ago,
so
much
money
got
stolen.
So
this
guy's,
this
ape
is
narrating
it.
You
cannot
make
this
up.
Hacker
steals
600
million
in
eth
from
Ronin
blockchain.
AB
The
one
underlying
axi
hacker
then
goes
short
Ronin
and
axis
axi
token,
knowing
as
soon
as
news
breaks
that
tokens
will
plummet,
but
no
one
notices
and
they
get
liquidated
on
short
before
news
breaks.
Second,
what
is
Eve?
Who
is
Ronan?
What's
an
axi?
What's
axi
token,
no
clue?
What
short
is
what
language
is
this
again
people
are
followed,
and
then
somebody
very
helpfully
explains
it's
a
cryptocurrency.
It's
a
blockchain
network.
It's
an
nft!
It's
another
cryptocurrency
and
says
asserts
that
this
is
English
I.
AB
So
this
I
I
thought
this
is
a
really
good
illustrator.
A
really
good
illustration
right
of
like
we're
on
crypto
Twitter
we're
like
oh,
my
God.
They
shorted
the
position
and
they
liquidated
in
the
Arbitrage
and
the
I
don't
know
like
and
and
normal
people
are
like
I'm
gonna
learn
about
crypto.
Oh
I
hear
it's
big
on
Twitter
I'm
gonna
follow
people
on
Twitter,
okay,
okay,
I'm
done
so
now
is
the
time
for
Q
a
I've
got
four
minutes
here.
X
X
The
best
way
that
we
can
disseminate
with
respect
to
educating
designers
and
people
who
work
in
crypto
ux.
How
would
you
best
want
to
disseminate
this
knowledge
through,
like
workshops
or
like
blog
posts
or
company.
AB
Yeah
I
mean
this
space
is
supposed
to
be
the
space.
That's
all
about.
How
do
we
collaborate
together,
right,
I,
don't
know?
Are
there?
Are
there
already
like
ux
Dows?
Is
that
a
thing
yeah,
okay,
so
I'm,
just
ill
informed,
so
I,
don't
know
as
a
terminologist
like
my
approach
to
this
is
very
much
like
I'm
gonna
make
a
glossary
and
I'm
gonna
study
the
terms
and
I'm
gonna
say
this
is
what
this
means.
This
is.
These
are
synonyms.
AB
These
are
homonyms
and
I'm
gonna
map
it
out
and
make
decisions
about
which
one
I
like
and
then
I'm
going
to
with
an
iron
fist
enforce
it.
So
that's,
maybe
not
the
most
crypto
attitude.
I,
don't
know,
I,
don't
have
a
good
answer
to
that.
Beyond
that.
I
I
hate,
to
put
you
on
the
spot.
It
is
a
super
quick
question
yeah.
If
you
could
uninvent
one
word
using
this
space.
What
would
be
the
one
word?
Oh
man,
sorry.
AB
Oh
no,
no,
what
was
it
I
was
talking
about
it
this
morning.
Oh
man.
No,
no!
There
is
one
mining,
oh
God,
it
is,
it
is
harmful,
but
don't
worry
about
it.
We're
on
proof
of
stake.
Now,
that's
fine
I,
don't
know
I
I
hate,
so
much
of
it.
Oh
come
on
I
mean
I,
said:
okay,
I'm,
I'm,
All,
About,
clear
communication
right
so
I,
don't
know,
I'll,
think
and
so
real
quick.
There
is
something
that
I
failed.
To
mention.
AB
I
had
lots
of
examples,
but
obviously
I'm
not
gonna
have
time
one
thing
so
within
consensus.
We're
we're
aware
of
all
this
we're
looking
at
this
we're
seeing
this
this
education,
Gap
and
I.
Think
across
the
field.
Lots
of
people
are
seeing
the
education
Gap
right,
and
what
I'm
excited
to
see
is
that
during
this
bear
Market
lots
of
people
are
bringing
out
educational
resources
and
if
any
of
you
saw
the
my
colleague,
James
Beck
speak
a
couple
days
ago.
He
pitched
a
thing
called
metamask
learn
it's
a
thing.
AB
He
and
I
are
working
on
together,
along
with
a
lot
of
people
at
consensus
and
it's
we
are
sort
of
relearning
a
lot
of
these
lessons
in
there.
We're
writing
we're
trying
to
make
sort
of
that
intro
that
intro
platform
to
the
people
who
maybe
maybe
bought
some
eth
but
don't
know
about
web3
right,
so
that's
going
to
be
launching,
hopefully
at
the
end
of
November
and
we're
very
excited
about
it.
So
man,
oh
yes,
on
Twitter
I
am
mapachuro
like
mapa
m-a-p-a
churro,
like
the
cinnamon
sweet
stick.
AB
Thank
you
all
very
much.
I'll.
A
A
C
Hello:
okay,
it's
working
now
great
okay,
hello,
everyone,
so
I
have
some
exciting
announcements
to
make
in
just
one
hour
is
the
closing
ceremony
of
Defcon.
It
is
on
the
fifth
floor
in
the
top
of
the
mountain,
which
is
where
the
opening
ceremony
was,
and
right
after
we'll
be
heading
to
the
Shiva
Lounge
for
the
after
party,
and
also
this
weekend,
the
venue
is
going
to
be
open
for
co-working,
so
anyone
who
has
a
Defcon
wristband
can
come
to
the
venue
from
9am
to
6
p.m.
But
now
we
have
the
final
panel
of
Defcon
6.
C
M
Million
Dreams,
thank
you.
It's
my
first
Defcon,
but
the
last
panel
of
the
day.
So
that's
gotta
count
for
something
well.
Thank
you.
Everyone
for
coming
I
know
it's
the
end
of
the
day.
I
know
it's
the
end
of
a
big
week,
but
we're
all
really
excited.
We
got
a
great
panel
here
for
you
and
I'm
super
excited
to
kick
it
off,
so
my
name
is
Anna.
M
Specifically,
so
I
want
to
give
you
an
example
like
working
for
nobody
works
for
ethereum
and
in
the
same
way,
nobody
works
for
cello.
M
The
primary
lever
that
we
have
is
Grants,
but
in
and
and
usually
they
are
coordinated
by
a
pretty
centralized
group
of
people,
but
at
Adele
it
can
be
managed
by
a
governance
Community.
You
can
tap
into
unchain
funding
and
then
you
can
also
have
various
new
methods
of
ecosystem
growth
like
Delta,
doubt
swaps
and
other
various
tooling.
So
I
want
to
give
first
everyone
a
chance
to
give
an
introduction
starting
with
Juan,
and
maybe
you
can
tell
a
little
bit
of
a
background
for
how
you've
seen
this
happen
at
maker.
AC
Yeah,
thank
you.
Anna
I'm
Juan
from
the
sustainable
gas
system
scaling
core
unit
at
megadel,
a
joint
maker
right
before
the
foundation
started
to
to
dissolve
so
yeah.
It
was
very,
very
chaotic
and
extremely
interesting
and
since
then
I've
been
pretty
much
working
on
scaling
the
ecosystem.
We
used
to
do
a
lot
of
different
things.
In
the
beginning,
we
were
very
a
team
that
was
very
that
different.
AC
It's
a
very
the
skills
were
very
were
very
mixed
and
that
was
extremely
interesting
and
then,
through
the
last
year
and
a
half
or
so
we've
been
like
specializing,
and
now
we
are
we're
on
building
the
like
operational
tools
for
the
centralized
Workforce,
then
legal,
resilience
and
and
finally,
what
we
call
governance
design
because
we
haven't
found
a
better
name
yet,
but
yeah
that's
pretty
much
what
I've
been
doing
for
the
last
year,
so
very
much
looking
forward
to
to
speaking
here
with
these
great
people.
Thank.
W
Name
is
Abby.
My
role
now
is
the
head
of
community
and
governance
at
radical.
So
for
those
who
don't
know
radical,
we
basically
build
decentralized
collaboration
tools
and
infrastructure
for
people
building,
decentralized,
Technologies,
and
so,
but
we
really
consider
ourselves
even
more
so
than
a
crypto
project.
W
We
consider
ourselves
more
so
a
free
and
open
source
project,
and
so
my
view
on
ecosystem
scaling
definitely
comes
from
the
concept
of
like
ecosystem
in
open
source
projects
and
communities,
and
you
realize
that
in
like
web3
everything's,
open
source
and
so
inherently,
you
know
we're
actually
Building
open
source
ecosystems
and
communities,
and
so
it's
been
over
the
last
couple
of
years
there,
stewarding
governance
and
working
on
community
I
think
that
it's
all
been
about
like
combining
our
crypto
community
and
ecosystem
learnings
and
what
it
means
to
scale
crypto
ecosystem
with.
W
What
does
it
mean
to
scale
like
an
open
source
project
in
an
open
source
ecosystem
so
and
I
think
the
difference
there
is.
How
do
we
progressively
decentralize
to
support
the
emergence
and
autonomy
of
an
open
source,
ecosystem
and
I
think
my
focus
has
been
on
like
optimistically
designing
new
Futures,
in
which
decentralized
Technologies
can
better
support
the
coordination
and
growth
of
Open
Source
ecosystems
and
the
resilience
of
Open
Source
ecosystems,
so
so
yeah.
W
Right
now
is
helping
lead
the
our
transition
to
the
Dao,
which
means
a
lot
of
things
but
basically
means
progressively
decentralizing
the
project
from
where
we
were
prior,
which
was
basically
like
a
venture-funded
startup
to
a
foundation
with
you
know
a
token
governed
Dao
to
now
the
next
stage,
which
is
you
know,
dissolving
aspects
of
the
radical
foundation
and
transitioning
those
responsibilities
to
an
autonomous,
decentralized
entity
that
lives
within
the
Dow
is
funded
via
the
Dao
and
acts
as
a
participant
within
the
Dao
among
other
orgs.
W
That
will
slowly
emerge
over
time,
so
yeah
in
that
process.
We're
thinking
a
lot
about
what
it
means
to
not
only
scale
an
ecosystem
but
support
an
ecosystem.
That's
scaling
and
what
foundations
do
you
need
to
put
in
place
to
you
know
kind
of
actually
support
the
growth
and
resilience
throughout
a
progressive,
decentralization
or
transition,
and
so
we're
excited
to
chat
about
that
today.
M
Yeah
and
Progressive
decentralization
is
the
reason
that
I'm
so
excited
to
be
sharing
the
stage
with
y'all,
because
I
feel
like
we
are.
We've
been
at
different
stages
of
this
and
we've
seen
this
through
the
ecosystem
perspective.
But
ELP
I
really
want
to
hear
your
background
and
how
do
you
think
about
ecosystem
yeah.
AD
Thank
you,
hey
guys.
It's
Al
I
started
my
journey
like
as
an
entrepreneur.
Let's
say
like
a
couple
of
years
back
with
a
web
to
start
up
working
on
like
Agriculture
and
like
food
Technologies,
then
I
started
to
participate
in
circular
economies,
researchers
in
United,
Nation
and
European
Union
under
some
organizations
there
and
worked
a
lot
on
the
ground
and
try
to
understand
actually
what
we
could
do
to
improve
the
lives
of
people
in
developing
countries.
AD
M
I
actually
also
started
within
the
maker
ecosystem
and
the
reason
I'm
so
interested
in
funding
mechanisms
is
because
I
myself
originally
started
in
web3
as
a
beneficiary
of
a
grant
from
what
we
then
call
Community
Development
at
the
maker
foundation,
and
that
was
really
a
program
to
incubate
the
next
generation
of
people
that
will
eventually
take
over
a
lot
of
the
functions
and
be
able
to
manage
maker
protocol
through
the
dell
and
so
through
through
that
experience
and
I
I
learned
I
learned
so
much
because
that
was
such
a
pivotal
time
in
our
well
for
maker,
but
also
for
the
entire
ecosystem,
because
maker
I
think
was
one
of
the
first
and
really
big
projects
to
do
that
kind
of
transition
and
then
going
to
sell
a
foundation
I.
M
So
I
saw
the
same
thing
happening,
but
a
lot
earlier
on
and
I
kind
of
had
this
I
had
the
front
row
seat
to
seeing
how
to
make
this.
The
ecosystem
scaling
sustainable.
You
really
have
to
encourage-
and
you
have
to
design
for
intentionally
for
people
to
be
able
to
have
this
independent
thinking
to
be
able
to
decide
on
what
things
are
meaningful
for
the
ecosystem,
an
independent
process
which
has
to
do
with
like
how
do
you
apply
for
Grants?
How
do
you
access
funding
and
a
dow?
M
This
has
to
do
with
a
lot
of
core
units,
which
is
a
framework
that
we'll
jump
into
next
and
then
also
independent
sources
of
funding,
because,
ultimately,
having
funding
at
your
disposal
is
what
allows
you
to
have
agency.
And
if
you
have
agency,
then
you
can
really
execute
on
the
things
that
are
really
meaningful
for
your
ecosystem,
but
to
jump
into
what
ecosystem
development
really
means.
M
I
want
to
ask
this
to
each
one
of
you,
because
what
I
learned
going
from
protocol
like
maker
to
a
project
like
cello,
which
is
a
layer
one,
is
that
a
layer
one.
Your
ecosystem
is
really
dependent
on
your
application
layer
and
on
your
projects
and
companies
that
are
developing
in
your
ecosystem
and
also,
of
course,
like
your
community
and
your
users,
and
your
Advocates
and
lots
of
other
stakeholders,
but
primarily
it's
about
developing
an
application
layer.
But
what
is
ecosystems?
Development
mean
a
project
like
maker.
AC
Yeah
I
I
like
what
Abby
said,
but
I
don't
think
that
that
governance
should
be
an
afterthought
ever
you
really
need
to
work
on
the
supporting
mechanisms
and
structures
and
all
these
Frameworks
that
will
allow
you
to
scale
properly.
Otherwise,
you
end
up
with
this
type
of
yeah
people
screaming
at
each
other.
I,
don't
know
so
pretty
much.
AC
It's
like
you
have
this
bricked
version
of
governance
that
doesn't
allow
you
to
to
keep
going
and
and
looking
forward
and,
and
you
end
up
with
a
mess
I
can
I
can
speak
a
bit
more
about
maker.
If
you.
AC
So,
to
just
give
you
the
the
very
quick
overview,
the
way
we
organized
it
in
the
beginning
was
very
optimistic
if
you'd
like,
and
that's
why
right
now,
I'm
a
bit
reticent
about
any
any
type
of
optimistic
kind
of
Grant
or
or
funding
mechanism,
and
what
it
is
that
anyone
can
come
and
permission
permissionlessly
start
a
core
unit
and
get
funding,
and
it
is
very,
very
hard
for
if
there's
no
structure
there
to
actually
report
on
progress
on
Milestones
on
on
what's
happening.
AC
What's
there
to
be
achieved,
you
end
up
with
many
delegates
that
have
never
run
a
company
trying
to
judge
a
topic
that
they
might
not
understand,
and
there's
no
auditor
or
auditing
function
within
this.
So
you
end
up
with
MS
and
that's
a
bit
what
we're
trying
to
work
on
nowadays
through
maker
governance
and
governance,
design.
W
Nice,
nice,
so
yeah
I
think
that,
in
the
case
of
radical
and
maybe
more
generally
like
open
source
ecosystems,
I
think
that
there's
like
different
layers
of
ecosystem
development
right
so
I
think
that
there's
like
ecosystem
scale,
which
is
related
to
increasing
the
number
of
participants,
whether
that
be
like
users,
contributors
maintainers,
whatever
you'd
like
and
that's
kind
of,
also
Community
right,
which
is
like
building,
obviously
for
an
open
source
project.
W
That's
your
maintainers
and
your
contributors
and
being
able
to
grow
your
contributors
is
a
really
important
part
of
ecosystem
development
and
then
there's
resilience
which
I
think
and
I
would
also
say
what
interplays
with
that
is
like
diversity,
so
like
resilience
and
diversity.
So
what
you're
saying
is
like
having
a
really
strong,
diverse
application
layer?
Network
ecosystem
is
really
important
for
like
a
layer
one.
W
It
actually
goes
the
same
I
think
for
like
open
source
infrastructure
in
which
you
want
to
be
able
to
have
a
more
diverse
client
ecosystem,
or
at
least
least
like
technical
ecosystem,
to
ensure
the
projects
like
longer
term
resilience
and
so
I
think
that
that's
like
a
really
important
part,
and
is
why,
like
things
like
grants
and
rfps
and
bounties,
are
really
great
because
basically
you're
growing.
The
number
of
people
who
are
working
on
the
project
and
you're
also
increasing
the
diversity
of
the
project.
W
So
so
that's
one
and
then
I
think
that
there's
this
other
con
like
dimension
of
development,
which
is
like
I
I,
guess
it's
kind
of
like
developing
the
ecosystem.
You
know
what
I
mean,
which
is
like
not
just
having
a
bunch
of
people,
but
actually
having
kind
of
more
of
an
idea
of
how
you're
growing
people
in
an
ecosystem
so
like
what
you
were
saying
like
how
you
know:
grants
Were
Meant,
to
empower
new
people
to
take
over
leadership
roles.
W
I
think
that
this
is
like
an
incredibly
important
point
of
ecosystem,
which
is
like
ecosystem
development,
which
is
not
just
like
bringing
people
in
and
then
just
like
having
them
there.
It's
like
bringing
them
in
and
then
developing
them
and
like
helping
them
support
and
empowering
them
and
growing
them
into
leadership
positions
and
and
just
becoming
like
long-term
participants
and
I,
actually
think
that
this
is
like
low-key,
the
most
important
and
hardest
one
to
do,
which
is
like.
How
do
you
get
people
to
stick
around?
How
do
you
create
longer
term
incentives?
W
And
how
do
you
embed
like
longer
term
commitment,
because
often
this
is
what's
actually
necessary
to
kind
of
like
realize
all
of
these
ecosystem,
Visions
and
so
I
think
that
all
of
those
are
yeah
pretty
hard
to
do
they
all
interplay
with
each
other,
but
I
think
there's
a
lot
of
ways
to
kind
of
of
like
stimulate
each
type
of
development.
So.
W
Like
kind
of
I'm,
like
kind
of
pessimistic
on
just
programming
incentives,
because
I,
don't
think
that
it
often
introduces
or
encourages
the
correct
Behavior,
but
it
is
true,
is
that
we
do
have
kind
of
we
have
different
tools
and
we
should
be
experimenting
with
like
how
those
tools
look
like
in
the
long
term,
I
mean
we
kind
of
are
with
like
tokens
right,
like
that's,
basically
like
a
long-term
incentive
mechanism
that
we're
trying
to
experiment
and
build
governance
around,
but
yeah
we're
definitely
like
applying
the
Corp
reform
like
way
too
much
and
I
think
it's
just
us
trying
to
like
process
a
new
design
space
and
like
also
trying
to
make
things
work
at
the
same
time.
M
I
think
this
has
to
do
with,
like
we
all
like
to
talk
about
onboarding,
but
what
are
we
actually
onboarding
into
and
I
working
at
maker
I
really
saw
this
very
clearly,
I
think
there's
the
onboarding
into
the
technical
protocol
and
then
there's
onboarding
into
social
protocol,
and
the
social
protocol
is
what's
really
difficult
because
that's
like
that's
at
the
core
of
how
do
we
coordinate
with
each
other
like
we
can
have
all
of
the
tech
stack
in
the
world?
But
how
do
we
actually
Implement
those
things?
How
do
we
coordinate?
M
How
do
we
agree?
How
do
we
govern
well
together,
like
the
social
protocol,
is
the
one
that's
much
more
I
think
difficult
to
build,
and
so
I'll
I
think
you
have
a
really
interesting
perspective,
that's
external,
to
like
an
ecosystem.
It
has
more
to
do
with
maybe
like
developing
Regional
ecosystems,
so
I
I'd
love
to
hear
more
about
how
you.
AD
Think
about
ecosystem.
Thank
you
just
to
add,
really
quick.
Like
the
other
day,
A
friend
of
mine,
told
me
flow
of
capital
is
the
flow
of
trust.
So
when
it
comes
to
ecosystem
design
as
well
like
to
understand
the
contributor
taxonomy
and
like
kind
of
building
the
development
projects
in
the
regions
where
it's
required,
we
really
need
to
understand
like
the
kind
of
the
requirements
of
the
system.
We
want
to
design
on
the
ecosystem
side
as
well
and
like
once.
We
understand
the
system
that
we
want
to
design
them.
AD
So,
for
example,
if
you
would
have
a
specific
development
projects
in
some
regions,
and
you
could
actually
have
a
database
to
basically
see
those
milestones
and
deliverables
that
they
need
to
do
and
also
like,
we
can
incentivize
understanding,
sanitization
methods
that
have
been
used
by
different
protocols
and
different
entities,
whether
they
are
centralized
organizations
or
traditional
organizations.
I
think
we
can
also
like
kind
of
have
a
different
perspective
to
the
ecosystem,
design,
where
the
focus
would
be
public
goods,
plus
empowerment
of
the
local
communities
and
I.
AD
Think,
like
also
maker
and
like
cello,
are
very
focused
on
the
regional
based
ecosystem
design,
which
I
really
enjoy
so
I.
Think
like
last
year,
we
were
talking
with
you,
like
you
were
kind
of
mentioning
some.
A
custom
design
perspective
offers
in
the
local
communities
and
economies
would
be
interesting
to
go
into
that
level
as
well.
If
you
remember
the
whole
Grant
programs
in
like
in
African
regions,
and
because
we
could
actually
establish
like
a
kind
of
block
spaces
for
people
to
develop
themselves
and
Empower
themselves,
yeah.
M
Yeah
I
love
that
love
that
well.
Actually,
this
ties
in
into
how,
like
the
next
question,
that
I
wanted
to
go
into,
which
is
like.
Where
are
we
coming
from
like
what
is
the
past
case
scenario
and
like?
How
did
we
used
to
think
about
ecosystem
growth
versus?
How
are
we
thinking
about
it
now
and
what
is
to
look
forward
to
in
the
future
and
when
I
got
to
cello
a
year?
M
Almost
a
year
and
a
half
ago,
the
cell
Foundation
was
the
only
entity
that
was
thinking
about
ecosystem
development
and
so
Foundation
kind
of
like
set
a
lot
of
the
goals
and
like
regions
and
priorities
for
where
we
want
to
develop.
But
now
we
have
created
a
whole
system
of
governance
where
people
are
able
to
tap
into
unchain
funding
from
the
protocol
and
establish
their
own
independent
entities
that
are
able
to
set
their
own
priorities
and
their
own
goals.
M
How
they
want
to
like
plan
that
entire
ecosystem,
how
they
want
to
manage
deliverables
and
also
have
the
funding
and
they're
multisig
to
be
able
to
act
on
those
things.
So,
if
there's
like
a
hackathon,
they
want
to
sponsor
regionally,
then
they
can
and
I
think
that
is
huge
power
and
like
a
tremendous
responsibility.
But
this
is
yeah.
This
has
to
do
with
where
we
came
from
and
where
we're
going,
but
yeah.
W
You
want
me
to
start
sure:
I
can
talk.
Okay,
I'll
talk,
maybe
about
General
previous
state
as
I've,
seen
and
kind
of
what
nuances
of
like
our
current
state.
That
I
think
are
different,
so
I
think
in
like
previous
state,
at
least
not
for
like
open
source
ecosystems,
specifically
because
those
are
basically,
you
know,
like
decentralized
ecosystems
in
at
their
core
I,
think
that
there
was
obviously
like
a
much
more
like
centralized
approach
to
ecosystem
development
in
general,
in
which
there
is
like
a
directed
Force.
W
That's
like
kind
of
yeah,
just
like
creating
the
community
and
like
running
the
community,
I
think
of
like
I.
Don't
know
if,
like
notion,
is
a
really
good
example
of
this,
but
like
previous
projects
that
have
like
have
been
built
on
like
Creator
communities,
in
which
there's
kind
of
this,
like
top-down
directed
Force,
that's
driving
an
ecosystem
forth
right
and
it's
very
branded.
W
It's
like
very
directed,
it's
very
structured,
often
has
its
own
hierarchies,
because
ecosystem
is
being
looked
at
as
like
a
means
of
like
growth,
right
and
so
yeah
I.
Think
that's
like
the
previous
state
and
so
I
think
that,
like
now,
what's
different
is
that
we
have
a
lot
more
headless
ecosystems
right
like
headless,
Brands,
headless
ecosystems
in
which
people
are
identifying
with
different
ecosystems
and
communities
without
being
explicitly
tied
to
it
itself.
W
That's
like
a
very
OG
hacker
with
like
Griff
green
at
like
common
sac
and
everything
before
I
found,
radical
and
I
think
that
this
aspect
of
community
is
something
that
again
very
much
so
parallels
like
open
source
ecosystems
in
which,
like,
for
example
like
Russ,
is
this
like
insane
ecosystem
right
and
but
it's
very
headless,
and
that
there's
like,
obviously
because
it's
a
language
right.
W
It's
like
a
bunch
of
people,
building
this
language
and
Building
Things
on
top
of
it
and
other
open
source
ecosystems,
exhibit
this
trait
as
well
and
so
I
feel
like
now.
We're
seeing
companies
try
to
frame
themselves
as
open
source
ecosystems
because
they're
building
open
source
software
you
get
they're
also
building
companies
and
projects
right
and
I.
W
Think
now
we're
seeing
this
like
mesh
of
Two
Worlds,
in
which
this
previous
state
of
kind
of
like
Central
top-down,
community,
ecosystem
growth
and
scaling,
and
this
like
more
decentralized
immersion,
headless
ecosystem
approach
in
crypto
right
now
and
I.
Think
that
that's
kind
of
like
why
it's
I
think
hard
and
people
try
to
apply
the
corporate
form
because,
at
the
end
of
the
day,
we're
not
building
on
entirely
Vault
volunteer.
Volunteeristic
voluntary,
altruistic,
volunteer
based.
W
Know
what
I'm
trying
to
say
we're
you
know
we're
building
projects
that
have
actually
like
a
lot
of
like
long-term
incentives
and
value
networks
attached
to
them,
yet
we're
building
open
source
ecosystems
at
the
same
time
and
I.
W
Think
that
that's
why
it's
so
tough
for
us
to
try
to
like
process
like
where
to
go
and
I
think
governance
is
actually
the
answer,
because
that's
the
tooling
that
we
can
use
to
kind
of
figure
it
out,
but
yeah
so
I
think
we're
just
like
seeing
this
Clash
of
like
this
top-down
versus
headless
approach
and
I.
Think
it's
really
exciting
to
start
embracing
new
forms
of
the
Headless
ecosystem
growth
approach.
As
we
start
looking
forward.
AC
Yeah,
what
we've
noticed
is
that
it's
a
I
mean
we,
we
kind
of
predicted
that
this
was
going
to
happen
and
make
her
scale
to
a
size
that
it's
hard
to
tell
like.
The
kind
of
contributors
is
some
somewhere
between
120
to
170,
and
this
is
because
again
it's
it's
decentralized,
so
it's
hard
to
tell,
but
what
we
failed
to
build
when
we,
when
we
started
this
this
Frameworks
to
to
allow
for
M
care
holders
to
Direct
Value.
AC
So
we
went
from
a
foundation
very
clear
top-down
and
if
we
can
argue
about
the
benefits
of
its
grants
and
how
that
worked
for
better
and
worse,
and
then
we
went
to
this
to
this
mechanism,
where
we
have
a
lot
of
core
units
and
there's
really
no
incentive
to
integrate
or
to
collaborate.
AC
So
every
core
unit
is,
we
have
a
very
flat
hierarchy
and
there's
no
there's
no
way
for
M
care
holders
to
push
core
units
to
work
together
or
to
integrate
or
to
yeah
to
make
things
happen
and
to
create
value
for
the
protocol.
So
I
think
that's
something
we
will
see
in
the
in
the
next
couple
of
months.
Is
we're
going
to
see
a
trend
that
shifts
from
onboarding
people,
which
is
bring
as
many
people
as
you
can
to?
AC
How
do
we
build
this
coordination
mechanisms
to
make
sure
that
we
can
actually
coordinate
so
right
now,
there's
no
tool
that
I'm,
aware
of
and
if
you're
building
something
please
reach
out
to
actually
build
consensus
and
make
sure
that
we
can
create
a
decentralized
strategy
that
involves
the
owner
of
the
projects
that
are
the
ones
holding
the
token.
So
yeah
I
might
be
diverging
a
bit
too
much.
But.
M
No,
no
I
think
this
is
great
and
actually
I
think
that's.
This
is
a
great
example
of
like
a
past
State
and
moving
into
a
current
state.
But
can
you
give
us
an
example
of
like
what
what
what
is
a
core
unit
and
how
did
you
because
you
really
helped
write
the
mipset
that
established
core
unit?
So
can
you
tell.
AC
AC
So
we
we
got
inspired,
I
think
from
from
software
a
bit,
so
we
went
to
the
highest
abstraction
and
we
say
well,
we
said
what
what
do
you
need
and
every
single
project
organization
anything
it's
it's
work,
which
is
what
are
we
trying
to
get
done?
It's
the
workforce
which
is
who's
contributing
and
it's
the
the
incentives
of
the
capital.
So
basically
that's
that
was
it
you
if
you
feel
a
mips
39
there.
You
declare
what
your
mission
is
and
what
you're
trying
to
achieve
for
for
maker.
AC
The
mid
40
is
and
then
maybe
some
maker
Improvement
proposal
me
before.
Is
the
budget
so
I'm
requesting
this
much
money,
I'm
going
to
hire
all
these
people
and
or
yeah
and
and
then
the
41
was
the
the
facilitator,
which
is
the
kind
of
like
the
responsible
person
accountable
to
governance.
Regarding
this
regarding
this
process
and
I
think
that
everything
that
could
have
gone
wrong
went
wrong,
so
we
learned
a
lot
from
it.
We
ended
up
with
the
facilitator,
less
core
units.
AC
We
ended
up
with
Anonymous
off-boardings
of
Koreans
that
were
not
working
out.
We
ended
up,
I,
don't
know
upsizing
and
downsizing
budgets,
so
it
was
extremely
messy.
We
learned
a
lot
and
yeah.
That's
that's
a
bit
the
where
we
are
today
and
if
you
have
heard
about
the
end
game
plan,
the
end
game
plan.
That's
why
it
sounds
so
so
crazy.
But
it's
because
we
need
to
make
the
I
think
we
need
to
make
the
X
the
implicit
complexity.
We
need
to
make
it
explicit
and
we
need
to
make
sure
that
everyone
understands.
AC
Otherwise,
you
end
up
in
this
in
this
Dallas,
where
the
the
very
strong
personalities
kind
of
like
Get
Away
with
everything
and
and
you
can
call
them
the
nice
people,
I
guess
as
a
euphemism
end
up
like
push
aside
so
so
that's
a
bit
we're
trying
to
to
work
with
right
now.
M
If
something
inevitably
at
one
point
does
go
wrong
because
we
are
all
still
learning
and
we
are
still
trying
to
understand
like
how
to
operate
and
how
to
operationalize
this
new
paradigm
like
we
all
can
talk
about
the
ideas
behind
it,
but
then,
once
you
start
to
operationalize
it
you
realize
once
the
core
units
have
been
out
in
the
wild
for
a
year,
you
realize
all
the
things
that
have
gone
wrong.
M
Abby
do
you
have
any
like
parallels
to
core
units
radical
and
how
do
you
think
about
like
how
independent
entities
can
tap
into
that
funding
and
yeah
if
you've
thought
about
onboarding
and
off-boarding
proposals
wow,
so.
W
Much
we
took
a
lot
of
inspiration
so
again,
we're
currently
like
in
the
midst
of
this,
like
transition
right,
so
we're
currently
designing
the
organizational
framework
that
will
absorb
the
responsibilities
that
currently
only
remain
in
the
foundation
Council
for
directing
coordinating
and
funding
all
core
team
development.
W
So
our
core
units
are
technically
called
core
teams
right
and
so
in
that
process,
we've
kind
of
like
scoped
out
like
a
new
ecosystem
design
in
which,
instead
of
envisioning,
the
radical
Dow,
just
funding,
One
Core
team
again
in
the
essence
of
Open
Source
and
decentralization,
we
envisioned
the
Dao,
which
is
a
community
governed
treasury
funding,
different
orgs,
which
act
as
these
like
nested
polycentric.
You
know,
organizations
that
kind
of
resemble
sub-dials
in
the
sense
that
they
have
their
own
governance
processes.
W
They
have
their
own
memberships,
but
they
still
require
certain
trust
level
delegated
from
the
Dow
right
and
so
in
that
process
in
these
orgs
then
become
responsible
for
being
independent
thinkers
funders
and
have
their
own
process
within
the
Dow
using
Anna's
framework
about
like
that,
they
all
are
then
kind
of
trusted
to
allocate
Capital
within
their
mandate,
and
so
then
they
fund
teams
and
so
teams,
instead
of
making
proposals
directly
to
the
tower
making
it
to
the
org
themselves
and
the
org
is
making
the
decision
on
how
to
onboard
or
offward
teams
within
their
own
like
local
jurisdiction.
W
If
you
will,
and
so
the
reason
that
we
did.
This
is
because
again,
like
radical
success
will
be
in
how
we
deploy
this
treasury
in
the
long
term
to
fund
the
growth
of
the
radical
ecosystem,
the
growth
and
the
resilience
of
the
radical
ecosystem.
Right
like
we're
not
a
D5
protocol,
you
know
we're
trying
to
build
a
self-sustaining
community-owned
and
operated
open
source
project,
and
so
for
us.
W
That
means
you
know,
learning
and
taking
learnings
from
Dao's
about
how
we
can
like
make
it
more
effective
to
you
know,
coordinate
budgets
and
goals,
so
we're
not
just
like
negotiating
like
haircuts
all
the
time
you
know
is
I
think
that
that
process
has
led
us
to
this
like
more
emergent
model
that
supports
the
autonomy
of
these
orgs
themselves
and
the
governance
processes
of
themselves.
W
So
in
terms
of
like
onboarding
and
off-boarding,
that
means
that
there
needs
to
be
like
explicit,
like
I,
said,
trust
levels
between
the
Dao,
the
Orcs
And,
the
teams,
and
so
there's
actually
like
a
lot
of
really
going
back
to
what
you
were
saying
about
like
designing
like
smart
contracts
and
how
we
can
like
be
trying
out
new
things
instead
of
like
corporate
forms.
W
Is
that
there's
like
a
lot
of
really
cool
tools
like
being
built
by
like
gnosis
Guild
right
now
and
with
like
the
Zodiac
mods
that
allow
you
know
like
the
like
Dao,
the
Dow
is
like
a
community
governed
entity
to
delegate
trust
and
revoke
trusts
in
really
interesting
ways.
W
So
like
one
of
those
is
like
I
forget
what
mod
is
called
but
like
the
Guard,
Mod
I,
think
in
which
Adele
can
send
funding
to
a
multi-sig,
but
then
there
could
be
a
mod
built
into
the
safe
that
allows
the
community
to
revoke
the
funds
from
the
multi-sig
overriding
the
the
signatures
on
the
multi-sig
when
you
think
about
that.
W
That's
a
really
powerful
thing,
because
we're
able
to
rebalance
and
redistribute
the
power
of
delegating
and
revoking
trust
among
an
organization
and
create
more
autonomous
flows
for
that
which
I
think
better
supports
the
emergence
of
an
ecosystem
because
you're
not
just
having
these
like
Gatekeepers
deciding
who's,
onboarded
and
who's,
not
off-boarding,
and
so
that's
really
important.
When
you're
trying
to
develop
more
headless
brands
in
which
people
can
be
onboarding
to
the
ecosystem
and
doing
it
in
a
way
that's
autonomous,
meaning
the
power
is
distributed.
W
W
Those
rules
that
embed
those
checks
and
balances
between
the
community,
the
orgs
themselves,
which
represent
you
could
say,
The,
Trusted
actors
in
the
ecosystem
and
then
the
ecosystem
that
those
orgs
are
funding
and
then
the
general
community
of
people
who
are
participating
and
and
supporting
like
the
radical
projects.
W
So
it's
all
about,
like
kind
of
like
looking
at
all
these
different
participants
and
figuring
out
how
to
best
distribute
power
and
Trust
to
support
like
the
emergence
of
the
ecosystem,
without
just
kind
of
doing
this
like
whole,
like
spray
and
pray
approach
to
just
like
know,
with
no
accountability
or
like
no,
you
know
mechanisms
for
recourse,
so.
M
Amazing,
that's
super
interesting
and
that's
super
important
trust
is
super
important,
but
then
also
like
I
want
to
talk
about
process,
because
I
think
both
Dows
and
like
more
centralized
foundations
really
struggle
with
this
because,
like
we
can
give
a
grand.
But
then
how
do
you
ultimately
like
report
on
the
success
of
that
Grant?
M
You
can
talk
about
later,
more
so
like
the
challenges
with
that,
but
I
know
you're
developing
a
lot
of
actual,
like
tooling,
with
the
proposal
inverter
for
how
you
can
how
you
can
go
about
like
putting
together
a
proposal
getting
funding
for
the
proposal
tracking
milestones
and
then
reporting
on
those
Milestones.
So
I'd
love
to
hear
your
perspective
on
this
process.
AD
Perspective
so
I
think,
like
we
have
like
this
traditional
again
know-how
that
has
been
working
for
the
last
20
years,
like
that
has
circulated
around
to
two
trillion
dollars:
I
think
globally,
United
Nations,
World,
Bank
EU.
They
always
fund
milestone-based
funding.
They
require
proof
of
work
as
in
like
upload
documentations.
They
assign
you
mentors
and
program
managers
and
I
think
that's
kind
of
what
you
touched
upon
as
well
like
it's
kind
of
mycelium
like
a
mushroom
Network.
AD
AD
Now
we
are
building
like
this
mechanism,
where
you
can
write
a
proposal
applied
to
any
Grand
application
or
like
dial
funding
through
that
or
traditional
organization
funding
gaps
as
well,
like
African
grants
program
in
Tanzania,
and
then
they
will
ask
you
additional
questions
according
to
their
cultural
infrastructure
that
they
built
upon.
May
that
be
kyc
or
like
a
specific
requirements
about
the
contributors
and
Builders,
and
then
it's
basically
Milestone
based
funding
where
you
have
to
upload
the
work
you
have
to
provide
the
feedback
as
a
funder.
AD
W
Yeah
I,
like
the
mycelium
networks,
I,
think,
checks
and
balances
should
actually
be
reframed
as
like
symbiotic
relationships.
It's
technically
the
same
thing.
I
actually
think
we
have
more
potential
to
build
symbi
symbiosis
between,
like
participants
in
a
system
than
like
just
checks
and
balances
to
like
reframe
the
language
and
instead
of
applying
like
all
of
our
like
political
corporate
form
stuff
to
it.
You
know.
AC
Yeah
and
I
agree
that
I
think
that
eventually
we
need
all
the
the
tools
to
make
it
super
easy
for
anyone
and
make
sure
that
it's
that
is
extremely
easy
and
the
guardrails
are
in
place.
AC
AC
AC
Been
telling,
with
the
with
different
tools
and
yeah,
looking
forward
to
find
one
that
will
actually
work,
I
think
that's
also
an
industry
that
will
help
us
a
lot
in
terms
of
tooling
and
grounds,
but
I
think
we
need
to
reach
that
point
where
it's
almost
permissionless
and
there's
almost
no,
no
one
to
to
yeah
to
verify
it
right.
Eventually,
I,
don't
know,
use
scleros
or
something
but
I
hope
we
get
there.
M
Yeah
yeah
and
we've
experimented
with
a
few
like
grants.
Automation,
tooling
I
mean
well
first
of
all
like
yes,
we
do
actually
use
an
ocean
pipeline
to
track
grants
and
we
we
have
an
application
that
comes
in
like
we
have
this
whole
process
that
we
build
out
where,
like
an
application,
goes
in,
it
gets
assigned
like
a
few
reviewers.
M
They
like,
based
on
their
area
of
expertise.
The
way
that
we
do
grants
is
by
vertical
so
like
if
there's
like
a
kind
of
T
vertical
or
like
I
personally,
fund
community
and
ecosystem
or
community
and
education
grants
so
like
I,
would
review
that
vertical.
And
then
we
have
like
a
whole
process
for
moving
that
Grant
down
a
pipeline.
M
We
in
the
future,
like
we
really
wanted
to
experiment
more
with
like
open
decision
making
and
being
able
to
post
all
those
applications
to
like
a
public
forum.
But
then
the
challenge
of
the
foundation
is,
we
can't
always
disclose,
like
exact
applications
or
like
what
people
are,
the
amounts
that
people
are
requesting
for.
So
some
of
the
way
that
we've
tried
to
solve
this
is
one
tool.
We're
going
to
Pilot
is
Quest
book
or
not
Quest
Book
quest
book.
Yes,
Quest
book
is
one
of
it.
No
yeah.
H
M
And
climate
Collective,
which
is
actually
one
of
the
first
or
I,
guess
the
second
independent
entity
that
has
gotten
money
from
the
protocol
to
specifically
fund
like
climate
and
refi
related
projects,
they're
going
to
experiment
with
Quest
book
as
a
way
to
do
like
more
decentralized
and
more
open
grants
process.
Then
the
other
way
is
like
we
just
use
git
congrants
as
well
and
like
we
match,
we
do
matching
rounds
on
git
coin.
M
Grants
like
that
to
me
is
one
of
the
like
best
open
source
like
open,
Community,
participatory
ways
to
do
grants,
that's
external
to
an
ecosystem
and
I
think
we're
still
learning
so
yeah.
If
anyone
is
building
grounds
tooling,
I.
W
Don't
have
to
know
I
want
to
give
a
shout
out
to
our
grants,
lead
boredom.
Who
was
actually
someone
who
came
through
the
community
and
now
leads
our
grants
program
we're
only
in
we
just
finished
the
first
season,
starting
up
the
second
season
now,
but
their
approach
to
Grants
is
really
cool
and
I.
Think
it's
something
that
I'd
like
to
see
more
in
the
space
in
which
I
don't
think.
W
And
so
what
they're
doing
with
like
the
grants
program
is
actually
trying
to
reframe
it
kind
of
as
a
little
sub-dial
build
its
own
governance
processes
have
its
own
management
that
allow
for
people
not
only
for
other
orgs
within
the
radical
Dao,
such
as
like
the
core
development
org,
which
is
the
core
teams
to
direct
work
by
submitting
like
rfps
or
something,
but
to
also
experiment.
W
And
this
is
what
they're
going
to
start
doing
now
with
how
you
can
even
decentralize
the
decision-making
of
the
grants
itself
right,
which
I
think
is
like
another
me
means
of
creating
more
autonomy
in
these
funding
sources,
instead
of
it
being
kind
of
like
our
it's
like
not
our
foundation,
grants
program
right,
it's
boredom's
grant
program
and
boredom
is
listening
and
kind
of
creating
a
symbiotic
relationship
with
like
the
core
teams
themselves,
and
so
there's
a
lot
of
Cool
Tools
like,
for
example,
they're
using
outer
space
badges,
which
are
basically
like
these,
like
non-transferable
nft
badges
to
create
you
know
a
like
spawn.
W
A
membership
model
that
exists
within
the
down
can
be
recognized
by
the
parent
Dao,
but
have
its
kind
of
own
structure,
integrate
that
with
snapshot,
and
now
you
have
like
a
decentralized
governance
system.
That's
like
very,
very
scoped
to
the
participants
in
within
that
certain
Realm
of
the
ecosystem
and
I
think
that
that's
going
to
be
a
really
cool
experiment.
W
And
how
can
you
again
support
the
emergence
of
these
kind
of
like
independent
funding
streams
that
have
their
own
mandate
yet
also,
you
know
create
these
trusted
relationships
so
that,
like
other
orgs,
can
kind
of
check
the
power
of
the
grants
and
the
Dao
has
to
kind
of
approve
of
like
allocating
funds,
funds
and
so
I
think
that
that
will
be
like
a
really
good
experiment
moving
forward,
and
you
know
seeing
what
tooling
can
kind
of
support
that
type
of
organization.
Yeah.
M
Totally
and
also
I'll
I
know
that
Prime
has
done
a
lot
of
work
on
like
Prime
rating
and
conviction
voting
as
a
way
to
also
like
separate
signal
from
the
noise
and
understand
which
grants
are
like
worthwhile
funding.
Can
you
tell
us
more
about
how
you
think
about
that
yeah.
AD
So,
basically,
the
main
concept
is
conviction
model
so
which
would
be
again
a
trust
layer.
So
if
you
would
to
recognize
specific
Grant
programs
and
like
be
satisfied
with
their
approach
to
the
grants,
hand
holding
the
projects
that
they
select
and
the
the
way
that
they
actually
onboard
them
to
their
culture
and
their
organization
at
a
very
high
level,
so
they
can
actually
participate
in
their
governance,
participate
in
the
decision
making
process.
So
once
the
conviction
model
works
like
when
a
grant
program
approves
the
Grant
and
provides
the
feedback,
so
how?
AD
How
can
they
track
the
other
Grant
programs
in
the
ecosystem
and
see
their
feedback
and
like
kind
of
generate
this
feedback
loop
on
with
for
individuals
and
also
the
projects
that
individuals
are
working
on?
So
that's
kind
of
my
Approach
like
we
need
more
transparency
in
terms
of
like
the
grant
funding,
we
need
more
transparency
in
terms
of
like
the
the
way
that
we
build
things
together,
because
we
have
this
coordination,
which
it's
a
human
coordination.
We
all
know
each
other
for
a
while.
AD
We've
been
working
together
for
a
while
and
like
this
kind
of
accelerates
us
as
well
to
a
certain
degree,
we
have
a
specific
understanding
of
what
we're
building
I
mean
to
provide
that
to
the
newcomers,
to
this
ecosystem,
to
our
ecosystem
and
be
kind
of
neat.
So
I
feel,
like
you
know,
like
built
Brick
by
Brick,
and
make
sure
that
we
have
a
solid
infrastructure
and
onboard
people
to
that
in
a
way.
M
Yeah
totally
and
from
the
perspective
of
a
contributor
or
from
a
perspective
of
someone
who
is
maybe
newer
to
the
ecosystem,
like
do
any
of
you
have
any
like
key
takeaways
or
advice
for
how
can
someone
get
involved?
Who
wants
to
like
grow
an
ecosystem
either
like
at
a
protocol
level
or
like
open
source
ecosystem
in
general
or
or
build
tools
for
grant
funding?
AC
Yeah
now
I
find
that
I
I
I
went
out
a
bit
on
the
bull
versus
bear
Market
situations
and
and
it's
crazy
how,
when
it's
a
bull
market,
you
see
a
lot
of
I,
don't
know
dowels
or
contributors
popping
up
like
mushrooms
after
a
rainy
day,
but
then,
when
you
move
to
the
bear,
Market
everyone's
panicking
and
then
everyone's
thinking
about
the
the
token
holder.
So
it's
interesting
this
perspective
of
how
you
go
back
and
forth.
AC
I
was
actually
thinking
about
what
Simona
said
about
that.
Not
all
the
organism
needs
to
move
at
the
same
pace,
and
then
how
do
you
manage
like
how?
How
do
you
know
when,
when
it's
time
to
cut
that
part
to
make
sure
that
the
hole
survives
to
to
not
yeah
do
not
kill
the
whole
thing?
Because
of
of
one
part,
and
with
that
in
mind,
it's
I
think
it's
a
it's
a
great
time
to
to
build
and
focus
on
providing
value.
I
think
the
the
market
is
great
for
that.
AC
It
definitely
cleans
a
lot
of
the
of
what
Peter
Pan
was
saying
about
the
Kumbaya.
That
was
so
we'll
we'll
see
what
the
what
the
real
value
is,
but
but
yeah
if
you're
a
contributor,
and
you
want
to
join,
potentially
find
yeah,
an
organization
that
you
like
that
aligns
with
your
values,
start
to
provide
value,
and
eventually
you
I
think
you
will
be
picked
up
right
now.
AC
We
like
to
say
we
like
to
say
that
those
are
our
leader
of
Liverpool
instead
of
leaderless,
but
the
truth
is
that
I,
don't
think
that
everyone
wants
to
be
a
leader.
Maybe
so
some
people
really
like
the
framework
to
and
be
like
yeah
being
told
what
to
do
so.
We
need
to
find
those
Frameworks
to
make
sure
that
we
can
onboard
not
just
the
the
Giga
brains
and
the
and
everyone
that
that
can
do
that.
From
that
perspective,
so.
W
Yeah
I
think
that
I
do
think
that
now
in
the
bear,
Market
we're
like
laying
the
bricks
we're
laying
the
foundation
for
kind
of
the
ecosystems
to
develop
in
the
next
cycle.
If
you
will
and
I
actually
think
that
there's
a
lot
of
projects
that
are
currently
navigating
successions
of
power
for
the
first
time
or
maybe
for
the
second
time
and
that
there's
actually
a
lot
of
opportunity
for
ecosystem
leadership
to
kind
of
shine.
W
It's
hard,
though,
because
I
think
actually
how
you
get
involved
is
different
from
data
down
from
ecosystem
to
ecosystem
and
often
I,
think
grants
or
kind
of
like
trying
to
achieve
some
sort
of
like
funding
stream
through
an
organization
is
like
a
great
way,
but
there's
something
more
deep
there
in
which,
like
finding
an
ecosystem
in
a
community
that
you
align
with
principles
wise
and
trying
to
kind
of
like
participate
in
that
Community
for
like
and
align
yourself
with
that
community.
W
So
it's
it's
tough,
because
I
think
that
a
lot
of
people
like,
for
example,
like
as
we
were
trying
to
get
like
our
grants,
program
off
and
running,
there's
a
lot
of
people
who,
like
didn't,
know
how
to
engage
in
the
process
and
maybe
we're
like
since
we
didn't
understand
how
we
really
wanted
to
do
grants.
A
lot
of
people
had
expectations
for
how
other
people
did
grants,
and
maybe
we,
you
know,
like
miss
a
lot.
W
It's
come
from
community
members
who
just
started
like
showing
up
and
and
being
in
the
in
forums
and
in
the
community,
and
talking
and
asking
questions
who
then
started
answering
questions
for
other
people
asking
questions
who
then
started
being
you
know
the
people
that
you'd
go
to
when
you
want
to
distribute
power,
permissions
or
Capital,
and
while
for
us
we're
still
kind
of
like
learning
about
what
our
ecosystem
growth
should
be,
as
we
also
figure
out
all
the
other
things
with
radical.
W
It's
I
think
that
what
we're
trying
to
do
is
like
lean
into
those
like
more
one-to-one
like
individual,
like
relationships
of
supporting
people
like
growing
into
leaders
within
the
community
themselves
and
empowering
them
as
they
emerge
instead
of
again
like
gatekeeping.
It
so
and
I
think
that
that
comes
with,
like
a
lot
of
like
I
feel,
like
my
answers
are
more
about
like
what
we
can
do.
W
Coming
into
the
ecosystem
better-
and
it's
like
a
lot
of
like
like
intentional
program
development,
you
know
of
not
just
building
an
audience
but
building
a
community.
W
It's
a
lot
of
like
thinking
about
grants
more
intentionally,
not
just
as
distributions
of
capital
but
as
gateways
into
kind
of
like
other
means
of
development
within
a
project
and
also
kind
of
embracing
more
like
ecosystem
relationships,
I
think
and
kind
of
like
Partnerships.
Just.
AD
Really
quick,
so
basically
I
feel
like
also
as
a
web
trip
free
agent.
Let's
say
you
know,
like
kind
of
product
project
agnostic
person.
The
most
important
thing
to
the
new
one
board
is
I
would
say,
like
first
of
all,
learn
like
to
read
a
lot.
We
have
a
lot
of
learning
curves
and
that
you
need
to
go
through,
but
most
important
is
mentorship.
Like
apprenticeship,
that's
that's!
AD
That's
helped
me
a
lot
in
web
2
web
3
in
my
life
in
general
and
I,
see
like
we
have
amazing
leaders,
amazing
people
that
actually
cares
about
like
what
they're
building
their
mission
is.
How
can
we
generate
public
good
stuff?
AD
We
can
actually
improve
our
society
Prosper
our
society,
and
if
you
can
find
these
people
and
like
just
reach
out
to
them
and
don't
don't
be
even
shy,
you
know
like
I,
just
ask
them
to
mentally,
because
I
think,
like
many
people
that
I
know
great
leaders
in
the
psychosystem,
they
would
love
to
mention
newcomers
and
like
teach
them
what
they
know
and
learned,
because
we
learn,
as
we
teach
our
new
teachers.
You
learn
now
so
just
want
that
on
top
of
that
I.
AC
AC
An
example
is
the
delegates
in
maker,
though
the
first
one
just
started
the
Forum
thread
saying
this
is
my
platform
and
we
had
a
call
with
them,
and
that
was
it
so
now,
every
delegate
in
pretty
much
the
whole
industry
has
the
platform,
which
is
just
a
forum
thread,
and
maybe
a
call
introducing
themselves
to
the
community
and
delegates
in
this
particular
case
could
be
so
much
more
than
that
they
could
provide
Frameworks.
They
could
provide
reports,
they
could
provide
so
many
more
things
and
and
all
we're
getting
is
just
this.
Oh
I'm
voting
this.
AC
For
this
reason-
and
this
applies
to
almost
everything
so
try
to
think
outside
the
box,
going
back
to
Ops
Point
try
to
provide
value
when
you
approach
someone
instead
of
give
me
something
to
do
it's
more
like
hey
I
thought
that
this
could
be
of
use.
What
do
you
think,
if
you
think
it's
horrible,
try
to
get
me
in
the
in
the
right
direction,
but
it's
extremely
important
to
try
to
be
proactive
and
and
to
help
your
Mentor
or
your
team
mentor
to
to
help
you.
M
I
mean
I,
think
we've
come
full
circle
to
ecosystems,
being
a
mycelium
Network
and
all
of
us
being
mushrooms
in
the
network
and
the
dowels
imitate
nature,
as
Simona
pointed
out
earlier
in
the
week,
and
with
that
we
only
have
five
more
minutes.
So
if
we
want
to
take
a
couple
of
questions
or
just
say
some
closing
remarks,
or
where
can
people
find
you
all
and
connect
with
you?
After
after
Devcon.
W
We
can
talk
about
where
we
connect
and
then
I
can
hand
my
microphone
off
to
anybody
who
has
a
question
but
yeah
you
can
follow
radical
radicals,
r-a-d-I-c-l-e
on
Twitter
and
you'll,
probably
see
be
seeing
a
lot
on
our
Forum
radical.com
Community
about
the
transition.
I
write
discourse
like
this
is
my
job
now
discourse
posts,
and
so
we
have
a
lot
of
really
cool
ones
that
are
kind
of
like
outlining
our
transition
and
a
lot
of
really
cool
stuff.
W
There
that's
happening
in
the
open
in
the
open,
and
you
can
follow
me
at
Abby,
Abbey
underscore
tick
home
t-I-t-c-1b,
because
I
also
tweeted
about
this
a
lot
so.
AD
AC
M
J
Hi
yep,
you
were
mentioning
about
like
these
difference
between
symbiotic
relationships
instead
of
check
and
balances
and
I
would
love
to
know
like.
Could
you
expand
a
little
bit
more
on
that
and
how?
How
would
that
look
like.
W
Yeah
so
I
think
that
it's
about
I,
think
well.
I,
say
this
word
way
too
much,
but
I
think
it's
about
resilience
right
and
that,
like
when
you
look
at
our
natural
world,
actually
everything
is
built
off
of
not
really
checks
and
balances,
like
you,
I
think
that
that's
kind
of
more
of
like
a
competitive
way
to
look
at
it
like
when
something
spins
out
of
control.
Something
checks
it.
W
However,
when
you
look
at
like
natural
symbiotic
relationships,
the
difference
is
because
checking
balance
is
like
constraining
power
and
kind
of
creating
means
of
like
limiting
power
where
symbiosis
is
creating
relationships
that
grow
and
that
Thrive,
and
that,
like
spawn
and
I,
think
that
that's
kind
of
the
difference
in
which
I
think
symbiosis
symbiotic
relationships
are
often
less
of
this,
like
linear
check
and
balance,
and
more
of
this,
like
Dynamic
exponential
growth,
at
least
from
my
limited
Research
into
microbiology
and
I,
also
think
that,
but
I
do
think
that
this
concept
of
like
thriving
versus
constraining,
is
the
difference
that
I
see
in
which,
when
you
think
of
an
ecosystem,
you
you
see
an
ecosystem.
W
Not
again
is
this:
like
I
mean
some
people
do
again.
It
goes
back
to
like
natural
selection,
if,
like
what
you
think
about
like
kind
of
biology
in
general,
but
I,
think
newer
takes
on
biology,
are
looking
at
ecosystems
as
these
like
very
diverse,
interconnected
networks
that
are
all
building
on
each
other
and
are
all
and
I
think
we're
now
realizing
the
interdependencies
and
I
think
that's.
W
Those
interdependencies
are
not
like
a
check
in
a
balance,
they're
kind
of
a
dependency
on
each
other
to
survive,
and
so
I
think
that
that's
a
way
more
for
me
more
inspiring,
take
on
kind
of
how
we
can
be
building
ecosystems
in
general,
because,
if
you're
working
on
interdependencies,
instead
of
like
one
person
checking
versus
the
other
I,
think
that
you
can
build
more
resilient
ecosystems,
because
we're
focusing-
and
it's
like
how
we
it's
honestly
something
that
we
embody
and
I
think
in
the
ethereum
space
off
the
bat
right
is
that
we
want
to
be
composable.
W
We
want
to
be
modular,
we
want
to
be
supporting
each
other's
ecosystems
because,
together
we're
more
resilient
together.
We
are
this
like
headless
listing.
That
is
ethereum,
that
is
like
web3
and
that's
more
of
a
symbiotic
relationship
than
like
a
check
and
balance
kind
of
like
competitive
thing.
So
I
think
it's
coming
from
like
a
personal
opinion,
but.
M
I
think
what
makes
sense
to
me
is
like
it's
switching
the
model
from
like
one
to
many
relationship
where
it's
like
one
person
at
the
top,
having
connections
to
many
people
to
many
to
many
relationships
and
it's
the
bonds
between
the
it's.
It's
the
bonds
between
the
nodes
in
the
network
versus
like
one
person
towards
many
people.