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From YouTube: Ethereum as a self sufficient ecosystem - Josef Jelacic
Description
Slides: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1ZLdT20HFyMu7E-DxXZfQNHpFetD0OOcp?usp=sharing
Berlin Ethereum Meetup on May 25, 2022:
Josef Jelacic on “Ethereum as a self-sufficient ecosystem”
Although the Ethereum ecosystem is flourishing and although it was even growing in the last years despite the crypto (speculative) winter, we are still miles away from a sustainable environment where we could simply rely on economic interest of the companies in the space to maintain and improve all necessary pieces of the Ethereum stack. What will happen after large treasuries behind funding ecosystem goods like the EF disappear? And should they disappear?
A
A
So
well,
a
thank
thank
everybody
for
coming.
This
is
this
is
one
of
the
the
most
packed
meetups
that
I've
seen
in
a
long
long
while
and
thanks
so
much
to
the
organizers
of
the
berlin
theater
meetup.
As
far
as
I
know,
this
is
this
is
actually
no
my
my
journey.
My
journey
into
ethereum
started
in
berlin.
The
first
meetup
I
ever
ever
attended
was
in
berlin
in
the
old
ef's
office,
and
this
is
how
I
got
involved
in
this
ecosystem,
and
the
same
people
are
still
around
the
same.
A
People
are
still
organizing
these.
These
meetups,
which
is
which
is
just
awesome.
So
I'm
going
to
talk
about
ethereum
as
a
self-sufficient
ecosystem
and
well
sorry.
This
is
going
to
be
boring
because,
if
I
sell
say
self-sufficient,
what
I
mean
by
that
is,
like
you
know,
taking
like
an
economic
lens
and
looking
at
the
ecosystem
kind
of
from
a
high-level
perspective,
I'll
mention
a
lot
of
projects.
I
won't
get
deep
into
those
I'm
happy
to
give
you
some
context.
A
Hopefully
it
will
make
sense
if
not
just
like
feel
free
to
ask
me
later
on.
Even
if
you
have
like
anything
during
the
during
the
presentation,
just
raise
your
hand,
I'm
happy
to
quickly
expand,
but
we
don't
have
a
lot
of
time.
So,
let's
jump
into
it.
A
Okay,
sorry
for
being
a
boomer
content,
so
so
first
I
was
started
like
looking
at
the
ecosystem
kind
of
from
from
a
high
level
perspective.
A
I
will
talk
about,
like
my
breakdown
of
the
ethereum
tech
stack,
then
I'll
talk
about
like
what's
what's
a
safe
baseline
in
terms
of
and
again
the
boring
part,
the
financing
of
the
ecosystem,
because
this
is
this-
is
kind
of
the
lens
that
I'm
taking
and
I'm
going
to
show
you
some
like
data
about
like
the
treasuries
in
the
space
and
kind
of
the
on-chain
fees.
A
And
again,
that's
kind
of
the
my
viewpoint
of
self-sufficiency
is
from
this
like
economic
perspective
of
like
hey
is
this:
is
this
like
crypto
economy,
the
ethereum
economy,
big
enough,
so
we
can
actually
like
sustain
itself
by
just
the
the
value
that
it
brings
to
the
current
users.
I
probably
should
have
also
mentioned.
Who
am
I
and
what?
What
did
I
do
before?
I
was
part
of
the
for
the
past
several
years
I
was
working
with
a
lot
of
r
d
projects.
A
Part
of
the
work
was
related
to
to
overall
funding
within
the
ecosystem,
rather
on
a
high
level.
I
work
with
some
of
these
teams
like
closely,
but
some
of
the
numbers
mentioned
here
or
most
of
the
numbers
are
just
a
napkin
math.
So
don't
take
those
don't
think
those
like,
as
you
know,
like
a
universal
truth,
some
of
those
change
as
well.
So
obviously,
it's
not
always
up
to
date,
but
all
the
numbers
that
I'm
going
to
disclose
are
also
not
secret.
A
What's
that,
okay,
I
didn't
have-
I
didn't
know
I
didn't
know
this
was
part
I
didn't
notice.
This
was
part
of
the
of
the
presentation,
and
now
now
you
have
to
think
I'm
a
complete
boomer,
so
it's
actually
quite
fun,
so
some
numbers.
So
we
have
roughly
like
2.5,
000
kind
of
people
that
we
could
consider
core
slash
like
shell
developers,
people
who
have
like
deep
knowledge
about
the
ethiopian
ecosystem
people
who
either
develop
clients
tooling
around
the
around
it
that
understand
on
a
very
deep
technical
level.
A
What's
what's
going
on,
then
we
have
roughly
200k
kind
of
capable
developers.
You
can
see
those
as
like
the
web
tree
cohort
like
people
that
are
coming
into
the
ecosystem.
That
came
in
the
last
like
two
years
that
know
what's
going
on:
they
they
are
technical.
A
They
don't
follow
like
client
development
they're,
mostly
on
kind
of
the
application
layer,
but
you
know
no
dap.
They
could
switch
into
like
being
core
developers
and
kind
of
on
a
user
level
defy,
as
an
example,
obviously
like
defy
is
like
currently
the
the
biggest
use
case
for
for
ethereum.
The
estimates
are
that
there's
rough,
like
three
million
users,
this
doesn't
you
know,
go
into
detail
like
how
active
they
are
just
like
three
million
souls
that,
like
ever
touch
the
stuff
that
the
two
point
2.5
k
people
actually
created.
A
That's
that's
an
evil
plot
I
did.
I
don't
think
I
did
that
in
the
presentation,
so
some
some
other
numbers.
So
we
have.
We
have
roughly
like
five
teams
working
on
execution
layer,
clients,
five
plus
teams,
working
on
consensus
layer,
clients
like
in
the
you
know,
kind
of
the
e2,
the
pre
to
narrative,
and
we
also
have
like
more
than
five
teams
working
on
kind
of
the
l2
scaling,
which
you
know
that's
like
that's
really
kind
of
the
the
bottom
like
th
these.
A
These
are
the
pillars
of
like
what
everybody
is
building
on
top
of
cool.
I
clicked,
and
there
was
no.
There
was
an
animation
so
who
is
building
on
room,
like
obviously
there's
like
bunch
of
individuals
but
again
taking
the
lens
off
like
what
actually
like
makes
money
on
ethereum
you
see
startups.
You
see
a
lot
of
d5
projects,
you
see
like
services
for
the
ecosystem.
A
You
know
things
like
alchemy,
like
infrastructure
providers
like
those
are
all
associated
projects
that
make
money
off
ethereum
in
some
way.
You
know
it
can
be
defy.
It
can
also
be
like
b2b
solutions
and
so
on.
Then
you
have
daos,
like
you
have
a
lot
of
a
lot
of
dows
these
days.
You
know
building
building
protocols
being
somewhat
like
self-organized,
like
those
are
not
real
companies
from
perspective
like
entities,
but
they
they
make
money.
A
There's
a
lot
of
projects
in
in
the
space
that
that
are
thousands
and
actually
have
the
biggest
treasuries.
And
then
you
have
large
companies,
like
you
know
like
it
or
not.
A
You
have
like
projects
like
aws
microsoft,
these,
like
huge
giants
that
actually
have
business
associated
with
ethereum
as
such,
so
from
my
perspective
and
like
some
of
those
are
obviously
supporting
the
ecosystem
by
sponsoring
and
like
bringing
developers
and
so
on,
but
in
kind
of
from
my
perspective,
those
could
be
also
considered
as
like
potential
funders
of
the
ecosystem.
A
So
just
for
comparison,
this
is
data
from
open
arts.
The
on
the
left-
and
you
probably
can't
read
this-
this
is
a
snapshot
I
took
on
july
2021
on,
on
the
right
hand,
side.
There
is
the
snapshot
that
I
took
30
minutes
ago.
So
what
you're
looking
at
here
are
the
treasuries
of
of
the
kind
of
ethereum
projects
in
the
space,
and
obviously
you
have
like
unit
swap
on
top
with
roughly
like
2.5
billion
dollars
in
your
treasury.
You
have
like
compound
ava
and
some
other
projects.
A
You
can
also
see
the
differences
between
like
last
year
and
now
the
good
news
is
well.
Obviously,
some
projects
are
gone,
crypto
crashed,
but
not
so
much
the
treasuries.
So
roughly
there's
still.
A
It's
driving
me
nuts,
so
roughly
just
from
this
data,
and
this
doesn't
consider
ef
and
like
a
lot
of
other
kind
of
like
other
companies
in
this
space.
This
is
literally
just
daos
right.
This
is
literally
just
the
money
that's
sitting
on
chain.
You
have
something
over
six
billion
dollars
sitting
in
those
treasuries
like
waiting
to
fund
something
in
the
ecosystem,
which
is
good
cool.
So
now
all
right,
so
we
we
have.
The
ecosystem
has
deep
pockets.
That's
a
that's
a
good
information!
A
Now,
let's
look
at
the
stack
and
kind
of
like
what
the
ecosystem
could
fund.
So
just
you
know
for
simplicity.
I
kind
of
like
went
with
these
four
little
little
happy
boxes,
so
you
have
like
the
main
antenna
protocol
layer.
You
have
some
research
and
governance,
languages,
contracts
and
tooling.
So
in
the
protocol
layer
you
have
again
like
execution,
clients,
consensus
clients
on
the
research
and
governance,
like
you
have
a
bunch
of
like
core
research
around
like
hash
functions
and
signing
libraries.
What
not
you
have
a
bunch
of
ltu's.
A
You
have
like
the
internet
like
zkp,
track,
stateless,
and
you
know
also
the
eip
process
and
kind
of
stuff
connected
to
it.
Then
you
have
things
like
solidity
and
form
of
verification
or
like
fee,
and
you
know
like
other
languages
in
the
languages
and
contracts.
You
also
have
ides
remix,
some
some
plugins
or
some
like
smaller
projects
in
the
space.
A
Then,
on
the
tooling
side,
you
have
like
obviously
a
lot
of
like
tooling
on
like
the
javascript
side,
the
interior,
like
ethereum
js,
you
have
all
of
the
stuff
that
the
python
community
creates
and
a
lot
and
a
lot
of
other
tooling.
So
apologies
if
I
didn't
mention
a
particular
project
again,
this
is
just
a
you
know:
super
super
quick
run
through.
A
So
all
right.
We
have
these
nice
little
boxes
and
that
was
the
baseline
like
how
much
money
do
we
need
yearly
to
like
fund
things
that
fit
into
those
boxes
again?
This
is
take
this
as
a
napkin
mat,
but
the
execution
because,
like
obviously
a
bunch
of
this
data,
isn't
isn't
available.
You
know
it's
private,
I'm
sure,
like
they're,
the
expenses
like,
for
instance,
on
the
on
the
protocol
protocol
level
side,
I'm
sure
those
are
much
bigger
but
as
well.
Arguably
you
can
just
take.
A
You
know
like
five
clients
and
divide
like
seven
million
dollars
into
five
clients,
and
it
should
like
give
you,
I
guess,
like
good
enough
like
number
of
people
that
can
can
actually
work
on
that
for
a
year,
so
you
have
roughly
17
million
dollars
on
the
vertical
side.
You
have
like
roughly
17
million
dollars
on
the
on
the
research
and
governance
side,
where
a
good
portion
of
that
goes
into
zkp's
and
l2,
so
scaling
in
general.
You
have
roughly
five
million
dollars
on
kind
of
language
and
contract
side.
A
You
have
roughly
like
full
four
million
dollars
on
on
the
tooling
side
and
obviously
again
like
this
is
this
is
a
baseline.
There
is
like
there
is
much
more
money
that
could
be
like
utilized
in
all
of
those
boxes
or
any
of
these
projects,
but
we
just
need
an
anchor
so
so
again
like
things
things
that
are
not
considered,
so
that's
the
entire,
like
wallet
ecosystem.
That's
the
application
layer,
education
and
events,
operations
and
kind
of
like
compliance
stuff.
None
of
that
is
considered
within
that
number.
A
So
this
is
just
like
pure
devs
and,
like
you
know,
people
building
stuff.
A
Why
is
that
happening?
So
all
right,
that's
42,
surprise,
surprise,
point
eight
million
dollars,
let's
say
if
well,
we
need
roughly
like
50
million
dollars
currently
to
sustain
that
kind
of
like
basic
stack
around
ethereum.
That's
a
lot
of
money,
but
we
as
well
have
this
like
six
billion
dollars
like
sitting
in
treasuries,
and
I'm
not
saying
you
know
like
it-
should
just
like
go
entirely
into
this.
There's
like
a
lot
of
stuff
that
can
be
funded,
but
it
still
kind
of
feels
safe.
A
So,
but
you
know
just
like
having
having
deep
pockets,
wouldn't
really
get
you
get
you
anywhere
I
mean
like
it
could
get
you
far,
but
you
couldn't
couldn't
consider
that
to
be
like
anything,
self-sufficient
self-sustainable,
and
you
know
it's
kind
of
like
also
also
the
case
of
like
ef,
which
you
know
is
an
organization
that
has
been
a
huge
resource
resource
allocator
in
this
space
for
a
long
time,
but
it
doesn't
have
any
income.
It's
just
like
the
like.
Ef
is
magic
like
it's.
It's
a
is
this
like
huge.
A
You
know
like
surprise
for
everybody
where
all
of
a
sudden
there's
this
non-profit,
which
doesn't
have
to
worry
about
about
like
income
for
the
organization
itself,
because
it
like
happened
to
be
part
of
this
like
magic
event
of
emergence
of
like
this
new
new
dimension
of
programmable
money,
and
it
happened
to
have
that
money.
So,
but
that's
that's,
definitely
something
that
you
cannot
expect
to
happen
on
a
daily
basis.
A
So
let's
look
into
on-chain
fees
and
into
actually
it
this,
like
economic
demand
on
the
network
and
like
what
people
are
actually
willing
to
pay
to
use
ethereum.
A
So
again,
two
snapshots
last
year
july,
30
minutes
ago.
Well,
we
are
in
a
bear
market,
so
the
numbers
are
slightly
lower
and
you
can
also
see
like
bunch
of
projects
again
like
disappearing
and
appearing,
but
it's
not
too
bad.
This
is
still.
This
is
still
like
again
like
napkin
math.
It's
like
seven
million
dollars
every
day
in
fees
for
the
different
protocols
or
using
ethereum.
As
such.
A
That's
that's
a
huge
that's
actually
like
a
decent
economic
demand
and,
like
you
just
need
couple
of
days
for
the
intro
system
to
work
to
be
able
to
fund
the
50
million
dollar
ticket
that
allows
it
to
run
and
it
allows
it
to
to
you
know
kind
of
like
progress,
so
things
that
are
not
considered
in
this
number
again,
like
mining,
rewards,
yield
farming
and
all
of
the
like
d5
kind
of
above
the
basic
fees.
A
So
these
are
literally
just
the
fees
and
like
any
coming
to
the
enterprise
sector
like
there
are
no
like
consultancy
fees
like
anything
that
actually
the
you
know
the
kind
of
associated
businesses
that
are
utilizing
ethereum
in
a
different
way.
So
again,
that
was
just
on-chain
fees
and
obviously
exchanges.
That's
also
like
a
lot
a
lot
of,
like
you,
know,
money,
flow
and
fees
that
the
the
exchanges
get
and
obviously
exchanges
are
also
beneficiaries
of
the
of
the
ethereum
ecosystem.
A
So
I
mean
this:
this
number
is
already
outdated,
but
you
can
do
the
math.
You
have
roughly
like
1.5,
like
2
million
dollars.
Obviously
this
fluctuates
generated
or
paid
right
paid
in
on
chain
fees
on
a
tea
room.
So
yeah,
that's
my
conclusion:
we
are.
We
are
fine,
it's
I
mean
like
it.
It's
a
bear
market.
I
was
surprised
myself.
I
mean
we
are
in
a
bear
market,
but
we
are
fine.
I
mean
like
we.
We
can.
A
A
What
I
would
like
to
see
is
like
the
ecosystem,
not
just
relying
on
the
treasuries,
but
the
ecosystem,
rather
like
relying
on
the
the
social
standard
of
like
people
actually
giving
back
to
the
core
developers
and
giving
back
to
you
know
the
people
who
actually
make
this
possible
and
that
like
help
this
ecosystem
to
progress,
so
I
think
that
if
we
can
like
establish
social
standards,
that
the
projects
that
like
benefit
of
ethereum,
give
just
a
very
like
tiny
fraction
of
the
fees
into
into
the
development
of
the
curve
protocol
or
the
associated
like
two
stack,
you
know
I
think
like
ethereum
can
actually
run
for
like
decades
or
like,
if
not
you
know,
hundreds
of
years
as
the
technology.
A
Obviously
that's
a
that's.
A
bad
stake
always
like
never
make
these
these
sets
of
takes,
but
in
terms
of
the
economic
demand,
the
future
is
bright.
Like
I'm,
you
know,
I'm
I'm
not
worried
at
all,
and
with
that,
it's
it's
actually
nine.
So
there
was
those
bit.
Let's,
let's
see
this
the
last
last
animation
here:
no,
it
wasn't
there
yeah.
So
that
was
it.
Thank
you.
A
So
actually,
there's
one
more
thing:
there's
like
obligatory
shield
of
if
prague,
which
is
a
hackathon
conference
happening
in
prague
in
june.
So
in
a
couple
weeks,
please
sign
up
the
the
speaker.
Slots
are
already
filled,
there
are
still
hacker
slots
that
are
open.
There
is
a.
There
is
a
wait
list,
but
you
know
it's
like
tradition,
that,
like
people
who
get
free
tickets
kind
of
don't
show
up.
So
we
are
overbooking
slightly.
A
C
But
I
think
what
do
you
think
about
like
kind
of
like
if
one
thing's
really
long
term,
you
want
to
kind
of
have
still
money
in
100
years
in
the
foundation
and
to
make
it
more
like
an
endowment
where,
for
example,
like
the
foundation
stakes,
all
its
ethereum
and
only
uses
the
staking
rewards
for
protocol
which
could
like
fund
it
in
perpetuity?
Probably
so,
like
my,
my
question
is
more
like,
as
I
understand
vitalik
and
I
and
like
the
foundation,
is
that
it
actually
philosophically
wants
to
go
down
to
zero.
A
Yeah
so
so,
first
of
all
like
I'm,
I
left
the
foundation,
so
I
no
longer
speak
on
behalf
and
the
the
fact
that
it's
still
there
is
just
a
reminiscence
of
the
presentation.
So
I
can
only
give
you,
like
my
opinion,
my
subjective
view
on
this.
But
yeah
I
mean
it's
it's
more
complicated
because,
like.
A
You
know,
like
the
in
my
opinion,
like
the
the
neutrality
kind
of
like
also
comes
from
the
fact
that,
like
you,
just
don't
pick
like
projects
in
the
ecosystem
and
you
say
like
hey,
this
is
the
way
to
do
things
like
you.
Don't
want
to,
like
ef,
at
least
to
me
was
like
very
credible
in
the
sense
that
it
it
wasn't
aping
into
stuff.
It
was
always
this,
like
kind
of
like
a
actually
quite
conservative.
You
know
like
unit,
and
I
think,
there's
some
value
in
that.
A
Like
you
know
like
you,
don't
you
don't
want
to
you
don't
want
to
put
all
of
your
eggs
into
this
into
one
basket,
so
I
actually
think
like
strategically
it's
it's
a
good
decision
to
the
question
of
like.
A
Could
we
sustain
ourselves
from
just
like
running
like
or
getting
like
stickers
taking
rewards
and
like
funding
the
ecosystem?
From
that
I
mean
I
would
actually
love
to.
There
was
a
lot
of
a
lot
of
conversations
about,
like
kind
of
like
taxing
block
rewards.
You
know
that's
like
two
three
years
back,
I'm
glad
that
didn't
happen.
A
I
don't,
and
I
don't
want-
I
don't
want
there
to
be
like
a
programmed
way
for
for
this
to
happen,
and,
in
my
opinion,
like
you
know,
if,
like
ef
did
that
that
would
kind
of
get
into
that
direction.
You
would
just
like
expect.
This
is
here
to
stay
and
like
you,
wouldn't
you
wouldn't
need
these
like
new
champions
to
step
up,
like
you
know
like
folks
at
bitcoin
like
they
do
amazing
work
in
like
showing
their
alternative
ways
like
the
ecosystem
can
be
funded.
A
So
I
think,
like
the
way
to
to
actually
like
still
sustain
the
ecosystem,
isn't
true,
like
one
organization
such
as
ef,
like
throwing
like
a
a
huge
pile
of
money
into
something
that
could
generate
returns
and
like
funding
everything
from
that,
but
I
would
actually
say
it
has
to
come
from
the
projects
in
the
indian
in
the
ecosystem.
A
You
know,
even
even
if,
like
some
of
those
are
programmed
like,
if
there
is
a
doubt
that
says
well
all
right,
we
just
like
have
a
vote
and
we
give
like
five
percent
of
the
fees
like
to
this.
You
know
to
this
contract
that
will
distribute
the
money
towards
like
these
five
teams
that
build
the
build
the
clients
like.
I
I
think
that's
actually
there's
actually
a
better
approach
because,
like
you,
will
you'll
gain
like
more
resilience
in
the
system.
D
Okay,
oh
yeah.
Thank
you.
I
would
have
a
question
and
I
will
put
my
question
into
an
analogy.
So
the
the
housing
market,
2009
2007,
there
was
also
a
system,
and
you
know
the
the
first
people
who
couldn't
pay
off
their
debt
and
you
just
need
fifty
percent
of
these
people
to
break
down
the
system,
and
here
I
was
wondering:
is
it
possible
that
the
bigger
projects
belong
to
the
smaller
projects
and
in
these
you
know
like
crypto
winters?
D
If
the
smaller
programs
breaks
down
the
bigger
projects
might
not
get
enough
fees,
etc,
etc?
So
is
it
possible
how
what's
what's
your
take.
A
So
I'm
not
sure
I
understood
a
question
correctly,
but
is
it
like?
If,
if
I
don't
know
there
is
a
there's
all
of
a
sudden
like
something
wrong
with,
I
don't
know
like
abba
or
something
or
like
someone
who
builds
on
top
of
avid
and
like
this
would
disappear.
A
Yeah
I
mean
it's
it's
kind
of
it's
kind
of
like
a
black
swan.
It
sounds
to
me,
as
kind
of
like
a
black
swan
scenario
where-
and
we
probably
saw
this
like
multiple
times
for
like
certain
projects,
I
mean
the
the
good
news
and
kind
of
like
the
stuff
that
I
was
trying
to
showcase
is
that
I
basically
showed
you
show
you
only
the
data
which
is
kind
of
like
easy
to
get
you
can.
A
You
can
like
look
at
look
into
these
like
multisigs
that
hold
these
treasuries
and,
in
my
opinion,
there's
actually
like
much
more
money
in
in
the
ecosystem
than
like
what
you
what
you've
seen
here.
So
I
mean
I'm
not
saying
it's
impossible.
A
I
think
it's
like
unlikely
to
some
extent,
because
there
is
a
lot
of
a
lot
of
like
deep
pocketed
teams
and
there's
like,
but
you
know
even
the
stuff
that
you
see
around
yourself
like
take
gnosis,
for
instance
like
like
this,
this
place
was
started
by
gnosis
right,
I
mean
I'm
sure,
I'm
I'm
kind
of
like
missing
some
context.
Some
historical
context,
but
like
gnosis,
is
one
of
the
great
examples
of
a
project
that
like
started
early
in
the
ecosystem,
and
now
they
kind
of
like
deliver
more
and
more
value
across
the
board.
A
Not
not
just
you
know,
in
prediction
markets,
I'm
not
actually
sure
anyone
associates
diagnosis
with
production
markets
these
days.
So
I
I
think
there
there
can.
There
already
are
multiple
like
champions
in
the
ecosystem,
so
I'm
not
as
worried,
obviously
like
something
can
happen
and
like
people
can
all
of
a
sudden
like
change
the
direction
completely,
and
they
say
like
all
right
that
was
this
was
this
was
all
like,
like
you
know,
magic
internet
money
like
forget
about
it,
it
could
happen,
I'm
I'm
not.
A
You
know,
like
we've
seen
what
happened
like
during
covet.
We
see
what's
happening
now
like
in
ukraine
and
other
places
like
I
could
imagine
those
scenarios
before
I'm
not
saying
it's
it's
impossible.
I
feel
like
it's
unlikely.
E
So
the
thing
that
occurred
to
me
is,
if
you
go
back
to
the
list
of
all
the
treasuries
that
you
had
right
like
a
lot
of
those
treasuries.
Aren't,
aren't
that's
not
their
money
right,
so
like
ave
or
uni,
swap
or
whatever
right,
like.
That's
someone
else's
money,
that's
trading,
but
then,
when
you
went
to
the
fees
thing,
it's
also
kind
of
not
all
their
fees
right
because
they're
giving
a
lot
of
the
fees
back
to
the
users.
So
I
was
just
kind
of
trying
to
think
through.
E
E
I
think,
like
uni,
swap
in
the
last
years,
kind
of
really
come
out
and
said:
like
we're
gonna
just
start,
you
know
funding
stuff,
and
so
I
I
would
encourage,
I
don't
know
the
answer,
but
to
really
kind
of
dig
down
and
figure
out
like
where
is
the
free
capital
right
and
then
what
are?
What
are
dows
and
what
are
organizations
doing
with
it
right
because
I
it
seems
like
most
of
them
are
trying
to
somehow
promote
something.
That's
not
super,
like
I'm
gonna
get
my
money
back
right
away,
yeah
anyway.
A
So
so
that
goes
to
the
liquidity
providers.
I
mean,
like
you,
you're
you're,
right,
obviously
like
there's
like
I'm,
not
saying
it's
like
five
people
or
like
five
organizations
that
like
make
these
decisions,
there's
like
there
are
masses
of
people
behind
those
fees
or
masses
of
people
behind
those
dows
I
mean,
like
all
of
these
are
or
dao's.
If
I'm
not
wrong.
A
The
point
is
there
definitely
is
this
like
collective
interest
in
like
making
sure
that
this
thing
runs,
and
it
obviously
makes
a
lot
of
money
not
too
like
few
companies
but
to
like
a
lot
of
people
across
the
board,
but
the
other.
The
other
kind
of
like
underlying
part,
is
it's
like
it's
it's
disproportionately
more
than
what
I
feel
is
is
kind
of
a
safe
baseline
of
what
the
ecosystem
needs.
A
So
I'm
sure
that,
even
if
you
know
with
like
a
whole
bunch
of
rounding
errors
and
like
just
wrong
math
that
I
might
have
used
like
you
know
getting
these
numbers
or
like
even
I'm
not
sure
if
these
are
correct,
I
didn't
check
like
every
single
treasury.
I
just
trusted.
So,
even
if
there
is
there
is,
there
is
a
lot
of
place
for
for
failure
in
here.
So
that's
that's
kind
of
my
point.