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From YouTube: [Panel] Sustainability Drivers: How do Capitalist Incentives and Democratized Web3 Coexist?
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A
All
right
so
yeah,
thank
you,
everyone
for
coming,
so
the
the
topic
of
this
panel
is
something
that
I
think
is
kind
of
heady
and
really
interesting,
which
is,
as
we
are
working
with
web3
native
tools.
We
have
the
ability
to-
or
at
least
you
know,
the
tool
set
now
to
rebuild
the
economy
so
that
it
measures
and
allocates
value
in
sort
of
fundamentally
new
ways,
and
so.
A
Oh
yeah,
because
you're
out
recording,
I
want
to
be
recorded
okay,
so
so
the
idea
here
is
that
we
I
can
just
stand.
I
can
just
say
that
so
so
we
we
now
have
the
tools
right
with
web3,
to
rebuild
the
way
that
we
measure
value
and
the
way
that
we
allocate
resources
in
sort
of
fundamentally
new
ways
and
the
the
focus
of
this
panel
is
really
you
know
how
do
web
3
and
existing
capital
structures
coexist
right?
A
Where
are
we
really
rebuilding
like
very
new
types
of
incentive
mechanisms
that
really
really
do
go
after
value
and
go
after
these?
These,
like
really
deep
social
questions
in
in
very
different
new
ways
that
are
hopefully
better
than
what
came
before
web
3.,
and
then
what
are
places
in
which
we
are
rebuilding
the
sort
of
existing
capitalist
structures
and
where
you
know,
where
is
that
a
problem
and
sort
of?
Why
is
that
happening
right?
A
And
so
we
have
this,
this
giant
panel
of
experts
in
this
huge
huge
range
of
different
topics,
right
to
really
pick
a
pic
pick
apart
from
a
bunch
of
different
directions.
So
what
I
think
we
could
do?
First
is:
can
we
just
move,
you
know
starting
and
starting
there
and
coming
toward
me?
Could
you
introduce
yourself
and
say
you
know,
pick
pick
a
project
or
company
that
you
are
affiliated
with
and
you
know
just
say
kind
of
quickly
what
you
do
and
what
incentives
are
you
responding
to.
B
Sure,
okay,
so
nick
alexander,
so
I
am
head
of
partnerships
and
policy
at
phthalo
and
fallow-
is
building
an
on-chain
marketplace
for
carbon
credits,
so
my
experience
is
kind
of
restricted
to
the
voluntary
carbon
market.
What
I
actually
do
on
a
day-to-day
basis
is,
I
speak
to
project
developers,
so
people
in
brazil
who
trying
to
protect
the
rainforest,
you
know
I'm
trying
to
push
forward,
sdgs
and
so
forth,
and
I
try
to
translate
to
them
or
communicate
to
them
the
benefits
of
web
three.
B
A
B
So
the
the
closest
non-web3
analog
would
be
off
chain
marketplaces,
which
is
essentially
only
secondary
sales.
So
this
is,
you
know
the
the
traders,
the
brokers
who
do
nothing
with
regards
to
climate,
don't
actually
drive
any
project
implementation
whatsoever,
and
then
they
take
these
huge
margins
on
the
secondary
sales
because
they're
the
ones
with
connections
to
the
buy
side
companies
in
the
west
who
want
to
who
are
happy
to
pay.
B
C
Hi,
I'm
lucia
and
I'm
the
founder
of
emergen,
the
co-founder
of
the
eternals,
and
my
work
is
literally
this.
My
company
builds
projects
at
the
convergence
of
sustainable
development
and
intelligent
web
3,
but
through
financial
instruments.
So
we
really
are
there
to
reimagine
what
those
financial
instruments
might
look
like.
C
Financial
interest
for
that
plant
to
live
longer,
because
you're,
essentially
betting
on
the
fact
that
it
needs
to
stay
up
and
alive
to
render
a
specific
amount
of
ingredients,
and
so
we
basically
play
around
with
like
the
financial
instruments
of
web
2.
But
we
reimagine
what
that,
like.
A
regenerative
version
of
that
in
underlying
economic
or
social
incentive,
would
be
in
order
for
us
to
change.
What
that
that
instrument
will
have
as
an
outcome,
and
I
think
the
key
question
that
is
really
was
really
inspiring
to
start.
C
Thinking
about
this
at
a
much
more
fundamental
level.
Was
this
idea
that
so
far,
we've
seen
a
lot
of
impact
projects
focus
on
impact
as
an
outcome,
which
you
know
is
great,
but
my
interest
was
more
in
understanding
how
impact
itself
can
become
the
investable
asset
class,
rather
than
the
outcome
of
an
investment
of
an
investment
class.
C
So
if
you
turn
sound
on
and
you
meditate
with
it
like
anything
that
really
fuels
your
connection
with
rainforest
protection,
that
engagement
data
is
actually
causing
the
nft
and
your
wallet
to
evolve
and
also,
if
you
stop
engaging
with
it,
it
regresses.
So
it's
a
real-time
measure
of
your
personal
impact
in
rainforest
protection,
but
also,
as
you
sort
of
go
through
metamorphosis,
it
comes
with
more
community
benefits,
so,
let's
say
you're
in
a
secondary
market.
C
If
you're
in
you
sell
it
in
state
one,
the
market
will
set
a
price
x,
but
if
you've
evolved
it
and
it
becomes
visually
more
complex
and
also
comes
with
more
benefits.
Theoretically,
according
to
a
capitalistic
driver,
that's
worth
more,
and
so
it
starts
to
influence
the
actual
value
and
performance
in
a
secondary
market.
Even
though
it's
a
traditional,
let's
say
web
3
financial
instrument,
the
underlying
utility
has
now
been
been
reimagined
to
be
more
aligned
with
the
reason
we're
all
here
today,
right.
E
E
We've
specifically
engaged
as
a
company
to
try
and
commercialize
and
propagate
decentralized
storage
within
the
and
replace,
essentially
the
web
2
storage
facilities.
So
we
found
the
most
success
working
with
universities
and
research
institutions,
scientific
institutions,
things
like
that
and
in
terms
of
you
know,
I
guess
who
are
closest
analog
to
in
web
2.
It's
probably
a
division
of
amazon,
which
is
a
I
guess,
great
competitor
called
amazon
glacier,
which
is
their
archival
storage
system,
a
lot
of
which
is
actually
stored
on
on
physical
tape
and
is
not
connected
to
the
internet.
E
So
a
lot
of
the
success
we've
had
with
particular
universities
as
well.
As
you
know,
people
who
are
doing
a
lot
of
research
and
heavy
data
analytics
on
top
of
large-scale
data
sets
if
they
want
to
run
some
form
of
experiment
or
some
form
of
analysis
on
top
of
their
data.
They
actually
need
to
go
and
get
it
off
of
tape
and
then
put
it
onto
the
web
and
then
run
their
experiments
and
put
it
back
onto
tape,
which
is
very,
very
expensive
and
very
time
consuming.
E
So
it's
actually
very
limiting
in
their
ability
to
analyze
the
data
that
they
collect
and
when
you're
dealing
with
really
large
scale
problems
and
many
petabyte
data
sets.
You
want
to
be
able
to
run
all
sorts
of
different
analytics
on
those
to
be
able
to
try
to
solve
large
scale
problems,
but
if
you're
kind
of
held
back
by
the
monetary
aspect
of
it,
it
becomes
very
difficult.
You
have
to
pick
your
your
spots
to
be
able
to
to
analyze
it.
So
when
we
actually
take
these
data
sets
off
of
it's.
E
It's
actually
closer
to
web
one,
not
even
web
2.
when
we
take
it
off
of
tape
and
we
actually
bring
it
to
an
online
state.
People
can
run
significantly
more
analytics
on
top
of
it
and
actually
answer
more
difficult
questions
because
they
have
ability
to
be
wrong
essentially,
whereas
on
tape
you
you
kind
of
get
one
or
two
shots
a
year,
and
if
you
mess
up
one,
then
you
have
to
wait
next
year
to
run
another
sort
of
analytics
on
top.
A
It's
like
web
0.5,
it's
like
if
it's
stored
in
a
table
like
a
vcr,
it's
like
web
web
point.
One
is
stored
on
vacuum,
tubes,
yeah,
okay,
yeah
yeah,
and
I
do
think
seal
right
has
been
really
forward.
Thinking
right
in
engaging
with
the
scientific
community,
like
you
were
saying
to
like
find
super
super
useful
data
sets
and
store
them
on
follow
coin
and
sort
of
show.
A
The
value
there,
which
I
think
like
dovetails
very
much
with
with
falcon
plus
right,
which
is
this
like
impact
evaluator
for
useful
data
right
which,
which
I
know
like
cl,
participates
in
quite
a
lot.
I
don't
know
dude
is
that
is
that
sort
of
part
of
the
the
inside
of
puzzle
that
you
as
you
as
you
sort
of
see
it.
E
For
us,
we
know
what
the
incentives
are
for
filecoin,
it's
very
transparent,
so
we
feel
comfortable
in
actually
kind
of
getting
in
the
trenches
and
getting
dirty
with
these
universities
and
being
able
to
figure
out
what
the
needs
are
and
building
different
things.
And,
as
I
said
before,
we
have
the
ability
to.
You
know
fail
in
a
certain
sense
where
if
we
build
something
and
it
doesn't
work
or
the
university
tries
something
and
it
doesn't
work
or
they
try
and
experiment,
it
doesn't
work.
E
We
still
know
where
the
incentives
are,
so
we
have
comfort
in
our
ability
to
forecast
out
what
kind
of
revenue
we're
going
to
have.
So
it
allows
us
to
do
these
types
of
things.
It
also
allows
us
to
bring
on
these
data
sets,
because
we
know
exactly
what's
going
to
happen
so
we're
comfortable
with
that.
F
Hi
I'm
lauren
luce,
I'm
I'm
a
product
lead
at
giveth
and
I
also
lead
our
comms
team.
Give
it
a
dow.
That's
really
focused
on
changing
the
way
that
we
create
and
fund
public
goods.
So
public
goods
are
things
like
roads
that
we
all
rely
on
to
go
from
point
a
to
point
b
or
things
like
community
gardens
which
anybody
could
access
there.
There
are
goods
and
services
that
are
non-excludable
and
non-rivalrous.
F
Everybody
can
access
them
equally
without
needing
to
purchase
a
ticket
and
also
can
benefit
from
them
like
I
can
enjoy
it
while
you
enjoy
it
like.
I
can
enjoy
the
road
and
go
from
my
home
to
my
workplace
at
the
same
time
as
everybody
else
or
at
in,
in
also
with
everybody
else.
So
giveth
is
starting
out
by
this
microphone's
really
quiet.
Don't
you
think.
F
F
So
give
us
is
really
trying
to
change
the
way
that
we
create
and
fund
public
goods,
and
it's
starting
by
meeting
non-profits,
where
they're,
at
and
bringing
non-profits
into
the
web3
space
but
like
a
web
to
analog,
could
be
something
like
gofundme,
except
giveth
is
really
different
from
gofundme.
It's
like
anybody
can
create
a
project
and
start
raising
funds
for
their
projects,
but
there's
no
intermediaries
or
fees.
The
funds
go
directly
from
the
donor
to
the
project,
and
then
the
project
can
start
using
it
for
good
work.
F
It's
not
like
gofundme
were
actually
they're
holding
the
funds,
and
there
there
was
this
instance
in
canada
recently
where
actually
they
didn't
want
the
funds
to
go
to
the
project
that
they
were
donating
to.
It
was
the
protesters
in
canada
and
so
gofundme
actually
withheld
those
funds,
and
then
they
penalized
the
donors
who
were
actually
donating
to
support
that
project.
So
giveth
is
like
a
web3
alternative
to
this.
F
This
kind
of
system,
and
and
what's
more
than
that,
is
that
we're
actually
trying
to
change
the
way
that
public
goods
are
funding
by
eliminating
the
element
of
sacrifice
in
order
to
fund
public
goods
projects.
You
need
volunteers
who
are
working
for
the
nonprofits
to
put
in
their
time
and
effort
because
they
care
not
because
there's
actually
money
in
that,
and
you
also
need
donors
who
are
providing
the
capital
who
are
giving
to
this
because
they
care
so
much
about
those
public
goods
projects
that
they
want
to
give
capital
to
it.
F
So,
actually,
a
hundred
percent
of
the
funds
that
are
donated
go
directly
from
the
donor
to
the
project
and
the
donor
gets
rewarded
with
governance
over
the
platform
and
gets
gets
to
be
actually
like
an
instrument
and
part
of
the
community
in
deciding
the
way
that
the
platform
unfolds
and
which
new
features
are
added
and
what's
important
to
the
community.
So
it's
actually
like
a
bottom-up
donation
platform,
that's
run
by
the
community.
F
That's
mainly
focused
on
actually
changing
the
way
that
public
goods
funding
works
so
that
we
can
bring
also
this
dow
tooling
and
these
dao
systems
to
non-profit,
so
they
can
become
dows
of
their
own.
So
there's
a
lot
more
in
there,
but
it'll
take
me
forever
to
unpack
it.
So
I'll
leave
it
at
that.
For
now,
yeah.
A
D
Hi
everyone,
my
name,
is
sharfi
and,
and
I'm
a
co-founder
of
gain
force
which
is
like
rainforest
but
with
a
g
and
our
mission
I
gained
force
is
try
to
make
doing
to
link
donations
to
impact
because,
right
now,
if
you're,
you
know
trying
to
donate
to
a
non-profit.
You
put
your
money
some
to
your
non-profit
of
your
choice
and
you
have
no
idea
what,
where
this
money
goes
to,
how
much
does
a
nonprofit
take,
as
you
know,
as
a
percentage
of
their
of
your
donation?
D
How
much
actually
goes
to
the
communities
or
the
project
that
you're
trying
to
fund
and
also
if
it's
actually
making
an
impact
and
I
gained
for?
Is
we
really
try
to
make
sure
that
once
your
donation,
once
you
donate
to
our
platform,
the
donation
goes
into
an
escrow
account
and
it's
only
released
when
we
see
measurable
impact
and
to
go
back
to
your
question.
We
use
satellite
data
as
the
first
layer
for
force
protection
projects
to
make
sure
that
the
forest
canopy
is
actually
being
protected
and
every
month
or
every
couple
of
months.
D
If
we
detect
that
the
forest
canopy's
being
conserved,
then
we
actually
donate.
We
we
release
the
apart
of
the
donations
to
the
communities
and
it's
it's
a
continuous
type
of
funding
as
well.
So
it's
every
month,
every
couple
of
months.
This
way
we
create
different
economic
incentives
for
the
communities
on
the
ground.
D
A
Yeah,
nice,
which
so
I
mean
that's,
that's
a
major
thread
that
we've
touched
on
a
bunch
of
times
now
right.
Is
that,
like
you,
can
you
know
using
webthrough
native
tools,
because
you
have
this
degree
of
sort
of
situational
awareness
and
granularity
and
verifiability?
You
can
reach
people
directly
where
they
are
right
and
it's
not
you're
not
going
through
this.
A
This,
like
giant
transparent,
you
know,
organization
or
a
giant
opaque
organization,
but
you
can
really,
like
you
know,
like
you're,
saying,
put
money
in
an
escrow
account
and
it
goes
out
to
the
actual
people
on
the
ground
right,
protecting
this
plot
of
land,
and
if
you
see
this
plot
of
land
is
being
deforested,
they
just
stop
getting
paid
right
away
right.
So
it's
like
automatic
and
granular
and
you're
like
really
giving
that
money
to
people-
and
you
know
helping
them
do
things
other
than
than
deforesting
for
their
livelihood.
D
Yeah
one
of
the
things
that
blockchain
is
really
great,
as
is
transparency,
especially
in
terms
of
donation,
and
we
also
issue
impact
certificates
in
terms
of
what
we
call
nf
trees
and
these
impact
certificates
are
related
to
on-ground
data.
So
you
know
going
back
to
this
whole
transparency
issues.
All
of
the
satellite
data
would
be
open
source
stored
in
ipfs.
You
know
for
forever,
so
nobody
could
change
the
data
or
you
know
claim
that
the
data
has
that
the
forest
has
already
been
deforested
before
the
communities
were
even
there.
D
So
yeah
you
just
look
at
your
wallet
and
you
get
a
picture
of
the
project
site.
So
if
the
project
site
is
deforested,
the
image
would
change
that
metadata.
We
also
have
metadata
based
on
carbon
stored,
but
also
biodiversity
metrics
and
how
much
that
person
has
donated
and
that
changes,
and
so
you
really
have
this
engagement
and
this
transparency,
you
know
exactly
you
know,
my
money
is
going
to
the
escrow
account
and
then
it's
going
to
the
communities-
and
this
is
the
impact
that
you
see
awesome.
A
G
You
alan
for
the
invitation.
My
name
is
nicos
costopoulos,
I'm
representing
the
research
team
of
the
european
blockchain
observatory
and
forum
is
a
think
tank
officially
supported
by
the
european
commission,
our
role.
We
have
a
dual
role.
The
first
one
is
to
curate
reports
to
understand
the
european
blockchain
ecosystem.
G
Thank
you
for
mentioning
also
my
role
as
co-founder
of
rebaked.
It's
a
crowdsourcing
platform,
mainly
focusing
on
early
stage
projects
that
haven't
launched
yet
in
bull
markets
projects.
You
know
they
have
a
lot
of
resources
and
money
to
spend
to
find
employees
and
also
hire
external
consultants.
This
is
not
the
case
in
bear
markets
right
now.
G
People
who
have
more
free
time
to
spend
they
want
to
contribute
to
new
projects,
but,
as
you
can
understand,
when
you
have
a
token
you
can
distribute
it
through
a
bounty
or
through
other
mediums.
It's
pretty
much
like
liquid
salary,
if
the
token
is
listed,
but
if
the
token
is
not
yet
listed.
There
are
other
problems
that
we're
trying
to
face
and
overcome
awesome,
perfect.
A
So
so
I
wanted
to
ask
a
question
and
just
sort
of
throw
it
out
to
whoever
wants
to
wants
to
answer.
I
think
one
of
the
the
major
questions
in
this
space
right
now
is
how
to
do
governance
other
than
just
buy
a
token
that
people
can
buy
right
because
we
don't.
We
don't
want
money
to
equal
speech
right.
We
want.
We
want
speech
and
decision
making
power
to
ideally
represent
some
sort
of
stake
in
a
community
other
than
just
like
how
much
how
much
wealth
have
you
put
into
it
right?
F
Yeah
I
mean
I
have.
I
have
a
perspective
to
share
on
that,
for
sure
I
think
I
mean
so
there
are
tokens
that
you
can
purchase,
but
there's
also
like
soulbound
tokens
or
reputation
tokens
that
can
be
earned
by
having
like
by
having
skin
in
the
game
by
being
part
of
a
dow
for
a
period
of
time
or
by
doing
like
certain
qualitative
actions
and
there's
also.
It's
also
interesting,
there's
a
lot
of
work
being
done
in
like
how
to
capture
that
value.
It's
like
how
do
we
capture
capture
skin
in
the
game?
F
How
do
we
capture
qualitative
data
and
actually
like
translate
that
into
tokens?
So
there's
like
a
couple
of
great
examples
that
are
just
off
the
top
of
my
head.
One
is
the
praise
system
which
is
being
developed
which
is
developed
and
like
iterating
upon
they're
iterating
upon
it
by
the
common
stack
where
actually
it
like.
It
uses
a
culture
of
gratitude
to
allocate
tokens
to
people,
allocate
doubt
tokens
to
people
and,
and
basically
it
looks
like
if
somebody
does
something
cool.
F
If
somebody
does
something
you
like,
you
can
be
like
praise.
This
person,
like
like
praise
all
of
these
people
for
participating
in
a
great
panel
at
sbs,
and
then
that
will
get
quantified
like
that,
will
go
into
a
spreadsheet
and
then
quantifiers
are
looking
at
this
data
and
giving
it
a
score,
and
then
that
data,
it's
like
the
the
scores
of
each
phrase.
It's
like
you.
You
have
like
a
pot
of
funds
and
it's
like
that.
F
Pot
of
funds
is
distributed
amongst
the
different
scores
and
so
like
everybody
here
who
just
got
praised
for
that
would
get
tokens
that
represent
that
and
then
there's
other
awesome
projects
like
coordinate
that
are
also
doing
kind
of
capturing
this
qualitative
data
and
translating
into
tokens
and
like
it
can
actually
be
done.
It
can
be
done
with
transferable
tokens
that
you
could
also
buy,
or
with
tokens
that
are
reputation.
F
Tokens
which
are
like
non-transferable
and-
and
they
just
like,
represent
your
participation
in
the
dow,
and
I
think
that
there's
value
to
both
like
I
think
it's,
we
need
to
work
on
systems
that
are
rewarding
all
kinds
of
contributions
like
rewarding
skin
in
the
game.
It's
rewarding
people
who
provide
capital,
but
also
rewarding
people
who
provide
labor
and
expertise
and
people
who
are
like
really
invested
in
the
mission
of
a
particular
dow
or
a
particular
project.
100.
A
Awesome,
I
know
nick,
I
think
part
of
part
of
what
you're
doing
also
has
to
do
with
you
know
not
just
like
putting
putting
offsets
on
chain
but
like
differentiating
between
the
like
quality
of
different
offsets
right,
which
like
requires
it's
the
same
question
right.
That's
that's
sort
of
a
governance
or
like
higher
level
decision,
making
questions.
How
do
you
deal
with
it?
Yeah.
B
I
mean
this
is
a
huge
issue
in
the
voluntary
carbon
market,
because
you
know
amongst
the
voluntary
carbon
market
stakeholders.
No
one
can
agree
on
what
is
a
you
know,
a
high
quality
carbon
credit,
and
so
therefore
you
know
it's
left
to
individual
actors
to
to
say:
okay.
This
is
the
bar
I
want
to
to
put
so,
for
instance,
you
know
we
know
the
incidents
with
bcts
ncts.
B
You
know
the
bar
was
set
at
nature,
nature-based
projects
that
have
been
issued
by
vera,
which
is
like
the
registry,
but
with
regards
to
the
kind
of
process
to
deciding
that
like
who
who
gets
to
decide-
and
you
know
how
do
we
know
that
these
are
the
right
people
to
decide
upon
that
project
and
it
gets.
It
gets
a
bit
muddy
when
you
get
mixed
kind
of
like
technocratic
decision
making
with
like
democratic
decision
making
and
and
then
like.
I
think,
there's
always
the
issue
of
kind
of
perception
of
the
web.
B
Three,
because,
like
dows
and
so
forth,
we
we
were
quite
familiar
with
them.
But
when
I
say
dow
to
a
project
developer
in
the
amazon,
they
have
no
idea
what
it
means,
and
so
you,
the
more
the
more
kind
of
complex
the
decision-making
process
can
be.
Although
it's
web
3
and
it's
transparent
for
us,
it
doesn't
mean
it's
transparent
for
them
and
we
have
to
be
able
to
kind
of
communicate
in
a
language
that
other
people
understand
in
layman
terms,
and
that's
why
I
really
like
your
model,
because
it's
so
simple
right.
It's
direct!
B
D
Thank
you.
So
thank
you
for
the
shout
out,
so
I
gained
first,
the
commute
we
put
the
community
first
and
so
they're,
actually,
the
ones
that
get
the
governance
tokens
that
get
to
dictate
the
future
future
of
our
platform.
So,
instead
of
you
know
putting
in
money,
it's
because
I'm
protecting
the
rainforest
and
I'm
doing
good
work
that
I'm
getting
the
governance
tokens
to
dictate
how
how
game
force
will
go
in
the
future.
That's.
A
Really
powerful,
it's
like
yeah,
I
mean
something
is
like
okay,
you
know
you
if
you
have
all
these
different
actors
playing
different
roles
in
your
ecosystem
right.
You
really
have
this
ability
to
to
transparently
and
verifiably
like
reward
people
over
time
for
doing
different
types
of
things
right
and
like,
for
example,
protecting
the
forest.
A
D
C
And
I
think
that
this
is
like
a
conversation
that
we
really
need
to
have
within
spaces
like
this,
like
taking
a
few
steps
backward
and
asking
ourselves
like
okay,
a
governance
token.
Like
does
everybody
need
to
participate
in
governance,
not
really,
and
so
same
with,
like
the
way
that
you
interact
with
like
the
beneficiaries
of
a
lot
of
these
projects
like
to
us
we're
also
like
community
first
so
like
for
us.
It's
really
okay.
How?
C
So
the
way
that
they
think
about
farming,
the
way
that
they
think
about
ecotourism
is
very
different
than
the
way
we
perceive
these
kinds
of
things,
and
they
have
very
clear
ideas
of
what
kinds
of
businesses
they
want
to
run
so
really
for
us,
it's
like.
Can
we
fund
that
absolutely
and
then
the
other
bit
of
it
is
sort
of
saying,
okay?
Well,
how
are
they
going
to
actually
like
leverage
these
tokens
like
it's,
not
that
the
infrastructure
is
really
ready
for
this?
C
In
fact,
in
many
countries
the
regulation
isn't
there,
the
on-ramp
off-ramp
isn't
there,
and
so
how
do
you
actually
translate
that
into
value?
And
very
often
what
we
have
found
is
like
there
is
benefit
to
aligning
ourselves
with
some
kind
of
non-profit
or
registered
entity.
That,
then,
can
be
able
to
be
a
conduit
and
then
actually
taking
their
structures
and
saying:
okay,
well,
you've
been
a
non-profit
for
x
amount
of
years
and,
historically
speaking,
obviously,
there's
like
a
trust
issue
with
a
lot
of
nonprofits.
A
A
C
Had
an
issue
once
where
people
were
asking
like
why
there
was
a
helicopter
situation
in
our
plan
like
we
needed
to
fund
a
helicopter,
and
people
were
like
what
like,
why
would
you
direct
money
toward
that,
but
actually
we're
working
with
a
community?
That's
so
remote
that
there's
no
road
or
anything
to
get
them
there,
so
they
have
two
choices:
either
a
boat
or
a
helicopter
to
get
actual
cash
which
then
they
take
back
to
their
community,
and
then
it
has
like
a
very
liquid
economy
there.
C
So
the
boat
is
not
an
option
because
most
of
the
time
like
the
water
tide
changes,
and
so
it
can
get
very
complicated,
the
journey
can
extend
by
x
amount
of
days
they
might
get
stranded
or
stuck
or
whatever.
So
actually
the
helicopter
is
the
most
trusted
way
to
get
to
and
from
where
they
can
get
cash.
So
we're
gonna
fund,
a
helicopter
like
you
know,
but
so
I
think
the
culture
of
transparency
is
really
important
in
that
domain
of
saying,
like
here's,
why
you're
funding
this
and
where
that
comes
from?
F
Yeah,
I
I
was
you
know
in
this
question
of
like
who
needs
governance.
It's
like
a
really
important
question
and
I
think
it's
something
that
it's
really
an
opportunity
that
we
have
in
web
3
that
we
can
create
like
different
types
of
tokens
or
like
different.
Like
realms
of
governance,
like
we
can
have
reputation,
tokens
that
allocated
to
contributors
to
a
project
who
are
there
with
seniority
and
time,
and
then
we
can
have
like
tokens
that
anybody
can
buy
on
the
open
market
who
then
have
like
skin
in
the
game
in
a
financial
sense.
F
And
it's
like
those
tokens
can
be
used
to
govern
different
things
like
at
giveth.
We
have.
We
have
our
reputation
debt,
which
is
exactly
this
like
contributors,
who
are
there
for
a
period
of
three
months.
Working
full-time
are
eligible
to
receive
these
tokens,
and
then
those
tokens
are
used
to
vote
on
people's
role.
Proposals
like
when
new
people
are
being
hired.
We
look
at
their
role
proposals
and
we
vote
on
like
yeah.
F
Let's
let
this
person
should
have
a
role,
etcetera,
etcetera,
which,
like
isn't
exactly
like
the
it,
isn't
something
that,
like
the
broader
community
of
give
token
holders
might
be
interested
in.
But
then
we
have
a
conviction.
Voting
dow
that
governs
a
pot
of
funds
in
give
tokens
so
give
token
holders
have
skin
in
the
game.
They
want
to
know
like
how
those
gif
tokens
are
being
used.
If
they're
being
used
to
things
that
are
just
dumping,
the
give
tokens
or
decreasing
the
price,
then
it
affects
also
those
people
who
are
holding
give
tokens.
F
So
it's
like
we
can
use
not
only
like.
We
can
use
different
ways
of
issuing
tokens
for
different
levels
of
expertise,
and
we
can
also
use
like
different
systems
of
voting
that
are
like
made
possible
in
web
3.
Things
like
quadratic
voting
or
things
like
conviction
voting.
It's
like
all
of
these
different
styles
of
voting
that
aren't
just
like.
Like
one
token
one
vote
or
even
one
person,
one
vote
they're
actually
like
taking
in
other
factors
like,
instead
of
just
like
how
much
tokens
you
have
or
and
like
or
like
yes,
no
decisions,
it's
like.
F
Maybe
you
could
signal
preference
to
multiple
different
proposals
and
that's
how
conviction
voting
works.
I
think
there's
like
so
there's
different
ways
of
issuing
tokens,
different
ways
of
creating
voting
structures
and
like
in
webster.
We
can
build
all
of
these
systems
and
then
apply
them
also
on
the
ground,
with
like
projects
who
are
working
on
the
ground
in
like
ways
that
like
suit
them,
we
can
also
use
delegation
like
people
who
are
who
have
like
are
working
on.
F
B
Wanted
to
come
back
and
alex
too
yeah.
I
totally
agree-
and
I
just
wanted
to
make
one
point
on
transparency,
because
I
think
that
you,
the
example
you
used
had
had
that
same
instance
of
that.
That
same
example
happened
15
years
ago
with
an
ngo
and
then
the
new
some
news,
corp
found
out.
You
know
some
anti-international
development
news,
corp
found
out
that
you
know
an
ngo
had
flown
a
helicopter,
then
they
would
be
uproar.
B
The
ngo
would
have
gone,
you
know
completely
bankrupt,
but
that
just
demonstrates
the
importance
of
transparency
in
the
governance
processes,
and
that's
why
web3
can
actually
do
it.
So
you
think
about
that's
the
advantage
to
these
ngos
because
all
of
a
sudden
they
can
take
those
decisions,
they're
based
on
pragmatism,
on
effectiveness,
and
they
can
actually
do
so
in
a
transparent
way
without
kind
of
delegitimizing
their
operations.
I
think.
B
A
G
I
have
spent
quite
a
lot
of
time
researching
governance
tokens
and
I
want
to
emphasize
on
three
core
benefits.
The
first
one
is
helps
a
project
to
decentralize
faster.
This
is
very
important
also
from
a
legal
perspective,
because
regulators,
if
they
see
a
very
centralized
project,
it's
going
to
be
the
first
that
they're
going
to
attack.
G
So
this
is
something
to
also
safeguard
the
founders
and
the
first
members
of
our
community,
the
second
one,
and
it
helps
to
build
relationships
in
crypto.
We
have
a
very
terrible
culture
when
the
things
going
really
well
and
token
is
going
up.
Everyone
is
celebrating
with
you,
but
when
the
token
starts
you
know,
declining
everyone
is
against
the
team.
The
developer
has
to
fix
them,
building
together
or
even
engaging
together
with
the
community.
G
I
used
to
believe
that
also
engaging
so
many
people
it
might
help
for
a
product
to
deliver
faster,
but
after
hearing
also
kevin
discussing
about
the
delays
in
decision
making
for
those,
I'm
not
anymore,
very
sure
if
this
is
happening,
but
definitely
helps
to
gather
feedback
from
many
people
and
improve
the
product.
I
just
want
to
finalize
we're
saying
that
before
when
it
comes
to
sustainability
and
innovation,
we
had
hedge
funds,
venture
capitals
investing
and
their
goal
has
been
profit
now.
G
We
have
smaller
players,
but
still
the
motivation
is
going
to
be
profit
and
in
crypto
and
a
lot
of
people
who
are
working
with
sustainability
and
they
are
facing
profit
with
a
negative
manner.
It's
not
necessary
negative
and
I
still
believe
that
if
we
give
incentives
that
are
translated
to
profit
long
term,
it's
going
to
be
the
most
reliable
source
of
keep
pushing
and
having
better
results.
A
E
Yeah,
for
sure
I
mean
the
most
effective
dows
that
I've
seen
so
far
have
all
been
centralized,
which
is
obviously
the
opposite
of
what
it's
supposed
to
be
and
any
truly
decentralized.
Owls
at
this
point
seem
to
be
a
bit
like
anarchy.
You
get
in
there.
Proposals
can't
get
past,
there's
not
enough
participation,
so
I
think
there's
a
lot
of
really
cool
theoretical
ways
to
run
it
down
and
a
lot
of
really
interesting
theories
about
how
to
get
there.
E
One
of
the
more
interesting
ones
that
I've
seen
so
far
is
a
lot
of
what
you
guys
were
talking
about,
but
the
participation
based
tokens,
but
they
actually
have
an
expiry
to
them.
So
you
have
to
be
actively
doing
things.
You
can't
just
accrue
a
ton
of
tokens,
get
a
ton
of
influence,
but
it's
like
what
have
you
done
for
me
lately
kind
of,
and
I
think
that
that's
a
really
interesting
model
and
I'd
love
to
see
it
applied
in
a
lot
of
these.
E
These
ways-
and
I
know,
there's
you
know
from
a
traditional
sense
right.
Everything
is
centralized
now
so
applying
a
dial
model.
I
think
can
really
change
a
lot
of
how
people
approach
these
types
of
issues,
particularly
when
you're
dealing
with
research,
because
they
have
sort
of
a
hybrid
model
in
a
sense
right.
You
have
an
organization,
that's
an
overarching,
named
organization,
a
research
organization
that
has
participants
from
all
over
the
world
who
have
other
jobs
in
other
universities
or
or
other
research
organizations
as
well.