►
Description
Lane Kasselman, Chief Business Officer, Blockchain.com
y Carter, SVP and Channel Chief - Unstoppable Domains / Former Vice President at Amazon
Radhika Iyengar, Author | Silicon Valley Woman of Influence
Tom Trowbridge, Co-Founder, Fluence Labs
Max Yakubowski, Opinion Editor, Cointelegraph (Moderator)
Webit Global Impact Forum 2022
https://www.webit.org/2022/impact/
A
Thank
you
welcome
everyone.
If
you
have
seen
us,
it
means
that
you
have
joined
web
Global
impact
Forum.
This
is
a
panel
discussion
which
is
dedicated
to
the
most
Buzzy
I
would
say
Topic
in
the
public
discourse.
We
are
going
to
talk
about
the
new
era
of
internet
web3
technology
next
Frontier,
before
we
jump
into
that
discussion,
I'd
like
to
our
guests,
to
save
her
words
about
themselves
and
after
a
short
introduction
to
highlight
what
are
your
personal
interests
in
web3.
Let's
start
with
you
on
radica.
B
Sure
hi
nice
to
be
with
everybody
today:
I'm
radhika,
Angar,
I'm
founding
partner
at
starchain
ventures,
we're
a
venture
Studio
here
in
Silicon,
Valley
and
I'll
just
say.
By
way
of
introduction
that
I
published
my
book
on
blockchain,
it's
called
Enterprise
blockchain
has
arrived
in
2019
and
first
line
of
our
preface
was
that
web
3-0
was
going
to
be
the
big
thing.
B
You
know
an
evangelist,
an
advocate,
a
believer
of
the
power
of
web3,
to
create
this
open
decentralized
world
that
is
really
going
to
change
everything
that
we
do
and
is
already
changing
everything
that
we
do
and
I
guess.
My
personal.
You
know.
Passion
right
now
is
I'm
working
on
two
nft
Collections
and
they
are
really
largely
focused
on
underrepresented
communities.
So
I
think
the
whole
concept
of
diversity
and
equity
and
inclusion
and
equal
access
for
all
is
something
that
really
propels
me
forward
to
be
actively
involved
in
this
space.
A
C
Great,
thank
you
good
to
be
here
again
appreciate
the
invitation.
My
name
is
Tom
Trowbridge
I
helped
a
couple
things,
but
I
helped
found
hedera
hashgraph,
which
is
to
radical's
point
of
I.
Think
the
leading
Enterprise
distributed
Ledger
in
existence
is
governed
by
Enterprises
Google
IBM
numura,
dla
Piper.
C
You
know,
among
many
others,
and
it's
designed
to
be
a
block
a
distributed
Ledger
for
Enterprises
governed
by
Enterprises,
but
I
left
there
back
in
2019
right
about
when
you
publish
your
book,
I,
guess
and
and
joined
as
a
co-founder
of
fluence
labs.
Fluence
labs
is
backed
by
a
lot
of
leading
web
3
investors,
including
multi-coin
1kx,
distributed
Global
protocol
labs
and
are
we
even
others
and
we
are
building
a
peer-to-peer
sort
of
decentralized,
compute
Network?
C
And
so,
if
you
think
of
the
peer-to-peer
world,
you
have
payments
and
you
have
which
is
Bitcoin
ethereum.
Everything
else
and
you
have
storage,
which
is,
are
we
even
file?
Coin
ipfs
and
the
missing
piece
for
fully
decentralized
world
is
having
compute
exist,
pretty
much
outside
of
the
cloud
and
that
dovetails
into
my
interest,
which
is,
as
Industries
generally
have
grown
larger
over
time.
C
70
of
the
cloud
is
only
three
companies,
Amazon,
Google
and
Microsoft,
and
that
is
leading
leading
to
incredible
centralization
risks
in
terms
of
failures
and
also
in
terms
of
stifling
Innovation.
Given
the
the
very
huge
difficulties
in
leaving
those
platforms,
and
so
solving
both
of
those
problems
is
what
is
driving
my
interest
in
in
building
a
a
fully
peer-to-peer
World,
which
I
think
is
what
web3
is
about.
A
D
Thank
you
Max,
and
thanks
so
much
for
webbit
for
having
me
on
today.
My
name
is
Sandy
Carter
and
I
am
SVP
for
Unstoppable
domains.
Unstoppable
domains
is
a
startup.
In
fact
we
were
just
named
oops.
Let
me
go
this
open
up
this
way.
This
way
we
were
just
saying
by
Forbes
as
one
of
the
top
startups
for
2022..
What
we
focus
in
on
is
digital
identity,
so
ensuring
that
you
have
identity
that
travels
with
you
throughout
the
web
3
and
the
metaverse
world.
D
It's
really
exciting
and
I
think
it's
a
game
changer
as
we
move
forward
for
web
3.
before
I
came
to
Unstoppable
I
was
with
one
of
those
companies.
Tom
I
was
with
Amazon
web
services
for
about
five
years
and
that's
actually
where
I
started
on
my
web
3
Journey
looking
after
blockchain
and
seeing
how
our
customers
were
using
blockchain
and
having
things
on
chain
and
off
chain.
D
It
was
just
fascinating
and
then
started
with
a
couple
of
side
projects
that
I
was
working
on
and
just
became
fascinated
with
the
power
of
web3
and
the
metaverse
and
how
the
next
generation
of
the
internet
was
going
to
change
things
throughout
the
world.
I
will
tell
you
Max
one
of
the
things
that
surprised
me
the
most
when
I
came
over
because
I
came
over
from
Amazon.
D
Well,
you
know
in
the
web
2
world
where
women
were
about
25
still
not
enough,
but
about
25
percent
entered
the
web
3
world
and
found
that
you
know
it
was
single
digits
and
so
I
also
founded
a
group
called
Unstoppable
women
of
web3.
We
now
have
78
companies,
including
including
a
Google
Deloitte
from
the
web
2
world
and
then
also
the
who's
who
of
web3.
D
That
belonged
to
that
a
group
like
blockchain.com,
binance,
openc
and,
of
course,
Unstoppable
as
well
as
many
more
and
our
mission
is
to
educate
everyone
on
web3
so
that
we'll
have
an
equal
World.
Our
mission
and
comment
is
web
3
for
all.
So
that's
really
what
I'm
interested
in
is
having
this
Gateway
and
why
I'm
so
excited
about
this
panel
is
making
you
know
that
gateway
to
web3,
so
web3
is
available
for
everyone.
Yeah.
A
Thank
you
for
what
you
do
and
definitely,
if
you
remember
what
was
written
in
the
Plato
State,
oh,
he
actually
mentioned
that
the
education
is
the
key
to
rule
or
so
I
still
like
after,
like
2000
years,
those
line
I
Still
Remains
the
power.
Yes,
of
course
thank
you
so
much
and
wait.
Let's
go
and
see,
and
let's
hear
you.
E
Max
good
to
see
you
thanks
for
for
having
me
and
hi
to
all
my
fellow
panelists
nice
to
meet
you
I'm
Lane,
Castleman
I'm,
the
chief
business
officer
at
blockchain.com,
and
we
are
one
of
the
biggest
and
oldest
web3
companies
in
the
world.
We've
got
over
85
million
retail
customers
across
200
countries.
E
We
have
thousands
of
institutional
clients
across
that
customer
base
and
for
nearly
10
years
we've
been
on
the
front
lines
of
I
guess
what
was
called
digital
assets
and
digital
currency
and
then
crypto
and
now
web
free
over
that
decade
and
I
think
what's
so
exciting
about
being
in
this
space.
Now
more
than
just
having
so
many
amazing
people
shift
from
classical
traditional
Finance
or
traditional
Tech
and
moving
into
the
space
because
they
see
the
power
of
the
ecosystem.
But
you
get
to
have
some
really
amazing.
E
A
Yes,
thank
you
so
much.
Indeed,
if
we
remove
the
connotation
like
those
ideological
connotations
from
the
world
ideology,
I
would
say
there
was
blockchain.
Have
you
in
the
wildest
understanding?
Community
is
tender,
those
ideas
who
are
driven
by
those
ideology
of
a
better
future?
That's
why
it's
so
exciting
to
be
among
those
peoples
and
to
work
with
them
on
a
daily
basis.
A
So
we
as
I
guess
everyone
here
encourage
everyone
to
join
blockchain
community
and
this
this
decentralization
path,
but
we
already
started
to
mention
the
term
web3
before
we
go
further
into
the
discussion.
I'd
like
to
give
a
word
to
Sandy
who
make
a
presentation
about
web3,
I,
think
Sandy,
it's
your
world,
okay,.
D
Great
thank
thanks,
Max
and
great
to
have
all
these
amazing
panelists
here.
So
what
I
was
asked
to
do
is
just
to
intro
a
little
bit
about
what
web3
is
before
we
start
talking
about
it.
There
are
lots
of
definitions,
but
I
love
this
one
sentence
that
really
frames
it
up.
So
web3
is
an
open
movement.
So
it's
not
closed
as
Tom
talked
about.
D
You
know
making
sure
that
we
don't
have
close
movements
to
broadly
decentralize
the
internet
to
make
sure
that
it
is
distributed,
and
the
key
I
believe
is
allowing
for
individual
ownership
of
both
identity
as
well
as
personal
data.
So
when
I
get
asked
like,
what's
the
one
difference,
if
you
could
just
put
it
in
one
word,
the
difference
between
web
2
and
web3,
that
one
word
for
me
would
be
ownership
in
the
web
T
world.
D
You
know
the
ownership
of
data,
and
even
your
identity
is
owned
by
very
large
companies
and
in
some
cases,
governments
and
the
profit
and
the
financial
benefits
come
from
they're
selling
your
data
in
the
web
3
world,
though
the
data
is
owned
by
you,
the
person
and
the
member
like
in
web
2
you're
a
user
in
web3.
You
are
a
member
of
the
community.
D
So
if
you
have
to
explain
to
someone
in
one
word,
like
I,
do
a
lot
of
times
to
people
who
just
say
just
give
me
the
the
elevator
pitch
the
difference
between
web
2
and
web3
is
is
ownership,
and
then
we
drew
this
picture
to
try
to
frame
up
all
the
buzzwords
that
are
coming
at
us
today
to
see
how
they
all
fit
together.
And
so
what
I'd
like
to
do
first
is
to
start
with
the
two
sides
of
this
two-sided
Marketplace
on
the
left.
D
You
have
that
Creator
economy
that
you
heard
from
radica
about
nfts
right
that
creation
that's
happening
today
on
the
right
hand,
side
you
see
the
second
part
of
that
two-sided
Marketplace,
which
are
a
lot
of
these
digital
networks
that
are
providing
that
consumption.
That's
coming
in,
so
the
two-sided,
Marketplace
I
think,
is
really
an
important
element
of
what
we're
seeing
shape
today,
I'm
at
the
bottom
of
the
the
piece
in
the
center
I.
Think
this
really
helps
me
I'm
a
visual
learner,
and
so
for
me
to
see.
D
Visuals
is
really
important,
so
at
the
bottom
which
everything
is
based
on
is
the
blockchain
and
the
blockchain
is
simply
a
way
to
store
data.
Much
like
you
would
have
with
a
storage
shed
that
you
would
store
your
goods
in,
but
even
more
importantly,
blockchain
provides
that
trusted
and
secure
exchange
that
you
do
today.
D
Now,
today,
I
have
dowels
kind
of
in
the
center
of
the
stack
I
think
that
dowels
are
actually
becoming
so
important.
I
could
have
had
the
whole
chart
circle
around
dowels
and
a
dow
is
a
decentralized
autonomous
organization
and
it
enables
for
government.
In
fact,
many
companies
today
are
governed
through
Dows
versus
through
shareholders.
For
example,
one
of
our
partners,
decentraland,
is
actually
structured
as
a
dow
and
a
lot
of
cases.
D
Dowels
are
managed
by
artificial
intelligence
and
then
the
next
layer
are
metaverses,
so
no
metaverse
and
web3
isn't
fighting
against
each
other
I
believe
a
metaverse
is
based
on
web
3
and
the
blockchain
and
the
metaverse
really
has
those
digital
experiences
where
you
create
an
avatar
for
yourself,
but
you
live
and
you
work
and
you
breathe
inside
of
the
metaverse.
It's
a
new
world
created
on
top
of
Technologies.
D
We
know
and
love
like
AR
and
VR
and
then
at
the
very
top
are
the
interfaces,
and
this
is
where,
if
you're
a
startup
I
think
you
could
really
take
advantage
of
some
of
the
gaps
that
we
have
today
and
the
interfaces
the
way
that
you
go
after
accessing
a
metaverse
or
web3
or
a
blockchain.
In
fact,
I
just
did
a
conference
in
the
metaverse
and
two
participants
couldn't
figure
out
how
to
get
off
of
the
of
the
ceiling
of
the
conference
room,
which
was
quite
funny.
It
wasn't
their
problem.
D
A
You
Cindy
that
was
enlightening.
Thank
you
so
much
and
since
you
started
it
already,
I'd
like
to
ask
all
our
panelists
just
follow
this
in
this
example
and
give
me
one
word
which
actually
Associated,
like
you
can
associate
with
web
3
movement
and
dive
a
little
bit
in
that
your
own
definition
of
fat
three.
So
let's
start
with
you
Lane.
So
what
would
be
your
word.
E
Is
it
sure
so
you
know
web
one?
The
reason
I
said
geocity
is
I,
don't
know
if
I'm
dating
myself
on
this
on
this
forum,
but
it's
that
was
static,
content
right,
so
that
was
hosted
on
a
server
somewhere
likely
it
wasn't
owned
by
a
major
Enterprise
and
it
was
a
one-way
source
of
information
right.
There
was
no
interaction
between
parties.
You
were
just
getting
static,
information
off
a
website.
E
Web
2,
of
course,
is
you
know
where
we're
transitioning
from,
and
that
is
the
era
of
major
major
tech
companies
owning
our
data
and
serving
as
an
intermediary
between
our
activities
on
the
web,
whether
that's
a
financial
transaction
or
just
a
social
transaction
or
anything
else.
You
know
it
could
be
one
of
the
fan,
companies
or
a
major
multinational,
Financial
Corporation,
but
they
sit
in
the
middle
they
own.
Your
data
web3
is
the
elimination
of
the
middleman
right.
So
it's
shifting
that
Dynamic
from
corporations
to
individuals.
E
So
you
know
it
went
from
static,
one-way
content
to
needing
an
intermediary
to
process
information.
To
now
it's
one
to
one
between
two
parties
and
whether
one
part
is
a
corporation,
an
individual,
whatever
it
doesn't
doesn't
matter,
but
that's
really
where
we
are
today
and
what's
so
exciting
about
it,
because
what's
the
problem
with
intermediaries,
right
that
are
expensive,
they
take
a
lot
of
time
and
they
exert
their
own
control
for
their
own
benefit.
So
if
you
eliminate
them,
you're,
eliminating
those
vulnerabilities
and
that
delay
and
that
challenge
in
the
process.
B
If
it
had
to
be
just
one
word,
I'd
say
it's:
maybe
transformative
is
the
word
that
I
that
I
would
pick
for
web
three,
but
you
know
the
definition
of
web3
is.
Is
you
know,
as
we've
been
talking
about
now
since
the
beginning
of
the
panel?
It's
about
peer-to-peer
interactions,
it's
about
shared
data,
it's
about
decentralization
and
I.
B
Think
that
you
know
web3
has
come
about
in
this
particular
time,
because
we've
really
crossed
the
boundaries
of
web
2
and
what
it
can
provide
web
2
I
think
we
will
talk
about
this
later
in
the
panel
I
believe.
But
you
know,
if
you
look
at
what
web
web
2
couldn't
do,
is
what
web3
can
do,
and
so
it's
providing
that
secure
layer,
it's
providing
the
trust
layer,
it's
providing
a
value
layer,
it's
also
providing
an
identity
layer.
B
So
you
know
I,
think
all
of
these
things
we're
going
to
be
continuing
to
talk
about,
but
I
think
it's
providing
the
things
that
web2
cannot
provide
because
web2
has
been
based
on
TCP
as
a
protocol
which,
as
we
all
remember,
is
a
Communications
protocol.
So
it
really
wasn't
designed
to
do
anything
else,
but
for
open
communication
and
even
with
open
communication.
B
There's
issues
with
that.
So
I
think
that,
where
we're
really
reaching
the
boundaries
or
have
reached
the
boundaries
of
web
2
is
where
web3
comes
in
and
it
really
is
going
to
reshape
everything
we
know
about
this
online
digital
world,
which
is
now
you
know
we're
getting
into
things
like
the
metaverse,
for
example,
and
the
experience
into
a
3D
virtual
experience.
There
are
so
many
aspects
on
trust
and
value,
and
privacy
and
security
and
identity
that
are
going
to
be
absolutely
Mission
critical.
A
C
I
think
I'd
say
peer-to-peer
so
we'll
hyphenate
it
so
I'll
get
away
with
that
and
I'll
I'll
say
peer-to-peer,
because
for
for
for
a
couple
reasons,
but
one
the
way
kind
of
architecture
has
evolved
from
from
kind
of
company
and
and
kind
of
applications
is
first
everyone
hosted
things
internally.
Then
they
were
dragged
Kicking
and
Screaming
to
the
cloud
starting
late,
90s
going
2000s
and
everybody
thought
they
wanted
to
be
have
their
own
servers
in-house,
because
it
was
cheaper,
more
reliable,
they
could
control
it.
C
Then
they
realized
actually,
the
Cloud's
cheaper,
the
Cloud's,
more
reliable,
et
cetera
and
everyone
started
moving
there
and
I.
Think
peer-to-peer
is
the
next
and
probably
final.
You
know
iteration
of
architecture
where
people
realize
that,
having
redundant
and
and
frankly
open
source
platforms
to
both
host
and
build
their
applications
is
probably
the
Superior
alternative
to
the
cloud.
C
You
know
a
wider
variety
of
compute,
far
faster
and
more
and
more
and
far
cheaper
than
what
is
blockchain
based
and
by
the
way,
and
also
more
resilient
and
and
less
and
more
censorship
resistant
than
centralized
compute,
which
we
have
now
so
I
think
that
it's
really
peer-to-peer
is
the
is
the
is
sort
of
the
web
3
world
that
we're
talking
about,
and
that
has
kind
of
that.
That's
and
peer-to-peer
is
a
big
big
universe,
big
family.
It
can
incorporate
a
great
deal,
but
that's
that's
where
we're
headed.
A
Yeah
absolutely
I
totally
agree
with
you,
but
right.
Okay,
since
you
mentioned
the
transformation,
is
the
main
word
for
you
within
the
world
tree.
Let
me
ask
you
that
question,
but
is
there
anything
wrong
about
the
current
web?
Why
in
the
first
place,
do
we
need
that
paradigm
shift
to
the
way
internet
works
now.
B
Sure
absolutely
I
mean
there
is
a
really
very
compelling
set
of
reasons.
Why
we're
in
the
middle
of
this
transformation,
and
it's
going
to
be
something
that's
going
to
be
Decades
of
of
of
of
change.
If
you
will
of
not
honestly
Decades
of
change,
the
change
is
already
happening,
but
what
we're
going
to
reap
the
benefits
of
is
decades
long
and
incoming.
B
So
there's
lack
of
identity,
which
means
you
don't
really
know
how
to
authenticate
somebody
and
validate
somebody
and
in
the
web
2
world.
You
might
have
multiple
identifiers
for
the
same
person
right.
So,
every
time
you
log
into
any
one
of
these
companies,
that's
providing
a
way
to
establish
your
identity,
that's
a
unique
identifier,
so
there's
multiple
identifiers
for
each
person
or
each
entity,
and
so
when
you're
thinking
about
all
of
these
that
add
up
the
internet
and
the
web
2
world
was
really
not
private
or
secure
by
design.
B
It
was
just
an
open
communication
based
on
open
communication
protocol,
which
was
TCP
so
web3
is
really
changing
and
transforming
all
of
that,
because
it
is
private
and
secured
by
Design,
and
it
is
going
to
be
based
on
principles
of
peer-to-peer
interactions,
share
data
and
decentralization
because
having
one
entity
and
owner
of
that
data,
as
Sandy
was
talking
about,
is
really
going
to
be
detrimental
because
it
it
creates
a
information,
asymmetry
and
a
power
asymmetry.
So
the
web
3
world
is
really
changing.
A
Yes,
thank
you
so
much
absolutely
yeah.
Definitely
when
we
talk
about
the
what's
wrong
about
the
current
web,
like
on
the
first
place,
we
wouldn't
be
here
today
and
discussing
this
topic
if
everything
was
good
about
that
entrance
right.
So
that's
why
we
should
have
that
conversation
and
the
more
people
have
that
conversation
daily,
the
better.
It
is
the
more
the
level
of
adoption
Rises
right,
so
I
forgot
to
mention
that
if
you
want
to
join
our
conversation,
don't
forget
to
go
on
your
social
media
using
the
hashtag
web.
A
It
you
can
ask
your
question
there.
You
can
leave
your
comments
and
maybe
your
definitions
and
maybe
your
perspective
of
what's
wrong
with
the
current
web
right
so
and
speaking
about
the
web
too.
Of
course,
like
it's
already
two
decades
of
the
current
web
right
now
and
keeping
in
mind
we'll
just
write
a
cassette
about
what
we
should
change
about
that
internet.
So
Cindy,
let
me
ask
you
that
question
which
mistakes
we
must
avoid
to
build
a
better
web.
In
your
opinion,.
D
Well,
I
think
one
which
is
the
big
one
that
I
think
everybody's
talked
about
is
about
who
owns
the
data
and
where
the
data
is
is
stored
and
placed,
and
so
for
me,
that's
probably
one
of
the
biggest
things
that
I
think
in
web
3
that
we
need
to
look
after
is:
where
is
the
data
ownership?
Where
is
the
identity
ownership?
D
And
for
me
that
means
that
you're
able
to
use
one
ID
and
password
like
today,
I,
don't
know
about
you
guys,
I,
just
counted
I
have
289
usernames
and
passwords
289..
So
imagine
a
world
where
you
have
one
identity
and
you
can
log
into
a
defy
application.
You
can
log
into
the
metaverse.
You
could
log
into
a
game.
D
3
world
they're
looking
forward
to
it,
because
then
they
can
validate
that
I
am
a
person
one
person
they
can
offer
me
a
reward
for
my
data
and
therefore
they
can
reward
me
for
the
data
that
I
own
and
the
data
that
I
choose
to
share
and
I
see
this
being
such
a
powerful
Concept.
In
fact,
when
people
ask
me
my
favorite
web3
application
today
that
will
use
digital
identity,
it
hasn't
been
created
but,
for
example,
we're
working
with
Arizona
State
University
today
to
store
data
about
you
for
your
Your
Diploma,
Your
certifications.
D
D
We
also
Envision,
you
know
we're
working
with
several
people
today
on
Health
Care
data,
with
my
new
company
I,
just
recently
moved
and
I'm
trying
to
get
my
data
and
many
medical
facilities
won't
give
it
to
me,
even
though
it's
data
about
me,
they'll
only
give
it
to
another
medical
profession,
so
I,
imagine
a
world
where
your
digital
identity
travels
with
you.
It
provides
you
access.
It's
data
that
I
decide
to
share
that
you
decide
to
share
when
you
want
to
share
it
and
it's
an
identity
that
can
unlock.
A
E
A
Keep
talking
about
that
and
it
kind
of
related
to
the
topic
about
the
data
ownership,
but
Tom
I'd
like
to
ask
you,
but
you
mentioned
since
yogurt
was
peer-to-peer.
I
would
definitely
ask
you,
but
definitely
web3
is
trying
to
give
people
the
power
back
to
users
right
so,
but
on
the
first
place,
why
do
we
need
that
like?
Why
not
just
to
give
that
power
to
those
centralized
organizations.
C
You
know
the
in
India
the
government
at
one
point
banned
a
whole
number
of
of
social
media
or
Whatsapp
accounts
of
the
opposition
politician
opposition
political
party.
They
also
shut
down
I,
think
it
was,
it
might
have
been
what
zaparel's
Facebook
groups
for
that
were
about
organizing
a
farmer's
strike
protesting
in
particular
legislation.
C
Targeting
kind
of
you
know,
wheat,
pricing
or
centralization
of
of
green
kind
of
distribution,
and
so
and
and
Twitter
and
Facebook
employees
were
threatened
with
jail
if
they
didn't
comply,
and
so
we
think
of
it-
and
you
obviously
see
stuff
in
the
U.S
from
censorship
of
of
cobit
related
stuff.
That
turned
out
to
be
true
from
Twitter
or
you
know,
you
name
a
whole
bunch
of
things.
C
But
but
the
point
is
I,
guess
that
these
are
just
sort
of
the
initial
steps
and
don't
forget
we're
not
talking
about
Russia
here
or
China,
but
it
needs
a
democracy
and
that
stuff
is
happening.
So
that
is-
and
it's
easy
to
do
right
because
it's
everyone
is
on
WhatsApp
and
Facebook
and
something
else
so
it's
very
easy
to
threaten
shareholders
threaten
employees
and
those
are
in
threatened
management
right.
C
Those
are
very
three
very
simple
ways
to
go
out
and
to
have
massive
control
and
impact
with
a
very
clear
steps
that
government
can
take
in
a
decentralized
say,
messaging
protocol,
for
example,
there's
no
shareholders,
there's
no
management.
It's
all.
It's
run
and
operated
by
communities
of
people
that
may
even
be
anonymous.
Maybe
all
over
there's,
not
one
server
to
shut
down
infrastructure
is
also
duplicated,
so
it
is
a
far
more
censorship
resistant
setup
that
prevents
that
type
of
that
type
of
kind
of
kind
of
impact
from
happening.
C
It
also
is
more
resilient.
You
shut
down
some
servers,
the
the
the
actual
code
is
replicated
in
multiple
places
in
multiple
geographies
and
multiple
jurisdictions.
So
it
can
keep
running
this
by
the
way
leads
to
other
problems
right.
It
means
that
it's
harder
to
take
stuff
off
that
you
that
or
suffer
could
be
on
it.
That
is
actually
bad
and
negative
and
dangerous.
A
B
You
know,
autocratic
sort
of
system,
and
that
balance
is,
is
that
trilemma
that
I
often
talk
about
which
is
you
know
there
is
a
tug
between
three
different
forces.
So,
on
the
one
hand
you
know
in
a
system
like
a
government
system,
the
government
is
interested
in
two
things
is
interested
in
compliance
and
is
interested
in
security
and
in
an
open
government
I
mean
open,
Democratic
sort
of
system.
Ideally
you
want
to
have
preservation
of
privacy
too.
B
So
I
think
this
trilemma
between
security,
compliance
and
privacy
is
going
to
be
very,
very
critical.
So,
even
as
we
go
forward
in
decentralized
systems,
anonymity
itself
is
going
to
be
also
tricky
truly
tricky
because
for
certain
reasons,
we're
going
to
have
to
have
authentication
of
that
individual
or
that
entity
for
it
to
be
something
that
is
compliant.
And
so
you
just
can't
have
a
truly
Anonymous
kind
of
system.
Because
of
that
so
I
think
you
know
as
we
go
forward.
C
C
Think
you're,
you're
you're
asked
your
implication
is
potentially,
but
and
because
I
think
that
one
government
primary
objective
is
to
stay
in
power
and
I
think
that's
actually
the
number
one
objective
and
so,
whether
that's
a
party
or
whether
that's
an
individual
or
a
system,
it
is
that
is
kind
of,
has
historically
been
a
a
real
focus,
and
so
that
leads
to
bleeding
in
of
and
de-emphasis
de-emphasis
of
privacy.
There
are
systems
right
now,
where
you
can
have
completely
Anonymous
messaging.
It
does
exist,
it's
just
slow
and
cumbersome
and
not
not
widely
used.
C
I,
think
and
metadata
is
still
tracked,
which
basically
makes
them
kind
of
harder
to
be
fully
fully
Anonymous,
but
I
think
you
will
see
that
happen
in
the
future.
That's
very
whether
those
are
used
and
how
much
so
I'm
not
entirely
sure
I.
But
I
hear
your
point
on
the
the
cbdc
comment
that
if
you
basically
want
to
engage
in
a
society,
you'll
probably
have
to
be
authenticated
or
use
the
currency,
and
that
is
going
to
lead
to
a
lot
of
you
know
a
lot
of
risks.
Let's
just
say.
B
B
B
True,
anonymity
is
sort
of
that
ultimate
limit,
but
there
are
constraints
in
terms
of
how
you
achieve
that
balance
within
governmental
systems,
which
are
also
important.
Otherwise,
you've
got
you
know
a
society
that
doesn't
have
you
know
Law
and
Order.
Essentially
so
there's
there's
a
purpose
for
government.
That's
finding
the
right
balance,
I
think
and
that's
what
we're
in
agreement
with
totally.
C
A
E
Yeah
I
think
it's
an
interesting
question
Max,
because
it's
already
happening.
You
know
I,
think
in
it's
very
easy
on
on
panels
like
this,
and
certainly
other
discussions
about
web3
and
crypto
to
be
very
absolute
in
the
analysis
and
sort
of
the
view
of
what's
going
to
happen.
But
the
reality
is-
and
you
know
our
company
sees
this
firsthand
every
day
because
we
operate
in
so
many
different
markets
is
that
the
application
of
web3
Technology
varies
dramatically
across
countries
and
markets.
E
E
Right,
they're
not
trying
to
find
necessarily
a
safe
store
value,
they're,
just
looking
for
on-ramps
to
Netflix
and
Spotify
and
and
sort
of
the
normal
services
that
everybody
else
uses,
but
they
don't
really
have
a
solid
or
or
sufficient
banking
system
that
can
be
used
to
give
them
that
on-ramp,
that's
very
different
than
what
we're
seeing
happen
in
North
America,
where
our
financial
system
is
great
right.
Like
everything
works,
my
credit
card
always
works.
E
I'm,
not
worried
about
it
and
crypto
offers
a
different
use
case
for
consumers
here
and
so
I
think
when
you're
looking
at
all
right.
What
is
the
actual
use
case?
How
are
things
going
to
change?
We
are
seeing
real
examples
of
it,
but
we
shouldn't
expect
those
examples
to
be
represented
of
the
entire
planet,
because
we
are
very
different
communities
in
very
different
markets
and
we
will
sort
of
find
our
Unique
Piece
of
crypto.
Just
like
saying,
Finance
right.
That
means
means
a
million
different
things.
E
That's
the
same
thing
with
web
3
or
crypto
or
whatever
term
you
want
to
use.
It
means
so
many
different
things
and
just
depending
on
what
Market
you're
in
where
you
live
in
the
world
and
what
your
needs
are
that
will
truly
Define
the
types
of
web3
tools
and
services
you
want.
The
reality
is
like
you're,
probably
not
going
to
care
much
about
the
metaverse
right
now.
E
A
D
D
You
know
when
you
come
into
web
3.
It's
we're
all
gonna
make
it
right.
It's
not
we're
gonna
battle
and
we're
gonna
fight
it
out,
even
though
that
does
exist,
but
the
whole
cultural
moment
is
different,
even
creating
road
maps.
So
when
I
was
at
AWS,
we
would
create
a
road
map.
We'd
get
some
input,
but
we
would
create
it
and
then
we
would
unveil
it.
D
You
know
in
web
3
there
is
so
much
Community
involvement
and
engagement
that
the
road
map
is
actually
designed
and
created
by
the
community,
and
it's
a
difference
in
the
societal
ways
that
you
think
about
projects
and
you
think
about
Community.
Even
the
concept
of
you
know:
I
am
a
member
I'm,
not
a
user
has
a
whole
different
cultural
mindset
as
well.
D
That
I
think
is
already
you
know
a
swept
in,
and
you
know
one
of
my
favorite
quotes
is
that
culture
eats
strategy
for
lunch
or
for
dinner
or
whatever
you
want
to
say,
I.
Think
all
of
these
cultural
elements
around
the
user
has
power.
The
user
owns
data.
The
community
gets
to
help
design
the
road
map.
The
community
gets
a
vote,
we're
all
going
to
make
it
we're
working
for
the
good.
All
boats,
rise,
I
think,
is
a
very
different
mindset
than
the
web
2
world
that
exists
today.
A
A
So
definitely
what
I'm
trying
to
say
with
that
metaphor
are
indeed
there
are
some
challenges
on
a
way
to
get
that
real,
Mass
adoption
of
that
web3
and
the
technology
behind
that,
but
for
sure,
in
time
it
will
come
inevitably
and
for
us
who,
like
who
already
believed
that
life
when
iPod
appeared,
and
we
actually
had
to
try
to
adjust
ourselves
to
that
new
reality
how
to
use
those
screen.
You
know
touch
screens
Etc.
There
are
already
like
a
generation
of
people
who
were
born
with
that
knowledge.
A
The
same
will
happen
with
web3,
so
we're
building
something
for
the
better
future
and
I
think
that's
important
and
education.
Again,
let's
say
it
again:
education
is
the
key
to
unlock
the
future,
so
I'm
very
grateful
for
you
for
that
amazing
discussion
today
and
the
great
panel.
It
was
a
pure
pleasure
to
be
here
today
with
you.