►
From YouTube: Marcel van Remmerden talks about career development and design leadership | GitLab Design Talks
Description
Marcel van Remmerden and Rayana Verissimo talk about design, leadership, and career development at GitLab. https://gitlab.com/gitlab-org/gitlab-design/-/issues/1545
A
Hi
everyone,
I'm
hayana
fedessimo,
I'm
a
staff
product
designer
here
get
lab
and
currently
acting
product
design
manager
for
the
cicd
ux
team,
and
this
video
is
part
of
a
series
that
looks
into
the
staff
and
the
products.
I
manage
your
roles
and
responsibilities
today
we
have
here
marcel
and
we're
gonna
talk
about
how
the
staff
and
the
product
design
manager
roles
differ
from
each
other
and
from
other
roles
as
well.
In
the
ux
department,
talk
a
little
bit
about
transition
between
from
ic
to
leadership
and
career
development
at
gitlab.
B
For
sure,
thank
you,
my
name
is
mozelle
vernon
ramadan,
I'm
the
product,
design
manager
for
all
of
create
I've
been
in
this
position
for
about
one
year.
Now
previously,
I
was
a
senior
product
designer
in
the
editor
team,
which
also
belongs
to
create
and
yeah.
This
is
now
almost
the
end
of
my
second
year
at
gitlab,
so
pretty
long
time
already
in
gitlab
terms,
but
still
rather
fresh.
A
Yeah,
that's
in
in
gitlab
years,
that's
probably
like
seven
years.
You
know
regular
companies.
Can
you
tell
me
a
little
bit
about
like
what
your
background
in
design
is,
so
this
is
defenders
correctly?
This
is
your
first
experience
in
management
and
leadership.
If
that's
not
the
case,
can
you
tell
us
a
bit
about
what
you
did
and
where
you
came
from
before
gitlab.
B
B
B
B
B
A
B
Yeah,
it's
a
great
question
and
I
think
especially
when
you
look
at
my
consulting
experience.
This
is
where
it
really
came
in
very
handily,
because
when
you're
consultant,
you
have
to
jump
into
new
project,
basically
every
one
to
three
months,
and
you
constantly
have
to
understand
how
these
teams
work,
how
they
fit
together.
You
see
the
advantages,
you
also
see
the
disadvantages
and
you
can
basically
set
up
your
own
process.
A
So
it
also
sounds
a
lot
like
what
we
do
here:
gitlab
right
this
constant
iteration
and
yeah,
I
would
say
the
self-improvement,
but
I'd
say
my
experience
as
well
in
consultancy
is
that
you
don't
get
to
see
that
project,
I
would
say,
not
not
grow,
but
there's
a
deadline
right.
There
is
a
time
to
to
end.
So
how
would
you
say
that
the
this
iteration
differs
from
the
iteration
that
we
do
here
get
lab
in
terms
of
yeah
design
and
and
leadership.
B
Yeah,
especially
from
from
viewing
it
as
a
designer,
it
was
sometimes
very
tough
because
you
were
implementing
designs.
You
were
implementing
ideas,
you
were
coming
up
with
new
kinds
of
info
information
architecture
and
the
team
started
implementing
it,
but
that's
when
you
got
pulled
out
of
the
project
because
you
had
to
go
to
the
next
one
and
that
was
sometimes
very
frustrating
and
one
of
the
biggest
points
why
I
wanted
to
leave
ibm
back
in
that
time,
because
I
really
needed
to
still
understand
if
I
implement
something.
B
A
Yeah,
I
think,
designers
we
all
crave,
I'm
generalizing,
but
my
experience
is
because
we
all
crave
seeing
the
results
right
be
able
to
iterate
and
improve
on
our
deliverables.
So
I
understand
that
so
going
back
a
little
bit
about
your
career
here,
get
lab
I'm
interested
in
knowing
what
has
your
self-development,
your
your
path
being
at
gitlab,
so
you
talked
a
little
bit
about
the
transition.
B
For
sure
I
want
to
start
at
the
beginning,
when
I
joined
gitlab,
we
were
10
12,
13
designers,
roughly
and
back
when
I
joined
it
was
me
and
pedro
in
create.
We
had
jarek
also
join
us
after
a
couple
of
weeks,
and
this
was
the
first
time
where
create
really
got
split
up
from
a
design
perspective
into
multiple,
smaller
groups,
and
this
was
very
interesting
because
I
was
able
to
learn
under
pedro
how
the
gitlab
structure
works
about
the
gitlab
values.
B
I
was
more
taking
on
smaller,
tiny
issues
that
I
could
iteratively
work
on
without
yet
having
to
depend
on
on
myself
as
much,
but
then,
when
I
stepped
into
the
editor
team,
and
we
got
split
up.
That
was
really
where
I
had
to
work
way
closer
with
kai
my
pm
directly
and
where
it
was
more
just
me
him
and
the
rest
of
the
team
and
where
more
of
the
design
would
really
just
depend
on
me.
B
That
went
on
for
about
a
couple
of
months
almost
an
entire
year,
and
we
made
some
some
amazing
changes
in
that
time.
We
really
started
working
on
okrs.
We
really
started
growing,
bigger
and
bigger
in
that
time,
and
what
we
noticed
especially,
was
that,
with
that
growth,
we
also
needed
to
look
at.
How
does
our
collaboration
work
and
shortly
before
before
I
jumped
into
the
newly
opened
design
manager
position
for
create?
A
B
Yeah,
it
was
very
interesting
because,
when
I
previously
worked
together
with
all
the
amazing
team
members
in
create,
I
know
suddenly
was
their
manager
and
that's
just
a
different
kind
of
relation.
That's
just
a
different
kind
of
interaction
you're
having-
and
it
was
very
interesting
because
I
hadn't
been
in
that
position
before,
where
you
jumped
from
one
position
inside
the
team
suddenly
to
another
one.
B
I
had
been
leading
design
teams,
but
I
came
on
fresh
as
a
new
manager,
and
so
it
was
already
established
the
kind
of
interaction
you're
having
and
so
what
I
really
tried
to
communicate
to
all
the
designers
in
my
team
was,
I
know
how
amazing
you
are.
I
know
the
great
work
you
are
doing.
I
don't
want
to
interfere
here.
Tell
me
how
I
can
support
you
tell
me
how
I
can
help
you,
and
this
is
what
I
both
needed
to
also
communicate
to
them,
but
also
what
I
needed
to
first
understand
myself.
B
That
took
some
time.
I
needed
to
understand
how
I
wanted
to
play
this
role,
but
in
the
end,
it
really
was
very
clear
to
me
that
if
I
want
to
be
a
manager,
I
need
to
be
comfortable
giving
them
this
flexibility,
this
freedom
of
still
doing
the
designs
in
their
own
way,
even
though
they
have
a
manager.
Now
that
also
has
experience
as
gitlab
designer.
A
A
B
Absolutely
and
most
often
my
day
really
begins
with
notifications.
I'm
involved
in
many
different
efforts
at
the
same
time
and
I
have
to
find
ways
to
keep
up
to
date
to
them.
I
actually
love
our
new
feature
of
following
users,
because
that
allows
me
to
look
at
what
have
the
different
people
that
I've
been
working
with
been
doing.
B
I
jump
into
a
huge
number
of
google
docs
from
team
meetings
so
that
I
can
understand
what
have
they
been
working
on
that
I'm
aware
that
I
can
also
connect
people
with
each
other.
A
lot
of
my
work
is
really
just
asking
people
hey.
Have
you
already
talked
to
that
other
person?
That
also
is
working
on
something
related
and
to
be
able
to
do
that.
I
need
to
be
aware
of
what's
happening
across
the
entire
create
sector.
B
To
do
that,
I
also
have
tons
of
meetings
I
meet
every
product
manager.
I
meet.
Obviously
every
designer
I
meet
our
technical
writers.
I
meet
the
front
end
engineering
manager
for
all
of
create
actually
she's
the
engineering
manager,
not
only
the
front
and
engineering
manager,
and
so
there's
a
lot
of
discussion.
Communication
collaboration
happening,
there's
almost
no
design
work
anymore.
B
I
still
like
to
be
involved
as
some
kind
of
feedback
board
and
to
be
able
to
give
the
designers
that
I'm
working
with
direct
feedback
asking
them
also
sometimes
tougher
questions,
but
I
usually
don't
go
into
any
issues
anymore
and
just
design
from
scratch.
Something
that's
definitely
a
change
for
me.
A
And
how
do
you
get?
I
mean
I
understand,
there's
a
lot
of
outlets
right,
there's
a
lot
of
opportunities
to
get
knowledge
and
to
get
to
get
a
disunderstanding
of
what's
going
on
in
create,
but
since
you're
no
longer
designing
right
so
you're
not
on
the
day-to-day,
not
hands-on,
prototyping
and
working
on
issues.
How
do
you
get
the
context,
for
example,
of
what
the
so
many
different
categories
in
create
are
looking
like
or
what
the
vision
is
etc
in
terms
of
alignment
with
the
team?
A
B
There's
the
kickoff
videos
that
you
can
watch
to
look
at
what
has
been
scheduled,
but
each
team
also
talks
about
what
are
they
planning
on
working
in
sephora
issues?
Most
often,
that's
also
something
that
comes
up
in
my
discussions
with
the
pm,
where
we're
talking
about
hey.
What's
your
plan
for
the
next
one,
two
three
milestones
and
then
also
asking?
Is
that
already
reflected
in
the
category
direction
page?
I
also
use
these
quite
a
lot
to
make
sure
I'm
on
the
same
board
as
the
product
manager
and
as
the
designer
to
understand.
B
Where
is
the
entire
category
moving
towards
to
and
what
problems
are
we
solving
and
is
that
maybe
a
problem,
that's
related
to
another
team?
Do
we
need
to
pull
them
in
already?
Are
we
that
far
away
from
it,
and
so
there's
really
a
ton
of
ways
and
you
kind
of
have
to
be
aware
of
all
of
them
and
have
to
jump
into
them?
But
it's
not
that
you
have
to
read
every
single
notification
that
would
be
too
much.
A
Staying
connected
and
stay
on
top
of
the
high
level
conversation,
it's
a
it's
a
really
important
right
aspect
of
your
role,
and
I
hear
a
lot
of
designers
talking
about
cross-stage
collaboration
right,
so
going
a
bit
over
the
the
bubble
of
your
own
stage
group
how,
as
the
product
design
manager,
can
you
facilitate
or
be
involved
in
this
type
of
conversations?
This
is
something
that
is
part
of
your
scope
of
responsibilities.
B
And
so
that's
there's
a
lot
of
aspects
that
are
very
similar
to
just
staying
on
track
with
your
own
team?
How
to
do
this?
You
have
to
be
aware
of
what
group
conversations
are
going
on.
You
have
to
watch
kickoff
videos
and
so
bring
these
topics
up
with
your
own
designers,
see
if
they
have
already
talked
with
the
other
designers.
Look
at
the
ux
showcases.
All
of
this
is
really
so
important
for
staying
on
track
and
then
constantly
making
the
other
people
aware
like
this
is
an
effort
that's
going
on
in
this
team.
B
A
A
So,
but
I
still
want
to
cover
a
couple
of
topics
I
wanted
to
I'm
curious
to
understand,
not
to
understand,
but
we
know
that
leadership
development
like
self-development.
It's
not
about
your
title
right.
You
can
exercise
leadership,
you
can
be
an
expert
or
a
reference
inside
a
gitlab
without
transitioning
to
a
different
role
or
without
a
promotion.
That's
that's
clear,
but
I'd
like
to
hear
from
you.
You
talked
about
okrs
right
and
I
remember
the
ui
polish,
the
all
the
these
high
level
opportunities.
A
I
know
how
high
level
as
in
global
opportunities
that
happen
to
you,
that
you
were
involved
as
a
individual
contributor,
but
knowing
that
leadership
doesn't
come
only
with
the
title.
What
internal
and
external
learning
developments
did
you
seek?
What
opportunities
did
you
find
when
you
were
a
senior
product
designer
that
helped
influence
your
career
that
helped
you
yeah
get
to
where
you
are
today.
B
External
material,
that's
a
very
interesting
question:
I'm
I'm
trying
to
stay
on
top
of
what's
happening
inside
the
design
scene,
mainly
via
twitter,
and
using
that,
as
kind
of
like
a
board
to
jump
out
into
different
other
topics.
I
have
set
up
my
twitter
timeline
in
a
way
that
I'm
following
a
lot
of
product
and
design
leaders,
so
that
whenever
they
talk
about
something
I
kind
of
see
it,
I
can
jump
out
to
different
topics.
I
can
jump
over
to
different
channels.
B
B
Oh
absolutely
so
many
I
I
think
our
current
initiative
around
really
focusing
on
accessibility
is
amazing.
That's
something
where
I
have
some
knowledge,
but
definitely
not
enough,
and
I
think
there
can
almost
never
be
enough
knowledge
about
accessibility,
because
the
people
who
we
care
for
around
accessibility
are
really
the
ones
that
are
already
the
most
vulnerable
and
caring
more
for
these
users
is
gonna,
be
it's
gonna
be
making
an
amazing
impact
on
their
lives.
B
B
It
might
even
be
more
tough,
very
interesting
combination,
and
I
don't
yet
know
enough
myself
about
how
to
be
a
good
tech
writer
that
I
can
really
talk
deeply
with
them
most
of
my
topics
and
my
understanding
really
only
scratch
the
surface,
and
so
I
want
to
learn
more
about
this
area
so
that
I
can
collaborate
with
them
better,
but
then
also
looking
at
larger
structures
like
how
do
we
set
up
an
entire
design
team?
That's
not
only
a
people,
as
I
did
in
my
previous
company,
but
that's
like
50
100
200.
B
A
That's
awesome,
and
now
do
you
see
any
like
giving
the
whole
company
organization
structure
today?
What
opportunity
opportunities
you
see?
Do
you
see
they
are
in
place
today
that
can
enable
empower
you
to
pursue
yeah
learning
more
about
tech
writing
being
able
to
grow
the
design
team?
Do
you
have
any
thoughts
on
that.
B
Yeah
for
sure,
that's
really
where
our
transparency
and
our
openness
is
so
amazing,
because
in
another
company
I
might
have
to
go
to
another
building
to
meet
the
tag
writers
here
when,
for
example,
amy
just
joined
our
create
team.
Very
recently,
I
took
that
as
a
chance
to
set
up
a
weekly
bi-weekly
one-on-one
with
her
to
not
only
make
sure
she's
onboarding
into
the
create
team
well,
but
also
to
use
as
time
for
me
to
better
understand
how
does
she
approach
her
work?
B
A
I
think
that's
the
beauty
of
this
organization,
you
get
access
to
everything
and
everyone
can
contribute.
You
just
have
to
choose.
Where
do
you?
Where
do
you
want
to
focus
your
impact
right?
But
what
are
the
most
useful
about
them?
Oh
we're
at
time,
but
I
would
like
to
thank
you
marcel.
I
really
it
was
really
nice
and
getting
to
know
you
a
little
bit
better
and
talking
about
the
leadership
and
your
career.
So
thanks
for
making
the
time
to
have
this
conversation
with
me
today,.