Groton Municipal Television, CT Groton Historic District, 21 Sep 2021

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From YouTube: Groton Historic District Commission 9/21/21

Description

Groton, Connecticut municipal meeting: Historic District Commission September 21, 2021. Click on the link below to view the agenda.

https://www.agendasuite.org/iip/groton/file/getfile/57010

A

That's 701: this is the meeting of the historic district commission will take place in webinar format through zoom. The chair of the commission is sarah moriarity. The host of the webinar is typically the building official. He is in a seminar I am tom zanerini, the code enforcement officer and planner and linda galletta is in attendance as well.

A

Anyone speaking should state their name prior to speaking each time. The panelists in this webinar meeting will be the commission members and building staff.

A

Panelists who would like to comment on an item should indicate such by using the icon to raise hand at the bottom of the screen after the panelists raised their hand, they'll be able to comment one at a time when called upon by the chairperson panelists should mute their microphones until called upon panelists calling into the meeting by telephone may raise and.

B

A

Their hand by pressing star nine to mute or unmoot your call press star six to make a motion or second emotion. Commission members can raise a hand and be acknowledged by the host or chair to vote on a motion. Commission members will be called upon individually by the chair to vote. The public can participate in the meeting during the public communications agenda item.

A

The public will be asked to raise their hand during public communications if they want to speak at this time and by using the icon to raise hand at the bottom of the screen. And, lastly, the public will be called upon by the house by the host one at a time to be able to speak during this time. Attendees must identify themselves before speaking.

C

Thanks tom, so I will call this meeting to order on september 21st it's 703 and I will see uh goodrich for brady and leonard for nalt and um don. Do you want to read the call.

D

If somebody can put it up.

C

Tom can you I can read it if, because I have it on the side, if you can't pull the call up.

A

uh Okay yeah, I had it ready.

B

I'm not sure if you need to re-read the call, because it's a continued hearing.

C

It is oh, I wasn't here last time, so I guess I didn't realize that um so robert nelson is a continued hearing.

C

Yeah! Okay, then I know I don't think that we need to read the call um because it wouldn't have been republished, so there is no call so then I guess we will open public hearings with htc 21-46-28 wire street robert nelson, who I don't see unless he's in the audience and hasn't been promoted.

C

Tom, do you see anybody in the audience have more visibility than me, yeah.

A

Okay should be coming over.

C

C

C

Mr nelson, if you can hear me you're, muted.

E

I can I can hear you, can you hear me.

C

We can hear you so, oh.

E

C

So we just opened your public hearing and- and the presentation is yours to make.

E

Technical difficulties, yes, okay, so from the last meeting um there was some information that was requested by tom and a few of the other members. I have submitted that information. I hope it's in your packet um there's some detailed construction details um showing the details and the structural part of the the new porch, um also the before and after site plan, and there are some sketches showing yeah.

C

Mr nelson, if I can interrupt you, I wasn't at the last meeting. So if you can just tell me what you're looking to do.

E

Okay, so we're looking if you, uh if you stop right there, uh there's some better sketches. That was my sketch, but I I have a better one. I included today. I don't know if it's in the packet, uh it's a it's an enclosed porch on the end of the house, where there's a door at the moment.

E

Yeah I see. Maybe it should be a much better uh sketch yeah. If you go up there a little bit.

E

Okay, that's that's the back view and if you go a little more, that would be the okay right there right there that sketch. So you can see right. That would be the end of the house facing the driveway.

E

uh So that's an enclosed porch! You come out onto a little porch uh with stairs going down uh north and south front and back and the roof line matches the same existing roof line of the front porch, as you can see that to the right, so we're just matching the same: roof line, the same the same house, material, the clapboards trim, color and so forth. There'll be a door with a window in it and um that's that's pretty much it.

E

It's an eight by eight enclosed, porch kind of creating a mud room which we don't have entering the house there um and, like I said that I didn't have all this at the last meeting and better in great detail.

E

Also the I included a site plan you can see it doesn't really take much of the of the site and the materials. I think you know tom asked for that. So that's that's listed on there too. um The elevations 11 feet, which is identical to the front. Porch and again the siding will still be cedar. Clapboard painted the same as the house color and the trim will be the color the same as the house existing. Now that's pretty much it um and you've got photograph there showing the the house. So that's the side.

E

Porch will match the front porch.

C

So you're you're calling it a porsche, but it's not really a porch right. It's more of a breezeway.

E

It's it's really an enclosed porch yeah, exactly it's enclosed, totally enclosed.

E

And it'll look just like that front. Porch picture except it's enclosed.

C

When you say enclosed, you mean it's got, walls and a door like it's.

E

That's right right, there'll, be a door. Yep you'll be a door with a window uh just like yep right there. So there's your door on the end with a window and then solid walls, correct.

C

You're not using the existing door that has the three by three.

E

The existing door will stay where it is. Oh.

C

Because it'll be.

E

It comes like an air lock. I guess you could say you know yeah.

E

Yeah and then there'll be just a small porch. When you come out the door, then you can, you can go left or right. You know up or down like that.

B

E

That's pretty much it it'll. The trim will match the house, the color everything else. So just it'll blend right in yeah.

C

Peter, can you go back to the first picture that he kind of fan drew.

C

I'm sorry tom sorry have it.

A

E

I forget that one that was my original sketch in this, but.

C

That's kind of what it's going to look like right like it's well,.

E

Kind of yeah yeah, it's not in good proportion, but yes, that's kind of like it yeah the.

C

Lattice work underneath and then the ring.

E

Yes, let us work underneath underneath the which the existing porch has now too also so.

C

And the door that we're looking at.

E

C

Isn't the door you're going to be using it's going to be a glass door.

E

Yeah be a new door with a window and the door. That's in the house now will stay right where it is so. You have a like, I said, like an air lock. Basically.

C

Will the new door be one piece of glass or a three by three three or three.

E

It'll be uh um kind of like a three by three. I think yeah yeah. It doesn't show it there, but yes, it'll be just like the existing door.

D

Is the door to one side or the other or the door in the middle of the.

E

Door is only in the middle only in the middle right.

C

And the sides of the.

E

C

D

Would have windows no they'll be solid.

E

Yeah yeah there's really no need for windows in there.

B

This is a pretty new house right. When was this house built.

E

B

E

Well, the original original house was 1830, but it was all redone in 19 and 2013 by john aruda.

E

You probably know who he is so yeah, no.

B

Yeah, so you could probably get this the same exact material, then.

E

Oh yeah, it will be, it will be exactly the same. It's a you know: clapboard cedar, clapboards, the trim, everything yeah.

D

Do you do you have a picture of the porch on the other side.

E

uh What what other side you mean.

D

The other side of the house is.

E

C

Do you mean the front porch done, there's.

E

Only the front porch that you saw on the picture, there's no nothing. On the other end.

D

Okay, all right yeah.

E

Just that front porch and then there'll be the new one. On the on the end.

D

E

E

B

E

Back of the house has a you know: a small deck in it.

C

And tom, though the um I'm sorry, the math that showed the dimensions.

A

Let me go to it.

C

Do we know so that's with the stairs.

E

That's correct.

C

Okay and then the height is just.

E

uh 11 feet just exactly the same as the front porch.

C

Okay, and is that somewhere.

E

Roof line will match exactly yeah.

C

Okay, the height of 11, feet referenced in here somewhere.

E

Yes, it is it's on uh that one sketch upper right hand, corner yeah. If you look at the uh proposed sketch, it says: 11 elevation, 11 feet, identical to front porch.

B

E

There you go yeah.

C

All right, so I, and if my fellow commission members can correct me if I'm wrong, the only thing that I think is missing is saying that the exterior door will be exactly the same as the door. That's presently on the house.

C

Everything else seems to be here.

E

Yeah, if you look at that that picture yeah right there, so the exterior door will be identical to that one. You see there now, which is uh you know. I think it's a three by three three over three: uh it's painted blue, just like the other, the front door, yeah it'll be yeah.

C

um Tom, can you go back to that, drawing you were at where it listed the um height and materials? I just wanted to see what it said in relation to them.

C

So I think that we would want to reference.

C

That the railings will match the front of the house.

E

They yes they're, going to match exactly the front of the house, the same kind of railing everything will match yeah and the little trellis work underneath the porch will match the front. Porch. Also.

B

E

Yeah that little crosshatch uh woodwork there yeah yeah, the rest of the foundation, is all granite.

B

C

Am I missing anything.

C

No all right um do any of the question. Members have any additional questions or comments for the applicant.

C

No all right, thank you, mr nelson.

E

Thank you very much appreciate it.

C

So I will close htc.

C

uh 21-46, thank you um and move to consideration of public hearings for htc 21-46-28 water street. The application for the addition of the fully enclosed, porch or breezeway. Does anyone have any comments or motions.

D

A move to approve.

F

I'll second, it.

C

So I have one comment: I just want to make the application because we're, I think we need to be a little more nitpicky about materials and our approvals that you know the motion contained at the door. The trellis and the railings match the existing front porch and the existing door.

C

Because that wasn't in the application so we'll have to write that in.

C

Any questions on that fine, yeah, okay, all right uh all in favor I'll, do uh rule call uh goodrich aye moriarty, I leonard hi goodman aye, levinson aye. The application is approved all right. There are no other public hearings. Are there any pre-application hearings? Tonight we don't see anything excellent um public communications.

C

I don't believe there are any.

C

um Approval of the minutes from september 7th 2021 I'll move.

F

D

C

All in favor goodrich, hi moriarty, I leonard hi goodman hi levinson aye minutes are approved old business, 54 west main street.

C

I don't know where we are with this, but this was one of the applications that I was alluding to and then I think that maybe being a little bit more nitpicky on some of these approvals might be in our best interest.

C

F

Sorry just a comment. I agree with you on that, but they didn't the stuff. Wasn't the application they just didn't follow it.

C

I know, but I feel like you know like I went back and looked at the railings in in the application and there just wasn't a lot of detail and.

C

It probably should have been so.

F

um I suppose, but I mean there was a there- was a full detail: those railings on.

F

I just closed out of it, but on one of the pages with the heights and the everything about it,.

F

All right now, I agree with what you're saying it's just.

C

You know it, it says outdoor seating fence, detail and then it gives the dimensions, but I don't see on here- or I maybe it's too small and I've missed it, but I don't see where it says, wrought iron, which is something I would have liked to have seen.

F

That I agree with the particular concern on the rail or the fencing. There is the height.

F

um You know it's, it's like a foot and a half tall or two feet tall and I think the one on the drawing was like three feet. Yeah he's got a there's, a liquor. Commission violation there, but that's not us.

C

There is, and then you know, I would make an argument that those posts that he put up to attach the sails are fixed and would have needed our approval. They are not temporary structures.

F

um Sales are fixed to the building as well too.

C

So tom, I know you've been working with them a little bit. Has there been any feedback.

A

um The sales are new, of course, they've been new, they're not approved, and they will be part of an enforcement action to get them.

B

A

Either in front of you or taken down.

C

Okay, and were you able to write him about the lights.

A

um I have not yet uh we were working on the other uh pearl street, um but yes, we're going to address that. I think scott was going to help me with that from the building department sense, but yeah okay, so you guys both the light and the the sails at once.

C

D

There's also the speakers and, and the sign is complete, did we ever approve the actual lettering? That's up there.

C

No, which lettering of the white sign.

D

C

F

No, the sign details.

D

And and just as an aside, I don't know if people realize that he also has live music now.

F

Again, that's a liquor. Commission thing I mean he'll, someone will report him, I'm sure, based upon.

C

Has a very low decibel threshold like talking is in violation of their noise. um It's.

F

Not no, I don't think don's talking about a noise issue. I think the pieces when you apply for the liquor permit. They ask you if you want to choose, no live music, non-amplified live music or amplified live music.

C

He may have applied for it.

F

C

F

Well, only because I, when we he was doing his at the same time that we were doing ours for blocking bottles. So I was paying a lot of attention to the signs out of curiosity because I've never done a liquor permit before.

F

So I noticed that no one him chelsea from abbott's or us ever it says no live music on it period. So I looked into it and I asked bill sweeney again just out of curiosity um and you have to make that choice and you can't do it so right, but again it's it's! Not our problem.

C

No, and what I was saying is the noise ordinance and groton's threshold is so low that you know it's not going to take much other than a neighbor complaint to shut that down. But that's not us um and when I look through this application, I don't see the sign detail. I see a sign, but no.

C

No lettering or what we would normally see and I'm pretty sure this is everything that he submitted.

C

So would would it help tom if I sent you an email of our grapes, sure, okay, in addition to, I think I sent you one or two already, but I can make it a little bit more articulate and organized.

A

Yeah, that would be good for records yep.

C

Okay, all right! So as a group, we have the freestanding exterior, sign the sails and the posts.

C

The railing the lights on the attached side to the building don you mentioned the speakers.

F

A minor technical thing is those uh railings are supposed to return to the stairs. They don't do they're just wide open, failing.

C

D

Aren't the plants in violation too stairs.

C

That, unfortunately, that's not our okay, it's in violation of their zoning application. They were supposed to have arborvities.

A

Yeah they posted a bond for the uh for the landscaping, so we should have their money.

B

C

And then I think I started to and then got sidetracked to pull the minutes for one of these applications to see if they actually said that the railings were going to be wrought iron other than just you know, depicting them so I'll finish. That.

D

I just have a question for tom: the enforcement action is that, based on the non-compliance with our approval, or is that a separate matter.

A

No that's based on historic districts,.

D

F

Right well, but the sign the sign violates the zoning rules regarding neon signs. If that's what you're going to call what you're going to call it, I'm talking about the main brew pub sign.

F

You have a prohibition against you: have a prohibition against neon signs or backlit signs.

D

F

That's in the zoning code.

A

Right yeah there's none in mystic yeah right.

F

No there's none of the town in general and there's pretty specific with regarding to how the sign's supposed to be lit.

C

Other than what I've said are there any other concerns that we have that you'd like me to send in an email to tom.

F

Just to ensure that, like the trash and the ramp and stuff in the back were taken care of, I think they were, but.

F

That was part of the original approval.

B

D

Not just the landscaping, I know we don't generally have jurisdiction, but was that part of our approval too? As far as foundation, planting and the front planting.

C

It was on a site plan, but I don't think that we have any jurisdiction over it, whether he does it or not.

C

Unfortunately,.

C

Normally, I don't want to be overreaching, but um okay well I'll, send that to tom tomorrow and it'll be in his capable hands. um Where are we uh any other old business.

C

No uh new business, we have our 2022 commission meeting schedule.

C

One meeting in july, one meeting in august.

F

C

Summer, right I'll take it, it looks fine to me. Anyone have any concerns or comments.

D

D

That november, it's not an election day. Is it.

C

November 1.

C

D

You know- maybe it's the first tuesday after the first monday, which wouldn't be the first here, but I'm not sure.

C

No november 8th election day.

D

C

So says: wikipedia: um okay! Well, then I'll move to approve the uh 2022 meeting schedule. Second, all in favor, good, rich aye moriarty, I leonard goodman levinson. All right schedule is approved.

C

If there's any not anything else, I will move to a churn all right all right. We are adjourned. Thank you. Everybody.

D

Thank you thanks. Thanks.