►
Description
A recording of the Hyperledger Trade Finance Special Interest Group on April 27, 2021. On how the UN CITRAL Model Law on Electronic transferable Records is impacting Trade Finance and its digitisation. Mr Luca Castellani from UN CITRAL, and Kay Ren Yuh, senior project manager of Singapore IMDA, drove us through the a very informative outlook on the adoption of MLETR and the implementation of the project called Singapore Trade Trust with some very interesting hints on the future development of the project itself. An excellent starting point for digitisation of Trade Finance and Open Source Enterprise Blockchain solutions.
More about the Trade Finance Special Interest Group is at: https://wiki.hyperledger.org/display/TFSIG/
----
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A
A
Linux
foundation
meetings
involve
participation
by
industry
competitors
and
it's
the
intention
of
the
linux
foundation
to
conduct
all
of
its
activities
in
accordance
with
applicable
and
trust
and
competition
laws.
It
is
therefore
extremely
important
that
indeed
adhere
to
missing
agendas
and
be
aware
of
and
not
participate
in
any
activities
that
are
prohibited
under
applicable,
u.s,
state,
federal
or
foreign
and
trust
and
competition
laws,
examples
of
types
of
actions
that
are
prohibited
at
linux,
foundation,
missions
and
in
connection
with
linux
foundation
activities
are
described
in
linux
foundation
and
trust
policy.
A
A
A
So
welcome
everybody
to
this
this
new
missing.
Today
we
have
two
new
guests
and
I'm
honored
to
to
have
them
both
here
we
are
joined
today
by
mrs
luca
castellani
from
monster,
and
we
also
have
kate,
I
think,
both
of
them.
You
know
for
joining
us
thankful
for
for
giving
us
their
time.
I
would
like
to
start
first
from
luca
and
would
love
to
hand
it
over
to
him
to
to
have
speak
part
of
the
speech.
B
Thank
you.
Thank
you,
andrea,
and
many
thanks
to
you
for
organizing
with
many
thanks
to
kay
for
joining.
Here
we
have
a
very
close
cooperation
with
the
singapore's
imda.
So
it's
a
pleasure
to
to
have
with
a
conversation
I
prepared
a
set
of
slides.
I
will
do
my
best
to
try
to
share
them
now,
despite
one
year
plus
of
of
this
current
situation
that
we're
doing
still
what
the
best
we
can
cope
with.
My
name
is
luca
castellani.
B
A
B
You
so
I
will.
I
will
try
to
keep
with
this
introduction
as
short
as
possible,
because
I
believe
that
we
are
all
here
in
in
informal
meeting
that,
but
it's
made
of
I
I
saw
many
names
of
distinguished
experts
in
this
field,
so
I
would,
I
would
prefer
to
have
an
open
conversation
about
the
issues
when
to
have
like
a
one-way
illustration
of
what
what
is
going
on,
but
first
of
all,
just
to
be
on
the
same
page.
Uncitral
is
the
united
nations
commission
on
international
trade
law.
B
B
Its
main
task
is
to
prepare
legislative
tax
but
promote
the
harmonization
of
commercial
law,
especially
international
business
transactions
law,
and
I
would
say
also
now
modernization
in
the
beginning
that
the
mandate
was
more
about
harmonizing
existing
treaties.
But
now,
in
many
cases
uncetra
is
trying
to
set
bigger
standards
for
new
issues.
B
Three
are
model
laws,
which
is
to
say
they
have
they
work
as
a
source
of
inspiration
for
national
legislators,
and
so
we
encourage
the
national
legislator
to
to
take
these
mother
lodes
to
and
to
to
to
use
them
as
closely
as
possible
to
the
original
model,
because
that,
of
course
does
help
to
keep
uniformity,
but
it's
of
course,
always
possible
to
make
some
variations
and
sometimes
with
models,
but
our
choices
that
help
to
make
make
it
fit
better.
The
legal
tradition
of
that
jurisdiction.
B
There
is
also
one
treaty
from
2005
the
united
nations
convention
on
the
use
of
electronic
communications
and
international
contracts.
What
is
important
here,
the
main
takeaway,
is
that
all
together,
these
four
taxes
have
been
enacted
in
about
100
states.
So
we
are
talking
about
laws
that
are
already
in
force
in
half
of
the
world.
B
What
is
important
is
that
these
laws,
they
cover
different
aspects.
We
are
complementary,
but
we
are
all
based
on
the
same
fundamental
principles
and
this
does
open
the
door
to
broader
adoption
of
the
newborn,
which
is
the
modal
law
and
electronic
transfer
records.
Now
already
at
three
getting
full.
B
B
It
is
the
the
the
keystone
of
of
the
new
vision
that
implements
concept
of
data
pipeline
in
paperless
trade.
It
is
also
compatible.
All
artifacts
are
technology
neutral,
but
this
one
it
addresses
specifically
its
implementation
with
the
distributed
ledgers
in
the
explanatory
node.
You
can
get
this
book
letter
in
electronic
form.
The
text
of
the
model
and
explanatory
notes
in
all
six
languages
of
the
united
nations
on
the
answer
website
and
citral.un.org.
B
What
the
the
common
element
of
all
of
these
documents
is
the
fact
that
the
the
they
circulate
with
with
the
delivery
or
with
the
delivery
and
endorsement,
which
means
that,
in
the
business
practice,
there
is
an
assumption
that
they
exist
on
paper
they
can
be
possessed.
Possession
requires
a
tangible
object,
so.
B
In
particular,
uncetera
has
worked
on
the
issue
of
electronic
visual
planning
with
electronic
bits
of
lighting
have
been
something
that
has
has
been
has
been
pursued
for
some
time
already.
Uncertainty
is
working
also
on
substantive
maritime
law
issues,
so
you
will
see
some
elements
in
the
rules
which
is
a
treaty
from
1978,
but
deals
with
the
the
rights
and
obligations
of
the
parties
to
a
contract
of
carriage
of
goods
by
sea.
B
This
is
actually
a
medium
neutral
treaty,
so
bills
of
lighting
under
the
rotaram
rules
may
be
issued
equally
on
electronic
or
or
paper
support,
but
the
rotaram
rules
have
not
yet
entered
into
force.
There
are
five
states
parties
and
it
needs
20
states
parties
to
come
into
force,
so
this
regime
is
not
yet
there
and
in
in
2011,
when
we
started
working
on
the
model
on
electron
transfer,
records,
mltr
or
also
melitta.
B
We
we
looked
around
for
existing
laws
and
in
some
cases
we
for
we,
we
found
that
with
those
they
demanded
the
use
of
a
specific
technology
somewhere
based
on
registries
and
the
pki,
they
were
specific
to
one
type
of
transferable
document
or
instrument,
so,
for
instance,
one
registry
for
promissory
notes,
and
in
some
cases
they
also
created
a
special
type
of
electronic
transfer
record.
What
does
it
mean?
It
means
that
they
said
this
is
an
electronic
promissory
note,
but
it's
not
the
equivalent
of
the
paper
promissory
note.
B
B
B
When
it
comes
to
the
mltr,
the
fundamental
issues
are.
First
of
all,
this
is
not
a
regulation,
so
some
some
people.
They
think
that
you
know
we
deal
with
the
regulatory
matters
we
don't.
This
is
purely
enabling
it
aims
at
removing
legal
obstacles
to
a
specific
problem,
which
is
the
use
of
in
electronic
form
of
these
transferable
documents
and
instruments.
B
This
is
particularly
convenient
when
there
is
a
conversion
between
electronic
and
paper.
It's
rare
that
there
is
the
other
change
of
medium
between,
but
usually
it's
because
someone
does
does
not
or
cannot
use,
electronics
or
requires
the
change
of
medium
to
vape,
but
there
is
no
change
in
applicable
loans.
That's
particularly
convenient.
B
Another.
Very
good
outcome.
Is
that,
of
course,
because
the
substantial
applies
all
the
interaction
with
third
parties,
including
the
user's
collateral,
remains
just
the
same
as
if
it
were
on
paper.
Then,
of
course,
there
is
the
additional
dimension,
which
is
the
inclusion
of
dynamic
information
metadata,
especially
data
originating
from
oracles
smart
contracts.
B
B
Of
course,
it's
possible
to
add
additional
safeguards,
for
instance
by
using
oracles,
so
that
it
is
possible
to
link
directly
the
cargo
and
the
bill
of
lading.
For
instance,
technology
gives
us
the
possibility
to
do
this.
This
is
something
we
cannot
do
on
paper.
It's
just
a
matter
of
implementation,
as
I
always
say
when
it
comes
to
electronic
matters.
B
B
That
means
all
the
in
information
regarding
what
happens
to
the
transfer
record
after
issuance
has
to
be
recorded,
regardless
of
its
legal
significance.
That's
why
the
use
of
blockchain
and
dlt
may
be
advisable
because
we
know
in
that
environment
it
is
more
difficult
to
reverse
changes
to
electronic
records.
Everything
should
be
recorded.
Probably,
of
course
this
doesn't
mean
that
it's
not
possible
to
reverse
the
legal
effect.
B
This
is
possible
also
electronically,
so
the
there
may
be
different
issues
here.
Identification
for
kyc
has
to
be
carried
out.
Of
course,
to
comply
with
this
type
of
rules,
but
at
the
same
time,
this
does
not
affect
the
ability
to
limit
commercial
consequences
by
circulation
to
better
or
anonymously.
B
B
So
the
idea
here
is
to
put
all
these
information
in
a
single
electron
transfer
record
and
then,
of
course,
we
will
share
with
information
with
all
business
partners
to
the
extent
that,
of
course,
it
is
relevant
for
that
business
partner
to
understand
that
we
can
do
so
now.
This
is
the
implementation
of
the
data
pipeline
concept,
and
the
huge
advantage
of
these
is
that
that
single
electronic
record,
which
is
also
transferable,
of
course,
if
we
want
to
to
have
it
transferable-
has
the
best
data
quality.
B
B
So
why
enacting
the
mletr
reduction
of
compliance
costs
better
governance,
less
errors,
less
less,
also
inconsistencies
across
documents.
I
would
say
very
important:
it
can
give
significant
additional
safeguards
against
fraud.
If
it
is
well
designed
and
implemented,
it
is
meant
to
operate
across
borders.
It
has
specific
provisions,
so
it
does
help
international
trade.
B
And
it's
a
good
illustration:
if
we
go
generally
on
paper
straight,
we
know
that
paperless
operations,
minimize
personal
interaction,
which
means,
of
course,
less
less
risk
for
the
individuals,
because
there
is
less
exposure
but
at
the
same
time
also
less
risk
for
the
business
process,
because
we
have
less
human,
physical,
human
input
very
important
for
certain
goods
like
now
vaccines.
Of
course,
if
it's
implemented
a
blockchain,
it
would
be
possible
to
give
certain
high
standards
of
origin
traceability,
which
has
been
looked
into
seriously
by
by
several
players.
B
B
It
is
in
bills
that
have
been
introduced
in
parliament
in
a
couple
of
more
countries,
and
we
do
expect
a
few
more
enactments
with
the
year.
Of
course,
the
big
discussion
about
which
is
going
on
in
the
uk
and
is
promoted
by
icc
uk,
but
there's
also
a
significant
engagement
of
the
commission
of
england
and
wales,
and
this
so
you
may
find
quite
a
bit
of
information
there.
B
A
Thank
you
so
much
luka.
It
was
really
really
interesting
presentation,
lots
of
insights.
You
know
that
I
would
like
to
keep
for
the
question
and
answer
time
for
debate.
As
you
said,
you
were
right.
Let's
give
an
interactive
feel
to
the
whole
meeting,
so
I
will
hand
it
over
to
2k
loving,
to
step
in
and
to
present.
A
C
C
Now,
in
addition
to
our
regulatory
role,
imd
is
also
responsible
for
driving
singapore's
digital
transformation
through
the
use
of
ict
technologies.
We
work
closely
with
organizations
in
industries
such
as
trade,
logistics,
transportation
and
trade
finance
to
promote
the
adoption
of
ict
technologies
in
order
to
enhance
our
company's
competitiveness
in
the
global.
C
C
C
This
medium
is,
of
course,
inefficient
and
in
an
often
cited
analysis
by
maersk
and
ibm,
this
cost
can
be
as
much
as
20
of
the
cost
of
actually
transporting
the
actual
cargo
and,
furthermore,
silo
systems
are
rife
in
the
trade
ecosystem,
and
these
cyber
systems
are
not
interoperable
and
conventionally
extremely
costly
to
make
them.
So
this
was
a
point
that
was
also
brought
up
by
luca
just
now.
C
C
C
So
what
is
the
end
vision
that
we
are
driving
towards
right
to
solve
all
these
problems?
What
do
we
need
to
do
so?
We
need
to
effectively
digitize
two
categories
of
documents
that
are
used
in
international
trade,
so
normal
documents.
Well,
those
are
the
ones
that
are
just
used
to
convey
information
not
too
particularly
difficult
to
digitize,
but
it's,
but
we
don't
just
stop
there
at
you
know
just
digitalizing
it
right.
We
don't
just
stop
there.
C
We
use
technology
to
assure
all
the
trade
players
that
no
matter
how
they
obtained
a
document,
regardless
how
many
hands
it
had
passed
through
before
that
it
hadn't
been
tampered
with
since
it
was
created
right.
So
that's
authenticity
now,
of
course,
trick.
Players
also
need
to
be
assured,
as
you
heard,
luca
talked
about
the
need
for
identity
about
knowing
right
who
players
also
need
to
be
assured
of
who
really
created
that
document
as
well,
so
that's
source.
C
C
C
C
On
electronic
commerce
and
electronic
signatures,
which
I
think
we
can
thank
to
be
able
to
shop
on
the
internet
today,
so
if
you
now
look
at
the
other
track,
the
second
track
of
standards
development,
this
deals
with
the
creation
and
enhancement
of
technical
and
process
standards
at
international
bodies
such
as
uncfact,
that's,
the
united
nations
center
for
e-business
and
trade
facilitation
and
the
international
standards
organization.
Iso,
where
we
do
all
this
in
collaboration
with
experts
from
all
over
the
world,
and
these
are
then
baked
into
the
trade
trust
software
components
track.
C
And
number
four:
these
are
this
software
components
right.
These
are
designed:
okay
number
one.
These
are
released
on
open
source
licensing
terms
and
they
are
designed
to
be
able
to
be
easily
integrated
into
back-end
solutions
and
deploy
on
the
the
different
trade
players
existing
id
infrastructure
so
that
they
can
extend
interoperability
beyond
their
own
digital
community,
their
own
digital
work,
garden.
C
The
application
layer
is
where
systems
and
platform
providers
continue
to
thrive
by
providing
value
to
their
users.
This
is
one
reason
why
we
try
to
emphasize
trade.
Trust
is
not
a
platform
now,
of
course,
we
do
have
a
website,
and
you
know
things
that
you
can.
You
know
in
a
way
look
at,
but
in
its
purest
form.
C
C
C
Now,
what
would
be
of
extreme
interest
to
this
community,
I
think,
is
other
trade
trust
design
principles
now,
because
it
is
offered
to
the
world
as
a
public
good
right.
It
currently
uses
public
ethereum,
which
is
a
public
and
permissionless
blockchain,
so
as
to
ensure
that
no
one
party
has
undue
influence
over
the
rest.
C
This
is
particularly
relevant
if
you
were
talking
about
trying
to
connect
governments
to
this
blockchain
via
the
system.
Via
this
framework,
you
know
how
sovereign
nations
can
get.
So
if
you
now
look
at
the
second
bubble,
sorry,
the
second
principle
data
is
not
kept
on
the
blockchain
so
that
data
confidentiality,
commercial
confidentiality,
is
preserved.
C
So
again,
this
is
another
view
trying
to
reinforce
the
message
that
it
is
not
a
platform.
It
is
an
approach
to
help
platforms
and
systems
achieve
interoperability
and
mletr
compliant
title
transfer
and
as
the
singapore
government
right
it
is
not
our
pl.
It
is
not
our
intent
nor
ambition
to
compete
with
the
private
sector
or
the
solution
providers
out
there.
C
We
see
our
role
as
one
to
reach
where
the
private
sector
perhaps
find
it
difficult.
So
that's
why
we
have
conversations
at
the
wto
at
un
right
the
various
events
there
right
and,
of
course,
we
offer
the
digital
infra
infrastructure,
the
software
components
as
a
public
good
via
open
source
licensing.
C
Oh
wait.
I
see
a
comment:
oh
oops,
right.
Okay.
So
if
you
look
at
the
paper
transferable
instrument
right,
the
the
title
ownership
and
what
we
call
the
bl
data
right,
that's
all
on
that
medium
right
now,
when
you
digitalize
it,
you
can
actually
split
the
two,
because
we
know
in
a
the
transferable
part
of
the
record,
the
one
that
changes
hands
right.
C
C
C
C
C
However,
he
currently
does
it
right
in
terms
of
sending
electronic
files
to
his
business
partner.
He
can
use
that
same
method,
two
other
people.
So
in
this
figure
you
have
seller
one
and
trader
two
who
happen
to
be
on
a
blockchain
based
platform
for
buyers
and
sellers
who
capture
the
transaction
inside
that
particular
platform.
C
C
C
C
C
C
So
here
for
plain,
vanilla,
business
documents,
you
can
still
use
trade
trust
to
assure
authenticity
and
the
provenance
of
plain
documents,
so,
for
example,
so
here
I'd
like
to
allude
to
a
trial
that
was
conducted
with
australian
border
force
and
on
certificates
of
origin
between
australia
and
singapore,
where
they
used
the
traditional
framework
to
run
this
trial,
with
very,
very
good
feedback
from
the
private
sector.
Participants
as
well
right.
C
So
this
next
to
last
slide
is
really
our.
You
know.
It's
really
a
slide.
To
show
that
you
know
the
amount
of
interest
in
trade.
Digitalization
is
immense
and
we
have
the.
I
guess,
the
pleasure
of
working
with
many
international
organizations,
icc
dsi.
Being
one
of
that-
and
I
see
that
oswald
is
also
part
of
the
meeting,
so
a
shout
out
to
osmo,
but
we
do
have
other
governments
working
with
us
on
this.
C
And,
of
course,
we
you
know
want
to
issue
an
open
call
for
everybody.
Anybody
to
come
and
join
us
on
this
journey
as
well.
If
you
are
a
trade
ecosystem
player
feel
free
to
take
a
look
at
the
links.
There's
lots
of
information
there
and
feel
free
to
reach
out
for
any
further
discussions,
and
really
this
problem
of
digitalizing,
negotiable
documents
or
instruments
is
just
really
not
a
new
one,
but
all
the
efforts
that
have
come
before
right.
C
They,
they
do
so
with
some
sort
of
gating
mechanism,
whether
it's
a
platform-centric
access
or
perhaps
the
registry,
is
a
centralized
one
that
is
subject
to
a
particular
party's
control.
Well,
trade
trust
is
different.
You
can
tell
it's
actually
designed
to
give
its
users
the
freedom
of
choice
of
application
and
still
prevent
lock-in.
C
A
Thank
you
kay.
That
was
such
nice
presentation
thanks
luke
as
well.
It
was
really
really
insightful
one
I
mean
I
would
love
to
to
open.
If
julian
is
fine
with
it,
I
mean
I
would
like
to
give
the
words
the
attendance
today
to
to
to
have
questions
from
their
side
penny
a
lot
first.
To
start
I
mean
with
the
uk.
D
Andrea,
it's
john
taylor
here.
If,
if
it's
permitted,
oh
sorry,
I
can't
hear
you
yeah,
please
go
ahead!
Oh
thank
you
very
much.
Well,
first
of
all,
could
I
just
say
a
very
special
thank
you
to
both
luca
and
kay
for
excellent
presentations,
very
clear
and
congratulations
to
both
of
you
for
your
work
in
this
area.
D
D
D
B
Thank
you.
Thank
you
very
much,
john,
a
very
important
question.
We
don't
provide
that
guidance.
Of
course
there
are
two
ways
of
solving
very
important
problems,
as
it
is
usually
the
case
in
this
field.
There
could
be
you
know.
Traditionally
we
call
it
we
like
to
to
to
to
to
call
it
ex-ante
and
exposed.
B
B
The
the
key
element
there
often
is
the
agreement
of
the
parties
when
the
parties
agree
to
use
a
specific
method
or
a
specific
technical
solution.
They
agree
that
this
is
appropriate
now.
That
approach,
of
course,
is
very
flexible.
It's
very
technology
neutral,
but
has
the
disadvantage
of
not
helping
predictability
and
therefore
we
often
see
it
complemented
by
the
possibility
of
having
some
providers
who
are
recognized
by
a
national
authority
as
reliable
in
bahrain.
B
B
I
can
call
it
accreditation
system
if
that
makes
sense
or
a
recognition
or
designation
system
and
obviously
those
who
use
that
that
channel
they
benefit
from
certain
presumptions
and,
of
course,
that
means
that
there
is
a
reversal
of
the
burden
of
proof
on
the
reliability
of
the
method,
which
is
very
convenient.
It's
always
possible
to
prove
that
the
method
is
not
reliable,
but
but
of
course,
in
practical
terms,
that
makes
a
lot
of
difference.
E
Now
I
am,
I
wrote
a
paper
on
an
ethereum
build
lading
and
the
the
letter
a
little
while
ago,
and
I
yeah
it's
a
very
important
legal
text
and
there's
a
lot
happening
around
it,
but
also
because
of
it
so
definitely
a
very,
very
important
one.
I
also
think
it's
very
interesting
and
very
cool
to
see
people
using
the
public
blockchains
as
a
way
of
establishing
consensus
and
also
precisely
ethereum,
also
because
there's
a
lot
happening
in
the
space
with
the
ethereum
2.0
upgrade.
E
So
I
think,
there's
a
lot
to
be
excited
about
in
these
coming
years,
but
I'd
just
like
to
get
back
to
the
model
law.
It's
on
the
kind
of
control
approach
for
establishing
the
functional
equivalence
of
possession
in
the
virtual
space-
and
this
has
kind
of
traditionally
been
seen
as
a
capitulation
to
the
registry
system,
which
in
the
past
was
the
only
way
to
establish
possession
in
a
virtual
space.
E
But
the
problem
with
this
is
that
it
in
essence
gives
people
a
symbolic
key
to
a
warehouse,
rather
than
actually
gives
them
the
ability
to
to
manipulate
to
the
extent
that
might
be
a
desirable
for
establishing
possession,
but
the
notion
of
of
control.
I
think
that
wasn't
that
wasn't
defined
anywhere
in
the
in
malita.
To
what
extent
was
this
a
conscious
decision,
and
do
you
think
that
there
should
be
a
uniform
definition,
luca?
Thank
you.
B
B
E
Yeah,
it's
just,
I
think
it's
quite
an
interesting
kind
of
legal
philosophical
point
when
you,
when
you
establish
your
when
you
kind
of
establish
a
system
in
order
to
exclude
control,
but
then
you
know,
by
virtue
of
establishing
a
system,
you
already
kind
of
imply
an
external
control,
which
is
why
maybe
a
decentralized
system
is
legally
a
better
way
of
doing
it.
Thank
you
for
for
answering.
A
A
B
B
B
There
was
recently-
and
maybe
I
can
put
it
in
the
chat.
There
was
a
a
webinar
organized
by
uncetral.
It
was
actually
supposed
to
support
a
different
project,
but
basically
one
day
was
only
about
presentations
on
mltr
and
the
second
day
too.
Also
it
was
about
it
and
I
will
put
now
the
link
in
the
chat
and
the,
and
then
there
was
something
said
which
is
very
interesting
by
marina
cominos
from
ess
docs.
B
We
have
everything
we
need,
and
so
now
we
just
need
to
start
using
it
and
and
to
to
to
implement
it
so
that
the
next
thing
would
be
for
another
service
provider
doesn't
have
to
be
electronic
piece
of
landing,
it
can
be
promissory
nodes,
it
can
be
bits
of
exchange,
it
can
be
warehouse,
receipts
to
say
yeah.
Now
we
issue
under
mltr
out
of
choice
of
law
and
and
then
we
are
happy
with
it
and
we
can
do
it,
but
a
similar
thing
like
because
of
a
decision
of
the
swedish
supreme
court
in
sweden.
B
It
is
already
possible
to
issue
electronic
promissory
notes
if
they
meet
10
requirements,
which
are
so.
That
would
be
another
use
case.
So
I
think
that
what
we
are
we'll
see
now
we
will
see
people
who
will
say
yeah.
Now
we
will.
We
will
start
doing
this.
We
believe
in
this.
We
are
confident
enough.
We
know
the
risks,
we
know
how
to
do
it,
we
just
do
it
and
then
that's
it.
A
Talking
about
the
private
sector,
look
at
what
about
the
public
one
I
mean
I
saw
in
case
presentation.
I
saw
the
mention
to
the
certificate
of
origin.
You
know
how
maybe
tricky
hearts
is
to
to
let
public
institution
into
this.
What
about
the
current
situation?
Are
they
comparatively
into
this
and
going
fully
digitized?
A
C
C
Unfortunately,
you
know
even
blockchain
itself
is-
is
really
only
gaining
better
understanding
only
in
the
recent
times,
but
the
problem
that
we're
trying
to
solve
is
a
very
real
one.
The
costs
you
know
the
the
reduction
in
cost
of
shipping
is
just
one.
It's
just
one
of
the
more
visible
dimensions
that
we
chose
to
bring
up.
I
think,
what's
more,
exciting
is
once
every
once
the
information
once
it
is
digitalized
the
unleashing
of
you
know,
innovation
energies
by
providers
by
companies
would
be
immense.
C
I
do
not
think
we
have
yet
uncovered
all
that
is
possible
once
we
have
trade
documents
digitalized
to
a
very
large
degree,
so
that
that's
definitely
one
aspect
in
terms
of
challenges:
public
institutions-
I
guess
you
could
say
that
public
institutions
are
more
risk
averse.
That
certainly
is
true
for
some
rather
than
others,
but
I
think,
as
you
know,
as
as
mr
losing
young
is
it's
very
it's
often
you
know
quoted
to
say
it's.
C
You
know
if
you
look
at
the
innovation
curve
right
for
innovation
adoption
curve,
you
will
always
have
the
early
adopters.
You
will
always
have
the
language,
and
really
it's
about
some
of
us
showing
the
rest
of
us
the
way
away
and
really
taking
taking
those
first
steps
and
showing
the
rest
of
the
world.
It
is
possible,
it
is
you
know,
and
unfortunately
the
fact
is
digital
negotiable
instruments.
C
C
A
It's
no
I'm
thinking
also
of
other.
You
know
issues
related
to
this,
and
you
know
you
know
the
customs
authorities
they
are
so
reluctant
often,
and
they
make
so
much
dig
into
this
so
heavily
stocked
into
paper.
You
were
mentioning
kay
formally.
You
know
that
you're
creating
with
australia
with
other
countries.
A
C
C
No,
no
problem,
no
problem.
Of
course.
The
fact
is,
you
know:
international
trade
in
it
in
itself
is
a
huge
domain.
So
you
know
it
really
isn't
easy.
Just
to
you
know,
accomplish
everything
quickly,
but
you
know,
as
you
saw
from
lucas
presentation,
this
class
of
digital
negotiable
instruments
that
are
more
than
just
the
bills
of
leading
right.
There
are
other
instruments
as
well,
so
at
least
for
for
singapore.
C
We've
really,
you
know,
decided
to
focus
a
lot
on
the
bill
of
lading
for
now,
but
there
is
obvious
applicability
in
trade
to
other
instruments
as
well
in
terms
of
other
areas.
To
be
perfectly
frank,
we
we
are
looking
for
those
who
are
willing
to
join
us
on
this
journey
governments
and
and
companies
alike.
C
You
know
we're
looking
for
a
coalition
of
the
willing
and
able
right.
We
are
very
thankful
that
we
have
very
forward-looking
governments
like
china,
netherlands,
you
know
and
australia
who
have
you
know,
really
sought
to
work
with
us
on
real
concrete
projects
and
demonstrate
that
to
their
to
their
communities
and
to
the
world.
A
A
C
Okay,
certainly
I
I
will
take
a
step
at
this,
although
I
do
have
other
colleagues
from
the
trade
team
who
are
also
on
this
channel
shout
out
if
they
would
like
to
also
add
on
so.
First
of
all,
when
you
talk
about
adopting
the
mletr,
so
I
think
a
couple
of
dimensions,
we're
gonna
look
at
this
on
the
first
is
legal.
The
other
is
technical.
C
That's
on
the
technical
aspect.
Now,
on
the
other
aspect,
which
is
the
legal
aspect-
that's
that
remains
something
that
we
have
to
investigate,
because
again,
you've
got
to
be
a
bit
more
specific
about.
What
do
you
mean
by
a
ebl
platform
adopting
the
the
mletr
subject
to
lucas?
I
guess
a
a
correction.
C
C
A
A
C
C
B
A
lot
of
a
lot
of
the
materials
where
both
slides
and
recording
it's
about
the
mlita
and
I
wanted
I
want
to
apologize
because
I
I
before
I
called
trade
trust
the
platform
correctly
said
it's
not
a
platform
and
I
would
call
it
a
an
ecosystem,
but
it's
not
an
ecosystem,
it's
a
community!
So
you
know
what
okay,
why
don't
you
talk
about
trade
trust?
And
I
don't
talk
about
it
because.
B
C
C
C
C
D
Yeah
I
mean
the
the
next
country
that
will
integrate
the
model
law
into
their
their
legislation,
because
I
mean
as
much
as
I
mean.
The
the
great
benefit
of
this
is
is
is
really
to
have
the
direct
enforcement
of
those
of
those
documents
I
mean
directly
into
into
into
into
the
the
legal
system,
but
then,
for
those
that
have
not
adopted
this,
I
mean
you
will
still
have
to
rely
on
some
contract
to
revert
to
the
contract
low.
B
Thank
you.
This
is
a
very
interesting
question
and
I
I
realize
I
have
to
give
you
an
answer
on
two
or
three
different
points,
but
quickly,
mindful
of
time.
First
of
all,
we
do
promote
actively
with
model
law.
Obviously
we
need
the
help
of
the
private
sector.
We
need
the
help
of
governments.
We
need
the
help
of
everyone
laws
that
may
be
passed
when
they
are
based
on
uniform
texts.
B
If
you
just
want
to
know
who
is
gonna
who's
gonna
adopt
next,
I
can
tell
you
that
the
bills
to
enact
the
mldtr,
and
not
only
because
these
are
broader
bills
on
on
electronic
transactions.
Law
have
been
introduced
in
paraguay
and
in
kiribati,
but
that's
a
fact
with
this
public
information
that
is
available,
but
of
course
paraguay
and
kiribati
are
important
countries,
but
we're
not
on
top
five
world
traders.
B
So
we
see
things
happening,
it's
not
just
a
matter
of
passing
the
law.
It's
also
a
matter
of
understanding
and
implementing
the
law.
The
the
us
has
already
legislation
in
this
field.
U.S
had
for
many
years,
legislation
on
electronic
bills
of
lading,
but
it
was
never
used
until
the
end
of
2020
and
in
2020
was
used
only
for
inland
waterway
commodity
shipment
but,
for
instance,
in
the
us
laws
and
warehouse
receipts
are
being
used.
Electronic
warehouse,
warehouse
receipts
and
they're
also
very
compatible
with
mlitr.
B
So
I
would
say
this
is
a
little
bit
more
of
you
know
a
mosaic.
Now
we
see
different
things
happening.
There
is
a
convergence
where
there
are
countries
like
monaco,
the
the
the
francis
where
actually
the
functional
equivalence
rules
of
the
military
has
been
enacted
in
the
law,
but
it's
awaiting
implementing
regulations-
and
I
don't
know
if
there
is
a
market
demand,
but
it's
possible
to
implement
it
tomorrow.
So
it's
it's
more
complex,
it's
very
than
just
saying.
B
Yes,
the
law
has
been
passed
and
now
it's
possible
to
do
that,
but
we
see
a
lot
of
action
that
we
didn't
see
two
years
ago,
there's
a
huge
acceleration
because
of
the
effects
of
kovit
there's
a
huge
demand
for
information
and
requests
for
awareness
and
then,
of
course,
we're
here.
Whoever
wants
to
discuss
how
to
adopt
his
law
tomorrow,
we
are
here
to
assist.
A
D
That
just
means
it
was
very
good
and
interesting
and
interactive
session.
We
should
all
be
proud
or
you
should
be
proud
and
kate
and
andre
have
done
a
great
job.
Yeah
yeah,
that's
it
that's
it.
Normally.
People
try
to
get
out
of
these
things.
10
minutes
earlier,
so
extending
it
over
over.
The
projected
time
is
great.
A
Know
what
we
have
to
keep
up
with
the
level,
so
it's
going
to
be
challenging
for
us
to
to
go
on
this
way,
but
anyway
we
we
have
excellent
club,
races,
excellence,
you
know
speakers,
so
it's
pretty
easy.
It
was
actually
that.
Thank
you.
Thank
you
so
much
so
julian.
I
think
you
can
end
up
the
meeting
and
you
know,
let's
just
say.
D
Thank
you
thanks.
I
think
you're
having
slight
problems,
andrea
with
with
with
the
voice
and
connectivity,
andrea
thanks
for
setting
us
up
and
luca
and
kay,
thank
you
for
great
presentation
and
and
for
everyone
being
involved
and
turning
up
here
today
and
let's
continue
this
conversation,
and
I
think
there
was
a
kind
of
call
to
action
from
kay
and
luca
to
get
involved.
So
please
do
take
care.
Everyone
keep
safe.